The BMW UUC Digest Volume 3 : Issue 367 : "text" Format Messages in this Issue: FS: 1991 525 - MUST SELL '88 M5 Conversion for sale Re: '88 M5 Conversion for sale Re: '88 M5 Conversion for sale Re: '88 M5 Conversion for sale <E36> head swap Re: <E36> head swap Re: <E36> head swap Re: <E36> head swap Re: <E36> head swap Re: <E36> head swap Bar's Leaks/ was E36 head rebuilding/ was mystery coolant leak Re: M62 leaking chain cover Re: M62 leaking chain cover Re: M62 leaking chain cover
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 13:13:35 -0600 From: Rob Verenna <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Subject: FS: 1991 525 - MUST SELL Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 115,xxx miles, automatic, tan leather interior in great condition - no rips/tears/wear spots, tan exterior, A/C, AM/FM/Tape, power windows, mirrors and door locks, on-board computer, heated seats. Cooling system completely overhauled and new rear tires recently installed. Car runs great, it has been a dependable commuter for the past 10 months for 90 miles a day (bought 12/05 with 99k miles) but I have a company car to commute in now and too many cars in the driveway - my company car got ticketed during the snow removal this morning, so this car MUST GO. Located in Mundelein, IL, just north of Chicago. $3500 firm. Pictures available on request. - rob ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 16:38:14 -0800 From: Tom Childers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: '88 M5 Conversion for sale Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I'm serious about selling my '88 M5, and have it posted on the web. Asking price is $8500, and you can see it at http://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/car/263047403.html It's really an excellent, solid and reliable car, and wild fun on a twisty road. This is the ultimate Q-ship :-) If your or someone you know wants a hot bimmer that looks like a quiet family car, let me know. -tdc ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 20:18:29 -0600 From: "Paul Garnier" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "'Tom Childers'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[email protected]> Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: '88 M5 Conversion for sale Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> No ABS, eh? Paul A. Garnier Houston, TX 281-827-0725 www.fastnetworking.com -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom Childers Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 6:38 PM To: [email protected] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [UUC] '88 M5 Conversion for sale I'm serious about selling my '88 M5, and have it posted on the web. Asking price is $8500, and you can see it at http://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/car/263047403.html It's really an excellent, solid and reliable car, and wild fun on a twisty road. This is the ultimate Q-ship :-) If your or someone you know wants a hot bimmer that looks like a quiet family car, let me know. -tdc Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] __________________________________________________________________________ In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 19:06:32 -0800 From: Tom Childers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Paul Garnier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [email protected] Subject: Re: '88 M5 Conversion for sale Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Of course it has ABS :-) The maniac who built the car welded the brackets for that, the air conditioner heat shield, the battery box...everything. -tdc On Jan 15, 2007, at 6:18 PM, Paul Garnier wrote: > No ABS, eh? > > Paul A. Garnier > Houston, TX > 281-827-0725 > www.fastnetworking.com > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom Childers > Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 6:38 PM > To: [email protected] > Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [UUC] '88 M5 Conversion for sale > > I'm serious about selling my '88 M5, and have it posted on the web. > Asking price is $8500, and you can see it at > http://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/car/263047403.html > > It's really an excellent, solid and reliable car, and wild fun on a > twisty road. This is the ultimate Q-ship :-) If your or someone you > know wants a hot bimmer that looks like a quiet family car, let me > know. > -tdc > Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/ > [email protected] > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > ____ > In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the > BMW CCA. > > UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate > Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! > 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 06:49:14 -0500 From: John Grills <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Tom Childers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: [email protected], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: '88 M5 Conversion for sale Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> And no gratuitous shot of the engine compartment? Sorry, I couldn't resist. r/jpg On Jan 15, 2007, at 7:38 PM, Tom Childers wrote: > I'm serious about selling my '88 M5, and have it posted on the > web. Asking price is $8500, and you can see it at > http://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/car/263047403.html > > It's really an excellent, solid and reliable car, and wild fun on a > twisty road. This is the ultimate Q-ship :-) If your or someone > you know wants a hot bimmer that looks like a quiet family car, let > me know. > -tdc > Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/ > [email protected] > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > ____ > In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the > BMW CCA. > > UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate > Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! > 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 18:34:48 -0800 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [email protected] Subject: <E36> head swap Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Can an E36, M3 head be transplanted to an E36, 328 otherwise stock motor? If so, what if any performance gains can be expected? -Kevin ---------------------------------------------------------------- This e-mail communication is confidential and is intended only for the individual(s) or entity named above and others who have been specifically authorized to receive it. If you are not the intended recipient, please do not read, copy, use or disclose the contents of this communication to others. Please notify the sender that you have received this e-mail in error by replying to the e-mail. Please then delete the e-mail and any copies of it. Thank you. ---------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 22:31:07 -0500 From: "Ben Keyes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: [email protected] Subject: Re: <E36> head swap Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> AFAIK head itself & the valves are the same between the M3 & a 325 or 328 but the M3 cams are a common upgrade. perhaps easier to swap only the cams, perhaps easier to swap in a refreshed M3 head if you're rebuilding or upgrading. Ben kevin wrote: > > Can an E36, M3 head be transplanted to an E36, 328 otherwise stock motor? > If so, what if any performance gains can be expected? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 21:55:40 -0800 From: "Marco Romani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "'Ben Keyes'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: <E36> head swap Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I agree with Ben but I'm not sure if the valves are the same. - I haven't actually measured the combustion chamber diameter of the various motors but as for block bore sizes. The M50 is 84mm The M52 is also 84mm The S50 is 86 The S52 is 86.4 Marco -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ben Keyes Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 7:31 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [email protected] Subject: Re: [UUC] <E36> head swap AFAIK head itself & the valves are the same between the M3 & a 325 or 328 but the M3 cams are a common upgrade. perhaps easier to swap only the cams, perhaps easier to swap in a refreshed M3 head if you're rebuilding or upgrading. Ben kevin wrote: > > Can an E36, M3 head be transplanted to an E36, 328 otherwise stock > motor? If so, what if any performance gains can be expected? Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] __________________________________________________________________________ In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.16.12/628 - Release Date: 1/15/2007 11:04 AM ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:20:05 -0500 From: KMS- Brett Anderson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Marco Romani <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: "'Ben Keyes'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED], [email protected] Subject: Re: <E36> head swap Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I missed the original post. All M50/S50US/M52/S52 cylinder heads (except non Vanos M50) are identical and completely interchangeable. The valve springs and cams are the only difference. M52 and later heads went to a single temperature sensor doing 2 jobs. As a result, later castings are missing one drilled and tapped hole for a sensor. The boss is there, and it can be easily drilled and tapped. If using an M52 or later head on an M50, you need to check for three threaded holes on the side of the head. If using an M50 head on an M52 or later, you simply need to fill the extra hole with a plug that is readily available from BMW. Brett Anderson KMS > kevin wrote: >> Can an E36, M3 head be transplanted to an E36, 328 otherwise stock >> motor? If so, what if any performance gains can be expected? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 07:59:13 -0800 From: "Marco Romani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "'KMS- Brett Anderson'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: "'Ben Keyes'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[email protected]> Subject: Re: <E36> head swap Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Re the single temp sender - IIRC Bimmerworld makes an adapter for the wiring harness so that you can use the single temp sender in a car that used dual temp senders. Marco -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of KMS- Brett Anderson Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 7:20 AM To: Marco Romani Cc: 'Ben Keyes'; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [email protected] Subject: Re: [UUC] <E36> head swap I missed the original post. All M50/S50US/M52/S52 cylinder heads (except non Vanos M50) are identical and completely interchangeable. The valve springs and cams are the only difference. M52 and later heads went to a single temperature sensor doing 2 jobs. As a result, later castings are missing one drilled and tapped hole for a sensor. The boss is there, and it can be easily drilled and tapped. If using an M52 or later head on an M50, you need to check for three threaded holes on the side of the head. If using an M50 head on an M52 or later, you simply need to fill the extra hole with a plug that is readily available from BMW. Brett Anderson KMS > kevin wrote: >> Can an E36, M3 head be transplanted to an E36, 328 otherwise stock >> motor? If so, what if any performance gains can be expected? Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] __________________________________________________________________________ In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.16.12/631 - Release Date: 1/16/2007 8:25 AM ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 08:38:30 -0500 From: Ed MacVaugh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: <E36> head swap Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> The heads are identical including the valves on the later 3.2 M3 and the 328, only the cams are different. Without cams, no gains, with cams, gains if you have a manual trans in your 328, else the trans computer will seldom let the engine rev high enough to notice a difference. Ed [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Can an E36, M3 head be transplanted to an E36, 328 otherwise stock motor? > If so, what if any performance gains can be expected? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 20:17:21 -0800 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "[uucdigest]" <[email protected]>, bmw digest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Bar's Leaks/ was E36 head rebuilding/ was mystery coolant leak Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> A couple of listers suggested trying Bar's Leaks, and if I'm going to have to pull the head anyway, another $10. won't break the bank. We I'll be darned, the stuff might have worked. Three days of good cold starts, kitty kat purr smooth idles, no steam puffs, flutters, smell, etc. So I'm going to hold off on pulling the head and see how it holds up. 'Jack is whispering he want that M50 manifold put on right away if the coolant leak is gone. Now that its ok to come out of the closet about using this stuff, anyone else have long term experience with it? tia, Barry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 08:43:30 -0800 (PST) From: Ivan Demkovitch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: KMS- Brett Anderson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: UUC Digest <[email protected]> Subject: Re: M62 leaking chain cover Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I decided to replace main chain, oil pump chain and all associated sprockets. TIP: For lower sprocket followed worked for me. I rented bigger 3-jaw puller from autozone, used crank bolt as a support and it came out pretty easy. Pre-heated new sprocket to 425(my wife helped me here), was ready to tap it with a rubber mullet, but it went on like a glove without any hammering. I have few questions about setting timing. From what I read in Bentley I need: 0. Camshafts locked in place with special tool. 1. Have all sprockets loosed(I had to disturb exhaust sprocket position to replace plastic guides) 2. Center secondary sprockets (I had them installed same way I took them out) 3. Lock crank using pin tool. PROBLEM! After I placed subframe in place I can't seem to be able to insert Pin. Center steering link right in there. I wonder if I can take it off idling arm (right) if I will be able to insert pin? Or can I use TDC mark on timing chain cover? 4. Put sprockets with main chain. Here I'm in doubt. Can they go any way as long as timing right? Sprockets have some marks, Bentley silent about those. Should I just ensure that sprocket in a middle position and crankshaft is at TDC? 5. Use tensioner adjustment tool (threaded rod). Bentley calls for 0.7NM tension. Obviously, I don't have this kind of torque wrench. It's very small number. Can I just do it finger tight? 6. With tension rail preloaded tighten all sprockets. Does it sound correct? Also, I'm thinking about doing 1 rotation after that and see if camshafts come back to exact place. Should I expect to be able to put lock tools on without wiggling a little? Is there any tips on adjusting chain? Thanks a lot! Ivan ----- Original Message ---- From: KMS- Brett Anderson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Ivan Demkovitch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: UUC Digest <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, December 31, 2006 7:54:10 PM Subject: Re: [UUC] M62 leaking chain cover May as well do the chain while you're in there at this point. Check the condition of the gears and decide if they should be done at the same time. Upper ones are easy, crank gear can be a pain. Change the oil pump chain while you're in there. Brett Anderson KMS Ivan Demkovitch wrote: > Update. > > I got all special tools. Crank holder and Camshafts locks. > > Engine all apart, I see parts of plastic guides broken, so I'm going in :) > > Now I have 2 dilemmas > 1. Replace chain or not? If I do - I need to replace sprockets as well. Car > has 170k and I want to keep it for another 60-100k. Does chain replacement > make sence? > 2. ETK does not list plastic guides separately. They have complete tensioner > and reflection rails. Is there overhaul kit or something like this available? > > Other then that - motor internals look good as new, no visible wear or sludge. > > Thanks and have a happy New Year! > > Ivan > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: KMS- Brett Anderson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: Ivan Demkovitch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; UUC Digest > <[email protected]> > Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 11:14:01 AM > Subject: Re: [UUC] M62 leaking chain cover > > > You will need the special tool to hold the crank still while you break > the hub nut loose. And you'll need a very large breaker bar to loosen > it, and to tighten it. > > Brett Anderson > KMS > > > Ivan Demkovitch wrote: >> If BMW says it takes 14 hours then it will take me about 20 :) >> >> I'm not in a hurry, just wanted to gather info. Front seal might be needed >> also.. >> >> Is there special tools if I need to do that? >> >> Thank you, >> Ivan >> >> ---------------- >> You don't want to remove the lower cover. >> BMW says that job takes 14 hours, so someone who's never done it before >> is likely to take 30 hours. >> It is extremely rare for the lower cover to leak. >> If you remove the oil pan, you will need to replace both gaskets. >> Brett Anderson >> KMS >> >> > > Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] > > > __________________________________________________________________________ > In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. > > UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate > Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! > 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 11:53:16 -0500 From: KMS- Brett Anderson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Ivan Demkovitch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: UUC Digest <[email protected]> Subject: Re: M62 leaking chain cover Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> With the crank pin, try turning the wheels in one direction or the other, which will move the centre link away from the area you're working in. You could also shorten the pin. Under no circumstances should you try and do it without the pin in place, you're asking for disaster. At this point of the job, I'd strongly suggest forgoing the Bentley, pay the $30 and log on to www.bmwtechinfo.com, and print the factory repair procedure. And yes, absolutely, before final assembly, turn the crank 1440 degrees and recheck timing. The tools should slip right into place, and it's not uncommon to have to make minor changes during this procedure. Brett Anderson KMS Ivan Demkovitch wrote: > I decided to replace main chain, oil pump chain and all associated sprockets. > > TIP: For lower sprocket followed worked for me. I rented bigger 3-jaw puller > from autozone, used crank bolt as a support and it came out pretty easy. > Pre-heated new sprocket to 425(my wife helped me here), was ready to tap it > with a rubber mullet, but it went on like a glove without any hammering. > > I have few questions about setting timing. From what I read in Bentley I need: > > 0. Camshafts locked in place with special tool. > 1. Have all sprockets loosed(I had to disturb exhaust sprocket position to > replace plastic guides) > 2. Center secondary sprockets (I had them installed same way I took them out) > 3. Lock crank using pin tool. PROBLEM! After I placed subframe in place I > can't seem to be able to insert Pin. Center steering link right in there. I > wonder if I can take it off idling arm (right) if I will be able to insert > pin? Or can I use TDC mark on timing chain cover? > 4. Put sprockets with main chain. Here I'm in doubt. Can they go any way as > long as timing right? Sprockets have some marks, Bentley silent about those. > Should I just ensure that sprocket in a middle position and crankshaft is at > TDC? > 5. Use tensioner adjustment tool (threaded rod). Bentley calls for 0.7NM > tension. Obviously, I don't have this kind of torque wrench. It's very small > number. Can I just do it finger tight? > 6. With tension rail preloaded tighten all sprockets. > > Does it sound correct? > > Also, I'm thinking about doing 1 rotation after that and see if camshafts > come back to exact place. Should I expect to be able to put lock tools on > without wiggling a little? Is there any tips on adjusting chain? > > Thanks a lot! > Ivan > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:26:29 -0800 (PST) From: Ivan Demkovitch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: KMS- Brett Anderson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: UUC Digest <[email protected]> Subject: Re: M62 leaking chain cover Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Ok, will check TIS. I have CD but was lazy to install it. How do you do this 0.7Nm procedure? Do you actually use special BMW flexshaft tool? Also, I notices that original sprockets had plastic molding which helped to support chain I guess? The new ones doesn't have this plastic on them. Also, while doing 1440 degree turn I assume I keep tensioner rail pre-tensioned. ----- Original Message ---- From: KMS- Brett Anderson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Ivan Demkovitch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: UUC Digest <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 10:53:16 AM Subject: Re: [UUC] M62 leaking chain cover With the crank pin, try turning the wheels in one direction or the other, which will move the centre link away from the area you're working in. You could also shorten the pin. Under no circumstances should you try and do it without the pin in place, you're asking for disaster. At this point of the job, I'd strongly suggest forgoing the Bentley, pay the $30 and log on to www.bmwtechinfo.com, and print the factory repair procedure. And yes, absolutely, before final assembly, turn the crank 1440 degrees and recheck timing. The tools should slip right into place, and it's not uncommon to have to make minor changes during this procedure. Brett Anderson KMS Ivan Demkovitch wrote: > I decided to replace main chain, oil pump chain and all associated sprockets. > > TIP: For lower sprocket followed worked for me. I rented bigger 3-jaw puller > from autozone, used crank bolt as a support and it came out pretty easy. > Pre-heated new sprocket to 425(my wife helped me here), was ready to tap it > with a rubber mullet, but it went on like a glove without any hammering. > > I have few questions about setting timing. From what I read in Bentley I need: > > 0. Camshafts locked in place with special tool. > 1. Have all sprockets loosed(I had to disturb exhaust sprocket position to > replace plastic guides) > 2. Center secondary sprockets (I had them installed same way I took them out) > 3. Lock crank using pin tool. PROBLEM! After I placed subframe in place I > can't seem to be able to insert Pin. Center steering link right in there. I > wonder if I can take it off idling arm (right) if I will be able to insert > pin? Or can I use TDC mark on timing chain cover? > 4. Put sprockets with main chain. Here I'm in doubt. Can they go any way as > long as timing right? Sprockets have some marks, Bentley silent about those. > Should I just ensure that sprocket in a middle position and crankshaft is at > TDC? > 5. Use tensioner adjustment tool (threaded rod). Bentley calls for 0.7NM > tension. Obviously, I don't have this kind of torque wrench. It's very small > number. Can I just do it finger tight? > 6. With tension rail preloaded tighten all sprockets. > > Does it sound correct? > > Also, I'm thinking about doing 1 rotation after that and see if camshafts > come back to exact place. Should I expect to be able to put lock tools on > without wiggling a little? Is there any tips on adjusting chain? > > Thanks a lot! > Ivan > ------------------------------ End of [bmwuucdigest] digest(15 messages) **********
