Let me frame my reply first: I'm an ex-smoker and when I did smoke I tried to be as considerate as Matthew is explaining. As a non-smoker, I still carry myself to the smoking area for a little "contact high" every now and then (I call it "sniffing").
I honestly think, Ben, that you're complaint is with a smaller percentage of smokers than you think. I, along with almost every smoker I know and have known, do what Matthew described. I honesly think that it's a case of "one bad apple ruins the peck". Even as an ex-smoker, I take issue with the coments about "Also, I don't understand how smokers can defend something they clearly know is unhealthy, harms others (even if unintentional), waste of money, etc. I mean come on, get a grip!" IMO, it's my choice (as I see Matt making the comment that it's all about choice) whether I smoke or not. In my case, I did not quit for my health nor my wallet. I quit because my wife, who is also an ex-smoker, wanted to quit and I had to choose (again, there's that choice word) whether I wanted to support her in a loving and considerate manner or show her that I didn't respect her choice to quit. If it had not been for that sequence of events, I'd be burning one right now, knowing full well (I do have a college degree and have seen the ads, waning labels and pictures) the consequences. For now, I'll make the choice to leave it at that. It's time for a three-day weekend (via vacation day). Happy Weekend! Hatton Life sucks, get a helmet. Ben Arledge wrote: > I see Matthew's point and he has some good examples below. I tried to > make it clear that I was referring to most smokers, NOT all. Perhaps my > strong opinion was overpowering the message I was trying to convey. > > Matthew, nobody's forcing you to defend yourself, but you are. :) > > Cheers, > Ben > > -----Original Message----- > From: Smith, Matthew P -CONT(DYN) [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > Sent: Thursday, July 25, 2002 2:05 PM > To: CF-Community > Subject: RE: Smokers (was: Man uses fast food chains because he's fat) > > Well, that's the thing. > > I felt I was lumped with ALL smokers, I felt all smokers were being > lumped > together as inconsiderate a**holes blowing directly into your face, and > I > don't like that kind of generalization. > > I am considerate, always ask if whoever is around minds my smoke. If > someone objects, then I don't smoke, or I go somewhere else. > > I even ask other smokers sometimes: if we are dining together, I have > finished eating and they have not, I ask if they mind if I light up. I > once > had a friend who smoked but couldn't stand it if someone else smoked > while > they were eating. She was the only smoker I knew who was like that, but > since then, I always ask. No one has said "yes, please wait", but I > still > ask. > > I know a lot of inconsiderate non-smokers, too. Ever had to listen to a > throbbing bass track at a stop light? Even seen a KKK rally? > > >>>>>>Also, I don't understand how smokers can defend something they >>>>>> > clearly > >>>>>>know is unhealthy, harms others (even if unintentional), waste of >>>>>> >>>money, >>> >>>>>>etc. I mean come on, get a grip! >>>>>> > > I've thought about quitting, but just don't want to yet. I like it. > Really. Just like I enjoy a beer or a good whiskey. > > And that's where my first response came from. It's my choice. I don't > understand why I should be forced to defend it. > > > > > >>>-----Original Message----- >>>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >>>Sent: Thursday, July 25, 2002 2:45 PM >>>To: CF-Community >>>Subject: RE: Smokers (was: Man uses fast food chains because he's fat) >>> >>>Here you go indeed >>> >>>We aren't talking about designated smoking area that non- >>>smokers can readily avoid. Yes, you're right, the >>>supervisor *chose* to come talk with you there. We're >>>talking about people who do *not* chose to share your >>>smoke but might be forced to. >>> >>>And we are talking about *direct* health effects, not >>>indirect or financial. Breathing smoke directly affects >>>my health. >>> >>>-Ben >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>(here we go) >>>> >>>> >>>>>>that they're causing my >>>>>>headaches or other ailments because I'm breathing what they claim >>>>>> > is > >>>>>>their right. >>>>>> >>>>Let's see, when I take a smoke at work, I walk outside, about 30 >>>> > yards > >>>to a >>> >>>>designated smoking area. The only others around are other smokers. >>>> > How > >>>are >>> >>>>you affected? >>>> >>>>Funny that you mention this. Yesterday, I and two other smokers >>>> > were > >>>out at >>> >>>>the smoking area. Our supervisor happened to walk out there to talk >>>> > to > >>>us. >>> >>>>She is a non-smoker. She could have waited 5 minutes, and talked to >>>> > us > >>>in >>> >>>>the office. She chose to join us. Were we forcing her to smoke? >>>> >>>>OK, your SUV uses too much gas, you can't have it. Your guns (or >>>> > those > >>>of >>> >>>>other gun owners) are used in to many crimes, you can't have them. >>>> > Your > >>>>fast food is making you fat and I have to pay for your heath care, >>>> > no > >>>more >>> >>>>for you. >>>> >>>>Your sedentary life style is causing health problems, you are >>>> > required > >>>to be >>> >>>>in front of my house at 4:30 for mandatory exercise. You better be >>>> >>>there. >>> >>>>No, you can't think that way, it bothers me. Think the way I tell >>>> > you. > >>>>You will be assimilated. Resistance is futile. >>>> >>>> >>>>Matt >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>>-----Original Message----- >>>>>>From: Ben Arledge [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >>>>>>Sent: Thursday, July 25, 2002 2:25 PM >>>>>>To: CF-Community >>>>>>Subject: RE: Smokers (was: Man uses fast food chains because he's >>>>>> > fat) > >>>>>>I have to agree with Ben here. There sure are a lot of Ben's here. >>>>>> > :) > >>>>>>Most smokers just don't seem to understand that they're causing my >>>>>>headaches or other ailments because I'm breathing what they claim >>>>>> > is > >>>>>>their right. >>>>>> >>>>>>I personally regard most smokers in the same group as potheads >>>>>> > because > >>>>>>it's stupid and makes no sense. I would avoid hiring a smoker, and >>>>>> > I'm > >>>>>>seeing more and more companies thinking the same way. Smoking in >>>>>> > any > >>>>>>restaurants here is prohibited now. Yes! >>>>>> >>>>>>Here in Canada (read in a study a couple years ago) it's actually >>>>>>cheaper for the government if citizens smoke and die early from >>>>>>cancer/etc. than live longer and use health care resources for age >>>>>>related ailments. With that in mind, I'm more accepting that >>>>>> > people > >>>>>>smoke but if someone wants to smoke around me, prepare to have >>>>>> > your > >>>>>>personal space violated. >>>>>> >>>>>>And I think Tim Heald has it backwards. If he wants to smoke, he >>>>>> >>>should >>> >>>>>>stay home and away from the rest of us. >>>>>> >>>>>>Also, I don't understand how smokers can defend something they >>>>>> > clearly > >>>>>>know is unhealthy, harms others (even if unintentional), waste of >>>>>> >>>money, >>> >>>>>>etc. I mean come on, get a grip! >>>>>> >>>>>>Anybody else feel the same way? Or disagree? :) >>>>>> >>>>>>Cheers, >>>>>>Ben >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>-----Original Message----- >>>>>>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >>>>>>Sent: Thursday, July 25, 2002 11:43 AM >>>>>>To: CF-Community >>>>>>Subject: RE: Man uses fast food chains because he's fat >>>>>> >>>>>>Tim- >>>>>> >>>>>>you say "I am a smoker ... It's my body..." >>>>>> >>>>>>If you can equate your right to smoke with your right to >>>>>>eat Big Macs, you're forgetting an important point: >>>>>> >>>>>>When you smoke near other people, the side-stream >>>>>>(second-hand) smoke is being forced on them. >>>>>> >>>>>>When you eat, it directly affects only you. >>>>>> >>>>>>are you taking responsibility for the effect your >>>>>>personal decision to smoke has on them? >>>>>> >>>>>>I am an asthmatic. If you exercise your personal rights >>>>>>and smoke around me, what about *my* right to breathe? >>>>>> >>>>>>-Ben >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>I would have to say that maybe it's not all that different than >>>>>>> >>>>>>smoking. >>>>>> >>>>>>>1. Everyone knows both products are bad for them. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>2. The people who whine about each the most are either >>>>>>> > hypocrites > >>>>>>(still >>>>>> >>>>>>>using the product) or they are former users. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>I think suing the cigarette manufacturers (especially if you >>>>>>> > win) is > >>>>>>just as >>>>>> >>>>>>>stupid as this. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>I am a smoker. I know it causes cancer and all sorts of other >>>>>>> >>>>>>problems. >>>>>> >>>>>>>It's my body and I know I am personally responsible for my >>>>>>> > actions > >>>>>>where >>>>>> >>>>>>>smoking (or a big mac) are concerned. How is it that the nation >>>>>>> >>>that >>> >>>>>>was >>>>>> >>>>>>>founded on the idea that personal rights and responsibilities >>>>>>> > far > >>>out >>> >>>>>>way >>>>>> >>>>>>>those of the community, has fallen to such a low. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Bah, makes me sick sometimes just thinking about it. Oh well >>>>>>> > "Who > >>>is >>> >>>>>>John >>>>>> >>>>>>>Gault?". >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Anyone feel like helping me start a community of people of >>>>>>> > ability > >>>>>>somewhere >>>>>> >>>>>>>in the woods. We'll run a couple of T-3s out there and call it a >>>>>>> >>>day. >>> >>>>>>>What was it called? Galt's Gulch? >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Tim Heald >>>>>>>Developer >>>>>>>Schoollink, Inc. >>>>>>>910.223.2116 x 122 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>-----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>From: Bill Wheatley [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >>>>>>>>Sent: Thursday, July 25, 2002 1:24 PM >>>>>>>>To: CF-Community >>>>>>>>Subject: Re: Man uses fast food chains because he's fat >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>ahh not this again!! :) Maybe we'll get lucky and the greedy >>>>>>>> > SOB > >>>>>>>>will have a >>>>>>>>blocked artery and then he can sue them for his stroke too. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>WaAAAA I'm fat cause I am addicted to big macs. Get off it >>>>>>>> > dude. > >>>>>>This is >>>>>> >>>>>>>>completely different then smoking, you have to draw the line >>>>>>>> > of > >>>>>>personal >>>>>> >>>>>>>>responsibility somewhere. Just like these morons that spill >>>>>>>> >>>burning >>> >>>>>>hot >>>>>> >>>>>>>>coffee on their crotch. AHH how did that happen?? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>Oh was it the fact you had it between your legs duh moron!. >>>>>>>> > I'm > >>>glad >>> >>>>>>you >>>>>> >>>>>>>>cant reproduce because you obviously come from a defect >>>>>>>> > genetic > >>>line >>> >>>>>>lol. >>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>Bill Wheatley >>>>>>>>Senior Database Developer >>>>>>>>Macromedia Certified Advanced Coldfusion Developer >>>>>>>>EDIETS.COM >>>>>>>>954.360.9022 X159 >>>>>>>>ICQ 417645 >>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>>>From: "Howie Hamlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>>>>To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>>>>Sent: Thursday, July 25, 2002 11:57 AM >>>>>>>>Subject: Man uses fast food chains because he's fat >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,58652,00.html/ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>NEW YORK - Want a class-action lawsuit with that burger? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>A New York City lawyer has filed suit against the four big >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>fast-food >>>>>> >>>>>>>>corporations, saying their fatty foods are >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>responsible for his client's obesity and related health >>>>>>>>> >>>problems. >>> >>>>>>>>>Samuel Hirsch filed his lawsuit Wednesday at a New York >>>>>>>>> > state > >>>>>>>>court in the >>>>>>>>Bronx, alleging that McDonald's, Burger King, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>Wendy's and KFC Corporation are irresponsible and deceptive >>>>>>>>> > in > >>>>>>>>the posting >>>>>>>>of their nutritional information, that they >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>need to offer healthier options on their menus, and that >>>>>>>>> > they > >>>>>>>>create a de >>>>>>>>facto addiction in their consumers, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>particularly the poor and children. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>"You don't need nicotine or an illegal drug to create an >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>addiction, you're >>>>>>>>creating a craving," Hirsch said. "I think >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>we'll find that the fast-food industry has not been totally >>>>>>>>> > up > >>>>>>>>front with >>>>>>>>the consumers." >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>The suit does not specify the amount of damages Hirsch and >>>>>>>>> > his > >>>>>>>>client are >>>>>>>>seeking. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>> > > ______________________________________________________________________ Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/index.cfm?sidebar=lists
