Where did y ou get the 2000 cars a day at the gas station? That seems huge. That's 1 every 30 seconds solid over a 15 hour day.
I'd believe may 200, but not 2000. Bob On Sat, Dec 5, 2015 at 12:44 PM, Peri Hartman via EV <[email protected]> wrote: > That's great info, Tom! > > I think the convenience store aspect would remain, so just dividing your > numbers by four might be more realistic. That's still 250-300 or so miles > per day EV equivalent. Amazing! > > It would be good to corroborate this data. I'm hoping that this store is > an anomaly. > > Peri > > ------ Original Message ------ > From: "Tom Keenan" <[email protected]> > To: "Peri Hartman" <[email protected]>; "Electric Vehicle Discussion > List" <[email protected]> > Sent: 05-Dec-15 9:36:12 AM > Subject: Re: [EVDL] UK grid too weak for 34M EVs (not when we stop pumping > gas too!) > > About two years ago, I asked a gas station/convenience store owner what >> the normal amounts of electricity they used were, and he said about 350 kWh >> in summer, and 250 kWh in the winter. (Natural gas heating). I asked if >> this was for an entire month, and me said no, that was the amount used for >> a single day! He showed his power bill as proof. I was quite surprised, >> as my house uses roughly that amount per month. >> >> Granted, most of the energy was used for beverage and food coolers (about >> a dozen) and air conditioning. He estimated that the eight gasoline and two >> diesel dispensers and lift pumps was about a quarter of the total energy >> use for his station. >> >> If one considers this a typical store/gas station, and it serves perhaps >> 2,000 vehicles a day, each vehicle's share of energy is between 125 and 175 >> Watt-hours >> (0.125 to 0.175 kWh) when they fuel up. This takes into account their >> 'use' of powering the store, whether they buy soda and cigarettes or not. >> >> Obviously, energy used at a gas station is only a small part of the >> equation- extraction, transport, and refining of crude oil use vastly more >> amounts of energy in the whole petroleum cycle. The total energy used per >> vehicle would need to include that power used as well. >> >> Thought of another way, if the station were to go away (due to customer >> attrition) there would be an additional 250 to 350 kWh available per day >> for the grid to power plug-in vehicles. At 250 Wh/mi, that would translate >> to 1,000 to 1,400 miles per day of electric driving. Or enough miles/power >> to satisfy about 25 to 35 EVs doing forty-mile (round trip) commutes. The >> gas station attrition model would appear to need to eliminate about 2,000 >> ICE vehicles to shut down one gas station. >> >> Feel free to check my math - done on an iPhone... >> >> Tom Keenan >> >> On Dec 4, 2015, at 9:08 AM, Peri Hartman via EV <[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>> >>> That would be interesting information. I'll take a stab at an answer, >>> based on this EIA graph: >>> >>> http://www.eia.gov/beta/MER/index.cfm?tbl=T02.01#/?f=A&start=200001 >>> >>> Overall, it shows that commercial uses about 80% the amount of >>> residential (this is a visual interpretation). The figure, from EIA, for >>> residential is 11MwH per year. So, let's say the average commercial >>> location uses 8.8MwH per year. >>> >>> https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=97&t=3 >>> >>> Now for the EVs: If the average EV uses 300wH = .3KwH (including >>> accessories, charging losses, etc.) per mile and the average driver goes >>> 20000 miles per year, that's 6MwH of charging per year. >>> >>> So, based on averages and some EV assumptions, the gas station uses >>> enough electricy to charge somewhere between 1 and 2 EVs. >>> >>> Peri >>> >>> ------ Original Message ------ >>> From: "Robert Bruninga via EV" <[email protected]> >>> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]> >>> Sent: 04-Dec-15 6:47:23 AM >>> Subject: [EVDL] UK grid too weak for 34M EVs (not when we stop pumping >>> gas too!) >>> >>> : MP Amber Rudd sez the UK grid too weak for 34M EVs >>>>> BRITAIN’S electric car revolution could trigger blackouts by >>>>> overloading >>>>> our power network, senior Tories fear. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Typical right wing ignorance. >>>> >>>> What happens when 50% of cars are EV's. Then only 50% of the gas >>>> stations >>>> remain operating. How much ELECTRICITY does a gas station >>>> consume???? My >>>> wild a$$ guess is maybe the same as what it takes to charge 50 EV's. >>>> Now >>>> add up all the ELECTRIC savings by closing all those gas stations, and >>>> turning off half the gasoline pipelines, and half of the gasoline >>>> distribution system, and turning off HALF of all the electricity >>>> consumed >>>> pumping gas ouit of the ground, etc, and I bet it’s a WASH! >>>> >>>> Tonight I'm going to drop by my neighborhood gas station and see if the >>>> owner will tell me his electric bill and even better, if he will tell >>>> me how >>>> many cars he serves. I DOUBT he will tell me anything about the >>>> number of >>>> cars and the amount of gas since he is in EXTREME competition with the >>>> statinon across the road, but maybe he will reveal the electric bill. >>>> >>>> But we need this number. GO get your local number and lets compare >>>> notes. >>>> >>>> Bob >>>> --------------- >>>> >>> >>> >> > _______________________________________________ > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ > Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA ( > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20151205/d0ecda83/attachment.htm> _______________________________________________ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Read EVAngel's EV News at http://evdl.org/evln/ Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
