On 03 Apr 2012, at 02:06, Stathis Papaioannou wrote:

On Tue, Apr 3, 2012 at 6:08 AM, Craig Weinberg <whatsons...@gmail.com> wrote:

From blindsight, synesthesia, and anosognosia we know that particular
qualia are not inevitably associated with the conditions they usually
represent for us, so it seems impossible to justify qualia on a
functionalist basis. Just as a computer needs no speakers and video
screen inside itself, there is no purpose for such a presentation
layer within our own mechanism. Of course, even if there were a
purpose, there is no hint of such a possibility from mechanism alone.
If there was some reason that a bucket of rocks could benefit by some
kind of collective 'experience' occurring amongst them, that's a
million miles from suspecting that experience could be a conceivable

Rather than 'consciousness', human beings would benefit evolutionarily
much more by just being able to do something mechanically conceivable
things like teleport, time travel, or breathe fire. Awareness doesn't
even make sense as a possibility. Were we not experiencing it
ourselves we could never anticipate any such possibility in any

Since there is no evolutionary advantage to consciousness it must be a
side-effect of the sort of behaviour that conscious organisms display.

Consciousness comes from the conjunction of an (instinctive, preprogrammed, or better pre-engrammed) belief in a consistent reality/ god/universe/whatever, and the existence of that reality. The side- effect comes from the fact that the logic of communicable belief is different from the logic of the communicable-and-true beliefs.

Evolution, being driven by locally communicable events, cannot give an advantage to truth, that's true, but without truth, they would be no communicable events at all. So consciousness has to exist to make sense of the relative selection, by the universal mind, and the third person plural type of reality needed for sharable physical realities. It that sense, consciousness is not really a side effect, but is what make evolution and physical realities selectable by the "universal mind". Consciousness looks like a side effect, from inside, only in the Aristotelian picture. With comp, and its platonist consequences, we might as well say that matter and evolution is a side effect of consciousness. Without consciousness the notion of physical reality would lost his meaning, given that the physical reality can only result from the shared dreams, lived by the universal mind multiple instantiations. And consciousness can be associated with a range of behavior, but is not equal to any behavior. It is of the type of knowledge, and is a fixed point on self-doubting (like in Descartes). It is universal and exists, with comp, right at the "start" of arithmetical truth. It does not need to be selected, fro it exists at the start, and eventually is the one responsible for all possible observer selections.

The point here is difficult and subtle, and I am just trying to convey it. It takes into account the universal mind, as David pointed on recently, and which I have to endorse through thought experience with amnesia, (or some report of real experiences with some drugs) and the complete UDA reversal.

Otherwise, why did we not evolve as zombies?




You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"Everything List" group.
To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to 
For more options, visit this group at 

Reply via email to