On 11/3/2012 7:06 AM, Stephen P. King wrote:
On 11/3/2012 6:08 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote:
Dear Bruno,

No, that cannot be the case since statements do not even exist if the framework or theory that defines them does not exist, therefore there is not 'truth' for a non-exitence entity.

Brent already debunked this. The truth of a statement does not need the existence of the statement. You confuse again the truth of 1+1=2, with a possible claim of that truth, like "1+1=2".

Horsefeathers <http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/horsefeathers>! How is the truth of an arithmetic statement separable from any claim of that truth? What is the possible value of a statement that we can make no claims about?

You are causing confusion by asking how the truth of a statement is separable from any claim of that truth. But claims and statements are the same thing - so of course they are not seperable. Bruno is saying that the claim/statement is NOT the same as the fact that makes it true. "1+1=2" is a claim; it's the claim that 1+1=2. And that's a true claim; it's true that 1+1=2 whether you claim it or not.


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