Re: [Inkscape-docs] Cleaning round

[Maren Hachmann]

Thank you! It's good to see that long list shrink again.

 Maren

Am 26.01.20 um 18:01 schrieb ar j:
> ok saw let the contest over notes. will clear.
> 
> On Mon, 20 Jan 2020, 22:38 Maren Hachmann,  <mailto:ma...@goos-habermann.de>> wrote:
> 
> Thank you for helping to get rid of the spammers!
> 
> What contest are you referring to? The About Screen contest is finished
> since mid December.
> 
>  Maren
> 
> Am 20.01.20 um 07:37 schrieb ar j:
> > Greetings list,
> >
> > i just did a moderation round on the gallery. When the contest is
> over,
> > i'll delete the remaining ones
> >
> > --
> > Abdur-Rahmaan Janhangeer
> > https://github.com/Abdur-rahmaanJ
> >
> >
> > ___
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> > Inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> <mailto:Inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net>
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-docs
> >
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] Cleaning round

[Maren Hachmann]

Thank you for helping to get rid of the spammers!

What contest are you referring to? The About Screen contest is finished
since mid December.

 Maren

Am 20.01.20 um 07:37 schrieb ar j:
> Greetings list,
> 
> i just did a moderation round on the gallery. When the contest is over,
> i'll delete the remaining ones
> 
> -- 
> Abdur-Rahmaan Janhangeer
> https://github.com/Abdur-rahmaanJ
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] Small sections of text missing in inkscape translation statistics page

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Victor,

can you please report this as an issue at
https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-docs/documentation ?

Thank you!

 Maren

Am 23.10.19 um 07:41 schrieb Victor Westmann:
> Hello Inkscapers,
> 
> I hope everyone is doing fantastically well! I noticed that on the
> inkscape website link
> (https://inkscape.org/doc/devel/translations-statistics-master.html)
> there are a couple of sections that are missing!
> 
> They are: Shapes, Tips, Tracing, Tracing Pixel Art.
> 
> Let me know if I missed anything or if there is something that I can
> do to help fix this.
> 
> Thanks,
> Victor
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] Permission to edit website content

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Rhonda,

can you please open a bug report on gitlab for this?

https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-web/issues

If you want to learn about editing the website, see
http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php/WebSite

Kind Regards
 Maren


Am 18.10.19 um 18:10 schrieb suss.rhon--- via Inkscape-docs:
> Hello:
> 
> I am completely new to this list, so please excuse this newbie question.
> I noticed some non-functional links on the site and I would like to be
> able to correct them. Could you tell me how I can do this? I created an
> Inkscape account just today. Thank you in advance for your help. Have a
> nice day.
> 
> Rhonda
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] inbox coming back to website?

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 21.05.19 um 16:26 schrieb brynn:
> Hi Friends,
>    Is the Inbox ever coming back to the website, for personal
> messages?  I know it was back for a while, but then it was gone again.

I second this question - I need to contact new translators from time to
time, and I have no idea if they reply or not...

Maren

> 
>    I'm just wondering if I should start to save the messages which I
> need to send out from time to time, as a moderator.  Without the inbox,
> I wouldn't be able to access them, if it became necessary.
> 
> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] can't curate the description in gallery

[Maren Hachmann]

That's an issue with Saiba's spying email program, nothing to do with
sourceforge.

Maren

Am 21.04.19 um 22:43 schrieb brynn:
> Happy Easter, Saiba!
> 
> But geez (anyone), what the heck happened to the link I provided, to the
> image in the gallery?
> 
> Did SF change it?  Is it because I used the word "spam" in my message?
> 
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Saiba Akhtar
> Sent: Sunday, April 21, 2019 9:27 AM
> To: brynn ; Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] can't curate the description in gallery
> 
> 
> 
> hi all,
> 
> happy Easter, hope everyone enjoys the long weekend!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: brynn 
> Sent: 21 April 2019 14:08:50
> To: Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: [Inkscape-docs] can't curate the description in gallery
> 
> 
> Hi Friends,
>    When the Curate feature for the gallery first came out, I could
> edit the
> description (along with almost everything about an image).  Now it seems I
> can't.  But that's where the spam is!  That's where the spam always will
> be.
> 
>    The images seem entirely appropriate, and I would not remove
> them.  But
> if I can't delete the spam from the description, the only other option
> is to
> remove the images (3 of them today).
> 
>    Thoughts?  Bug report?  Example:
> https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https:%2F%2Finkscape.org%2F~yendrifernando%2F%25E2%2598%2585broken-linkdata=02%7C01%7Csa2438%40live.mdx.ac.uk%7C0a6723f0fc3047098a6108d6c65a999c%7C38e37b88a3a148cf9f056537427fed24%7C0%7C0%7C636914489774187974sdata=jI8ru3hizNDr9cogyRRiIxrDn1OmAeLFvytgqR8E%2FzE%3Dreserved=0
> And there are 2 more
> (same member).
> 
> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] is voting working for gallery moderation?

[Maren Hachmann]

You can get to your messaging settings via the user profile (there's a
button at the bottom).

Are you subscribed to new gallery posts?

If you are, and it doesn't work, please make a bug report at
https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-web/issues

Maren


Am 03.04.19 um 14:00 schrieb ar j:
> #agree
> 
> maybe we need some super moderators as calling others just to be able to
> delete something is not very nice.
> 
> personally one problem i get is that i can't be notified of new
> submissions in gallery. maybe i missed something?
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Issue tracking for Inkscape moves to Gitlab

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 17.01.19 um 03:06 schrieb Bryce Harrington:

> Well, having a unified inbox on gitlab as you proposed may get us
> partway towards something like that.  If we accept 0.92 bugs in gitlab
> (for 0.92.4 and newer) then we can be more aggressive at discouraging
> bug filing on launchpad - we can scrub all mention of it and all links
> to it from all our public pages.

- On most public pages scrubbing is not possible (links to specific bugs
in the FAQ, for example) or does not make sense (instructions for bug
triage, instructions for searching for existing reports before posting a
new one).

Maren



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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Issue tracking for Inkscape moves to Gitlab

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Brynn,

I've updated the 'report bugs' page already, in a preliminary manner,
because the release will probably be tomorrow, and the page is linked
from the release notes.

So it needs to be up-to-date whenever someone decides to publish.
Whoever that may be.

I'd like to ask Marc, Patrick and Bryce to review the changes.
https://inkscape.org/contribute/report-bugs/

They affect the 'search the bugtrackers' part, and I changed the link at
the bottom.

Thank you for offering your help, Brynn, and already helping to collect
info!

Would you be able to look out for more links to launchpad that need to
be updated on the website (probably FAQ and more)?

Maren


Am 15.01.19 um 17:08 schrieb brynn:
> I could try to do that.  But I need specifics.
> 
> Is the only thing that needs to be changed is the link (and supporting
> text around the link, if necessary)?  Should the link go to
> https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape/issues, or directly to open a new
> Issue form?
> 
> Of course I'll list every change for translators and send it to you :-)
> 
> I'm probably not the best person to update the wiki.  I'm not very
> familiar with it.
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2019 8:08 AM
> To: inkscape-de...@lists.sourceforge.net ; Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Issue tracking for
> Inkscape moves to Gitlab
> 
> Hi,
> 
> could someone help web content editors by browsing the website and
> looking for places that require updating?
> 
> I think it's probably FAQ, the bug report page, contribute testing, and
> develop pages.
> 
> Then there must also be some Wiki pages.
> 
> I'm currently a bit busy with other stuff, so I'd appreciate if someone
> gave me a list with links + screenshots or similar.
> 
> Or, if someone updated the pages, that would be cool - but then I'd
> still need a list (preferably with screenshots), for being able to
> notify translators.
> 
> Maren
> 
> Am 15.01.19 um 10:56 schrieb Bryce Harrington:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> As of this week, the Inkscape project is shifting to Gitlab for issue
>> tracking in place of Launchpad.
>>
>>   https://gitlab.com/groups/inkscape/-/issues
>>
>>
>> We've been using Gitlab for our code hosting and other purposes for a
>> year and a half now[1], and have found it to be reliable and
>> convenient.  We didn't migrate Issue Tracking until now, so we could
>> take time to make sure we had a plan:
>>
>> 1.  Going forward, new bug reports should be filed only in Gitlab.
>>
>> 2.  Launchpad will remain available as a historical archive of our bug
>>     reports.  Filing bugs there will remain possible for now, but
>>     discouraged.
>>
>> 3.  Bugs in Launchpad that are still reproducible in Inkscape 0.92.4 or
>>     newer can be re-filed on Gitlab and closed on Launchpad.
>>
>> We are planning efforts to help organize the migration work and keep
>> track of progress.  More info on this will be coming soon.
>>
>> Eventually, when the necessary bugs have been migrated, bug reporting in
>> Launchpad will be shut off.
>>
>> We're enthused about this change, and hope you too will find gitlab a
>> more user friendly way to report issues, and we'd love your help
>> triaging and solving Inkscape bugs.
>>
>> Bryce
>>
>>
>> 1:  https://inkscape.org/news/2017/06/10/inkscape-moves-gitlab/
>>
>>
>>
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>>
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Issue tracking for Inkscape moves to Gitlab

[Maren Hachmann]

I haven't heard back from Bryce yet, unfortunately, but Marc explained
about why he doesn't think 0.92.4 bug reports should go to the new bug
tracker here:
https://chat.inkscape.org/channel/team_devel?msg=NHquGcpEQcebFKjB3

Use 1.0alpha as a starting point for now, we can rephrase that later.

Just so we have something to link to.

Not sure where 0.92.4 issues should be reported then, though. Not
everyone will be able to do a test with 1.0alpha for their same issue,
and it is still the official release.

Maren

Am 15.01.19 um 18:07 schrieb brynn:
> If either 0.92.4 or 1.0 alpha is about to be released, can't the edits
> just say 'from now on'?   (Not really "from now on" specifically, but in
> effect it would be - here's where new bug reports go now.) Because users
> wouldn't be reporting bugs for 0.92.3 or older, after 0.92.4 is
> released, would they?
> 
> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2019 9:19 AM
> To: brynn ; inkscape-de...@lists.sourceforge.net ; Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Issue tracking for
> Inkscape moves to Gitlab
> 
> Am 15.01.19 um 17:08 schrieb brynn:
>> I could try to do that.  But I need specifics.
> 
> - Thank you, Brynn.
> 
>> Is the only thing that needs to be changed is the link (and supporting
>> text around the link, if necessary)?
> 
> - No, the new policy about both bug trackers needs to be mentioned and
> explained on the 'report bugs' page, at least.
> 
> However, for that we still need a reply from Bryce about the Inkscape
> version that applies to. Wait for that before you start, please.
> 
> I can see why he said 0.92.4 and higher - because that's what is
> currently under development. I don't know what Marc's rationale is for
> only intending to do this for alpha and higher. Maybe there was some
> kind of misunderstanding in their communication earlier, dunno, just
> know that we need to know before we make any changes, and even before we
> publish the release news article...
> 
> On the other pages, probably a simple switch is sufficient, or change to
> a link to report bugs page if suitable, to have 1 central place that
> needs to be updated instead of multiple places.
> 
>> Should the link go to
>> https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape/issues, or directly to open a new
>> Issue form?
> 
> - Better allow users to search for duplicates first, so not the new
> issue form.
> 
>> Of course I'll list every change for translators and send it to you :-)
> 
> - Thank you, that will be awesome.
> 
>> I'm probably not the best person to update the wiki.  I'm not very
>> familiar with it.
> 
> - If you find something that needs updating, you can let us know here,
> then.
> 
> Maren
> 
>> All best,
>> brynn
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2019 8:08 AM
>> To: inkscape-de...@lists.sourceforge.net ; Inkscape-Docs
>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Issue tracking for
>> Inkscape moves to Gitlab
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> could someone help web content editors by browsing the website and
>> looking for places that require updating?
>>
>> I think it's probably FAQ, the bug report page, contribute testing, and
>> develop pages.
>>
>> Then there must also be some Wiki pages.
>>
>> I'm currently a bit busy with other stuff, so I'd appreciate if someone
>> gave me a list with links + screenshots or similar.
>>
>> Or, if someone updated the pages, that would be cool - but then I'd
>> still need a list (preferably with screenshots), for being able to
>> notify translators.
>>
>> Maren
>>
>> Am 15.01.19 um 10:56 schrieb Bryce Harrington:
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> As of this week, the Inkscape project is shifting to Gitlab for issue
>>> tracking in place of Launchpad.
>>>
>>>   https://gitlab.com/groups/inkscape/-/issues
>>>
>>>
>>> We've been using Gitlab for our code hosting and other purposes for a
>>> year and a half now[1], and have found it to be reliable and
>>> convenient.  We didn't migrate Issue Tracking until now, so we could
>>> take time to make sure we had a plan:
>>>
>>> 1.  Going forward, new bug reports should be filed only in Gitlab.
>>>
>>> 2.  Launchpad will remain available as a historical archive of our bug
>>>     reports.  Filing bugs there will remain possible for now, but
>>>     discouraged.
>>>
>>> 3.  Bugs in Launchpad that are still reproducible in Inkscape 0.92.4 

Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Issue tracking for Inkscape moves to Gitlab

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 15.01.19 um 17:08 schrieb brynn:
> I could try to do that.  But I need specifics.

- Thank you, Brynn.

> Is the only thing that needs to be changed is the link (and supporting
> text around the link, if necessary)?  

- No, the new policy about both bug trackers needs to be mentioned and
explained on the 'report bugs' page, at least.

However, for that we still need a reply from Bryce about the Inkscape
version that applies to. Wait for that before you start, please.

I can see why he said 0.92.4 and higher - because that's what is
currently under development. I don't know what Marc's rationale is for
only intending to do this for alpha and higher. Maybe there was some
kind of misunderstanding in their communication earlier, dunno, just
know that we need to know before we make any changes, and even before we
publish the release news article...

On the other pages, probably a simple switch is sufficient, or change to
a link to report bugs page if suitable, to have 1 central place that
needs to be updated instead of multiple places.

> Should the link go to
> https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape/issues, or directly to open a new
> Issue form?

- Better allow users to search for duplicates first, so not the new
issue form.

> Of course I'll list every change for translators and send it to you :-)

- Thank you, that will be awesome.

> I'm probably not the best person to update the wiki.  I'm not very
> familiar with it.

- If you find something that needs updating, you can let us know here, then.

Maren

> All best,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2019 8:08 AM
> To: inkscape-de...@lists.sourceforge.net ; Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Issue tracking for
> Inkscape moves to Gitlab
> 
> Hi,
> 
> could someone help web content editors by browsing the website and
> looking for places that require updating?
> 
> I think it's probably FAQ, the bug report page, contribute testing, and
> develop pages.
> 
> Then there must also be some Wiki pages.
> 
> I'm currently a bit busy with other stuff, so I'd appreciate if someone
> gave me a list with links + screenshots or similar.
> 
> Or, if someone updated the pages, that would be cool - but then I'd
> still need a list (preferably with screenshots), for being able to
> notify translators.
> 
> Maren
> 
> Am 15.01.19 um 10:56 schrieb Bryce Harrington:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> As of this week, the Inkscape project is shifting to Gitlab for issue
>> tracking in place of Launchpad.
>>
>>   https://gitlab.com/groups/inkscape/-/issues
>>
>>
>> We've been using Gitlab for our code hosting and other purposes for a
>> year and a half now[1], and have found it to be reliable and
>> convenient.  We didn't migrate Issue Tracking until now, so we could
>> take time to make sure we had a plan:
>>
>> 1.  Going forward, new bug reports should be filed only in Gitlab.
>>
>> 2.  Launchpad will remain available as a historical archive of our bug
>>     reports.  Filing bugs there will remain possible for now, but
>>     discouraged.
>>
>> 3.  Bugs in Launchpad that are still reproducible in Inkscape 0.92.4 or
>>     newer can be re-filed on Gitlab and closed on Launchpad.
>>
>> We are planning efforts to help organize the migration work and keep
>> track of progress.  More info on this will be coming soon.
>>
>> Eventually, when the necessary bugs have been migrated, bug reporting in
>> Launchpad will be shut off.
>>
>> We're enthused about this change, and hope you too will find gitlab a
>> more user friendly way to report issues, and we'd love your help
>> triaging and solving Inkscape bugs.
>>
>> Bryce
>>
>>
>> 1:  https://inkscape.org/news/2017/06/10/inkscape-moves-gitlab/
>>
>>
>>
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>>
> 
> 
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[Inkscape-docs] SFC-Banner: Please exchange for SCALE Hackfest donation banner.

[Maren Hachmann]

Martin,

it's the last day of Conservancy's fund raiser today.

Can you please exchange the banner text and link on the website for one
for the Hackfest donations?

Link: https://inkscape.org/support-us/hackfests/

If you want to save yourself an update (for the Saarbrücken Hackfest),
don't make it too specific (currently, SCALE is the target, but later it
will be Saarbrücken) ;-).

Maren


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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Issue tracking for Inkscape moves to Gitlab

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi,

could someone help web content editors by browsing the website and
looking for places that require updating?

I think it's probably FAQ, the bug report page, contribute testing, and
 develop pages.

Then there must also be some Wiki pages.

I'm currently a bit busy with other stuff, so I'd appreciate if someone
gave me a list with links + screenshots or similar.

Or, if someone updated the pages, that would be cool - but then I'd
still need a list (preferably with screenshots), for being able to
notify translators.

 Maren

Am 15.01.19 um 10:56 schrieb Bryce Harrington:
> Hi all,
> 
> As of this week, the Inkscape project is shifting to Gitlab for issue
> tracking in place of Launchpad.
> 
>   https://gitlab.com/groups/inkscape/-/issues
> 
> 
> We've been using Gitlab for our code hosting and other purposes for a
> year and a half now[1], and have found it to be reliable and
> convenient.  We didn't migrate Issue Tracking until now, so we could
> take time to make sure we had a plan:
> 
> 1.  Going forward, new bug reports should be filed only in Gitlab.
> 
> 2.  Launchpad will remain available as a historical archive of our bug
> reports.  Filing bugs there will remain possible for now, but
> discouraged.
> 
> 3.  Bugs in Launchpad that are still reproducible in Inkscape 0.92.4 or
> newer can be re-filed on Gitlab and closed on Launchpad.
> 
> We are planning efforts to help organize the migration work and keep
> track of progress.  More info on this will be coming soon.
> 
> Eventually, when the necessary bugs have been migrated, bug reporting in
> Launchpad will be shut off.
> 
> We're enthused about this change, and hope you too will find gitlab a
> more user friendly way to report issues, and we'd love your help
> triaging and solving Inkscape bugs.
> 
> Bryce
> 
> 
> 1:  https://inkscape.org/news/2017/06/10/inkscape-moves-gitlab/
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] website messaging?

[Maren Hachmann]

Oh, right, I sent you a test message a week ago or so.

I conclude that you didn't get it?

 Maren

Am 27.12.18 um 23:09 schrieb brynn:
> Hi Friends,
>    Is there an ETA for website messaging to come back online?  I use
> it for moderation, and have not been able to contact members for weeks
> or a couple of months now, I guess.
> 
> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] screencasters video tutorials on the website

[Maren Hachmann]

There is:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCKKj0FJtVE8sGn4afabKvTA

CR has been using this for the Inkscape videos.

I don't know, though, what the heathenx videos have to do with this?

Maren

Am 17.12.18 um 18:29 schrieb brynn:
> I'm not sure.  The screencasters video are being uploaded into a
> member's personal account.
> 
> I guess there's probably not an official account.  I guess the Inkscape
> website can host any official videos.  Right?
> 
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: ar j
> Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2018 10:57 PM
> To: brynn
> Cc: Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] screencasters video tutorials on the website
> 
> 
> is there an official youtube account for inkscape?
> 
> 
> Abdur-Rahmaan Janhangeer
> 
> 
> On Tue, 6 Nov 2018, 08:46 brynn,  wrote:
> Hi Friends,
>    Relatively recently, the screencasters.heathenx website was
> closed.  I
> just found out about it a month or 2 ago.  Mark (aka Xav, on
> InkscapeForum) has
> acquired copies of most if not all of them.  Little by little, he has been
> uploading them to YouTube.
> https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9iOkFutSFbcTCzQlyCr5Ig/videos  I think
> he said
> he's been adding approx 3 per week.
> 
>    I've just edited the link on the Learn page
> (https://inkscape.org/learn/) of the website, and added a brief notation
> about
> the videos being added to YT.  On the Video Tutorials page
> (https://inkscape.org/learn/videos/), where there was simply a link to that
> website, I deleted it.
> 
>    The reason I deleted it, is because I don't have time to do this
> myself.
> But I recall a year or maybe closer to 2 years ago someone was
> interested in
> adding individual videos (links to them, I mean) to that page.  So I
> thought
> they (or anyone) might like to kind of keep track of what's been
> uploaded to YT,
> and choose the "Best of" and add them to the Video Tutorials page.
> 
>    If someone is interested to do this, but they don't already have
> access
> to edit the page, just reply to this message, and someone can get you
> set up to
> do that.
> 
>    If no on is interested, or has time right now, there are already
> other
> videos on the page.  So I think it will be ok.  But if anyone is
> interested, the
> best of those videos would be nice to include there.
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> 
> 
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> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Website update: current status

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 06.11.18 um 04:19 schrieb brynn:
> Oops.  Sorry, I have a couple more questions.
> 
> 1 -- I don't understand what this means:
> 
>> As redirects aren't working
> properly, you need to include the language code for the language you're
> linking to in the link.
> 
> Is that something which translators need to understand? 

- Yes, you probably won't need to worry about this.

> If it's for
> everyone, what is meant by "redirect" in this context?
> 
> 2 -- About links to another page on the website:
> 
>> For a link that is goes to another page on inkscape.org, do not include
> the domain. In the protocol dropdown, select '' instead of
> 'https' to be able to leave it out.
> 
> Perhaps "" was chosen because of its width?  But I wonder if
> "inkscape.org" or something else more specific might reduce confusion? 
> I'm just thinking for myself, if it happens I don't make any edits for a
> few months, I'll forget that I'm supposed to use  for local links.

- In a few months (or maybe earlier), we will have an automatted search
mask for internal links. Please try to remember it until then.

See https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-web/issues/238 for updates.

> Hhmm  Ok, I'm working on adding a new FAQ, and trying to make a link
> to the Community page.  I choose  and then I paste in the URL. 
> But the protocol switches itself to https://, and the https:// is
> removed from the URL.  But the domain is still there.
> 
> I can switch it back to .  But should the URL field just say
> "community/" ?  Or should it be "/community/" ?  It looks like
> "/community/" is the right answer.  I'll try to publish.  Ok, it
> looks like that worked  :-)

- Yes, see also the linked Wiki page below where it is explained in
detail. Specifically, you will find the relevant section at
http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php/WebSite#Specific_Instructions

Maren

> Thank you very much,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Friday, November 02, 2018 5:14 PM
> To: Inkscape Devel List ; translators ; Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Website update: current status
> 
> Hi,
> 
> another status update:
> 
> Martin has worked to fix the issues that had the greatest impact on
> website use, after the switch to the new Python 3 version of the website.
> 
> What works again:
> -
> 
> - News editing and translation
> - CMS page editing and publishing
> - Registration
> - Uploading images
> 
> What doesn't work:
> --
> 
> - Correct menu language (when you visit the website, you may get English
> pages, but see a menu in German, Italian, or some other language. This
> doesn't happen consistently.)
> - Providing fallback pages if a page doesn't exist in a certain language
> (it then just goes directly to the English page, with the - hopefully -
> English menu).
> 
> This means that translators must pay extra attention on the URL, to see
> if they are working on their own language, and not the English page!
> 
> - Messages between users
> - ... and some more, see https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-web/issues
> 
> What works differently:
> ---
> 
> The website does no longer use link plugins. Those were a source of a
> lot of issues, confusing editors and the CMS alike. Martin converted all
> existing link plugins to normal html links.
> 
> This means that - unless a Table of contents, an image, a gallery, a
> user list or any other plugin are part of the page - one can now
> copy-paste almost any text from one page to another, without risking to
> break something.
> 
> All new links will now be inserted using the link icon in the editor (or
>  in the source mode). As redirects aren't working
> properly, you need to include the language code for the language you're
> linking to in the link.
> 
> For a link that is goes to another page on inkscape.org, do not include
> the domain. In the protocol dropdown, select '' instead of
> 'https' to be able to leave it out.
> 
> Another side effect of the change seems to be that publishing works a
> lot faster than we're used to.
> 
> The Website instructions Wiki page has been updated to reflect the
> current changes:
> http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php/WebSite
> 
> Help needed
> ---
> 
> Martin has asked me to ask if someone (preferably someone who is fluent
> in Python, and if possible, has Django experience) can help with website
> bug fixing. A good place to start would be to install the website
> locally on your computer (requires Linux, or a VM with Linux), and to
> check on the issues section for the website on gitlab.
> 
> Vectors team, could you publish this request on social media? Ask Martin
> for details :)
> 
> Maren
> 
> 



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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Website update: current status

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 06.11.18 um 04:51 schrieb brynn:
>> - Not for me... When I click send, I get a blank page.
> 
> When I click send, I'm redirected to my profile page, which is exactly
> what usually happens when I send a message.  It seemed to me just like
> usual.  It only occurred to me later that they could not see them.

Hi Brynn,
can you add the info about the differing behavior to the bug report,
please? Might have to do with languages again, then.

https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-web/issues/252

Maren

>> - I don't think they got them, no.
> 
> Ok, I'll just send new messages when it comes back online.
> 
> Thank you very much,
> brynn
> 
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Monday, November 05, 2018 7:20 PM
> To: brynn ; Inkscape-Docs
> Cc: Martin Owens
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Website update: current
> status
> 
> Am 06.11.18 um 01:56 schrieb brynn:
>> Thanks for the update, Maren.  And thanks - As Always - for your hard
>> work on the website, Martin!  And of course thanks to everyone else who
>> pitches in!
>>
>> I just wanted to make one note.  And ask a question.
>>
>> It is possible to send messages.by which I mean that it appears that
>> a message is sent.  However, there's no way to receive messages.
>> There's no access to inboxes.
> 
> - Not for me... When I click send, I get a blank page. It does not get
> sent by email, and it does not arrive in my inbox on the website (which
> is accessible at https://inkscape.org/alerts). Just the icon is missing,
> the pages are there. I tested with my two accounts, in both directions.
> 
> 
>> I actually had sent 2 or 3 messages (moderation issues) before I
>> realized that we can't access our inboxes.  Will those members
>> eventually receive them?  Or should I plan to re-send them later?
> 
> - I don't think they got them, no.
> 
>> Thanks again!
>> brynn
>>
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
>> Sent: Friday, November 02, 2018 5:14 PM
>> To: Inkscape Devel List ; translators ; Inkscape-Docs
>> Subject: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Website update: current status
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> another status update:
>>
>> Martin has worked to fix the issues that had the greatest impact on
>> website use, after the switch to the new Python 3 version of the website.
>>
>> What works again:
>> -
>>
>> - News editing and translation
>> - CMS page editing and publishing
>> - Registration
>> - Uploading images
>>
>> What doesn't work:
>> --
>>
>> - Correct menu language (when you visit the website, you may get English
>> pages, but see a menu in German, Italian, or some other language. This
>> doesn't happen consistently.)
>> - Providing fallback pages if a page doesn't exist in a certain language
>> (it then just goes directly to the English page, with the - hopefully -
>> English menu).
>>
>> This means that translators must pay extra attention on the URL, to see
>> if they are working on their own language, and not the English page!
>>
>> - Messages between users
>> - ... and some more, see https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-web/issues
>>
>> What works differently:
>> ---
>>
>> The website does no longer use link plugins. Those were a source of a
>> lot of issues, confusing editors and the CMS alike. Martin converted all
>> existing link plugins to normal html links.
>>
>> This means that - unless a Table of contents, an image, a gallery, a
>> user list or any other plugin are part of the page - one can now
>> copy-paste almost any text from one page to another, without risking to
>> break something.
>>
>> All new links will now be inserted using the link icon in the editor (or
>>  in the source mode). As redirects aren't working
>> properly, you need to include the language code for the language you're
>> linking to in the link.
>>
>> For a link that is goes to another page on inkscape.org, do not include
>> the domain. In the protocol dropdown, select '' instead of
>> 'https' to be able to leave it out.
>>
>> Another side effect of the change seems to be that publishing works a
>> lot faster than we're used to.
>>
>> The Website instructions Wiki page has been updated to reflect the
>> current changes:
>> http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php/WebSite
>>
>> Help needed
>> ---
>>
>> Martin has asked me to ask if someone (preferably someone who 

[Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Website update: current status

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi,

another status update:

Martin has worked to fix the issues that had the greatest impact on
website use, after the switch to the new Python 3 version of the website.

What works again:
-

- News editing and translation
- CMS page editing and publishing
- Registration
- Uploading images

What doesn't work:
--

- Correct menu language (when you visit the website, you may get English
pages, but see a menu in German, Italian, or some other language. This
doesn't happen consistently.)
- Providing fallback pages if a page doesn't exist in a certain language
(it then just goes directly to the English page, with the - hopefully -
English menu).

This means that translators must pay extra attention on the URL, to see
if they are working on their own language, and not the English page!

- Messages between users
- ... and some more, see https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-web/issues

What works differently:
---

The website does no longer use link plugins. Those were a source of a
lot of issues, confusing editors and the CMS alike. Martin converted all
existing link plugins to normal html links.

This means that - unless a Table of contents, an image, a gallery, a
user list or any other plugin are part of the page - one can now
copy-paste almost any text from one page to another, without risking to
break something.

All new links will now be inserted using the link icon in the editor (or
 in the source mode). As redirects aren't working
properly, you need to include the language code for the language you're
linking to in the link.

For a link that is goes to another page on inkscape.org, do not include
the domain. In the protocol dropdown, select '' instead of
'https' to be able to leave it out.

Another side effect of the change seems to be that publishing works a
lot faster than we're used to.

The Website instructions Wiki page has been updated to reflect the
current changes:
http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php/WebSite

Help needed
---

Martin has asked me to ask if someone (preferably someone who is fluent
in Python, and if possible, has Django experience) can help with website
bug fixing. A good place to start would be to install the website
locally on your computer (requires Linux, or a VM with Linux), and to
check on the issues section for the website on gitlab.

Vectors team, could you publish this request on social media? Ask Martin
for details :)

Maren

Am 12.10.18 um 03:14 schrieb Maren Hachmann:
> Hi there,
> 
> Martin, Bryce and Travis from our friendly hosters at OSUOSL have worked
> on switching the inkscape.org website to the newer version this evening.
> 
> In some parts of the world, due to DNS propagation, you might not yet
> see the new page, but you will soon (it looks pretty much the same,
> though, just the backend is newer).
> 
> It now features a new shiny django (yay!).
> 
> Unfortunately, it currently has problems with page edits, news edits and
> resource uploads.
> 
> Please hold off editing anything on it, to not lose any work.
> 
> Martin is working on fixing things, and will let you know when it's good
> for editing again.
> 
> Downloads and viewing the pages work as usual (except for viewing pasted
> texts), so most people won't be affected by the issues.
> 
> Kind Regards,
>  Maren
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] Introduction

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Michael,

thank you for joining us here!

It's a good combination that you have skills in both technical writing
and in Inkscape :) Your help is very welcome, with any of the chapters
(preferably those whose images have already been fixed).

Re-reading them lately, I found a lot of places where I now think they
could be phrased better, or even the approach could be changed a bit, to
make it easier for the readers.

I've used these last days since you first offered your help to prepare
the sample chapter so it's going to be more helpful, to update all those
README files, and to get some basic formatting in, so you'll be better
able to see where we're going with the guide.

I'm currently going through the chapters alphabetically (see
changelog/progress here:
https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-docs/manuals/commits/setup_rtd) to
have them well formatted.

At the moment, my focus is on images. After that, I would like to put
the first version online officially. In between, when I notice something
that I find could be better in the logical structure of the guide, I try
to improve that.

Changes are happening at a fast pace currently. All changes that are in
the changelog linked above also made it to
https://inkscape-manuals.readthedocs.io (automatically).

In order to find a good workflow for you, I'd like to know a bit about
your toolset:

Are you familiar with any of the technical tools that are used for the
manual? (git / gitlab, reStructured Text, Sphinx, LaTeX, readthedocs)

What operating system are you using?

How would you like to suggest changes? Would you rather like to work on
the source files directly, or maybe do you prefer copy-pasting your
suggestions into one of those 'issues' on gitlab?

Would you prefer if we didn't use the alphabetical order, but rather the
chapter order, for working through the guide?

Let me know what you think,
 Kind Regards,
 Maren





Am 25.10.18 um 12:48 schrieb Michael Glascott:
> Hi all.
> 
>  
> 
> I had suggested updates for the old doc on Floss Manuals and Maren let
> me know about the new project.
> 
>  
> 
> I’m a technical writer and have been using Inkscape more and more recently.
> 
>  
> 
> I see there are a number of open proofreading issues, I could certainly
> help with these but if there are higher priorities, let me know.
> 
>  
> 
> I’ve glanced at the new manual, I’ll take a more in-depth look to
> familiarise myself with the style/layout etc.
> 
>  
> 
> Michael
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Sent from Mail  for
> Windows 10
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
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[Inkscape-docs] Website update: current status

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi there,

Martin, Bryce and Travis from our friendly hosters at OSUOSL have worked
on switching the inkscape.org website to the newer version this evening.

In some parts of the world, due to DNS propagation, you might not yet
see the new page, but you will soon (it looks pretty much the same,
though, just the backend is newer).

It now features a new shiny django (yay!).

Unfortunately, it currently has problems with page edits, news edits and
resource uploads.

Please hold off editing anything on it, to not lose any work.

Martin is working on fixing things, and will let you know when it's good
for editing again.

Downloads and viewing the pages work as usual (except for viewing pasted
texts), so most people won't be affected by the issues.

Kind Regards,
 Maren


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[Inkscape-docs] inkscape.org offline since last night (probably)

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi there,

could someone please have a look at what's wrong with inkscape.org?

Last night, when I went to bed, it was too slow to respond, and now it's
just plain offline (ping works, though).

As the only email from OSUOSL lately was about random reboots, maybe the
reboot didn't go well?

Maren

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Re: [Inkscape-docs] problems on Around the Internet page

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 08.08.2018 um 11:33 schrieb brynn:

...

> 
>    a -- Is this something that should be added to the Community To-Do
> List page on the Inkscape website?
>    b -- Or maybe it's a quick fix which someone could do in the near
> future?
>    c -- Or should the item just be deleted from Around the Internet page?
>    d -- Or is there a better link to access the Inkscape images on
> Wikimedia?

- The warning isn't too relevant, but if it bothers you, use this page:
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:SVG_created_with_Inkscape

(or, if you have time for it, you could fix the images that are listed
on the page you linked on wikimedia, by adding/using the correct
template for them, or ask someone to do it (but really, not our job) -
and don't ask me how that works, I don't know.)

> 2 -- Museum of Sodipodi and Inkscape About Screens
> (http://gould.cx/ted/ink-about/)
> 
>    The linked page gives a 404 Not Found error.  Just one question:
> 
>    a -- I guess I've seen a lot of the About screen contest images in
> the gallery.  Is this the best URL for finding them?
> https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/?q=about  Or is there a better one?

You could link to:

- The real about screens:
https://inkscape.org/de/community/about-screen-contests/ (see bottom of
page)
https://inkscape.org/de/~inkscape/galleries/about-screens/

- The category with all of them:
https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/=about-screen-contest/

Maren

>    Thanks for comments or suggestions :-)
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> 
> 
> --
> 
> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] major update to Report Bugs page

[Maren Hachmann]

Sorry, that intermediate email that's quoted below never made it into my
inbox...

A page with a side panel can be selected when you select a new template
for the page.

Page > Templates > Side Bar Page

I don't know what Martin meant to put into the side bar.

Might be that changing the template will loose the contents again
(changing back might restore it).

Maren

Am 26.07.2018 um 05:56 schrieb brynn:
> Ok, did I do the table of contents template correctly?
> 
> https://inkscape.org/en/report-bugs-2-edit/
> 
> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: brynn
> Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2018 8:39 PM
> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net ; Maren Hachmann
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] major update to Report Bugs page
> 
> OMG!  I don't know what happened.  The last time I looked at it, which was
> shortly before I sent the original message, everything was fine!
> 
> No, I did not try to change the template.  I've actually been offline
> since my
> last reply, so I have no idea what might have happened.
> 
> There was some kind of problem with the site, during the time I was
> working on
> the page (when emails had been disabled, because of a suspected security
> issue).
> A couple of times, I had to try twice to publish, where it didn't go
> through the
> first time.  I don't know if that would be related to the security issue or
> notor if that could have erased the edit mode.
> 
> Should I go ahead and replace the contents in Edit mode?  Or should we
> try and
> figure out what went wrong first?
> 
> Just to make sure I do the right thing, I need to choose Table of
> Contents from
> the dropdown menu, right?  That's what Martin means by "side panel"
> isn't it?
> 
> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Sunday, July 22, 2018 6:59 PM
> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] major update to Report Bugs page
> 
> The page seems to be empty right now in edit mode (I was shocked a bit,
> when I visited it and it was empty - in published mode, it's still
> there, just made a copy, just in case...), but it's using a Normal
> template.
> 
> What happened? Was the contents lost on changing the template?
> 
> Maren
> 
> Am 22.07.2018 um 16:12 schrieb brynn:
>> I thought it was using the Normal Page template.  At least that's what I
>> was trying to do.  I was just going to copy that and paste it into the
>> already existing page, overwriting it.  If it's not the Normal Page, I
>> might need some help with that.
>>
>> I would definitely need help with the sidebar layout.  Maybe Patrick
>> knows how? He said he'd be busy this week, so moving it won't happen
>> immediately, either way.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> brynn
>>
>> -Original Message- From: docto...@gmail.com
>> Sent: Sunday, July 22, 2018 6:59 AM
>> To: brynn ; Inkscape-Docs
>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] major update to Report Bugs page
>>
>> Hi Brynn,
>>
>> The content to the page looks good overall.
>>
>> CMS wise, the page should use either the Normal Page, or the Sidebar
>> Page as the template. This is because we can't see for sure what it
>> will look like with an 'inherit' setting which picks a blank page.
>>
>> I'd also encourage the use of the sidebar template as it's been very
>> useful for functional pages where detailed content goes in the main
>> left side part and action buttons go on the right sidebar to make it
>> easy to quickly move.
>>
>> Best Regards, Martin Owens
>>
>> On Sun, 2018-07-22 at 04:05 -0600, brynn wrote:
>>> Hi Friends,
>>>     As a result of my comment and concern about a long "warning"
>>> message
>>> which was meant to remind bug reporters about what kind of info needs
>>> to be
>>> included in the bug report,
>>>
>>>     details here:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/inkscape/+bug/17744
>>> 04
>>>
>>> and also, it was the first time I realized that Help menu > Report a
>>> Bug goes
>>> directly to the Report Bugs page of the website
>>> (https://inkscape.org/en/contribute/report-bugs/)
>>>
>>> which in it's current state does not really perform as that kind of a
>>> function
>>> (it's more informational than instructional), Patrick and I have
>>> overhauled that
>>> page.  We wanted to put the proposed change to the website team,
>>> before setting
>>> it live.
>>>
>>>     Here's the propose

Re: [Inkscape-docs] extension testers needed

[Maren Hachmann]

Yes, that looks exactly like the solution that was chosen for the
multiselect in m23, too (but I think only CSS was used to display a
checkmark or an empty box as a bg image - however, that won't work on
mobile, without Ctrl key, I believe, so no matter what, it's going to
need some js - maybe not a whole library, though.).

Maren

Am 20.06.2018 um 10:11 schrieb Jabier Arraiza:
> 
> Thanks Maren for the feedback.
> I agree with you is better separated. The problem is the list is big
> for multiselect if we want all options displayed without scroll. Maybe
> is more clear the Martin version, the problem in Martin version is we
> not know we can select multiple items.
> 
> About the select with click, it can be done with a bit of JS. 
> 
> Maybe there is some extended JS plugins in the net we can use more
> fancy. There is some in the net I see that make a combobox like martin
> but each option with a check on one side to active/inactive. This seems
> to me better UI.
> 
> https://select2.org/getting-started/basic-usage
> http://www.jqueryfaqs.com/Articles/Multiple-Select-MultiSelect-DropDownList-with-CheckBoxes-using-jQuery.aspx
> 
> Regards.
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Maren Hachmann 
> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] extension testers needed
> Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2018 23:01:42 +0200
> 
> I agree about the multiselect (but don't like the design too much, I
> think it's better to have the items more separate, like it's done in
> Martin's version).
> 
> Jabier, as a non-smartphone owner, I wonder how does multiselect work
> without a keyboard? (we've recently had an m23 user who didn't even
> think of using Ctrl to select multiple options...).
> 
> Click-activate, click-deactivate would be useful then, I assume?
> 
> Maren
> 
> Am 19.06.2018 um 22:31 schrieb Jabier Arraiza:
>> Or maybe all the whole tags can be handled by one only multiselect
>> with
>> 3 groups.
>> https://inkscape.org/en/~jabiertxof/%E2%98%85screenshot-from-2018-06-
>> 19-22-28-49
>>
>> Regards.
>>
>> On Tue, 2018-06-19 at 14:38 -0400, Martin Owens wrote:
>>> On Sun, 2018-06-17 at 19:23 -0600, brynn wrote:
>>>> Yes, it could be something like check boxes for the systems and
>>>> versions.
>>>
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> Victor, Maren and Brynn, could you test the function I've just
>>> added
>>> to
>>> the upload form. It adds a drop down of selectable tags which only
>>> appear when you select a category that this group of tags is
>>> associated
>>> with. It uses the same selection as the gallery/category pages do
>>> (so
>>> for extensions we have a ready made list of options)
>>>
>>> https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/upload/
>>>
>>> It may need some tweaks, but I wanted to get the format in front of
>>> you
>>> sooner so you can try it out.
>>>
>>> Best Regards, Martin Owens
>>> Websites ᴙ Us
>>>
>>> ---
>>> ---
>>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>>> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>>> ___
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>>> Inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-docs
>>>
>>>
>>> -
>>> -
>>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>>> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>>>
>>>
>>> ___
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>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-docs
> 
> 
> -
> -
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] extension testers needed

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 20.06.2018 um 00:30 schrieb docto...@gmail.com:
> Gracias Jabier,
> 
> And thanks everyone for testing.
> 
>> Great work. Maybe if the dropdown is changed to a multiselect on
>> click become more easy to use, and become a dropdown on unfocus. Just
>> a idea.
> 
> I did experiment with a multi-select and even a checkbox based widget.
> The advantages of the dropdowns where it's use of existing code (no
> need to include more js) and it's consistency with other dropdowns
> overall.

- One disadvantage I see with the current version is that it may look
like people need to upload their extension three times, once for each OS
- or like they can only choose one OS.

Maybe it's just me, but I think that could become a source of
misunderstandings.

Maren

>> One question in licensed type why not put in the dropdown a extra
>> info
>> in GPLV2 "(as inkscape)" or something similar to help integrating
>> things into the codebase.
> 
> This is harder to think about. Changing the name is an administrative
> action (not a coding one) so one could change it any time. But it'd
> also change the display, the search text and any other place GPL would
> show otherwise.
> 
> Best Regards, Martin Owens
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] extension testers needed

[Maren Hachmann]

I agree about the multiselect (but don't like the design too much, I
think it's better to have the items more separate, like it's done in
Martin's version).

Jabier, as a non-smartphone owner, I wonder how does multiselect work
without a keyboard? (we've recently had an m23 user who didn't even
think of using Ctrl to select multiple options...).

Click-activate, click-deactivate would be useful then, I assume?

Maren

Am 19.06.2018 um 22:31 schrieb Jabier Arraiza:
> Or maybe all the whole tags can be handled by one only multiselect with
> 3 groups.
> https://inkscape.org/en/~jabiertxof/%E2%98%85screenshot-from-2018-06-19-22-28-49
> 
> Regards.
> 
> On Tue, 2018-06-19 at 14:38 -0400, Martin Owens wrote:
>> On Sun, 2018-06-17 at 19:23 -0600, brynn wrote:
>>> Yes, it could be something like check boxes for the systems and
>>> versions.
>>
>> Hello,
>>
>> Victor, Maren and Brynn, could you test the function I've just added
>> to
>> the upload form. It adds a drop down of selectable tags which only
>> appear when you select a category that this group of tags is
>> associated
>> with. It uses the same selection as the gallery/category pages do (so
>> for extensions we have a ready made list of options)
>>
>> https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/upload/
>>
>> It may need some tweaks, but I wanted to get the format in front of
>> you
>> sooner so you can try it out.
>>
>> Best Regards, Martin Owens
>> Websites ᴙ Us
>>
>> ---
>> ---
>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>> ___
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>> Inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-docs
>>
>>
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>> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>>
>>
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] Community

[Maren Hachmann]

Using google translate, it looks like a community to me, and it's now
listed in a list labelled 'International communities'.

I do think that's the better place for it to be - it is not just a
gallery, which is the category it was in previously.

Try
https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto=en=y=_t=de=UTF-8=https%3A%2F%2Fgimpscape.org%2F==url
to more easily see what the page is about (google translate can also be
used to view whole web pages in a different language).

You're right that the community practically lives on Telegram, but
Indonesian-speaking users will have the opportunity find out more about
the community before they join, when they visit the web page first
instead of Telegram directly.

Maren

Am 20.05.2018 um 23:13 schrieb brynn:
> I'm not sure, but I think their original request was to be listed on the
> Around the Internet page.  The reason I think that, is because of the
> instructions at the top of that page, to post a message in the Docs list
> and request to be listed (which is exactly what they did).
> 
> Also, the list of communites on the Communities page, are all support
> forums. That was my purpose in asking if they have a forum, then they
> could be listed there, too.
> 
> Possibly if you could change the link on Communities page, to their
> Telegraph account, it would still fit in the list of support
> communities.  But people can't find support on their website (no
> forum).  And they can still be listed on Around the Internet page.
> 
> Just my thoughts.
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2018 8:48 AM
> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Community
> 
> Hi Rania and Bryce,
> 
> I've moved the link to a better location on the website, i.e. you can
> find it at
> https://inkscape.org/en/community/
> 
> now.
> 
> Kind Regards,
> Maren
> 
> Am 18.05.2018 um 03:04 schrieb Bryce Harrington:
>> On Tue, May 15, 2018 at 10:05:30AM +0700, Rania Amina wrote:
>>> Hi, there!
>>> I'm Rania Amina, Inkscape user from Indonesia. Via this email, i
>>> wanna to
>>> inform about our community named Gimpscape ID. This community has
>>> focus on
>>> design by using open source software such as Inkscape, Gimp, Krita,
>>> etc. We
>>> active in Telegram [https://t.me/gimpscape]. We also have website [
>>> gimpscape.org] to accomodate tutorial, news, and artwork that created by
>>> our member every day.
>>>
>>> Hope our community can be included in Inkscape.org page. Thanks a lot.
>>>
>>> Rania Amina
>>
>> Hi Rania!
>>
>> At the Inkscape Hackfest it was brought up that there is a very active
>> and healthy community in Indonesia, and we really wanted to get in
>> contact with you, so I am really happy you've joined us here!
>>
>> Adding a link to your website from ours is certainly doable - I've added
>> you to the Community > Around the Internet page.
>>
>> But I wonder if there's other things we can do to tie Indonesia into the
>> larger community more strongly?  Can you tell us more about your group
>> and its activities?  Do you get together in person very often?  How do
>> the community members use Inkscape, and do any of you tinker with code?
>> Do members participate in the official (English)
>> irc/mailinglists/forums/facebook/etc.?  Would it be beneficial for the
>> community to have official Inkscape Indonesian-language discussion
>> channels?
>>
>> Thanks again for connecting, looking forward to more discussion.
>>
>> Bryce
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
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>> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-docs
>>
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] Community

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Rania and Bryce,

I've moved the link to a better location on the website, i.e. you can
find it at
https://inkscape.org/en/community/

now.

Kind Regards,
 Maren

Am 18.05.2018 um 03:04 schrieb Bryce Harrington:
> On Tue, May 15, 2018 at 10:05:30AM +0700, Rania Amina wrote:
>> Hi, there!
>> I'm Rania Amina, Inkscape user from Indonesia. Via this email, i wanna to
>> inform about our community named Gimpscape ID. This community has focus on
>> design by using open source software such as Inkscape, Gimp, Krita, etc. We
>> active in Telegram [https://t.me/gimpscape]. We also have website [
>> gimpscape.org] to accomodate tutorial, news, and artwork that created by
>> our member every day.
>>
>> Hope our community can be included in Inkscape.org page. Thanks a lot.
>>
>> Rania Amina
> 
> Hi Rania!
> 
> At the Inkscape Hackfest it was brought up that there is a very active
> and healthy community in Indonesia, and we really wanted to get in
> contact with you, so I am really happy you've joined us here!
> 
> Adding a link to your website from ours is certainly doable - I've added
> you to the Community > Around the Internet page.
> 
> But I wonder if there's other things we can do to tie Indonesia into the
> larger community more strongly?  Can you tell us more about your group
> and its activities?  Do you get together in person very often?  How do
> the community members use Inkscape, and do any of you tinker with code?
> Do members participate in the official (English)
> irc/mailinglists/forums/facebook/etc.?  Would it be beneficial for the
> community to have official Inkscape Indonesian-language discussion
> channels?
> 
> Thanks again for connecting, looking forward to more discussion.
> 
> Bryce
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] strange gallery behavior

[Maren Hachmann]

Known issue: https://bugs.launchpad.net/inkscape-web/+bug/1579061

Maren

Am 14.03.2018 um 13:42 schrieb brynn:
> Hi Friends,
>    Just doing some browsing in the gallery, in Most Popular order
> category. Is it just me, or do I see the exact same images scattered on
> pages 6, 7, 8 (but not in the same order) ??
> 
>    The image titled "Gastón" is on all three pages; Lazur's blue and
> brown Fibonacci sprial is on all 3 pages; an image titled "Lupo Ernest"
> is on pages 6, 7, 8, and 9; Lazur's 0.92 About Screen (wood shaving)
> also on all four of those pages; image titled "Red wine" on pages 9, 10,
> and 11; etc.
> 
>    I don't see this in other order categories, but I haven't looked
> past page 10 either.
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> PS - Let me know if you want a new Issue for this (although I might not
> know the proper terminology).
> 
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> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] new moderation features

[Maren Hachmann]

Thanks, that helps. Kudos for figuring out that weird reason.

Turns out one cannot subscribe to all news. I don't think it should
require me to subscribe to a specific language, when I have set it to
'all', though.

Screenshots:
http://i.imgur.com/3TxCOWG.png
http://i.imgur.com/Hi70BIT.png

Maren

Am 09.02.2018 um 17:26 schrieb Martin Owens:
> Thanks for trying Maren,
> 
> I've pushed a much more comprehensive set of changes, firstly by making
> form errors VERY visible. What's happening is that the form is being
> rejected because a field is required. The first fix was to tell the
> form that the field wasn't required, I don't know why it didn't work
> for you the second time though, so that's why I've pushed a bigger fix
> that shows tabs in red, keeps tabs present and shows field errors in
> red.
> 
> So hopefully when you test again, it'll either work, or fail in a
> really big showy way.
> 
> Best Regards, Martin Owens
> 
> On Fri, 2018-02-09 at 14:50 +0100, Maren Hachmann wrote:
>> Thanks for having a look.
>>
>> No, doesn't work.
>>
>> To reproduce:
>>
>> Visit https://inkscape.org/en/alerts/settings/
>> Go to one of the tabs (e.g. Website Page Published)
>> Move one of the sliders (e.g. Send Email Alert -> On)
>> Save Notification Settings
>>
>> Go to a different page.
>> Open Message settings page again.
>> All will be as before, the change was not registered. Emails are not
>> sent, either.
>>
>> Maren
>>
>> Am 09.02.2018 um 13:55 schrieb Martin Owens:
>>>
>>> Maren,
>>>
>>> Can you try now? I think I might have fixed the subscription saving
>>> issue.
>>>
>>> Martin,
>>>
>>> On Thu, 2018-02-08 at 19:07 -0700, brynn wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I think you misunderstood me.
>>>>
>>>> Let's say someone flags a member - anyone, moderator or regular
>>>> member.  If 
>>>> another moderator looks at that member's profile, they have no
>>>> idea
>>>> that member 
>>>> has already been flagged.
>>>>
>>>> That member probably has at least one reported resource in their
>>>> profile page, 
>>>> which is a clue that member might already be flagged.  But
>>>> sometimes
>>>> the member 
>>>> doesn't get flagged.
>>>>
>>>> Of course we can look at the Moderation Page, to find out if they
>>>> have been 
>>>> flagged.  But it would just be convenient to see it on the
>>>> profile
>>>> page, and not 
>>>> have to look around for it.
>>>>
>>>> I'm just thinking that maybe reported items all need to be
>>>> handled
>>>> the same way. 
>>>> Maybe reported Comments need to show some indication that it's
>>>> been
>>>> flagged?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> brynn
>>>>
>>>> -Original Message- 
>>>> From: Martin Owens
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2018 10:53 PM
>>>> To: brynn ; Inkscape-Docs
>>>> Cc: die humblex
>>>> Subject: Re: new moderation features
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Martin, would it be  possible to have a similar label
>>>>> for
>>>>> flagged
>>>>> members?  Just to prevent confusion?  Or is the idea more about
>>>>> identifying
>>>>> hidden things, while members don't get hidden?
>>>> Users get deleted when they are censured. So there's no flag to
>>>> show.
>>>> They and their objects are toast (that includes anything they've
>>>> posted)
>>>>
>>>> Best Regard, Martin Owens 
>>>>
>>> -
>>> -
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>>>
>>
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] new moderation features

[Maren Hachmann]

Thanks for having a look.

No, doesn't work.

To reproduce:

Visit https://inkscape.org/en/alerts/settings/
Go to one of the tabs (e.g. Website Page Published)
Move one of the sliders (e.g. Send Email Alert -> On)
Save Notification Settings

Go to a different page.
Open Message settings page again.
All will be as before, the change was not registered. Emails are not
sent, either.

Maren

Am 09.02.2018 um 13:55 schrieb Martin Owens:
> Maren,
> 
> Can you try now? I think I might have fixed the subscription saving
> issue.
> 
> Martin,
> 
> On Thu, 2018-02-08 at 19:07 -0700, brynn wrote:
>> I think you misunderstood me.
>>
>> Let's say someone flags a member - anyone, moderator or regular
>> member.  If 
>> another moderator looks at that member's profile, they have no idea
>> that member 
>> has already been flagged.
>>
>> That member probably has at least one reported resource in their
>> profile page, 
>> which is a clue that member might already be flagged.  But sometimes
>> the member 
>> doesn't get flagged.
>>
>> Of course we can look at the Moderation Page, to find out if they
>> have been 
>> flagged.  But it would just be convenient to see it on the profile
>> page, and not 
>> have to look around for it.
>>
>> I'm just thinking that maybe reported items all need to be handled
>> the same way. 
>> Maybe reported Comments need to show some indication that it's been
>> flagged?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> brynn
>>
>> -Original Message- 
>> From: Martin Owens
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2018 10:53 PM
>> To: brynn ; Inkscape-Docs
>> Cc: die humblex
>> Subject: Re: new moderation features
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Martin, would it be  possible to have a similar label for
>>> flagged
>>> members?  Just to prevent confusion?  Or is the idea more about
>>> identifying
>>> hidden things, while members don't get hidden?
>> Users get deleted when they are censured. So there's no flag to show.
>> They and their objects are toast (that includes anything they've
>> posted)
>>
>> Best Regard, Martin Owens 
>>
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] gallery moderators - re spam flooding

[Maren Hachmann]

Yeah, on launchpad in the answers section, it's often hundreds of
identical messages, these last years. Hard to find the real ones. But
launchpad has gotten faster in removing them.

At inkscape.org, I guess it's still posted manually, by a real person,
currently. Might be the downloads are infected... Don't open to look,
please, in these cases.

Maren

Am 02.02.2018 um 02:33 schrieb brynn:
> Hi moderators (and other interested folks),
>    Just a heads up for moderators.  You may have seen the spam which
> came in today (if it hasn't already been deleted by now).  Five separate
> uploads, each into a different category (even in the pastebin!)
> advertising a toll free phone number for tech support for Malewarebytes
> (MBAM).
> 
>    Since I've known mbam to be an excellent and reputable
> anti-malware program, I was shocked.  I had to investigate.  As it turns
> out, the spam isn't coming from the mbam community.  They are the
> target, or victim, and yes, along with us and our gallery.
> 
>    Anyway, long story short, there's a rash or outbreak of a type of
> spam known as "spam flooding" throughout the internet.  It's happening
> in forums, galleries, and emailsocial media too, I suppose.  The
> spammers typically post several to many identical messages, in one go. 
> And most commonly it gives a toll free phone number, offering software
> support or customer service.  (And lord only knows what's on the other
> end of that number!)  And many, many businesses, corporations, products,
> whether software or otherwise are being targetted by this.
> 
>    Well, all we really can do at this point, is be vigilant.  Thanks
> for your help :-)
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] Spanish Website Editor

[Maren Hachmann]

... that last half phrase was a left-over of editing - ignore :)

Maren

> Am 31.01.2018 um 21:44 schrieb Jabier:
>> Hi All.
>>
>> Can we add privileges to a new Inkscape spanish website translator?
>> His user in inkscape.org is: "RREDesigns" 
>>
>> He is a amacing member of graficalibre spanish comunity.
>>
>> Thanks in advance.
>>
>>
>>
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] Adding extensions api docs

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 09.11.2017 um 10:13 schrieb Mois:
> Hi Eduard, thank you for this.
> So it does seem like there are some significant downsides to using a
> single build.
> 
> You can see the combined result
> . Toward the end there is a
> link to the subpage "Python Extension API", but check out how the rest
> of the docs are mixed up.

- Thanks for getting to work on this! Perhaps people will also enjoy
documenting things more, when they know that their documentation will be
easily accessible, and so more helpful. I like how it shows where things
are being used, and how it also includes info on standards and external
library documentation (never noticed before).

> I'll also try separate documentation and see what it looks like.
> Currently trying to get the gitlab CI running locally in docker, and
> then I might integrate the doc build. Could we host the generated
> documentation on the website?

- I think that would be possible. It would require something like this
(I think - Martin will probably know better, and might be able to assist
with the django parts):

- adding the pages here:
https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-docs-export-website - possibly
automating this?

- adding the CSS and js links into a (new?) template file here:
https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-web/blob/master/docs/templates/docs/page.html

- adding the CSS and js files here:
https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-web/tree/master/inkscape/static

- possibly edit this file, to split of footer and header:
https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-web/blob/master/docs/views.py

- add links to the website, so people can know about it existing

Kind Regards,
 Maren

>> Is there a possibility to create "Chapters" or "Subprojects" (or
>> anything similar) with doxygen?
> My search shows that in Doxygen there are groups
>  which
> might do roughly what you meant. But I think ultimately the Class list
> and Namespaces list would still be mixed up (need to verify).
> We still have subpages, which link to commonly used classes, and are
> written manually.
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> Mois
> 
> 
> On 11/08/2017 03:48 PM, Eduard Braun wrote:
>> Hi Mois,
>>
>> it's a bit hard to talk about this without seeing the actual result.
>>
>> Why don't you link your local branch and/or create a "WIP" merge
>> request so we can give some targeted feedback?
>> If you even have a possibility to make the generated documentation
>> available that would be great, too (then people can check it out
>> directly without requiring a source checkout and doxygen and spare
>> time to generate it).
>>
>> Regarding mixing C++ and Python:
>> That's exactly what I meant before and why I suggested to consider
>> "separate" documents. It might make sense to generate them
>> side-by-side if the different parts of the documentation are separated
>> "well enough" but while searching in the C++ part I almost certainly
>> do not require documentation on the Python extensions (and vice
>> versa). For me (and probably most developers) and also technologically
>> those parts are independent, so independent documentation would not hurt.
>> I doubt C++ devs would be "irked" but if the information is not well
>> separated it might add additional "noise" when working with it which
>> does not exactly increase the usefulness of the documentation.
>> Also I'm afraid extension developers might be "intimidated" if we
>> throw the whole Inkscape code documentation their way if they only
>> want information on a specific Python module (I assume we have many
>> extension developers that are not actively involved in hacking
>> Inkscape code itself).
>> Is there a possibility to create "Chapters" or "Subprojects" (or
>> anything similar) with doxygen? I.e. a single documentation that
>> consists of multiple but independent parts? Obviously we could do that
>> "manually" by simply linking to two independent doxygen documentations
>> but I agree with you one complete self-contained documentation might
>> be nice. Then again it's probably not much beyond "nice" and as said
>> above it also wouldn't hurt if they are separate, so if there's no
>> easy possibility to achieve this I'd probably just go with separate
>> documents for the reasons outlined above...
>>
>> Best Regards,
>> Eduard
>>
>>
>>
>> Am 08.11.2017 um 09:10 schrieb Mois:
>>>
>>> Hey all,
>>>
>>>
>>> this is a continuation of a thread regarding extensions documentation
>>> in general, but I am starting a new thread due to the slightly
>>> different focus.
>>>
>>> I made changes that add the python sources to doxygen generation.
>>> This is already somewhat useful, because it is easy to see class
>>> methods with arguments at a glance.
>>>
>>> Also made a doxygen 'subpage' for the python extensions, linking to
>>> some common classes in the extensions directory. (note: some input on
>>> this list is welcome)
>>>
>>> Now, 

Re: [Inkscape-docs] Extensions guide

[Maren Hachmann]

I'm not sure about the current maintenance status of Doxygen in the
project, but more and up-to-date, automated api documentation sounds
great to me!

It would probably be possible to integrate any generated static html
pages into the Inkscape website, along with the other docs (tutorials,
man page, keyboard shortcuts, translation status).

@Eduard: Do you know if there is anything that needs to be taken into
account, before someone makes a new git branch and starts to work on
adding comments and adjusting doxygen settings (or other things)?

Maren

Am 06.11.2017 um 22:32 schrieb matyil...@openmailbox.org:
> Hi,
> 
> for now I've extended the Python modules for extensions, and linked to
> it from a few pages to make it easier to find, but I'd be interested in
> documenting the api too.
> 
> As for the generator Doxygen might be an option. I haven't used it
> extensively, but it supports python (with traditional docstring
> structure, or its own "##" syntax and special commands). It might be
> easier to integrating into the build process since Inkscape uses Doxygen
> already.
> 
> matyilona
> 
> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 10:27:40AM +0200, Mois wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I am not sure if that is what you meant, but some proper api
>> documentation would be wonderful!
>> By this I mean commenting the code and then generating documentation
>> from the comments, e.g. using Epydoc  or
>> Sphinx .
>> Indeed the code is not super huge and complicated, but having a page
>> with a good overview is valuable.
>>
>> I would be interested in contributing to such a project too. Also have
>> experience with Inkscape and Python.
>>
>> In addition to now commenting the modules you listed, it would be useful
>> to have commenting guidelines for future extension developers.
>> Other work would be picking one generator, integrating it into the build
>> process, etc.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Mois
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] quick question re website messaging

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 09.10.2017 um 07:55 schrieb brynn:
> I know the private message editor doesn't have rich text, so I thought
> pasting the text which comes from LibreOffice would be ok.  

- That's correct. It's only when it allows you to add plugins that
copy-pasting from one page with plugins to another page with plugins
will cause problems, because plugins may only be used on a single page.

Copy-pasting into a plain text editor cleans the plugins out from the text.

Maren

> 
> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Martin Owens
> Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2017 8:19 PM
> To: brynn ; Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] quick question re website messaging
> 
> Hi Brynn,
> 
> Good question.
> 
> The pastebin should be fine. the only reason the editor copies the
> codes over is because it's a 'rich-text' type editor with all the extra
> buttons for bold/headers etc etc. If it's just a text box, it should
> just paste text only.
> 
> Best Regards, Martin Owens
> 
> On Sat, 2017-10-07 at 19:57 -0600, brynn wrote:
>> Hi Friends,
>>     Just a quick question.  Somewhere recently someone told me
>> not to paste
>> text into the website pages editor, from a word processing type of
>> text document
>> (like LibreOffice).  Apparently it transfers conflicting codes or
>> something.
>>
>>     Is it the same for using the website's private
>> message?  Should I only
>> use Notepad?
>>
>>     (I'm just making myself some templates for when I need to
>> message
>> members as a moderator.  Then I can just paste in the message, change
>> the member
>> name and maybe the name of the image.)
>>
>> Thanks,
>> brynn
>>
>>
>>
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] CSS class extension

[Maren Hachmann]

You should have received an email with a temporary password now :)

Kind Regards,
 Maren

Am 10.08.2017 um 15:37 schrieb Mois:
> Sorry, a few assumptions on my side :)
> 
> For username, "monomon" would be good, if available.
> 
> On 08/10/2017 04:30 PM, Maren Hachmann wrote:
>> Oh, you haven't mentioned that you'd like your extension to be added to
>> the Wiki list!
>>
>> I thought you wanted to say 'hi', tell people about your extension, and
>> find out how to get involved in development.
>>
>> Anyway, if you want to add it to the list yourself, please do so :)
>>
>> Which user name would you like to have set for the Wiki?
>>
>> Maren
>>
>> Am 10.08.2017 um 15:19 schrieb Mois:
>>> Oh I'm sorry, just followed the instruction on the wiki
>>> <http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php/Inkscape_Extensions>, which
>>> says "please let us know (via Docs mailing list..." I am going to look
>>> into fixing those instructions, then. How does one become a wiki editor?
>>> Don't see a "register" button.
>>>
>>> Thank you I will post to those other mailing lists.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
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>>> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>
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> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] CSS class extension

[Maren Hachmann]

Oh, you haven't mentioned that you'd like your extension to be added to
the Wiki list!

I thought you wanted to say 'hi', tell people about your extension, and
find out how to get involved in development.

Anyway, if you want to add it to the list yourself, please do so :)

Which user name would you like to have set for the Wiki?

Maren

Am 10.08.2017 um 15:19 schrieb Mois:
> Oh I'm sorry, just followed the instruction on the wiki
> , which
> says "please let us know (via Docs mailing list..." I am going to look
> into fixing those instructions, then. How does one become a wiki editor?
> Don't see a "register" button.
> 
> Thank you I will post to those other mailing lists.
> 
> 
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> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] CSS class extension

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Mois,

sounds interesting :)

This being the documentation mailing list, I wonder if perhaps you'd
want to send this message to the inkscape-devel (and maybe
inkscape-user) mailing list?

Kind Regards,
 Maren

Am 10.08.2017 um 11:35 schrieb Mois:
> Hi,
> 
> long-time Inkscape user here, looking to get into coding for it too.
> 
> I created this really simple extension for setting CSS classes
>  on elements.
> It has an option to clear inline styles of the elements, so that the css
> class would have an effect.
> 
> It is useful when having numerous elements that repeat or have the same
> styles.
> First, select a correctly styled one, use "Merge styles into CSS".
> Then select the rest and use "Set CSS class" to apply the new style on them.
> 
> I am aware of the extension posted on the forums that sets classes
> ,
> but having to manually clear styles after is a bit of a pain, so not
> completely usable for my case... and it's not in a code repository, so
> no way to contribute.
> 
> I read that in GSoC CSS handling will be improved, which is awesome!
> 
> Hope someone finds this useful.
> 
> Regards,
> Mois
> 
> 
> 
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> 
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[Inkscape-docs] [Manual]: Beginners' Guide Status

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi to all of you who are interested in the Beginners' Guide!


I'd like to give you another status update about our progress on the book:

What happened since the last status update?
---

- JP read over the first section, from a user perspective (and found no
grave issues with it! :D)

- Sergio joined the team, by commenting on an issue at gitlab. He will
help in checking for hurdles for beginning Inkscape users, from a
non-native speaker point-of-view, and (I hope) also with consistency
checking. He has already made a good start, finding some inconsistencies
and bugs within the second section of the book.

- brynn proofread the largest part of the second section, to make sure
it's using proper English!

- Elisa, while in Paris at the Inkscape Hackfest that is currently going
on (see also:
https://inkscape.org/en/news/2017/06/06/hackfest-2017-paris/), had a go
at separating single images and adding lots of new ones!

- Jabier brushed up the CSS a bit, and tested export options :) See
below for a link to the latest pdf, with some splashes of color!

- I have updated screenshots and uploaded images with translated file
names for section 1 and 2, and am currently working my way through the
pictures in section 3 of the book.

What can you help with at this stage?
-

We need proof-readers, the more the merrier!
The only requirements are that you need to be a native speaker
of English and need to have a basic knowledge in Inkscape usage.

We also need someone who can help with the book layouting, if possible
with some experience in preparing books for print and/or screen and some
knowledge of CSS. There's a lot of room for creativity here :)

And last but not least, the book needs consistency checkers, who make
sure that things fit together throughout the book, and that the terms
used match those in the Inkscape glossary. This is really important, so
the book will look like 'one piece', even though it's being worked on by
different people.

If you want to join the team, comment on the issue that you'd like to
help with here:
https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-docs/manuals/issues
or just reply to this email.

All book chapters are short, and work is shared - you can opt to take on
just one or two chapters! If we have more people who can help with that,
we'll have the book ready in a breeze!

Alpha Version
-

The current draft of the manual is available for reading at:
http://write.flossmanuals.net/start-with-inkscape/_draft/

Jabier's latest pdf version of the manual is available for download at:
http://objavi.booktype.pro/data/books/startwithinkscape-en-2017.06.27-23.32.07.pdf

See you on flossmanuals :),
 Kind Regards,
 Maren

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[Inkscape-docs] [Manual] Update

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Manual folks (and those who want to join us),

we have reached a major milestone today:
TRANSLATIONS ARE DONE :D
59 of 59 chapters translated! :)

The only thing that is left to do for this step is to remove that task
from the Community ToDo list on the Inkscape website ;-)
(this one: https://inkscape.org/contribute/to-do-list/).
I'm going to do that tomorrow.

I'm so happy that we're now through with this, and now have a
preliminary version available for people to look at. I also would like
to thank Sylvain Chiron and Hinerangi Courtenay, who worked on the
translations of the first section, for their help with this huge task.

What else happened this week?
=

- brynn's news item about the manual effort has been polished a bit
further, reviewed by its author, and was published. You can read it all
here now:
https://inkscape.org/en/news/2017/06/06/new-inkscape-beginners-manual/
(it has also been translated to four other languages by our website
translators' team).

- JP, a new team member joined us as a test user on gitlab. JP wants to
help by giving us feedback on how the book chapters work for new
Inkscape users.

- Jabier played a bit with setting up cover images on flossmanuals.

- Brynn started proofreading, and has looked over the first three
chapters in the second section already :)

What's next?


The next tasks concern images and proofreading, and can be done in parallel.

Images:
---

  - pictures that we will keep will need English file names. These are
(currently) all pictures that do not contain any (French) text.
  - pictures that need to be replaced or edited need to be re-made.
This concerns all pictures with French text in them. For some, we
may get away with just cutting off the French text, and putting its
translation next to the image in the book. Others need to be shot again.

If you can help with any of the image related tasks, please find more
info at https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-docs/manuals/issues/16 and
comment there, so we can organize who does what.

Proofreading:
-

  - as you all know, the translator of most of the chapters (me) is not
a native English speaker. Also, while I have fixed and updated a lot
while translating already, there remain parts in the text that could be
rephrased and polished a bit. We need your help with proofreading now.

If you are a native English speaker, please comment at one of the
section-related issues at gitlab:
https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-docs/manuals/issues

Current status for taking a peek


The latest alpha version of our work is available for reading at
http://write.flossmanuals.net/start-with-inkscape/_draft/_v/2.6/introduction/

If you want to join the team, it's not too late - just send a message to
the list here, or comment at gitlab, and we can get you set up. Due to
the nature of the book, all chapters are very short, so work can be
shared easily.

Kind Regards,
 Maren

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Re: [Inkscape-docs] News item...manual...first draft ready

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 10.06.2017 um 08:54 schrieb brynn:
>First and most important.  I take the first item in the list as
> calling for a few beginners to review it.  But when I follow the link,
> the task appears to be calling for one person to locate some beginners
> and sort of coach them or guide them through reviewing it.
> 
>So either the task itself needs to be changed.  Or the first item
> in this article needs to change.  Do you see what I mean?

- Yes, I've thought about that myself. In the end, I had decided that
people who want to join can still do it via adding a comment. I'll
update the description a bit, now, to make that clearer.

>So do you know any way to force a line space between items in the
> list? If you know, I would suggest moving the links to the end of the
> period (well, maybe a couple spaces after the period) and making a line
> space before the next item.  But if it can't be done easily, just forget
> it.  It's not worth spending a lot of time to research.  :-)

- It's a bit difficult to do, if you want translators to mimick it and
not lose it while translating.

I think it can be published now :)

Thanks again, Brynn!

Kind Regards,
 Maren

> All best,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Thursday, June 08, 2017 4:04 PM
> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] News item...manual...first draft ready
> 
> Brynn, I've just updated the article draft. Can you have a short look?
> 
> Kind Regards,
> Maren
> 
> Am 07.06.2017 um 20:07 schrieb Maren Hachmann:
>> I'll have a look again later today, first I'll need to get the README on
>> gitlab ready, then I'll make the edits to include a link.
>>
>> I found a previous version of the news article yesterday and liked it a
>> lot :)
>> Thank you, Brynn, for working on this so quickly and phrasing it so
>> nicely!
>>
>> Kind Regards,
>>  Maren
>>
>>
>> Am 07.06.2017 um 14:14 schrieb brynn:
>>> I thought I posted that I had a first draft, but now I can't find it.
>>> So this is it:  https://inkscape.org/en/news/unpublished/812/
>>>
>>> Let me know if any changes are needed, or if it can be published as is.
>>> Or for those who have access, please feel free to make changes and/or
>>> publish it yourself  :-)
>>>
>>> All best,
>>> brynn
>>>
>>> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> 
> 


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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Manual] Updates and news

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Brynn,

we'll see how it goes on gitlab with the issues.
There were no time constraints put on them (although that's possible on
gitlab), I don't understand where that comes from.

Go ahead creating your issues, let us know if you need help with it.
Keep them concise, please, so it'll be quick to read and discuss.

Kind Regards,
 Maren

Am 10.06.2017 um 06:05 schrieb brynn:
> Hi Everyone,
>Regarding keeping up with tasks:  I think it's a very good idea,
> in general.  But I have some reservations.  In an open source community,
> as far as I've learned, people tend to manage whatever projects they've
> committed to on their own, and on their own schedule.
> 
>Also, with a project such as this manual/guide, where it can be
> edited at any time, by anyone who is interested  Well, it's really
> never quite completed - not any task is ever completely finished.
> 
>So having a list of tasks, with the names of the people who are
> working on it would be great.  But using a list of tasks and putting
> time constraints on it - I'm not sure how that could be effective or
> helpful.
> 
>Unless you're talking about the publishing side of it?  I can see
> where you'd actually want deadlines for certain things, for publishing
> new versions. Sort of like when they freeze certain parts of development
> right before a new release.
> 
> 
>I'm very glad to know we'll be using gitlab to help manage the
> project! I remember asking a couple of weeks ago about that.
> 
>So now I can create an issue for the proposed different
> organization of chapters that I mentioned.  And also an Issue about the
> graphics issues I mentioned.
> 
>But first, I want to make sure that's how we're using it.  Or are
> we only using Issues for task management?
> 
> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Thursday, June 08, 2017 5:53 PM
> To: Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: [Inkscape-docs] [Manual] Updates and news
> 
> Hi everyone,
> 
> after sending out the message about having felt a bit lonely while
> translating the manual, several people sent me some helpful tips on how
> to do it better :) (Thanks!)
> 
> This update message is the incarnation of one of those.
> 
> Also, I was very pleased to see that there are so many people still
> interested in helping, and to see some new people to join us on the
> Beginners' Guide project. Welcome again, Jabier, Jelle and Marietta!
> 
> 
> So, what happened this week?
> -
> 
> 
> - Brynn has worked on a friendly news item to get more contributors that
> will soon be published (find it here, if you're a website editor:
> https://inkscape.org/en/news/unpublished/812/)
> 
> - CR posted a first draft (png) of a cover image, with a tasty Inkscape
> ice cream (find it here:
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/h4n88xpnc6declz/inkscape_cover_beginner_m)
> 
> - Jabier has volunteered to work on the CSS a bit, and tested the pdf
> export, where he found an issue, which, fortunately, we were able to
> solve (see example pdf of draft from a couple of days ago:
> http://objavi.booktype.pro/data/books/startwithinkscape-en-2017.06.07
> -01.46.42.pdf)
> 
> - Jelle offered to help with proofreading, and possibly also with design
> 
> - Marietta joined the team, and started out making a public task list
> (here: https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-docs/manuals/issues/, more
> on that further down) and committed to help keeping it updated. She also
> proofread one chapter for language inaccuracies, and offered to help
> with the glossary and testing of the manual's effectiveness.
> 
> - Martin (doctormo) helped by giving me permissions to manage the manual
> task list and members on gitlab
> 
> - I have learnt a bit about managing a project this size (at least, I
> hope I have... let me know when I'm stepping on your toes, please), did
> some investigation on export formats, helped set up the gitlab issues
> section, coordinated with members to get them set up, reviewed the news
> article and translated and technically reviewed 17 chapters, also
> feeding back to Elisa for the original French version.
> There are 14 chapters left to be translated, I expect to be done with
> that in a week, if nobody else joins me there.
> 
> - Together we had some good discussions here on the list, that show that
> work on the manual is very much alive :)
> 
> Hope I haven't forgotten anyone, and didn't get the facts wrong - if I
> have, please blame it on the lack of:
> 
> The new task tracker
> 
> 
> Marietta suggested that we have a task tracker to follow up on tasks and
> to keep an overview about respons

Re: [Inkscape-docs] News item...manual...first draft ready

[Maren Hachmann]

Brynn, I've just updated the article draft. Can you have a short look?

Kind Regards,
 Maren

Am 07.06.2017 um 20:07 schrieb Maren Hachmann:
> I'll have a look again later today, first I'll need to get the README on
> gitlab ready, then I'll make the edits to include a link.
> 
> I found a previous version of the news article yesterday and liked it a
> lot :)
> Thank you, Brynn, for working on this so quickly and phrasing it so nicely!
> 
> Kind Regards,
>  Maren
> 
> 
> Am 07.06.2017 um 14:14 schrieb brynn:
>> I thought I posted that I had a first draft, but now I can't find it. 
>> So this is it:  https://inkscape.org/en/news/unpublished/812/
>>
>> Let me know if any changes are needed, or if it can be published as is. 
>> Or for those who have access, please feel free to make changes and/or
>> publish it yourself  :-)
>>
>> All best,
>> brynn
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
>> Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2017 3:42 PM
>> To: brynn ; inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] News item about the new manual work?
>>
>> Am 06.06.2017 um 14:29 schrieb brynn:
>>> Hi Maren,
>>>Oh yes, that's awesome content, and great ideas!  I'll be able to
>>> get that done today!
>>>
>>>Yes, a "getting unstuck" or "faq" or "troubleshooting" section
>>> would be great!  It will be a little while before I start on that.  But
>>> it's on my to-do list.
>>>
>>>(Looks like I started up a mess, with my recent request to fix
>>> one of those type of items via developers!  Meaning the draw first,
>>> style 2nd debate, which is nothing to do with what I wanted.  But oh
>>> well, it's progress.)
>>>
>>>I'll post when I have a draft ready.
>>
>> - Great, thank you!
>> Be sure to post a link, when you are ready for proofing.
>>
>> Kind Regards,
>> Maren
>>
>>> All best,
>>> brynn
>>>
>>>
>>> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
>>> Sent: Sunday, June 04, 2017 4:54 PM
>>> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
>>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] News item about the new manual work?
>>>
>>> Hi Brynn,
>>>
>>> yes, a short news item would be nice to show that work has started on a
>>> Beginners' Guide (it's not a real manual, in the classical sense).
>>>
>>> I think we especially need:
>>> - a few (not so many!) testers who only begin using Inkscape, to tell us
>>> if they understand it. They can accompany us, but also join at a later
>>> point of time. This could also be a teacher, who has experience teaching
>>> Inkscape to students.
>>> - one or two artists who want to design a cover image for the various
>>> output formats. This artist needs to be able to find his way around in
>>> the booktype interface, and to be able to follow the manual instructions
>>> about the interface. Also needs to remember to indicate a separate
>>> licence for the cover image - it needs to be CC-By-SA, with the Inkscape
>>> icon in it.
>>> - one to three web designers who can take a closer look into the
>>> Booktype CSS options, find out what is possible, and make an Inkscape-y
>>> design for the html version of the book, and perhaps also style the pdf.
>>> I think epub doesn't have too many styling options available (but I may
>>> be wrong).
>>> - 2 or 3 quality assurance people, who can check for consistency of
>>> terms used, html tags used for specific concepts (e.g. keyboard
>>> shortcut, menu entry, position of tool icons, ...) etc. throughout the
>>> book.
>>> - one or two persons who team up to make consistent screenshots with
>>> default icon set and English interface (if possible, on Windows, as most
>>> users will be on that platform). One could make the example svgs (or ask
>>> Elisa for them) and the other could make the screenshots and upload them.
>>> - one or two persons who move the pictures around when they are in, so
>>> they are all in their appropriate position in relation to the text.
>>>
>>> I think we do have enough native speakers now who can fix strange
>>> wording :)
>>> Feel free to cut off the parts that don't appear useful in an article.
>>> Much of this was meant as an explanation for you.
>>>
>>> As for later work, what do you think about this?
>>> We can add a 'Getting unstuck' section, perh

Re: [Inkscape-docs] News item...manual...first draft ready

[Maren Hachmann]

I'll have a look again later today, first I'll need to get the README on
gitlab ready, then I'll make the edits to include a link.

I found a previous version of the news article yesterday and liked it a
lot :)
Thank you, Brynn, for working on this so quickly and phrasing it so nicely!

Kind Regards,
 Maren


Am 07.06.2017 um 14:14 schrieb brynn:
> I thought I posted that I had a first draft, but now I can't find it. 
> So this is it:  https://inkscape.org/en/news/unpublished/812/
> 
> Let me know if any changes are needed, or if it can be published as is. 
> Or for those who have access, please feel free to make changes and/or
> publish it yourself  :-)
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2017 3:42 PM
> To: brynn ; inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] News item about the new manual work?
> 
> Am 06.06.2017 um 14:29 schrieb brynn:
>> Hi Maren,
>>Oh yes, that's awesome content, and great ideas!  I'll be able to
>> get that done today!
>>
>>Yes, a "getting unstuck" or "faq" or "troubleshooting" section
>> would be great!  It will be a little while before I start on that.  But
>> it's on my to-do list.
>>
>>(Looks like I started up a mess, with my recent request to fix
>> one of those type of items via developers!  Meaning the draw first,
>> style 2nd debate, which is nothing to do with what I wanted.  But oh
>> well, it's progress.)
>>
>>I'll post when I have a draft ready.
> 
> - Great, thank you!
> Be sure to post a link, when you are ready for proofing.
> 
> Kind Regards,
> Maren
> 
>> All best,
>> brynn
>>
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
>> Sent: Sunday, June 04, 2017 4:54 PM
>> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] News item about the new manual work?
>>
>> Hi Brynn,
>>
>> yes, a short news item would be nice to show that work has started on a
>> Beginners' Guide (it's not a real manual, in the classical sense).
>>
>> I think we especially need:
>> - a few (not so many!) testers who only begin using Inkscape, to tell us
>> if they understand it. They can accompany us, but also join at a later
>> point of time. This could also be a teacher, who has experience teaching
>> Inkscape to students.
>> - one or two artists who want to design a cover image for the various
>> output formats. This artist needs to be able to find his way around in
>> the booktype interface, and to be able to follow the manual instructions
>> about the interface. Also needs to remember to indicate a separate
>> licence for the cover image - it needs to be CC-By-SA, with the Inkscape
>> icon in it.
>> - one to three web designers who can take a closer look into the
>> Booktype CSS options, find out what is possible, and make an Inkscape-y
>> design for the html version of the book, and perhaps also style the pdf.
>> I think epub doesn't have too many styling options available (but I may
>> be wrong).
>> - 2 or 3 quality assurance people, who can check for consistency of
>> terms used, html tags used for specific concepts (e.g. keyboard
>> shortcut, menu entry, position of tool icons, ...) etc. throughout the
>> book.
>> - one or two persons who team up to make consistent screenshots with
>> default icon set and English interface (if possible, on Windows, as most
>> users will be on that platform). One could make the example svgs (or ask
>> Elisa for them) and the other could make the screenshots and upload them.
>> - one or two persons who move the pictures around when they are in, so
>> they are all in their appropriate position in relation to the text.
>>
>> I think we do have enough native speakers now who can fix strange
>> wording :)
>> Feel free to cut off the parts that don't appear useful in an article.
>> Much of this was meant as an explanation for you.
>>
>> As for later work, what do you think about this?
>> We can add a 'Getting unstuck' section, perhaps, with hints on what to
>> do when one gets a result one does not expect - which can cover the
>> whole range from 'look into status line' to frequent issues to 'ask in
>> forums' to 'post a bug report'.
>> I think you would be the one who is best suited to compile a list of
>> frequent noob issues with solutions that could be addressed here. If you
>> would like to do that, you can take your time, I know you've got a lot
>> of other tasks to address at the moment.
>>
>> Kin

Re: [Inkscape-docs] Fwd: Re: [Inkscape-devel] News item about the new manual work?

[Maren Hachmann]

We're working on getting set up on gitlab already.
I'll post an invitation shortly, stay tuned :)

Kind Regards,
 Maren

Am 07.06.2017 um 14:08 schrieb brynn:
> I'm not sure if this was answered.  So just in case, and apologies if
> I'm duplicating an answer.
> 
> Most mail programs have a Reply button, Reply All button and Forward
> button.  So I almost always us Reply All on a mailing list.  That makes
> sure that the reply goes to everyone which the original was sent to (if
> there were more than 1 original recipient).
> 
> Maybe that would help, if your email program offers it?
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Marietta Walker
> Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2017 3:47 PM
> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: [Inkscape-docs] Fwd: Re: [Inkscape-devel] News item about the
> new manual work?
> 
> 
> 
> And I am the culprit on not getting sending back to the list.  My email
> defaults to the sender not the list and I keep forgetting to change the
> email address and I just did it to Maren with the messages below!
> 
> Shame on me
> 
> Marietta
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Forwarded Message Subject:  Re: [Inkscape-docs]
> [Inkscape-devel] News item about the new manual work?  Date:  Tue, 6 Jun
> 2017 16:36:12 -0500  From:  Marietta Walker
> mailto:marie...@loghomenet.us  To:  Maren Hachmann
> mailto:ma...@goos-habermann.de
> 
> No problem at all. I did take a look, and you will find I am pretty
> flexible, but is OK to use the English board? I am sure I will not learn
> French in time to help with anything! I will be happy to extract and
> help track task and mark them complete as we go. And as a new user of
> Inkscape, you can count on me to also test as we go. Regards Marietta On
> 6/6/2017 4:09 PM, Maren Hachmann wrote: > Hi Marietta, > > a kanban
> board is a good idea, but there are free alternatives which I > would
> prefer to see used, e.g. https://framaboard.org/. > > Perhaps you would
> be willing to extract the tasks from previous messages > (esp. the one
> about the news item to Brynn) and move the board over to > framaboard?
> Also, we would need someone to take care of marking tasks > that are
> done by people who are not registered there as done. > > We don't need
> everyone to have an account, I think - we could also just > add their
> names, when we know they want to work on it. > > What do you think,
> Marietta? > > Kind Regards, > Maren > > Am 06.06.2017 um 20:45 schrieb
> brynn: >> No thanks for me. (I've already got a whole notebook of login
>>> passwords.) But I think Martin has been looking for something like >>
> that. Especially if it would give automatic reminders (afaiu). >> >> All
> best, >> brynn >> >> -Original Message- From: Marietta Walker >>
> Sent: Monday, June 05, 2017 9:59 AM >> To:
> inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net >> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs]
> [Inkscape-devel] News item about the new >> manual work? >> >> Hi all,
>>> >> I have set myself up with Trello in order to track notes and
> completion >> of Chapter review.. (Just to let everyone know I will not
> be actually >> editing chapters, only providing feedback to Maren on
> those things I >> need to. ) >> >> I digress. Trello is free and easy to
> use. It has taken me about ten >> minutes to figure it out and set my
> self up with a checklist, which I am >> now working on breaking into
> Sub-heading groups. >> >> With that said, if anyone would like to join
> me there to create >> checklists /progress tracking, If everyone jumped
> in to use, we could >> also let the group know where we are because I
> have made it public for >> viewing. >> >> So if you want to check it
> out-here is the link. >> https://trello.com/b/5MTvCikC/inkscape >> >> If
> you want to use it, then create an account and then send me your info.
>>> >> Regards >> Marietta >> >> On 6/4/2017 6:10 PM, Marietta Walker
> wrote: >>> I think it will suit me perfectly. >>> >>> Thanks--Marietta
>>>> >>> On 6/4/2017 5:55 PM, Maren Hachmann wrote: >>>> Thank you,
> Marietta, Carl, and Martin for pointing me into the right >>>> direction
> (hopefully) and for calling for help, and volunteering your >>>> time :)
>>>>> >>>> I'm glad to know that people are still interested in helping,
> but might >>>> just not have known how (or, in CR's case, are too busy
> with other st

Re: [Inkscape-docs] News item.... graphics issues in manual

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Marietta,

I now have master permissions on the linked project, and have added you
as a developer there. Also assigned you to your first task :)

You don't need SSH to just work on the issues section. We will not use
the repository for anything but the README file currently.

Translations are far in the future, let's start with the task at hand.
Try to keep the overhead small (short issue texts, concise descriptions).

If you like, you can create an issue for 'We need to figure out how
translations of the manual can be created and tracked'
(proposed solution: just make a copy of the book on flossmanuals, then
translate, organize translators via issue on gitlab, use issue tags to
specify language.).

Kind Regards,
 Maren

Am 07.06.2017 um 06:41 schrieb Marietta Walker:
> For Martin:
> 
> Are we working on the project at Gitlab titled:
> Inkscape\Inkscape-docs\manuals or are you creating another project?   If
> we keep it under one large generic heading such as the above mentioned,
> then we can track sub projects under one umbrella, English Translation
> for Inkscape Beginners/Dutch Translation for "Whatever/etc. Am I making
> any sense?
> 
> Also do I need to add SSH to my account?
> 
> Since I am completely unfamiliar with Gitlab, I am wanting to get in
> there and learn and get started.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On 6/6/2017 10:15 PM, brynn wrote:
>>> - We will delete some, and keep those that are good. If you don't want
>> to work on this, then we can add this to the task list, for someone else
>> to grab.
>>
>> No, I don't mind doing it.  I just need to be clear what the goal is
>> and what the parameters are.  Although I won't be happy if I rename
>> files and find out later that they're going to be replaced.
>>
>> Here you seem to be asking me to make the screenshots.  But in a
>> different message, I thought you said that CR had volunteered. Maybe I
>> misunderstood somewhere?  But I don't have a very pretty theme color.
>>
>> How about if I make a list of all the ones that need to be replaced,
>> and give the list to C R.  Then he could make them with the default
>> Windows theme, and either upload them himself, or send to me and I'll
>> upload?
>>
>> Not sure about developers spending time reviewing the manual at
>> hackfest, when time is at such a premium, with travel expenses and
>> all.  It seems like after hackfest would be better.  Plus do we really
>> need reviews from advanced users? New users would seem better for
>> sources of reviews?
>>
>> But I can finish my part before hackfest.  If C R has time to make
>> them, I'm sure we can finish the whole thing by that time.  Or even if
>> you want me to try making another user account, to find out if it
>> could use a different theme. Then I could make the screenshots.
>>
>> All best,
>> brynn
>>
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
>> Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2017 7:50 PM
>> To: brynn ; Inkscape-Docs
>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs]News item graphics issues in manual
>>
>> Am 07.06.2017 um 03:08 schrieb brynn:
>>> If you're saying that Inkscape is supposed to detect what kind of screen
>>> is being used, and automatically set itself accordingly, that's
>>> something I've never heard of, or experienced.
>>
>> - According to the program code, if width/height > 1.65, Inkscape will
>> switch to 'Wide' mode. You could try it out by removing / renaming your
>> preferences file. I suspect you have moved it from your old computer.
>> Let's stick to that for screenshots, it makes sense. If it doesn't work,
>> it's a bug.
>>
>>>> It would be helpful if you could continue with renaming the images that
>>> do not need to be changed - i.e. the tool icons, or drawings without any
>>> text or menus shown.
>>>
>>> I haven't started yet.  I don't want to duplicate or waste work energy.
>>> It seems like it would be less work all around, to just give appropriate
>>> names to the new screens and graphics, than to rename them all now, and
>>> upload whole new images to relace them later.  Or am I missing something
>>> about the plans and processes?
>>
>> - We will delete some, and keep those that are good. If you don't want
>> to work on this, then we can add this to the task list, for someone else
>> to grab.
>>>> Can you go through the images, and rename all the files that will
>>>> not be
>>> deleted, so they will be understandable when others look at them at
>>> Hackfest time?
>>>
>>> Wouldn't I need to wor

Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] News item about the new manual work?

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 06.06.2017 um 14:20 schrieb brynn:
> Hi Marietta and Everyone,
>That was my fault.  When you first messaged me, I didn't notice
> that you messaged me privately, off-list.  So everything I said, I
> thought everyone else was reading (except for the last one, where I
> realized it, and shared some personal info).
> 
>One of the things I said, which I thought the whole list was
> seeing, is getting Marietta's account connected with the manual.  

- No need to do that. Just join the group as is described in the email
that started this, then start working :)

> I
> couldn't figure out how to do it.  I can see, apparently, everyone who
> is reg'd for Floss Manuals profiles.  But I don't see how to get into
> them to change anything.  I'm not sure if that has happened yet?  Looks
> like not?  I'll send Maren your username, and she can get it set properly.
> 
>Maren (it's Maren, not Marten) could be called the project
> manager, but C R and I are also co-admins (just in case Maren is not
> available for some urgent admin-level need).

- It's Elisa, CR and you, Brynn, who have admin permissions, in addition
to myself as the 'owner' of the book - which doesn't amount to much,
because there's not really a lot that an admin can do more than a normal
user.

This has been done to ensure that there will be someone at the Hackfest
who does have access to all the functionality, in case it's needed, and
to have a fallback who can create new versions, in case something
happens to me ;-) (we do have too little redundancy in this project in
many places).
Also, to honor the people who have shown the largest interest in this
with some additional responsibility :P

Kind Regards,
 Maren




>For everyone else, Marietta certainly has the kind of skills we
> can use in this project!  It's up to her whether, or how much she wants
> to participate. Marietta, you could certainly jump in, even if you just
> notice a word or phrase which could be better.  Just to get your feet
> wet (as soon as your account is set properly).
> 
>When you see that you're set up, go to the Notes tab, and read
> through the guidelines.  Then you can decide if there's something you'd
> like to do.
> 
>Sorry for the mix-up.  And congrats for sticking with it, and
> speaking up again.
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> 
> -Original Message- From: Marietta Walker
> Sent: Sunday, June 04, 2017 12:20 PM
> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] News item about the new
> manual work?
> 
> Thank you Marten,
> 
> I have been in touch with Brynn and I have offered to help if I can.
> But I too was wondering who is the Project Manager, handling the task
> analysis and the work assignments.  I really don't think you can have a
> project of this level, with multiple people involved, and not have
> someone assessing skill levels, tracking task completion, determining
> milestones, and communicating progress.
> 
> Your Project Manager must also be given the authority to ask questions
> related to the tasks and resources needed to complete the assigned
> progress and to expect an answer. I have been waiting for someone to
> contact me related to the skill set I possess to let me know if I can
> help at all.
> 
> Brynn I am sorry, I thought you were the Project Manager, so I shared my
> skill set with you, thinking you were putting together people and skills.
> 
> Maren seems to be moving along and as she mentioned, you do need someone
> familiar with Inkscape, which I am not.  I just started using it a few
> months ago to do basic 2D drawings for quilting projects.
> 
> If I can help, I will be glad to do so, but I do have limitations in
> knowing the software.
> 
> Regards
> Marietta
> 
> On 6/4/2017 10:09 AM, Martin Owens wrote:
>> Can someone help Maren?
>>
>> I feel like a news article and a deviantArt post would be useful for
>> drumming up volunteers.
>>
>> But also, for a project director when just getting started, it's useful
>> to hand out jobs, so people know that they are needed and that they
>> don't have to think too much about which of the jobs they should do
>> while figuring out the software/editing platform.
>>
>> Thoughts?
>>
>> Best Regards, Martin Owens
>>
>> On Sun, 2017-06-04 at 14:46 +0200, Maren Hachmann wrote:
>>> CR, I have been translating (and fixing contents as I go) 1-2
>>> chapters
>>> each day for the last 2.5 weeks and am more than halfway through (35
>>> chapters done, 24 left to do). There wasn't anyone else to be seen
>>> around, after the first week, when one person translated a chapter
>>&

Re: [Inkscape-docs] News item.... graphics issues in manual

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Brynn,

Am 06.06.2017 um 13:50 schrieb brynn:
>> I'm a bit disappointed about everyone being so engaged and vocal about
> helping/liking the action, and now me working on it alone for > 2 weeks
> already.
> But that's normal, I guess - it was the reason why I haven't started
> this earlier, and I felt ready to take it on now, no matter what.
> 
> Don't worry, Maren.  I'm still on top of helping with the manual.  It's
> just life offline keeps pulling me away from computer lately.

- Mine is busy, too.

> I will start proofing as soon as I can get this moderation stuff settled.

- Yes, if you could help with fixing language errors, that would be
helpful.

> For working on the graphics, as you have outlined, I have some blockers
> on that. Somewhere I've mentioned them, but I don't think they were
> answered.  (I think I put comments in the Notes tab, below the line of
> *.  But I see now that that line of * is gone, and so are the comments I
> made.)

- Yes, that tab has been wiped.

> Starting on Interface chapter:
> 
> 1 -- graphics are not proportional, they're stretched long and squeezed
> side to side

> 2 -- the interface that's being used, uses a non-default display mode
> (with command bar on the right)

- Yes, this is described in the book. It's the standard display mode new
users get when they are using a wide screen (please someone correct me
if I'm wrong, my screen is 4:3). Widescreens are standard now, so most
users should get that display.

> 3 -- the interface is using some custom icon set

- It uses the standard icons. All the icons that look different to you
are provided by the operating system and look different from your
Windows setup, yes (they look the same for me, btw.).

> Before we start working on the graphics issues, these things need to be
> addressed, in my opinion (otherwise we might have to eventually
> duplicate some work).

- You can leave the picture layouting to someone experienced with web
page styling. This also requires coordination with the style person or
persons, and some understanding of how the different output formats
influence the layout.

It would be helpful if you could continue with renaming the images that
do not need to be changed - i.e. the tool icons, or drawings without any
text or menus shown.

And then, as a native speaker, language fixes would help us, and perhaps
compiling that list of frequent issues for the chapter that we would
like to add.

Also, I seem to remember there was a glossary chapter that needed to be
added.

> I think we need to be using the most default interface screenshots as
> possible. And of course, the graphics should be displayed in proper
> proportions.
> 
> The most important thing to decide, is where the new graphics will come
> from. Should be someone with not such an ugly theme (color) as mine. 
> Should be someone who is committed to providing the graphics and won't
> disappear.  Should be using a default display mode and icon set.

- CR volunteered for this in another email :D

> I wonder if it's possible in Windows, if I make a new user account, that
> account could use a different theme?  I'll investigate.  If I can, I'll
> provide the graphics.

- Let's take one step after the other, Brynn. It's better to finish one
thing, then take on the next.

This is also easier for me, because I don't need to be all over the
place when I know that a task is being tackled and finished.

Can you go through the images, and rename all the files that will not be
deleted, so they will be understandable when others look at them at
Hackfest time?

Can you get back to us when you are done with that, so we can then find
a new task?

(Probably one of: proofreading for language errors, compiling list of
frequent basic issues and helpful tricks).

Kind Regards,
 Maren

> I'm changing the title of this message to start a separate thread on the
> graphics issues.  (I see a long string of replies to making a News item,
> and I suspect there may be a few different issues.  I'm off to read more
> now  :-) (Also switching to only Docs list)
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Sunday, June 04, 2017 6:46 AM
> To: inkscape-de...@lists.sourceforge.net ; Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] News item about the new
> manual work?
> 
> CR, I have been translating (and fixing contents as I go) 1-2 chapters
> each day for the last 2.5 weeks and am more than halfway through (35
> chapters done, 24 left to do). There wasn't anyone else to be seen
> around, after the first week, when one person translated a chapter
> (unfortunately they picked the only one that needs to be rewritten from
> scratch, because Inkscape changed), and two people proofread a couple of
> chapters (thank you!!!). Well, and a couple of days

Re: [Inkscape-docs] News item about the new manual work?

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Carl (and Brynn, see bottom),

Am 04.06.2017 um 15:55 schrieb Carl Symons:
> 
> I have been holding off on any further editing and proofreading pending a 
> resolution of the following information for myself.
> 
> There are places in the manual where additional information would be useful. 
> Information that is not in the original version. Should it be added? If yes, 
> to what extent should the content be tweaked?

This depends on the amount of detail you want to add. It should fit into
the book's concept of giving 'just the necessary basics'.

Everything that is not strictly necessary, and does not *largely*
improve the helpfulness of the book for someone who knows *nothing*
about vector graphics, should be left to the detailed manual for
advanced users.

This is just an introduction, for people who want to learn by
do(odl)ing, and who will pick up the concepts as they advance. It is
meant to be easy - in writing style, with short sentences, as well as in
contents.

Would you like to pick up proofreading again where you left? You're
welcome to make edits that fit the above description any time, without
having to ask for permission.


> Also ... there was some discussion about reorganizing the manual, changing 
> chapter order and the like.
> 
> Apologies if this has been discussed previously. I've only recently joined 
> the 
> manual effort.
> 
> It would help to know if the project is mostly about translation or if it's 
> more extensive than that. Guidance please.

@Brynn + Carl:
I think we might postpone the changing of chapter order to a later point
of time, so we will get a first, 'working' copy faster, and so people
have a chance to gain insight into the conceptualization of the book.
Also, that discussion got us sidetracked a bit, it seems, if it lead to
Carl not knowing what to do next (and if).

If anything, changing the order is a matter of drag and drop, and can be
done any time, it shouldn't stop us from working.

(I was thinking having a skeleton ready at Hackfest time might be
useful, in case Elisa and Cédric would like to help work on this then -
but of course, I don't know what their plans are for Paris).

Kind Regards,
 Maren

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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] News item about the new manual work?

[Maren Hachmann]

Thank you, Marietta, Carl, and Martin for pointing me into the right
direction (hopefully) and for calling for help, and volunteering your
time :)

I'm glad to know that people are still interested in helping, but might
just not have known how (or, in CR's case, are too busy with other stuff
- believe me, I understand).
Guess I got too used to the standard open source theme of 'grab a task
and do it if you're up to it' - and I'm also kind of shy about telling
others what to do. I'm sorry about not getting that I should take on a
more active, guiding role, to make it easier for new members to join.

@Marietta: What do you think about Martin's suggestion?

Kind Regards,
 Maren


Am 04.06.2017 um 22:52 schrieb Martin Owens:
> On Sun, 2017-06-04 at 13:20 -0500, Marietta Walker wrote:
>> If I can help, I will be glad to do so, but I do have limitations
>> in knowing the software.
> 
> You would make a good editor then, both in the generic sense for 
> English grammar and the functional sense in 'do you understand this'
> 
> Is this something you'd be good at helping with?
> 
> Best Regards, Martin Owens
> 
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>
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] News item about the new manual work?

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Jabier (and all who are interested in joining),

thank you for your offer!

You can have a look here, it has most of the info and all the important
links:
https://sourceforge.net/p/inkscape/mailman/message/35841546/

Jabier, maybe you would like to help with the styling or cover design? I
haven't explored all about how much freedom the platform allows us, though.

As this is just a basic, beginners' guide, I think a developer is a bit
overqualified for the contents! We could use your help with contents
later, when (if) we create a more glossary-like manual, for looking
things up. But this would be a separate project, most probably written
on a different platform.

Kind Regards,
 Maren




Am 04.06.2017 um 22:06 schrieb Jabier Arraiza:
> Thanks Maren for your work! I hope soon can get more help. Sorry the
> therad about manual become too long and finaly remove atention from me.
> 
> The manual is a HTML5, Scribus or...?
> Whats the TODO list about this?
> 
> Cheers, Jabier.
> 
> 
> On Sun, 2017-06-04 at 14:46 +0200, Maren Hachmann wrote:
>> CR, I have been translating (and fixing contents as I go) 1-2
>> chapters
>> each day for the last 2.5 weeks and am more than halfway through (35
>> chapters done, 24 left to do). There wasn't anyone else to be seen
>> around, after the first week, when one person translated a chapter
>> (unfortunately they picked the only one that needs to be rewritten
>> from
>> scratch, because Inkscape changed), and two people proofread a couple
>> of
>> chapters (thank you!!!). Well, and a couple of days ago, someone
>> seems
>> to have accidentally wiped all the notes on the book, that were
>> supposed
>> to help get people started (or maybe it was a platform bug).
>>
>> I'd be glad to see some proofreading and styling/screenshooting
>> people
>> get on board, so we can continue seamlessly after I'm through with
>> translating.
>>
>> I'm a bit disappointed about everyone being so engaged and vocal
>> about
>> helping/liking the action, and now me working on it alone for > 2
>> weeks
>> already.
>> But that's normal, I guess - it was the reason why I haven't started
>> this earlier, and I felt ready to take it on now, no matter what.
>>
>> Anyway, I'm going to continue to plow through, then translations will
>> be
>> ready before the hackfest. In parallel, I'm going to be plowing
>> through
>> my new garden, and to help fix up someone else's house, so I expect
>> to
>> not have time for much else.
>>
>> I'd be glad if someone could try and reengage people to help with the
>> manual (preferably people who are able to work independently and know
>> Inkscape inside out, or who concentrate on something they really do
>> well, like fixing up language or styling).
>>
>> There are more than enough open tasks:
>> from CSS to cover design, to screenshooting, to consistency checking
>> and
>> layouting, to improving on my more or less weird English, to adding
>> missing content (or perhaps, translating, of course).
>>
>> And yet, when we do this, I think it's important to take care to
>> honor
>> the underlying 'Keep it simple and as short as possible' concept of
>> the
>> book, which would make it possible for young teenagers to use it to
>> get
>> started, without much theoretical ballast.
>> Elisa seems to have invested a *lot* of thought into how she built up
>> the chapters and when to start teaching which concept. I suspect her
>> concept stems from experience in teaching live Inkscape courses.
>>
>>  Maren
>>
>> Am 04.06.2017 um 13:32 schrieb C R:
>>> I'd say let's wait and do a progress report, so we can say that
>>> we're
>>> making progress on it, rather than just that we've decided to do
>>> it. I
>>> plan on helping this area of the project much more after I handle
>>> the
>>> hackfest swag. It would be better to have a more or less complete
>>> manual before we announce it to the public, unless it's a call for
>>> help with it.
>>>
>>> If it's a call for help with that area of the project, then go
>>> ahead, though. :)
>>>
>>> Thanks for the amazing amount of work you're doing for the project,
>>> brynn. It's definitely helping drive my own motivation for Inkscape
>>> project work. :)
>>>
>>> -C
>>>
>>> On Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 12:17 PM, brynn <br...@frii.com> wrote:
>>>> Hi Friends,
>>>>As I'm writing up a quick draft to announce the upcoming
>>>> hackfes

Re: [Inkscape-docs] News item about the new manual work?

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Brynn,

yes, a short news item would be nice to show that work has started on a
Beginners' Guide (it's not a real manual, in the classical sense).

I think we especially need:
- a few (not so many!) testers who only begin using Inkscape, to tell us
if they understand it. They can accompany us, but also join at a later
point of time. This could also be a teacher, who has experience teaching
Inkscape to students.
- one or two artists who want to design a cover image for the various
output formats. This artist needs to be able to find his way around in
the booktype interface, and to be able to follow the manual instructions
about the interface. Also needs to remember to indicate a separate
licence for the cover image - it needs to be CC-By-SA, with the Inkscape
icon in it.
- one to three web designers who can take a closer look into the
Booktype CSS options, find out what is possible, and make an Inkscape-y
design for the html version of the book, and perhaps also style the pdf.
I think epub doesn't have too many styling options available (but I may
be wrong).
- 2 or 3 quality assurance people, who can check for consistency of
terms used, html tags used for specific concepts (e.g. keyboard
shortcut, menu entry, position of tool icons, ...) etc. throughout the book.
- one or two persons who team up to make consistent screenshots with
default icon set and English interface (if possible, on Windows, as most
users will be on that platform). One could make the example svgs (or ask
Elisa for them) and the other could make the screenshots and upload them.
- one or two persons who move the pictures around when they are in, so
they are all in their appropriate position in relation to the text.

I think we do have enough native speakers now who can fix strange wording :)
Feel free to cut off the parts that don't appear useful in an article.
Much of this was meant as an explanation for you.

As for later work, what do you think about this?
We can add a 'Getting unstuck' section, perhaps, with hints on what to
do when one gets a result one does not expect - which can cover the
whole range from 'look into status line' to frequent issues to 'ask in
forums' to 'post a bug report'.
I think you would be the one who is best suited to compile a list of
frequent noob issues with solutions that could be addressed here. If you
would like to do that, you can take your time, I know you've got a lot
of other tasks to address at the moment.

Kind Regards,
 Maren


Am 04.06.2017 um 13:17 schrieb brynn:
> Hi Friends,
>As I'm writing up a quick draft to announce the upcoming
> hackfest, I suddenly wondered if it might be a good idea to write a
> short item about the recent new work on the new manual?
> 
>I could do that, after I finish the hackfest article.  I'm
> thinking Maren might be able to get all the details correct, the first
> time around? Although I don't mean to volunteer her.  As I said, I could
> do it myself, if we decide to do it.
> 
>I think it would help in community-building, to keep the wider
> community up to date about these things.  What do other manual workers
> and Docs list subscribers think?
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] News item about the new manual work?

[Maren Hachmann]

CR, I have been translating (and fixing contents as I go) 1-2 chapters
each day for the last 2.5 weeks and am more than halfway through (35
chapters done, 24 left to do). There wasn't anyone else to be seen
around, after the first week, when one person translated a chapter
(unfortunately they picked the only one that needs to be rewritten from
scratch, because Inkscape changed), and two people proofread a couple of
chapters (thank you!!!). Well, and a couple of days ago, someone seems
to have accidentally wiped all the notes on the book, that were supposed
to help get people started (or maybe it was a platform bug).

I'd be glad to see some proofreading and styling/screenshooting people
get on board, so we can continue seamlessly after I'm through with
translating.

I'm a bit disappointed about everyone being so engaged and vocal about
helping/liking the action, and now me working on it alone for > 2 weeks
already.
But that's normal, I guess - it was the reason why I haven't started
this earlier, and I felt ready to take it on now, no matter what.

Anyway, I'm going to continue to plow through, then translations will be
ready before the hackfest. In parallel, I'm going to be plowing through
my new garden, and to help fix up someone else's house, so I expect to
not have time for much else.

I'd be glad if someone could try and reengage people to help with the
manual (preferably people who are able to work independently and know
Inkscape inside out, or who concentrate on something they really do
well, like fixing up language or styling).

There are more than enough open tasks:
from CSS to cover design, to screenshooting, to consistency checking and
layouting, to improving on my more or less weird English, to adding
missing content (or perhaps, translating, of course).

And yet, when we do this, I think it's important to take care to honor
the underlying 'Keep it simple and as short as possible' concept of the
book, which would make it possible for young teenagers to use it to get
started, without much theoretical ballast.
Elisa seems to have invested a *lot* of thought into how she built up
the chapters and when to start teaching which concept. I suspect her
concept stems from experience in teaching live Inkscape courses.

 Maren

Am 04.06.2017 um 13:32 schrieb C R:
> I'd say let's wait and do a progress report, so we can say that we're
> making progress on it, rather than just that we've decided to do it. I
> plan on helping this area of the project much more after I handle the
> hackfest swag. It would be better to have a more or less complete
> manual before we announce it to the public, unless it's a call for
> help with it.
> 
> If it's a call for help with that area of the project, then go ahead, though. 
> :)
> 
> Thanks for the amazing amount of work you're doing for the project,
> brynn. It's definitely helping drive my own motivation for Inkscape
> project work. :)
> 
> -C
> 
> On Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 12:17 PM, brynn  wrote:
>> Hi Friends,
>>As I'm writing up a quick draft to announce the upcoming hackfest, I
>> suddenly wondered if it might be a good idea to write a short item about the
>> recent new work on the new manual?
>>
>>I could do that, after I finish the hackfest article.  I'm thinking
>> Maren might be able to get all the details correct, the first time around?
>> Although I don't mean to volunteer her.  As I said, I could do it myself, if
>> we decide to do it.
>>
>>I think it would help in community-building, to keep the wider
>> community up to date about these things.  What do other manual workers and
>> Docs list subscribers think?
>>
>> All best,
>> brynn
>>
>>
>>
>> --
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-translator] Website: Download page updated

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Eduard,

feel free to edit the page to make it look nicer :)

(would be really kind if you could adapt the German version then, too)

I'm keeping translators informed of updates (if the authors forget to do
it themselves), and translating.

Contents discussions are a subject for the docs mailing list, so I'm
including them in my reply.

Kind Regards,
 Maren

Am 01.06.2017 um 21:14 schrieb Eduard Braun:
> Am 01.06.2017 um 21:02 schrieb Maren Hachmann:
>> Hi translators,
>>
>> hope you're having some nice sunny days, too :)
>>
>> Marc has updated the Download page at https://inkscape.org/en/download/
>> to be a bit clearer on the meaning of the icons, by adding some text
>> below them.
>>
>> Maybe you can make some time this weekend to edit them in in your
>> language?
>>
>> Thank you!
>>
>> Kind Regards,
>>   Maren
> 
> Do we need the "For " and "..."? It looks a bit cluttered.
> Also "... or get the code." gets wrapped in an ugly way (maybe just use
> "Source code"?).
> 
> Centering and bolding of those labels would probably improve clarity yet
> another bit.
> 
> Regards
> Eduard
> 


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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Manual] Organization of the new manual

[Maren Hachmann]

Smal correction: a chapter for Copy/Duplicate exists. Could be extended
by deletion options.

Maren

Am 20.05.2017 um 13:49 schrieb Maren Hachmann:
> Hi Brynn,
> 
> I think we should probably get a good overview about the book's current
> structure first, before we venture into making major changes.
> 
> The current sections are meant to gently guide people from drawing
> *with* geometrical shapes (as a scaffolding), to drawing complex shapes,
> to using extras.
> 
> This is a very different approach from the one I use in my intro
> tutorial, for example, where I explain some basics first, then go to
> trying them out.
> 
> The book we are working on is thought out in a different manner. It
> doesn't teach theory so much as it allows people to explore on their
> own, and only introduces the concepts when they are needed. It's like
> you would do it when you explain Inkscape to kids, or to people who want
> to learn in a less intellectual way.
> 
> I like this approach a lot, as it doesn't require people to understand
> everything before they can start creating their first drawings. I find
> it would be a loss, if we turned this concept upside down, by adding
> /all/ the theory to the beginning.
> 
> That said, I think it could be useful to quickly explain how to use the
> palette, so beginners can color their drawings, and to ask people to
> tweak some of the more badly chosen default settings (the four 'scale
> with...' buttons and the Autosave feature), which will bite them in the
> behind if not set to a useful value right from the start.
> 
> I agree that a new chapter for the Align+Distribute dialog (in the
> advanced section), as well as one for Copy/Duplicate/Delete make a lot
> of sense.
> 
> I would not include the transform dialog in this book at all. Its sheer
> amount of options is a bit frightening.
> 
> You will find it easier to discuss this, though, when the translation
> part is mostly done and you have all the relevant info available (which
> is why I am currently concentrating on translating, one or more chapters
> every day).
> 
> Anyone who can translate French -> English is welcome to join - there
> are 43 (mostly short) chapters left to work on, as of today, May 20th 2017.
> 
> Kind Regards,
>  Maren
> 
> Am 18.05.2017 um 19:24 schrieb brynn:
>> Hi Friends,
>> First I just want to thank Maren again, for getting this manual set 
>> up, 
>> so that we can move forward with translating and editing.  3 Cheers!!!
>>
>> During our early discussions, I had mentioned, and she agreed, that 
>> since the Docs list covers kind of a lot of territory (website, new manual, 
>> various other documentation) we might want to identify discussions 
>> pertaining to 
>> the manual by something in the title of message.  That's why I put [Manual] 
>> at 
>> the beginning of the title of this message.  I'm not sure if it should maybe 
>> go 
>> at the end of the title?  Or maybe should be [Man]?
>>
>> My main reason for this message, is because I want to start a 
>> discussion 
>> about overall organization of the chapters.  To me, it makes sense to get 
>> that 
>> ironed out in the beginning.  Because as it grows, it could become harder 
>> and 
>> harder to change how it's organized.
>>
>> (Note that in this message I'm more describing the chapter and 
>> section 
>> titles, because right after this, I want to send another message on the 
>> subject 
>> of possibly improving section and chapter titles.  Eventually, they'll come 
>> together, but for getting everyone's ideas out, it's probably better to have 
>> separate threads.)
>>
>> So here are some thoughts I'm having on organization.  If everyone 
>> else 
>> wants to wait, that's fine too.  Just speak up  :-)
>>
>> To me, the Selection tool is a global tool and does not belong under 
>> Geometric Shapes.  That implies either it can only be used with the shape 
>> tools, 
>> or used best with them.  And that's not the case at all, in my view.
>>
>> I'm thinking we need a new major section, that would go between 
>> Introduction and Geometric Shapes.  Maybe it would be called something like 
>> The 
>> Basics or Getting Started?  The purpose of it would be to quickly make 
>> newbies 
>> productive, while linking to the relevant parts of the manual, at each step. 
>> Then the rest of the manual would by and large be about the same (except 
>> I'll 
>> probably suggest a different order for some of chapters later).  This could 
>> really almost be in t

Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Manual] Organization of the new manual

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Brynn,

I think we should probably get a good overview about the book's current
structure first, before we venture into making major changes.

The current sections are meant to gently guide people from drawing
*with* geometrical shapes (as a scaffolding), to drawing complex shapes,
to using extras.

This is a very different approach from the one I use in my intro
tutorial, for example, where I explain some basics first, then go to
trying them out.

The book we are working on is thought out in a different manner. It
doesn't teach theory so much as it allows people to explore on their
own, and only introduces the concepts when they are needed. It's like
you would do it when you explain Inkscape to kids, or to people who want
to learn in a less intellectual way.

I like this approach a lot, as it doesn't require people to understand
everything before they can start creating their first drawings. I find
it would be a loss, if we turned this concept upside down, by adding
/all/ the theory to the beginning.

That said, I think it could be useful to quickly explain how to use the
palette, so beginners can color their drawings, and to ask people to
tweak some of the more badly chosen default settings (the four 'scale
with...' buttons and the Autosave feature), which will bite them in the
behind if not set to a useful value right from the start.

I agree that a new chapter for the Align+Distribute dialog (in the
advanced section), as well as one for Copy/Duplicate/Delete make a lot
of sense.

I would not include the transform dialog in this book at all. Its sheer
amount of options is a bit frightening.

You will find it easier to discuss this, though, when the translation
part is mostly done and you have all the relevant info available (which
is why I am currently concentrating on translating, one or more chapters
every day).

Anyone who can translate French -> English is welcome to join - there
are 43 (mostly short) chapters left to work on, as of today, May 20th 2017.

Kind Regards,
 Maren

Am 18.05.2017 um 19:24 schrieb brynn:
> Hi Friends,
> First I just want to thank Maren again, for getting this manual set 
> up, 
> so that we can move forward with translating and editing.  3 Cheers!!!
> 
> During our early discussions, I had mentioned, and she agreed, that 
> since the Docs list covers kind of a lot of territory (website, new manual, 
> various other documentation) we might want to identify discussions pertaining 
> to 
> the manual by something in the title of message.  That's why I put [Manual] 
> at 
> the beginning of the title of this message.  I'm not sure if it should maybe 
> go 
> at the end of the title?  Or maybe should be [Man]?
> 
> My main reason for this message, is because I want to start a 
> discussion 
> about overall organization of the chapters.  To me, it makes sense to get 
> that 
> ironed out in the beginning.  Because as it grows, it could become harder and 
> harder to change how it's organized.
> 
> (Note that in this message I'm more describing the chapter and 
> section 
> titles, because right after this, I want to send another message on the 
> subject 
> of possibly improving section and chapter titles.  Eventually, they'll come 
> together, but for getting everyone's ideas out, it's probably better to have 
> separate threads.)
> 
> So here are some thoughts I'm having on organization.  If everyone 
> else 
> wants to wait, that's fine too.  Just speak up  :-)
> 
> To me, the Selection tool is a global tool and does not belong under 
> Geometric Shapes.  That implies either it can only be used with the shape 
> tools, 
> or used best with them.  And that's not the case at all, in my view.
> 
> I'm thinking we need a new major section, that would go between 
> Introduction and Geometric Shapes.  Maybe it would be called something like 
> The 
> Basics or Getting Started?  The purpose of it would be to quickly make 
> newbies 
> productive, while linking to the relevant parts of the manual, at each step. 
> Then the rest of the manual would by and large be about the same (except I'll 
> probably suggest a different order for some of chapters later).  This could 
> really almost be in the form of a tutorial, although not necessarily.
> 
> This section I'm proposing would include the following
> -- the current Interface chapter
> -- the current Managing the Workspace chapter(which appears to be about 
> Document 
> Properties dialog)
> -- the current Selection tool
> -- the current Fill and Stroke dialog
> -- a new chapter which explains the difference between raster and vector 
> (unless 
> this already exists and I haven't found it yet?)
> -- current Importing raster images
> -- current exporting PNG
> -- current Copying/duplicating
> -- current Saving your work  (these last 3 are currently way down the list, 
> in 
> advanced section) (see discussion below)
> -- a new chapter introducing transparency, but 

Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Manual] Terminology

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Brynn, Carl + all manual editors,

having a glossary at the end of the Beginners' guide sounds like a nice
idea.
Also makes for a good place to link to, from various places in the book.

Unfortunately, we cannot copy-paste from
http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php/Inkscape_glossary, to get a
quickstart, because of licensing reasons, but we should stick to the
terminology that is used there, which is the canonical way to name
things for Inkscape.

Kind Regards,
 Maren



Am 18.05.2017 um 22:37 schrieb Carl Symons:
> On Thu, May 18, 2017 at 11:55 AM, brynn  wrote:
>> Hi Friends,
>> I think Maren mentioned to Carl about terminology (in a different
>> message) and I agree that one of the most important things we need to do, is 
>> use
>> the same terminology throughout the manual.  However, that said, I'm not sure
>> what the best way to accomplish that would be.
> 
> This is an excellent suggestion for high level consistency as well.
> 
>>
>> Actually I was going to propose some changes to some of the section 
>> and
>> chapter titles, in this message.  But now that I think about it, that might 
>> be
>> putting the cart before the horse (as we say here, sometimes).
>>
>> Should we create a Glossary?  I mean as part of the manual?  Or 
>> should
>> we create a glossary that we just use for our own reference, as we write?  
>> Maybe
>> make it part of the wiki?  The gitlab wiki?
> 
> Yes, a Glossary would be helpful in the manual. It would be useful as
> the manual is written; almost essential when beginners are using
> Inkscape. Probably good in a wiki, perhaps after the manual is
> complete to maintain consistency.
> 
> 
>>
>> Once or twice I've had a thought about making a glossary for the 
>> website
>> someday.  But until the website contains more instructional info, it probably
>> has no purpose yet.  But what I mean is that creating a glossary, whether
>> formally part of the manual, or just in the wiki, could also be used on the
>> website someday.
> 
> Yes.
> 
> 
>>
>> If not glossary, what are some other ways we could keep ourselves 
>> all on
>> the same page regarding terminology?  What about one person (or 2?) who
>> primarily takes care of that?  Other ideas?
> 
> It's likely that the people writing have some idea of what any terms
> mean. So it would work for people to write using their own terms (for
> example, I don't plan to write technical stuff about anything that I
> don't understand. So in situations where the material is too advanced
> for me, I'll only edit grammar, spelling and clarity, depending on
> others who are more knowledgeable to provide the technical details).
> Some smart person can come back and make terminology consistent
> throughout the manual. I think that would be better than for people to
> try to learn proper terminology first.
> 
> This also applies to the style of writing throughout the document.
> Several people will be writing--and they should be writing in a way
> that is comfortable to them. A final editing task will be to revisit
> the document as a whole and make the style consistent.
> 
> 
> Carl
> 
> 
>>
>> All best,
>> brynn
>>
>>
>> --
>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>> ___
>> Inkscape-docs mailing list
>> Inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-docs
> 
> --
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> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-docs
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] howdy Inkscape manual writers

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Carl,

maybe checking for consistency / lingual correctness would be something
that you'd like to focus on, then?

Inkscape has a glossary in the Wiki, which states the Inkscape-way of
expressing things:
http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php/Inkscape_glossary
(and I already know that I have been rather sloppy, when I glance over
the glossary - so there's some work to do here... We might also have to
change chapter names.).

I believe that it's helping beginners if terminology is consistent over
different sources (e.g. this book, other manuals, the Inkscape program
itself) - doesn't mean that other words may never be used, but that it
should always be clear which one is the official term, e.g. by
highlighting it in bold when mentioned the first time.
This also gives people better results when they do web searches to learn
more.

But any way that you can help with the manual will be useful :)
You decide what you want to do and how much.

 Maren

Am 18.05.2017 um 02:32 schrieb Carl Symons:
> On Tuesday, May 16, 2017 5:03:49 PM PDT Maren Hachmann wrote:
>> Hi Carl,
>>
>> welcome - great to have you here :D
>>
>> Looks like you've already made good use of Inkscape in the FLOSS
>> community :) 
> 
> I've also helped young students (7 - 10 years old) get interested in 
> computers 
> (not videogames) with Inkscape and the HeathenX tutorials. A couple of the 
> students are pretty good.
> 
>>
>> I'm looking forward to your contributions - oh, hey, you already
>> proofread the first chapter (... *adds Carl to the About page*)!
> 
> Yes, I proofed it and made some changes. I did not read the styles manual 
> first, so it might not be exactly correct.
> 
> I can be too picky some times; it's okay to suggest that I settle down. It's 
> not bad; I just want things to be right.
> 
> 
> Carl
> 
>>
>>  Maren
>> (fellow FLOSS event-co-organizer, sometimes-news-writer (the Inkscape
>> website could definitely use help there, too!) and Inkscape user)
>>
>> Am 17.05.2017 um 01:08 schrieb Carl Symons:
>>> My name is Carl Symons from US-Washington State, Bellingham.
>>>
>>> Bellingham is th home of linuxfestnorthwest.org. For several years, I
>>> was one of the organizers and did a lot of pieces with Inkscape. On
>>> the main page, you can see the iconic LFNW Totem. Originally created
>>> in hardcopy with poster paint. I converted it to Inkscape SVG, used
>>> for many things including the large version seen on
>>> www.linuxfestnorthwest.org/2017/sponsors/world-famous-lfnw-raffle.
>>> While you're there, have a look at the World Famous Raffle sign thaht
>>> I also also created in Inkscape. Despite creating these, it's easy to
>>> imagine what Inkscape is like for someone just getting started...I'm
>>> not very skilled, but I have fun.
>>>
>>> For several years, worked on KDE news (dot.kde.org), writing
>>> (dot.kde.org/2012/10/15/plasma-active-3-improves-performance-brings-new-ap
>>> ps) and editing almost every piece for a couple of years (2010 - 2012)
>>>
>>> I'll assist with editing and proofreading as needed.
>>>
>>> Carl
>>>
>>> --
>>>  Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>>> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>>> ___
>>> Inkscape-docs mailing list
>>> Inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-docs
>>
>> 
>> -- Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>> ___
>> Inkscape-docs mailing list
>> Inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-docs
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
> ___
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> Inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-docs
> 


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Re: [Inkscape-docs] howdy Inkscape manual writers

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Carl,

welcome - great to have you here :D

Looks like you've already made good use of Inkscape in the FLOSS
community :)

I'm looking forward to your contributions - oh, hey, you already
proofread the first chapter (... *adds Carl to the About page*)!

 Maren
(fellow FLOSS event-co-organizer, sometimes-news-writer (the Inkscape
website could definitely use help there, too!) and Inkscape user)

Am 17.05.2017 um 01:08 schrieb Carl Symons:
> My name is Carl Symons from US-Washington State, Bellingham.
> 
> Bellingham is th home of linuxfestnorthwest.org. For several years, I
> was one of the organizers and did a lot of pieces with Inkscape. On
> the main page, you can see the iconic LFNW Totem. Originally created
> in hardcopy with poster paint. I converted it to Inkscape SVG, used
> for many things including the large version seen on
> www.linuxfestnorthwest.org/2017/sponsors/world-famous-lfnw-raffle.
> While you're there, have a look at the World Famous Raffle sign thaht
> I also also created in Inkscape. Despite creating these, it's easy to
> imagine what Inkscape is like for someone just getting started...I'm
> not very skilled, but I have fun.
> 
> For several years, worked on KDE news (dot.kde.org), writing
> (dot.kde.org/2012/10/15/plasma-active-3-improves-performance-brings-new-apps)
> and editing almost every piece for a couple of years (2010 - 2012)
> 
> I'll assist with editing and proofreading as needed.
> 
> Carl
> 
> --
> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
> ___
> Inkscape-docs mailing list
> Inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-docs
> 


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Re: [Inkscape-docs] Manuals: Inkscape Beginners' Manual ready for translation to English and editing

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Victor,

:)

Will you join us there?

Maren

Am 16.05.2017 um 00:48 schrieb Victor Westmann:
> I'm so happy we got to this point! Really happy! Can't believe it we
> were able to solve this and finally, start editing this new material!!! ;-D
> 
> Congrats to everyone involved in clearing the way for this to become true.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> 
> 
> --Victor Westmann
> 
> 2017-05-15 15:24 GMT-07:00 Maren Hachmann <ma...@goos-habermann.de
> <mailto:ma...@goos-habermann.de>>:
> 
> Hi everyone,
> 
> join us for translating and editing the Inkscape Beginners' manual,
> which is based upon Elisa de Castro Guerra's French book "Initiation à
> Inkscape" (Original French version available at
> https://www.flossmanualsfr.net/initiation-inkscape/
> <https://www.flossmanualsfr.net/initiation-inkscape/> - don't translate
> this one ;-) ) !
> Thank you, Elisa, for sharing your work and helping with licencing (also
> for joining the admins)!
> 
> The plan is to translate the book from French to English (Sylvain and
> Hinerangi already did some of the work), and make adjustments as we see
> fit, then to make it available for people who only start using Inkscape
> - if possible, accessible directly from inside the Inkscape program.
> 
> Here are some notes to get you started (we may tweak processes later, if
> we find better ones):
> 
> 
> Platform usage
> ==
> 
> This book is written at flossmanuals.net <http://flossmanuals.net>,
> which is a website that allows
> for collaborative editing of books about Free/Libre and Open Source
> Software. To learn more about the community that's behind it, please
> visit http://www.flossmanuals.org/about-floss-manuals-foundation
> <http://www.flossmanuals.org/about-floss-manuals-foundation>.
> 
> The manual for this 'manual writing platform' (which is an instance of
> the Booktype software), is available at
> http://sourcefabric.booktype.pro/booktype-16-for-authors-and-publishers/
> <http://sourcefabric.booktype.pro/booktype-16-for-authors-and-publishers/>
> .
> 
> Joining
> ===
> 
> Join the group at
> http://write.flossmanuals.net/groups/beginners-manual-for-inkscape/
> <http://write.flossmanuals.net/groups/beginners-manual-for-inkscape/> :-)
> Also say hi on the docs mailing list (see below, section
> "Communication", so we know who is who, and what you can help with.
> 
> Editing
> ===
> 
> IMPORTANT: When you're editing the book, ALWAYS leave a screen either by
> clicking on the 'Cancel' or on the 'Save' button. This is because, if
> you leave it by just closing the tab in your browser, the chapter will
> stay locked and inaccessible for other editors.
> 
> Version
> ===
> 
> This book will refer to the Inkscape 0.92.x series (important for your
> screenshots!).
> 
> Writing Style
> =
> 
> This book is meant as an introduction for people who are not yet
> familiar with Inkscape terminology.
> 
> When deciding how to phrase something, think of yourself when you
> started to use a vector editor, or think of a teen who you would like to
> introduce to the program, and who you would like to enjoy the process,
> and to be able to make nice drawings after reading the book.
> 
> Stay on topic, make it easy to understand, and keep the learning curve
> shallow. Write less rather than more. Be nice and encouraging to the
> reader. There exists another manual that provides the deep, technical
> details. We need to keep in mind that it will also be read by people
> whose native language is not English.
> 
> Communication
> ===
> 
> Anyone who edits the book can exchange messages, files and snippets via
> chat with other users who are online at the same time.
> For discussions of wider interest, or when you hit an obstacle, please
> subscribe and send a message to the inkscape-docs mailing list at
> https://sourceforge.net/p/inkscape/mailman/inkscape-docs/
> <https://sourceforge.net/p/inkscape/mailman/inkscape-docs/> .
> 
> Currently, we have 4 book admins (Elisa, Brynn, CR and me). Admins can
> change the book settings, add other admins and create release versions.
> 
> Chapter status
> ==
> 
> Chapters move from one status to the next, when they're being worked on:
> 
> 1. needs translation:
> Chapter isn't (fully) translated yet. If you speak both F

Re: [Inkscape-docs] zip versions of 0.48 not available

[Maren Hachmann]

Martin,

It's most probably this bug:
https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-web/issues/47

Maren

Am 16.05.2017 um 20:44 schrieb Martin Owens:
> On Tue, 2017-05-16 at 12:28 -0600, brynn wrote:
>> Hi Friends,
>> Just trying to get a version of 0.48 for testing (helping
>> someone in a 
>> forum) and for both zip and 7z, it says
>>
>> Download Failed
>> WARNING! The download for this isn't working or isn't set up right.
>>
>> Is this a problem?  Or is there somewhere else where we can
>> get older 
>> versions?
> 
> Hi Brynn,
> 
> Can you mention the page you're looking at/linking from?
> 
> Best Regards, Martin Owens
> 
> --
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> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material? (targeting the moon)

[Maren Hachmann]

ntent of his current
> manual, to be used as a starting point for the technical one?
> -- Likely certain people would be better suited for writing this more
> technical one.  I know for myself, I couldn't write it, no matter how
> hard I tried.  Often I find myself writing in simple language, even when
> I know the reader doesn't need it simplified.  Must be in my DNA, haha.
> -- I wonder if having 2 manuals would be confusing for users?  I think
> as long as the titles of the manuals makes it very clear, it would be
> ok.  Such as Introduction to Inkscape for the beginnners' manual or
> Technical Inkscape Manual for the other.  Something like that.  (And
> also make sure the URLs include the distinction, so searching isn't
> confusing either.)
> 
> 
>> (btw. I have volunteered to set this up, seems you overlooked ;-) - for
> customization, translation and version branches, I'd still have to learn
> a bit, but it doesn't appear to be too hard).
> 
> No, I read it.  But since I was "voting" for the Booktype option, I
> didn't have any reason to make a comment about setting up the Sphinx
> option.
> 
> I sincerely hope I have a wrong manual that I'm looking at, and that we
> don't have a serious problem with the translation being not strictly a
> translation!
> 
> Somewhat random thought.  I guess both Floss Manuals and Booktypes can
> be themed or branded?  Perhaps at some time during this
> manual-translating and then writing process, the community can have a
> discussion about Inkscape branding? I'm not sure if we can say it's
> overdue, but I would suggest that the time has come  :-)
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2017 5:07 PM
> To: brynn ; C R ; Inkscape Devel List ; Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material?
> (targeting the moon)
> 
> @jazznico: Is there a way to transfer books between the French
> flossmanuals site and the English one? I.e. would it be possible to
> export and import a book? Or would it be possible to have a language
> selection menu on flossmanualsfr instead, with English available for
> selection? This would make it easier for our international editors to
> deal with the interface.
> 
> Hi Brynn,
> 
> thanks for taking a closer look! (I'm so glad someone was able to take
> the time for this.)
> 
> FLOSS is the abbreviation for 'Free/Libre Open Source Software'.
> The websites are flossmanualsfr.net / flossmanuals.net respectively.
> They allow for collaborative writing of manuals for FLOSS.
> 
> I fully understand the need for a WYSIWYG editor. The one from Booktype
> is quite okay. Where it lacks is when you want to insert a file or image
> - because you need to upload it first, then you need to find out that
> the link to it that you need to enter in the insertion dialog is
> '/static/filename.ext'. That's more difficult than it would need to be
> (but you can use the same image file on different pages this way).
> 
> (Btw. what do you think of helping with the translation by making sure
> that all images get uploaded? When I copy-paste from the French book, I
> get all the images, but they are just links to the original book, not
> part of the one I'm editing. And it takes quite some time to rename the
> files to something English,  upload, add a useful placeholder text and
> then exchange the links. I'd prefer to spend that time on translating.)
> 
> About the 'location', I've had this silly idea:
> 
> As a first step, we create/translate/update this introductory manual at
> flossmanuals (if possible at the English site, to make it easier for
> contributors). It's a great way for getting people started with Inkscape.
> 
> As a second step, or in parallel, we could also have a more
> glossary-like, more technical manual, that explains what each menu item
> /LPE/... does. This technical manual could also be used by developers to
> document their changes, and it could use the more technical style with
> Sphinx/reST/readthedocs. It could even start out simple, with keywords /
> lists, and be refined by people who don't like those ;-)
> 
> (btw. I have volunteered to set this up, seems you overlooked ;-) - for
> customization, translation and version branches, I'd still have to learn
> a bit, but it doesn't appear to be too hard).
> 
> The one issue I see with this split is that it would spread resources
> (us) a bit wide, maybe. But from the time when I started using Inkscape,
> I know that having a manual like the one Elisa wrote would have helped
> me a lot - I barely understood a word in Tav's manual.
> 
> Now, as an advanced user, I (claim I) know everything that Elisa
>

Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] License for the new manual

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Brynn,

not yet. I've spent the night getting things ready for all of us (and I
bet I'll regret that later today...), but there's still a bit left that
I need Mick's help for, before it can go public (e.g. the website only
offers CC-By-SA licence for choice...) and I need someone to explain /
research how to add admins and editors, and how to use the group
feature. Also need to add some notes about editing.

Thank you for your patience ;-)

Maren

Am 12.05.2017 um 06:23 schrieb brynn:
> Thanks Maren.  Sorry for replying twice.  After I sent the first, I
> realized it needed to be copied to Docs list.
> 
> Can you give link to the new English one?
> 
> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2017 6:40 PM
> To: inkscape-de...@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-devel] [Inkscape-docs] License for the new manual
> 
> I've just played around at flossmanuals.net a bit, and was surprised how
> easy and quick it is to import the book there from the French site.
> 
> (I intended to just give it a try, but it worked so well, that I got
> carried away starting to edit it...)
> 
> Elisa, can you give Mick the heads up that we've managed to do the
> import ourselves already?
> 
> I'm working on importing the chapters from the French book, so we have
> the files and the original texts readily available.
> When that's done, I'll send a message to the list to invite editors.
> 
> Kind Regards,
> Maren
> 
> Am 11.05.2017 um 22:58 schrieb Maren Hachmann:
>> Great :)
>>
>> So let's keep our fingers crossed that it'll be possible to have an
>> English interface for working on the book - and then we can call out for
>> people to open up accounts.
>>
>> Kind Regards,
>>  Maren
>>
>> Am 11.05.2017 um 21:05 schrieb C R:
>>> Thanks for clarifying, Martin!
>>> -C
>>>
>>> On Thu, May 11, 2017 at 5:54 PM, Martin Owens <docto...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>> Hi Maren, Victor, CR,
>>>>
>>>> Yes, let's settle this. CC-BY 4.0
>>>>
>>>> https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
>>>>
>>>> Shall be used for the inkscape manual.
>>>>
>>>> I believe there's a weighty enough consensus not to beat around the
>>>> bush any more.
>>>>
>>>> Best Regards, Martin Owens
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, 2017-05-11 at 01:18 +0200, Maren Hachmann wrote:
>>>>> Sorry, I think I need to explain and ask one last question:
>>>>>
>>>>> I asked for CC-By, because that allows the licence to be changed when
>>>>> you make derivatives, and because it wasn't clear yet which licence
>>>>> we
>>>>> might want to use in the end, and because this wasn't my decision to
>>>>> make.
>>>>>
>>>>> Martin, you took it on you to count the votes. I think CC0 is out of
>>>>> the
>>>>> question by now. What is the current status?
>>>>>
>>>>> (Mc asked about CC-By, I think. I bet CR would prefer CC-By to CC-By-
>>>>> SA,
>>>>> from what I read.)
>>>>>
>>>>> Do people now just want to go with CC-By, either because they like it
>>>>> most, or to just 'be done' with it and start working? (I'd like to
>>>>> have
>>>>> some kind of final decision).
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>>>> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>>>> ___
>>>> Inkscape-devel mailing list
>>>> inkscape-de...@lists.sourceforge.net
>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>> ___
>> Inkscape-devel mailing list
>> inkscape-de...@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
>>
> 
> 
> --
> 
> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
> ___
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> inkscape-de...@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
> 


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Re: [Inkscape-docs] website moderation policy final / teams?

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Brynn,

Am 12.05.2017 um 12:27 schrieb brynn:
> Hi Friends,
>Since there have been no further comments regarding website
> moderation policy, I've made the changes to the CoC that we discussed.

- It's not published yet, was that intentional or were you waiting for
some confirmation?

>Most of those who commented about being retroactive, thought
> since the policy was not existing at the time, we should not delete
> images uploaded before this date (or the members who uploaded them). 
> (So we can vote those old ones that I flagged, back in now.)

- Done. There are still a couple of images where Martin voted to remove,
but we didn't... those are stuck in the queue.

>I started to put out a call for volunteer moderators (on the
> To-Do List page, and also posting in forums and mailing lists) except I
> wasn't sure about the wording.  I was going to say something like
> "Volunteers are needed to join the Website Team as Moderators."
> 
>But then I realized there's no such thing as a Website Team, and
> actually it's a Website Editors teamwhich I'm not sure if moderators
> would be subset of editors...  Hhmm, maybe so?

- I'd say we can make one. Would you like to provide the icon?

>Anyway, I seem to recall there was some mention of possibly
> creating a Moderation Team.  But before I post something like
> "Volunteers are needed to form a/join the Website Moderation Team" maybe
> we should decide if Moderators need their own team?
> 
>This might be another subject, but pursuant to all the recent
> discussion and movement towards getting the French manual translated, so
> we can find update and expand it, I wonder if we need to think about a
> Documentation Team?

- I think it's not urgent, because communication might happen within the
Booktype website (they have groups and chat). Generally, I believe it
would be a good idea.

>Since Martin is the website guru, he probably has an idea what
> would be best here.  Personally, I can't think of a reason for a formal
> moderation team. But there may be one (or more), that make sense, that I
> just never realized.

- Permissions ;-)

Maren

>Thoughts, comments?
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> 
> -----Original Message- From: brynn
> Sent: Friday, May 05, 2017 10:04 AM
> To: Inkscape-Devel ; Inkscape-Docs ; C R ; Maren Hachmann ; Martin Owens
> ; Sylvain Chiron ; Eduard Braun
> Subject: [Inkscape-docs] website moderation policy final
> 
> Hi Friends,
>It seems like this last message about moderation policy got
> buried in
> all the recent important chatter.  So I'm re-sending the most vital
> parts of it,
> so we can finish this up.  For convenience,
> https://inkscape.org/community/coc/
> And here's the suggested change:
> 
> In the Guidelines for User-Submitted Content section, replace
> 
> "Art and other content submitted to the Inkscape website should adhere
> to the
> following rules:"
> 
> with
> 
> "Content uploaded to the gallery should be related to Inkscape (e.g.
> created
> with Inkscape, created for use with Inkscape, showing how to work with
> Inkscape,
> etc.). We reserve the right to remove any content that does not seem
> appropriate
> or does not adhere to the following obligatory rules:"
> 
> C R said
>> Little thing, but "created for use with Inkscape" could cover things
> like just regular images... in fact it could cover just about
> anything, even things made with Adobe Illustrator. I'd simply cut that
> bit out.
> 
> Hhmm.yes, I see what you mean.  My interpretation of that, is for
> things
> like extensions or filters.  But maybe there's a better way to say it?
> 
> What about "created to be installed in Inkscape"?  Or maybe just "to be
> installed in Inkscape"?  That would eliminate any kind of image.  Any other
> suggestions out there?  Eduard?
> 
> I wonder about adding "Inkscape Project"?  Such as:
> "Content uploaded to the gallery should be related to Inkscape or the
> Inkscape
> Project (e.g.  created"
> That would cover things like a website graphics or page mockup, board
> meeting
> transcript, etc.
> 
> C R said
>> If there's a significant amount of undesirable content currently, it's
> probably best to make it retroactive. If it's just a few things, then
> we should approach the owners about it. Not to be pushy, but to inform
> them of the new policy.
> 
> To me, it's a significant amount.  By my estimate, probably 1 or 2
> thumbnails
> per page of the gallery are random photos!  So that's way too many to
> consider
> trying to contact them.
> 
> 

Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] License for the new manual

[Maren Hachmann]

Great :)

So let's keep our fingers crossed that it'll be possible to have an
English interface for working on the book - and then we can call out for
people to open up accounts.

Kind Regards,
 Maren

Am 11.05.2017 um 21:05 schrieb C R:
> Thanks for clarifying, Martin!
> -C
> 
> On Thu, May 11, 2017 at 5:54 PM, Martin Owens <docto...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi Maren, Victor, CR,
>>
>> Yes, let's settle this. CC-BY 4.0
>>
>> https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
>>
>> Shall be used for the inkscape manual.
>>
>> I believe there's a weighty enough consensus not to beat around the
>> bush any more.
>>
>> Best Regards, Martin Owens
>>
>> On Thu, 2017-05-11 at 01:18 +0200, Maren Hachmann wrote:
>>> Sorry, I think I need to explain and ask one last question:
>>>
>>> I asked for CC-By, because that allows the licence to be changed when
>>> you make derivatives, and because it wasn't clear yet which licence
>>> we
>>> might want to use in the end, and because this wasn't my decision to
>>> make.
>>>
>>> Martin, you took it on you to count the votes. I think CC0 is out of
>>> the
>>> question by now. What is the current status?
>>>
>>> (Mc asked about CC-By, I think. I bet CR would prefer CC-By to CC-By-
>>> SA,
>>> from what I read.)
>>>
>>> Do people now just want to go with CC-By, either because they like it
>>> most, or to just 'be done' with it and start working? (I'd like to
>>> have
>>> some kind of final decision).
>>
>> --
>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>> engaging tech sites, Slashdot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>> ___
>> Inkscape-devel mailing list
>> inkscape-de...@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-devel
> 


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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material? (targeting the moon)

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Elisa,

thank you very much for asking the flossmanuals.net manager!
Would you keep us updated on whether it works or not?

Kind Regards,
 Maren

Am 11.05.2017 um 16:09 schrieb Elisa Godoy de Castro Guerra:
> Hello,
> 
> Mick Is the manager of floss manuals english.
> I ask him for the possibility of import the book.
> I give him the url, he is trying.
> 
> Regards,
> Elisa
> 
> 2017-05-11 1:07 GMT+02:00 Maren Hachmann <ma...@goos-habermann.de
> <mailto:ma...@goos-habermann.de>>:
> 
> @jazznico: Is there a way to transfer books between the French
> flossmanuals site and the English one? I.e. would it be possible to
> export and import a book? Or would it be possible to have a language
> selection menu on flossmanualsfr instead, with English available for
> selection? This would make it easier for our international editors to
> deal with the interface.
> 
> Hi Brynn,
> 
> thanks for taking a closer look! (I'm so glad someone was able to take
> the time for this.)
> 
> FLOSS is the abbreviation for 'Free/Libre Open Source Software'.
> The websites are flossmanualsfr.net <http://flossmanualsfr.net> /
> flossmanuals.net <http://flossmanuals.net> respectively.
> They allow for collaborative writing of manuals for FLOSS.
> 
> I fully understand the need for a WYSIWYG editor. The one from Booktype
> is quite okay. Where it lacks is when you want to insert a file or image
> - because you need to upload it first, then you need to find out that
> the link to it that you need to enter in the insertion dialog is
> '/static/filename.ext'. That's more difficult than it would need to be
> (but you can use the same image file on different pages this way).
> 
> (Btw. what do you think of helping with the translation by making sure
> that all images get uploaded? When I copy-paste from the French book, I
> get all the images, but they are just links to the original book, not
> part of the one I'm editing. And it takes quite some time to rename the
> files to something English,  upload, add a useful placeholder text and
> then exchange the links. I'd prefer to spend that time on translating.)
> 
> About the 'location', I've had this silly idea:
> 
> As a first step, we create/translate/update this introductory manual at
> flossmanuals (if possible at the English site, to make it easier for
> contributors). It's a great way for getting people started with
> Inkscape.
> 
> As a second step, or in parallel, we could also have a more
> glossary-like, more technical manual, that explains what each menu item
> /LPE/... does. This technical manual could also be used by developers to
> document their changes, and it could use the more technical style with
> Sphinx/reST/readthedocs. It could even start out simple, with keywords /
> lists, and be refined by people who don't like those ;-)
> 
> (btw. I have volunteered to set this up, seems you overlooked ;-) - for
> customization, translation and version branches, I'd still have to learn
> a bit, but it doesn't appear to be too hard).
> 
> The one issue I see with this split is that it would spread resources
> (us) a bit wide, maybe. But from the time when I started using Inkscape,
> I know that having a manual like the one Elisa wrote would have helped
> me a lot - I barely understood a word in Tav's manual.
> 
> Now, as an advanced user, I (claim I) know everything that Elisa
> explains, but Tav's more technical manual contains so much more info,
> which I'm now able to understand (and often have the urge to update).
> 
> So that's why I think that having two different manuals wouldn't be such
> a bad idea. The technical manual could be written by the more technical
> users and, hopefully, devs (when they change something).
> 
> Well, just an idea. Let me know if you think it's crap ;-)
> 
> Kind Regards,
>  Maren
> 
> Am 10.05.2017 um 07:47 schrieb brynn:
> > Hi Everyone,
> >I've tried to read up and study and understand the info which
> > Maren presented.  Because my understanding is extremely limited, I
> > hesitate to offer any comments at all.  But for whatever it might be
> > worth, here they arealong with a couple of questions.
> >
> >First, one of your last comments:
> >
> >> All of them would be FLOSS, have support for internal linking,
> allow to
> > insert images and allow editing via browser.
> >
> >I think you're using "FLOSS&q

Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material? (targeting the moon)

[Maren Hachmann]

 sound so good (at least what I can
> understand).  But still no wysiwyg editor.  I still think that might
> scare away some potential contributors.
> 
> Booktype
> 
> So far, this sounds like the best option to me.
> 
> Gitbook
> 
> The 5 contributor limit for free hosting sounds untennable to me.
> 
>So based on my feeble understanding of all this, I'd vote for
> Booktype.
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2017 5:59 PM
> To: C R ; Inkscape Devel List ; Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material?
> (targeting the moon)
> 
> Hi,
> 
> sorry for the delay. I've been trying things out a bit, and I feel I
> haven't seen enough yet, but I won't have time tomorrow, so posting
> anyway now.
> 
> So, it seems that what we still need for a manual (any kind) is a
> platform to create it (not only write, but also output to different
> formats).
> 
> I have had a chance to look at 3 different platforms on my list, and I'm
> trying to outline the pros and cons, as I perceive them, please add
> yours to the list. There are many more platforms in existance (see also:
> https://github.com/PharkMillups/beautiful-docs#generating-docs), and if
> anyone here has some experience with them, please add.
> 
> *
> 
> - Gitlab Wiki + X, as suggested by Martin.
> 
> WHAT: An online Wiki on gitlab with a source code editor, associated
> with a gitlab project.
> 
> PROS:
>- custom-made to suit the project's individual needs (no specifics yet)
>- Preview functionality
> 
> CONS:
>- only (limited set of) Markdown, RDoc or AsciiDoc
>- limited formatting options, formatting not so much about 'roles'
> of formatted text, but more about 'looks'
>- the backend isn't written yet
>- no option for branches via interface (so we could start writing
> for trunk, and continue fixing for stable)
>- no direct translation support
>- support for the backend depends upon a single individual, no user
> community
>- no WYSIWYG editor
>- no GUI access to git repo, for managing where to put uploaded
> files etc.
>- no GUI for undoing a change (like in a 'normal' Wiki), or looking
> at a diff
> 
> EXAMPLE (frontend): https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-web/wikis/home
> 
> *
> 
> - Gitlab Editor + Sphinx / readthedocs:
> 
> WHAT: A git repository with an online source code editor and
> documentation update on readthedocs.org on save (i.e. commit).
> 
> PROS:
>- available quickly (didn't know how it works exactly, but got it
> all up and running with test content within an evening)
>- uses git and reStructured Text
>- allows to have branches, so devel version features can be
> documented when they are coded
>- supports translations (not entirely sure how, though, haven't
> tested it yet, wanted to send this email instead. E.g. Django docs are
> translated. Fallback to English if no translation of a document. I think
> they use different branches.)
>- free theming, separately for each output format
>- free hosting, can also use our own domain name with
> readthedocs.org, e.g. docs.inkscape.org
>- after installing some programs, tool chain runs locally
>- preview via gitlab editor or local editor
>- same toolchain can be used for developer documentation (includes
> code documentation from docstrings)
>- extensible via plugins (haven't had a chance to take a closer look
> yet or test any)
>- I think it's possible to add a 'edit this page on gitlab' link to
> each page, to get new contributors, even when using readthedocs.org (not
> tested, but read that others did similar things)
>- extremely wide range of export formats via plugins
>- infinite hierarchy nesting
>- syntax highlighting (e.g. for command line usage instructions, or
> extension writers)
>- video embedding (not tested)
> 
> CONS:
>- learning curve for admin (theming, plugins,...)
>- learning curve for editors (syntax, workflow)
>- no WYSIWYG editor, only preview (incomplete, because doesn't
> support all sphinx stuff)
> 
> EXAMPLE:
>- repository:
> https://gitlab.com/Moini/inkscape-extensions-multi-bool/tree/master/docs
>- rendered documentation:
> http://inkscape-multi-bool-extension.readthedocs.io/en/latest/index.html
> 
> *
> 
> - Booktype:
> 
> WHAT: A web portal for creating books, hosted by friends of the Inkscape
> project.
> 
> PROS:
>- available right now, no further setup required
>- best interface by far, easy and intuitive to

Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material? (targeting the moon)

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 05.05.2017 um 16:04 schrieb brynn:
> Hi Maren and all,
>I appreciate your research into, and review of.well I don't
> even understand what this is.
> 
>Could someone give me a simple explanation?  I'm still thinking
> "translate French FLOSS manual" and then update and expand the
> translation as a FLOSS doc.  I don't think we should abandon that, after
> all the work that Sylvain and Hineringi have put in.  Not to forget the
> French team too.

- Yes, that would be one of the options (the last one in the list I posted).
But there are more ways to write documentation, especially if you're
dealing with maintaining different versions of the software (and thus
the manual) in parallel, and different languages.

I'm not suggesting abandoning that book. On the contrary, yesterday I've
translated one more short chapter (and found the editor to be less
comfortable than the one we have on our django website, esp. for
inserting files/pictures), and I've just sent out a private email to
Hinerangi, because I think she might not be listening here currently,
but we'd need her consent for a licence change from GPL (which is
generally deemed unsuitable for documentation) to a CC licence.

But it would be entirely possible to manage the book's contents on a
different website, using a different system.

>Are we moving away from FLOSS because of its license?  This is a
> fine point which I don't get.  Could someone make this simple for me, too?

- No, the licence discussion is not related to the discussion about
finding a suitable editing platform.

The website where the book lives currently, flossmanualsfr.com, is a
fine website for writing books. However, it lacks some features that
would be very useful for us, e.g. customization, versioning with undo,
support for different software versions and languages.

Likewise, the other suggested platforms lack features (especially in
contributor-usability), and there exist other platforms that people may
know about.

I was hoping to get some input on what is more important to people. To
me as someone who would probably be working on the more organizational
side, the frontend doesn't matter so much. I'm used to doing my editing
in a text editor, and to use a preview. I'm also used to
installing/running software on my computer, for testing my edits locally
(which wouldn't be mandatory, though - a website that allows to edit the
texts is available for each of the items on the list). What matters to
me is that it is easy to have multiple versions and translations
available, and to be able to automate the process. Also, to allow people
who aren't involved in the project yet to do quick edits and request
their inclusion into the manual. And to have a highly customizable
output - concerning output formats (ebook formats, html, pdf, maybe even
an 'app'), and styling of those (which I think CR might enjoy).

But I know that many of the possible editors might be afraid of the
gitlab workflow, and I wanted people to be able to take a look at the
different options.

I've got one more platform to add to the list (as 'looked at, I'd
discourage usage'):

***

Gitbook

WHAT: node.js-based modern toolchain to build docs from
markdown/Asciidoc (locally installable version available) - disclaimer:
didn't test, only read.

PROS:
- comes with an editor that is graphical, and integrates support for
the version control part, so users do not need to worry about learning
git or finding their way around the git**b user interfaces.
- includes support for multiple language versions
- customizable templates / themes
- free hosting available

CONS:
- the above mentioned editor is proprietary. There exists a
no-longer-in-development open source legacy version.
- free hosting limited to 5 contributors
- all in all (if you take away the limited hosting and the non-free
editor) similar to the readthedocs version, but building on a system I
wouldn't be able to deal with, userbase / maturity is probably a lot
smaller/less than the one of readthedocs/sphinx.

Homepage: https://www.gitbook.com/
Source repo example: https://github.com/GitbookIO/gitbook/tree/master/docs
Example web page:
https://www.gitbook.com/book/frontendmasters/front-end-handbook/details



Kind Regards,
 Maren

> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2017 5:59 PM
> To: C R ; Inkscape Devel List ; Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material?
> (targeting the moon)
> 
> Hi,
> 
> sorry for the delay. I've been trying things out a bit, and I feel I
> haven't seen enough yet, but I won't have time tomorrow, so posting
> anyway now.
> 
> So, it seems that what we still need for a manual (any kind) is a
> platform to create it (not only write, but also output to different
>

Re: [Inkscape-docs] License for the new manual

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 05.05.2017 um 19:57 schrieb Sylvain Chiron:
> Le 05/05/2017 à 16:18, Maren Hachmann a écrit :
>> Merci! :D (was Hinerangi's consent required?)
> 
> I think she translated the first four chapters, so I’d say yes.
> 
> Here is offered the opportunity for her to oppose.

- Actually, she would need to consent, not be given opportunity to oppose.

Hinerangi, in case you haven't gotten the full info:
We're asking you if you would be okay with the licence of your
translated chapters in the linked book to be changed from GPL to CC-By-SA.

This is so the book can become part of a new manual effort for Inkscape.

Please let us know as soon as possible :)

Thank you,
 Maren

> https://fr.flossmanuals.net/start-with-inkscape/about-this-book/
> 
> Regards,
> --
> Sylvain
> 


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Re: [Inkscape-docs] License for the new manual

[Maren Hachmann]

Merci! :D (was Hinerangi's consent required?)

Maren

Am 05.05.2017 um 16:13 schrieb C R:
> Thanks Sylvain!
> 
> On Fri, May 5, 2017 at 3:11 PM, Sylvain Chiron <chironsylv...@orange.fr> 
> wrote:
>> Le 05/05/2017 à 16:02, Maren Hachmann a écrit :
>>> - When exploring flossmanualsfr, I noticed there are two places where a
>>> licence can be indicated:
>>>
>>> 1. in the book's settings
>>> 2. in the book's contents
>>
>> Yes. I have made the change.
>> --
>> Sylvain
> 


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Re: [Inkscape-docs] License for the new manual

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 03.05.2017 um 19:07 schrieb Sylvain Chiron:
> Le 02/05/2017 à 16:57, brynn a écrit :
>> I know there's another translator, but I can't seem to
>> open the manual today, to look it up.  So if someone knows who that is,
>> please copy them in to this new thread.
> 
> The other translator is Hinerangi. But she could not invest the
> translation actively, so it is suspended again — :/.

- Sylvain, if you would be okay with adapting the licence of your
translation, too, could you contact Hinerangi about the licencing (if
she made any changes, that is), so we can base our efforts on your and
Hinerangi's translations?

(even if Elisa changed hers, that doesn't mean that you /have/ to change
it, because you 'forked' before the licence changed - but it would be
nice :))

Kind Regards,
 Maren

>>> Also, according to
>>> https://fr.flossmanuals.net/start-with-inkscape/about-this-book/
>>> This document is GPL v3.
>>> I recommend against choosing this license, as it requires all other
>>> content used along with the parts of it to be gpl 3, which is
>>> unnecessarily restrictive, especially for a document of this type.
> 
> Yes, it is a weird choice — :).
> --
> Sylvain
> 


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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material? (targeting the moon)

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi,

sorry for the delay. I've been trying things out a bit, and I feel I
haven't seen enough yet, but I won't have time tomorrow, so posting
anyway now.

So, it seems that what we still need for a manual (any kind) is a
platform to create it (not only write, but also output to different
formats).

I have had a chance to look at 3 different platforms on my list, and I'm
trying to outline the pros and cons, as I perceive them, please add
yours to the list. There are many more platforms in existance (see also:
https://github.com/PharkMillups/beautiful-docs#generating-docs), and if
anyone here has some experience with them, please add.

*

- Gitlab Wiki + X, as suggested by Martin.

WHAT: An online Wiki on gitlab with a source code editor, associated
with a gitlab project.

PROS:
- custom-made to suit the project's individual needs (no specifics yet)
- Preview functionality

CONS:
- only (limited set of) Markdown, RDoc or AsciiDoc
- limited formatting options, formatting not so much about 'roles'
of formatted text, but more about 'looks'
- the backend isn't written yet
- no option for branches via interface (so we could start writing
for trunk, and continue fixing for stable)
- no direct translation support
- support for the backend depends upon a single individual, no user
community
- no WYSIWYG editor
- no GUI access to git repo, for managing where to put uploaded
files etc.
- no GUI for undoing a change (like in a 'normal' Wiki), or looking
at a diff

EXAMPLE (frontend): https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-web/wikis/home

*

- Gitlab Editor + Sphinx / readthedocs:

WHAT: A git repository with an online source code editor and
documentation update on readthedocs.org on save (i.e. commit).

PROS:
- available quickly (didn't know how it works exactly, but got it
all up and running with test content within an evening)
- uses git and reStructured Text
- allows to have branches, so devel version features can be
documented when they are coded
- supports translations (not entirely sure how, though, haven't
tested it yet, wanted to send this email instead. E.g. Django docs are
translated. Fallback to English if no translation of a document. I think
they use different branches.)
- free theming, separately for each output format
- free hosting, can also use our own domain name with
readthedocs.org, e.g. docs.inkscape.org
- after installing some programs, tool chain runs locally
- preview via gitlab editor or local editor
- same toolchain can be used for developer documentation (includes
code documentation from docstrings)
- extensible via plugins (haven't had a chance to take a closer look
yet or test any)
- I think it's possible to add a 'edit this page on gitlab' link to
each page, to get new contributors, even when using readthedocs.org (not
tested, but read that others did similar things)
- extremely wide range of export formats via plugins
- infinite hierarchy nesting
- syntax highlighting (e.g. for command line usage instructions, or
extension writers)
- video embedding (not tested)

CONS:
- learning curve for admin (theming, plugins,...)
- learning curve for editors (syntax, workflow)
- no WYSIWYG editor, only preview (incomplete, because doesn't
support all sphinx stuff)

EXAMPLE:
- repository:
https://gitlab.com/Moini/inkscape-extensions-multi-bool/tree/master/docs
- rendered documentation:
http://inkscape-multi-bool-extension.readthedocs.io/en/latest/index.html

*

- Booktype:

WHAT: A web portal for creating books, hosted by friends of the Inkscape
project.

PROS:
- available right now, no further setup required
- best interface by far, easy and intuitive to use
- team functions, user roles, chat
- prevents concurrent editing
- wide range of export and import formats
- support for themes/settings for specific export formats (e.g.
different font sizes etc.)
- free hosting and maintenance via flossmanuals(fr)
- community of experienced documentors

CONS:
- confinement to django database for version control, more difficult
to get data out of it again for editing
- no direct translation support (make a copy of the book, copy
changes over after doing a comparison in the history)
- limited versioning support (only the latest one can be
edited)
- we'd need to ask someone to add CC-By-SA licence (currently, the
options I got were CC-By, GPL. I guess this would be quick and easy to
solve.)

EXAMPLE (rendered documentation):
https://www.flossmanualsfr.net/initiation-inkscape/

*

All of them would be FLOSS, have support for internal linking, allow to
insert images and allow editing via browser.

*

I wish it were possible to combine the ease of use of the booktype
frontend with the portability, branch support, sustainability and
versatility of the gitlab/sphinx/readthedocs backend...

Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material? (targeting the moon)

[Maren Hachmann]

Thanks again, Nicolas! Booktype 2.x (and its predecessor) definitely
looks nice, seems to be easy to use and to produce quality output.

I'm compiling a list of the different options atm. with pros and cons.

Maren

Am 01.05.2017 um 22:08 schrieb Nicolas Dufour:
> 
> Le Lundi 1 mai 2017 21h28, Maren Hachmann <ma...@goos-habermann.de> a
> écrit :
>> - How does version control work for booktype? Could it be combined
>> with a git repository, or does it use a fully independent system? 
>> (I couldn't find a direct hint, maybe it's just using the django 
>> database to keep track of changes/edits?)
> 
> 
> As far as I can tell, everything (except the attached documents, e.g.
> images embedded in the chapters) is stored in a database. Each
> version of a chapter is stored with a revision number and can be
> compared with any other revision of the same chapter (the user
> interface looks like a wikimedia version history page). So I'm not
> sure using git to store the content (the database dump?) is a good
> idea here.
> 
>> - What is the source file format of booktype? Markdown? (guessing
>> from the requirements for pip)
> 
> 
> No, Booktype uses an online wysiwyg editor to edit the books and save
> the chapters in HTML directly.
> 
> Note that both the English and French Flossmanuals servers still use
> an old (1.6.1) Booktype version, and things may have changed in the
> new 2.x branch (officially launched last year).
> 
> Regards, -- Nicolas
> 


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Re: [Inkscape-docs] License for the new manual

[Maren Hachmann]

With the 'good licence' I meant CC-By-SA, sorry for the confusion.

Maren

Am 02.05.2017 um 21:11 schrieb Maren Hachmann:
> (this is not a direct reply to the last email by Brynn, just generally
> to this new licence thread)
> 
> @Brynn / CR: I think the term copyright does not mean the same as 'All
> rights reserved'. Copyright is just an umbrella term for all of them.
> Just look at the Inkscape files:
> (line 10)
> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~inkscape.dev/inkscape/0.92.x/view/head:/src/inkscape.cpp#L10
> 
> @Brynn/CR/Martin: Yes, the Intro book at flossmanuals is licenced GPLv3.
> But: I have asked if the licence could be changed/amended, to include
> CC-By-SA (you may have missed that in the stream). Only the author
> hasn't answered yet. Jazzynico said he would contact her. So we are
> waiting for her answer, before we can decide to pursue / not pursue that
> road.
> 
> @everyone: FTR, I prefer CC-By-SA for a manual, too. If the Intro book
> cannot be licenced as CC-By-SA for some reason, then translating it
> would get a lower priority for me, and finding other resources for a
> start would rise in priority, but it's still worth being translated,
> because it is a good book, with a very nice tone and approach.
> 
> If someone asked me to write an Inkscape manual and to release it into
> PD (which is impossible, being German... we cannot cast off the moral
> rights, even if we want to, see
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_rights#In_Europe), CC0 is possible,
> though) I wouldn't do it. I do use that license for small artwork, and I
> would use it for stuff where it cannot be enforced anyway, or which is
> of humanitary nature.
> But here, no lives depend on it, and I want to make sure that people's
> work is credited, and that all derivatives of the manual may be shared
> freely. Not just /most/, but *all*.
> 
> @Brynn: (question from last email) Probably if the teaching material
> doesn't use the same licence. But it's still possible to use different
> licences for different parts, as long as you make a note of that, and
> don't mix them completely, as far as I know. So, I don't see an issue,
> rather a chance that more teaching materials might choose a good licence
> ;-) (I'd like to see more teachers and students use Inkscape, btw.)
> 
> Maren
> 
> Am 02.05.2017 um 20:42 schrieb brynn:
>> I'm not very knowledgable about licensing or licenses.  But what part of
>> GPL prohibits any of the 4 things you listed?
>>
>> All best,
>> brynn
>>
>> -Original Message- From: C R
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2017 11:23 AM
>> To: Brynn
>> Cc: inkscape-devel ; Maren Hachmann ; Inkscape-Docs ; Nicolas Dufour ;
>> Sylvain Chiron
>> Subject: Re: License for the new manual
>>
>>
>>
>> Going to simplify a bit:
>>
>>> From my perspective anyone should be able to take parts of the
>>> official inkscape 
>> manual and:
>> 1. Modify it, update it, correct it
>> 2. Combine it with other teaching content (rules out GPL3, GPL2, and
>> CC-BY-SA)
>> 3. Use it in commercial products, or part of a compilation of manuals
>> (Rules out CC-BY-NC-SA)
>> 4. Use it any other way they like, because it's just tutorials for using
>> Inkscape, and anyone who wants to learn or spread the word about
>> Inkscape should be able to do so however they like. There's literally no
>> wrong way to do that. :)
>>
>> imho we should avoid licenses that were not made for documentation
>> entirely (GPL anything).
>>
>>
>> Thoughts about this?
>> -C
>>
>>
>>
>> On 2 May 2017 3:57 p.m., "brynn" <br...@frii.com> wrote:
>> Retitled - "License for the new manual" (was "Any chance we can make
>> some docs.")  Also copying in Sylvain, since he's been working on
>> translation.  I know there's another translator, but I can't seem to
>> open the manual today, to look it up.  So if someone knows who that is,
>> please copy them in to this new thread.
>>
>> We should sort out what license we will offer the new manual under as
>> a first step,  before starting any work. We need to reach a consensus
>> before work can proceed.
>>
>> Well, considering work has already started on the manual (the
>> translating part), we might be a little behind the 8 ball.  But I agree
>> that we need to nail down the license asap.
>>
>> Retitling this to start the discussion.
>>
>> Also, according to
>> https://fr.flossmanuals.net/start-with-inkscape/about-this-book/
>> This document is GPL v3.
>> I recommend against choosing this license, as it 

Re: [Inkscape-docs] License for the new manual

[Maren Hachmann]

(this is not a direct reply to the last email by Brynn, just generally
to this new licence thread)

@Brynn / CR: I think the term copyright does not mean the same as 'All
rights reserved'. Copyright is just an umbrella term for all of them.
Just look at the Inkscape files:
(line 10)
http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~inkscape.dev/inkscape/0.92.x/view/head:/src/inkscape.cpp#L10

@Brynn/CR/Martin: Yes, the Intro book at flossmanuals is licenced GPLv3.
But: I have asked if the licence could be changed/amended, to include
CC-By-SA (you may have missed that in the stream). Only the author
hasn't answered yet. Jazzynico said he would contact her. So we are
waiting for her answer, before we can decide to pursue / not pursue that
road.

@everyone: FTR, I prefer CC-By-SA for a manual, too. If the Intro book
cannot be licenced as CC-By-SA for some reason, then translating it
would get a lower priority for me, and finding other resources for a
start would rise in priority, but it's still worth being translated,
because it is a good book, with a very nice tone and approach.

If someone asked me to write an Inkscape manual and to release it into
PD (which is impossible, being German... we cannot cast off the moral
rights, even if we want to, see
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_rights#In_Europe), CC0 is possible,
though) I wouldn't do it. I do use that license for small artwork, and I
would use it for stuff where it cannot be enforced anyway, or which is
of humanitary nature.
But here, no lives depend on it, and I want to make sure that people's
work is credited, and that all derivatives of the manual may be shared
freely. Not just /most/, but *all*.

@Brynn: (question from last email) Probably if the teaching material
doesn't use the same licence. But it's still possible to use different
licences for different parts, as long as you make a note of that, and
don't mix them completely, as far as I know. So, I don't see an issue,
rather a chance that more teaching materials might choose a good licence
;-) (I'd like to see more teachers and students use Inkscape, btw.)

Maren

Am 02.05.2017 um 20:42 schrieb brynn:
> I'm not very knowledgable about licensing or licenses.  But what part of
> GPL prohibits any of the 4 things you listed?
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: C R
> Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2017 11:23 AM
> To: Brynn
> Cc: inkscape-devel ; Maren Hachmann ; Inkscape-Docs ; Nicolas Dufour ;
> Sylvain Chiron
> Subject: Re: License for the new manual
> 
> 
> 
> Going to simplify a bit:
> 
>> From my perspective anyone should be able to take parts of the
>> official inkscape 
> manual and:
> 1. Modify it, update it, correct it
> 2. Combine it with other teaching content (rules out GPL3, GPL2, and
> CC-BY-SA)
> 3. Use it in commercial products, or part of a compilation of manuals
> (Rules out CC-BY-NC-SA)
> 4. Use it any other way they like, because it's just tutorials for using
> Inkscape, and anyone who wants to learn or spread the word about
> Inkscape should be able to do so however they like. There's literally no
> wrong way to do that. :)
> 
> imho we should avoid licenses that were not made for documentation
> entirely (GPL anything).
> 
> 
> Thoughts about this?
> -C
> 
> 
> 
> On 2 May 2017 3:57 p.m., "brynn" <br...@frii.com> wrote:
> Retitled - "License for the new manual" (was "Any chance we can make
> some docs.")  Also copying in Sylvain, since he's been working on
> translation.  I know there's another translator, but I can't seem to
> open the manual today, to look it up.  So if someone knows who that is,
> please copy them in to this new thread.
> 
> We should sort out what license we will offer the new manual under as
> a first step,  before starting any work. We need to reach a consensus
> before work can proceed.
> 
> Well, considering work has already started on the manual (the
> translating part), we might be a little behind the 8 ball.  But I agree
> that we need to nail down the license asap.
> 
> Retitling this to start the discussion.
> 
> Also, according to
> https://fr.flossmanuals.net/start-with-inkscape/about-this-book/
> This document is GPL v3.
> I recommend against choosing this license, as it requires all other
> content used along with the parts of it to be gpl 3, which is
> unnecessarily restrictive, especially for a document of this type.
> 
> Well that's the same license as Inkscape.  How is it too restrictive?
> 
> For me, the main point is that it needs a license that will allow anyone
> to edit it.  We can't get stuck with an outdated manual and have no way
> to edit it (as a community), ever again.
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: C R
> Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2017 

Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material? (targeting the moon)

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 02.05.2017 um 09:13 schrieb brynn:
...

> If it needs screenshots that are close up, showing a drawing, I could do
> that. But anything showing dialogs, it would not be a good idea, imo.
> 
> But I'll have a go at using a translator.  And if I see any places where
> I can make a screenshot ready, I'll do that too.
> 

- Sounds great :) Thank you, Brynn!

Maren


> Sorry about getting the page wrong.  Not 2 minutes after I sent the
> message, I realized it was not the first page.  Oh well.
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Monday, May 01, 2017 5:06 AM
> To: brynn ; C R
> Cc: Inkscape-Devel ; Inkscape-Docs ; Victor Westmann
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material?
> (targeting the moon)
> 
> Am 01.05.2017 um 07:19 schrieb brynn:
>>> @Brynn: if you want to help with the translation of that 'intro' book,
>> you could, for example, make corresponding screenshots for it, of the
>> English version. You could also get an account on that site, and explain
>> to others who speak both French and English how it works, and what they
>> would need to do to join. Or write a news article asking for translators
>> who would like to help.
>> Also, you could add a 'Credits' page at the end, which seems to be
>> missing still.
>> And, of course, you can proofread and edit. Sylvain has already
>> translated quite a bit.
>>
>> Thanks Maren.  I'll jump right in, as much as possible.  But I don't
>> understand this part:
>>
>> "make corresponding screenshots for it"
>>
>> Screenshots for what purpose?
> 
> - The English screenshots need to be made. The original book is in
> French and has French screenshots, with French menus and maybe example
> texts in French (don't know for sure), as far as I know. Some may not
> need any translation, because there may not be any words in them, but
> others will.
> 
> They could be inserted into the corresponding chapters, even if there is
> no text yet.
> 
>> Getting an account on FLOSS Manuals goes without saying, once the
>> translation is finished and we can go ahead updating and expanding.  But
>> I'll be in the same boat as potential new translators, for learning how
>> it works.  I won't be in a position to help newcomers, until I've had a
>> little experience myself.
>>
>> Credits page -- the first page gives all the credits.  Is something more
>> needed?
> 
> - Ah, yes, I've found it now, thanks. It's here:
> https://fr.flossmanuals.net/start-with-inkscape/about-this-book/ (not
> first page, though)
> 
> Maren
> 
>> Proofreading -- I've read several pages already, and the English is
>> flawless so far!  But before I go on, I'd like to hear if anyone else is
>> proofreading, so we don't waste our collective time.
>>
>> Actually, because of our previous discussions, I've been waiting for
>> Sylvain to let me know when something is ready for proofing.  I could
>> still do it anyway. But maybe I'll message him and ask.
>>
>> All best,
>> brynn
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
>> Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2017 4:29 PM
>> To: C R ; brynn
>> Cc: Inkscape-Devel ; Inkscape-Docs ; Victor Westmann
>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material?
>> (targeting the moon)
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> oh, wow, I've just been offline for a couple of hours - wouldn't have
>> expected that, if finally someone gives the 'go' for a manual, there
>> would be such a huge echo (we've been discussing this on and off for a
>> /very/ long time already). That's just cool :D
>>
>> Just some comments to various things that were mentioned:
>>
>> @CR: I think Scribus is a great tool for making the kind of graphical,
>> polished, sellable, printable, book-with-columns-like structure which
>> was linked in that very first link. For something that is really nice to
>> look at, and is fun to read and touch.
>>
>> I also think this is not the same as a manual, which should be quick to
>> browse, quick to grasp, with lots of interlinks, with a file format
>> suitable for version control (well, yes, Scribus is xml, I've been told,
>> so it would be /readable/ - but those diffs are really ugly), with
>> out-of-the-box automated generation of online versions of a manual - as
>> can be done with tools like sphinx/readthedocs, doctype, and other tools
>> specifically tailored for open source documentation + gitlab CI.
>> You can take a look at the link from Victor's message to the ma

Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material? (targeting the moon)

[Maren Hachmann]

Hi Nicolas :D,

thank you!

What I would like to know (and what is now buried deep in the email
stream) is:

- How does version control work for booktype? Could it be combined with
a git repository, or does it use a fully independent system?
(I couldn't find a direct hint, maybe it's just using the django
database to keep track of changes/edits?)

- What is the source file format of booktype? Markdown? (guessing from
the requirements for pip)

Regards,
 Maren

Am 01.05.2017 um 21:08 schrieb Nicolas Dufour:
> Hi all,
> 
> I'm just back from two weeks away, and as the thread is very long now
> I didn't find time to read everything. Sorry if I'm off-topic.
> 
> Le Lundi 1 mai 2017 13h07, Maren Hachmann <ma...@goos-habermann.de> a
> écrit :
>> I only wish Nicolas or Elisa could be here to give us some more
>> in-depth
> 
>> info about their server's capabilities
> 
> 
> Not sure what you mean. Of course the Inkscape project can use the
> French FM server for the translation, but note that an English
> version also exists (http://write.flossmanuals.net/). It would
> probably be easier to work on the English server directly.
> 
> 
>> and their book's licencing.
> 
> If I remember correctly, the GPLv2 was the first license that was
> chosen when the FM project was created about 10 years ago, and some
> books still use it. But the server allows users to choose a different
> license when creating a new book (CC, GPL, PD). As for the Inkscape
> book, I see it's under a GPLv3. I don't know if it can be changed
> (and how) or not. Elisa could probably give more details.
> 
> Regards, -- Nicolas
> 


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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material? (targeting the moon)

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 01.05.2017 um 07:19 schrieb brynn:
>> @Brynn: if you want to help with the translation of that 'intro' book,
> you could, for example, make corresponding screenshots for it, of the
> English version. You could also get an account on that site, and explain
> to others who speak both French and English how it works, and what they
> would need to do to join. Or write a news article asking for translators
> who would like to help.
> Also, you could add a 'Credits' page at the end, which seems to be
> missing still.
> And, of course, you can proofread and edit. Sylvain has already
> translated quite a bit.
> 
> Thanks Maren.  I'll jump right in, as much as possible.  But I don't
> understand this part:
> 
> "make corresponding screenshots for it"
> 
> Screenshots for what purpose?

- The English screenshots need to be made. The original book is in
French and has French screenshots, with French menus and maybe example
texts in French (don't know for sure), as far as I know. Some may not
need any translation, because there may not be any words in them, but
others will.

They could be inserted into the corresponding chapters, even if there is
no text yet.

> Getting an account on FLOSS Manuals goes without saying, once the
> translation is finished and we can go ahead updating and expanding.  But
> I'll be in the same boat as potential new translators, for learning how
> it works.  I won't be in a position to help newcomers, until I've had a
> little experience myself.
> 
> Credits page -- the first page gives all the credits.  Is something more
> needed?

- Ah, yes, I've found it now, thanks. It's here:
https://fr.flossmanuals.net/start-with-inkscape/about-this-book/ (not
first page, though)

Maren

> Proofreading -- I've read several pages already, and the English is
> flawless so far!  But before I go on, I'd like to hear if anyone else is
> proofreading, so we don't waste our collective time.
> 
> Actually, because of our previous discussions, I've been waiting for
> Sylvain to let me know when something is ready for proofing.  I could
> still do it anyway. But maybe I'll message him and ask.
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2017 4:29 PM
> To: C R ; brynn
> Cc: Inkscape-Devel ; Inkscape-Docs ; Victor Westmann
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material?
> (targeting the moon)
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> oh, wow, I've just been offline for a couple of hours - wouldn't have
> expected that, if finally someone gives the 'go' for a manual, there
> would be such a huge echo (we've been discussing this on and off for a
> /very/ long time already). That's just cool :D
> 
> Just some comments to various things that were mentioned:
> 
> @CR: I think Scribus is a great tool for making the kind of graphical,
> polished, sellable, printable, book-with-columns-like structure which
> was linked in that very first link. For something that is really nice to
> look at, and is fun to read and touch.
> 
> I also think this is not the same as a manual, which should be quick to
> browse, quick to grasp, with lots of interlinks, with a file format
> suitable for version control (well, yes, Scribus is xml, I've been told,
> so it would be /readable/ - but those diffs are really ugly), with
> out-of-the-box automated generation of online versions of a manual - as
> can be done with tools like sphinx/readthedocs, doctype, and other tools
> specifically tailored for open source documentation + gitlab CI.
> You can take a look at the link from Victor's message to the mailing
> list, if you would like to know more:
> https://sourceforge.net/p/inkscape/mailman/message/35773618/
> 
> Even the booktype server of flossmanuals works with automation.
> Using one of those would also have the advantage that, once set up, this
> system could be used for both developer as well as user documentation
> (as Victor wrote in his post - and I agree with him).
> 
> As for the attribution, I think especially the book-like structure would
> profit from it, as I believe that artists may be more likely to
> contribute their drawings if those are - at least - credited to them.
> 
> Also, it would be good if things like the keyboard+mouse reference and
> other stuff we already have could be included. It's faster that way.
> Faster also means: quicker rewards. This is good if you want to have
> many contributors. Also, crediting people for their work is just
> something that makes them more willing to contribute (as stated above).
> CC-By would lose that, after the first iteration, as far as my
> understanding of the licence goes.
> 
> Some of the people involved in flossmanualsfr are also l

Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material? (targeting the moon)

[Maren Hachmann]

We can do both :) (and even combine them). I've been thinking we're
exploring options. I'll make a suggestion shortly.

I only wish Nicolas or Elisa could be here to give us some more in-depth
info about their server's capabilities and their book's licencing.

Kind Regards,
 Maren

Am 01.05.2017 um 07:07 schrieb brynn:
> I'm confused -- I missed a step somewhere.
> 
> Are we no longer talking about translating the French manual on FLOSS
> Manuals?
> 
> Or are you talking about something else entirely?
> 
> Sorry to be so simple-minded.
> 
> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: C R
> Sent: Sunday, April 30, 2017 3:39 AM
> To: Maren Hachmann
> Cc: Victor Westmann ; inkscape-devel ; Inkscape-Docs ; brynn
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material?
> (targeting the moon)
> 
> I also think this is not the same as a manual, which should be quick to
> browse, quick to grasp, with lots of interlinks, with a file format
> suitable for version control (well, yes, Scribus is xml, I've been told,
> so it would be /readable/ - but those diffs are really ugly), with
> out-of-the-box automated generation of online versions of a manual - as
> can be done with tools like sphinx/readthedocs, doctype, and other tools
> 
> Martin and I are thinking gitlab + markdown will suffice for the basis
> of contribution, and we can worry about scribus and doc publishing later.
> 
> Also, it would be good if things like the keyboard+mouse reference and
> other stuff we already have could be included.
> 
> Probably should use markdown code to identify key shortcuts in plain
> text. Makes them easier to edit, diff, and provides an easy way to add
> new ones.
> 
> Also, crediting people for their work is just
> something that makes them more willing to contribute (as stated above).
> CC-By would lose that, after the first iteration, as far as my
> understanding of the licence goes.
> 
> 
> We get into the territory of having to  edit each and every diagram or
> screen capture. It's messy. I think a better credit would be to have a
> contributor page for those who contribute the most. If that's
> insufficient credit, I think people might be contributing for the wrong
> reasons.
> 
> Some of the people involved in flossmanualsfr are also long-time
> contributors to and developers of Inkscape, so that's the relation.
> 
> But you see how the licensing gets in the way? We can't use any of it
> now. People wanted credit more than they wanted to have the contents be
> reusable. GPL is for software. People try to rewrite for content, but
> that's not what it's for. Worse, it imposes more restrictions than CC-BY.
> 
> I think it's best to say something like: "Unless otherwise stated, all
> content in this book is CC0, Public Domain." Then, those who require
> attribution can include it in the caption below the graphics.
> 
> The NC licence is maybe a bit overprotective, but I'm all for crediting
> and having a manual be available for anyone who needs it.
> 
> Yes, let's not do NC. The point of this is to get it into as many hands
> as possible. People want a bit of money to handle printing and
> distribution, let them. It's less work for the project and more free
> publicity.
> 
> -C
> 
> Maren
> 
> Am 29.04.2017 um 21:22 schrieb C R:
>> Also this: http://write.flossmanuals.net/inkscape/
>>
>> On Sat, Apr 29, 2017 at 8:04 PM, C R <caj...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Books done in Scribus can be "published" in a variety of ways,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, I understand that.  But I thought Victor was talking about a
>>>> hardback
>>>> book, like at the link he provided.  That kind of book is hard to get
>>>> published, unless you have some prior agreement with a publisher. 
>>>> At least
>>>> that's my understanding.
>>>
>>> We can self-publish, but we'd have to order a thousand copies, which
>>> would take some startup funds. I don't think hardback would be
>>> necessary.
>>> In fact, I don't imagine printing is necessary. We could render out a
>>> nice illustration of the book, with "ebook" under it, and people can
>>> enjoy the aesthetic without downing a bunch of trees to make physical
>>> copies of the manual. Virtual copies have great things like
>>> hyperlinks, and text search capabilities. So there are more benefits
>>> to having a digital copy anyway.
>>>
>>>> Somewhere in this thread was some discussion about licensing.  If
>>>> this is to
>>>> be a hardback book (old fashioned way of p

Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material? (targeting the moon)

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 30.04.2017 um 11:39 schrieb C R:
> 
> 
> I also think this is not the same as a manual, which should be quick to
> browse, quick to grasp, with lots of interlinks, with a file format
> suitable for version control (well, yes, Scribus is xml, I've been told,
> so it would be /readable/ - but those diffs are really ugly), with
> out-of-the-box automated generation of online versions of a manual - as
> can be done with tools like sphinx/readthedocs, doctype, and other tools
> 
> 
> Martin and I are thinking gitlab + markdown will suffice for the basis
> of contribution, and we can worry about scribus and doc publishing later.
> 

- This sounds to me like it would be duplicating work, when automated
systems exist, but aren't used from the start.

> 
> Also, it would be good if things like the keyboard+mouse reference and
> other stuff we already have could be included. 
> 
> 
> Probably should use markdown code to identify key shortcuts in plain
> text. Makes them easier to edit, diff, and provides an easy way to add
> new ones.

- Yes, but we could copy the structure and contents, which are both
good. I certainly don't know all the shortcuts by heart. And there are
many that aren't listed in the keys.xml file.

>  Also, crediting people for their work is just
> something that makes them more willing to contribute (as stated above).
> CC-By would lose that, after the first iteration, as far as my
> understanding of the licence goes.
> 
> 
> We get into the territory of having to  edit each and every diagram or
> screen capture. It's messy. I think a better credit would be to have a
> contributor page for those who contribute the most. If that's
> insufficient credit, I think people might be contributing for the wrong
> reasons.
> 

- I fully agree that a general 'Credits' page would be sufficient. The
Inkscape website contents is dual licenced, too. And we do not have
individual credits for each page, word, image, link or whatever. It
would be very difficult to do that anyway.
Do you think that poses a problem?

If someone wants to know specifically, a git blame would be sufficient
to find out (this wouldn't work for the website's CMS, though)...


> Some of the people involved in flossmanualsfr are also long-time
> contributors to and developers of Inkscape, so that's the relation.
> 
> 
> But you see how the licensing gets in the way? We can't use any of it
> now. People wanted credit more than they wanted to have the contents be
> reusable. GPL is for software. People try to rewrite for content, but
> that's not what it's for. Worse, it imposes more restrictions than CC-BY. 

- We could, if we used GPL... It doesn't prevent translation or
modification. And we can ask, as Martin suggested.

> I think it's best to say something like: "Unless otherwise stated, all
> content in this book is CC0, Public Domain." Then, those who require
> attribution can include it in the caption below the graphics. 

- That's certainly possible. However, I wouldn't contribute text or
proofreading or maintenance help under these circumstances. There are
many things that I have published as CC0 (Public Domain is impossible in
Germany, because there are certain moral rights, such as 'authorship'
that one cannot give up, even if one wanted to).
But a manual that is made for an open source, copyleft software should
fit the philosophy, in my opinion. I care about attributing work to the
people who did it, and I don't want that someone who comes along to grab
what they did can just deprive them of it.

Regards,
 Maren



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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material? (targeting the moon)

[Maren Hachmann]

>>>
>>>
>>> Yes, I understand that.  But I thought Victor was talking about a hardback
>>> book, like at the link he provided.  That kind of book is hard to get
>>> published, unless you have some prior agreement with a publisher.  At least
>>> that's my understanding.
>>
>> We can self-publish, but we'd have to order a thousand copies, which
>> would take some startup funds. I don't think hardback would be
>> necessary.
>> In fact, I don't imagine printing is necessary. We could render out a
>> nice illustration of the book, with "ebook" under it, and people can
>> enjoy the aesthetic without downing a bunch of trees to make physical
>> copies of the manual. Virtual copies have great things like
>> hyperlinks, and text search capabilities. So there are more benefits
>> to having a digital copy anyway.
>>
>>> Somewhere in this thread was some discussion about licensing.  If this is to
>>> be a hardback book (old fashioned way of publishing) *to me* it makes more
>>> sense to carry a copyright.
>>
>> The only requirement for a published physical book is an isbn number
>> (for product catalog, and inventory purposes). The license of the
>> book, as I understand it, is left completely open to the authors. We
>> would not have this published by a company interested in owning the
>> copyright, of course.
>>
>>> As far as I understand, publishers take a cut
>>> of sales.  And if it's a public domain content, there wouldn't be many
>>> sales.  It seems like it would make it even harder to find a publisher.
>>
>> A publisher isn't necessary for this project, assuming the content is
>> what's important. If we want book sales out of this, that's the point
>> where it will become an issue.
>>
>>> I don't know, maybe I'm old and old fashioned.  But the FLOSS manual, on the
>>> other hand, certainly should be either public domain, or CC-BY-NC-SA might
>>> be better.  Whatever it needs to have, to allow the community to edit.
>>
>> All I can guarantee is that my contributions will be public domain. :)
>>
>>> This is probably a bad idea.  But I'm trying to think outside the box.  What
>>> if I (or other non-French-speaker) took one of the French pages, and sent it
>>> through the public google and/or bing translators.  I know those are far
>>> from perfect.  (So far!)  But since I know Inkscape, it seems like it
>>> would give me enough of a clue what it's about, to be able to write it
>>> properly in English.
>>
>> Well, translation plus proof-reading is fine I'd think. It's not like
>> the subject matter would be alien to you. :) Fact is, you could easily
>> re-write from scratch the missing sections in English, then we would
>> be able to use it in our own "official" Inkscape manual too.
>>
>>> Then maybe the translators can proof read it, to make sure something
>>> important wasn't missed?  Proof reading would seem to be much less
>>> time-consuming for them.
>>>
>>> Would that work??
>>>
>>> All best,
>>> brynn
>>
>>
>> As I understand it, the Inkscape Project has nothing to do with
>> flossmanuals, so perhaps it's beyond the scope of this project.
>>
>>>
>>> -Original Message- From: C R
>>> Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2017 9:54 AM
>>> To: brynn
>>> Cc: Inkscape-Docs ; Inkscape Devel List ; Maren Hachmann ; Victor Westmann
>>>
>>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material?
>>> (targeting the moon)
>>>
>>>> I don't mean to slow anyone's roll here.  But wouldn't it make more sense
>>>> to put
>>>> any kind of energy towards documentation into the much discussed, direly
>>>> needed,
>>>> user-focused, step by step manual?  Rather than starting from scratch on a
>>>> whole
>>>> different kind of project?
>>>
>>>
>>> Yea, this actually makes a lot of sense as a first step.
>>>
>>>> There are many books out there already, which amount to a series of
>>>> tutorials.
>>>> It's not a bad thing.  I just think this kind of project is better suited
>>>> for a
>>>> single author, or maybe a small team.  And I think the project needs the
>>>> manual
>>>> much, more more than the community needs another book of tutorials.
>>>
>>>
>>> I agree. I think the book could be a lot o

Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material? (targeting the moon)

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 29.04.2017 um 10:05 schrieb C R:
> I have requested access to the gitlab repo. Once allowed, I'll drop a
> Scribus document in there with a cover, and the master pages with some
> initial styling for the document. I'll also do a README file with an
> initial layout/contents proposal based on some of the ideas here.
> 
> To my mind, the most useful thing would be getting an inkscape
> quick-start guide going as the preface. This way users can start
> making use of the document right away.
> 
> We may also want to publish each section of the book as a pdf as we go
> along, so users don't have to clone our repos just to get the
> information. :)
> 
> Contributors should also be aware that it's not okay to copy/paste
> content from blogs, tutorials, etc. For this document, everything must
> be re-written from scratch, and all screen captures, graphics etc.
> must be of our own making and cc0 (public domain). Anyone not
> interested in contributing 100% public domain content, should not
> contribute to this project.

- For a printable book, this sounds like a good idea :D

For a more 'scientific' manual, I think it's not suitable to do this in
Scribus, and that we should turn to a proven documentation software.

I've heard that Scribus performance drops dramatically with the number
of pages. How would you go about translatating the book?

I strongly disagree with CC0 - I would only contribute to something that
where attribution and copyleft are honored. It's fine to pull content
from properly licenced sources, imho, too. There are quick start guides
with good licences - this would make the process a lot faster, if it
wouldn't need to be written from scratch, but only modified. So yeah,
count me out :)

Maren

> -C
> 
> 
> 
> On Sat, Apr 29, 2017 at 12:01 AM, Maren Hachmann
> <ma...@goos-habermann.de> wrote:
>> Great :)
>>
>> I think, in this context, it makes sense to also link to the thread on
>> the translators mailing list, where many of us have already been
>> discussing the issue, and started to investigate options.
>>
>> https://sourceforge.net/p/inkscape/mailman/inkscape-translator/thread/CAPOH7%3DZn3sWhZ%3D1DDB-1FUp%2BQUZzrLmyy7iOFiL1VcfY0maG9g%40mail.gmail.com/#msg35807172
>>
>> Victor (who initiated the thread) has already written about his findings
>> about Sphinx there, and he also linked to a list on github, where
>> different documentation systems are listed (sorry, your latest email is
>> still on my todo list, Victor).
>>
>> Elisa has mentioned the Booktype instance of flossmanualsfr, as far as I
>> remember.
>>
>> Regards,
>>  Maren
>>
>> Am 29.04.2017 um 00:17 schrieb Martin Owens:
>>> On Sat, 2017-04-29 at 00:01 +0200, Maren Hachmann wrote:
>>>> Would it make sense to use gitlab's new subgroups feature for this?
>>>>
>>>> The inkscape-docs team could be a sub-team of Inkscape, that way.
>>>> There
>>>> are only 4 members as of now, so changing wouldn't be so difficult as
>>>> it
>>>> might be later on.
>>>
>>> Agreed.
>>>
>>> I've moved everything around and re-added the members to the group.
>>>
>>> Project is now: https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-docs/manuals
>>> Group is now: https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-docs
>>>
>>> Best Regards, Martin Owens
>>>
>>
>>
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] [Inkscape-devel] Any chance we can make some docs material? (targeting the moon)

[Maren Hachmann]

Would it make sense to use gitlab's new subgroups feature for this?

The inkscape-docs team could be a sub-team of Inkscape, that way. There
are only 4 members as of now, so changing wouldn't be so difficult as it
might be later on.

Maren

> Am 28.04.2017 um 16:14 schrieb Martin Owens:
>> On Fri, 2017-04-28 at 12:39 +0100, C R wrote:
>>> I'd love to quit my job and just do docs. :) Unfortunately, that's
>>> what it would probably take to get docs going to the extent we'd
>>> like.
>>> It's been discussed before, but never gone anywhere because of lack
>>> of time/hands involved.
>>>
>>> Yes, we should use Scribus to do it. In fact, it should probably be a
>>> github project to attract contributors. This way we can patch what
>>> needs to be patched when stuff changes in subsequent releases.
>>
>> Sounds like you have a solid step one Chris.
>>
>> Here's the inkscape-docs group on gitlab, EVERYONE should join, there
>> should be a button to join:
>>
>> https://gitlab.com/inkscape-docs
>>
>> And here's the new book/manual/docs project where files can be put:
>>
>> https://gitlab.com/inkscape/manuals
>>
>> I recommend using the wiki attached to the project to plan the
>> adventure slowly. Add a bit at a time and don't rush to have something
>> "complete" but have something small produced.
>>
>> Best Regards, Martin Owens
>>
>>
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> 


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Re: [Inkscape-docs] website issue

[Maren Hachmann]

Made a report, but I suspect Martin already knew about it.

He's currently working on updating the website, after it has moved to
gitlab.
This entrailed a couple of other updates that had been put on hold, and
I assume one of those caused the issue.

Maren

Am 21.02.2017 um 03:10 schrieb Maren Hachmann:
> I hope this isn't an issue on db level, and that our backups are working...
> (I'm pulling one from the cms every day, mentioning just in case).
> Doesn't contain any images, though.
> 
> Btw., Brynn, for new issues you can now use this address:
> https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-web/issues
> 
> Maren
> 
> 
> Am 21.02.2017 um 02:52 schrieb brynn:
>> Something weird is happening with the website.  I'm not quite sure how to 
>> explain it.  Images are missing (except in the gallery) and all links, even 
>> text 
>> links, are blue spheres.
>>
>> Just in case you didn't notice yet.  I waited half an hour, to make sure it 
>> wasn't a momentary glitch.
>>
>> All best,
>> brynn
>>
>>
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> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] website issue

[Maren Hachmann]

I hope this isn't an issue on db level, and that our backups are working...
(I'm pulling one from the cms every day, mentioning just in case).
Doesn't contain any images, though.

Btw., Brynn, for new issues you can now use this address:
https://gitlab.com/inkscape/inkscape-web/issues

Maren


Am 21.02.2017 um 02:52 schrieb brynn:
> Something weird is happening with the website.  I'm not quite sure how to 
> explain it.  Images are missing (except in the gallery) and all links, even 
> text 
> links, are blue spheres.
> 
> Just in case you didn't notice yet.  I waited half an hour, to make sure it 
> wasn't a momentary glitch.
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] news editing

[Maren Hachmann]

Yes, please do. The article is so far from what I would have had in mind
that I'd only be tempted to write one / to criticize (and I want neither).

Regards,
 Maren

Am 18.02.2017 um 10:17 schrieb brynn:
> Thanks guys.  I figured everything out, and finished it.  Sometimes I
> call out for support before I've explored everything that I should.  I
> have my email set for plain text only, so that's what happened.
> 
> Bryce suggested a proofread by Maren.  If you don't want to, I'll do
> another proof myself, then go ahead and publish.
> 
> Thanks again,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Friday, February 17, 2017 11:49 AM
> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] news editing
> 
> Yes, definitely. Copying directly from an email breaks it, if the email
> client has support for some kind of (html) formatting (happened with the
> other unpublished article, too, when Martin copied from his email
> client...).
> 
> Anything that is copied into the website into a field that uses some
> kind of formatting with an extra editor (WYSIWYG), needs to be copied
> from a pure text handling instance, like notepad, kate, gedit, or even
> the search or address bar in the browser (that's usually the fastest way
> to remove formatting), unless you *want* monospace fonts, or a text that
> is difficult to edit ;-)
> 
> Maren
> 
> Am 17.02.2017 um 06:10 schrieb Martin Owens:
>> Hi Brynn,
>>
>> Not sure why that's going wrong for you.
>>
>> Pop the editor into HTML mode and check the code directly. Maybe the
>> paste caused some weird tags that's confusing the editor.
>>
>> Best Regards, Martin Owens
>>
>> On Thu, 2017-02-16 at 20:44 -0700, brynn wrote:
>>> Hi Martin and/or Maren,
>>> I'm trying to make a quick News item using Bryce's 0.92.1
>>> announcement.
>>> I'm trying to make "Regression Fixes" into h4 heading.  I highlight
>>> those 2
>>> words, and choose h4 heading from the Paragraph Format dropdown
>>> menu.  But it
>>> keeps changing the entire page to h4!
>>> Is there something new about the editor that I haven't
>>> learned about
>>> yet?
>>> Maybe it has something to do with having been copied from
>>> email, and
>>> pasted directly into the editor?  Maybe I need to type it in
>>> fresh?  At least I
>>> already know I have to re-do the links, so they use the proper codes.
>>> Well, I'll be limping along, by changing the html directly,
>>> until I hear
>>> from one of you (it's getting late for family households).
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> brynn
>>>
>>>
>>> ---
>>> ---
>>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>>> ___
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>>> Inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-docs
>>
>> --
>>
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>>
> 
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] news editing

[Maren Hachmann]

Yes, definitely. Copying directly from an email breaks it, if the email
client has support for some kind of (html) formatting (happened with the
other unpublished article, too, when Martin copied from his email
client...).

Anything that is copied into the website into a field that uses some
kind of formatting with an extra editor (WYSIWYG), needs to be copied
from a pure text handling instance, like notepad, kate, gedit, or even
the search or address bar in the browser (that's usually the fastest way
to remove formatting), unless you *want* monospace fonts, or a text that
is difficult to edit ;-)

Maren

Am 17.02.2017 um 06:10 schrieb Martin Owens:
> Hi Brynn,
> 
> Not sure why that's going wrong for you.
> 
> Pop the editor into HTML mode and check the code directly. Maybe the
> paste caused some weird tags that's confusing the editor.
> 
> Best Regards, Martin Owens
> 
> On Thu, 2017-02-16 at 20:44 -0700, brynn wrote:
>> Hi Martin and/or Maren,
>> I'm trying to make a quick News item using Bryce's 0.92.1
>> announcement. 
>> I'm trying to make "Regression Fixes" into h4 heading.  I highlight
>> those 2 
>> words, and choose h4 heading from the Paragraph Format dropdown
>> menu.  But it 
>> keeps changing the entire page to h4!
>> Is there something new about the editor that I haven't
>> learned about 
>> yet?
>> Maybe it has something to do with having been copied from
>> email, and 
>> pasted directly into the editor?  Maybe I need to type it in
>> fresh?  At least I 
>> already know I have to re-do the links, so they use the proper codes.
>> Well, I'll be limping along, by changing the html directly,
>> until I hear 
>> from one of you (it's getting late for family households).
>>
>> Thanks,
>> brynn
>>
>>
>> ---
>> ---
>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
>> ___
>> Inkscape-docs mailing list
>> Inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/inkscape-docs
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website

[Maren Hachmann]

a gallery entry, where you can only seewhat is it, 20 at once. 
> And you have to search for your catagory, where if you don't already
> know the terminology of what you're looking for, you won't be very
> successful finding it.  And the website speed.well, I hope we get
> more space sooner than later.

- I hope so, too. And more RAM :)

>   If and when we get more server space, could we host our own video
> tutorials?  Or is it never in the plans?  I think it would make the
> website even better.  (And of course, not depending on other websites
> for content is a plus.)

- That's difficult to do, because video files are so large. Also, we'd
get more people to find them if they're hosted on a website like
youtube. And most uploaders use those public services anyway. Uploading
twice is a lot to ask, it takes a long time to upload a video, depending
upon your internet connection.

Hope this helps a bit,
Regards,
 Maren

> 
> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message- From: Vardenis Pavardenis
> Sent: Wednesday, January 11, 2017 6:44 AM
> To: Maren Hachmann ; brynn ; Martin Owens ;
> inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
> 
> 
> Hello,
> Matin Owens said: "Because really that page needs to not exist in the
> form it is." and he doing website improvements. So, maybe just wait and
> don't update if really this page change form from current form to new
> form. Lessons list can be created easily, if something agrees with my
> suggestion, but if the page really change whether it's worth it to build?
> 
> 
> 11.01.2017, 05:22, "Maren Hachmann" <ma...@goos-habermann.de>:
> 
> 
> Am 11.01.2017 um 04:00 schrieb brynn:
> 
> 
> I think that page may need to exist into the future. Not all video
> authors will want to go to the trouble to upload theirlinks. And
> having this page will allow us to have a list of some of the best ones,
> which are not in the gallery.
> 
> 
> 
> - Anyone can add any video to the gallery. You can do so, too. We could
> have a 'featured' tag or something similar, too, if we want to designate
> 'the best'. But we can also just let the community decide what they like
> best, by voting on the items. Who knows with certainty what is helpful
> for others...
> 
> 
> 
> Although eventually, maybe it could be combined with the Text Tutorials
> page. They won't be intermingled, just 2 separate section. Maybe - just
> a thought.
> 
> 
> 
> - I would go so far as to replace the text tutorials page, too... it's
> just causing translation work, with no additional benefit in comparison
> to a gallery page (for me).
> 
> 
> 
> As I've said before, I'm sure we can make it nicer to look at.
> 
> Another thought - links to non-YouTube videos will work as well? vimeo,
> e.g.
> 
> 
> 
> - All links will work. For embedding, vimeo and youtube do work. Other
> providers can be added as needed.
> 
> Regards,
> Maren
> 
> 
> 
> All best,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Martin Owens
> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2017 4:37 PM
> To: Maren Hachmann ; inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
> 
> On Tue, 2017-01-10 at 21:21 +0100, Maren Hachmann wrote:
> Can't say that I can see why we'd take this route, when seemingly, we
> all agree that the page would be better off being replaced with a
> proper
> solution to the problem...
> We already had this situation once (where it was my fault), I don't
> like
> to see it repeated.
> 
> Btw. anyone can add a link to an Inkscape tutorial video they like,
> and
> mark as 'Tutorial'. It needn't be the author (but it would be good to
> have them on board, of course). If someone needs help with how to do
> this, I'm available for explanations / step-by-steps.
> 
> I'm really hoping my improvements which are yet to go in, will help get
> links added correctly.
> 
> Because really that page needs to not exist in the form it is.
> 
> But who knows, I have hope the next website release will be met with
> positive review.
> 
> Best Regards, Martin Owens
> 
> --
> 
> 
> Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors
> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
> With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE.
> Training and support from Colfax.
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 11.01.2017 um 14:44 schrieb Vardenis Pavardenis:
> Hello,
> Matin Owens said: "Because really that page needs to not exist in the
> form it is." and he doing website improvements. So, maybe just wait and
> don't update if really this page change form from current form to new
> form. Lessons list can be created easily, if something agrees with my
> suggestion, but if the page really change whether it's worth it to build?
> 

Hi Vardenis,

- I find it would be extremely valuable to have an up-to-date, reviewed
list of useful videos, which could then be added to the gallery.
It's a lot of work to view them all, and then to categorize them, but
I'm sure this would benefit many people. Just now I have answered a user
question with a link to youtube - it would be so much better to answer
it with a link to our gallery :)

I would like it a lot to see them tagged with difficulty levels
(Beginner, Intermediate, Advanced - just like Brynn does on her website
for the text tutorials).

As for tutorial series, it's maybe enough to add the first one in the
row/difficulty level, and then tell people that there are tons of
others, and roughly what topics they cover (at least, if the author of
the series doesn't answer if they are okay with a curated set of their
videos being embedded in the Inkscape website's gallery).

Kind Regards,
 Maren

> 11.01.2017, 05:22, "Maren Hachmann" <ma...@goos-habermann.de>:
>>
>> Am 11.01.2017 um 04:00 schrieb brynn:
>>
>>  I think that page may need to exist into the future. Not all video
>>  authors will want to go to the trouble to upload theirlinks. And
>>  having this page will allow us to have a list of some of the best
>> ones,
>>  which are not in the gallery.
>>
>>
>> - Anyone can add any video to the gallery. You can do so, too. We could
>> have a 'featured' tag or something similar, too, if we want to designate
>> 'the best'. But we can also just let the community decide what they like
>> best, by voting on the items. Who knows with certainty what is helpful
>> for others...
>>
>>  Although eventually, maybe it could be combined with the Text
>> Tutorials
>>  page. They won't be intermingled, just 2 separate section. Maybe
>> - just
>>  a thought.
>>
>>
>> - I would go so far as to replace the text tutorials page, too... it's
>> just causing translation work, with no additional benefit in comparison
>> to a gallery page (for me).
>>
>>  As I've said before, I'm sure we can make it nicer to look at.
>>
>>  Another thought - links to non-YouTube videos will work as well?
>> vimeo,
>>  e.g.
>>
>>
>> - All links will work. For embedding, vimeo and youtube do work. Other
>> providers can be added as needed.
>>
>> Regards,
>>  Maren
>>
>>  All best,
>>  brynn
>>
>>  -Original Message- From: Martin Owens
>>  Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2017 4:37 PM
>>  To: Maren Hachmann ; inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
>> <mailto:inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net>
>>  Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in
>> website
>>
>>  On Tue, 2017-01-10 at 21:21 +0100, Maren Hachmann wrote:
>>
>>  Can't say that I can see why we'd take this route, when
>> seemingly, we
>>  all agree that the page would be better off being replaced with a
>>  proper
>>  solution to the problem...
>>  We already had this situation once (where it was my fault), I
>> don't
>>  like
>>  to see it repeated.
>>
>>  Btw. anyone can add a link to an Inkscape tutorial video they
>> like,
>>  and
>>  mark as 'Tutorial'. It needn't be the author (but it would be
>> good to
>>  have them on board, of course). If someone needs help with
>> how to do
>>  this, I'm available for explanations / step-by-steps.
>>
>>
>>  I'm really hoping my improvements which are yet to go in, will
>> help get
>>  links added correctly.
>>
>>  Because really that page needs to not exist in the form it is.
>>
>>  But who knows, I have hope the next website release will be met with
>>  positive review.
>>
>>  Best Regards, Martin Owens
>>
>>  
>> --
>>
>>  Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processor

Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 11.01.2017 um 04:00 schrieb brynn:
> I think that page  may need to exist into the future.  Not all video
> authors will want to go to the trouble to upload theirlinks.  And
> having this page will allow us to have a list of some of the best ones,
> which are not in the gallery.

- Anyone can add any video to the gallery. You can do so, too. We could
have a 'featured' tag or something similar, too, if we want to designate
'the best'. But we can also just let the community decide what they like
best, by voting on the items. Who knows with certainty what is helpful
for others...

> Although eventually, maybe it could be combined with the Text Tutorials
> page. They won't be intermingled, just 2 separate section.  Maybe - just
> a thought.

- I would go so far as to replace the text tutorials page, too... it's
just causing translation work, with no additional benefit in comparison
to a gallery page (for me).

> As I've said before, I'm sure we can make it nicer to look at.
> 
> Another thought - links to non-YouTube videos will work as well?  vimeo,
> e.g.

- All links will work. For embedding, vimeo and youtube do work. Other
providers can be added as needed.

Regards,
 Maren

> All best,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Martin Owens
> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2017 4:37 PM
> To: Maren Hachmann ; inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
> 
> On Tue, 2017-01-10 at 21:21 +0100, Maren Hachmann wrote:
>> Can't say that I can see why we'd take this route, when seemingly, we
>> all agree that the page would be better off being replaced with a
>> proper
>> solution to the problem...
>> We already had this situation once (where it was my fault), I don't
>> like
>> to see it repeated.
>>
>> Btw. anyone can add a link to an Inkscape tutorial video they like,
>> and
>> mark as 'Tutorial'. It needn't be the author (but it would be good to
>> have them on board, of course). If someone needs help with how to do
>> this, I'm available for explanations / step-by-steps.
> 
> I'm really hoping my improvements which are yet to go in, will help get
> links added correctly.
> 
> Because really that page needs to not exist in the form it is.
> 
> But who knows, I have hope the next website release will be met with
> positive review.
> 
> Best Regards, Martin Owens
> 
> --
> 
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website

[Maren Hachmann]

Can't say that I can see why we'd take this route, when seemingly, we
all agree that the page would be better off being replaced with a proper
solution to the problem...
We already had this situation once (where it was my fault), I don't like
to see it repeated.

Btw. anyone can add a link to an Inkscape tutorial video they like, and
mark as 'Tutorial'. It needn't be the author (but it would be good to
have them on board, of course). If someone needs help with how to do
this, I'm available for explanations / step-by-steps.

Maren


Am 10.01.2017 um 20:37 schrieb brynn:
>> * a custom image.
> 
> I might make a couple of example bullets.  Nothing fancy, because here, I 
> think 
> we need something subtle.  If I make a custom bullets, I guess I would have 
> to 
> give you and/or Maren the file, so you can upload it.  After that, how would 
> I 
> call on that custom bullet, when I’m want to use it?
> 
> Yes, I like how you reorganized that page.  That looks much better already.
> 
> Maybe I can do the same thing.  I mean, start experimenting on the current 
> page, 
> instead of waiting for Vardenis’ list.
> 
> I have to leave for a dentist appointment in a few minutes, otherwise I’d 
> start 
> right now.  Maybe tonight I can start.
> 
> Thanks for the info Sylvain  :-)
> 
> PS - sorry if you're seeing blue text, I'm not sure what happened - didn't 
> know 
> plain text could have any color but black - working to fix  :-)
> 
> ___
> From: Sylvain Chiron
> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2017 9:27 AM
> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
> 
> Le 07/01/2017 à 04:49, brynn a écrit :
>> I suppose there's no way to make a custom bullet, is there?  I can 
>> see
>> the list format working, with more subtle bullets.   Maybe gray instead of
>> black, or something else --  smaller bullets maybe?  Sylvain, if you're 
>> watching
>> this thread, maybe you know about that?  I guess I've done it in the past, by
>> list style.  But I'm not sure how hard it would be to do on this website.
> 
> https://css-tricks.com/almanac/properties/l/list-style/
> You can only have:
> * a disc (default),
> * a circle (default for nested list),
> * a square (default for list nested several times),
> * nothing,
> * a custom image.
> 
> I also think the page is ugly.
> The first thing to do is to use more headings for the tree, at least for
> authors, like here:
> https://inkscape.org/fr/apprendre/tutoriels-video/
> I tried to remove the circles (leaving only the discs) but it looks like
> the editor doesn’t allow `list-style`.
> --
> Sylvain
> 
> --
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Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 06.01.2017 um 10:45 schrieb Martin Owens:
> P.S. Maren, I should check to make sure that our pages don't say "by
> Username" when the item is "I have permission" instead of "I own this
> work"

? *scratches head*

Is there anything you're asking me to do here? I'm not sure I know which
items you may be referring to, though...

Regards,
 Maren

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Re: [Inkscape-docs] Website, Debugging updated: Publish?

[Maren Hachmann]

Thanks, Martin. Because of current website load, I'll wait a bit before
I push the publish button. It doesn't work too well currently :/

Maren

Am 04.01.2017 um 13:31 schrieb Martin Owens:
> It should be live, sorry for the confusion.
> 
> On Thu, 2016-12-29 at 20:42 +0100, Maren Hachmann wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Martin seems to have updated the debugging section a couple of days
>> ago:
>> https://inkscape.org/en/develop/debugging/?edit
>>
>> Was it intended to be published, or is it still a WIP?
>>
>> Maren
>>
>> ---
>> ---
>> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most 
>> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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> 


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Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 03.01.2017 um 23:50 schrieb Vardenis Pavardenis:
> I'm thinking now about just editing this list, but Marten idea too
> wonderful, but it's hard to achieve, but I try to contact some authors
> of videos to upload videos in inkscape.org too.
> Make list is a lot easer I think, and sure I can try (if it good, some
> edit and update), about list I'm thinking first of all "Inkscape
> Explained"
> (https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLynG8gQD-n8Byyq30_FOq9ylUFL1nTkGC 
> <https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLynG8gQD-n8Byyq30_FOq9ylUFL1nTkGC)>)
> it's must know for all beginners(IMO), then some videos from beginner,
> intermediate, logo design. how to draw from Sid Arts, game art/animation
> from Chris Hildenbrand and if I found from others and paste (pastebin)
> in here in format:
> Author AuthorChannelUrl
> with narration
> VideoUrl
> VideoDescription
> 
> I'm think I can do that (beta. :-))) in few days or less. Deal?

- Sounds wonderful to me :) I'm happy with any kind of update.

If you like, you can already have a think about how you would layout the
page. Brynn is right about the nested lists being not easy to look at.

Regards,
 Maren

> 04.01.2017, 00:37, "brynn" <br...@frii.com>:
>>
>> So now you don't want to edit Video Tutorials page? Just so I'm clear
>> what's
>> happening.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> brynn
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Vardenis Pavardenis
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2017 3:22 PM
>> To: Maren Hachmann ; brynn ; inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
>> <mailto:inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net>
>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
>>
>>
>> I Agree, it's better to contact to video authors and if authors agree
>> to upload
>> videos in website it would be wonderful and as Maren said in page Top
>> 10 or
>> something. Than i try to contact YouTubers who create videos and
>> request that
>> they upload too videos in inkscape.org website. :-)
>>
>>
>> 04.01.2017, 00:07, "Maren Hachmann" <ma...@goos-habermann.de
>> <mailto:ma...@goos-habermann.de>>:
>>
>>
>> Am 03.01.2017 um 23:02 schrieb brynn:
>>
>>
>> I think getting rid of that page would be fine, once I've had a chance
>> to contact all the tutorial authors (just like Neon22 is doing for
>> extensions) and we have a lot of tutorials loaded to the site. But
>> again, that's not something I can start on right away.
>>
>>
>>
>> - But Vardenis could, and there's no urgency at all. I wonder if he
>> might prefer doing a task that will take the website forward, instead of
>> a short-term fix? We could select the top 10 or so videos, if we still
>> want to keep that page, then. It's much, much too long (and the field is
>> still open, no decision was made).
>>
>>
>>
>> But for the short term, we can make the Video Tutorials page a little
>> more current, and look better too. I'm not sure where all those bullets
>> came from. I think someone else must have edited after I did (years ago)
>>
>> But I'm still trying to understand what Martin meant.
>>
>>
>>
>> - He might have meant both at the same time, in preparation for the
>> switch, not sure.
>>
>> Maren
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2017 2:54 PM
>> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
>> <mailto:inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net>
>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
>>
>> Am 03.01.2017 um 22:49 schrieb brynn:
>> I'm so confused! We were talking about editing the Video Tutorials
>> page. But
>> now we are putting them in the gallery?
>>
>> - I wouldn't mind if some day, someone would decommission that page
>> entirely... It's not a beautiful page, and the gallery can do it just as
>> well, only with search, tags, ordering by quality, pagination,
>> commenting ...
>>
>> I think that would be an improvement, and also make it easier for new
>> videos to be added by their creators.
>>
>> But maybe that would be going too far?
>>
>> Regards,
>> Maren
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Vardenis Pavardenis
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2017 2:47 PM
>> To: brynn
>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
>>
>>
>> https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/upload/ Resource Name, Descriptin,
&g

Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 03.01.2017 um 23:02 schrieb brynn:
> I think getting rid of that page would be fine, once I've had a chance
> to contact all the tutorial authors (just like Neon22 is doing for
> extensions) and we have a lot of tutorials loaded to the site.  But
> again, that's not something I can start on right away.

- But Vardenis could, and there's no urgency at all. I wonder if he
might prefer doing a task that will take the website forward, instead of
a short-term fix? We could select the top 10 or so videos, if we still
want to keep that page, then. It's much, much too long (and the field is
still open, no decision was made).

> But for the short term, we can make the Video Tutorials page a little
> more current, and look better too.  I'm not sure where all those bullets
> came from. I think someone else must have edited after I did (years ago)
> 
> But I'm still trying to understand what Martin meant.

- He might have meant both at the same time, in preparation for the
switch, not sure.

Maren

> Thanks
> 
> -----Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2017 2:54 PM
> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
> 
> Am 03.01.2017 um 22:49 schrieb brynn:
>> I'm so confused!  We were talking about editing the Video Tutorials
>> page.  But
>> now we are putting them in the gallery?
> 
> - I wouldn't mind if some day, someone would decommission that page
> entirely... It's not a beautiful page, and the gallery can do it just as
> well, only with search, tags, ordering by quality, pagination,
> commenting ...
> 
> I think that would be an improvement, and also make it easier for new
> videos to be added by their creators.
> 
> But maybe that would be going too far?
> 
> Regards,
> Maren
> 
>> -Original Message- From: Vardenis Pavardenis
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2017 2:47 PM
>> To: brynn
>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
>>
>>
>> https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/upload/ Resource Name, Descriptin,
>> External
>> Link - In here YouTube Link as I understand.
>>
>>
>> 03.01.2017, 23:45, "brynn" <br...@frii.com>:
>>
>>
>> I don't understand what this means:
>>
>>
>>
>> - He was rather asking to post a link as a resource.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2017 2:32 PM
>> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
>>
>> Am 03.01.2017 um 22:00 schrieb brynn:
>>
>>
>> Hi Vardenis,
>>  I think I understand what you mean. You're thinking it would be
>> better
>> not to mix up video and text tutorials, in the gallery? Well, they
>> already
>> are
>> mixed up in the gallery (https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/=tutorial/).
>> However,
>> you can choose to look at only text or only videos. See on the right
>> column,
>> where it says "textual" and "video", black buttons with white text?
>>  Although I'm not sure if that works, if the author did not
>> put such a
>> tag when they uploaded?? Yeah, if you click on video, it's blank, as
>> if there
>> were no videos. Is it possible to manually add those tags, to the video
>> tutorials?
>>
>>
>>
>> - Yes, they can be tagged just like any other item in the gallery. The
>> tags on the right are the 'official' ones, just like it works for the
>> extensions.
>>
>> (I'm addressing this reply to the list, since I have this question.)
>>
>>
>>  But Martin is talking about something else, I think. He's
>> asking to
>> have the videos embedded on the Video Tutorials page.
>>
>>
>>
>> - He was rather asking to post a link as a resource. The embedding will
>> work automatically.
>>
>>
>>
>> I haven't ever done that
>> before, or seen it. So I'm not sure what it will look like.
>>  I'll try an example, using one of the heathenex vids, because
>> I know
>> they have a free license. Then we can both see what it's going to look
>> like.
>> I'll do it in just a few minutes.
>>  But I still wonder about taking just any YT video and
>> embedding it.
>> Are
>> all YT videos automatically public domain?
>>
>>
>>
>> - Nope, most are 'Standard Youtube Licence'.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Maren

Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 03.01.2017 um 22:49 schrieb brynn:
> I'm so confused!  We were talking about editing the Video Tutorials page.  
> But 
> now we are putting them in the gallery?

- I wouldn't mind if some day, someone would decommission that page
entirely... It's not a beautiful page, and the gallery can do it just as
well, only with search, tags, ordering by quality, pagination,
commenting ...

I think that would be an improvement, and also make it easier for new
videos to be added by their creators.

But maybe that would be going too far?

Regards,
 Maren

> -Original Message- 
> From: Vardenis Pavardenis
> Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2017 2:47 PM
> To: brynn
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
> 
> 
> https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/upload/ Resource Name, Descriptin, External 
> Link - In here YouTube Link as I understand.
> 
> 
> 03.01.2017, 23:45, "brynn" <br...@frii.com>:
> 
> 
> I don't understand what this means:
> 
> 
> 
> - He was rather asking to post a link as a resource.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks
> 
> -Original Message- 
> From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2017 2:32 PM
> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
> 
> Am 03.01.2017 um 22:00 schrieb brynn:
> 
> 
> Hi Vardenis,
>  I think I understand what you mean. You're thinking it would be
> better
> not to mix up video and text tutorials, in the gallery? Well, they already
> are
> mixed up in the gallery (https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/=tutorial/).
> However,
> you can choose to look at only text or only videos. See on the right column,
> where it says "textual" and "video", black buttons with white text?
>  Although I'm not sure if that works, if the author did not put such a
> tag when they uploaded?? Yeah, if you click on video, it's blank, as if there
> were no videos. Is it possible to manually add those tags, to the video
> tutorials?
> 
> 
> 
> - Yes, they can be tagged just like any other item in the gallery. The
> tags on the right are the 'official' ones, just like it works for the
> extensions.
> 
> (I'm addressing this reply to the list, since I have this question.)
> 
> 
>  But Martin is talking about something else, I think. He's asking to
> have the videos embedded on the Video Tutorials page.
> 
> 
> 
> - He was rather asking to post a link as a resource. The embedding will
> work automatically.
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't ever done that
> before, or seen it. So I'm not sure what it will look like.
>  I'll try an example, using one of the heathenex vids, because I know
> they have a free license. Then we can both see what it's going to look like.
> I'll do it in just a few minutes.
>  But I still wonder about taking just any YT video and embedding it.
> Are
> all YT videos automatically public domain?
> 
> 
> 
> - Nope, most are 'Standard Youtube Licence'.
> 
> Regards,
> Maren
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- 
> From: Vardenis Pavardenis
> Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2017 1:11 PM
> To: brynn
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
> 
> 
> I'm thinking maybe better just add link's to article (Video Tutorials) and
> don't
> upload all this videos as resources in gallery, tutorials section (current
> video
> tutorials only link's), because in gallery, tutorials is more text based than
> videos, and I think if I would start uploading videos to tutorials category
> (https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/=tutorial/), it would become a bit of a mess
> and "Video Tutorials" category in websites loss of sense. What do you thinks?
> 
> Sorry for my bad English language, Thanks.
> 
> 
> 03.01.2017, 21:45, "brynn" <br...@frii.com>:
> 
> 
> First I should say that I'm not a frequent YT user or video watcher. Is there
> no copyright issue, to just grab a video and upload it?
> 
> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- 
> From: Martin Owens
> Sent: Monday, January 02, 2017 9:49 PM
> To: brynn ; Vardenis Pavardenis
> Cc: Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
> 
> Don't forget to upload each of the videos into the website, if you add
> the youtube video as the URL link it will embed the video and you can
> add text and other important information like the license (if there is
> one).
> 
> This way videos can be collected onto these tutorial pages using the
> gallery widgets.
>

Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 03.01.2017 um 22:33 schrieb brynn:
> Oh, hi Maren  :-)
> 
> Did I do it right?  Please look at text link
> "Inkscape-screencast2-Globe" which is the first under "with narration"
> for Richard Querin.
> 
> Or did he mean to put it in the gallery, and I misunderstood?

- Yes :)

> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- From: Maren Hachmann
> Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2017 2:29 PM
> To: inkscape-docs@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
> 
> Am 03.01.2017 um 20:45 schrieb brynn:
>> First I should say that I'm not a frequent YT user or video watcher. 
>> Is there
>> no copyright issue, to just grab a video and upload it?
> 
> - Martin meant 'upload a link as a resource to the website' when he
> wrote 'upload'. Linking should be allowed in this case :) (standard
> youtube licence, I expect).
> 
> Regards,
> Maren
> 
>> Thanks,
>> brynn
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Martin Owens
>> Sent: Monday, January 02, 2017 9:49 PM
>> To: brynn ; Vardenis Pavardenis
>> Cc: Inkscape-Docs
>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
>>
>> Don't forget to upload each of the videos into the website, if you add
>> the youtube video as the URL link it will embed the video and you can
>> add text and other important information like the license (if there is
>> one).
>>
>> This way videos can be collected onto these tutorial pages using the
>> gallery widgets.
>>
>> Martin,
>>
>> On Mon, 2017-01-02 at 16:02 -0700, brynn wrote:
>>> No need to create a page.  But if you want to make a list of
>>> tutorials, with a
>>> link to each one, I'll be glad to add them to that page.  That page
>>> needs some
>>> attention besides current videos, too.  I'm not sure how it got to be
>>> organized
>>> like it is, but I'm sure we could eliminate a lot of bullets.
>>>
>>> Thanks for your help,
>>> brynn
>>>
>>> -Original Message- From: Vardenis Pavardenis
>>> Sent: Monday, January 02, 2017 12:40 PM
>>> To: brynn
>>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in
>>> website
>>>
>>>
>>> No, no (I don't have permissions and maybe someone don't agree with
>>> me). I'm not
>>> editing, I'm only discuss for now about "Video Tutorials" section,
>>> and I'm
>>> thinking Nick Saporito, Chris Hildenbrand, Sids Art tutorials can be
>>> more
>>> helpful than now tutorials in Video Tutorial section.
>>> I can try (In text editor) create page with format familiar to the
>>> current with
>>> new video tutorials from above authors and share here. :-)
>>>
>>>
>>> 02.01.2017, 21:26, "brynn" <br...@frii.com>:
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Vardenis,
>>> Yes, Nick Saporito has very quickly compiled a huge amount of
>>> Inkscape
>>> tutorials! I think that now, they aren't quite as good as when he
>>> first
>>> started. Goes a little too fast now. And it drives me crazy that he
>>> ALWAYS
>>> calls the Selection tool, "the arrow tool". Even after I mentioned
>>> it, he still
>>> keeps saying it. But still, they are a free resource, and I think
>>> they are
>>> helpful for a LOT of Inkscape users.
>>> Chris Hildenbrand's tutorials are mostly text tutorials. I
>>> think only a
>>> few are videos. Unless recently he's started using videos? But yes,
>>> very good!
>>> I haven't heard of Sids Art. I'll follow your link and check
>>> it out.
>>> Yes, those would certainly help to make the Video Tutorials
>>> page more
>>> current. I didn't understand you though. Did you mean to say that you
>>> are
>>> going to edit that page? If you want to help with the Inkscape
>>> project, and
>>> edit that page, we can give you permissions to edit the website.
>>>
>>> All best,
>>> brynn
>>>
>>> -Original Message- From: Vardenis Pavardenis
>>> Sent: Monday, January 02, 2017 11:55 AM
>>> To: brynn
>>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in
>>> website
>>>
>>>
>>> Hello, Brynn,
>>> Thanks for you website, it is amazing! And really try to help wit

Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 03.01.2017 um 22:25 schrieb brynn:
> Ok, Vardenis, click on the text link "Inkscape-screencast2-Globe", on the 
> Video 
> Tutorials page.  It's the first one under "with narration" for Richard Querin.
> 
> And Martin, is that what you meant?

- Is this something that requires translation? Or will we wait until
it's complete?

Maren

> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- 
> From: Martin Owens
> Sent: Monday, January 02, 2017 9:49 PM
> To: brynn ; Vardenis Pavardenis
> Cc: Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
> 
> Don't forget to upload each of the videos into the website, if you add
> the youtube video as the URL link it will embed the video and you can
> add text and other important information like the license (if there is
> one).
> 
> This way videos can be collected onto these tutorial pages using the
> gallery widgets.
> 
> Martin,
> 
> On Mon, 2017-01-02 at 16:02 -0700, brynn wrote:
>> No need to create a page.  But if you want to make a list of
>> tutorials, with a
>> link to each one, I'll be glad to add them to that page.  That page
>> needs some
>> attention besides current videos, too.  I'm not sure how it got to be
>> organized
>> like it is, but I'm sure we could eliminate a lot of bullets.
>>
>> Thanks for your help,
>> brynn
>>
>> -Original Message- 
>> From: Vardenis Pavardenis
>> Sent: Monday, January 02, 2017 12:40 PM
>> To: brynn
>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in
>> website
>>
>>
>> No, no (I don't have permissions and maybe someone don't agree with
>> me). I'm not
>> editing, I'm only discuss for now about "Video Tutorials" section,
>> and I'm
>> thinking Nick Saporito, Chris Hildenbrand, Sids Art tutorials can be
>> more
>> helpful than now tutorials in Video Tutorial section.
>> I can try (In text editor) create page with format familiar to the
>> current with
>> new video tutorials from above authors and share here. :-)
>>
>>
>> 02.01.2017, 21:26, "brynn" :
>>
>>
>> Hi Vardenis,
>> Yes, Nick Saporito has very quickly compiled a huge amount of
>> Inkscape
>> tutorials! I think that now, they aren't quite as good as when he
>> first
>> started. Goes a little too fast now. And it drives me crazy that he
>> ALWAYS
>> calls the Selection tool, "the arrow tool". Even after I mentioned
>> it, he still
>> keeps saying it. But still, they are a free resource, and I think
>> they are
>> helpful for a LOT of Inkscape users.
>> Chris Hildenbrand's tutorials are mostly text tutorials. I
>> think only a
>> few are videos. Unless recently he's started using videos? But yes,
>> very good!
>> I haven't heard of Sids Art. I'll follow your link and check
>> it out.
>> Yes, those would certainly help to make the Video Tutorials
>> page more
>> current. I didn't understand you though. Did you mean to say that you
>> are
>> going to edit that page? If you want to help with the Inkscape
>> project, and
>> edit that page, we can give you permissions to edit the website.
>>
>> All best,
>> brynn
>>
>> -Original Message- 
>> From: Vardenis Pavardenis
>> Sent: Monday, January 02, 2017 11:55 AM
>> To: brynn
>> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in
>> website
>>
>>
>> Hello, Brynn,
>> Thanks for you website, it is amazing! And really try to help with
>> your website
>> and outdated tutorials, I'm now trying with Video Tutorials section
>> in website,
>> Thanks for you help. ;-)
>> I'm thinking in "Video Tutorials" section tutorials from Nick
>> Saporito
>> (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEQXp_fcqwPcqrzNtWJ1w9w/playlists),
>> he have
>> playlist Inkscape explained(for very beginners), Inkscape Beginner
>> Tutorials,
>> Inkscape Intermediate/Advanced Tutorials, Inkscape Typeface
>> Tutorials, Inkscape
>> Logo tutorials, he explains from very beginning to advanced topics in
>> Inkscape,
>> too Chris Hildenbrand have awesome tutorials(
>> https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCVMhFCCmrMisICIoyTIXsKw/playlists )
>> for game
>> art, Inkscape basics of game art creation, Inkscape seamless
>> patterns, too in
>> channel is tutorials about how to animate. Too Sids Art - Inkscape
>> And Drawing
>> have interesting tutorials
>> (https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLLI43BLYCGCqrnxqHwDRTni9K3V-Y
>> bkhs).
>>
>> I'm thinking this videos make Video Tutorials section more modern and
>> more
>> interest.
>>
>> What do you thinks about that?
>>
>> Sorry for my bad English language, Thanks. :-)
>>
>>
>> 02.01.2017, 20:41, "brynn" :
>>
>>
>> I have an interest in tutorials of all kinds, and keep a list of what
>> I consider
>> the best or most helpful tutorials (meaning that they don't contain
>> any errors
>> or outdated steps) on my website: https://forum.inkscapecommunity.com
>> /index.php
>> It's probably about 6 months out of date, right now. But I'll make it
>> current
>> pretty soon.
>>
>> I have a plan to bring them 

Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website

[Maren Hachmann]

Am 03.01.2017 um 22:00 schrieb brynn:
> Hi Vardenis,
> I think I understand what you mean.  You're thinking it would be 
> better 
> not to mix up video and text tutorials, in the gallery?  Well, they already 
> are 
> mixed up in the gallery (https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/=tutorial/).  
> However, 
> you can choose to look at only text or only videos.  See on the right column, 
> where it says "textual" and "video", black buttons with white text?
> Although I'm not sure if that works, if the author did not put such a 
> tag when they uploaded??  Yeah, if you click on video, it's blank, as if 
> there 
> were no videos.  Is it possible to manually add those tags, to the video 
> tutorials?  

- Yes, they can be tagged just like any other item in the gallery. The
tags on the right are the 'official' ones, just like it works for the
extensions.

(I'm addressing this reply to the list, since I have this question.)
> But Martin is talking about something else, I think.  He's asking to 
> have the videos embedded on the Video Tutorials page.  

- He was rather asking to post a link as a resource. The embedding will
work automatically.

> I haven't ever done that 
> before, or seen it.  So I'm not sure what it will look like.
> I'll try an example, using one of the heathenex vids, because I know 
> they have a free license.  Then we can both see what it's going to look like. 
> I'll do it in just a few minutes.
> But I still wonder about taking just any YT video and embedding it.  
> Are 
> all YT videos automatically public domain?

- Nope, most are 'Standard Youtube Licence'.

Regards,
 Maren

> 
> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- 
> From: Vardenis Pavardenis
> Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2017 1:11 PM
> To: brynn
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
> 
> 
> I'm thinking maybe better just add link's to article (Video Tutorials) and 
> don't 
> upload all this videos as resources in gallery, tutorials section (current 
> video 
> tutorials only link's), because in gallery, tutorials is more text based than 
> videos, and I think if I would start uploading videos to tutorials category 
> (https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/=tutorial/), it would become a bit of a mess 
> and "Video Tutorials" category in websites loss of sense. What do you thinks?
> 
> Sorry for my bad English language, Thanks.
> 
> 
> 03.01.2017, 21:45, "brynn" :
> 
> 
> First I should say that I'm not a frequent YT user or video watcher. Is there
> no copyright issue, to just grab a video and upload it?
> 
> Thanks,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- 
> From: Martin Owens
> Sent: Monday, January 02, 2017 9:49 PM
> To: brynn ; Vardenis Pavardenis
> Cc: Inkscape-Docs
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in website
> 
> Don't forget to upload each of the videos into the website, if you add
> the youtube video as the URL link it will embed the video and you can
> add text and other important information like the license (if there is
> one).
> 
> This way videos can be collected onto these tutorial pages using the
> gallery widgets.
> 
> Martin,
> 
> On Mon, 2017-01-02 at 16:02 -0700, brynn wrote:
> 
> 
> No need to create a page. But if you want to make a list of
> tutorials, with a
> link to each one, I'll be glad to add them to that page. That page
> needs some
> attention besides current videos, too. I'm not sure how it got to be
> organized
> like it is, but I'm sure we could eliminate a lot of bullets.
> 
> Thanks for your help,
> brynn
> 
> -Original Message- 
> From: Vardenis Pavardenis
> Sent: Monday, January 02, 2017 12:40 PM
> To: brynn
> Subject: Re: [Inkscape-docs] Update "Video Tutorials" section in
> website
> 
> 
> No, no (I don't have permissions and maybe someone don't agree with
> me). I'm not
> editing, I'm only discuss for now about "Video Tutorials" section,
> and I'm
> thinking Nick Saporito, Chris Hildenbrand, Sids Art tutorials can be
> more
> helpful than now tutorials in Video Tutorial section.
> I can try (In text editor) create page with format familiar to the
> current with
> new video tutorials from above authors and share here. :-)
> 
> 
> 02.01.2017, 21:26, "brynn" :
> 
> 
> Hi Vardenis,
>  Yes, Nick Saporito has very quickly compiled a huge amount of
> Inkscape
> tutorials! I think that now, they aren't quite as good as when he
> first
> started. Goes a little too fast now. And it drives me crazy that he
> ALWAYS
> calls the Selection tool, "the arrow tool". Even after I mentioned
> it, he still
> keeps saying it. But still, they are a free resource, and I think
> they are
> helpful for a LOT of Inkscape users.
>  Chris Hildenbrand's tutorials are mostly text tutorials. I
> think only a
> few are videos. Unless recently he's started using videos? But yes,
> very good!
>  I haven't heard of Sids Art. I'll follow your link and check
>