Re: [lace] Securing knots in silk

[Adele Shaak]

Hi Liz:

If you’ve done Japanese embroidery and have finished it with wheat paste, then 
you will know whether or not the paste will show. It might depend on the colour 
of thread you’ve used. Even clear glue will make a noticeable dark spot on the 
thread; I don’t think wheat paste will do that. However, - wheat paste works by 
stiffening the fibers, and if the piece is worn or repeatedly flexed for some 
reason, the wheat paste will break down. And of course if you wash the lace it 
will come out. So if you’re going to frame your piece and put it on the wall, 
the wheat paste will probably work just fine, but if you’ll wear it, maybe it 
won’t work so well.

As you no doubt know from your Japanese embroidery, if you stitch silk through 
itself the scales catch on one another and the thread will not slip away from 
that. You could put each thread through a needle and stitch it through any 
other thread to hold it. Of course that’s pretty tedious and there’s a strong 
chance you won’t be able to stitch so many threads without in some way pulling 
the silk out of alignment. 

Each method has its pros and cons; I think if you’re just planning this as a 
show piece you could easily firm up the knots with wheat paste and leave it at 
that.

Hope this helps.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

> I have a question about the best way to secure knots in silk thread?
> 
> I have just finished a piece from the "Into a Circle" pattern pack using Bart 
> and Francis flat silk thread.  I have done the sewings and tied a surgeons 
> knot.  I have not cut off the bobbins yet and I can see that some of the 
> knots are beginning to open up.
> 
> In Japanese Embroidery a dab of wheat paste is used to make sure nothing 
> slips.  But I can hear Jeri gasping in horror from here!
> 
> Do any of you have any suggestions?
> Thank you,

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Re: [lace] Book recommended

[Adele Shaak]

Hi David -

I’m with you. Weavers have a few techniques they call lace - in which they
create regular patterns of holes in the cloth as they weave it. So there are
weavers who weave lace.

However, that’s not what Lauren Chater is talking about in her book. I
looked up her publisher’s (Simon & Shuster) website and saw this:

"Katarina battles to protect her grandmother’s precious legacy – the
weaving of gossamer lace shawls stitched with intricate patterns that tell the
stories passed down through generations”

So, let’s get this straight … her woven shawls are said to be
“stitched”, which would suggest embroider … except that they’re made
from gossamer wool, and given that the story takes place in Russia I have a
feeling that these shawls are actually Orenberg shawls (very fine knitted
lace). Another quote that suggests they’re knitted is “every shawl starts
with a circle”

It may be an excellent book, but the author definitely doesn’t know her
techniques and her vocabulary!

Adele


> On Sep 27, 2018, at 8:27 AM, David C Collyer 
wrote:
>
> Dear Friends
>
> Last night I bought a book on kindle which has been highly recommended.
It's
> called "The Lace Weaver" by Lauren Chater.
>
> It'll be a while till I get to it but I'm always a bit wary when the author
> calls it weaving. I don't know any lace makers who do.
>
> We'll see

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Re: [lace] Book recommended

[Adele Shaak]

Hi Ilske, 

Good suggestion, but our problem is the other way around. It’s not the word 
lace, it’s that the author uses words associated with weaving, knitting and 
embroidery - all very different things - to describe the same thing. So, in 
your example, your Spitze is either Strick- or Häkel- but it isn't both. And 
neither your Strick-spitze nor your Häkel-spitze is gewebte!

Adele

> On Sep 27, 2018, at 9:27 AM, Ilske Thomsen  
> wrote:
> 
> Hello Adele and David,
> could it be as it was in Germany still 70 years ago. Works done in very fine 
> threads,  wool or cotton or silk, in what ever sort of handicraft, knitting 
> or crochet, named lace more exact Strick-spitze, Häkel-spitze. And the author 
> uses the word lace in such sense?
> 
> Ilske

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Re: [lace] Belgium in WWI: Flour Sacks and Lace

[Adele Shaak]

Didn’t work for me, either, but I discovered that’s because there was a
spelling error in putting up the page!

Hit this link for information on war lace in “Beligan”

https://laceioli.ning.com/forum/topics/beligan-war-lace-from-wwi


Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

> On Oct 27, 2018, at 2:03 PM, Jill  wrote:
>
> JeriThe link to IOLI Ning site does not work for me. Jill
> https://laceioli.ning.com/forum/topics/belgian-war-lace-from-wwi

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Re: [lace] Guttermans Threads

[Adele Shaak]

There are several different kinds of Gutterman threads, in both synthetic and 
natural fibres. Gutterman’s silk and their 100% cotton work well for lace. I 
haven’t worked with any of their polyester threads.

Adele

> Are Guttermans threads suitable for lacemaking?  My local haberdashery has 
> started keeping them in a range of colours. 
> Ann
> UK

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Re: [lace] Mystery thread

[Adele Shaak]

I let Google translate this page and it turned out quite well:

https://translate.google.ca/translate?hl=en=nl=http://www.ethesis.net/aa
lst_textiel/deel_I/aalst_textiel_deel_I_2_g.htm=search


As you can see, the company was taken over by Coats in the 60s. Since your
cone is plastic, I assume the thread has been made under the Coats banner.
The number 9052 could be a stock number, as Nancy suggests, but since it comes
directly after the place-name “Aalst”, I would not be surprised if it was
the European equivalent of a Zip code.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)


> On Sep 3, 2018, at 11:59 AM, N.A. Neff  wrote:
>
> See
http://www.ethesis.net/aalst_textiel/deel_I/aalst_textiel_deel_I_2_g.htm
> .
>
> FFR is an acronym for the company ( Filature et Filteries Réunies), and I
> think "Aalst" is the name of the town.  "9052" is probably their stock or
> product number.
>
> 80/2 is surely the weight, "Wit" and "Blanc" = white
>
> "ca 2500M" = about 2500 meters ("circa" = about)
>
> and I would guess "Brillante" means optic white or bleached. If it's cream
> now, I expect it's yellowed because of how it was stored or perhaps just
> age.
>
> What do you think?  HTH

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Re: [lace] Design program

[Adele Shaak]

I learned on Adobe Illustrator, which cost a lot but I loved it. Then Apple 
upgraded their operating systems and I lost my version, and couldn’t get it 
back because by then Illustrator was subscription-only and I did not want to go 
that route. So I had no good computer graphics program for a while, but then I 
found Affinity Designer, a British program that is similar to Illustrator but 
much cheaper (I think I only paid $70 US!). I must say I’m very happy with it, 
and recommend it to anyone wanting a good vector-drawing program with lots of 
scope.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

> On Sep 19, 2018, at 1:22 PM, Gon Homburg  wrote:
> 
> I use for designing and drawing Adobe Illustrator. I like to use it. Perhaps
> Knipling and Lace8 are cheaper that Illustrator, but both programs are not
> compatible with Apple.
> So I am happy with my Illustrator. I asked once the seller of Lace in the
> Netherlands, why Lace wasn’t compatible with Apple. He answered that Apple
> was for graphic designers. Which in my opinion is also a lace designer.
> 
>> Op 19 sep. 2018, om 21:54 heeft jo  het volgende
> geschreven:
>> 
>> For the fee of 3 months you can own CorellDraw,
>> for a tenth of the monthly fee you can use Adobe Illustrator. No affiliate.
>> Both are still significantly more expensive than Lace8 and KnipLing.
> 
> -

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Re: [lace] Book recommended

[Adele Shaak]

Hi Jeri:

I searched the title and author and immediately came up with the publisher’s
page for the book:
http://www.simonandschuster.com.au/books/The-Lace-Weaver/Lauren-Chater/978192
5596335


As you can see, this book is published by Simon & Shuster Australia, in both a
trade paperback and an electronic edition. Given that the trade paperback's
price is only listed in $AUS and $NZ, I suspect that the “real" book is
readily available in Australia and New Zealand but not, perhaps, in other
countries. The electronic edition can, of course, be downloaded anywhere in
the world, which is most likely why you only found the Kindle listing if, for
example, you searched Amazon US.

However, The Book Depository also has it and as you probably know, The Book
Depository ships free worldwide. Their website says they it will be dispatched
from Australia within 4 days.
You will find their listing here: https://tinyurl.com/yapnjfon


Hope this helps.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

> The Subject line of David's memo says "Book recommended".  Searched, and
only
> found Kindle references to The Lace Weaver by Lauren Chater.  Please
forgive
> my ignorance, but can it be purchased as a REAL book - by my definition?
>  Thankfully, this is a work of fiction.  If any of you want to have
> something of substance that you wrote available to read in a dozen years,
> consider paper and ink.  It will be copyright-protected for years to come.
> Jeri Ames in Maine USALace and Embroidery Resource

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Re: [lace] Alice Howell hacked?

[Adele Shaak]

Oh, that and so much more. Thank goodness we are not all as innocent as we used 
to be! Instead, we ask questions like:

- why is Alice trying to get me to buy a gift card at 5:42 a.m. Pacific time?
- Alice has a full life and many friends. Why would she need me to buy a gift 
card for her?
- Even if I did think Alice needed me to buy a gift card, there is no 
information as to where to have it sent so … how is this going to work, exactly?

I can’t figure out exactly how this phishing message was supposed to work, 
because usually you’d be given a link that would take you to a website that 
would pretend to sell you a game card while harvesting your credit card 
information, and that didn’t happen here - there’s no link in the message. 
Wondering if maybe our ancient major-domo is so old it didn’t process the link? 
Hmmm.

Adele

> On Jan 16, 2019, at 3:24 PM, Mary Blackwell  wrote:
> 
> My guess is that Alice’s request for help buying a gift card for her “nephew” 
> is totally bogus, since she (and I) are well beyond the age of having 
> game-playing nephews!  
> 
> OUR nephews (if any) are CEOs and professionals!   
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On Jan 16, 2019, at 11:13 AM, Devon Thein  wrote:
>> 
>> I am wondering if these messages from Alice Howell asking  the list,
>> as though a single person,  to buy a gift card are evidence that she
>> has been hacked. I am not sure how to ask her because the email
>> address is actually the email address I have for her.
>> Devon

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Re: [lace] English point ground lace

[Adele Shaak]

I always think it’s a little like cooking: Seven people make Irish Stew. This 
one cuts her carrots crosswise into buttons, that one quarters her carrots and 
cuts them into chunks. Everybody’s potatoes look a little different. This one 
leaves out one ingredient. That one likes to put in plenty of parsnips. They 
are all making Irish Stew.

Then people who don’t know much about cooking show up, and start labelling the 
stews. This one is from the lady on Broad Street. This man lives over by the 
park. That cook works in a restaurant. The restaurant down the street makes it 
a different way. And so Broad Street Stew, Park Stew, and Restaurant Stew are 
born - and there are two different kinds of Restaurant Stew, and people who 
learn about the two will argue forever about which one is the real, true stew. 

That’s the sort of thing that has happened in the lacemaking world. There are 
hundreds of years of vibrant history. Sometimes lacemakers moved long 
distances. The might be refugees or they might have been deliberately brought 
in to an impoverished area, to bring in a new way to make money. They teach the 
lace from the place they come from but it changes slowly over the years, and by 
the time the collectors and labellers show up it is noticeably different and 
gets its own label. Or, sometimes two laces are basically the same, but then 
people will pick and poke at them because they’re sure there must be 
differences because they come from two different places. 

That is why museum workers tear their hair out trying to figure out how to 
label laces (I’m sure Devon will chime in about her travails). We can broadly 
separate laces by the techniques used - point ground laces, for example. The 
laces you mention fall into that category, along with many Continental laces 
like Tonder, Bayeux, Chantilly … Then there are tape laces, part laces like 
Honiton and Duchesse … 

Then there are some funny hiccups, like how Honiton lace was not made in 
Honiton and I’ve been told a lot of Valenciennes was made at Binche and vice 
versa. In the interests of clarity I think our geographic way of naming laces 
should be superseded by some other method. But I’m not in charge of these 
things ;-)

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)


> On Jan 23, 2019, at 10:15 AM, Susan  wrote:
> 
> What differentiates one from another?! To prepare for some lace study visits, 
> I am making samples of Bucks, Devon Trolly, Downton & Malmesbury plus a few 
> items from the Luton Museum lace dealer’s pattern book. As I was leafing thru 
> several books, I stopped dead in my tracks. Some patterns looked very similar 
> to Little pea, plum pudding & maids in a row—except I wasn’t looking at a 
> book on Bucks!  Say what!?! It made me wonder, if these lace samples were all 
> spread out on a table, how would they be identified? Thread—they all seem to 
> be cotton (so far). Thread weight—some seem a bit finer. Individual 
> motifs—there’s definitely a lot of crossover in shapes & fillings. Bucks 
> seems to feature more florals, otherwise the geometric components are highly 
> similar. Multiple grounds are mentioned but is this the defining feature of 
> each? Or is it the combination of shapes/motifs that separates Luton from 
> Bucks etc? What Am I missing in my first cursory observations? Sug!
 ge!
> stions are welcome. Many thanks. Sincerely, Susan Hottle, Florida USA
> 

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Re: [lace] Lace Advent Calendar 2018

[Adele Shaak]

I clicked on the window for December 1 about ten times, then refreshed the 
screen, then clicked on it another couple of times, and then, finally, realized 
that it is not December 1st yet. Looking forward to the calendar as always, 
Jean!

Adele

> Once again David and I have produced a Lace Advent Calendar which you can find
> on my website:
> 
> https://www.jeanleader.net/calendar/index.html
> 
> 
> For those who are not familiar with, it starting from December 1st, there is
> a
> window that can be opened with a new lace picture every day, patterns on two
> of the days (they have different coloured numbers), and a competition that
> you
> can complete when all of the days with clues have been revealed.
> 
> Spread the word and have fun.
> 
> Jean in dark, wet Glasgow

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Re: [lace] Teachers or no Teachers

[Adele Shaak]

Your lace may very well be as good as, or even better than, lace made by 
someone who has had a teacher. Or not. 

Some people can have the best teachers and still produce bad lace. Some don’t 
tension well. Some have short attention spans. Some people can’t see as well as 
they think they can. Many people aren’t good at comparing what they’re making 
with the examples they’re shown.  

There are so many factors at work - are you conscientious, do you take care to 
make your lace look like what’s in the book, do you read attentively and how 
well do you understand what you’ve read, how well do you follow the 
instructions, do you take the trouble to find thread the right size for the 
pricking.

Having a teacher means you get set up nicely with well-matched thread and 
pricking and any mistakes or bad habits are pointed out to you. The secrets a 
teacher passes on - well, they’re not really secrets, just lace lore, and what 
gets passed on depends on the teacher, the time available, and the questions 
that are asked. A lot of learning stems from the other students in the class - 
somebody might ask if they can substitute 100/3 for 60/2, and the teacher might 
use the situation to talk about thread sizes and things to think about when 
switching threads, or the teacher might just answer yes or no.

Each teacher has different strengths and weaknesses that may or may not be a 
good fit for you. So you can’t know for sure that you’d make better lace if you 
had a teacher. And if you did have a teacher, you might learn better from a 
different one.

I guess what I want to say is that in-person instruction is a good way to 
learn, but in-person instruction from several different teachers is even 
better, and one person working off the grid in a cabin in the woods with the 
single worst instruction book ever printed may still learn to make good quality 
lace. 

Just my 2 cents.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

> On Nov 24, 2018, at 2:53 PM, Ann Humphreys  wrote:
> 
> I’ve never had a lace teacher. I’ve learned from books and videos. 
> Will my lace not be as good as those who have had teachers. What are the 
> secrets that lace teachers pass onto their pupils?
> Just curious. 
> Ann

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Re: [lace] A Rembrandt discovered due to the lace

[Adele Shaak]

OK. I’ve been reading Santina Levey this morning, and I think the collar in the 
Jan Six XI Rembrandt is indeed bobbin lace. Read Levey's remarks on Flemish 
bobbin lace on p. 23 and take a good look at plates 112 and 135 - 140. The 
Flemish falling collars are specifically mentioned as being made in bobbin 
lace, which was much softer than needle lace and very popular for falling 
collars. 

Plate 140 is another Rembrandt portrait, with a very similar collar, that she 
states is bobbin lace.

Plate 112 shows an early bedcover of part lace, and it is divided into squares, 
like reticella but the closeup shows that it is a bobbin-made part lace. When I 
started making lace I was told that the rectangular make-up was a sure sign of 
needle lace - but I can see that was wrong information.

There is one similar lace piece shown (plate 132, bottom), that is needle lace. 
To me it looks more fully filled-in, heavier & stiffer than the other pieces. 
If you look at the Rembrandt portraits, they often show the lace being casually 
curled up, as if wafting in a breeze. Needle lace didn’t do that. Softness and 
lightness were the hallmarks of Flemish bobbin laces at this time.

I don’t see any reason to challenge Levey over this, or the European expert 
that Jan Six XI consulted.

But, I haven’t read what the people commenting on the NYT article have said.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

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Re: [lace] What's in a thread

[Adele Shaak]

I watched it on YouTube with the slides - really interesting. Thank you so much 
for posting, Veronika.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

> Textile historian Angharad Rixon has posted a talk, with slides, about
> the use of non-linen threads in 17th century needle lace: 
> 
> https://www.textilesupport.net/single-post/2019/02/20/Whats-in-a-Thread 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GbFkj5_HG34=youtu.be 
> 
> Regards, Veronika

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Re: [lace] Bobbin question

[Adele Shaak]

I think we need a woodworker to chime in here, but I believe that bobbins that
are not professionally made may also be rough because of the type of wood
used. A coarse-grained splintery softwood is never going to give you the
finish of a dense hardwood. Or so I understand.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada, home of the splintery softwood


> Sue wrote:

> I felt that most of these bobbins were hand made and often a bit rough and
ready so not necessarily a style but maybe as a result of inexperience and not
made by a skilled craftsman perhaps.

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Re: [lace] Downton Lace

[Adele Shaak]

I’m also thinking about how lace was traded - lacemakers were paid by the 
length they made, and they didn’t make 50 yards of it in one long length the 
way machines do. It was cut off when the tally-man came, so all lace would be 
in fairly short pieces - of varying lengths. Looking at the voluminous dresses 
of the 1700s and 1800s, I’m sure it would have been a perfectly normal thing to 
have lace that was pieced together from several shorter pieces.

Since the advent of machine-made things, we have become very nice about how 
perfect things must be, but that’s just us taking our cue from what machines 
can do. Back before machines, there was a much greater tolerance for variation, 
and mistakes, in hand-crafts of all kinds. Having visible ends isn’t even a 
mistake - it’s a normal part of the manufacturing and trading process.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)
 
> On Jan 31, 2019, at 4:31 AM, Jane Partridge  wrote:
> 
> We tend to start patterns one at a time, winding bobbins particularly for 
> that pattern, and when we've done whatever length we want to work, be it for 
> a sample or for a particular project (which may or not hide the ends in 
> seams) we finish it off neatly and secure all ends with knots or whatever.
> 
> "Back in the day" they wouldn't have had time for such luxuries. Lace would 
> be on the pillow, with a pattern started once - ages ago - with a length of 
> completed lace cut off (literally, with scissors, as we would cut a length 
> from a card of machine-made lace now) when the tally-man came to collect the 
> lace and pay the cottage worker making it, leaving ends at the "start" not 
> even in rolls, and the lace on the pillow continuing. 
> 
> How we hang in or finish off our lace has little relevance to those days, 
> when lace was made and time wasted meant less bread on the table. 
> 
> Jane Partridge

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Re: [lace] Lassen question

[Adele Shaak]

My understanding is that lassen is used when the end of a pattern overlaps the 
beginning; and the patterns therefore match. This would have nothing to do with 
corners; it would be done in the one place in the lace piece where the end 
overlapped the beginning. So, if you were making a hankie that had drafted 
corners, you would work all the way around the pattern and then an inch or two 
past where you started so you can overlap and lassen it together.

It looks to me from the hankie Devon has put up on Ning, and the way the 
pattern continues straight around, that they had a long straight piece of lace 
edging, and that was folded back on itself to create the 90 degree corners. If 
it were me I would have sewn the lace seam in place before I cut the triangle 
off, and then overstitched the cut ends. I can’t say for sure that is the way 
this one was made, but I am struck with how perfectly lined up the threads are, 
just before they hit the seam, so I don’t think the lace was cut first and sewn 
later. (still nothing to do with Lassen, I know).

Hope this helps. It would be interesting to look at things like doily edgings, 
picture frames, and the like, to find use of the lassen technique. I seem to 
recall seeing it used on a piece of Tonder; I think the technique  would be 
useful for many different lace types.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

> On Jun 16, 2019, at 2:54 PM, Devon Thein  wrote:
> 
> < the Met and tell us how the joins are made.>>
> Funny you should ask. I was looking at one of the binche handkerchiefs from
> Princess Alice of Monaco, 63.196.6. The joins are in the corners and they
> do not use lassen, although they are very skillfully done. I have posted
> photos of the four corners on
> http://laceioli.ning.com/group/identification-history?xg_source=activity the
> laceioli.ning site in identification/history. The handkerchief dates from
> 1888-1902 based on the monogram which changed when the owner became
> divorced.
> I think that lassen is something that you do with Binche and point de
> Paris. Are there any other laces that use "lassen"?   Nancy, did you see
> any other handkerchiefs of interest? I might have photos.

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Re: [lace] Honiton? Beds?

[Adele Shaak]

I’m not sure, but I’d say it was Beds because it not only doesn’t have raised & 
rolled work, it also doesn’t have the coarse thread that I connect with Honiton 
lace. Also it looks to me like it is made all-in-one - the motifs and the 
ground made at the same time. 

Adele

> On Jun 18, 2019, at 8:05 AM, Devon Thein  wrote:
> 
> Now that I am looking at the piece that is described as coming from
> Honiton, I am wondering if the technique is actually Bedfordshire. What do
> you think?
> Devon

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Re: [lace] Lassen question

[Adele Shaak]

I always think of the word “lash” as in “lash together”

Adele

> Possibly the logic for offering the term "weld" is that two pieces of
> It would be interesting to know the etymology of "lassen" - maybe has a
> Latin origin. "Lasso" comes to mind, as also the root word of "lace" but I
> could be over-thinking!
> Bev in Shirley BC Canada

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[lace] Wedding lace

[Adele Shaak]

Good morning! I’ve got a question:

Does anybody know anything about antique wedding lace?

I have a piece of Duchesse lace that is approx. 13 inches (33 cm) square. It is 
filled with flowers and other motifs that have to do with weddings and 
fertility. So, I’m pretty sure it was used as part of the wedding ceremony, BUT 
- gee, it seems awfully big to be a “wedding handkerchief” which is what the 
label said it was. Also, the  motifs are fine Duchesse bobbin lace, but they 
are joined together with a simple needle-lace background of regularly-spaced 
buttonhole stitches, that is made with a thicker thread. So, a comparatively 
heavy openwork net. That doesn’t say “handkerchief” to me.

This piece might actually be a handkerchief, and perhaps the size of wedding 
hankies has changed over the 100+ years since my piece was made. However, I 
have a niggling suspicion that it might not have originally been a hankie at 
all. I have heard of chalice covers and I’m thinking it might be that, or maybe 
even something else. I don’t know much about traditional European religious 
ceremonies, and for all I know it might even have come from a Jewish marriage 
ceremony - I have *no* idea what that ceremony uses.

The symbology is secular: roses and chrysanthemums, etc, so it could be 
anything. Or it could just be a hankie and I’m overthinking this. It is the 
size and the net background that is making me think twice.

Anybody have any thoughts?

Adele

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Fwd: [lace] Wedding lace

[Adele Shaak]

I have uploaded a photo of the “wedding handkerchief” to the Vancouver
Lace Club website:

https://vanlaceclub.files.wordpress.com/2019/06/weddinglace1.jpg


It’s not up on Flickr; I couldn’t figure out how to do that.

Adele


> On Jun 23, 2019, at 12:57 PM, H M Clarke mailto:hcl...@mac.com>> wrote:
>
> Hi Adele,
>
> That does sound like an oversize lady’s handkerchief, even today. My
‘antique’ hankies are far smaller, less than half the dimensions including
significant amounts of lace.
>
> As for the wedding part of it, I was not aware of any such tradition until I
emigrated and found local lacemakers. It is not something that played any part
of any wedding I went to or heard about. Before anyone contradicts me, I would
explain that I come from peasant stock almost entirely from East Anglia in
England so cannot comment about other regions or more posh weddings. Then
again, I have no recollection of wedding handkerchiefs being mentioned during
any of the British royal weddings either. As a cynic, I would suggest that the
wedding tag was to attract extra attention to the piece :-/
>
> I would be interested in reading about the experiences in other parts of the
world as well as identification of Adele’s treasure.
>
> Regards, Helen in Adele’s part of the world

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Re: [lace] On Arachne since 1996

[Adele Shaak]

I think it was 1996 when I joined; not right at the beginning, but not much 
later. I vividly remember how awesome it was to be able to get lacemaking 
information directly from real people who actually knew what they were talking 
about. How long ago that was - 25 years in physical time, but a million years 
in Internet time. 

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

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Re: [lace] re the Marian Powys essay. Not so good!

[Adele Shaak]

I'll read your Marian Powys essay no matter where it is published or how many 
footnotes it may contain (I prefer zero, but that’s just me).

About a decade ago I discovered a very interesting factoid about the famous 
first line of Jane Austen’s “Pride & Prejudice” (“It is a truth universally 
acknowledged …)
My factoid suggested that it was a satirical re-working of a line from somebody 
else’s very famous book. I thought this added a dimension to the sentence that 
had not been there before, and wrote a letter to the editor of the Austen 
Society newsletter to tell the story. I received a late night phone call from 
the editor, sputtering in indignation, who accused me of accusing the great 
Jane of plagiarism. She was furious, and I pointed out that all I had done was 
notice something, I wasn’t accusing anybody of anything, and that it was OK 
with me if we just dropped the whole thing. The more friendly ladies at the 
local Austen Society suggested I send it to a British publisher of this type of 
information (“Notes and News”?), and from them I received a multi-page document 
requesting my academic qualifications and a full listing of my previous 
academic publications, without which I would not be considered for publication 
in their newsletter. 

So, fine. The world doesn’t get to know. It is enough that I know ;-)

But Mother Julian was right. All will be well.

Adele

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Re: [lace] Dutch Lace Pillow Question

[Adele Shaak]

Hi Devon:
I’ve taken a look at this weird little thing in extreme closeup. If it’s a
decoration it is odd that it is completely plain. I am struck by the fact that
it is in line with the pricking, and it covers the space between the top of
the pricking and the drawer opening, and I wonder if it could be just a piece
of cloth (it’s not black, more of a dark green, maybe a piece of velvet?)
meant to cover the completed lace from the time it leaves the pricking until
it reaches the safety of the little drawer.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)



> On Sep 4, 2019, at 9:56 AM, Devon Thein  wrote:
>
> I have no idea what purpose the black appendage on the top of the pillow
> serves. It doesn't look like the sort of thing that you wind finished lace
> on, or protect finished lace in.

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[lace] "Jean Lucinda's Lace Lessons"

[Adele Shaak]

Our lace club meeting was today, and one member brought in a cardboard box she 
was given, with a label “Jean Lucinda’s Lace Lessons” (hand-lettered; not a 
commercial label). 

The contents of the box suggest that this was a set of lessons you could 
subscribe to, and that perhaps the teacher’s name was Jean Lucinda. Does that 
ring a bell with anyone? From the language used in the lace lessons, it sounds 
like the teacher was English (or had learned in England).

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

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[lace] "Jean Lucinda's Lace Lessons"

[Adele Shaak]

Just to let you know a member of our local found Jean Lucinda. I don’t know how 
you can search somebody just by their first and middle names, without knowing 
the last, but she does! Jean Lucinda turned out to be longtime local lacemaker 
Jean Astbury (1905-1991). Jean was the first lacemaker I ever met; I lived far 
away and was learning from books when I discovered that a lace conference was 
about to take place in Vancouver (this was 1981 or 1982). Jean was part of the 
registration committee and she also made my first lace pillow, a straw-stuffed 
Honiton, as I took an “Intro to Honiton” class at that conference.

Adele

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Fwd: [lace] lace-digest V2019 #57

[Adele Shaak]

I never find anything in the folders; if you look up at the top menu you’ll see 
something called “Photostream” and that’s where I found the train bobbin. 

Correct me if I’m wrong, but I think the Photostream shows all the uploaded 
photos in the order they were uploaded, with the most recent first.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC


> On Nov 6, 2019, at 6:30 PM, Elizabeth Ligeti  wrote:
> 
> Where abouts in the Flikr file is the “train” bobbin?  There are so may
> Arachne lolders, and I cannot see any other folder with Brian Lemin’s name
> on it, so where do I look?
> It would help if people put the folder name when they direct us to  all these
> lovely lace photos, -- or we get bogged down with just drooling over lots of
> lace, and don’t find what we are actually looking for!! (Or is this Just
> Me?)

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[lace] Railway Bobbin

[Adele Shaak]

I love the railway bobbin! 

I think that when railways first appeared (ca 1830), they were an amazing 
thing; I can see somebody carving this design onto a bobbin in commemoration of 
the day they saw the train. I once saw an early (as in, 1835 or so) advertising 
poster for an English railway company. It showed … ta-da! - the train itself, 
against an unimportant countryside backdrop. You saw open cars, and closed 
cars, and freight cars and hoppers, and flat cars and all the different ways 
the train could carry things. 60 years later, train advertising concentrated on 
all the wonderful scenery you would so comfortably pass through, but not at the 
beginning.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC

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Re: [lace] 1851 Great Exhibition catalogue

[Adele Shaak]

I found a short reference to Mrs. Treadwin’s display (#55, on about p. 103). 
Mrs. Treadwin is ringing a bell in my mind but I don’t know why. Was she the 
one who designed Victoria’s wedding lace? Or?

Adele


> On Oct 10, 2019, at 4:02 AM, Diana Smith  
> wrote:
> 
> Thank you for the link Brian. After scrolling up, down and inside out I’ve 
> learnt there are five catalogues of the exhibition. After considerable time 
> studying what turned out to be only other countries of the world I managed to 
> find a short reference to Lacemaking in the East Midlands.

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Re: [lace] Left handed tricks?

[Adele Shaak]

Just to add a fun little wrinkle - something I didn’t know until last year was 
that whether something is clockwise or counter-clockwise depends entirely on 
your vantage point. Take a bobbin and start winding thread on clockwise as 
you’re looking at the head of the bobbin. Then continue the same winding, but 
look at the thread from the bottom of the bobbin - you are winding 
counter-clockwise.

Which might explain why so many people have trouble when they’re told to wind 
clockwise or counter-clockwise.

Whichever way you’re winding, hold the bobbin horizontally. If you’re 
left-handed, you’ll be holding the bobbin with your right hand, and the head of 
the bobbin will point to the left.

Extend the forefinger of the hand that is holding the bobbin, so it lies along 
the thread shank, but not touching it. Now: If you are left-handed and winding 
clockwise as you look down on the bobbin head,  the thread goes over the top of 
the bobbin, towards you, and back away underneath the bobbin, then continue 
winding the thread up between the finger and the bobbin, then pull the thread 
away from you, around your finger, back up between the bobbin and your finger, 
and over the shank towards you, making a figure 8. Put the tip of your finger 
over the head of the bobbin and move the hitch down onto the bobbin.

If you are a leftie winding counter-clockwise as you look down on the head of 
the bobbin, extend the finger of your right hand (which is holding the bobbin) 
as before. The thread will come under the bobbin shank towards you, and up and 
over the shank, heading away from you. Wind the thread down between the bobbin 
and your finger and then wrap around your finger from bottom, up the back of 
your finger, and coming over the top towards you and down between the bobbin 
and your finger. Tip the finger over the head of the bobbin and move the hitch.

Either way, you make a Figure 8 with the thread. And, of course, it also works 
for right-handers. Just remember to make the figure 8 and you won’t go wrong.

Hope this helps.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)


> On Feb 26, 2020, at 3:00 PM, Alice Howell  wrote:
> 
> When the student is holding the bobbin and winding the thread on, is the
> thread winding clockwise or counterclockwise?

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Re: [lace] Sarah Dazeley hanging bobbin

[Adele Shaak]

Cindy - it’s a bobbin that commemorates a public hanging. Yes, that was a thing.


Adele
West Vancouver, BC


> On Jan 26, 2020, at 4:11 PM, Cindy from Dallas  wrote:
> 
> Forgive my ignorance, but what is a “hanging bobbin”?
> 
> Cindy from Dallas
> Ravelry ID:cinhad
> knittingyards.wordpress.com

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Re: [lace] Lace knitting

[Adele Shaak]

Thanks for the story! Miniature lace knitting is so impressive!

I did a little lace knitting many years ago; then I tried a Shetland shawl that 
I realized, on about the 5th try, had a mistake in the pattern! I haven’t done 
any since. 

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)


> On Jan 27, 2020, at 6:37 AM, Jazmin  wrote:
> 
> I thought I'd share my most recent finished piece.. I know it's knitted
> lace, and if crochet is the redheaded step child of the lace world, we're
> the one who half the time doesn't even make the family tree. Still..
> 
> 
> Heather in wintery SW Ontario, Canada

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[lace] Hoping for a better translation

[Adele Shaak]

Hi Everybody - I have an old (1987) leaflet of patterns from Jana Novak, called 
“Julekniplinger”. I think it is written in Swedish; maybe it’s Danish; I don’t 
know. 

I am trying to identify the thread; it calls for “bleget hør”. I plugged that 
into Google's Swedish/English translator, and it came up with “bleached whore”. 
After I stopped laughing I decided to ask for help on Arachne. 

Anybody?

Thanks for your help.

Adele

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Re: [lace] Lacemaking in Colonial Spanish America

[Adele Shaak]

I think she’s making bobbin lace, all right.

If you’re describing something in a manuscript that also contains
information about lots of other things, your space is probably limited. You
get the most bang for your buck, illustration-wise, by depicting several
things at once. So you draw a long view of a woman making bobbin lace, plus
the lace itself is enlarged enough to show the pattern and the method of work.
The picture isn’t intended to be a decorative object, it is intended to
convey information; this composite picture shows the woman, the apparatus, the
pattern being produced, and gives an idea of the method of work.

Seeing the photo of the wide pillows at Arenys de Mar, that Bev sent, I can
easily see that you could use a pillow that wide, possibly making the same
narrower patterns several times at one go. It does look like the woman in
Devon's picture is working on the centre two stalks, and we can see she has
bobbins set aside to work the sets of two stalks on either side.

Fascinating picture.

Adele
Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)


> On Feb 15, 2020, at 5:01 PM, DevonThein  wrote:
>
>  It was from the Codex of Martinez
> Companon. The conservator says it is part of a manuscript sent to the king
of
> Spain in the late 18th century. The information about it, in the index,
says
> Mestiza de Valles texiendo trensilla. This seems to mean Mestizo woman
weaving
> braid. Does this show a woman making bobbin lace? What do people think
about
> this?

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Re: [lace] Lappet or something else

[Adele Shaak]

Devon:

Just mucking around with Google translate, I found Muts translated as 
cap/bonnet, and one of the translations for slip is lappet.

So what I’m thinking is that your piece is a kind of lappet, maybe something 
used in conjunction with the traditional Dutch cap.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC



> On Apr 18, 2020, at 3:01 PM, Devon Thein  wrote:
> 
> … The pieces look like they might be early
> 19th century, when people still wore lappets. But 20th century? What
> does Staal voor een Mutsenslip mean? I have posted the photos on
> laceioli.ning in the Identification-history group. Can anyone explain this
> to me?
> http://laceioli.ning.com/group/identification-history
> 
> Devon

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Re: [lace] Tonder lace

[Adele Shaak]

Hi Devon:

I took a quick look at Kristensen’s “Tønder Lace: About Lace-making History in 
Western Sønderjylland from the 17th Century till Today”, and I have are a 
couple of thoughts for you:

First, the lacemakers weren’t following a set traditional style of lace; they 
were making what was fashionable and would sell well, and over the centuries 
they were quick to make Binche, or Arras, or whatever was in vogue.

On p. 30 of the Kristensen book, 1800 is given as the date when Lille lace 
became popular in Sønderjylland; they began to make it and it is from Lille 
lace that the Tønder lace we recognize today, evolved.

Also on page 30 of the book, there is a photo of a Tønder lace pattern, 
“Strawberry”, that to my eyes has many things in common with your piece. The 
filling, the tallies grouped in the background, and the look of the cloth 
stitch all seem to me to be quite like the closeups you have on the IOLI Ning 
site.

If you look at the straight edge of your piece, that edging, taken on its own, 
has the orderly appearance that we are used to seeing in Tønder lace today. The 
rest of the design is odd to our eyes, but how often have we seen Tønder lace 
that attempted to fill in a wide space, rather than just an edging? I know I 
haven’t seen any attempt at a yardage design other than plain net with little 
sprigs on it. Maybe it was common at the time, maybe it was something that was 
tried and didn’t last, or maybe you just happen to have a piece that was a bit 
of an experiment. As you say, it does look like Pottenkant.

Hope this helps.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)


> I have encountered a piece of Tonder lace dating from about 1800. I don’t
> doubt that it is Tonder of this date because it was identified by an
> expert. However, I have never seen a piece that looked like this. ... Has
> anyone ever seen anything comparable to this? What characteristics do you
> think identify it as Tonder? I have not found any Copenhagen holes in it,
> although that is by no means a requirement for something to be Tonder.
> Thoughts?
> 
> I have posted photos on laceioli ning, the identification-history group.
> http://laceioli.ning.com/group/identification-history

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Re: [lace] [Lace] Return to class

[Adele Shaak]

There was an article in The Lancet (July 3rd)
https://www.thelancet.com/pdfs/journals/laninf/PIIS1473-3099(20)30561-2.pdf


Talks about how why the danger of surface transmission is less than was
originally thought.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
west coast of Canada

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Re: [lace] Return to class

[Adele Shaak]

Sorry, don’t know why that last bit sent. I was just trying to trim the 
message, and off it went into the ether.

Let’s try again: 

Just wondering - I have seen wiping with an alcohol-dampened cloth take foil 
straight off of book covers, so personally I’d worry a little bit about the 
alcohol treatment. I think it would depend on what the decoration was stuck on 
with and whether a cover-coat was applied. 

Adele
west coast of Canada


> and 2) after washing their hands, everyone wipe their bobbins
> at the start of class with a cloth dampened with 90% or higher isopropyl
> alcohol. (It doesn't have to be dripping nor the bobbins rubbed, so it
> won't damage any finishes )

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Re: [lace] Mystery lace

[Adele Shaak]

Speaking from a design standpoint, I really like the way those figures that are 
outlined in braid and then filled in with half stitch add scattered opaque 
spots to the lace. Looking at the picture of the whole piece, they really do 
look like snowflakes! 

Adele 
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

> On May 22, 2020, at 3:04 AM, Jean Leader  wrote:
> 
> Well, if you look at Joseph Seguin’s La Dentelle (avaiable on the Arizona 
> site) Plate XXXVI you might call it Guipure Façon Angleterre, or Guipure 
> Anglaise.They both have the same coiled ground and one of them also has 
> cucumber tallies.
> 
> Allhallows Museum Honiton has two flounces with this coiled ground which 
> Santina Levey reckoned were English therefore Honiton late 17th C. They are 
> illustrated in John Yallop’s ‘The History of the Honiton Lace Industry’ (the 
> book is his PhD thesis and he was the honorary curator at AllHallows).  The 
> Glasgow Museums lace collection also has two pieces with this coiled ground, 
> one of which is very similar to one of the Honiton pieces. Back in 1993 John 
> Yallop told me that the use of the coiled ground is associated with Flanders 
> around 1700 but it may be found at much later dates in Eastern Europe.
> 
> Jean in grey Glasgow

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Re: [lace] Crazy ideas about how old bobbins are?

[Adele Shaak]

I’m just thinking about the lacemakers. I’ve read so much about how in the 19th 
century, as handmade lace competed with machine-made, lacemakers were poorer 
women, right down to very young girls, who made lace for a pittance, and they 
supplied their own pillow and bobbins. I would not be surprised if many a young 
man whittled bobbins for his sisters and his girlfriend or wife, or even 
himself. I would not be surprised if they got to be pretty good at it; you 
never see boys whittle these days, but a hundred years ago it was just 
something you did to pass the time. 

I recently saw an episode of “Escape to the Country” where they profiled a man 
(in England) who turns authentic medieval wooden bowls with a (replica) 
medieval foot-powered lathe. I have seen bobbins from the 1600s that I would 
think were turned on a lathe, and I’ve also seen bobbins from Europe that were 
probably post-WW1, that were hand-carved.

As to Downton bobbins in particular, I don’t know.

Just my musings, but I hope they help.

Adele

> On Oct 23, 2020, at 5:25 PM, Brian Lemin  wrote:
> 
> You may remember that after all my (our, I include Diana of course)) years of 
> bobbin study I only recently was told that all early Downton bobbins were 
> hand carved.  From this I want to ask you all two questions please.
> 
> 
> 1. If you have any Downton bobbins can you look critically at them a see if 
> there may be any carving signs on them.  Mostly you will see this evidence in 
> the neck area, but you might see them elsewhere.
> 
> 2.  When we think of bobbins being used from say (not being pedantic) 1500 
> onward s and the very few lathes available at that time[They gradually became 
> more available until about 1750 ish, from then on all bobbins appear to have 
> been turned]  Do you think that all our early English used (East Midland) 
> bobbin were hand carved?  Are all hand carved bobbins "old" [i.e. pre 1750?]  
> I think when i am asking these questions i am thinking that I am assuming 
> "copies" of the bobbins being used as opposed to ornate hand carved bobbins.
> 
> 
> Its a huge subject and for sure i do not have any formed ideas about this 
> topic, but perhaps you may have, so please share them with us.

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Re: [lace] Dior Used an Extremely Rare Technique Dating Back to the 15th Century to Create This Delicate Detail

[Adele Shaak]

I thought the same at first. Then I realized that all this “rare technique 
dating back” and “in danger of disappearing” talk is just the author, punching 
up her story. She has seen the workrooms and all the young people making this 
lace; and knows these phrases aren’t exactly true, but that those are the 
exotic details InStyle and its readers want. I'm glad they showed the work 
being done, and I would not be surprised if lots of people took up lacemaking 
based on the article.

I thought right away about making similar flowers and decorating a top or 
something! I did see a butterfly in one of the photos, too. I’m not that fond 
of the flowers seen in the article, but there are lots of other possibilities. 
I have to thank the article (and Sue, for bringing it to our attention) for 
reminding me of what can be done with fairly simple patterns.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

> On Jul 26, 2020, at 7:59 AM, lynrbai...@supernet.com wrote:
> 
> Dear all,
> I saw this article, too, and wondered at the "Rare Technique Dating Back.."  
> This person doesn't know about us.  I thought it both funny and sad.  I 
> wonder if we could copy the lace, the butterflies especially diddn't look 
> that difficult, and make our own Dior knock-offs.  I tried the url below, and 
> Apple News was not friendly.  I think the original article is worth a read, 
> not for really new information, but to understand the ignorance in the 
> general public, or even in the fashion world.  Although in Europe lace is 
> used by couture designers.  
> 
> Lyn in Lancaster, Pennsylvania, USA,

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Re: [lace] Goddess of Lace?

[Adele Shaak]

H. I would guess there isn’t one, given that lacemaking developed in Europe 
in the late 15th century, long after people only believed in the one God. 
Lacemakers did have patron saints, of course - Saint Catherine and Saint 
Andrew, depending on where the lacemaker lived, and probably other saints in 
other areas. But they would only be saints, not goddesses.

If we don’t already have one, then I would suggest we could choose one if we 
wanted to. My vote would go to Aphrodite, the Greek goddess of love and beauty. 
Not only is lace beautiful, but Google assures me that the root word Aphros 
means foam (what kind of foam I will not specify as this is a family list)

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

> On Dec 5, 2020, at 2:19 PM, M. Osgood  wrote:
> 
> I’ve just been asked who the Goddess of Lace is.  Never having heard of her, 
> I thought I’d go to the experts.  
> 
> Is there a Goddess of Fishnets?  Or Knots?  or Weaving?
> 
> Do we start with Greeks or Romans? Or Egyptians? Or Celtic or Norse?
> 
> Martha 
> in Oregon

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Re: [lace] Speed and efficiency in lace?

[Adele Shaak]

There is an old British Pathé newsreel from 1929, where they filmed an elderly 
lacemaker at work. Given her evident age, she would have learned her lacemaking 
in the 1860s or so. The interesting thing for me is that she moves the bobbins 
with her left hand, and puts in the pins with the other. She does seem to go 
along at a great rate - however the lace isn’t of very good quality.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jf9pmm7Yk78=PL-D58_GV_WDdbZq5R_S7MyGRP2BjFLWo-=83=2s

I have seen some videos of lacemakers who do work very quickly, but you can see 
they spend quite a bit of time rearranging their bobbins after they threw them 
out of position because they were going so fast. I can go fairly fast at times 
but I prefer to keep everything in an order that works for me.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

> Anyway, just for fun, I was curious if anyone else had experiences or
> advice to speed up lace through shortcuts or other tricks to share with one
> another. I certainly find I am much faster working palms up, but most of my
> projects are better suited for cookie pillows so I rarely work that way.

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Re: [lace] Lace quote

[Adele Shaak]

It is an interesting quote. Probably not useful, especially viewed with today’s 
more utilitarian eyes. 

Back then, of course, you lived with ornament in the clothing of the moneyed 
classes. I recall reading somewhere (can’t give you a citation, sorry) that one 
of the great things about early bobbin lace was that it was an embellishment 
that could be quickly applied, (compared to the previous embellishment, 
embroidery, which took a lot longer to apply to any particular garment) plus it 
was portable. If you’re finished with your blue velvet jerkin, the lace, which 
was only tacked on anyway, could be quickly removed in its entirety with its 
structure intact, and moved onto your next garment. You couldn’t do that with 
embroidery! 

Also, I’m thinking lace, and other fine embellishments, probably were more 
necessary than they are today. People flaunted their fortunes in dress, but 
also I seem to recall (again, no citation) reading that there were dress 
requirements at court. In an era when you held your vast estate (and income) at 
his/her majesty’s pleasure, having the monarch get pissed off at you for not 
following the dress code had a lot more repercussions than it does today. 

Adele (also on the west coast of Canada, but with more rain than Helen)


> I don’t know where my copy of Le Pompe is at the moment so I cannot check. It 
> is an interesting quote though I would question its accuracy. In what way 
> does anyone need lace? Or even find it useful? Unless you have to make a lace 
> trimmed dress, lace curtains, or similar? Lacemaking was useful in the areas 
> and times of such things and lacemakers needed to make some money though I 
> don’t think that is what it is trying to say. Am I missing something? Perhaps 
> it is because most of my ancestry consists of country peasants whose lives 
> would not have included any lace. 
> 
> Regards, Helen (on the west coast of mainland Canada). 
> 
>> *Lace is a work not only beautiful but useful and needful.*
> 
> -

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Re: [lace] spangled lace

[Adele Shaak]

What a find! Certainly looks early to me. Last year I did some yardage (from a 
pattern in Rosemary Shepherd’s Early Lace Workbook) and the cushion motifs and 
the method of work look very familiar! If I remember correctly, the pattern I 
worked was dated to the early 1600s.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

> Okay, I've put up on Flickr a close-up of the spangled lace I am convinced
> is 16th or 17th C. What do you think??
> 
> Nancy
> Ashford, Connecticut  USA
> 

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Re: [lace] How do you line a lace jacket?

[Adele Shaak]

Hi Alice: 

I think it depends a little on what kind of lace she made, what she made it of, 
and how it reacts when its off the pins. Compare, for example, a densely-woven 
piece with plenty of cloth stitch and a heavier thread, to some much more 
flimsy piece of point ground made with fine cotton.

In the antique pieces I have seen, the lace is generally just tacked at the 
seams if support is needed. Since this lace will be supported by the lining, it 
is acting more as an interlining than a true lining, which hangs free of the 
fabric. I’m just making this point because if you read the directions for 
linings in a sewing book, they will suggest the lining be made a trifle bigger 
than the main piece, so the lining does not bind, but those instructions should 
be ignored here.

If I were your friend, I would select a fabric for the lining, and make the 
jacket to fit (using the pricking, but I would add seam allowances). After the 
lining-fabric jacket is complete, and fits and I’m happy with it, I would 
position the lace on the jacket and then tack it down. If the pieces do not 
quite meet in some places, the lace will probably give a little. If the gap is 
too much, she could add in some plaits or whatever looks good, to fill in any 
little spaces.

Hope this helps.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC (west coast of Canada)
where it is sunny this morning, but frosty


> My friend is just finishing the lace for a jacket.  She's trying to figure
> out the best way to line it when it's done.  The lace sections do contract a
> bit when the lace is off the pins so the pricking is a bit larger than the
> finished lace.
> Should she use the lace or the pricking for her lining pattern?  If she
> traces the actual lace, she will need to add seam/hem allowance.  Perhaps the
> shrinkage of the lace would mean the pricking is large enough for seams/hems,
> thus eliminating the need to trace the lace.
> 
> She's planning to use flat feld seams so there's no raw edges.  And she
> expects to hand baste the lining to the lace along the seams and around the
> edges.  The lace does have some large-ish spaces so she thinks a lining is
> necessary.

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Re: [lace] Picture on Flicker

[Adele Shaak]

I used to have this problem, but then I realized that if you look at the top 
menu bar on the Flickr page, there’s an option called “Photostream”. Click on 
that and the most recent upload will be the first thing you see.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)


> On Apr 14, 2021, at 5:30 PM, H M Clarke  wrote:
> 
> Am I the only one who struggles to find specific pictures in the Flickr 
> albums? Despite looking several times I still can’t see the mythical hankie. 
> This isn’t the first time I have had this problem either. 
> 
>> Yes Karisse, Carmen Roig is a Spanish lacemaker, and the hanky is worked in 
>> Ret-Fi, our Catalonian Blonda.
> 
> -

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Re: [lace] RE: lace-digest V2021 #28

[Adele Shaak]

Go to the Flickr site and click on “Photostream” in the top menu bar.
First there are the doily books that were just raffled off, then there’s a
piece of early spangled lace, and then Carmen Roig Ortuño’s lace pillow.

Adele


> On Oct 9, 2021, at 6:03 PM, Elizabeth Ligeti  wrote:
>
> Where do I find Carmen’s lace, please? I cannot see a section with her
name
> (can’t remember her surname) .

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Re: [lace] History of Lacemaking Coming to America

[Adele Shaak]

Hi Lorri - Also, i believe there was lacemaking in New France (when it was
governed by the French before 1763); a lacemaker in Quebec studied this about
20 years ago. She mentioned her research on Arachne, so the info should be in
the archives. I think there were French nuns involved in instruction, but I
can’t remember much of it. New France included Nova Scotia; so not far by
sea from Boston.

Adele

> On Jan 4, 2022, at 12:41 PM, Lorri Ferguson  wrote:
>
> Does anyone have information on lacemaking coming to  America?
> I know some about the lacers in Ipswitch, but when and how did lacemakers
> first come to the Colonies?
>
> Lorri Ferguson
> Renton, Washington

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Re: [lace] Burano Needle Lace in Hallmark movie!

[Adele Shaak]

Yes, I saw that, too! Was wondering how accurate the scenes in Burano were, as
I’ve never been there, but they certainly looked right.

The first movie was made in the Vancouver area, and one of the props
assistants contacted our lace club to ask if we could give them advice as to
what a late 19th-century Italian wedding veil would look like. We sent them to
SMOC (BC Society for the Museum of Original Costume) but I don’t know if
they ever made that contact, and I don’t know if SMOC would be much help.
However, it’s nice to see them trying to be authentic, but I’m not sure
they went with an accurate look - the pattern on the wedding veil seemed too
large and heavy to me, and in the closeups it seems uncomfortably stiff. At
our club (we talked this over after the first movie) we discussed the veil,
and were thinking that maybe they had other things to consider (like, whether
the audience can see the pattern on their TV from across the room) as the veil
is the centrepiece of three movies.

It was nice to see the couple working away at their needle lace, even though a
little suspension of disbelief was needed!

I don’t know how the TV scheduling is where you live, but on W Network in
Canada they replayed the first movie just before the second movie, which
premiered last night. The third movie is being shown next Saturday night. And,
yes, since these are Hallmark movies I’m sure we’ll get lots and lots of
chances to see them.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)




> On Feb 13, 2022, at 12:33 AM, Vicki Bradford  wrote:
>
> Hello all,
> Tonight on the Hallmark channel was the second of a trilogy about a lace
> wedding veil that three college friends find and purchase jointly in an
> antique shop while having their annual reunion. The veil comes with a
legend
> that whoever is in possession of the veil will find “true love”. I
won’t
> elaborate on those details but in this second “episode”, one of the
three
> friends is going to Italy to teach an art history class and decides to take
> the veil along to try to determine its provenance.  This second movie shows
> accurate scenes in, among other locations, Venice and Burano.   There also
are
> scenes in Burano showing needle lace makers, and it even has two of the
actors
> working lace on the traditional bolster with the round rod/dowel thingy
over
> which the pattern is placed. (Sorry I don’t know what that dowel piece is
> called). I confess that maybe I’m a bit sappy for “happily ever
> after” storiesespecially when there are real lacemaking depictions
> included. If you didn’t see it, I think you might find it worth your
while
> to look for it as I’m sure it will be repeated. I really enjoyed it!
>
> Vicki in Maryland

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[lace] Help With Skeined Cotton Thread

[Adele Shaak]

Hi, Everybody:

I just got a skein of old linen thread that’s not like anything I’ve ever
seen before, here in Canada, but I think maybe some of the Europeans on this
list might be familiar with what I have and be able to help me.

It’s a single skein, not marked or labelled, and it is very fine - maybe
equivalent to 180 gassed Egyptian cotton in size - and I think it is linen
from the feel of it. It is about 15cm (6in) long right now, but it has been
folded, and about 1.5cm in from each end it is secured with a circle of pink
thread. One end is a single fold of the entire skein and the other is two
folded ends held together.

I think - but I haven’t opened it so I am not sure - that what it is, is a
skein of thread about 60 cm around, that has been flatted and folded in half
and secured at each end. The thread is so very fine, and has that slight
wiriness I associate with linen, that I am worried that if I just start
mucking about with it, in my ignorance I will tangle it beyond saving.

I suppose that if I knew what I was doing, I would cut the pink ties, open up
the skein … and then what? How would this be handled? Is there a method? I
want to be able to wind it onto bobbins but I’m not sure how to do it.

Any advice on what I should do now?

Adele
Vancouver, BC

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Re: [lace] Freehand Lace Group?

[Adele Shaak]

If this was the freehand lace group on the IOLI Ning site, I believe they are
in the process of moving it to a different platform. (I don’t know which
one.)

Adele

> On Feb 2, 2022, at 3:45 PM, Elena Kanagy-Loux 
wrote:
>
> Dear Arachnids,
>
> I was trying to access the Freehand Lace Group website this evening but the
> url I have is not working. I'm wondering if I have the wrong address, or
> has the website perhaps lapsed? I hope not, as it is so useful in my
> research! If someone would remind me of the url so I can double-check it
> that would be much appreciated.
>
> Best Wishes,
> Elena
>
> --
> Elena Kanagy-Loux

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Re: [lace] Honiton design

[Adele Shaak]

Hi Alex:

Could you be thinking of Pauline, Lady Trevelyan? Looking at her Wikipedia
entry, she was a friend of Ruskin, the Rossettis, and "various other people”
in the pre-Raphaelite movement, although Morris is not mentioned. But I would
assume she knew him.

In Anne Buck’s book on Thomas Lester, at the top of p. 44, there is mention
of a Honiton border designed by Lady Trevelyan, acquired by the V in 1864. A
picture of the Honiton border is on page 64 of that book.

Hope this helps.

Adele

> On Jan 28, 2022, at 4:22 AM, Alex Stillwell 
wrote:
>
> Hi Arachnids
>
> I am working on Honiton lace at the moment and seem to remember reading
that
> one of William Morris’s friends/acquaintances did some designing for
Honiton
> lace in an attempt to improve the lace being made. I believe she was female
> and may have been resident in Devon at the time. I have hunted through all
my
> books on Honiton, lace history, lace identification and collecting lace, of
> which I have a fair number, without finding it. Can anyone help me please?
>
> Blow the dust, let’s make lace
>
> Alex
>

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Re: [lace] point ground with no gimp

[Adele Shaak]

Devon - I am without my lace books at the moment, so I can’t give you any
citations. But there is a type of lace that was done in the early 19th
century, that is a point ground with no gimp on the outside of the motifs. In
the books I have, it was called “Regency Lace” - probably a reference to
the English regency in the 1810s. I do not know if it is Lille or Arras or if
it is a Bucks Point variation.

The examples I’ve seen have no gimp around the motifs but if there are
little holes inside the motif, they will put gimp around them. I can see your
piece has no gimp at all; I would suggest it is just a variation of Regency
lace.

As ever, just my 2 cents.

Adele
Summerland, BC Canada


> On Feb 1, 2023, at 7:51 AM, DevonThein  wrote:
>
> On another note. I have encountered a lace in the Met collection which is a
> point ground without any gimp.
> https://www.metmuseum.org/art/collection/search/214651
> Please note, the picture enlarges.
> The information cites Lille or Arras as the origin of the lace. But, Lille
> lace has a gimp. Actually, as far as I can discover, all point grounds tend
to
> have gimps since it helps to even out the design area. In fact, the effect
of
> this lace is that the design area looks a bit rough. The information also
says
> early 19th century. Is this some experimental lace? Or is there a genre of
> point ground without a gimp that I am simply not recalling?
>

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[lace] Tiara Leaves

[Adele Shaak]

Good morning! Anybody else been watching the coronation?

I loved the simple, elegant spray of leaves that was repeated throughout the
modern-day decoration, and am wondering if anybody knows how the metal leaves
were made, that formed Princess Charlotte’s headband? They do look like they
might be wire tallies. It looks like the Princess of Wales was wearing
something similar.

Adele

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[lace-chat] Quiet List

[Adele Shaak]

Hi Everybody:

I have my apartment up for sale, so all my lacemaking equipment is packed away. 
I'm in withdrawal!

If anybody out there wants to spend a quiet minute or so thinking wouldn't it 
be nice if somebody bought Adele's apartment really soon I would appreciate 
it. Might make a difference, and certainly can't hurt.

While I'm waiting, I am thinking of trying a piece of needle lace, as that can 
always be hidden in a second. But I'm a bit discouraged with NL - I can never 
hide my threads invisibly, like everybody else seems to be able to do. I always 
wind up with a lumpy bumpy cordonnet, and it's very disheartening. I have taken 
a couple of NL courses, but you never get that far in the classes, so I've 
never been able to display my ineptitude to a teacher and have her show me what 
I'm doing wrong.

That's the problem with classes, isn't it? You go home with big plans but then 
you hit a snag you never recover from.

Adele
North Vancouver, BC Canada

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Re: [lace-chat] Richard III's remains identified!!

[Adele Shaak]

Hi David:

I think they talk about Shakespeare as having created the humpback, the 
withered arm, plus he did a hatchet-job on Richard III's character. I wonder if 
 in Shakespeare's day they would have seen the scoliosis (which developed on 
during Richard's adolescence) as an outward sign of the evil within - 
absolutely tailor-made for emotional drama!

Interesting that the descendent of Richard's family that they found, Michael 
Ibsen, was the last in the line. This type of DNA goes from a mother to all of 
her children, male and female, but only descends further through the female - 
men don't pass it on. Michael Ibsen has a sister but she has no children. So - 
one generation more and they wouldn't have had any descendant to compare DNA 
with.

Adele
North Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)





 Dear Friends,
 I find this new archaeological discovery just fascinating. The use of 
 DNA technology seems to be going ahead in leaps and bounds. Hope this 
 tiny URL works for you:-
 
 http://tinyurl.com/anryorr
 
 My only concern is that from my extensive reading on Richard III, 
 authors have lead me to understand that the myth of his scoliosis was 
 created by Shakespeare, but perhaps that was merely the withered arm.
 
 David in Ballarat, AUS

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Re: [lace-chat] Richard III burial

[Adele Shaak]

Yes, but Westminster Abbey isn't in the running.

Richard III was born in Yorkshire and funded building projects in York Minster 
- which was, at the time, a very important church - and is the largest gothic 
cathedral in northern Europe. Leicester Cathedral, on the other hand, though 
medieval, was just a parish church - it didn't become a cathedral until 1927. 
Many historians argue that Richard himself wished to be buried at York Minster.

Tradition can go either way, and there are many traditions. You can be buried 
where you died or you can be buried where you were born or where your family is 
from or ... or ...  I think York Minster has quite a good argument in its 
favour, but the permission to dig up the grave was only given on the 
understanding that he would be re-buried at Leicester.

The whole question reminds me of one of Ellis Peters' excellent Brother 
Cadfael novels, wherein there was much jockeying by the abbeys to get hold of 
saint's relics or some other reason for people to visit the church - because 
visits meant donations and they wanted the money to aggrandize their church so 
they could get more visitors and more money and ...

It will be interesting to see how it all works out.

Adele
North Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)



On 2013-02-05, at 11:06 AM, dmt11h...@aol.com wrote:

 Jill wrote:
 One of the major  considerations is that all the proposed burial places are
 Anglican, and Richard  was a pre-reformation Catholic. Â Therein lies a
 dilemma
 
 But Westminster Abbey was also Catholic prior to the  Reformation, so where
 is the problem?
 
 
 From the website:
 Westminster Abbey is steeped in more than a thousand years of history.
 Benedictine monks first came to this site in the middle of the tenth century,
 establishing a tradition of daily worship which continues to this day.
 The Abbey has been the coronation church since 1066 and is the final
 resting  place of seventeen monarchs.
 The present church, begun by Henry III in 1245, is one of the most
 important  Gothic buildings in the country, with the medieval shrine of an
 Anglo-Saxon  saint still at its heart.
 Devon

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[lace-chat] Cutwork Collar

[Adele Shaak]

Hi Everybody:

The cover of Hello Canada this week has a nice picture of the Duchess of 
Cambridge out shopping, wearing a lovely cutwork collar. It's enough to make me 
go down to the storage locker to dig out my embroidery books!

Some of you know I've been trying to sell my apartment since last fall, so all 
of my lacemaking stuff has been packed away. Now I have sold it, so I can make 
a mess again! I'm tempted to start about a half-dozen projects, just because 
I've been in craft limbo since last August and my fingers are itching. 

Adele
North Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

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Re: [lace-chat] Twinkees

[Adele Shaak]

No, no, it's the yucky stuff.

I have to admit I **loved** that white stuff when I was a teenager. It was
just the right fluffiness, just the right amount of artificial flavouring and
just the right amount of sugar. A perfect foodstuff!

Real dairy cream would spoil, of course, and you'd lose the wonderful
advantage of being able to put and package of Twinkies away in the cupboard
for years at a time. I don't think people buy Twinkies for that purpose; it
just winds up that way.

Adele

 When you say filled with cream, do you mean real dairy cream made from real
milk or that yuckie, synthetic, tasteless white stuff that confectioners
misname cream.

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[lace-chat] Bobbins As Decor

[Adele Shaak]

I recently moved to a new neighbourhood, and today as I walked through the 
local shopping area I took a look in the Farrow  Ball store. I think of FB as 
an expensive paint store, but they've expanded and are carrying other luxury 
home items, like tea towels and hand-dipped candles imported from Europe. 

Way in the back I came across a display of old needlework tools, and a jar full 
of completely serviceable midlands bobbins, which I was told are made in Wales. 
They're decorated, unspangled but drilled for spangling and not too expensive 
at $6.50, if you just wanted a few or wanted to make a present.

Thought I'd mention it as I know in North America it's usually a lot easier to 
find a Farrow  Ball store than a lace supplies dealer. But I don't know if all 
the stores carry them.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

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Re: [lace-chat] Bobbins As Decor

[Adele Shaak]

Hi:

Farrow and Ball is an English company - started in the 1930s in Wimborne 
Minster, Dorset (according to Wikipedia). But now it has grown and is quite 
international. I looked on their website - they have a store locator that will 
tell you where their stores are in about 30 countries. The US store locator is 
on the US website at http://us.farrow-ball.com/  They have lots of locations in 
the States but I don't think any are in Wyoming.

Adele

 Adele, is Farrow  Ball a Canadian chain?  I have never heard of it here in 
 the States.  
 Sallie in Wyoming

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Re: [lace-chat] Extreme Knitting

[Adele Shaak]

Try this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVRfVEONxJQ

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)


On 2013-10-24, at 7:21 PM, Angel Skubic wrote:

 I made sure the whole thing was put in but all I got was a blank page...
 
 Cearbhael
 
 -Original Message-
 From: owner-lace-c...@arachne.com [mailto:owner-lace-c...@arachne.com] On
 Behalf Of Sue Duckles
 Subject: [lace-chat] Extreme Knitting
 
 Now this is what I call extreme!!!
 
 http://compattoyarnsalon.typepad.com/storeblog/2010/02/youtube---rachel-john
 -
 extreme-knitting-1000-strand-knit.html
 
 

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Re: [lace-chat] Australian friends - TV question

[Adele Shaak]

Hi Janice:

Thanks for this! Other streaming services, like Hulu, etc, are not available in 
Canada (except for Netflix, which doesn’t have all the shows it does in the 
States). But this Acorntv is available up here. I’m going to look into it.

By the way, the acorntv.com URL you posted got me to a video business in 
Ireland. I found the streaming service by Googling, and came up with this URL: 
https://signup.acorn.tv/  Once you get there, up on the top you can click on 
“Browse our Shows”.

Adele

> On Sep 23, 2015, at 9:00 AM, Janice Blair  wrote:
> 
> You can see it on Acorntv.com  To watch on your tv, you need an Apple or Roku
> box, but you can see it on your computer.  Acorn has lots of British,
> Australian, Canadian tv series including most the ones you like on
> PBS.Janice Janice Blair Murrieta, CA, www.jblace.com 
> 
> 
> On Monday, September 21, 2015 12:35 PM, Malvary 
> wrote:
> 
> 
> Haven't heard about this series. Is it on PBS?
> 
> Malvary in Ottawa where we have had another lovely day

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[lace-chat] Quote Source

[Adele Shaak]

>   "I'm sorry this letter is so long; I didn't have time to make it short."
(Now I'll spend the rest of the day wondering who I'm quoting.)
>
> —

The Internet tells me the source was a letter by Blaise Pascal in 1657. Huh. I
could have sworn it was Churchill.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

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Re: [lace-chat] USA places to visit help

[Adele Shaak]

David, I think you’re thinking of the Navajo. The vast (71,000 sq. km) Navajo 
Reservation is mostly in northeastern Arizona and also extends into New Mexico 
and into bits of Colorado and Utah. Major cities nearby are Flagstaff (to the 
west) and Phoenix, Arizona (to the southwest, and a bit far), and Albuquerque 
and Santa Fe in New Mexico (east of the reservation). Santa Fe is well known 
for its arts scene. As to beautiful bits of desert, I agree with Malvary that 
the area around Sedona (between Phoenix and Flagstaff) is very beautiful and 
mystical. Sedona is also known as a centre of New Age mysticism. I don’t know 
anything about what the desert is like near Albuquerque and Santa Fe.

As you’re Australian I expect you already know this, but just in case - check 
out the average temperatures for anyplace you decide to go. The desert can be 
very cold.

Hope this helps.

Adele

> I'm well aware that USA is about the same size as Australia but I need to
> find just one other place to visit! I can tell you that I loathe hordes of
> tourists as well as all cities. I love the bush and the deserts and would
> probably appreciate a little warmth after January in New York.
> 
> 
> 
> I do recall many years ago learning about the native Americans who made the
> silver and turquoise jewellery but can't remember where they are. Hiring a
> car is not out of the question.
> 

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Re: [lace-chat] Wishes

[Adele Shaak]

Yes, let’s all wish one another a very Happy New Year! May good luck and good 
lace come your way!

Janice, your New Year’s Eve sounds exhausting, but good fun. You must be very 
speedy to make so many appetizers in just one hour. My own celebration will be 
a quiet home-alone thing - I would spend it making lace except lacemaking 
doesn’t really go with bubbly and there’s a bottle with my name on it.

David, say Hi to 2019 for me. I’ll be there in about 9 hours.

Adele


> On Dec 31, 2018, at 2:15 PM, Janice Blair  wrote:
> 
> Happy New Year David and all Arachneans.
> I am taking it easy now as I am helping organize a party in our clubhouse for
> 130 people.  Have to be there are 5:00 pm to make appetizers, doors open at
> 6:00 pm and then we eat, drink and party until midnight.  They get to go home
> and we get to clear up.  

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Re: [lace-chat] Urgent Favor...........Alice Howell

[Adele Shaak]

Wondering, from those of you more computer-crime-savvy than I am - 

Usually, these emails would have a link included, and the link would take you 
to some website that looks like Gamestop (whatever that is) and if you were 
foolish enough to buy a gift card they would then harvest your name and credit 
card details. 

But this message has no link, so I’m wondering - what do they hope to get from 
it? Does anybody know enough about cyber-crime to tell me? 

Adele

> On Jan 16, 2019, at 5:42 AM, Alice Howell  wrote:
> 
> How are you? I need a favor from you. 
> I need to get an Gamestop Gift Card for my Nephew, Its his birthday and i
> totally forgot. i can't get this for him right now because I'm currently
> traveling.Can you kindly help me  get it from any store around you? I'll pay
> back as soon as i am back. Kindly let me know if you can handle this.
> 

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Re: [lace-chat] Lace on stamps - my re-organised web pages.

[Adele Shaak]

Looks good, Ann! Everything I tried worked just fine. I have bookmarked your 
page so I can come back to it and see what else you have!

I’m on an Apple iMac desktop.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

> On Mar 3, 2019, at 8:06 AM, Ann McClean  wrote:
> 
> I've just spent the last week re-organising my Lace Stamps webpage - so 
> what do you think?
> Not all stamps are featured as yet as I wanted to make sure that the 
> layout and links worked 1st.
> Would also be interested how you view my website - Desktop PC, tablet or 
> phone?
> 
> https://www.annmcclean.co.uk/LaceStamps/index.html
> 
> N.B. this is NOT a selling post.
> 
> Regards,  Ann McClean
> in Mid-Wales, UK.

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Re: [lace-chat] Posts and summer

[Adele Shaak]

My lace club went through this a little over a year ago; we ended with a
higher rent but a much better place.

Good luck with the move and the new library system. I think most clubs have to
keep their library off-site; it takes a bit of getting used to but it can work
well.

Adele



> The guild just got notice that the place we meet is being closed, so we
have
> scrambled to find a new location.  The old place let us leave our locked
> library bookcases in the back room, but the new place will not.  We have to
> set up a new library handling system.

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Re: [lace-chat] Posts

[Adele Shaak]

I don’t think so, Sue. Just don’t have anything to chat about, I guess. 

The weather? It’s supposed to be July 2nd but this morning we’ve got good 
weather for October (13 celsius and rainy). Good weather for sitting and making 
lace - indoors, in a cosy living-room - but I’m working.

I hear it’s been hot in Europe - maybe everybody over there is down at their 
local supermarket, hanging out in the freezer aisle.

Adele
West Vancouver, BC
(west coast of Canada)

> I don't seem to be receiving Arachne posts lately is there a problem ? 

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