[LUTE] Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Francisque

[Mayes, Joseph]

I should point out - if someone hasn't already - that the Francisque is one of 
Luth d'ore's editions. Really clearly printed and well thought-out edition. I 
recommend it highly.

Joseph mayes

From: lute-...@new-old-mail.cs.dartmouth.edu 
 on behalf of Christopher Stetson 

Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 10:42 AM
Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [EXTERNAL] [LUTE] Re: Francisque

   Hello Tristan and Jean-Marie.
   I've had a facsimile copy of the Tresor since one bought those things
   with a check in an envelope, and agree about the quality of the music,
but haven't had it out in years,  so thanks for the  reminder.   I
   have played through Susanne, but tend more toward the dances.
   Best, and keep playing,
   Chris.

   On Fri, Sep 4, 2020 at 1:47 PM Tristan von Neumann
   <[1]tristanvonneum...@gmx.de> wrote:

 I agree, some of the pieces require virtuosity.
 But I found that the fingering is quite logical, and most pieces
 still
 sound good when played slowly.
 It's not a ride like Eysert, or Terzi Intabulations...
 When I wrote 7c I meant: if you have less than required number of
 diapasons, 7c is still good to go.
 On 04.09.20 18:56, Jean-Marie Poirier wrote:
 > Hi Tristan and all,
 >
 > "Le Trésor d'Orphée" is a very popular print with players
 interested
 > in the music of the early 17th century, different from Vallet,
 Besard
 > or Ballard.
 > It is one of my frequent sources to perform from, but I would
 > certainly not qualify its difficulty "moderate" !!! For instance
 the
 > opening piece "Susanne un jour" requires a solid technique and so
 do
 > some of the Galliards or Fantasies... True, some of the dances
 > (Branles) are quite nice rewarding to play but not all of the
 music is
 > simple and easy ! And by the way, an 8 course is much more
 > "comfortable" to play it through ;-) !
 >
 > All the best,
 > Jean-Marie
 >
 > Le 04/09/2020 à 18:38, Tristan von Neumann a écrit  :
 >> It's playable with a 7c lute comfortably, and the difficulty is
 moderate
 >> if you consider the great effect, so don't be afraid.
 >
 >
 >
 > To get on or off this list see list information at
 > [2]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

   --

References

   1. mailto:tristanvonneum...@gmx.de
   2. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: A trivia question

[Mayes, Joseph]

This raises a question as well: Where would one have found this "renaissance 
audience?"

From: lute-...@new-old-mail.cs.dartmouth.edu 
 on behalf of Sarge Gerbode 

Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2020 11:52 AM
To: G. C.; Lutelist
Subject: [EXTERNAL] [LUTE] Re: A trivia question

I think this one wins the prize, but I am not sure variations on this
kind should win, as they are a sort of grab bag one could select from
for any particular performance. I think even a Renaissance audience
would be put to sleep by an hour-long set of variations.

So what's the longest non-variation piece?

--Sarge

On 8/29/2020 6:56 AM, G. C. wrote:
> Vincenzo Galilei wrote 100 variations over the Romanesca, which would take 
> more
> than one hour to perform
>
> On Sat, Aug 29, 2020 at 2:54 PM G. C. <[1]kalei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>   [2]https://www.mail-archive.com/lute@cs.dartmouth.edu/msg24116.html
>
> --
>
> References
>
> 1. mailto:kalei...@gmail.com
> 2. https://www.mail-archive.com/lute@cs.dartmouth.edu/msg24116.html
>
>
> To get on or off this list see list information at
> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: [EXTERNAL] The lute list is retiring soon

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hi Wayne

First - Good luck on your retirement! Then Thank you so much for your many 
contributions to the lute-geek community. (I consider myself one of the 
geekiest) This is the end of an era for us and the beginning of a new path for 
you. It's been fun!

Joe

From: lute-...@new-old-mail.cs.dartmouth.edu 
 on behalf of Wayne 

Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2020 3:04 PM
To: lute net
Subject: [EXTERNAL] [LUTE] The lute list is retiring soon

Hi -

  I have been running this lute mail list since 1998, and it has been 
interesting and fun.  Now I am retiring from my job at Dartmouth College, and 
when I retire the computers that I have run will be shut down.  This includes 
the  mail servers that run the lute mail list.  So it is time to retire from 
running the lute mail list too.  I will also be closing my lute web page, my 
lute tablature page, and "Lutes For Sale" web page.

  If someone wants to take up running the lute mail list I suggest that they 
announce it on my list in the next month, while my list is still running.  My 
list runs using software that I wrote, and I don’t recommend that someone else 
try to use it.  I don’t know the last day yet, but I will make an announcement 
when my list actually closes.

   Wayne




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[LUTE] Re: Vous Usurpe

[Mayes, Joseph]

Nonsense is much appreciated - we need more of such!
Happy winter solstice.

Joseph - the fan

From: lute-...@new-old-mail.cs.dartmouth.edu 
 on behalf of Joachim Lüdtke 

Sent: Saturday, December 21, 2019 5:25 AM
To: Mayes, Joseph; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Vous Usurpe

Dear Joseph Mayes,

you are right: that's incomprehensible because I have produced errors over 
errors! The name of the composer is not Victor Wadenbaiß, as I wrote, but 
Victor Wadenshnapp. He is the bandleader of the group Victor Wadenshnapp und 
die Veganen Vampire (their first album, now lost, was titled "The 
Transsylvanian Lute", further albums have not appeared). But he was even not 
the composer of the piece I thought of, and the title of this piece is not 
"Donnerstag aus Lärm" but "Mittwoch aus Licht", composed by the late 
Stockhausen. But there is no part for Liuto asper in "Mittwoch aus Licht", and 
it may be that there is even no instrument called Liuto asper (yet, would 
someone among the lute builders on this list volunteer to invent and build 
one?).

To sum up: this all was nonsense and intended as such ...

Best

Jo the Word Botcher

-Original-Nachricht-
Betreff: [LUTE] Re: Vous Usurpe
Datum: 2019-12-20T19:37:37+0100
Von: "Mayes, Joseph" 
An: "lute@cs.dartmouth.edu" , "Joachim Lüdtke" 


.and here I thought that I was Jo the clueless luter.

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@new-old-mail.cs.dartmouth.edu 
 on behalf of Joachim Lüdtke 

Sent: Friday, December 20, 2019 1:21 PM
To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Vous Usurpe

Is it possible that it is not "Vous usurpe", but a mistitled intabulation of 
the Liuto asper part from Victor Wadenbaiß`s "Donnerstag aus Lärm" instead?

Just my pennyworth

Jo the clueless luter


-Original-Nachricht-
Betreff: [LUTE] Vous Usurpe
Datum: 2019-12-20T17:25:25+0100
Von: "Rainer" 
An: "Lute net" 

Dear lute netters,

does anybody know what happened to "Vous Usurpe" on page 23 of the music 
supplement to Lute News 99?

The piece looks like a failed automatic conversion form Italian to French 
tablature.

The music sounds more like Boulez than Marco Dall' Aquila :)

Rainer



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[LUTE] Re: Vous Usurpe

[Mayes, Joseph]

..and here I thought that I was Jo the clueless luter.

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@new-old-mail.cs.dartmouth.edu 
 on behalf of Joachim Lüdtke 

Sent: Friday, December 20, 2019 1:21 PM
To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Vous Usurpe

Is it possible that it is not "Vous usurpe", but a mistitled intabulation of 
the Liuto asper part from Victor Wadenbaiß`s "Donnerstag aus Lärm" instead?

Just my pennyworth

Jo the clueless luter


-Original-Nachricht-
Betreff: [LUTE] Vous Usurpe
Datum: 2019-12-20T17:25:25+0100
Von: "Rainer" 
An: "Lute net" 

Dear lute netters,

does anybody know what happened to "Vous Usurpe" on page 23 of the music 
supplement to Lute News 99?

The piece looks like a failed automatic conversion form Italian to French 
tablature.

The music sounds more like Boulez than Marco Dall' Aquila :)

Rainer



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http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html


[LUTE] Re: Gamut Music

[Mayes, Joseph]

Great show! Kudos on your playing, Ed.

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu  on behalf of Edward 
Martin 
Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2019 11:29 AM
To: lute net
Subject: [LUTE] Gamut Music

   Dear ones,
   The local PBS station in northern Minnesota produced a video on Gamut
   Music, of which I am affiliated.   This was recorded 2 months ago, and
   was aired last month.   I hope you find it interesting, as you can see
   Dan Larson demonstrating finishing touches on a viola d'amore, as well
   as him doing finishing touches on a lute rose.   You can also see some
   of the Gamut stringmakers in the process of making gut strings, from
   beginning to completion. As well, I am on the video, playing on an
   11-course Frei, 68 cm, in all gut, with silverer gimped strings on 10th
   and 11th course.   For the recording, I played "Canaries" by Ennemond
   "Vieux" Gaultier
   I hope you enjoy this.
   [1]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLKDl0Ww_Tg=youtu.be_sou
   rce=May+Day+Sale+reminder_campaign=May+Day+Sale_medium=email
   Best,
   ed

   --

References

   1. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLKDl0Ww_Tg=youtu.be_source=May+Day+Sale+reminder_campaign=May+Day+Sale_medium=email


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[LUTE] Re: Chanterelle

[Mayes, Joseph]

My $.02
I find the carbon chanterelle to be on the "harsh" side.

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu  on behalf of Wim 
Loos 
Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2019 4:08 PM
To: LuteNet list
Subject: [LUTE] Chanterelle

   Dear all,
   I ´m looking to string my 7c renaissance lute, string length 60cm
   (a=415) again. In this moment I use nylgut and pyramid wound strings.
   Only the chanterelle is nylon while the nylgut string was broken.
   I considder to use carbon for the chanterelle, does anybody know if is
   this a good alternative.
   I hope jou can give me a advise what to do.
   Thanks in advance,
   Wim Loos

   --


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[LUTE] Re: Composers you wish had a bigger legacy

[Mayes, Joseph]

OK I completely agree that Bartolotti is a wonderful and underappreciated 
composer. But I have not encountered much chromatic music. Of course, I am only 
familiar with his guitar music - are we talking about something else?

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu  on behalf of 
Christopher Wilke 
Sent: Tuesday, August 7, 2018 11:48 AM
To: Braig, Eugene
Cc: Lutelist Net
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Composers you wish had a bigger legacy

   I move that Bartolotti be posthumously be given a "Chromy" award for
   his contribution to chromatic music. May his rainbow-color bust now
   join the ones of Gesualdo, Wagner and Schoenberg already in the
   Chromatic Composers Hall of Fame.
   Chris
   [1]Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

   On Tuesday, August 7, 2018, 9:43 AM, Braig, Eugene 
   wrote:

   Ludovico Roncalli: same.

   I also wish Angiol Michele Bartolotti was better recognized for his
   contribution to fully chromatic music.

   Eugene

   -Original Message-

   From: [2]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu <[3]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu> On
   Behalf Of Ido Shdaimah

   Sent: Tuesday, August 7, 2018 9:03 AM

   To: lutelist Net <[4]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu>

   Subject: [LUTE] Re: Composers you wish had a bigger legacy

 Giovanni Zamboni: only one book (though still a lot more than

 others...).

 --

   To get on or off this list see list information at
   [5]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

   --

References

   1. https://overview.mail.yahoo.com/?.src=iOS
   2. mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu
   3. mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu
   4. mailto:lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
   5. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] 5 guitar books

[Mayes, Joseph]

   Dear collected wisdom


   Is there anyone out there who has the Chanterelle Edition of the "Cinq
   Livres de Guitarre" and would consider selling it?


   Thanks in advance,


   Joseph Mayes
   --


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[LUTE] Re: Some questions

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hello Mr. Isbin

I can only answer your questions from my own perspective - naturally. I have 
tried to do so below:

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu  on behalf of 
Gilbert Isbin 
Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2018 5:33 PM
To: LS LUTELIST
Subject: [LUTE] Some questions

   Why is the lute world ruled by early music ? Because the lute is considered 
an "early instrument" most if not all of the players were attracted to the 
instrument through its music.
   Why are 90 or 95% of the lutenists afraid to play new music for the
   lute ? This is a poorly stated question, as in, "Are you still on parole?" 
Rather than ask why lutenists are "afraid" why not ask why they prefer music 
other than new music. For me, I like the style of the older music and despise 
the pretentiousness of some new music.
   Why did guitarists, recorder players, cellists, pianists , oud players
   etc. took the challenge to play today's music and the lute world almost
   - with a very few exeptions - doesn't ? See above response.
   Why are luteplayers afraid to play something different ? Have you stopped 
beating your mother?
   Why do lutenists think the lute must be played with a very specific
   approach ? Why do contemporary composers think "pretty" is a pejorative?
   Why are lots of lutenists looking down at lutenists who are trying to
   do something else with the instrument, with other techniques, new
   approaches? Again - poorly stated question. You ask why something that may 
or may not be true is true. Like my asking why all composers insist on writing 
for de-tuned mandolin?
  What is the future for the lute music if it stays to be that dogmatic ? Good 
question.
   I guess Dowland and all the other wonderful lutes composers would have
   a good laugh with the today's lute world approach to the instrument. If 
Dowland et al heard new music I believe they would choose another line of work.


   With kind regards,

   Met vriendelijke groeten,

   Bien cordialement,
   Gilbert Isbin
   [1]www.gilbertisbin.com
   [2]gilbert.is...@gmail.com

   --

References

   1. http://www.gilbertisbin.com/
   2. mailto:gilbert.is...@gmail.com


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[LUTE] Re: How to tighten frets

[Mayes, Joseph]

Wow!! Thank you Sterling!

This will save on fret-gut and that's great! But think of what I will save on 
shoes!!!

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu  on behalf of 
spiffys84121 
Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2018 7:20 AM
To: Lute list
Subject: [LUTE] How to tighten frets

   I was going to make a video, but I think a few words will suffice.

   To tighten a loose fret, move the fret up to a very loose position
   until you can push one end of the fret through the knot. Pull it as
   tight as it will go just as you did when originally tying the fret.
   Usually you will get only a few millimeters of extra. Now, burn the
   existing bit with a soldering iron or match or flame-thrower or however
   you make heat. Put the fret in position. Now you'll never have to use
   ridiculously lame shims under your frets again.

   The very first time I put frets on a lute as a kid I said-"oh, you can
   tighten them if they get loose." And ever since then I've wondered why
   people use shims, or even the completely baffling practice of replacing
   loose frets. "Do they," I wondered "replace their shoe laces every time
   they tie their shoes?"

   Maybe I'm a dreamer, but I think we can end this strange shims and fret
   replacing practice in our lifetimes.

   Sterling

   Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone


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[LUTE] Re: Early Music life

[Mayes, Joseph]

This space is very special in that it eschews the rancor and strife of the 
times and confines the discussion to subjects that, while we do not always 
agree, do not become heated and stupid.

Consider this a respectful plea to continue in that vein.

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu  on behalf of 
Tristan von Neumann 
Sent: Thursday, January 4, 2018 3:59 PM
To: lutelist Net
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Early Music life

Thank you Dr. Mardinly for backing me up.


Am 04.01.2018 um 19:51 schrieb John Mardinly:
> The bad news here is that Tristan was absolutely correct.
>
> A. John Mardinly, Ph.D., P.E.
> The Sleep of Reason Produces Monsters
> Francisco Goya
>
> On Jan 3, 2018, at 7:25 PM, Roger Landes <[1]landesro...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Tristan von Neumann:
> Was this message meant to be private?  If it was then you owe all the
> members of this list an apology. But if you intended it to go to the
> entire list you should be banished by the the list administrators.
> Roger Landes
> [2]https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.rogerlandes.
> com=DwIFaQ=l45AxH-kUV29SRQusp9vYR0n1GycN4_2jInuKy6zbqQ=VLPJ8OE-c_
> C6joGeE1ftlvxMmQPq9N6mpKZONBRt90E=fDacMx83I7a-3M8DVn9J4YIA6X7fufvLmxK
> a3YkOJm0=kzWqRyEaXaLu4FmBSDLHjEGKGyVhzgOP_ZW-7qJPz7M=
> On 1/3/2018 8:16 PM, Tristan von Neumann wrote:
>
>   Dumb people don't just get smart with the "right government", my
>   friend...
>   Your whole system is rotten, and believe you me, even some third
>   party candidates would not have been able to make the great purge
>   happen.
>   Am 03.01.2018 um 19:51 schrieb John Mardinly:
>
>   America, being in the throes of "Make America Great Again", is
>   unfortunately in general hostile to any music that requires more
>   than
>   two brain cells to appreciate. Fortunately, there are some
>   exceptions.
>   A. John Mardinly, Ph.D., P.E.
>   The Sleep of Reason Produces Monsters
>   Francisco Goya
>   On Jan 3, 2018, at 9:32 AM, Ron Andrico
>   <[1]praelu...@hotmail.com>
>   wrote:
> Thank you for your New Year's greeting, Tristan.
> Much as I would wish the US early music scene to be otherwise,
>   it is
> for the most part not what might be characterized as informal,
>   inviting
> nor inclusive.  While there are a few soloists and ensembles
>   attempting
> to perform in less traditional venues, the attempts are not
>   really
> successful.  Ronn McFarlane did in fact play in a bar in
>   Cleveland
> once.  I had lunch with him the following day and he reported
>   that
> there were 10 people in attendance.
> I have written about this at some length and will continue to
>   do so,
> but the early music scene in the US really caters to
> sit-down-and-shut-up audiences who are encouraged to
>   participate in
> some weird fan worship culture.  There are a few exceptions,
>   and
> Mignarda is definitely among the exceptions.  We make it a
>   point to
> seek out non-traditional audiences, and we have deliberately
>   been
> performing in a variety of smaller venues, restaurants, coffee
>   shops,
> libraries and in house concert settings for most of our 15
>   years as a
> duo.  We also perform in churches and the usual larger venues,
>   but we
> like having contact with our audiences.
> I am of the opinion that early music will die out with the
>   rapidly
> ageing baby-boom generation unless more of an effort is made
>   on the
> part of performers to connect with people of all ages and
>   backgrounds
> and encourage informal ensemble playing.  In the coming year,
>   we will
> be initiating a series of local informal gatherings where
>   amateurs
>   and
> professionals can connect and share a love of making ensemble
>   music.
> Wish us luck.
> RA
>   __
> From: [2]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu
>   <[3]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu> on
>   behalf
> of Tristan von Neumann <[4]tristanvonneum...@gmx.de>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 3, 2018 1:41 PM
> To: lutelist Net
> Subject: [LUTE] Early Music life
> Happy New Year to all who are on the European calendar.
> Here's one question - is there any noticeable Early Music life
>   going
>   on
> in your neighborhood, besides the 

[LUTE] Re: New music

[Mayes, Joseph]

Ronn Mcfarlane wrote a three movement work for the Mayes Duo - "On the Heath". 
You can hear it on one of his Ayrheart CDs.

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu  on behalf of Silvia 
Amato 
Sent: Friday, December 22, 2017 3:23 AM
To: Peter Hoar
Cc: LuteNet list
Subject: [LUTE] Re: New music

I hope to see this music , it's really interesting! I Hope the composers will 
publish their work!
Best regards
Silvia

Inviato da iPhone

> Il giorno 22 dic 2017, alle ore 04:10, Peter Hoar <78r...@gmail.com> ha 
> scritto:
>
>   Jozef van Wissem writes music for Baroque lute.
>
>   On 22 December 2017 at 13:43, Stephan Olbertz
>   <[1]stephan.olbe...@web.de> wrote:
>
> I like this one here by Dosia McKay, comissioned by Will Tocaben:
> [2]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6lgO_kWGzo
> And a nice chat with the composer:
> [3]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StxpE-7YrUY
> After 10 minutes it gets kind of funny when she talks about her love
> of
> Bach's bass lines...
> Regards
> Stephan
> -Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
> Von: [4]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:[5]lute-arc@cs.dartmouth.
> edu] Im Auftrag
> von Toby Carr
> Gesendet: Freitag, 22. Dezember 2017 00:32
> An: lutelist Net
> Betreff: [LUTE] Re: New music
>Matthew Wadsworth's latest CD included a new piece for theorbo by
>Stephen Goss that I think is worth mentioning, and I believe they
> have
>plans to continue that collaboration
>On 21 Dec 2017 23:16, "David van Ooijen"
> <[1][6]davidvanooi...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
> Like most (pro) lute players, I play, record and arrange my
> share
>  of
> contemporary music, have some written for me even, but it's
> far
> outnumbered by early music.
> On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 at 00:12, Daniel Shoskes
> <[1][2][7]kidneykut...@gmail.com> wrote:
>   I highly recommend it. I commissioned a work from Ronn
>  McFarlane and
>   I think it's one of his most beautiful:
>   [2][3][8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYgAAyMtgtE
>   <[3][4][9]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYgAAyMtgtE>
>   Ronn playing it live: [4][5][10]https://www.youtube.com/
>  watch?v=Cz3j5muuVKc
>   <[5][6][11]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cz3j5muuVKc>
>   Recording:
>   [6][7][12]https://itunes.apple.com/us/album/passacaglia/
>  878859427?i=8788594
>   69
>   <[7][8][13]https://itunes.apple.com/us/album/passacaglia/
>  878859427?i=878859
>   469>
>   Also commissioned a version of Adon Olam from Rene
> Schiffer
>  that is
>   in the form of a passacaglia with a theorbo part.
>   Let's keep them gainfully employed!
>   Danny
>> On Dec 21, 2017, at 5:38 PM, Jacob Johnson
>
> <[8][9][14]tmrguitar...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>  I don't think that's entirely accurate. Ronn
>   McFarlane
>plays
> his own
>> compositions, Jakob Lindberg performs the Britten
>Nocturnal (I
> know,
>> it's not that new, and it's not really for lute, but
>   IMO
>it
> kinda
>> counts), Chris Wilke recorded a whole cd of Roman
>Turovsky's
> new works
>> for baroque lute, I saw Elizabeth Kenny perform TWO
>recent
> theorbo
>> commissions at the LuteFestWest, and there's certainly
>more
> examples I
>> just can't think of at the moment.
>> As soon as I can afford to do so, I intend to
>   commission
>some
> works for
>> myself to play.
>>
>> Jacob Johnson
>>
>
>   [uc?export=downloadid=0B6_gM3BRE6ZrYVVZZU5QNmJqdDQ&
>  amp;revid=0B
>   6_g
>> M3BRE6ZraW9nQ2U4SGNwV0tYVWxobnNBVjBsZi9FNHhzPQ]
>> Guitar/Lute
>> [1][9][10][15]www.johnsonguitarstudio.com
>> [16][11]469.237.0625.
>> On Thu, Dec 21, 2017 at 4:12 PM, Christopher
> Stetson
>
>> <[2][10][12][17]christophertstet...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>  Hello all.
>>  An interesting question, Peter, thanks for
>   bringing
>it up.
> To
>>   answer
>>  honestly and personally, I'm not especially
>interested in
> new
>>   music,
>>  per se, for any of the instruments I play (mainly
>lute,
> guitar,
>>  mandolin, but some others too).   I couldn't
>really say
> why,
>>   except
>>  that the music I've looked at from the last 30
>   years
> tends, and I
>>   mean
>>  tends, to be difficult and not especially tuneful
>   to
>my
> ear.

[LUTE] vocal source

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hello Collected Wisdom

I feel a bit inadequate for having to ask this, but...

I'm playing "Si Vous Voulez" from the Whickhambrook Ms. and am looking for the 
vocal model. The song is attributed to Loyoset Compere, but I can't seem to put 
my questing finger on the original. Does anyone out there in the lute-universe 
have a direction for me?

Thanks,

Joseph Mayes



To get on or off this list see list information at
http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: CD

[Mayes, Joseph]

Congratulations Roman. You have a great collaborator in Chris. It must be a 
wonderful recording.

All the Best,

Joseph

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu  on behalf of Roman 
Turovsky 
Sent: Saturday, September 17, 2016 2:27 PM
To: David van Ooijen; Lute List
Subject: [LUTE] CD

Dear friends,

I am very happy to announce that Christopher Wilke has recorded a CD of
my compositions for Baroque lute
on Ukrainian themes, titled DE TEMPORUM FINE POSTLUDIA. It was an honor
and a pleasure to work with a
musician of such unparalleled musicality and depth as Chris.

The CD was recorded back in early May, and mastered,  in New York by
Jaroslaw "Slau" Halatyn.
It also has an introductory article by Tim Crawford!

It is available now on CDbaby, and the physical CD will be available on
September 20th!
http://turovsky.org/CD/

Heartfelt thanks to all our supporters and subscribers, your CD is in
the mail (and this includes
all participants in my radioprojects)!

RT




To get on or off this list see list information at
http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Retirement

[Mayes, Joseph]

Interesting! I do music full-time and when I retire, I plan to look into 
nanoanalysis engineering. :-)

Best,

Joseph Mayes



From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu  on behalf of John 
Mardinly 
Sent: Friday, March 4, 2016 4:18 PM
To: Lute Net
Subject: [LUTE] Retirement

   This is wonderful! Now I can do music full time!

   A. John Mardinly, Ph.D., P.E.
   Retired Principal Materials Nanoanalysis Engineer
   EMail: [1]john.mardi...@asu.edu
   Cell: [2]408-921-3253 (does not work in TEM labs)
   But don't call the labI won't be there!

References

   1. mailto:john.mardi...@asu.edu
   2. tel:408-921-3253


To get on or off this list see list information at
http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Pachenbel suite for theorbo

[Mayes, Joseph]

OOPS! Forgot this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0PQPgmz3j1E


On 2/25/16 9:30 AM, "Lex van Sante"  wrote:

> I've not been able to find this recording. Neither the one by Müller-Dombois.
> However I found one by Walter Gerwig. By the way the name of the composer is
> Pachelbel.
> Happy luting
> Lex
> Op 25 feb 2016, om 15:17 heeft Edward Martin het volgende geschreven:
> 
>>   Anthony Bailes also recorded this suite.
>> 
>>   On Thu, Feb 25, 2016 at 3:01 AM, Peter Steur <[1]p.st...@inrim.it>
>>   wrote:
>> 
>>   --Boundary-00=_XEI34BGBH2K712S0
>>   Content-Type: Text/Plain;
>> charset="iso-8859-1"
>>   Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>>   BTW the first recording that I'm aware of is by Eugen Dombois, on vinyl
>>   ...
>>   Peter
>>   ---Messaggio originale---
>>   Da: Wayne
>>   Data: 23/02/2016 18:32:08
>>   A: [2]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
>>   Oggetto: [LUTE] Re: Pachenbel suite for theorbo
>>   Peter Steur contributed them, and as Arto says, for baroque lute.
>> Wayne
>>   To get on or off this list see list information at
>>   [3]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>>   --Boundary-00=_XEI34BGBH2K712S0
>>   Content-Type: Text/HTML;
>> charset="iso-8859-1"
>>   Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   v\:* {
>>   BEHAVIOR: url (#default#vml)
>>   }
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   >   bgColor=#ff>
>>   >   border=0>
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   BTWthe first recording that I'm aware of is by Eugen
>>   Dombois, on vinyl ...
>>   
>>   Peter
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   >   dir=ltr>---Messaggio originale---
>>   
>>   
>>   Da: >   href="mailto:[4]wst...@cs.dartmouth.edu;>Wayne
>>   Data: 23/02/2016
>>   18:32:08
>>   A: >   href="mailto:[5]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu;>[6]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu>   V>
>>   Oggetto: [LUTE] Re:
>>   Pachenbel suite for theorbo
>>   
>>   Peter Steur contributed them, and as Arto says, for baroque
>>   lute.
>>   
>>   Wayne
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   To get on or off this list see list information at
>>   >   href="[7]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html;>[8]htt
>>   p://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html>> 
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   >   align=center>>   id=IncrediStamp>
>>   
>>   >   cellPadding=0 width=580 align=center border=0>
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   >   border=0>
>>   
>>   
>>   >   align=right>>   href="[9]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=28
>>   61,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_test
>>   _id=0sd=20160225">>   style="BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none;
>>   BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none" border=0
>>   src="cid:0CFBD4C8-A4E0-4E1C-A8ED-7808F63DBD78">
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   >   width=500 border=0 valign="middle"
>>   href="[10]http://www.incredimail.com?id=621161did=10501ppd=28
>>   61,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687">
>>   
>>   
>>   >   title="Animazioni GRATIS per la tua e-mail" style="TEXT-DECORATION:
>>   none"
>>   href="[11]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>>   861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>>   t_id=0sd=20160225">Animazioni GRATIS per
>>   la tua e-mail 
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   
>>   >   bgColor=#e2fbb2 height=1>
>>   >   height=1 colSpan=3>>   href="[12]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>>   861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>>   t_id=0sd=20160225">
>>   >   bgColor=#e2fbb2 height=1>
>>   
>>   >   bgColor=#91a184 height=1>
>>   >   height=1 colSpan=3>>   href="[13]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>>   861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>>   t_id=0sd=20160225">
>>   >   bgColor=#bcd5a7 height=1>
>>   
>>   >   bgColor=#91a184 height=32>>   href="[14]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>>   861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>>   t_id=0sd=20160225">
>>   >   bgColor=#e2fbb2 height=32 border="0">>   href="[15]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>>   861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>>   t_id=0sd=20160225">
>>   >   id=link title="Animazioni GRATIS per la tua e-mail"
>>   style="TEXT-DECORATION: none; HEIGHT: 32px"
>>   href="[16]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>>   861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>>   t_id=0sd=20160225" border="0">Fai clic qui! 
>>   >   bgColor=#e2fbb2 height=32>>   href="[17]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>>   861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>>   t_id=0sd=20160225">
>>   >   bgColor=#bcd5a7 height=32>>   href="[18]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>>   861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>>   t_id=0sd=20160225">
>>   
>>   >   bgColor=#91a184 height=1>
>>   >   height=1 colSpan=3>>   

[LUTE] Re: Pachenbel suite for theorbo

[Mayes, Joseph]

This suite can also be found on Youube.


On 2/25/16 9:17 AM, "Edward Martin"  wrote:

>Anthony Bailes also recorded this suite.
> 
>On Thu, Feb 25, 2016 at 3:01 AM, Peter Steur <[1]p.st...@inrim.it>
>wrote:
> 
>--Boundary-00=_XEI34BGBH2K712S0
>Content-Type: Text/Plain;
>  charset="iso-8859-1"
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>BTW the first recording that I'm aware of is by Eugen Dombois, on vinyl
>...
>Peter
>---Messaggio originale---
>Da: Wayne
>Data: 23/02/2016 18:32:08
>A: [2]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
>Oggetto: [LUTE] Re: Pachenbel suite for theorbo
>Peter Steur contributed them, and as Arto says, for baroque lute.
>  Wayne
>To get on or off this list see list information at
>[3]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>--Boundary-00=_XEI34BGBH2K712S0
>Content-Type: Text/HTML;
>  charset="iso-8859-1"
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
>
>
>v\:* {
>BEHAVIOR: url (#default#vml)
>}
>
>
>
>bgColor=#ff>
>border=0>
>
>
>
>
>
>BTWthe first recording that I'm aware of is by Eugen
>Dombois, on vinyl ...
>
>Peter
>
>
>
>dir=ltr>---Messaggio originale---
>
>
>Da: href="mailto:[4]wst...@cs.dartmouth.edu;>Wayne
>Data: 23/02/2016
>18:32:08
>A: href="mailto:[5]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu;>[6]lute@cs.dartmouth.eduV>
>Oggetto: [LUTE] Re:
>Pachenbel suite for theorbo
>
>Peter Steur contributed them, and as Arto says, for baroque
>lute.
>
>Wayne
>
>
>
>
>To get on or off this list see list information at
>href="[7]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html;>[8]htt
>p://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html> 
>
>
>
>
>
>
>align=center>id=IncrediStamp>
>
>cellPadding=0 width=580 align=center border=0>
>
>
>
>border=0>
>
>
>align=right>href="[9]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=28
>61,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_test
>_id=0sd=20160225">style="BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none;
>BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none" border=0
>src="cid:0CFBD4C8-A4E0-4E1C-A8ED-7808F63DBD78">
>
>
>
>width=500 border=0 valign="middle"
>href="[10]http://www.incredimail.com?id=621161did=10501ppd=28
>61,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687">
>
>
>title="Animazioni GRATIS per la tua e-mail" style="TEXT-DECORATION:
>none"
>href="[11]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>t_id=0sd=20160225">Animazioni GRATIS per
>la tua e-mail 
>
>
>
>
>bgColor=#e2fbb2 height=1>
>height=1 colSpan=3>href="[12]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>t_id=0sd=20160225">
>bgColor=#e2fbb2 height=1>
>
>bgColor=#91a184 height=1>
>height=1 colSpan=3>href="[13]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>t_id=0sd=20160225">
>bgColor=#bcd5a7 height=1>
>
>bgColor=#91a184 height=32>href="[14]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>t_id=0sd=20160225">
>bgColor=#e2fbb2 height=32 border="0">href="[15]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>t_id=0sd=20160225">
>id=link title="Animazioni GRATIS per la tua e-mail"
>style="TEXT-DECORATION: none; HEIGHT: 32px"
>href="[16]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>t_id=0sd=20160225" border="0">Fai clic qui! 
>bgColor=#e2fbb2 height=32>href="[17]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>t_id=0sd=20160225">
>bgColor=#bcd5a7 height=32>href="[18]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>t_id=0sd=20160225">
>
>bgColor=#91a184 height=1>
>height=1 colSpan=3>href="[19]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2
>861,201207171420,16,1,1953940358219890687rui=156356875app_tes
>t_id=0sd=20160225">
>bgColor=#bcd5a7 height=1>
>
>bgColor=#e2fbb2 height=1>
>height=1 colSpan=3>href="[20]http://www.incredimail.com/?id=621161did=10501ppd=2

[LUTE] Re: Taylor Swift

[Mayes, Joseph]

d'oh!

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu <lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu> on behalf of 
Sterling Price <spiffys84...@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, September 2, 2015 8:25 PM
To: Mayes, Joseph
Cc: Braig, Eugene; David van Ooijen; John Mardinly; lute list
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Taylor Swift

Actually the correct spelling is d'oh!





Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 2, 2015, at 5:01 PM, Mayes, Joseph <ma...@rowan.edu> wrote:
>
> Dough!!!
>
>
>> On 9/2/15 5:51 PM, "Braig, Eugene" <brai...@osu.edu> wrote:
>>
>> Sorry, Joe.  That's Foreigner.
>>
>> Eugene
>>
>> ____
>> From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] on behalf of
>> Mayes, Joseph [ma...@rowan.edu]
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2015 4:57 PM
>> To: David van Ooijen; John Mardinly
>> Cc: lute list
>> Subject: [LUTE] Re: Taylor Swift
>>
>> My daughter is into "Journey." Is there a renaissance guitar version of
>> "Juke Box Hero" out there?
>>
>> Joseph
>>
>>
>>> On 9/2/15 3:25 PM, "David van Ooijen" <davidvanooi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>   Haha! Look for MeesterDavidGitaar on YouTube ( that's me in my other
>>>   life, one of my other lives). I did several Taylor Swift
>>>   covers/arrangements. I think Never Grow Up would lend itself well to
>>>   lute. Safe and Sound too. Ask your daughter which one  she likes best
>>>   and I'll see what I can do.
>>>   David
>>>
>>>   On Wednesday, September 2, 2015, John Mardinly
>>>   <[1]john.mardi...@asu.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>>OK, now for something completely different: I have a 13 year old
>>>daughter who is into Taylor Swift. Big time.   I told her I would
>>> play
>>>some Taylor Swift songs on the lute. Do any arrangements exist,
>>> or is
>>>this something I am going to have to do myself?
>>>A. John Mardinly, Ph.D., P.E.
>>>Principal Materials Nanoanalysis Engineer
>>>EMail: [1]john.mardi...@asu.edu
>>>Cell: 408-921-3253 (does not work in TEM labs)
>>>Titan Lab: 480-727-5651
>>>NION UltraSTEM Lab: 480-727-5652
>>>JEOL ARM 200 Lab: 480-727-5653
>>>2010F Lab: 480-727-5654
>>>Office: 480-965-7946
>>>John Cowley Center for HREM, LE-CSSS
>>>B134B Bateman Physical Sciences Building
>>>Arizona State University
>>>PO Box 871704
>>>Tempe, AZ 85287-1704
>>>--
>>> References
>>>1. mailto:[2]john.mardi...@asu.edu
>>> To get on or off this list see list information at
>>> [3]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>>>
>>>   --
>>>
>>>   ***
>>>   David van Ooijen
>>>   [4]davidvanooi...@gmail.com
>>>   [5]www.davidvanooijen.nl
>>>   ***
>>>
>>>   --
>>>
>>> References
>>>
>>>   1. mailto:john.mardi...@asu.edu
>>>   2. javascript:;
>>>   3. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>>>   4. mailto:davidvanooi...@gmail.com
>>>   5. http://www.davidvanooijen.nl/
>
>
>
>

[LUTE] Re: Taylor Swift

[Mayes, Joseph]

My daughter is into "Journey." Is there a renaissance guitar version of
"Juke Box Hero" out there?

Joseph


On 9/2/15 3:25 PM, "David van Ooijen"  wrote:

>Haha! Look for MeesterDavidGitaar on YouTube ( that's me in my other
>life, one of my other lives). I did several Taylor Swift
>covers/arrangements. I think Never Grow Up would lend itself well to
>lute. Safe and Sound too. Ask your daughter which one  she likes best
>and I'll see what I can do.
>David
> 
>On Wednesday, September 2, 2015, John Mardinly
><[1]john.mardi...@asu.edu> wrote:
> 
> OK, now for something completely different: I have a 13 year old
> daughter who is into Taylor Swift. Big time.   I told her I would
>  play
> some Taylor Swift songs on the lute. Do any arrangements exist,
>  or is
> this something I am going to have to do myself?
> A. John Mardinly, Ph.D., P.E.
> Principal Materials Nanoanalysis Engineer
> EMail: [1]john.mardi...@asu.edu
> Cell: 408-921-3253 (does not work in TEM labs)
> Titan Lab: 480-727-5651
> NION UltraSTEM Lab: 480-727-5652
> JEOL ARM 200 Lab: 480-727-5653
> 2010F Lab: 480-727-5654
> Office: 480-965-7946
> John Cowley Center for HREM, LE-CSSS
> B134B Bateman Physical Sciences Building
> Arizona State University
> PO Box 871704
> Tempe, AZ 85287-1704
> --
>  References
> 1. mailto:[2]john.mardi...@asu.edu
>  To get on or off this list see list information at
>  [3]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
> 
>--
> 
>***
>David van Ooijen
>[4]davidvanooi...@gmail.com
>[5]www.davidvanooijen.nl
>***
> 
>--
> 
> References
> 
>1. mailto:john.mardi...@asu.edu
>2. javascript:;
>3. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>4. mailto:davidvanooi...@gmail.com
>5. http://www.davidvanooijen.nl/
> 

[LUTE] Re: Taylor Swift

[Mayes, Joseph]

Dough!!!


On 9/2/15 5:51 PM, "Braig, Eugene" <brai...@osu.edu> wrote:

> Sorry, Joe.  That's Foreigner.
> 
> Eugene
> 
> 
> From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] on behalf of
> Mayes, Joseph [ma...@rowan.edu]
> Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2015 4:57 PM
> To: David van Ooijen; John Mardinly
> Cc: lute list
> Subject: [LUTE] Re: Taylor Swift
> 
> My daughter is into "Journey." Is there a renaissance guitar version of
> "Juke Box Hero" out there?
> 
> Joseph
> 
> 
> On 9/2/15 3:25 PM, "David van Ooijen" <davidvanooi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>>Haha! Look for MeesterDavidGitaar on YouTube ( that's me in my other
>>life, one of my other lives). I did several Taylor Swift
>>covers/arrangements. I think Never Grow Up would lend itself well to
>>lute. Safe and Sound too. Ask your daughter which one  she likes best
>>and I'll see what I can do.
>>David
>> 
>>On Wednesday, September 2, 2015, John Mardinly
>><[1]john.mardi...@asu.edu> wrote:
>> 
>> OK, now for something completely different: I have a 13 year old
>> daughter who is into Taylor Swift. Big time.   I told her I would
>>  play
>> some Taylor Swift songs on the lute. Do any arrangements exist,
>>  or is
>> this something I am going to have to do myself?
>> A. John Mardinly, Ph.D., P.E.
>> Principal Materials Nanoanalysis Engineer
>> EMail: [1]john.mardi...@asu.edu
>> Cell: 408-921-3253 (does not work in TEM labs)
>> Titan Lab: 480-727-5651
>> NION UltraSTEM Lab: 480-727-5652
>> JEOL ARM 200 Lab: 480-727-5653
>> 2010F Lab: 480-727-5654
>> Office: 480-965-7946
>> John Cowley Center for HREM, LE-CSSS
>> B134B Bateman Physical Sciences Building
>> Arizona State University
>> PO Box 871704
>> Tempe, AZ 85287-1704
>> --
>>  References
>> 1. mailto:[2]john.mardi...@asu.edu
>>  To get on or off this list see list information at
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>>[4]davidvanooi...@gmail.com
>>[5]www.davidvanooijen.nl
>>***
>> 
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>> 
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[LUTE] Re: [SUSPECTED SPAM] Re: [SUSPECTED SPAM] Re: Pegheads on new lute

[Mayes, Joseph]

Howdy Chris

We're all looking forward to your concert here in the City of Brotherly Love. 
I am aware of the early music police and their hang-ups. However, at my age and 
experience, I just don't care - or perhaps take some pleasure in annoying them.

Best,

Joe

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu on behalf of 
Christopher Wilke chriswi...@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Wednesday, May 27, 2015 12:12 PM
To: Mayes, Joseph
Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [SUSPECTED SPAM] [LUTE] Re: [SUSPECTED SPAM] Re: Pegheads on new lute

   Joe,
   Yes, but you're forgetting that HIP is approximately 29.2 to 37.7% for
   show. Do the concert on an actual 19th century guitar with original
   geared tuners and a certain self-appointed Very Important segment of
   audience will grumble that they've been cheated out of an Authentic
   Transcendental Historical Experience. Peggy-looking things (even fake
   ones) will settle their stomachs and make them feel much better about
   the musicianship. Play the Monteverdi Vespers on an 18 foot-long Roman
   Giant Tortoise Theorbo and the secret police will be all smiles.
   Chris
   [1]Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

 At May 27, 2015, 11:34:28 AM, Mayes, Joseph wrote:

   Early - 19th C. - guitars were made with machines or friction pegs.
   Those made with machines were more expensive. If you use pegheads on
   one of these instruments, you have an expensive guitar masquerading as
   a cheap one. I'll join Sterling at the vomitorium.
   Joseph Mayes
   
   From: [2]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [3]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu on
   behalf of Sterling Price [4]spiffys84...@cs.dartmouth.edu
   Sent: Wednesday, May 27, 2015 8:02 AM
   To: Michael Grant
   Cc: LuteNet list
   Subject: [SUSPECTED SPAM] [LUTE] Re: Pegheads on new lute
   If your lute has shitty, ill fitting pegs then PegHeads might be fine,
   but it seems that most lute builders know how to make pegs that work
   just great. When I see PegHeads on early guitars with six strings I
   seriously feel the need to throw up.
   Sterling
   Sent from my iPad
   On May 26, 2015, at 10:55 AM, Michael Grant [5]mmgrant0...@gmail.com
   wrote:
--001a11c35b4c9e155e0516fefe80
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
   
I had PegHeds (that is how the inventor and manufacturer spells his
product) installed on a 10 c Ren lute. 19 PegHeds to replace tired,
   worn,
crappy wooden friction pegs that had broken off, actually started
   shearing
off under load. The lute was used and I had just gotten it. Chuck
   Herin,
the PegHed guy is, by pure luck, only about 2 hours from me here in
   South
Carolina. I drove the instrument to him, he made very small bore
   changes
in the pegbox and installed them. Here are before and after pics of
   the
lute's pegbox. The PegHeds cost $30 a piece. That adds up but what
   was it
costing me to have a lute with 1/2 of the broken pegs missing and so
unplayable, what would it have cost me to take it to a lute luthier
   and
have new friction pegs turned and installed and how long would that
   have
taken. Then I would have been back to friction pegs. Add both costs
   up
and the PegHeds were a no brainer! I recommend them highly.
   
Michael
   
On Tue, May 26, 2015 at 11:20 AM, Dan Winheld [6]dwinh...@lmi.net
   wrote:
   
I am neither conventional nor wise, so I can only offer my own
   personal
experience  opinions:
   
Most people love them, I wouldn't pay $20 for a barrelful of them.
   But
they are life saver on Orpharions; or any multi-string,
   double-course low
tension wire strung instrument. For those instruments, and those
instruments alone, I would consider them almost a necessity.
   
They are nice on my Baroque lute student's 13 course instrument -
   but
string changing is his problem!
Hate them on my own 8 course, but I have adapted  gotten used to
   them-
and that lute is so good I put up with them. The conventional but
exquisitely fitted pegs on my Vihuela are a lot faster  easier than
   the
Pegheads on my lute; I am used to the quick action of the 1 to 1
   gear
ratio of no gears! String changes? Instant!
   
No gears for me, thanks!
   
Da
   
   
On 5/26/2015 6:22 AM, Charles Mokotoff wrote:
   
I took delivery of a new lute this week that has Pegheads
   installed.
I've never been one for much authenticity, so this doesn't bug me
   at
all. All I can say is, where have they been all my lute life? I
   don't
know what I am going to do with all the extra time I have now. They
are
fantastic. The only single thing I miss is the simplicity of
   removing
a
string with conventional pegs, but to be able to just sit there and
put
your left hand up to easily tweak tuning feels miraculous to me.
I am curious what

[LUTE] Re: [SUSPECTED SPAM] Re: Pegheads on new lute

[Mayes, Joseph]

Early - 19th C. - guitars were made with machines or friction pegs. Those made 
with machines were more expensive. If you use pegheads on one of these 
instruments, you have an expensive guitar masquerading as a cheap one. I'll 
join Sterling at the vomitorium.

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu on behalf of 
Sterling Price spiffys84...@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Wednesday, May 27, 2015 8:02 AM
To: Michael Grant
Cc: LuteNet list
Subject: [SUSPECTED SPAM] [LUTE] Re: Pegheads on new lute

If your lute has shitty, ill fitting pegs then PegHeads might be fine, but it 
seems that most lute builders know how to make pegs that work just great. When 
I see PegHeads on early guitars with six strings I seriously feel the need to 
throw up.
Sterling

Sent from my iPad

On May 26, 2015, at 10:55 AM, Michael Grant mmgrant0...@gmail.com wrote:

 --001a11c35b4c9e155e0516fefe80
 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

 I had PegHeds (that is how the inventor and manufacturer spells his
 product) installed on a 10 c Ren lute.  19 PegHeds to replace tired, worn,
 crappy wooden friction pegs that had broken off, actually started shearing
 off under load.  The lute was used and I had just gotten it.  Chuck Herin,
 the PegHed guy is, by pure luck, only about 2 hours from me here in South
 Carolina.  I drove the instrument to him, he made very small bore changes
 in the pegbox and installed them.  Here are before and after pics of the
 lute's pegbox.  The PegHeds cost $30 a piece.  That adds up but what was it
 costing me to have a lute with 1/2 of the broken pegs missing and so
 unplayable, what would it have cost me to take it to a lute luthier and
 have new friction pegs turned and installed and how long would that have
 taken.  Then I would have been back to friction pegs.  Add both costs up
 and the PegHeds were a no brainer!  I recommend them highly.

 Michael

 On Tue, May 26, 2015 at 11:20 AM, Dan Winheld dwinh...@lmi.net wrote:

 I am neither conventional nor wise, so I can only offer my own personal
 experience  opinions:

 Most people love them, I wouldn't pay $20 for a barrelful of them. But
 they are life saver on Orpharions; or any multi-string, double-course low
 tension wire strung instrument. For those instruments, and those
 instruments alone, I would consider them almost a necessity.

 They are nice on my Baroque lute student's 13 course instrument - but
 string changing is his problem!
 Hate them on my own 8  course, but I have adapted  gotten used to them-
 and that lute is so good I put up with them. The conventional but
 exquisitely fitted pegs on my Vihuela are a lot faster  easier than the
 Pegheads on my lute; I am used to the quick action of the 1 to 1 gear
 ratio of no gears! String changes? Instant!

 No gears for me, thanks!

 Da


 On 5/26/2015 6:22 AM, Charles Mokotoff wrote:

I took delivery of a new lute this week that has Pegheads installed.
I've never been one for much authenticity, so this doesn't bug me at
all. All I can say is, where have they been all my lute life? I don't
know what I am going to do with all the extra time I have now. They
 are
fantastic. The only single thing I miss is the simplicity of removing
 a
string with conventional pegs, but to be able to just sit there and
 put
your left hand up to easily tweak tuning feels miraculous to me.
I am curious what the conventional wisdom is on these.

--


 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html


 --
 __
 Michael M. Grant, PhD, MBA
 *Coastal Psychological Consulting, PA*
 74 Lodge Trail
 Pawleys Island, SC 29585
 843.314.3263 Phone
 843.314.3784 Fax
 www.coastalpsychological.com

 --001a11c35b4c9e155e0516fefe80
 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

 div dir=ltrdivI had PegHeds (that is how the inventor and manufacturer 
 spells his product) installed on a 10 c Ren lute.  19 PegHeds to replace 
 tired, worn, crappy wooden friction pegs that had broken off, actually 
 started shearing off under load.  The lute was used and I had just gotten it. 
  Chuck Herin, the PegHed guy is, by pure luck, only about 2 hours from me 
 here in South Carolina.  I drove the instrument to him, he made very small 
 bore changes in the pegbox and installed them.  Here are before and after 
 pics of the lute#39;s pegbox.  The PegHeds cost $30 a piece.  That adds up 
 but what was it costing me to have a lute with 1/2 of the broken pegs missing 
 and so unplayable, what would it have cost me to take it to a lute luthier 
 and have new friction pegs turned and installed and how long would that have 
 taken.  Then I would have been back to friction pegs.  Add both costs up and 
 the PegHeds were a no brainer!  I recommend them highly.brbr/divdiv!
 Michaelbr/div/divdiv class=gmail_extrabrdiv 
 

[LUTE] Re: Lute in the Future

[Mayes, Joseph]

Whew!!! I thought it was just me.

Joseph Mayes


On 2/25/15 1:07 PM, Daniel Shoskes kidneykut...@gmail.com wrote:

 Ron: when I read many of your posts, I sometimes feel confused and
 undereducated. You often refer to ³those people we all know² or ³certain
 groups² and I guess I¹m not with the ³in crowd² because I honestly don¹t know
 who or what you mean.
 
 So, for the information of me and others like me on the outside looking in,
 what ³certain incorporated non-profit organizations² are you referring to?
 
 Danny
 
 On Feb 25, 2015, at 8:15 AM, Ron Andrico praelu...@hotmail.com wrote:
 
... but as far as I can see the only viable solution in
   our niche market is to ask our certain incorporated non-profit
   organizations to stop behaving like fan clubs and make targeted funds
   available to energetic and motivated artists for recording worthwhile
   projects - and not with limitations so the funds apply only to the
   select few students of the gatekeepers who have been running the racket
   for far too long.

 
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Spruce for lute vs guitar.

[Mayes, Joseph]

I am certain that discussion concerning tone woods, nail-use, phrasing,
voice-leading, and the current famous-player-cult of adoration took place in
1400 and has continued to take place with only the voices changing right
down through history. I don't think this is a bad thing in any respect.
Timothy seems to wish to hold us to a higher standard, but I see no fault in
what we're doing.

My $.02

Joseph Mayes 


On 1/21/15 3:42 PM, timothy swain timothy...@clear.net wrote:

 I find it hard to believe many of the discussion points that come up;
 Robert Lundberg (lute builder, who died of cancer in 2001--he was a
 good friend-- deserved person of great respect about lute building)
 talked a lot about the very same subjects that people still discuss
 (as if they're unaware, or the topics had never been discussed
 before). Where I live is in Oregon: yew grows here, as do many
 evergreens--Bob used to talk about certain species becoming harder to
 obtain,  foresaw times when certain species of wood would become very
 difficult to get.
 
 It strikes me that many of the points being discussed are beside the
 point--(many, many are excellent  deserve attention)--or maybe I
 misunderstand the purpose of the discussions. At any rate, they're
 somewhat interesting to follow, although not of permanent interest!
 But many of the subjects have come up again  again  yet again...
 
 Timothy Swain
 
 On Tue, Jan 20, 2015 at 1:14 PM, Braig, Eugene brai...@osu.edu wrote:
 -Original Message-
 
 On 17.01.2015 20:54, Herbert Ward wrote:
 Do lutes and guitars compete directly for tone wood supplies?
 
 In other words, do lute builders and guitar builders use the same
 criteria in selecting spruce lumber for soundboards?
 
 
 
 
 From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf
 Of Markus Johann Mühlbauer
 Sent: Tuesday, January 20, 2015 3:08 PM
 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
 Subject: [LUTE] Re: Spruce for lute vs guitar.
 
 There seems to be a lot of confusion about what tonewood is supposed to
 be. Some use the term only for wood that is especially suited to be used
 as soundboard, others use it for any wood that can be used to build a
 good instrument.
 
 I've looked up some properties of soundboard woods in a book and found
 that there seems to be a difference in desired growth ring distance
 depending on the type of instrument you want to build. I guess guitars
 are not so much different from lutes, so there should be much difference
 for the physical properties of the tonewood. This leads me to the
 assumption that the desired growth ring spacing is the same for both
 instruments.
 
 Another much more interesting aspect is the species of tree used. Usualy
 Lute soundboards are made of Picea abies (Norway Spruce). Guitar
 soundboards can be made far greater choice of softwoods (mostly new
 world woods not available in Europe at the times lutes were played).
 Some of those substitutes like Sitka spruce are as good or somtimes
 even better than Norway spruce.
 
 So technically one could say they compete, but guitar builders have more
 possible sources for tonewoods.
 
 Regards,
 Markus
 
 
 I certainly agree with your bottom line, Markus, that guitar builders have
 more possible sources for tonewoods.  However, Picea abies is still in very
 high demand as soundboards for modern classical guitars (marketed to US
 luthiers under many trade names, perhaps most commonly as European or
 German spruce (although I believe very little of the current supply comes
 from Germany).  Given the relative volume of guitar production, even
 considering classical guitars in comparison to steel-strung incarnations,
 I'd wager there is a pretty substantial competition with lute builders for
 quality timber.  That's only an assumption and I have no idea how what kind
 of influence that has on markets and production.
 
 Sitka (P. sitchensis) is really only prized in high-tension, steel-strung
 modern acoustic guitars.  I've only encountered a few classical builds in
 Sitka.  Of the North American spruces, Engelmann (P. engelmannii) is probably
 the most popular for classical instruments.  . . .  And of course, western
 red cedar (Thuja plicata) is also prized as classical guitar tonewood,
 although its favor seems to wax and wane a bit in comparison to spruce(s).
 
 I actually have a vihuela that Chad Neal, a local luthier friend, rebuilt
 using hybrid Lutz spruce (P. x lutzii) which is actually a white (P. glauca)
 x Engelmann spruce hybrid.  I think it works very well in context.
 http://4.bp.blogspot.com/__F-xZ4YNaFk/SsLPMHXvD_I/AAU/wFEGYRuLxOc/s16
 00/IMG_5096.JPG
 
 Very slow growth--closely spaced grain--seems the most highly prized feature
 of soundboards whatever the timber (assuming an absence of flaw/defect like
 runout, etc.).  However, the very few well-made (and sometimes very old)
 instruments I've encountered with widely spaced grain bring the rationale for
 that status quo into question.
 
 

[LUTE] Re: Ren lute as sub for theorbo

[Mayes, Joseph]

To find out why the theorbo was invented, you'd have to ask the inventor:
Rube Goldberg

JM


On 11/3/14 11:56 AM, Roland Hayes rha...@legalaidbuffalo.org wrote:

 I suggest its origins were for the solo singer to accompany himself (Peri,
 Caccini, others in Italy ca. 1600).  Salamone Rossi calls for it in
 instrumental dances very early, and it makes sense with one on a part strings
 - the chords and the basses plucked really stand out.  From there to the trio
 sonata and competent continuo players being included along with lutenists and
 keyboardists in early productions, and a sort of tradition developed despite
 the many drawbacks you list, Chris.
 
 -Original Message-
 From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf
 Of Christopher Wilke
 Sent: Monday, November 03, 2014 11:41 AM
 To: Geoff Gaherty; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu; Martyn Hodgson
 Subject: [LUTE] Re: Ren lute as sub for theorbo
 
 Martyn,
 
 On Mon, 11/3/14, Martyn Hodgson hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
  
    If you believe the
 lute 'works well'  and is 'quite audible' for
    continuo in ensemble, such as that
 required for a Bach harpsichord
    concerto, why do you think the theorbo was  ever invented?
 
 I've often wondered how the theorbo ever became a thing myself. What an
 improbably solution it offers for musical issues! And what an awkward,
 ungainly thing it is to master and use idiomatically! Strange fingerboard
 tuning... Limited melodic range... inability to double most vocal lines for
 support, especially when accompanying shaky singers... harmonic register
 placed in an undistinguished mid-range that is easily covered by others in
 even small groups... Campanellas are neat, but they take a lot of additional
 dedicated practice time to master and are virtually useless in ensemble
 playing other than in the most exposed passages. The basses, of course, sound
 great! They can be used to incredible effect - IF the bass line is diatonic
 for the tuning you happen to have during that section of the piece... and
 fairly slow moving... sans lots of leaps... without requiring a surplus of
 articulation... or too many ascending scalar passages that will ring...
  and you've also spent tons of time practicing to securely find your way
 through the forest of strings. (Know that the director will invariably want
 the theorbo to be the sole accompaniment instrument for the prima donna's
 passionate chromatic lament in B-flat minor at the opera's heart-rending
 denouement. He will announce this only as you're tuning up immediately before
 the opening show.) Volume is an asset. However, aside from the beauty of the
 open basses, the overall sound doesn't project especially well and so is more
 evident to the player than the listeners. It does look cool, however.
 
 I speak as someone who has played a lot of theorbo. My very first album was
 dedicated to solo theorbo music. I still love the instrument and its
 repertoire. However, considering all the time I've had to put into becoming
 competent and considering the challenges of the medium versus the
 acceptability of then-current alternatives (i.e. Renaissance lute), I've often
 pondered why the ancients ever bothered to embrace this cranky beast as
 enthusiastically as they did. My guess is it caught on because it looked cool
 back then, too. ;-)
 
 Chris
 
 
 
 
 Dr. Christopher Wilke D.M.A.
 Lutenist, Guitarist and Composer
 www.christopherwilke.com
 
 
 On Mon, 11/3/14, Martyn Hodgson hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
 
  Subject: [LUTE] Re: Ren lute as sub for theorbo
  To: Geoff Gaherty ge...@gaherty.ca, lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
 lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
  Date: Monday, November 3, 2014, 10:47 AM
  
     If you believe the
  lute 'works well'  and is 'quite audible' for
     continuo in ensemble, such as that
  required for a Bach harpsichord
     concerto, why do you think the theorbo was  ever invented?
   
     __
  
     From: Geoff Gaherty ge...@gaherty.ca
     To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
  lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
     Sent: Monday, 3 November 2014, 13:42
     Subject: [LUTE] Re: Ren lute as sub for  theorbo
     On 2014-11-03, 8:18 AM, Christopher Wilke
  wrote:
      Ren lute is absolutely fine. When I  played in the Collegium at
     Eastman,
     Paul (O'Dette)
  occasionally sat in with us continuo players. He
     always
     used his 8 course
     I played continuo on my 7-course
  renaissance lute for many years in a
     baroque ensemble class at the Royal
  Conservatory of Music in Toronto.
     Although I own an archlute, the 7c was  much more portable, easier to
     play, and sounded just fine.  Some
  chords were awkward because of the
     tuning, but otherwise it worked well, and  was quite audible in our
     ensemble of 5 or so.  Heck, I even
  played continuo in a Bach
     harpsichord
     concerto!
     Geoff
     --

[LUTE] Re: luteshop video

[Mayes, Joseph]

Martin

Kudos on your film. I really enjoyed it a lot. It seems I can't observe a
lure being built without wanting to own it - I think the term is LAS.
Loved the music, too.

Joseph mayes


On 9/3/14 6:15 AM, Martin Shepherd mar...@luteshop.co.uk wrote:

 Dear Ed,
 
 Thanks for your kind comments.  Yep, it was my son Francis (not child,
 exactly, at 21 years old!) who really did all the hard work, spending
 large amounts of his summer vacation on it, for which I am immensely
 grateful.  He's just about to return to Oxford for the final year of his
 music degree.  I have become somewhat addicted to the atmospheric nature
 of his photography, as (apparently) have many others.
 
 Martin
 www.luteshop.co.uk
 www.facebook.com/luteshop
 
 On 03/09/2014 06:04, Ed Durbrow wrote:
 Really, really lovely little film. I liked the pacing, a very succinct
 history interspersed with scenes of lute making and wonderful music.
 Was that your child who made the video?
 
 On Sep 2, 2014, at 6:12 PM, Martin Shepherd mar...@luteshop.co.uk wrote:
 
 Hi All,
 
 The promised documentary can be seen here:
 
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JbWvcYsGa8U
 
 I hope you enjoy it!
 
 Martin
 
 
 ---
 This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus
 protection is active.
 http://www.avast.com
 
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
 Ed Durbrow
 Saitama, Japan
 http://www.youtube.com/user/edurbrow?feature=watch
 https://soundcloud.com/ed-durbrow
 http://www9.plala.or.jp/edurbrow/
 
 
 
 
 
 --
 
 

[LUTE] Re: Bare spot on soundboard.

[Mayes, Joseph]

The question that is heartily begged, is: With all of this fall-de-rall about 
where to place the pinky, and how hard it is on baroque instruments or 
multi-course instruments, and Oh gosh, I have to lift it on occasion to play 
some things - Why in the world would you put it down in the first place?!? I 
have played lute for a long, long time and owned lots on instruments. 
Archlutes, 10 course lutes, vihuelas, renaissance guitars, baroque guitars, 
etc. etc. etc. Never have I felt the need to place my pinky on the soundboard.

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Louis 
Aull [aul...@comcast.net]
Sent: Sunday, August 03, 2014 12:51 PM
To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Bare spot on soundboard.

   Tony,


   It really depends on the angle your arm enters the soundboard and the
   length of your pinky relative to the index finger. If your arm enters
   the lute top well behind the bridge, the pinky naturally falls on the
   sound board. So it makes a good anchor point for finding the strings as
   well as keeping the lute in position.


   As the baroque necks got longer and peg boxes got heavier, the weight
   of the neck could be eased by raising the neck toward your head.
   Unfortunately that changes the angle your forearm comfortably makes
   with the bridge. Watch some of the hot shots and you will see what
   compromise they have reached between the two. Also watch the pinky lift
   on the big chords that involve both the very top and bottom strings.


   As my lutes got bigger I found my pinky raising more and more often,
   and eventually I stopped putting it down. One learns how to place the
   thumb for each chord without putting down a pinky by the relative
   position to the other fingers. My arm now enters the lute soundboard
   from a position directly above the bridge and I pluck the strings just
   below the rosette. The lute rests between my legs with a 45 degree neck
   angle to my body. I have to warm up a bit for my right hand to
   correctly find the basses, but after that I just recognize the chord
   and the thumb finds the note. A big benefit of this position is I sit
   upright in the chair and both arms find a comfortable position,
   allowing me to play longer, without shoulder or wrist discomfort. With
   the pinky up you can tolerate a taller bridge and closer spaced
   strings.


   My swan neck I play now has an beautiful englemann spruce top with no
   finish, touching it for any reason leaves a mark.


   Louis Aull


   --


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http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Bare spot on soundboard.

[Mayes, Joseph]

Zowie!! Just mention, in passing that one of the sacred cows is somehow not the 
best idea, and the floodgates open!
In all of this justification for using the pinky on the face, I have heard 
nothing by way of explaining why it's necessary. Oh yeah, the old guys did it, 
so it must be the right thing to do - exactly why so many guitarists after 
Segovia bent their wrists.

Just my $.02

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Bruno 
Correia [bruno.l...@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, July 28, 2014 1:54 PM
To: List LUTELIST
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Bare spot on soundboard.

   Dear Tobiah,
   You should check jazz guitarist Martin Taylor, he always rests his
   pinky on the soundboard or the tap plate many archtop guitars have.
   He plays very difficult polyphonic jazz arrangements.
   Regards. A A

   2014-07-28 14:44 GMT-03:00 Tobiah [1]t...@tobiah.org:

   On 07/28/2014 10:33 AM, Tobiah wrote:

 On 07/28/2014 10:23 AM, David Rastall wrote:

 We-ell, not exactly. A The pinkie-on-the-soundboard thing is
 legitimate renaissance lute technique. A It's described in treatises
 dating all the way back to the 16th century. A I once had an
 opportunity to play Jakob Lindberg's Rauolf lute that dates back to
 1590, and sure enough, there was the mark on the soundboard that
 bears the imprint of 400 years worth of pinkies! A You'll also
 notice
 that some early 19th-century guitars have a resting place glued on
 to
 the top for the player's pinkie. A Plus, I certainly wouldn't say
 that
 Merle Travis finger style playing was developed by players with
 inadequate right hand techniques. A Not to mention bluegrass banjo
 playersa|

 Fair enough. A I retract my comment!

 I still want to retain my evaluation of this usage of
 the pinky as a crutch, however popular it may have been
 throughout the centuries. A I used it as a youth and
 outgrew it, and having been on both sides of the fence,
 and experiencing the benefits and freedoms of having
 shed it, in that way I stand behind my original statement.

   Tobiah
   To get on or off this list see list information at
   [2]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

   --
   Bruno Figueiredo
   A
   Pesquisador autA'nomo da prA!tica e interpretaAS:A-L-o
   historicamente informada no alaA-ode e teorba.
   Doutor em PrA!ticas InterpretativasA pela
   Universidade Federal do Estado do Rio de Janeiro.

   --

References

   1. mailto:t...@tobiah.org
   2. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: backpacks for lutes?

[Mayes, Joseph]

I have framed on my studio wall a detail from a painting called The 
Grasshopper and the Ant. It shows a poor (but honest) theorbo player begging 
from a well-dressed apparently-rich fellow in the snow. The theorbo player has 
his instrument on his back - no case.

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Bernd 
Haegemann [b...@symbol4.de]
Sent: Friday, March 07, 2014 1:22 AM
To: wayne cripps
Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [LUTE] Re: backpacks for lutes?

Has anybody ever seen a historical painting of a lute player with his
backpack?


Am 05.03.2014 20:56, schrieb wayne cripps:
 I see guys carrying 'cellos and guitars in backpacks - does anyone make a 
 backpack for a baroque lute (in its case)?

Wayne




 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Bartolotti's continuo treatise

[Mayes, Joseph]

I'll second that sentiment. There is a small number of folks on this list
who feel called upon to put down a more wealthy and successful cousin.


On 2/27/14 8:49 AM, Monica Hall mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:

There is no reason why Campion should have been embarrassed at being a
guitar player as well as a theorbo player.   Foscarini, Bartolotti,
Grenerin, De Visee and Medard were all guitarists and theorboists and
indeed most professional players may have played both instruments as
and when required in a manner appropriated to the occasion.
 
 
 
Please don't knock the guitar!!!
 
 
 
Monica
 
- Original Message -
 
From: [1]Shaun Ng
 
To: [2]Monica Hall
 
Cc: [3]R. Mattes ; [4]Lutelist
 
Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2014 8:28 AM
 
Subject: Re: [LUTE] Re: Bartolotti's continuo treatise
 
  Campion actually says that he reccommends his pupils to take a few
  lessons on the guitar before starting with the lute.
 
What I have found interesting is how Campion--who doesn't seem to be
embarrassed to call himself both a theorbo and guitar master--seems to
suggest that the way to play (or more precisely 'touch') the theorbo is
really similar to the guitar. I wonder what this says about French
eighteenth century performance style.
 
Campion (my translations):
 
  There is an art to touching [the notes of] the chords. The thumb,
  after having touched the essential note, must then do
  a batterie with the other fingers, restruming [the strings] and
  alternately multiplying the chord, unless the strings are separated
  [] This is why I always give a dozen guitar lessons to those who
  intend to accompany on the theorbo.
  The harpegement of chords on theorbo makes up superbly
  when abbreviating the bass [in quick] movements. It is for this
  reason that I usually give, as I said, a dozen lessons on the
  guitar to those who intend to accompany on the theorbo. Its facility
  brings about in a short time [an understanding of] the touch [of the
  instrument].
 
Shaun Ng
 
On 27 Feb 2014, at 9:46 am, Monica Hall [5]mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
wrote:
 
  I have read all the messages in order but there are rather a lot of
  them and
  no reason why I should reply to all of them in detail.  To repeat
  again what you
  actually said...
  First, as I've said before: a guitar accompaniment is not a vaild
  source
  for continuo realizations! Guitar players where actually known for
  there
  inability to play sophisticated music (and that's why everyone and
  their
  grandmother sneered at them).
  There were a lot of amateur guitarists  but many of them were
  perfectly
  capable of playing sophisticated music.  In the passage which
  Jean-Marie has
  quoted Gramont says
  The King's taste for Corbetta's compositions had made this
  instrument so
  fashionable that everyone played it, well or ill.
  The Duke
  of York could play it fairly well, and the count of Arran as well as
  Francisco himself.
  Clearly many of these people could play sophisticated music as well
  as a professional player..
  The memoires are a witty and entertaining account of life at the
  Restoration Court but you don't have to take everything in them at
  face value.
  Some people may have sneered at the guitar but this is very often
  just a matter of cultural snobbism which was alive and well in
  the 17th century as it is today.
  There is no reason why a guitar accompaniment should not be a vaild
  source
  of information about realizing a continuo. Many guitarists were
  quite able to do this within the limitations which the instrument
  imposes and they may have had a better grasp of the way chords can
  be used than some lutenists. Campion actually says that he
  reccommends his pupils to take a few lessons on the guitar before
  starting with the lute.
  That will have to do for tonight.
  Monica
  - Original Message - From: R. Mattes
  [6]r...@mh-freiburg.de
  To: Monica Hall [7]mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
  Cc: Lutelist [8]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
  Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2014 9:18 PM
  Subject: Re: [LUTE] Re: Bartolotti's continuo treatise
 
  On Wed, 26 Feb 2014 20:10:03 -, Monica Hall wrote
  Monica - are you still reading up? It's really hard to answer
  without
  knowing which of my posts you have read so far.
 
 First, as I've said before: a guitar accompaniment is not a vaild
 source
 for continuo realizations! Guitar players where actually known for
 there
 inability to play sophisticated music (and that's why everyone and
 their
 grandmother sneered at them).
  This is an outrageous remark.   Certainly there were some people in
  the 17th century who disliked the 

[LUTE] Re: Cantio Sarmatoruthenica 97

[Mayes, Joseph]

This may explain why, in the new life members list in the new LSAQ, Roman
is listed twice.


On 2/11/14 10:26 AM, stephen arndt stephenwar...@verizon.net wrote:

 Very nice. It leaves me wishing that you would record the complete works of
 Roman Turovsky.
 
 -Original Message-
 From: Roman Turovsky
 Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2014 8:49 AM
 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu ; Le_luth
 Subject: [LUTE] Cantio Sarmatoruthenica 97
 
 http://youtu.be/UcTeHQu-Ml0
 Self-performed, warts and all...
 Enjoy!
 Amities,
 RT
 
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
 
 

[LUTE] Re: Cantio Sarmatoruthenica 97

[Mayes, Joseph]

I thought that he was a performer and artist and composer (and baroque
composer in disguise) therefore was given more than one life.

JM


On 2/11/14 10:44 AM, r.turov...@gmail.com r.turov...@gmail.com wrote:

 too big for his own shoes, I suppose
 RT
 
 On 2/11/2014 10:39 AM, Mayes, Joseph wrote:
 This may explain why, in the new life members list in the new LSAQ, Roman
 is listed twice.
 
 
 On 2/11/14 10:26 AM, stephen arndt stephenwar...@verizon.net wrote:
 
 Very nice. It leaves me wishing that you would record the complete works of
 Roman Turovsky.
 
 -Original Message-
 From: Roman Turovsky
 Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2014 8:49 AM
 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu ; Le_luth
 Subject: [LUTE] Cantio Sarmatoruthenica 97
 
 http://youtu.be/UcTeHQu-Ml0
 Self-performed, warts and all...
 Enjoy!
 Amities,
 RT
 
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
 
 
 
 
 
 

[LUTE] Re: Concerts

[Mayes, Joseph]

OOPS!!

If you just type in http://rowan.tix; it will take you to the right place.

Or as Homer Simpson says, Dough!!

Joseph Mayes


On 1/31/14 4:51 PM, Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com wrote:

 A problem still seems to occur, the Rowan university link, should have this
 last number : 628216
 But it has been transformed to b28216.
 You would need to copy the link and make the correction by hand, strange!
 Regards
 Anthony
 
 On 31 janv. 2014, at 19:30, Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com wrote:
 
   A link apparently wasn't working so here they are again:
 
   CONCERT INFO
   Miguel Yisrael USA Tour 2014
   1) Recital at Rowan University, [1]March 3 of 2014 [2]at 8
   pm :[3]http://rowan.tix.com/Event.asp?Eventb8216
   2) Recital in Boston, [4]March 5 of 2014 [5]at 8 pm: booked out
   3) Recital in Philadelphia, [6]March 7 of 2014 [7]at 8
   pm:[8]http://www.pcmsconcerts.org/concerts/miguel-yisrael-lute/
 
   On 31 janv. 2014, at 10:57, Anthony Hind [9]agno3ph...@yahoo.com
   wrote:
 
 Further information on the French baroque lute concerts :
 1) Recital at Rowan University, march 3 at 8 pm :
 [1][10]http://rowan.tix.com/Event.asp?Eventb8216
 2) Recital in Boston : booked out
 3) Recital in Philadelphia :
 [2][11]http://www.pcmsconcerts.org/concerts/miguel-yisrael-lute/
 On 29 janv. 2014, at 23:15, Anthony Hind
   [3][12]agno3ph...@yahoo.com
 wrote:
   Dear lutenists
   For those who may be interested these concerts of French baroque
   lute
   music are announced:
   Miguel Yisrael's USA Official Tour 2014 - A The Lute of The Sun
 King
   A
   Concert 1 - Miguel Yisrael, baroque lute recital - Rowan
   University,
   New jersey, USA
   Monday, March 3th of 2014, 8 p.m. Rowan University, Glassboro, New
   Jersey, USA
   Concert 2 - Miguel Yisrael, baroque lute recital - Boston, USA
   Wednesday, March 5th of 2014, 8 p.m.
   Tickets sold out
   Concert 3 - Miguel Yisrael, baroque lute recital - Philadelphia
 Chamber
   Music Society, Philadelphia, USA
   Friday March 7th of 2014, 8 p.m.
   American Philosophical Society, Philadelphia
   Regards
   Anthony
   --
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 [4][13]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
 --
   References
 1. [14]http://rowan.tix.com/Event.asp?Eventb8216
 2. [15]http://www.pcmsconcerts.org/concerts/miguel-yisrael-lute/
 3. [16]mailto:agno3ph...@yahoo.com
 4. [17]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
 
   --
 
 References
 
   1. x-apple-data-detectors://0/
   2. x-apple-data-detectors://1/
   3. http://rowan.tix.com/Event.asp?Eventb8216
   4. x-apple-data-detectors://3/
   5. x-apple-data-detectors://4/
   6. x-apple-data-detectors://5/
   7. x-apple-data-detectors://6/
   8. http://www.pcmsconcerts.org/concerts/miguel-yisrael-lute/
   9. mailto:agno3ph...@yahoo.com
  10. http://rowan.tix.com/Event.asp?Eventb8216
  11. http://www.pcmsconcerts.org/concerts/miguel-yisrael-lute/
  12. mailto:agno3ph...@yahoo.com
  13. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
  14. http://rowan.tix.com/Event.asp?Eventb8216
  15. http://www.pcmsconcerts.org/concerts/miguel-yisrael-lute/
  16. mailto:agno3ph...@yahoo.com
  17. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
 
 
 

[LUTE] Re: 2014

[Mayes, Joseph]

I'll add my bit - Happy!! Happy!!

Joseph Mayes
From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Leah 
Baranov [lutech...@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2013 8:18 PM
To: Lex van Sante
Cc: lute mailing list list
Subject: [LUTE] Re: 2014

   All the best to everyone in 2014!
   Leah

   On Tue, Dec 31, 2013 at 7:15 PM, Lex van Sante [1]lvansa...@gmail.com
   wrote:

To all of you, happy luting in 2014!
Lex
--
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 [2]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

   --

References

   1. mailto:lvansa...@gmail.com
   2. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: and the early music movement

[Mayes, Joseph]

I do not feel that I need to defend Christopher Wilke. If I had a substantive 
question or issue with early music, I would go top Chris way before I would ask 
any of the pros you mention.
I would like to take a moment to address the all pros I heard until now were 
very good. statement. Perhaps, Ernesto, you should listen more critically or 
get out more - I have heard some emperors play who had no cloths at all.

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of 
erne...@aquila.mus.br [erne...@aquila.mus.br]
Sent: Saturday, December 21, 2013 7:37 AM
To: Christopher Wilke
Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Dmth; howard posner
Subject: [LUTE] Re: and the early music movement

Christopher,

maybe you should start to hear good early music musicians.
They all improvise, and are excellent at it.
I do not know any recorder, theorbo, cembalo, clarinet, cornetto, etc etc 
player who does not improvise.
They learn it at school, in ensembles, from each other.
Take Van Eick, a basic recorder repertoire - full with improvisation.
Any Basso Continuo is an improvisation of sorts.

On the other hand, all onstage jazz impro's were tried out before in rehearsal. 
There are very few musicians who do free-impro, total on-the-spot 
improvisation, onstage.
Even Metheny and Coleman's song x, a timeless masterpiece, is not way out 
free in the utter sense of free improvisation.

Bad early music exists as well. I only hear it from amateurs. All pros I heard 
until now were very good. A huge number of amateurs is excellent as well.

Your comments on early music are very unrealistic. Have you ever been to the 
Basel conservatoire yourself?

Ernesto Ett
11-99 242120 4
11-28376692



Em 20.12.2013, às 20:51, Christopher Wilke chriswi...@yahoo.com escreveu:

Howard,


On Fri, 12/20/13, howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com wrote:

On Dec 19, 2013, at 5:27 AM,
Christopher Wilke chriswi...@yahoo.com
wrote:

   This also fits in nicely with Richard Taruskin's
often stated thesis
that early music performance practice
today is really a modern
fabrication that seeks to apply 20th
(now 21st) century aesthetic
preferences to past music.

 This would make sense only if there were a single
 20th-century aesthetic preference.

Who is to say there is not? Those alive during a historical period are too 
sensitive to the trees of plurality to discern the forest of ideology 
motivating seemingly disparate activities. (I assume most of us on this list 
are holdovers born in the 20th century. If there are any lutenists age 13 or 
younger on this list, please feel free to let us know your assessment of the 
degree of aesthetic cohesion exemplified in artistic movements of the last 
century. Probably, Uh, you mean that old stuff? Like, I dunno. Don't care.)

 The important thing about 20th-century aesthetic
 preferences to past music is that the 20th century
 preferred past music.  Audiences turned out for music
 of the 18th and 19th centuries more than for the new
 stuff.  That had never happened before.

Hardly. Audiences turn out in droves for new popular music: product intended 
to be enjoyed for a while before being discarded in favor of the next hit. It 
may come as a shock to us on the list, but very few people in the general 
population pay attention to classical music at all. We're the oddballs and I'm 
afraid Beyonce has us lute players beaten by a large margin in terms of broader 
musical relevance in the present.

 Because early musicians spend lots of time in factories

Yes. In music, they are called conservatories.

 and the repeatable, homogenized
 regularity of product made possible by the use of
 computers.

 I'm not sure I follow you here.  Are you talking about
 digital recording, or something else?

Well, no, I wasn't speaking of digital recording specifically, but that is a 
new development of the 20th century. While the invention of aural recording and 
the resultant commodification of the resultant mass-produced product, has 
certainly had an influence on the way music was performed in the 20th/21st 
centuries, that is really a much larger topic. I was rather referring to the 
psychological mindset incurred when one is able to press a button and have 100 
identical pages print versus the old school method of one having to manually 
press 100 similar, yet slightly distinct pages, or the even older method of 
writing out 100 pages by hand. We expect the characteristics of like objects to 
be extremely consistent, if not exact. (See the above remark about conservatory 
training.)

There is every reason to believe that earlier generations neither expected or 
desired total consistency. Indeed, improvisation and ornamentation WERE the 
expected tools of all professional musicians. Listeners knew that every hearing 
of a piece would be unique. We, however, expect our MP3s to sound exactly the 
same on each 

[LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed we got so far away from the [LUTE]-forum

[Mayes, Joseph]

Well-said, indeed!
Thank you, Chris, for your thoughtful posts.

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of 
Christopher Wilke [chriswi...@yahoo.com]
Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2013 8:27 AM
To: Jarosław Lipski; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed we got so far away from 
the [LUTE]-forum

   This also fits in nicely with Richard Taruskin's often stated thesis
   that early music performance practice today is really a modern
   fabrication that seeks to apply 20th (now 21st) century aesthetic
   preferences to past music. Indeed, the technically clean, vibrato-less,
   metronomic, inexpressive character of many performances of early music
   nowadays seems to be an artistic reflection of mechanized
   industrialization, assembly lines, and the repeatable, homogenized
   regularity of product made possible by the use of computers.
   It would be too much of a stretch to suggest that the approach of
   Segovia and contemporaries provides a model of early interpretation
   today, but one might be able to argue that, being older, some aspects
   of those aesthetic priorities were (un/subconsciously) closer to the
   spirit of earlier times than the modern performance dogma.
   Ah ha! says the HIP Police Person, But the Basel crew has something
   those bloated philistines of Segovia's generation never deigned to
   consider: we base every choice upon...
   (At this point the HIP Police Person raises eyes and hands to the
   heavens. A ray of golden light shines down and a snippet of the
   scholarly edition of Josquin's Missa Di Dadi, sung by an angelic
   choir, is heard. Apollo on his chariot begins to descend but he
   suddenly gets a call on his iPhone reminding him that he is needed for
   a baroque opera rehearsal in Stockholm.)
   ...the SOURCES! Ahh... the HIP person sighs with
   quasi-orgasmic relish.
   To which I say: Read all the 19th century treatises you can. Absorb
   them. Many are written so clearly, you'll have be able to form a
   perfect aural picture of how the music sounded. Then listen to period
   recordings. Suddenly no one is doing they're supposed to be doing,
   according to their own sources! The picture you formed was filtered
   through your own time, not theirs. How great must the gulf between our
   current intellectual comprehension and their actual practice be for
   music created in a pre-industrialized age, from which no recorded
   artifact survives?
   Chris
   Dr. Christopher Wilke D.M.A.
   Lutenist, Guitarist and Composer
   www.christopherwilke.com
   On Wednesday, December 18, 2013 6:46 PM, JarosAAaw Lipski
   jaroslawlip...@wp.pl wrote:
   WiadomoAAAe napisana przez howard posner w dniu 18 gru 2013, o godz.
   23:10:
   
On Dec 18, 2013, at 1:47 PM, Dan Winheld [1]dwinh...@lmi.net wrote:
   
Is it just me, or is there not something ironic about a serious
   minded 21st century LUTE-list member finding a great 20th century
   musical icon (think of him what one will otherwise) outdated?
   
Not at all.  Implicit in the whole early music movement is the
   assumption that the mainstream classical approach to early music was
   outdated, including icons like Karajan, Stokowski, and yes, Segovia.
   Their approach was an early-to-mid-twentieth-century approach that
   became outdated when we learned better.
   
   Sure, but we're not talking about Segovia's early music
   interpretations.
   To get on or off this list see list information at
   [2]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

   --

References

   1. mailto:dwinh...@lmi.net
   2. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed we got so far away from the [LUTE]-forum

[Mayes, Joseph]

OUCH!


On 12/19/13 11:25 AM, Dan Winheld dwinh...@lmi.net wrote:

 So your heart belongs to di Dadi (Cole Porter, 1938)
 
 On 12/19/2013 6:22 AM, Geoff Gaherty wrote:
 On 19/12/13 8:27 AM, Christopher Wilke wrote:
 Richard Taruskin
 Josquin's Missa Di Dadi
 
 Funny you should mention these two in the same email.  Decades ago I
 attended an early music workshop in Miami where Taruskin was one of
 the instructors, and his task of the week was to lead us recorder
 players through a sight-reading of a different Josquin mass each
 night.  He chose masses which he had never heard performed, in the
 hopes of finding an undiscovered masterpiece. Needless to say, all of
 them were fine music, but we were all blown away by the Missa di
 Dadi.  This was probably the first performance of this mass since the
 16th century, and I'm still in awe of having been one of the first
 people in centuries to experience it.
 
 Geoff
 
 
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed

[Mayes, Joseph]

Segovia's influence on the lute revival is once-removed Many of todays top 
players began with the classical guitar - for better or worse - there can be no 
doubt as to Segovia's influence there - for better or worse. I wonder how many 
people will debate our influences thirty years after we die.

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of 
r.turov...@gmail.com [r.turov...@gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, December 14, 2013 9:19 AM
To: Chris Barker; 'gary'; 'lutelist'
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed

I have not even heard of Segovia when I had my first lute lesson 30
years ago, and to this day I find it unimaginable that such an unmusical
personality  could exert such an influence. Or any influence, for that
matter.

As to lute revival - he takes no credit for that whatsoever. That took
place in spite of him.

RT





On 12/14/2013 8:45 AM, Chris Barker wrote:
 Re:  Gary's comments on Segovia...  If it were not for Segovia's efforts, the 
 guitar, lute, and kindred instruments would not occupy the places they have 
 today.  I was at a dinner put on by the old Dallas Classical Guitar society 
 almost a decade ago when the young guitarist seated to my left referred to 
 Andres Segovia as just an uninformed old man with poor performance practice 
 who could be only be heard on a bunch of scratchy LPs.  I took my first 
 guitar lessons in 1958.  We all considered Andres Segovia a saint.  And now, 
 much older and wiser, are still of the same opinion, and we hold his critics 
 in great disdain.

 In all sincerity,

 Chris Barker

 -Original Message-
 From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf 
 Of gary
 Sent: Saturday, December 14, 2013 5:44 AM
 To: lutelist
 Subject: [LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed

 Recently, a message was posted referring to Andres Segovia as a bully.
 I think that's a little harsh, I know it's become popular to bash Segovia and 
 that he had a huge ego, but I don't recall him actually bullying anyone into 
 agreeing with his views. It seems to me that he just expressed his views and 
 his admirers, of which there were many, gleefully adopted them as guitar 
 gospel, bedazzled by his mastery of the guitar. I have never heard of any 
 actual bullying on Segovia's part.
 Rather, the onus for any intimidation would be on the shear number and ardor 
 of his admirers.

 Gary



 To get on or off this list see list information at 
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed

[Mayes, Joseph]

OK good people, this will be my final post on this subject. I grow weary of
the gratuitous condescension and infuriating belittlement - take the
trouble to learn how to do it, indeed.


On 12/11/13 9:26 PM, Bruno Correia bruno.l...@gmail.com wrote:

2013/12/11 Mayes, Joseph [1]ma...@rowan.edu
Well, browse the recordings since mid seventies.
 
  Well, I was sort of fearing some push-back from the tap-dancing
  barefoot crowd. I don't know how you can speak for most of the
  lutenists out there. I certainly only meant to speak for me.
 
 
No it doesn't. Lamentable only for those who didn't have the trouble to
learn how to do it. Ask Hoppy, O'Dette, North, Herringman, Lislevand,
Ferre, Barto (the list is too big...) and many others how to do it.
It's not that difficult and the result is pure joy.
Right back to - if Paul does it, it must be right. I wish you joy of your
pure joy.
 
  Sweetness requires nails. The sound - sort of a thub, thub one
  achieves without them is so unsatisfying as to be lamentable.
 
Fungus? That's pure speculation. About Sor, check his method, no
research needed it's there.
Yes Sor advised against nails - the word I objected to was hated I don't
see that in the method.
 
  Tarrega played with nails until he lost them due to fungus - He
  convinced his late-in-life student Pujol that flesh was the way to
  go. Sor hated nails? I'd like to see that research.
 
 
Rubish, Dolmetsch didn't study enough lute praxis and Bream wasn't a
lutenist in the first place (actually he never assumed he was - this is
documented in an interview). The stars do not agree entirely with
themselves, but the important points remain the same.
I guess you're more acquainted with rubish than am I. For someone who
wasn't a lutenist, Bream recorded and performed quite a lot.
 
  As for asking Hoppy, I think that illustrates part of the problem
  with the HIP folks. Because the stars do it one way - that's the
  right way. Bear in mind that Dolmetch and Bream, et al thought they
  had it right, too.
 
I thought this list was supposedly a place to discuss lute performance
practice and not each ones taste. Some people may prefer to play with
nails on carbon single strings and with amplification. What does it
have to do with HIP?
Lute performance practice has everything to do with each one's taste. I
assume that historical performance varied as greatly as contemporary
performance - dictated by each one's taste. But really, I am as HIP as the
next fellow - I sound just like the paintings.
 
  But, as I say, I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything. Play
  any way you want to, just leave the dogma on the porch.
  Joseph Mayes
  
  From: [2]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [[3]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On
  Behalf Of Bruno Correia [[4]bruno.l...@gmail.com]
  Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 8:29 PM
  To: List LUTELIST
 
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed
 
   It may sound good to you, but not for most of the lutenists out
there.
   Ask Hoppy about this issue? Ok, you don't need to ask him, after all
   you don't ride a horse to the gig... Hey, I'd like to do that, the
   traffic has been so bad nowadays.
   The most frequent word to describe the lute's sound is sweetness!
How
   can you have achieve it with nails? Double strings also require that
   both strings be pressed at once and not one after the other. The
lute
   is after all a sweet instrument (specially with gut). Even in
classical
   guitar tutors (19th-20th century) the issue of nails was still
rolling
   on. Sor hated it and only tolerated Aguado because of his great
skill.
   That's why Tarrega and Pujol also avoided it (even if it was a
   requirement due to the high tension of the Torres guitar).
   Going back: The sources were just saying that many people were
careless
   about their sound production. In order to avoid it, what about
cutting
   your nails once and a while, washing your hands (daily if you can)?
   2013/12/10 Mayes, Joseph [1][5]ma...@rowan.edu
 
 I play the lute, archlute and vihuela with nails for the same
reason
 that I
 play the classical guitar with nails: because it sounds better!
 Of course, by that I mean it sounds better to me. Nails give the
 attack a
 precision that flesh does not. It also comes closer, IMHO to the
 sound
 usually described in historical sources as desirable on lute -
 silvery,
 tinkling, etc.
 Many sources tell us not to use nails - which they wouldn't have
 bothered to
 do if people were not doing it that way.
 I don't play with flesh, I don't ride my horse to the gig, and I
 don't

[LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed

[Mayes, Joseph]

Thanks, Chris

You've raised the level of discourse.

Best,

Joe


On 12/12/13 8:48 AM, Christopher Wilke chriswi...@yahoo.com wrote:

 Joe,
 
 No need to be offended. You raise some good points. Because of my
 activities as a classical guitarist and lutenist, I must occasionally contend
 with nails and lack of nails on each instrument. The biggest hurdle has been
 baroque lute. Until relatively recently, I could not any kind of acceptable
 sound out of it when I had nails, but after much effort, I think I've finally
 cracked how to do it.
 
 It is NOT true that playing with nails results in the individual strings of a
 course being played one after another. This only happens if one assumes that
 playing with nails simply means transferring modern classical guitar
 technique to the lute in toto. I can get a full sound with nails, but I don't
 play the lute like a classical guitar when the nails are present and I can't
 play it the same way as I do without nails. Unfortunately, I have found few
 models regarding what sort of technique is needed to play the lute with nails.
 It's been completely a method of trial and error. That's a scary path to trend
 when you've got a concert coming up! (For what it's worth, there are also no
 real modern models regarding how to play baroque lute with a historically
 accurate right hand position in general.)
 
 Joe, I think you have some valid points which are well worth considering
 seriously.
 
 Chris 
 
 
 
 Dr. Christopher Wilke D.M.A.
 Lutenist, Guitarist and Composer
 www.christopherwilke.com
 
 
 On Thu, 12/12/13, Mayes, Joseph ma...@rowan.edu wrote:
 
  Subject: [LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed
  To: Bruno Correia bruno.l...@gmail.com, List LUTELIST
 lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
  Date: Thursday, December 12, 2013, 8:01 AM
  
  OK good people, this will be my final
  post on this subject. I grow weary of
  the gratuitous condescension and infuriating belittlement -
  take the
  trouble to learn how to do it, indeed.
  
  
  On 12/11/13 9:26 PM, Bruno Correia bruno.l...@gmail.com
  wrote:
  
     2013/12/11 Mayes, Joseph [1]ma...@rowan.edu
     Well, browse the recordings since mid
  seventies.
 
       Well, I was sort of fearing some
  push-back from the tap-dancing
       barefoot crowd. I don't know how
  you can speak for most of the
       lutenists out there. I certainly
  only meant to speak for me.
 
 
     No it doesn't. Lamentable only for those
  who didn't have the trouble to
     learn how to do it. Ask Hoppy, O'Dette,
  North, Herringman, Lislevand,
     Ferre, Barto (the list is too big...) and
  many others how to do it.
     It's not that difficult and the result is
  pure joy.
  Right back to - if Paul does it, it must be right. I wish
  you joy of your
  pure joy.
 
       Sweetness requires nails. The sound
  - sort of a thub, thub one
       achieves without them is so
  unsatisfying as to be lamentable.
 
     Fungus? That's pure speculation. About
  Sor, check his method, no
     research needed it's there.
  Yes Sor advised against nails - the word I objected to was
  hated I don't
  see that in the method.
 
       Tarrega played with nails until he
  lost them due to fungus - He
       convinced his late-in-life student
  Pujol that flesh was the way to
       go. Sor hated nails? I'd like to
  see that research.
 
 
     Rubish, Dolmetsch didn't study enough lute
  praxis and Bream wasn't a
     lutenist in the first place (actually he
  never assumed he was - this is
     documented in an interview). The stars do
  not agree entirely with
     themselves, but the important points
  remain the same.
  I guess you're more acquainted with rubish than am I. For
  someone who
  wasn't a lutenist, Bream recorded and performed quite a
  lot.
 
       As for asking Hoppy, I think that
  illustrates part of the problem
       with the HIP folks. Because the
  stars do it one way - that's the
       right way. Bear in mind that
  Dolmetch and Bream, et al thought they
       had it right, too.
 
     I thought this list was supposedly a place
  to discuss lute performance
     practice and not each ones taste. Some
  people may prefer to play with
     nails on carbon single strings and with
  amplification. What does it
     have to do with HIP?
  Lute performance practice has everything to do with each
  one's taste. I
  assume that historical performance varied as greatly as
  contemporary
  performance - dictated by each one's taste. But really, I
  am as HIP as the
  next fellow - I sound just like the paintings.
 
       But, as I say, I'm not trying to
  convince anyone of anything. Play
       any way you want to, just leave the
  dogma on the porch.
       Joseph Mayes
      
  
       From: [2]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu
  [[3]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu]
  On
       Behalf Of Bruno Correia [[4]bruno.l...@gmail.com]
       Sent: Tuesday, December

[LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed

[Mayes, Joseph]

I play the lute, archlute and vihuela with nails for the same reason that I
play the classical guitar with nails: because it sounds better!
Of course, by that I mean it sounds better to me. Nails give the attack a
precision that flesh does not. It also comes closer, IMHO to the sound
usually described in historical sources as desirable on lute - silvery,
tinkling, etc.
Many sources tell us not to use nails - which they wouldn't have bothered to
do if people were not doing it that way.
I don't play with flesh, I don't ride my horse to the gig, and I don't
attend any bear-bating.


My $.02

Joseph mayes


On 12/10/13 11:05 AM, Bruno Correia bruno.l...@gmail.com wrote:

Here we go again with the nails issue. There are many sources
describing the use of flesh as the best way to sound upon the lute,
however, the use of nails was certainly a possibility. But only because
three cats used it doesn't mean it was the general taste of those
times. Just because Jimi Hendrix played with his teeth doesn't
mean that everyone does it today. I could only justify the nails if I
still played the classical guitar, otherwise what benefit would it
bring?
2013/12/10 Martin Shepherd [1]mar...@luteshop.co.uk
 
  Well, there's Piccinini, who recommends playing with nails, and
  Mace, who says that some people do it and think it's the best way,
  but he says it might be OK in an ensemble but doesn't like it for
  solo playing.  There may be others - Weiss?  Vihuela references? I'm
  sure others can help.
  Martin
 
--
 
 References
 
1. mailto:mar...@luteshop.co.uk
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed

[Mayes, Joseph]

Well, I was sort of fearing some push-back from the tap-dancing barefoot 
crowd. I don't know how you can speak for most of the lutenists out there. I 
certainly only meant to speak for me. Sweetness requires nails. The sound - 
sort of a thub, thub one achieves without them is so unsatisfying as to be 
lamentable.

No - that's not actually what I think - It's just the same sort of tone that 
I'm responding to.

Tarrega played with nails until he lost them due to fungus - He convinced his 
late-in-life student Pujol that flesh was the way to go. Sor hated nails? I'd 
like to see that research. 

As for asking Hoppy, I think that illustrates part of the problem with the 
HIP folks. Because the stars do it one way - that's the right way. Bear in mind 
that Dolmetch and Bream, et al thought they had it right, too.

But, as I say, I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything. Play any way you 
want to, just leave the dogma on the porch.

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Bruno 
Correia [bruno.l...@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 8:29 PM
To: List LUTELIST
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Bream Collection... I just noticed

   It may sound good to you, but not for most of the lutenists out there.
   Ask Hoppy about this issue? Ok, you don't need to ask him, after all
   you don't ride a horse to the gig... Hey, I'd like to do that, the
   traffic has been so bad nowadays.

   The most frequent word to describe the lute's sound is sweetness! How
   can you have achieve it with nails? Double strings also require that
   both strings be pressed at once and not one after the other. The lute
   is after all a sweet instrument (specially with gut). Even in classical
   guitar tutors (19th-20th century) the issue of nails was still rolling
   on. Sor hated it and only tolerated Aguado because of his great skill.
   That's why Tarrega and Pujol also avoided it (even if it was a
   requirement due to the high tension of the Torres guitar).

   Going back: The sources were just saying that many people were careless
   about their sound production. In order to avoid it, what about cutting
   your nails once and a while, washing your hands (daily if you can)?

   2013/12/10 Mayes, Joseph [1]ma...@rowan.edu

 I play the lute, archlute and vihuela with nails for the same reason
 that I
 play the classical guitar with nails: because it sounds better!
 Of course, by that I mean it sounds better to me. Nails give the
 attack a
 precision that flesh does not. It also comes closer, IMHO to the
 sound
 usually described in historical sources as desirable on lute -
 silvery,
 tinkling, etc.
 Many sources tell us not to use nails - which they wouldn't have
 bothered to
 do if people were not doing it that way.
 I don't play with flesh, I don't ride my horse to the gig, and I
 don't
 attend any bear-bating.
 My $.02
 Joseph mayes


   --

References

   1. mailto:ma...@rowan.edu


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http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Vivaldi

[Mayes, Joseph]

I guess I must fess-up to the fact that this performance will be with two
classical guitars, mercifully devoid of any Youtube risk, attoll.

If I had a near neighbor like the legendary EB, I would get a mando and do
it myself.

JM


On 10/14/13 2:29 PM, Braig, Eugene brai...@osu.edu wrote:

 Good luck at it, Joe.  Can you share what mandolin type(s) will be featured in
 solos?  Any Youtubing planned to come of it?
 
 Best,
 Eugene
 
 
 -Original Message-
 From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf
 Of Bernd Haegemann
 Sent: Sunday, October 13, 2013 3:08 AM
 To: Mayes, Joseph
 Cc: Lutelist
 Subject: [LUTE] Re: Vivaldi
 
 perhaps here?
 
 `http://imslp.org/wiki/Concerto_for_2_Mandolins_in_G_major,_RV_532_(Vivaldi,_A
 ntonio) 
 http://imslp.org/wiki/Concerto_for_2_Mandolins_in_G_major,_RV_532_%28Vivaldi,
 _Antonio%29
 
 
 
 Am 13.10.2013 03:06, schrieb Mayes, Joseph:
 Two of my students are playing the G major concerto for two mandolins. They'd
 like me to play continuo on my archlute. Does anyone know where a bass part
 (with or without figures) could be obtained?
 
 Thanks,
 
 Joseph Mayes
 
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

[LUTE] Vivaldi

[Mayes, Joseph]

Two of my students are playing the G major concerto for two mandolins. They'd 
like me to play continuo on my archlute. Does anyone know where a bass part 
(with or without figures) could be obtained?

Thanks,

Joseph Mayes



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http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Capo use on early instruments

[Mayes, Joseph]

Well...as long as you used authentic 16th Century hair-ties


From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of 
t...@heartistrymusic.com [t...@heartistrymusic.com]
Sent: Friday, October 11, 2013 12:08 AM
To: R. Mattes; Dan Winheld
Cc: Monica Hall; Gary R. Boye; Lutelist
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Capo use on early instruments

Hello All,
   and thanks for this discussion.
I have an 8 course Renaissance lute which I recently used
to play and record a piece a whole step higher.  Instead of arduously
fingered transposing, I strapped a nickel-silver section of a
candle holder across the fingerboard at the 2nd fret with thick hair ties.
  This is no joke - it worked quite well.  While it probably would have
been better to acquire an instrument designed to be pitched higher,
I don't have that kind of expendable income, so I improvised.
A 1/4 x 5 or 6 machine screw with a solid shaft would probably work
just as well.
  All the best,
Tom


From:   Dan Winheld dwinh...@lmi.net
Subject:[LUTE] Re: Capo use on early instruments
Another good point- the only lute for which I built my own capo (pain
in the butt piece of fussy work) was a 72 cm SL Division bass lute
that worked very well as an E lute (a-415 or 440) with a generous 10
fret neck, and narrow-ish sloping shoulders at the neck-body joint.
But, in order to work, required equal tempered frets. Great instrument
for accompaniment as well as a substantial amount of solo work. But a
58 - 62 cm SL, 8-fret neck tenor lute with meantone fretting? forget
the damn capo!

Dan

On 9/25/2013 4:13 PM, R. Mattes wrote:
 He makes the point that they did it in this way because the vihuela
 had only 10 frets and a capo on the fingerboard would have reduced
 this to 9.
 and lutes only had 7 or 8 frets ...




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http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

Tom Draughon
Heartistry Music
http://www.heartistrymusic.com/artists_tom.html
714  9th Avenue West
Ashland, WI  54806
715-682-9362

[LUTE] Re: Thigh support for theorbo

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hi Danny

My better half, Kathleen, tried the Gitano and several other suction-cup
gizmos on her 8-course with success until the pressure it took to initiate
the cups made a nice rib-crack. She's back to the footstool.

I like to stand with my archlute using a strap. I use a wedge of foam to
counter the twist that the instrument seems to want to do.

With Best Regards,

Joseph Mayes


On 10/2/13 5:35 PM, Daniel Shoskes kidneykut...@gmail.com wrote:

 Dear Theorbistas: has anyone ever tried one of the classical guitar
 rests/cushions/supports that many guitarists now use instead of a footstool
 for their theorbo? Some have suction cups or clamps which I wouldn't be
 thrilled to use on my instrument, but some, like the Dynarette don't.
 
 I'm still struggling to find an ergonomic position and the sitting on the
 strap options just don't fit my body.
 
 Thanks
 
 Danny
 
 
 
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 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Giacomo Merchi: Allegretto per la chitarra 1776

[Mayes, Joseph]

Nice!

Joseph Mayes


On 9/4/13 4:50 PM, WALSH STUART s.wa...@ntlworld.com wrote:

 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_iZXUD6rTA





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[LUTE] Re: Time to work on how we look?

[Mayes, Joseph]

I have to agree that the visual choreography takes away from the enjoyment. 
Weather it's the fellow playing F C d M (incidentally with some wrong notes and 
rhythms) who looks like his dog just died, or Tatiana, who looks for all the 
world like she is experiencing some sort of sexual gratification 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olW6-jhSgMg

Joseph Mayes


From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of 
Mathias Rösel [mathias.roe...@t-online.de]
Sent: Tuesday, August 20, 2013 2:37 PM
To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Time to work on how we look?

 On 08/20/2013 01:22 AM, William Samson wrote:
  Interesting new study showing that visual cues are more important
that
  the sound of a performance in how people judge it:

 There must be some truth to it.  For instance, I find it difficult to
watch this performer:

   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d44jKuw3Nlw

 The unwarranted and discomforting 'passion' in his face is enough to usurp
any
 beauty I might have otherwise found in his music.

One of the reasons why the lute and other string instruments were considered
superior to, say, wind instruments in the 17th and 18th centuries was that
lute players weren't forced to contort their faces (as is someone who blows
into a flute).

Mathias



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[LUTE] Re: Time to work on how we look?

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hi Leah

I have no objection to valid and truly-felt emotions showing up in the 
countenance of a soprano singing a dramatic area. I feel that some performers 
actually practice their emotions like a good actor - it rings false to me, no 
matter how well-played the music, and detracts from the experience.

My $.02

Joseph Mayes


From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Leah 
Baranov [lutech...@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, August 20, 2013 5:18 PM
To: Mathias Rösel
Cc: Lute List
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Time to work on how we look?

   To use this clip of Griselda as an example is comparing apples and
   oranges: facial expressions are part of rhetorical expression and is
   the responsibility of the singer acting the role he/she is
   interpreting. It is entirely appropriate in the performance of a
   dramatic aria.
   Exaggerated dramatic contortions by an instrumentalist IS
   distracting...but a smiling and relaxed demeanor should not be
   considered a fault.
   Leah

   On Tue, Aug 20, 2013 at 4:55 PM, Mathias Roesel
   [1]mathias.roe...@t-online.de wrote:

   I have to agree that the visual choreography takes away from
 the
 enjoyment.
  Weather it's the fellow playing F C d M (incidentally with some
 wrong
 notes and
  rhythms) who looks like his dog just died, or Tatiana, who looks
 for all
 the world like
  she is experiencing some sort of sexual gratification.
 
  And what's wrong with sexual gratification?  Music is no place for
 prudery; I say we
  need more orgasms, not fewer.
 Sorry, beg to differ (I for one do not want to see it, although I
 enjoyed
 listening to her playing). Watch this and let us know if you
 maintain what
 you wrote:
 [2]http://youtu.be/8x6xp9FaEbU
 Mathias
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 [3]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

   --

References

   1. mailto:mathias.roe...@t-online.de
   2. http://youtu.be/8x6xp9FaEbU
   3. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: now- How did Iadone play?

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hi Dan

I have a picture of Iadone from an old string packet. I know how misleading 
pictures can be (future guitarists will look at Picasso's Blue Guitar and be 
flummoxed) but his right hand looks like the archaic bent-wrist guitar style.

I'll send the picture along if I can find it.

Best,

Joe


From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Dan 
Winheld [dwinh...@lmi.net]
Sent: Tuesday, August 13, 2013 11:35 AM
To: Edward Mast
Cc: 'lute'
Subject: [LUTE] Re: now- How did Iadone play?

Hi Ed-

That's right- New York Pro Musica, Noah Greenberg. And those old heavy
but cool Passauro (Sp?) lutes. Do you know if there are any vids of him
playing? Or even still pictures somewhere? Even some ex- student's
description would help. I have largely gone over to thumb-out myself-
HIP thumb out as far as I can figure it out- too much Archlute,
Baroque lute  late Renaissance lute to stay with thumb under
exclusively; so I would like to know more about how Joe played, since
his recorded sound impressed me so much all those years ago.

Thanks!   - Dan

On 8/13/2013 6:40 AM, Edward Mast wrote:
 Hi Dan,

 Joseph Iadone was my first exposure to the lute.  He headed an early music 
 workshop that I attended for several years in Vermont (early 70's).  Lucy 
 Cross taught there also.  And Richard Taruskin, who led us through the early 
 chapters of Hindemith's Elementary Training for Musicians.  I never heard any 
 lute solos there, just amazing ensemble music, and lute songs, of course. 
 (Russell Oberlin was there the first year I attended).  Joe was a truly 
 unique player; no one played - or plays - like him.  I actually first heard 
 about him through my brother, who was studying bass with him at the Hartt 
 School of Music.  He did play with the New York Pro Musica, founded by Noah 
 Greenberg.  I have some of their recordings with Joe, or Christopher Williams 
 (one of his students) playing.  He also made some wonderful recordings with 
 the Renaissance Quartet.  One of the recordings I have on CD is one he did 
 largely himself at home, recording all the parts to duos, trios and quartets.
 The story as I've heard it is that Hindemith asked Joe to play the lute in 
 his collegium at Yale, so he had to teach himself how to play it.  I think 
 some of the information about technique he got from the introduction to 
 Varietie of Lute Lessons.  Thumb over (or out) but without nails and 
 thumb-index for single lines.

 Ned




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[LUTE] Re: Lute mail list down

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hear! Hear!


On 4/4/13 7:41 AM, Ron Andrico praelu...@hotmail.com wrote:

Wayne:
Thanks very much for what must have been a huge amount of work in
fixing the server problem.  We know how much time and effort something
like this can take, and everyone on the lute list appreciates your
generosity and expertise in providing this forum.
With gratitude,
Ron  Donna,
 Subject: Re: [LUTE] Lute mail list down
 From: w...@cs.dartmouth.edu
 Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2013 16:54:20 -0400
 To: praelu...@hotmail.com
 
 
 The lute list was down for a week, I got it working friday, but it
broke again
 on monday and I just got it started again.
 
 Wayne
 
 On Apr 3, 2013, at 4:08 PM, Ron Andrico praelu...@hotmail.com
wrote:
 
 Hello Wayne:
 
 Is the lute list still down? I seem to get random lute list
messages and, to top it off, my hotmail account just switched to a new
format. I'm not sure what's what.
 
 Ron
 
 Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2013 19:34:18 -0400
 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
 From: w...@cs.dartmouth.edu
 Subject: [LUTE] Lute mail list down
 
 
 The lute mail list server has been down for a week. I have it
running
 on a spare for now, I hope I can get it fixed tomorrow.
 
 Wayne
 
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
 
 
--
 

[LUTE] Re: [SUSPECTED SPAM] Saturday quotes - audiences

[Mayes, Joseph]

Office cleaning goes apace leaving me with Anthology I, Anthology II,
Anthology III, and a volume of Commentary of ³The Medieval Lyric² Revised
edition from 1988. These can be had as a package for postage. The lucky
recipient must take the bunch Just let me know.

Joseph Mayes

PS I also have a paperback volume in good condition of Denis Delair¹s
³Accompaniment on Theorbo and Harpsichord² 1690. I understand that this is a
rare book and I have only been able to find it for sale on line for hundreds
of dollars. I would be willing to let this go to the first $100 offer I
receive.


On 3/30/13 8:54 AM, Ron Andrico praelu...@hotmail.com wrote:

 
We have posted our Saturday quotes, this week on audiences for early
music.
[1]http://wp.me/p15OyV-G8
Ron  Donna
 
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 References
 
Visible links
1. http://wp.me/p15OyV-G8
 
Hidden links:
2. http://wp.me/p15OyV-G8
3. http://wp.me/p15OyV-G8
 
 
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[LUTE] Free stuff

[Mayes, Joseph]

Sorry - I forgot to change the subject


On 4/3/13 2:04 PM, nssadmin ma...@rowan.edu wrote:

 Office cleaning goes apace leaving me with Anthology I, Anthology II,
 Anthology III, and a volume of Commentary of ³The Medieval Lyric² Revised
 edition from 1988. These can be had as a package for postage. The lucky
 recipient must take the bunch Just let me know.
 
 Joseph Mayes
 
 PS I also have a paperback volume in good condition of Denis Delair¹s
 ³Accompaniment on Theorbo and Harpsichord² 1690. I understand that this is a
 rare book and I have only been able to find it for sale on line for hundreds
 of dollars. I would be willing to let this go to the first $100 offer I
 receive.
 
 
 On 3/30/13 8:54 AM, Ron Andrico praelu...@hotmail.com wrote:
 
 
We have posted our Saturday quotes, this week on audiences for early
music.
[1]http://wp.me/p15OyV-G8
Ron  Donna
 
--
 
 References
 
Visible links
1. http://wp.me/p15OyV-G8
 
Hidden links:
2. http://wp.me/p15OyV-G8
3. http://wp.me/p15OyV-G8
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
 
 
 

[LUTE] Free stuff

[Mayes, Joseph]

Free to Good Home
 
For reasons known only to my university, I must clean out my office. I must
find a home for Journals from the Lute Society (Great Britain) and from the
LSA.
I have issues of ³The Lute² from 1959 through very recent, and issues of the
LSA ³Journal² from 1971 to the present.
If you¹d like to have these for your very own, and would pay for postage, I
will gladly send them to you. I want to make one trip to the post office, so
you must want them all.
 
Joseph Mayes ma...@rowan.edu




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[LUTE] Re: The English Guitar

[Mayes, Joseph]

There is an English guitar sitting on Thomas Jefferson's harpsichord at
Monticello.

Joseph Mayes


On 1/31/13 8:07 AM, Gary R. Boye boy...@appstate.edu wrote:

 Dear Bill,
 
 I think I can (briefly) answer your questions:
 
 There is a HUGE amount of music that survives for this instrument. If
 you check my web page for the 18th century and do a CTRL-F for english
 guitar there are at least 274 publications:
 
 http://applications.library.appstate.edu/music/lute/C18/1700.html
 
 More of these sources now labeled guitar are probably for this
 instrument as well.
 
 The quality? It varies . . . it is an amateur instrument and much of the
 music is just an arrangement of a melody--a single line at the end of a
 publication really for piano and voice. But I must admit that the piece
 Rob played and his playing was disarmingly effective; hearing one of
 these instruments always makes me want to play one . . .
 
 There is a nice sonata by J.C. Bach:
 
 J.C. Bach c1775
 Bach, Johann Christian. A sonata for the guitar with an accompaniment
 for a violin (London, [England]: Longman, Lukey, and Co.) [BUC]
 English guitar and violin in staff notation
 
 The second question is easy: to my knowledge, this instrument was NEVER
 called the English guitar in the 18th century. Always guittar or
 even guitar with various other spellings/other names in German and
 French.
 
 Gary
 
 On 1/31/2013 5:00 AM, William Samson wrote:
 (Semi) serious question.  What music was composed for this instrument
 outside Scotland? - Is it any good? (- the music from outside Scotland,
 that is).
 
 Second question - What did they call this instrument back in the day?
 Specifically, was it ever called The English Guitar?
 
 Bill
 From: Rob MacKillop robmackil...@gmail.com
 To: Lute lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
 Sent: Thursday, 31 January 2013, 8:50
 Subject: [LUTE] The English Guitar
   I'm no fascist, so if you want to discuss the so-called English
 Guitar,
   I suggest you do so here, not in the thread of my video performance
   (which everyone except Martyn seems to have seen). I only ever said
   don't use my video thread to discuss the wider issues of the guittar.
   My reason for creating a separate thread is that it makes it easier
 for
   me to avoid. The reason for avoiding the discussion is that there are
 a
   few regulars here who cannot discuss anything without killing the
   subject for anyone who has a love for it.
   So, what is an English Guitar?
   Rob (exits stage left...)
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[LUTE] Re: 13th century Conductus played on gittern and psaltery

[Mayes, Joseph]

Wow!! Delightful!

Joseph Mayes


On 1/24/13 3:30 PM, WALSH STUART s.wa...@ntlworld.com wrote:

 Sol Sub Nube Latuit. A liturgical piece for two voices, no doubt
 embedded in the fervent Christian rituals and faith... nothing to do
 with instrumental music
 
 Here imagined as played by an irreverent pair of instrumentalists,
 insofar as it is possible to be irreverent when wearing tights, pointy
 footwear and playing culpably fay instruments like psaltery and gittern.
 
 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BPI586YQt4
 
 
 Stuart
 
 
 
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[LUTE] Re: Reconstructing Dowland; deconstructing Dowland

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hello David

I loved your Resurrection and certainly do not mean this question as a
critique - but - Do you have a philosophy for when to roll a chord? I hear
a great many wonderful players and each seems to have a different idea about
this. 

Thanks,

Joseph Mayes   
 


On 11/13/12 3:33 PM, David Tayler vidan...@sbcglobal.net wrote:

 Most of Dowland's lute solos come down to use a sketch--two outside
lines, a few chords, and some noodly appendages--ornaments added by
lutebook owners or their copyists.
Many conclusions can be drawn, but the basic question remains, what to
do with all of these sources? Obviously, performing them as is is one
solution, and perfectly fine--a snapshot in time of what a lute player
of the time would have played. Absoutely OK, and there it is, in the
ms. But suppose there is more?
The other path is to add inner voices and strip out the noodly
appendages. I've given this quite a bit of thought over the last
twenty-five years, and I have a few simple guidelines.
1. Eliminate parallel fifths and octaves. Dowland never wrote bad
counterpoint, so these have to go. Famous example is the version of
Lachrimae with the parallel fifth in the opening phrase, even though
Dowland's published version is different.
2. Strip out orbiting noodly appendages. One sure sign of cookbook,
color-by-number ornaments are those that present a set of added melodic
sequences that start and end on the same note. Accomplished composers
rarely use these, they are intended mainly for students. By returning
to the same note, you mostly avoid the problem of parallel octaves and
fifths, thus, an amateur who could not read music and did not study
counterpoint could provide correct counterpoint in simple ornaments.
Ornamentation treatises mention this trick as a way to dive in to
ornamentation: nothing wrong with it, but it is for beginners--not
Dowland.
3. Make sure cadences have leading tones somewhere in the bar, and end
chords with thirds in the harmony. Although you see open fifths in mid
century lute works, by 1590 you mainly see full harmony. A skilled
player would not play G Major with a third and C Major without the
third just to avoid fifth position, and you see this in the ms sources.
Whether these open chords were simply sketches, or intentionally left
to the play to fill in, foreshadowing later works such as Visee, these
need leading tones.
4. Inner parts. Dowland's works at an absolute minimum always support a
tenor or alto part, or both. If they are missing, they need to be
supplied. There are a myriad of examples in the lute solos and lute
songs, and they follow simple rules of counterpoint. If you study the
chromatic fantasies, you can see complex inversions and imitation, but
ta simple, well-written line will do. After analyzing all of the works,
I can see that they were composed with inner parts in mind--that is,
there are no works that paint contrapuntal corners where inner parts
are not possible, which you see in other composers.
Following these rules, I have created a very simple example. In one
place I changed the harmony to make sure the form was rounded, that
is, a sort of mini refrain but the rest is pretty straightforward.
http://youtu.be/Pr7jtlXk-OU?hd=1
I'm interested in new ideas going forward, before I tackle some of the
more complex works. Please feel free to make suggestions.
dt
 
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[LUTE] Re: [LUTE] Bach¹s Lute Suites: This Myth is Busted

[Mayes, Joseph]

I have an issue whenever I hear a blanket statement like He never wrote for
it, and JSB never played the trumpet. It strikes me as similar to there
is no God or there is a God.

We know JSB liked the sound of the lute - he invented a keyboard instrument
to imitate that sound. We can guess that he didn't like the sound of the
guitar or the piano because, although both instruments were around during
his lifetime, he wrote nothing for either. Further studies may reveal a Back
letter that states his feelings about/writing for lute but absent that,
we're just guessing. Categorical statements like Romans' or Paul O'Dette's
are not all that helpful.

JM


On 4/30/12 9:19 AM, Roman Turovsky r.turov...@verizon.net wrote:

 JSB never played trumpet either, but he wrote for it competently.
 There is sufficient grounds to assume he would have approached lute
 with equal consideration he afforded any other instrument he wrote for,
 given his diligence and meticulousness.
 The lute is the only instrument he showed no understanding of -
 because he never wrote for it.
 RT


 - Original Message -
 From: Jarosław Lipski jaroslawlip...@wp.pl
 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
 Sent: Monday, April 30, 2012 5:13 AM
 Subject: [LUTE] Re: Bach’s Lute Suites: This Myth is Busted


 Roman,

 Yes , no one questions that. Lute Suites are not well written for lute,
 for sure. Weather they are playable or not can be discussed. However we
 are not talking about this. The question is if Bach intended them to be
 performed on a lute. I can tell you something from my own experience. Many
 years ago when I studied in London there was a Polish composer who wanted
 to write a guitar piece which was commissioned for a special occasion.
 Because I was asked to perform it he consulted me several times on
 playability of some passages. In spite he was obviously aware of the range
 of classical guitar, the way he structured his music was very unintuitive.
 If he hadn't had a guitarist to consult during a compositional process
 probably he would have written something unplayable for someone who would
 try to take the score literally. Now, could you imagine that Bach being
 probably one of the most prolific composer in history of music, but being
 mostly as we say nowadays a keyboard player !
 would have time to study possibilities of an instrument that he did not
 play himself? Possibly he knew the range of this instrument and how it
 sounds, but the idea that he would have cared about every note to be
 played comfortably on a lute seems to me not tenable. In fact it is quite
 possible that being fond of lute's sound (as we know from some writings
 and his love for lute-harpsichord and clavichord) and being asked by Mr
 Schouster he made an arrangement of his work with a real intention of
 editing it for lute players.
 Anyway, it's just a speculation, but it shows that one can interpret the
 same data in many different ways. Until more evidence is found it is
 better to refrain from making up new theories, I suppose.
 All best

 JL


 isticWiadomość napisana przez Roman Turovsky w dniu 30 kwi 2012, o godz.
 04:42:

 Jarek,
 I thinks the available evidence pretty much points where Clive thinks it
 does, and I am inclined to agree with him, notwithstanding Vasily
 Antipov,
 an excellent Russian player who actually can perform Lute Suites as
 written (he knows no technical difficulties).
 The Lute Suites are simply not performable by an average professional
 player (unlike the rest of JSB's works), and that is the ultimate
 giveaway
 (besides being out of lutenistic character).
 RT

 From: Jarosław Lipski jaroslawlip...@wp.pl
 Roman,
 I do not share your dislike for musicology. It pays really big service to
 all of us I suppose. It has its rules and  trespassing them creates the
 effect you are talking about. I am just saying that the available
 evidence on so called Lute Suites does not entitle us to make very
 definite statements that Bach never ever wrote anything with a lute in
 mind apart from 2 small movements in his Passions. It would be not too
 difficult to create a contradictory theory, but this kind of speculation
 seems to be rather a waste of time.
 JL

 Wiadomość napisana przez Roman Turovsky w dniu 29 kwi 2012, o godz.
 23:01:

 a geetar then.
 Phrases like there is some likelihood that item X might very well could
 have been item Y
 may work in some musicological situations, but not in the case of our
 Lute Suites.
 RT

 - Original Message - From: Jarosław Lipski
 jaroslawlip...@wp.pl
 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
 Sent: Sunday, April 29, 2012 4:50 PM
 Subject: [LUTE] Re: Re: Re: Bach’s Lute Suites: This Myth is Busted


 but in this case a spade is not a spade :)
 JL


 Wiadomość napisana przez Roman Turovsky w dniu 29 kwi 2012, o godz.
 22:32:

 Yes,
 but -
 sometimes we have to give up the musicological mumbo-jumbo,
 and just call a spade a spade.
 RT

 - Original Message - From: Jarosław Lipski
 jaroslawlip...@wp.pl
 

[LUTE] Bach¹s Piano Suites: This Myth is Busted

[Mayes, Joseph]

Then why is it possible to state categorically that Bach never wrote for
lute? How can we assume what Back must have expected?

JM


On 4/30/12 10:52 AM, howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com wrote:

 We can't say categorically that Bach never wrote for piano.  When he sent The
 Musical Offering to Fred, he must have expected that it would be played on a
 piano because that's what Fred had.




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[LUTE] Re: Bach¹s Lute Suites: This Myth is Busted

[Mayes, Joseph]

Greetings Eugene

I agree with about all you've said - I would add some what I think are cogent 
factoids: Take the fifth 'cello suite. The music requires a scordatura, it has 
not survived in Bach's hand, and it was lost for hundreds of years. People have 
no trouble calling it a 'cello suite. The same music, in Bach's hand, in 
continuous un-lostness, and dedicated to a contemporanious lutenist is deemed 
suspicious.(?) Add to this that in Bach's time it would have been way more 
usual to write a suite for lute than for 'cello - and that the lute suite is 
better music. IMHO It leaves me scratching my head.

Best Regards,

Joseph


From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Braig, 
Eugene [brai...@osu.edu]
Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 11:07 AM
To: lute
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Bach¹s Lute Suites: This Myth is Busted

Greetings Prof. Mayes,

Yeah, I should not have used the Bach's own hand line; that's not really what 
I was getting at.  Still, Ana Magdalina is a bit of a different case than 
Falckenhagen, e.g.,  just because she was obviously rather close to ol' Johann 
and known as one of her husband's regular copyists.  I don't think anybody is 
arguing that Bach's lute works aren't Bach's, only that there is very little 
to suggest that he himself ever expected that music to be performed by actual 
lutenists with actual lutes in lap.  In many cases-e.g., BWV 1000-there are 
examples with good Bachy provenance obviously intended for other instruments; 
this particular piece is also a good example of one to come to us as lute via 
an arrangement by a lutenist acquaintance of Bach's.

Again, I don't think there's anything wrong with playing any/all of the alleged 
lute works on lutes or even in referring to them as Bach's lute music.  That 
is how we've all come to know this stuff.  ...And we all know Bach himself was 
an inveterate recycler of his own (and even others': e.g., the solo keyboard 
concerti) music.  There's also nothing wrong with an objective recognition of 
what is known of the source material for Bach's lute works, whatever conclusion 
anybody would like to draw from it.

Best,
Eugene

-Original Message-
From: Mayes, Joseph [mailto:ma...@rowan.edu]
Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 7:49 AM
To: Braig, Eugene; lute
Subject: Re: [LUTE] Re: Bach¹s Lute Suites: This Myth is Busted

Hi Eugene
The Bach's own hand argument is specious - we don't have the 'cello 
suites in Bach's hand either and even though they were in Ana Magdalina's hand 
and at least one for another instrument, we still call them Bach's 'Cello 
Suites.

Joseph Mayes


On 4/25/12 10:23 PM, Braig, Eugene brai...@osu.edu wrote:

 I don't know how relevant the concept of urtext is in this case.
 Urtext or not, there is still no evidence to tie Bach's alleged lute
 suites to Bach in his hand and plenty of evidence that these are
 arrangements or speculation at best.  There's nothing wrong with
 playing that music on the lute (especially because there is evidence
 that some folks from around that time did like to play some of these
 pieces on lute: e.g., Weyrauch and Falckenhagen), but I don't think
 there's anything wrong with acknowledging what info there is of its 
 provenance either.  You're right; it's all speculation.

 I think you have the concept of Bach's rental stable in reverse.
 Titmuss and others aren't arguing for Bach as renter/lessee but as
 lessor/owner, leasing his own stable out to paying customers.  To
 quote the originally linked article, There is evidence that he ran an
 instrument rental business.  If so, that sounds like a man who would
 own a fair number of popular instruments himself and not necessarily be 
 proficient with every one that he did own.

 Best,
 Eugene

 
 From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] on behalf
 of David Tayler [vidan...@sbcglobal.net]
 Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2012 9:14 PM
 To: lute
 Subject: [LUTE] Re: [LUTE] Re: [LUTE] [LUTE] [LUTE] Bach¹s Lute
 Suites: This Myth is Busted

For me the point is that Carolyn Abbate fimly trounced the notion of an
urtext thirty years ago :)
I just don't see any point in revisiting it. It turns out that
composition works like quantum mechanics, the closer you look, the
fuzzier it gets.
So all this linear provenance, composers intent, etc, that went out the
window years ago. I mean, no one is saying don't speculate, but it is
just speculation.
As far as Bach renting instruments, that proves one of two things.
First, that he probaly did not rent them, because they would not have
been in his household inventory at the time of his death, and, second,
in the extremely unlikely event that he rented them, he must have
wanted them. Here's my 2 euro cents. The gamba sonatas, some of the
greatest music ever written for gamba, composed on a rent-a-viol?  Good
thing

[LUTE] Bach¹s Lute Suites: This Myth is Busted

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hi Eugene
The Bach's own hand argument is specious - we don't have the 'cello
suites in Bach's hand either and even though they were in Ana Magdalina's
hand and at least one for another instrument, we still call them Bach's
'Cello Suites.

Joseph Mayes 


On 4/25/12 10:23 PM, Braig, Eugene brai...@osu.edu wrote:

 I don't know how relevant the concept of urtext is in this case.  Urtext or
 not, there is still no evidence to tie Bach's alleged lute suites to Bach in
 his hand and plenty of evidence that these are arrangements or speculation at
 best.  There's nothing wrong with playing that music on the lute (especially
 because there is evidence that some folks from around that time did like to
 play some of these pieces on lute: e.g., Weyrauch and Falckenhagen), but I
 don't think there's anything wrong with acknowledging what info there is of
 its provenance either.  You're right; it's all speculation.
 
 I think you have the concept of Bach's rental stable in reverse.  Titmuss and
 others aren't arguing for Bach as renter/lessee but as lessor/owner, leasing
 his own stable out to paying customers.  To quote the originally linked
 article, There is evidence that he ran an instrument rental business.  If
 so, that sounds like a man who would own a fair number of popular instruments
 himself and not necessarily be proficient with every one that he did own.
 
 Best,
 Eugene
 
 
 From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] on behalf of David
 Tayler [vidan...@sbcglobal.net]
 Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2012 9:14 PM
 To: lute
 Subject: [LUTE] Re: [LUTE] Re: [LUTE] [LUTE] [LUTE] Bach¹s Lute Suites: This
 Myth is Busted
 
For me the point is that Carolyn Abbate fimly trounced the notion of an
urtext thirty years ago :)
I just don't see any point in revisiting it. It turns out that
composition works like quantum mechanics, the closer you look, the
fuzzier it gets.
So all this linear provenance, composers intent, etc, that went out the
window years ago. I mean, no one is saying don't speculate, but it is
just speculation.
As far as Bach renting instruments, that proves one of two things.
First, that he probaly did not rent them, because they would not have
been in his household inventory at the time of his death, and, second,
in the extremely unlikely event that he rented them, he must have
wanted them. Here's my 2 euro cents. The gamba sonatas, some of the
greatest music ever written for gamba, composed on a rent-a-viol?  Good
thing they didn't get repo'd!
And there was no ocarina on his shelf. Just instruments that happened
to be used in the finest sacred pieces composed in the baroque
period--the John and Matthew passions.
Coincidence? Equally likely, IMHO, finding a moon rock in an astronauts
luggage. And I mean no disrespect, it just seems awfully tidy.
And I missing something, and maybe someone here can help me, but the
page marked unplayable in the article, doesn't this work fine on the
archlute?
Of all the arguments, playability certainly is intriguing.
dt
  __
 
From: Braig, Eugene brai...@osu.edu
To: lute lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Wed, April 25, 2012 11:31:40 AM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: [LUTE] [LUTE] [LUTE] Bach's Lute Suites: This Myth
is Busted
I think the point, David, is that the music we have inherited as
Bach's works for lute doesn't have any linear provenance to actually
connect them to an intention by Bach for them to be performed on lute.
That said, transcriptions of any Bach music are as legitimately lute
as the alleged lute works.
Sure, he may have dabbled on a lute in his own collection, but who
knows with what music?  While I own a Viennese ocarina, jaw-harp,
6-hole American cedar flute, chromatic harmonica, etc. there's little
likelihood of me composing music for any of them within my lifetime.
(Granted, I am not anything like a properly trained composer.)
As Titmuss points out, there is some speculation Bach also rented
instruments.  If so, I wouldn't necessarily expect an intimate
compositional familiarity with the pieces in his rental stable.
Eugene
-Original Message-
From: [1]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu
[mailto:[2]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of David Tayler
Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2012 2:17 PM
To: lute
Subject: [LUTE] Re: [LUTE] Re: [LUTE] Bach's Lute Suites: This Myth is
Busted
  Let's see, Bach owned a lute, but didn't play it. Probably used it
for
  a planter.
  In all seriousness, this argument hinges on the idea of an urtext,
  which is simply not tenable for a composer who arranged and
rearranged
  his own works as well as the works of other composers. We don't know
  how Bach--and others--played this music, 

[LUTE] Bach¹s Lute Suites: This Myth is Busted

[Mayes, Joseph]

Another possibility springs to mind: Bach designed and wrote music on the
Lautenwerk because he liked the sound of the lute, but was more comfortable
on a keyboard. Because he sat at one instrument does not mean that he was
not composing for another.
Hard to play? Need a bunch of edits? Most likely the same would have been
true for any piece written for the lute by a non-lutenist.

My $.02

Joseph Mayes


On 4/25/12 2:18 PM, Braig, Eugene brai...@osu.edu wrote:

 While I enjoyed this read, I didn't see anything particularly new here.  For
 example, Hopkinson Smith specifically named all the sources of Bach's original
 lute music in the liner notes he drafted for his recording of this music
 around 30 years ago.  He also stated their evident non-lute provenance.  I
 have heard Paul O'Dette unequivocally state on more than one occasion
 something like Sorry, Bach did not write for the lute.  Etc.  I suspect that
 anybody who is still clinging to the notion that Bach knowingly composed lute
 music after having had some exposure to some reference of the source material
 either really, really wants to believe so to somehow legitimize the lute or is
 a fan of modern classical guitar who wants to somehow legitimize the perceived
 ancestor of his/her own instrument.
 
 Best,
 Eugene
 
 -Original Message-
 From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf
 Of t...@heartistrymusic.com
 Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2012 11:58 AM
 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu; Luca Manassero
 Subject: [LUTE] [LUTE] Bach¹s Lute Suites: This Myth is Busted
 
   A very interesting article.  I can't wait to see the responses from the rest
 of the list!  I am reminded that Walther Gerwig did an arrangement of Bach's
 Cello Suite No.1 in G major, BWV1007.  Very nice and beautifully played - in
 Renaissance tuning!
   Tom
An interesting post:
[1]http://www.classicalguitarcanada.ca/2012/04/bachs-lute-suites-th
is-m yth-is-busted-part-i/ Luca
 
 References
 
1.
http://www.classicalguitarcanada.ca/2012/04/bachs-lute-suites-this-
myth-is-busted-part-i/
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
 
 
 Tom Draughon
 Heartistry Music
 http://www.heartistrymusic.com/artists/tom.html
 714  9th Avenue West
 Ashland, WI  54806
 715-682-9362
 
 
 
 

[LUTE] Re: Jason Petty lutes

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hello

I know and deal with Jason on a regular basis. He indeed lives and works
in New Zealand. 


Joseph Mayes


On 12/1/11 12:29 AM, Adam Olsen arol...@gmail.com wrote:

 I apologize in advance if this is not the correct forum for such a question.
 
 Can any of you who know Jason Petty confirm that he currently resides
 in New Zealand?  I just want to make sure the person I'm talking to is
 not a scammer, and that my money will actually be going to the correct
 place.
 
 Regards,
 
 Adam Olsen
 
 
 
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 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Best wishes to members in distressed areas

[Mayes, Joseph]

Thank you, Roman, for your kind wishes. I am high and dry. Didn't even loose 
power. (One of my fig trees fell over before the storm, however.)

Joe


From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Roman 
Turovsky [r.turov...@verizon.net]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 5:52 PM
To: Edward Mast; Lute List
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Best wishes to members in distressed areas

Lynda's house is well elevated near the Palisades cliffs. She should be
totally OK.
Cezar's house hshould be OK as well, is has some elevation.
Sot sure  where Joe lives.
Irene passed more to the East, some of my friends who live near Princeton
say that things are generally OK in the area.
RT
- Original Message -
From: Edward Mast nedma...@aol.com
To: Lute List lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 5:42 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Best wishes to members in distressed areas


 The news has been showing some very distressing pictures of flooded areas
 in New Jersey and New England.  Three members I can think of in the New
 Jersey area are Cezar Mateus, Lynda Kraar, and Joseph Mayes.  To them -
 and all effected by Irene - I send best wishes and hopes that you've not
 been badly hit by the flooding.

 Ned Mast





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[LUTE] Re: Lute Repair?

[Mayes, Joseph]

This makes no sense. If the repair takes that long, there's something wrong! If 
the maker is too busy to attend to the repair, he should not take the job. This 
all brings Luciano Faria to mind.

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Edward 
Mast [nedma...@aol.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2011 8:19 AM
To: David Smith
Cc: 'brentlynk'; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Lute Repair?

Hello Brent,

I think David's reply is on the mark.  My sense is that lute makers of any 
skill are generally very busy trying to fill orders for new instruments.  While 
feeling obligated to do repair work on instruments they've built, this work is 
secondary to the new work they've contracted for.  As frustrating as it is to 
be without an instrument, I think nothing will be gained by pushing the maker 
about the repairs, though an occasional polite inquiry should be ok.

A recommendation, though, since you rely on your instrument for work; if you 
can possibly afford it get a second instrument.  There are many things that can 
happen to a lute to make it temporarily unplayable.  Having a backup seems 
prudent.

Best wishes,

Ned
On Jun 22, 2011, at 1:52 AM, David Smith wrote:

 Hi Brent,
 I have a little experience in both getting repairs and ordering instruments.
 My experience is that luthiers must juggle many different demands on their
 time and repairs are prioritized amongst all their other demands. One year
 ago I had a bridge on a couple of year old 10 course lute come off. I
 contacted the luthier and fedex'd the lute to him overnight with the
 expectation that the repair could be done quickly. It took around 3 months.
 It was done beautifully and I love the result. I did not pay for it until it
 was finished. The communication of expectations on the other hand was not
 done cleanly. The luthier is a master builder but not necessarily a
 fantastic PR person.

 In the same vain I have an 8 course lute (from a different luthier) that was
 ordered last October with the expectation that it would be available
 sometime around January. In March I was informed that it was almost done and
 paid the remaining amount. I am still waiting. I have discussed this with
 the luthier and there are many reasons why time does not flow as predictably
 as I would like. This is an internationally recognized luthier with a
 fantastic reputation for quality and reliability. I have no complaints
 except that I expect production line timing from a craftsman - the
 expectations do not match and I get to reset my expectations.

 If your luthier is reputable (which I assume he is) then it will happen when
 it happens. I would love it if communication could be clearer but I have not
 seen that. The response you received from the luthier sounds like someone
 under lots of demands and unable or unwilling to provide time estimates.
 This is one of the joys of owning a work of art (and there are really many
 when you consider the living instrument in yours hands created from blocks
 of wood).

 So, while I agree that it is getting near time for your repair to be done
 and you are justified in your desire to have more precision in the responses
 it is not surprising to me.

 I would approach the luthier with understanding of his constraints but also
 continue, on a regular but not bothersome period, to ask for an update.

 I hope my experiences help some.

 Regards
 David

 -Original Message-
 From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf
 Of brentlynk
 Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 5:15 PM
 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
 Subject: [LUTE] Lute Repair?

 Hello,

 I am new to this list, but I have been playing the 10-course lute for a
 couple decades... :-)

 I have a problem and I am not sure how to handle it -- I really need some
 advice and guidance from people who know the lute-world better than I do (I
 play, but am pretty much solo secondary to geographical constraints,
 LOL...).

 I sent my lute off to a reputable luthier (who built it about 15 years
 ago...) for repairing a cracked soundboard and rib, and I have had some
 difficulty getting it back. It has been five months since I sent it in for
 repairs, and the luthier was paid in advance (over $800) for the repairs...

 But when I last asked about getting it back because, like anybody, I want it
 back, and on top of that, I am missing gigs and losing money, the luthier
 simply
 responded: you'll be the first to know when it is finished.

 Well, that response kind of bothered me because I have been so patient and
 the luthier told me that it would be ready soon a couple months ago...

 I realize that everyone is busy, etc...and I want to be a nice guy -- I
 certainly don't want to burn any bridges, etc...(which is why I am not
 mentioning names!). But I am just wondering what an acceptable amount of
 time is for getting such a repair done -- if it is 10 months and 

[LUTE] Re: Stability of lute in playing fast.

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hi Dan

Good to hear from you - we seem to agree. (or is that just a symptom of
a miss spent youth?)

Joe


On 3/31/11 10:07 PM, Daniel Winheld dwinh...@comcast.net wrote:

 Hi Joe-
 
 I'll take that 2¢ and put in my bank account.
 Need all I can get these days- NO SMUDGES ON MY
 LUTES! There are other branches in Lutedom
 besides Orthodox. There is Conservative- finger
 down, but flexible and moves up and down with the
 hand. There is Reform, sometimes off the
 soundboard, sometimes on. I am
 Reconstructionist/Atheist- that little finger is
 out, but mostly no solid contact; a bare touch
 like the feeler gauges on old cars for sensing
 the curb when parking - sometimes light contact
 for fast thumb-index runs for thumb under, and
 off for chordal play. I think it is always off
 when playing thumb out (Baroque  archlute,
 usually also vihuela) but will have to watch
 myself next time to see for sure.
 
 Modern guitars have an elevated fingerboard,
 which puts the top enough further out of reach of
 the fingers to make little finger down a complete
 disaster (at least for me) and the extensive use
 of the 3rd finger means the pinky cannot ever be
 tied down- esp. if the distance from strings to
 soundboard is another 1/2 centimeter or so. Some
 of the pick guards on archtop guitars function as
 much as a platform for the pinky (plectrum
 players) as top protection- location here, as in
 real estate, is everything.
 
 And that's my 2¢ back- don't spend it in one place.
 
 
 I think that the little finger down thing has
 become a religion, these days. It is likely that
 there were as many styles of play as there were
 players in the old times. It's interesting
 that not all surviving instruments have the
 smudge. Were they cleaned up? Were they
 repaired with new soundboards? Were they played
 without that pinky on the face?
 
 Guitarists do not play with the pinky on the
 face and play fairly fast and acurately. It
 seems a somewhat unnecessary bit of the
 Orthodox Lute technique.
 
 Just my $.02
 
 Joseph Mayes
 
 From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu
 [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Herbert
 Ward [wa...@physics.utexas.edu]
 Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2011 12:43 PM
 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
 Subject: [LUTE] Stability of lute in playing fast.
 
 Below I use the word jerk several times.  I suspect
 there may be a more elegant and accurate verb.  If
 so, please excuse me.
 
 A few weeks ago I watched a bluegrass mandolin player.
 This man had won a (Texas?) state bluegrass mandolin
 championship, and, as one might suppose, he could quite
 fast.
 
 In watching him play, I immediately noticed the large
 degree to which his mandolin jerks around (for lack
 of a better phrase) while he's playing, with no tendency
 to jerk less during the fastest and most intricate
 passages, or indeed even during the quieter passages.
 
 This contrasts starkly with my modus operandi, which
 is to stabilize the lute as much as possible, in order
 to give myself a stationary target, especially for
 my right hand.
 
 The obvious explanation for this is to suppose that
 the mandolin player's hands, and in particular his
 right hand, move with the mandolin while he's playing,
 and thus negate the effect of the jerking.  But, in
 playing the lute, my right hand is, more or less,
 glued to the lute in that my little finger rests
 on the soundboard and my forearm rests on the lute's
 edge close to the strap button.
 
 All this leaves me fairly confused.  Do all elite
 lute players keep their little fingers and forearms
 solidly on the lute?  Do they stress this in
 their teaching?  Do they present this as part
 of the technique needed to play fast?  Do any of
 them play with jerking lutes?  Have any of this
 list's readers worked through this issue personally?
 
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
 

[LUTE] Re: Stability of lute in playing fast.

[Mayes, Joseph]

Ah...I knew there would be push-back.

I'm not certain how little finger up became equated with tense wrist and
arm muscles, or how those performers appreciated for their best sound
became those with the little finger down, or how finger down became
associated with volume. I think some stretching is going on, here.

Joseph Mayes



On 3/31/11 10:29 PM, alexander voka...@verizon.net wrote:

 Thinner strings of the earlier lute, lighter tension leave a little chance of
 producing timbrally rich and interesting sound, with any sort of body to it,
 without being able to push away from something. A tense wrist - arm muscles
 are in no way a solution, so grounding the little finger (either quite
 permanently or at the moment of plucking) allows for support while keeping the
 arm relaxed. Anyone who will attempt to produce any sort of volume close to
 the bridge with fingers moving along the string without anchoring against the
 lute plate or the bridge, will realize this immediately. The sound production
 is what counts first of all in use of this unnecessary technique. With the
 later lutes and strings growing in diameter and tension, or the mass (the
 length) somewhat different needs arise. However, even on a guitar of the
 classical period, with its' 7 newtons of tension on the top string, the
 performers being appreciated for the best sound, like Aguado and Giuliani were
 the ones lodging their pinkie to the bridge and the top, respectively. The
 speed and a proper accentuation of the running notes, are just additional
 part of it. They are not determining the need for support. al ray
 
 
 On Thu, 31 Mar 2011 21:36:36 -0400
 Mayes, Joseph ma...@rowan.edu wrote:
 
 I think that the little finger down thing has become a religion, these
 days. It is likely that there were as many styles of play as there were
 players in the old times. It's interesting that not all surviving
 instruments have the smudge. Were they cleaned up? Were they repaired with
 new soundboards? Were they played without that pinky on the face?
 
 Guitarists do not play with the pinky on the face and play fairly fast and
 acurately. It seems a somewhat unnecessary bit of the Orthodox Lute
 technique.
 
 Just my $.02
 
 Joseph Mayes




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[LUTE] Re: Stability of lute in playing fast.

[Mayes, Joseph]

   All of the players who learned to play their instrument with the little
   finger down will agree with you. There is copious evidence for this
   method being used in the 16th and 17th centuries. Early guitar tutors
   also suggest planting the little finger. What I am saying is that it is
   unnecessary, and has little or no beneficial effect on the sound
   produced. Also - it was obviously not universal for lutes, archlutes,
   guitars, what have you.
   Joseph Mayes
   On 4/1/11 6:59 AM, Martyn Hodgson [1]hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk
   wrote:

 You are quite right - your email attached one of Jospeh Mayes to
 whom I should have directed that particular observation. I'm pleased
 you agree the little finger resting on the belly is a necessary part
 of historical lute technique.

 MH
 --- On Fri, 1/4/11, alexander [2]voka...@verizon.net wrote:

 From: alexander [3]voka...@verizon.net
 Subject: [LUTE] Re: Stability of lute in playing fast.
 To: Martyn Hodgson [4]hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk
 Cc: JosephMayes [5]ma...@rowan.edu, Herbert Ward
 [6]wa...@physics.utexas.edu, [7]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
 [8]lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
 Date: Friday, 1 April, 2011, 11:04
 Oh, yes, another thing, how did you come to a conclusion that i am
 arguing against the little finger support while i am arguing that
 only such a support allows to produce a decent sound on a lute?.. al
 ray
 On Fri, 01 Apr 2011 10:05:16 +0100 (BST)
 Martyn Hodgson [9]hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk
 [10]http://uk.mc263.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=hodgsonmartyn@yaho
 o.co.uk  wrote:
 
 Dear Alexander,
 
 What evidence do you have that early lutes (I presume you're
 referring
 to 16th century instruments) were strung at a lower tension
 than
 similar size later lutes?
 
 And what evidence do you have that the tension of a guitar
 around 1800
 was 7 Newtons?
 
 Early evidence on the use of placing the little finger on the
 belly is
 unequivocal - if we wish to attempt to reproduce what the Old
 Ones
 themselves heard it is clearly necessary to adopt the same
 techniques.
 
 MH
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 [11]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

   --

References

   1. file://localhost/net/people/lute-arc/hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk
   2. file://localhost/net/people/lute-arc/voka...@verizon.net
   3. file://localhost/net/people/lute-arc/voka...@verizon.net
   4. file://localhost/net/people/lute-arc/hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk
   5. file://localhost/net/people/lute-arc/ma...@rowan.edu
   6. file://localhost/net/people/lute-arc/wa...@physics.utexas.edu
   7. file://localhost/net/people/lute-arc/lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
   8. file://localhost/net/people/lute-arc/lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
   9. file://localhost/net/people/lute-arc/hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk
  10. http://uk.mc263.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk
  11. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Stability of lute in playing fast.

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hello Louis
You observations seem right to me.

At the end of a three hour set my wrist if fine - my butt hurts.

Joe


On 4/1/11 9:37 AM, Louis Aull aul...@comcast.net wrote:

Hi Joe,
 
 
 
The continued discussion of finger position brought to mind some of the
mechanical aspects of the lute as well as well. Robert Lundberg in his
wonderful book on lute construction insists that the bowls of
historical lutes were shaped down on the sides from in front of the
bridge to the rose to allow more clearance for the strings. I know that
this lowering of the sides could also have been due to repair or
correction of the neck angle. Raising the neck angle without removing
the neck causes the sides of the bowl to bow out and lower slightly.
But in looking at pictures of players hand's and instruments of of all
kinds, guitars, lutes, banjos, a perfectly made instrument may wind up
in the hands of anyone. A bridge low enough to allow the pinky to rest
on the soundboard will find itself torn to shreads by the pick of a
strum player (see Willie Nelson). Perhaps Robert was actually seeing
the truth here. Look at the finger rest that Chet Atkins used to get
the rest point up to his very short pinky, yet keep the clearance for
pick work.
 
 
 
As the necks got longer and peg boxes got heavier, the neck angle
naturally rises to reduce this weight. At 45 degrees, the weight is
half that of 90 degrees. As the neck comes up, the right wrist rotates
to a position more in parallel with the strings and the pinky has a
natural tendancy to come off the sound board. This allows the builder
to raise the bridge to get more sound and protect the soundboard from
pick damage. Lutes in the 18th century tend to have higher bridges.
Once the bridge is raised, it's over for the pinky without a finger
rest or placing the pinky on the bridge. The smudge would have been
left on some strings. (could the smudgeless soundboards have had a Chet
Atkins finger rest?)
 
 
 
At the end of a three hour set, hows your wrist?
 
 
 
Louis Aull
 
Phone: 770.978.1872
 
Fax: 866.496.4294
 
Cell:404.932.1614
 
 
 
--
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Stability of lute in playing fast.

[Mayes, Joseph]

I think that the little finger down thing has become a religion, these days. 
It is likely that there were as many styles of play as there were players in 
the old times. It's interesting that not all surviving instruments have the 
smudge. Were they cleaned up? Were they repaired with new soundboards? Were 
they played without that pinky on the face?

Guitarists do not play with the pinky on the face and play fairly fast and 
acurately. It seems a somewhat unnecessary bit of the Orthodox Lute technique.

Just my $.02

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of 
Herbert Ward [wa...@physics.utexas.edu]
Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2011 12:43 PM
To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [LUTE] Stability of lute in playing fast.

Below I use the word jerk several times.  I suspect
there may be a more elegant and accurate verb.  If
so, please excuse me.

A few weeks ago I watched a bluegrass mandolin player.
This man had won a (Texas?) state bluegrass mandolin
championship, and, as one might suppose, he could quite
fast.

In watching him play, I immediately noticed the large
degree to which his mandolin jerks around (for lack
of a better phrase) while he's playing, with no tendency
to jerk less during the fastest and most intricate
passages, or indeed even during the quieter passages.

This contrasts starkly with my modus operandi, which
is to stabilize the lute as much as possible, in order
to give myself a stationary target, especially for
my right hand.

The obvious explanation for this is to suppose that
the mandolin player's hands, and in particular his
right hand, move with the mandolin while he's playing,
and thus negate the effect of the jerking.  But, in
playing the lute, my right hand is, more or less,
glued to the lute in that my little finger rests
on the soundboard and my forearm rests on the lute's
edge close to the strap button.

All this leaves me fairly confused.  Do all elite
lute players keep their little fingers and forearms
solidly on the lute?  Do they stress this in
their teaching?  Do they present this as part
of the technique needed to play fast?  Do any of
them play with jerking lutes?  Have any of this
list's readers worked through this issue personally?



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[LUTE] Re: Lute humidifiers

[Mayes, Joseph]

Sponge, Dampit, What hast thou? I find an equal amount of danger from
dripping moisturizers as from dryness. I have a room humidifier running
night and day between Oct. and May.

Best,

Joseph Mayes


On 3/7/11 12:17 PM, Edward Mast nedma...@aol.com wrote:

 Any music store will probably carry the type of humidifiers made to fit into
 the sound holes of cellos or violins (basically a perforated plastic tube with
 a sponge inside).  I use one of these and simply place it in the peg box area
 of the case.  I've also tried a kitchen sponge in a baggie, (with some holes
 cut in it), but mildew did build up in the sponge,  so I prefer the violin
 humidifier.  
 
 On Mar 6, 2011, at 9:51 PM, Suzanne Angevine wrote:
 
 Artist sponges made damp and enclosed loosely in a baggie, stuffed in the
 pegbox part of the case are what I've heard of.
 
 Suzanne
 
 On 3/6/2011 5:45 PM, Dan Smith wrote:
Does anyone have any recommendations for a humidifier for lute. Would
appreciate any advice - thanks.
 
--
Dan Smith
Raleigh, NC
 
--
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
 
 
 
 
 

[LUTE] Re: harmonics

[Mayes, Joseph]

Ronn McFarlane encloses the letter in a diamond.

Best,

Joseph Mayes

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Ed 
Durbrow [edurb...@sea.plala.or.jp]
Sent: Friday, January 14, 2011 8:26 AM
To: LuteNet list
Subject: [LUTE] harmonics

   How would one indicate a natural harmonic in French tablature?

   Ed Durbrow
   Saitama, Japan
   [1]http://www9.plala.or.jp/edurbrow/
   [2]http://www.musicianspage.com/musicians/9688/

   --

References

   1. http://www9.plala.or.jp/edurbrow/
   2. http://www.musicianspage.com/musicians/9688/


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[LUTE] Re: Karamazov

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hear, Hear!

From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of 
Christopher Wilke [chriswi...@yahoo.com]
Sent: Sunday, December 05, 2010 10:23 AM
To: Edward Mast; e...@gamutstrings.com; Roman Turovsky; Anthony Hind
Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Karamazov

I find that only people who think of themselves as serious musicians or music 
lovers have a problem with performers moving to the music.  My advice to those 
bothered by what they perceive as someone getting into it too much would be 
either A) Don't look, just listen B) Accept it as an alternative style of 
performance that may not necessarily be your own preference or C) Travel back 
in time to the gallant era when such things mattered (just be sure to avoid 
Mozart, who once broke a shoe because he was stomping along so forcefully to 
the music).  To me, the only way one's movements can really distract from my 
enjoyment of the music is if a performer is missing notes because they're 
flipping their lutes around their necks or something.

No one owns this music, even less the way one chooses to look while playing it.

Chris


Christopher Wilke
Lutenist, Guitarist and Composer
www.christopherwilke.com









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[LUTE] Re: OT: Guitar technique

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hi Dan

The HVL collected edition corrects the obvious note mistakes, but leaves the 
ambiguous (at best) harmonics notation and the original fingering - which is 
sparse, to say the least, and often wrong.

Best Regards,

Joseph Mayes


From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Daniel 
Winheld [dwinh...@comcast.net]
Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2010 5:32 PM
To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [LUTE] OT: Guitar technique

A question for the players of standard modern classical guitar on
this list (I am on no other)- I have not played classical guitar (nor
owned one) since 1975, so don't even know what e-list, forum or
whatever to consult.

Can any of you tell me if there are editions of the collected guitar
works of Villa-Lobos that give detailed, explicit L.H. fingerings
beyond the few hints that Villa-Lobos himself provided? Specifically,
some of the Etudes have passages that are ambiguous to me (Etude #2
especially), and it's been a hell of a long time since I played this
stuff. Some of them I never attempted.

I started playing the Etude #1 by Heitor Villa-Lobos about six weeks
ago for extra practice in thumb-under technique on my new 8 course
lute. (One can run the right hand pattern with any chord, chord
progression, or just open strings for practice, of course). I Have
been captivated completely by this exotic (to me) Brazilian
classical/pop Jungle music- it's very nice vacation from all the
usual repertoires, and so much accessible on the familiar instrument.

Thanks for any help-  Dan
--



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[LUTE] Re: OT: 19th C guitar

[Mayes, Joseph]

I have some experience with both 19th C. guitars and modern classical
guitars. I find the main difference to be in the amount of sustain rather
than the volume. I think this is the result of fan bracing. As Christopher
pointed out, this bracing is not a new thing. 19th C. guitars with fan
bracing - ie some Panormo guitars - tend to sound very much like the modern
classical.
The poster who said that classical guitars will never fill a large hall
(soundwise) is quite correct - but somehow not relevant.

Joseph Mayes


On 11/1/10 10:54 AM, Edward Mast nedma...@aol.com wrote:

 It seems to me that the sound of an instrument should not be considered
 without considering the music it's playing.  Composers generally are very
 aware of the sound of the instrument(s) for which they're writing.  Some
 transcriptions work well, but many (in my opinion) don't.  The modern
 classical guitar has repertory in which it sounds natural and very satisfying.
 Other repertory - written for lute or other instruments - does not sound
 natural or satisfying played on the guitar (again, in my opinion).   Of course
 this has to do not only with the different sounds of the instruments, but with
 the techniques employed in playing them.   And so on with all instruments.
 On Nov 1, 2010, at 10:22 AM, Bruno Correia wrote:
 
   Christopher,
 
 
 
   I agree entirely with your coments. Classical guitars are very tense
   instruments, nails are required if you want to play with good volume.
   Btw they never fill a big hall (soundwise)...
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
   2010/11/1 Christopher Wilke [1]chriswi...@yahoo.com
 
 There are a lot of myths in the guitar community about how and why
 the modern instrument came about.  The thought that the modern
 guitar is to the 19th century guitar what the modern piano is to a
 fortepiano has been repeated so often that people believe it.
 A modern classical guitar is not at all loud.  Try comparing the
 sound of a 19th century guitar without nails to a modern guitar
 played without nails.  The 19th century guitar will not only sound
 louder, but balanced (assuming the guitar is decent).  The modern
 guitar will sound weak and muddy with a very boomy bass and
 virtually no treble definition.  The 19th century guitar is
 therefore actually the louder of the two instruments.
 The key ingredient to the modern guitar's sound is fingernails.  I
 believe that in order to get more volume, performers started playing
 standard 19th century guitars with nails, but found the sound
 unpleasantly strident.  (Aguado, for example, used nails.  His duo
 partner, Sor, however, did not.)  The solution came in making a
 bigger body, which did not add volume in itself - it merely mellowed
 out the tone to allow for nail playing.  Fan bracing was also used
 to make the timbre less pingy, but this was nothing new; it had been
 used on baroque lutes long before.  All of these developments took
 place with gut strings.  Nylon strings came about post-WWII and
 allowed for greater string tension and more forceful playing.
 I personally enjoy the sound of a modern classical.  It makes a
 beautiful and effective solo instrument.
 Chris
 Christopher Wilke
 Lutenist, Guitarist and Composer
 [2]www.christopherwilke.com
 
   --- On Mon, 11/1/10, Jelma van Amersfoort [3]jel...@gmail.com wrote:
 From: Jelma van Amersfoort [4]jel...@gmail.com
 Subject: [LUTE] Re: OT: 19th C guitar
 To: Suzanne Angevine [5]suzanne.angev...@gmail.com
 Cc: Lute List [6]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu
 
 Date: Monday, November 1, 2010, 4:28 AM
 
 I think making the body bigger
 doesn't automatically make the guitar
 louder. It mostly emphasizes the lower
 harmonics/fundamentals and the
 bass side of the guitar. I think they were after a
 different (darker,
 more homogenous) timbre rather than a louder sound, in the
 late 19th
 and early 20th century. Is a very interesting question, but
 also hard
 because there are so many different styles of guitar making
 in that
 time.
 
 Early 19th century guitars work as well in halls as modern
 classical
 guitars, I find, but by different means: they (most of
 them) seem to
 be more treble-like, and more 'piercing' compared to (most)
 modern
 classical guitars.
 
 Hartelijke groeten, Jelma van Amersfoort
 
 
 
 
 
 On Sun, Oct 31, 2010 at 5:24 PM, Suzanne Angevine
 
 [7]suzanne.angev...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 In that same excellent concert the second half was
 played on a replica of a
 19th century guitar, the kind with a smaller body and
 simple lute-like
 barring.  I'm struck by how beautiful, bright, and
 clear the sound of these
 instruments is, especially when playing music from
 that period. (I heard a
 fine Carulli  sonata.)
 
 So what were builders and players after that they made
 the body bigger and
 the barring stronger on modern classical guitars?
 
 Suzanne
 
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list 

[LUTE] Re: In My Life

[Mayes, Joseph]

Ed

You are a man of parts. I'm happy to know you.

Joseph Mayes


On 10/21/10 12:45 AM, Edward Martin e...@gamutstrings.com wrote:

 Dear ones,
 
 I received the transcription from Tom.  He did a beautiful job, and I
 tweaked it a bit.  But, it works beautifully.
 
 The reason I asked if anyone on the list had this piece is
 thus:  every year, for the past 25 years, I have performed in a
 service, sponsored by the Grief Support Center at SMDC, a large
 medical center.  I just returned from the gig.  This service is a
 remembrance for families and loved ones of children who have
 died;  needless to say, it is a very emotionally charged event, and
 beautifully done.  I usually perform renaissance lute pieces for
 it.  While contemplating this event, yesterday, I stumbled upon a you
 tube video of Jake Shimabukuro, on ukulele -
 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aaQhbqkCe0Afeature=related.  I was
 taken by how beautiful this was on a ukulele, and I immediately
 considered doing this piece in the service (of course, on lute).
 
 Needless to say, Tom Draghon came to the rescue, as I hadn't the time
 to transcribe the piece, and asked if anyone had it.  After receiving
 it from Tom, I performed it with little preparation, and it went so
 well.  That piece seemed to touch many emotions, and there were so
 many who thanked me for it, as they felt it was the perfect piece for
 such an event.
 
 Thanks, Tom!
 
 ed
 
 
 
 
 
 
 Edward Martin
 2817 East 2nd Street
 Duluth, Minnesota  55812
 e-mail:  e...@gamutstrings.com
 voice:  (218) 728-1202
 http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1660298871ref=name
 http://www.myspace.com/edslute
 
 
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: In My Life Copyright Issue What is Copyright Infringement?

[Mayes, Joseph]

What occurs to me in all of this is just how far from the spirit of the law,
the letter of the law has gone. The Humble rockers who wrote the beautiful
song are way out of it - We're now talking about the enrichment of suits and
bean-counters. There seems to be a misalignment of the universe when the guy
delivering the ink cartridge to write the contract makes more than the
composer.
There should be a way to protect the rights of artists - not middle-men.

Joseph Mayes


On 10/21/10 8:12 AM, alexander voka...@verizon.net wrote:

 Lute players clearly are not aware of the surrounding world...
 
 http://www.dailytech.com/British+Copyright+Org+Threatens+Singing+Store+Employe
 e+Then+Apologizes/article16592.htm
 
 
 On Thu, 21 Oct 2010 13:41:51 +0200
 wolfgang wiehe wie-w...@gmx.de wrote:
 
 what´s about singing this song on a public place (toilette)?
 is this copyright infringement?
 ;-)
 w
 
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: Lute volume

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hi Chris

I think it means that most composers understand the classical guitar
like a monkey understands a watch. You are right - using a steel strung,
amplified guitar would usually do the trick. Instead the guitarist must
amplify or overplay to the point where true ugliness ensues. String players
do not like to play softly. Perhaps they do not know how.

Joseph Mayes


On 10/20/10 8:45 AM, Christopher Wilke chriswi...@yahoo.com wrote:

 Going in a slightly different direction, I've noticed that in contemporary
 music chamber music concerts involving guitar, the guitar is almost always
 amplified.  This applies to standard repertoire pieces (Boulez, etc.) as
 well as pieces by living composers who are present at the concert and who have
 presumably given their blessing.  I know of no score that specifies amplified
 guitar.  The composers apparently just write notes and expect the performer
 to use whatever means needed to make it heard.  (I've always wondered why they
 continually use the nylon-strung classical guitar with amplifier instead of an
 unamplified steel-string played with a plectrum, which would have the chance
 of being heard.)

 I'm not sure what, if anything, this tells us.  Perhaps if modern composers
 don't really care if you use an amplifier, then therefore...  Am I really
 going to argue for lute amplification in early music settings on the
 assumption that olden composers would have been delighted?  No.  But I do
 think that amplification via playing harder, perhaps closer to the bridge
 and eschewing many of the niceties we do in refined solo playing, is entirely
 appropriate.










 Christopher Wilke
 Lutenist, Guitarist and Composer
 www.christopherwilke.com


 --- On Wed, 10/20/10, Martyn Hodgson hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:

 From: Martyn Hodgson hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk
 Subject: [LUTE] Re: Lute volume
 To: Lute Net lute@cs.dartmouth.edu, Stewart McCoy lu...@tiscali.co.uk
 Date: Wednesday, October 20, 2010, 6:27 AM

Dear Stewart,

It's certainly odd if the amplification
 used for your large scale
social events is used more generally
 which is what you appeared to
suggest by your view that 'if you want
 people to hear what you are
playing, there are times when
 amplification has its uses' ; this might
appear to condone almost anything merely
 on a personal whim.

rgds

Martyn
--- On Wed, 20/10/10, Stewart McCoy
 lu...@tiscali.co.uk
 wrote:

  From: Stewart McCoy lu...@tiscali.co.uk
  Subject: [LUTE] Lute volume
  To: Lute Net lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
  Date: Wednesday, 20 October, 2010,
 10:52

   Dear Martyn,
   The problem with discussions of this
 sort is that we often have
   different things in mind, and the
 thread has covered different kinds
of
   performance.
   I agree that an amplifier would be out
 of place for a HIP
performance
   say for a lute recital in a church,
 but if, for example, you agree
to
   play the lute as background music for
 a social occasion, when people
   are sipping champagne, munching
 canapes, and talking loudly to each
   other, you have to be amplified or you
 won't be heard. My view is
that
   it is better for people to hear and
 enjoy amplified lute music on
such
   occasions, than not hear and not enjoy
 HIP lute music without
   amplification. I don't see anything
 odd about that.
   Best wishes,
   Stewart.
   -Original Message-
   From: Martyn Hodgson [mailto:[1]hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk]
   Sent: 20 October 2010 08:55
   To: Stewart McCoy
   Subject: Re: [LUTE] Lute volume
   Dear Stewart,
   This seems an odd view to me - surely
 if we have any pretensions to
   trying to hear what the early auditors
 heard we ought to eschew such
   electronic amplification - otherwise
 we end up with a sound world
the
   composer could not have reasonable
 expected. If the lute is not
audible
   and the player's skill (and ability to
 play loud - for a lute) is
   undoubted perhaps the difficulty lies
 in the unecessarily raised
volume
   of other parts (vocal and
 instrumental)?
   I think the key is where you say 'if
 you want people to hear what
you
   are playing' .
   yours
   Martyn
   --- On Wed, 20/10/10, Stewart McCoy
 [2]lu...@tiscali.co.uk
 wrote:
 From: Stewart McCoy [3]lu...@tiscali.co.uk
 Subject: [LUTE] Lute volume
 To: Lute Net [4]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu
 Date: Wednesday, 20 October,
 2010, 0:59
   Cher Valery,
   No, it's not HIP to play with
 amplification, but if you want people
to
   hear what you are playing, there are
 times when amplification has
its
   uses. Better to be amplified than not
 heard at all.
   Amities,
   Stewart.
   -Original Message-
   From: [1][5]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu
   

[LUTE] Re: In My Life

[Mayes, Joseph]

Ooo  Me too!  me too!

Joseph Mayes


On 10/19/10 12:54 PM, Edward Martin e...@gamutstrings.com wrote:

 Dear Ones,
 
 Has anyone on the list ever transcribed the old Lennon / Beatles
 tune, In My Life for renaissance tuning?  If so, is anyone willing
 to provide it?
 
 Thanks in advance,
 
 ed
 
 
 
 
 
 Edward Martin
 2817 East 2nd Street
 Duluth, Minnesota  55812
 e-mail:  e...@gamutstrings.com
 voice:  (218) 728-1202
 http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1660298871ref=name
 http://www.myspace.com/edslute
 
 
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: In My Life

[Mayes, Joseph]

For me - solo lute (If you'd ever heard me sing, you wouldn't have to ask)

Joseph Mayes


On 10/19/10 1:34 PM, t...@heartistrymusic.com t...@heartistrymusic.com
wrote:

 Has anyone on the list ever transcribed the old Lennon / Beatles tune,
 In My Life for renaissance tuning?  If so, is anyone willing to
 provide it?
 For solo lute or for lute and voice?
   Tom
 Edward Martin
 2817 East 2nd Street
 Duluth, Minnesota  55812
 e-mail:  e...@gamutstrings.com
 voice:  (218) 728-1202
 http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1660298871ref=name
 http://www.myspace.com/edslute
 
 
 
 
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
 
 
 Tom Draughon
 Heartistry Music
 http://www.heartistry.com/artists/tom.html
 714  9th Avenue West
 Ashland, WI  54806
 715-682-9362
 
 

[LUTE] Re: Carbon strings + Titanium Nylon?

[Mayes, Joseph]

   But, But, But, I would posit that gut trebles, played with a flat
   angle, close to the bridge with some force could sound like carbon /
   titanium played with taste.
   JM
   On 10/6/10 9:05 AM, Martyn Hodgson [1]hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk
   wrote:

 Well, we don't know absolutely - but it would surely be incorrect to
 say we don't have any idea whatsover.

 Certainly we know gut trebles were used and 'titanium nylon' were
 not, which is the point at issue.

 MH

 From: Mayes, Joseph [2]ma...@rowan.edu
 Subject: [LUTE] Re: Carbon strings + Titanium Nylon?
 To: Edward Martin [3...@gamutstrings.com, Martyn Hodgson
 [4]hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk, Anthony Hind
 [5]agno3ph...@yahoo.com
 Cc: [6]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu [7]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu
 Date: Wednesday, 6 October, 2010, 13:04
 Just to be contrary, I should point out that we have no idea how
 lutes
 sounded. Admittedly, carbon fiber was not all that prevalent in the
 renaissance.
 Joseph Mayes
 On 10/6/10 7:37 AM, Edward Martin [8...@gamutstrings.com
 [9]http://uk.mc263.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to...@gamutstrings.com
   wrote:
  Thanks for the note, Marytn.  I agree with you, totally.  For the
  most part, I have played gut exclusively for the past 18 years or
 so,
  as the sound is so beautiful, not to mention that it _is_ the way
  lutes sounded.
 
 
  ed
 
 
 
 
  At 02:01 AM 10/6/2010, Martyn Hodgson wrote:
 
 
 Dear Anthony,
 
 This seems a very retrograde step. Surely if we are wishing to
 hear
 something even approaching how the Old Ones sounded we ought
 to
 eschew treble strings which are so very different from what
 they had.
 Clearly gut was generally used for trebles and there's no
 reason to
 suppose their density has changed significantly since then -
 in short a
 material close to gut, if not gut, ought to be our goal for
 these
 strings rather than significantly lower density, and hence
 thicker (and
 plummier sounding), strings.
 
 Of course it's quite possible these particular players to
 which you
 refer don't wish to try and achieve this sort of sound and
 quite like
 the modern guitar type tone..
 
 regards
 
 M.
 --- On Tue, 5/10/10, Anthony Hind [10]agno3ph...@yahoo.com
 [11]http://uk.mc263.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=agno3ph...@yahoo.c
 om  wrote:
 
   From: Anthony Hind [12]agno3ph...@yahoo.com
 [13]http://uk.mc263.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=agno3ph...@yahoo.c
 om 
   Subject: [LUTE] Re: Carbon strings + Titanium Nylon?
   To: Edward Martin [14...@gamutstrings.com
 [15]http://uk.mc263.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to...@gamutstrings.co
 m 
   Cc: [16]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu
 [17]http://uk.mc263.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=l...@cs.dartmouth.
 edu
   Date: Tuesday, 5 October, 2010, 14:24
 
Dear Ed and All
  For the reason you state below :
%
  The density of carbon is so much
  more than gut, therefore a smaller size is appropriate, around a
 0.38
  or so. Because of the need for a smaller diameter, the sound is
  certainly more sharp sounding.
 
  ed
%
two lutenists on the French list, who have adopted
 synthetic strings
for their stability, (rather than just for their low cost),
 and who
 are
ready to experiment to achieve the sound they are looking
 for, have
adopted very low density Titanium Nylon fishing lines for
 their top
strings, which they claim give a thicker, and therefore,
 sweeter
 warmer
sounding top string for the same tension, compared to high
 density
 KF
carbon (which they use for their Meanes) or even compared
 to
 slightly
higher density nylon.
%
They liked the sound of the old nylgut (with its density
 close to
 gut),
but claimed that it tended to break too easilly (which
 presumably
 has
been resolved with the latest version)..
%
In fact, they were looking for a sound similar to that
 which is
achieved with titanium nylon guitar strings, but these do
 not exist
 in
diameters suitable for the lute.
It would seem that such a string can be found in a suitable
 diameter
(0,35 to 0,50) in fishing line, under the name, Nylon
 Powerline
Titanium; but there is also Asari Falcon titanium G2, which
 might be
suitable.
(for those interested these are special fishing lines for
 surf

[LUTE] Re: look what the cat brought in

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hauntingly beautiful!!

Joseph Mayes


On 9/14/10 2:51 PM, David van Ooijen davidvanooi...@gmail.com wrote:

 And yet another day at the office (ignoring 11 and 10's by the way ;-).
 
 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exZD0zyT818
 
 David
 
 (And what is Olivia Newton John doing in the suggestions menu?)




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http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Castelfranco

[Mayes, Joseph]

OOPS!!

The correct link for the Castelfranco Ms. is: 
http://www.editionsorphee.com/assorted_items/castelfranco.html
Please disregard previous posting.

Joseph Mayes


From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Anton 
Höger [diwa-animat...@t-online.de]
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 12:30 PM
To: Lute List
Subject: [LUTE] Hans Leo Hassler Canzonen

Hi,

I have uploaded 3 new Lute duets for 2 equal lutes


Hassler, Hans Leo - Canzon II
Hassler, Hans Leo - Canzon IV
Hassler, Hans Leo - Canzon V


Enjoy

Anton


lute list

2 Lauten 10-chörig
http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=2ff9bbd6c00cf4bce5c3dee5769931ec581ba18fc46fe28aa7b01fe6e4055ae3

Arresti, Floriano - Ricercare

2 Lauten ad Quartam
http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=2ff9bbd6c00cf4bce5c3dee5769931ece85bafcec95ed4d2947708e37b913e74

Agricola, Alexander - De tous bien plaine
anonym - J'ay prins amours
Banchieri - Suonata Prima
Buchner - Tandernack
Cabezon - Tiento 1 del Primer Tono
Cabezon - Tiento 6 del Primer Tono
Cabezon - Tiento 8 del Cuarto Tono
Cabezon - Tiento 9 del Quinto Tono
Caurroy, Eustache du - Fantasie 31
Cavazzoni, Girolamo - Canzon sopra Falt D'Argens
Cima, Giovanni Paolo - Canzon 14
Bull - Doctor Bull's my selfe
Farnaby, Giles - Spagnoletta
Grillo, Giovanni Battista - Canzona
Hassler - Canzon 20
Inglott, William - The Leaves be greene
Maschera - Canzon-La Mazzuola
Pellegrini, Vincenzo - La Capricciosa
Robin, Munday-Robin
Thomas Lupo - Masque 2

2 Lauten ad secundam
http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=2ff9bbd6c00cf4bce5c3dee5769931ec1dfabc6e2bda0fe2a601da0f25e869f4

Antegnati - Canzon Nona La Battera
Cabezon - Diferencias sobre la Gallarda Milanesa
Cabezon - Quaeramus (Mouton)
Cabezon - Tiento 3 del Primer Tono
Cima, Giovanni Paolo - Canzon 1
Cima, Giovanni Paolo - Canzon 4
Cima, Giovanni Paolo - Canzon 10
Decapella-Ung soir Guillot
Gabrieli, Andrea - Rricercar del 12 tono
Gabrielli, Giovanni - Canzon Terza
Giles Farnaby - Mask
Maschera-Canzon 04
Maschera - Canzon XII

2 Lauten Unisono
http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=2ff9bbd6c00cf4bce5c3dee5769931ec4cc8e15564edcfa13e34c0a955f98962

Ammerbach - Chi passa per questa strada
Anonym - La Corrente Balletto Francese
Anonym - The Woods so wild
Anonym -La Spagna
Banchieri - Fantasia secunda
Byrd - Monsieurs Alman
Cabezon - Si par suffrir
Cabezon - Tiento 2 del Primer Tono
Cabezon - Tiento 5 del Primer Tono
Cabezon - Tiento 7 del Cuarto Tono
Cabezon - Tiento del Primer Tono
Caurroy, Eustache du - Fantasie 9
Cavaccio, Giovanni - Canzona-La Foresta
Cavazzoni, Girolamo - Canzon sopra Il belle bon
Cavazzoni, Girolamo - Recercar 2
Compère, Loyset - O bone Jesu
Compère, Loyset - Scaramelle fa la galle
Erbach - Canzon 8
Farnaby, Giles - His Humor
Farnaby, Giles - loth to depart
Ghizeghem-Anonimus - De tous biens plaine
Guami Gioseffo - Canzon La Guamina
Gussago - Sonata 7 La Sguizzerotta
Hassler, Hans Leo - Canzon I
Hassler, Hans Leo - Canzon II
Hassler, Hans Leo - Canzon IV
Hassler, Hans Leo - Canzon V
Janequin - Le Chant Des Oyseaux
Johnson - Johnsons Medley
Lauder, James - Mylord Pavin
Macque, Giovanni de - Canzon 4
Monte, Philipp de - Fantasia sopra que me servent
Morton - Nʹaray je jamais mieulx que jʹay
Mouton, Jean - Canzon in c
Naich, Ubert - Che Giova Saettar
Palestrina - 8 Ricercari
Passereau-Il est bel et bon
Reade, Richard - Pavan  Galiarde
Schmid d. J.- Anchor che col partire
Schmid d. J. - Bella d'amor
Soderino, Agostino - La Brivia
Schmid, Bernhard d. Ä.- Ung gai bergier
Tomkins - In Nomine
Vila, Pere Albert - Tiento 1
Vila, Pere Albert - Tiento 2
Ward-Duo (2Lyra Viols)
Wert - Era il Belviso suo
Willaert -Motette-Dulcis


3 Lauten a,a,g-Laute
http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=2ff9bbd6c00cf4bce5c3dee5769931ecad2b71be7ffe8c9aa7b01fe6e4055ae3

MPC - Passameze (CCLXXXVI)


3 Lauten ad Quartam
http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=2ff9bbd6c00cf4bce5c3dee5769931ec03da445f908cb26a79b5ba589d1986ba

Biancardius, Franciscus - Laudate Dominum
Engelmann, Georg - Galliarda Sunon
Jenkins - Fantasia No.7
Lasso - Lagrime di San Pietro 1
linkliste ganzer Ordner
Monte - I begl'occhi und'io
Schein, Johann Hermann - Canzon 24

3 Lauten für a,g,d-Laute
http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=2ff9bbd6c00cf4bce5c3dee5769931ec36081df009b8685064328c9cace34742

Anonymus - Barafostus Dreame
Cabezon - Diferencias sobre el Canto del Cavarello
Franzoni, Amante - Canzona
Ghiselin - La Spagna
Malvezzi, Cristofano - Sinfonia a 6
Senfl, Ludwig - Das Geläut zu Speyer


3 Lauten Unisono-Einstimmig (single line)
http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=2ff9bbd6c00cf4bce5c3dee5769931ec399dcfc9ef2dc4b49d4bfef7ef5beeff

Bull, John In Nomine
Byrd 3 Fantasie a3
Caurroy-Fantasie-30
Caurroy-Vingtneufiesme Fantasie
Gibbons, Orlando - Fantasien
Lasso-Domine, non est exaltatum cor meum
Lasso-Haec quae ter triplici
Lupo - Fantasia
Lupo - Pavan-1
Lupo - Pavan-2
Lupo - Pavan-3
Morley, Thomas - Canzonets-for-3-Voices
Nola (da) Giovanni -Chi la Galiard
Ruffo-La desperata

[LUTE] Castelfranco Ms.

[Mayes, Joseph]

Greetings from exotic New Jersey.

I just returned from the Guitar Foundation of America's convention in Austin, 
TX where I got to hear some fine lute playing by Ronn Mcfarlane and pick up a 
volume of heretofore unknown to me lute music. It is the recently published 
Castelfranco Manuscript.

This is a vary handsome hardbound volume of commentary, reset (Italian 
tablature) lute music, and guitar transcriptions of same by the Italian 
guitarist/scholar Alberto Mesirca. It's not inexpensive, but I think it worth 
the money to have in my library. You can get it through: 
http://www.facebook.com/l/d6abekFRe7XHZQgircIwlqJvMoA;www.editionsorphee.com/assorted_items/castelfranco.html;

Best regards,

Joseph Mayes



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[LUTE] Re: Airlines and Intruments

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hi Ned

What you need is a dandy little renaissance guitar. It's sometimes mistaken for 
a lunch box.

Joseph


From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Edward 
Mast [nedma...@aol.com]
Sent: Friday, July 16, 2010 5:08 PM
To: Benjamin Narvey
Cc: lute-cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Airlines and Intruments

Thinking ahead to 2011, I hope to attend the Lute Society Seminar, traveling by 
plane.  At least one person has said that he never has had a  problem with 
being allowed to carry his instrument onto the plane with him, checking it in 
at the gate (this is assuming a smallish Renaissance lute  case).  Have others 
here found that they have been able to do this?  Or not been allowed to do this?

Ned
On Jul 16, 2010, at 12:46 PM, Benjamin Narvey wrote:

 You may like this as well:

 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YGc4zOqozo

 (-;



 --
 Dr Benjamin A. Narvey
 Institute of Musical Research
 School of Advanced Study
 University of London
 t +33 (0) 1 44 27 03 44
 p/m +33 (0) 6 71 79 98 98
 Site web/Website: www.luthiste.com



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 http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[LUTE] Re: P.C. stringing

[Mayes, Joseph]

I see that this thread has reached a new bottom. :-)


On 5/5/10 9:29 AM, Roman Turovsky r.turov...@verizon.net wrote:

 There are kosher non-commestibles, such as kosher toilet tissue. so I
 suspect
 things once-eaten could also be so..
 
 Another question comes to mind is whether normally kosher strings handled by
 a notoriously promiscuous lutenist become unkosher, due to american
 vernacular usage of pork.
 
 RT
 
 
 
 - Original Message -
 From: Daniel Shoskes kidneykut...@gmail.com
 To: gary digman magg...@sonic.net
 Cc: lutelist lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
 Sent: Wednesday, May 05, 2010 9:08 AM
 Subject: [LUTE] Re: P.C. stringing
 
 
   The rules of Kashrut apply only to what is eaten. It is Kosher to
   play with a football made from pigskin or to inject pig derived
   insulin. There ARE guidelines within Jewish law for the ethical
   treatment of animals and avoidance of unnecessary pain or suffering
   (including when they are killed for food or other uses (like
   strings)).
 
   Danny
   On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 5:38 AM, gary digman [1]magg...@sonic.net
   wrote:
 
 Many tmes in concert I've been asked to talk a little about the
 lute. When I explain that the strings are made from sheep
 intestines, a noticeable gasp arises from the audience, but I defuse
 the situation by explaining that we are not killing lambs to make
 strings, we are killing lambs to eat them. So have a nice rack of
 lamb or lamb stew...we need more strings!.
 Gary
 - Original Message - From: Leonard Williams
 [2]arc...@verizon.net
 To: Lute List [3]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu
 Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2010 2:40 PM
 Subject: [LUTE] P.C. stringing
 
 Please don't anyone be offended by this inquiry about strings and
 personal
 philosophy!
 1.  Is there such a thing as Kosher gut strings?  Or does the
 requirement
 apply only to ingestibles?
 2.  How do vegetarians feel about gut strings?
 I ask because, in retrospect of a gut-strung hurdy-gurdy
 presentation I gave
 at an elementary school, I realize that those were some possible kid
 questions I was not prepared to deal with.  Frankly, I'm not sure
 how much I
 should have told them about sausage casings and gut strings had they
 asked!
 I was blessed with a very short time allotment.
 Thanks and regards,
 Leonard Williams
 To get on or off this list see list information at
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[LUTE] Re: CD Dall'Aquila

[Mayes, Joseph]

I am having some confusion about the reportedly bad sound on POD's
latest CD. The feeling being poor Paul, he deserves the best and look what
some club-eared engineer has done to him.
Does Paul not have some input into things like the sound of his
recording?

Joseph Mayes


On 3/30/10 2:25 PM, David Tayler vidan...@sbcglobal.net wrote:

 Is there a one stop shopping for for Aquila's music scores?
 I'm in a buying mood.
 Sorry about the CD sound, I guess there are no refunds.
 I suppose we could send a group letter, making it
 very clear of course that the engineering is the
 issue, and that Paul deserves the best.
 dt
 
 At 07:05 AM 3/29/2010, you wrote:
 Here the recording is in a castle, not in a church, near the city of Aquila,
 Italy. But there was perhaps more suitable rooms in the castle ?
 It's a pity because Dall'Aquila's music is beautiful(and Paul's playing too)
 V.
 
 -Message d'origine-
 De : Monica Hall [mailto:mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk]
 Envoyé : lundi 29 mars 2010 15:56
 À : Valéry Sauvage
 Cc : Lutelist
 Objet : Re: [LUTE] Re: CD Dall'Aquila
 
 
 I agree with you.   I listened to a few tracks and was appalled.   It's as
 if they had recorded it in the local swimming baths.
 
 There is this tendency to use churches for recording this repertoire -
 possibly because churches (in England at least) charge less than other
 venues.  Most of them are completely inappropriate and unsuitable.
 
 What a shame for Paul.
 
 Monica
 
 
 - Original Message -
 From: Valéry Sauvage sauvag...@orange.fr
 To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
 Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 1:42 PM
 Subject: [LUTE] Re: CD Dall'Aquila
 
 
 It seems to me the CD is worst (but I'm listenint to the web page on a
 computer with poor speakers cutting high frequencies) CD, on a good hifi
 player, treble are really agressive. Like if it was played on a metal strung
 instrument (but not a soft orpharion, Alas...) and also a cathedral effect,
 like a bad computer reverb effect.
 But I would like others opinion if some had the CD (On the French list there
 is another bad opinion)
 V.
 
 -Message d'origine-
 De : Andrew White
 Envoyé : lundi 29 mars 2010 13:57
 À : Valery Sauvage
 Objet : Re: [LUTE] CD Dall'Aquila
 
 
 Val,
 
 Does the CD sound better, worse of the same as the tracks on the webpage?
 
 http://www.harmoniamundi.com/#/albums?view=playlistsid=1456
 
 It sounds to me like the microphone is at the back of a hall
 
 Andrew
 
 On 29/03/2010, at 9:03 PM, Valery Sauvage wrote:
 
   I just receive the last CD by Paul O'Dette, of Dall'Aquila's music at
   Harmonia Mundi.
 
   I'm afraid it is really bad. Not Paul's playing (excellent as usual)
   but sound recording is really not audible (is it the right word ?)
   Trebles are aggressive, bass mixed in a soap sound... The booklet says
   it is the historical place where it was recorded that is very much
   reverberant... Why did they choose this place ? even if it was not
   possible to record in the church in Aquila where the plan to do first,
   but can't because of the earthquake.
 
   I send a mail to Harmonia Munid, to ask them to take this out of sell
   and make a new one on the usual standard... (and to ask my money back
   !)
 
   Other opinions ?
 
   Val L
 
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[LUTE] Re: Modern lute recordings

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hi Chris

Your points are well-taken, however why should the mike hear what the live 
listener can not?

Joseph Mayes


From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of 
chriswi...@yahoo.com [chriswi...@yahoo.com]
Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2010 10:44 AM
To: Daniel Shoskes; Arto Wikla
Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Modern lute recordings

(Back to commercial recordings, not folks' 'tube submissions)

In my view, if you notice the reverb, its too much.

I'm also a big advocate of close miking.  This is another thing that is 
especially appropriate for a soft instrument like the lute, but is rarely done. 
 Its funny, I've done a fair amount of recording with LOUD rock bands where the 
philosophy is to get the cleanest example from each instrument by putting the 
mics right on the amps or drums.

Name the last movie you've seen that featured a scene with characters 
whispering in which the sound engineer decided it would be a good idea to 
record in a warehouse with mics on the other side of the room.  (Hhhhere's 
thh seecccret-t-t-t iiiorrrmatio yyyoouuu 
annnt-t-t-ed-ed-ed.  Wwwwat-t-t-t?)  How ridiculous would that sound?


--- On Wed, 3/17/10, Arto Wikla wi...@cs.helsinki.fi wrote:

 From: Arto Wikla wi...@cs.helsinki.fi
 Subject: [LUTE] Re: Modern lute recordings
 To: Daniel Shoskes kidneykut...@gmail.com
 Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
 Date: Wednesday, March 17, 2010, 2:23 AM
 Hi Danny and the List,

 The sound of that tubing is really very natural, and I
 cannot hear any extra reverb, either. And very nice and
 relaxed playing, too!

 All the best,

 Arto


 Daniel Shoskes wrote:
 I've posted several times the processing
 I use, based on the
 recommendation of my sound engineer
 uncle. I apply an inverted smile
 EQ and if I am recording in my small
 office, I add a small amount of
 reverb (if I am alone in the house and
 can record in the big living
 room the reverb is not necessary). The
 inverted smile corrects for
 inadequacies in the response of the mic.
 I was once recorded with a
 $15,000 mic and that led me to believe
 that cheaper mic+EQ is very
 close to the reality captured by the
 expensive mic and therefore that
 the EQ isn't cheating. In my most
 recent recording, using a superior
 mic (but not in the thousands of dollars)
 I thought the sound was much
 better and only the tiniest adjustment
 (taking down the highest and
 lowest bands in the EQ) was needed:
 
 [1]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b2w15WCzoWY
 Danny
 (not a lute hero but a regular
 y-tuber)
  



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[LUTE] Re: Modern lute recordings

[Mayes, Joseph]

Not to be argumentative, but...

A) you will also rarely listen to any performer with your ear pressed up 
against the strings. The very nature of recording subtracts ambience, what they 
call room and gives you a rather unrealistic notion of what's going on

[LUTE] Re: Protecting top of instrument

[Mayes, Joseph]

Hello Ned
There is a product called Kling-on made for guitarists to protect the top
from flamenco techniques. It is like a tap plate but is held in place by
static cling rather than a sticky and un-undoable glue. Stringsbymail.com
sells it by the sheet.
Or you could think, Why would anyone play with his/her little finger on
the soundboard in the first place? (To sound just like the paintings?)

Joseph Mayes


On 3/10/10 11:01 AM, nedma...@aol.com nedma...@aol.com wrote:

Aside from the precaution of keeping one's fingernails trimmed to
minimize wear on a lute top, is there anything to do if a top already
has substantial wear, to protect against further wear?  I'm thinking in
terms of something like a clear varnish over the worn area.  Has anyone
found something that works without negatively effecting the sound?  And
also doesn't look bad?
 
 
 
Ned
 
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[LUTE] Re: Liuto forte

[Mayes, Joseph]

 __

   ALL guitarists with brains get sick of their repertoire, eventually.
   I want to respect you, Roman - I do! I read your posts with interest
   and even glance at your neo-baroque compositions from time to time. But
   then you make some knuckle-dragger type statement like that and I'm
   back to square one.



   I suppoes it's natural to resent a more succesful, wealthier, and more
   accomplished cousin - but can't you keep that resentment off of the
   list?



   Joseph Mayes

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[LUTE] Re: Luciano Faria

[Mayes, Joseph]

   I understand. Because we ordered instruments in good faith from a
   supposed reputable builder, it is some how our fault. Thank you for
   clearing that up.

   Joseph Mayes
 __

   From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu on behalf of Luca Manassero
   Sent: Tue 12/15/2009 3:17 AM
   To: LuteNet list
   Subject: [LUTE] Re: Luciano Faria

   Dear LuteList friends,
   I know that my answer could start an infinite flame, but after
   reading all these angry messages I feel I'd like to comment.
   Of course I feel sympathetic with all of you, having lost your money
   and
   waiting for an answer whatsoever, but let me point out the following:
   - there are plenty of lutemakers in the US and in other parts of the
   world. Lutemakers with a very strong reputation and (often) reasonable
   waiting lists;
   - so why you placed an order to a good lutemaker living in a very
   distant country? I guess mainly because this good lutemaker was
   cheaper.
   - Money gain always comes at risk: the higher the gain, the bigger the
   risk, usually.
   Everybody can take the consequences of all this.
   I do not want to suggest anything so tragic, but for what we all know
   he
   could be dead, and (as far as I know) there's no internet available
   THERE.
   Sorry, but I felt telling you. For the future check that very good
   lutemaker near you, or one of the many located in Europe and not
   necessarily disappearing with your deposit(s).
   Luca
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[LUTE] Re: luciano faria

[Mayes, Joseph]

   I wouldn't recommend this luthier to anyone!! I have three instruments
   ordered - one completely paid for - that are at least three years
   overdue. I finally reached him by phone and he told me he had no idea
   when I would get my instruments. I then asked for my money back. He
   said that was not possible either. What's left for me to do? Interpol?
   Instead of ordering a guitar from Luciano, just send him the money. It
   will save you a bunch of unrewarding anticipation and amount to the
   same thing.

   Find another luthier!!!

   Best,

   Joseph Mayes
 __

   From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu on behalf of THOMAS GEORGI
   Sent: Wed 12/9/2009 10:03 AM
   To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
   Subject: [LUTE] luciano faria

   Is there anybody who can recommend Luciano Faria or has experience
  ordering an instrument from him? I am considering order a vaboam
   guitar
  from him.
  Thanks, Tom Georgi
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[LUTE] Re: Edward Martin/who knows?

[Mayes, Joseph]

   Quite right, Dana, but if memory serves Milan introduces the 6 Pavanas
   by saying that the next six fantasias are pavanas. The there's the
   problem of pavans being generally in duple and some of the Milan
   pavanas are in triple.

   With deep and abiding respect,


   Joseph Mayes
 __

   From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu on behalf of dem...@suffolk.lib.ny.us
   Sent: Wed 8/26/2009 5:39 PM
   To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
   Subject: [LUTE] Re: Edward Martin/who knows?

By the way, Milan himself wrote that the Pavans, at any
rate, can be repeated- even three times if one wishes.
   Fantsia is a different beast than a Pavan.  Pavan is a dance piece, the
   size of the room used by the dancers for their procession dictates how
   much music will be needed, sometimes it is good for the band to have a
   sequence of pavans ready; perhaps even special pieces for particular
   personages in the procession.
   A fantasia is a work of art music, some art on the part of the
   performer
   is expected.  This includes the possibility of repeated sections;
   however,
   I would expect some kind of embellishment on such repeats.
   --
   Dana Emery
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[LUTE] more Luciano

[Mayes, Joseph]

   Once more let me admonish anyone thinking of ordering a lute from
   Luciano Faria - I am still waiting for my instruments - A fully-paid
   for theorbo and deposits on two other lutes that are all about three
   years late!

   He doesn't answer emails, phone calls, or (I'm thinking) smoke signals.
   I am out thousands of dollars. I can think of no remedy for me, but I
   will keep sounding these warnings to all and sundry: DON'T DO IT!!!

   Joseph Mayes
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[LUTE] Re: octave tuning

[Mayes, Joseph]

   Hi Ned

   Yes, he (I) did know more about the particular set up on this lute than
   Dana, who has never seen the instrument. However, Dana makes a valid
   point in that you can certainly tone down the octaves on any instrument
   by lowering the tension.

   I play thumb-out - always. The stringing that was on the lute when you
   received it allowed me to play all courses without worrying about the
   break. If you're going to play thumb-under, or even if you play
   thumb-out with a different angle of attack than mine, you may find that
   your results call for another stringing schedule.

   There seem to be as many ways to play this instrument as players. I
   consider the experimentation necessary to find your own path, wealth -
   one of the great things about playing an instrument that is relatively
   free of dogma.

   Keep on plucking.

   Joseph Mayes
 __

   From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu on behalf of nedma...@aol.com
   Sent: Wed 7/8/2009 3:44 PM
   To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
   Subject: [LUTE] octave tuning

  Dana made mention of the issue of size of strings and tension
   effecting
  the relative balance of the sound of the octaves.  I honestly don't
  know much yet about this issue - will have to become more familiar
   with
  it.  Prior to my getting this instrument, it was played by
  a professional performer.  I would assume he knew more about this
  issue when setting it up.
  By the way, in responding to posts here, is it generally done by
  responding to the whoe group rather than the individual sender?  Or
  perhaps it depends upon the post. . .
  Ned
__
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[LUTE] Re: First lute advice

[Mayes, Joseph]

   I know I am sticking my neck way out here, but I thought I'd throw in
   my 2 cents - let the flames begin!

   As I see it, in the early days of both lute and guitar, the technique
   was largely the same: thumb-under, pinky on the soundboard, etc. As
   time passed, and both music and the technique to play that music
   evolved, lute technique moved toward what purists consider Guitar
   technique that is, thumb-out, alternating between index and middle,
   etc. The guitar continued in an almost unbroken chain of development to
   the present day, while the lute, its players and its music went away.
   Ergo, one can think of modern guitar technique as evolved lute
   technique. There is no difference in lute set-up to use guitar
   technique. I have never heard of a luthier being asked to accommodate a
   different style of play in the string spacing at the bridge. Unless Ed
   Durbrow was thinking of plectrum playing - then I must admit complete
   ignorance.

   Best Regards,

   Joseph Mayes
 __

   From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu on behalf of Michael
   Sent: Mon 6/15/2009 12:50 PM
   To: Lute list
   Subject: [LUTE] Re: First lute advice

   On Fri, Jun 12, 2009 at 1:20 AM, Ed Durbrowedurb...@sea.plala.or.jp
   wrote:
If you are a guitarist, one has to ask if you are planning on playing
   with guitar technique or plan on learning lute technique. This makes a
   difference for the spacing of the courses at the bridge.
   Could someone please address this issue in more detail?  What does it
   mean to play a lute with a guitar technique?
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[LUTE] Re: review

[Mayes, Joseph]

   I once had a reviewer say that I played music from largely bygone
   centuries any idea what that means?

   JM
 __

   From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu on behalf of Lex van Sante
   Sent: Mon 6/1/2009 9:12 AM
   To: lute mailing list list
   Subject: [LUTE] Re: review

   Once a professional critic wrote about a recital of mine that my lute
   sounded like a crackling painting. Untill now I still don't know what
   substance he was on.xD
   Op 1 jun 2009, om 14:57 heeft howard posner het volgende geschreven:
   
On Jun 1, 2009, at 5:31 AM, Rob MacKillop wrote:
   
The guy is a native-English speaker, so has no excuse, and, no, I
have
  no idea what he is talking about. Still, a review's a review!
   
It has the virtue of being obviously obscure; you're not deluded by
apparently clear writing into thinking it actually says anything
worth knowing.  I've been involved in writing and editing reviews of
one sort or another (I'm doing both between reading and writing these
posts) and I've seen lots of reviews that appear to be using plain
English but consist entirely of throat-clearing, introductions of
topics that aren't pursued, and characterizations that are meaningful
only to the writer; at the end, there's no actual meaning.
   
Here's a famous bit of critical drivel, from a 1979 review of Queen's
Jazz album by a rock critic with a big reputation.  The prose is
fine, but when you've read it, try to relate it something in the real
world.  Does fascist rock band actually mean something?  Or is the
critic just suffering the effects of keen distaste mixed with drugs?
   
Whatever its claims, Queen isn't here just to entertain. This group
has come to make it clear exactly who is superior and who is
inferior. Its anthem, We Will Rock You, is a marching order: you
will not rock us, we will rock you. Indeed, Queen may be the first
truly fascist rock band. The whole thing makes me wonder why anyone
would indulge these creeps and their polluting ideas.
   
   
   
For context, you can read the whole rant at:
   
   
   [1]http://www.rollingstone.com/artists/queen/albums/album/195592/review
   /
5942056
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[LUTE] Luciano Faria, Luthier

[Mayes, Joseph]

   Howdy Collected Wisdom



   I wanted to update the list on my travails with the above-captioned
   luthier for two reasons: 1. When I posted my tail of woe before,
   several people responded with similar stories. I think there is some
   value in an ongoing cautionary tale. and  2. There may yet be a
   resolution, and I would hate to leave the story only half-told.



   After my last posting, I heard from Luciano. He said he was at fault,
   and that if I just allowed him two weeks, he would set all straight.
   that was on February 25th. (These have been the longest two weeks,
   ever!)

   Once again, he has vanished from telephone and email correspondence.



   I have deposits on two instruments and a fully paid-for theorbo that I
   must begin to consider lost. Take a lesson for my woes - it doesn't
   matter how good the price, or how fine the instrument if you never get
   it.



   Best Regards,



   Joseph Mayes

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