Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
I decided to try lubricating the speedometer cable to see if the continued small surginess of the cruise control is due to that. The needle _is_ still a bit jumpy, especially at low speeds. I used M1 5W-20, since my tube of speedometer cable lube was empty. As a light-weight synthetic, it should be pretty good in the cold. I jacked up the rear of the car so I could put it in gear, and dripped it into the open end of the cable as it ran. Then I took it for a test drive. The speedometer jumpiness is much reduced, as is the surging in the cruise control. I will need to do this in the 450 SL too, my only other example of a vacuum cruise control, as it also exhibits both symptoms. I had theorized that since there was a large capacitor smoothing the output of the road-speed signal that a bit of jumpiness in the sensor would be smoothed out, but I now believe that to be wrong. (You also have to account for the gain of the error amplifier, versus the output impedance of the circuit driving that capacitor.) I then decided, since I had the instrument cluster out, to see why the lamp-test feature didn't work on the low-fuel light. After much fooling around, I figured out that in 1979 there _was_ no lamp-test feature on that light! (The only one missing that feature.) But since I was there I added it. Just takes a diode and a resistor soldered to the back side of the big connector inside the cluster. The car's still for sale! http://cathey.dogear.com/mb240dsale.html, as is the 450 SL: http://cathey.dogear.com/JSLsale.html -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Oh, Kevin Smith is also interested in one of my rental units. He wants to send me a cashiers cheque and to take my fees from it and turn over the rest to his interior designer. and I have a bridge to sell him as well On Friday, April 7, 2006, at 10:15 PM, Jim Cathey wrote: First bite on the car, and it's a scam. I look forward to the coming days! I'm glad that this bozo is interested in my Goods for sale, and can't read. (Or write!) Let's see. Dear BLANK, go BLANK yourself. ... and get better mail-merge, spelling, and grammar programs! -- Jim I am Kelvin smith from US, colorado spring, currently an automobile dealer here in London, France, westafrica. I do business worldwide like buying New Used Autos for sales and all kinds of Electronics.I was just going through the Classified ads and I then came across the advert concerning your Goods for sale, am very much interested in purchasing. So kindly let me know the features, condition as well as the price you are willing to sell. ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Clay Seattle Bioburner 1972 220D - Gump 1995 E300D - Cleo 1987 300SDL - POS - DOA The FSM would drive a Diesel Benz
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Drum roll please. For sale, 1979 240D. 302kmi, auxiliary fuel tank. Perfect for biodiesel operation, has 1000 mile range. Not perfect, but looks pretty good. Rust-free. Reluctant cold-starter, but has started every time for me so far. Very clean inside, you can date with this car and not be ashamed. $2500 See http://cathey.dogear.com/mb240dsale.html for pictures and more information. OK, I don't expect you guys to buy it, I'm planning to list it on nearby Craigs lists to start, especially in Seattle. But I'd appreciate feedback on the web site, etc. I'm planning to redo the pictures if I can get a nice overcast day while it's still clean. The hazy sun resulted in pictures that are much more washed-out looking than the car deserves. Also need to get an engine compartment shot, I seem to have forgotten that one. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
After I got done with the computer junk I left the dungeon, only to find it had clouded over already. So I went back outside and took some replacement pictures. They're on there now, along with a few I'd missed (like the engine!) http://cathey.dogear.com/mb240dsale.html Please comment! -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
You better recheck the engine pics...I'm getting a 404. Jeff Zedic Toronto
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
OK, I fixed the links in the thing (a bit of case sensitivity that I messed up). I've also rearranged things per my wife's suggestions. (She was a computer layout person, so her input is usually good.) http://cathey.dogear.com/mb240dsale.html -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
First bite on the car, and it's a scam. I look forward to the coming days! I'm glad that this bozo is interested in my Goods for sale, and can't read. (Or write!) Let's see. Dear BLANK, go BLANK yourself. ... and get better mail-merge, spelling, and grammar programs! -- Jim I am Kelvin smith from US, colorado spring, currently an automobile dealer here in London, France, westafrica. I do business worldwide like buying New Used Autos for sales and all kinds of Electronics.I was just going through the Classified ads and I then came across the advert concerning your Goods for sale, am very much interested in purchasing. So kindly let me know the features, condition as well as the price you are willing to sell.
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Jim, just tell him the car is in Nigeria and a money wire transfer to you is required. Free shipping to wherever he wants the car. On 4/7/06, Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: First bite on the car, and it's a scam. I look forward to the coming days! I'm glad that this bozo is interested in my Goods for sale, and can't read. (Or write!) Let's see. Dear BLANK, go BLANK yourself. ... and get better mail-merge, spelling, and grammar programs! -- Jim I am Kelvin smith from US, colorado spring, currently an automobile dealer here in London, France, westafrica. I do business worldwide like buying New Used Autos for sales and all kinds of Electronics.I was just going through the Classified ads and I then came across the advert concerning your Goods for sale, am very much interested in purchasing. So kindly let me know the features, condition as well as the price you are willing to sell. ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- John Freer Palm Springs, CA 1992 500 SEL 140K Stardust 1985 380SL 145K Blue Belle 1996 Sidekick 57K Kermit
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Page comes back to me as mime type text/plain. Not sure if it's on my end (proxy) or on yours. I assume most of folks on this list use IE to view your pages. I'm using Firefox 1.5 FWIW.. ...Kevin Jim Cathey said: Drum roll please. For sale, 1979 240D. 302kmi, auxiliary fuel tank. Perfect for biodiesel operation, has 1000 mile range. Not perfect, but looks pretty good. Rust-free. Reluctant cold-starter, but has started every time for me so far. Very clean inside, you can date with this car and not be ashamed. $2500 See http://cathey.dogear.com/mb240dsale.html for pictures and more information. OK, I don't expect you guys to buy it, I'm planning to list it on nearby Craigs lists to start, especially in Seattle. But I'd appreciate feedback on the web site, etc. I'm planning to redo the pictures if I can get a nice overcast day while it's still clean. The hazy sun resulted in pictures that are much more washed-out looking than the car deserves. Also need to get an engine compartment shot, I seem to have forgotten that one. -- Jim ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Thank God for Microsoft -- Linus Torvalds
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Another beautiful morning. I was told here yesterday that the glow plug holes can be brushed out using a .22 rifle cleaning brush for a noticeable effect on cold starting, there _was_ a considerable amount of soot in them when I had the plugs out before. May try this today, it's pretty easy to get the plugs out. I think I'll first have a look at the spare 615 head I've got so I can see what I'm facing. (The .22 brush may be best for the smaller pencil plugs rather than these series plugs. Do I even _have_ a .22 metal rifle brush?) By the time I made it into the woods to look at the spare head it has started to rain. Great. The spare head tells me that the .22 brush ought to work just fine. I looked, and I have _two_ bore brushes that ought to work. I checked the voltage drop on the plugs, and that dratted #3 was again over 2V, versus the 1V spec. So I pulled them all out and cleaned them. They were much less sooty than the last time, the Italian tuneups seem to have worked. Brushing out the bores didn't yield much. I swapped the one iffy plug with the one spare glow plug I have. A prospective buyer stopped by and we went for a test drive. He's local, and interested in a biodiesel-mobile. The first real nibble! -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Pulled the hood ornament. Looking at the manual, the old epoxied POS, and the (partial) new star I now see what the huge spring to the bottom of the grille is about: the locking collar is missing (on both ornament assemblies!) and the heavy spring is what's holding the whole mess in. The old assembly had its heavier (of two) springs moved from the inside of the spring retainer cup to the outside of it (below), and the inner spring was extended and had a cotter pin through it to pin the outer spring in place. (The relocated spring is what normally puts tension on the star itself so that it stays wherever it's moved to in its socket, but its lack wasn't felt because the socket was epoxied together, presumably as part of holding on a snapped-off star.) Then the whole mess was spring-loaded down into the grille's hole by the long heavy spring. Without the locking collar what else can you do? I ended up just moving the old outer spring to the same place on the new (resulting in two outer springs, one inside the retaining cup and one outside) and used a piece of framing nail to pin it in place through the inner spring's hook as before. Then the whole mess was loaded into the grille's hole and tied down with the long spring, just as before. Highly inelegant, but functional. And it looks just fine from outside. If someday a retaining clip turned up it could easily be made right as no harm has been done to anything, so that's OK, but it seems just fine to me as it is. Done! Have I said that lately? Thanks to Kevin, for Erik the half-a-star! Now I just need to wait for the weather to clear enough to wash the car again and take the pictures. Then it goes up for sale. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Where do you plan to market it? Harry - Original Message - From: Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Pulled the hood ornament. Looking at the manual, the old epoxied POS, and the (partial) new star I now see what the huge spring to the bottom of the grille is about: the locking collar is missing (on both ornament assemblies!) and the heavy spring is what's holding the whole mess in. The old assembly had its heavier (of two) springs moved from the inside of the spring retainer cup to the outside of it (below), and the inner spring was extended and had a cotter pin through it to pin the outer spring in place. (The relocated spring is what normally puts tension on the star itself so that it stays wherever it's moved to in its socket, but its lack wasn't felt because the socket was epoxied together, presumably as part of holding on a snapped-off star.) Then the whole mess was spring-loaded down into the grille's hole by the long heavy spring. Without the locking collar what else can you do? I ended up just moving the old outer spring to the same place on the new (resulting in two outer springs, one inside the retaining cup and one outside) and used a piece of framing nail to pin it in place through the inner spring's hook as before. Then the whole mess was loaded into the grille's hole and tied down with the long spring, just as before. Highly inelegant, but functional. And it looks just fine from outside. If someday a retaining clip turned up it could easily be made right as no harm has been done to anything, so that's OK, but it seems just fine to me as it is. Done! Have I said that lately? Thanks to Kevin, for Erik the half-a-star! Now I just need to wait for the weather to clear enough to wash the car again and take the pictures. Then it goes up for sale. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Where do you plan to market it? Thought I'd start with the Spokane, Seattle, and Portland Craig's lists. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Dropped by the U-Pull yesterday, and found three better door checks (the one on the car I already replaced is great, the other three are only so-so), an intact piece of wind lace for the driver's door, and a passenger-side under-dash panel that has the firewall-side black part. (This is a later addition, I don't think this car ever had that, and the face half attachment is clearly different.) Will look into swapping these items in, the underpanel may require cutting and gluing. Today I put in the three door checks, greased them first. (It took longer to get them out at the U-Pull than to install them here, largely because I didn't have the BFH at the yard. Those frickin' hinge pins... A heavy cold chisel makes a terrible hammer, but is better than nothing.) Only one of the three original door checks was broken, but all were 'weak'. They were the old roller style, the new ones are BB. Much nicer now. Then I unscrewed the driver's B-pillar cover and pulled off the ratty windlace. I painted new contact cement down the door frame and applied the salvaged windlace from yesterday. It went on very easily. Then the cover screwed back on. Much easier than I thought it was going to be, and looks a whole lot better. Finally I took a look at the under-dash panel. The 'new' one has the black part stapled to the color part, whereas the old color part has holes for fingers on the black part. (The new color part is both the wrong color and has a different style of attachment to the dashboard. Not useful.) Once I'd used scissors to cut through the sound matting to separate the two parts I could see that the black part still had the old-style fingers on it, so it was merely a matter of pulling out the staples and installing it in the car. It fits, and should help cut down a little more of the engine purr. OK, now we're _really_ done, except for the hood ornament. (Parts of which are due to arrive today.) -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Drove it to band tonight. Raining, car full of the family. It just purred down the road, smoothly on cruise control with the wipers doing their job, and I was feeling rather smug. With the underdash panels on it's nice and quiet. It shaped up rather nicely, I think. Will miss it, a bit. (Need to get to work on missing it.) -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Neat Jim, I'm glad its working out so well Harry - Original Message - From: Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2006 1:05 AM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon Drove it to band tonight. Raining, car full of the family. It just purred down the road, smoothly on cruise control with the wipers doing their job, and I was feeling rather smug. With the underdash panels on it's nice and quiet. It shaped up rather nicely, I think. Will miss it, a bit. (Need to get to work on missing it.) -- Jim ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Done. (Except for the hood ornament.) I even waxed it. Need to do a photo shoot now, then I can list it. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Remind me - what year is this car? Randy B -Original Message- cleared off
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Jim, please advise if there are any homes for sale in your neighborhoodI desperately need you for a neighbor! Your patience and perseverance are commendable. On 3/28/06, R A Bennell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Remind me - what year is this car? Randy B -Original Message- cleared off ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- John Freer Palm Springs, CA 1992 500 SEL 140K Stardust 1985 380SL 145K Blue Belle 1996 Sidekick 57K Kermit
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Remind me - what year is this car? 1979. Manual HVAC windows. Anybody got a good price on a used hood star for it? Will probably have to buy new, otherwise. We're ready to put it on, as the last 'pre-detailing' step. The only other _new_ part we've put on the car is fuel line. Everything else has been good used, and has worked out very well. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Jim Cathey wrote: Remind me - what year is this car? 1979. Manual HVAC windows. Anybody got a good price on a used hood star for it? Will probably have to buy new, otherwise. I don't believe you CAN buy new. IIRC, it was superceeded by a 201 part. (or was the 116 superceeded by the 123 star?) It took me a while, but I eventually found a 116 star on ebay that I got for under $15 delivered. A little dull, but the genuine original full sized star.
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
I admire your persistence and patience. I have projects laying around from *gasp* twenty plus years that need attention. Where do you find the time and motivation for such things? Gotta admit I like your writing style too. Been out of work since last May! -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
More progress. -- Jim March 27, 2006 Finally, moving on. I glued the loose passenger map pocket to the door skin. Inelegant, but should work. I was careful so that it can be removed fairly cleanly if the pocket should ever get replaced. ...On a freeway test drive today the cruise worked even better than it did at low speed, mostly because the car is less sensitive to throttle variations at higher speeds. Perfectly acceptable, if you ask me. I need to look at the throttle linkage again, it may be that we've lost a little bit of onramp power since I dinked with it while installing the idle cable. It's a pity that other obligations prevented me from tackling the sunroof today, it was beautiful out. It's supposed to rain tomorrow. March 28, 2006 Yep, raining. Adjusted the throttle linkage again to get better access to full throttle. Loosened the ADA screw two full turns. Tried a test drive, no real difference. Car doesn't smoke on heavy acceleration, and sucking and blowing on a line connected to the ADA's port didn't seem to make any difference. I whipped the full-throttle stop four more lashes, just for grins, and drove it again. Not really any different, but I hooked up the MityVac to the ADA, and when I pumped it up to 15, floored it, and then released the vacuum I could feel a surge as the ADA reacted. So, it's not totally dead anyway. The weather cleared up a bit, so I dove into the sunroof. _Very_ sticky, which I could tell once I'd unpinned the operating cable. Can't even slide it by hand, it takes two! Try _that_ while at the same time trying to flip the switch. Anyway, it was painfully obvious that naive attempts to lubricate the sunroof had been done. The two shiny cover rails (with the screw heads in them) that are exposed when the roof is open were caked with what looked like a bad varnish, the remains I suppose of some random lubricant caked with dirt. Of note is that this is a non-bearing surface, and needs no lubrication at all! I put these in the solvent tank while I did the real job. The roof came apart easily enough, having done it before helps. The difficult part is cleaning out the rearward part of the sliding track where it's buried behind the headliner. I used a bit of rag clamped into the end of a straightened coat hanger and dipped in solvent. Fortunately the rear part of the track seems to have escaped the home lubricator. It was fairly clean, especially when compared to the front part of the track. With all of the crud scraped and dissolved out of there, and the same for the sliding feet on the roof panel itself, I lubricated it all with Lubriplate and put it back together. Even after an hour in the solvent tank the rail covers needed heavy scrubbing with a rag to shine up. The roof panel slid easily enough by hand when I put it back in place, so I finished putting all the bolts in and tried it out. It still got stuck at the back, just about as bad as before! WTF? I started taking it back apart, and with it disconnected from the cable and bracket it slid easily enough again. As it turns out, the sliding bracket to which the roof panel screws (and through which runs a tube inside of which is the cable from the motor) needs to be pulled forward out of the car as well. (Run the cable all the way back first.) The inside of this tube was all gummy and was preventing the bracket from sliding easily over the sheath of the cable back under the headliner. I cleaned it out with solvent and lubricated it too. Upon reassembly the sunroof then worked properly. Now for the small tears in the sunroof headliner panel. I took it inside to a table and cleaned off the metal side rails where the glue had failed and the material was loose. I then used contact cement to reglue the panel to the frame. With that done I cut some small pieces of scrap headliner material I had and cemented them behind the tear and the hole that was in the panel. The scrap material was even the right color! Same hole pattern, too, which helped with the hole. It is a bit puckery still and not nearly as invisible as I'd hoped, but I still think it's better than it was. With the hole patched it should no longer draw probing little fingers... A final treatment with Simple Green to clean off the whole panel and then I installed it back in the car. A drop of oil on each metal snap clip helped ease them back into place. Just about done, except for the detailing. (Wash, touch-up paint, wax, clean the interior.) I have had no problems with the battery the entire time, I think its only problem was difficult starting combined with not letting it charge back up. (Especially easy if you didn't get it started!) So I will consider the PO's report spurious and will mark it as taken care of. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
(The cruise is fixed. What a nightmare!) -- Jim March 25, 2006 Removed the test contacts in the amplifier and put it back in its case. Put together the bench vacuum pump again now that its glue has had a chance to dry. When stuffed inside its foam 'football' it's really quite quiet. It ought to come in very handy from time to time, and it's nice to finally have a use for that wretched pump I got stuck with. March 26, 2006 Reinstalled the cruise amplifier. Installed the auxiliary fan support brackets. No auxiliary fan, but this is the best place to store the brackets! Glued torn right-side door weatherstrip. Checked brown and green vacuum lines (again) for leaks, nothing. I don't know what to think. While driving it today it seems to me that the throttle pedal gyrations (which you can feel with your foot if you try) must be abnormal, and reflect an excessive consumption of vacuum by the actuator. But _why_ does it do this? It doesn't on the bench. I thought I'd better cover some bases, something I believe to be true is not. So I tried a different stalk switch. A long shot, but in theory it is possible for a contact that doesn't open-circuit all the way to disrupt the amplifier. No dice, the car drove the same. Maybe I need to swap actuators too to be sure of it. I also started the resoldering process on the two dead amplifiers I have in the box. If I can get them to work on the bench I'll try them both in the car to see what happens. ...Got one running well on the bench and took it for a drive. Exactly the same results. Definitely pointing away from the amplifier. The other spare amplifier, after resoldering, goes into immediate deceleration. Probing reveals a climbing FET output voltage, for no apparent cause. Looks like a leaky FET, probably gate punch-through damage induced during the resoldering resulting in leakage from the Drain. Be careful with those! This exercise leaves me with two spare vacuum amplifiers that seem to work, one from before and the one I just fixed. That's enough! March 27, 2006 Removed the cruise actuator and brought it in to the bench. Seems to act exactly like the one I use for testing. No abnormal appetite for vacuum in other words. Removed vacuum pump. What a PITA! Disassembling it I find no torn diaphragms, and the valves work. There was oil in one of the valves, the intake, but I suspect that this car had an oil leak into the vacuum system at a prior date that was not completely cleaned out. I suppose it could be that the puddled oil was preventing the valve from working fully? Let us hope. The cam and bearing are perfect. The rubber bits all look good. Reassembling the pump looks to be even harder than disassembling it. I put the valve cover back together and sucking and blowing on the two ports results in good behavior. No backwards leaking that I can detect. The pump requires 1 of preload on the main spring for reassembly, I used a block of wood on the floor as a spacer while standing on the pump. Awkward, but do-able. The reassembled pump went back on the engine easily enough and 'squawked' as it pumped when the engine was turned by hand. Sounded normal enough. With the engine started the brake booster pumped down in a normal amount of time. Went for a test drive. Same. Crap. That was the last major piece to look at and it looks good. Y'know, as I mentioned before when weird things happen that you can't explain then something you believe to be true is not, one of your basic assumptions is wrong. So I started a round of divide-and-conquer diagnosis. First I unhooked the brake booster and used duct tape to secure the vacuum check valve (which feeds the reservoir/doors/cruise systems) to its end, taped shut the usual tap for the accessories, and went for a drive. Perfect cruise operation, other than the lack of power brakes! The vacuum level never dropped much at all. The pump has got plenty of 'oomph'. I then hooked up all the vacuum taps to this point and tried again. Still good. I then taped off the brake fitting and moved the check valve to the usual tap, though bypassing the splitter and much of the hose and tried again. Better than usual, but not good. So that eliminates the brake booster as a leak (not that I suspected it but we are in full science mode now). At least this lets me hook up the power brakes again! I then removed the usual vacuum hose from the tap and used a section of 1/4 fuel line as a vacuum tap. This fits over a stepped portion of the body of the vacuum fitting, and should eliminate any chance of restrictions in the usual hosing causing problems. The check valve was taped into the end of the fuel line. Still not good. That leaves the vacuum tap as the only remaining potential culprit. I removed the brake vacuum line from the car and heated the plastic tap fitting with a heat gun and drove a nail down it to stretch it out. I couldn't get it in all the way. With it stretched a
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
(The cruise is fixed. What a nightmare!) -- Jim I admire your persistence and patience. I have projects laying around from *gasp* twenty plus years that need attention. Where do you find the time and motivation for such things? Gotta admit I like your writing style too. Rick Knoble '85 300 CD '87 190 DT
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Congratulations Jim. Harry - Original Message - From: Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 4:31 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon (The cruise is fixed. What a nightmare!) -- Jim March 25, 2006 Removed the test contacts in the amplifier and put it back in its case. Put together the bench vacuum pump again now that its glue has had a chance to dry. When stuffed inside its foam 'football' it's really quite quiet. It ought to come in very handy from time to time, and it's nice to finally have a use for that wretched pump I got stuck with. March 26, 2006 Reinstalled the cruise amplifier. Installed the auxiliary fan support brackets. No auxiliary fan, but this is the best place to store the brackets! Glued torn right-side door weatherstrip. Checked brown and green vacuum lines (again) for leaks, nothing. I don't know what to think. While driving it today it seems to me that the throttle pedal gyrations (which you can feel with your foot if you try) must be abnormal, and reflect an excessive consumption of vacuum by the actuator. But _why_ does it do this? It doesn't on the bench. I thought I'd better cover some bases, something I believe to be true is not. So I tried a different stalk switch. A long shot, but in theory it is possible for a contact that doesn't open-circuit all the way to disrupt the amplifier. No dice, the car drove the same. Maybe I need to swap actuators too to be sure of it. I also started the resoldering process on the two dead amplifiers I have in the box. If I can get them to work on the bench I'll try them both in the car to see what happens. ...Got one running well on the bench and took it for a drive. Exactly the same results. Definitely pointing away from the amplifier. The other spare amplifier, after resoldering, goes into immediate deceleration. Probing reveals a climbing FET output voltage, for no apparent cause. Looks like a leaky FET, probably gate punch-through damage induced during the resoldering resulting in leakage from the Drain. Be careful with those! This exercise leaves me with two spare vacuum amplifiers that seem to work, one from before and the one I just fixed. That's enough! March 27, 2006 Removed the cruise actuator and brought it in to the bench. Seems to act exactly like the one I use for testing. No abnormal appetite for vacuum in other words. Removed vacuum pump. What a PITA! Disassembling it I find no torn diaphragms, and the valves work. There was oil in one of the valves, the intake, but I suspect that this car had an oil leak into the vacuum system at a prior date that was not completely cleaned out. I suppose it could be that the puddled oil was preventing the valve from working fully? Let us hope. The cam and bearing are perfect. The rubber bits all look good. Reassembling the pump looks to be even harder than disassembling it. I put the valve cover back together and sucking and blowing on the two ports results in good behavior. No backwards leaking that I can detect. The pump requires 1 of preload on the main spring for reassembly, I used a block of wood on the floor as a spacer while standing on the pump. Awkward, but do-able. The reassembled pump went back on the engine easily enough and 'squawked' as it pumped when the engine was turned by hand. Sounded normal enough. With the engine started the brake booster pumped down in a normal amount of time. Went for a test drive. Same. Crap. That was the last major piece to look at and it looks good. Y'know, as I mentioned before when weird things happen that you can't explain then something you believe to be true is not, one of your basic assumptions is wrong. So I started a round of divide-and-conquer diagnosis. First I unhooked the brake booster and used duct tape to secure the vacuum check valve (which feeds the reservoir/doors/cruise systems) to its end, taped shut the usual tap for the accessories, and went for a drive. Perfect cruise operation, other than the lack of power brakes! The vacuum level never dropped much at all. The pump has got plenty of 'oomph'. I then hooked up all the vacuum taps to this point and tried again. Still good. I then taped off the brake fitting and moved the check valve to the usual tap, though bypassing the splitter and much of the hose and tried again. Better than usual, but not good. So that eliminates the brake booster as a leak (not that I suspected it but we are in full science mode now). At least this lets me hook up the power brakes again! I then removed the usual vacuum hose from the tap and used a section of 1/4 fuel line as a vacuum tap. This fits over a stepped portion of the body of the vacuum fitting, and should eliminate any chance of restrictions in the usual hosing causing problems. The check valve
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
So I looked up the spec, and when I disconnected all the auxiliary stuff and measured the vacuum rise at the tap when the engine was started after exhausting the brake booster it took about 12 seconds at idle to bring it back to 15 Hg, about 1/2 Bar. (This appears to be a 10 brake booster, so I'm assuming single diaphragm. I believe that the vacuum pump is single-diaphragm as well.) That is within spec. so far as I can tell. However, with the auxiliary stuff hooked up it takes _much_ longer to pump down the auxiliary tank. But I'm measuring in the wrong place to duplicate what the spec. calls for. All this cruise crap was getting old, so I welded the 17mm socket I bought to the end of the lug wrench. That, at least, was easy! Then I connected up the idle cable, now that I have the spring clip. I put a little brass bushing over the frayed end of the cable, and used a locking collar with aluminum inserts to clamp the end of the cable. The throttle linkage required a little bit of adjustment in order to get the correct range on the idle cable. (It was tight, because the frayed end was a bit short.) The dash knob now works as intended. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Status from the last couple of days: March 23, 2006 Resurrected the cruise control bench test setup. Started fiddling with the amplifier. Acts right, near as I can tell. I did resolder some parts around the relay, it seemed to be a bit sensitive to tapping in that area. The waveform to the actuator throbbed at first, but after all the handling it was stable and acted like others I've seen. We'll see on a test drive today if it's any better. ...No, it's not better. While I was out I bought a 6-point 17mm socket to weld to that tire iron I bought. That ought to make a good tire iron for hubcapped wheels. (The pointy end of the handle can pry the caps off.) I messed with it some more, even going so far as to connect a SP4T switch to several test points inside and going for a drive with a meter connected to the switch. It was still spastic, and a different amplifier I tried was worse. (I don't think it was a good one, though it is one I've tried to repair.) However I can say that the speed feedback signal is good. Nice and linear, with no jumping. (The output of the error amplifier and the current feedback test points are both jumpy. But not on the bench. I would think that any problem would be at the error amplifier stage.) I decided to clean up the contacts on the actuator better, and this time pried apart the connector shell. There was a spider nest inside, so I cleaned that out, scraped the pins of the actuator, squeezed the connector sockets together a bit, scrubbed them out, and put it back together. I also tied the actuator directly to the vacuum line, bypassing all other consumers. It worked a _lot_ better. I put the vacuum system back as it should be, and it wasn't so good, though I think it was better than before. It may be that we're running out of vacuum and that's causing weird symptoms. I'll hook up a gauge tomorrow so I can watch it during a drive. It could well be that there's more than one fault here. Those can be fun to diagnose! After dinner I spent a few hours going over the circuit board on the bench. The output 'breathes' sometimes, but not others. I do not know if this is significant, and I found no particular mechanism for this behavior, and no particular way to induce or eliminate it. Using a signal generator as the speedometer signal should eliminate feedback that way, the only other feedback is the current sense to the actuator. All the capacitors in this circuitry seem to be connected, and good. Tacking a few extra filter caps here and there had no effect. I've forgotten what little servo theory I knew, but it could indeed be normal if it had been thought harmless by the original designers. March 24, 2006 Today looked like rain, so no sunroof operation! More cruise control madness I guess. I dug out the nasty Hella vacuum/pressure pump from an early 126. This is a badly-designed nightmare that is not very durable. I bought a broken one for parts thinking it was like the later ones, only to find it is not. Up 'til now I've had no use for it. (I did repair it once upon a time, but patching torn long-throw small-diameter diaphragms with glue is a short-term solution at best. This pump was merely held in reserve in case I ever had a car that needed it, or for reference.) It is poorly suited to converting it to a pure vacuum-only pump, but I'm giving it a try. I found that if I take the cover off and close both ports thus exposed I can get it to snap itself into a state where it is sucking continuously from one of its internal vents while blowing out its normal output port. This vent, when plugged, doesn't result in the internal diaphragm switches snapping over, yet produces a vacuum. Good, maybe there is yet a use for this nasty POS. (The later-style pumps are easy to convert to this duty, but I don't want to lose my spare.) I made a collar for the vent out of a strip of pop can and super glue, into which I have Shoe-Gooed a plug with a piece of Tecalan vacuum pipe sticking out. This collar was duct-taped around the vent. I hooked a lighter plug directly to the motor, bypassing the time limit circuitry. I teed into the car at the tap for the cruise and ran a salvaged yellow vacuum line through the firewall to the passenger seat. This whole mess (along with the MityVac [for its gauge]) was teed together with a check valve to the pump so that I could read the system's vacuum level while driving, and augment it by powering up the auxiliary pump. Then I went for a drive. Left to itself, the system vacuum stabilized (eventually) at 17 Hg. Turning on the cruise control immediately resulted in a significant drop, to around 10 Hg, with a slowly sinking average. The cruise control worked well at this point. After a bit of driving, however, the vacuum level had dropped to below 5 Hg. Once it was below 4, the cruise control stopped working well and the familiar spastic behavior resulted. This was very consistent. The real test was
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
had a really pleasant chat with Jim when he came by to get the hubcaps. Nice family and that 240D is a SUPERB car for what it is. I must bow down to Jim's ability to take dead iron and make it come back to life. The car got all the way to Seattle from Spokane and most likely will get even better on the way back. Thanks for the kind words. Car did indeed go all the way back home, uneventfully. I got these words out of my wife: I was wrong. Sweet music! Car purrs like a kitten on the highway, too. The super large tank in the trunk should give it an 800 mile range easy. He got paintless dent repair to the front fender and with the The light came on at about 1000 miles. We only got 23.5 MPG on this shakedown cruise, that was a bit disappointing. Ran her hard, though. All the mountain passes and such really wrung the car out. Starts and runs smoother easier and stronger than ever before. trim strip back on, it would be hard to tell it was hurt unless you get really close. He wants to get the AC back in and working, as well as CC to function well. If he sells over here, he can expect his base price of $2500 easy. If I sell it over there I may not need to get the AC working. That would be nice. Easy enough to restore, probably, but I have to wait until a suitable donor shows up at the U-Pull. That could take an indefinite amount of time. No other approach is economically feasible for a profit-making venture. But we don't want to be sitting on this car for very long. My wife fears its continued existence here. This is not a Kansas 220D car, but a really nice example of the w123 in #3 condition. With a good rubbing out, a detailing, spit shine to the engine compartment, I think it could be a #2. No excess smoke or noise, just a great klatta klatta. Anybody interested in a car with some upgradability should consider it for a friend or relative. List members would want to take the next step in car care and cover the cosmetic items and get a timing chain in at the next valve adjustment. I think it has curb appeal, great example of a 10 footer, and better than many of the '79 cars I see available. Just my $0.02 It'll be for sale soon! But I always figured it would be sold non-list, since we here all are capable of making our _own_ rides out of non-functioning junk. Right? Gump is no POS, btw. It's cleaning up nice, and isn't that far from deserving a nice paint job. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
had a really pleasant chat with Jim when he came by to get the hubcaps. Nice family and that 240D is a SUPERB car for what it is. I must bow down to Jim's ability to take dead iron and make it come back to life. The car got all the way to Seattle from Spokane and most likely will get even better on the way back. The super large tank in the trunk should give it an 800 mile range easy. He got paintless dent repair to the front fender and with the trim strip back on, it would be hard to tell it was hurt unless you get really close. He wants to get the AC back in and working, as well as CC to function well. If he sells over here, he can expect his base price of $2500 easy. This is not a Kansas 220D car, but a really nice example of the w123 in #3 condition. With a good rubbing out, a detailing, spit shine to the engine compartment, I think it could be a #2. No excess smoke or noise, just a great klatta klatta. Anybody interested in a car with some upgradability should consider it for a friend or relative. List members would want to take the next step in car care and cover the cosmetic items and get a timing chain in at the next valve adjustment. I think it has curb appeal, great example of a 10 footer, and better than many of the '79 cars I see available. Just my $0.02 On Sunday, March 19, 2006, at 02:50 PM, Zeitgeist wrote: A'yup! I still occasionally get folks stopping by out 'o' the blue to ask if my cars are for sale, or if I know where to find others. Craig's List apparently has turned into a gold mine for some high-power diesel sellers. I'd certainly sell yer rig over on this side of the divide, if'n you want top dollah and a quick movah. On 3/17/06, Woodlandtaylors [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jim, Put a for sale sign in the back window, my daughter said the late 70's and 80's MB diesels are fetching big bucks around Seattle - any comment Casey. Casey Olympia, WA Biodiesel: I drive in a persistent vegetative state '87 300TD intercooler (212k) '84 300D (211k) Gashuffer: '89 Vanagon Wolfsburg Edition (187K) ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Clay Seattle Bioburner 1972 220D - Gump 1995 E300D - Cleo 1987 300SDL - POS - DOA The FSM would drive a Diesel Benz
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
I will say that these models are going for high cash. After the turn out for the Biodiesel forum today, there will be increased interest in a Benz, and sellers can ask what they like. Far too many tiny little VW cars attending and many newbies would love a more refined car. On Friday, March 17, 2006, at 05:44 PM, Woodlandtaylors wrote: Jim, Put a for sale sign in the back window, my daughter said the late 70's and 80's MB diesels are fetching big bucks around Seattle - any comment Casey. Dennis T -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jim Cathey Sent: Friday, March 17, 2006 5:32 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon We're planning to fill up both tanks in Idaho tomorrow and drive to Seattle and back in the car. The shakedown cruise. Fuel is a lot cheaper in Idaho, in case you're curious. Effectively the car is 'done', though there are a few small things left to do. I'm into it a conservative 80 hours of labor, and the expenses (including acquisition) are a hair under $1000. (Hmm, motor mounts, restoring the AC, and a CLA on the sunroof are still on the list. Maybe not so small. Sigh.) I doubt this is going to make much money for us. Nice looking car, though. That's why I want to drive it to Seattle. That way I get some small ROI for all the TLC before we sell it. And it ought to save us a bit of money if we don't have to buy expensive Washington fuel. (An extra gas tax.) -- Jim ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.2.4/283 - Release Date: 3/16/2006 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.2.4/283 - Release Date: 3/16/2006 ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Clay Seattle Bioburner 1972 220D - Gump 1995 E300D - Cleo 1987 300SDL - POS - DOA The FSM would drive a Diesel Benz
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Craig McCluskey wrote: I use a piece of piano wire with a hook bent at the end. Coincidentally, I have one of those too. It's a special tool I made for removing Honda window cranks. David Brodbeck '83 300D Turbo
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
A'yup! I still occasionally get folks stopping by out 'o' the blue to ask if my cars are for sale, or if I know where to find others. Craig's List apparently has turned into a gold mine for some high-power diesel sellers. I'd certainly sell yer rig over on this side of the divide, if'n you want top dollah and a quick movah. On 3/17/06, Woodlandtaylors [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jim, Put a for sale sign in the back window, my daughter said the late 70's and 80's MB diesels are fetching big bucks around Seattle - any comment Casey. Casey Olympia, WA Biodiesel: I drive in a persistent vegetative state '87 300TD intercooler (212k) '84 300D (211k) Gashuffer: '89 Vanagon Wolfsburg Edition (187K)
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
The 'new' differential is in, and the whine is gone. Whew. I clock it as a seven hour job, not counting putting a differential back in Smelly. On the plus side now I've taken a rear subframe off of a car, so it's no longer a scary thing. We're planning to fill up both tanks in Idaho tomorrow and drive to Seattle and back in the car. The shakedown cruise. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
We're planning to fill up both tanks in Idaho tomorrow and drive to Seattle and back in the car. The shakedown cruise. Fuel is a lot cheaper in Idaho, in case you're curious. Effectively the car is 'done', though there are a few small things left to do. I'm into it a conservative 80 hours of labor, and the expenses (including acquisition) are a hair under $1000. (Hmm, motor mounts, restoring the AC, and a CLA on the sunroof are still on the list. Maybe not so small. Sigh.) I doubt this is going to make much money for us. Nice looking car, though. That's why I want to drive it to Seattle. That way I get some small ROI for all the TLC before we sell it. And it ought to save us a bit of money if we don't have to buy expensive Washington fuel. (An extra gas tax.) -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Good luck Jim on your maiden voyage. You deserve a nice ride. Dwight Giles, Jr 1979 240D auto, 250K + miles 1990 300D 2.5t, 130K miles Wickford, RI -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jim Cathey Sent: Friday, March 17, 2006 8:22 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon The 'new' differential is in, and the whine is gone. Whew. I clock it as a seven hour job, not counting putting a differential back in Smelly. On the plus side now I've taken a rear subframe off of a car, so it's no longer a scary thing. We're planning to fill up both tanks in Idaho tomorrow and drive to Seattle and back in the car. The shakedown cruise. -- Jim ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Jim, Put a for sale sign in the back window, my daughter said the late 70's and 80's MB diesels are fetching big bucks around Seattle - any comment Casey. Dennis T -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jim Cathey Sent: Friday, March 17, 2006 5:32 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon We're planning to fill up both tanks in Idaho tomorrow and drive to Seattle and back in the car. The shakedown cruise. Fuel is a lot cheaper in Idaho, in case you're curious. Effectively the car is 'done', though there are a few small things left to do. I'm into it a conservative 80 hours of labor, and the expenses (including acquisition) are a hair under $1000. (Hmm, motor mounts, restoring the AC, and a CLA on the sunroof are still on the list. Maybe not so small. Sigh.) I doubt this is going to make much money for us. Nice looking car, though. That's why I want to drive it to Seattle. That way I get some small ROI for all the TLC before we sell it. And it ought to save us a bit of money if we don't have to buy expensive Washington fuel. (An extra gas tax.) -- Jim ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.2.4/283 - Release Date: 3/16/2006 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.2.4/283 - Release Date: 3/16/2006
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Heh...yeah, I have the little gnomes with hammers, all right. This is the one that you need a press to change, right? I've never used one. Careful use of an oven and freezer, and some soapy water and a hammer have worked for me. (Freeze bearing, heat support to 200 degrees, slick 'em up and tap the bearing in in.) -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
I drained the black glop (literally!) out of the differential. I've never seen such goopy stuff. The first mound of it that fell out into the drain pan, before I got the ooze going through the hole to the inside, stayed there during the entire operation. It was like black runny peanut butter. I let it drain for half an hour or so, then put the plug back in and filled it with diesel. Then I ran the car in gear for a minute or two and drained it again. The diesel came out black, but the glop in the bottom was hardly touched. So I got out the oil sucker and slurped it all up. Then I repeated the diesel sluicing, and then sucked it out once more. I put in 1.5 quarts of gear oil and took it for a test drive. Still noisy. Crap. The differential that's in there bears a 115 part number, so I'm sure that either of the differentials I have squirreled away will work. (I think I got one from a 123 and one from a 115.) The one that I put on the parts car (so it would roll) has the same bolt-based attachment for the half-shafts, so that's the one I guess I'm going to use. I think it came off of a 240D, though it is on a 300D right now. More work to liberate it first, but what are you going to do? -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Jim Cathey wrote: Heh...yeah, I have the little gnomes with hammers, all right. This is the one that you need a press to change, right? I've never used one. Careful use of an oven and freezer, and some soapy water and a hammer have worked for me. (Freeze bearing, heat support to 200 degrees, slick 'em up and tap the bearing in in.) Hmm. Okay, I guess that cuts down the number of special tools required, although it still looks like I'd need a two-arm puller. I'm really not too sure if this is something I can do in my apartment parking lot. The shop manual makes it look like a pretty major undertaking. Just getting the driveshaft out and back in is eight pages and involves jacking up the transmission. David Brodbeck '83 300D Turbo
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
On Mar 16, 2006, at 2:06 PM, David Brodbeck wrote: This is the one that you need a press to change, right? David Brodbeck Not necessarily. Use your imagination if you don't have access to a press. Johnny B. I Mac Therefore I am
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
I just changed the center bearing on the '78 450SLC this afternoon. Note - MARK the alignment of the front/rear sections BEFORE you pull them apart!!! I keep reading about loosening the clamping nut to be able to slide the shafts apart, but I've never needed to (four cars now) - they just slide apart. They don't feel loose or sloppy, just not too tight to slide. Once that's done, and the drive shaft is out of the car, remove the snap ring in front of the bearing. My bearing then slid off with one whack from the edge of my hand. New one went on a bit tighter - took several taps with a hammer and drift to get it seated. Removing the bolts from the flex disks was the most difficult part - for a decrepit old man working on his back under a car that's not high enough with dirt falling into his eyes - On 3/16/06, David Brodbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jim Cathey wrote: More likely is the center driveline bearing support. Especially if it sounds like the gnomes are underneath your seat whacking on the floor with mallets under hard acceleration. The center of the driveline is not held in place and it gets an angle in it and starts being thrown against the tunnel. Heh...yeah, I have the little gnomes with hammers, all right. This is the one that you need a press to change, right? David Brodbeck '83 300D Turbo ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK '90 300D 243K, Rattled '87 300SDL 290K, Limo Lite, or blue car '81 240D 173K, Gramps, or yellow car '78 450SLC 67K, brown car '97 Ply Grand Voyager 78K Van Go
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
On Mar 16, 2006, at 8:31 PM, David Brodbeck wrote: Hmm. Okay, I guess that cuts down the number of special tools required, although it still looks like I'd need a two-arm puller. I'm really not too sure if this is something I can do in my apartment parking lot. The shop manual makes it look like a pretty major undertaking. Just getting the driveshaft out and back in is eight pages and involves jacking up the transmission. David Brodbeck Another simple job. all you need to do is unbolt both ends and center support, possibly loosen the nut on the drive shaft pry the shaft out of flex discs. Try not to mangle the bearing shield when removing the bearing and don't forget to match mark the two halves to each other. I see no reason to jack the tranny. Johnny B. I Mac Therefore I am
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Jim, Did smelly have a diff with it? Dennis T -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.2.4/282 - Release Date: 3/15/2006
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
John Berryman wrote: Another simple job. all you need to do is unbolt both ends and center support, possibly loosen the nut on the drive shaft pry the shaft out of flex discs. Try not to mangle the bearing shield when removing the bearing and don't forget to match mark the two halves to each other. I see no reason to jack the tranny. Thanks, that sounds do-able. Is it me, or does the manual make a lot of these jobs more complicated than they need to be? They also claim you need a special tool to remove and install the half shafts from the hubs, but I've heard several people here say they just slide in and out by hand. David Brodbeck '83 300D Turbo
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 19:56:11 -0800 David Brodbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: They also claim you need a special tool to remove and install the half shafts from the hubs, but I've heard several people here say they just slide in and out by hand. They do. Craig
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Thanks, that sounds do-able. Is it me, or does the manual make a lot of these jobs more complicated than they need to be? They also claim you Often. need a special tool to remove and install the half shafts from the hubs, but I've heard several people here say they just slide in and out by hand. My most special tool is a small sledgehammer. Good for anything from a gentle tap to NOW! I've done many half-shafts, and used no special tools. Oh, a small pair of vise-grips for pulling and reinstalling the little retaining clips. Is that special? -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Did smelly have a diff with it? Not when I got it, that's why it was so #$%$ hard to move! I bought one at the U-Pull and installed it some time ago, just so I could move the car around. It irked me at the time that I had to put a good differential in since it only needed a bad one to hold the suspension up. Well, maybe it's getting a bad one tomorrow! Sometimes things just work out... -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Hmm. Okay, I guess that cuts down the number of special tools required, although it still looks like I'd need a two-arm puller. I'm really not Puller's easier, but a hammer and a drift will probably do the trick. Tap, tap, tap... too sure if this is something I can do in my apartment parking lot. The shop manual makes it look like a pretty major undertaking. Just getting the driveshaft out and back in is eight pages and involves jacking up the transmission. It's do-able, and oh-so-satisfying! -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
On Mar 16, 2006, at 10:56 PM, David Brodbeck wrote: Thanks, that sounds do-able. Is it me, or does the manual make a lot of these jobs more complicated than they need to be? I read manuals, always have but I often find legitimate short-cuts or different procedures than are published. Often times though, the manual is spot-on. Johnny B. I Mac Therefore I am
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
On Mar 16, 2006, at 11:47 PM, Jim Cathey wrote: I've done many half-shafts, and used no special tools. Oh, a small pair of vise-grips for pulling and reinstalling the little retaining clips. Is that special? -- Jim Yes, very special. Johnny B. I Mac Therefore I am
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
They always do. It takes a lot of words to explain even a simple operation. Imagine writing detailed instructions for putting on your wrist watch for someone who has never seen such a thing. Tom Potter Sometimes Technical Writer -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Brodbeck Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2006 7:32 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon ... The shop manual makes it look like a pretty major undertaking. Just getting the driveshaft out and back in is eight pages and involves jacking up the transmission. David Brodbeck '83 300D Turbo ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Raining, great. I got the parts car (Smelly) jacked up and put some little jack stands and big firewood pieces underneath it for safety. The differential came down and out a lot easier than I remember it going in. It only took an hour to get it into the bed of the truck. Breakfast time! -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Both differentials are now sitting on my tailgate. The 'bad' one has a lot looser pinion than the one that's going in now. Gears look good though. Maybe I could have tightened the pinion nut and fixed it, it certainly would have been a lot easier than dropping the entire rear subframe and I even have the special MB tool for doing the differential castle nut. But I didn't want to have that not work and need to do the swap anyway. I wish to take the car on a long road trip tomorrow, so I need it to be done. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Sounds like you need to change the flexi disc in the driveshaft...I changed mine and it made the car so much smoother...she had an unusual shudder when accelerating uphill...the part is something like $30 and not too difficult to install...looks like an old style rotary phone center made of hard rubber with metal inserts where the bolts go, it is just behind the transmission rubber mount (which may need replacing as well). Mike in San Diego John Berryman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 15, 2006, at 11:39 AM, Jim Cathey wrote: Any thoughts out there? -- Jim Driveshaft center bearing? May be the tranny mount, I had one that sounded like something bad in the driveline. The noise changed a little at varying loads and went completely away on hard acceleration. Does yours sound like a pinion bearing going South? The whine should sound noticeably different on accel/decel if it is. You could do a backlash measurement or compare to another similar vehicle. Johnny B. I Mac Therefore I am ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net - Yahoo! Mail Bring photos to life! New PhotoMail makes sharing a breeze. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Mar 16 06:45:00 2006 Received: from mxa.windwireless.net ([199.164.167.40]) by server5.arterytc5.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1FJmEG-0008Fg-2O for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Thu, 16 Mar 2006 06:45:00 + Received: from dogear.com (IP-206-63-94-251.progress.wi-fi.windwireless.net [206.63.94.251] (may be forged)) by mxa.windwireless.net (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id k2G6jVud010025 for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Wed, 15 Mar 2006 22:45:32 -0800 Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2006 22:44:52 -0800 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) From: Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-Id: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) X-Virus-Scan: smtp-vilter X-SMTP-Vilter-Version: 1.1.0rc2 X-SMTP-Vilter-Backend: Clam AntiVirus Daemon (clamd) X-SMTP-Vilter-Status: clean X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0rc4 (mxa.windwireless.net [199.164.167.40]); Wed, 15 Mar 2006 22:45:32 -0800 (PST) X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon X-BeenThere: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.6 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_striplin.net.striplin.net List-Unsubscribe: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: http://striplin.net/pipermail/mercedes_striplin.net List-Post: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2006 06:45:00 - Sounds like you need to change the flexi disc in the driveshaft...I changed mine and it made the car so much smoother...she had an unusual shudder when accelerating uphill...the part is something like $30 and not too difficult to install...looks like an old style rotary phone center made of hard rubber with metal inserts where the bolts go, it is just behind the transmission rubber mount (which may need replacing as well). There are two of these, one at the tranny and one at the differential. But I don't really think this is (or could be) the cause of a whine or growl. Shuddering and weird behavior, sure. I'm figuring it's either the differential making too much noise, or the isolation rubber not soaking up the normal noise. I'm leaning toward the former, 'cause replacing the clearly bad differential mount with a better one helped, but did not eliminate it. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
michael smith wrote: Sounds like you need to change the flexi disc in the driveshaft...I changed mine and it made the car so much smoother...she had an unusual shudder when accelerating uphill... Aha! I've had a weird shudder and knocking sound when accelerating hard, especially uphill. Sounds like this could be the culprit. Do I just undo the bolts and then slip it out? David Brodbeck '83 300D Turbo
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Aha! I've had a weird shudder and knocking sound when accelerating hard, especially uphill. Sounds like this could be the culprit. Do I More likely is the center driveline bearing support. Especially if it sounds like the gnomes are underneath your seat whacking on the floor with mallets under hard acceleration. The center of the driveline is not held in place and it gets an angle in it and starts being thrown against the tunnel. just undo the bolts and then slip it out? Not quite that easy, there are collars that mate. You usually have to loosen the spline clamp (in the middle), and the center bearing support so that the driveline can collapse a bit to clear the centering collars. (By prying.) It's fairly easy to do, but a hammer and a prybar are usually necessary to get things apart. If you do remove the whole driveline, which you have to do to address the center bearing and support, make sure that you mark the driveline so that the two halves go back together exactly as they came apart. The balancing will be wrong if you don't. See: http//cathey.dogear.com/JSLdline.html -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Jim Cathey wrote: More likely is the center driveline bearing support. Especially if it sounds like the gnomes are underneath your seat whacking on the floor with mallets under hard acceleration. The center of the driveline is not held in place and it gets an angle in it and starts being thrown against the tunnel. Heh...yeah, I have the little gnomes with hammers, all right. This is the one that you need a press to change, right? David Brodbeck '83 300D Turbo
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
I jacked up the rear of the car again and checked the lube level in the (noisy) differential. It was full, but of a nasty black sludge. I poured in some leftover gear oil I had, I suppose I'm going to have to flush it out and replace the lube altogether. However, I don't know that I trust the differential to be still good, and I'd hate to invest the gear lube in a bad part when getting another differential is so inexpensive. ($28, not a trivial undertaking, though.) This differential, though, has external bolts for the half-shafts, and the 240D candidate in the yard does not. Other noise candidates? It's a classic gear whine that sounds like it's coming from the back, doesn't vary on cornering, and is loudest at partial throttle settings at lower speeds. I replaced the differential mount with a less-collapsed one that I believe came out of our SL as a case of PM. Not much of a change. Subframe mounts? Spring pads? Any thoughts out there? -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
On Mar 15, 2006, at 11:39 AM, Jim Cathey wrote: Any thoughts out there? -- Jim Driveshaft center bearing? May be the tranny mount, I had one that sounded like something bad in the driveline. The noise changed a little at varying loads and went completely away on hard acceleration. Does yours sound like a pinion bearing going South? The whine should sound noticeably different on accel/decel if it is. You could do a backlash measurement or compare to another similar vehicle. Johnny B. I Mac Therefore I am
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Driveshaft center bearing? May be the tranny mount, I had one that sounded like something bad in the driveline. The noise changed a little at varying loads and went completely away on hard acceleration. Does yours sound like a pinion bearing going South? The whine should sound noticeably different on accel/decel if it is. You could do a backlash measurement or compare to another similar vehicle. I get the impression that the noise originates further back than the center bearing, or the back of the transmission. But of course with noises it can be awfully hard to pin down. It's a 240D automatic. What hard acceleration? :-) Taking the car to the paintless dent removal place I'm thinking the differential is quieter than it was. (With 1/2 pt new oil.) Enough that I think I'll clean it out and put in fresh oil. That sludge in there can't be right. The cruise control, unfortunately, was the same. It works at first, then sinks about 5 MPH (to 60). -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
From earlier enquiries it looks like I'm missing a piece of the throttle linkage, a weirdly-bent strap of metal into which the idle knob link attaches. It's a strap of metal with one end as if it were bent around a stick and a long tail left on one side, and it's carefully shaped to fit within the butterfly-shaped hole in STOP lever. The curved section on one side of the lever, the tail sticking through. There's a hole in the tail (I imagine) for the idle cable to fit through, with a clamping nut on the back. Not something that one could fabricate easily at home, not and have it work as intended. (Flex so that the STOP lever can still function.) Anybody got an extra one? I've attached a partial photograph of one, it ought to end up on the list server. -- Jim -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: stop.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 26823 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://striplin.net/pipermail/mercedes_striplin.net/attachments/20060314/e63d8054/stop.jpg
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
I washed the seat tracks out in the solvent tank, they (all four of them) were filthy. I then spray-lubed the tracks with lithium grease and reassembled the seat. No real problem (though time-consuming) except that while reinstalling the seat I snapped off the front handle! Aargh! _This_ time, at least, I have the piece, so I used Shoe Goo to reattach it. It should be fine. The seat moves easily now. Out shopping I bought a cup holder, an in-line fuel filter, and some diesel biocide. Time to treat the tank! I put half in each tank. On the test drive I tried out the now-hooked-up cruise control, and it acts like most of the other broken (but intact) ones I've played with: it will accelerate when you ask it to, but cannot hold a speed. Solder! The weather this afternoon was also quite nice, so I hit the sunroof switch. It flew open without any trouble whatsoever. Closing, however, was a different story. It binds when closing and you can hear the motor slipping the clutch in the trunk. When you let off the switch you can see the roof continue to creep forward a little bit as cable tension dissipates. Hit the switch again and it lurches forward a tiny bit and then binds. Ad infinitum. Pulling on it to help it close does nothing, so I don't suspect a loose clutch. I'm going to have to open it up and go through it. At least I've done one before. This evening I removed the cruise control amplifier, stripped the varnish off the back, and resoldered about half of it before I ran out of time. Oddly enough, the often-bad electrolytic capacitor that is a main suspect was in great shape, so I left it in. I slipped the amplifier back into the car, and on its test drive the cruise control worked. It surged a bit, but that's main symptom #2, and probably a sign that not all solder joints are yet good. At least on this 240D a surging throttle pedal is barely noticeable due to the lack of horsepower. Progress! -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Jim Cathey wrote: Replaced the horns. For whatever reason, both old ones were dead. Seems to be pretty common in salt country. I think the rust gets them. When I got my Mercedes, one horn was dead from being rammed into the bottom of a ditch, and the other died a few months later. I put in a pair of high-tone air horns instead, because they were cheap at the local auto parts store.
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Replaced the horns. For whatever reason, both old ones were dead. Seems to be pretty common in salt country. I think the rust gets them. This, of course, is a rust-free car. I think there was a high curb incident at one point, though. pair of high-tone air horns instead, because they were cheap at the local auto parts store. Two replacement horns, from a 240D even, were $1 each at the U-Pull. Sounds great! How to tell a high-tone from a low? Tap them on the ground. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
I pulled the passenger seat so that I could clean the tracks and put a new side (height) adjustment handle on. Unfortunately the U-Pull seat I bought didn't have a height adjuster for the passenger, and I find when I look closely that the fore/aft adjuster handle that I had planned to graft in its place is different. Bent, vs straight. I had been going to cut the handle off the front and weld it to the side, but that bend in the plastic is a problem. Well, if you're going to weld do it right! I went to my scrap bucket and found a length of 3/8 rod. Was chromed, and I think had been part of a tool that I found somewhere, but it was all rusty. I used the torch to bend it into a triangular shape about the same size as the missing handle. I then broke off what remained of the plastic handle and welded the triangle to the end of the metal lever. A coat of rattle-can black and the thing even looks almost like it ought to. The tracks are getting solvent-tanked, and then will get greased. I love the smell of acetylene in the morning! -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Today's progress. Speaking of glow plugs, it is possible to work on and modify the old series-plug relay. Replaced the horns. For whatever reason, both old ones were dead. The vacuum tank had leaked down by morning, I don't suppose that is a surprise. I next tackled the glow plug relay, which has been having some intermittent faults. (No light.) I opened the harness connector and squeezed the sockets together a bit (to tighten them up) and hit them with contact cleaner. I then burnished the pins on the relay and opened it up to check the capacitor values. (It's interesting that the current to the plugs is sensed via a 1-turn transformer around a reed switch.) Two of the larger caps were bad, so I replaced them. The big one (2200uF) that runs the light was OK, oddly enough. Unfortunately while messing around on the bench I managed to slip with a probe and blew up two diodes, one a 6.8V Zener. This took some time to find! I had a junkbox 6.2V Zener, I call that close enough. Anyway, after several hours of circuit tracing and head scratching I got it back to where it was before I killed it. (We won't be 'billing' for that time!) The beauty of electronics from this age is that there are rarely special parts inside, component-level repair is entirely possible. Next, check the timing. I want to try to extend it to the long side to make up for the engine's age. It obviously needs a lot of preglow! I dug some numbers out of the MB manual: deg C deg F OhmsSpec. Measrd. Modified - - - --- --- -30 -22 45-65 -20 -4 35-54 -10 14 26-46 -5 23 30 nom. 0 32 850020-35 27 40 20 68 12 nom. 25 77 25008-169 15 80 176 300 0-4 0.5 1 On the bench with the resistance at 8500 Ohms the time was 27 seconds. The appropriate trim pot inside could make the light's time shorter, but not any longer, so I paralleled an additional 1000uF capacitor with the 2200uF one, which extended the light time to 40 seconds. (All that circuit tracing helped decide how best to do this.) The glow timeout is about 150 seconds. Anyway, after all this the time was better but the light was still flakey on a test drive. (I was picking up chainsaw chains, and the central locking worked fine when I tried it.) Back on the bench it was sensitive to twisting and bending. So though I had resoldered almost everything already I had not done the heavy relay and connector pins, which are the most likely candidates as they are so big (cold). I did those and then it was no longer sensitive to flexing. Back in the car the light behaved as I'd expect. Whew! -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Jim, I am so glad that you are having such a fun time with this car. Lynn in WA
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
I had a busy day! From the log: B. Arctic weather again! Had to use the heat gun to thaw the door enough to open. Before I got too cold I managed to fabricate the missing link for the throttle junk, so now the cruise can be hooked up again. (I'm sure the amplifier is broken, but it'll get its turn.) I also got the chewed-up idle cable threaded back through its adjuster, but still need to come up with an attachment to the linkage. Jacked up the corner and put in the missing brake pad wear sensor, courtesy of the U-Pull. I got out the MityVac and checked the various (five) vacuum systems for leakage. It appears that the only real leak is the door lock system (which was expected), so that's good. There might be a slow leak in the vacuum tank, it's hard to tell. My fingers got frozen so I came in for breakfast and to put my feet up by the fire. I knew I had to open up the driver's door anyway, so I'll start chasing the vacuum system there next. I then replaced the door check strap and the broken door release handle. Then I made up a new moisture barrier, and started chasing the vacuum lock system. The left side of the car is OK. I'm working through the tees that are under the floor mats, and I'm labeling the vacuum lines as I figure out what they are. I have a sneaking suspicion that the trunk-located stuff is at fault, and the auxiliary fuel tank is definitely in the way. Must it be removed to get at the vacuum tank and the fuel filler lock? Both right-side door lock actuators leak, as does the trunk. I pulled the trunk actuator and found that what is leaking is the little collar around the shaft, the body is sealed from the elements and the main diaphragm is thus well-protected from mechanical damage and oxidation. It does not leak. I'm trying an experiment where I use weatherstrip cement (the good stuff: 3M) to seal the small cracks in the collar. ...The sealing seems to have worked, the pod now holds vacuum. I next moved on to the fuel door lock and removed it (painful!), it looked OK but leaked somehow, so I disassembled it and sealed its diaphragm too. It was rather difficult to get back in. The thing leaked down several times, but I kept pulling it out and looking at it, it looked fine and didn't leak on the MityVac, yet when in place it leaked. The lines, right? Wrong, I capped those and _they_ didn't leak then, yet the entire assembly did. I think the tees are getting stiff, I finally got it together once and it did not leak. The front passenger door lock also leaked, so I opened up the door and removed the element. It looked really grungy, so I supposed its diaphragms were torn. I disassembled the element and tubbed it, scrubbing with a bristle brush. Everything cleaned up nicely, so nicely that I couldn't see anything wrong with any of the four diaphragms. The rubber was still pretty 'live'. A mystery, I put it back together (all clean and warm) and it sealed. Same problem with the lines leaking, though, when it was in place. I tugged on the lines through the door hinge trying to make it worse, theorizing that there was a crack there, but then it stopped leaking altogether and I was unable to get it to leak thereafter. It's a bit of a mystery, but I think that the rubber is actually in pretty good shape (except for the one smoking gun in the trunk) and was just stiff and dirty from disuse so that it didn't quite seal in lots of places. I put the system back together and it worked great! Even the vacuum reservoir seems to be holding. Whether this system will hold vacuum for more than a few hours, though, remains to be seen. I made up a new moisture barrier for the passenger door and reassembled it. I still have to do the driver's door and put back the floor channels. I then went under the hood and cleaned up the vacuum piping, then put it in its final configuration. The MityVac shows no leaking of any of the vacuum consumers, except the key (brown) line when the key is off. (No leaks when it is on.) I started the car and all the vacuum stuff seemed to be working, and the car even shut off immediately with the key. Success! -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Now come on over and swap some parts over for me when you get some time! Actually, I'm looking forward to getting this 240D and having some fun with it. I'm glad that you're having some fun with yours! Kevin in Hillsboro Oregon 1973 220D
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Out shopping I picked up some light bulbs to finish today's job, and while I was at it I did a gross test of the 0-60 time. (One-one thousand, two-one thousand...) Roughly 25 seconds, which is in the ballpark for these. Having putted around on errands in this thing I must say that except for the sluggish acceleration it's a fairly pleasant little ride. Cold-blooded starting, though. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Jim Good. Drive it like you stole it and put some purge or other diesel additive in and push it hard. (Sorry Marshall, about eh additive part. My 240D is nothing like it was 4 years ago when I got it. Now borders on responsive to the throttle on the highway. Dwight Giles, Jr 1979 240D auto, 250K + miles 1990 300D 2.5t, 129K miles Wickford, RI -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jim Cathey Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2006 8:28 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon Out shopping I picked up some light bulbs to finish today's job, and while I was at it I did a gross test of the 0-60 time. (One-one thousand, two-one thousand...) Roughly 25 seconds, which is in the ballpark for these. Having putted around on errands in this thing I must say that except for the sluggish acceleration it's a fairly pleasant little ride. Cold-blooded starting, though. -- Jim ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Oh man! What am I in for with this old slushy 240D? An exercise in patience, I'd say. Can anybody tell me what the normal driving/shifting characteristics of this 79 240D would be? It seems reluctant to downshift on its own which doesn't help matters any. (And rarely [if ever] starts out in 1 unless the lever is in L.) But the linkage is already pulling as hard on the tranny's lever as will let the throttle go to full stop. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
(And rarely [if ever] starts out in 1 unless the lever is in L.) How's the kickdown switch? Does the kickdown solinoid click when depressed? If not, that would be quite depressing! Good luck with that thing! Kevin in Hillsboro Oregon 1973 220D PS. What's your resale price gonna be for that 240D once its ready to go with the bugs all cleaned off the rear window?
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Maybe it needs more Drive It Like You Stole It to get the cobwebs out. Fresh fuel and a few hundred highway miles. Maybe you should round trip to Moses Lake On Sunday, March 5, 2006, at 09:46 AM, Jim Cathey wrote: The brakes and wheel bearing seem to be sorted out, the car drives fairly normally on the road now. Smelly provided a replacement front hub (with all the trimmings). Still a gutless pig, I worry about the continued health of bugs flying near my rear window. My first 240D slushbox driving experience, this must be what everybody's talking about. I think I'll stick to sticks, myself. What a difference! I wonder why there's a trailer hitch on this thing? Seems rather impractical. -- Jim ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Clay Seattle Bioburner 1972 220D - Gump 1995 E300D - Cleo 1987 300SDL - POS - DOA The FSM would drive a Diesel Benz
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
I thought he meant to keep you from peeing all over the owner by fixing it and driving it away after you stole it from him. Just my interpretation. Dwight Giles, Jr 1979 240D auto, 250K + miles 1990 300D 2.5t, 129K miles Wickford, RI -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of kevin kraly Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 6:07 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon Car drove just fine, and due to the rain no bugs were endangered by the back window. Oh man! What am I in for with this old slushy 240D? If I decide to buy it and I can get it running, it's primarily going to be an in-town car, the veggieoilmobile. Kevin in Hillsboro Oregon 1973 220D parting out ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
How's the kickdown switch? Does the kickdown solinoid click when depressed? If not, that would be quite depressing! Switch clicks, but I've not checked into the electrical part of it yet. Never even had the fuse box cover off yet! But the lights work, looks like I might drive it to band tonight. Just me and the boy... According to the Haynes I've already adjusted the linkage as it should be done. I think. Still got old fuel in it, I must say I'm not too keen on filling it up or anything like that! I'm up a 3 socket extension, that was what was plugging the second hose to the heater core (due to GM valve being flanged in there). -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
PS. What's your resale price gonna be for that 240D once its ready to go with the bugs all cleaned off the rear window? Unsure. I'm trying to make money off of this one though, as an experiment. $2k? With much Bio blah blah trumpeting? -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
On 3/6/06, Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: own which doesn't help matters any. (And rarely [if ever] starts out in 1 unless the lever is in L.) But the linkage is already pulling as hard on the tranny's lever as will let the throttle go to full stop. Jim, Don't know from practical experience, but I've talked to a local MB private specialist in the past about certain vehicles I have been interested in and how he felt about them. Apparently there are a couple, several?, transmissions that do that in MB's past. They were designed to start out in 2nd, and L/1st was only for hard pulls from stop, so the driver would have to know that's how he wanted to start and downshift manually (in an automatic) to get to 1st . this *may* be how this transmission works. In fact, at the time I thought it was so weird I googled it and found some info on how to change that characteristic. That might be the google I used to find this list ... odd circle of events. Ed -- Knowledge is power... Power Corrupts. Study hard... Be Evil.
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Jim, Yes that 240D starts out in 2nd-unless you push/kick down hard as you are taking of and kick it into first. It will (should) do that in either S or D. Dwight Giles, Jr 1979 240D auto, 250K + miles 1990 300D 2.5t, 129K miles Wickford, RI -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ed Booher Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 8:59 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon On 3/6/06, Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: own which doesn't help matters any. (And rarely [if ever] starts out in 1 unless the lever is in L.) But the linkage is already pulling as hard on the tranny's lever as will let the throttle go to full stop. Jim, Don't know from practical experience, but I've talked to a local MB private specialist in the past about certain vehicles I have been interested in and how he felt about them. Apparently there are a couple, several?, transmissions that do that in MB's past. They were designed to start out in 2nd, and L/1st was only for hard pulls from stop, so the driver would have to know that's how he wanted to start and downshift manually (in an automatic) to get to 1st . this *may* be how this transmission works. In fact, at the time I thought it was so weird I googled it and found some info on how to change that characteristic. That might be the google I used to find this list ... odd circle of events. Ed -- Knowledge is power... Power Corrupts. Study hard... Be Evil. ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
The Bondo job on the headlight surround seems to have been successful. Looks a lot better now, though it is a solid painted item. Am doing the other one now. I thought about having my wife paint a 'bloodshot eye' effect, but I don't know if that's a great idea or not. Anything has got to be better than the interior moss and globs of dirt that I had. The kickdown solenoid is now clicking for sure, and the backup lights definitely are on (they share a fuse, along with the horn). Next test drive I'll know more about the shifting. I can't believe that a 240D doesn't normally start in 1! -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
A new chain will be peened, and the old chain would have the clip link. At least that is how the chain from Rusty came to me, and IIRC, the list has mentioned the need to peen or use the special chain tool. also not to reuse the clip link On Thursday, March 2, 2006, at 06:49 PM, Jim Cathey wrote: Hint. Don't stop. I never saw one get so bad that it wouldn't drive somewhat normal. Saw plenty of blown chains/engines. I don't understand. What shouldn't I stop? I don't want to buy a chain if it's already got a new one in it that is misinstalled. But how to detect this... -- Jim ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Clay Seattle Bioburner 1972 220D - Gump 1995 E300D - Cleo 1987 300SDL - POS - DOA The FSM would drive a Diesel Benz
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
A new chain will be peened, and the old chain would have the clip link. At least that is how the chain from Rusty came to me, and IIRC, the list has mentioned the need to peen or use the special chain tool. also not to reuse the clip link I found no clip link, nor signs of sloppy peening. Could well be the factory swaged chain still there. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Jim, Mine is as you described-crossing the firewall and then back over the top to the IP-pix to follow off list. Dwight Giles, Jr 1979 240D auto, 250K + miles 1990 300D 2.5t, 129K miles Wickford, RI -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jim Cathey Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2006 5:07 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon I'd be happy to take and send you pictures of the throttle linkage of my '79 240D. I am not sure if I have that type of linkage you are looking for or not-mine is a series of rods with pivots that goes over top of the valve cover. If that's it' let me know and I'll happy to shoot and send. My brother has a 78 which might have the earlier type of linkage. That's it, probably. Both vintages have bunches of Rube Goldberg crap on top of the valve cover, the difference is on which side the throttle pedal force is applied. In the older style the linkage runs along the firewall to the right side, forward to a pivot at the exhaust manifold, up (via a dogleg) to the valve cover, over the top, then finally down to the IP. There's extra crap bolted here and there for cruise, idle adjust, stop lever, AT. This as described is the one I'm looking for, detailed photos of the mess at the top specifically. (You can see how this is handy for throttle-plate-equipped machines like gassers or older diesels like the Frankenheap, where most of that linkage needn't be there.) The newer style has the linkage run forward (as a torque rod) from the firewall, and then is linked here and there upwards to the valve cover for whatever reasons. I have examples of this style, no photos are required. Thanks! -- Jim ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
redghost wrote: A new chain will be peened, and the old chain would have the clip link. At least that is how the chain from Rusty came to me, and IIRC, the list has mentioned the need to peen or use the special chain tool. also not to reuse the clip link An original chain or one that's been replaced with a factory replacement in the last 10 or so years will NOT have a clip. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Pierced IP diaphragm? On Friday, March 3, 2006, at 07:11 AM, Jim Cathey wrote: If it's off one tooth (cam gear), you won't be able to turn the engine by hand - a piston will hit a valve. I had a one tooth jump the first time I changed a timing chain - there was no doubt. Backed it up one tooth, and the engine ran as sweet as could be. Ah, but which way did yours jump? I can't explain it, but this one reads at more than 20 degrees ATDC, and runs. All the way to redline though with no power. I'm thinking I'm going to have to rig the dial indicator and go back to basic principles to make sure the timing scale is right, etc. -- Jim ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Clay Seattle Bioburner 1972 220D - Gump 1995 E300D - Cleo 1987 300SDL - POS - DOA The FSM would drive a Diesel Benz
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Dog needed to go to the vet, so I popped out the back seat and put in the dog bed instead and we went to town. Car drove just fine, and due to the rain no bugs were endangered by the back window. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Here is my car, right down to the auxiliary fuel tank. Mine looks the same, but it measures out more like 20 gallons not the 50 this guy claims. Except, of course, this car is a couple of years newer with a lot less miles, and in generally excellent condition. Unlike mine. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=4617065320 -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
The seller wrote: Inside, the car feels fresh and inviting. and pulls hills easily with passengers aboard. The transmission shifts properly, and downshifts with a dab of your toe for accelerating past slower vehicles (!). Holy cats, this guy is, how you say, on crack. The thing pulls hills? With 70 gallons of fuel and with passengers and an automatic? Did he fail to mention the twin turbo chargers? This guy could sell sand to Tucsonans. He even feathered the photo edges in Photoshop. I'm trying to figure what makes this car worth a few times more than mine. Good to see what your car looks like, Jim. Brian 83 240D From: Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2006 22:16:25 -0800 Here is my car, right down to the auxiliary fuel tank. Mine looks the same, but it measures out more like 20 gallons not the 50 this guy claims. Except, of course, this car is a couple of years newer with a lot less miles, and in generally excellent condition. Unlike mine. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=4617065320 -- Jim ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net _ Dont just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
You're right Brian- 240D auto pulls hills as in barely. I like the dab of the toe marketing language . TRANSLATE= push till your calf muscles hurt when you get to the top. But I love the old things. I also agree with your comparison-my 90 Saab 900se was much tighter than the 240D. But my 124 300D is probably as tight as my Saab. Stick in the Saab makes it hard to strictly compare. Also front and rear drive. Dwight Giles, Jr 1979 240D auto, 250K + miles 1990 300D 2.5t, 129K miles Wickford, RI -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian Chase Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2006 3:09 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon The seller wrote: Inside, the car feels fresh and inviting. and pulls hills easily with passengers aboard. The transmission shifts properly, and downshifts with a dab of your toe for accelerating past slower vehicles (!). Holy cats, this guy is, how you say, on crack. The thing pulls hills? With 70 gallons of fuel and with passengers and an automatic? Did he fail to mention the twin turbo chargers? This guy could sell sand to Tucsonans. He even feathered the photo edges in Photoshop. I'm trying to figure what makes this car worth a few times more than mine. Good to see what your car looks like, Jim. Brian 83 240D From: Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2006 22:16:25 -0800 Here is my car, right down to the auxiliary fuel tank. Mine looks the same, but it measures out more like 20 gallons not the 50 this guy claims. Except, of course, this car is a couple of years newer with a lot less miles, and in generally excellent condition. Unlike mine. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=461706532 0 -- Jim ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net _ Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Holy cats, this guy is, how you say, on crack. The thing pulls hills? With 70 gallons of fuel and with passengers and an automatic? Did he fail to mention the twin turbo chargers? More like 45 gallons. Good to see what your car looks like, Jim. More like: ...car used to look like! Anybody got (or could take) a detailed photo of the throttle linkage mess atop the valve cover? I want to see how the extra linkage stuff I found in the trunk fits on, so I can hook up the idle knob and cruise actuator. This is a 79 240D, without vacuum to the tranny. It has the around-the-engine-in- 80-days throttle linkage, a vestige of the throttle butterfly system, rather than the ball-socket torque rod that came later. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
The brakes and wheel bearing seem to be sorted out, the car drives fairly normally on the road now. Smelly provided a replacement front hub (with all the trimmings). Still a gutless pig, I worry about the continued health of bugs flying near my rear window. My first 240D slushbox driving experience, this must be what everybody's talking about. I think I'll stick to sticks, myself. What a difference! I wonder why there's a trailer hitch on this thing? Seems rather impractical. -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Jim I'd be happy to take and send you pictures of the throttle linkage of my '79 240D. I am not sure if I have that type of linkage you are looking for or not-mine is a series of rods with pivots that goes over top of the valve cover. If that's it' let me know and I'll happy to shoot and send. My brother has a 78 which might have the earlier type of linkage. Dwight Giles, Jr 1979 240D auto, 250K + miles 1990 300D 2.5t, 129K miles Wickford, RI -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jim Cathey Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2006 9:25 AM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon Holy cats, this guy is, how you say, on crack. The thing pulls hills? With 70 gallons of fuel and with passengers and an automatic? Did he fail to mention the twin turbo chargers? More like 45 gallons. Good to see what your car looks like, Jim. More like: ...car used to look like! Anybody got (or could take) a detailed photo of the throttle linkage mess atop the valve cover? I want to see how the extra linkage stuff I found in the trunk fits on, so I can hook up the idle knob and cruise actuator. This is a 79 240D, without vacuum to the tranny. It has the around-the-engine-in- 80-days throttle linkage, a vestige of the throttle butterfly system, rather than the ball-socket torque rod that came later. -- Jim ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Maybe the trailer hitch was for a bike rack-or for a pusher engine. Dwight Giles, Jr 1979 240D auto, 250K + miles 1990 300D 2.5t, 129K miles Wickford, RI -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jim Cathey Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2006 12:46 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon The brakes and wheel bearing seem to be sorted out, the car drives fairly normally on the road now. Smelly provided a replacement front hub (with all the trimmings). Still a gutless pig, I worry about the continued health of bugs flying near my rear window. My first 240D slushbox driving experience, this must be what everybody's talking about. I think I'll stick to sticks, myself. What a difference! I wonder why there's a trailer hitch on this thing? Seems rather impractical. -- Jim ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Still a gutless pig, I worry about the continued health of bugs flying near my rear window. My first 240D slushbox driving experience, this must be what everybody's talking about. All of my W123's were NA 300 slushboxes which some say are gutless pigs, but still faster than a slushbox 240D would be. I've never ridden in a 240D of any flavor. The slowest slushy that I've ever ridden in and was LUCKY enough to own was a 1962 Corvair Monza convertible with a 2spd powerglide whose timing was quite retarded! It did OK once it was straightened out. Once while in a gas station, my dad told the attendant to hurry back, and the guy's reply was You can't possibly be in a hurry; You're drivin' a Corvair! From what you said, I guess that the same holds true for 240D's. Kevin in Hillsboro Oregon 1973 220D slushy
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
I'd be happy to take and send you pictures of the throttle linkage of my '79 240D. I am not sure if I have that type of linkage you are looking for or not-mine is a series of rods with pivots that goes over top of the valve cover. If that's it' let me know and I'll happy to shoot and send. My brother has a 78 which might have the earlier type of linkage. That's it, probably. Both vintages have bunches of Rube Goldberg crap on top of the valve cover, the difference is on which side the throttle pedal force is applied. In the older style the linkage runs along the firewall to the right side, forward to a pivot at the exhaust manifold, up (via a dogleg) to the valve cover, over the top, then finally down to the IP. There's extra crap bolted here and there for cruise, idle adjust, stop lever, AT. This as described is the one I'm looking for, detailed photos of the mess at the top specifically. (You can see how this is handy for throttle-plate-equipped machines like gassers or older diesels like the Frankenheap, where most of that linkage needn't be there.) The newer style has the linkage run forward (as a torque rod) from the firewall, and then is linked here and there upwards to the valve cover for whatever reasons. I have examples of this style, no photos are required. Thanks! -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
kevin kraly wrote: If a tooth equals 18 degrees, is it true that the cam gear has 20 teeth for 360 degrees? No, that would mean the crank sprocket has 20 teeth and the cam IP have 40. One tooth equals 18 degrees at the crank, not at the cam.
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
Wow, Jim! I am so glad to hear this. especially after yesterday! Lynn in WA
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
If a tooth equals 18 degrees, is it true that the cam gear has 20 teeth for 360 degrees? No, that would mean the crank sprocket has 20 teeth and the cam IP have 40. One tooth equals 18 degrees at the crank, not at the cam. Or some ratio. I don't think there's quite 40 teeth on the cam sprocket. But it could have 20 and the crank 10. (And I don't think either of these figures is right.) -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] Project 240D in Oregon
No, that would mean the crank sprocket has 20 teeth and the cam IP have 40. Ah, that makes sense! The crank turns twice the number of revolutions as the cam. Kevin in Hillsboro Oregon 1973 220D project
