forms -- the "required" attribute
I'm setting up an HTML and tried to use the "required" attribute on one input field. (Actually my form consists of only that single field.) Unfortunately "required" has no effect in Netsurf (#5033 on Ro 5.25). The user can get away with just clicking Submit without entering any data. In the Netsurf documentation, the section on web standards says "Forms: nearly done". I presume this attribute is one of the undone-yet! I tested my form on Chrome (on Android fone), and it rightly did not allow Submit to be clicked before the user filled in the field. In fact Chrome zooms in on the field and pops up a tooltip-like box pointing to it saying something like "You must fill in your name". I don't suppose RiscOS can do the tooltip thing, but maybe Netsurf could put a similar message at the bottom of the window where we usually see "Done (0.1s)" -- maybe even in flashing red? Or a message in the field itself -- like the "placeholder" attribute. By the way, it would be nice if Netsurf could automatically blank the "placeholder" text (as other platforms do) when the user begins to type something in the field. Of course Ctrl-U does the trick in RiscOS, but it has to be done manually or else the placeholder text gets submitted along with what's typed. (And naive users might not know the Ctrl-U keystroke.) I found detailed specs here but haven't yet tried everything: https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTML/Attributes/required Cheers. And thanks again to the faithful dedicatees on the Netsurf crew for all their work over many years! -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Please test webp image format
> In article <1c52658a2840684728dce5b1fa248...@imap.plus.net>, >David Pitt wrote: >> The bad news is that there is colour transposition seen on RISC OS >> 5 on the Titaniun and RPi3B+, and OS4.02 on RPCEmu. Yellows appear >> as blue and vice versa. Red and blue transposed, probably. cj wrote on 7 Dec: > The colours are reversed on iMX6 as well, so it is not limited to the > OS rgb/bgr reversal.a Yes, same. Here on ArmX6 (Ro 5.25, RComp 2018-apr) the fire shown in the last photo looks quite surreal when coloured cyan. Welcome news, though, ye Netsurf team! Only yesterday I was frustrated when somebody shared me a photo that arrived in Google's newfangled WebP format. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: RISC OS CI#4886 - can't type reply
Vincent Sanders wrote on 8 Nov: > This was reported as issue > https://bugs.netsurf-browser.org/mantis/view.php?id=2715 > I resolved the issue and should be fixed in 4890 and onwards I loaded #4891 and re-tried the text-area thing I reported in this thread. That problem too has now disappeared, though I'm not clear how they were connected. Thanks, Vincent. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: RISC OS CI#4886 - can't type reply
David Higton wrote on 7 Nov: > Something appears to have gone wrong betweem the RISC OS CI versions 4885 > and 4886. I tried typing a reply in the ROOL site, but no keyboard input > appeared. The same is true for for 4886 and 4887, but 4885 is OK for me. > Can someone else please try this and let me know if you can reproduce it > - if so, I will report it. I was using #4887 earlier today and found that none of the controls for a text area would work (Ctrl-A, Ctrl-C, Ctrl-X etc). Went back to my previous version, #4881, and all is well. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
page refresh -- still a problem
This problem again (using Netsurf #4881 on ArmX6 OS 5.25). See threads in this list dated 2016-may-03 (when #4088 was in use) and 2018-july-13. Did some further updates on the Archive site today, and again came up against the old fails-to-reload problem. None of these do the trick: F5 or ^F5 or ^R or the buttonbar route or Adjust-click on the buttonbar or ^buttonbar or Netsurf menu "Navigate > Reload this page". The old page always reappears. Tried quitting and restarting Netsurf, still no joy. Before anybody asks: the site does not use frames. I guess the item will have to be cleared from my local cache. Is there a straightforward way of doing this that I don't know about? Iconbar "Choices > Cache" does not offer one. Seems to me the "Reload this page" option ain't strong enuf. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: "Warning from Netsurf: Unknown"
Vincent Sanders wrote on 4 Nov: > I have changed how all network errors are reported to be a proper error > page instead of a popup. please can those affected (using CI builds) > confirm that the new behaviour is more informative and works for them. Thanks for that welcome change, Vincent. I downloaded and installed #4881 just now and tried the site that I first reported in this thread. I now get a "Connection timed out" error page -- screenshot here : http://archivemag.co.uk/TEMP/NS-timedout.png (45K) But I'm not clear whether this page came from Netsurf or from the site named in the URL bar of the page. If Netsurf, could I suggest that your design say so? (Maybe just add a Netsurf logo.) Anyway, it *is* more informative! Cheers. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: "Warning from Netsurf: Unknown"
Tim Hill wrote on 22 Oct: >> [Jim:] Could the error message be made more informative than just the one >> word "Unknown" ? > NS 3.9 correctly says "timeout was reached". I'm using 3.10 Dev CI #4874, which says only "Unknown". -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: "Warning from Netsurf: Unknown"
Daniel Silverstone wrote on 22 Oct: > On Tue, Oct 22, 2019 at 11:49:01 +0100, David Pitt wrote: >> [INFO netsurf] content/fetchers/curl.c:1189 fetch_curl_done: done >> http://www.dalsemi.com/datasheets/appindex.html >> [INFO netsurf] content/fetchers/curl.c:1232 fetch_curl_done: Unknown >> cURL response code 28 > This code is CURLE_OPERATION_TIMEDOUT Could the error message be made more informative than just the one word "Unknown" ? -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
"Warning from Netsurf: Unknown"
I downloaded Netsurf #4874 today, replacing #4850. Upon trying to load various websites I get a mysterious error message that says only "Warning from Netsurf: Unknown". The status line at the bottom of the Netsurf page also says "Unknown". Example: http://www.dalsemi.com/datasheets/appindex.html I would like to know what this means! I don't recall getting this message in previous versions of Netsurf. But maybe it's just a bad day today. Using ArmX6 with Ro 5.25 (Rcomp 2018-apr-25). -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Google and #spf
Dave Sine Surnomine wrote on 23 Sep: > #4850 with Javascript enabled, google.co.uk doesn't work. > With Javascript disabled, google does work okay. You're right! Sure makes one wish for that "Javasccript on/off" button on the Netsurf button bar that we've oft wished for! (Ancient Fresco had one, could pinch the icon from Fresco.) So much handier than repetitititive trips to iconbar Choices > Content > Disable Javascript > Set. Have never found a way of programming Keystroke to do this. If anyone has succeeded, please export the relevant Keystroke Selection file & share it. Or a "switch" that could be added to an URL file to set Javascript off, when relevant to that particular URL, as in this case. And thanks for looking into the problem, Daniel. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Google and #spf
For the past few days, telling Netsurf to go to http://google.co.uk results in an endless loop and no joy. What's this all about? The Netsurf URL bar changes from what I typed to this: http://www.google.co.uk/#spf=1569197185001 The 13-digit number keeps changing, and the hourglass keeps running. With or without Javascript enabled. Was using Netsurf #4845 when this phenomenon began. Downloaded #4850 just now, but still no joy. https://duckduckgo.com/html/search continues to work with no prob. So what is Google playing at? Is a fix likely for Netsurf? -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: The 3.9 Release / documentation for Media Queries etc
Vincent Sanders wrote on 21 Jul: > NetSurf 3.9 features support for CSS Media Queries (level 4) and > improvements to JavaScript handling. > Also included are many bug fixes and improvements. Good work: thanks to the whole Netsurf team. I'd like to know more about Media Queries vis-a-vis Netsurf. Will the documentation (link from Netsurf welcome page) be updated soon? As I understand it from the bottom of my learning curve, Media Queries has to do with designing a website so that it automatically adapts according to whether the user is viewing it on a large or small screen. In the site I have been working on, I have treated Netsurf as the default. Realizing that Windows users habitually view a page the full size of their wide monitor, and thus get unreadably wide lines of text, I inserted a workaround to constrain page to 800px (about A5 width). This works fine on A5 Android tablet too. The problem of sensibly adapting the layout for a small screen on a smartphone has so far eluded me, hence my interest in Media Queries. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
shortcut "font" in CSS
Does the shortcut version of the "font" property in CSS work properly in Netsurf? This CSS gives me the display I want: font-family: serif; font-style: italic; font-weight: bold; font-size: 24pt; This single CSS expression is supposed to be equivalent, but Netsurf ignores it: font: serif italic bold 24pt; Or am I failing to understand the spec? Using #4682 and many previous builds. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Gmail In Netsurf 3.9 / keyboard shortcut for Javascript
Justin Wierbonski wrote on 21 Sep: > ... is there a keyboard shortcut for turning off/on javascript? Something I've wished for (on this list and elsewhere) for ages! Good old Fresco, years ago, had a buttonbar item to switch its (primitive) Javascript on and off. I have tried, but failed, to use !Keystroke to set up such a key. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
the "up" button misbehaveth
The "up" button (normally 5th from left, an upward-pointing triangle, aka "move up directory tree") I find really useful. A feature Netsurf has that mainstream browsers don't (as far as I know). It deletes the tail of the URL back to a "/", and a second click back to the next "/", etc. However, its behaviour has been a bit wonky in recent versions of Netsurf. Sometimes the truncation is back to the middle of something, rather than back to a "/". I'm using #4451 on ArmX6 Ro 5.25 and Armini(Beagle) 5.22, but this misbehaviour began more than a year ago and unforch I can't say exactly which #. Anyone see the same? -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: bad linebreaks
Steve Fryatt wrote on 27 Apr: [re longstanding flaw where Netsurf thinks it's OK to break a line at a tag or an entity] > I'm fairly sure (without going to check) that it's both known about > and has been stated that it is being ignored until the component > responsible is replaced as part of the road to Javascript. I'm > guessing the layout engine, but I could easily be wrong on that -- as > Chris says, it has been many years. Fingers crossed for a cure in the forthcoming release! -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
new release and nested
Michael Drake wrote on 15 Aug: > We are close to making a release, and would like to check that > nothing is broken. It seems to be a current fashion that many websites declutter their menu by grouping sub-options under a minimal number of main choices. Some sites do this only for small screens, and give a fuller list on large screens. Alas, Netsurf seems to get the small-screen version. Here's an example: http://stjohns-glastonbury.org.uk At first I groaned and presumed it's the usual Javascript impasse. But looking at its HTML code, you can see that its navigation system uses (unordered list) for the three menu items that Netsurf shows, but WITHIN each of these list items is nested a second set that Netsurf does not display. Any chance that the new Netsurf release could add this trick? I've no idea how difficult it would be. (But at least it ain't Javascript!) I upgraded to #4405 just now, in hope, but nope. (I'm the volunteer coordinator for this church website, so I have to deal with it often. As a workaround, I copied the HTML for the navigation section into StrongEd and inserted linebreaks to make it easier to read. Each of the menu items has a straightforward URL to the relevant page within the site. So I simply saved my tweaked version as a new local page called "menu-redux/html", and now I can click in that page to be taken to where I want within the site.) -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Missing images
Richard Porter wrote on 9 Aug: > I've got a strange problem on one of my sites. > On http://www.mmpa.org.uk/ all of the gif images are missing, including > the yellow navigation buttons at the top. Yellow buttons appear here OK on newly installed Netsurf #4405. (Using ArmX6 with Ro5.25) -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Please try the latest build
Michael Drake wrote on 15 Aug: > Please try entering the incorrect credentials, the correct > credentials, and canceling the login, by closing the login window. Problem arises in testing this: After a successful login, Netsurf will return to the site without asking again for credentials. How do we make it forget so that we can try again to see what happens with bogus credentials? (Of course no problem if I had more carefully read Michael's instruction that said to try with incorrect credentials *first*.) -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Please try the latest build
Michael Drake wrote on 15 Aug: > Please try entering the incorrect credentials, the correct > credentials, and canceling the login, by closing the login > window. Using newly installed #4405 here on ArmX6 with Ro5.25. All the above tests (in that order!) work OK. Have always thought, though, that it'd be nicer if Netsurf gave some message when a login is unsuccessful, rather than just repeat the identical dialogue, which the user can feel is an infinite loop. Some months ago I reported a site that asked for ONLY a password, WITHOUT a username. Netsurf failed but other browsers coped, giving a reduced dialogue box. (That site, for a wedding now past, now gives only an "under construction" page, but other examples might exist at www.squarespace.com where it was hosted.) Dunno if Netsurf's revised code would now cope with this unusual situation. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
why is site php.net so slow in Netsurf?
Trying to learn stuff from http://php.net is so painful on Netsurf because any page from the site takes ages to load and a further age to scroll. (Using #4342) I'm curious about the mechanisms involved. Any wisdom, please? -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: launching a PDF from a link
Tim Hill wrote on 11 Jul: > Yes, I think that was Jim's desire: click on a link to a PDF on a webpage > and it opens in your default PDF viewer without the save-drag & > double-click. Gzackly. The extra steps are too much for the technophobic Mrs N. She can view a Jpeg link without extra steps, so why must Netsurf require fifflefaffle for PDF? (Similar Q for MPro (and Pluto?) email with Jpeg vs PDF attachments.) -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
launching a PDF from a link
Is there a way of causing Netsurf to actually open a PDF, rather than offering to download it, when the user clicks a link to the PDF? When you click the link for a Jpeg (or various other types of file), the file opens immediately. Why does PDF behave differently? What is the mechanism involved? And why does the PDF link cause BOTH the download dialogue AND a blank web page to appear? I'm using RiscOS 5.23 and at the moment Netsurf #4342. (I presume things would differ for, say, Amiga instead of RiscOS.) -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
bad linebreaks
I raised a report on the bug-tracker about really bad linebreaks that Netsurf sometimes commits. This isn't a new thing. I'm using #4316 but fault has existed since many many versions ago and as far as I know has never been reported. My theory is that the Netsurf code thinks it's OK to start a new line when text reaches nearly the edge of the frame and that it can perform the break not only at a wordspace but also at an HTML tag, i.e. at "<" or ">" or "". (Hmm, what about ?) You too often see a word like "Johns" with the apostrophe-s or just the -s on the next line. Or a split in the middle of something like "x2=4y". Or "( blabla)" can leave the opening or closing parenthesis on a different line. Or worse. It obviously depends on the width of the window, so you might have to drag the width to see it happen (presuming of course that it's not a fixed-width page). Try a news page from http://theregister.co.uk as an example. Anybody concur with me? -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Page which doed not display properly
Richard Torrens wrote: >> It is not a J/S thing. But the html is terrible to decipher! Tim Hill wrote on 8 Mar: > It is. The >26 tags would beg to differ. Would be nice to add a colour for ... to the HTML mode in StrongEd so that JS would immediately jump out at you in a page where "the html is terrible to decipher". I think somebody is working to update that mode but I can't remember who. Is it you, Tim? Indeed, it'd be nice if the Netsurf toolbar were to include a graphic that would light up to alert that a page contains Javascript. I have often wished for a button that would switch Javascript on or off and indicate the status (just a shortcut for iconbar choices > Content). (Meanwhile my Netsurf "welcome" page does include Tim's welcome workaround from 2016nov, to indicate Javascript on/off status.) -- Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk
displaying a nested list
Any chance that Netsurf could be made to display a nested list, please? Many designers seem to like using this feature for menus -- here's an example: http://stjohns-glastonbury.org.uk All three of the menu items here (About, Heritage, More...) are meant to produce a dropdown of several sub-items. Netsurf users might assume the problem is Javascript, because nothing seems to happen on clicking the menu. But inspect the HTML source and you see no Javascript, only nested lists. As a workaround, I concocted a "Menu-redux" page by saving the source, deleting most of it, and adding a tag to the head. Now I have a separate page containing all the menu items as a clickable list: http://archivemag.co.uk/TEMP/menu-redux.html An outside agency designed this site as a sort-of content-management thing; I have volunteered locally to coordinate uploading stuff to it. My Menu-redux workaround is fine for the public-facing site. However, for the Admin page I have to log in, and URLs for Admin menu items include a session ID which is different every time. So it would sure be nice if Netsurf could display those dropdown nested menus -- which are widely used -- to begin with, rather than requiring a workaround. I have no idea, though, how much developer effort that would entail. -- Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Forcing website menus to reveal themselves
Richard Ashbery wrote on 23 Feb: > Is there any way of showing Javascript driven drop-down menus? Try inspecting the code of the site (in Netsurf press F8) in a text editor. Search for a unique-ish word that is used in one of the menus. You might find a bunch of stuff matching all the menu words to a specific URL within the site, including the menu words that would appear as a drop-down in the mainstream browsers. I recently found this to be the case in one site I use a lot, so I concocted myself a little "menu-bypass.html" page that takes me direct to any page I want. (PS: If this works for you, howbout writing it up as a hint for Archive?) -- Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.riscos-swshow.co.uk Feb 24
Re Wikipedia (OT)
Tim Hill wrote on 19 Feb: > Even Wikipedia gets this right. If it didn't, then of course it would now, because you surely have signed up for an account as one of the crowd-sourced and peer-reviewed editors and you would have contributed the required correction. -- Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.riscos-swshow.co.uk Feb 24
Re: linking to root of website, not root of drive
Michael Drake wrote on 19 Feb: > On 19/02/18 15:46, Jim Nagel wrote: >> - NetSurf displays the pages served up via WebJames perfectly, >> except that it is NOT obeying the stylesheet > I guess WebJames is not serving the CSS file with the "text/css" MIME > type. I think there's a mimemap file that lives somewhere in !Boot, > which may need updated with an entry for CSS. WebJames may ship with > an example mimemap for this. Ah, thanks again, Michael! Found the required Mimemap syntax for a CSS entry in the "Solved problems" section of the Webjames helpfile. However, I then found I *already* have that entry in my Mimemap! Then a closer look: I found that the file 2018/css had RiscOS filetype Text. Changed filetype to CSS (), relaunched Webjames -- and now everything is fine! (Begs the question: why does RiscOS actually bother having a specific filetype for a CSS file? It's only text. Doubleclicking it only loads it into a text editor. Nothing else in RiscOS except the browser, as far as I know, has any use for a CSS file. The HTML page invokes the file as "xxx.css" and explicitly declares it as a stylesheet. The distant host doesn't care about RiscOS filetypes. What was the mechanism that made the filetype matter in this case? Academic, I guess, now that it's working!) -- Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.riscos-swshow.co.uk Feb 24
Re: linking to root of website, not root of drive
Richard Porter wrote on 19 Feb: > I have the same problem. I'm running WebJames with its root directory > as the directory containing my web sites. That means that "/" on the > local site takes me back to the top level and not the root of the site > I want. Eureka! I tried setting a system variable in Choices.Webjames.Attributes, on the DocumentRoot line and Webjames happily served it. So in that attributes file I now have DocumentRoot <webjames-thissite$dir> and in the root directory of each of my sites I now have an obeyfile called !!hey-Webjames (the plings to put it at the top) containing set webjames-thissite$dir <obey$dir> filer_run SSD.$.Network.Servers.!Webjames (your pathname might differ) Put a copy of the identical obeyfile into the root of each site. So when I want to point Webjames at a single specific local site, simply doubleclick !!hey-Webjames in that site's root directory. In Netsurf's URL bar type just "localhost" and Webjames serves it. (Webjames doesn't seem to mind the apparently repeated filer_run line when it has already been running for a previous site.) -- Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.riscos-swshow.co.uk Feb 24
Re: linking to root of website, not root of drive
Richard Porter wrote on 19 Feb: > ... I don't think your ISP's software comes into it unless your ISP is > also your hosting company. Sorry: I used the wrong term. I did mean the hosting company. -- Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.riscos-swshow.co.uk Feb 24
linking to root of website, not root of drive
I have tidied up one of my websites to make better use of CSS, and now intend to add some new pages to it. Of course I want to keep it Netsurf-friendly. The section of each article includes the usual link to my stylesheet, which (in Linux filepath syntax) might be 2018.css or ../2018.css or ../../2018.css etc depending how many branches back it roosts on the directory tree. Advice from Linuxland tells me that simply prefixing a "/" with no dots before it makes the link "absolute" (to the root of the website) rather than relative to the page where we are when writing the link. IT would be quite handy to use this trick rather than having to adjust the links for stylesheet, page background and top-of-page graphic if I relocate a page in the directory structure. This indeed works when viewing my page online. However, when developing the page in the local copy of my site rather than online, the "absolute" version of the link looks for the *root directory of my own RiscOS drive* rather than the root of the website. If I make a copy of the stylesheet as $.2018/css Netsurf is happy. Is there a way around this? Is there some setting I would need to make in Netsurf to define what I mean by "/" as root? (Presumably there is such a setting in my ISP's software, for I am not being taken to the root of their drive!) Excuse me if this is a dumb question, but I haven't been here before. http://glastonburyconservation.org.uk if anybody wants to have a look. -- Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.riscos-swshow.co.uk Feb 24
date in search results
What causes Google (or other searchers) to display (or not display) a DATE in search results? For instance, search for "Terran site:iconbar.com" -- some of the items listed show a date and some don't. If I ran the world, *every* item would show a date. So often one wants current information, not waste time on stuff from 2001. But sometimes historical stuff is indeed what is sought. So state date. I've long wondered what the mechanism is. -- Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.riscos-swshow.co.uk Feb 24
Re: CSS support for display:table
Thanks for such a swift reply, Michael. Will digest and report back.
You said:
> The min-content value for width is just at editors draft stage.
> https://drafts.csswg.org/css-sizing-3/
> So it's subject to change, and not standardized yet.
In the final para of my post, I didn't quote all the code I found in
that Stackoverflow suggestion about width:min-content (which was
dated 2015). The writer included interim lines addressed to specific
browsers while the aforementioned editors' deliberations continue. He
suggested:
figure {
width: -webkit-min-content;
width: -moz-min-content;
width: min-content;
}
That seems to mean Mozilla and Webkit. Is there perhaps an equivalent
for Netsurf?
--
Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk
|| See you at the show? www.riscos-swshow.co.uk Feb 24
CSS support for display:table
I'm wondering if Netsurf CSS supports these commands (if that's the correct term) display:table or width:min-content Netsurf's online documentation for development progress says the CSS "display" category is complete, but I can't seem to get this particular display function to perform. What I'm struggling to achieve is to use the and tags to produce a caption under a photo. This works fine as long as the caption is a single line. But if the caption text is longer, you'd think it would simply flow to a new line under the picture but, no, it fills the width of the whole page before it breaks to a new line. See examples: http://archivemag.co.uk/TEMP/Netsurf-figure/ . The main part of the page is a tutorial (from my son); my attempts are added at the bottom. * The page "works-but-uses-BR.html" nearly shows the result I want -- picture and caption at the right of main story, which starts at top of page alongside the picture. But take out my bodged tags and see what happens. * The "tablecaption-X.html" page fails (see (3) below). Multi-line captions are so common (look at any magazine or newspaper) that I'm surprised that CSS doesn't have a simple built-in standard for them. Obviously whatever approach I settle on, I want it to suit Netsurf as well as mainstream browsers. The idea for using display:table came from an online search: (1) https://stackoverflow.com/questions/6534473/how-can-i-make-the-wid th-of-my-figcaption-match-the-width-of-the-img-inside (2) https://stackoverflow.com/questions/10264463/can-a-figcaption-be-r estricted-to-the-width-of-a-responsively-sized-image The third idea uses table:caption; caption-side:bottom; -- again, does Netsurf support it? In my attempts the caption lands at the right of the picture, not beneath it. (See "tablecaption-X.html".) (3) https://www.sitepoint.com/community/t/how-to-force-this-figcaption -element-to-respect-its-parents-width-boundaries/30025 (Unforch this link stymies Netsurf but try e.g. Firefox or Android.) A promising idea in (1) is width:min-content -- a value for width used in the reply at https://stackoverflow.com/a/28341085/496046 that is apparently new, according to documentation at https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/CSS/width#min-content -- does Netsurf support this? -- Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.riscos-swshow.co.uk Feb 24
CSS for a RiscOS font and button
=== 1 === In CSS, is it possible to specify a particular RiscOS font? For example, Oxford.Bold.Italic -- what would the CSS syntax be? Presumably those dots in the Ro filepath would change -- to what? Viewers of the page in question will be mostly RiscOS users, but the font declaration should degrade gracefully for people who don't have that font or for anybody happening to view the page on other platforms where the font might be called Optima or just generic sans-serif. I know it's general good practice to stick to "standard" fonts, but out of curio city, I'm wondering how to specify this partic font. === 2 === In CSS, how would I define a button to look like a familiar RiscOS action button? I mean like the one at the bottom of a Save dialogue, with a yellow moat around a grey slab. I want to use it for "Submit" at the bottom of an HTML form. (I am adapting a page where a grey panel further up is actually a menu though it shows only the default option -- the appearance of the current Submit button close by is too similar.) Thanks. -- Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.riscos-swshow.co.uk Feb 24
Re: online telephone directory
Jim Nagel wrote on 5 Feb: > ... Until a week or two ago (last time I needed it) the BT Phonebook > worked fine in Netsurf. The new design is in the > big-boxes-on-mostly-blank-page style that seems the current fashion > (e.g. the gov.uk pages). ... Hmmm, I thought the new design was giving me no result when I search, but rather just redisplaying the same page. However, I again searched for my own home phone number, scrolled way down the page, and there it was. Tried again, searching for the person I actually want to find, scroll down, it's blank. Scroll some more, and suspect I saw a snippet of text. Did Ctrl-A, and, aha, it must have been white text on a white background, for I now see text saying the number is ex-directory. Tiresome. -- Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.riscos-swshow.co.uk Feb 24
online telephone directory
Sigh. BT has yet again redesigned the front-end of its online phonebook: http://thephonebook.bt.com Do F8 in Netsurf and admire the pretty layout of the code. Until a week or two ago (last time I needed it) the BT Phonebook worked fine in Netsurf. The new design is in the big-boxes-on-mostly-blank-page style that seems the current fashion (e.g. the gov.uk pages). Does anybody know a current phonebook site that DOES work with Netsurf? -- Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.riscos-swshow.co.uk Feb 24
Re: list just quiet, or am I still cut off?
Funnily enuf, a handful of postings came through in the past couple of hours, from Martin Avison, Tim Hill and myself. All dated today. Tim Hill wrote on 11 Nov: > I can see eight postings dated 8 Nov. Message IDs are > <20171108112311.gg13...@platypus.pepperfish.net> > <d16f6b19706a9cad2b9edde199d5d...@wingsandbeaks.org.uk> > <d492fd9756.r...@user.minijem.plus.com> > <5697c374a7li...@torrens.org> > <5697cbebe8li...@torrens.org> > <5697d25908...@timil.com> > <5697c81778...@timil.com> > <5697fb898ccvj...@waitrose.com> The last one on your list (Chris Newman, "Pane srolling") is the only one that I see. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
i am cut off again
Thanks to those who replied by email to my earlier posting today. I haven't received any of the Netsurf items they received in the past few days, nor my own. It does indeed appear that my Netsurf feed is blocked again. Thought it was cured last week. Will take it up again with my mail host. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
list just quiet, or am I still cut off?
The last item delivered to me from this list was Dave Higton's, dated Nov07 at 20:56. I understood that the firewall block of Netsurf traffic (a "port flooed") that had somehow come into being at my mail server had been cleared on Nov07 at 17:31. So have there been 0 postings to this list since Nov07 20:56, or has some new blockage come into being? I shall now see whether I receive my own post. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: problem with Mailman or is it just me?
Tim Hill wrote on 6 Nov: > (bcc to JN) > In article <a87cd39656@abbeypress.net>, Jim Nagel > <nets...@abbeypress.co.uk> wrote: [snip] >> https://listmaster.pepperfish.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/netsurf-use >> rs-netsurf-browser.org >> I went to the Netsurf-users Info Page [via link quoted above] and >> subscribed using a different address (a valid one), but it responds: >> "You must supply a valid email address." I wonder if a couple of others could try that link, please: try subscribing to the Netsurf list from a different valid address of your own. Do you get the same message as I did? What ISP are YOU using? > I would guess that the newsletter site is doing a reverse look-up of your > email address and, just as the routing failed as set out in Message with > ID: <20171105113126.gw7...@platypus.pepperfish.net> it is failing to get > the right response from your email service's server. No response means > invalid address, apparently. > But, hey, I guess you didn't see that or receive the direct copy so I'm > probably wasting my time. I resorted to the Netsurf-users Archives to see recent postings to the list, and found Tim's message there. (Jeremy Nicoll supplied the link: https://listmaster.pepperfish.net/pipermail/netsurf-users-netsu rf-browser.org/ ) > I think I'd be speaking to my ISP and ask them if changing ISP is the > only cure. If you don't get the bcc of this maillist article I would > definitely change ISPs. ;-D No, I didn't get the BCC email either. Please do a "reply-all", which will send to both my Abbeypress and Archivemag domains, which are hosted on separate servers (Xencentric and Orpheus respectively). Rob Kendrick (Netsurf team) and Neil Spellings (Xencentric) have been in touch regarding routing details; stand by. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
problem with Mailman or is it just me?
I havent received any messages from the Netsurf list since Oct26 -- other than two odd ones which DID arrive (my own on Nov02, Geoffrey Baxendale on Nov03). Others have told me that messages DO arrive to them, including another one or two that I myself posted. I have tried fetching my mail using both Netfetch 5 (which has introduced some form of DMARC) and the older Netfetch 3.66; no joy. https://listmaster.pepperfish.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/netsurf-users-netsurf-browser.org I went to the Netsurf-users Info Page and subscribed using a different address (a valid one), but it responds: "You must supply a valid email address." Then further down that page, I tried UNsubscribing. Instructions here say "If you leave the field blank, you will be prompted for your email address." So I left it blank, clicked Unsubscribe, and it replies: "Error: No address given." According to the bottom of that page, the list is running on Mailman version 2.1.5. Is there a glitch, or is it just me? Could someone else try unsubscribing or subscribing, please, and report? (Please copy any reply via email to me, else I won't see!) And could there be any connection with my not receiving messages from the list though I am able to post -- or is it again just me? -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
test2
I'm getting reports by private email that they received my earlier "test" message in the Netsurf list. But here, I still have received nothing beyond the two messages I listed in that earlier "test" posting. Peculiar. It's not that I am receiving NO messages from the list, because those two odd ones DID arrive after Oct26. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
test
Sorry, just a test. Oct26 was the last message I received from this list. People elsewhere reported they received postings after that. Today I received two. Will this one now come through to me? -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
"no username" trips authentication dialogue
A nephew has emailed us a wedding invitation in the form of a website. It requires a password, which he tells us in the email, but does NOT require a username. With Netsurf, the site starts loading, then the "Site Authentication" dialogue pops up asking for Username and Password. Leave the first field blank, type the password, click Login, loading apparently continues, then the Site Authentication dialogue pops up again (showing blank and password just as we left it). I tried on an Android browser. Its dialogue shows only a Password field, no field for username, and it displays without problem. Seems strange if the RiscOS authentication routine has never come across this situation before. Netsurf #4204. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
"no username" trips authentication dialogue
A nephew has emailed us a wedding invitation in the form of a website. It requires a password, which he tells us in the email, but does NOT require a username. With Netsurf, the site starts loading, then the "Site Authentication" dialogue pops up asking for Username and Password. Leave the first field blank, type the password, click Login, loading apparently continues, then the Site Authentication dialogue pops up again (showing blank and password just as we left it). I tried on an Android browser. Its dialogue shows only a Password field, no field for username, and it displays without problem. Seems strange if the RiscOS authentication routine has never come across this situation before. Netsurf #4204. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Page layout
Richard Torrens (lists) wrote on 26 Oct: > ... screen shot at http://photos.torrens.org/wv.jpeg > NetSurf is correctly using the option but these don't > work properly. This on ARMX6 with NS 3.7 (Dev CI #4207) Here on #4204 I can't get the Contacts page that you show in the screenshot. You must have got a dropdown from the "About us" button (or somewhere) that I don't get here. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Page layout
Richard Torrens (lists) wrote on 25 Oct: > I suspect the developers don't need more examples of pages that don't > lay out properly? But in case they do, try http://watervoles.com Home page and some others look OK here (Netsurf #4204), but some of the menu dropdowns require Javascript. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Netsurf info panel remains blank -- a FontFS problem?
>> On 27 May, Jim Nagel wrote: >>> ... the info line at bottom left of main [Netsurf] window stays blank. >>> In the past, it usefully showed the target URL when the pointer was >>> over a link in the main window. ... >>> * #4085 and #4088 -- here on Armini Ro 5.22 and ArmX6 5.23. Dave Higton, Brian Howlett and Peter Young report that Netsurf #4088 works properly for them. I tried reverting to Netsurf 3.3 and now see the same blank there too. Which was not the case here in the past. Ah, on my Armini it DOES work correctly, just not on the ArmX6. So it must be something in my system -- but what? I checked all the options in Netsurf iconbar choices: nothing seems relevant to this question, and I haven't changed anything there in months. Aha. My desktop font (set in Configure > Theme) is Oxford, which is held in FontFS on the ArmX6. If I change desktop font to Homerton, which is in "rom", Netsurf's info line returns to normal behaviour. Misbehaviour again if I choose any other FontFS font as desktop. Yet the Armini has exactly the same desktop font as ArmX6, and there Netsurf behaviour is normal. So I remain puzzled. Anyway, the problem is not with Netsurf. I'll pursue my puzzlement elsewhere. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
info panel remains blank
In recent builds* of Netsurf, the info line at bottom left of main window stays blank. In the past, it usefully showed the target URL when the pointer was over a link in the main window. Is this change of behaviour intentional? Or perhaps a line of code has been overlooked in the revision process? Anybody else noticed the same thing, or is it just me? * #4085 and #4088 -- here on Armini Ro 5.22 and ArmX6 5.23. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: input focus
cj wrote on 5 May: > It happens here as Jim described ..., with ROS 5.23 (19 Jan 17). Mine is 5.23 (2016-June-29). (I should get round to the upgrade!) -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
input focus
I notice that the input focus -- often but not always -- goes to Netsurf when I click on a link in an email that opens a web page. This was not the case until fairly recently*. The input focus always used to remain with the email window. Is this the result of a deliberate change in Netsurf, or is it just a fluke of some sort? Not a serious problem, just that I have to consciously change some of my habitual keystrokes in a repetitive chore that I do. (* I first noticed the different input-focus behaviour with Netsurf #4001 and now #4085. In my previous versions (#3955 and back), Netsurf did not take the input focus till I explicitly clicked in its window. Throughout this period, my email software has had no update.) Using Ro 5.23 on ArmX6, Ro 5.22 on Armini (Beagle). -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Window position
Richard Porter wrote on 6 Apr: > I can't see the point of 'Stagger window position' being on ... So often I wish that the "stagger" behaviour would behave more helpfully, when I have a page of search results and want to follow several of them. Adjust-click the first result -- a new Netsurf page opens, covering the results page. Bring it to the front. Adjust-click the second result -- a new Netsurf page opens, covering the results page. Bring it to the front. Etc. Perhaps if stagger were configurable, the new pages could open far enough to the right so that enough of the list of results remains visible for the next Adjust-click. Or maybe a new trick such as Shift-Adjust-click could open the new window *behind* the one I click in. (Perhaps this is comparable to the likes of Firefox, where you can configure whether opening a new tab puts you immediately into the new tab or lets you remain in the present one, in my case the list of search results.) -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.wakefieldshow.org.uk April 22
Re: KYP West
Brian [Bailey, we discover] wrote on 26 Mar: (re http://www.kypwest.org.uk ) > The site now seems to load but accessing individual geographic areas gets > the following, > Proxy Error > The proxy server received an invalid response from an upstream server. > The proxy server could not handle the request GET /kyp/southglos. > Reason: Error reading from remote server The Know Your Place site itself (http://kypwest.org.uk) seems to load OK, but the indiv geographical areas you call pages from the Bristol city council site, e.g. http://maps.bristol.gov.uk/kyp/?edition=glos The page for the exhibition at Wells (near me) is also hosted on an outside site (https://bishopspalace.org.uk), and Netsurf unforch has pictures on top of text etc. I know not whether the shortcoming is in Netsurf or in nonstandard coding of the site, of course. But thanks for the pointer, Brian. Will mention Know Your Place in the local conservation newsletter I do. ** If you see this line in your reply, you need to SNIP ** -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.wakefieldshow.org.uk April 22
Re: Netsurf inconsistent behaviour between RISC OS 5.23 and 6.20
Brian Jordan wrote on 24 Jan: > The home page of www.clubmans.org.uk has a news area in the lower > part. It is intended that this is a scrolling and in all > mainstream browsers I have tried this is the case [1]. it is also the > case in NetSurf #3966 running under RISC OS 5.23 on my Raspberry Pi. > ... Here, it looks as you describe it should. ArmX6 with Ro 5.23 and Netsurf #3955. (Might pinch some of your design ideas!) -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: history and hotlist not saved; CSS site
Harriet Bazley wrote on 24 Nov: >> [Jim wrote:] The hotlist is saved in Choices:WWW.Netsurf >> But where is the history saved? > Choices:WWW.Netsurf.URL I think. Ahh, yes. That filename wasn't obvious till hindsight. And now that I look at the directory with Full Info and date order, behold the three files Hotlist, URL and Cookies at the top of the list, stamped with the exact time I shut down last night. I'll put in a formal feature suggestion (via Sourceforge?) that additions to Hotlist ought to save themselves immediately (or the user being given a chance to save them manually, at least). I can't be the only Netsurf user who has ever lost stuff like this because of the machine losing power or freezing, and Netsurf not having the chance to quit correctly. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: history and hotlist not saved; CSS site
Harriet Bazley wrote on 23 Nov: > On 23 Nov 2016 as I do recall, > Jim Nagel wrote: >> Does Netsurf not save its hotlist and history till the user quits the >> program? >> > No, it doesn't. > An attempt to avoid constant unpredictable disc accesses, I assume, > and it's not a problem until the program crashes, but it would be nice > at least if editing the hotlist physically updated the relevant file - > it's not something that happens all that often, unlike opening new > pages, and unlike in other programs there's no way to 'save your work' > manually. >It's a bit counter-intuitive that the only way to ensure that > changes to the program data are preserved is to quit the program > immediately after making them! Amen to that! Counterintuitive indeed. The hotlist is saved in Choices:WWW.Netsurf But where is the history saved? -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk Abbey Press 32 Norbins Rd(01458) 83 3603 Glastonbury BA6 9JG pocket 0797 415 3861 >> before emailing large files (>1Mb), please ask me for FTP details
history and hotlist not saved; CSS site
Does Netsurf not save its hotlist and history till the user quits the program? Last night I was looking for tips on how to use CSS for something on my website, came across a wonderful site and immediately added it to my Netsurf hotlist. An hour later, some other application froze and the computer had to be rebooted. Today I wanted to return to that site about CSS, but there was no record of it in my hotlist. Nor in my history. Tried all sorts of searches via Google and Duckduck -- no luck. Bereft. Is there any way to make Netsurf save history and hotlist during a session? Or am I misunderstanding something? As for the site I lost, maybe somebody else knows it and could point me in the right direction. - Exceptionally clean design. The bits of code within sentences were presented with a grey background. - Fine use of language, not cutesy or nerdy or commercial. - It had a surprisingly nifty name, one syllable I think, almost in the league of web.com or code.com -- so simple it made me wonder that the writers found it still available. - Further surprise when I got to a deeper page: it was a UK company, despite the ".com" domain, located somewhere like Shoreditch or Marylebone. Stop press: Found it! It's html.com Back to original Q about when Netsurf saves its hotlist. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: memory-gobbling on Virtual Acorn
Bryan Hogan wrote on 20 Aug: > You've missed out several important bits of information: > - what version of VRPC SA > - what version of RISC OS 4.02 > - how much memory is currently allocated to VRPC was 16M (dunno how it ever got set so low), now 256M > - how much memory Netsurf is gobbling all of the 16M > - what sites are you visiting when this happens Just some Spamcop report-response pages -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: memory-gobbling on Virtual Acorn
Dave Symes wrote on 20 Aug: > Open the Model.cfg file in a text editor. > Look for the [Ram] entry and change accordingly. Many thanks, Dave. I think that has done the trick. Was puzzled at finding TWO [Ram] entries in the file. From memory: [Ram] base = 0x100 16Mb [Ram] base = 0x140 16Mb What are the two entries for? When I changed only one from 16Mb to 256Mb, Windows was sorry that Virtual Acorn had encountered an error and could not start. I changed the other entry as well, and now all is well. Methinks VRPC feels faster overall, and Netsurf behaves like it does at home on ArmX6. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
memory-gobbling on Virtual Acorn
I'm using Virtual RiscPC on my ol' Windows XP laptop while away from base. Various wrinkles of this setup are still unfamiliar to me. One is that Netsurf (recent, #3538) too quickly eats up all the free memory. What can I do to avoid this? I guess I either need to fix Netsurf or need to find a way to make Windows give more memory to VRPC. Haven't yet found a way to do either; advice welcome, please. -- Jim Nagel www.archivemag.co.uk my cross-Canada cellfone 519 589 3732
Re: Failure when receiving data from the peer
>>> http://www.ccrexplorers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=17 Vincent Sanders wrote: >> I have retrived this page with and without javascript on gtk and >> framebuffer frontends without problem so i must conclude the issue >> lies with the Atari frontend. Chris Young wrote on 10 Jul: > It's working here too but I did notice that the page downloads *very* > slowly, so maybe it is just timing out? >Try increasing curl_fetch_timeout and/or max_retried_fetches Chris didn't say what platform he's using. But here on RiscOS (to my surprise) the page loads and displays quite quickly with Javascript off, a bit slower (I think) with Javascript on. Netsurf #3538. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: how to make Netsurf forget its logged-in state
Frank de Bruijn wrote on 14 May: > If I quit NetSurf it *does* forget the login details, as I would have > expected. The authentication window pops up again after a restart. > That's with NetSurf 3.6 (Dev CI #3538). Which version are you using? I'm using Netsurf 3.5 #3433 (with Javascript switched off at the moment, if that's relevant). And I'll update today, I promise. I usually update much more frequently; the past month or two are atypical. You're right, though: quitting Netsurf does forget the login details. So that's obviously the simple solution to my original problem. Still would like to know where Netsurf stores this info -- cache? -- and if there'd be any way to erase it (i.e., to "log out") without quitting everything else that might be open. Further curious observation just now after restarting Netsurf: I type the URL as http://archivemag.co.uk/Volume24/01 and give details in the login box; I get in. Then I type the URL as www.archivemag.co.uk/Volume24/01 -- this time including the optional www prefix -- and the login box appears again. So it seems Netsurf treats these as two separate cases, even though they lead to the identical target in the website itself. OK, no harm in that, just an observation. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: how to make Netsurf forget its logged-in state
[Please reply to the list rather than to me privately.] Ashish Gupta wrote on 13 May: > Thanks for explaining the login process. It looks like you make use of > Basic Auth for the login. The PHP includes statements like this: if (!isset($_SERVER["PHP_AUTH_USER"]) Does that confirm what you say about "Basic Auth"? Is that something that resides on the server as a resource for customers like me? (As you can see, my knowledge of PHP is minimal; this routine was written for me by somebody else.) > I think you should be able to destroy the saved state if you login > using another username and password. > Could you try doing this ? > Open this URL, http://username:passw...@yoursite.com in netsurf. Did that, using a different valid username as part of the URL, as you suggest. Got in without seeing a login box. > Could you try a couple of cases ? > One, a username password which is valid but different from the saved one. > A different (invalid) username password combo. > I am hoping the invalid combo forces the login window next time (or > locks you out). Did those tests too. In all cases, I got in without seeing a login box. Then downloaded the log file which the PHP generates on the server and checked it. These login tests do NOT appear on the log. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: how to make Netsurf forget its logged-in state
Harriet Bazley wrote on 12 May: > Clearing the cache/cookie file? Thanks. Cookies: none involved -- it's my own site I'm talking about, and it doesn't make any cookies. Cache: Is there an easy way to clear the Netsurf cache? Where is it? >From the web page displayed in Netsurf, menu>Utilities offers Hotlist, History and Cookies; no mention of Cache. The relevant History entry can be cleared, but that does not cure my present problem. Iconbar menu leads to History and to Cookies, but no mention of Cache. Iconbar Choices includes Cache, but the resulting dialogue does not mention clearing it. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
how to make Netsurf forget its logged-in state
I'm tinkering with something on my own website, an area that requires the viewer to provide a username and password. I successfully get in with my own username and password. Now I want to test those of another user. So I click the link that takes me to the subsite -- and I'm straight in; I don't see any box asking for username and password. Tried Ctrl-F5, menu Reload, tried deleting from the History file, tried quitting and relaunching Netsurf. Still never see the login box again. How do I "log out"? (If that's the correct term in this situation. Maybe it's more like changing the "state".) -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: online phone book
Gavin Wraith wrote on 3 May: > ... If you try > http://thephonebook.bt.com/publisha.content/en/search/residential/adva > nced.publisha [as a single line] > you will get a page that NetSurf can cope with ... . Yay! Thanks so much. That goes immediately into my Hotlist, and probably also onto the Netsurf home page here, and also as a Hint into Archive. > I would be amazed if pleas for a Javascript-free interface did not > fall upon deaf ears. ... Oh, I had never imagined imploring BT to go JS-free, but I did imagine there might be some comparatively slight tweak that they could make so that at least their first-level buttons would work. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: online phone book
Jim Nagel wrote on 28 Apr: > Can anybody point me to a free online telephone directory that works > on Netsurf? None? -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Netsurf refresh -- frames
Jim Nagel wrote on 13 Apr: > I recently updated the home page of my own website. Then tested > viewing it with Netsurf. It kept serving up the old page, despite my > clicking Netsurf's Reload button -- with Select (to reload page), then > again with Adjust (to "reload page and all the objects it contains"). Did some further updates on the Archive site today, and again came up against this fails-to-reload problem. Neither ^F5 or ^R or the buttonbar route do the trick: old page always reappears. Then an Aha moment. My change was to the contents of a FRAME within the page. Is there any way to cause a frame to reload? Do the powers of ^F5 etc need to be extended? Still using Netsurf #3433 here, on Armini 5.22 and ArmX6 5.23 -- I promise to fetch newest version this weekend. (As for frames, I see their disadvantages. The Archive site was maintained for 15 years by a volunteer member, who designed it when frames were in fashion. Sad to say, he died at Christmas.) -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
online phone book
Can anybody point me to a free online telephone directory that works on Netsurf? The BT one worked fine until two or three years ago, when it seems they "improved" some Javascript or something. Now only the "find a business by type" section (the default) works in Netsurf. Clicking the other tabs, "Find a business by name" and "Find a person" both produce an irrelevant Products and Services page: http://www.thephonebook.bt.com/publisha.content/en/index.publisha Have searched the web for alternative directory sites, but all want you to register and pay, or they don't work in Netsurf. I could have a go at making suggestions via the BT press office, if anybody could clue me in on what the tech problem is. It might well be something fairly simple in their Javascript. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Netsurf refresh
Vince M Hudd wrote on 13 Apr: > Ctrl-F5 - which may be unfamiliar, but is standard on all the browsers > I use (including NetSurf) - is the keystroke I use to reload pages > when working on websites because it *does* fetch a new version of the > page, rather than just reload it from a cache. Interactive help for the item on the Netsurf buttonbar does say "Reload". Does it do the same thing as Ctrl-F5 or not? -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Netsurf refresh
This might or might not be related to the issues Vincent Sanders talks about in the current thread "Netsurf cache". I recently updated the home page of my own website. Then tested viewing it with Netsurf. It kept serving up the old page, despite my clicking Netsurf's Reload button -- with Select (to reload page), then again with Adjust (to "reload page and all the objects it contains"). Is this non-update to be expected? Am I misunderstanding the use of Reload? (Hmm, just noticed from a search of Netsurf menu that the shortcut for "Navigate > Reload page" is Ctrl-F5 -- I didn't try that unfamiliar keystroke, but presume it does same as above. Is Ctrl-R used at all?) I finally deleted the history file; then my revised page displayed. Shouldn't reload trump history? Using Netsurf #3433 at the moment. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Netsurf Cache -- relocation tangent
Richard Porter wrote on 12 Apr: > I exclude any cache directories from backups. Ditto Scrapdirs. When you do a search, however, !Locate so far lacks the ability to exclude specified directories. That's what decided me to move !Cache and !Scrap to the very end of the root directory. !Locate used to spend ages hunting through them. Now I can simply abort the search before it gets to the end. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Netsurf Cache -- relocation tangent
Martin Avison wrote on 12 Apr: > ... problems with the cache taking large amounts of disc > space, and the resulting long backup times for !Boot ... Several months ago I got fed up with this, and also with time wasted by !Locate searching through all of !Cache. So on all my machines I made a new directory that comes alphabetically last: $._ !Cache and !Scrap and !Newsdir now live there, with appropriate pointers in the old places. Works well. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk Abbey Press 32 Norbins Rd(01458) 83 3603 Glastonbury BA6 9JG pocket 0797 415 3861 >> before emailing large files (>1Mb), please ask me for FTP details
Re: bad formatting of news page
I find on the Netsurf bugtracker (Mantis) that back in Feb, Chris Young reported the same problem with web pages from his local paper in Bedford. http://bugs.netsurf-browser.org/mantis/view.php?id=2426 The Bedford pages bear an uncanny resemblance to those from my Somerset local, so I'm guessing they use the same software to generate them. Michael Drake, of the Netsurf team, replied this morning in the bugtracker thread, rather cryptically: This is: LibCSS needs to gain support for Media Queries. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
bad formatting of news page
What is it about the formatting of my local newspaper's web pages? Netsurf shows the main column of text so narrow that every line requires horizontal scrolling. Typical example: http://www.centralsomersetgazette.co.uk/Baily-s-costs-dream-revive-2-000-jobs-Morland-s/story-28054944-detail/story.html I find the least painful way to read the story is to save the whole page as text and then read the textfile. Has the website programmer made some inept setting in the stylesheet (CSS), or is Netsurf making some mistake or interpreting something too literally? I presume browsers such as Firefox show what the designer intended. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
multi-core processors
Some of the new Arm hardware running RiscOS (e.g. the ArmX6 and Titanium) has a multi-core processor. So far, of course, RiscOS lacks the ability to make use of the extra potential. Question occurs to me: what's the situation with the other platforms on which Netsurf runs -- Amiga, Atari, etc? Does multi-core ability exist in hardware there? Do the Netsurf developers have ideas for how Netsurf could take advantage of the extra processing power when the OSes allow it? -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: unresizable web page (last bank standing)
Richard Ashbery wrote on 5 Mar: > Now downloaded C1 #3433 and image displays correctly. Resizing > enlarges picture as expected. Text remains same size. Yes, here too, having newly updated to #3433. So thanks to the Netsurf team for correcting whatever it was. (Now if only the Lloyds suits will be so cooperative, they will be the last bank standing in this town and could mop up all the customers the other three banks have deserted.) -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk Glastonbury
unresizable web page (last bank standing)
Is it something about the coding of this site or about Netsurf's rendering of it? Or maybe it's in the CSS of the page? https://www.change.org/p/last-bank-standing-don-t-let-communities-lose-their-only-bank The picture displays so huge as to be unrecognizable pixels; paragraphs of text are a single line so wide that they are unreadable. Resizing the Netsurf window (even with Ctrl on the Resize icon) does nothing but make the font smaller -- text remains a single line. Using Netsurf #3382 on Ro 5.23. === (A propos the site cited, Barclays Bank closes its branch in this town at this very moment. Natwest closed a year ago, HSBC a few months ago. That leaves Lloyds. And Lloyds closes later this month.) -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk Glastonbury
Re: Review: Codethink sponsored work on NetSurf, LibCSS and LibDOM
Excellent effort, Michael. Thanks from all of Us Users to you and Codethink! > ... At [Codethink](http://www.codethink.co.uk/) we have an arrangement > that allows engineers to fill time between projects by making > contributions to certain open-source projects. Netsurf (#3382) timed out when I tried to look at the Codethink site, but when I immediately tried again it displayed immediately. Curious why that should be. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
auto-launching a PDF
When Netsurf fetches a PDF file, would it be possible to trigger the PDF-reading application automatically, rather than requiring the user to save the file to disc and then launch it manually? (The manual procedure is too complex to explain to a technophobe Other Half.) What prompts me to ask is that I came across the following text inside !PDFtest.Docs.Hints, which is dated 1998-03-24, apparently by Leo Smiers (who ported the PDF reader from XPDF on Linux; Colin Granville carried on the work): = Hints dd 980309 = Starting !PDF from !Fresco version 1.32 It's possible to make Fresco start !PDF when it downloads a PDF file. To do this, you must add lines to the !InetSuite.Internet.Files.MimeMap and !Fresco.Runables files. In the MimeMap file add the line: application/pdf PDF ADF .pdf In !Fresco.Runables (if this file does not exists you have to create it) add the line: ADF Now quit and restart !Fresco. When you view a .pdf file, Fresco will filer_run the downloaded pdf file. If !PDF has been seen, it will load and display the page. Many thanks to Dean Murphy from ANT Ltd. Cambridge from whom I recieved this information. = Perhaps this facility exists already in Netsurf and I just don't know about it. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Filtering webpages
Stuart Winsor (aka "lists") wrote on 26 Jan: > Fresco ... display menu had the following > options, which could be ticked or not as required > Document colours (could turn off background colours to make content visible) ... > Controls (Buttons, URL bar, Status) Yes. I have always missed these two features in Netsurf, especially Fresco's control button that toggled ECMAscript (Javascript) on or off (and showed its current state). -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: 2 sites that don't!
Gavin Wraith wrote on 26 Jan: > Using it on the text of the first webpage produces source for a leaner > webpage that reveals the hidden text. Here is the procedure: > 1. Page->View Source in NetSurf > 2. Save to some scrap directory. > 3. Shift-click to load into StrongED > 4. Shift-Drag noscript to apply icon. > 5. Save the result and change its type to HTML. Did that on the first web page. Got a security warning from StrongEd about "process"; I said "allow always". Then "File name '.in' not recognised". Maybe my version of Lua is too old? !BOOT.Resources.!Lua.version says 5.70 (2013-08-16). Potentially sounds like a very welcome utility. Have often wished for a similar thing to override bothersome CSS, particularly CSS that specifies tiny grey text (which seems to be a current fashion among some designers with younger eyes than mine). -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
/ Archive 23:12 white-on-grey
cj wrote on 26 Jan: > ... and what about the latest issue of Archive where, on page 3 you > have white text on a light grey background??? Yes; that was bad. The contrast looked fine in the past, and looked fine this time too on screen, but unfortunately my printshop used a new printer. Before next issue I'll ask him to put through a test sheet with samples of the whole range of tints. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: New Netsurf - improved Javascript stability
> On 2015-Sep-29 Jim Nagel wrote: > [snip] >> I'm on #2935 (Aug 25) and have been suffering a great many sites that >> time out with no display at all. Sometimes hourglassing goes on >> forever and there's nothing for it but Alt-Break to kill Netsurf. >> Some of these cases will succeed if I relaunch Netsurf, switch off >> Javascript from its iconbar menu, and only then reload the site. Harriet Bazley wrote on 4 Oct: > Can't you just switch off JavaScript and reload the page without having to > restart Netsurf? That's always worked for me. You're right. Your revelation simplifies it a bit for me. > (Still on 2817 to avoid auto-JavaScript-start-up) I'm on #2968 now, after Vincent Sanders (thanks!) improved something as a result of a particular site I reported. Steve Fryatt posted links in this thread to the Netsurf team's explanations of why they have configured Javascript to be on by default: they WANT to receive reports of problem sites so that they can refine their code. So thanks again, Vincent! -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.riscoslondonshow.co.uk October 24
even Wikipedia times out now
It seems that Netsurf now times out even for Wikipedia. Try this page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fritzing Hourglass goes on forever, though it least it does not tie up the whole machine. Go to Netsurf iconbar choices, Content, Disable Javascript, and try the Wikipedia page again. Now it loads no problem. (Netsurf #2964 on Iyonix with Ro 5.18) Anybody else see the same behaviour? I notice that the Choices file (which results from changing something in the Netsurf configuration) no longer stores the Javascript setting -- it's on by default, and that's that. I'm pretty sure that in the past, the Choices file contained a line enable_javascript:1 (or 0). If I'm right, when did this change take place? What's the reasoning? It would sure be handy to have a keyboard shortcut to switch Javascript on and off! -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.riscoslondonshow.co.uk October 24
Re: New Netsurf - improved Javascript stability
Dave Higton wrote on 21 Sep: > I downloaded the latest CI build of NS yesterday. There hasn't been > one for quite a while. I noticed that it doesn't crash when opening a > sport page of the BBC News website, for example. This is a big > improvement. > I think we're seeing evidence of big changes within Netsurf. Anybody concur? I'm on #2935 (Aug 25) and have been suffering a great many sites that time out with no display at all. Sometimes hourglassing goes on forever and there's nothing for it but Alt-Break to kill Netsurf. Some of these cases will succeed if I relaunch Netsurf, switch off Javascript from its iconbar menu, and only then reload the site. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk || See you at the show? www.riscoslondonshow.co.uk October 24
Re: Do Netsurf's errors get logged? (Syslog, Wimplog)
In article 54f9b39313grov...@orpheusmail.co.uk, Rod at Orpheusmail grov...@orpheusmail.co.uk wrote: Would you elaborate please, as I don't fully understand. (The bit about 'kill' facility that is). cj wrote on 29 Aug: I haven't sorted the best UI yet, which is why it is not in the release version. Basically, as part of a job you could list tasks that should be killed if running (and restarted again at the end of the job). For example, if you have a job to backup your Pluto directory and data files, you could include Pluto in a kill file for that job. When it came to this job, SyncDiscs would check whether Pluto was running, and if so, issue a task close message before starting the backup. There would then be no chance of the data files changing part way through the backup, and hence the backup of Pluto ending up in an inconsistent state. This could be extended to restart Pluto once the job has completed.a However, I am not sure whether such a facility would be of general interest. Err, umm, sorry to sound as if my initials are D R, but I'm lost: is this anything to do with the subject line? -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
noscroll
http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/technical-articles/fritzing-takes-your-design-from-breadboard-to-pcb/ If you make the window bigger, you see more of the text. But the scrollbars don't change in response. Once the window fills the whole screen, there's no way to view the remaining text. The cursor keys or pagedown have no effect; nor does the scrollwheel. Never seen this phenomenon before. What's going on in the coding? If it's something in the site's CSS, is there any way of tweaking it in Netsurf? First noticed this using Netsurf #2789 on Armini 5.22; same behaviour now in Netsurf #2935 on Iyonix 5.18. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
black background obscures most of page
Most of this page is obscured by a black background that overprints all but the first inch or two at the top of the page: http://www.combehillwood.co.uk/polden-way/ This is using Netsurf #2935, the latest build, installed just now. It was the same on #2789 (dated about June 9). I'm curious to know what mechanism is at (mis)work here. Is it something in the CSS maybe? Or something in Javascript? I did a full save of the page in order to inspect the CSS, but it's beyond me. (One CSS file is nearly 700K.) I reported a possibly similar problem last spring about a CNET page that Netsurf #2644 appeared to render initially; it then immediately obscured most of it with a vertical grey band. Could that have been the same mechanism at work? Behaviour of that page is different now with #2935: even less of the text is visible. http://www.cnet.com/products/synology-diskstation-ds412-plus/ As I say, I'm curious about the mechanism. If it's Javascript, I appreciate the vastness of the programming job. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Do Netsurf's errors get logged? (Syslog, Wimplog)
Steve Fryatt wrote on 12 Aug: On 12 Aug, cj wrote in message 54f1f9a962ch...@chris-johnson.org.uk: In article cd18f7f154@abbeypress.net, Jim Nagel nets...@abbeypress.co.uk wrote: Warning from Netsurf The file could not be saved due to an error: 'ADFS::Drive2.$.2310d/zip' is a directory This is a common error and nothing to do with Netsurf as such. It is due to some oddity with SparkFS and handling of zip files, and seems to depend on how the original zip was produced (software). I get it from Filer_Action when running SyncDisc jobs. I'm not sure it's that odd. If SparkFS has been seen and the zip file has the correct filetype, RISC OS will report the object to NetSurf as a directory, not a file (/some/ calls will report it as an image directory, but others won't). In fact what caused the error was that the drive already had an object with the same name as the download I wanted to save (2310d/zip). The text of the warning was totally inappropriate and misleading. (2) The text of the warning was not recorded by !Syslog (whose job is to make it easy for people submitting bug reports to quote the exact wording of an error message). I searched the whole log and found nothing from Netsurf. Some confusion? There's no single SysLog log, so it isn't clear which whole log Jim searched... I searched anything in !Syslog.Logs with a recent datestamp, particularly the logfile called WIMP. ... NetSurf uses its own non-blocking error dialogues, so WimpLog won't ever see the errors reported. In terms of bug reporting, NetSurf's own log is far more detailed and far more useful. Does Netsurf record a warning such as this one in its log file? Its current files are 0 length, possibly because I have rebooted since the incident, so can't check. But I searched for warning in an old Netsurf logfile that I saved for some reason, and turned up nothing. Anyway, it'd be more helpful if Netsurf's download routine would say an object of that name already exists; do you want to overwrite it? rather than relay this wuzzy is a directory wuzziness. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Can't access email at www.libero.it
Rodolfo Medina wrote on 8 Jul: Since other web browsers like Firefox are too heavy for my old ones Huyndai laptop and Pentium III, I want to try Netsurf but have the problem that it won't access my email account at www.libero.it. When I try to, it redirects me again and again on the login page and form. The same problm occurs also with other browsers like w3m, Lynx, Dillo. Please help whoever can. Have you tried the mobile version of the site, if there is one? Sometimes Netsurf does better on that. Generally worth trying an m. prefix to URL, in this case http://m.libero.it -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Google
Richard Porter wrote on 8 May: I think it's absolutely essential that we have a javascript on/off button on the toolbar. If javescript is off google won't work and if it's on streetmap.co.uk won't work. I fourth the motion. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Updated disc cache
Vincent Sanders wrote on 3 Apr: If you are feeling very adventurous you can report the bandwidth achieved. This is a line in the debug Log file held in scrap *after* the browser has been quit. The last line of the Log will read something like: (2298.806358) desktop/netsurf.c netsurf_exit 294: Exited successfully The bandwidth line will be about 20 lines from the end of the log and look like (2298.804881) content/llcache.c llcache_finalise 3352: Backing store average bandwidth 128324035 bytes/second Thanks for the work. Where do we report it TO? Can you give a quicklink, please? -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
unreadably narrow column in rendering of page
These pages from local newspaper takes ages in the fetching-processing stage, and then finally displays its text in a pane that is too narrow to read. http://www.centralsomersetgazette.co.uk/Just-doctor-ordered/story-26229361-detail/story.html http://www.centralsomersetgazette.co.uk/Street-schoolgirl-gains-place-national-theatre/story-26181050-detail/story.html Dunno if the fault is Netsurf or the designer of the page. The wife (voice teacher for pupils in stories) is not impressed. Netsurf #2644 on Iyonix (RiscOS 5.18). -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: #2654 / dummy !runimage to date an app directory
Tony Moore wrote: In RISC OS, if a directory is copied, its original datestamp is loat, however if a !Runimage is present then the application directory shows the datestamp of the !Runimage, thus preserving the datestamp of the original full-save. David Pitt wrote on 18 Mar: Is this with VRPC? Not VRPC per se -- depends on the version of RiscOS. I haven't got Ro 4.39 to hand at the moment to check, but I think that in the Ro 4 *desktop* when you move a directory its datestamp gets changed, but if in Configure Filer you switch off interactive file operations before doing the move (maybe also if you use *copy on the commandline) the datestamp is preserved. At least I remember using this switch-off-interactive trick in the past to keep datestamps. In Ro 5, however, a directory's datestamp seems to be preserved if you move the directory in the normal desktop way. Can't speak for Ro 6; haven't got it. Obviously VRPC uses 4 or 6. Application directories, however, are special. In any version of RiscOS an app dir takes its date from the !Runimage within it. If there is no !Runimage its datestamp behaviour is like any other dir. Thus in the case of an app without a !Runimage, it's a useful trick to stick a dummy !Runimage inside the app directory for the sole purpose of producing a meaningful datestamp on the outer directory, so that the user can easily tell one version of the app from another. One example is the !PS3 driver, where John Tytgat and Martin Wuerthner have followed exactly that suggestion. So it makes sense in the case of the Netsurf Full save too, for the sake of users of (apparently) some versions of the OS. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
CNET page obscured by vertical grey band
Netsurf (#2644 and previous) seems to display CNET pages but then makes them unreadable by covering half or more with a vertical grey band. Example: http://www.cnet.com/products/synology-diskstation-ds412-plus/ Is the grey band actually the background of buttons at the top of the page whose height is being interpreted as infinite? Workaround: Can read all of this page by exporting to a text editor. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
wee feature request for 3.3 -- a Javascript on/off button
It would be handy if the Netsurf buttonbar had an item that would: (a) toggle Javascript on or off (b) indicate whether it's on or off. The first point is simply an immediate and visible shortcut to the iconbar Choices Content Disable Javascript. The second could be achieved by the graphic for the button: it could have lit-up and switched-off versions. This instant-and-visible shortcut would be useful during the ongoing development of Javascript for Netsurf, because some sites behave quite differently with or without our existing JS. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
Re: Change.org massively scaled images
Cristopher Dewhurst wrote on 3 Dec: Does anyone know why Netsurf scales the images on www.change.org to what seems like several thousand percent? For example on the recent petition https://www.change.org/p/new-era-should-not-become-the-end-of-an-era?u tm_source=action_alertutm_medium=emailutm_campaign=192906 [That is all one long link -- beware spurious newlines that might be inserted by email system] pixels in some of the images are about an inch square on the screen so you have to scroll over large areas to read the text. At least this is what I get on NS 3.3 Dev Cl#2419, RISC OS 5.21 Raspberry Pi, be interesting to see what happens on other platforms? On Iyonix with Netsurf #2432 I see two logos apparently at intended size and no other graphics. After the letterhead at top of page, Netsurf shows a massive grey rectangle (see separate thread) about 8 screens wide and 16 screens high. Following that is a small body of text that is up to 16 screens wide without wrapping. -- Jim Nagelwww.archivemag.co.uk
