[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Lum Gim Fong]

Longboard Atlantis with top tube wave.

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[William R.]

Oh man... I like that so much! I can't deal. My wife's going to kill me...

Bill in Westchester, NY

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Joe Bernard]

There's a new pic on the Blug of the swoopytube Atlantis. It kinda looks like 
an ANT Truss Bike with a sloping toptube. 

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[iamkeith]

There was a bubba tube in there, too.  New atlantis tube is nice, but the rosco 
bubbes were still the coolest ever.  I do like "rainbow" though.

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Deacon Patrick]

First came the double top tube. Then the diagnitube. Now ... Rainbowtube!

With abandon,
Patrick

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[phil k]

Yeah nice and also a good design to reinforce the dt.

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Chris Birkenmaier]

 EST double top tube yet!

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Richard Rios]

love it! best of 20s art deco meets best of 50s color scheme! wish they would 
do double top tubes on smaller sizes...

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Clayton.sf]

looks awesome. one little detail I wish it had are 3 hole bottle bosses for an 
anything cage, but preordered anyway - a 59 a while back  ;-).

Clayton Scott
ST, CA

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[John G.]

That’s easily my favorite double top tube design from Rivendell. Looks very 
classy!

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Christopher Wiggins]

Brynnar,

I've pre ordered these.  If you want a big 'un, let me know.

Chris

On Friday, April 20, 2018 at 1:10:51 PM UTC-4, ctifusion wrote:
>
> Vince sent me a picture of the 59 with the second top tube. It arcs 
> (curved) from the seat tube to the down tube with each joining about three 
> inches from either the top tube or head tube. Vince didn't seem to think it 
> was super secret, but it is not a staged pic and there are no decals so 
> maybe it's not one that Riv wanted circulated (I thought the Blug mentioned 
> more pics to come soon). I'm happy to post it if people think that's okay. 
>
> I think it looks cool, especially the fillet brazed joints, and it's 
> definitely a new style from earlier double top tubes. I ordered mine prior 
> to seeing it as that seemed to add to the fun of being involved in the 
> pre-sale.
>
> So, to post or not to post? 
>
> Brynnar
> Indianapolis
>
>
>
> On Thursday, April 19, 2018 at 4:42:20 PM UTC-4, Edwin W wrote:
>>
>> We have not yet seen what the two larger sizes will look like, but wasn't 
>> there a seat tube to downtube double top tube in there?
>> Inspiration could have come from this:
>>
>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-French-bicycle-frame-La-Triomphante-path-racer-randonneur-fixie/183159497124?hash=item2aa52821a4:g:cYEAAOSwRHVamvxg
>>
>> Got my double top tubes on my Appa 58,
>>
>> Edwin
>>
>> On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 2:24:37 PM UTC-5, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>>
>>> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
>>>
>>> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis
>>>
>>> Happy shopping! 
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Robert Barr]

Looks good Brynnar!

On Sat, Apr 21, 2018, 9:04 AM ctifusion  wrote:

>
> 
> 59cm new Atlantis.
>
>
>
>
>> We want the pic, we want the pic!
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[James Warren]

Wow. That looks good. Is it my imagination, or does it go with the color as 
well?

-Jim W.


> On Apr 21, 2018, at 6:04 AM, ctifusion  wrote:
> 
>  
> 
> 59cm new Atlantis.
> 
> 
>  
> We want the pic, we want the pic!
> 
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> .
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> .
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> .
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> .

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[ctifusion]

59cm new Atlantis.


 

> We want the pic, we want the pic!

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[dougP]

Joe:

I rec'd an Instagram from #rivbike today of a sketch.  yellowhausbicycles 
also.

dougP

On Friday, April 20, 2018 at 12:54:30 PM UTC-7, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> We want the pic, we want the pic!

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Joe Bernard]

We want the pic, we want the pic!

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Garth]

Well . . . It's not like the Sun will stop shining in all It's magnificence 
regardless of anyone's choices  :)  



On Friday, April 20, 2018 at 1:10:51 PM UTC-4, ctifusion wrote:
>
> Vince sent me a picture of the 59 with the second top tube. It arcs 
> (curved) from the seat tube to the down tube with each joining about three 
> inches from either the top tube or head tube. Vince didn't seem to think it 
> was super secret, but it is not a staged pic and there are no decals so 
> maybe it's not one that Riv wanted circulated (I thought the Blug mentioned 
> more pics to come soon). I'm happy to post it if people think that's okay. 
>
> I think it looks cool, especially the fillet brazed joints, and it's 
> definitely a new style from earlier double top tubes. I ordered mine prior 
> to seeing it as that seemed to add to the fun of being involved in the 
> pre-sale.
>
> So, to post or not to post? 
>
> Brynnar
> Indianapolis
>
>
>
> On Thursday, April 19, 2018 at 4:42:20 PM UTC-4, Edwin W wrote:
>>
>> We have not yet seen what the two larger sizes will look like, but wasn't 
>> there a seat tube to downtube double top tube in there?
>> Inspiration could have come from this:
>>
>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-French-bicycle-frame-La-Triomphante-path-racer-randonneur-fixie/183159497124?hash=item2aa52821a4:g:cYEAAOSwRHVamvxg
>>
>> Got my double top tubes on my Appa 58,
>>
>> Edwin
>>
>> On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 2:24:37 PM UTC-5, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>>
>>> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
>>>
>>> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis
>>>
>>> Happy shopping! 
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[ctifusion]

Vince sent me a picture of the 59 with the second top tube. It arcs 
(curved) from the seat tube to the down tube with each joining about three 
inches from either the top tube or head tube. Vince didn't seem to think it 
was super secret, but it is not a staged pic and there are no decals so 
maybe it's not one that Riv wanted circulated (I thought the Blug mentioned 
more pics to come soon). I'm happy to post it if people think that's okay. 

I think it looks cool, especially the fillet brazed joints, and it's 
definitely a new style from earlier double top tubes. I ordered mine prior 
to seeing it as that seemed to add to the fun of being involved in the 
pre-sale.

So, to post or not to post? 

Brynnar
Indianapolis



On Thursday, April 19, 2018 at 4:42:20 PM UTC-4, Edwin W wrote:
>
> We have not yet seen what the two larger sizes will look like, but wasn't 
> there a seat tube to downtube double top tube in there?
> Inspiration could have come from this:
>
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-French-bicycle-frame-La-Triomphante-path-racer-randonneur-fixie/183159497124?hash=item2aa52821a4:g:cYEAAOSwRHVamvxg
>
> Got my double top tubes on my Appa 58,
>
> Edwin
>
> On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 2:24:37 PM UTC-5, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
>>
>> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis
>>
>> Happy shopping! 
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[iamkeith]

On Thursday, April 19, 2018 at 2:42:20 PM UTC-6, Edwin W wrote:
>
> We have not yet seen what the two larger sizes will look like, but wasn't 
> there a seat tube to downtube double top tube in there?
> Inspiration could have come from this:
>
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-French-bicycle-frame-La-Triomphante-path-racer-randonneur-fixie/183159497124?hash=item2aa52821a4:g:cYEAAOSwRHVamvxg
>
> Got my double top tubes on my Appa 58,
>
> Edwin
>
> On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 2:24:37 PM UTC-5, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
>>
>> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis
>>
>> Happy shopping! 
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[iamkeith]

By golly, that's probably pretty close.  Pasting the photo here for 
prosperity after the auction goes away:



On Thursday, April 19, 2018 at 2:42:20 PM UTC-6, Edwin W wrote:
>
> We have not yet seen what the two larger sizes will look like, but wasn't 
> there a seat tube to downtube double top tube in there?
> Inspiration could have come from this:
>
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-French-bicycle-frame-La-Triomphante-path-racer-randonneur-fixie/183159497124?hash=item2aa52821a4:g:cYEAAOSwRHVamvxg
>
> Got my double top tubes on my Appa 58,
>
> Edwin
>
> On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 2:24:37 PM UTC-5, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
>>
>> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis
>>
>> Happy shopping! 
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Edwin W]

We have not yet seen what the two larger sizes will look like, but wasn't 
there a seat tube to downtube double top tube in there?
Inspiration could have come from this:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-French-bicycle-frame-La-Triomphante-path-racer-randonneur-fixie/183159497124?hash=item2aa52821a4:g:cYEAAOSwRHVamvxg

Got my double top tubes on my Appa 58,

Edwin

On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 2:24:37 PM UTC-5, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
>
> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis
>
> Happy shopping! 
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Ed Fausto]

Got it Ash, Thanks :-)

> On 17 Apr 2018, at 1:19 PM, Ash  wrote:
> 
> Hi Ed,
> 
> My PHB is 81cm.  
> 
> Actually 50cm Atlantis would have worked just fine for me.  Ordered the 
> smaller size with the hope that my wife (who's a bit shorter than me) will 
> also rider the new bike occasionally.  
> 
> With 47cm Atlantis I think I'll also be moving to 13cm stem for my Bosco 
> (with App I use 11cm)
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Ash
> 
> 
> 
>> On Monday, 16 April 2018 15:47:22 UTC-7, ed wrote:
>> Hi Ash,
>> Congratulations!
>> I am also considering getting one.
>> I am currently using an older 51 Atlantis with Albatross bars.
>> But I felt the cockpit too cramp even though I am using a 13cm Nitto stem.
>> Would you mind sharing your pbh?
>> Regards,
>> Ed
>> 
>>> On 17 Apr 2018, at 6:41 AM, Ash  wrote:
>>> 
>>> After some contemplation and a quick discussion with Riv world HQ folks, 
>>> changed the Atlantis size to 47cm.
>>> 
>>> So going from 51cm/650b Appa to 47cm/26" Atlantis, my new dream bike!
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 On Sunday, 15 April 2018 20:29:52 UTC-7, Ash wrote:
 Catching up with the forum after a few days.  Oh man!  This is fabulous 
 news!
 
 I was not in the market for a bike.  I was thinking I won't be in the 
 market for next 10 years.  
 
 Oh my lovely Joe Appaloosa..  our friendship might be ending 9 years too 
 soon.  
 
 Ordered 50cm/26" that will likely (storage space issues) replace my green 
 51/650B Appaloosa.  
 
 
 
> On Friday, 6 April 2018 12:24:37 UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:
> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
> 
> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis
> 
> Happy shopping! 
> 
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
> 
>>> 
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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Ash]

Hi Ed,

My PHB is 81cm.  

Actually 50cm Atlantis would have worked just fine for me.  Ordered the 
smaller size with the hope that my wife (who's a bit shorter than me) will 
also rider the new bike occasionally.  

With 47cm Atlantis I think I'll also be moving to 13cm stem for my Bosco 
(with App I use 11cm)

Cheers,

Ash



On Monday, 16 April 2018 15:47:22 UTC-7, ed wrote:
>
> Hi Ash,
> Congratulations!
> I am also considering getting one.
> I am currently using an older 51 Atlantis with Albatross bars.
> But I felt the cockpit too cramp even though I am using a 13cm Nitto stem.
> Would you mind sharing your pbh?
> Regards,
> Ed
>
> On 17 Apr 2018, at 6:41 AM, Ash  wrote:
>
> After some contemplation and a quick discussion with Riv world HQ folks, 
> changed the Atlantis size to 47cm.
>
> So going from 51cm/650b Appa to 47cm/26" Atlantis, my new dream bike!
>
>
>
>
> On Sunday, 15 April 2018 20:29:52 UTC-7, Ash wrote:
>>
>> Catching up with the forum after a few days.  Oh man!  This is fabulous 
>> news!
>>
>> I was not in the market for a bike.  I was thinking I won't be in the 
>> market for next 10 years.  
>>
>> Oh my lovely Joe Appaloosa..  our friendship might be ending 9 years too 
>> soon.  
>>
>> Ordered 50cm/26" that will likely (storage space issues) replace my green 
>> 51/650B Appaloosa.  
>>
>>
>>
>> On Friday, 6 April 2018 12:24:37 UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>>
>>> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
>>>
>>> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis
>>>
>>> Happy shopping! 
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>>
>>> -- 
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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Ed Fausto]

Hi Ash,
Congratulations!
I am also considering getting one.
I am currently using an older 51 Atlantis with Albatross bars.
But I felt the cockpit too cramp even though I am using a 13cm Nitto stem.
Would you mind sharing your pbh?
Regards,
Ed

> On 17 Apr 2018, at 6:41 AM, Ash  wrote:
> 
> After some contemplation and a quick discussion with Riv world HQ folks, 
> changed the Atlantis size to 47cm.
> 
> So going from 51cm/650b Appa to 47cm/26" Atlantis, my new dream bike!
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Sunday, 15 April 2018 20:29:52 UTC-7, Ash wrote:
>> Catching up with the forum after a few days.  Oh man!  This is fabulous news!
>> 
>> I was not in the market for a bike.  I was thinking I won't be in the market 
>> for next 10 years.  
>> 
>> Oh my lovely Joe Appaloosa..  our friendship might be ending 9 years too 
>> soon.  
>> 
>> Ordered 50cm/26" that will likely (storage space issues) replace my green 
>> 51/650B Appaloosa.  
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Friday, 6 April 2018 12:24:37 UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
>>> 
>>> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis
>>> 
>>> Happy shopping! 
>>> 
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>> 
> 
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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Ash]

After some contemplation and a quick discussion with Riv world HQ folks, 
changed the Atlantis size to 47cm.

So going from 51cm/650b Appa to 47cm/26" Atlantis, my new dream bike!




On Sunday, 15 April 2018 20:29:52 UTC-7, Ash wrote:
>
> Catching up with the forum after a few days.  Oh man!  This is fabulous 
> news!
>
> I was not in the market for a bike.  I was thinking I won't be in the 
> market for next 10 years.  
>
> Oh my lovely Joe Appaloosa..  our friendship might be ending 9 years too 
> soon.  
>
> Ordered 50cm/26" that will likely (storage space issues) replace my green 
> 51/650B Appaloosa.  
>
>
>
> On Friday, 6 April 2018 12:24:37 UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
>>
>> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis
>>
>> Happy shopping! 
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Ash]

Catching up with the forum after a few days.  Oh man!  This is fabulous 
news!

I was not in the market for a bike.  I was thinking I won't be in the 
market for next 10 years.  

Oh my lovely Joe Appaloosa..  our friendship might be ending 9 years too 
soon.  

Ordered 50cm/26" that will likely (storage space issues) replace my green 
51/650B Appaloosa.  



On Friday, 6 April 2018 12:24:37 UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
>
> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis
>
> Happy shopping! 
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[ctifusion]

Thanks to Dave I was able to order a 59 today (have fun with the QB!). 
Maybe a bit on the big side but after a conversation with one of the nice 
young fellows at the global headquarters we decided that it was the right 
one for me. I'm going to run those super wide Crust (666mm) drops on it at 
first. I think with a 5cm technomic or a short dirt drop I'll be able to 
get it pretty close to where they are on my 60cm Surly LHT (60.5 TT). With 
the Rat Trap Pass tires that bike has 1 cm shorter stand over height but I 
should get the bars much higher on the Riv.  If not I'm happy to ride 
albatross on anything. Going to build some wheels and do a parts 
bin/vintage build first and then decide on how to set it up. Anyone 
thinking 1X11 or is that too cool already?

They said they would send me a pic of the extra top tube, which he 
described as arching from the seat tube to the down tube (??). I figured it 
would be fun to wing it and put the money down sight unseen. I don't think 
there has been an extra tube on any Riv that I didn't like, so...

It's been 12 years since I bought a Riv and 5 since I put together anything 
serious. My wife noted that I have built three vintage bikes in the last 
year or two but those don't count!

brynnar
Indy


On Sunday, April 8, 2018 at 10:36:08 AM UTC-4, ctifusion wrote:
>
> Is there info on exact tire sizes for the different sizes? I'm between the 
> 59 and 62. I like fat tires so I think I'm comfortable with the 59 which is 
> exciting as the recent sizing has not made me feel like there was a bike 
> out there that'd really fit. I'd prefer that they did fat 650b all the way 
> up the sizes but if I'm in the market for anything it's a fast-ish all-road 
> drop bar bike. Double top tube in the original Altantis color? COOL!
>
> This is the most excited I've been about a new Riv in a while. Anyone 
> interested in a 59cm 2004 Quickbeam??  
>
> Brynnar
> Indy
>
>
>
> On Sunday, April 8, 2018 at 8:13:25 AM UTC-4, Dave Johnston wrote:
>>
>> As Keith points out standover heights are listed so you can also do 
>> PBH - 2.54 = standover as a starting point. That is to say the 
>> Standover should be 1in less than PBH (1 in crotch clearance in bare 
>> feet). 
>>
>> You can fudge 1 cm larger since you are wearing shoes which lifts you 
>> up, and 3cm maybe 4cm smaller on the 6deg frames. For skinny tires and 
>> road use go for the bigger end and for the fattest tires and off road 
>> use lean smaller. Bigger bikes ride more stable / smoother, may have 
>> less toe overlap (depends on tire size), and it's easier to get the 
>> bars higher so can be more comfortable as well. 
>>
>> Ignore the actual frame size in cm, since it doesn't correlate to 
>> non-Riv sizing, classic Riv bikes, or anything you rode in the 70's. 
>> Unless of course you rode a bike way to small in the 70's & 80's like 
>> many people did in which case it might be the same. 
>>
>> If I'm between sizes I also take top tube length into account when 
>> using drops, but it doesn't matter much at all for sweep back bars. 
>>
>> -Dave 
>>
>>
>> On 4/8/18, Dave Small  wrote: 
>> > Thanks, Dave and iamkeith.  I'll do some cipherin' and figure out what 
>> I 
>> > would need. 
>> > 
>> > -- 
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>>
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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Joe Bernard]

Eric: I doubt it, that's just a bodge Roman did. He's the frame bag guy at Riv, 
he likes to fill spaces on the bike with carrying things. He's good at it!

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Eric]

Are there plans to have a triple water bottle mount bosses on the rear of 
the seattube? 

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Elisabeth Sherwood]

Hi, William, and thanks so much for the response!

Unfortunately, I'm actually not mystified by bicycle geometry. :-)  I work 
in a bike shop and if I'm around always work with the shorter women who 
come in hoping to be fit on road bikes (and I've trained all the other 
staff and mechanics to understand the issues). I also have experience with 
other models of Rivendells -- between my boyfriend and me, we have three 
(one for me; two for the boyfriend).  We visit the SF Bay Area at least 
once a year to see family and always take a ride to visit Rivendell HQ.

Unfortunately, the new 47cm Atlantis frame -- if the ETT of 54cm is correct 
-- will not work for me (even with the nicely slack seat-tube angle) _if I 
would like to use drop bars_.  It's a lovely frame, and perhaps in 20 years 
or so I may prefer swept-back bars on a beautifully designed, 
somewhat-rough-stuff all-rounder, but not at this time.

It's unfortunate (for me and for similarly height-challenged women who 
could probably justify a $1,600 frame but who would have a harder time 
justifying a nearly $3,000 one!), but there are far great tragedies in the 
world!

Enjoying the list/forum, and always happy when I check in to read the 
updates. I wish Rivendell a long and prosperous future! All the best,

Elisabeth Sherwood
Washington, DC


On Wednesday, April 11, 2018 at 12:11:27 AM UTC-4, William deRosset wrote:
>
> Dear Elisabeth,
>
> This is why stack and reach sizing helps cut through the mess that sloping 
> top tubes and variable setback creates. 
>
> I turn out to be a bone-stock 56 cm racing bike rider based on the CONI 
> manual, but that ends up being a: 57, a 55, or a 53 in Grant Petersen 
> machines depending on the model, somewhere around a 59 in French-fit rando 
> machines. 
>
> It all works out to: 73 from the tip of my saddle to the top of the brake 
> lever, 2" or so drop, and 73 saddle height with drop bars. Adjust for loop 
> bars, add a pile of reach for mountain bike bars, and hope that nobody has 
> cut the threadless steerer too short on non-gp machines.
>
> By the way, GP bikes were traditionally built with ling top tubes and 
> slack seat tubes, contrary to the long-leg and short torso design orthodoxy 
> for women. Individual variation trumps generalization, but stack and reach 
> will help demystify the effective geo of sloping bikes.
>
> Or you can call in to the mothership. They won't steer you astray.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Will
> William M deRosset
> Fort Collins CO USA
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Lester Lammers]

Dave,

I'm 66 and don't plan to use drops on this frame. I went with the 53 
because I wanted 650b wheels. I used Noodles on my Bleriot ten or so years 
ago and liked them though I did not often use the hooks.  As the years pass 
and traffic increases, I now prefer to be more upright...but not 90 
degrees. Golden Years...yeah right. :-) 

You are correct on the 51 JA and drops. Ditto for the 50 MIT Atlantis. 

Regards,

Les

On Wednesday, April 11, 2018 at 7:39:17 AM UTC-4, Dave Johnston wrote:

> Lester, 
> If I recall the 51 Joe has a top tube 1.0 cm shorter than a 53 
> Atlantis, so that also might be better for drops. 
>
> I had an email conversation back and forth with Grant last year and he 
> was pushing hard to ditch the drops altogether, he doesn't see the 
> point of even using drops, especially if you are an older non-racer 
> type (like 40+) 
>
> -Dave 
>
> On 4/11/18, Lester Lammers  wrote: 
> > My pbh is 83 and according to Will I was between the 50 and 53. I went 
> with 
> > 
> > the 53 because I wanted 650b wheels. The 50 would have been a better fit 
> > for me with drop bars but I'll use MTB bars on it. Since the new frame 
> geos 
> > 
> > are a departure from the traditional I'd call Riv and discuss B4 
> ordering. 
> > 
> > On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 10:29:03 PM UTC-4, ed wrote: 
> >> 
> >> Hi Lester, 
> >> What is your pbh that they recommend a 53 Atlantis? 
> >> Thanks, 
> >> Ed Fausto 
> >> 
> >> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 1:15 AM, Lester Lammers  >> > wrote: 
> >> 
> >>> Howdy Bill, 
> >>> 
> >>> I suppose it would depend on body type. My 55 cm Cheviot has a 57.5 cm 
> >>> ETT and I'd need a very short stem for drops. I'm still considering 
>  the 
> >>> 
> >>> MIT 53cm, which has a 57.5 cm ETT, but without drop bars. I will call 
> Riv 
> >>> 
> >>> and discuss. 
> >>> 
> >>> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 9:26:51 AM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote: 
> >>> 
>  I disagree with the assertion that the MIT Atlantis is not intended 
> for 
>  
>  drop bars. The 56 new Atlantis would be spot on perfect for me with 
> drop 
>  
>  bars and a 100mm extension stem. I look at lots of geo-charts and I’m 
>  usually bummed at how short top tubes are. So my hope and feeling is 
>  that 
>  there are plenty of options out there for folks who objectively know 
>  that 
>  they aren’t able to buy an Atlantis. 
>  
>  Bill Lindsay 
>  El Cerrito Ca 
> >>> 
> >>> -- 
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> >> 
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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[David Johnston]

Lester,
If I recall the 51 Joe has a top tube 1.0 cm shorter than a 53
Atlantis, so that also might be better for drops.

I had an email conversation back and forth with Grant last year and he
was pushing hard to ditch the drops altogether, he doesn't see the
point of even using drops, especially if you are an older non-racer
type (like 40+)

-Dave

On 4/11/18, Lester Lammers  wrote:
> My pbh is 83 and according to Will I was between the 50 and 53. I went with
>
> the 53 because I wanted 650b wheels. The 50 would have been a better fit
> for me with drop bars but I'll use MTB bars on it. Since the new frame geos
>
> are a departure from the traditional I'd call Riv and discuss B4 ordering.
>
> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 10:29:03 PM UTC-4, ed wrote:
>>
>> Hi Lester,
>> What is your pbh that they recommend a 53 Atlantis?
>> Thanks,
>> Ed Fausto
>>
>> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 1:15 AM, Lester Lammers > > wrote:
>>
>>> Howdy Bill,
>>>
>>> I suppose it would depend on body type. My 55 cm Cheviot has a 57.5 cm
>>> ETT and I'd need a very short stem for drops. I'm still considering  the
>>>
>>> MIT 53cm, which has a 57.5 cm ETT, but without drop bars. I will call Riv
>>>
>>> and discuss.
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 9:26:51 AM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>>
 I disagree with the assertion that the MIT Atlantis is not intended for

 drop bars. The 56 new Atlantis would be spot on perfect for me with drop

 bars and a 100mm extension stem. I look at lots of geo-charts and I’m
 usually bummed at how short top tubes are. So my hope and feeling is
 that
 there are plenty of options out there for folks who objectively know
 that
 they aren’t able to buy an Atlantis.

 Bill Lindsay
 El Cerrito Ca
>>>
>>> --
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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Lester Lammers]

My pbh is 83 and according to Will I was between the 50 and 53. I went with 
the 53 because I wanted 650b wheels. The 50 would have been a better fit 
for me with drop bars but I'll use MTB bars on it. Since the new frame geos 
are a departure from the traditional I'd call Riv and discuss B4 ordering.

On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 10:29:03 PM UTC-4, ed wrote:
>
> Hi Lester,
> What is your pbh that they recommend a 53 Atlantis?
> Thanks,
> Ed Fausto
>
> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 1:15 AM, Lester Lammers  > wrote:
>
>> Howdy Bill,
>>
>> I suppose it would depend on body type. My 55 cm Cheviot has a 57.5 cm 
>> ETT and I'd need a very short stem for drops. I'm still considering  the 
>> MIT 53cm, which has a 57.5 cm ETT, but without drop bars. I will call Riv 
>> and discuss. 
>>
>> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 9:26:51 AM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>>> I disagree with the assertion that the MIT Atlantis is not intended for 
>>> drop bars. The 56 new Atlantis would be spot on perfect for me with drop 
>>> bars and a 100mm extension stem. I look at lots of geo-charts and I’m 
>>> usually bummed at how short top tubes are. So my hope and feeling is that 
>>> there are plenty of options out there for folks who objectively know that 
>>> they aren’t able to buy an Atlantis. 
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay 
>>> El Cerrito Ca
>>
>> -- 
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>>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Lester Lammers]

We did not discuss the JA. 

On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 8:42:26 PM UTC-4, tc wrote:
>
> Lester, in your discussion with Will, did you guys talk about similarities 
> to the Joe by chance, or were you focused on getting Atlantis sizing down?
>
> Tom
>
> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 6:48:58 PM UTC-4, Lester Lammers wrote:
>>
>> I called Riv WHQ, and spoke with Will. I ended up ordering a 53 MIT. We 
>> discussed drop bars and he recommended non-drops and canti brakes for me on 
>> this frame on this frame. If you are confused as I was, call B4 ordering. 
>> It may  save disappointment. FWIW, the ST diameter is 26.8. 
>>
>> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 2:13:05 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Lester
>>>
>>> You are confusing me.  You say you have a 55cm Cheviot with e 57.5cm 
>>> ETT.  That's not what the current Geo-chart 
>>>  says.  Do you have a Cheviot 
>>> that does not match the geo-chart?  Does your post have a typo?  According 
>>> to the numbers on Rivbike.com, a 53cm MIT-Atlantis has a 2cm SHORTER 
>>> effective top tube than a 55cm Cheviot.  In addition to that, a 53cm 
>>> MIT-Atlantis has a 0.5 degree more laid back seat tube angle, which means 
>>> that you will move the saddle ~5mm farther forward on your Atlantis than 
>>> you did on your Cheviot.  That's 2.5cm (a full inch) shorter cockpit, so 
>>> you should be good to go with drops.
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 10:15:39 AM UTC-7, Lester Lammers wrote:

 Howdy Bill,

 I suppose it would depend on body type. My 55 cm Cheviot has a 57.5 cm 
 ETT and I'd need a very short stem for drops. I'm still considering  the 
 MIT 53cm, which has a 57.5 cm ETT, but without drop bars. I will call Riv 
 and discuss. 

 On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 9:26:51 AM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:

> I disagree with the assertion that the MIT Atlantis is not intended 
> for drop bars. The 56 new Atlantis would be spot on perfect for me with 
> drop bars and a 100mm extension stem. I look at lots of geo-charts and 
> I’m 
> usually bummed at how short top tubes are. So my hope and feeling is that 
> there are plenty of options out there for folks who objectively know that 
> they aren’t able to buy an Atlantis. 
>
> Bill Lindsay 
> El Cerrito Ca



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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[William deRosset]

Dear Elisabeth,

This is why stack and reach sizing helps cut through the mess that sloping top 
tubes and variable setback creates. 

I turn out to be a bone-stock 56 cm racing bike rider based on the CONI manual, 
but that ends up being a: 57, a 55, or a 53 in Grant Petersen machines 
depending on the model, somewhere around a 59 in French-fit rando machines. 

It all works out to: 73 from the tip of my saddle to the top of the brake 
lever, 2" or so drop, and 73 saddle height with drop bars. Adjust for loop 
bars, add a pile of reach for mountain bike bars, and hope that nobody has cut 
the threadless steerer too short on non-gp machines.

By the way, GP bikes were traditionally built with ling top tubes and slack 
seat tubes, contrary to the long-leg and short torso design orthodoxy for 
women. Individual variation trumps generalization, but stack and reach will 
help demystify the effective geo of sloping bikes.

Or you can call in to the mothership. They won't steer you astray.

Best Regards,

Will
William M deRosset
Fort Collins CO USA

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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Ed Fausto]

Hi Lester,
What is your pbh that they recommend a 53 Atlantis?
Thanks,
Ed Fausto

On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 1:15 AM, Lester Lammers 
wrote:

> Howdy Bill,
>
> I suppose it would depend on body type. My 55 cm Cheviot has a 57.5 cm ETT
> and I'd need a very short stem for drops. I'm still considering  the MIT
> 53cm, which has a 57.5 cm ETT, but without drop bars. I will call Riv and
> discuss.
>
> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 9:26:51 AM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> I disagree with the assertion that the MIT Atlantis is not intended for
>> drop bars. The 56 new Atlantis would be spot on perfect for me with drop
>> bars and a 100mm extension stem. I look at lots of geo-charts and I’m
>> usually bummed at how short top tubes are. So my hope and feeling is that
>> there are plenty of options out there for folks who objectively know that
>> they aren’t able to buy an Atlantis.
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito Ca
>
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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[tc]

Lester, in your discussion with Will, did you guys talk about similarities 
to the Joe by chance, or were you focused on getting Atlantis sizing down?

Tom

On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 6:48:58 PM UTC-4, Lester Lammers wrote:
>
> I called Riv WHQ, and spoke with Will. I ended up ordering a 53 MIT. We 
> discussed drop bars and he recommended non-drops and canti brakes for me on 
> this frame on this frame. If you are confused as I was, call B4 ordering. 
> It may  save disappointment. FWIW, the ST diameter is 26.8. 
>
> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 2:13:05 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> Hi Lester
>>
>> You are confusing me.  You say you have a 55cm Cheviot with e 57.5cm 
>> ETT.  That's not what the current Geo-chart 
>>  says.  Do you have a Cheviot 
>> that does not match the geo-chart?  Does your post have a typo?  According 
>> to the numbers on Rivbike.com, a 53cm MIT-Atlantis has a 2cm SHORTER 
>> effective top tube than a 55cm Cheviot.  In addition to that, a 53cm 
>> MIT-Atlantis has a 0.5 degree more laid back seat tube angle, which means 
>> that you will move the saddle ~5mm farther forward on your Atlantis than 
>> you did on your Cheviot.  That's 2.5cm (a full inch) shorter cockpit, so 
>> you should be good to go with drops.
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 10:15:39 AM UTC-7, Lester Lammers wrote:
>>>
>>> Howdy Bill,
>>>
>>> I suppose it would depend on body type. My 55 cm Cheviot has a 57.5 cm 
>>> ETT and I'd need a very short stem for drops. I'm still considering  the 
>>> MIT 53cm, which has a 57.5 cm ETT, but without drop bars. I will call Riv 
>>> and discuss. 
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 9:26:51 AM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>>
 I disagree with the assertion that the MIT Atlantis is not intended for 
 drop bars. The 56 new Atlantis would be spot on perfect for me with drop 
 bars and a 100mm extension stem. I look at lots of geo-charts and I’m 
 usually bummed at how short top tubes are. So my hope and feeling is that 
 there are plenty of options out there for folks who objectively know that 
 they aren’t able to buy an Atlantis. 

 Bill Lindsay 
 El Cerrito Ca
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Jonathan D.]

Someone in Portland Oregon needs to order a 53 so I can test ride and compare 
to a Joe Appaloosa. 

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Bill Lindsay]

Congratulations.  I hope you love it.  

Bill

On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 3:48:58 PM UTC-7, Lester Lammers wrote:
>
> I called Riv WHQ, and spoke with Will. I ended up ordering a 53 MIT. We 
> discussed drop bars and he recommended non-drops and canti brakes for me on 
> this frame on this frame. If you are confused as I was, call B4 ordering. 
> It may  save disappointment. FWIW, the ST diameter is 26.8. 
>
> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 2:13:05 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> Hi Lester
>>
>> You are confusing me.  You say you have a 55cm Cheviot with e 57.5cm 
>> ETT.  That's not what the current Geo-chart 
>>  says.  Do you have a Cheviot 
>> that does not match the geo-chart?  Does your post have a typo?  According 
>> to the numbers on Rivbike.com, a 53cm MIT-Atlantis has a 2cm SHORTER 
>> effective top tube than a 55cm Cheviot.  In addition to that, a 53cm 
>> MIT-Atlantis has a 0.5 degree more laid back seat tube angle, which means 
>> that you will move the saddle ~5mm farther forward on your Atlantis than 
>> you did on your Cheviot.  That's 2.5cm (a full inch) shorter cockpit, so 
>> you should be good to go with drops.
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 10:15:39 AM UTC-7, Lester Lammers wrote:
>>>
>>> Howdy Bill,
>>>
>>> I suppose it would depend on body type. My 55 cm Cheviot has a 57.5 cm 
>>> ETT and I'd need a very short stem for drops. I'm still considering  the 
>>> MIT 53cm, which has a 57.5 cm ETT, but without drop bars. I will call Riv 
>>> and discuss. 
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 9:26:51 AM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>>
 I disagree with the assertion that the MIT Atlantis is not intended for 
 drop bars. The 56 new Atlantis would be spot on perfect for me with drop 
 bars and a 100mm extension stem. I look at lots of geo-charts and I’m 
 usually bummed at how short top tubes are. So my hope and feeling is that 
 there are plenty of options out there for folks who objectively know that 
 they aren’t able to buy an Atlantis. 

 Bill Lindsay 
 El Cerrito Ca
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Lester Lammers]

I called Riv WHQ, and spoke with Will. I ended up ordering a 53 MIT. We 
discussed drop bars and he recommended non-drops and canti brakes for me on 
this frame on this frame. If you are confused as I was, call B4 ordering. 
It may  save disappointment. FWIW, the ST diameter is 26.8. 

On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 2:13:05 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:

> Hi Lester
>
> You are confusing me.  You say you have a 55cm Cheviot with e 57.5cm ETT.  
> That's not what the current Geo-chart 
>  says.  Do you have a Cheviot 
> that does not match the geo-chart?  Does your post have a typo?  According 
> to the numbers on Rivbike.com, a 53cm MIT-Atlantis has a 2cm SHORTER 
> effective top tube than a 55cm Cheviot.  In addition to that, a 53cm 
> MIT-Atlantis has a 0.5 degree more laid back seat tube angle, which means 
> that you will move the saddle ~5mm farther forward on your Atlantis than 
> you did on your Cheviot.  That's 2.5cm (a full inch) shorter cockpit, so 
> you should be good to go with drops.
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
>
> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 10:15:39 AM UTC-7, Lester Lammers wrote:
>>
>> Howdy Bill,
>>
>> I suppose it would depend on body type. My 55 cm Cheviot has a 57.5 cm 
>> ETT and I'd need a very short stem for drops. I'm still considering  the 
>> MIT 53cm, which has a 57.5 cm ETT, but without drop bars. I will call Riv 
>> and discuss. 
>>
>> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 9:26:51 AM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>>> I disagree with the assertion that the MIT Atlantis is not intended for 
>>> drop bars. The 56 new Atlantis would be spot on perfect for me with drop 
>>> bars and a 100mm extension stem. I look at lots of geo-charts and I’m 
>>> usually bummed at how short top tubes are. So my hope and feeling is that 
>>> there are plenty of options out there for folks who objectively know that 
>>> they aren’t able to buy an Atlantis. 
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay 
>>> El Cerrito Ca
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Lester Lammers]

My mistake, old eyes, the ETT on the 55cm Cheviot is 59.5cm. Drops would 
certainly work.

On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 2:13:05 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> Hi Lester
>
> You are confusing me.  You say you have a 55cm Cheviot with e 57.5cm ETT.  
> That's not what the current Geo-chart 
>  says.  Do you have a Cheviot 
> that does not match the geo-chart?  Does your post have a typo?  According 
> to the numbers on Rivbike.com, a 53cm MIT-Atlantis has a 2cm SHORTER 
> effective top tube than a 55cm Cheviot.  In addition to that, a 53cm 
> MIT-Atlantis has a 0.5 degree more laid back seat tube angle, which means 
> that you will move the saddle ~5mm farther forward on your Atlantis than 
> you did on your Cheviot.  That's 2.5cm (a full inch) shorter cockpit, so 
> you should be good to go with drops.
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
>
> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 10:15:39 AM UTC-7, Lester Lammers wrote:
>>
>> Howdy Bill,
>>
>> I suppose it would depend on body type. My 55 cm Cheviot has a 57.5 cm 
>> ETT and I'd need a very short stem for drops. I'm still considering  the 
>> MIT 53cm, which has a 57.5 cm ETT, but without drop bars. I will call Riv 
>> and discuss. 
>>
>> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 9:26:51 AM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>>> I disagree with the assertion that the MIT Atlantis is not intended for 
>>> drop bars. The 56 new Atlantis would be spot on perfect for me with drop 
>>> bars and a 100mm extension stem. I look at lots of geo-charts and I’m 
>>> usually bummed at how short top tubes are. So my hope and feeling is that 
>>> there are plenty of options out there for folks who objectively know that 
>>> they aren’t able to buy an Atlantis. 
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay 
>>> El Cerrito Ca
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Joe Bernard]

I get 59-ish ETT on my 55 Chev. 57.5 is the actual number for the 
not-really-a-toptube. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[David Johnston]

As far as I can tell if you rode an old 56cm Atlantis you would now be
on a MIT 53cm Atlantis and you would have essentially the same reach
(a mm or 2 less)  and 5mm more stack and a cm more crotch clearance on
the MIT 53cm.

-Dave J

On 4/10/18, lconley  wrote:
> I also need to check seat post size. If it is not 27.2 then I may need to
> look elsewhere if it doesn't have a long TT because I cannot use the lugged
>
> setback seatpost (I am of the stumpy legs and chimp arms variety). I honed
> the ID of my 27.0 ID seat tube Bombadil to about 27.1 so I could use the
> lugged seatpost.
>
> I seem to remember many years ago, when the most important aspect of a
> saddle was it's weight, putting my elbow up to the seat tip and seeing
> where the end of the stem was to determine stem length - ideal was the
> longest finger reached the bars. These days - in order to be comfortable,
> it is way beyond that - not trying to fit on a racing bike anymore.
>
> Laing
> Cocoa, FL
>
>
> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 12:58:51 PM UTC-4, tc wrote:
>
>> Garth, yep, I know stack and reach.  To my weird brain though, if I know
>> PBH, and I also know the goofy
>> "[top-of-seatpost-at-comfy-height]__to__[center-of-bar-flats-at-comfy-stem-height]"
>>
>> measurement on a bike that I know fits me well, then I'm an instant away
>> from seeing whether another bike can be configured to fit me well ...
>> whether I have stork legs and t-rex arms, or stumpy legs and chimp arms.
>> I
>> don't think you can say the same for PBH-only bike sizing.
>>
>> If you take that latter goofy measurement on a bike that fits you well,
>> and cut a piece of string to that length, then 'overlay' it on a bike
>> you're thinking about getting, you'd be able to see in an instant whether
>>
>> you can get a stem with the right reach (and height) -- plus a saddle with
>>
>> enough adjustment in the rails for proper setback -- for the new bike to
>> fit you just as well as your existing bike.  Assuming your PBH is also
>> accommodated.
>>
>> I know, weird, and likely overkill if you're in the middle of the PBH
>> range. But there are many who are in between PBH ranges, and/or don't have
>>
>> 'normal' upper/lower torso ratios.
>>
>> Tom
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 11:52:17 AM UTC-4, Garth wrote:
>>>
>>> Tom,  The standard measurement these days by more and more frame makers
>>> is called the reach, along with the stack.  Riv has recently added these
>>> to
>>> their geometry chart and can reveal how deceptive TT alone can be, let
>>> alone any 1 certain measurement by itself.
>>>
>>> All of the numbers are meant as a guide of course, as every body is
>>> unique, some more/less flexible and feel best in this or that
>>> position...not what someone else tells them is best for them.
>>>
>>> There are many articles explaining it, here's one ...
>>> https://velovoice.blogspot.com/2015/05/bike-sizing-stack-and-reach.html
>>>
>>>
>
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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Bill Lindsay]

Hi Lester

You are confusing me.  You say you have a 55cm Cheviot with e 57.5cm ETT.  
That's not what the current Geo-chart 
 says.  Do you have a Cheviot that 
does not match the geo-chart?  Does your post have a typo?  According to 
the numbers on Rivbike.com, a 53cm MIT-Atlantis has a 2cm SHORTER effective 
top tube than a 55cm Cheviot.  In addition to that, a 53cm MIT-Atlantis has 
a 0.5 degree more laid back seat tube angle, which means that you will move 
the saddle ~5mm farther forward on your Atlantis than you did on your 
Cheviot.  That's 2.5cm (a full inch) shorter cockpit, so you should be good 
to go with drops.

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA


On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 10:15:39 AM UTC-7, Lester Lammers wrote:
>
> Howdy Bill,
>
> I suppose it would depend on body type. My 55 cm Cheviot has a 57.5 cm ETT 
> and I'd need a very short stem for drops. I'm still considering  the MIT 
> 53cm, which has a 57.5 cm ETT, but without drop bars. I will call Riv and 
> discuss. 
>
> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 9:26:51 AM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> I disagree with the assertion that the MIT Atlantis is not intended for 
>> drop bars. The 56 new Atlantis would be spot on perfect for me with drop 
>> bars and a 100mm extension stem. I look at lots of geo-charts and I’m 
>> usually bummed at how short top tubes are. So my hope and feeling is that 
>> there are plenty of options out there for folks who objectively know that 
>> they aren’t able to buy an Atlantis. 
>>
>> Bill Lindsay 
>> El Cerrito Ca
>
>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[lconley]

I also need to check seat post size. If it is not 27.2 then I may need to 
look elsewhere if it doesn't have a long TT because I cannot use the lugged 
setback seatpost (I am of the stumpy legs and chimp arms variety). I honed 
the ID of my 27.0 ID seat tube Bombadil to about 27.1 so I could use the 
lugged seatpost.

I seem to remember many years ago, when the most important aspect of a 
saddle was it's weight, putting my elbow up to the seat tip and seeing 
where the end of the stem was to determine stem length - ideal was the 
longest finger reached the bars. These days - in order to be comfortable, 
it is way beyond that - not trying to fit on a racing bike anymore.

Laing
Cocoa, FL


On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 12:58:51 PM UTC-4, tc wrote:

> Garth, yep, I know stack and reach.  To my weird brain though, if I know 
> PBH, and I also know the goofy  
> "[top-of-seatpost-at-comfy-height]__to__[center-of-bar-flats-at-comfy-stem-height]"
>  
> measurement on a bike that I know fits me well, then I'm an instant away 
> from seeing whether another bike can be configured to fit me well ... 
> whether I have stork legs and t-rex arms, or stumpy legs and chimp arms.  I 
> don't think you can say the same for PBH-only bike sizing.
>
> If you take that latter goofy measurement on a bike that fits you well, 
> and cut a piece of string to that length, then 'overlay' it on a bike 
> you're thinking about getting, you'd be able to see in an instant whether 
> you can get a stem with the right reach (and height) -- plus a saddle with 
> enough adjustment in the rails for proper setback -- for the new bike to 
> fit you just as well as your existing bike.  Assuming your PBH is also 
> accommodated.
>
> I know, weird, and likely overkill if you're in the middle of the PBH 
> range. But there are many who are in between PBH ranges, and/or don't have 
> 'normal' upper/lower torso ratios.
>
> Tom
>
>
> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 11:52:17 AM UTC-4, Garth wrote:
>>
>> Tom,  The standard measurement these days by more and more frame makers 
>> is called the reach, along with the stack.  Riv has recently added these to 
>> their geometry chart and can reveal how deceptive TT alone can be, let 
>> alone any 1 certain measurement by itself. 
>>
>> All of the numbers are meant as a guide of course, as every body is 
>> unique, some more/less flexible and feel best in this or that 
>> position...not what someone else tells them is best for them. 
>>
>> There are many articles explaining it, here's one ... 
>> https://velovoice.blogspot.com/2015/05/bike-sizing-stack-and-reach.html
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Lester Lammers]

Howdy Bill,

I suppose it would depend on body type. My 55 cm Cheviot has a 57.5 cm ETT 
and I'd need a very short stem for drops. I'm still considering  the MIT 
53cm, which has a 57.5 cm ETT, but without drop bars. I will call Riv and 
discuss. 

On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 9:26:51 AM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:

> I disagree with the assertion that the MIT Atlantis is not intended for 
> drop bars. The 56 new Atlantis would be spot on perfect for me with drop 
> bars and a 100mm extension stem. I look at lots of geo-charts and I’m 
> usually bummed at how short top tubes are. So my hope and feeling is that 
> there are plenty of options out there for folks who objectively know that 
> they aren’t able to buy an Atlantis. 
>
> Bill Lindsay 
> El Cerrito Ca

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[tc]

Garth, yep, I know stack and reach.  To my weird brain though, if I know 
PBH, and I also know the goofy  
"[top-of-seatpost-at-comfy-height]__to__[center-of-bar-flats-at-comfy-stem-height]"
 
measurement on a bike that I know fits me well, then I'm an instant away 
from seeing whether another bike can be configured to fit me well ... 
whether I have stork legs and t-rex arms, or stumpy legs and chimp arms.  I 
don't think you can say the same for PBH-only bike sizing.

If you take that latter goofy measurement on a bike that fits you well, and 
cut a piece of string to that length, then 'overlay' it on a bike you're 
thinking about getting, you'd be able to see in an instant whether you can 
get a stem with the right reach (and height) -- plus a saddle with enough 
adjustment in the rails for proper setback -- for the new bike to fit you 
just as well as your existing bike.  Assuming your PBH is also accommodated.

I know, weird, and likely overkill if you're in the middle of the PBH 
range. But there are many who are in between PBH ranges, and/or don't have 
'normal' upper/lower torso ratios.

Tom


On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 11:52:17 AM UTC-4, Garth wrote:
>
> Tom,  The standard measurement these days by more and more frame makers is 
> called the reach, along with the stack.  Riv has recently added these to 
> their geometry chart and can reveal how deceptive TT alone can be, let 
> alone any 1 certain measurement by itself. 
>
> All of the numbers are meant as a guide of course, as every body is 
> unique, some more/less flexible and feel best in this or that 
> position...not what someone else tells them is best for them. 
>
> There are many articles explaining it, here's one ... 
> https://velovoice.blogspot.com/2015/05/bike-sizing-stack-and-reach.html
>
>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Bob Lovejoy]

Garth,

I am no expert, definitely still learning, but agree with you on stack and 
reach being very good indicators of fit.  The note that Tom posted was good 
info as well.

That said, have stack/reach measurements been posted for the MIT Atlantis? 
 I may have missed them.  They would be great to see though and could be 
compared against the other Riv models, as well as other frames.

Bob


On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 10:52:17 AM UTC-5, Garth wrote:
>
> Tom,  The standard measurement these days by more and more frame makers is 
> called the reach, along with the stack.  Riv has recently added these to 
> their geometry chart and can reveal how deceptive TT alone can be, let 
> alone any 1 certain measurement by itself. 
>
> All of the numbers are meant as a guide of course, as every body is 
> unique, some more/less flexible and feel best in this or that 
> position...not what someone else tells them is best for them. 
>
> There are many articles explaining it, here's one ... 
> https://velovoice.blogspot.com/2015/05/bike-sizing-stack-and-reach.html
>
>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Garth]

Tom,  The standard measurement these days by more and more frame makers is 
called the reach, along with the stack.  Riv has recently added these to their 
geometry chart and can reveal how deceptive TT alone can be, let alone any 1 
certain measurement by itself. 

All of the numbers are meant as a guide of course, as every body is unique, 
some more/less flexible and feel best in this or that position...not what 
someone else tells them is best for them. 

There are many articles explaining it, here's one ... 
https://velovoice.blogspot.com/2015/05/bike-sizing-stack-and-reach.html

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[tc]

Yeah I think this is why PBH alone isn't sufficient to size a bike, unless 
it's a really wide range.  My wife and I are within an inch of each other's 
PBH, but her torso is markedly shorter than mine.  Also, her femurs 
comprise a larger % of her leg length than mine, affecting comfortable 
setback, affecting reach to the bars.  So while I can comfortably ride a 58 
Sam with an 80mm stem and Noodles, she can't get a stem short enough to 
make Noodles work on a 58 (notwithstanding the Analog 'no-reach' stem, 
maybe).  Even if she could, she love her Albatross bars and upright 
position they offer.

I think a combo of PBH, plus a slightly modified version of Black Mountain 
Cycle's sizing method would fine tune sizing very well.  For those not 
aware, one of the dimensions BMC uses is the distance between the front tip 
of the saddle to the flats of the drop bar *on a bike that fits you well*.  See 
example here .  However, given 
short and long saddles (and some w/out a lot of fore/aft rail to play 
with), I would modify this dimension so that the measurement is from the 
center of the seat post (at the height you ride ... yeah, you'd have to 
remove your saddle) to the flats of the drop bar.

Of course call Riv in the end and explain your body dimensions and they 
will hook you up.

Tom

On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 9:26:51 AM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> I disagree with the assertion that the MIT Atlantis is not intended for 
> drop bars. The 56 new Atlantis would be spot on perfect for me with drop 
> bars and a 100mm extension stem. I look at lots of geo-charts and I’m 
> usually bummed at how short top tubes are. So my hope and feeling is that 
> there are plenty of options out there for folks who objectively know that 
> they aren’t able to buy an Atlantis. 
>
> Bill Lindsay 
> El Cerrito Ca

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Bill Lindsay]

I disagree with the assertion that the MIT Atlantis is not intended for drop 
bars. The 56 new Atlantis would be spot on perfect for me with drop bars and a 
100mm extension stem. I look at lots of geo-charts and I’m usually bummed at 
how short top tubes are. So my hope and feeling is that there are plenty of 
options out there for folks who objectively know that they aren’t able to buy 
an Atlantis. 

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito Ca

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Lester Lammers]

I agree. It does not appear that these frames are intended for drop bars. 
I'd need a 53cm frame and the ETT is 57.5. 

On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 8:00:37 AM UTC-4, Elisabeth Sherwood wrote:
>
> Oh, boy -- I'm so disappointed! I was looking forward to seeing the 
> geometry on the 47cm frame size, hoping that it would be the same (or 
> close!) as the current design and/or the Homer Hilson.
>
> No luck -- the chart says the ETT is 54cm.  Way too long for someone 5'2" 
> (at least, for a woman with a relatively standard woman's proportion 
> between legs/torso/arms) and hoping to use drop bars. Even with the slack 
> seat-tube angle, it just seems way too long.
>
> Maybe they'll build one up with drop bars to try out one day in Walnut 
> Creek someday. 
>
> Elisabeth Sherwood
> Washington, DC
>
>
>
> On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 3:53:02 PM UTC-4, dougP wrote:
>>
>> I have an Atlantis that I dearly love and I still find this to be 
>> exciting.  Also, good to see the 47 cm is back.  My wife absolutely loves 
>> hers but could not ride anything larger, and there are many people in her 
>> size range.  
>>
>> dougP
>>
>> On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 12:34:00 PM UTC-7, Chris Birkenmaier wrote:
>>>
>>> If I didn't already have a Joe A that I dearly love, I would be very 
>>> tempted.
>>>
>>> On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 3:24:37 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:

 Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:


 https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis

 Happy shopping! 

 Bill Lindsay
 El Cerrito, CA

>>>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Elisabeth Sherwood]

Oh, boy -- I'm so disappointed! I was looking forward to seeing the 
geometry on the 47cm frame size, hoping that it would be the same (or 
close!) as the current design and/or the Homer Hilson.

No luck -- the chart says the ETT is 54cm.  Way too long for someone 5'2" 
(at least, for a woman with a relatively standard woman's proportion 
between legs/torso/arms) and hoping to use drop bars. Even with the slack 
seat-tube angle, it just seems way too long.

Maybe they'll build one up with drop bars to try out one day in Walnut 
Creek someday. 

Elisabeth Sherwood
Washington, DC



On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 3:53:02 PM UTC-4, dougP wrote:
>
> I have an Atlantis that I dearly love and I still find this to be 
> exciting.  Also, good to see the 47 cm is back.  My wife absolutely loves 
> hers but could not ride anything larger, and there are many people in her 
> size range.  
>
> dougP
>
> On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 12:34:00 PM UTC-7, Chris Birkenmaier wrote:
>>
>> If I didn't already have a Joe A that I dearly love, I would be very 
>> tempted.
>>
>> On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 3:24:37 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>>
>>> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
>>>
>>> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis
>>>
>>> Happy shopping! 
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[jandrews]

Similarly I called Riv Bike too to discuss sizing.  I would like to 
purchase a MIT Atlantis as a dedicated tourer and keep my SH in dirt mode.  
I was thinking I'd be somewhere between the new 56cm and the 59cm...but was 
told that I'd be on a 53cm!  My pbh is 84.5 and I find that very surprising.
I ride a 56cm SH and a 58cm Simpleoneboth purchased new from Riv.
I was sort of holding out hope that I would be recommended a 59cm since I'm 
so invested in 700c...but no.
However, it does seem like I could be sized on a 55cm Appaloosa which runs 
700c, so I could go that route and save $100 on the frame...if I really 
want to keep using 700c.
FYI, I know I fit (Barely) the previous gen. 58cm Atlantis (which is 700c)

Decisions decisions


On Monday, April 9, 2018 at 3:30:15 PM UTC-4, Matt Beecher wrote:
>
> I’m a 87. I called riv, talked to Rich, then ordered the 56 upon their 
> recommendation.   I’ve already got an Atlantis and I’m excited to try it in 
> 650B.  I’ll likely keep both. 
>
> Matt B 
> Oswego, IL

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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Matt Beecher]

I’m a 87. I called riv, talked to Rich, then ordered the 56 upon their 
recommendation.   I’ve already got an Atlantis and I’m excited to try it in 
650B.  I’ll likely keep both. 

Matt B
Oswego, IL

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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Dave Small]

Hi Dave,

That's what I do, too.  My PBH is 88cm.  Extrapolating from the Appaloosa: 
 Based on predicted standover height I might take a 59cm, but then the TT 
would probably be too long and it would have a double TT, which I don't 
want.  The standover on a 56cm is a little lower than I have with most 
Rivs, but the predicted TT would be in line with what I'm used to and know 
I like.  The key words in those 2 sentences are "predicted," "probably," 
and "might."  

I'll call Riv.  I don't want to base a sizing decision on speculation, and 
I've come to trust their opinion as much as---and sometimes even more 
than---my own.  

Dave

On Sunday, April 8, 2018 at 8:13:25 AM UTC-4, Dave Johnston wrote:
>
> As Keith points out standover heights are listed so you can also do 
> PBH - 2.54 = standover as a starting point. That is to say the 
> Standover should be 1in less than PBH (1 in crotch clearance in bare 
> feet).
>
> If I'm between sizes I also take top tube length into account when 
> using drops
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[ctifusion]

Is there info on exact tire sizes for the different sizes? I'm between the 
59 and 62. I like fat tires so I think I'm comfortable with the 59 which is 
exciting as the recent sizing has not made me feel like there was a bike 
out there that'd really fit. I'd prefer that they did fat 650b all the way 
up the sizes but if I'm in the market for anything it's a fast-ish all-road 
drop bar bike. Double top tube in the original Altantis color? COOL!

This is the most excited I've been about a new Riv in a while. Anyone 
interested in a 59cm 2004 Quickbeam??  

Brynnar
Indy



On Sunday, April 8, 2018 at 8:13:25 AM UTC-4, Dave Johnston wrote:
>
> As Keith points out standover heights are listed so you can also do 
> PBH - 2.54 = standover as a starting point. That is to say the 
> Standover should be 1in less than PBH (1 in crotch clearance in bare 
> feet). 
>
> You can fudge 1 cm larger since you are wearing shoes which lifts you 
> up, and 3cm maybe 4cm smaller on the 6deg frames. For skinny tires and 
> road use go for the bigger end and for the fattest tires and off road 
> use lean smaller. Bigger bikes ride more stable / smoother, may have 
> less toe overlap (depends on tire size), and it's easier to get the 
> bars higher so can be more comfortable as well. 
>
> Ignore the actual frame size in cm, since it doesn't correlate to 
> non-Riv sizing, classic Riv bikes, or anything you rode in the 70's. 
> Unless of course you rode a bike way to small in the 70's & 80's like 
> many people did in which case it might be the same. 
>
> If I'm between sizes I also take top tube length into account when 
> using drops, but it doesn't matter much at all for sweep back bars. 
>
> -Dave 
>
>
> On 4/8/18, Dave Small  wrote: 
> > Thanks, Dave and iamkeith.  I'll do some cipherin' and figure out what I 
> > would need. 
> > 
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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[David Johnston]

As Keith points out standover heights are listed so you can also do
PBH - 2.54 = standover as a starting point. That is to say the
Standover should be 1in less than PBH (1 in crotch clearance in bare
feet).

You can fudge 1 cm larger since you are wearing shoes which lifts you
up, and 3cm maybe 4cm smaller on the 6deg frames. For skinny tires and
road use go for the bigger end and for the fattest tires and off road
use lean smaller. Bigger bikes ride more stable / smoother, may have
less toe overlap (depends on tire size), and it's easier to get the
bars higher so can be more comfortable as well.

Ignore the actual frame size in cm, since it doesn't correlate to
non-Riv sizing, classic Riv bikes, or anything you rode in the 70's.
Unless of course you rode a bike way to small in the 70's & 80's like
many people did in which case it might be the same.

If I'm between sizes I also take top tube length into account when
using drops, but it doesn't matter much at all for sweep back bars.

-Dave


On 4/8/18, Dave Small  wrote:
> Thanks, Dave and iamkeith.  I'll do some cipherin' and figure out what I
> would need.
>
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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Matt Beecher]

Just email them...or hope Grant reads this post. If that 55 fits me (PBH 87), 
I’ll finally get my 650B new Atlantis to go with my Atlantis Classic. 

That said, I emailed them on Friday and I’m eagerly awaiting their response. 

Matt B
Oswego, IL

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Dave Small]

Thanks, Dave and iamkeith.  I'll do some cipherin' and figure out what I 
would need.  

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[iamkeith]

I think I've even seen something that says a frame size as much as  "4 cm less 
than than would fit on the old 2.5 degree models" is ideal.  I'm going to be 
offline for a bit and unable to corroborate that with a reference though.

In the meantime, standover heights for the new atlanti ARE listed, even if the 
the pbh heights aren't.

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Dave Johnston]

per Riv on the expanded (aka 6 deg sloping top tube) frames:
"PBH minus 29 to 32 is good"
info at the very bottom of this page:
https://www.rivbike.com/pages/pubic-bone-height-how-to-measure-your-pbh

or you can look at the Appaloosa in this chart and extrapolate:
https://www.rivbike.com/pages/choosing-a-frame-size
or subtract 2-3cm from the old Atlantis sizing.

-Dave J


On Saturday, April 7, 2018 at 9:40:09 PM UTC-4, Dave Small wrote:
>
> Hi all.  I've been out of town and mostly offline for 4 days and am 
> catching up.  I've looked through this string and read the new postings on 
> Riv's site, and don't see PBH recommendations for the new Atlantis.  Has 
> Riv posted them anywhere?  Thanks.  
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Joe Bernard]

Not gonna happen, TC. I just bought that Crust from James and Candice so I'm in 
deep on the credit card for a while ;-)

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Dave Small]

Hi all.  I've been out of town and mostly offline for 4 days and am 
catching up.  I've looked through this string and read the new postings on 
Riv's site, and don't see PBH recommendations for the new Atlantis.  Has 
Riv posted them anywhere?  Thanks.  


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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[dougP]

"Be the first one on your block" or perhaps "...first one on your 
blog"

dougP

On Saturday, April 7, 2018 at 4:35:06 PM UTC-7, tc wrote:
>
> Buy one and build it!  Come on, Joe, you knocked that Chev outta the park, 
> now show us how the Longboard should be built up!
>
> Tom
>
> On Saturday, April 7, 2018 at 2:17:18 PM UTC-4, Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>> ...I still want to see an Analog Cycles dropbar gravel bike version with 
>> the single front chainring and pie-plate cassette...
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[tc]

Buy one and build it!  Come on, Joe, you knocked that Chev outta the park, 
now show us how the Longboard should be built up!

Tom

On Saturday, April 7, 2018 at 2:17:18 PM UTC-4, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> ...I still want to see an Analog Cycles dropbar gravel bike version with 
> the single front chainring and pie-plate cassette...
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Joe Bernard]

All Riv frames are F/F/HS. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[David Hays]

Like I need another bicycle…Do these come with the headset like my Homer did?
David


> On Apr 7, 2018, at 2:39 PM, Surlyprof  wrote:
> 
> When asked in another thread what do we wish Rivendell offered that they 
> don't currently offer, I wrote "a 650b Appaloosa".  This looks as close as 
> I'll get and probably even better.
> 
> Time to start negotiating with the wife!
> 
> John
> 
> On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 12:24:37 PM UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:
> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
> 
> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis 
> 
> 
> Happy shopping! 
> 
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
> 
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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[scott minor]

I’d love to see what the double TT models look like (59, 62).  Is there a photo 
or drawing out there anywhere?  

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Surlyprof]

When asked in another thread what do we wish Rivendell offered that they 
don't currently offer, I wrote "a 650b Appaloosa".  This looks as close as 
I'll get and probably even better.

Time to start negotiating with the wife!

John

On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 12:24:37 PM UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
>
> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis
>
> Happy shopping! 
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Abcyclehank]

@iamkeith and others.  One of the pics for the “new” Atlantis shows the braised 
filet bottom bracket area it appears to me.  Would not be a deal breaker for 
me; but then again I have a 99.5 PBH and have/had (it’s complicated) a 68cm 
“Old” Atlantis.

Ryan “ready for spring” Hankinson
West Michigan

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Austin B.]

Nice to see they're reusing the ball-and-socket seat lug from the Roadini. 
And I got a nice chuckle from the photo on the website that shows a bottle 
cage mounted to the *back* of the seat tube facing rear tire! Brilliant!

I really like what RBW is doing these days. I hope this one is a home run 
for them.

Austin
Sykesville, MD

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Jonathan D.]

It looks great. I hope I get to test ride it and compare to the Appaloosa. A 
shorter top tube would be great with my build. 

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[iamkeith]

Ah, thanks.  And "a limited number" appears to be about 9 or 10 of a size.  
"Elude" should be "allude," of course.

On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 2:38:31 PM UTC-6, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> Keith: The details are still being uploaded so you probably haven't seen 
> this yet. The pre-sale price is $100 off and looks to be a thing until the 
> frames start landing in May. 

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Joe Bernard]

Keith: The details are still being uploaded so you probably haven't seen this 
yet. The pre-sale price is $100 off and looks to be a thing until the frames 
start landing in May. 

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[iamkeith]

So have any locals, who have been able to see and ride the sample, looked 
at the bottom bracket and are you able to describe it better?   I'm still 
wondering what "combination tigged / fillet brazed" means.  That's the only 
unknown detail that gives me any pause whatsoever.

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[iamkeith]

RE Geometry:  

I haven't delved into the details too deeply yet, but  speaking personally 
as one who long wanted but never quite fit one of the old Atlanti sizes - 
nor *most* of the more recent 6 degree models - these appear to be* just 
different enough*!  I'd have adequate stand over clearance on the 56 - 
comparable to the old 58 - but also an adequate top tube length, comparable 
to the old 61.  Combined with the new, progressive geometry that makes it 
unique compared to anything else I own, I don't think I could ask for more 
of a reason to get one.  

BTW, maybe someone from Riv can confirm but, from recent conversations and 
research I've gathered that the standover height listings are based on the 
absolute fattest, knobbiest tire that can be squeezed into the frame.  
That's exactly how I'd use it so it's nice to know for me, but there might 
be even more flexibility for most people.

RE Pre-Sale:

Anybody know the details of how this will work?  Is there a limited 
timeframe, limited number of each size available, etc.?   I want to do it 
but I have to wait for some clients to pay their invoices.   On the other 
hand, I won't be able to afford wheels for quite a while, so the main 
motivator is taking advantage of a discount and giving Riv some cash flow.  
 How much of a discount do we suppose there is?  If I recall, the pre-sale 
discounts on the Joe completes were pretty sizeable, but those on frames 
aren't typically as big.   Mostly I don't want to worry about pulling it 
together in time if it's going to be a stress inducer.

 

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Bob Lovejoy]

I am still looking over the geometry but the sloping top tube probably 
makes it look even more different than it really is.

That said, the sizing came out different than I expected (not a bad/good 
thing...).

For instance, I would fit a 61cm (Waterford) Atlantis, 59cm TT (eff), 700c 
wheels, standover 85.1cm
On a new MIT Atlantis, the equivalent (TT anyway) would seem to be:  56cm 
frame, 59cm TT (eff), 650B wheels, standover 83.5cm

Both bikes max at 55mm?

Anyway, interesting!  I bet it will be a great bike but I will be studying 
the geometry more just to learn...  Also, the numbers I am looking at are 
from the Riv geometry charts and not personally known or verified.

Bob Lovejoy
Galesburg, IL


On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 2:43:12 PM UTC-5, Minh wrote:
>
> my memory may be off but is the sizing markedly different from the old 
> atlantis?  
>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[dougP]

I have an Atlantis that I dearly love and I still find this to be 
exciting.  Also, good to see the 47 cm is back.  My wife absolutely loves 
hers but could not ride anything larger, and there are many people in her 
size range.  

dougP

On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 12:34:00 PM UTC-7, Chris Birkenmaier wrote:
>
> If I didn't already have a Joe A that I dearly love, I would be very 
> tempted.
>
> On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 3:24:37 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
>>
>> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis
>>
>> Happy shopping! 
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Minh]

my memory may be off but is the sizing markedly different from the old 
atlantis?  

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[RBW] Re: New Atlantis Pre-sale page is up on rivbike.com

[Chris Birkenmaier]

If I didn't already have a Joe A that I dearly love, I would be very 
tempted.

On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 3:24:37 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> Now you can put your money down on a new Atlantis:
>
> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/framesets/products/frame-new-atlantis
>
> Happy shopping! 
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>

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