Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-27 Thread Deborah Harrell
Didn't have time to finish this yesterday, so am completing it first thing- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Dan Minette wrote: Behalf Of Nick Arnett more snippage for brevity Assuming that a large number of people can't be wrong about something because they are

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-27 Thread Charlie Bell
On 28/09/2006, at 7:24 AM, Deborah Harrell wrote: What I think has me 'smelling something rotten' are the various other oddities and discrepancies (as others have already listed, frex the Saudis flying out unquestioned AFAIK); I think it is far more likely that 'the conspiracy' (instead of

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-26 Thread bemmzim
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: brin-l@mccmedia.com Sent: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 2:46 PM Subject: RE: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?) Dan Minette [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Behalf Of Nick Arnett Assuming

RE: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-25 Thread Deborah Harrell
Dan Minette [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Behalf Of Nick Arnett Assuming that a large number of people can't be wrong about something because they are smart and well-connected is a tautology. I think that you are still missing the point, so let me try it again. Let me start with one

RE: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-25 Thread Deborah Harrell
Dan Minette [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Behalf Of Nick Arnett Assuming that a large number of people can't be wrong about something because they are smart and well-connected is a tautology. I think that you are still missing the point, so let me try it again. Let me start with one

RE: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-25 Thread Deborah Harrell
Dan Minette [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Behalf Of Nick Arnett Assuming that a large number of people can't be wrong about something because they are smart and well-connected is a tautology. I think that you are still missing the point, so let me try it again. Let me start with one

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-24 Thread Julia Thompson
William T Goodall wrote: On 18 Sep 2006, at 12:43AM, Dave Land wrote: On Sep 16, 2006, at 4:24 PM, William T Goodall wrote: On 16 Sep 2006, at 9:12PM, Dave Land wrote: After watching the Pyroclastic video that WTG pointed to, Not me. Just to clear that up Maru Of course not. It was

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-24 Thread Andrew Crystall
On 24 Sep 2006 at 10:55, Charlie Bell wrote: I occasionally say that evolution is a theory in much the same way that gravity is. How it works is a theory. Kind of a mystery, too, which is pretty cool when you think about it. Very cool indeed. Mysteries are what science is all

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-24 Thread Charlie Bell
On 25/09/2006, at 9:31 AM, Andrew Crystall wrote: On 24 Sep 2006 at 10:55, Charlie Bell wrote: I occasionally say that evolution is a theory in much the same way that gravity is. How it works is a theory. Kind of a mystery, too, which is pretty cool when you think about it. Very cool

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-23 Thread Warren Ockrassa
On Sep 16, 2006, at 1:12 PM, Dave Land wrote: After watching the Pyroclastic video that WTG pointed to, I realized that I'd been giving way too much credence to Just-So Stories about what might possibly have happened. It's not that this particular video was all that bad (it was utterly

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-23 Thread Warren Ockrassa
On Sep 19, 2006, at 8:01 AM, Nick Arnett wrote: On 9/18/06, Charlie Bell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ...'cause there's no such thing as something that is so well supported it can be considered a fact. Like gravity. Just a theory. I'm fairly certain that gravity is a fact. I occasionally say

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-23 Thread Julia Thompson
John W Redelfs wrote: On 9/13/06, Gibson Jonathan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks Dan, I guess I missed that message in the bustle of my life. As another after word, every single one of my Archt schoolmates contacted in no way buys the official story. Every one of them cited the pile-up of

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-23 Thread Charlie Bell
On 24/09/2006, at 2:58 AM, Warren Ockrassa wrote: On Sep 19, 2006, at 8:01 AM, Nick Arnett wrote: On 9/18/06, Charlie Bell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ...'cause there's no such thing as something that is so well supported it can be considered a fact. Like gravity. Just a theory. I'm fairly

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-19 Thread Nick Arnett
On 9/18/06, Charlie Bell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ...'cause there's no such thing as something that is so well supported it can be considered a fact. Like gravity. Just a theory. I'm fairly certain that gravity is a fact. How it works is a theory. Nick -- Nick Arnett [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-19 Thread Charlie Bell
On 20/09/2006, at 1:01 AM, Nick Arnett wrote: On 9/18/06, Charlie Bell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ...'cause there's no such thing as something that is so well supported it can be considered a fact. Like gravity. Just a theory. I'm fairly certain that gravity is a fact. How it works is a

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-19 Thread Nick Arnett
On 9/19/06, Charlie Bell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm fairly certain that gravity is a fact. How it works is a theory. Finally - that's exactly what I was saying about evolution before. Same thing. No disagreement here. Nick -- Nick Arnett [EMAIL PROTECTED] Messages: 408-904-7198

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-18 Thread Nick Arnett
On 9/17/06, Gautam Mukunda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But for this type of conspiracy to have occurred - one in which the towers were destroyed by explosives inside the building, and then the evidence of this suppressed after the attacks - then literally thousands of people would have to be

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-18 Thread Klaus Stock
be a conspiracy of the type alleged, thousands of _perfectly ordinary_ people would have to be involved. There was an estimate that in the GDR, one out of seven persons worked for the Stasi (Staatssicherheit = state security), in one way or the other. Most were of course IMs (Inoffizielle

RE: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-18 Thread Dan Minette
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Nick Arnett Sent: Monday, September 18, 2006 9:43 AM To: Killer Bs Discussion Subject: Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?) On 9/17/06

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-18 Thread Nick Arnett
On 9/18/06, Dan Minette [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: He wasn't well connected, he did not have inside information. He just knew the subject matter. There are thousands of structural engineers who should have been able to see the holes in the explanations of the collapse of the towers if the holes

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-18 Thread jdiebremse
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Nick Arnett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 9/17/06, Gautam Mukunda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But for this type of conspiracy to have occurred - one in which the towers were destroyed by explosives inside the building, and then the evidence of this suppressed

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-18 Thread Nick Arnett
On 9/18/06, jdiebremse [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Isn't that not a tautology at all, but one of the basic assumptions about peer-review in science? Only for scientists who treat theories as if they were facts. Nick -- Nick Arnett [EMAIL PROTECTED] Messages: 408-904-7198

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-18 Thread Charlie Bell
On 19/09/2006, at 2:52 PM, Nick Arnett wrote: On 9/18/06, jdiebremse [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Isn't that not a tautology at all, but one of the basic assumptions about peer-review in science? Only for scientists who treat theories as if they were facts. ...'cause there's no such thing as

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-17 Thread Dave Land
On Sep 16, 2006, at 4:24 PM, William T Goodall wrote: On 16 Sep 2006, at 9:12PM, Dave Land wrote: After watching the Pyroclastic video that WTG pointed to, Not me. Just to clear that up Maru Of course not. It was Jonathan Gibson. Gibson ... Goodall ... I think there's more to the

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-17 Thread William T Goodall
On 18 Sep 2006, at 12:43AM, Dave Land wrote: On Sep 16, 2006, at 4:24 PM, William T Goodall wrote: On 16 Sep 2006, at 9:12PM, Dave Land wrote: After watching the Pyroclastic video that WTG pointed to, Not me. Just to clear that up Maru Of course not. It was Jonathan Gibson. Gibson

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-17 Thread Nick Arnett
On 9/15/06, Gautam Mukunda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So either my entire immediate family and a surprising proportion of my friends, and I, were all in on the conspiracy I'm sorry, but I don't quite see why it would be necessary for you and your various acquaintances to have been part or or

RE: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-17 Thread Dan Minette
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Nick Arnett Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2006 9:17 PM To: Killer Bs Discussion Subject: Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?) On 9/15/06

RE: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-17 Thread Gautam Mukunda
--- Dan Minette [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nick wrote: Is there some reason I'm not aware of that you and your network of highly placed acquaintances would need to be notified if we were planning an act of high treason? In his rush to play the man instead of the ball, Nick completely

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-16 Thread Dave Land
Gautam, et al, Sometimes, my wife says of herself, I don't know how you can stand to be around me: _I_ can barely take it. That's a little how I feel about myself and my recent interest in all the 9/11 conspiracies: I can hardly stand to be around myself when I get caught up in it. After

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-16 Thread Gautam Mukunda
--- Dave Land [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm writing to apologize for being such a pompous ass. Also to state that my current position on the whole thing is that whoever it was who plotted to bring down the WTC buildings succeeded in a manner so spectacular that it must have surprised even

Re: 9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-16 Thread William T Goodall
On 16 Sep 2006, at 9:12PM, Dave Land wrote: After watching the Pyroclastic video that WTG pointed to, Not me. Just to clear that up Maru -- William T Goodall Mail : [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web : http://www.wtgab.demon.co.uk Blog : http://radio.weblogs.com/0111221/ Theists cannot be trusted

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-15 Thread Gibson Jonathan
On Sep 14, 2006, at 3:34 PM, Charlie Bell wrote: On 14/09/2006, at 7:26 PM, Gibson Jonathan wrote: Hey, there was a lot of mass and volume to be those structures and it is little wonder some of it spread out. The point we are all scratching our heads over is how they didn't topple off to

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-15 Thread Charlie Bell
On 15/09/2006, at 11:52 PM, Gibson Jonathan wrote: Charlie, You've turned the whole thing in it's head. Your asking me to prove support for your position that the official story, du jour, holds true. No, I'm asking you for evidence to support your claim that it doesn't. The point we

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-15 Thread Gibson Jonathan
Sorry Charlie, I have lost the references I have to the side-toppled buildings I speak of, but will relay them as they turn up. Some of the same ones appeared in the threads when we first dove into this some months ago, if that helps. Ok, let's get into the science a bit more. This event

9/11 conspiracies (WAS RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?)

2006-09-15 Thread Gautam Mukunda
John Gibson wrote: I understand your acceptance. Interesting that your friend is well-placed and perhaps well-heeled - this actually fits a premise I'll go into later about people who know where their bread gets buttered. I'd really like to know just how these studies were funded,

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-14 Thread John W Redelfs
On 9/13/06, William T Goodall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 13 Sep 2006, at 8:34PM, Dan Minette wrote: I think she used some four letter words in response to the poll that stated that somewhere about 30% to 35% of Americans believed that the US government was somehow involved in

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-14 Thread John W Redelfs
On 9/13/06, Gibson Jonathan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks Dan, I guess I missed that message in the bustle of my life. As another after word, every single one of my Archt schoolmates contacted in no way buys the official story. Every one of them cited the pile-up of those vertical support

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-14 Thread Gibson Jonathan
On Sep 13, 2006, at 4:24 PM, Ronn!Blankenship wrote: At 05:49 PM Wednesday 9/13/2006, Gibson Jonathan wrote: Yes, our friends and neighbors live an exceptionally rich fantasy life. On Sep 13, 2006, at 12:38 PM, William T Goodall wrote: On 13 Sep 2006, at 8:34PM, Dan Minette wrote: I

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-14 Thread Gibson Jonathan
On Sep 13, 2006, at 7:29 PM, Dan Minette wrote: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gibson Jonathan Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 3:24 PM To: Killer Bs Discussion Subject: Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-14 Thread Richard Baker
JohnR said: True, oh so true. There are actually irrational people in America who think that somehow the universe created itself. LOL. Even more amazingly, there are people there who believe that the universe was created by a God who was somehow not ever created. I suppose Americans are

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-14 Thread Alberto Monteiro
Gibson Jonathan wrote: Because my simple napkin calc starts with the two eggs, stir gestate, and then bake until brought to term... how can two hot- cross-bun children share one soul? I suppose they could be half- souls each, depending if Confucius rules apply and the difference is

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-14 Thread Ronn!Blankenship
At 09:04 PM Wednesday 9/13/2006, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/13/2006 7:26:15 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: _If_ humans have a spirit (which seemed to be a basic enough assumption in the context not to have to state it explicitly :P) , All we

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-14 Thread Ronn!Blankenship
At 09:17 PM Wednesday 9/13/2006, William T Goodall wrote: If pigs could fly we could bottle their farts and use them to build a time machine Maru If pigs could fly I'd give serious consideration to investing in pith helmets. Quasihomophony Maru -- Ronn! :) While looking out for

RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-14 Thread Ronn!Blankenship
At 10:00 PM Wednesday 9/13/2006, Ritu wrote: Ronn Blankenship wrote: IIRC there are some religions which believe that the baby acquires a spirit or whatever they call it when s/he takes his/her first breath outside the womb. From what was said to me during my pregnancies, I think the

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-14 Thread Charlie Bell
On 14/09/2006, at 7:26 PM, Gibson Jonathan wrote: Hey, there was a lot of mass and volume to be those structures and it is little wonder some of it spread out. The point we are all scratching our heads over is how they didn't topple off to one side. None of these buildings {though

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-14 Thread Warren Ockrassa
On Sep 13, 2006, at 4:24 PM, Ronn!Blankenship wrote: Only if you ass—u—me that whatever a soul is, it is contained within a fertilized egg cell. All we can say for sure is that if a living human being requires some sort of spirit or essence or katra or whatever you call it then at some

RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-13 Thread Dan Minette
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dave Land Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 1:05 PM To: Killer Bs Discussion Subject: Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information? On Sep 12, 2006, at 10:16 AM, Gibson Jonathan

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-13 Thread Gibson Jonathan
believe when there is no reliable information? On Sep 12, 2006, at 10:16 AM, Gibson Jonathan wrote: BTW - Is it impertinent to ask whatever happened to our WTC questions now? Someone, I'm not sure who, but I think it may have been Dan Minette, wrote to the list that Gautam's friend on the 9/11

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-13 Thread Ronn!Blankenship
At 05:49 PM Wednesday 9/13/2006, Gibson Jonathan wrote: Yes, our friends and neighbors live an exceptionally rich fantasy life. On Sep 13, 2006, at 12:38 PM, William T Goodall wrote: On 13 Sep 2006, at 8:34PM, Dan Minette wrote: I think she used some four letter words in response to the poll

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-13 Thread Bemmzim
In a message dated 9/13/2006 7:26:15 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: All we can say for sure is that if a living human being requires some sort of spirit or essence or katra or whatever you call it then at some point prior to a live birth such an entity must enter

RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-13 Thread Dan Minette
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gibson Jonathan Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 3:24 PM To: Killer Bs Discussion Subject: Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information? Thanks Dan, I guess I missed

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-13 Thread William T Goodall
On 14 Sep 2006, at 3:04AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/13/2006 7:26:15 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: All we can say for sure is that if a living human being requires some sort of spirit or essence or katra or whatever you call it then at some

RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-13 Thread Ritu
William T Goodall wrote: Or perhaps all the 'souls' play musical chairs while we sleep and we wake up with a different one each day :- Wasn't that the premise of a Greg Egan short story? Not all the souls playing musical chairs, of course, but one which woke up in a different body each

RE: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-13 Thread Ritu
Ronn Blankenship wrote: IIRC there are some religions which believe that the baby acquires a spirit or whatever they call it when s/he takes his/her first breath outside the womb. From what was said to me during my pregnancies, I think the Hindus [or at least the non-atheist/non-agnostic

What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-12 Thread John W Redelfs
On 9/9/06, Dave Land [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is a vital point: ABC was _given_ the public airwaves -- a multi-billion dollar gift. People had to decide to drive to the theater and pay ten bucks to see the Moore film if they chose to. ABC will air Path to 9/11 for free for two consecutive

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-12 Thread Gibson Jonathan
Hullo, I sympathize. As someone with a good nose for bull-shite I tend to side with your POV on this. What we are all witness to is the old signal to noise ratio. As the publishing sphincters have been loosened {so to speak} first with the DTP revolution and now the web allows any all

Re: What should we believe when there is no reliable information?

2006-09-12 Thread Dave Land
On Sep 12, 2006, at 10:16 AM, Gibson Jonathan wrote: BTW - Is it impertinent to ask whatever happened to our WTC questions now? Someone, I'm not sure who, but I think it may have been Dan Minette, wrote to the list that Gautam's friend on the 9/11 commission was disinclined to answer further