Mark,
Pretty much my thoughts as well. Nobody is seeking to sanitise anything Mike
but when Albert played for Leeds there was near blind hatred for every member
of the Leeds team from opposition fans (perhaps less so from the Liverpool fans
of the time) and I don't remember Albert getting any
Depending upon which channel you were watching - it was probably Eddie Waring
but could have been Peter Ward. Did John Helme ever do commentary on RL ?
- Original Message -I think I watched Wakefield play RL on telly in the
70's oncewho was the bloke who did all the commentating? RL
- Original Message -
Eddie Waring...that's the one!
It's an up and under !
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email leedslist-unsubscr...@gn.apc.org
PETE CASS
- Original Message - There was an accusation that GFH would flip the
club sometime ago but they refuted that. would they really be prepared to sell
so soon??
The question is not about whether they will sell or not, of course they will,
because that is their business model. It is all
- Original Message - The delicious irony!
Meeting in the Thatcher Room!
Yes, as the deadline approached we were transferred as the last minute.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options:
Supporters Direct Press Release
5th February 2013
Supporters Direct also launches report on protecting stadia, citing Chelsea
Pitch-Owners scheme
Chair of the powerful Culture, Media and Sport Select Committee, John
Whittingdale MP, has joined the list of MPs speaking at today's event
- Original Message - Maybe they are looking into Paris, 1975
I'd doubt it as it was UEFA who fixed it in retaliation for our complaining
about them previously fixing Salonika.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options:
Got to agree with much of (what I assume is) the thinking behind Dr Mikes post.
Personally I wish Becchio well and hope he does the best he can with the skills
that he has. It takes many different things to make up a football team.
I also agree to a considerable extent about Smith though I'm not
Wouldn't want to take issue with much of what RW says also.
Becchio is undoubtedly a poor footballer but he probably knows that and many
similarly limited footballers don't play as strikers so they can hide their
limitations better and expectations of them are much lower. He is probably
If Bates was still in charge we would immediately suspect that Norwich had paid
a fee into KBs coffers in the BVI. Makes you wonder.
Maybe Morison has done something that we don't know about to upset Delia.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options:
If Bates was still in charge we would immediately suspect that Norwich had paid
a fee into KBs coffers in the BVI. Makes you wonder.
Maybe Morison has done something that we don't know about to upset Delia.
The club are delighted to announce the signing of Norwich city striker Steve
Morison.
Surely it will be Brown
I will reveal my new hate figure all in good time.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email leedslist-unsubscr...@gn.apc.org
PETE CASS (1962 -
McGovern O'Hare I think you mean.
Neither were shit players but they got caught up in all the other shit that was
going on at the time. They could certainly play for Clough but at Leeds he was
so far up his own arse that nothing and nobody stood any chance.
- Original Message -
Hot tub + Champers; I get.
Hot tub + Champers + emails to the list - now that's truly weird.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email leedslist-unsubscr...@gn.apc.org
- Original Message - Correct David. The plod were always going to have
the last word on this issue.
Bates is an idiot.
Which is also why other clubs chairmen didn't support Bates when he took up
this case. He's not an idiot. He just doesn't care about the outcomes for other
people. He
Are you saying that you don't know about the court case about the policing
costs ?
- Original Message -
I hate bates, but what has the police got to do with him?
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options:
Are you saying that you don't know about the court case about the policing
costs ?
Can I re-phrase that as it isn't quite how I intended to put it. Quite probably
many people are unaware that Bates won a case at the Law Courts in the Strand
last year against WYP and the costs charged to the
- Original Message -
You mean this case
Yes that's the one. Appeal due to be heard next month by the way.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email
Good point or at least good thinking. I hadn't added that one up.
- Original Message -
From: Paul Cundell
To: Rick Duniec
Cc: leedslist@gn.apc.org
Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2013 10:53 PM
Subject: Re: [LU] more joke policing at ER
Is that why Bates has been kept around
The Football Supporters' Federation will launch the Score Campaign: Twenty's
Plenty for Away Tickets in central Manchester on Thursday 24th January
(7pm). The event is free and open to fans of ALL clubs - we want to see you
there. This is the first in a series of nationwide meetings to be
http://www.goal.com/en-gb/news/2896/premier-league/2013/01/11/3662826/premier-league-clubs-weigh-up-16m-proposal-to-offer-free
By Wayne Veysey | Chief Correspondent
Premier League clubs weigh up £16m proposal to offer free travel to away
fans
The radical initiative was proposed by Stoke chief
- Original Message - At the end of the day GFH's expertise is in
property development. Has Bates brought them in to fulfill his dream for
Beeston Village?Who knows, as I say, whilst Bates remains fans will assume the
worst.
I couldn't agree more with these concerns. GFH-C have no
-
From: Phill Shields
To: Rick Duniec
Cc: leedslist@gn.apc.org
Sent: Monday, January 07, 2013 10:35 PM
Subject: Re: [LU] Was Brum - Now 2013
Yes. I think we know who was behind the money that he put up.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info
The buyback option at a pre-determined price has expired on Thorp Arch. This
was why the Trust tried to assist the club in a buyback, and the option period
ended with the farce of Bates attempting shifting blame onto the Council.
All of the provisions of the option on ER should still be in
that is known for certain (AFAIK anyway) is that
the ER buyback option was prior-protected and unaffected by the administration.
For that at least some of the Krasner group deserve our thanks, plus a clever
lawyer somewhere.
- Original Message -
From: Phill Shields
To: Rick Duniec
Dr Mike
Amusing though your rants sometimes are, your response says more about you than
it does about me. Yes I am for real and I'm in no way anti-Semitic.
My father comes from Lvov/Lviv and I live in f88king Alwoodley for Yarways (sp)
sake and have just got back in from talking to one of my
Mike
Maybe you are just having one of those days or maybe you had a humour bypass op
recently.
I'd strongly recommend that you read both of those (my) posts at least once
again each, but maybe with a slightly more open mind. It only works when you
open it btw.
The first post actually strongly
Phill
I share the concerns behind every point that you make in this post except
perhaps the one about GFH-C setting up the company in the Caymans. I'd have to
know what the normal practice for GFH-C is for their other adventures, which I
suspect are all offshore. If this is in any way out of
Well in the early 70s I was a Park Avenue fan when Leeds were not playing, so
City were not my soft spot. Kevin Hector -anybody ? Hooped shirts ?
Bradford needs as much success as it can get anywhere so if City get to Wembley
then support should be unequivocal. Up the Bantams!
I'll buy the
You make a very important point and one that I personally have considerable
sympathy with.
But where does that take us ?
The underlying conversation was about how current reality is affected.
You can feel as smug and superior as you want but it is an illusion.
Your opinion (and my opinion for
From: Leeds United Supporters Trust
Leeds United Supporters Trust Statement - LUFC Financial Analysis Update 7th
January
Back in September 2012, we undertook a detailed review of the finances at
Leeds United and made a number of comments and predictions. We can now
revisit these in light of
- Original Message - Are you seriously saying you have no idea who owns
ER? GFH has said a priority is buying back ER and TA and coincidentally Bates
gets to stay. Would you invest in bricks and mortar for a property you didn't
own? Our money has been used to develop facilities which
- Original Message - I wonder who set the formula.
It was set for the original deal between the club and Jacob Adler.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email
What anybody wants and what might be the best thing to do could be completely
different things. This dilemma comes with the job. The Trusts first question is
flawed for this reason, though this may be dealt with if you get past the first
question - which I have not - yet.
The timing of this is
- Original Message - From: Eric B
How about we arrange a takeover and then keep him on as chairman??? doh.
We can learn a lot from Bates.
Not stuff you might wish to know, be useful all the same.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/article-2246749/Leeds-anxious-buyers-Gulf-Finance-House-Capital-fail-pay-Charles-Sale.html
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email
Leeds 2-1 Crystal Palace- Match Report
Report of match Leeds United v Crystal Palace from 24th November 2012
Reporter PA
Leeds manager Neil Warnock delivered on his promise that the season started
here as his side kicked off their new era by ending Crystal Palace's 14-game
unbeaten run with a
I can say from personal knowledge that almost the last person on Gods earth
that the late Lord Harwood would want to follow him a club president is Ken
Bates. (Paul is one of a very few people who also know this to be a certainty).
His Lordship will be spinning in his grave at the news of this
I can say from personal knowledge that almost the last person on Gods earth
that the late Lord Harwood would want to follow him as the club president is
Ken Bates. (Paul is one of a very few people who also know this to be a
certainty). His Lordship will be spinning in his grave at the news of
I can positively confirm that whoever owns the Football club (as far the the
golden share is concerned) has the right to buyback Elland Road. To be more
accurate the entity that has the golden share rights has the right to buyback
the ground. They don't own the option as such but they have the
Please join the FSE (free) and give your opinion on the concept of spreading
the Euros over the continent.
- Original Message -
From: Nikos Pogatsidis
Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2012 11:37 AM
Dear FSE-Member,
as you may have heard from the press UEFA is at the moment
It isn't just you.
- Original Message -
I'm surprised it's just me that thinks the person who has instructed a
bunch of chancer wannabe bankers (apparently sic) to hog any and all
opportunities of buying Leeds could be none other than a Mr. Kenneth B. of some
parish or other.
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/85165989/GFH_20120927_PR.pdf
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email leedslist-unsubscr...@gn.apc.org
PETE CASS (1962 - 2011) Rest In Peace
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/retailandconsumer/leisure/9520254/Travelodge-landlords-vote-for-rescue-deal.html
By Telegraph Staff
3:06PM BST 04 Sep 2012
The proposed company voluntary arrangement was accepted by 97pc of creditors -
well above the 75pc needed.
It will enable
KBs Monaco address is shown on the Company Details for the club as held at
Companies House and these records are available on the net without paying for a
Cos Ho download from various secondary sources.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options:
That last post would have been better not sent. Apologies to all.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email leedslist-unsubscr...@gn.apc.org
PETE CASS (1962 - 2011) Rest
- Original Message -
But look at it this way, you have a business which some overly ambitious
partner has brought to the point of ruin. You have no money and a pile of debt.
Then, along comes a despicable dragon, who will invest in your business and
turn it around. You don't like it,
- Original Message - Rick - I'm all ears. I haven't read Broken Dreams,
and welcome a quick summary of where Kenneth comes into the story? Did he not
shed the debt?
To understand KBs background and his methods of operation
Broken Dreams is a good starting point.
Whilst it is well
Original Message - Was there not some long-standing call on the club's
finances (REFF? Bondholders?) resulting from Ridsdale's folly that was still
in the background, and could not be cleared unless the club went through
administration - ie the legal link between oldclub and newclub
Krasner went along with Bates because he was under impossible pressure both
from the financial wall that he was facing and the fact that lies from the
devil are always more attractive than the truth. Disaster right now/maybe being
saved, or disaster later. Disaster later was probably inevitable
.. by fans of MK Dons The EastGang of Russia, Ukraine and
Bulgaria and fans of
Leeds United Alliance of Russia, Ukraine, Belarus, Kazakhstan, Greece and
Ireland.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options:
From: Michael Brunskill michael.brunsk...@fsf.org.uk
Date: 11 August 2012 20:29
Subject: The Football Supporters' Federation - 2012 Annual Report
Dear FSF affiliate member,
The Football Supporters’ Federation’s Annual Report for the 2011-12 season is
available to all affiliated/associated
Robert Endeacott has sent you a message.
Date: 8/06/2012
Subject: My new book 'After Extra Time - Dirty Leeds Uncut'
Dear all, apologies for this mass email but it's for a good cause... well
some of it is. My new novel is out this week and as well as being available
from Waterstones and we hope
By Phil Hay
Published on Saturday 30 June 2012 09:10
The takeover of Leeds United is entering its final throes with Ken Bates
nearing the end of his long reign as chairman.
United are poised to pass into new ownership after a decisive bid by investors
based in the Middle East.
The YEP
Further to our previous statement of the 29th May, Leeds United can confirm
they have granted an exclusivity period to enable a potential investor to
carry out the appropriate due diligence.
It is anticipated this will be a fairly straightforward process.
A confidentiality clause prevents the
Watching the England games has been VERY popular in Poland.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email leedslist-unsubscr...@gn.apc.org
PETE CASS (1962 - 2011) Rest In
that next seasons fixtures are published at 9am on Monday.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email leedslist-unsubscr...@gn.apc.org
PETE CASS (1962 - 2011) Rest In
http://www.scribd.com/doc/56787088/Irish-T...anking-collapse
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email leedslist-unsubscr...@gn.apc.org
PETE CASS (1962 - 2011) Rest In
L.U.S.T. Update: Frustrated Players Back Our Vision
Friday, June 8, 2012 at 5:50PM
Leeds United Supporters' Trust have been speaking with sources close to the
players at Leeds United, as frustration grows among fans over the lack of
progress on transfers, the current takeover talks, and
Do we have any UK Solicitors on the list with knowledge of commercial property,
placing charges against property at the Land Registry, and possibly also Court
Injunctions and how you deal with them ? I need some help and advice.
___
Leedslist mailing
I wish
- Original Message -
You selling ER or TAKE?
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email leedslist-unsubscr...@gn.apc.org
PETE CASS (1962 - 2011) Rest
He wasn't trying to steal the island. He was trying to exploit it for his own
personal gain with no thought for the residents.
Par for the course.
Noel Lloyd is now a local hero for stopping him.
- Original Message -
From: Richard Naef
To: Leeds leedslist
Sent: Wednesday, June
Fascinating insights:
That is more of a fascinating LACK of insight.
Lorimer has no idea what he is talking about when it comes to his statement
about nobody else wanting to take on the club at the time of Bates' arrival.
Then again in his own words he wouldn't know anything about it because he
Unless you are talking about last nights Kuwaiti, Abdul from Bahrain was real
enough.
- Original Message -
Weve already had a phony sheik.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options:
- Original Message -
Bit harsh trusting the implied opinion of an administrator after the pigs ear
administrators made of LUFC's 'rescue'
In my view KPMG managed to achieve exactly what their client (Ken Bates
appointed them) instructed them to achieve and in very testing
- Original Message -
Who ARE these people?
There is a clue in that they were all wandering around Beeston for no obvious
reason or purpose on a Tuesday outside of the football season, excluding
perhaps the TV crew.
Bates saved us. Oh dear oh dear oh dear.
First Trevor Birch and then
http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/sport/leeds-united/latest-whites-news/leeds-united-so-what-s-stopping-the-flood-of-new-arrivals-ordered-by-neil-1-4586258
By Gary Walker
Published on Friday 25 May 2012 14:27
When I suggested a fortnight ago that Leeds United chairman Ken Bates needed to
Without wanting to wish good fortune on Chelsea the longer their game went on
against Bayern there was an unmistakable growing feeling of payback for 1975
(and to a far lesser extent for 1976 -St. Etienne at Hampden). It wasn't there
at kick off but the way the game panned out it just grew and
New post on Football Management
Deconstructing Peter Lorimer
by John Beech
Peter Lorimer's thoughts on fans being on the boards of football clubs (1)
were, at least as reported by the BBC, somewhat confusing and even confused.
Certainly his assertion that he does not envisage a member of the
I don't think that the club had anything to do with the various sponsorship
opportunities and memorabilia sales. I think all funds raised by those means
went into the statue fund and any surplus went to Motor Neuron disease research.
Don't know if the club charged for use of the pavilion and
The England Fans Guide to Poland Ukraine
Grab your free copy of the FSF Euros Handbook for use during the upcoming
European Championships in Poland Ukraine.
It doesn't matter whether or not you intend to travel to Poland Ukraine, you
can still have a copy posted to you FREE to use and
Late Tackle Magazine - The National Football Magazine written by Fans for
Fans
*Late Tackle Magazine - The New(ish) National Football Magazine*
Dear Football Lover,
Late Tackle magazine, is the new(ish) thinking fans' football magazine
which goes beyond the agenda-led reporting in the
That is a truly inspired second ranking. Easily forgotten (totally
undeservedly) as I admit that I had. As a fullback, as opposed to a wing back,
possibly challenging for number one spot (though I admit to not seeing
Grenville Hair. Wasn't Grenville at Bradford PA also ?)
- Original
https://www.facebook.com/groups/162396129125/10150919478429126/
Does anyone have a more info on this ?
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email
It had just popped up on a Malaysian facebook page for some reason
- Original Message -
upto the minute this list eh?
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe,
It is because he has mysteriously disappeared with hints of dirty dealings and
Chinese politics. Big news in Singapore it seems. I suppose I should have
guessed, this being Leeds.
- Original Message - It had just popped up on a Malaysian facebook page
for some reason
-
It might make sense to borrow at low interest rates but would you care to
speculate as to the security offered to the lender in order to underwrite the
£5 million facility ? Low (normal) rates are only available from normal lenders
under normal lending procedures which would involve security
- Original Message - From: Paul Cundell
I would agree if we were the owners of the stadium or were borrowing the money
to buy the stadium.
Why would you go into debt to renovate someone else's property?
It's a commercial property so needs a different
mindset to that of thinking about
http://www.fsf.org.uk/news/Leeds-United-fans-group-LUST-banned-for-disagreeing-with-Bates.php?id=
Fan ban for disagreeing with Bates
30th March 2012
The hierarchy at Leeds United has refused to lift its membership ban on
Leeds United Supporters' Trust's (LUST) chair and board members despite
http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/sport/leeds-united/latest-whites-news/come-on-leeds-united-it-s-good-to-talk-1-4404613
By Gary Walker
Published on Friday 30 March 2012 14:46
Why should, I was asked this week, Leeds United owner Ken Bates get involved
in any dialogue with the Leeds United
http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/sport/leeds-united/latest-whites-news/leeds-united-dig-deep-ken-the-fans-deserve-better-1-4380413
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe,
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2012/mar/22/forgotten-story-abraham-klein-referee
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email leedslist-unsubscr...@gn.apc.org
PETE
- Original Message - we were in the pub garden near Wembley, though I
have no idea of the name of the place,
Surely you were in The Green Man just up the hill. What a day.
I have always thought that this was the biggest Leeds attendance of all time.
Didn't he score the goal against Arsenal that won the League Cup for Swindon
(of the 3rd division) at Wembley ?
- Original Message -
The very same. Played 400 games for Swindon first, and is regarded as their
best ever player.
___
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4oQTUv37nU
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email leedslist-unsubscr...@gn.apc.org
PETE CASS (1962 - 2011) Rest In Peace Mate
From the FSF website-
An MP has today tabled a bill in Parliament calling for total transparency
on club ownership and an end to the “football creditors rule”. The Football
(Financial Transparency) Bill has been introduced by Damian Collins MP who
sits on the influential Culture, Media and
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/david-conn-inside-sport-blog/2012/mar/13/fa-white-flag-soul-football
FA raises white flag in 20-year fight for the soul of football
The Premier League has emerged victorious after the governing body signed
away much of its authority with barely a whimper
- Original Message - Maybe something for LUST to work on since they now
have lost against Bates ;)
What a strange conclusion to come to.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To
For those who may be interested the response by Football to the Sports Minister
is to be made public at 1pm today.
(16 pages)
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email
That's quite a good summary of the 16 pages
- Original Message -
I presume that it's Yeah whatever bovvered
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and options: http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/leedslist
To unsubscribe, email
- Original Message - It just strikes me that LUST are like Hal Ashland
in the story, kidding
themselves they are involved with the club but the club are like the the
prossie, they couldn't give a about any fan. They only want us to keep
going back and spending our money.
The only
- Original Message -
OK, that's a fair point, Leeds United will never be Ken Bates and vice versa
and that is the only thought that keeps me going, BUT commercially he can do
what he wants.
I see where you are coming from but actually he can't. Even in a close-monoply
situation the
ianjamesmurray wrote:
He owns a company which owns the football league share, he will never own
the club. The club belongs to us.
http://footballmanagement.wordpress.com/2011/02/09/club-club-or-club-a-3cs-model/
Club', 'club' or 'club'??? A 3Cs model
by John Beech
The evidence submitted by
L.U.S.T: An open letter to Neil Warnock
Dear Neil,
On behalf of more than 4,500 members and shareholders of Leeds United
Supporters’ Trust, we would like to welcome you to our club. Leeds United
and Neil Warnock have a long history as rivals, but we are delighted to see
you have finally come
Have a look here -
http://www.seat61.com/
Anyone know anything about taking a train from Beijing to London?
Everything always looks great when advertised. The idea seems exotic and
something that I'd love to do.
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info
I was talking about the financial aspects, not on the field genius, but I think
you know that.
- Original Message -
From: Mark Humphries
Where were we in the league when we were put into admin
___
Leedslist mailing list
Info and
Meeting this Thursday 9th February and 'Campaign for change' march Saturday
11th February
We would like to remind all supporters of two significant events coming up
this week.
First of all we have a meeting this Thursday evening at the Magic Sponge,
7.30pm as both a follow up to the last
http://lufctrust.squarespace.com/blog/2012/2/6/lust-statement-on-leeds-united-investment.html
L.U.S.T Statement on Leeds United investment
Monday, February 6, 2012 at 4:40PM
Last week on Yorkshire Radio, Ken Bates invited the Leeds United Supporters'
Trust to, put their money where their mouth
Siobhain McDonagh MP backs historic opportunity for change in football
At 6pm this Thursday (today), AFC Wimbledon supporter Siobhain McDonagh MP
will have a 30 minute Parliamentary debate in the House of Commons on:
Government policy on football governance and the case of AFC Wimbledon.
The
- Original Message - Bates also revealed that a tribunal to decide on
the fate of Andy O’Brien has been set for February 27.
I'm very worried about what might come out here. I don't KNOW anything but this
has all the vibrations of a monumental mess and PR disaster.
201 - 300 of 417 matches
Mail list logo
