Page crashes Netsurf

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

www.fodradio.org/  
crashes Netsurf. Not a normal crash: Netsurf simply evaporates. No log, no
warning.

Done so 3 times, so it's consistent here.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Badly formatting page

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

It's probably a crap html, but this page is very badly formatted by
NetSurf.

http://www.4pcb.com/index.php?load=contentpage_id=46

I suspect there are always going to be some bad pages - but they are
getting fewer!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Form oddity

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

On 05 Aug, li...@torrens.org.uk wrote:
 I have just written a form to send emails to a mailing list I have.

 This allworks fine, but the resultant incoming email has  0A 0D 0A where
 I had pressed Return twice.

 Seems to be a spare 0D in there. Seems to have been put in by NetSurf!

To answer? myself, it's not quite that simple. The email I had looked at
was the version in the List archives. The actual version I received was
fine.

The log saved by the form handler also had the 0Ds - so presumably it's a
quite normal happening and NetSurf is doing what it should!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Style sheets

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Reloading a document does not appear to re-load the style-sheet.

Is this intentional, an oversight or a bug?

BTW: the work that is being done is impressive. Especially as it's a
task which can never be finished. Thanks to all involved.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Crash on closing window while searching

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Just had this happen again.

Log is at www.torrens.org.uk/documents/Log

However - no search window was open. I had just edited one of my own pages
and viewed it before uploading. Nop other window ws open.

as Isaid, it's not uncommon here, bu I cannot pin down any way of
predicting when it will happen
.
3.0 (Dev) (09 Jan 2011 19:15) r11270

but it's been going on some ttime!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Drag drop crashes

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

The latest Netsurfs seem very sensitive to something when I drag a text
from StrongED to a www form.

It happens as I am draging over the NS window, before I release the mouse.

Conceivably it's to do with mouse switch noise but I think not as it
occurs on an RPC as well as an Iyo.

I have put some logs at
ftp://4qd:4rfvb...@torrens.org.uk//www/www.torrens.org.uk/documents/logs/

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Possible bug?

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I use a cgi-bin program to anti-spam links in my www site.

This program works fine with Chrome, but with Netsurf returns an error
BadType.

Is this a bug?
3.0 (Dev) (15 Sep 2011 23:00) r12798


To test it. see
http://www.4qd.co.uk/addrs/repair.html
Any of the links email via our anti-spam filter! will retirn the eroor.
e.g.
http://www.4qd.co.uk/addrs/repair.html#Calif

--
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Text box edit

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article be1eb1e452.jess@itworkshop.invalid,
   Jess Hampshire jesshampsh...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hi

 Would it be possible to have an option to use the system editor to 
 edit text boxes?

 (Also it would be nice to have a system to set the mode.)

 It would be nice to be able to use StrongEd's mail mode on gmail, for 
 example.

 Thanks

I frequently use StrongED to edit text: then mark it and drag and drop
into Netsurf.

Not sure how anyhting in Netsurf could make this simpler?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Text box edit

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 62d8b9e452.jess@itworkshop.invalid,
   Jess Hampshire jesshampsh...@gmail.com wrote:
 he sort of thing I was thinking of, was a menu item over text boxes 
 that sent the contents to an external editor, in much the same way as 
 messenger pro used to. (it would also be nice to have options for what 
 the editor sees it as.)

Pluto uses a Ctrl-Shift-E which throws the current text to an external
editor. 

This works very well. IMO better than a menu entry.

But isn't this pretty well exclusive to Risc OS?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Hotlist truncation/corruption

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 20121122083649.GA3366@somnambulist.local,
   Daniel Silverstone dsilv...@netsurf-browser.org wrote:
 If any of you had backups of your hotlist from before NetSurf seems to have
 lost entries, you could use copies of those backups to do the test.  If the
 problem manifests repeatably, then copies of the offending hotlists would go a
 long way to helping us diagnose and fix the fault.


It's a saving issue. Just closed Netsurf and watched the file shrink from
16K to 552 bytes.

Both attached

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!
Title: NetSurf hotlist




Buy/Sell

FreeAds Burwell
Preloved | used latex for sale UK and Ireland
Free Classified Ads . Classifieds . Property, Jobs, Motors, Personals...
 East Anglia Free ads, East Anglia classifieds, East Anglia FREE CLASSIFIED ADS, 450,000+ free classifieds in the UK
Gumtree - Cambridge
craigslist: cambridge, UK classifieds for jobs, apartments, personals, for sale, services, community, and events
Welcome to the Camlets Home Page
eFreeko, recycling the planet - Home Page
hififorsale.com's AudiophileCandy
Canon: Ace Cameras For Best Deals On Used Cameras, Lenses, Accessories, Scopes, Binoculars, Eyepieces and Astronomical Equipment.
Digital Camera Magazine Classifieds
Gumtree.com - Gloucester Classifieds

Computing

gEDA Project Homepage
pdf2gerb: Convert PDF to Gerber and NC Drill formats « scattershot genius;
Vutrax Electronics CAD - Off-site Links
Perlmasters Perl Script and CGI Script Resource Site
Perl
CPAN
RISC OS

32 Bit Conversions
David Pilling :: Home : RISC OS
Dave Higton's home page
SiteMatch RISC OS Web Site Synchroniser
Google Directory - Computers  Systems  RISC OS  Software  Monitor Definition Files
 IYONIX pc
RISCOS Ltd
RISC OS Knowledgebase
RISC OS Select - Private - News
RISCOS.org : Support - !Boot Structure
Recommended software - RISCOS
BBC - h2g2 - RISC OS Computers
John's HTML Tutors
 ZFC Guides
Avisoft Home Page

Tests etc

IANA  Root Zone Database
Test Your Firewall
The W3C Markup Validation Service

Unix

CGI - perldoc.perl.org
demime - A tool to scrub mime from mailing lists
Pure-FTPd - About
Stripmime


Electronics

AVR
EAsm homepage
Semiconductors
== Diodes ==
Soldering
LF-1000 TIPS
BOSS Enclosures
Dancap Electronics Home Page - Official Hakko Distributor for the UK and Northern Ireland
Kaisertech, hot air rework, fume extraction, dummy components.
Rampantapathy : - Cart contents
Welcome to STMicroelectronics
SuperMagnete.de - The Strongest Magnets in the World

Food

Food From Britain
http://www.justsolutions.eu/CamFruit/displayGrowers.asp
 Spice Pages: Coconut (Cocos nucifera)
 Spice Pages: Coconut (Cocos nucifera)
 Welcome to Rick Stein's Seafood Restaurant, Accommodation  Cookery School - Rick Stein

Genealogy

Stoke Ferry

Dr Henry Linhook Helsham of Stoke Ferry, Norfolk (1767-1806)
Dr Robert Harvey (1700-1756) of Stoke Ferry, Norfolk, England.
Stoke Ferry - White's 1854
GENUKI: Norfolk: Genealogy: Towns and Parishes: Stoke Ferry
GENUKI: Norfolk: Genealogy: Towns and Parishes: Stoke Ferry: Coates: Names


Holidays

Camp Sites and Caravan Parks in England
An extensive caravan parks and sites directory, a portal for caravan sales and rental, and a comprehensive on-line guide to caravan, mobile home, motorhome, tent, trailer tent and cabin holidays :: Caravan Sitefinder UK
Defra, UK - Rural Affairs
Paws For a Walk - The Dog Friendly Website
Holiday Accommodation Dog  Pet Friendly Cottages Caravans BB Hotels
Pet friendly dogs welcome self-catering country cottages and holiday cottages
Cotswolds
Holiday Accommodation Dog  Pet Friendly Cottages Caravans BB Hotels
Forest of Dean

Evans Holidays
Royal Forest of Dean, Herefordshire and Monmouthshire Dog Friendly Accommodation
Holiday accommodation in the Forest of Dean, Gloucestershire
Cottages Wye Valley Forest of Dean accommodation self catering

Lincolnshire
Lincolnshire Walks - Lincolnshire County Council
Norfolk
The Brecks, Norfolk  Places to Stay, Visit, Eat and Drink in the Brecks
Nottingham
Homepage


Music

BBC - Radio 3
Index of /2ndhand/

Natural history

Animals

Cats

Cat Rescue and Rehoming - Siamese Cat Club Welfare Trust
SpringerLink - Journal Article
FAB Home Page
Mr. Lee CatCam

Fish
Aquariumlife.net - Aquarium articles, forums, DIY projects, tools
Species - ARKive

Plants

Flower seeds Vegetable seed Grass seed, Garden Sundries
Latin name index P - Plants For A Future database report
Plants For A Future - 7000 useful plants
PFAF Database Search
Thomas Etty Esq. - Heritage Vegetable Seeds
Novelty Tropical Seeds
Invasive non-native plants
http://www.fruitipedia.com/


NetSurf

NetSurf homepage
NetSurf test builds

Photography

Advanced Camera Services
Canon EOS Beginners' FAQ III - Lenses
Canon EOS Beginners' FAQ III - Lenses
photo.net - photo.net

Searches

Search for People, Businesses and Places - 192.com
Route Planner (GB) : Routes, maps and directions - The AA
AltaVista - Babel Fish 

Re: Hotlist truncation/corruption

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article s2f288a3d7li...@torrens.org.uk,
   Richard Torrens (lists) li...@torrens.org.uk wrote:
 In article 20121122083649.GA3366@somnambulist.local,
Daniel Silverstone dsilv...@netsurf-browser.org wrote:
  If any of you had backups of your hotlist from before NetSurf seems to
  have lost entries, you could use copies of those backups to do the
  test.  If the problem manifests repeatably, then copies of the
  offending hotlists would go a long way to helping us diagnose and fix
  the fault.


 It's a saving issue. Just closed Netsurf and watched the file shrink from
 16K to 552 bytes.

 Both attached


Should have said this is with 3.0 (Dev CI #656)

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: RISC OS Javascript support

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 52ff29f39bdhw...@talktalk.net,
   David H Wild dhw...@talktalk.net wrote:
 I have come across three oddities in connection with JavaScript.

 (i) If you look at Flickr Having JS off brings a message about JS being off
 but gives the picture. With JS on there is no message, but the picture
 doesn't appear although the little strip of pictures is there.

 (ii) In Yahoo groups having JS on means that the navigation buttons don't
 appear.

 (iii) On today's Guardian website has, with JS off, a grid of squares
 saying Link to slideshow 1. clicking on this produces the picture that
 should have been there.. With JS on the grid of links doesn't appear and
 there is a blank space on the page.

 This is with 740 on a rPC.

Similar effect with Streetmap.co.uk

This will probably be because only some JS is working as of yet - enough
that the site recognises JS to be present, but not enough to do the job
required.

I'm sure it will all get sorted in time, until then we must be patient -
and thankful that it is happening at all. Adding JavaScript must be a
herculean task!

Thanks to all the team.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Hotlist on RISCOS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 5306d264c4d...@triffid.co.uk,
   Dave Symes d...@triffid.co.uk wrote:
 And you'll be lucky if you hit the spot (Once in a blue moon). The
 receptive bit for the DD must be about one or two pixels in size, and
 don't ever bother if the Directory is at the bottom of the window,
 you'll never get it in.


It would make a lot of sense if a directory could be clicked on to
activate it (open directory icon) so that it could be filled. Adding to an
empty directory is indeed chancey.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Scroll wheel speed

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article mpro.mgxcqe03fwazk01j8.li...@stevefryatt.org.uk,
   Steve Fryatt li...@stevefryatt.org.uk wrote:
 On 20 Jan, Richard Torrens (lists) wrote in message
 5310fde37bli...@torrens.org.uk:

  The main problem I find is not the speed, but the fact that there is a
  buffer somewhere that stores scroll clicks, so that scrolling continues
  after the wheel is stopped.

 That's in RISC OS, and happens when the app doesn't take scroll events as
 quickly as you produce them.  See also scrolling via PageUp/Down.

The effect seems much less now than of old. Presumably Netsurf flushes the
buffer when it returns to look at the scroll wheel? 


BTW: there seems to be a change recently. I have a Macro inserter and
previopusly   User|iPassword|m   would enter user and password as it
should. Recent issues (815, 827 - not tried others) do not accept |i as a
TAB. UserPassword is entered in the User box, |i is ignored.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Line wrap

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I'm using 1048.

The line wrapping is a little odd. For instance on a www page I have
includes:
The MOSFETs we are using in 2012 have a bmaximum/b
Rsubds(on)/sub of around 6 milliohms.

If width is such, Netsurf will break the line before the sub -
effectively in the middle of a word.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Line wrap

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Might it help if we users made a list of places where line-wrap can
occur?

Clearly at any white space.
Hyphens?
Any other place?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: streetmap.co.uk

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 026d155b53.bo...@boase.demon.co.uk,
   Bernard Boase b.bo...@bcs.org wrote:
 Until recently Netsurf could render maps at streetmap.co.uk provided 
 one entered via their older interface at 
 http://www.streetmap.co.uk/newdefaulte2.htm from which exporting a 
 drawfile could be extremely useful.

 But now even entering via this URL, the map display is only in the new 
 format which Netsurf apparently cannot display. I am currently using 
 3.1 (Dec Cl #1252).

 Any suggestions?

I use Stretmap a lot.

But I always use it by clicking a link in StrongED. e.g.
http://streetmap.co.uk/loc/Burwell

This takes you to a page hich asks whih Burwell. Click the appropriate one.

Then you go to a page which asks for j/s. Wait and you do automatically to
the static map - which works absolutely fine.

This with 3.1 (Dev CI #1125)

Streetmap hasn't changed recently. You can also menu on a squatre of the
map and Object - Object - Save which can be dropped straight into
OpenVector and imported as a JPEG.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: streetmap.co.uk

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 535b3bc356j...@jaharrison.me.uk,
   John Harrison j...@jaharrison.me.uk wrote:

  ... Streetmap hasn't changed recently...

 It has!  

 I use it regularly and the behaviour changed (as per my previous posting)
 about a week ago.

Alright - I should have been more spoecific. There has been no change in
Streetmap's behaviour when used the way I outlined.

I've just updated to 3.1 (Dev CI #1257) and Streetmap (used the way I
said) behaves exactly as it always has.

But if javascript is on - then it does not work at all, doesn't display
the No javascript message and doesn't progress (no change there
either!)... Maybe this is your problem?

Support at Streetmap were very helpful: I contacted them some while ago,
when they changed to the new version, and was assured that the old version
would remain.

So whatever's happened is not a Netsurf thing...

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Bed page display

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://www.cornishworkshop.co.uk/hammerhandle.html

is a series of nested tgbles.

The text overwrites, all on one line, with no proper wrapping in the cells.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Site crashes NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

www.bsbi.org.uk
seems to consistently crash NS (3.1 (Dev CI #1543)) without displaying a
thing.

Can anyone else get this site?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

MousAxess

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Is anyone else here using MouseAxess with NetSurf?

I hav found Netsurf very inclined to crash. It feels like it's caused bey
switch bounce, usually from the menu button. But removing MouseAxess seems
to stop it.

I have not found any other programs which crash like this...

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: MousAxess

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 53d5cd2686t...@netsurf-browser.org,
   Michael Drake t...@netsurf-browser.org wrote:
 In article 53d4c22179li...@torrens.org.uk,
Richard Torrens (lists) li...@torrens.org.uk wrote:

  I hav found Netsurf very inclined to crash. It feels like it's caused
  bey switch bounce, usually from the menu button. But removing MouseAxess
  seems to stop it.

 Please could someone who is seeing this crash file a bug report with a
 Log file attached. Otherwise it is unlikely ever to be investigated.

 Cheers,

 That's http://bugs.netsurf-browser.org/ of course.

Well I went there, then to the next page. How do I report a bug?

Life's too short to open accounts and log in or to work out complicated
routines, sorry.

If someone else can do this, there are 3 log at
http://www.torrens.org.uk/documents/Logs/

Netsurf crashes erratically, but this appears to be caused by MouseAxess.
It is associated with use of the menu button, for instance to scroll the
window. 

It is not new - though recent releases may be more sensitive. I have
noticed it most on an Iyonix (5.18). That's out of action, I write now on
an RPC (4.39 (28 Apr 2004) [Kernel 6.80]) where the Logs were generated.

These 3 logs were vry close together: it's not difficult to cause it, but
I still have no clue as to the exact button/drag sequence.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: MousAxess

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 20140207125751.gb5...@parsifal.org.uk,
   John-Mark Bell j...@netsurf-browser.org wrote:
   That's http://bugs.netsurf-browser.org/ of course.
  
  Well I went there, then to the next page. How do I report a bug?

 You log in, click the Report Issue link, fill in the form, and click
 Submit Report.

That page, at the bottom has a link: bug reporting interface.

That takes me to http://bugs.netsurf-browser.org/mantis/my_view_page.php

which has no Report Issue link...

I suspect the key is the my_view_page bit. It probably only works for
logged-in members

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: MousAxess

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 53d63f0cd7brian.jord...@btinternet.com,
   Brian Jordan brian.jord...@btinternet.com wrote:
 In article 53d63916ddli...@torrens.org.uk,
Richard Torrens (lists) li...@torrens.org.uk wrote:

 [Snip]

  Well I went there, then to the next page. How do I report a bug?

  Life's too short to open accounts and log in or to work out complicated
  routines, sorry.

  If someone else can do this, there are 3 log at
  http://www.torrens.org.uk/documents/Logs/

 If you haven't yet done so, I'll post yours along with one of my own
 which is a log of I crash I provoked when scrolling with the menu button.

Thanks.

It's definitely MoussAxess related. I now do 
RMKill Moussaxess
before surfing - if I remember!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: BoxConvert?

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article
out-53934cb3.md-1.4.17.chris.yo...@unsatisfactorysoftware.co.uk,
   Chris Young chris.yo...@unsatisfactorysoftware.co.uk wrote:
 a) When did this start?

I haven't updated NS for a while so don't know when it started!

 b) Can you post one of the faulty pages here, or upload it in a way in
 which it can be downloaded without the SSI being parsed?

After a bit more experimenting, it is caused by the line:

Pa href=http://!--#echo var=HTTP_HOST --!--#echo
var=DOCUMENT_URI --Top of page/a

Two pages in the attached archive: one contains the line, one does not.

NS clearly isn't going to do anything sensible with this - but at present
it causes the page not to load at all.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!


new.zip,A91
Description: application/riscos

BoxConvert?

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I can confirm that the latest build allows the page to display.

What Netsurf should do with the line
a href=http://!--#echo var=HTTP_HOST --!--#echo var=DOCUMENT_URI
--Top of page/a
I leave to others ... it's never going to do the right thing locally, so
as long as it doesn't stop display I think it's unimportant what happens.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: My wish: To be able to save just the HTML file

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 541d749f.2040...@fastmail.fm,
   Vesa Paatero vpaat...@fastmail.fm wrote:
 Hi,

 My wish for Netsurf developers is a simple one: To be able to save just 
 the HTML file of a web page with link references intact. Currently, 
 Netsurf always saves the whole web page, i.e. the HTML file with links 
 changed to point to the associated files saved into a directory 
 automatically created for them. I imagine it would be relatively easy to 
 enable saving just the HTML page, yet it currently can't be done ... or 
 if it can be done, please let me know.

 Thanks for considering it!

 Vesa

Very easy to do:

f8  edit the html in StrongED of whatever editor you use.
f3  in StrongED: save the page.

I don't think anything needs to be done in NS!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

R-Pi B+ RISC OS problems

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Netsurf won't run here: during loading it gives an error:
Memory exhausted whilst loading URL file.

Memory isn't exhausted: I suspect there is another problem which is being
wrongly errored.

So where and what is the URL file so I can check it?

This is with recent Netsurf and back quite a way. So I think it is a
problem with the file - not with the memory!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Raspberry-Pi B+ problem

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I have a  problem running NetSurf on a R-Pi B+

It used to work. Then, one day, stopped running. I made no change to the
R-Pi at the time.

However the B+ appears to be extremely unreliable: Disc error keeps
being reported. Usually falsely - but sometimes ther is a corruption, so I
thin something may have been corrupted. But what?

I have had the SD card replaced, and th eR-Pi itself. I have also almost
entirely eliminated the power supply as a problem.

When I run Netsurf, it goes into a continuous hour-glassing loop.
alt-break stops it.

I have Reporter running: this gives me no clues. It reports
*Filer_run  !Netsurf.

Then after the Alt-Break, it lists a whole host of output, stopping at
 [Appl/0B2039C4] RMEnsure Iconv 0.04 Error 16_10F iconv support requires
the Iconv module 0.04 or newer
 ** WimpError ** from Window Manager
  Error  : 050DEAD0
  Message: Press Stop to terminate Unknown.

I have replaced Netsurf with a completely new update. No change. I have
replaced Iconv and several other modules. No joy!

So0 has anyone any idea of what is happening, or what I should do next?
It's the Unknown that's looping.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Raspberry-Pi B+ problem

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 253e6ecc5d1.033bd...@davehigton.me.uk,
   Dave Higton d...@davehigton.me.uk wrote:
 On Wed, 10 Dec 2014 12:41:02 + (GMT) Richard Torrens wrote:

 [snip]
  I have had the SD card replaced, and th eR-Pi itself. I have also
  almost entirely eliminated the power supply as a problem.

 What about the power supply cable?  Have you eliminated that too?

 Your problems look very much as if they are caused by low power supply
 voltage.  Can you measure what voltage appears within the RPi?

 Dave

I measured 5.16v, stable, on the expansion pins of the B+. It showed no
variation as thePi was used.

I also fitted a 3,000µF capacitor actoss these pins.

The extra capacitor had no perceptible effect.

So it certainly doesn't look like supply problems. Unless the voltage
tolerance on the supply is incredibly tight.

Netsurf was working for quite some time with no sign of any trouble.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Raspberry-Pi B+ problem

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 5473e1e3dbch...@chris-johnson.org.uk,
   cj ch...@chris-johnson.org.uk wrote:
 In article 5473d22af9li...@torrens.org.uk,
Richard Torrens (lists) li...@torrens.org.uk wrote:
  I have Reporter running: this gives me no clues. It reports
  *Filer_run  !Netsurf.

  Then after the Alt-Break, it lists a whole host of output, stopping at
   [Appl/0B2039C4] RMEnsure Iconv 0.04 Error 16_10F iconv support requires
  the Iconv module 0.04 or newer
   ** WimpError ** from Window Manager
Error  : 050DEAD0
Message: Press Stop to terminate Unknown.

 Can it be assumed that the 'whole host' corresponds to the Netsurf
 !Run file up to the point where it tries to rmensure Iconv?

Yes, exactly as the !Run file.

 The unknown may be the !Run obey file itself or Iconv trying to
 initialise.

I thought Iconv might be corrupt, replaced it. No change.

 The implication is that you haven't changed Netsurf or any of its
 support modules. 

a working NetSurf stopped working for no apparent reason. So I tred a
completely new one. It now has RunImage dated December 4th - I think
that's 2425.

 From the error message you are running a fairly old
 version. What actual versions are you running? What compatibility
 mode are you running the Pi in?

I have just tried all 3 modes. It makes no difference.

I also tried executing (via a StrongED task window) the !Run file step by
step. This gives a Window Manager is currently in use after
/NetSurf$Dir.KickNS
and after
Run NetSurf$Dir.!RunImage %*0 2Wimp$ScrapDir.WWW.NetSurf.Log

First is thrown back to the Task Window, second is a Wimp error Box.

Netsurf doesn't run, but machine does not freeze.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Raspberry-Pi B+ problem

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article e014447454.c...@cdewhurst2010.btinternet.com,
   Chris Dewhurst cdewhurst2...@btinternet.com wrote:
 Hi Richard,

 Not sure if the below will help but you could give them a try, even if 
 to eliminate from your enquiries.

 (1) On my R-Pi sometimes Netsurf gets stuck in a loop of redirecting 
 itself to its home page. Quitting Netsurf and deleting the folder:

 SDFS::16GbPi.$.!Boot.Resources.!Scrap.ScrapDirs.ScrapDir.WWW

 (or wherever the WWW folder resides in your !Boot folder)

 then restarting Netsurf cures it.

Excellent! Thanks.

I renamed SDFS::RISCOSpi.$.!Boot.Choices.WWW.NetSurf
to .NetSurfX

NetSurf then started fine
then I quit Netsurf and started moving the old files back.

The problem was a corrupted Hotlist in there. It was 7M and most of that
was junk looking very much like a memory dump.

The section immediately after the hotlist was a load of lines such as

(27736.96) render/html_object.c html_object_free_objects 651: object
0x67ea3858

which is clearly dumped from Netsurf.


Deleting all the junk after the final /ul of the hotlist proper, nothing
has been lost.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Hot List

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Could you change the saving of the hot list?

At present it only saves when NS is quit - a pain if you have just made
changes and NS quits1

It either needs a Menu Item: Save Hot List or it should save automatically
when changed.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Hot List

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 20150429101112.GY23045@somnambulist.local,
   Daniel Silverstone dsilv...@netsurf-browser.org wrote:
 I'm not sure it's very realistic to expect project maintainers to
 continue to support a platform which none of them run and which has no
 active maintainer to help -- where despite there clearly being a number
 of engineers who still run the project and who have the requisite
 skills, noone can be found to provide what little support would be
 needed to keep the project on-track.  But I suppose that's how platform
 support atrophies and is eventually removed.

You have a very valid point.

RISC OS needs a good browser: its probable that if it had one, more people
would use it.

But it looks like most of us who use NS on RO are users, not programmers.
I have done a little programming, long ago. C I have no understanding of
at all. I have looked a C source code as one of our motor controllers was
programmed, and the source was in C. It left me colder than cold...

Maybe you, Daniel, or one of the other programmers should write a request
to comp.sys.acorn.programmer to see if you can interest anyone there in
joining the team. There may well be someone who is capable, could be
interested, but does not subscribe to this list.

I'd do it myself, but am in no position to know how easy it will be, or
what sort of things are involved.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Hot List

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 0fc224ac3bf.03edd...@davehigton.me.uk,
   Dave Higton d...@davehigton.me.uk wrote:
 I've become aware over the years since then that the big difference
 between children and adults is their attitude.  No-one tells children
 that they can't learn, and so they go through all their childhood
 years learning at an astonishing rate.  Then something happens, and
 they persuade themselves (or each other) that learning is no longer
 possible.

True.  

But one thing age does teach you is judgement: it becomes far easier to
work out how much hassle the task is going to be, and that the reward is
not worth the hassle!

So you end up doing something else...

I gave up programming becasue it was too much hassle. Long ago (I'm now
71).

There are plenty of things I do enjoy learning about: except they tend
not to stick in my memory as much as of yore.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Google

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 20150508125407.ga2...@kyllikki.org,
   Vincent Sanders vi...@netsurf-browser.org wrote:
 It has been reported in the tracker as bug number 2314. Google have
 changed the non javascript portion of their reply (the noscript entry)
 to comtain completely broken html that simply causes the browser to
 refresh and fail to work usefully.

 We cannot do anything about this in NetSurf itself and need Google to
 unbreak their noscript, If you can get anyone there to listen that
 would be good as I have been unable to find someone to contact. This
 affects all non javascript browser (or those with it turned off) and
 cannot be worked around.

I suspected as much ...

Writing a browser is a somewhat Herculean task and keeping it operating
with broken www sites is a never ending task.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Google

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 54c08ebfb1joh...@ukgateway.net,
   John Williams joh...@ukgateway.net wrote:
 Or one of those record your button presses and menu items programs we
 used to  have in the olden days.

It's called KeyStroke, Alisdair Jørgensen, originally sold by Quantum
software, now PD. It could indeed record such a train of button presses on
menu items. I would Google a link for you but...

KeyStroke also comes with various add-ons. Probably a button bar.

I have a Search page on my own www site: I have just tried it and that
call to Google works.
www.torrens.org.uk/search.html



 --  Richard Torrens. http://www.Torrens.org.uk
for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats and more!

Re: Google

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 3145b6c054.roger...@rogerarm.freeuk.com,
   Roger Darlington roger...@freeuk.com wrote:
 On 8 May 2015, Richard Torrens (lists) wrote:
  Another way of using Google is, for example

  http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Acacia

  Just double click on the link. Works from Pluto, StronEd and anything else
  which will launch a URL.

 But that doesn't work on Netsurf :-(
 It just oscillates the same :-(

  Once on the search, you can delete the search term and type in another.
  So it seems to be only from the first page. Weird!


Sorry, I've confused myself by togling JS once too many times.

The search script on my www site does work with JF off: Relevant bit is


!-- Search Google --
PFORM method=GET action=http://www.google.com/custom
TABLE bgcolor=#FF cellspacing=0 border=0
td
INPUT TYPE=text name=q size=40 maxlength=255 value=
INPUT type=submit name=sa VALUE=Google Search
brinput type=radio name=sitesearch value= checked Search WWW
/td/tr/TABLE
/FORM
!-- Search Google --

Save that as search/html, re-type is as faf (html) and use it

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Google

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

If you let the search page loop run, you eventually get to a page Google
has detected unusual traffic - are you a robot?

Fill in the CAPTCHA and it loops again.

But maybe if they get enough loops they will notice... or pigs will fly!

On the page there is also a why did this happen link. That doesn't work
either!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Google

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Yesterday Google stopped working with Netsurf.

Has anyone any cures or suggestions?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: !Fetch_NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 9f2fd6de54.pnyo...@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk,
   Peter Young pnyo...@ormail.co.uk wrote:
 Richard still hasn't told us which version of Fetch_NS he's trying to 
 run, which is highly relevant.

2.21, which runs fine on the RPC,

I quoted the line from the !Run file - which caklls a Taskwindow. On the
RPC, that TaskWindow opens as expected.

On the ARMX6, no such task window opens.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: !Fetch_NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article de1dd4de54.supe...@albenito.eclipse2k.freeserve.co.uk,
   Allan Bennett alben...@eclipse2k.freeserve.co.uk wrote:
 In message 54dde90eceli...@torrens.org.uk
   Richard Torrens (lists) li...@torrens.org.uk wrote:

  Has anyone got Fetch_NS running on an ARMX6?

 Yes, working here on ARMX6 and Armini. It did take some setting up, 
 though...

 On first run, you should be presented with a list of options, but I 
 never had much joy with this and resorted to modding the files in 
 !Boot.Choices.Fetch_NS.Settings.  Mostly self-explanatory. Mostly!

 I have !Wget in configure 'look at'.

The instructions do say you have to chose which transport: there are lines
in the !Run file to be commented in out as appropriate. I did that. The
transports are called, and start to work - in the background. They then
fail.

A task window is not opened: presumably this should only open when the
transport returns some output.

The error returned by wget says the filename is incorrectly formatted. At
Line 24!

I have installed a new version of 2.21, fresh from the zip file, and will
now reset the ARMX6 and try again.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: !Fetch_NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

On 06 Jul, li...@torrens.org.uk wrote:
 I have installed a new version of 2.21, fresh from the zip file, and will
 now reset the ARMX6 and try again.


Same result... the error is returned from the BASIC program
!Fetch_NS.Resources.SetLatest

So I have emailed Frank for help.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

!Fetch_NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Success!

curl 7.11.0 seems to be the latst version. It doesn't like ARMv7

Wget 1.15 i the latest version and works. I had an old wget!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

!Fetch_NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Has anyone got Fetch_NS running on an ARMX6?

I have tried curl and wget. Neither does the job. Both do not open a task
window, so I cannot see progress and nothing appears to happpen. However
both cause an error window to open sometime after firing up.

With wget, the error is Incorrectly formatted filename at line 24 but
what program is running is not stated and I have no idea where to look.

Later..
I have found that removing the Do from the line in !Run which reads:

TaskWindow Do Fetch_NS$App Fetch_NS$UrlLATEST Fetch_NS$Opt
Fetch_NS$Choices.LATEST -wimpslot 2048k -name Fetch LATEST file data
-quit

allows the taskwindow to open. I'll keep probing.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: !Fetch_NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 6995e38e767.016fd...@davehigton.me.uk,
   Dave Higton d...@davehigton.me.uk wrote:
 2) to fix the issue of the missing dot in the path starting with
 Root$Dir because my definition of Root$Dir has no trailing dot.

This presumaby u=is something entirely local to you? The Settings file
initially says

| Set the download and installation directories
| ** You will need to modify these (and remove the | to activate)! **
|Set Fetch_NS$Download$Dir Root$PathDownload.Netwerk.NetSurf
|Set Fetch_NS$Install$Dir Root$PathNetwerk



Those must point to:
Fetch_NS$Download$Dir directory where you want the downloads to be saved

Fetch_NS$Install$Dir directory from which Netsurf is run.


the original paths are not very enlightening!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Error on Yahoo news

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 00110f20.031e94909...@smtp.freeola.net,
   Peter Slegg p.sl...@scubadivers.co.uk wrote:
 This url  uk.news.yahoo.com  just gives me the error

It strikes me that that is not a URL.

As this is a Netsurf list, do you mean http://uk.news.yahoo.com ? That
orks here. As does  https://uk.news.yahoo.com 

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Fail 2890 json

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article 20150814072335.GB10674@somnambulist.local,
   Daniel Silverstone dsilv...@netsurf-browser.org wrote:
 t is distinctly likely that current CI builds will cause issues.  We're
 undergoing a *huge* JS transition and forcing JS on while we do it.  If
 you encounter issues, turn JS off after loading your browser (note it
 will turn on again next time the browser loads).

This is extremely welcome news! Is surely is no small undertaking and I
wish you all the best of luck with it!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

PLI

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Doing a list of genealogical notes, I wanted to space them out so there
was a blank line between each record. So I replaced each LI by PLI.

This does not work in Netsurf - but does in Firefox and Chrome

Is this a bug?

The page in question is
www.torrens.org.uk/Genealogy/Torrens/DataScot/sasines.html

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Very slow page rendering

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <000a3379.01eff490b...@smtp.freeola.net>,
   Peter Slegg  wrote:

> http://git.netsurf-browser.org/netsurf.git/tree/atari/gemtk/guiwin.c

> This page takes abut 20mins to download and render, Highwire browser
> takes about 6sec.


About 4 seconds here, ARMX6 and NS 3254

But our internet is very variable: when lots of households are on line, it
can be slow!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Segfault: issue 2381

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <55240ff66dstuartli...@orpheusinternet.co.uk>,
   lists  wrote:
> In article <68193746bbf.07b8d...@davehigton.me.uk>,
>Dave Higton  wrote:
> > If any of you has seen NetSurf quit (the log shows a segfault)
> > when you clicked in the window, I'd recommend that you get one
> > of today's builds.  (Last time I looked, the latest was 3053.)

> Yes, I've just hit this problem. Unfortunatly none of the versions I have
> will even run. They crash out when I try to load them.

> This means I cannot get to the !NetSurf site or anywhere else.

Have a look at NetSurf$ChoicesSave(Macro) - probably
$.!Boot.Choices.WWW.NetSurf

I had a corrupted HotList which caused a similar problem. The Hotlist is
html, so can be inspected in StrongEd or whatever.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

2 sites that don't!

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://www.catbehaviourist.com/sure-feed-microchip-pet-feeder-review/

http://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/cats/cat_bowls_feeders/feeders/programmable/479534?gclid=CImfsqu3x8oCFUORGwodHCUFYQ

Both display very badly. First site all text is hidden. The source is very
over-complicated, so I can't see why.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: 2 sites that don't!

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Grahame Parish  wrote:
> Not related to the problem with the sites, but I confirm that the 
> feeders work very well.  We have several cats with different dietary  
> requirements.

Thanks - but any other discussion, off-list I think!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: 2 sites that don't!

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <145dff4755.ga...@wra1th.plus.com>,
   Gavin Wraith  wrote:
> I have a useful little Lua script, called noscript, for use with
> StrongED that strips out all the stuff between matching 
> and  tags. Here it is:

Useful: I have on occasion loked for the tags and deleted everything
between - it can be done with a StrongED search and replace. But the
script is easier.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Filtering webpages

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Gavin Wraith  wrote:

> So many web pages these days are crammed with stuff put in by
> advertisers or third parties which upset the viewing experience,
> or which NetSurf is unable to render properly. The individual
> user is increasingly going to need tools to fight back, with
> which they can emasculate the page of all the clutter added in
> for statistical purposes, to add unwanted advertisements and
> pop-ups. The days of innocence are long over, so filtering of
> web pages is now a necessity.

NS has choices: 
Hide advertisements
Disable pop-up windows
Disable JavaScript

These, I would guess, tell it to ignore such content. It is then filtering
exactly as you seem to want!

So I guess you are asking for a throwback icon, to throw the source out to
an external editor, where it can be processed and returned back to NS?

This is perfectly possible within RISC OS. But I doubt that it is possible
in other OSes.

I hope the developers will contradict me and say it's totally possible -
but I have doubts!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Unrecognized or bad HTTP Content

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

www.perryscider.co.uk

This causes NS 3460 to report
  Unrecognized or bad HTTP Content or Transfer-Encoding

Site works on Chrome, Browse. Causes Otter to crash.

Can't connect with Telnet

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Text drag & drop

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <5577741072joh...@ukgateway.net>,
   John Williams  wrote:
> > Somewhere between 3492 and 3507 the ability to mark text, drag and drop
> > elsewhere has been lost. Also the find text does not mark the finds.

> Absent in 3495. So that might correspond with:

> Apr 24 2016 1:35:32 PM
> 1. update risc os frontend for layout table - Vincent Sanders/cgit

> - from the changes page.

Drag and drop does still work - it's just that you now cannot see what you
are dragging!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Text drag & drop

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Somewhere between 3492 and 3507 the ability to mark text, drag and drop
elsewhere has been lost. Also the find text does not mark the finds.

This was very useful! I hope it's  temporary thing?

ARMX6, 5.23 (18-Mar-16)

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Weird page

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://www.thehowleytavern.co.uk/menu.html

The menu contents do not appear.

But if you view the page as text, and run that, all is well! So I can't
see what is causing the problem.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: !Cache

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <55bcdc22b0nets...@avisoft.f9.co.uk>,
   Martin Avison  wrote:
>  How does !Cache take account of NS choices? Disc cache is set to 1024MB.

> > What are the disadvantages of using a zip fine for Netsurf in !Cache.

> > This is on ARMX6. I'm aware that the lfau means that each block is
> > quite large. Not sure how large on a 250GB. There were lots of
> > directories in !Cache.

> I have raised this sort of thing before. I think you would find there
> were lots and lots of *empty* directories. Apparently on other FS such
> directories cause no problems! I even wrote a program to analyse the
> cache, and to create deletes for all empty directories. But I suspect it
> currently has bugs, and I got diverted to other things!

> I think my directory now (after deleting it all like you have in about
> April) is now about 168MB - which is under its 1024MB limit. It does seem
> to be using 6300 directories but only holds 1550 files! Still seems a
> directory overload to me.

There is cerainly a directory overload! 15 directories, each seems about 5
deep, so 75 in all!

At present, it seems each directory has one file in it, but I've not
checked all.

But I have replaced !Cache.Caches.Default.Netsurf with a zip archive
called Netsurf. This appeasrs to work fine, currently it's 492K - with 75
directories in it.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

No-display page

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://www.petervis.com/Radios/sinclair-micromatic-pocket-radio/sinclair-micromatic-pocket-radio.html

Does not display. There is a lot of css at the start, then

body { visibility: hidden;
display:none }

which kills it! But should this happen?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Site crasher NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://nosher.net

Twice gives a window to accept certificate. On accepting second one, NS
dies.


3.6 (Dev CI #3714) and a few prevous. Does thisa happen to others?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Site crashes NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <9396a3c255.c...@cdewhurst2010.btinternet.com>,
   Chris Dewhurst <cdewhurst2...@btinternet.com> wrote:
> On 20 Sep 2016 Richard Torrens (lists) [mailto: li...@torrens.org.uk] 
> wrote:

> > http://nosher.net

[Snip]

> Richard is it still crashing when you read this ?

Yes, it still crashes!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: css

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <fa4268d155.ga...@wra1th.plus.com>,
   Gavin Wraith <ga...@wra1th.plus.com> wrote:
> In message <55d122c0cdli...@torrens.org.uk>
>       "Richard Torrens (lists)" <li...@torrens.org.uk> wrote:

> >The latest Netsurf 3.6 (Dev CI #3739) appears to be ignoring css. Does
> >anyone else find this?

> I cannot say that I have noticed it. Can you give us a URL frinstance?

http://www.Torrens.org.uk/Sinclair/inside/

The first 3 links off that all contain

which should align all the images right amongst other css.

It did work fine and still does on Chrome - but there seems to be more
to it! I've just tried with earlier versions back to 3709 and none work. 

So I deleted Netsurf's cache - and it now works properly again! 

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

css

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

The latest Netsurf 3.6 (Dev CI #3739) appears to be ignoring css. Does
anyone else find this?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Non-displaying page

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://employees.csbsju.edu/hjakubowski/classes/ch331/transkinetics/olinhibition.html

It's a css problem, as commenting out the css makes it visible.

Dunno if it's a bug or a fault in the css...

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Non-displaying page

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <d06acb50-44e8-3d6a-8e5b-af68cf28f...@codethink.co.uk>,
   Michael Drake <michael.dr...@codethink.co.uk> wrote:
> On 05/01/17 13:27, Richard Torrens (lists) wrote:
> > Is this a bug or a style fault on the page?

> The "body { visibility: hidden !important; }" style means "hide the
> whole page from view".  There is some JavaScript to unset it,
> revealing the page.

> It's daft, because the page won't display at all in any browser with
> JavaScript disabled.  In NetSurf, it doesn't work with JavaScript
> enabled because our JavaScript support is far from complete.

Thanks for the explanation. I don't know how can you hope to keep up with
such daft www programmers!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Non-displaying page

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Is this a bug or a style fault on the page?

http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/health/popular-heartburn-drugs-may-increase-esophageal-cancer-risk/

The first 
  /* Will be removed by ChartBeat's async flicker control below */
  body { visibility: hidden !important; }
  

Remove this and the page displays. So I suspect it may not be a bug?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Change of email

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Geoffrey Baxendale  wrote:
> In message <421ebf2956.thebears@thebe...@onetel.com>
>   Geoffrey Baxendale  wrote:

> > Hi,
> >
> > I am having to change my email address and can't get anywhere using the
> > netsurf site using the "users list" unsubscribe feature. It just says no
> > address given. Same with FF or Netsurf.
> >
> > Any ideas?
> >
> > TTFN
> OK, I have finally cracked it by using Chrome on my tablet. Still can't
> log in via Netsurf.

Looking at the headers one is:
List-Unsubscribe: ... 
 

So an email can be sent to unsub. Presumably the ?subject=subscribe
will subscribe. I'm changing my email so am trying it.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: history and hotlist not saved; CSS site

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <496fe1b4-8a09-4243-e65a-50b1381b7...@codethink.co.uk>,
   Michael Drake  wrote:
> On 23/11/16 09:58, Harriet Bazley wrote:
> > On 23 Nov 2016 as I do recall,
> >   Jim Nagel  wrote:
> >
> >> Does NetSurf not save its hotlist and history till the user quits the
> >> program?
> >>
> > No, it doesn't.

> As of CI build #4070, the hotlist file is saved shortly after URLs are
> added / removed.

> Cheers,

Excellent! A long-awaited chamnge. Thanks for the contiunuing good work.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: HTML's SUP

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <6867f785-ecfc-4839-aaf2-fa02655d1...@powys.org>,
   Tim Powys-Lybbe  wrote:
> Ah, that suggests that SUP works correctly within CSS but not within
> old-fashioned simple HTML, which is what I use.

No, they both work fine. See attached html version plus screenshot.

If they are not the same something must be different on your setup. Or
maybe the effect is less than you expect?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!





2 1/3



  

Redraw oddity

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

https://www.quora.com/Where-does-iPhoto-store-photos-locally

At first this displays a blank page. But wipe over it with another
window...

Does anyone else get the same behaviour?

 3.7 (Dev CI #4086) on ARMX6 5.23
(29-Jun-16)

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Experimental treeview search feature

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <8e933e3d-f507-99c8-2fec-26a5ca310...@netsurf-browser.org>,
   Michael Drake  wrote:
> An experimental search feature has been added to the following:

>1. Hotlist viewer (bookmarks)
>2. Global history viewer
>3. Cookie manager window

> To use it, click in the area next to the search icon at the top
> of the window, and start typing.

A feature I have sometimes wished was present - it works fine (ARMX6 5.23).

Thanks.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Experimental treeview search feature

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <9fd418f6-1f08-b24e-3aff-5bfce9381...@codethink.co.uk>,
   Michael Drake  wrote:
> On 22/09/17 02:20, Harriet Bazley wrote:
> > Other thoughts: from a practical point of view, I think it would be
> > preferable if any active search were deleted when the window is closed.
> > Otherwise it gets a bit disconcerting when you go to reopen your
> > history/hotlist and there are only two or three entries visible, due to a
> > search you carried out earlier and have long since finished with -
> > particularly as the icon in question doesn't have the input focus when the
> > window reopens,

> I agree, it would be better to cancel the search when the window
> is closed.  Unfortunately the core doesn't know when the front
> end closes the window at the moment, so it's not straightforward
> to change that just yet.

> and clearing the old search string is a pain!

> Once the search field has focus, either ESC or CTRL+U should clear it.

Would a "clear" button make sense? Maybe a click on the search icon?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Experimental treeview search feature - a problem

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I have just spotted a (hopefully small) problem - it's impossible to
delete items!

Select an item and assoon as the mouse pointer moves away from the window
or over the search box, the item is delelected.

Same thing happens if you press Menu!

#4211,  ARMX6 5.23

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: URL lengths

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <56a1aa7e00joh...@ukgateway.net>,
   John Williams  wrote:
> What is the maximum URL length (including POST data) that NetSurf can
> handle?

What may be relevant is the following entry from my web server error
logs:

2017-10-02 02:57:45: (response.c.553) file not found ... or so:  File name
too long
/YesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreSc
 ann ->  

At which point the Web server (lighttpd) logs it as an error.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Validation

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I was trying to validate an html page using w3c validator. I could not!

The reason was that the page contains lots of links to Google searches
etc. e.g.
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en=hp=ISO-8859-1=omeprazole+causes+bile+reflux=Google+Search;>

The validator complains about the & in there - it wants  but the link
with that in won't work.

So is this a fault in the validator - or something which should be
accomodated in NetSurf?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Validation

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <56abf12512...@timil.com>,
   Tim Hill  wrote:
> No,  won't work from your editor. It will work only in the Browser.

> The four amp version of the link above will be
> http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=ensource=hpie=ISO-8859-1q=omeprazole+causes+bile+refluxbtnG=Google+Search

> And, buried in HTML, it works fine. It doesn't work in Pluto or StrongED
> though, so don't expect it to. They are happy with '&' and don't
> translate the ''s as a browser does/has to.

Thhanks - I can't have dug dseep enough. But what a pain - I extract URLs
from NetSurf's URL bar using !Transfer2. It of course picks up the
unglyphed version.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Image/text alignment

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I have been trying to get some .png images aligned with text using CSS. Is
there yet a way to do so in Netsurf?

img {vertical-align:"middle;" }
etc. do not work. 

The progress page
http://www.netsurf-browser.org/documentation/progress.html#CSSFeatures
says "in progress - Only implemented for table cells." 


This page seems to have been "Last updated 20 December 2012" - I know -
keeping documentation up to date seems nearly as much work as the
programming!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Pane srolling and searching

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/c/F207018
is an odd page - it has 6 lists within panes.

I was searching for "Anglian" within the window and there were several
occurrences. But as these are within the panes it is extremely difficult
to know where they are!

Also pane scrolling had a great tendency to misbehave. sometimes the
mouse-wheel would scroll a pane, sometimes not. And sometimes the wrong
pane would scroll!

so I think it may be a useful test window.


3.8 (Dev CI #4246)
ARMX6
5.23 (29-Jun-16)

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Pane scrolling and searching

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <5697c374a7li...@torrens.org>,
   Richard Torrens (lists) <li...@torrens.org> wrote:
> http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/c/F207018

Oops! URL should have been 
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/a?_ref=10

"Anglian" occurs within first and second panes.

Sorry!

> is an odd page - it has 6 lists within panes.

> I was searching for "Anglian" within the window and there were several
> occurrences. But as these are within the panes it is extremely difficult
> to know where they are!

> Also pane scrolling had a great tendency to misbehave. sometimes the
> mouse-wheel would scroll a pane, sometimes not. And sometimes the wrong
> pane would scroll!

> so I think it may be a useful test window.


> 3.8 (Dev CI #4246)
> ARMX6
> 5.23 (29-Jun-16)

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Page causes crash

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

This may not be a Netsurf thing, but it happens rarely on anything other
than Nersurf.

The whole of this ARMX6's networking crashes. The only way I have found to
recover is a reset.

I have found a page which seems to cause this fairly reliably:
http://www.alamy.com/stock-photo/water-vole-hole.html


Does this happen to anyone else?
RO 5.23 (29-Jun-16)
NS 3.8 (Dev CI #4238) and earlier versions for some time.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Page causes crash

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Thanks eveyone.

Proves it's not a Netsurf thing, or an ARMX6 thing, but it must be a clash
with something installed on my ARMX6.

I'll keep looking.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Page layout

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I suspect the developers don't need more examples of pages that don't
layout properly? But in case they do, try

http://watervoles.com

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page causes crash

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <a8a5289356.r...@user.minijem.plus.com>,
   Richard Porter <r...@minijem.plus.com> wrote:
> On 30 Oct 2017 Richard Torrens (lists) wrote:

> > This may not be a Netsurf thing, but it happens rarely on anything
> > other than Nersurf.

> > The whole of this ARMX6's networking crashes. The only way I have
> > found to recover is a reset.

> > I have found a page which seems to cause this fairly reliably:
> > http://www.alamy.com/stock-photo/water-vole-hole.html


> > Does this happen to anyone else?
> > RO 5.23 (29-Jun-16)
> > NS 3.8 (Dev CI #4238) and earlier versions for some time.

> Seems to load ok here (ARMX6, 5.23, #4214)

There may be a clue - some others report NS does not load the image.

Even when it doesn't cause the crash here the image doesn't display. So
some ARMX6 display the image - some don't.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Netsurf Disc Cache

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <56ef43aa6dnets...@avisoft.f9.co.uk>,
   Martin Avison  wrote:
> If anyone wants to try my small program which produces file and directory
> statistics for the disc cache, plus an obey file which if run will delete
> all empty directories, please email me.

Yes please.

I have, on a few occasions, simply deleted .Netsurf and
released several GB of space. Deleting the whole cache causes no
noticeable problem.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Image won't display

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <570714fc76bbai...@argonet.co.uk>,
   Brian  wrote:
> In article <570702972bli...@torrens.org>, Richard Torrens (lists)
>  wrote:
> > A very weird problem...

> > The page http://stronged.torrens.org/man/modes/syntaxmodefile.html which
> > I am writing. It has a line  > alt="clicklist/png" width="653" height="104"> But Netsurf won't display
> > the image. Chrome does it properly.

> > But http://stronged.torrens.org/man/modes/img/clicklist.png displays the
> > image!

> Not here, I'm getting 404 - Not Found

That is because I have changed the image name so that it does work!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Image won't display

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <4e9f7074-3a2d-e7b2-3d74-175f46e71...@codethink.co.uk>,
   Michael Drake  wrote:
> On 12/06/18 14:07, Richard Torrens (lists) wrote:
> > A very weird problem...
> > 
> > The page
> > http://stronged.torrens.org/man/modes/syntaxmodefile.html
> > which I am writing. It has a line
> > 
> > But Netsurf won't display the image. Chrome does it properly.

> It's getting caught by NetSurf's ad blocking CSS.

> Looks like it matches the following selector.

>   img[src*="/click"]

> You can disable ad blocking in the preferences.

Thanks for the very speedy explanation! But if I want others to read the
page, I need to change the name...

Done.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page layout

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Peter Young  wrote:
> >> http://watervoles.com

[Snip]

> Try it with Disable JavaScript unticked in Choices > Content. Here, 
> same computer and NS Dev CI 4234 it looks to me as it should do.
> http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk/wv.jpg

> Several of the tabs at the top don't work, though.

Indeed it displays properly with j/s on.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page layout

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <480a239156@abbeypress.net>,
   Jim Nagel <nets...@abbeypress.co.uk> wrote:
> Richard Torrens (lists) wrote on 26 Oct:
> > ... screen shot at http://photos.torrens.org/wv.jpeg
> > NetSurf is correctly using the  option but these don't
> > work properly. This on ARMX6 with  NS 3.7 (Dev CI #4207)

> Here on #4204 I can't get the Contacts page that you show in the 
> screenshot.  You must have got a dropdown from the "About us" button 
> (or somewhere) that I don't get here.

I had previously done a Qwant site search 
 contact site:watervoles.com

https://lite.qwant.com/?q=contact+site%3Awatervoles.com=web
and must have picked this page out of the history.

BTW: Qwant is a French search engine and is well worth investigating. I
have it set as Home page.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page layout

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <56909be808li...@torrens.org>,
   Richard Torrens (lists) <li...@torrens.org> wrote:
> I suspect the developers don't need more examples of pages that don't
> layout properly? But in case they do, try

> http://watervoles.com

The respnses here make me think others are not seeing the same thing, so
there is a screen shot at
http://photos.torrens.org/wv.jpeg

NetSurf is correctly using the  option but these don't work
properly.

This on ARMX6 with  NS 3.7 (Dev CI #4207)

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: mailto:

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <56ccf68de6...@timil.com>,
   Tim Hill  wrote:

> Coincidentally, I have just been adding 'munge' to
> http://timil.com/riscos and IME this conversion of a mailto link into
> entities seems enough to prevent harvesting by spammers. Or the ones that
> do are so useless it doesn't even reach me!
 
My script required a hidden variable be sent - the variable determines the
script action.

This system appears to defeat spammers - most of the email addresses that
have been spammed seem to have been harvested from computers by malware.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

mailto:

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I think the response to mailto: may be broken!

I have a new site
http://www.burwellness.co.uk/
where there is a contact link - if you want to try it, it is the link under
Therapy Rooms to let

This calls a cgi-bin which returns the email address. This works on
Android/chrome and on Firefox, but not on Netsurf.

I've used this system before with Netsurf, so something seems to have
changed. The contact tab at the top uses the same cgi-bin but links to a
web page.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page which doed not display properly

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <56d58e70b8...@timil.com>,
   Tim Hill <t...@timil.com> wrote:
> In article <56d587af09li...@torrens.org>, Richard Torrens (lists)
> <li...@torrens.org> wrote:
> > http://www.magheragenealogy.org/

> > Most of of the page's text does not display in Netsurf.

> > It is not a J/S thing. But the html is terrible to decipher!

> It is. The >26  tags would beg to differ.

> The best result from a page like that? 
> Menu > Page > Export > Text

I removed all "<script"**"/script>" bits with StrongED. - there are indeed
27!

The page still does not display properly - so as I said, it is not a J/S
thing!

And yes, there are various ways of readuing it!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Page which doed not display properly

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://www.magheragenealogy.org/

Most of of the page's text does not display in Netsurf.

It is not a J/S thing. But the html is terrible to decipher!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page which doed not display properly

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <455569058123901cbf28cd87c0dab...@wingsandbeaks.org.uk>,
   Jeremy Nicoll - ml netsurf  wrote:
> > The page still does not display properly - so as I said, it is not a 
> > J/S
> > thing!

> That does not follow.  Maybe the code you removed was essential... and
> that WOULD make it a script issue.

If removing _all_ script from a page does not alter the way the page
displays, then the way it displays is nothing to do with the removed
script.

I would have thought that did not require explaining. Apologies for not
being clear enough.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page which doed not display properly

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <56d5995dc6...@timil.com>,
   Tim Hill  wrote:
> With the luxury of a PC at my elbow, I tend to throw recalcitrant pages
> at it rather than try and decipher them. WYSIWYG page design tools, such
> as WordPress used to construct Richard's page

I woul point out that this Richard dos not use anything other than
StrongED!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page which doed not display properly

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Jim Nagel  wrote:
> Would be nice to add a colour for ...  to the HTML 
> mode in StrongEd so that JS would immediately jump out at you in a 
> page where "the html is terrible to decipher".

> I think somebody is working to update that mode but I can't remember 
> who.  Is it you, Tim?

Having got to grips with advanced Search and Replace, I have it in mind to
next get to grips with Modes. If so one thing I may well do is to update
the HTML mode.

But doing the script removal will highlight the scripts you are removing.
I have now written this up as an example:
http://stronged.torrens.org/man/search/examples/js.html

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

URL crashes Netsurf

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

This URL

www.siemens-home.bsh-group.com/uk

causes Netsurf to totally crash on the ARMX6 with 5.23 (18-Feb-18). 

The crash is total, no log file, Alt-Brk does nothing. Ctrl-Brk does do a
reset.

Does it happen to anyone else?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

SVG

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

How far has SVG rendering got?

sVGs are not common yet, but I met a page with some prsent, which don't
display properly:

https://www.electronics-notes.com/articles/antennas-propagation/dipole-antenna/folded-dipole.php

It's also curious tha the text is truncated on the left margin as if CSS
left-margin has a negative value.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!