Re: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Boy, after seeing the Macgillivray's in Highlands, NJ yesterday and seeing the photos of this bird, I can see the similarities for sure.  But the MacGillivray's did not have those light edgings as Shai notes and seemed a little brighter overall and the throat seemed different too.  I'd lean

Re: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Boy, after seeing the Macgillivray's in Highlands, NJ yesterday and seeing the photos of this bird, I can see the similarities for sure.  But the MacGillivray's did not have those light edgings as Shai notes and seemed a little brighter overall and the throat seemed different too.  I'd lean

RE: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Hi Kevin and all, This is true, but it doesn't solve the problem. eBird central might mean well, but they could be wrong in any given instance--and they are bound to be from time to time, just like NYSARC was wrong to "officially" declare that Monk Parakeets were gone in 1982. We could go on

RE: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Hi Kevin and all, This is true, but it doesn't solve the problem. eBird central might mean well, but they could be wrong in any given instance--and they are bound to be from time to time, just like NYSARC was wrong to "officially" declare that Monk Parakeets were gone in 1982. We could go on

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Keep the conversation going with eBird. As an ornithologist, I'm interested in tracking the ups and downs of potential newly established species. As a lister, I'm interested in keeping my list clean and comparable for ABA rankings. I don't work with eBird, but be assured that the guys that do

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Keep the conversation going with eBird. As an ornithologist, I'm interested in tracking the ups and downs of potential newly established species. As a lister, I'm interested in keeping my list clean and comparable for ABA rankings. I don't work with eBird, but be assured that the guys that do

Re: [ebirdsnyc] Re: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Thanks for sharing Cesar. Goes to show what a difference the original photos can make as I was in the MAGW camp based on the back of the camera shots. Shane Sent from my iPhone > On Dec 19, 2017, at 5:35 PM, Arie Gilbert ariegilb...@optonline.net > [ebirdsnyc]

Re: [ebirdsnyc] Re: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Thanks for sharing Cesar. Goes to show what a difference the original photos can make as I was in the MAGW camp based on the back of the camera shots. Shane Sent from my iPhone > On Dec 19, 2017, at 5:35 PM, Arie Gilbert ariegilb...@optonline.net > [ebirdsnyc] wrote: > > Cesar, > > You

Re: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Cesar, You very admirably reiterated "THE LAW OF INDIRECT OBSERVATION". See the "universal laws of birding" on the Queens county Bird Club's web page. http://www.qcbirdclub.org/the-universal-laws and FWIW on first sight I thought MGWA too...

Re: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Cesar, You very admirably reiterated "THE LAW OF INDIRECT OBSERVATION". See the "universal laws of birding" on the Queens county Bird Club's web page. http://www.qcbirdclub.org/the-universal-laws and FWIW on first sight I thought MGWA too...

Re: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Ok, great to learn so much on a more familiar species.  Thanks for all the help and clarification!I learned more about Orange-crowned Warblers in this one week when I thought it might be a MGWA, than in all the years I have been seeing them with no doubt in my mind as to what they were. 

Re: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Ok, great to learn so much on a more familiar species.  Thanks for all the help and clarification!I learned more about Orange-crowned Warblers in this one week when I thought it might be a MGWA, than in all the years I have been seeing them with no doubt in my mind as to what they were. 

Re: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Hi Cesar, Thanks for sharing the photos. Interesting bird. When I saw the photos I thought OCWA, because of the structure and overall feeling I got. Great find and save for your CBC Count. Anders Peltomaa On Tue, Dec 19, 2017 at 1:46 PM Cesar Castillo wrote: > Dear All, > >

Re: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Hi Cesar, Thanks for sharing the photos. Interesting bird. When I saw the photos I thought OCWA, because of the structure and overall feeling I got. Great find and save for your CBC Count. Anders Peltomaa On Tue, Dec 19, 2017 at 1:46 PM Cesar Castillo wrote: > Dear All, > > I have posted the

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Hi all, Just to add a bit more context: There have been many in-depth discussions on this topic among the eBird reviewers, and the folks at Cornell acknowledge that this is an issue they wish to tackle soon. In one of his recent responses to our reviewer listserv, Marshall Iliff indicated that

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Hi all, Just to add a bit more context: There have been many in-depth discussions on this topic among the eBird reviewers, and the folks at Cornell acknowledge that this is an issue they wish to tackle soon. In one of his recent responses to our reviewer listserv, Marshall Iliff indicated that

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

As much as I’d like to claim the high-minded ideals of the altruistic citizen scientist who is wholly uninterested in his own numbers, I can’t. I’m very much a lister—at turns shamefully and shamelessly so. Numbers and lists don’t motivate me; moments with the birds do. But numbers and lists sure

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

As much as I’d like to claim the high-minded ideals of the altruistic citizen scientist who is wholly uninterested in his own numbers, I can’t. I’m very much a lister—at turns shamefully and shamelessly so. Numbers and lists don’t motivate me; moments with the birds do. But numbers and lists sure

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

I agree, it is important to track these birds. Especially as it seems they have adapted quite well and are spreading. Perhaps, we will see them expand like the Monk Parakeets. I had an encounter with the said species this year at Bush Terminal Piers Park, in October. A total of 4 birds with no

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

I agree, it is important to track these birds. Especially as it seems they have adapted quite well and are spreading. Perhaps, we will see them expand like the Monk Parakeets. I had an encounter with the said species this year at Bush Terminal Piers Park, in October. A total of 4 birds with no

RE: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Lest we forget, a number of existing cases (parrots often, some of which we find locally) in which strays turned into intermittent breeders, and now are established, countable exotics. Shouldn't we be interested in how this transition occurs (or fails to do so)? In my Brooklyn XMas count

RE: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Lest we forget, a number of existing cases (parrots often, some of which we find locally) in which strays turned into intermittent breeders, and now are established, countable exotics. Shouldn't we be interested in how this transition occurs (or fails to do so)? In my Brooklyn XMas count

Re: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Definitely an Orange-crowned Warbler for all the reasons already cited by Shai. Thanks for making the images available for further review. Cheers, "I prefer to be true to myself, even at the hazard of incurring the ridicule of others, rather than to be false, and to incur my own

Re: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Definitely an Orange-crowned Warbler for all the reasons already cited by Shai. Thanks for making the images available for further review. Cheers, "I prefer to be true to myself, even at the hazard of incurring the ridicule of others, rather than to be false, and to incur my own

RE: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

And please allow me to clarify that I have no idea why it is circulating that I put the blessing on the ID as MacGillivray's after having a single 2 second look at a tiny image on someone's phone on Sunday. My reaction was simply a "wow" and I never pursued it further. Patricia Lindsay Bay

RE: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

And please allow me to clarify that I have no idea why it is circulating that I put the blessing on the ID as MacGillivray's after having a single 2 second look at a tiny image on someone's phone on Sunday. My reaction was simply a "wow" and I never pursued it further. Patricia Lindsay Bay

RE: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Hi Cesar and all, Very cool-looking bird! I think its overall shape (and particularly its very finely pointed bill) and manners suggest Orange-crowned Warbler. I also think that a MacGillivray's Warbler would show a thicker, blacker loral stripe. Finally, the whitish edges to the tips of the

RE: [nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Hi Cesar and all, Very cool-looking bird! I think its overall shape (and particularly its very finely pointed bill) and manners suggest Orange-crowned Warbler. I also think that a MacGillivray's Warbler would show a thicker, blacker loral stripe. Finally, the whitish edges to the tips of the

RE: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

I agree strongly with John and Angus. The consequences for the eBird Hot 100 are at most not very important and at least potentially amusing. I thought everybody knew they were supposed to keep track of their own lists, rather than to trust in the algorithms of strangers! More specifically,

RE: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

I agree strongly with John and Angus. The consequences for the eBird Hot 100 are at most not very important and at least potentially amusing. I thought everybody knew they were supposed to keep track of their own lists, rather than to trust in the algorithms of strangers! More specifically,

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

There is a simple solution that will satisfy the "report everything" contingent and still keep your eBird list free of canaries: create another free eBird account for this (and perhaps other) purposes. Have this account opt out of the Top Birders list and possibly also out of Rare Bird Alert

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

There is a simple solution that will satisfy the "report everything" contingent and still keep your eBird list free of canaries: create another free eBird account for this (and perhaps other) purposes. Have this account opt out of the Top Birders list and possibly also out of Rare Bird Alert

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Oh, weird, I am indeed wrong then ;) Wouldn’t be hard to automate a rule in eBird that folllowed ABA protocol on what’s countable or not? *Dominic Garcia-Hall* *www.antbirds.com * *NY +1 917 740 1945* *UK +44 161 408 4002* On 19 December 2017 at 19:11, nathan

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Oh, weird, I am indeed wrong then ;) Wouldn’t be hard to automate a rule in eBird that folllowed ABA protocol on what’s countable or not? *Dominic Garcia-Hall* *www.antbirds.com * *NY +1 917 740 1945* *UK +44 161 408 4002* On 19 December 2017 at 19:11, nathan

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

"Personally, I think tracking these potential colonizers is important and interesting. Simply invalidating them or discouraging reporting isn't a good solution." Agreed, particularly as range flux is likely to accelerate in ways we'll need to observe and measure as climate changes take hold. We

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

"Personally, I think tracking these potential colonizers is important and interesting. Simply invalidating them or discouraging reporting isn't a good solution." Agreed, particularly as range flux is likely to accelerate in ways we'll need to observe and measure as climate changes take hold. We

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Unfortunately, my life list has both a Brooklyn European Goldfinch and a Manhattan Yellow-fronted Canary on it. Sent from my iPhone On Dec 19, 2017, at 2:08 PM, Dominic Garcia-Hall > wrote: I believe they don’t count on county/state lists

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Unfortunately, my life list has both a Brooklyn European Goldfinch and a Manhattan Yellow-fronted Canary on it. Sent from my iPhone On Dec 19, 2017, at 2:08 PM, Dominic Garcia-Hall mailto:dominic.h...@gmail.com>> wrote: I believe they don’t count on county/state lists or users' lists, even if

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

I believe they don’t count on county/state lists or users' lists, even if you report them as regular species taxa (or if they don't have a domestic designation in the first place). If you tick a Black Swan in Australia, you'll see your list go up by one. If you tick it in NJ, you won't, even if

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

I believe they don’t count on county/state lists or users' lists, even if you report them as regular species taxa (or if they don't have a domestic designation in the first place). If you tick a Black Swan in Australia, you'll see your list go up by one. If you tick it in NJ, you won't, even if

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

And I believe that is why the ebird reviewers ask you to include them. That way they can get an idea of what other species are out there competing for food and habitat. Sent from my iPhone On Dec 19, 2017, at 1:50 PM, Angus Wilson >

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

And I believe that is why the ebird reviewers ask you to include them. That way they can get an idea of what other species are out there competing for food and habitat. Sent from my iPhone On Dec 19, 2017, at 1:50 PM, Angus Wilson mailto:oceanwander...@gmail.com>> wrote: For European

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

For European Goldfinch I suspect 'domesticated' isn't an option. Same for other known or presumed escapes or deliberate releases that occur with regularity in NYS (e.g. Chukar and various non-domesticated waterfowl). Personally, I think tracking these potential colonizers is important and

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

For European Goldfinch I suspect 'domesticated' isn't an option. Same for other known or presumed escapes or deliberate releases that occur with regularity in NYS (e.g. Chukar and various non-domesticated waterfowl). Personally, I think tracking these potential colonizers is important and

[nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Dear All, I have posted the original images on flicker.  I have not messed with the photos except in increasing their sharpness.  I can see how this could be an orange-crowned warbler, however I remember seeing a grey hood that extended quite a bit, Carry Laben and I immediately thought

[nysbirds-l] OCWA or MGWA

Dear All, I have posted the original images on flicker.  I have not messed with the photos except in increasing their sharpness.  I can see how this could be an orange-crowned warbler, however I remember seeing a grey hood that extended quite a bit, Carry Laben and I immediately thought

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

European Goldfinch seems to be one of those species without a Domestic option. On Tue, Dec 19, 2017 at 1:37 PM nathan o'reilly wrote: > Although some species do not have a Domestic option like the > Yellow-fronted Canaries I've had a couple times in Manhattan and told by

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

European Goldfinch seems to be one of those species without a Domestic option. On Tue, Dec 19, 2017 at 1:37 PM nathan o'reilly wrote: > Although some species do not have a Domestic option like the > Yellow-fronted Canaries I've had a couple times in Manhattan and told by an > ebird reviewed to

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Although some species do not have a Domestic option like the Yellow-fronted Canaries I've had a couple times in Manhattan and told by an ebird reviewed to add them. I hope to rectify my life list by getting them in the wild this summer. Seems like most people don't know this about the Domestic

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Although some species do not have a Domestic option like the Yellow-fronted Canaries I've had a couple times in Manhattan and told by an ebird reviewed to add them. I hope to rectify my life list by getting them in the wild this summer. Seems like most people don't know this about the Domestic

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

The proper way to enter escaped exotics on eBird lists is to select the domestic version. For example, if you search eBird for Budgerigar you will also get Budgerigar (Domestic). Choose the latter. David Barrett Manhattan On Dec 19, 2017 1:16 PM, wrote: > The umpteen

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

The proper way to enter escaped exotics on eBird lists is to select the domestic version. For example, if you search eBird for Budgerigar you will also get Budgerigar (Domestic). Choose the latter. David Barrett Manhattan On Dec 19, 2017 1:16 PM, wrote: > The umpteen responses I’ve gotten to

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

The umpteen responses I’ve gotten to the contrary are why I hedged my sureness. Does anyone know the proper protocol for entering escapees on checklists (benefitting science) without having them inaccurately show up on lifelists (benefitting type-A listers)? Also, I know some of my Central Park

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

The umpteen responses I’ve gotten to the contrary are why I hedged my sureness. Does anyone know the proper protocol for entering escapees on checklists (benefitting science) without having them inaccurately show up on lifelists (benefitting type-A listers)? Also, I know some of my Central Park

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

I’m 95% sure that European Goldfinches (like Budgies) won’t show up on anyone’s eBird NY State life list even if you keep the species in your regular checklists. eBird knows what to count/not count in that respect. On Tue, Dec 19, 2017 at 12:38 PM Deborah Allen wrote: >

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

I’m 95% sure that European Goldfinches (like Budgies) won’t show up on anyone’s eBird NY State life list even if you keep the species in your regular checklists. eBird knows what to count/not count in that respect. On Tue, Dec 19, 2017 at 12:38 PM Deborah Allen wrote: > The European Goldfinches

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

The European Goldfinches should be entered into ebird, especially if there is any evidence of breeding, so their populations can be monitored.Deb Allen-Original Message- From: nathan o'reilly Sent: Dec 19, 2017 4:55 AM To: Ben Cacace Cc:

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

The European Goldfinches should be entered into ebird, especially if there is any evidence of breeding, so their populations can be monitored.Deb Allen-Original Message- From: nathan o'reilly Sent: Dec 19, 2017 4:55 AM To: Ben Cacace Cc: NYSBIRDS-L , eBirds NYC Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l]

[nysbirds-l] Top 10 Locations: Greene County (NYS eBird Hotspots)

Location pages have been created for the current top 10 sites for Greene County based on total species seen. Numbers in parentheses represents the # of sub-locations for these sites. If you spot any issues with the pages please let me know off list. Also, could you help verify that the

[nysbirds-l] Top 10 Locations: Greene County (NYS eBird Hotspots)

Location pages have been created for the current top 10 sites for Greene County based on total species seen. Numbers in parentheses represents the # of sub-locations for these sites. If you spot any issues with the pages please let me know off list. Also, could you help verify that the

Re:[nysbirds-l] Bryant Park Woodcock - yes

Spotted same place early this morning Sent from my iPhone > On Dec 18, 2017, at 3:14 PM, Home wrote: > > Couldn’t find it in yesterday’s CBC with Gabriel Willow but it re-emerged- > actively foraging in the open along the southeast edge allowing passersby on > 40th

Re:[nysbirds-l] Bryant Park Woodcock - yes

Spotted same place early this morning Sent from my iPhone > On Dec 18, 2017, at 3:14 PM, Home wrote: > > Couldn’t find it in yesterday’s CBC with Gabriel Willow but it re-emerged- > actively foraging in the open along the southeast edge allowing passersby on > 40th Street to take photos

Re:[nysbirds-l] Mtn bluebird CONTINUES Tues 12-19

I just got a report that the bird is being seen now @ 11:14am These directions may be better if you are unable to use the map links below. from the Northwest corner of the Robert Moses field 2 lot, walk to the paved roadway and continue west onto the sand road

Re:[nysbirds-l] Mtn bluebird CONTINUES Tues 12-19

I just got a report that the bird is being seen now @ 11:14am These directions may be better if you are unable to use the map links below. from the Northwest corner of the Robert Moses field 2 lot, walk to the paved roadway and continue west onto the sand road

[nysbirds-l] Robert Moses SP, Suffolk County, Mt. Bluebird Yes

Last seen at 9:45 AM flying northeast over Fire Island Inlet. Seen in same location feeding in Red Cedar trees. Sent from my iPhone -- NYSbirds-L List Info: http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME.htm http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES.htm

[nysbirds-l] Robert Moses SP, Suffolk County, Mt. Bluebird Yes

Last seen at 9:45 AM flying northeast over Fire Island Inlet. Seen in same location feeding in Red Cedar trees. Sent from my iPhone -- NYSbirds-L List Info: http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME.htm http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES.htm

[nysbirds-l] BirdCallsRadio - For The Record; Legacy Interview: Helen Hays

Birders et al, Thought many of you would be interested in a new series. For The Record; Legacy Interviews: with our Sixth guest Helen Hays http://birdcallsradio.com/ Cheers, Mardi Dickinson Norwalk, CT KymryGroup™ BirdCallsRadio™

[nysbirds-l] BirdCallsRadio - For The Record; Legacy Interview: Helen Hays

Birders et al, Thought many of you would be interested in a new series. For The Record; Legacy Interviews: with our Sixth guest Helen Hays http://birdcallsradio.com/ Cheers, Mardi Dickinson Norwalk, CT KymryGroup™ BirdCallsRadio™

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Prospect Park/Brooklyn birders: Have any of you seen them more recently and do you enter the European Goldfinch into ebird when you see them? I know some birders do not consider them "wild" so they do not report them to ebird. Cool sightings for Gov Island though. It is unfortunate to be

Re: [nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Prospect Park/Brooklyn birders: Have any of you seen them more recently and do you enter the European Goldfinch into ebird when you see them? I know some birders do not consider them "wild" so they do not report them to ebird. Cool sightings for Gov Island though. It is unfortunate to be

[nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Unfortunately the island is closed to the public until May 1st but I was very lucky to get invited to the island yesterday. There was a small flock of European Goldfinch in Hammock Grove of ~12 birds and a small group of 5 (same birds?) seen off Nolan Park later in the day. I was looking into

[nysbirds-l] Governors Island: European Goldfinch Flock (18-Dec)

Unfortunately the island is closed to the public until May 1st but I was very lucky to get invited to the island yesterday. There was a small flock of European Goldfinch in Hammock Grove of ~12 birds and a small group of 5 (same birds?) seen off Nolan Park later in the day. I was looking into