[PAYCO] Re: Congress Invitation
Izwe Lethu! Majoni it is very said that we have lost the focus of our revolution to an extent that we have created enemies in us. I just need to give a simple example that is evident to everyone. No matter how much ANC is divided they always know that the interest of the organisation comes first in terms of aquiring as many South Africans votes as they can.This votes gives ANC power to continue governing this country. This is done in the interest of the organisation despide the differences they have. Unfortunately with us is that whenever somebody is angry with certain developments in the PAC he/she always resort to destroying this movement. We are spending all our effort in trying to destroy each other while Empirealism is working itself to dry what is left of Afrika's resources. We know that some of us are under pay roll of ANC to destroy PAC which stand to be the alternative to the ANC capitalist governance. I pay my alligiance to the PAC which was formed by SOBUKWE who was succeeded by MOTHOPENG not forgeting (LEBALLO and SIBEKO), MAKWETU, MOGOBA, PHEKO and which is now being led by LETLAPA. I respect the leadearship of the PAC and will always SERVE, SUFFER and SACRIFICE for PAC. Lastly comrades I say ON MY LIFE,HOURNER and FORTUNES I SOLOMELY PLEDGE and SWEAR that I SHALL ALWAYS LIVE UP TO THE ASPIRATION OF THE PAC. Those who want to live this great organisation of Sobukwe should do so without intefering with this movement for we do not intertain those who have already left. To those who can hear this WE HAVE THE WHOLE CONTINENT AND HISTORY ON OUR SIDE WE WILL WIN!!! From: Hulisani Mmbara To: PAYCO GOOGLE GROUP PAYCO GOOGLE GROUP Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 1:15:38 PM Subject: FW: [PAYCO] Congress Invitation From: tumelo.segakw...@inl.co.za To: mja...@pac.org.za; mphash...@webmail.co.za; mphahle...@gmail.com; g...@bcawu.co.za CC: payco@googlegroups.com; mmbar...@hotmail.com; skwat...@webmail.co.za; kwamendeb...@webmail.co.za Date: Tue, 25 Aug 2009 09:37:49 +0200 Subject: RE: [PAYCO] Congress Invitation Dear Andiswa, Hope this mail finds you well. Through you , I need to address the Parco boys directly and with all due respect request that you block their communication to the PAC, which they do not respect. Kevin and Linda I said it before and I will say it again, My president is not your President so I do not expect you to send any letters to his office, in case you are not aware we have only 1 seat in parliament thanks to you and your weak organization cos had it not been for PAYCO we would have obtain more seat than one. So stop sending him your rubbish. If your organization is going to a congress then tell that to people who care,but, hey I know why you send it to us, you are prodigal sons who want to come back home and the only way to come home is by you dropping your acts and joining the PACYL as members. You guys are agents of our struggle's enemy and it pains me to see such active young men like yourselves confused in a way you are, you say one thing and do another. As the national spokesperson for PACYL until the congress why don't you engage me and other coordinator like Pitso and Derrick. And as for the issue of assault I suggest that you be very civil about your approach to politics, cos clearly you think we are scared and afraid of you but we are not. Linda I need you to disciple Thapelo in Pretoria tell him PAC is not a Boxing ring if he wants to talk he must use the facility we called mouth and not fist. From: Andiswa Mjali [mailto:mja...@pac.org.za] Sent: 18 August 2009 03:04 PM To: Tumelo Segakweng; mphash...@webmail.co.za Subject: FW: [PAYCO] Congress Invitation FYI From: Andiswa Mjali [mailto:a_mj...@yahoo.co.uk] Sent: 18 August 2009 01:43 PM To: skwat...@webmail.co.za; mphahle...@gmail.com Cc: maiv...@pac.org.za; victor.serakal...@dcs.gov.za; gwej...@gmail.com; mja...@pac.org.za; mnyhon...@yahoo.com Subject: Fw: [PAYCO] Congress Invitation FYI - Forwarded Message From: "kwamendeb...@webmail.co.za" To: payco@googlegroups.com; mmbar...@hotmail.com Sent: Tuesday, 18 August, 2009 10:22:23 Subject: [PAYCO] Congress Invitation Revolutionary Greetings!!! Kindly receive the signed Congress Invitation. Pleace circulate it far and wide as possible. Yours in socialist revolution. Kwame Ndebele PAYCO Secretary General --- South Africas premier free email service - www.webmail.co.za -- For super low premiums, click here http://home.webmail.co.za/dd.pwm NOTICES: 1. This message and any attachments are confidential and intended solely for the addressee. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender at the specific Independent Newspape
Re: FW: [PAYCO] Congress Invitation
Land First All Shall Follow!!! Majoni I dont think any court in the world will ever built PAC, I therefore think non will ever destroy PAC. Therefore comrades we remain drivers of our own destiny as the PAC. Before Alice congress there was PAC and that PAC was ruled under the decree which was in line with the constitution. What happens now is that we have the Bloumfontein High Court which recognised the Alice congress. Now we have the Cape High Court which seeks to nulify the Alice congress. Where do we feuture as the PAC members. Are we to rely on court decitions for the PAC. I think comrade to be fair it is under the current leadership that we can correct our situation. It is this current leadership (after all considerations) that is able to call us on a special congress to fix our problems. It is a sorry situation now that some of us who still claim to be PAC do not recognise this ability we have to built this organisation. If we do not recognise the current PAC leadership then which one do we have that can facilitate the ability to built PAC. Can we expect the court to call the congress for PAC? Comrades you are right saying that we did not join individuals when joining this movement. Also Prof Sobukwe tought us not to Hero worship any person for we cannot gaurantee an individual. Stop swearing at the current leadership. I agree with one comrade that the language we are using, swearing on the current leadership is a taboo to PAC. Now what agenda are we serving by continuasly using a taboo language when addressing other comrades. Again comrade if we do not recognise the current leadership why are we having so much interest in it. Lets stop lying to ourself comrade, we recognise this leadership and under this leadership we are able to correct our shortcomings in the PAC. I dont have to refere you to our diciplinary code. You should know it by now. Forward to Afrika indipendence. Today South Africa tommorow the Democratic Socialist Azania. Izwe Lethu!! From: Yandisa Ngcuka To: payco@googlegroups.com Cc: skwat...@webmail.co.za; mphahle...@gmail.com; maiv...@pac.org.za; victor.serakal...@dcs.gov.za; gwej...@gmail.com; mja...@pac.org.za; mnyhon...@yahoo.com; tumelo.segakw...@inl.co.za Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 2:41:55 PM Subject: Re: FW: [PAYCO] Congress Invitation Son of Afrika, This is realpolitik at its best, and I don’t think it should worry you that much as history will absolve these efforts by PAYCO. History will certainly judge the current so called Leadership very harshly. There are two immediate dynamics that we need to critically scrutinize: 1). We have a very weak organization: Inter alia, there’s no leadership, no vision, almost non-existent structures, no programs, no legitimate policies, no political education and workshops, illegitimate constitution. Therefore, it is my view that if we continue focusing on personalities (especially the president) as opposed to building our own structures, then these problems that we’re currently facing will always resurface. Yes, building structures without any leadership might prove to be ineffective, however, It’s quite evident now that the “president” and his “NEC” are hell-bent to destroy the movement due to their narrow interests. Their time will end, but the PAC will remain. Our main priority comrades should be the PAC, not it’s compradorist leadership. We did not join the individuals, we joined the organization and I think all of us – proponents and opponents and the leadership change need to grasp this logic. 2). There is an issue of a Cape High Court Order against the PAC. Amongst other things, the order states that: “..the Constitution which was allegedly adopted by the First Respondent (PAC) at its meeting of 4 -6 July 2008 is set aside and declared to be null and void.” The “president” issued a memorandum on August 13th 2009 when it was evident to him that most structure are aware of this court order. The Court Order is dated, 23 April 2009 and remained binding when the President lost the leave to appeal. Why did the “president" take so long to inform the structures about this? The Kwa Langa (ward 52) Branch of the Cape Metro region has requested the leadership to clarify the political and legal implications of the Court Order, with no avail - yet, the “president” is based in Cape Town. The above is a further indictment that the uninformed membership and the organizational disunity serve the so called leadership quite well as they continue looting the organizational resources while we insult each other. Izwe Lethu!! Yandisa On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 1:15 PM, Hulisani Mmbara wrote: > > From: tumelo.segakw...@inl.co.za >To: mja...@pac.org.za; mphash...@webmail.co.za; mphahle...@gmail.com; >g...@bcawu.co.za >CC: payco@googlegroups.com; mmbar...@hotmail.com; skwat...@webmail.co.za; >kwamendeb...@webmail.co.
[PAYCO] Re: APLA DAY A DAY TO REMEMBER
Izwe Lethu! Please comrades I would like to echo my humble plea to all Pan Africanist out there. I think we made our points regarding our views and opinions on PAC and the current PAC leadership. This is not time to settle the score. I think COPE is there for those who want to settle scores. What is left is then What? Where?How? and When? are we laying the first brick in rebuilding this organisation and at what platform? Time is running out we need to declare our loyality to this organisation or we must find our own. No one said that a road to liberation is a smooth one. We are fighting a protacted warfare with untold posibilities of which one is what we are experiencing now. We either solve our problems as the PAC or we ship out. This is a final clarion call comrades. The first stage is to renew our membership to PAC, secondly is to establish PAC branches and structures and finally is to engage constructively in those structures to change this current sitution in the PAC. This can be done only if we follow our path correctively, knowing that the PAC exist and is there for all of us. Azania Shall Prevail so said the African Profecy Izwe Lethu 072 673 8015 From: Snow Mokgalabone To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 10:31:21 AM Subject: [PAYCO] Re: APLA DAY A DAY TO REMEMBER Very nice parental guidance. My father used to say “old people can mislead and always refer to history by running away from reality”. He further said, my child “English idioms sometimes are baseless and have no meaning to us Africans” My Grandmother added by saying “ whenever you write please check the relevancy of the content and apply your mind because you might be funny to the young ones” Ta From:payco@googlegroups.com [mailto:pa...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Ntandazo Gcingca Sent: 10 September 2009 10:22 AM To: payco@googlegroups.com Subject: [PAYCO] APLA DAY A DAY TO REMEMBER Dear Hulisani Mmbara The recently elected APLAMVA structure it’s legitimate and is not running parallel with any structure, unless you can start to mention one. Please tell me as grounded as you claim. Can the real Pan Africanist express the way you do? You are not posses and governed by the 8 pillars of Pan Africanism, worse the PAC basic document, disciplinary code, manifesto and the speeches of President Robert Sobukwe. I understand where you come from and where you are going. Surprise, surprise “The ground is fertile and conducive for Pan Africanist to bounce back”. I don’t want you to change. Change is a PAIN, only few in this world envoys’ pain. Most people are for comfort zone. Those days had come and gone. When we look back, where we come from, at the time there ware no PAC structures in place. The establishment of AZANYU and PASO was the turning point of the PAC situation. I fully agree “What is bound to appear is bound to disappear”. We call it negation of negation. One day I will tell you why President Zephaniah Mothopeng said “The situation in SOUTH AFRICA is interesting” The establishment of Azanian Socialistic state is the highest achievement that the MEN of today can achieve. “The road is fully ofcheese as well as cheats” and “fully of trip as well as traps”. The topic in the basic document is engraved “The final triumph – We will win. You only continuously wins battles when you are discipline and very sensitive towards your MEN, even your enemy sometimes. WE ARE MADE FOR THIS. Our collective memories and action will only make a difference when we sing and move together. Let all honour “APLA DAY” as a symbol of maturity. My father used to say to me “My boy you must come to life, you must come to the world. That mentally unfortunately was drummed in my ears as long as I live. I believe that he world only embrace the ones are in need off. The duty of the PAC It’s a challenge of a life time. I remained humble. Ntandazo “Didi” Gcingca 073 707 1158 From:Tumelo Segakweng To: "payco@googlegroups.com" Sent: Thursday, September 3, 2009 6:56:11 PM Subject: [PAYCO] Re: APLA DAY A DAY TO REMEMBER I need to meet, however is the leader of PAYco, Africanist can not act as enemies in the same camp so lets meet and iron issues so that it can be understood if we part ways now or we mend what is broken but let all have patience when approaching such issues, Kwame I particularly need to seat with and kavin. Please call me on my reliable phone 0764848481. I remain Tumelo Segakweng From:payco@googlegroups.com [pa...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Hulisani Mmbara [mmbar...@hotmail.com] Sent: 02 September 2009 12:00 AM To: PAYCO GOOGLE GROUP PAYCO GOOGLE GROUP Cc: FIHLA FIHLA; JUSTICE CONCERNED CDE Subject: [PAYCO] Re: APLA DAY A DAY TO REMEMBER My Dear Comrades This call for 'APLAMVA parade' is being made by the illegitimate and illegal parallel str
[PAYCO] Pan Africanists Material
Revolutionary Greetings!! Comrades I would like to appeal to all comrades who have Africanist material books in a soft copy to make it available to all of us taking advantage of this chart medium. Dispide being veteran's of this movement, by nature of being in this oganisation for so long we need to be reminded of PAC politics. If we really want to built this wonderful organisation of Sobukwe we need to put our politics in perspetive. We can only built a good structure if we speak the same language. Once we are able to do this sellouts,anachist,collaboraters,opportunists and all other sinister forces operating as PAC caders will be exposed and the real Party caders will remain to built this party to be a force to be reckoned. We have the Whole Continent and History On Our Side We Will Win Yours in the cause of africanist Revolution Izwe Lethu!! --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[PAYCO] Re: Fwd: PAYCO NATIONAL CONGRESS DOCUMENTS
Izwe Lethu!! Majoni I think it is high time that we accept that there's always been problems in the organisation. At this juncture realy we should be able to deal with them. Maybe the following might help in triggering a clear sober political retrospection. When Payco was formed it was not accepted with the resoan that our struggle is being betrayed even more by the then president Mr Mlamli Makwetu. Some comrades even wanted his head. It is a blind lie to say Azanyu formed Payco. It was the convention that was held which proposed the name change as there was a faction which uses the name Azanyu (The Revolutionary Watchdogs). This did not go well with most of the comrades who were neither Watchdogs. Ultimatetly Payco was accepted after a lot of debates and mudslinging. Now the same is happening and what do we do? It is a fact that Alice congress took a resolution to change Payco to Pacyl. It is a fact that this Alice congress according to the courts of this country seems to have been nullified . Here comrade we are talking about NEO COLONIALIST oriented courts of law which of cause will never serve the interests of the PAC nor has authority over the decisions of the PAC. If we are to built this organisation we should take into consideration the above and other factors not listed above. That is we should accept that the two factions exist. PACYL exist by the resolution of Alice congress and PAYCO exist by the resolution of the courts of this country. PAC Congress is the highest decision making body. This suggest if there was any agreement it remains binding to all (Payco,Pawo,Pasma and all other PAC structures). Comrades should tell us if ever the Alice congress was eligitimate and when was it eligitimate? Before the congress or after the congress, before the courts decisions or after the courts decisions? I think this will help clear some of us comrades who are blinded by the dust that the two fuctions are causing. Lastly comrades errispective of whatever Payco should accept and respect the fact that Pacyl exist and the same with Pacyl should accept that Payco exist. The two formations should try to find common grounds to agree and a common solution to be formulated. Viva and long live to the United PAC youth wing. From: Lucky Khoza To: Payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, October 8, 2009 2:57:52 PM Subject: [PAYCO] Fwd: PAYCO NATIONAL CONGRESS DOCUMENTS My dear comrade Khuliso,I find it disheartening to hear this kind of iresponsible utterances from a comrade of your nature and calibre.First and for most -- Forwarded message -- From: Lucky Khoza Date: Thu, 8 Oct 2009 14:57:05 +0200 Subject: PAYCO NATIONAL CONGRESS DOCUMENTS To: magigw...@gmail.com My dear comrade Khuliso, I find it disheartening to hear such kind of irresponsible utterances from a comrade of your nature and calibre. First and for most will you be able to tell when was PAYCO disbanded i.e (day/date, time, venue), obviously no you cannot. PAYCO as a structure must be thoroughly consulted for such an action to take place, you do not wake today and feel excite and just try to disband a structure. It's the thinking and the actions like yours that put the PAC where it is today. Forming parallel structures will never see the light off the day. What you are saying remain a fairytale for you and your cohorts in your own dreamland. Do you really know that the process which led to the so called pacyl was flawed and there for declared illegal by the courts? You are continually acting in contempt of the courts by propagating such a structure. Common sense tells that you are not in par with the latest developments in the movement and in the country at large. With due respect Son of the soil I never doubted your political orientation even for a single second, but surprisingly you proved me wrong. What you are doing amount to a dog barking at a moving car. Base on what you said noble son, I tend to believe that you are not well informed. PAYCO will exists as long as progressive force exists. Regards, Lucky Khoza The views and opinions expressed in this message are those of the individual sender of this message and do not necessarily represent the views and opinions of the JSE. Consequently, the JSE does not accept responsibility for such views and opinions and this message should not be read as representing the views and opinions of the JSE or constitute binding terms and conditions without subsequent written confirmation and an authorizing resolution where required. Each page attached hereto must also be read in conjunction with this disclaimer and should any part of this message be unclear, the issue should be clarified with the Company Secretary of the JSE. Confidentiality note: The message is intended for the addressee only. If you are not the intended recipient of this message, you are notified that any distribution, use of or copying of this
[PAYCO] Re: BY - ELECTIONS IN GAUTENG PROVINCE (MOGALE CITY - KRUGERSDORP) & Westonaria
Sons and Daughters of Afrika!! I must be honest with you. we are really acting and behaving like the charterist youth who until today remain political blinded by political developments in our era. There has never been such political mudslinging in the PAC. This is caused by comrades who thinks they know better and understand PAC or Pan Africanism more than others. I agree 101% with comrade Jack Masoga. I don't think is proper to call a PAC gathering a circus and at the same time claim to be PAC. If we are serious about building this organisation we must first learn to respect others and their dessending views. Let us stop calling each others names. I wonder how many Julias Malema's we are having in this organisation. We should address issues by putting down facts. We must try to show each other the correct path maybe we will find the correct way. We should refrain from fosting others to our particular views by swearing at each other. In that way we will be using nuckle dusters against each other instead of political facts. We should rally each other and not create enemies out of our difference. Our difference should serve as self critisism so that at the end we emerge more purer. Lastly I congratulate those comrades who are holding the Pan Africanist Flag higher. Continue comrades for Afrika will remember you. PLEASE COMRADES STOP SWEARING AT EACH OTHER!!! Our blood our sweat and our toil will free Afrika!! No force can dilute our militancy not even a hiroshima bomb can dilute our militancy. Viva Poqo From: Jack masoga To: payco@googlegroups.com Cc: PAYCO Azania Sent: Friday, October 9, 2009 9:22:29 PM Subject: [PAYCO] BY - ELECTIONS IN GAUTENG PROVINCE (MOGALE CITY - KRUGERSDORP) & Westonaria Revolutionary Greetings Majoni I always read about WHO is WHO on this platform, people think that they are better than others. I was invited to PAYCO Congress to be held at Nothern Cape which started tonight. However I want to challenge the Youth in the Pan Africanist Congress of Azania to wake up and implement IOTA by contesting the two Wards which are up for taking. I took stock of work that was done by PAYCO around Khutsong and nearby areas which is West Rand. I hope Comrade Nonceba Mbilini, Bafana Mthimkhulu, Lazim Mokoena will ensure that PAC under their Leadership in the West Rand will win those Wards so that we speak in the position of Power. Please MaAfrika stop calling Africansits Sell- out, Agents of Imperilism, Yes Man of Whoever, Capitalist, instead concentrate on the 1st aim of the PAC which is "to rally and unite the African People under the banner of African Nationalism" How do your expect to rally and unite African people if you "Africanists call each other names" what a shame MaAfrika. I remain Cal Zimbiri 0731822656 (012) 323 9905 (O) --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[PAYCO] Re: Fwd: PAYCO NATIONAL CONGRESS DOCUMENTS
Comrade Kwame Mo Afrika I think it will be very much assisting that as Payco national you should offer a directive to indicate major bone of contention with regard to the Alice congress. This will assist us in making an informed decision on the current PAC leadership.This should be factual with full information to substantiate your facts. First how can so many branches of PAC know about the congress and only the few did not know. Maybe on this one you should ask Comrades like Thapelo who were making sure that branches are informed of this congress and the proposed constitutional amendments. Can you substantiate as to what you mean by the tradition of PAC with regard to the Alice congress. Which branches where barred from attending the Alice congress? Can you please mention a few. If I remember clearly we have always had problem with credentials in the organisation. Alice credentials were better than any other credentials PAC congeresses have ever had. Do you think that so many people who attended the Alice congress where there to serve one person. Do you think that all the people who campaigned and voted this party under the leadership of Comrade Letlapa were coeced into doing so because they are politicaly naive to the party development. I remember comrade I personally spoke to Comrade Mbara at Alice when they were denied entry to the congress with the reason that they did not meet the credential requirements. Maybe I am one of those hooligans who harrased Payco comrades. In simple comrades I find very much misinformation in your facts. I don't wish anybody to pursue others only to settle scores. If we realy need to built this organisation we can only do so as PAC. We should renew our membership and pay subscription. We should belong to legitimate existing branches or we should create them. The current leadership is not for lifetime. If we are not happy with it we can as well propose that it withdraw. We can only do that in a well constituted PAC gathering (National Conference or Congress). I don't think we can do that through media. Mothopeng tought us that no press can destroy us and no press can build us. So lets not hope that by talking to the media we can build PAC. Son of the soil there are so many comrades out there who are realy frastrated by the developments in this organisation. We can only help them by being true to them. In that way will be true to PAC and will be true to the True Africanist Revolution. After the Payco congress I wish that PAYCO NEC can meet with PACYL NEC and iron out issues after which a proposal can be issued to the PAC with regard to the way forward. That will be a revolutionary UNITY Building initiative. Forwrd to a united PAC youth wing. Long live the spirit of AZANYU!! From: "kwamendeb...@webmail.co.za" To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Friday, October 9, 2009 8:29:57 AM Subject: [PAYCO] Re: Fwd: PAYCO NATIONAL CONGRESS DOCUMENTS > Son of the soil, > > Let's deal with facts not assuptions: > > Fact Number one: > *Politically and in line with PAC tradition Alice Congress was > illegitimate. > *Credentials were questionable > *Party brances opposed to the former president Letlapa Mphahlele were not > informed about the Congress and those who went to Alice were barred and > denied entry. > *Component structures were not officially informed about the Congress as > per tradition. > *PAYCO leadership was harrassed by Letlapa's hooligans at Alice > > Fact number 2: > *PAYCO is the only legitimate structure recognised by the party > Constitution > *AZANYU was renamed PAYCO after the resolution of the 1996 > Convention after thorough consultation with the leadership at that point > in time and was affirmed in the Congress that elected Dr Mogoba as > President. > *PAYCO/AZANYU were created to organise youth for the party and to > conscentise the youth about PAC and its vision and mission,not to serve > individuals or to create confusion in the party. Fact number 3: *All resolutions taken in the Alice Conference are null and void except the resignation of Mphahlele as were taken under the smuggled constitution which has no force and effect in accordance with Cape High Court Judgement. *Mphahlele's resignation is valid because it was done under the reinstated constitution. *Currently in accordance with the Cape High Court decision,PAC has no leadership,hence the efforts to enforce the Cape High Court decision and establishment of the Interim leadership. Fact Number 4: *The decisions of the High Court are binding to all *Mphahlele has challenged the Thami group in the so called Neo Colonial courts of law and got a decision favourable to him and there was no labelling of those courts as Neo-Colonial institution,I really despise selective amnesia. Fact Number 5: *We want unity in the party we are therefore ready to reconcile with all comrades who have been used to pursue factionalism in the party. Yours for
[PAYCO] Re: Revised response to Mr Moloto
Comrade Kwame I think is unreasonable of you to say that somebody who joined PAC in 1959 is still a PAC member even if he/she does not pay subscription. Does this apply to Makwetu, Maxwell, Tefo and the rest of others who at one stage joined this party. The constitution and code of conduct tells us that for one to be a ligitimate member he/she has to pay his/her dues which of cause is a subscription fees. Paying of this subscription fees validate ones membership to the party. If you don't pay you are not a member period. I question your logic in that. With regard to membership cards I think a vast majority of PAC branches has the same problem, even in the times of President Makwetu,Mogoba and Motsoko Pheko's leadership. This is a PAC problem and not an idividual problem. I myself do not have a membership card but I am able to produce proof to whoever that I am a PAC member who is up to date with subscription fees. I also contribute monthly R200 to PAC and make other contribution to the branch and the region that I am from. I don't see where the point you are making is taking us. Another example is that I regret having been part of the branches around my region who boycoted the 2004 election because of the problem we had with Maxwell and the PAC. This led us to losing the provincial seet in Limpopo and we are still struggling to get one. So comrade there is no excuse. Lastly I will say in simplicity as the great founder of this organisation said about those who were not part of the revolution that those who are not with us are against us. So don't find your self in that situation. I APPRICIATE YOUR CONTRIBUTION TO THIS ORGANISATION. PLEASE DON"T CONFUSE THOSE WHO DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE DYNAMICS IN THIS ORGANISATION. Please stop your act now and become with us the habingious of the new world order. For a united PAC Youth formation. Long live the spirit of AZANYU From: "kwamendeb...@webmail.co.za" To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Wednesday, October 14, 2009 3:53:59 PM Subject: [PAYCO] Revised response to Mr Moloto Revolutionary greetings, Mr Moloto, I want to take this opportunity and address some of the issues you made about PAYCO, party membership and party building. * Base and Departure First and foremost what is key and critical is to accept and identify with the PAC vision,its ideology,policies,objectives,constitution and its disciplinary code. As PAYCO members we identify and accept these fundamental and founding principles of our revolutionary party. To us PAC is the Alpha and Omega in fighting neo-colonialism,capitalism and other forms of oppressive systems in Azania. PAC is the only party that can truly bring about complete independence of our people and lead them to economic,social and cultural emancipation,hence despite all the differences we have with different people and inspite of the attacks and insults we have endured in the party we remain steadfast and never shunned this movement. We believe it is our historical duty to advance the ideology,mission,and policies of the PAC. We are also duty bound to defend the glorious history of the movement and defend the legacy of our founding fathers and sacrifices of Poqo/APLA cdes with our dear lifes and dignity. *members in good standing I am certain that a majority of PAYCO members if not all are PAC members. Every person who clain to be PAC is a matter of fact and reality that he/she has joined PAC at one stage,therefore allows that member all the rights to claim to be PAC. You join PAC or any political party once. The payment of yearly subscriptions is an administrative and organisational matter. A man who joined PAC in 1959 and the one who joined in 2008 are PAC members whether they payed their subscription or not. Let me remind you Mr Moloto,that PAC annual subscription fee is just R10. You cannot believe the amount of money some of us we spend on monthly basis on PAC activities. I come from Newcastle Region,KwaZulu Natal,Branch 21(ward21). I pay my subscriptions yearly and also contribute R100 monthly to finance branch activities.In 2007 My branch and 7 other branches in the region submitted their Membership forms and deposited money on party account to be issued party membership cards and never received even a single membership card. Branches in my region resolved to withhold all the subscription fees in the branches concerned until we receive our cards for 2007. In some instances we were forced to repay comrades from our pockets as cards were not coming forth to avoid conflicts and mistrust to the party. I was told that mine was not to be processed as I was guilty of bringing the name of the party into disrepute,but why were my comrades denied their cards as well for my "sins". Despite being regarded unfit to be PAC members Mphahlele and company were ready to receive our debit orders on monthly basis. We decided to cancel those monthly debit orders of R100 a month after seein
[PAYCO] Re: Revised response to Mr Moloto
Greetings Son's and Daughters of The Soil Well I must say I am impressed by the respond you gave to me. My only concern is that in the matters that affect PAC I don't think anyone can be nutral. My concern is that you keep labelling people and associate them with a particular individual who happens to be PAC president. I was taught that in the PAC we only have the president for an administration purposes. We are all the leaders of revolution.We all joined this movement and not individual this does not apply to you only.For your information I joined this movement long ago when I didin't even know who is the president of this movement. I joined this movement through my little understanding of PAC politics. Having been presented with PAC politics in the times of Azanyu I immidiately identify with this organisation. Now what I am addressing is the issue of you labelling the comrades as lapping dogs of whoever. I have never in my PAC political life try to identify with a particular faction. I have always lived and accepted the leadership of the party even when things are not right in the movement. Until maybe the courts of this country disband the current leadership I will always abide by it.So for us to robustly address PAC problems we should stop labelling people. Two wrongs don't make it right. If you were labelled and called names you should not do the same with others. In that way you are not solving the problem but exesorbating it.We cannot comrade for whatever reason disassociate ourself with the leadership of this movement. You seem to understand the constitution and the code of this movement yet you are unable to apply it proparly. The constitution provides a platform for comrades to raise issues. Why can't we follow the constitution on this one. We all remain unhappy with certain developments in the party. What we cannot do is to run to the nearest media office and think we can address our issues through the media. I still emphasise this: IT IS ONLY THROUGH A PROPERLY CONSTITUTED PAC GATHERING THAT WE CAN AMMICABLY ADDRESS PAC ISSUES. Not at street coners and shebeens around the country. Can this strike a sense on you. Izwe Lethu!! From: "kwamendeb...@webmail.co.za" To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, October 15, 2009 11:35:28 AM Subject: [PAYCO] Re: Revised response to Mr Moloto Greetings, Sometimes I just cannot believe is the same PAC I joined that I am in,when I hear the levels of engagement,lack of reason and logic in the points of views advanced. I joined a PAC of intellectual towers,who engage on facts and logic,not mere speculation and excitement. You never cease to disappoint me with your poor understanding of PAC constitution, History,disciplinary code,tradition and general legal principles.Let me clear the issue again with you,and please reason logically with my points of view: 1. We all join PAC or any political party once and become members. A man who joined PAC in 1959 and the one who joined yesterday are all members of the PAC because they chose to join PAC not other parties. 2. Subscriptions are administrative and organisational. PAC survive mainly on subscription from its members hence we must pay our subscription yearly. The fact that you did not pay your subscription does not strip you your membership of the PAC,but it denies you certain rights and privileges,eg,you cannot elect leadership and you cannot be part of decision making at any level,but you can partake in party meetings, debates, workshops,campaigns,programmes and projects. Hence we talk of members in good standing and those who are not,the implication is that you remain a member but you have not met some of your constitutional obligations. 3. I thought it is common knowledge that when a member joins another party automatically forfeits his membership with the other party. Even if the person had just renewed his subscription with the party,he just cease to be a party member the day he chooses to join another party. I don't have to tell you whether Makwetu or Maxwell are PAC or not as this is clear as day light. I maintain my statement that a man who joined PAC in 1959 and the one who joined in 2008 are both PAC members,as long as they remain loyal to PAC and are not members of other political parties. 4. I gave the tale of my branch to give a tangible reality of the situation in terms of the membership and state of branches are concerned. This is because we have been accused of being non members and that we are arm-chair revolutionaries. I know that many comrades have been insulted as non members and arm-chair revolutionaries by people who don't know what is happening on the ground. I would always salute any person who choose to be a PAC member instead of any vibrant and booming political party where there are material benefits and lucrative career opportunities,becuase it takes courage and extra ordinary determina
[PAYCO] Re: Revised response to Mr Moloto
Greetings! Comrade I think it will be realy unfair of me to ignore the point you are raising. I agree with you on a question of subscribed and non subscribed comrades. Yes we all remain PAC members. I think we are realy creating a culture of not engaging by denying other comrades participation in the affairs of the party just because they are not in good standing. Let me please withdraw my utterances with regard to the legitimacy of one being a member of the party. By only allowing delegades in our conferences we are in transgretion of the party constitution. I think all of us should be given an opportunity to participate fully in the matters of the party as the constitution says.Most of us missed this point. I think we should revisit it and correct it. Thanks comrade for inlightening not only me but all who for some reason ignored this point. Lets bring back the culture of PAC as we know. From: "kwamendeb...@webmail.co.za" To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Thursday, October 15, 2009 11:35:28 AM Subject: [PAYCO] Re: Revised response to Mr Moloto Greetings, Sometimes I just cannot believe is the same PAC I joined that I am in,when I hear the levels of engagement,lack of reason and logic in the points of views advanced. I joined a PAC of intellectual towers,who engage on facts and logic,not mere speculation and excitement. You never cease to disappoint me with your poor understanding of PAC constitution, History,disciplinary code,tradition and general legal principles.Let me clear the issue again with you,and please reason logically with my points of view: 1. We all join PAC or any political party once and become members. A man who joined PAC in 1959 and the one who joined yesterday are all members of the PAC because they chose to join PAC not other parties. 2. Subscriptions are administrative and organisational. PAC survive mainly on subscription from its members hence we must pay our subscription yearly. The fact that you did not pay your subscription does not strip you your membership of the PAC,but it denies you certain rights and privileges,eg,you cannot elect leadership and you cannot be part of decision making at any level,but you can partake in party meetings, debates, workshops,campaigns,programmes and projects. Hence we talk of members in good standing and those who are not,the implication is that you remain a member but you have not met some of your constitutional obligations. 3. I thought it is common knowledge that when a member joins another party automatically forfeits his membership with the other party. Even if the person had just renewed his subscription with the party,he just cease to be a party member the day he chooses to join another party. I don't have to tell you whether Makwetu or Maxwell are PAC or not as this is clear as day light. I maintain my statement that a man who joined PAC in 1959 and the one who joined in 2008 are both PAC members,as long as they remain loyal to PAC and are not members of other political parties. 4. I gave the tale of my branch to give a tangible reality of the situation in terms of the membership and state of branches are concerned. This is because we have been accused of being non members and that we are arm-chair revolutionaries. I know that many comrades have been insulted as non members and arm-chair revolutionaries by people who don't know what is happening on the ground. I would always salute any person who choose to be a PAC member instead of any vibrant and booming political party where there are material benefits and lucrative career opportunities,becuase it takes courage and extra ordinary determination. I know the insults and embarrassments we endure in the communities we live in,but we remain committed and proud members of PAC. Some of us we are forcing to be members even if we are rejected by the party. I remember at one stage Bishop Toboti mentioned my name and Mmbara as non members in Ukhozi FM(widely listened radio station in KZN) when I arrived at work everybody was mocking me and asking me why I am not joining their parties because PAC does not want me,but I had to stomach that and march forward. 5. Your lame excuse that the problem of non issuing of membership cards is a PAC thing really annoys me,because it says the PAC is a party of failures and incompetent people who cannot process membership cards for less than 100 000 members,but wants to run Home Affairs and process birth certificates, ID's, travel Visas and passports for 46 million people,I reject this with contempt. When we elected Mphahlele as part of his mandate was to get the administrative and organisational sytems working not to complicate the situation and claim that things have always been like that. If the status quo remains it is enough evidence that Mphahlele and company have failed. 6. On the question of contribution I wanted to refute a nonsense that we are unable to pay R10 and want to embark on PAC issues,I
[PAYCO] Re: Fwd: Mayihlome News
Izwe Lethu! Comrade Tumelo your atterances have revived my hope that there are still comrades out there who can stop at nothing to revive the spirit of this organisation. Azanian grounds are very much fertile for the socialist revolution. If only we can redirect our energies to building this organisation and give our toiling masses hope that under the leadership of PAC and the banner of Pan Africanism our massess can breath the final sigh of releaf for the realisation of our revolution. Payco we share your frastration but cannot support your contineous disregard of the leadership of this organisation. I don't think a child can bear itself and care for itself until it become a grown person. A child needs a mother and a father support and guidence. Let PAC be our mother and father. Only through this relationship our revolution will be attained. Payco comrades need to know that they are not the only ones who sees wrongs in our movement. We all share this bitter feelings but that does not give us a permision to swear and disregard our leadership. Whatever you think you can attain on yourself will never be realised. You will only vanish in the dust bin of history like we did in the Revolutionary Watchdogs. Long live PAC Forward to a United Socialist Afrika From: Tumelo Segakweng To: "payco@googlegroups.com" Sent: Friday, October 23, 2009 1:56:56 PM Subject: [PAYCO] Re: Fwd: Mayihlome News Sibusiso Xaba - I now address you. Brother, I expect you to give a way forward to your boys and girls in Payco. You are all approaching this issue mildly and honestly I do not admire that slow motion I believe in action and I fully believe that comrade Sabelo Phama would support me. I am a revolutionary and many victory under my belt can prove me right. For years now - you sing the same song and no results, what do you call that? Time wasted will never be regain. I know there are lawyers and doctors in Payco and right now your qualifications are not helping in fact they will never help at all. Kwame next time get to the point and stop somersaulting. I will not attend your congress and I believe there should not be one. So why do not you all come to khutsong on the day of your congress and we map out a way forwad.Law will tell you that what you are doing is wrong and you still doing it, You do not have a mother body how can say you go to congress but, hey ,Kwame you continue to do it. Clearly you guys do not have good plans to help PAC recover, well I have plans and if you do not stop what you are doing me and rightful thinking Azanians will act very soon, ask Bafana and Ncebi they know what I can do, and trust me we can do more and better thing than that. I want to Speak to Matome, Sibusiso, Gen Fithla, Mr Ncukani, Kevin and Kwame.I have a plan I need you to tell me yours. I remain humble in the struggle to revive PAC, and I am prepared to face the consequences even if it mean I should die. If you feel the way I feel than lets act and stop talking.We talk too much and there should be action, resolutions and decisions must be taken. who agrees with me on this one? I say PAC was not formed in the Court of law so no judge can help us, only ourselves. To hell with the Motsoko Pheko ruling this is the guy hope contributed to our down fall. Those who want to sit and wait for Jesus please step out of our way. In three months PAC must be in good shape, Now lets work. Pasma is a strong component a think unstudent must leave student politics to student, Well done PASMA TUT, that what we need unity and fearlessness. Again WELL DONE BOYS!!! Azania is ours,Izwelethu -Original Message- From: payco@googlegroups.com [mailto:pa...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Sbusiso Xaba Sent: 23 September 2009 05:06 PM To: payco@googlegroups.com Subject: [PAYCO] Fwd: Mayihlome News For those who have not subscribed to the Mayihlome News -- Forwarded message -- From: Mayihlome News Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 13:05:03 + Subject: Mayihlome News To: sbusiso.x...@gmail.com Mayihlome News /// THE ILLUSION OF LOGIC IN WORKPLACE REMUNERATION FORMULA Posted: 21 Sep 2009 05:00 AM PDT http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/wordpress/ciBM/~3/hAePGd0wsdA/ Human capital experts tell the world that the payment structure in a workplace is based on a logical formula consisting of complex variables namely the function complexity, skill scarcity, skill criticality, undesirability, risk, accountability and responsibility. It is rational expectation that the higher the indicator on a variable the higher the compensation. It is also sensible to conclude that work experience and academic qualifications assist the recruiters to determine the best candidate for the position. This skill and credential matrix is forwarded in sophisticated microeconomic platforms as the foundation for the remuneration system. The major
[PAYCO] Re: tumelo
Comrade Jabu I think the reality here is that only PAC members are to vote out the president not the court of this country. I don't think in this matter the court has duristiction. If it has I advice people like you to see to it that the court decision is inforced, Otherwise Payco must just throw this devil reasoning and judgement away and like prodical sons ask for forgiveness from the PAC leadership. Izwe Lethu!! Every positive thinking takes us forward. Viva PAC From: Jabu Makhanya To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2009 3:30:54 PM Subject: [PAYCO] tumelo To: PAYCO and PAC members It is paramount to entertain every opinion without prejudice but I regret to advise that stooges in the likes of Tumelo no longer deserves to be regarded. He is a natural embecile. He will never learn anything new about the PAC. He is a dogmatic by nature. Anyone who refuses to to abide by the legal institutions of the country, is nothing else but a fool. We cannot continue repeating the same thing that Letlapa's leadership was nullified by the natural justice system of this country, and yet someone is still accusing others of undermining the so called Letlapa. Letlapa's era is over as the PAC leader whether you like or not. Jabu --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[PAYCO] Re: FW: 3rd PAC National Convention 28-29 November 2009
Comrades in this piece of writing I would like to remind many of us about the gold olden days of our revolution when many of us in this country were so much afraid to mention the word APLA, the name which was so much associated with PAC. Also the likes of Thabo Mbeki’s dared to mention the name PAC. All the imperialists’ countries and their local servants were so much afraid that their ill neo colonialist and capitalist conceived plans for this country were on the verge of collapse because of the relentless armed struggle waged by APLA under the PAC. That was when hope was installed in every traditional authority, townships and villages around occupied Azania that at last Azania shall be free and under an Africanistic Socialist order. That was the time when many of us were so mute that we were afraid of being victimised for being associated with the movement that is associated with APLA. Today under this neo colonialist order we think that we are so much free that we have a right to do and say as we wish about the name PAC. Even mice around this country have got something to say about PAC. PAC name is so synonymous to the smelling takkies we daily wear that the name PAC is reduced to nothing and can be used by and claimed by any other person who so wishes to and go unpunished. Here comrades I am referring to an individual or individuals who think for some reason they have a right to this movement that they can organise a convention without any mandate. The last convention that was organised in this fashion yielded the formation of PAM. I don’t know what are the plans now for this convention? Irrespective of being disgruntled by the current leadership there is a constitutional guidelines to be followed. Whether the 1959 or any other amended constitution there are guidelines to be followed. At least a portion of the existing membership or structures of the party (for argument sake say one third of the membership) should be thoroughly consulted before a decision of such nature can be agreed to. Where the current organiser of this convention does took a mandate to organise such a gathering? How many PAC branches, regions or provincial structures were consulted? Which constitutional mandate was applied in organising such gathering? When was the agreed time and date for this convention? I think Mo Afrika Ntonzima knows he is wrong in this matter. And him and the people he represent should do away with this convention at least until a proper channel is followed or there is an agreement for such gathering. Let’s not address our problems by instituting wrong moves. In this fashion our problems will be carried over and not resolved. My last question is on the leadership of this movement as to how do they allow things like this to perpetually happen without taking drastic measures to discipline and or call to order people who continue to sow the seeds of divisions and frustrations in this movement? For how long will we continue like this? I think PAC has reached its zenith on the matter of factionalism and centralised corrective measures should be taken to radically address these persisting problems in the organisation. If the oath of allegiance protocol should be implemented let it be so. Let’s bury factionalism and build this organisation based on the programme of action. Izwe Lethu!! From: Hulisani Mmbara To: PAYCO GOOGLE GROUP PAYCO GOOGLE GROUP Sent: Wednesday, November 4, 2009 8:56:35 AM Subject: [PAYCO] FW: 3rd PAC National Convention 28-29 November 2009 > Date: Tue, 3 Nov 2009 19:31:22 +0200 > Subject: 3rd PAC National Convention 28-29 November 2009 > From: ntonzi...@mailbox.co.za > To: tula...@legal-aid.co.za; david.mpan...@transnet.net; ed...@pasma.org.za; > emadzu...@yahoo.com; frazersm...@mighty.co.za; lineosm...@yahoo.com; > lpmas...@webmail.co.za; lwand...@pasma.org.za; mmbar...@hotmail.com; > mt...@ananzi.co.za; nkru...@lantic.net; nonce...@gmail.com; > sosokab...@yahoo.com; yand...@aaatravel.co.za; nf...@pgwc.gov.za > > Nkokheli zam kwane-Afrika ngokubanzi! > > On behalf of the Western Cape Leadership as the host of the 3rd PAC > National Convention you are requested to mobilize all your party > structures in your respective jurisdictions of political work and given a > responsibility to circulate this communiqué to as many Africanist folds as > possible for them to be party of this big PAC event. It is critical that > you engage with your respective branches about what best the party can do > to be realm of the Azanian political stage. > > In PAC, a Convention setting has a history of turning things in favour of > the African masses and enlightens them about the state of their plight. > This is what the PAC first National Convention managed to deliver most as > it changed the nature and character of the then political engagement, > hence the 21 March 1960 and the birth of armed struggle under a PAC > visi
[PAYCO] Re: Fwd:
Izwe Lethu! The struggle of the Jigsaw patern tells us there is nothing wrong with what is happening in the party. The problem is the level at which this is happening. Like a jigsaw our struggle is at a backward stroke and we cannot expect much cutting. What we are doing now is that we are clearing the decks. At the moment the Africanist Movement is conducting a retrospection. The movement is in a self battle to try and find itself and particularly its position in the whole Neo Colonialist settlement. In other words we are clearing the decks. The battle is on and the field of operation is Azania. Azania is slowly but surely approaching the last phase of revolution. People need to know that this stage yields frustration and dispair. All poor little oportunist amongst us will be exposed and only cadres who have and still continue to stand the test of time will remain. Those who are leaving are making our work simple. Being angry at each other and swearing at each other will never change the situation. The truth is we have lost our path. Lets continue searching, at the end we will find the way. Lastly comrades simple solutions will never yield any progress. Izwe Lethu From: Pasika Nontshiza To: "mayekisocommunicati...@gmail.com" Cc: "payco@googlegroups.com" Sent: Tuesday, November 17, 2009 9:15:13 PM Subject: [PAYCO] Re: Fwd: In search of a perfect solution for the masses of Azania,the road will be littered with a lot of contradictions. The confusion in the Africanist family is just but one example. The challenge is not to hurl insults at each other,trying to score cheap political points over nothing. How did you understand Chairman to mean when he exalted,'Let the thousand flowers blossom,let the thousand ideas contend'. Raise the level of debate not personalities. Izwe Lethu. Clarence Mayekiso wrote: > -- Forwarded message -- From: Clarence Mayekiso < mayekisocommunicati...@gmail.com > > Date: Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 1:40 AM Subject: Re: To: "Magajana, Sondisa" < maga...@vwsa.co.za > > Sorry i have been absent due to business commitments, the PAC will never recover no matter what trick they try most people are just opportunists, the so called Pan Africanist Convention will further expose all the opportunists, some amongst the ranks of PAM. > With apologies to Prof. Sobukwe 'No matter what they say their actions will betray them'. As for myself I am no longer a member of the PAC i will not celebrate the destruction of the PAC knowing the sacrifice Zeph Mothopeng, David Sibeko, John Pokela, Robert Sobukwe, Themba Ncapayi, Sabelo Phama and others did for the cause of PAN AFRICANISM. PAM is the future. May the soul of the PAC rest in peace!!! Long Live Pan Africanism!!! > From: Clarence Mayekiso > On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 9:15 PM, Magajana, Sondisa < maga...@vwsa.co.za > wrote: > Warm greetings S.G > > What is your take with regards to the PAC crisis in Cape Town and else where > > Izwe lethu > Volokswagen of South Africa (Pty) Ltd. (Reg No. 1946/023458/07) > Chairman: Dr J Heizmann* Managing Director: D Powels Directors: M Glendinning (Sales & Marketing), S Mund* (Finance), S Macozoma, PJ Smith (Human Resources), N Maliza (Corporate and Government Affairs), T du PLessis (Production) > German* > DISCLAIMER : Volkswagen of South Africa (Pty) Ltd Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender. No liability shall attach whatsoever to VWSA from this communication except > where the sender is acting on specific authority of VWSA, such authority being public record and acknowledged by VWSA by nature of the employee's functions. This document may in no way be photocopied, printed, scanned or > electronically duplicated for any purposes other than that for which it was originally intended. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, please discard this message and notify VWSA immediately at postmas...@vwsa.co.za > VWSA's anonymous toll free ethics number is: 0800 11 53 54 > --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: [PAYCO] Ideology
Thanks comrade for raising this thorny issue in our political mist. I think comrade during the years we have recruited people from different political thoughts. We rallied this people on the principle of aquiring more support for the election purpose. We did not rally this people on the principle of African Nationalism and Pan Africanism Ideas which makes the core of our ideology. That is the first mistake we have made and we should live with it. Time dictates to us this development. Secondly Mo-Afrika I think if people can go back and refere to our founding fathers speeches they will find answers to the issues you are raising. People need to know that Marxism addresses itself to the class struggle where the sociaty is divided in different classes. It does not address the Nationalist struggle or it does so on small scale. As Africans we are fighting a nationalist struggle. First we are oppresed as a Nation and not as a class(ofcouse there are classess within the same oppressed nation with the rise of a black elite class ochestrated by BEE). As to whether we are Marxist or Socialist one need to refere to what African leaders have said: that we remain neutral in all but non that affect the destiny of Afrika. To us Marxism, Lenninsm are tools of analisis to where we derive a solution to African problems. We are neither Marxist nor Socialists. WE ARE PAN AFRICANISTS and we are guided by African Nationalism ideals. WE MUST SEE US AS PAN AFRICANIST BEFORE ANY OTHER THING. AND WE MUST UNDERSTAND PAN AFRICANISM BEFORE WE CLAIM TO BE. WE MAINTAIN THAT PAN AFRICANISM IS SOCIALISTIC IN FORM. TO US PAN AFRICANISM AND SOCIALISM ARE THE SAME. >From Cape to Cairo Morroco to Malagasia not even a settle can claim one inch >of Afrika, IZWE LETHU!!! From: "p...@mailbox.co.za" To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Fri, December 11, 2009 11:23:29 AM Subject: [PAYCO] Ideology Greetings Sons and Daughters Ma-Afrika there's a serious need to look at the IDEOLOGY with a clear cautions and careful. I've try to highlight this to many sometime ago and it is really a serious problem. Many are saying the are "Marxist", "Socialist" we you ask clarity the contradict each other. Some they say aren't Marxist but are Socialist and it become very difficult to continue work with people who are sing different song in one church. The massage we are sending outside is conflicting but all of us we are claiming to be "Pan Africanist". Lte me ask what type of socialism are we are talking about? It has different types. Secondly, the Nationalist are also here, because nationalism is ideology on its own. There having a right to do so cause of African Nationalism. As well as Socialist because of African Socialist Democracy. Let me warn before hand does who say it's one. Nkrumah African Socialism and Nyerere African Socialism is not the same, so when we engage each other we must put it in back of our minds. Thirdly, some of the Socialist differ as some are Stalinist, Trosky, Aunt Rosa, and so forth. I'm raising this after this engagement with M'Afrika Mawande Jack on this forum many comrades they try to engage me outside it and it became clear to me that we need to seat down and this iron out the defferences. So that when we go out to the public we spaek the same language, if not sing the same song in the same page and same hym book. Please Ma-Afrika let discuss this openly and honest and stop say socialism is one cause it not.If you say that you will be like Mavarara asking them about "what is NDR ? their respond is you don't know National Democratic Revolution chief/ mchana. instead of answering you the dodge the question as they can't answer it. Let's engage each other all of us who are in this forum. Irrespective of where you came from nad which angle young or old, green or yellow, male or female no one will kill or beat you. Your servant in an Africanist cause' Lubabalo Popo PAYCO Political Commissar 078 604 6098 p...@mailbox.co.za/ elubab...@gmail.com -- South Africa's premier free email service - www.webmail.co.za -- For super low premiums, click here http://home.webmail.co.za/dd.pwm -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com
Re: [PAYCO] new political spaces
In transforming the PAC into an advanced organisation to occupy the centre stage of political developments in our political epoch we are confronted with arduous tasks and our experience is far from being adequate. SO WE MUST BE PREPARED AND BE GOOD IN LEARNING. Conditions changes all the time, to adopt one’s thinking to the new conditions, one must study. Even those who have a better grasp of Pan Africanism and Socialist revolution and are comparatively firm in their African Nationalist Struggle have to go on studying to absorb what is new and study new problems. We can learn what we did not know. We must not only be good in destroying the old order, we must be good in creating the new one. We must not forget the old but we must embrace the new. We must be able to see or create an opportunity in the new. Now there are two different attitudes towards learning from others. One is a dogmatic attitude of transplanting everything, whether or not is suited to our conditions, the other attitude is to use our heads and learn those things that suit our conditions and absorb whatever experience is useful to us. This is the attitude we should adopt. Theories of Marx, Lenin and Mao should not be regarded as dogma, but as a guide to action. Studying these theories should not be a matter of learning terms and phrases but of learning them as the science of revolution. We must see to it that all our cadres constantly bear in mind that ours is a struggle for a Democratic Socialist Order. Whenever we happen to be we must treasurer our manpower and material resources, and must not take short view or indulge in wasteful petty issues as it might be the case with us concerning the current PAC leadership. If we are not happy with the leadership we must work tirelessly to usurp that leadership. We must bear in mind that we are fighting a protracted warfare that must be maintained. In order to speed up this political restoration and development of PAC into a vibrant party to be reckoned we must do our utmost, in the cause of our struggle. We must destroy and abolition factionalism. We must take resolute measures against anyone who is destroying our movement by sewing and exacerbating the seeds of division. A dangerous tendency has shown itself of late in the PAC among many of our comrades, the unwillingness to share the gains and hardship of the struggling masses. This culminated into a concern by oneself of his personal fame and gains in the expense of the PAC. This is very bad and it has demonstrated that it can destroy the party. Our party is suffering because of our mistakes in dealing with concerns in the organisation. If we are to maintain that we do not recognise the current leadership which continues to be recognise by legal institutions of this country, then we are doomed. At the present this is the only PAC leadership that exist and every one of us who really needs to contribute in the political development of this country should use the PAC under the current leadership as the focal point. We can never make a meaningful contribution as Pan Africanists under PAC if our house is in tatters. We should swallow our pride and do away with our own selfish interests or revenge of whatever and help resuscitate this movement. Only through radical involvement and robust debates in a correct PAC platform will we make our contribution and mark in this political era. As individuals we cannot do much but as PAC we can. By PAC I mean PAC with NEC, PEC, REC, BEC’s and all the components structures. By PAC I do not refer to a certain ‘Pac’ under a tree somewhere in South Africa. If comrades we cannot be true to ourselves we are not able to take our masses anywhere. I wish to make a challenge to every person that we should derive the means to unite all the Pan Africanist Forces by April next. People should stop talking of Unity if they cannot take an initiative. To those who continue to use a foul bourgeoisie charterist language and disrespect other comrades I am saying to them you are synonymous to the enemies of revolution. YOU ARE ANTI PAC. Please all comrades with sensible mind and consciousness and those who do not fear to be labelled and be regarded unpopular and those who does not fear death by thousands cuts help me in fostering Unity in this organisation. I will only consider and entertain contributions by comrades who will never address PAC concern in a traditional vulgar bourgeoisie language. Peace Amongst the Africans and War Against the Enemy Forward to a United PAC From: Mawande Jack To: PAYCO Azania ; payco@googlegroups.com; ttxu...@yahoo.com; chargein...@gmail.com; gilingwe.maye...@mayecon.co.za; sero...@hotmail.com Cc: Tsietsi Sent: Tue, December 15, 2009 9:13:53 AM Subject: [PAYCO] new political spaces Comrades Some disgruntled sections from the ANC-Alliance who had severed links with the ruling party are launching initiatives like the
Re: [PAYCO] Ideology
Majoni! Please let me take this opportunity to further elaborate more on the question of Ideology. The truth is that we have comrades who regard themselves as Marxist within PAC. Unfortunately this comrades in their study of Marxism they somehow missed Marxism on the question of a National Struggle. If I may qoute Marxist cannot be envolved with theoritically upholding Internationalism that they dismiss their own Nation's concrete National Liberation Struggle. If that happens that would be a caricature of Marxism. Mao referes to those people as people who want to liquidate the National question.Nationalism means exclusivism and isolation. African Nationalism means and is for equality not superiority. As Africans we are the vivtims of Nationalism that preaches superiority and inferiority. The masses of Africa wants national equality, democratic rights for their nationality equal with all other nations. Buorgeois Nationalism( ochestrated by ANC,SACP and BEE) isolates the oppresed masses from their mass allies and delivers them into the hands of the exploiters and reactionaries of their own nationality. The succesful National Liberation Movement unless is let by the working class, it will only defeat foreighn domination, it does not eliminate class exploitation.This is the case with ANC. We have seen liberation Movements defeat foreighn domination only to become Neo-Colonial states governed by a domestic buorgeousie who are absolutely in collaboration with the Ex-rulers(former colonialists). Investment under Neo-Colonialism increases rather than decrease the gap between the rich and the poor. Neo-colonialism is the worst form of imerialism, those who practice it (neo-colonialism) means power without responsibility and for those who suffer from it means exploitation without redress. Comrades who raise or partake in the debates of this issues need to consult. Unless you understand PAC and PAN AFRICANISM one will always find it difficult to understand and deal with this contradictions. Our words and actions should help to unite and not to devide PAC. They should be beneficial and not harmful to PAC unity and Africanist Socialist construction.Our words and actions should help to consolidate and not to undermine or weaken our democratic centralism. Our words and actions should help to strengthen and not to discard or weaken the leadership of the PAC. The method of handling contradictions among PAC cadreship should be by the democratic method. The method of discussion, of critisism, of persuation and education and not by the method of coercion or repression. Innevitably the enemies of PAC will give expression to their own ideologies. They will stubbonly express themselves on political and ideological question by every means. We should not use the method of repression and prevent them from expressing themselves, we should allow them to do so and at the same time argue with them and direct apropriete criticism to them. We must undoubtedly criticise wrong ideas of every description. It certainly would not be right to refrain from criticism, we cannot look and say nothing as wrong ideas spread unchecked and allow them to monopolize the situation. Unfortunately we did so. Mistakes must be criticised and poisonous weeds fought wherever they crop up. Such criticism should not be dogmatic. What is needed is scientific analysis and convincing arguments. To criticise comrades short comings is necessary. in doing so we must truly take the stand of the Pan Africanists and speak out whole-heartedly with eagerness to protect and educate them. TREATING COMRADES LIKE ENEMIES IS TO GO OVER THE STAND OF THE ENEMY. Some comrades in the PAC have become arrogant and high-handed in their behavior towards other comrades. They always blame other comrades but never themselves.They always see their own achievement but never their own short comings. this comrades assert to the notion of "idipendence" usually wedded to the doctrine of "me first" and are generally wrong on the question of the relationship between the individual and the PAC. Though in words they profess respect for the PAC in practice they put themselves first and the PAC second. This comrades are after fame and position and want to be in the limelight. When they are put in charge they assert their "indipendence" with this aim they draw some comrades in, push others out and they resort to boasting and touting among the comrades importing their valgur style of the bourgeois political parties like ANC into PAC. It is their dishonesty that causes their grief. I believe we should do things honestly for without an honest attitude it is absolutely impossible to accomplish anything in this world. COMRADES LETS WORK TIRELESLY TO PREVENT THE PAC GAINS IN THE STRUGGLE FOR A SOCIALIST DEMOCRATIC AZANIA AND AFRIKA. Forward to a socialist revolution.tomorrow a United Monolithic Giant Socialist Afrika!!! Izwe Lethu
Re: [PAYCO] ja...@avusa.co.za has shared something with you
To All I just want to congradulate comrade ja...@avusa.co.za for posting such a thoughtful material in our political mist and confusion as to what is needed to refocus our socialist struggle. I think many of us shy away to say the least about what is necessary for our revolution. Comrades we are posting so many materials in this network but we continue to fail to produce a program by which we will enable our revolution to take its couse. Unfotunately the political forces and powers that may be are denying us a chance to share and contribute our thoughts in the political shaping of our revolution. We no longer hold national conferences. Whenever we gather we discuss and are only interest and concern about leadership posts and who is leading our organisation. This creates a political vacuum in our organisation. I will prefare comrades to be honest and voice out their thoughts as opposed to just posting a material for comrades to draw their own conclusion. If we continue like this we are only delaying our revolution. Please be open on your thoughts comrades. We cannot afford to delay our revolution any further. By any means necessary forward to Africa Socialist Indipendence forward!!! From: "ja...@avusa.co.za" To: payco@googlegroups.com; p...@mailbox.co.za Sent: Mon, January 4, 2010 4:45:25 PM Subject: [PAYCO] ja...@avusa.co.za has shared something with you something to provoke our thoughts http://uhurunews.com/story?resource_name=african-socialist-international-versus-pan-africanist-congress --- This message was sent by ja...@avusa.co.zavia http://addthis.com. Please note that AddThis does not verify email addresses. Make sharing easier with the AddThis Toolbar: http://www.addthis.com/go/toolbar-em -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com
Re: [PAYCO] Re: Land Invasion at Metsweding Region
Izwe Lethu!! From: SOSO MASHILOANE To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, January 13, 2010 2:50:45 PM Subject: Re: [PAYCO] Re: Land Invasion at Metsweding Region > >Kindly receive my heartfelt greetings Ma-afrika > >The community of metsweding has embark on land invasion programme in a >protest to redress the imbalances created by ruling party over fifteen years >without proper service delivery particularly the backlog of housing.On >saturday the 09/01/2010 morning(05h:30) the community of Ekangala and Refilwe >mobilise each other to share equitably what was stolen to them by >Aparteid government later ANC provincial governments Gauteng & Mpumalanga when >they failed to resolve the issue of land transfer to municipalities during a >cross border dermacations. What sparked the revolutions is that Land is >not available to the community whenever they inquire about it but few church >leaders and business people continue to develop their respective >businesses without any concerned from municipality. > >When the police came to intervene, angry community members protested that they >want proper housing for their family members and they won`t relocate anywhere >untill their needs has been met. > >therefore Ma Afrika I`m appealing to you that we should join hands with the >community of metsweding in execution and sustainability of these programme. >Since it falls within the scope of our ideology we would need your guidance >to drive it politically and safe guards the interest of the community. > >Bear in mind that with or without us the masses will find the way and if >revolutionary leaders are not there opportunist would emerge and mislead our >revolutions. Its time to restore our pride as Pan Africanist and its only >through such relevant programme of actions > >Izwe Lethu > >Soso >076 363 > > -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com
Re: [PAYCO]
Majoni! Homosexuality is nonsense. We can live with those people but cannot legislate their nonsense. If all serial killers likes and enjoy killing I think to some that will be their democratic right. We can live with serial killers but cannot legislate their right of killing. So majoni stop this democratic nonsense and be realistic. We cannot condone homosexuality. Payco comrades who are ANC in their thinking must live PAC not later than yesterday. I share Mugabe's view on homosexuality "They are worse than dogs" Izwe Lethu! From: Thembeka Majali To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Sat, January 30, 2010 2:21:56 PM Subject: Re: [PAYCO] Do not impose your views on others and be selective in your definition of an african and those are your views not that of the PAC. Its heartening to hear such individuals rejecting other fellow africanists because of their sexual orientation weather you like it or not there are homesexuals inside the PAC and live with that reality. Furthermore to your utter rubish PAC signed that liberal rights based SA Constitution that you are referring to including your member of Parliament, is darking and dancing with that charterists constitution. Politically and Strategicallyso, you can amend the countries constitution once you take political and economic power but as long as you are a handful of members your views are just a dream if you are serious about the growth of your membership. Remember PAC's aim is to rally and Unite the africans. Many of you sometimes who are now homophobic were once homosexuals or have slept with other men but no one wants to interfere with anyones private life or sexual orientation. Its fallacious to think that homesexuality has western origins, its roots can also be traced in africa particularly among traditional healers perhaps you could do your own research about it. You are unfair to those african men and women who have given birth to those children whose sexual orientation is different from yours. Weather you like it or not they will remain as members of the PAC and wont be threatened by such utterances. There are many youthful issues that you should be responding to not boast about your immature intellectual disorientation. On Sat, Jan 30, 2010 at 1:44 PM, Thembeka Majali wrote: > > >On Thu, Jan 28, 2010 at 3:15 PM, khuliso emmanuel wrote: > >I agree with Mo-Africa Pitso Mphasha. First President of PACYL >> >> >>Vhahashu Ma-afrika, homosexuality and lesbianism should be rejected and >>condemned as they are regarded as totally unacceptable to cultural norms and >>values of African society," those who wants to be Africans, they should >>refrain from evil deeds. If PAYCO comrades want to align themselves with the >>constitution of these chaterists, they should do so. But PAC Youth League is >>saying "gay rights are immoral. It's right in the bible" and anybody who will >>be against the PAC Youth League voice will lebelled sellout. >> >>I remain noble son >>Khuliso >> >>--- On Thu, 1/28/10, Thembeka Majali wrote: >> >> >>>From: Thembeka Majali >>Subject: Re: [PAYCO] >>>To: payco@googlegroups.com >>>Date: Thursday, January 28, 2010, 11:35 AM >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>Or maybe ask why did we have Azanian Peoples Revolutionary Party a breakaway >>>group from PAC in exile? >>> >>> >>> >>>On Thu, Jan 28, 2010 at 11:32 AM, Thembeka Majali >>> wrote: >>> >>>M'afrika what you are asking could be a similar question to why do we have >>>some faction calling themselves Youth League or Women's League. Is it about >>>branding or moving with fashion times? PAYCO I hope you could issue a statement to the Human Rights Commission, dismiss those charges against you and publicly distance yourselves from the League's confussion. Read todays SOWETAN. On Wed, Jan 27, 2010 at 11:31 AM, Mothibe, Lucas wrote: Izwe lethu > >Maafrica I need clarity in the following: Are we Comrades or Africanist ? >>>Comrade is the term that was used by soviets (Marxists and Leninists) when >>>greeting each other during those days. >>> >>>Are we socialist or communist ? >>> >>>Are we for a National Democratic Revolution(NDR) or African Nationalism? >>> >>>If NDR ,what is the difference between us and SACP. >>> >>> >>>Regards >>>Lucas Mothibe >>> >>>From:payco@googlegroups.com [mailto:pa...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of >>>Mawande Jack >>>Sent: 19 January 2010 05:24 PM >>>To: payco@googlegroups.com; PAYCO Azania >>>Subject: [PAYCO] >>> >>> >>>Haiti-A Call For Global Action >>>by Randall Robinson >>>January 07, 2004 >>> >>>Part I >>>January 1, 1804 – January 1, 2004: >>>This day is sacred. >>> >>>It is the 200th anniversary of the Haitian Revolution. >>> >>>Fought by Haitians. >>> >>>Won for us all. >>> >>>Between 1791 and 1804, hundreds of thousands of Africans enslaved in Haiti
[PAYCO] Sobukwe Memorial Lecture Speech
THE PAN AFRICANIST CONGRESS OF AZANIA SOBUKWE MEMORIAL LECTURE AN INPUT BY THE AFRICANIST DUDU DERRICK BILA (APLA MILITARY VETERAN OF THE LIBERATION STRUGGLE) Mister program director, the honourable President of the Pan Africanist Congress of Azania (Mr. Letlapa Mphahlele), the former president of the PAC of Azania (Bishop Mmutlanyana Stanley Mogoba), senior members of the PAC of Azania, distinguished guests, members of the PAC of Azania, ladies and gentlemen, I greet you all. Izwelethu!! I-Africa Mister program director, beloved sons and daughters of Africa, we are today gathered together on a great occasion: THE SOBUKWE MEMORIAL LECTURE. We are meeting at a time when the global economic downturn has had adverse effects on the economies of the countries of the world, African states included. Indeed we are meeting at a time when global warming is aggravating this unfavourable economic climate in the entire world, whilst, the results of Copenhagen indaba are not quite encouraging. During such trying times for Africa and the world as a whole, nothing could have been more appreciating than to hold this occasion, in honour of the man of the calibre of Robert Managliso Sobukwe; a world class political scientist, who was an asset for Africa and the world as a whole. In so far as Africa is concerned, he is one of the African leaders who prescribed the idea of Pan Africanism as a solution to the problems facing the African continent and the African people. To the world, he called upon the nations of the world to discover the shortest distance between man and man, as the honest way to ensure world peace. In his inaugural address at the official launching of the Pan Africanist Congress, he preached to the world to accept the idea of the existence of only one race: The human race. He was eloquent on the fact that the PAC of Azania does not recognize any of the so called inescapable fundamental differences amongst members of the even the three main branches of the human race: the Caucasoids, Mongoloids and Afrinoids. He did not subscribe to the theory that there are inherent mental, emotional and psychological differences among members of the different branches of the human race. He contended the granting of the “rights” on the basis of the ethnological origin was actually the entrenching of sectional arrogance of the contempt for human worth and disregarded for human dignity. He maintained that these were mere efforts to perpetuate the monster of white domination, which comfortably tests on the three pillars of; Merciless political oppression of the African people by the colonists and imperialists Ruthless economic exploitation of the African people by the colonialists and imperialist and Inhuman social degradation of the African people by colonialist and imperialists Unfortunately, his warning both to the African leaders and the world leaders fell on deaf ears. Consequently, in Africa, the land of plenty, we have endless tribal and sectional wars; and in the world arena we are stuck by the absence of the world peace. Mister program director, one of the greatest political scientists the world has ever known and a protagonist of Pan Africanism once said, and I quote “Here is a tree rooted in African soil, nourished with waters from rivers of Africa. Come and sit with us under its shade and become with us, the leaves of the same branches and branches of the same tree.” I close the quote. These words are the brainchild of Prof Robert Mangaliso Sobukwe, the founding president of the Pan Africanist Congress of Azania. From this quotation, it is quite evident that, the tree is not alien tree but an indigenous one. In this tree we see life, harmony, dynamism and benefit. As we continue drinking from this well of knowledge, Robert Mangaliso Sobukwe also said and I quote “The struggle in South Africa is part of the greater struggle throughout the continent for the restoration to the African people of the effective control of this land. The ultimate goal of our struggle therefore, is the formation of the United States of Africa” I close quote Mister program director, beloved sons and daughters of Africa, as I proceed with the unfolding of this topic, it will be evident that the above two quotations neatly sum up the ideology of Pan Africanism. Mister program director, we live in a world and during times of power and power politics. In a world such as this, there is absolutely no room and no meaningful or bright future for small splinter states. This is the world of the survival of the fittest. Our history serves as a testimony to this stubborn fact. One only has to refer to the past historical events, especially the petition of Africa, when mother Africa was ruthlessly sliced like a lemon by the merciless imperialists and colonialists. Those political vultures share their spoils. Countries which participated shamelessly in robbing the African people of their land in
Re: [PAYCO] a charade of betrayal
I agree with you 101%. One Apla cadre onced told me just after the 1994 election that we only give ANC twenty years and people will realise what kind of an enimal ANC is.I just hope and wish that as PAC we put our house in order or we just rest our difference now and focus more in educating our massess an explain all this development which are not new to us for we have been anticipating them since our break away from the charterists. Lets carry forward where the Status Campaign could not. Apla sticks to its guns no matter what we are ready. Viva PAC Viva APLA From: Snow Mokgalabone To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, March 9, 2010 12:15:15 PM Subject: Re: [PAYCO] a charade of betrayal Well it has been a long time waiting to hear or read this kinds of comments from the same people who claim liberation. I can boldly say that, all this issues of corruption, mismanagement, malema's, vavi's and the alliance in particular are as a results of the negotiated package that gave birth to the rainbow nation. I am just emotionally touched that still today a liberation movement by the name of PAC cannot elaborate this matters to its own masses rather we have the same people who are angry about their own system to re-occupy the center stage the party was supposed to be. It is well known fact that our disgruntlement cannot be singled out from organisational crisis which might be a cooked anticipation like our democracy. I am smelling a civil war within the ruling party and the alliance immediately after the FIFA world cup, and then it will be cascaded down to civil societies. My reasons are as follows: * the continuing service delivery protests as a result of greed by Government officials * infighting of economic resources by the ruling party echelons * the upcoming NGC of ANC to vilify each other or remove certain individuals from offices of power and authority * the increase in electricity price which will eventually leads to increase in basic food and other amenities The civil war I am referring to, will be funded by the same comrades who are currently funded by other institutes to cause chaos, once chaos is caused, a new interim administration will be installed by the same people to continue serving their interests in a diverse format. Our people will be excited of a regime change but with no tangible economic changes at heart but with few economic indicators to make ourselves patient for another 20 years. While all this is taking place, HIV/AIDS will be rive, the government officials not serving the people anymore but chowing each other through polotiking as usual. There is just a PAC that is needed to address all this things.look at what is taking place in other countries here in AFRIKA the same things I attempted to allude to. Thanks On Tue, Mar 9, 2010 at 10:49 AM, Mawande Jack wrote: > > > > > > > > Mandela let us down, says Winnie >March 09 2010 at 07:32AM Get IOL on your >mobile at > m.iol.co.za > > >By Colin Fernandez > >Nelson Mandela has been > accused by his former wife of betraying South Africa's black > population. > >In a savage attack, Winnie Mandela said he had done > nothing for the poor and should not have accepted the Nobel peace prize > with the man who jailed him, FW de Klerk. > >The 73-year-old said her > ex-husband had become a "corporate foundation" who was "wheeled out" > only > to raise money for the ANC party he once led. > >She said Archbishop > Desmond Tutu was a "cretin" and claimed the sacrifices of Steve Biko and > others in the fight against apartheid were being overlooked. > >The > comments were apparently made in an interview on Monday with Nadira > Naipaul, the wife of novelist V S Naipaul. > >Mrs Mandela became notorious in 1991 when she was > jailed for six years for the kidnap of Stompie Moeketsi - a sentence > later > cut to a fine. > >Stompie, 14, had been murdered three years earlier > by members of Mrs Mandela's bodyguard, the Mandela United Football > Club. > >She also caused outrage by endorsing the punishment of > apartheid collaborators with "necklacing" - putting burning tyres around > their necks. > >On Monday she said: "This name Mandela is an albatross > around the necks of my family. > >"You all must realise that Mandela > was not the only man who suffered. There were many others, hundreds who > languished in prison and died. > >"Mandela did go to prison and he > went in there as a young revolutionary but look what came > out. > >"Mandela let us down. He agreed to a bad deal for the blacks. > Economically we are still on the outside. The economy is very much > 'white'. > >"I cannot forgive him for going to receive the Nobel with > his jailer De Klerk. Hand in hand they went. Do you think De Kler
Re: [PAYCO] *sigh*
Majoni!! Forces if we are realistic it should be known by every PAC member that revolution does not come easy. This is because PAC is a revolutionary movement which strives for total liberation and not for constitunal rights as the ANC was. We are therefore confronted with a huge task of having to defeat all the emperialist countries that have something to benefit in this country. So all the capitalists and underdogs like the malemas will do much to bury and discredit the PAC. PAC alone remain a biggest thread to empirialism in this country. PAC therefore should visit time and again Maoist revolutionary teachings. At this moment let us embrace our demise and wait for the Azanian massess to be ready for revolution.We know that elections in this capitalist set up will never deliver us to our goal. Not in this era. So comrades we are fighting a protacted warfare. A revolution in our lifetime. So lets not wory about micky mouse politics and continue to teach our people true politics and mobilise them based on our aims and objectives of our revolutionary struggle. We must not despair. Time will tell Izwe lethu!! From: Lucky Khoza To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Mon, March 29, 2010 8:31:40 AM Subject: Re: [PAYCO] *sigh* As much as I agree with you that Careerism, factionalism, parliament causes a lot of problems in the party,but I reject the idea off closing shop. This statement can only be uttered by the enemies of the PAC. As they did year in and year out, even those who claim to be the party's leaders. The party still has the capable leaders in all structures,but the PAC has no leadership and cadre development strategy. Party members lack ideological cohesion which affects its leadership hence we find ourselves in this situation of careerism, factionalism, parliament and etcs. Remember you are in a party without a national Programme of action that would unite party structures and leaders to a common goal and of cause that common goal is not anywhere near careerism or parliament. Lastly we lack a national leader with a vision and ideologically grounded who can marshall all party members towards a common goal and those are the aims and objectives adopted on the formation of the party. We are a party with a rich history and the only party with viable policies for Africans in Africa. In this time of our struggle we need all Africanist to come together so that we can be able to defeat neo-colonialism, it's not time to call it a day now. The PAC has got a lot to offer to the country, the continent and the globe at large. Courage MaAfrika Izwe Lethu!!! Lucky Khoza PAYCO SG On 3/28/10, Katlego Mphomane wrote: > I am of an opinion that the PAC fold its flag and put it in the > museum. The PAC is good as dead, Ma'Afrika all of us are raping the > memories of all MARTYRS that this org produced in its glory > days.Careerism,factinalism,paliarment etc. has killed the PAC. > > -- > Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com > > Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com > > You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco > > Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > payco+unsubscribegooglegroups.com or reply to this email with the words > "REMOVE ME" as the subject. > -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to payco+unsubscribegooglegroups.com or reply to this email with the words "REMOVE ME" as the subject. -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to payco+unsubscribegooglegroups.com or reply to this email with the words "REMOVE ME" as the subject.
Re: [PAYCO] RE:
Mo Afrika Lesufi your atterances are the ones which perpertuate the demise of this movement. You must stop to refere to any of PAC comrades as lumpens or whatever. We are part of those comrades and we remain true to this movement. You are only pointing one finger to others forgeting the rest of your fingers are pointing at you. So we are all PAC comrades and we respect the decision of other comrades who still share the Sobukwe dream. Payco alone cannot rectify the problems within this movement. All of us are very much responsible in resusitating this organisation. Don't further cause disunity in this movement. We are tired of people like you who continues to further devide this movement. Be true to yourself and the rest of African massess and provide a harmonias solution to their demise. Don't boast about the legitimacy of Payco. Provide us with a working progamme that will unite this movement. We do not want Payco to end up like we did as Azanyu Revolutionary watchdogs. Comrades need to be very sensitive about the problems in this organisation. We all have a share in our movement demise. We therefore has a duty to perform in irradicating this demise. Izwe Lethu! From: Leaganoshi Lesufi To: payco@googlegroups.com; Cunningham Ngcukana ; Yandisa Ngcuka ; just...@lebea.co.za; sero...@hotmail.com; mophol...@yahoo.co.uk; Lulamile Ntonzima ; nkru...@lantic.net; thembeka.maj...@gmail.com; crosby.njwab...@webmail.co.za; Loyiso Mfuku ; Tulani Pike ; sndam...@pac-cape.org.za Sent: Tue, March 30, 2010 10:14:08 AM Subject: RE: [PAYCO] RE: M'Akrika Mduduzi & Fellow Africanists, I share your sentiments we all long for normality within the PAC, nevertheless, the reality currently is that we are in the state of anarchy without a legitimate leadership. Things are in an unpleasant state such that when we go to conferences we do not even have time for PLENARY so as to generate consensus on leadership and other businesses of meetings of this nature. Currently PAYCO boasts to be the only component structure of PAC that is unified along a POA in IOTA (Ideologize, Organize for Take-over) except for the lumpens who call themselves pac youth league. The formation of the league did not come about as a result of you differences, however, due to fcational interest of the Letlapa camp with unPAC constitution adopted at the Alice. Hence, we call all Africanist to rally behind PAYCO to rescue PAC from the destructors and political thieves. We will be creating a platform members to ca be able to be members in good standing, perhaps in the form of a Judicially Administrated PAC Bank Account so that we can all renew our membership. We are expolring every avenue. We need everybody on board. In the meantime you may want to suuport us financially as well, particularly for the maintainance of the PAYCO Website and PAYCO-Mayihlome News Services. Attached please find our Bank Details. Please lets use name & surname as reference. As promised before on request we will make available Financial Reports on all the contributions we receive especially to those who continue to support the cause. Izwe Lethu I Afrika, Lest We Forget! Leaganoshi Lesufi PAYCO Treasurer General --- On Tue, 3/30/10, Mduduzi Sibeko wrote: >From: Mduduzi Sibeko >Subject: RE: [PAYCO] RE: >To: payco@googlegroups.com, "Cunningham Ngcukana" >, "Yandisa Ngcuka" >, just...@lebea.co.za, sero...@hotmail.com, >mophol...@yahoo.co.uk, "Lulamile Ntonzima" , >nkru...@lantic.net, thembeka.maj...@gmail.com, crosby.njwab...@webmail.co.za, >"Loyiso Mfuku" , "Tulani Pike" >, sndam...@pac-cape.org.za >Date: Tuesday, March 30, 2010, 10:14 AM > > > > >Looking at these sentiments it very sad to observe that the PAC will always >suffer from internal scuffles. When I was a young PASO and AZANYU in the >early nineties I picked up a paper from the ground dropped deliberately or not >I m uncertain. But, it had this caption “ has Sobukwe dream turned into >rivalry or infighting ?”. my point is that after the demise of uncle Zeph no >leader in the PAC has enjoyed a plenary support within the file and rank >members of the organization. From Makwethu up to now, we are still suffering >from failing to elect leaders that we support or perhaps we support them and >withdraw our support latter. I am saying this as I have observed that there is >a lot of attacks taking place within the PAYCO itself. When will we elect >leaders that will enjoy a plenary support from the organization ? > >Mduduzi Sibeko >011 724 9298 >071-101-2595 >msib...@randwater.co.za > >From:payco@googlegroups.com [mailto:pa...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of >Mahlangu, Congress >Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 4:34 PM >To: Cunningham Ngcukana; Yandisa Ngcuka; just...@lebea.co.za; >sero...@hotmail.com; mophol...@yahoo.co.uk; Lulamile Ntonzima; >nkru...@lantic.net; thembeka.maj...@gmail.com; crosby.njwab...@webmail.co.za; >Loy
[PAYCO]
Comrades I think it is clear now to everyone of us to conclude that we commited a biggest mistake by participating in the negotiations that we knew will never deliver a true freedom to our people. PAC leaders then under President Makwetu conspired to accept what the settler regime was offering and inturn they forced it down our throughts with a notion of a constituent assembly so that we accept this negotiations. Also the front line states under the leadership of President Mugabe made it sure that we as PAC accept this crump. This has now brought a nightmare to the party and will take a momentous task to deal with it. Like one comrade who said we have now became revolutionary lumpens. We are only using PAC basic documents to suit and push for our personal agendas. It might not be every one of us but we do. We should just take a bolt stand and re-adopt the 1959 Manifesto and constitution. All other adoptions should follow from the 1959 Manifesto. In that way we will be really talking about going back to basics. Comrade I think you are raising thorny issues that will see PAC taking a revolutionary path that is. Unfortunately we continue to waste time by talking while things continue to fall apart. At this juncture PAC members and Pan Africanists in general should strive for a national gathering that will usher in the drawing of a programme of action. In that gathering we should disband all the current committees,be it PAC,Payco,PACYL,AWO,Pawo,Aplamva,Aplava,Paso and Palf. The program will then guide us as to what kind of leadership we should have and how is this leadership going to be elected. In this way we will deal with careerism within the party and will truelly see resurection of this organisation. Our politics are still relavant only our deeds are wrong. This is the least I can say. I know comrades will come forwadely with a clear program which will provide us with a clear strategy to resurect this movement and not see us breeding and grooming other lumpens. Please comrade Cunningham, Mawandi and others work towards creating a program that will save this movement. We can't wait any longer. With this song "a si yenzi luthu ngomlomo" Izwe Lethu -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com To unsubscribe, reply using "remove me" as the subject.
Re: [PAYCO]
Comrade Mduduzi There was one comrade I knew who had a book on David Sibeko about his involvement in the UN. It was a green book with the face of David Sibeko. I happen to see this book arround 1990-1993. unfortunately the comrade passed away arround 2007/8 and was then a member of DA. His name was Makopo in Lebowakgomo Township Limpopo. His children are staying at Vosloorus. Comrades like Kingdom at Lebowakgomo/Mahwelereng should know the where abouts of this meterial as there was a huge collection of other PAC external mission materials at the hands of this comrade. Izwe Lethu! From: Mduduzi Sibeko To: Cunningham Ngcukana ; payco@googlegroups.com; k...@executivemail.co.za Sent: Wed, April 14, 2010 4:26:12 PM Subject: [PAYCO] Hi Cunningham: By a chance I was watching a documentary on DSTV, I can’t remember which channel it was. But the discussion there at the UN Headquarters centered around the Cuban Missile crisis of the early seventies. Acute hostilities between the US including its allies and the soviet including its empire or rather satellite States. David Sibeko, appeared on the UN video clip and his address which lasted about seven munities or more was very illuminating and refreshing. This unsung hero of the Azanian struggle contribution has fallen in to oblivion. Has anyone ever undertaken to take the spade and dig what lies beneath the history of this gallant fighter ? Mduduzi Sibeko 011 724 9298 071-101-2595 msib...@randwater.co.za The information contained in this message and or attachments is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any system and destroy any copies. -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com To unsubscribe, reply using "remove me" as the subject.
Re: [PAYCO] RE:
Majoni! Comrade I remain puzzled by our inability to come up with a lasting solution to our party demise. We continuasly refer to the programme that will address our demise. Can't we draw that programme and paste it here for further discusion and perusal? It is so sad that a party which habours such great thinking tanks who understand the dynamics of a revolution can fail to address and come with implimentable solution to our demise. Majoni we are no longer wasting time infact we are driving all the remaining Pan Africanists remnants within the party to its early grave. I truely sympathise with the comrades who were forced by circumstances to leave this party and found themself in the hands of charterists bouegeousies. We have heard what you have to say. Can you provide us with a wayforward to address our demise. Inkulumo yeno is now deafening our ears. Azanians are waiting impatiantly for the lasting solution to their revolution that went apace. we can work within the community and do well but will always be identified with PAC a "FLAT TYRE". At this moment every PAC member should draft a silmple one or two page discusion document to outline the wayforward. Izwe Labo!!( Macherter)!! Sorry Majoni!! Izwe Lethu!! From: Mduduzi Sibeko To: Cunningham Ngcukana ; payco@googlegroups.com; Mawande Jack ; sero...@hotmail.com; Khaliphile Sizani ; Loyiso Mfuku ; Yandisa Ngcuka ; loymcit...@webmail.co.za; just...@lebea.co.za; kwamendeb...@webmail.co.za; Lulamile Ntonzima ; Simphiwe Nofuma ; crosby.njwab...@webmail.co.za Sent: Mon, May 3, 2010 2:33:20 PM Subject: [PAYCO] RE: Hi Cunningham I t I recall some years in one of our congress your car tires were pricked, Patric Baleka was very angry with that. Who was involved in that ? were you at odds with those that did this ? Do you remember Baleka. What happened to him , I heard that he Joined COPE. From:Cunningham Ngcukana [mailto:cunningham.ngcuk...@investecmail.com] Sent: Monday, May 03, 2010 12:20 PM To: Mduduzi Sibeko; payco@googlegroups.com; Mawande Jack; sero...@hotmail.com; Khaliphile Sizani; Loyiso Mfuku; Yandisa Ngcuka; loymcit...@webmail.co.za; just...@lebea.co.za; kwamendeb...@webmail.co.za; Lulamile Ntonzima; Simphiwe Nofuma; crosby.njwab...@webmail.co.za Subject: RE: Hi Mduduzi I was part of the first meetings leading to the Convention and Thohoyandou. The meetings were held at SACWU with Sthembele Khala; Mudini Maivha; myself and many comrades. We debated the issue of leadership and Mogoba. I rasised a critical concern that without policies; strategies and tactics I has a problem of focussing on individuals. I raised the issue of Mogoba as a person who was outside the party mainstream and not aware of dynamics. I raised the issue of Muendane’s history in the party in Robben Island and the external mission. The refrain was that Uncle Zeph had asked everybody to return back to the party. I raised the concern of Muendane’s inability to submit himself to leadership by any person and such a character as a danger. Cde Jaki Seroke would remember these numerous meetings. The other concern was that the process was driven by Gauteng based comrades without input from key bases of the party like the Western Cape and the former Transkei and I feared a backlash from structures and cadres whom I had worked with. As a result I neither attended the Convention nor Thohoyandou Conference as I did not want to participate in a flawed process that was looking for a Messiah. Mogoba I subsequently met with the leaders of the labour movement and underground comrades. He promised consultation and an advisory structure like a politburo and he disappeared after that. Muendane attempted a process of policy development with a chosen coterie of people and wanted to jettison socialism from the PAC political and ideological approach. Mogoba was chased by lumpens in Cape Town who were a Makwethu faction and Muendane effected revenge to those he had a score to settle. Mogoba was a priest not a political animal even Dandala was better. He roped in Mayende who has no clue of economics and who wrote paraffin called the land policy of the PAC a similar thing Sipho Shabalala wrote As an economic policy of PAC without any economic bearing or understanding. The PAC was so far removed from the grass roots structures and was run in a corporatist manner. This allowed a revolt that carried Pheko into the leadership by branches with populism without substance. Kind Regards Cunningham Ngcukana From:Mduduzi Sibeko [mailto:msib...@randwater.co.za] Sent: 03 May 2010 11:05 To: Cunningham Ngcukana; payco@googlegroups.com; Mawande Jack; sero...@hotmail.com; Khaliphile Sizani; Loyiso Mfuku; Yandisa Ngcuka; loymcit...@webmail.co.za; just...@lebea.co.za; kwamendeb...@webmail.co.za; Lulamile Ntonzima; Simphiwe Nofuma; crosby.njwab...@webmail.co.za Subject: RE: There was euphoria when Mokgoba took the helm of the PAC. It was
Re: [PAYCO] Fwd: Raymond Nkrumah Kgagudi wrote on your Wall...
Mo Afrika Tladi In the interest of UNITY WITHIN THE PAC the PAN AFRICANIST MOVEMENT in general I do not expect you to answer to this comrade in the maner you did. You sound very much an angry person. Unfortunately your anger is misdirected. You are the spokes person of PAYCO and in the name of PAC. I need to remind you that PAYCO is synonimus to PAC. So PAC comrades in whatever fuction within PAC will always find a way to contribute in whatever matter associated with PAC. Comrades will never remain mute in matters that concern and affect PAC. People who contribute here are not neccesarly PAYCO members, but they remain Pan Africanists in their chosen sphere. At the moment PAC is on a retrospective stance and whatever contribution by comrades will be more appreciated than your anger. Comrade we are seeking a way for unity of interest in the PAC and you instead chose to disunite the comrades. You are breaking one principle of Pan Africanism that is TO UNITE AND RALLY AFRICAN PEOPLE UNDER THE REVOLUTIONARY IDEA OF AFRICAN NATIONALISM. Comrade you don't need my lacture you should know this. All I am cautioning here is a thorny issue of disunity in our movement and cannot tolerate comrades who continue to sore and nurish the seed of disunity in this SOBUKWE SHIP. UNITY IN OUR LIFETIME!!! From: sello mafrika Tladi To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 2:38:47 PM Subject: Re: [PAYCO] Fwd: Raymond Nkrumah Kgagudi wrote on your Wall... Which capacities are you giving this advise to PAYCO both of you as PAC supporters or sympathisers.Last time we spoke to Raymond myself and PAYCO President he told us that he does not want to be associated with PAC youth wing PAYCO.How is DSM? Mabaso I hope you are not lost this PAYCO FORUM not of that ghost you formed with Thami.I refuse to call it with the name of revolutionary movement that was formed to defend revolution in occupied Azania. You used to be useful in the PAC but not today. counter revolutionaries will never chat a revolutionary way forward On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 2:14 PM, Chargein Mabaso wrote: I agree with Nrumah. As Pan Africanists we have correct political line and ideology. Problem: rhetoric and vulgarizaton of Pan Africanism. Our main rival, the ruling party, mastered what Pan Africaists are very weak at doing: understanding and practicing political hegemony and the notion of "From the masses, to the masses..."(mass line). You may call it Stalinism, but it works. That's what kept and still keeps the ANC and other political parties in power. That's , political influence and control of the thinking of the whole society at large(workers, peasants, business people, professionals, academcs, clerics and atheists, cerebrities, sports people, pensioners, women, youth,students, etc). These are all the people who will either take us to or remove us from power depending on who has won their hearts and minds, not our members. If not, South Africa will be under the minority rule of a group of terrorists who can sieze power only through force of arms, not through international accepted democratic practices (popular votes). > >Cunningham and other Pan Africanists in NACTU owes us an explanation for their >faiulre to do what is expected of them, just like Vavi and other trade union >leaders. MDC is today a serious threat in Zimbabwe with its pro-West ideas >because of unions under its apron strings. What is different between NACTU >and other trade unions in the whole world? > >I still believe with the full support of influential unions and other >formations of the civil society we can rule this country from tommorrow >onward. I have not doubts. Let's just address address all our failures and >weaknesses. And then go t the voters. Door-to-door campaign is what we >inherited from Sobukwe and his cabinet. Arm-chair politics will continue >keeping Pan Africanists out of power in South Afica. > >PAYCO group must be used only to refine our ideoogy; to iron out ideological >strggles, not for rhetorics and complaining about ANC outperforming us in the >election game. We must answer challenges facing the movement, such as : > * Pan Africanism wthout Pan Africanists > * Africanist Socalist Democracy v.s New Democracy in SA > * United States of Africa or Unified Socialist Africa > * United States of Africa without socalist States or socialists > * Pan Afrcanism: Capitalism or Socialism? > * Private planned or State planned economy > * Malema's nationalisation : Capitalist or Socalist route? Difference?? > * Return of land: How?? > * Transfer of economic power: How?? > * etc > > >On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 12:31 PM, sello mafrika Tladi wrote: > > >> >> >>-- Forwarded message -- >>From: Facebook Date: Thu, Apr 29, 2010 at 12:18 PM >>Subject: Raymond Nkrumah Kgagudi wrote on your Wall... >
Re: [PAYCO] Fwd: Raymond Nkrumah Kgagudi wrote on your Wall...
Izwe Lethu! I think Majoni with such honest debates as that of Mo Afrika Mmbara we might see the light at the end of the tunnel. At last hope will be emparted to the African people and will be releaved of their demise under the ANC goverment and will be convinced that PAC at last might deliver them from capitalist evil perpertuated by ANC goverment.It is true that our leadership were and continue to be sympathetic to the ruling party. I realy do not recall a time where PAC leadership has expressed their distaste of the neo-liberal and capitalist bougeousie goverment of ANC. Like I said earlier that some of us are even embrasing ANC leaders. Let me say this in Biblical terms as Sobukwe has said'It is now that we have to choose for we will in simple terms say that those who are not with us are against us. NO FORCE CAN DILUTE OUR MILITANCY!! Izwe Lethu!! From: Hulisani Mmbara To: PAYCO GOOGLE GROUP PAYCO GOOGLE GROUP Sent: Thu, May 6, 2010 11:21:08 AM Subject: RE: [PAYCO] Fwd: Raymond Nkrumah Kgagudi wrote on your Wall... M'Afrika Charge-In It is true that PAYCO supported Letlapa's Presidential campaign on the basis that as president, together with the leadership collective would tackle the ruling party and make the party more visible and present in the national political landscape. He agreed that he would adopt a combative approach towards the ruling ANC. We also expected him to play a significant role to undermine factionalism in the party through a revolutionary programme of action which would keep members of the party focused on mass struggles. We further expected him to support all componet structures to effectively fullfil their roles in the party. However this was not to be. We realised that he was not prepared at all to speak against the ANC. He became a perpetrator of factionalism par execellence. He refused and obstructed the NEC from coming up with any strategic document or a programme of action. He undermined component structures. It was against this background that we withdraw our principled support for him and called on him to step down because it was then clear to us that we have been duped to support another side of the coin of the same ANC programme that Godi was pushing. It has became apparent that all presidential candidates including Thami ka Plaatjie where carry the same ANC programme. All of them where competing to deliver the PAC to the ANC. Their conduct to date bears testimony to that. All of them are ANC lackeys. That Letlapa could not be reedemed became clear to us when the resolution of the policy conference held in Cape Town in December 2006 where frustrated and ultimately thrown out of the window. But we remained patient and some of us volunteered to work in the office for more than six months since beginning of 2007 in order to strengthen the party. You will remember comrade Charge-In that before Letlapa invoke the decree it was none other that PAYCO represented by myself who opposed Letlapa's unilateral decision to remove you as secretary for finance on the basis of non-performance. I specifically told the NEC that nobody in the NEC, including Letlapa has been assessed, that there was no peformance model in place to do such assessment and that the President cannot remove elected officials willy-nilly according to his mood on any given day. Another major problem was that he did absolutely nothing to secure the relocation of the Secretary General, Ahmed Cassim, despite the fact that the NEC and the NWC resolved many time on this issue. In December 2007 PAYCO took a decision to withdraw its support for Letlapa because it was clear that he was carrying a counter revolutionary mandate. We made this decision publicly known in January 2008, after conveying the same message to Letlapa in person, during the same month and have been consistent ever since. As PAYCO president at the time, i lead this particular move from the front and in the process made myself enemies amongst slow learners in the party for allegedly dragging our dirty linen in public. However i am happy to say those who vehemently opposed us at the time also joined us later after, especially after the discredited Alice congress. The biggest lesson we learned with the Letlapa experience is that we must never again allow inactive members of the party to lead the PAC again. We repeated the same problem that created Mogoba and Pheko, all of them fetched from the wilderness top come and lead the PAC. We must never repeat that mistake. No leader of the PAC is good enough to lead the PAC unless such leader takes an active role in the party otherwise you end up with elements who have the mandate to carryout enemy progammes infiltrating the leadership of the party. I will express my views in some deatil to Raymond's comments and many similar comments around PAYCO media strategy some other time. All i can say for
Re: [PAYCO] Did you hear about the pseudo PAC unity meeting?
Comrade Mmbara I think a party that does not have a fartherly figure will always find itself in a state of dispair as in the case of PAC. Mlambo remains a member of Apla High Command. He is a father to PAC. Your disrespect of him and his proposal is really questionable as to what really the agenda you are pushing. Do you really hate Letlapa so much that whatever initiative to help build PAC that includes Letlapa becomes counter revolutionary to you. If I may ask what revolution did you fight to can lecture revolutionaries like Mlambo and Latlapa about revolution. Comrade I need to emphasis that we will support whatever initiative to help build PAC. We cannot support initiative designed to further cause disunity in this movement. The convention you refered to remains a factional move to some of us and we couldin't support it. This is a clarion call by Mlambo to address the imparse in the Africanist movement and you want to redicule him, an Apla High Commander trying to rebuild the PAC. Comrade you must really re-think yourself and apologise to PAC members and Mlambo in particular. If you cannot support this initiative shut and save yourself. Just watch it you do not be classified a counter revolutionary. COMRADE WHAT IS YOUR AGENDA? Every betrayer...every collaborater deserves a ... From: Hulisani Mmbara To: PAYCO GOOGLE GROUP PAYCO GOOGLE GROUP Cc: JUSTICE CONCERNED CDE ; CUNNINGHAM ; NTONZIMA ; NDAMANE Sent: Mon, May 10, 2010 7:27:20 PM Subject: [PAYCO] Did you hear about the pseudo PAC unity meeting? A Discussion from the wall of PAYCO Facebook group page between April 15 and April 20, 2010 Justice Mvakali Ø CDE J MLAMBO APLA CIC IS CALLING ALL PAC NEC FROM 1959 TO DATE, APLA HIGH COMMAND, ALL FORMER AND CURRENT NEC OF PAYCO, PACYL, APLAMVA, PASMA, PAWO, PACWL, PASO, PALF, TRADE UNIONS. Agenda PAC UNITY AND WAYFORWARD. APLA AND MOST PAC MEMBERS SUPPORTS THIS MOVE. LET PAC RISE. April 15 at 6:36pm Hulisani Mmbara Ø What is the basis and kind of unity that Mlambo is calling for? Letlapa Mphahlele is a sell out and all his structures are carrying out a counter-revolutionary programme to destroy the PAC. Does Mlambo want us to unite with that programme? This call is in my view an infiltration by counter revolutionary forces in the party to neutralize and ultimately defeat the progressive agenda to rebuild and reposition the PAC. It is clear that Letlapa and company are out of order. Did Mlambo ever call them to order? April 18 at 12:56pm Hulisani Mmbara Ø Why can't Mlambo focus on enjoying his pension and stop causing confusion in the PAC? Since when is Mlambo a leader enough to broker unity in the Party? He pretends to be for unity of the PAC but where was he all this time? Letlapa has been wrecking havoc since 2007. Where was Mlambo and what did he do? We will not allow people to use their seniority in the party to infiltrate external programmes into the party under the pretext of 'unity'. April 18 at 1:06pm Hulisani Mmbara Ø What we need is a return to constitutionality and legitimate leadership not Mlambo's monkey business. April 18 at 1:09pm Hulisani Mmbara Ø We must not allow anyone to deflect our focus from core issues and challenges that confront us now. Unity will take care of itself through a programme of action of the PAC. We can't have academic debates about unity. Unity is always unity in action. Once there is order, leadership and a programme of action. That’s when we will see unity. Unity must be seen through collective action. We can't romanticize about unity. Unity must be unity of the same minds and action. Unity is found in action, not cheap sentiments! April 18 at 1:21pm Vuyo Mo Ludidi Ø M'Afrika Mmbara you seem to be against the call by Cde Mlambo. Can you substantiate your position as I’m convinced you are not against the idea of unity but rather the initiative, I suspect. Izwe Lethu! April 19 at 4:01pm Justice Mvakali Ø CDE MBARA, THE BEST WOULD BE FOR YOU TO GO TO CDE MLAMBO AND ASK THOSE QUESTIONS. BUT YOU DONT JUST DISMISS ANYTHING WITHOUT GETTING FACTS ABOUT IT. YOU SOUND ANGRY AND THAT DOES NOT HELP. WE NEED A UNITED PAC ON THE BASIS OF PRINCIPLE. MOST OF THE PEOLPLE HAD THEIR OWN FLOPS IN THE PARTY BUT WE ARE MATURED CADRES SO WE MUST FOCUS ON WHAT BUILDS THE PAC THAN WHAT DESTOYS IT. WE CAN DEBATE THIS ISSUE BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY PAC WILL REMAIN DEVIDED. ATLEAST MLAMBO IS TRYING TO GIVE US AN OPPORTUNITY TO TALK ISSUES. FIRST OF ALL THE CONSTITUTIONALITY YOU REFER TO AND THE LEGITIMATE LEARDERSHIP DEMANDS US TO FORM BRANCHES AND BUILD THE PARTY AS PER RESOLUTION IN CAPE TOWN AND THE IS NO ADMIN SYSTEM IN PLACE TO MONITOR THAT AND PPL ASKED FOR MEMBERSHIP FORMS AND CARDS HOW DO YOU ANSWER THAT? LET MLAMBO TAKE THE INITIATIVE AND SEE. April 19 at 5:34pm Hulisani Mmbara Ø Comrades I am not against unity in principle which means rallying around implementa
Re: [PAYCO] Convention of confusion
Mo Afrika Kwame Maybe comrade I should remind you that Letlapa, Modini and Skwatcha I just the few leaders of PAC. We are the PAC. I don,t think we should put much blame on what is happening in the PAC on those few. The trueth is those few represent the majority of PAC members and that leaves you and other comrades or rather a handful so called conventionalist a faction in the PAC. By that fact you remain a faction. Please there are sensible comrades in the PAC who do not want to correct one wrong with a thousant wrongs. You know you are also wrong. What puzzles me is that in the whole issue you guys think that you are messiahs. You see no wrong in you. You potray yourself as if you are purer than any person in this movement. Comrade you are very few and cannot dictate to the majority members of this organisation your perceived wrong ideas. You are furthure destroying this organisation. Whenever a matter of unity arise you remain so mute. Instead you are critisizing without bringing any altanative. So between us and you who are destroying this organisation? I need to be true to yourself, either you are agents who are bount to destroy this organisation or you are fullfilling the agendas of those few comrades who want a piece of cake in a neo colonialist loot. I think it is time that the inteligents members of this organisation should try and expose people who are agents of destruction in this movement, so that we separate agents from innocent disillusioned comrades. The few we remain the better. We cannot tolerate you to destroy a few at the expense of many. Letlapa, Modini and Skwatsha are only PAC leaders we are the PAC. Down with your destructive motives. Down with wolves in the sheeps skin. From: "kwamendeb...@webmail.co.za" To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, May 19, 2010 1:28:42 PM Subject: Re: [PAYCO] Convention of confusion Comrade Tumelo, I respond to your open letter directed to myself, Hulisani Mmbara, Thapelo and the progressive forces that attended the Cape Town Convention. I personally feel sorry for you as you are trying your level best to defend the undefendable and to convince yourselve that PAC under Mphahlele has made massive strides and has grown in size. Let me help you as a dear comrade, wake up! wake up! its nothing but a bad dream, infact an illusion. First and foremost let me declare to you that I come from Newcastle region, Branch 25 (our branches are ward based) and we have 17 fully fledged branches in a Municipality with 31 wards) and can safely tell you that I have been involve in the establishment of all these branches. In 2007 my branch submitted its forms and deposited money for 50 members to the National office and our money was chowed by Skhwatsha, Mudini and Letlapa. I am truly a street fighter and just cannot be bullied by other boys. Yes I was brought up by my grandmother and not ashamed nor do I feel small. Rest assured son of the soil that I am not traumatised nor stressed by my family background rather it has taught me to be resilient and always fight for justice hence I joined the PAC not ANC or any other party as it sought to create a just society founded on socialist principles. You are correct I get emotional where PAC is concerned, particularly when its destroyed from within. I expect any genuine PAC member to be emotional when PAC that embodies the aspirations, interests and needs of our people is crushed. Mind you people sacrificed their lives for PAC, some sacrificed their youth for PAC, some went to Jail for PAC, some risked the lives of their family members for PAC. PAC is anchored on the pain, sacrifices and suffering of our people therefore it is highly impossible not to be emotional where PAC is concerned, surely you would know that if you were committed and passionate as some of us are about PAC, its history and its achievements. Let me pause for now would respond to other issues you raised when I get time. Izwe lethu!!! Kwame > > Open letter to Mmbara,Linda,Thapelo Matseba and the entire hooligans > emerged from the so called PAC National convention > Ma afrika!, i’ve been so quiet and observant on some of your progressive > debate but now allow me to address you one by one on facts not fiction. > > 1.Mmbara who are you in fact?, you claims to be representing task team of > the PAC, is that not correct?, if you are, who tasked you to perform that > duty?.Are you aware that your booze convention was meant for confused > individuals who are not PAC members or leaders including you?, if you are > contesting that fact why your coordinators didn’t invite the provincial > leaderships of the PAC. What informs your convention?, stress or > entertainment?. > > 2.Linda, from which branch of the PAC are you coming from?, why are you > always insulting and labelling PAC leaders as veranda boys?, what kind of > a boy are you, street boy or traumatised boy raised by a single parent?, i >
Re: [PAYCO] Indeed PAC needs Unity
Mo Afrika Kwame Joni lets not make this issue of unity a shallow misdirected topic. Leadership of Letlapa is very much recognised in our constitutional institution . We cannot continue to disregard this fact. You can argue much on this issue, you can even give practical references to this issue but the trueth of the matter is that Letlapa's leadership is recognised not only by our neo liberal constitution, it is also recognised by the 40 000 plus people who voted PAC in the last election which remains questionable if you and your other comrades ever contributed or participated in that simple minority vote for PAC. So comrade you can shout at your loudest voice and only a handful of your faction will ever hear you. What remains to the majority of PAC comrades is that Payco is for the distruction of PAC based on their hate or rather a personal hate to Letlapa and others. This unity does not concern Letlapa and few others, it concern the majority of us who want to see a united PAC. Your excusses cannot be accepted. You are either for the unity of PAC or you are unti unity of PAC period. For Africanist Unity!! Viva PAC From: Dzumbu Mmbara To: PAYCO Sent: Fri, May 21, 2010 11:27:49 AM Subject: [PAYCO] Indeed PAC needs Unity http://payco.org.za/index.php/payco-members-forum/4-ideology-and-general-politics/11-indeed-pac-needs-unity 1 Hour, 50 Minutes ago Dear Africanists, Allow me to express my self on the issue of Unity talks as propagated and envisaged by party stalwarts like Johnson Mlambo, Dr Stanley Mogoba, Joe Mkhwanazi and other party founding members. The idea of unity and cohesion in the PAC is paramount and supported by PAYCO and surely by all in the PAC. Having said the above, as PAYCO we believe any talk of unity must be founded on shared common goals and driven by common desires. We stand for unity of purpose, hence we've been calling for unity of purpose and the adoption of a National Programme of Action that would drive and direct our programmes, activities and goals as an organisation. We share the concerns raised by the comrades who are propagating for Unity Talks, but we disagree with the approach adopted completely. We believe any attempt to handle party unity cannot succeed as long as those who lead that process are not brutally honest with those they are trying to unite. For starters, we have not heard these leaders denouncing factionalism that is fueled by Mphahlele in the party, rejecting the creation of parallel structures, physical assaults to party members, non distribution of party membership cards, disbandment of structures that refuse to support an Agenda to destroy the party and total disregard of party constitution. We expect those who lead this process to speak out against these destructive tendencies as they have been unashamed to attack PAYCO for its non support of the Unity Talks. PAYCO can also put on record that it has not been formally engaged on this matter , which is quite strage. You would normally expect that structures would be formally engaged individually on the objectives of the process and be given an opportunity to interrogate the entire process and to take into confidence its structures on the ground. This has not been the case with these Unity Talks. The main contenders have not been engaged, we've been hearing about the Unity Talks on Facebook and over the grapevine. We hold a view that this process has not been properly handled therefore cannot succeed to unite PAC. PAYCO also feels it was completely out of order for the proponents of the Unity Talks to undermine the Cape Town Convention and its resolutions in pursuing Unity Talks. The organisers of the Unity Talks have undermined the National Task Team, a structure that was given a mandate to lead the PAC to the National Policy Conference and the National Congress. The National Task Team is the only structure that commands respect from all party component structures,e.i, PAYCO, PASMA, PAWO, PALF, APLAMVA and PASO. PAYCO shall only partake in unity Talks that put constitutionality first and that is driven by the National Task Team or jointly driven with the National Task Team. PAC needs no Messiahs to salvage it from this quagmire it finds itself into, we are quite capable to resolve our problems on our own. United We Stand! Divided We Fall!!! Foward Ever!!! Backward Never!!! Izwe Lethu!! Kwame Ndebele PAYCO President Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service. Get it now. -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.co
Re: [PAYCO] Indeed PAC needs Unity
Izwe Lethu Mo Afrika Mawande. I reserve my comment because you said it mouthfully. Let other comrade listen to your advice. Through your contribution I can see the glims of Afrika United and Afrika Rejuvinated Izwe Lethu!! From: Mawande Jack To: payco@googlegroups.com; Cunningham Ngcukana ; Khaliphile Sizani ; gilingwe.maye...@mayecon.co.za; Tsietsi ; sero...@hotmail.com; Mduduzi Sibeko ; Vuyani Mbinda ; mbi...@mtcec.co.za; ayandabil...@webmail.co.za Sent: Mon, May 24, 2010 10:27:44 AM Subject: RE: [PAYCO] Indeed PAC needs Unity Ma-Afrika Unity is the fundamental principle in all our work as party cadres in that the PAC, an organisation respresents a melting pot of ideas and views and provides everyone with the ultimate sense of belonging and serves as an enabler for each and everyone of us realise our full potential. Before getting intergrated into party confines, we are but a raw social material and hence individualistically narrow in our perspectives, oulooks and general social interactions. Only within the PAC can we graduate into complete social beings by way of political socialisation undertaken systematically through the medium of the unifying Africanist ideology which vehemently eschews factionalism, tribal tendencies, petty bourgeois arrogance, small-minded talk, and a host of other western capitalist chauvinist vices. What then are we striving for as the party, primarily for party unity, constantly for a unified ideological outlook, and ultimately for the United States of Africa and a global Pan-Africanist peoplehood. Our primary responsibility is to ourselves as the personifaction and embodiment of these levels of unity which history and the logic of conditions in our society bestows in us thus allowing very little chance to chose particular forms of action other than those that maximise unity, philosophically as social meaning, value and purpose. In other words, well-grounded Africanists desire nothing less or more other that unity in words and deeds. In the final analysis unity is an attitude of mind and a way of life of all Africanists in their relationship with one another, with the masses, with nature and ultimately with God. It why at various stages of the party's life, tend to emerge critical questions of unity and figures propagating party or organisational unity more forcefully than others. It is because it is in the nature of party life for that situation to prevail. These are not default actions by politically misdirected individuals or opportunists but represents more a dynamic urge to work in the fulfillment of something lacking within that member concerned first and foremost.There can be no higher service in the PAC, no political fulfillment among party cadres, no job well done and no deam realised, other than dedicating oneself to party unity. This is the highest form of party discipline and any member commitment to party work and progress shall at all times be measured on that score. There can be no better unifier than the sum of cadres dedicated to party work bacause it pressuposes the ultimate fulfillment of service to our people. Let allow all activities, all endeavours, large and small, towards unity be given free reign. Let all these schools of thought, methods and approaches within the party in search of unity contend for the party to emerge purer and purer in the whole crucible of the African people's historical destiny. Izwe Lethu!! I-Afrika!! Mawande Jack From: payco@googlegroups.com [mailto:pa...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of SOSO MASHILOANE Sent: 24 May 2010 09:01 AM To: payco@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [PAYCO] Indeed PAC needs Unity Izwe Lethu Ma- Afrika I concur with the President of Payco with all the consultation process which needs to be followed however my biggest concern is that , who should be the initiator of this UNITY process? Is he or she going to be recognised by our so could factional structures (Both NTT & the Pac which is under Letlapa) ? Lastly Ma - Afrika how far can we go for the sake of PAC to reach this common goal? I understand that some of our activist from the ranks and files of PAC history would always judge them harshly. Its time that we have viable, credible & constituency base structures Yours in quest for Africanist cause Soso Mashiloane Former PASMA DSG 076 363 --- On Sun, 5/23/10, Mohlomphegi Mphahlele wrote: >From: > Mohlomphegi Mphahlele >Subject: Re: >[PAYCO] Indeed PAC needs Unity >To: payco@googlegroups.com >Date: >Sunday, May 23, 2010, 6:34 PM > > > > >Mo Afrika Kwame > >Joni lets not make this issue of unity a >shallow misdirected topic. Leadership of Letlapa is very much > recognised >in our constitutional institution . We ca
Re: [PAYCO] PAC leader joins ANC
Ma Afrika!! The heading of this not so supprising news should read PAM and not PAC leader joins ANC. We who have anticipated this are not suprised by this comrade's move. I myself have always put this comrade under the league of the likes of Patricia Delile. I can also say without any contradiction that some of the PAYCO comrades once they are finished with destroying this movement will also join ANC. They are now still engage in a programme to destroy and destabilise this movement. Once their deeds are served they will be rewarded with positions in the African National Capitalist (ANC) organisation. So comrades how many of us are in the pipeline to join ANC? All I can say to the departing comrade is PLEASE RAISE HIGH THE PAN AFRICANIST IDEALS in your new found "home" Fairwell Qhawe La Maqhawe From: Hulisani Mmbara To: PAYCO GOOGLE GROUP PAYCO GOOGLE GROUP Sent: Mon, May 24, 2010 1:08:45 PM Subject: [PAYCO] PAC leader joins ANC PAC leader joins ANC http://www.timeslive.co.za/local/article466670.ece/PAC-leader-joins-ANC Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service. Get it now. -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com
Re: [PAYCO] PAC leader joins ANC
Comrade Snow I wish I could not answer you on this comment. The reason being that you need to be lectured on one thing or two. PAC is a liberation movement and not a political party. We do not yet have a socialist democracy in which we can participate as a political party. PAC does not advocate to a western imperialist democracy as Mothopeng has said. We are for an Africanist socialist democracy. As PAC we are still engaged in a Africanist revolutionary struggle. Therefore any PAC member remains a revolutionary and is expected to be such and to abide by the aoth of aligiancy of PAC. I further wish to explain to you the different based on being "involved" and being "committed" to the Africanist revolution. Revolutionaries are committed to a revolutionary struggle. They are not mearly envolved. For you to understand take an example of a (beacon and egg burger). Here a chicken is involved and a pig committed (for a pig has to be killed) in preparing a meal. The likes of Sobukwe rose beyond their mayopic selfish personal interests and committed themselves to the Africanist cause. They had to give up their socialite life for the sake of African People. A revolutionary is not like a sailor. He is not involved in any adventurist jeourny. A revolutionary is for and one thing only "A REVOLUTIONARY CHANGE". So adventurist comrades like you must find a shortest way out of Africanist Revolution while time permits. You are like fence sitters in PAC. It will be hard for you to understand this. Sobukwe onced said students are not realible revolutionaries, as they became revolutionaries at school and once they complete their studies they become toothless stooges afters their schooling term. A good example is Pasma comrades. How many of them are still engaged in PAC cause after completing their studies? So comrade we are not in an adventurist tourists in PAC, we are revolutionaries. To be a revolutionary you must rise beyond your selfish interest. Izwe Lethu Joni!!! From: sonwabile fisa To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, May 26, 2010 11:34:38 AM Subject: Re: [PAYCO] PAC leader joins ANC I quote "I can also say without any contradiction that some of the PAYCO comrades once they are finished with destroying this movement will also join ANC" Respecting your views, but I find it peculiar that you are calling PAYCO members comrades whilst you are alleging that they are in a program to destroy the organisation. I suggest that as an observant and objective leader who is able and capable of foreseeing potential catastrophic risks of this nature within the party you doe something to mitigate them and to possible root out such behaviours. It is imperative to note and respect the fact that individuals voluntarily joined the party for reasons only know by them, it therefore becomes important again to respect their resignations from the party if they feel that their expectations or purposes have not been served. When tolerance levels reach zenith about the current long overdue squabbles that are crippling the organisation, I’ll leave the party and for that I need nobody’s approval and people can say what they want to say. As things stand now, you have a vast number of party members silently watching and only concentrating on their careers or well-beings if you wanna put it that way. If a ship is sailing, one needs both life jackets and life rafts to be able to get to the next ship, but the above cant be correct for a ship that 3 quarters down to the ocean. Labelling people as sell-outs from mere basis of resignation can’t be entirely correct, however in an event where barbaric behaviours have prevailed, those must be condemned and this should not only apply to members resigning but also to those that are still within the party. If PAC as an organisation not as group of individuals who think are on the right footage decide to rebuild itself, the foundation of that rebuilding should comprise of honesty, realism, transparency, and non selfishness at minimum. Whether who is right or wrong about bringing about unity and order in the party, common grounds hand compromises have to prevail from all the groups concerned. If not members must forget about unity. Regards Soso Fax #: 086 697 9605 E-mail sonwabi...@yahoo.com "We all die, our plan is not to live forever but to create something that will" Kwame Nkrumah --- On Mon, 5/24/10, Mohlomphegi Mphahlele wrote: >From: Mohlomphegi Mphahlele >Subject: Re: [PAYCO] PAC leader joins ANC >To: payco@googlegroups.com >Date: Monday, May 24, 2010, 6:00 PM > > > > >Ma Afrika!! > >The heading of this not so supprising news should read PAM and not PAC leader >joins ANC. We who have anticipated this are not suprised by this comrade's >move. I myself have always p
Re: [PAYCO] PAC leader joins ANC
Joni!! Comrade you will be loughed at by revolutionaries. I have always advocated that PAC of today is infiltrated by comrades like you who were not braught well in the politics of PAC. Thats why we advocate the tendency of charterism within our current PAC. Your culture of engaging is taboo to the PAC. You have demostrated to everyone what kind of a comrade you are. Like Malema you need a political education on (PAC) politics and revolutionary dynamics. In simple terms you need to be taught Maoism on the "Struggle of the Jigsaw" partern. Save your embarasement and stop here with this issue. Comrades please help clarify the comrade. Like many in Payco you sound very much angry. Peace amongst the Africans and war against the enemy!! Izwe lethu!!! From: Snow Mokgalabone To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Fri, May 28, 2010 12:14:39 PM Subject: Re: [PAYCO] PAC leader joins ANC Mo-Africa If PAC today is a Liberation Movement, why participate in the so called Democratic South African Politics? Well the below mentioned theories are not new to me as you allege, to me you don't understand the practical formations that actualize these demarcations in reality. Son of the soil, the fact remains that the PAC of today does not assemble revolution nor prepared to be one. PAC today is a pure political party in action, it is only the history that makes the PAC a then revolutionary party and a ex-movement. What revolution are you engaging in today when today's PAC is part of the parliamentary system, when today's PAC is attempting to use names such as Youth League without looking at the historical reasoning behind the original naming. Is it revolutionary for today's PAC not to have a revolutionary programme? Is it revolutionary for the today's PAC to expel its veterans or members left right and center without proper disciplinary process? Your sudden lecture to me is attributed to irrelevant reasoning because I never challenged the historical stands of the then PAC. For a point even Sobukwe arose and participated largely in student politics like me and some of your friends if any. Please do not mention Sobukwe in the occurrences of today's PAC but rather quote today's PAC president and his allies. While I am enjoying a seat at the fence, what is different between the political activities of PAC, ID, UDM and IFP? All these are matching towards elections and parliamentary seats which says to me PAC is as well a political party that is influenced by constituency (voters) politics> Lastly tell this cyber platform at least three (3) revolutionary programmes of today's PAC in simple terms. Can I assume you only know the dictionary explanation of the word revolution? Thanks With Respect-Mohlomphegi Mphahlele On Fri, May 28, 2010 at 11:43 AM, Mohlomphegi Mphahlele wrote: Comrade Snow > >I wish I could not answer you on this comment. The reason being that you need >to be lectured on one thing or two. PAC is a liberation movement and not a >political party. We do not yet have a socialist democracy in which we can >participate as a political party. PAC does not advocate to a western >imperialist democracy as Mothopeng has said. We are for an Africanist >socialist democracy. As PAC we are still engaged in a Africanist revolutionary >struggle. Therefore any PAC member remains a revolutionary and is expected to >be such and to abide by the aoth of aligiancy of PAC. I further wish to >explain to you the different based on being "involved" and being "committed" >to the Africanist revolution. Revolutionaries are committed to a revolutionary >struggle. They are not mearly > envolved. For you to understand take an example of a (beacon and egg burger). > Here a chicken is involved and a pig committed (for a pig has to be killed) > in preparing a meal. The likes of Sobukwe rose beyond their mayopic selfish > personal interests and committed themselves to the Africanist cause. They had > to give up their socialite life for the sake of African People. A > revolutionary is not like a sailor. He is not involved in any adventurist > jeourny. A revolutionary is for and one thing only "A REVOLUTIONARY CHANGE". > So adventurist comrades like you must find a shortest way out of Africanist > Revolution while time permits. You are like fence sitters in PAC. It will be > hard for you to understand this. Sobukwe onced said students are not realible > revolutionaries, as they became revolutionaries at school and once they > complete their studies they become toothless stooges afters their schooling > term. A good example is Pasma comrades. How many of > them are still engaged in PAC cause after completing their studies? > >So comrade we are not in an adventurist tourists in
Re: [PAYCO] PAYCO VS PACyl ON SA FM
Izwe lethu Joni!! You said it mouthfully From: Masande Gonya <1masa...@gmail.com> To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Fri, May 28, 2010 2:02:01 PM Subject: Re: [PAYCO] PAYCO VS PACyl ON SA FM Africanist we must be vigilant, the media is not right tool for now , because it is controlled by western people. MOST OF THE TIME WE SAY THAT. The masses are waiting for us out there, the facebook and google is not going to bring unity within the party. We are not politicians, we are revolutinaries ma-afrika. The masses are waiting for us, we must ask ourselves what do we want from achieve within the space of time. Pan-Africanism is does not preach about disunity, it speaks about unity. I strongly feel PAC is the only solution to the current problems of africa, what is required is members to unity. let us love one another, we must not be enemies. The dream of 1963, 25 May it is still there. But we must be willing to change our personalities for the sake our people. I am not old in politics, but i see there is huge problem within the ranks of our movement. I am currently doing my academic research on the politics of azania and turn around strategy that can be used to get the opportunity to get support from the masses. It nice to know what happen pre-1994, and that was mistake that was caused. In a revolution if something didn't work out, there is a need to reshape and move forward. I am currently reading Sun Tzu on the Art of War, I recommend to all africanist to get hold of the book so that we can serve the people of this continent. To debate seating in the chair, with your fingers in your computer is not going to justice to people who are dying in and other. If we can not change the government via democratic proccess (which i strongly believe PAC was not supposed to engaging in) we are liberation movement not a organisation of parliament or union buildings. The african cause will remain a cause. I remain an Africanist. On 28 May 2010 11:03, Phakamile Myakayaka wrote: majoni ikhona ingxaki kwaye it is of gigantic propotion.i just listened to safm and i am not happy at all.solution:let's all meet and iron our differences in order to move forward as a strong force of african warriors on a revolutionary march to total emancipation of amaAfrica, uPAYCO makakhokhele i'm ready to loose blood for the african course IZWE LETHU! > > > > >On Fri, May 28, 2010 at 7:49 AM, wrote: > >I fully agree with you son there's no reason for us go public b'cause we >>are still denting our own image.But as I said the other day certain comrades in a road to score points >> >> >>-- >>South Africa's premier free email service - www.webmail.co.za -- >>For super low premiums, click here http://home.webmail.co.za/dd.pwm >> >> >>-- >>Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com >> >>Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >> >>You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco >> >>Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com >-- >Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com > >Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >> >You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco > >Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -- “If you want to go fast, go alone; but if you want to go far, go together.” Lineo Nalane (from Lesotho) in 2007 -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com
Re: [PAYCO] The Rise of A Star : Welcome Ikwezi To Our Shores
I must say that I am not empressed by the crop of leadership in PAC since the passing of President Lekoane Mothopeng. Comrades who have been close to me for all those years will attest to that. My biggest concern is that we cannot continuasly fail this movement by electing a leadership which at a latter stage we want to remove because of this and that. Our leaders have been failing us since 1990. The biggest problem in this movement is that we lack a coharent structure. No matter what constitution we can have there is no how we can protect it if we represent our own jackets. What I am saying is that if PAC was structured according to the constitution(read any) and we act as a unit (branch,region or province) there was no way we cannot protect the abuse of our constitution by any person. Unfortunately we continue with our tendency of being our own reps representing our own jackets and thinking we can speak on behalf of the rest. In the history of our constitutions,the constitution demands that there are certain procedures to be followed whenever a member or a certain portion of membership is not certisfied with a particular issue. This is not being done. If it has been done then the process protocol was not followed. CONSTITUTIONAL PROTOCOLS NEED TO BE FOLLOWED. My deepest concern is that time is running out and we are failing to resolve an impasse in this movement. My understanding is that if we are not happy with a particular leadership we vote that leadrship out. Why then is not the case with our present leadership? Instead of doing that we continue to throw insults on our own leadership and we continue to act indipendently from the leadership. I know for a fact some of us don't regard the present leadership as PAC leadership. The question is,is that the truth? Then who lead the PAC? Can comrades outline a process by which the present leadership can be removed especially when the current constitution which governs the present leadreship is not respected or adherd to? On what ground then can we do that and beeing guided by what? We are enough with the Pan Africanist Politics what we want is a revolutionary wagon we can ride on that will deliver the Pan Africanist Ideals to the people and finally a true Africanist revolutionary victory. COMRADES HOW TRUE ARE WE TO THE ASPIRATION OF THIS MOVEMENT? From: Pasika Nontshiza To: diop...@gmail.com; sizan...@mweb.coza Cc: thomo.nkgad...@gmail.com; dzu...@live.com; sbusiso.x...@gmail.com; sebenzi...@raf.co.za; Jackie Seroke ; Thapelo Matlala ; Cunningham Ngcukana ; payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Mon, October 11, 2010 5:20:13 PM Subject: [PAYCO] The Rise of A Star : Welcome Ikwezi To Our Shores Spring has sprung too for Africanists,what, with the revival and reintroduction of Ikwezi journal. having been a voice of reason in exile,Ikwezi resurfaced and offered the much needed relevant political information about the pan-Africanist struggle. Its ability to present information in a critical,yet revolutionary manner contributed a lot to the confusion perpetuated by the apologists of the capitalist and neo-colonial system. Ikwezi could not have come at a right time, what with the ship of freedom(PAC) hijacked by anarchists masquerading as members,condemning the masses of our people to slavedom and lack of direction.Let those who claim to be Pan-Arficanists accelerate and raise the level of debate so that the masses of Azania could have a proper direction. A clarion call to all freedom lovers: Ikwezi is paving the way for all of us to agitate,advocate and contribute to the cause of freedom and do what Africanists are known for- rise to the challenge when they are required to. Ikwezi can be contacted through-diop...@gmail.com Izwe Lethu Pasika Nontshiza -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com
Re: [PAYCO]
PAC Comrades We are not cursed at all. Unfortunately I do not support comparing infighting within PAC now with what happened during the apartheid era. I would say the infighting then was influence by ideological differences with exception to later PAC external mision differences. Our infighting now are influenced by greed and general ill discipline within the party. We have adopted and ANC kind ill discipline in the name of democracy. Even ants think they can challange elephants in this movement. Some of prominant leaders are using young ignorant cadres to further their self interest. This young cadres who are groomed by anc politics and happened to have read PAC basic documents during their study period and lack no direction are used to defy the leadership of PAC. This are the same leaders who cry fault to the Letlapa leadership but seek to do the same or even worse to further their selfish aim of assuping the leadership of this movement so that they can have a taste of parliamentary gravy train. This leaders would never given or show this young cadres direction even when they bring or talk a taboo deregotry language in this movement. I must indicate that we are also not happy with events within this party. Maybe because we are blinded by the discipline we have we can't do anything accept to wait for the right moment through the right channels to get rid of the present leadership if we are realy not happy with them. As of now we are appealing to this young comrades to refrain from using faul language to adress members of this party who happens not to see things their way. As for the leaders who are using this young cadres to further their selfish interests we are saying the Gods of Afrika are apon you. High Revolutionary Discipline From: Mduduzi Sibeko To: "payco@googlegroups.com" Sent: Thu, December 2, 2010 10:06:14 AM Subject: [PAYCO] Comrades from Two Camps. PAC 50 years of infighting is inherited by all generations to generations. Is this infighting genetically inherited ? Jacob Zuma attempted to save his day by ridiculing the PAC, not in an exact verbatim, but he said something like this as a warning to factions within their ranks, “ those going out of the ANC will be cursed like the PAC”. Apart from the overt scorning of the PAC by Zuma. Are we really cursed ?If its true that from the inception there was rivalry in our ranks. Someone has pointed out that Josias Madzunya withdrew his Alexander constituency from participating in an anti pass campaign, because of his failed ambitions of leading the PAC. Then we would not date our paralysis in the Leballo’s era. It is very unfortunate that the organization we so loved is so fragmented beyond any hope of repair to its pristine condition. The PAC will never come right, we like it or not, it will not. I know some of you comrades could be irked by these pessimistic assertions. But I tell you, in my case, I have been absent in participation, and when I was active in the early 90’s, we had our sots of infighting. It’s now close to 20 years in my life time that these infighting haven’t ceased instead they proliferate.PAC going to court is bizarre, I saw this some years ago and I was befuddled. The PAC will be left with history of its own. I am afraid. No further appeal can be made. Resources are exhausted now. Mduduzi Sibeko Admin/finance T +27-11-724-9249/81 C +27-71-101-2595 F +27-11-900-1929 F 086-754-2176 e msib...@randwater.co.za www.randwater.co.za The contents and any attachments to this e-mail are subject to the following disclaimer: Click Here-Company Disclaimer The information contained in this message and or attachments is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any system and destroy any copies. -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com
Re: [PAYCO] In Search of a Revolutionary Africanist Youth Voice
Well said Cdr Pasika From: Pasika Nontshiza To: payco@googlegroups.com Cc: Sizani Sent: Thu, December 16, 2010 11:34:26 AM Subject: [PAYCO] In Search of a Revolutionary Africanist Youth Voice Any political trajectory without a revolutionary youth voice is bound to fail, the Azanian situation is no exception.It is against this background it should concern Africanists when its youth voice is not being heard or perharps its being drowned. T he current Youth and Student Festival is a case in point. How on earth can a country which is struggling to pay school fees for its tertiary students, host a jamboree just for the youth kiss each other. What is making a lot of noise-is the silence for those who are supposed to speak for the disadvantaged youth. Are we to suppose that our Paycos and Pasmas are in support of this looting of state resources in the name of the youth. If they are,how close are they to their constituencies.If they are not, what are they doing about that. It is unfortunate that in the situation the PAC finds itself in,its youth is not a solution. One has only got to read the input in Paycogoogles - what a turn off, the Mayihlome Lectures are not a solution either, as they are obsessed with petty political issues rather than national issues. Our youth have become paper tigers who feel that posting a comment on the internet is enough to advance the cause of Pan-Africanism. We are desecrating the memories of our heroes by quoting them out of context and do nothing about their thinking and theories. The Charterists are accelerating the gear of looting, the youth has been targeted to deliberately confuse it. Masses have got no alternative. Shouldn't we use this sites to conscientise our youth and organise them for an action? To invoke Phokela : "Let's Go Back To Basics" -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com
Re: [PAYCO] Resolutions as tabled, corrected and adopted by the NCC
Cmorades I think if we cannot criticaly scrutinize and critic each other and speak our mind openly on all issues pertaining to PAC we won't come alright. It must be clear to everyone that we are following all developments within our movement. Here I include all PAC and PAC fuction members. Mind you how you regard each fuction. My concern here is comrade Ntsie being elected to that consultative committee. This comrade lead Azanyu Revolutionary Watchdogs enegetically while others like comrade Seroke were part of Amazambane according to them. Later this Azanyu Revolutionary Watchdogs faded out of this country political arena. As to how Ntsie can answer to this, its his problems. He later emerge as a PAC(Amazambane) Organizer. In this potfolio I can attest that he failed desmally to organise anything tangeble to have made PAC a prosperous revolutionary Party. Now to an ignorant observer like me if ofcause I am, how can I entrust comrade like Ntsie to take PAC anywhere when he had all the oportunity to do so and failed the organisation. Escuse me comrades from raising that. I always maintain that we cannot correct one wrong with a thousant wrongs. PAC under the leadership of Letlapa has failed our expectation. This is not supprising since Cdr Letlapa is toring the path where the likes of Makwetu, Mogoba and Motsoko once tored. I think in the coming elective congress the trueth can be told as to why all our leaders are betraying us? What stick is being fed to them to bite and forget the mandate given to them? I yarn for the real PAC as founded in 1959 under the courageous leadership of Robert Sobukwe in the interest of the toiling African Massess. That day will dawn yes it will dawn. From: Hulisani Mmbara To: PAYCO GOOGLE GROUP PAYCO GOOGLE GROUP Sent: Thu, January 27, 2011 10:27:19 PM Subject: [PAYCO] Resolutions as tabled, corrected and adopted by the NCC Dear Comrades Please find attached the Resolutions as tabled, corrected and subsequently adopted by the NCC. Izwelethu! Hulisani Mmbara 082 593 3012 (Cell) 086 690 1176 (Fax) -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com
RE: [PAYCO]
Cdr Mduduzi and all other Africanists Race remains as Sobukwe has said a thorny issue. Like you comrade it is really difficult for me to separate an African from a Settler. However I pasted an extract from Sobukwe State of the Nation Campaign and believe it should give us an insight into this whole issue of race. "We will go on, Sons and Daughters of Afrika, until in every shanty, in every bunk in the compounds, in every hut in the deserted villages, in every valley and on every hill top, the cry of African freedom and independence is heard. We will continue until we walk the streets of our land as free men and free women, our heads held high. We will go on until the day dawns when every person who is in Afrika will be African and a man's colour will be as irrelevant as is the shape of his ears. We will go on, steadfastly, relentlessly and determinedly until the cry of "Afrika for the Africans, the Africans for humanity and humanity for God" becomes a reality; until government of the Africans by the Africans for the Africans is a fait accompli". Having read through this extract then the answer will be whites as part of the foreighn possesser and usurpers of our land remains settlers. All whites irrispective of whatever will remain settlers as long as they continue holding on our land that was brutally stolen from Africans. They will remain settlers and not Africans until the day dawn on which our revolutionary mission is complete. To take from the above extract; until government of the Africans by the Africans for the Africans is a fait accompli. I believe that though our leaders appeared more moderate for reconciliation purpose on the issue of settlers the truth remains as Mogabe has put it that "A SETTLER REMAINS A SETTLER". We should stop contradicting our selve thinking for people who care less about us. --- On Wed, 6/22/11, Mduduzi Sibeko wrote: From: Mduduzi Sibeko Subject: RE: [PAYCO] To: "payco@googlegroups.com" Date: Wednesday, June 22, 2011, 1:45 PM Cde Seroke and Mzu On the issue of race and who was an African this is what Sobukwe said “Politically we stand for government of the Africans for the Africans by the Africans with everybody who owes his only loyalty to Africa and accepts the democratic rule of an African majority, being regarded as an African. We guarantee no minority rights because we are fighting precisely that group-exclusiveness which those who plead for minority rights would like to perpetuate. It is our view that if we have guaranteed individual liberties we have given the highest guarantee necessary and possible. I have said before, and I will still say so now, that I see no reason why, in a free, democratic Africa, a predominantly black electorate should not return a white man to parliament, for colour will count for nothing in a free Africa.” During the late eighties and early 90’s. I grappled with the problem of harmonizing the concepts of white minority rule, (as it was a common phrase or a cliché that was used in the literature of liberation movements) and what Sobukwe had said about who was an African and our unqualified loathing of minority rights guarantees. Sometimes in 1993, Former president Clarence Makwethu had a meeting with Mr. fw De klerk. According to President Makwethu, F.W said to him. “ Mr. Makwethu, can I have a question to you ?”. Makwethu said “ go ahead” “Who is a settler” asked De Klerk. You see, without a coherent ideological understanding, it would have been difficult for Makwethu to delineate our position in as far as the issue of race and who was an African. however, Mr. Makwethu ,was at times, astute and vibrant in debates. He clarified the position to Mr. De Klerk. The question that you raised about the over- inclusiveness of the definition of African is a problem that I don’t think that as an africanist i will address it satisfactorily. We define an African as “everybody who owes his only loyalty to Africa and accepts the democratic rule of an African majority” the questions becomes, what about those that are natives in this country but do not want to accept the democratic rule of the African majority. admittedly, we as africanist are extremely reluctant to regard whites as Africans. The very same tagging them as settlers was ideologically incorrect. I know very well that some of you that have read to this passage may be now beginning to tag me as a liberal. Be what it may be, this is my understanding which may also be ideologically incorrect. The question is, designations such as Settlers, Europeans and others, were they to be used perpetually. What did we mean when we said and venerated Sobukwe’s words which read as “in our vocabulary, the word races as applied to man, does not exist, we regard multiracism as racism multiplied” I do not gainsay the indisputable fact that there are whites, who are even to this day, do not want to accept the democratic rule of the
[PAYCO] This Kit changed all my life
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[PAYCO] Look what i found here
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Re: [PAYCO] Khumbula i Afrika!
Revolutionary Greetings We must bear in mind that the very same pettit beaugeoasies want to create fuctionalism because they operate well under such circumstances. So those of us who are well conciuntised must not allow this people to rein in our party. Instead of becoming the very same fuctions they are creating we must be united as one under the umbrella of African Nationalism. This people must not devide us in whatever way. If we allow fuctionalism then we will have fallen into their trap. We must be within the movement and continue to preach unity without giving that unity names. Unity of PAC cadres is a must in our situation. We are all aware that we are infiltrated and the worst part is that we are infiltrated by the people we trust so much and have intrusted the PAC with. So fortunately there are ways to deal with such people constitutionally. Now if in the case of PAYCO that continues not to recognise the Alice constitution then we are doomed. It is that very same constitution that can be used to get rid of this people. Payco and all of us must swallow our pride and recognise this constitution only to use it to revamp PAC. It is not only Payco who are wise enough to see that we are being sold out here. All of us can see and we are really not happy ubout what is prevailing in the organisation. My take is we cannot and will never solve PAC issues as divided as we are. Some of us are just hoping that the PAC leadership can just out of no where seaze to exist. That will never happen and can only be addressed through the constitution that some of us so much despise. So lets be sensible and come into the realities that are facing us and together we can recreate PAC and steer this Sobukwe ship to the shores it is destined to. All Africanist must come back home and first recognise the very same PAC leadership that we are so much pissed with. After which we must peruse the same constitution that we so much despise and use it to solve the PAC problems that the very same constitution braught within PAC. So far there is no any other route unless we decide to illiminate other people. Otherwise this has been a long talk and so far nothing has happened and by look of things nothing will be happening until like the revolutionary watchdogs Payco will come back into the PACYL with the tail between its legs. These are realities comrades and we either heed to a unity call without any conditions or some of us are doomed. Izwe Lethu From: Xola To: payco@googlegroups.com; Zamikhaya Gxabe ; Baliwinile Kwankwa ; nkosan...@gmail.com; Justice Mvakali ; Julian Mohlala ; Chargein Mabaso ; Ntate Philemon Tefu ; Tembelani Xundu ; Hulisani Mmbara ; Jaki Seroke ; Junior Ntabeni ; Phillip Dhlamini ; Phillip Matsebe ; Thuthuzelekani Ngcingwana ; Ntate Ike Mafole ; Mark Shinners ; Sam Ditshego ; Sam J M Motau ; Sbusiso Xaba ; Meshack Ledwaba ; Letlapa Mphahlele ; Vusi Mahlangu ; Mohlomphegi Mphahlele ; Mancane Sibiya ; g...@bcawu.co.za Cc: Mbulelo Fihla ; Pearl Mofokeng ; Phillip Atamelang Kgosana Sent: Saturday, October 1, 2011 7:25 AM Subject: [PAYCO] Khumbula i Afrika! There is always strength in principled unity. "Principled" in that it is based on a programme to achieve the noble ends of freedom for the African people. "Principled" because it is simply founded on the ideal seeking to totally empower the poor to emancipate themselves from continued socio-economic pauperization. "Principled" in that it focuses on mass action rather than sectarian or elitist crusades. Accepting that nobody, party, social movement, group or faction has exclusive rights to some magic "liberatory" wand, revolutionary pluralism seeks to forge partnerships and networks for the empowerment of our people through the masses' own revolutionary action. Factionalists, informed by their petit bourgeois aspirations and arrogance, appropriate to themselves the "right to think for the masses." When the masses inevitably ignore them, factionalists continue relentlessly to demonise all those who differ with them even inside their own parties or movements. This arrogant conceit eventually suppresses all progressive discourse and activism, ejecting potentially revolutionary innovations and capabilities. This type of destructive factionalism is rampant in many political parties and social movements throughout the world. In periods of revolutionary lulls and reaction, it always rears its ugly head. In the current neo-liberal triumphalistic epoch, it manifests in South Africa through the inexorable fragmentation of the revolutionary left. This is because petit bourgeois opportunists always lose focus of the masses' aspirations, and obsess in replacing one enstranged and lost leadership by another, in an endless vicious cycle of factional fratricide, perpetuating the continued pauperization of
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