RE: Tire Storage

Subject: Re: Tire Storage It says 0.6 over 5000 square feet or 0.90 over 3000 square feet. Either could be more demanding depending on pipe layout/size and maybe sprinkler k-factor. 0.6 over 5000 is actually 300 GPM more demanding than the other criteria, so in certain situations the .6

Re: Tire Storage

It says 0.6 over 5000 square feet or 0.90 over 3000 square feet. Either could be more demanding depending on pipe layout/size and maybe sprinkler k-factor. 0.6 over 5000 is actually 300 GPM more demanding than the other criteria, so in certain situations the .6 criteria could be controlling (prob

Tire Storage

Looking for some insight on Table 18.4(a) (8) (2013 version. Specifically "Over 12 to 20". It says 0.60 & 0.90 and that water supplies must fulfill both requirements. Why not just say 0.90 ? Brian Harris, CET BVS Systems Inc. Design Manager bvssystemsinc.com Phone: 704

Rubber Tire Storage

NFPA 13, 2014 Table 18.4(d) for rubber tire storage This table gives the requirements for the ceiling sprinklers. Could there be additional requirements (other than those on the table 18.4(d), for the ceiling sprinklers?). For example, if the shelves were solid, depending on the size of these

RE: [EXTERNAL] Tire Storage

You can suggest that the owner of the building, or the tire storage tenant install a lay in ceiling at 30’ above the floor. The ceiling tile material will need to be either ½” gyp board tiles or clipped in place acoustic tile to resist uplift. As for the on floor vs on pallets on the floor

Tire Storage

I have a design build warehouse we are looking at for tire storage. Unfortunatly, the tire storage arraignment is not listed in the CMSA or ESFR tables, and only partly addressed in the Control Mode Density / Area Table. The proposed storage arrangement is 15' high on side on floor under

RE: Tire Storage

@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Tire Storage [EXTERNAL] NFPA 13, 2014 Table 18.4(a) Some "Sprinkler Discharge Densities" are given as (for example): "0.30 plus high expansion foam" Does this mean the roof system needs to be high expansion foam with a density of 0.3? I'm just confused

Re: Tire Storage

8899 > 216-570-7030 cell > > > > -Original Message- > From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-bounces@lists.firesprinkler. > org] > On Behalf Of Tony Silva > Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:39 PM > To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > Subje

Re: Tire Storage

Protection > 24400 Highland Rd CLE 44143 > 216-621-8899 > 216-570-7030 cell > > > > -Original Message- > From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-bounces@lists.firesprinkler. > org] > On Behalf Of Tony Silva > Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:39 PM > To:

RE: Tire Storage

Tony Silva Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:39 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Tire Storage NFPA 13, 2014 Table 18.4(a) Some "Sprinkler Discharge Densities" are given as (for example): "0.30 plus high expansion foam" Does this mean the roof system needs

Tire Storage

NFPA 13, 2014 Table 18.4(a) Some "Sprinkler Discharge Densities" are given as (for example): "0.30 plus high expansion foam" Does this mean the roof system needs to be high expansion foam with a density of 0.3? I'm just confused with the use of the word "plus" and want to make sure it doesn't me

CMSA / Tire Storage (part 2)

I think I've read just about every cut sheet for every sprinkler head in existence but can't seem to find a CMSA head that can be used for tire storage. Does anybody know if one even exist? Brian Harris, CET BVS Systems Inc. Design Manager bvssystemsinc.com<http://bvssystemsin

RE: CMSA / Tire Storage

Never mind folks Book says CMDA but I was reading CMSA Thanks Travis! Brian Harris, CET BVS Systems Inc. bvssytemsinc.com<http://bvssystemsinc.com/> From: Brian Harris Sent: Friday, February 09, 2018 11:43 AM To: 'sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org' Subject: CMSA / T

CMSA / Tire Storage

Any chance table 18.4(a) (NFPA-13 2013) is labeled wrong? Reading 18.4 (1) says that table is for standard spray sprinklers but the table itself is labeled for CMSA ? Brian Harris, CET BVS Systems Inc. Design Manager bvssystemsinc.com Phone: 704.896.9989 Fax: 704.896.1

Re: Rubber Tire Storage

the same way. > > Matt > > > -Original Message- > From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] > On Behalf Of bcasterl...@fsc-inc.com > Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2018 1:38 PM > To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > S

RE: Rubber Tire Storage

, 2018 1:38 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Rubber Tire Storage Tires are hard to get lit and therefore hard to put out once you do (thermal inertia). Maybe the reason for the separate standard, more than the material composition, is the expected fire growth/decline rate

Re: Rubber Tire Storage

Tires are hard to get lit and therefore hard to put out once you do (thermal inertia). Maybe the reason for the separate standard, more than the material composition, is the expected fire growth/decline rate, decline whether sprinklered or not. I read somewhere years ago with a tire storage

RE: Rubber Tire Storage

Extension 77540 craig.pr...@ch2m.com From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of John Paulsen Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2018 1:30 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Rubber Tire Storage [EXTERNAL] James: He doesn't

RE: Rubber Tire Storage

sign. SL From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Prahl, Craig/GVL Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2018 10:31 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Rubber Tire Storage Tires are tires. Tires are not plastic milk jugs. Today'

RE: Rubber Tire Storage

-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of James Crawford Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2018 12:56 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Rubber Tire Storage [EXTERNAL] NFPA #13 (2013) is my reference. I have an AHJ that is telling me that Rubber Tires are classified as a Group "A&qu

RE: Rubber Tire Storage

Rd. Grove City, OH 43123 P - 614-782-2438 F - 614-782-2374 C - 614-348-8206 From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of James Crawford Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2018 12:56 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Rubber Tire Storage

RE: [EXTERNAL] Rubber Tire Storage

: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: [EXTERNAL] Rubber Tire Storage NFPA #13 (2013) is my reference. I have an AHJ that is telling me that Rubber Tires are classified as a Group "A" plastic for the purpose of commodity classifications. I have informed him that Rubber Tires are a

RE: Rubber Tire Storage

Xanax. From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of James Crawford Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2018 9:56 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Rubber Tire Storage NFPA #13 (2013) is my reference. I have an AHJ that is telling me

Re: Rubber Tire Storage

a > Group “A” plastic. > > > > I have shown him the Table A5.6.3 for Commodity classifications in NFPA > #13 where rubber tires are not mentioned and chapter 18 that deals with > Rubber Tire storage but he still disagrees. > > > > Any suggestions? > > >

Rubber Tire Storage

here are a synthetic rubber so are a Group "A" plastic. I have shown him the Table A5.6.3 for Commodity classifications in NFPA #13 where rubber tires are not mentioned and chapter 18 that deals with Rubber Tire storage but he still disagrees. Any suggestions? Thank you

Rubber Tire Storage

Reference is NFPA #13 (2013 ed) Table 18.4.(d) for a maximum 40'-0" high building there are 3 options. On side in palletized portable rack On tread or laced in open portable steel rack On tread, on side, and laced tires in open portable steel racks or palletized portable rack I

RE: Rubber Tire Storage

: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Rubber Tire Storage Full scale fire tests? On Apr 11, 2017, at 15:24, James Crawford wrote: We have an existing building protected with ESFR K17 sprinkler heads operating at 52 psi for 35’ storage in a 40’ high building. They want to store

Re: Rubber Tire Storage

can do, I am using > NFPA #13 (2013ed) for reference. > > Table 18.4(d) ESFR sprinkler protection for maximum 40’ building would allow > rubber tire storage on side in palletized portable racks, and that is all. > > They would like to use fixed racks without solid shelves, b

Rubber Tire Storage

or maximum 40' building would allow rubber tire storage on side in palletized portable racks, and that is all. They would like to use fixed racks without solid shelves, but I do not see this as an option, any ideas why this has been removed as the building gets higher? Thank y

Max Bldg Height Fixed vs Portable Racks ESFR Rubber Tire Storage

Good morning, NFPA 13 (2016) Table 18.4(d) I would appreciate any and all thoughts regarding comparing item two and item four. It appears that, all other things being equal, max building height is 40 feet when using palletized portable racks but 35 feet if the racks are fixed. I know a lo

RE: Tire Storage

with Craig. -Original Message- From: Bobby Gillett [mailto:gillet...@keyfireprotection.com] Sent: 12 March 2012 16:52 To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Tire Storage Agree, that is what I was thinking - any suggestions on the lower level? Just base it in what it is - 8&#x

RE: Tire Storage

forum@firesprinkler.org Subject: FW: Tire Storage My thinking is because they (THE MEZZANINES) go right to the face of the rack and the tires below are only protected by what trickles through on single racks and by what trickles through and enters the flue space on the double row racks - you do not get com

RE: Tire Storage

half Of rfletc...@aerofire.com Sent: Monday, March 12, 2012 2:32 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Tire Storage Why does the bottom 8 ft of storage have to be protected twice? If the ESFR's at the roof can do the storage the sprinklers below the grating are to protect the ais

FW: Tire Storage

...@aerofire.com Sent: Monday, March 12, 2012 1:32 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Tire Storage Why does the bottom 8 ft of storage have to be protected twice? If the ESFR's at the roof can do the storage the sprinklers below the grating are to protect the aisle and OH2 shou

RE: Tire Storage

: Monday, March 12, 2012 1:32 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Tire Storage Why does the bottom 8 ft of storage have to be protected twice? If the ESFR's at the roof can do the storage the sprinklers below the grating are to protect the aisle and OH2 should be adequate.

RE: Tire Storage

-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Bobby Gillett Sent: Monday, March 12, 2012 11:00 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Tire Storage Roland, I felt like if the ceiling is designed based on the 16'-0 high rack scenario and

RE: Tire Storage

Roland, I felt like if the ceiling is designed based on the 16'-0 high rack scenario and this will cover to the floor in the areas where the mezzanine is open (between racks in front of some, etc.). Then under the mezzanine protect this based on the same storage scenario but for 8'-0

RE: Tire Storage

.org] On Behalf Of Roland Huggins Sent: Monday, March 12, 2012 12:35 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Tire Storage This issue was tangentially discussed by the TC this cycle. It was flagged by several of us that explicit guidance is needed for ceilings that are metal grating such

Re: Tire Storage

This issue was tangentially discussed by the TC this cycle. It was flagged by several of us that explicit guidance is needed for ceilings that are metal grating such as mezzanines. It would also apply to walkways as discussed here. Nonetheless, the TC statement does shed some light on ad

RE: Tire Storage

...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Bobby Gillett Sent: Monday, March 12, 2012 12:52 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Tire Storage Agree, that is what I was thinking - any suggestions on the lower level? Just base it in what it is - 8'-0

RE: Tire Storage

cell www.keyfireprotection.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of craig.pr...@ch2m.com Sent: Monday, March 12, 2012 11:29 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Tire Storage Shou

RE: Tire Storage

m.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Bobby Gillett Sent: Monday, March 12, 2012 12:03 PM To: mi...@phoenixfp.net; sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Tire Storage Yes Bobby Gille

RE: Tire Storage

Hill Sent: Monday, March 12, 2012 10:53 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Tire Storage Sounds to me like an open grate mezzanine used as a walkway for the upper half of the rack. So basically the racks extend up through holes left in the mezzanine? Mike Hill -Original

RE: Tire Storage

: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Tire Storage I'm not sure I follow how your rack and mezzanine are arranged. Ours had about a 3,000 sf mezzanine with racks below and above. Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive Spartanburg, SC  29304

RE: Tire Storage

] On Behalf Of craig.pr...@ch2m.com Sent: Monday, March 12, 2012 11:38 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Tire Storage I'm not sure I follow how your rack and mezzanine are arranged. Ours had about a 3,000 sf mezzanine with racks below and above. Craig L. Prahl, CET

RE: Tire Storage

.8439 CH2MHILL Extension 74102 craig.pr...@ch2m.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Bobby Gillett Sent: Monday, March 12, 2012 11:21 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Tire St

RE: Tire Storage

resprinkler.org] On Behalf Of craig.pr...@ch2m.com Sent: Monday, March 12, 2012 10:04 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Tire Storage Are tires stored above and below the mezzanine? Is the mezzanine open grating? Also, is there a room for dead tires? Reason I ask is that my

RE: Tire Storage

ad room is sprinklered as is the roof over the upper level of rack storage however the tire storage rack below the mezzanine is not protected. Apparently the EOR figures that since it's open grating that the water will run down from above. DUMB assumption but common... Kicker i

Tire Storage

I am working on a tire store that has a 40x50 area on the back of the building dedicated for tire storage. The ceiling (open structure) is 22'-0 at the highest point, the racks are open 16'-0 high fixed in place - single and double row w/the double rows having about 16" flue spa

RE: Max spacing for Tire Storage

Tire Storage has its own chapter and it refers to many different densities depending on height and type of storage (all the way down including up to 5'-0). I would apply this chapter and if nothing else directed you otherwise then apply the 8.6.2.2.1 Bobby Gillett Sr. Project Manager Key

Re: Max spacing for Tire Storage

Since the other table (c) also states that in EH, if the density is >0.25 then you have 100 sq ft spacing and 12' max, then I would think it applies in all situations where you have densities >0.25 gpm / sq ft. On 10/13/2011 11:39 AM, Greg McGahan wrote: Well, 8' high ti

Re: Max spacing for Tire Storage

Well, 8' high tire storage isn't exactly high piled, so I am not sure if it applies or not? Greg On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 1:31 PM, Morey, Mike wrote: > Is there any reason table 8.6.2.2.1(d) (13 2010 ed) wouldn't apply? > Systems with a density of over .25 are limited t

RE: Max spacing for Tire Storage

.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Morey, Mike Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2011 1:32 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Max spacing for Tire Storage Is there any reason table 8.6.2

RE: Max spacing for Tire Storage

-boun...@firesprinkler.org on behalf of Greg McGahan Sent: Thu 10/13/2011 2:29 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Max spacing for Tire Storage I can not find it in the 2010 ed of 13 - so is ther ea limitation on head spacing in tire storage? We are at the .30 density in this applicatio

Max spacing for Tire Storage

I can not find it in the 2010 ed of 13 - so is ther ea limitation on head spacing in tire storage? We are at the .30 density in this application and the existing heads are spaced at 130 sqft. It would be great if they could stay there. Thanks, Greg McGahan -- Greg McGahan Living Water Fire

RE: Column Sprinklers in rubber tire storage

forum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Column Sprinklers in rubber tire storage The ESFR exception is in 2002 Section 12.3.1.7.1(3) but not carried to 12.4.1.1.1. You could check the code change documentation to see if the change was viewed as a change in requirements or only a clarification tha

RE: Column Sprinklers in rubber tire storage

ject: Column Sprinklers in rubber tire storage We have an AHJ that is using the 2002 NFPA 13 and doesn't care what is in the 07. We have 25 ft. high tire storage in portable racks in a 35 ft bldg. They want column sprinklers installed with the ESFR's because there is no specific exception (t

Column Sprinklers in rubber tire storage

We have an AHJ that is using the 2002 NFPA 13 and doesn't care what is in the 07. We have 25 ft. high tire storage in portable racks in a 35 ft bldg. They want column sprinklers installed with the ESFR's because there is no specific exception (that I can find) for column sprinklers as t

Rubber Tire Storage

Is there a maximum pile volume for rubber tires stored on side in portable racks 25 ft. high? Roof height is 35 ft. Ron Fletcher Aero Automatic Phoenix, AZ ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.or

Re: [Sprinklerforum] NFPA 231D 1994 - Tire Storage

[mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Chris Russel Sent: Monday, August 24, 2009 5:34 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: [Sprinklerforum] NFPA 231D 1994 - Tire Storage I am looking at a building with a system that was installed some time in the mid to late 90s

[Sprinklerforum] NFPA 231D 1994 - Tire Storage

I am looking at a building with a system that was installed some time in the mid to late 90s. Currently there is a tire shop in the building. I am trying to figure out if the system met the requirements of this hazard when it was installed. I did a little research and found that NFPA 231D 1994 wa

Tire Storage & ESFR

I have a 3 bay automotive service area that also contains tire storage. The building is 80L x 54W x 20H. There is a mezz area that is 80L x 25W on the back side with open grating flooring. The tires are stored on treads, on fixed double row rack. There are 2 levels below a mezzanine and 2 levels abov

tire storage

We have floor level, up 5-0 to solid shelf, up 5-0 to another solid shelf and 21-0 to roof. Maximum storage is 14-0. Which table in tire storage would one use?? Thanks in advance. Geoffrey H. Dyce Sales Manager Contractor I, #87582700012007 NICET IV Industrial Fire & Safety Inc. Ph:

RE: Tire storage

lywood shelving, layout the tire storage arrangement, and then cut out the "tire holes" and empty spaces in between the sidewalls as necessary to create an open area of around 70%. We used a plunge router with a round over bit to cut the holes and relieve the edge, so as not to scuff the side

Re: Tire storage

304-0491 > Direct - 864.599.4102 > Fax - 864.599.8439 > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://www.ch2m.com > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dyce Geoffrey > H. > Sent: Monday, October 06, 2008 9:44 AM > To: sprinklerforum@firesprin

RE: Tire storage

: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Tire storage We have a situation where tires are stored in fixed racks lying flat on solid plywood shelves with no flue space. The racks are 8-0 wide, plywood shelving at 5-0 and 10-0 for the first two elevations and open to the joists at the top layer. Tires

Tire storage

We have a situation where tires are stored in fixed racks lying flat on solid plywood shelves with no flue space. The racks are 8-0 wide, plywood shelving at 5-0 and 10-0 for the first two elevations and open to the joists at the top layer. Tires are not stored past 14-0. We work off NFPA 13,

SV: SV: SV: Rubber tire storage

lans -Ursprungligt meddelande- Från: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] För Joe Hankins Skickat: den 27 augusti 2007 15:59 Till: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Ämne: Re: SV: SV: Rubber tire storage Leif, The committee was eliminated when the separate storage standards were rolled int

Re: SV: SV: Rubber tire storage

;t there be one? Best regards/ Leif Glans -Ursprungligt meddelande- Från: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] För Joe Hankins Skickat: den 25 augusti 2007 16:52 Till: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Ämne: Re: SV: Rubber tire storage Portable racks have always been treated as multiple

SV: SV: Rubber tire storage

Ämne: Re: SV: Rubber tire storage Portable racks have always been treated as multiple-row racks because that's the way they behave in a fire. (Some people want to call them palletized storage when they are simply a pallet with a metal frame, but the space between the top of storage on one

SV: SV: Rubber tire storage

EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] För Joe Hankins Skickat: den 25 augusti 2007 16:52 Till: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Ämne: Re: SV: Rubber tire storage Portable racks have always been treated as multiple-row racks because that's the way they behave in a fire. (Some people wa

Re: SV: Rubber tire storage

et on the next level is what makes it rack storage, whether they are fixed or moveable). The nonsensical differentiation between portable rack storage of tires and fixed rack storage of tires was made by the tire storage committee, which did a number of "unusual" things before it

SV: Rubber tire storage

to me. Best regards/ Leif Glans -Ursprungligt meddelande- Från: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] För Roland Huggins Skickat: den 24 augusti 2007 18:14 Till: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Ämne: Re: Rubber tire storage The criteria has been around a while and I wasn't inv

Re: Rubber tire storage

gth so a larger remote is required. Table 12.4.2(b) Racks have a flue space providing a small but important gap every 4 feet or so. For these a smaller remote is allowed. Roland On Aug 24, 2007, at 8:01 AM, Leif Glans wrote: Hallo all! I have a situation with rubber tire storage for industria

Rubber tire storage

Hallo all! I have a situation with rubber tire storage for industrial trucks. The tires are roughly 2m high and stored on side in one level (on-tread?) The storage is on a loading dock and has a roof above it. The roof is roughly 8.5m high next to the factory and slopes outwards 2/12. If one