[WISPA] Weather Sensors

2010-09-21 Thread Blair Davis
I am looking for inexpensive, network aware weather sensors... Maybe temp, wind speed and wind direction to start. Other data would be useful as well. I want to put these on my towers and then aggregate the data on our webpage. Ideas? This is a small project and it can't go much over

Re: [WISPA] Weather Sensors

2010-09-21 Thread Chuck Profito
try Oregon Scientific Full Weather Station WMR80 / WMR80A I think one of these has a Ethernet port From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Blair Davis Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 11:47 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Weather

Re: [WISPA] Weather Sensors

2010-09-21 Thread Bret Clark
Reminds me of my favorite weather site where you can get real-time weather statistics from other users who have purchased online weather stations. http://www.wunderground.com/wundermap/? On 09/21/2010 03:25 AM, Chuck Profito wrote: try Oregon Scientific Full Weather Station WMR80 /

Re: [WISPA] tower tool bag

2010-09-21 Thread Bob Moldashel
Call Estex Manufacturing. They can make a canvas nose bag with reinforced rigid walls Sent via DROID on Verizon Wireless -Original message- From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tue, Sep 21, 2010 03:03:07 GMT+00:00 Subject: Re: [WISPA] tower

Re: [WISPA] Most effective Marketing / Advertisement

2010-09-21 Thread Jason Hensley
We've started doing the door hangars as well. When we do an install, installer will put a hanger on neighbors doors where we KNOW we can get them service. Beats all of the unknown random callers that we have to go a site survey before we know if we can service them. From:

Re: [WISPA] Kernel Patching

2010-09-21 Thread Marco Coelho
I still remember using a 4 bit microprocessor (4004 and 4040). On Mon, Sep 20, 2010 at 10:05 PM, RickG rgunder...@gmail.com wrote: I thought you were a 2 bit operator :P On Mon, Sep 20, 2010 at 11:00 PM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com wrote: I'm a 2 bit operation. Really.

Re: [WISPA] Weather Sensors

2010-09-21 Thread Dennis Burgess
Kinda kewl .. Wondering if you did mount them to your tower, what would be the max height you should place it at ? --- Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik WISP Support Services Office:

Re: [WISPA] I'm pulling Mikrotik

2010-09-21 Thread Charles n wyble
I use pfsense as my edge and core router and am happy with it. Hoping to turn up the initial socalwifi nodes this weekend. These will back haul through pfsense. So I will get a better sense of how it scales. Glenn Kelley gl...@hostmedic.com wrote: Tom - I think no matter what the solution

[WISPA] Specifications for Internet services on public frequency

2010-09-21 Thread Georges-Keny PAUL
Hello all, Some people of the list, like Robert West, Glenn Kelley and of course Matt Jenkins, strongly recommended me this list for my “case”. We are located in Haiti. My team is working on technical and technological specifications of a document for the deployment of Internet

Re: [WISPA] I'm pulling Mikrotik

2010-09-21 Thread Faisal Imtiaz
This has been an interesting thread... I cannot help but remember a story that someone told me when I was young. As an experiment, a group of blind folks were taken to a Zoo and introduced to an Elephant. Obviously they had never seen one. After the visit they were asked to describe their

[WISPA] [OT] US hunters shoot down Google fiber

2010-09-21 Thread David E. Smith
I know some of you don't like competiton, but this is going a bit too far... Google has revealed that aerial fibre links to its data centre in Oregon were regularly shot down by hunters, forcing the company to put its cables underground.

Re: [WISPA] I'm pulling Mikrotik

2010-09-21 Thread Steve Barnes
Faisal, Very, Very well stated. This is the strength of this list and at time the weakness. We are passionate people passionate about what we do and how we got to where we are. I cannot tell you the number of times that I have written full page emails here ready to flame someone for not

[WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Justin Mann
Hello, We are currently using Everyone.net 3rd-party email hosting provider for about 60 domains and 1000 email accounts. We are very displeased with their service and have decided to make a change. Last time it was a bit of a shot in the dark, this time we would like to make a choice we can

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Josh Luthman
I've used Gmail for a couple of years now. No cost, no issues. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Tue, Sep 21, 2010 at 12:23 PM, Justin Mann justinl...@unwiredwest.com wrote: Hello, We are currently using Everyone.net 3rd-party

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Mark Nash
Josh, have you set up multiple domains within Gmail? For the number of users we're talking about? - Original Message - From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 9:24 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Jeromie Reeves
I am happy with google for email. They are currently doing a forced change to the service that is going to make life less fun for people hosting with them for a bit. If you have say www.foo.com email hosted with them, and your user bar has the email b...@foo.com AND has a personal google account

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Josh Luthman
I have well under 1000 users total - maybe a few hundred. Probably 20 or 30 different domains. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Tue, Sep 21, 2010 at 12:29 PM, Mark Nash markl...@uwol.net wrote: Josh, have you set up multiple

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Josh Luthman
with them, and your user bar has the email b...@foo.com AND has a personal google account (igoogle) registered using said b...@foo.com, then they will be forcibly combined come this fall. Other then this It was this way at the latest November 2006. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct:

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Faisal Imtiaz
We run ours on in-house, on a cluster of on Centos Servers But if I had to out-source, I would consider Tucows email service before Google. Tucows service tend to be more suited for ISP/NSP's and they don't market to yours and our customers. Regards. Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet Telecom

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Justin Mann
What user email client are you using? Are your users happy with it? We are considering hosting email ourselves, as we used to, but we need an email client that is a little more full-featured and less clunky than the older web clients we were used to. On 09/21/2010 09:41 AM, Faisal Imtiaz

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Martha Huizenga
We use Horde for our webmail client. It's fairly user friendly and easy to use. Martha Huizenga DC Access, LLC http://www.dcaccess.net 202-546-5898 */Friendly, Local, Affordable, Internet!/**/ Connecting the Capitol Hill Community Join us on Facebook

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Josh Luthman
I used to use Horde and my users and I tend to agree..the Interface is hard to use. Roundcube is prettier and seemed to work for the short while we had it and Squirrel Mail was my users' favorite. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Martha Huizenga
I think Horde has definitely gotten better. I'll check out the others. martha Martha Huizenga DC Access, LLC http://www.dcaccess.net 202-546-5898 */Friendly, Local, Affordable, Internet!/**/ Connecting the Capitol Hill Community Join us on Facebook

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Mark Nash
We used to use Squirrel Mail and I though it was unprofessional. The Everyone.Net web interface is very good. It looks alot like Roundcube... - Original Message - From: Martha Huizenga To: WISPA General List Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 10:00 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA]

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Michael Baird
Zimbra is ahead of all of those, and it is a complete system that scales very well and is based on open software. Regards Michael Baird I think Horde has definitely gotten better. I'll check out the others. martha Martha Huizenga DC Access, LLC http://www.dcaccess.net 202-546-5898

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Jeromie Reeves
I do not think we are talking about the same issue here. http://www.google.com/support/a/bin/answer.py?hl=enanswer=181874 This just started a few months ago (on a voluntary basis) and will be a forced issue this fall (October ~) On Tue, Sep 21, 2010 at 9:35 AM, Josh Luthman

Re: [WISPA] I'm pulling Mikrotik

2010-09-21 Thread Faisal Imtiaz
Coming from enterprise wireline side of the business. Let me share with you something that we have seen with most of our customers. I personally think that 'providing' a router as part of a 'managed' service is a much better business proposition for ISP/NSP/WISP's than 'selling' them a

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Mark Nash
Unless I'm reading this incorrectly, Zimbra seems very full-featured and very pricey over time... I was looking at the appliances. - Original Message - From: Michael Baird To: WISPA General List Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 10:02 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Scott Lambert
On Tue, Sep 21, 2010 at 09:23:23AM -0700, Justin Mann wrote: Hello, We are currently using Everyone.net 3rd-party email hosting provider for about 60 domains and 1000 email accounts. We are very displeased with their service and have decided to make a change. Last time it was a bit of a

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Dennis Burgess
Justin, You can host that on a small server of your own. Other than the upkeep, etc, its not expensive. You can also give control of your domains to your end users IT departments, so you don't have to reset a password etc though a webased system. WE offer servers including the

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Mark Nash
That sounds attractive. I made the ultimate decision to move to outsourced email due to one driving factor: fear. Fear of losing our server and not having a backup, or having a backup that was too old. Nightly backups of the mail server is just not enough. With this many users, email is

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Layne Sisk
We use BlueTie and just recently migrated about 10,000 more users to their service. Tasks, calendaring, contacts, and up to 10G of storage. We found it was cheaper than doing it in-house, and better. You can get a trial account at their website www.bluetie.com, and test it out. If you like it

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Mark Nash
Their demo of their web client looks awesome... What's the pricing like? We're paying $.35 to $.45 for accounts now. Per domain branding? How was the migration? - Original Message - From: Layne Sisk la...@serverplus.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday,

Re: [WISPA] Specifications for Internet services on public frequency

2010-09-21 Thread Matt Jenkins
Do you have to contend with Foliage? If so do you have any pictures of what it looks like and how dense it is? This will have a major impact on what frequencies will be viable for use in your area. On 09/21/2010 06:54 AM, Georges-Keny PAUL wrote: Hello all, Some people of the list, like

Re: [WISPA] tower tool bag

2010-09-21 Thread RickG
like :) On Tue, Sep 21, 2010 at 7:38 AM, Bob Moldashel lakel...@gbcx.net wrote: Call Estex Manufacturing. They can make a canvas nose bag with reinforced rigid walls *Sent via DROID on Verizon Wireless* -Original message- *From: *RickG rgunder...@gmail.com * To: *WISPA

Re: [WISPA] Specifications for Internet services on public frequency

2010-09-21 Thread Georges-Keny PAUL
Basicaly, We will deal with hard environment, but not really foliage. One of the advantage with our country, it's you can easily have a coverage from one point. The link will coverage long distance. Maybe with multiple hop from one point to an other. Just to have an idea just take a look on Google

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Mike Hammett
Outlook, Outlook Express, Windows Mail, Windows Live Mail, Thunderbird, etc. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com On 9/21/2010 11:44 AM, Justin Mann wrote: What user email client are you using? Are your users happy with it? We are considering hosting

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Mike Hammett
I'm working on moving to Zimbra. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com On 9/21/2010 11:57 AM, Josh Luthman wrote: I used to use Horde and my users and I tend to agree..the Interface is hard to use. Roundcube is prettier and seemed to work for the short

Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti RMA Process

2010-09-21 Thread Jayson Baker
Yeah, they rock. Although, the last two times we RMA'ed Loco2's they sent us Nano2's. We told them. They said you sent us Nano2s I said no, we didn't. They said there's nothing more we can do Ok. Fine. I'll keep the more expensive product. Thanks! On Fri, Sep 17, 2010 at 3:37 PM, Robert

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread RickG
Josh, Do you have a link for that. I looked but all I found were fee services. Thanks! On Tue, Sep 21, 2010 at 12:24 PM, Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote: I've used Gmail for a couple of years now. No cost, no issues. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343

Re: [WISPA] [Mikrotik] FTTH Show

2010-09-21 Thread Jayson Baker
Wanted to go. Registered. Went there. They never took the money. So I used it to gamble instead. :-) On Mon, Aug 30, 2010 at 10:39 AM, Matt Larsen - Lists li...@manageisp.comwrote: Anyone here going to this show? http://www.ftthconference.com/FTTH10/public/enter.aspx Still deciding

[WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Robert West
Okay, fighting this nightmare of setting up a MT 411 board as a VPN. Anyone have a script of a step by step? I can connect remotely but can never see anything on the network. Throwing in the towel yet again. Me-

Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Josh Luthman
Probably want to masquerade the subnet. What ips did you use for the tunnel in relation to the other interfaces? On Sep 21, 2010 8:29 PM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com wrote: Okay, fighting this nightmare of setting up a MT 411 board as a VPN. Anyone have a script of a step by step?

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Chuck Hogg
There is not a free Google Partner edition any longer. Josh got in on a period when it was free, and loves to brag about it! Once he gets passed his alloted accounts, it won't be free any longer (I have some domains under it as well when it was free, but not my primary ISP domains). There is

Re: [WISPA] Specifications for Internet services on public frequency

2010-09-21 Thread Robert West
Welcome, Paul! From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Georges-Keny PAUL Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 9:55 AM To: wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Specifications for Internet services on public frequency Hello all, Some

Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Blake Covarrubias
What type of VPN? Could you give a bit more info on the network layout? I could probably shoot you over a config if I had that info. -- Blake Covarrubias On Sep 21, 2010, at 5:33 PM, Josh Luthman wrote: Probably want to masquerade the subnet. What ips did you use for the tunnel in relation

Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Robert West
Yep, did that. As far as the other interfaces, do I need to use ether3 as the vpn port? It's not plugged into anything, I was going into ether2 with the vpn as well as my local interface. From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman

Re: [WISPA] [Mikrotik] FTTH Show

2010-09-21 Thread Robert West
W I N ! From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jayson Baker Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 4:51 PM To: Mikrotik discussions Cc: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Mikrotik] FTTH Show Wanted to go. Registered. Went there. They never

Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti RMA Process

2010-09-21 Thread Robert West
Mike was drinking that night. Happens.. From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jayson Baker Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 4:20 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti RMA Process Yeah, they rock. Although, the last two

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Robert West
Email? I stopped with the email long ago however, we have some that INSIST on it so we just add them to our email account on our host. We pay a whole 100 bucks for a shared hosting account at IX Hosting. If they want email, we just add it to our unlimited' accounts for a 5 buck a month charge.

Re: [WISPA] Specifications for Internet services on public frequency

2010-09-21 Thread Robert West
Who on the list are in South America? May be similar. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Matt Jenkins Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 4:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Specifications for Internet

Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Robert West
Trying to connect remotely via windows based laptop, PtPP protocol. Setup the PtPP server with all the stuff, can connect just fine and get out to the internet but not into the private network. Missing something simple here. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org

Re: [WISPA] Specifications for Internet services on public frequency

2010-09-21 Thread Robert West
Sounds like a road trip.. J From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Georges-Keny PAUL Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 4:15 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Specifications for Internet services on public frequency

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Glenn Kelley
Bob Just imagine when a customer sends out an email asking for someone to renew their credit card or something else - and uses your domain... and sends it to your customer(s) I know a few this has happened with. It is always best to use something different. just my 2 cents. On Sep 21,

Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Faisal Imtiaz
Here is a step by step guide.. http://gregsowell.com/?p=680 If you can connect to via Winbox and see the logs, see if you are getting an IP address from the MK, and also check on your windows box to see if you are getting that IP. Most likely you are missing the ' add-default-route=yes'

Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Philip Dorr
If you are using the same IP subnet on the VPN and the Ethernet you need arp set to proxy-arp On Tue, Sep 21, 2010 at 8:29 PM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com wrote: Trying to connect remotely via windows based laptop, PtPP protocol.  Setup the PtPP server with all the stuff, can connect

Re: [WISPA] Specifications for Internet services on public frequency

2010-09-21 Thread Greg Ihnen
I'm in South America but way way out in the jungle. It's the wild wild west out here so compliance is easy. Regulations? We don't need no stinking regulations! This place is quieter than an anechoic chamber. But I know a guy who's running a wisp in town. His problem is it's the wild wild west

Re: [WISPA] Specifications for Internet services on public frequency

2010-09-21 Thread Glenn Kelley
we sent a number of UBNT radios down and both 2.4 and 5.8 were a mess... Airmax helped - but your right - stuff was just left running - who knows where. Our team did a bunch for the United Methodist Church - and have some backhauls hopping all the way to the DR vs purchasing local. 5.1

Re: [WISPA] tower tool bag

2010-09-21 Thread Scott Carullo
canvas army surplus water bucket Scott Carullo Technical Operations 877-804-3001 x102 From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 10:49 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] tower tool bag

Re: [WISPA] tower tool bag

2010-09-21 Thread Scott Carullo
the thicker ones won't collapse - long skinny ones will or ones that are too thin - canvas army water bucket seems good size, good stiffness, ridged ring on top etc Scott Carullo Technical Operations 877-804-3001 x102 From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com

Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Butch Evans
On Tue, 2010-09-21 at 20:28 -0400, Robert West wrote: Okay, fighting this nightmare of setting up a MT 411 board as a VPN. Anyone have a script of a step by step? I can connect remotely but can never see anything on the network. Throwing in the towel yet again. 99.9% probability: You

Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Francois Menard
Are you saying that the VPN server should not be in the same subnet as the subnet to which access is sought for ? its basically if there is a bridge, rather than a routed relationship between the VPN client and the VPN server ... thus the need for Proxy-ARP in that case ? ??? F. On

Re: [WISPA] Email hosting

2010-09-21 Thread Scott Carullo
Buy your own smartermail license or have someone with extra capacity like me do it for you just make sure if you do it you pay for all the extras to reduce spam and viruses otherwise you are going to have a bad experience. Scott Carullo Technical Operations 877-804-3001 x102

Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Josh Luthman
Usually no. I suggest a different subnet. On Sep 21, 2010 10:51 PM, Francois Menard fmen...@xittel.net wrote: Are you saying that the VPN server should not be in the same subnet as the subnet to which access is sought for ? its basically if there is a bridge, rather than a routed relationship

Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Faisal Imtiaz
I am not sure what type of configuration you folks are talking about. For my PPTP dial-in, I setup a IP Pool with a hand full of IP's from the same subnet as to what I am connecting to. The Local IP on the PPTP server is from the same subnet (Gateway IP), and Proxy-arp is enabled. (Setup a

Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Faisal Imtiaz
Let me clarify... As long as you get a valid IP on your PPTP client, from the PPTP Server, and the default route to the PPTP server, then you should be able to get to any of the IP's (public or private) being routed on that MK box. Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet Telecom On 9/21/2010 10:54

Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Josh Luthman
Can we see ppp secret print (KEEP IN MIND THE PASSWORDS ARE PLAINTEXT HERE!!!)? Then /ip addr pr Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Tue, Sep 21, 2010 at 11:09 PM, Faisal Imtiaz fai...@snappydsl.net wrote: Let me clarify... As

Re: [WISPA] Semi-OT: Getting consumer-level Internet connections fixed

2010-09-21 Thread Faisal Imtiaz
Patrick, The short answer to your question is NO... This feature is part of the Best Effort Service provided to Consumers. Thus the classification 'Consumer Class'. As frustrating as this is for Techies, this is also one of the primary reasons why the Tech folks who work for such service

Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Butch Evans
On Tue, 2010-09-21 at 23:07 -0400, Faisal Imtiaz wrote: I am not sure what type of configuration you folks are talking about. For my PPTP dial-in, I setup a IP Pool with a hand full of IP's from the same subnet as to what I am connecting to. The Local IP on the PPTP server is from the

Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Butch Evans
On Tue, 2010-09-21 at 23:09 -0400, Faisal Imtiaz wrote: Let me clarify... As long as you get a valid IP on your PPTP client, from the PPTP Server, and the default route to the PPTP server, then you should be able to get to any of the IP's (public or private) being routed on that MK box.

Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik VPN Script

2010-09-21 Thread Butch Evans
On Tue, 2010-09-21 at 22:51 -0400, Francois Menard wrote: Are you saying that the VPN server should not be in the same subnet as the subnet to which access is sought for ? No...I said that IF you are using IPs that are part of an existing subnet, then you WILL need to use proxy-arp to make it