Yes the newcomers need to face the "big dogs" with hundreds of servers.
No it's not "fair", but who was making the assumption that running a Team Fortress 2 server must be some fair utopia where we all split the amount of players evenly among ourselves? On Fri, Jan 24, 2014 at 3:40 PM, Doctor McKay <mc...@doctormckay.com> wrote: > So newcomers need to face the "big dogs" with hundreds of servers with > their one server? > > > Dr. McKay > www.doctormckay.com > > > On Fri, Jan 24, 2014 at 6:35 PM, Nerdboy <nerdb...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > An easy solution to allow newcomers to get more traffic would be to > > reduce the number of servers you run. That way quickplay traffic is > > distributed more evenly rather than "who bought the most rack space?" > > > > On 1/24/14, Valentin G. <nextra...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Then explain how should people remedy this situation? > > > > > > Not every community can retroactively join the master race and > > > suddenly be around for 6 years and have a great playerbase out of thin > > > air. Yes, there are servers that currently rely on quickplay. So what > > > if 50% is QP traffic. That's still 50% of players that are returning. > > > In order to increase that percentage of returning players we still > > > *need* to have the other 50%. If people don't even come to your server > > > in the first place (by being in the 50% QP population) there is not > > > even the *chance* of them staying around. > > > > > > This is the model when you use QP. Use the system, deliver an > > > experience that continuously moves the split towards a healthy, > > > returning player base. Of course it would be great if players still > > > went around the server browser and naturally found out about new > > > servers and stayed there. Since that doesn't happen anymore, newer > > > communities have to rely on quickplay. That's simply how it works. > > > It's really great for all the people here that have a long history in > > > their community and a stable and returning playerbase already. Not > > > everyone can enjoy that, and you are trying to prevent them from even > > > having the ability to achieve that. > > > > > > I really hope one day people get that into their thick heads. There > > > are start-ups that haven't been around since the TF2 beta. They *can > > > not* have as healthy of a playerbase as you already have. Don't talk > > > them down because of that, and even applaud Valve when every chance of > > > building up their community is ripped from their hands. > > > > > > On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 12:14 AM, Gordon Reynolds > > > <thisisgordonsem...@gmail.com> wrote: > > >> Maybe there is a point to take from this. > > >> > > >> Maybe the kind of people who played TF2 pre-F2P era, aren't the same > > >> people > > >> who want to play TF2 now? > > >> > > >> Demographics change, if you think the same type of people pick up TF2 > > >> today > > >> as the ones who paid money to pick it up pre-F2P, you might be in for > a > > >> bit > > >> of a shock. Or not, look at your numbers, 50% of your population is > just > > >> there because that's where they ended up, they didn't choose to be on > > >> your > > >> server. > > >> > > >> > > >> On Fri, Jan 24, 2014 at 3:10 PM, Doctor McKay <mc...@doctormckay.com> > > >> wrote: > > >> > > >>> Find me a vanilla server that remains populated without the help of > > >>> Quickplay. They don't exist. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Dr. McKay > > >>> www.doctormckay.com > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> On Fri, Jan 24, 2014 at 6:07 PM, Gordon Reynolds < > > >>> thisisgordonsem...@gmail.com> wrote: > > >>> > > >>> > So if you've had a server for a few years and you still get 47% > > >>> > quickplay > > >>> > traffic doesn't that tell you that you're running a server that > might > > >>> > be > > >>> > twice as large as it needs to be? I mean if you pulled regulars > from > > >>> > quickplay players wouldn't that number slowly drop (during peak), > > >>> > because > > >>> > of all your regulars? > > >>> > > > >>> > Or do quickplayer honestly, literally, -not care what server they > are > > >>> on-, > > >>> > and will never add your server to favorites as is? > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>> > On Thu, Jan 23, 2014 at 8:11 PM, Doctor McKay < > mc...@doctormckay.com > > > > > >>> > wrote: > > >>> > > > >>> > > The cvar was actually added at the request of myself and several > > >>> others. > > >>> > > > > >>> > > I took the liberty to make a chart showing exactly what percent > of > > >>> > > my > > >>> > > players come from Quickplay. The result was disappointingly high: > > >>> > > http://i.imgur.com/91xNnU1.png > > >>> > > > > >>> > > I don't expect any more than 20% of Quickplay users to uncheck > the > > >>> > > "Official servers only" box. That means that I have lost around > 40% > > >>> > > of > > >>> my > > >>> > > traffic. My community is relatively popular, too. Smaller > > >>> > > communities > > >>> or > > >>> > > communities that are just starting up will lose a lot more > traffic > > >>> than I > > >>> > > will. > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > Dr. McKay > > >>> > > www.doctormckay.com > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > On Thu, Jan 23, 2014 at 10:48 PM, Robert Paulson < > > >>> thepauls...@gmail.com > > >>> > > >wrote: > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > It's quite obvious really. Valve only makes features to benefit > > >>> > > themselves > > >>> > > > or players, and cl_connectmethod was at face value did not do > > >>> > > > either > > >>> > one. > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > They don't care about server owners having this knowledge > unless > > >>> > > > it > > >>> > > > benefits them and didn't even bother to protect the convar from > > >>> > spoofing > > >>> > > by > > >>> > > > a using 1 convar flag. > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > Its main purpose was to stop server owners from complaining > about > > >>> > > > all > > >>> > the > > >>> > > > restrictions placed on quickplay on the flawed assumption that > > >>> > quickplay > > >>> > > is > > >>> > > > a tiny and unimportant part of your player base. > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > On Thu, Jan 23, 2014 at 7:20 PM, Doctor McKay > > >>> > > > <mc...@doctormckay.com > > >>> > > > >>> > > > wrote: > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > While I agree with what you are saying, what does > > >>> > > > > cl_connectmethod > > >>> > have > > >>> > > > to > > >>> > > > > do with any of this? > > >>> > > > > On Jan 23, 2014 9:12 PM, "Robert Paulson" > > >>> > > > > <thepauls...@gmail.com> > > >>> > > wrote: > > >>> > > > > > > >>> > > > > > First they came for the custom attachments, and I did not > > >>> > > > > > speak > > >>> > out. > > >>> > > > > > Because I did not use it. > > >>> > > > > > Then they came for fast respawn, and I did not speak out. > > >>> Because I > > >>> > > did > > >>> > > > > not > > >>> > > > > > use it. > > >>> > > > > > Then they came for increased slots, and I did not speak > out. > > >>> > Because > > >>> > > I > > >>> > > > > did > > >>> > > > > > not use it. > > >>> > > > > > Then they came for the MOTD, and I did not speak out. > Because > > >>> > > > > > it > > >>> > > would > > >>> > > > > hurt > > >>> > > > > > others more than me. > > >>> > > > > > Then they came for me, and there was no one left to speak > for > > >>> > > > > > me. > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > This is a repeat of the "Custom Tabs" fiasco. Except Valve > > >>> probably > > >>> > > > won't > > >>> > > > > > remove it this time because they can wave the evidence > that a > > >>> > > minority > > >>> > > > of > > >>> > > > > > players use quickplay, despite the fact that quickplay has > a > > >>> > monopoly > > >>> > > > on > > >>> > > > > > new players and without them your server is dead. Your > > current > > >>> > > players > > >>> > > > > > won't play TF2 forever. > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > I saw this coming a mile away when Valve released the > > >>> > > cl_connectmethod > > >>> > > > > > convar. As I have said time and time again, Valve has > > >>> > > > > > obligations > > >>> > to > > >>> > > > > server > > >>> > > > > > owners as well as players. We, or at least I, bought TF2 > > >>> expecting > > >>> > > not > > >>> > > > > to > > >>> > > > > > have our hosting abilities crippled so much. > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > On Thu, Jan 23, 2014 at 5:11 PM, Doctor McKay < > > >>> > mc...@doctormckay.com > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > wrote: > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > Why? > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > Adding a "Valve servers only" checkbox (that's checked by > > >>> > default) > > >>> > > is > > >>> > > > > > going > > >>> > > > > > > to hurt enough (and only those communities that are > playing > > >>> > > > > > > by > > >>> > the > > >>> > > > > rules; > > >>> > > > > > > cheating communities will just steal *more* traffic from > > the > > >>> > > > legitimate > > >>> > > > > > > communities). > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > It's now all but impossible to try to retain a client who > > >>> joined > > >>> > > via > > >>> > > > > > > Quickplay (and those are the clients we *need* to > retain). > > >>> > > > > > > We > > >>> > can't > > >>> > > > > show > > >>> > > > > > > them our website. We can't even allow them to use a menu > to > > >>> jump > > >>> > to > > >>> > > > > > another > > >>> > > > > > > one of our servers anymore. > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > Please think about what you're doing. If your intention > is > > >>> > > > > > > to > > >>> > harm > > >>> > > > the > > >>> > > > > > good > > >>> > > > > > > communities, you're doing a fine job at it. > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > Dr. McKay > > >>> > > > > > > www.doctormckay.com > > >>> > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > >>> > > > > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the > > list > > >>> > > > archives, > > >>> > > > > > > please visit: > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > >>> > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > >>> > > > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the > list > > >>> > > archives, > > >>> > > > > > please visit: > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > >>> > > > > > > > >>> > > > > _______________________________________________ > > >>> > > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > > >>> > archives, > > >>> > > > > please visit: > > >>> > > > > > > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > >>> > > > > > > >>> > > > _______________________________________________ > > >>> > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > > >>> archives, > > >>> > > > please visit: > > >>> > > > > > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > _______________________________________________ > > >>> > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > > >>> > > archives, > > >>> > > please visit: > > >>> > > > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > >>> > > > > >>> > _______________________________________________ > > >>> > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > > archives, > > >>> > please visit: > > >>> > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > >>> > > > >>> _______________________________________________ > > >>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > archives, > > >>> please visit: > > >>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > >>> > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > >> please visit: > > >> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > > please visit: > > > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > please visit: > > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > > _______________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > _______________________________________________ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
