On 08 Jul 2015, at 18:46, John Clark wrote:
On Wed, Jul 8, 2015 , Bruno Marchal <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Nonsense. I can show you the diaries proving that the
Helsinki Man did write "I see Moscow" AND did write "I see
Washington".
> Yes, but (I see Moscow) and (I see Washington)
describes two different, and exclusive, first person experience.
Those two first person experiences are indeed
different from each other but they do have one thing in common,
they both have equally vivid memories of being the Helsinki Man
yesterday, and if that's not what being the Helsinki Man today means
then what does it mean?
> you are here again confusing the 3-1 view (an outsider
description of the first person experiences (plural) of the two
copies, and the 1-views [...] You keep confusing the 3-1 view
and the 1-views
I'm not generally a BIG fan of acronyms but you seem to like
them and I fear you will get carpal tunnel from typing "you
confuse the 1p with the 3p" so often, so how about YCT1PWT3P ?
> "I the Helsinki Man predict that I will see Moscow AND
Washington" is correct if "I-the helsinki man" refers to two persons
It refers to ANYONE who remembers saying "I the Helsinki Man
predict that I will see Moscow AND Washington". So Bruno you
tell me, after the duplication how many people remember saying
that?
> but after the duplication, "I-the Helsinki man" refers to two
exclusive and incompatible FIRST-PERSON EXPERIENCES,
There is absolutely nothing incompatible about two different
people having equally vivid memories of being the Helsinki Man. Yes
its odd because we are not accustomed to people duplicating
machines, but odd is not the same as illogical.
>> Not that predictions, good bad or mediocre, have anything to
do with the nature of personal identity or consciousness.
> This is wrong,
So when something does not turn out as you expected you black out
and lose consciousness or no longer feel that you are Bruno
Marchal or both.
> and irrelevant
So your "proof" has nothing to do with consciousness or the nature
of personal identity. Then what is it about?
> that has nothing to do with UDA
Maybe so I don't know, I've forgot again what "UDA" is. I know
you've told me before but it must be pretty forgettable. Wait a
minute... I think the D has something to do with a bird... is it
dovetail?
I see only your usual rhetorical tricks, and you don't answer the
question asked.
Just answer this. I recall that W means "I feel to be in W", and "I
feel to be in M", with the "I" being the first person I, that is the
owner of personal diary/memory which is taken in the
teletransportation box.
I recall that you have agreed that the first person experiences W and
M are incompatible and belongs to separate streams of consciousness/
first person experiences.
I recall that you have agreed that P(coffee) = 1 (in the step 3
protocol)
The question is: do you agree that in Helsinki P("W v M") = 1?
Bruno
John K Clark
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