On 03 Aug 2015, at 18:51, John Clark wrote:
On Mon, Aug 3, 2015 at 5:30 AM, Bruno Marchal <[email protected]>
wrote:
>>> Then you die with the simple teleportation.
>> Then who will die in the simple teleportation?
> You, when you are in Helsinki.
For the sake of clarity and consistency when dealing with this
topic John Clark humbly requests that Bruno Marchal make the
following simple changes in future correspondence with John Clark:
1) Substitute "John Clark" for the personal pronoun "you".
We have explained to you that the key is in the difference between 1-
Clark and 3-Clark, or 1-you and 3-you, or 1-me and 3-me. not in the
use of names and pronouns.
2) Keep in mind that after the duplication there is no such thing as
*THE* 1p that John Clark will experience in the future. Thank you
for your cooperation.
Yes, but we have refuted this. Indeed all your copies refute that
prediction, as anyone able to read can see.
You are continuing your rhetorical tricks.
> it is not abaout the lmocation of your bodies, but about the
first person experience
There are two first person experiences, which one is Bruno
talking about?
We have shown that P((W & ~M) v (M & ~W)) = 1, for the exact same
reason that P(coffee) = 1.
So you can be sure (modulo the hypothesis and the protocole) that you
will have a unique experience of seeing a unique city after pushing
the button. "The" refers to that unique experience. "unique" from the
1-pov, of course, as from the 3-1 view, they are not unique. But they
$are* unique from the 1-pov, ad as the question is about that 1-pov
prediction, it makes sense to refer to it.
> that you will live (again, with that non ambiguous definition
of identity that we have agree on).
The definition John Clark agreed on is "you" is somebody who
remembers being a man in Helsinki. On Monday Wednesday and Friday
Bruno agrees with this definition, on Tuesday Thursday and Saturday
Bruno does not, and on Sunday Bruno is a bit confused.
Lies. The same definition is used for the person. The difference you
see is when we address the question, we need to emphasize the 1p
refered to in the question.
> You avoid to answer the question/ What do you expect to live
after pushing the button.
Avoid the question my ass! Just yesterday John Clark said clear
as a bell "that depends on who "you" is. John Clark would know
that in the future the Moscow Man would see Moscow and the
Washington Man would see Washington. [...] And I [John
Clark] also knew which one would be which, I knew the Moscow Man
would get his photons from Moscow and the Washington Man would get
his photons from Washington. [...] what Bruno Marchal would
expect John Clark neither knows nor cares because expectations,
correct ones or incorrect ones, have nothing to do with the
continuity of consciousness or the unique feeling of self."
You make my point by avoiding the question again and again and again.
I think it is hopeless, as you just avoid systematically the question.
You are in Helsinki, you will push the button. The question is what do
you expect to live as first person experience?
- I expect to die.
- I expect to feel myself in two cities at once.
- I expect to feel myself in only one city.
I recall you that we have agreed on the identity criterion
(remembering Helsinki and the personal pushing on the button), and the
definition of the first person experience (here it is just remembering
it and its description in the personal diary). This leads, assuming
computationalism of course (or more general), only one option above
open, as the diaries of both copies confirmed (for people able to read).
Bruno
> you and Peck are the only one having a problem here.
Then Peck and Clark are the only ones here who can think
rationally on this subject.
> You are just playing with word.
And you are using words like a naive child not like a logician
with a disciplined mind.
John K Clark
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
Groups "Everything List" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
send an email to [email protected].
To post to this group, send email to [email protected].
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"Everything List" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email
to [email protected].
To post to this group, send email to [email protected].
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
