RE: VXA tape trouble and warning
Recently, there was a post on this list about loss of data with VXA drives if the power is cycled while a tape is in the drive. Some of the statements in that post were incorrect. One very important correction: VXA tape drives DO have the capability to recover data after a power loss. This is an explanation from the Ecrix technical support team of exactly how this works. HOW DO MOST DRIVES HANDLE POWER LOSS? With most tape backup devices, a loss of power means a loss of data. If power is lost during a write operation a tape drive will not have a proper end of data marker which defines where the current backup finished. This separates new and old data. When the 'power loss' tape is read a fatal error may occur when a tape drive crosses the boundary between new and old data. HOW DOES VXA HANDLE POWER LOSS? If a VXA drive is powered off in the middle of a write operation, it can still recover the data. It does this by correcting the data format to take into account the absence of an end of data marker. This will allow reading of the tape up to the point where power was lost. However, the drive must go through a recovery process to determine where the boundary between new and old data. You can expect 1-4 hours before the drive comes ready. With firmware of V2848 or lower the middle (rectangle) LED would blink. With V2959 firmware the right arrow will blink green/yellow indicating a format recovery is underway. HOW DOES VXA HANDLE OTHER INTERRUPTIONS? If a write operation stops sending data to the tape drive for 10 minutes the drive will write a 'pseudo' end of data marker and then reposition itself to the back side of the last block of data that was just written. This way the tape can be read with no problems. A WORD OF CAUTION All this being said, it is NOT a good idea to power off ANY tape drive with a tape still in the drive. The best protection for your data is to remove the tape before powering off your drive. If you are having difficulties with any tapes caused by a power interruption, please contact us at [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Frank Saab [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ecrix -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Search: http://www.mail-archive.com/retro-talk%40latchkey.com/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
Re: VXA tape trouble and warning
I've reset DDS-* drives by holding down the eject button for 5 seconds to soft reset the device. Can the same be accomplished on these drives It might save your tapes. I am having troubles with my VXA tapes and thought I'd pass on some signs, symptoms and a warning. The warning: Don't powercycle the VXA drive with a tape in it. Ecrix confirms that one is *likely* to destroy or lose some header information and the tape *may* then be recognized by RS as ERASED. There is no way to recover the umpteen gigs of info that are already on the tape at this point. Let me hear you all say redundant backups three times real fast right now! The trouble: Lost communications between the computer and the VXA drive. Backup will stall in the middle for various reasons (client dropped off the network, 519 errors, slow response...). RS will still be trying to run the backup and I've been able to stop the backup. Upon starting any backup to the tape at this point, the VXA drive is unrecognized (no SCSI drive recognition while RS scans the bus). I then restarted the computer, and powercycled the drive (tape still in it, as it wouldn't eject using the front panel). Tape is now unrecognized by RS and is listed as "erased" when it is inserted. Neither RS nor ECRIX have any solution (they reviewed the RS log files and their own log files from the drive), although ECRIX said they thought RS was working on communications problems with the drive, this was not confirmed by RS support. Haven't solved the communications problem yet, but if anyone has suggestions, I'm looking for answers. Suspects are SCSI cables (easy to check, just haven't traded them out yet). -- Todd Williams UCSD ECE Computing Support Group (858)-534-7821 If you ever stop learning . . . perhaps you're dead!!! -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Search: http://www.mail-archive.com/retro-talk%40latchkey.com/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
Re: VXA vexations
Same SCSI card, same cable, same tapes (tried several), very similar computer, same OS, same version of Retrospect; the only thing that seems to be different is the location of the drive. Is it possible that you don't have an up to date ATTO driver installed? Pam -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Search: http://www.mail-archive.com/retro-talk%40latchkey.com/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
Re: VXA vexations
Title: Re: VXA vexations re: 206 errors on Mac Ecrix have revised the drive firmware to V2848 11/11/00in order to address some of these problems. Timing problems may vary from one system to another, even with the same cable/adapter/terminator/drive due to differences in the system clock and bus speeds and also due to system and network loading effects. Take a look at the Ecrix site for more info and make sure you're using current firmware: http://www.ecrix.com/support/faqdetail.cfm?id=139 Doug.Wyman Houston TX I've got a VXA drive with the low-voltage differential SCSI interface, and Retrospect is giving me 206 errors whenever I try to back anything up to the drive. When first received, the drive was attached to my desktop G3 (beige) for testing, and worked very well. Once I felt it was ready for full use (and when I finally found the time) the drive and the ATTO SCSI card were moved to another beige G3 desktop that serves as our primary backup machine. Now I can't get the thing to back up anything without giving the dirty heads, bad media error. Same SCSI card, same cable, same tapes (tried several), very similar computer, same OS, same version of Retrospect; the only thing that seems to be different is the location of the drive. The backup machine is located in the server closet, along with lots of other equipment. I've tried a few different locations within the space that's available to me, but that has done nothing to help. The Retrospect knowledgebase says something about interference from another device being the culprit in something like this. Has anyone else seen stuff like this from VXA drives, or is it just me, or perhaps something gone south on the drive? -- David G. Thornton Mac Systems Manager CCL Label, Sioux Falls, SD e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] This message transmitted on 100% recycled electrons. -- -- To subscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives: http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Search: http://www.mail-archive.com/retro-talk%40latchkey.com/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
Re: VXA rewinds before incremental backup?
...is Retrospect smart enough to continue where it left off without rewinding the tape? Yes, Retrospect is a damn good tool. As Irena said, the tape will be rewined to check what tape it is. Then Retrospect will forward the tape to put the new information *after* the old one. It takes a little longer than a HD backup but it works. thanx, / jakob -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
Re: VXA rewinds before incremental backup?
Hi Bob, If you insert a VXA tape, the tape drive *must* get to the beginning of the tape in order to read the header information. Retrospect has no way of knowing what tape it's dealing with if the tape drive can't report the information stored in the header. Thanks, Irena Solomon Dantz Tech Support 925.253.3050 [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Bob Stern [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: "retro-talk" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat, 7 Oct 2000 13:39:50 -0700 To: "retro-talk" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: VXA rewinds before incremental backup? If you are doing an incremental backup and you insert a VXA tape that has not been used since the last backup, is Retrospect smart enough to continue where it left off without rewinding the tape? Or is rewinding necessary before and after every write session? Bob Stern -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050. -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
RE: VXA Discount URL
Robert: It's at www.ecrix.com/eval The promotional offer is extended through October. --Geoff Rainville, Ecrix. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Robert Schwalbe Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2000 5:04 PM To: retro-talk Subject: VXA Discount URL Within the last three weeks it seems that someone made mention of Ecrix extending a special promotion that included a 30 day evaluation unit along with software, accessories, and a pretty darn good price. It certainly doesn't seem to be promoted on Ecrix's website and while even though I've seen the web pages that contained this special extended offer with my own eyes, I've seemed to misplace the URL. Would someone be kind enough to either once again post it to this list or just e-mail it to me? -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050. -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
Re: VXA Mac Tool
I'm running it on a beige G3 300MHz desktop. I wouldn't trust a Power Computing system as a backup server...those are the Packard-Bell of the Mac clone world. Actually, most of the motherboards are the same as the Apple equivalents. They changed other things like floppy drives and CD-ROM drives to a cheaper 3rd party though. Yep. And most used the 7200 as the basis for that equivalency. And the 7200 was Apple's answer to Packard Bell. -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
Re: VXA Mac Tool
The VXA isn't on a PPC as the backup server. The PPC is only a workbench I'm using to test the drive. I'm trying to figure out why the device is always blowing up in use with hardware sense code failures or stuck tapes. This is the second drive we've gotten from Ecrix. The backup system is a blue G3 with an Adaptec 2930CU card installed for the SCSI bus. I can't find any firmware updaters or drivers on Adaptec's site for this card for Macintoshes. I'm thinking of putting the tape drive on its own bus with an Adaptec 2906 SCSI-2 card. Needless to say, I'd really like this drive to be rock stable, and so far it hasn't been. If anyone has any advice pro or con on using the 2906, I'd like to hear it. On 9/27/00, Jon Gardner sent an email about Re: VXA Mac Tool I'm running it on a beige G3 300MHz desktop. I wouldn't trust a Power Computing system as a backup server...those are the Packard-Bell of the Mac clone world. -- -- Infoasis --- 534 4th St., Ste. 2 --- San Rafael, CA 94901 (415) 459-7991 --- FAX: (415) 459-7992 [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- http://www.infoasis.com -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
Re: VXA Mac Tool
Yep. And most used the 7200 as the basis for that equivalency. And the 7200 was Apple's answer to Packard Bell. lol. The don't wanna-be Performa? 7200 as built was as stable as anything else. It earned it's bad reputation based soley off of the fact that it was hard to upgrade. For it's moment in time, it was a nice machine, although, at the time upgradability was a key issue for many people, myself included. I never recommended buying a 7200, just like I cannot recommend getting a Cube now. Matt -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
Re: VXA Mac Tool
on 9/26/00 9:00 PM, Todd Reed at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Has any one had any luck using the VXA tool on a Mac? My version just bombs with some cryptic error that it can't find the target. Doesn't crash, but doesn't find the drive either though the drive is listed in the window. Yeah, it works great for me. Be sure that no other programs are running that might be accessing the SCSI devices (like, for example, Retrospect). Jon L. Gardner '89, Computer Systems Manager mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Texas AM University Dept. of Food Services http://food.tamu.edu/ Tel 979.458.1839 * Fax 979.845.2157 * Hip 979.229.4323 PGP public key available at http://food.tamu.edu/pgp/jon.html -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
Re: VXA Mac Tool
on 9/27/00 4:18 PM, Todd Reed at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ecrix is telling me that the tool has problems running on older Macs. I'm using a beige Power Computer 150 mhz system and the built-in SCSI. The tool is noting that it's using the asynchronous SCSI manager. Anyone having any luck running the tool on beige Macs? I'm running it on a beige G3 300MHz desktop. I wouldn't trust a Power Computing system as a backup server...those are the Packard-Bell of the Mac clone world. Jon L. Gardner '89, Computer Systems Manager mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Texas AM University Dept. of Food Services http://food.tamu.edu/ Tel 979.458.1839 * Fax 979.845.2157 * Hip 979.229.4323 PGP public key available at http://food.tamu.edu/pgp/jon.html -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
Re: VXA Mac Tool
Jon Gardner [EMAIL PROTECTED] slyly asked: So, hey, Dantz folks, when can we start beta-testing Retrospect X? Well, since we're on 4.3 now, I think we should have Retrospect X (ten) by about Spring 2009. Please note that this schedule will slip as necessary to enforce reliability standards. ;-) Eric Ullman Dantz Development -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
Re: VXA Mac Tool
Has any one had any luck using the VXA tool on a Mac? My version just bombs with some cryptic error that it can't find the target. Doesn't crash, but doesn't find the drive either though the drive is listed in the window. Todd On 9/26/00, Geoff Rainville emailed about "VXA Mac Tool": There was some talk on this list last week about the VXA Tool for Mac. It is now live and posted on the ecrix.com site, in the support section. VXATool for MAC is a MAC based utility used to configure your VXA-1 tape drive. With VXATool, you can check and uplevel firmware, optimize the drive for speed or capacity, and toggle compression off or on. As someone mentioned last week, this ain't a pretty program, but just a nice, functional tool. Enjoy, and thanks for VXA support. http://www.ecrix.com/support/download.html --Geoff Rainville, Ecrix. -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050. [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.infoasis.com Just my two cents worth... Your mileage may vary -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
Re: VXA
Does anyone have experience with the VXA autoPAK system? If so, how has it performed for you? Thank you for any feedback. :-) Sincerely, Robert Cooper MIS Director Renaissance TTP, Inc. Not exactly your answer, but Yes, I DO have an autopak. I'm TRYING to run it off an Apple Mac G4 (OS 9.0.4) but the G4 doesn't see the damn thing!! What server type are you (looking to) running it from? Mark Witrylak Computer Support Team Ysgol Seicoleg School of Pyschology Prifysgol Cymru, Bangor University of Wales, Bangor Adeilad Brigantia The Brigantia Building Ffordd Penrallt Penrallt Road (Off College Rd) Bangor Bangor Gwynedd LL57 2ASGwynedd LL57 2AS Cymru Wales ffon: 01248 388214Tel: 01248 388214 ffacs: 01248 382599Fax: 01248 382599 -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: VXA
Well i was hoping to run it from a Beige G3! Sounds like their may be some problems though. Thank you for your input! Does anyone have experience with the VXA autoPAK system? If so, how has it performed for you? Thank you for any feedback. :-) Sincerely, Robert Cooper MIS Director Renaissance TTP, Inc. Not exactly your answer, but Yes, I DO have an autopak. I'm TRYING to run it off an Apple Mac G4 (OS 9.0.4) but the G4 doesn't see the damn thing!! What server type are you (looking to) running it from? Mark Witrylak Computer Support Team -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: VXA
Let me jump in gentleman and give a bit of feedback. Dantz has seen no complaints or incompatibilities thus far where the AutoPak is concerned. As of today we fully support the AutoPak on both platforms provided you are using 4.2 Mac/5.1 Windows or later. For the mac product I would strongly recommend using Retrospect 4.3 as it greatly enhances the performance of the Ecrix VXA drive. What I would suggest Robert is getting you in contact with someone at Ecrix that could answer any preliminary questions as well as any technical questions you may have concerning the stability of the AutoPak on a Mac G3 using Retrospect. I will get someone to contact you directly via email. Mark, I would ask that you get in touch with our tech support department on your issue so we can determine where things on your end are going wrong. I would contact tech support via email ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) seeing that you are in the UK, but if you would like to do it via phone here's the number to call, +1.925.253.3000 then choose option 1. I hope this helps. Shawn Shawn Stuckey Business Development Manager Dantz Development Corporation BetterBackup.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Robert Cooper Sent: Thursday, September 07, 2000 10:45 AM To: retro-talk Subject: Re: VXA Well i was hoping to run it from a Beige G3! Sounds like their may be some problems though. Thank you for your input! Does anyone have experience with the VXA autoPAK system? If so, how has it performed for you? Thank you for any feedback. :-) Sincerely, Robert Cooper MIS Director Renaissance TTP, Inc. Not exactly your answer, but Yes, I DO have an autopak. I'm TRYING to run it off an Apple Mac G4 (OS 9.0.4) but the G4 doesn't see the damn thing!! What server type are you (looking to) running it from? Mark Witrylak Computer Support Team -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
I've added the two OnStream drives (ADR50 and SC30) in the internal SCSI configurations (wide connector if available). I've listed the pricing I can get to keep the comparison prices consistent. Steve Rothman, the Eliant 820 is an Exabyte drive utilizing an 8mm helical scan tape. The VXA-1 media $/GB price is also actually a bit higher than you calculated Media $/GB --- Exabyte M2: 60GB, 12MB/s, $3777 ($80 media) 1.33 Sony AIT-2: 50GB, 6MB/s, $3289 ($94 media) 1.88 DLT 8000 : 40GB, 6MB/s, $3915 ($64 media) 1.60 Sony AIT-1: 35GB, 3MB/s, $1913 ($88 media) 2.51 VXA-1 : 33GB, 3MB/s, $939 ($67 media) 2.03 ADR50 : 25GB, 2MB/s, $697 ($46 media) 1.84 DDS-4 : 20GB, 3MB/s, $1072 ($33 media) 1.65 Mammoth : 20GB, 3MB/s, $2126 ($56 media) 2.80 DLT 4000 : 20GB, 1.5MB/s, $1352 ($64 media) 3.20 SC30 : 15GB, 2MB/S, $438 ($41 media) 2.73 Mammoth-LT: 14GB, 2MB/s, $1193 ($35 media) 2.50 DDS-3 : 12GB, 1MB/s, $777 ($16 media) 1.33 Eliant 820: 7GB, 1MB/s, $1160 ( $8 media) 1.14 DDS-2 : 4GB, .51MB/s, $606 ( $7 media) 1.75 -Native capacity listed, compressed capacity is typically 50% more -Sustained transfer rate listed -Cost is based on internal model with wide SCSI connector (if available) -VXA-1 tape drive is even cheaper through Ecrix July promo ($539) -Media listed is highest capacity format in single packs Here's how I personally chose which tape drive to go with: The way I figure, in order, the most important factors regarding the tape backup system are: 1. Reliability 2. Performance 3. Ease 4. Cost Some of these items will be in different order for other people but I think that reliability is always the most important factor in a backup. (To stress my point, substitute the word "parachute" for "backup." I'm sure you'll always choose the most reliable parachute over any other.) Reliability: The key feature with a backup is the ability to restore data and no tape system is 100% problem-free. But, only Ecrix makes these ridiculous durability claims and actually backs it up with extreme torture tests (boiling freezing tapes). This is what really got my attention on the VXA drives. Performance: You need to backup your users in the shortest amount of time possible. If it takes you more than one night to create a full backup, some users will go more than a day between backups thus reducing your backup system's effectiveness. Plus, the less you inconvenience your users, the less likely they'll keep "snoozing" Retrospect when it starts a backup. But with a fast tape drive you'll need a fast network and fast clients. Watch for the bottleneck. Ease: higher capacity tapes reduce the amount of tape swapping that needs to happen during a backup or restore. If it takes 5 tapes to perform a full backup, then it'll take 5 nights before the full backup is done and the first incremental backup can take place meaning that some people will go 5 days between their full and incremental backups. Ideally, a full backup will fit on a single tape or you'll have an autoloader. Cost: lower = good but when computing the cost per GB, you must factor in the cost of the tape drive as well. $7 media sounds really appealing but weigh in drive cost, performance and storage capacity. Below, I've computed actual cost per GB for my test scenario of 100GB total to backup, 3 storage sets. Tran#Tapes Total True Model (GB) RatePrice Media Req'd Price $/GB --- VXA-1 333MB/s$539 $6712 $1,343 $3.39 DDS-3 121MB/s$777 $1627 $1,209 $3.73 DDS-24 .51MB/s$606 $775 $1,131 $3.77 SC30152MB/s$438 $4121 $1,299 $4.12 ADR50 252MB/s$697 $4612 $1,249 $4.16 VXA-1 333MB/s$939 $6712 $1,743 $4.40 Eliant 820 71MB/s $1,160 $845 $1,520 $4.83 DDS-4 203MB/s $1,072 $3315 $1,567 $5.22 Mammoth-LT 142MB/s $1,193 $3524 $2,033 $6.05 DLT 400020 1.5MB/s $1,352 $6415 $2,312 $7.71 Sony AIT-1 353MB/s $1,913 $88 9 $2,705 $8.59 Mammoth 203MB/s $2,126 $5615 $2,966 $9.89 Exabyte M2 60 12MB/s $3,777 $80 6 $4,257 $11.83 DLT 8000406MB/s $3,915 $64 9 $4,491 $12.48 Sony AIT-2 506MB/s $3,289 $94 6 $3,853 $12.84 For this comparison, I've included the VXA-1 at the promotional price since it's been extended through Aug and is available to everyone. The total cost of DDS-3 is actually $134 cheaper than the VXA-1 but the cost/GB is higher, it requires 27 tapes total (9 tapes per storage set) and its transfer rate is considerably slower. So, it's probably fairly obvious
RE: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
Can someone whip up a Filemaker app that will calculate the $/GB of any given backup solution based on the cost of the mechanism and the number of media required? Different backup systems make sense for different size installations, obviously. top of the world, Luke Jaeger, Technology Coordinator Disney Magazine Publishing Northampton, Massachusetts [EMAIL PROTECTED] Any opinions expressed in this message are my own and may not represent the opinions of Disney Publishing, etc etc etc. * -- From: Larry Acosta Wong Reply To: retro-talk Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2000 4:36 AM To: retro-talk Subject: RE: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?) I've added the two OnStream drives (ADR50 and SC30) in the internal SCSI configurations (wide connector if available). I've listed the pricing I can get to keep the comparison prices consistent. Steve Rothman, the Eliant 820 is an Exabyte drive utilizing an 8mm helical scan tape. The VXA-1 media $/GB price is also actually a bit higher than you calculated Media $/GB --- Exabyte M2: 60GB, 12MB/s, $3777 ($80 media) 1.33 Sony AIT-2: 50GB, 6MB/s, $3289 ($94 media) 1.88 DLT 8000 : 40GB, 6MB/s, $3915 ($64 media) 1.60 Sony AIT-1: 35GB, 3MB/s, $1913 ($88 media) 2.51 VXA-1 : 33GB, 3MB/s, $939 ($67 media) 2.03 ADR50 : 25GB, 2MB/s, $697 ($46 media) 1.84 DDS-4 : 20GB, 3MB/s, $1072 ($33 media) 1.65 Mammoth : 20GB, 3MB/s, $2126 ($56 media) 2.80 DLT 4000 : 20GB, 1.5MB/s, $1352 ($64 media) 3.20 SC30 : 15GB, 2MB/S, $438 ($41 media) 2.73 Mammoth-LT: 14GB, 2MB/s, $1193 ($35 media) 2.50 DDS-3 : 12GB, 1MB/s, $777 ($16 media) 1.33 Eliant 820: 7GB, 1MB/s, $1160 ( $8 media) 1.14 DDS-2 : 4GB, .51MB/s, $606 ( $7 media) 1.75 -Native capacity listed, compressed capacity is typically 50% more -Sustained transfer rate listed -Cost is based on internal model with wide SCSI connector (if available) -VXA-1 tape drive is even cheaper through Ecrix July promo ($539) -Media listed is highest capacity format in single packs -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
Hey Gowan...wanna buy a few hundred Syquest 200s? How about 5.25" MO's? :) - Original Message - From: "Gowan Fenley" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "retro-talk" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2000 7:28 AM Subject: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?) Steve said: My previous experience with DDS-2 was very unhappy -- too much maintenance, too much downtime, too many ever-changing recommendations about what brand of media to use, etc. ...(The only single-tape solution in my price range is VXA, which sounds very nice, but there is NO WAY I will go with a new, single-vendor solution...) Too bad you are dead set against the VXA, since it is an excellent solution for the problems you mention above. With the discounted eval offer Ecrix is offering, you really can't get a better value for the money right now. Yes, you are limited to the manufacturer (currently) for media, but most of us buy tapes infrequently and well in advance anyway, plus this certainly address the problem of choosing media brands... We have been putting a VXA drive through the ringer for several weeks now, and I have been very impressed with the performance and robust construction of the drive. The packet technology pioneered by VXA not only is much more reliable than "regular" tape storage protocols, but represents a much-needed advancement in what has been stagnant technology for many years. Trying something new involves a certain amount of risk, but did that stop you from buying an iMac? Just my opinion - no commercial interest in Ecrix, etc. -gf -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
Andrew said: Hey Gowan...wanna buy a few hundred Syquest 200s? How about 5.25" MO's? :) Yuck yuck. Yep, we've scrapped plenty of SyQuests too. A perfect example to prove my point! The most widely accepted industry standard at one time, yet driven out of business by Iomega's product. Could it be that DDS is to Syquest as VXA is to Zip Of course, if you want to look at single vendor proprietary platforms, you don't have to look farther than Apple Hey, you can always shoot for the lowest common denominator and invest in Travan! -gf -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
Le 02/08/2000 a 09:22 -0400 , Gowan Fenley ecrivait : Hey, you can always shoot for the lowest common denominator and invest in Travan! And loose your data... -- Xavier HUMBERT - Systemes et Reseaux | [EMAIL PROTECTED] INJEP | [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
Mark said: Gowan, what type of throughputs are you getting and what spec machine do you use as a server? Server is a Dell Poweredge 1300 with a single Pentium 3/450 and 256Mb RAM. Throughput ranges from 171Mb/sec on local volumes down to 2Mb/sec on a fully throttled (20% cpu time) remote mail server via a slow (192Kbs) WAN link. Typical throughput on a 100BT switched LAN is 55-110Mb/min for workstations in the 200-500Mhz range. Hardware compression turned on, version is Retrospect 5.11. -gf -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
Oh yes - also compare after store is enabled. -gf -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
on 8/2/00 6:22 AM, Gowan Fenley at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Of course, if you want to look at single vendor proprietary platforms, you don't have to look farther than Apple ...or Microsoft, or Intel, or AMD. Sorry, had to get those "digs" in there somewhere ;-). Apple's not the only "proprietary platform" out there, and since I have to work on both, it's nice to remember that Microsoft is just as proprietary as Apple, its just more prevalent. -- Glenn L. Austin Computer Wizard and Race Car Driver [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.austin-home.com/glenn/ -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
(The only single-tape solution in my price range is VXA, which sounds very nice, but there is NO WAY I will go with a new, single-vendor solution...) You really have to look at risk vs. cost in this case. You can get into a VXA drive with a few tapes for $600-$700 and have an immediate 33-66Gb single-tape backup capacity. You'll pay about twice that much for a DDS equivalent, and more for anything else. That would be great in many situations. In my particular case, I need to specify everything I need for a two year time span (which in my case means two drives plus all tapes and cleaning tapes, etc.) on a single purchase order. It looks to me, for my particular requirements, including the two drives, required tapes, etc. that VXA is about halfway between DDS-2 and DDS-4 in price. If I was judging this purely on price specs, I'd go for the VXA, because of the promised reliability and only needing a single tape/backup. But in my particular situation, I cannot tolerate the risk that my VXA drives may go bad a year from now and that no one besides Ecrix could fix/replace them. How can I predict the responsiveness of the Ecrix repair department over the years to come? Also, when my two year supply of tapes is up, in mid-2002, will VXA tapes be readily accessible and reasonably priced? Perhaps, perhaps not... I know, for a fact, that there will be multiple sources to repair/replace DDS-3 drives over the next 2 - 3 year, and that DDS-3 media will be available from multiple vendors over the next 2 - 3 years. If I was looking basically 6 months ahead, or more of a gambler, I would probably buy Ecrix anyway. It sounds like a great drive and I wish them luck! But I'm not a gambler, I'm a corporate clone that will have an angry boss if my backup strategy fails in a year or so because I picked a brand-new, single-source mechanism/media vendor that my boss never heard of... -Steve -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
At 15:37 +0200 8/2/00, Xavier HUMBERT - Labo Informatique wrote: Le 02/08/2000 a 09:22 -0400 , Gowan Fenley ecrivait : Hey, you can always shoot for the lowest common denominator and invest in Travan! And loose your data... We use a Travan system where I work and we are planning onupgrading to DDS-4, but I've been taking a look at the VXA options since reading about it on this list. My big question is: does VXA suffer from the same "stretching tape" problem that Travan has, or is it like DAT, which doesn't have that problem? From a price standpoint, it looks like the VXA is the winner, but reliability is paramount in a backup solution. -- +--+--+ |Wade Masshardt| The Wisconsin Alumni Association | | Tech Support Coordinator | 1-888-WIS-ALUM (1-888-947-2586) | | 608-265-8766 | http://uwalumni.com/ | +--+--+ | mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | +-+ -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
Steve: You're killing me here. A two-year tape purchase in advance, but we won't get the sale? It used to be said that "no one got fired for buying IBM" but that's not true anymore...lots of new companies with smarter, better technologies took some market share from them. So here we are with a better technology, a better price point, a product you like, but no sale: too risky, and you're going to go with the "established" company. That's one of those close-ended arguments that's tough to debate. You already know that Ecrix was started by long-time pro's in this market, and that the team here has gone from start-up to established business before. And we intend to do it again. You already know that there's a possibility of some of these more established companies abandoning tape altogether...sure the company will still be around, but who knows what tape-related service you'll get in two years. Dang, it's -tough- to build and sell a better moustrap. Can we smack your boss around a bit? Sorry, just joshing with you. DDS is obviously worthy competition and a fine product. We'll talk to you in two years. Marketing pitch: For those of you not "corporate clones" we're doing the August promotion right now, at www.vxa.com/eval: Internal Kit $489, External Kit $649, Internal Retrospect Bundle $589, External Retrospect Bundle $749 Geoff Rainville Web Promotions Ecrix Corporation [EMAIL PROTECTED] 303-245-9669 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Steve Rothman Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2000 9:18 AM To: retro-talk Subject: Re: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?) (The only single-tape solution in my price range is VXA, which sounds very nice, but there is NO WAY I will go with a new, single-vendor solution...) You really have to look at risk vs. cost in this case. You can get into a VXA drive with a few tapes for $600-$700 and have an immediate 33-66Gb single-tape backup capacity. You'll pay about twice that much for a DDS equivalent, and more for anything else. That would be great in many situations. In my particular case, I need to specify everything I need for a two year time span (which in my case means two drives plus all tapes and cleaning tapes, etc.) on a single purchase order. It looks to me, for my particular requirements, including the two drives, required tapes, etc. that VXA is about halfway between DDS-2 and DDS-4 in price. If I was judging this purely on price specs, I'd go for the VXA, because of the promised reliability and only needing a single tape/backup. But in my particular situation, I cannot tolerate the risk that my VXA drives may go bad a year from now and that no one besides Ecrix could fix/replace them. How can I predict the responsiveness of the Ecrix repair department over the years to come? Also, when my two year supply of tapes is up, in mid-2002, will VXA tapes be readily accessible and reasonably priced? Perhaps, perhaps not... I know, for a fact, that there will be multiple sources to repair/replace DDS-3 drives over the next 2 - 3 year, and that DDS-3 media will be available from multiple vendors over the next 2 - 3 years. If I was looking basically 6 months ahead, or more of a gambler, I would probably buy Ecrix anyway. It sounds like a great drive and I wish them luck! But I'm not a gambler, I'm a corporate clone that will have an angry boss if my backup strategy fails in a year or so because I picked a brand-new, single-source mechanism/media vendor that my boss never heard of... -Steve -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
Steve said: ...In my particular case, I need to specify everything I need for a two year time span (which in my case means two drives plus all tapes and cleaning tapes, etc.) on a single purchase order. ... I cannot tolerate the risk that my VXA drives may go bad a year from now and that no one besides Ecrix could fix/replace them. ...will have an angry boss if my backup strategy fails because I picked a brand-new, single-source mechanism/media vendor that my boss never heard of... Yes, I see your point here. Of course any drive vendor can go out of business, but with a non-proprietary standard you could replace (expensively) the entire unit. This is a good question to ask Ecrix - what are their plans for licensing or otherwise expanding the VXA format to widen the market? Perhaps Mr. Rainville would care to comment? -gf -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
Steve: You're killing me here. A two-year tape purchase in advance, but we won't get the sale? Now that you're mentioning tape... Your promotional drive prices are very nice. The "External Retrospect Bundle" for $750 is slightly better than the LaCie DDS-3 + Retro avail from MacWarehouse for $800. But let's talk about tape prices. It looks to me like the VXA 33/66 cartridge costs about $75 from Ecrix. It's not hard to find a DDS-3 12/24 cartridge for $18. So it looks like on a pure $/GB basis, VXA media costs about 50% more than DDS-3 ($2.27/GB for VXA vs $1.50/GB for DDS-3). And that ain't all. In the real world, my backup set is going to be some arbitrary size, so in many cases the price differential gets even worse. In my particular case, my backup set is about 25-30 GB (native). So that ranges from 2 to 3 DDS3 carts ($18 - $54) or 1 VXA cart ($75). And I want to purchase about 10 "sets" worth of media, because I do both "rotating" and also permanent archiving. It looks to me like with DDS3 I can probably get started with about 25 or 30 tapes ($450-540), but with VXA media I'd need at least 10 tapes ($750). So I would be paying two or three hundred dollars extra for VXA media. And it could get worse - what if my requirements gradually grow to 35 or 40GB native per set? I believe getting a few extra DDS3 carts a year or two down the road is going to be cheap and easy. We have no idea what the availability or price will be for VXA in a year or two. (I haven't even got into the prices for cleaning cartridges, but it appears to me that the VXA cleaning cartridges are far more expensive than DDS-3, but then I don't know how often either of them needs to be used.) Listen, I'm not at all trying to slam Ecrix or VXA. I'm very hopeful that the technology works out and becomes a big player in the market, with more vendor support, etc. For that matter, if I was to buy a small system now for my home computer I would strongly consider your product, because for a home scenario all I would need is the drive and a couple tapes. As far as my self-professed corporate clone attitude, I'd consider taking a chance at the office on a new single-source backup product IF it looked WAY better than the competition AND was WAY cheaper. In many ways, VXA *does* look a little better to me than DDS-3 - BUT, for my particular requirements, when you include the media, it is more expensive, not at all cheaper. final buzzer sounds here Am I risk averse? Hell, yeah -- we are talking BACKUP here, after all, what could be a more risk-averse topic? -Steve -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
Larry Acosta Wong posted this very nice chart to this list about two weeks ago, and I hope he won't mind me reposting it here again. His VXA media cost is from his reseller, who is selling for less than we do on our website. --geoff --- Exabyte M2: 60GB, 12MB/s, $3777 ($80 media) Sony AIT-2: 50GB, 6MB/s, $3289 ($94 media) DLT 8000 : 40GB, 6MB/s, $3915 ($64 media) Sony AIT-1: 35GB, 3MB/s, $1913 ($88 media) VXA-1 : 33GB, 3MB/s, $939 ($67 media) DDS-4 : 20GB, 3MB/s, $1072 ($33 media) Mammoth : 20GB, 3MB/s, $2126 ($56 media) DLT 4000 : 20GB, 1.5MB/s, $1352 ($64 media) Mammoth-LT: 14GB, 2MB/s, $1193 ($35 media) DDS-3 : 12GB, 1MB/s, $777 ($16 media) Eliant 820: 7GB, 1MB/s, $1160 ( $8 media) DDS-2 : 4GB, .51MB/s, $606 ( $7 media) -Native capacity listed, compressed capacity is typically 50% more -Sustained transfer rate listed -Cost is based on internal model with wide SCSI connector (if available) -VXA-1 tape drive is even cheaper through Ecrix July promo ($539) -Media listed is highest capacity format in single packs --- -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Steve Rothman Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2000 12:11 PM To: retro-talk Subject: RE: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?) Steve: You're killing me here. A two-year tape purchase in advance, but we won't get the sale? Now that you're mentioning tape... Your promotional drive prices are very nice. The "External Retrospect Bundle" for $750 is slightly better than the LaCie DDS-3 + Retro avail from MacWarehouse for $800. But let's talk about tape prices. It looks to me like the VXA 33/66 cartridge costs about $75 from Ecrix. It's not hard to find a DDS-3 12/24 cartridge for $18. So it looks like on a pure $/GB basis, VXA media costs about 50% more than DDS-3 ($2.27/GB for VXA vs $1.50/GB for DDS-3). And that ain't all. In the real world, my backup set is going to be some arbitrary size, so in many cases the price differential gets even worse. In my particular case, my backup set is about 25-30 GB (native). So that ranges from 2 to 3 DDS3 carts ($18 - $54) or 1 VXA cart ($75). And I want to purchase about 10 "sets" worth of media, because I do both "rotating" and also permanent archiving. It looks to me like with DDS3 I can probably get started with about 25 or 30 tapes ($450-540), but with VXA media I'd need at least 10 tapes ($750). So I would be paying two or three hundred dollars extra for VXA media. And it could get worse - what if my requirements gradually grow to 35 or 40GB native per set? I believe getting a few extra DDS3 carts a year or two down the road is going to be cheap and easy. We have no idea what the availability or price will be for VXA in a year or two. (I haven't even got into the prices for cleaning cartridges, but it appears to me that the VXA cleaning cartridges are far more expensive than DDS-3, but then I don't know how often either of them needs to be used.) Listen, I'm not at all trying to slam Ecrix or VXA. I'm very hopeful that the technology works out and becomes a big player in the market, with more vendor support, etc. For that matter, if I was to buy a small system now for my home computer I would strongly consider your product, because for a home scenario all I would need is the drive and a couple tapes. As far as my self-professed corporate clone attitude, I'd consider taking a chance at the office on a new single-source backup product IF it looked WAY better than the competition AND was WAY cheaper. In many ways, VXA *does* look a little better to me than DDS-3 - BUT, for my particular requirements, when you include the media, it is more expensive, not at all cheaper. final buzzer sounds here Am I risk averse? Hell, yeah -- we are talking BACKUP here, after all, what could be a more risk-averse topic? -Steve -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
I added cost/GB numbers to the end of this nice chart, hope my math is ok. It looks like the media cost of VXA is about in the middle -- not great, not a bargain. DDS-3, which happens to be the format I am comparing to VXA, is tied to be the second cheapest - the only format cheaper is the only one on the list I never heard of... And remember, the cost/GB is basically a "best case" figure, if you don't always use the full capacity of a tape. Large capacity is very convenient, but smaller capacity is often a much better deal. For many scenarios the media price is insignificant, there are a ton of different considerations when picking out a backup system. But if anyone is cost conscious, and will be using a lot of media, they should really do some calculations before picking a system. -Steve Larry Acosta Wong posted this very nice chart to this list about two weeks ago, and I hope he won't mind me reposting it here again. His VXA media cost is from his reseller, who is selling for less than we do on our website. --geoff MEDIA ---PRICE/GB Exabyte M2: 60GB, 12MB/s, $3777 ($80 media)$1.33 Sony AIT-2: 50GB, 6MB/s, $3289 ($94 media) 1.88 DLT 8000 : 40GB, 6MB/s, $3915 ($64 media) 1.60 Sony AIT-1: 35GB, 3MB/s, $1913 ($88 media) 2.51 VXA-1 : 33GB, 3MB/s, $939 ($67 media) 1.91 DDS-4 : 20GB, 3MB/s, $1072 ($33 media) 1.65 Mammoth : 20GB, 3MB/s, $2126 ($56 media) 2.80 DLT 4000 : 20GB, 1.5MB/s, $1352 ($64 media) 3.20 Mammoth-LT: 14GB, 2MB/s, $1193 ($35 media) 2.50 DDS-3 : 12GB, 1MB/s, $777 ($16 media) 1.33 Eliant 820: 7GB, 1MB/s, $1160 ( $8 media) 1.14 DDS-2 : 4GB, .51MB/s, $606 ( $7 media) 1.75 -Native capacity listed, compressed capacity is typically 50% more -Sustained transfer rate listed -Cost is based on internal model with wide SCSI connector (if available) -VXA-1 tape drive is even cheaper through Ecrix July promo ($539) -Media listed is highest capacity format in single packs --- -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: VXA drive (was DDS-3 vs DDS-4?)
May I add one other drive to this list? What does anyone here think of this drive from OnStream (http://www.onstream.com)? Other than having a few (three in one machine), I have no connection to OnStream. They seem to work well, I just hadn't seen much mention here in the time I've been lurking... ...Doug OnStream ADR50 : 25GB, 2MB/s, $700 ($50 media) Exabyte M2: 60GB, 12MB/s, $3777 ($80 media) Sony AIT-2: 50GB, 6MB/s, $3289 ($94 media) DLT 8000 : 40GB, 6MB/s, $3915 ($64 media) Sony AIT-1: 35GB, 3MB/s, $1913 ($88 media) VXA-1 : 33GB, 3MB/s, $939 ($67 media) DDS-4 : 20GB, 3MB/s, $1072 ($33 media) Mammoth : 20GB, 3MB/s, $2126 ($56 media) DLT 4000 : 20GB, 1.5MB/s, $1352 ($64 media) Mammoth-LT: 14GB, 2MB/s, $1193 ($35 media) DDS-3 : 12GB, 1MB/s, $777 ($16 media) Eliant 820: 7GB, 1MB/s, $1160 ( $8 media) DDS-2 : 4GB, .51MB/s, $606 ( $7 media) -Native capacity listed, compressed capacity is typically 50% more -Sustained transfer rate listed -Cost is based on internal model with wide SCSI connector (if available) -VXA-1 tape drive is even cheaper through Ecrix July promo ($539) -Media listed is highest capacity format in single packs --- -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: VXA users in Europe/Sweden?
Hello Jakob, VXA is distributed in Sweden through Giga AB, in Stockholm. Their website is www.gigatrading.se. There are also several resellers in Sweden: Desknet Datateknik AB (www.desknet.se), Logical Solutions AB (www.logical.se), United Business Machines UBM AB (www.ubm.se). For more information on where to buy VXA drives check the VXA "Where to Buy" guide at www.vxa.com/buyVXA. Regards, - Frank.. -- Frank Saab + [EMAIL PROTECTED] Internet Business Manager + Ecrix Corporation 5525 Central Avenue + Boulder, Colorado 80301 + USA tel: 303/245.7275 + pcs: 303/641.7444 + fax: 303/402.9266 retro-talk wrote: Subject: VXA users in Europe/Sweden? From: "jakob krabbe" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 17:01:20 +0200 I thought AIT-1 was the way to go when a dealer mentioned VXA. I've read the recent input on this list but if VXA is as good as the dealer says, how come no-one in Sweden is selling them? (MicroWarehouse, Dustin, Dabus etc.) My contact said the distributor didn't sell their product through "regular" channels... but if you have a great product, why don't try sell it through the big distributors? Also, if we get a VXA drive for about half the price of a AIT-1 drive, what happens next year, can we get tapes then or do we have to change system again? What I'm saying is, if this VXA is so great, how come there are so few using it. I've never heard of it before and there haven't been THAT many disscussions conserning VXA on this list. Not compered to AIT, DLT or DSS atleast. thanx, / jakob - -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: VXA?
Thanks for all the comments on VXA, it really sounds like the way to go, so I'm going to be getting one when I get my new G4. Thanks again, Brian -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: vxa
I have had a VXA drive here for about 3 months. Aside from some long seek (finding the beginning of the tape) times if you crash Retrospect in the middle of a backup and the fact that it is noisy compared to the DDS3 drive I was using, It is very fast (~30% faster than DDS3) and reliable (several complete restores). -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: VXA drives
I've got all the individual posts dating back to 6/23/99. Brad. -Original Message- From: Gene Kubicki [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, January 21, 2000 4:26 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: VXA drives I bought a VXA drive from Ecrix 2 days ago, very easy to set up with Retrospect, very fast at backup. I replaced an overburdened DDS-3. However, if for whatever reason Retrospect crashes during a backup it can take as long as 12 hours to remove the tape from the drive in order to start the backup again. In talking with tech support (very available) they said it should not take this long? The drive is apparently trying to find the beginning of the tape. Verry frustrating. Also if anyone has the digests for last year in a searchable format (digest viewer) please let me know as I am new to the list. -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
