Re: [WISPA] [Wisp] Baicells question

[Jayson Baker]

Unless you have your own EPC. In which case you don't use the LGW. IPs are
then assigned by the EPC and you should be able to assign a Static IP and
route a subnet to it just fine.

Best Wishes,
Jayson A. Baker
Peak Internet

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 5, 2017, at 6:18 AM, Josh Luthman via WISP  wrote:

I think bridging is in beta.  Right now officially it's NAT only.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Jul 5, 2017 1:36 AM, "mike.lyon--- via WISP"  wrote:

> When deploying a Baicells eNb and Baicells CPE, is it possible to route a
> subnet to a specific CPE without it getting NAT'd at the CPE or eNb?
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> -Mike
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Re: [WISPA] PtP Dish Alignment

[Jayson Baker]

1 person on each end with a small hand-held mirror.  Flash the person on the
other tower.
When it's sunny out, you'd be surprised how far away you can see that.

On Wed, Oct 20, 2010 at 12:39 PM, Chuck Profito cprof...@cv-access.comwrote:

  Well in my area if its e-w about a turn, n-s  2 or 3.  But what do I
 know, Tim's doing the turning, I'm calling the signal levels to him.  I'm
 the tower bender!  :-)



 *From:* wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] *On
 Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
 *Sent:* Wednesday, October 20, 2010 11:05 AM

 *To:* WISPA General List
 *Subject:* Re: [WISPA] PtP Dish Alignment



 So it's 50 foot higher and 10 miles away...what angle is that?

 On Oct 20, 2010 1:38 PM, Chuck Profito cprof...@cv-access.com wrote:
  Come on Josh,
 
  get a couple of land marks from Google Earth, that takes care of left and
  right, and Google Earth tells you altitude at the base of each plus your
  height, now it's just up or down from level, a few turns.
 
  Google is your friend!
 
 
 
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of Josh Luthman
  Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2010 10:02 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] PtP Dish Alignment
 
 
 
  I just filled a printer page with trig figuring out hoe I'm going to
 place
  my projector. There are more uses then people think.
 
  On Oct 20, 2010 12:55 PM, Mark Nash markl...@uwol.net wrote:
  YES LOL ;)
 
  Only once did I know of a a practical use for trig. A friend of mine was
  trying to make a cut pattern in sheet metal to make a cone. The cone had
 to
  fit a certain size at the top and a certain size at the bottom.
 
  The cone was a pivotal part of his home brewing system. He is the kind
 of
  guy who can buy this stuff pre-made but preferred to do it himself. I
 don't
  have that kind of time on my hands, I just buy the stuff. Though he is a
 bit
  prouder of HIS homebrew system than I am, and that's the difference.
 Nobody
  else who opens my fridge knows, though.
  - Original Message -
  From: Josh Luthman
  To: WISPA General List
  Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2010 9:16 AM
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] PtP Dish Alignment
 
 
  Am I the only one that uses Trigonometry for vertical alignment?
 
  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373
 
 
  permail/wireless/
 




 
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Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti RMA Process

[Jayson Baker]

Yeah, they rock.  Although, the last two times we RMA'ed Loco2's they sent
us Nano2's.
We told them.  They said you sent us Nano2s  I said no, we didn't.  They
said there's nothing more we can do

Ok.  Fine.  I'll keep the more expensive product.  Thanks!

On Fri, Sep 17, 2010 at 3:37 PM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote:

 I think they figured out that the cost of a bad and argumentative RMA
 process is greater than a smooth one.

 I have enough frustration and the UBNT RMA process is good for my mood.

 Bob-


 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Michael Baird
 Sent: Friday, September 17, 2010 1:06 PM
 To: wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti RMA Process

 Ubiquiti used to be hit and miss with RMA's, they have improved the
 process over time.

 Regards
 Michael Baird
  I have been throughly impressed with the RMA process at Ubiquiti.  I had
  some blown up Bullets and they processed the RMA very quickly and had
  new units back to me within a few weeks.  After dealing with the
  extremely long RMA process that Tranzeo has, it's refreshing to see a
  company like Ubiquiti stand behind there product.  It's definitely one
  more reason to use their equipment.
 
 




 
 
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Re: [WISPA] [Mikrotik] FTTH Show

[Jayson Baker]

Wanted to go.  Registered.  Went there.  They never took the money.  So I
used it to gamble instead.  :-)

On Mon, Aug 30, 2010 at 10:39 AM, Matt Larsen - Lists
li...@manageisp.comwrote:

  Anyone here going to this show?

 http://www.ftthconference.com/FTTH10/public/enter.aspx

 Still deciding whether I should go or not.

 Matt Larsen
 vistabeam.com

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Re: [WISPA] Things i say to customers..... And they actually believethem............

[Jayson Baker]

Shame on you for picking on the old lady!

On Sun, Sep 19, 2010 at 7:55 PM, j284...@yahoo.com wrote:

 Like
 Sent from my BlackBerry®

 -Original Message-
 From: Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com
 Sender: wireless-boun...@wispa.org
 Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2010 21:52:08
 To: WISPA General Listwireless@wispa.org
 Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: [WISPA] Things i say to customers. And they actually believe
them




 
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Re: [WISPA] UBNT Grounding

[Jayson Baker]

Shielded cable that is not attached properly to the RJ45 will do nothing but
pick up MORE static.
We solder the drain wire onto the edge of the RJ45 connector after we crimp
it on the wire.

On Sat, Aug 14, 2010 at 7:49 AM, can...@believewireless.net 
p...@believewireless.net wrote:

 We've had the same problem even using shielded cable.  We've found
 that we need to wrap the drain wire around the ground lug of both
 wires to fix the problem.



 
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Re: [WISPA] UBNT Grounding

[Jayson Baker]

I've never seen shielded cable with no drain wire.  But I suppose it could
exist.
Get better cable, with a drain wire.

On Sat, Aug 14, 2010 at 4:11 PM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 What if there is no drain wire?

 On Aug 14, 2010 6:09 PM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com wrote:

 Shielded cable that is not attached properly to the RJ45 will do nothing
 but pick up MORE static.
 We solder the drain wire onto the edge of the RJ45 connector after we crimp
 it on the wire.



 On Sat, Aug 14, 2010 at 7:49 AM, can...@believewireless.net 
 p...@believewireless.net wrote:
 
  ...





 
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Re: [WISPA] Wierd StarOS/OLSR - Ubiquity RocketM5 bridge - Cisco issue

[Jayson Baker]

I didn't quite follow all of that, it must be too early.
But I can tell you we have 4 of the PtP UBNT links using their M-series.  3
of those OSPF fine.  The other won't OSPF for the life of me.  All same
config and firmware on all units.

On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 4:38 AM, Scott Lambert lamb...@lambertfam.orgwrote:

 We have been putting up some Ubiquity RocketM5 point-to-point bridge
 links, running airos 5.2, lately to replace some overloaded StarOS
 backhauls.  Where these links have gone in, we static route the traffic
 across them.  They happen to be on the OSPF/OLSR divider boundry.  I
 would like to find a good way to redistribute between the routing
 protocols, but that's for another day.  When I get time, I'll probably
 just convert the 20 odd OLSR towers to OSPF.

 These are our first experience with Ubiquity.  The first two were no
 muss, no fuss.  The third link went up nicely.  It's configured the same
 as the other two links.  About an hour after we plugged the local end
 at our office into the main switch, rather than a laptop, we started
 loosing routes to sites which pass through the tower at the far end of
 the link.

 All hosts on the tower LAN can see each other.  We can reach all of
 them from anywhere else on our network.  It is just routes for hosts
 connected wirelessly to that tower which are no longer known to the
 staros box which has the existing backhaul to our office.

 We rebooted everything at the remote tower.  The links came up.  The
 routes were good.  Approximately an hour later, the same routes fell
 out.  So, we decided it must be due to some sort of wierd multicast OLSR
 issue when these towers were suddenly able to see each other across
 the bridges.  I unplugged the ethernet at the office and waited until
 tonight to try again.  The routes straightened themselves out as soon as
 I unplugged the office end.  Wild.

 This afternoon, I setup a seperate VLAN on the switch for this link.
 Before I left the office I plugged it in about, 8:00pm.  I didn't have
 any other devices configured on that VLAN.

 There were no problems for several hours until I configured the new VLAN
 on the Cisco that was sometime between 1:01 and 1:10am.  The RANCID
 run at 1:01 didn't see any changes but the run at 2:01 found them.  At
 1:10am Nagios noticed that it couldn't reach the equipment through those
 same routes.

 + interface GigabitEthernet0/3.13
 +  description Wireless VPN 3
 +  encapsulation dot1Q 13
 +  ip address 10.127.3.1 255.255.255.0
 +  no cdp enable
 + !

 That's the subnet for the RocketM5s.  The StarOS gear on the tower uses
 a public /29 subnet.

 I tried various things with reboots and restarts of OLSR on the staros
 gear at the tower.  The routes came back for four or five minutes then
 went away again.  No good.

 So, at about 2:10am, I logged into the RocketM5 at the tower and
 disabled it's ethernet interface.  Within a few seconds, my pings to
 equipment through the lost routes began succeeding.

 It's now 3:25, and all's well.  I am puzzled.  We really need the
 additional bandwidth the ubiquity link can give us on this link.

 At 3:26 I enabled the LAN at the tower just to make sure.  Within 2
 minutes, splat.  This time I left the LAN enabled at the tower and
 disabled the WLAN interface at the office.  All better in seconds.

 Administratively shutting down interface gig0/3.13 at the office seems
 to be enough to heal OLSR at the tower.  If the tower LAN can see the
 cisco, we drop routes.  But the other ubiquity links connect back to the
 same cisco at the office.

 I think we will probably replace the switch at the tower tomorrow to see
 if it has problems we haven't tickled before.  I'm stumped.  Does anyone
 else have any ideas?


 --
 Scott LambertKC5MLE   Unix SysAdmin
 lamb...@lambertfam.org




 
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Re: [WISPA] Wierd StarOS/OLSR - Ubiquity RocketM5 bridge - Cisco issue

[Jayson Baker]

I can't comment on the OP, but I can tell you that we are.  OSPF talks, but
never goes Full and exchanges routes.
Latest FW on both ends.  Like I said, same exact config as the other links
which work perfect.

On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 7:20 AM, Faisal Imtiaz fai...@snappydsl.net wrote:

 Make sure you are running the most recent version of 5.2 firmware.also
 you need to be running then in AP-WDS and CPE-WDS mode.

 Faisal

 On Jun 24, 2010, at 9:08 AM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com wrote:

  I didn't quite follow all of that, it must be too early.
  But I can tell you we have 4 of the PtP UBNT links using their M-series.
  3
  of those OSPF fine.  The other won't OSPF for the life of me.  All same
  config and firmware on all units.
 
  On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 4:38 AM, Scott Lambert lamb...@lambertfam.org
 wrote:
 
  We have been putting up some Ubiquity RocketM5 point-to-point bridge
  links, running airos 5.2, lately to replace some overloaded StarOS
  backhauls.  Where these links have gone in, we static route the traffic
  across them.  They happen to be on the OSPF/OLSR divider boundry.  I
  would like to find a good way to redistribute between the routing
  protocols, but that's for another day.  When I get time, I'll probably
  just convert the 20 odd OLSR towers to OSPF.
 
  These are our first experience with Ubiquity.  The first two were no
  muss, no fuss.  The third link went up nicely.  It's configured the same
  as the other two links.  About an hour after we plugged the local end
  at our office into the main switch, rather than a laptop, we started
  loosing routes to sites which pass through the tower at the far end of
  the link.
 
  All hosts on the tower LAN can see each other.  We can reach all of
  them from anywhere else on our network.  It is just routes for hosts
  connected wirelessly to that tower which are no longer known to the
  staros box which has the existing backhaul to our office.
 
  We rebooted everything at the remote tower.  The links came up.  The
  routes were good.  Approximately an hour later, the same routes fell
  out.  So, we decided it must be due to some sort of wierd multicast OLSR
  issue when these towers were suddenly able to see each other across
  the bridges.  I unplugged the ethernet at the office and waited until
  tonight to try again.  The routes straightened themselves out as soon as
  I unplugged the office end.  Wild.
 
  This afternoon, I setup a seperate VLAN on the switch for this link.
  Before I left the office I plugged it in about, 8:00pm.  I didn't have
  any other devices configured on that VLAN.
 
  There were no problems for several hours until I configured the new VLAN
  on the Cisco that was sometime between 1:01 and 1:10am.  The RANCID
  run at 1:01 didn't see any changes but the run at 2:01 found them.  At
  1:10am Nagios noticed that it couldn't reach the equipment through those
  same routes.
 
  + interface GigabitEthernet0/3.13
  +  description Wireless VPN 3
  +  encapsulation dot1Q 13
  +  ip address 10.127.3.1 255.255.255.0
  +  no cdp enable
  + !
 
  That's the subnet for the RocketM5s.  The StarOS gear on the tower uses
  a public /29 subnet.
 
  I tried various things with reboots and restarts of OLSR on the staros
  gear at the tower.  The routes came back for four or five minutes then
  went away again.  No good.
 
  So, at about 2:10am, I logged into the RocketM5 at the tower and
  disabled it's ethernet interface.  Within a few seconds, my pings to
  equipment through the lost routes began succeeding.
 
  It's now 3:25, and all's well.  I am puzzled.  We really need the
  additional bandwidth the ubiquity link can give us on this link.
 
  At 3:26 I enabled the LAN at the tower just to make sure.  Within 2
  minutes, splat.  This time I left the LAN enabled at the tower and
  disabled the WLAN interface at the office.  All better in seconds.
 
  Administratively shutting down interface gig0/3.13 at the office seems
  to be enough to heal OLSR at the tower.  If the tower LAN can see the
  cisco, we drop routes.  But the other ubiquity links connect back to the
  same cisco at the office.
 
  I think we will probably replace the switch at the tower tomorrow to see
  if it has problems we haven't tickled before.  I'm stumped.  Does anyone
  else have any ideas?
 
 
  --
  Scott LambertKC5MLE   Unix
 SysAdmin
  lamb...@lambertfam.org
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti - Success Feels Good

[Jayson Baker]

What will any radio do when it's channel gets jammed with noise.

On Sat, Jun 12, 2010 at 11:08 AM, Travis Johnson t...@ida.net wrote:

 Hi,

 I would still like to know what it's going to do when an entire
 polarization gets jammed with noise? Will the radio still pass traffic?
 Or will there be so many errors that it will overtake the link and
 nothing will work?

 Travis
 Microserv

 Tom DeReggi wrote:
  I jsut wanted to mention, that it really does give peice of mind knowing
  that there is a MIMO technology out there that I can count on, that is
  inexpensive.
  I just finished my 4th Ubiquiti PTP link (over last two weeks).  Once
 again,
  Painless and perfect.
  I got 38mb one way 22mb the other with 10Mhz Channel MCS 15.  And with
 20Mhz
  channel up to 69mbps one way, and 80 the other.
  Link Quality nad Capacity showed like 96%.  LAtency was also down under
 2ms.
  But my point here is not the speed. It was that it was easy. I just put
 it
  up, and it worked. Air view was helpful, finding channel. All 4 installs
  worked that way. No hassle, no fuss.
  This last one was a 15 mile link, Rocket5M on each side, with PACWireless
  2ft dish on one end and a 23 db panel on the other.
  Nothing has ever been this easy.
 
  With that said There were some confusing things. I ran V on Chain0,
 and
  H on Chain1 got -66, then for grins swapped conectors on CPE side only,
 so
  Chain0 was H and Chain1 was V and got -65.
  I do not understand why this happened. I would have thought signal should
  have dropped by -20 db or so? Wierd. This did not just happen when in
  Alignment mode. I may have been in MCS7 mode at the time though.
  So it appears it must be transmitting on both pols in MCS7 mode, I dont
 have
  any other way to explain it. But none the less, it just worked.
 
  I'm concern about using it at PtMP, because we use Station WDS, and AP
 only
  supports up to 6 WDS clients. So it wont scale for PTMP Briding clients.
  Unless that can be curred. But I tell you for PTP, or a couple
 associations,
  its pretty sweet.
 
  (I still like T-Link-45s better when I only need 25-30mbps, but  the UBNT
  has shown to be a wonderful experience, also.)
 
 
  Tom DeReggi
  RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
  IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti - Success Feels Good

[Jayson Baker]

Both chains are both two-way streets
2x2 MIMO

On Fri, Jun 18, 2010 at 6:41 AM, Greg Ihnen os10ru...@gmail.com wrote:

 My question (still in topic I think) is will the one chain that's still
 viable become a duplex channel and still keep passing traffic? Or are the
 chains just a one way street?

 Greg

 On Jun 18, 2010, at 8:06 AM, Jayson Baker wrote:

  What will any radio do when it's channel gets jammed with noise.
 
  On Sat, Jun 12, 2010 at 11:08 AM, Travis Johnson t...@ida.net wrote:
 
  Hi,
 
  I would still like to know what it's going to do when an entire
  polarization gets jammed with noise? Will the radio still pass traffic?
  Or will there be so many errors that it will overtake the link and
  nothing will work?
 
  Travis
  Microserv
 
  Tom DeReggi wrote:
  I jsut wanted to mention, that it really does give peice of mind
 knowing
  that there is a MIMO technology out there that I can count on, that is
  inexpensive.
  I just finished my 4th Ubiquiti PTP link (over last two weeks).  Once
  again,
  Painless and perfect.
  I got 38mb one way 22mb the other with 10Mhz Channel MCS 15.  And with
  20Mhz
  channel up to 69mbps one way, and 80 the other.
  Link Quality nad Capacity showed like 96%.  LAtency was also down under
  2ms.
  But my point here is not the speed. It was that it was easy. I just put
  it
  up, and it worked. Air view was helpful, finding channel. All 4
 installs
  worked that way. No hassle, no fuss.
  This last one was a 15 mile link, Rocket5M on each side, with
 PACWireless
  2ft dish on one end and a 23 db panel on the other.
  Nothing has ever been this easy.
 
  With that said There were some confusing things. I ran V on Chain0,
  and
  H on Chain1 got -66, then for grins swapped conectors on CPE side only,
  so
  Chain0 was H and Chain1 was V and got -65.
  I do not understand why this happened. I would have thought signal
 should
  have dropped by -20 db or so? Wierd. This did not just happen when in
  Alignment mode. I may have been in MCS7 mode at the time though.
  So it appears it must be transmitting on both pols in MCS7 mode, I dont
  have
  any other way to explain it. But none the less, it just worked.
 
  I'm concern about using it at PtMP, because we use Station WDS, and AP
  only
  supports up to 6 WDS clients. So it wont scale for PTMP Briding
 clients.
  Unless that can be curred. But I tell you for PTP, or a couple
  associations,
  its pretty sweet.
 
  (I still like T-Link-45s better when I only need 25-30mbps, but  the
 UBNT
  has shown to be a wonderful experience, also.)
 
 
  Tom DeReggi
  RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
  IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Documentation Methods

[Jayson Baker]

We do this as well.  Have for quite some time.

No contract--that's all electronically done and accepted by our activation
system once the system is online.

But when we arrive we discuss with customer how it's going to work, where
it's going to be mounted, etc.
They sign a one-page authorization to install which outlines costs, and
limits our liability.

Installer takes pictures of antenna, looking towards tower, cable run, and
inside penetration.
That is attached to customer account for future reference.

On Thu, Apr 22, 2010 at 9:18 PM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote:

 OH!  Something I recently started doing, a signed OK for any hole drilled
 BEFORE it's drilled.

 A suggestion from my insurance boy.,  Sounded like a good idea.


 - Original Message -
 From: Chuck Bartosch ch...@clarityconnect.com
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2010 11:12 PM
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Documentation Methods


  You should add (in my opinion):
 
  (1) photo of installation location BEFORE you do the install, not just a
  post install photo.
 
  (2) a sign-off from the customer saying your installation was acceptable.
  That goes a LONG ways when the wife gets home and complains. You got the
  husband's sign-off (or vice versa).
 
  Chuck
 
  On Apr 22, 2010, at 11:05 PM, Steven G McGehee wrote:
 
  Thought of another question I wanted to pose to you gents regarding
  documentation on installations, primarily customer installations (as
  opposed to PoP/tower installations). I was curious what methods you
  employed during and/or after the install to best 'capture' the details
  of the installation.
 
  For example, some of the things we do are take notes of any specific
  'gotchas' on site like needing to park in a certain area, what type of
  ladder or roof access there is, if you have to sign in or be escorted by
  a rep. of the business - etc. We also take photos of the installation
  when we're finished and write up notes afterwards on their account
  detailing the length and path of the cable that goes from the unit into
  the structure, what other PoPs we could see at the time, what
  signal/speeds we were getting, etc.
 
  If any of you would share your methods on what you do, I'd appreciate
  it. I think we're doing enough, but I'm always open to other suggestions
  and interested in seeing what others in the business are doing.
 
  Thanks.
 
 
 
 
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  --
  Chuck Bartosch
  Clarity Connect, Inc.
  200 Pleasant Grove Road
  Ithaca, NY 14850
  (607) 257-8268
 
  When the stars threw down their spears,
  and water'd heaven with their tears,
  Did He smile, His work to see?
  Did He who made the Lamb make thee?
 
 From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger!
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] VoIP

[Jayson Baker]

Roll you own.

We have PRI's at our tower sites (at least the primary sites), and redundant
Asterisk switches.

The switches have a VLAN, which is common throughout the entire network down
to the ATA/IP Phone.

VoIP doesn't touch any router.  The ATA at customers house is on the same
VLAN as the switch, so no NAT issues or anything.

Because switch is at the tower, it's only the last mile of QoS we have to
worry about.

We've done it many different ways--started out wholesaling, rebranding, etc.
 So far this has been the simpliest and best-working solution yet.

On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 9:33 AM, Kevin Sullivan
kevin.sulli...@alyrica.netwrote:

 We'd like to start offering VoIP to our wireless customers, and we've taken
 a look at a couple of packaged soultions like NetSapiens. What is everyone
 else using? We'd like to start at a lower $$ than the $17,000 that we've
 been hearing from the packaged deals.

 Kevin



 
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Re: [WISPA] VoIP

[Jayson Baker]

PRI is something like $600/mo.  On one particularly busy site we have about
200 users on it, and never seen it go above 12 active channels.

The ATA connects to the antenna.  In our case, most are UBNT units.  The
UBNT does PPPoE and NAT for the customer, but VLAN 999 is passed straight
through.  The ATA picks this up and bridges the rest.  VoIP switch at the
tower is on VLAN 999, so the ATA gets it's IP from the switch and connects
directly to it without any routers.

Use something like Trix if you think Asterisk is too much work.  Cost... I
don't know... we downloaded Asterisk for free, so it didn't cost us
anything.

On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 10:03 AM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 How much is a PRI for each tower?

 What is the ATA connecting to?

 I've tried Asterisk and there is absolutely no comparison versus my current
 platform in simplicity.  Way too much work and cost in my opinion...

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue
 that counts.”
 --- Winston Churchill


 On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 11:58 AM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
 wrote:

  Roll you own.
 
  We have PRI's at our tower sites (at least the primary sites), and
  redundant
  Asterisk switches.
 
  The switches have a VLAN, which is common throughout the entire network
  down
  to the ATA/IP Phone.
 
  VoIP doesn't touch any router.  The ATA at customers house is on the same
  VLAN as the switch, so no NAT issues or anything.
 
  Because switch is at the tower, it's only the last mile of QoS we have to
  worry about.
 
  We've done it many different ways--started out wholesaling, rebranding,
  etc.
   So far this has been the simpliest and best-working solution yet.
 
  On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 9:33 AM, Kevin Sullivan
  kevin.sulli...@alyrica.netwrote:
 
   We'd like to start offering VoIP to our wireless customers, and we've
  taken
   a look at a couple of packaged soultions like NetSapiens. What is
  everyone
   else using? We'd like to start at a lower $$ than the $17,000 that
 we've
   been hearing from the packaged deals.
  
   Kevin
  
  
  
  
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti AirOS Comparison

[Jayson Baker]

Weird.  We use the Rocket APs and Nano5M CPE's heavily and for a TON of
VoIP.  No problems.
Occasionally we'll see PPPoE re-connect, but since we VLAN the VoIP straight
through, it's unaffected.

On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 6:10 AM, can...@believewireless.net 
p...@believewireless.net wrote:

 Upgraded the AP and all CPE to Beta 5 this morning and latency still
 sucks.  Signal is a -57 on one side and -59 on the other.  Every one
 of our VoIP customers on this tower is complaining.




 
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Re: [WISPA] VoIP

[Jayson Baker]

True.  But it doesn't take much.  We have a bunch of P4 2.4GHz/1GB RAM
machines that are old by todays standards, but run Asterisk just fine with
never more than about 10% CPU load during peak hours.
As long as you don't transcode, you could even run it on a Linksys WRT54G
router with Linux flashed.

On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 10:11 AM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 The software costs nothing but you have to pay for that hardware.  Then
 maintain it.

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue
 that counts.”
 --- Winston Churchill


 On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 12:07 PM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
 wrote:

  PRI is something like $600/mo.  On one particularly busy site we have
 about
  200 users on it, and never seen it go above 12 active channels.
 
  The ATA connects to the antenna.  In our case, most are UBNT units.  The
  UBNT does PPPoE and NAT for the customer, but VLAN 999 is passed straight
  through.  The ATA picks this up and bridges the rest.  VoIP switch at the
  tower is on VLAN 999, so the ATA gets it's IP from the switch and
 connects
  directly to it without any routers.
 
  Use something like Trix if you think Asterisk is too much work.  Cost...
 I
  don't know... we downloaded Asterisk for free, so it didn't cost us
  anything.
 
  On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 10:03 AM, Josh Luthman
  j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:
 
   How much is a PRI for each tower?
  
   What is the ATA connecting to?
  
   I've tried Asterisk and there is absolutely no comparison versus my
  current
   platform in simplicity.  Way too much work and cost in my opinion...
  
   Josh Luthman
   Office: 937-552-2340
   Direct: 937-552-2343
   1100 Wayne St
   Suite 1337
   Troy, OH 45373
  
   “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to
  continue
   that counts.”
   --- Winston Churchill
  
  
   On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 11:58 AM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
   wrote:
  
Roll you own.
   
We have PRI's at our tower sites (at least the primary sites), and
redundant
Asterisk switches.
   
The switches have a VLAN, which is common throughout the entire
 network
down
to the ATA/IP Phone.
   
VoIP doesn't touch any router.  The ATA at customers house is on the
  same
VLAN as the switch, so no NAT issues or anything.
   
Because switch is at the tower, it's only the last mile of QoS we
 have
  to
worry about.
   
We've done it many different ways--started out wholesaling,
 rebranding,
etc.
 So far this has been the simpliest and best-working solution yet.
   
On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 9:33 AM, Kevin Sullivan
kevin.sulli...@alyrica.netwrote:
   
 We'd like to start offering VoIP to our wireless customers, and
 we've
taken
 a look at a couple of packaged soultions like NetSapiens. What is
everyone
 else using? We'd like to start at a lower $$ than the $17,000 that
   we've
 been hearing from the packaged deals.

 Kevin




   
  
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Ubnt vs Moto vs ... your brand

[Jayson Baker]

We have hundreds of legacy 802.11a/g UBNT equipment deployed in Colorado and
Costa Rica.
In Colorado we offer 12Mbps/6Mbps service over 802.11g--it works great.  We
use NS2 and PS2 as AP, MT behind that to do things like QoS/routing.
Latency does spike and is not consistent.  We have seen no issues with
hidden node or problems like that.  The stuff just works and has for years.

The newer AirMax stuff is very impressive.  Only a small deployment in
Colorado so far.
Latency is awesome.  Usually 1-2ms from client to tower, even during load.
 Maxing the upload will sometimes spike latency to 30ms.

There have been some firmware issues along the way, but so long as you're
using good software, you'll be very happy.
It doesn't sync like Canopy does, true.  But we've never found that to be an
issue for us.

On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 6:29 PM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 It's not so much what you're discussing there as much as the capabilities
 of
 the ptmp products.

 You simply can not offer the latency guarantees using Ubiquiti/802.11 that
 Canopy provides.

 Now if you've got 3 people to serve I think it's financially ridiculous to
 get a Canopy system involved...

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue
 that counts.”
 --- Winston Churchill


 On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 8:23 PM, Glenn Kelley gl...@hostmedic.com wrote:

  In trying to make the right buying decision - some simple answers may
  help.
 
 
 
  1.  What is the meantime failure rate for your ubiquity equipment
 
  2.  What is the avg amount of truck rolls per week you run to fix an
  issue vs the # of customers you have?
  ie- if you have say 1500 clients and do 8 troubleshooting calls a week
  then it would be 1500/8 = .0053% )
 
  3.  how often does a tech call come in (w/o a truck roll) that is
  equipment related...  For some reason I think some of the ubiquity
  radios just need a power cycle and voila - they behave much better...
  so - what is the average # of calls per total clients that come in
  that are fixed w/ simple methods vs a truck roll for the ubiquity
  users ...
 
 
 
  Moto Users - do you have this info as well:
 
  Reason I ask is because I am wondering - if the cost of Moto is
  actually worth it...  as a smaller operator - this information would
  be most beneficial for sure.
 
  Buying a Moto radio - even if 2 or 3 times the $$ if - the service
  calls on the back side are much less - might be worth it.
 
  Perhaps the cost of Radio vs People (both in manpower as well as
  client satisfaction for uptime) make the buying decision much
  easier...  but having some numbers to go along with this would be great.
 
 
  Thanks
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Ubiquity VLAN Capability

[Jayson Baker]

You can telnet into the unit and run vconfig to do whatever kind of VLAN'ing
you want.  This is what we do, via an rc. script put in the /etc/persistent
directory.
Check the forum.

On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 12:42 PM, Tracy Tippett 
tracytipp...@swiftwireless.com wrote:


 Has anyone had experience getting the Nano products to support multiple
 VLANs I looked at the forum but wasn't able to decipher a clear answer.
  Does it require a third party software patch?

 Tracy Tippett

 --Original Mail--
 From: Jeremy Parr jeremyp...@gmail.com
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Tue, 13 Apr 2010 14:26:15 -0400
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti AirOS Comparison

 On 13 April 2010 11:52, MDK rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote:
  Did you do a throughput comparison?

 It was mostly a joke, but I'll bite. A throughput comparison is not
 fair, since they both just leverage someone else's chipset. My point
 was simply that if a low end wifi based product had these features 10+
 years ago, why the hell does UBNT see fit to release something today
 that is shiny and fast, but lacking core functionality. I guess the
 market demands cheap.



 
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Re: [WISPA] what to use with Mikrotik as AP

[Jayson Baker]

MIMO/802.11N on MT sucks.  Use UBNT.

On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 12:20 PM, Mark Dueck m...@netking.bz wrote:

 Hi,

 I'm running a small WISP and I've been using only Tranzeo till now.  I
 would like to start using something that support MIMO.  What should I
 consider?  Been reading a lot on this list about UBNT and Mikrotik.
 What boards do you use if you go with Mikrotik?  Will I get any benefit
 if I put some MIMO clients, but still mostly use Tranzeo clients?


 Also for Mikrotik backhauls, can someone give details of the boards,
 cards and enclosures you use for them?

 many thanks,
 Mark



 
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Re: [WISPA] VoIP

[Jayson Baker]

So put 2 garage sale PC's at the tower.  :-)

On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 1:42 PM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 I'm not suggesting you need a high end machine but rather you need to make
 sure that box is working.  When it comes to someones phone calls the last
 thing I want to be the case is the garage sale PC at the tower has a
 hardware problem.

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue
 that counts.”
 --- Winston Churchill


 On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 2:59 PM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
 wrote:

  True.  But it doesn't take much.  We have a bunch of P4 2.4GHz/1GB RAM
  machines that are old by todays standards, but run Asterisk just fine
  with
  never more than about 10% CPU load during peak hours.
  As long as you don't transcode, you could even run it on a Linksys WRT54G
  router with Linux flashed.
 
  On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 10:11 AM, Josh Luthman
  j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:
 
   The software costs nothing but you have to pay for that hardware.  Then
   maintain it.
  
   Josh Luthman
   Office: 937-552-2340
   Direct: 937-552-2343
   1100 Wayne St
   Suite 1337
   Troy, OH 45373
  
   “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to
  continue
   that counts.”
   --- Winston Churchill
  
  
   On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 12:07 PM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
   wrote:
  
PRI is something like $600/mo.  On one particularly busy site we have
   about
200 users on it, and never seen it go above 12 active channels.
   
The ATA connects to the antenna.  In our case, most are UBNT units.
   The
UBNT does PPPoE and NAT for the customer, but VLAN 999 is passed
  straight
through.  The ATA picks this up and bridges the rest.  VoIP switch at
  the
tower is on VLAN 999, so the ATA gets it's IP from the switch and
   connects
directly to it without any routers.
   
Use something like Trix if you think Asterisk is too much work.
   Cost...
   I
don't know... we downloaded Asterisk for free, so it didn't cost us
anything.
   
On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 10:03 AM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:
   
 How much is a PRI for each tower?

 What is the ATA connecting to?

 I've tried Asterisk and there is absolutely no comparison versus my
current
 platform in simplicity.  Way too much work and cost in my
 opinion...

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to
continue
 that counts.”
 --- Winston Churchill


 On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 11:58 AM, Jayson Baker 
  jay...@spectrasurf.com
 wrote:

  Roll you own.
 
  We have PRI's at our tower sites (at least the primary sites),
 and
  redundant
  Asterisk switches.
 
  The switches have a VLAN, which is common throughout the entire
   network
  down
  to the ATA/IP Phone.
 
  VoIP doesn't touch any router.  The ATA at customers house is on
  the
same
  VLAN as the switch, so no NAT issues or anything.
 
  Because switch is at the tower, it's only the last mile of QoS we
   have
to
  worry about.
 
  We've done it many different ways--started out wholesaling,
   rebranding,
  etc.
   So far this has been the simpliest and best-working solution
 yet.
 
  On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 9:33 AM, Kevin Sullivan
  kevin.sulli...@alyrica.netwrote:
 
   We'd like to start offering VoIP to our wireless customers, and
   we've
  taken
   a look at a couple of packaged soultions like NetSapiens. What
 is
  everyone
   else using? We'd like to start at a lower $$ than the $17,000
  that
 we've
   been hearing from the packaged deals.
  
   Kevin
  
  
  
  
 

   
  
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] what to use with Mikrotik as AP

[Jayson Baker]

If you have to use MT as the AP, yes go with the UBNT cards.
MT cards are ok for CPE stuff.  Certainly not tower stuff.

But I was moreso saying don't use MT as the AP.
Use the UBNT Rockets or Nano's as APs.

On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 2:04 PM, Mark Dueck m...@netking.bz wrote:

 On 04/19/2010 01:41 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
  On the subject of strictly MT backhauls what kind of throughput are you
  looking for?
 
 My throughput requirements are minimal at this point.  I'm in Belize,
 and clients here generally get 128 to 512kbps connections. If I get a
 36Mbit backhaul link, I'm good for a while.
  I always use this enclosure
  http://quicklinkwireless.com/Itemdesc.asp?ic=DCE-H-LG-2eq=Tp=
 
  For a backhaul with 1 card a 411ah is fine.  433ah for two cards.
 
  Ubnt for xr2/xr5 cards.
 
 So you'd rather go with ubnt cards than Mikrotik?
  I've used Arc antenna/enclosure for 5ghz small backhauls and they work as
  expected.  I've used Pac dishes for extra punch.
 
  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373
 
  “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to
 continue
  that counts.”
  --- Winston Churchill
 
 
  On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 2:35 PM, Dennis Burgess dmburg...@linktechs.net
 wrote:
 
 
  your MT vendor or hardware vendor can help you with this.
 
  ---
  Dennis Burgess, CCNA, Mikrotik Certified Trainer, MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE,
  MTCTCE, MTCUME
  Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik  WISP Support Services
  Office: 314-735-0270 Website: http://www.linktechs.net
  LIVE On-Line Mikrotik Training - Author of Learn RouterOS
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of Mark Dueck
  Sent: Monday, April 19, 2010 1:20 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: [WISPA] what to use with Mikrotik as AP
 
  Hi,
 
  I'm running a small WISP and I've been using only Tranzeo till now.  I
  would like to start using something that support MIMO.  What should I
  consider?  Been reading a lot on this list about UBNT and Mikrotik.
  What boards do you use if you go with Mikrotik?  Will I get any benefit
  if I put some MIMO clients, but still mostly use Tranzeo clients?
 
 
  Also for Mikrotik backhauls, can someone give details of the boards,
  cards and enclosures you use for them?
 
  many thanks,
  Mark
 
 
  
  
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Re: [WISPA] monitoring product (was Re: Ubiquiti Beta 5.2.4 Released)

[Jayson Baker]

We do this now.  From NOAA weather stations.  All our backhaul links are
polled every 60 seconds for just about everything they spit out (i.e. bits
in/out, signals, errors, temperature, etc.) as well as NOAA weather info
(temp, humidity, pressure, etc.) for the nearest station.  It's all
available on a graph to us through extranet.  Works very well.

On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 8:07 AM, Matt Liotta mlio...@r337.com wrote:

 This makes me think about a cool product someone needs to produce. Some
 sort of device that could be deployed at a wireless colocation site that
 would simply listen on a variety of bands and collect weather information.
 The device would make all this data available via some reasonable API;
 possibly SNMP. Then a monitoring system to collect this data and graph it
 historically. This would allow the operator to have a much better view of
 the environment for which their network is operating in.

 -Matt

 On Apr 9, 2010, at 10:00 AM, John Scrivner wrote:

  I am not a huge UBNT fan but I might be persuaded to buy one of these for
  each tower to setup as a remote Spectrum Analyzer for each tower
 location.
  How much do these radios run and who sells them on here?
  Scriv




 
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Re: [WISPA] 3.65 GHz WiMAX deal

[Jayson Baker]

Why would you use this in rural deployment, as opposed to something like a
cheaper UBNT MIMO system, which will give you better penetration?

On Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 9:04 AM, Patrick Leary ple...@apertonet.com wrote:

 Indeed MIMO does help through trees according to people I trust, but
 again we default to the but at what cost question. We believe this to
 be especially true in more rural deployments.


 Patrick Leary
 Aperto Networks
 813.426.4230 mobile

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
 Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2010 7:52 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] 3.65 GHz WiMAX deal

 Subchannelization should help penetration a little also.

 Sent from my iPhone

 On Mar 18, 2010, at 9:43 AM, Matt lm7...@gmail.com wrote:

  Do you support PPPoE in the SM?  Heard that MIMO helps tree
  penetration.
 
  Matt
 
 
  Yes, but you won't pay $200 for their CPE complete and our base
  station costs are less or similar and we are getting much better
  uplink speed according to what I have seen so far from reports about
  the Moto 320 so far.
 
 
  Patrick Leary
  Aperto Networks
  813.426.4230 mobile
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- boun...@wispa.org]

  On Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
  Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2010 7:30 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] 3.65 GHz WiMAX deal
 
  I think the new motorola is mimo.
 
  Sent from my iPhone
 
  On Mar 18, 2010, at 9:29 AM, Matt lm7...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  We don't know about you, but we at California-based Aperto Networks

  are tired of waiting for stimulus dollars to trickle into the WISP
  business, so we are taking matters into our own hands. So Aperto
  Networks -- the
  802.16 pioneer and WiMAX leader -- is excited to offer the 3.65 and

  5
 
  GHz carrier class and commercial grade (not the residential CPE)
  PM320 PacketMAX CPE for only $199 each to the WISP. Effective
  immediately, the price applies to all N type CPE in either band and
  17 dbi integrated
  (3.65 GHz) and 20 dBi (5 GHz). 5 GHz with integrated 21 dBi and
  3.65 GHz
  with integrated 20 dBi are $220 to the WISP. There are no packs and

  no minimum quantities to get this price -- buy even just one, same
  price.
 
  Is there 3.65 stuff MIMO?
 
  Matt
 
 
  ---
  ---
  ---
  ---
  
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Re: [WISPA] UBNT WDS Bridge mode for transparency

[Jayson Baker]

Actually, at the Vegas conference UBNT said you should *never* specify MACs.
I don't remember why, but you may want to check into it first!

On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 5:51 PM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 Depends on what you're using.

 If they're both AP and you want them both to broadcast, AP WDS is what you
 want.  I suggest you specify MACs and not use the auto feature.  If there
 are 3 or more APs you absolutely can not use auto as it will create a loop
 (ignoring STP for now...).

 If you want to have an AP, then a customer radio and finally their PC and
 see the PC's mac as if the customer radio is just a switch you need station
 wds.

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue
 that counts.”
 --- Winston Churchill


 On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 7:46 PM, Greg Ihnen os10ru...@gmail.com wrote:

  UBNT says you have to use WDS with Bridge mode if you want transparent
  packet transport with no funny business. Does that apply to one end being
 AP
  and the other being station WDS? Or do they both have to be AP?
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL

[Jayson Baker]

That's what we did.  $24.95/mo gets you 12Mbps/6Mbps.  $49.95/mo gets you
20Mbps/6Mbps.
We guarantee minimums--not just an up to speed.  A lot of people really
like that too.
Our packages: www.peakinter.net

On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 11:14 PM, MDK rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote:

 One of the things you have to keep in mind, is that you really do have to
 offer your customers a decent value for their dollars.35 Bux for a
 fraction of a meg is darn steep pricing these days.   We offer a 300K for
 25
 and 2 meg for 38.50, which is reasonably competitive.

 You don't' need to be the cheapest to be competitive, but you can't be
 way
 outside of normal pricing.

 I'm thinking of throwing up some MIMO gear and offering something like a 7
 meg service.Was thinking of making it about 75 / mo.Not the
 cheapest.   Not the most expensive, either. What would 7 meg be in your
 area?



 ++
 Neofast, Inc, Making internet easy
 541-969-8200  509-386-4589
 ++

 --
 From: Kurt Fankhauser k...@wavelinc.com
 Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 8:05 AM
 To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL

  Local phone company here just expanded their DSL coverage area and mailed
  out fliers to everyone for $15 DSL. I see no mention of it being a
  promotional price. One person said as long as you have it they will not
  raise the rate from $15. Think its for 768k service. Anyways we are
  getting
  about 1 person a day switching from our $35/month/768k wireless service
 to
  this DSL. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how to retain these
  customers They are not even giving us a chance to offer them a lower
  price as they all already have the DSL turned on and been using it for a
  month before they cancel ours.
 
 
 
  Kurt Fankhauser
  WAVELINC
  P.O. Box 126
  Bucyrus, OH 44820
  419-562-6405
  www.wavelinc.com
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
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Re: [WISPA] Optoisolator for Ethernet?

[Jayson Baker]

How weird.  We need exactly this too.  A building we're in that used to be
two, but were combined, and each have their own service drops.  There's a
difference in ground potential.

On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 6:30 PM, Greg Ihnen os10ru...@gmail.com wrote:

 I've seen a telephone (copper pair) optoisolator which had a short piece of
 fiberoptic cable inside. Each circuit on both sides of the cable had their
 own highly isolated power supplies. This was the only thing that worked in
 the Amazon region to stop phone equipment from getting wiped out during the
 intense electrical storms. The beauty of this device was it didn't require a
 first class ground system to work, in fact it didn't require any ground. A
 ground would just present up a difference in potential between the phone
 line and ground and encourage destruction. The telco side of this thing
 would just float at what ever potential the telco's lines were presenting
 and the on site equipment on the other side of this thing never saw that
 potential. Has anyone seen such a thing for Ethernet?

 Greg



 
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Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL

[Jayson Baker]

We offer something the telco never will...
A local business with local, friendly support staff.  All calls are answered
and handled locally.
We promote this heavily--and a lot of people are willing to pay more for it.

On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 9:24 AM, Steven G McGehee stev...@qx.net wrote:

 Hi Kurt,

 What we decided to do a few years ago was let the residential users
 go, basically. We knew we couldn't compete with the telcos/cable co.
 increasingly lower prices so our sales guys (I'm a tech) changed tactics
 and just focused on businesses -- offering them multi-megabit upstream
 speeds, carrier grade uptime with SLAs whereby they get a credit for
 every hour they're down (which is quite rare, but customers like the
 sound of it). We often also throw offer a second backup wireless link
 (usually connecting on to a different PoP on a different frequency) and
 setup EIGRP for them. Hosting/email services/24-7
 monitoring/colocation/voip are on the menu too so those get put into
 negotiations with the potential clients.

 Residential users don't have a need for a lot of that though, so we too
 were wondering how to compete. While we still do dialup/DSL for them,
 our strategy was to go for the businesses...a few years behind us, we're
 happy with that decision. Good luck!

 -Steven



 Kurt Fankhauser wrote:
  Local phone company here just expanded their DSL coverage area and mailed
  out fliers to everyone for $15 DSL. I see no mention of it being a
  promotional price. One person said as long as you have it they will not
  raise the rate from $15. Think its for 768k service. Anyways we are
 getting
  about 1 person a day switching from our $35/month/768k wireless service
 to
  this DSL. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how to retain these
  customers They are not even giving us a chance to offer them a lower
  price as they all already have the DSL turned on and been using it for a
  month before they cancel ours.
 
 
 
  Kurt Fankhauser
  WAVELINC
  P.O. Box 126
  Bucyrus, OH 44820
  419-562-6405
  www.wavelinc.com
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
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Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL

[Jayson Baker]

Oh yeah--that helps too.  We flat-rate everything.
$24.95/mo for your Internet includes your taxes, your fees, your equipment
rental.
$19.95/mo for your Phone includes taxes, fees, equipment rental, E911, and
everything else.
And we don't have contracts.  We tell everyone, if you like us you'll stay,
if you don't we're not going to penalize you
Talking straight-up to the customer when they call and flat out saying
things like that makes most people go, damn... you guys are pretty cool!

:-)

On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 9:56 AM, Kurt Fankhauser k...@wavelinc.com wrote:

 I was wrong I guess the $15 is only for 12 months. Also looks like their
 $29.95 after the 12 months and there is probably taxes on that. We have
 been
 thinking of lowering our price to the $29 range though.

 Kurt Fankhauser
 WAVELINC
 P.O. Box 126
 Bucyrus, OH 44820
 419-562-6405
 www.wavelinc.com


 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Jayson Baker
 Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 11:26 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL

 We offer something the telco never will...
 A local business with local, friendly support staff.  All calls are
 answered
 and handled locally.
 We promote this heavily--and a lot of people are willing to pay more for
 it.

 On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 9:24 AM, Steven G McGehee stev...@qx.net wrote:

  Hi Kurt,
 
  What we decided to do a few years ago was let the residential users
  go, basically. We knew we couldn't compete with the telcos/cable co.
  increasingly lower prices so our sales guys (I'm a tech) changed tactics
  and just focused on businesses -- offering them multi-megabit upstream
  speeds, carrier grade uptime with SLAs whereby they get a credit for
  every hour they're down (which is quite rare, but customers like the
  sound of it). We often also throw offer a second backup wireless link
  (usually connecting on to a different PoP on a different frequency) and
  setup EIGRP for them. Hosting/email services/24-7
  monitoring/colocation/voip are on the menu too so those get put into
  negotiations with the potential clients.
 
  Residential users don't have a need for a lot of that though, so we too
  were wondering how to compete. While we still do dialup/DSL for them,
  our strategy was to go for the businesses...a few years behind us, we're
  happy with that decision. Good luck!
 
  -Steven
 
 
 
  Kurt Fankhauser wrote:
   Local phone company here just expanded their DSL coverage area and
 mailed
   out fliers to everyone for $15 DSL. I see no mention of it being a
   promotional price. One person said as long as you have it they will not
   raise the rate from $15. Think its for 768k service. Anyways we are
  getting
   about 1 person a day switching from our $35/month/768k wireless service
  to
   this DSL. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how to retain these
   customers They are not even giving us a chance to offer them a
 lower
   price as they all already have the DSL turned on and been using it for
 a
   month before they cancel ours.
  
  
  
   Kurt Fankhauser
   WAVELINC
   P.O. Box 126
   Bucyrus, OH 44820
   419-562-6405
   www.wavelinc.com
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
 

 
 
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WISPA

Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL

[Jayson Baker]

Bassturds!

On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 10:00 AM, Marlon K. Schafer 
o...@odessaoffice.comwrote:

 Gotta offer higher speeds.

 Better service (customer service especially).

 Get a REAL bill from one of your customers.  It won't be for $15.  They'll
 have taxes, usage fees, modem rental etc. tacked on there.

 I've asked people that have switched from us to give us a copy of the bill
 so we can see just how much they are really saving.  No one has ever
 brought in a bill.  I don't think they save one red cent.

 BTW, you can thank USF for this.  The telco will give away internet to keep
 the subsidies on the land line rolling in.

 Out here Century Tel/link gets between $60 and $100 per month per line in
 USF funds (depends on who you ask).  One of my congressional staff folks
 told me that Century Tel gets 2/3rds of it's income from subsidies of one
 kind or another.  Heck, that makes them a government agency, not a private
 phone company :-).

 deep sigh
 marlon

 - Original Message -
 From: Kurt Fankhauser k...@wavelinc.com
 To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 8:05 AM
 Subject: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL


  Local phone company here just expanded their DSL coverage area and mailed
  out fliers to everyone for $15 DSL. I see no mention of it being a
  promotional price. One person said as long as you have it they will not
  raise the rate from $15. Think its for 768k service. Anyways we are
  getting
  about 1 person a day switching from our $35/month/768k wireless service
 to
  this DSL. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how to retain these
  customers They are not even giving us a chance to offer them a lower
  price as they all already have the DSL turned on and been using it for a
  month before they cancel ours.
 
 
 
  Kurt Fankhauser
  WAVELINC
  P.O. Box 126
  Bucyrus, OH 44820
  419-562-6405
  www.wavelinc.com
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL

[Jayson Baker]

But if they just truly just don't like you and don't want your service, they
are penalized to get out of a contract.
We switch a LOT of people over from the local telco, who has been
contracting people as much as they can.
People HATE that company for that.  And bad mouth them all over town for it.

On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 10:34 AM, Travis Johnson t...@ida.net wrote:

 I disagree with no contracts. Many times people get upset for reasons
 outside of our control (viruses, antenna damage, water in broken cable).
 If we didn't have a contract in place, they would just cancel.
 Otherwise, we at least have a chance to talk to them and see if we can
 fix it _before_ they switch.

 Travis
 Microserv

 Jayson Baker wrote:
  Oh yeah--that helps too.  We flat-rate everything.
  $24.95/mo for your Internet includes your taxes, your fees, your
 equipment
  rental.
  $19.95/mo for your Phone includes taxes, fees, equipment rental, E911,
 and
  everything else.
  And we don't have contracts.  We tell everyone, if you like us you'll
 stay,
  if you don't we're not going to penalize you
  Talking straight-up to the customer when they call and flat out saying
  things like that makes most people go, damn... you guys are pretty
 cool!
 
  :-)
 
  On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 9:56 AM, Kurt Fankhauser k...@wavelinc.com
 wrote:
 
 
  I was wrong I guess the $15 is only for 12 months. Also looks like their
  $29.95 after the 12 months and there is probably taxes on that. We have
  been
  thinking of lowering our price to the $29 range though.
 
  Kurt Fankhauser
  WAVELINC
  P.O. Box 126
  Bucyrus, OH 44820
  419-562-6405
  www.wavelinc.com
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of Jayson Baker
  Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 11:26 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL
 
  We offer something the telco never will...
  A local business with local, friendly support staff.  All calls are
  answered
  and handled locally.
  We promote this heavily--and a lot of people are willing to pay more for
  it.
 
  On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 9:24 AM, Steven G McGehee stev...@qx.net
 wrote:
 
 
  Hi Kurt,
 
  What we decided to do a few years ago was let the residential users
  go, basically. We knew we couldn't compete with the telcos/cable co.
  increasingly lower prices so our sales guys (I'm a tech) changed
 tactics
  and just focused on businesses -- offering them multi-megabit upstream
  speeds, carrier grade uptime with SLAs whereby they get a credit for
  every hour they're down (which is quite rare, but customers like the
  sound of it). We often also throw offer a second backup wireless link
  (usually connecting on to a different PoP on a different frequency) and
  setup EIGRP for them. Hosting/email services/24-7
  monitoring/colocation/voip are on the menu too so those get put into
  negotiations with the potential clients.
 
  Residential users don't have a need for a lot of that though, so we too
  were wondering how to compete. While we still do dialup/DSL for them,
  our strategy was to go for the businesses...a few years behind us,
 we're
  happy with that decision. Good luck!
 
  -Steven
 
 
 
  Kurt Fankhauser wrote:
 
  Local phone company here just expanded their DSL coverage area and
 
  mailed
 
  out fliers to everyone for $15 DSL. I see no mention of it being a
  promotional price. One person said as long as you have it they will
 not
  raise the rate from $15. Think its for 768k service. Anyways we are
 
  getting
 
  about 1 person a day switching from our $35/month/768k wireless
 service
 
  to
 
  this DSL. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how to retain these
  customers They are not even giving us a chance to offer them a
 
  lower
 
  price as they all already have the DSL turned on and been using it for
 
  a
 
  month before they cancel ours.
 
 
 
  Kurt Fankhauser
  WAVELINC
  P.O. Box 126
  Bucyrus, OH 44820
  419-562-6405
  www.wavelinc.com
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
  
 
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Re: [WISPA] [Motorola II] Ubiquity AirMax - rehashed?

[Jayson Baker]

We use a lot of Loco2's - as you mention, they work great.

We're starting to deploy a lot of AirMax 5GHz stuff - it works even better.
 We regularly see customers getting speedtest of 80Mbps (down and up).
 Latency is good.  We're in a very heavily crowded 5GHz area, and it doesn't
seem to affect it at all once you turn on AirMax.

On Thu, Mar 4, 2010 at 10:43 AM, Jerry Richardson
jrichard...@aircloud.comwrote:

  Can I get some feedback on those using AirMax procucts?



 We've use the NS2's in situations where we there are not many clients and
 the CPE's can all hear each which seems seems to work well.



 The form factor, design, price, and performance combination of the M series
 hard to ignore and if it works as well as the NS2's have I'm game for trying
 it on a small scale where I need a lot of bandwidth and resistence to
 interference.



 I'm willing to let my bad Bullet experience go as a fluke.





 [image: aircloud_WebTiny_color_white_back_120x45]

 *Broadband for Business*

 *Public and Private WiFi*



 Jerry Richardson

 VP Operations

 925-260-4119 x2

 Website http://www.aircloud.com/   Blog http://weblog.aircloud.com/
 Twitter http://www.twitter.com/aircloudbband   
 LinkedInhttp://www.linkedin.com/pub/jerry-richardson/6/372/354



image001.gif


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Re: [WISPA] Clear

[Jayson Baker]

They've met with our datacenter folks and been on the roof numerous times.
To me, that says they're getting ready to make some sort of move.

On Wed, Feb 24, 2010 at 6:39 AM, Dylan Bouterse dy...@corp.power1.comwrote:

 Interesting. They are installing equipment on towers in our area (after
 having leases for 4+ years) but I'm not seeing Orlando as a current or
 future area. Actually I'm not seeing future areas (just in the legend).
 Maybe I have the wrong map.

 http://www.clear.com/coverage

 Dylan

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Mike Hammett
 Sent: Tuesday, February 23, 2010 11:20 PM
 To: wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: [WISPA] Clear

 In looking at Clear's web site, they have a green for areas that are
 covered now and a dark grey for future coverage.  Does anyone know how
 quickly they expect to fill that coverage?  How quickly they'll expand
 beyond their future coverage?


 -
 Mike Hammett
 Intelligent Computing Solutions
 http://www.ics-il.com



 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Clear

[Jayson Baker]

I haven't seen their site, but I know they've been sniffing around Colorado
Springs quite a bit the last year.  I think they're getting ready to make a
move.

On Tue, Feb 23, 2010 at 9:19 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.netwrote:

 In looking at Clear's web site, they have a green for areas that are
 covered now and a dark grey for future coverage.  Does anyone know how
 quickly they expect to fill that coverage?  How quickly they'll expand
 beyond their future coverage?


 -
 Mike Hammett
 Intelligent Computing Solutions
 http://www.ics-il.com




 
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Re: [WISPA] Reflector grid or dish for NS2/NS2L

[Jayson Baker]

I wouldn't use a dish on the NS2, maybe the NS2L is ok.  NS2 has two patch
antennas internally, which will cause a really screwed up pattern out of a
dish.  Even though people claim to do it, I would not.  NS2L has only a
single patch, and should be better, but still not perfect.  Keep in mind
these are not FCC certified.

On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 5:49 PM, Rick Harnish rharn...@wispa.org wrote:

 Blair,



 http://www.wispa.org/?page_id=325  SecurAlign is a WISPA Vendor member who
 makes reflector dishes for this exact purpose.  Their website is
 http://www.securalign.com/  Ask for Layne Christianson.



 Thanks,

 Rick



 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Blair Davis
 Sent: Monday, February 15, 2010 7:40 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] Reflector grid or dish for NS2/NS2L



 I am looking for reflectors that can be used with the NS2 or NS2L to
 increase gain and directionality.

 Has anyone seen or heard of something like this?  It seems to me to be an
 obvious add-on to the radios and a much better way to get more gain than
 using the external antenna port on the NS2.  I expect it would be less
 expensive than grid and pigtail as well.

 Blair

 No virus found in this incoming message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 8.5.435 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2687 - Release Date: 02/15/10
 19:35:00




 
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Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show

[Jayson Baker]

You're wanting to go on a family vacation?  I thought this was to be a WISP
conference.  Like, for WISP operators.
I, personally, have no intention of spending that much for airline tickets,
and going to play with Mickey Mouse while I'm at a conference.

On Mon, Feb 8, 2010 at 6:44 AM, Dylan Bouterse dy...@corp.power1.comwrote:

 Orlando!

 We have the 4 Disney parks, Universal Studios, Blue Men, Sea World, I-Drive
 area, Kissimmee area and a WHOLE lot more. I'm not aware of any zip lines
 though. :oP

 Dylan

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Mike
 Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 8:29 AM
 To: 'WISPA General List'
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show

 Phoenix.  Dry and warm.

 *OR* I live 5 minutes up the hill from a world class casino and hotel
 complex. http://www.meskwaki.com/

 I could host, and you could take turns climbing my towers, and riding the
 zip lines here at Gilly Hollow.  One of them is a terror at 750 feet.

 Mike

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Robert West
 Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 11:18 PM
 To: 'WISPA General List'
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show

 I'm the same.  If Vegas, I'd pass.  Having shows in Vegas isn't about the
 show, it's about Vegas.  The show is just the vehicle to use to get there.
 A show in Vegas has become a cliché.

 Bob-



 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Glenn Kelley
 Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 11:39 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show

 I was just in Vegas for the Ubiquity meeting

 If you are planning to take your family anywhere - VEGAS is not the place -
 IMHO

 When you get off the plane and exit the airport you are handed pamphlets
 for
 prostitutes to come to your hotel room from $25/ hr
 Having 3 daughters and 1 son ... I can tell you - this is hardly the place
 I
 would like to take my family on vacation.

 Disney sounds better ;-)

 Of course this is all business - - going out to Columbus, Philadelphia,
 Indy, Chicago, Denver - yeah - much nicer...



 
 _
 Glenn Kelley | Principle | HostMedic |www.HostMedic.com
  Email: gl...@hostmedic.com
 Pplease don't print this e-mail unless you really need to.

 On Feb 4, 2010, at 11:23 AM, Randy Cosby wrote:

  Next time, drive up to Mesquite  (1.25 hours) or St. George - Great
  rooms / prices you can feel good about taking the family to. :)
 
  Randy
 
 
  On 2/4/2010 9:12 AM, Eje Gustafsson wrote:
  *shudder* Reminds me of WISPCon in Vegas. The WISPCon hotel screwed up
 my
  families reserveration. Roadeo show in town and one other large
 conference.
  There was not a hotel room in entire Vegas, Henderson or anywhere close
  enough to drive to. Got to the hotel around 7pm to find out there was no
  available room for us. We called probably 100 different places and
 visited
  probably another 40+ places, pleading and begging for a room. We didn't
 even
  find any rooms at the ones that only rented per week.
  Me, my wife, one baby and one toddler.
  Finally about 2:30am we gave up and ended up sleeping in our rental
 minivan
  on the parking lot. In the middle of the night by accident set of the
 car
  alarm. Got kicked off the lot by the Casino security guards. Dumb ass
  suggested we drive downtown and take in on a hotel that charge by the
 hour.
  Yeah exactly the place I want to take 2 small children.. Parking the car
 on
  a street and sleeping in it was out of the question. We circled the
 block
  parked at a different location at the Casino parking area and went back
 to
  sleep.
 
  The memories.. Might have to do that again but without the kids ;)
 
  / Eje
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of lakel...@gbcx.net
  Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 10:00 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
 
  10+ years ago I remember making a deal with a hotel to take a shower in
 a
  room that was being refurbished after driving through he night from NY.
 No
  available rooms for 50 miles.
 
  I should throw all my crap into a U-haul truck, drive it out there and
  abandon the thing!  LOL
 
  -B-
  Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
 
  -Original Message-
  From: Blake Bowersbbow...@mozarks.com
  Date: Wed, 3 Feb 2010 22:36:47
  To:bwebs...@wirelessmapping.com; WISPA General List
 wireless@wispa.org
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
 
  I have never had a problem finding rooms at Dayton, usually with my
  normal reservations taking place 2-3 days before the show.  Never.
 
  Now, the hamvention, like all the other hamfests, is no 

Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

So what's the latest with this?

We essentially have an IPTV headend running in the shop.  It's nice being
able to sit in my office and work on the computer, while watching TV
streamed over the LAN.

But that doesn't make much money.

At the UBNT AirMax conference they said they're doing IPTV over the new M
stuff.  But... I still run into that little issue of 6Mbps multicast rates.

On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 9:56 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net 
jree...@18-30chat.net wrote:



 Jayson Baker wrote:
  I will need to test that. The setting lets you use any valid modulation
 for
  the
  RF mode your in. I will also test with my B5M's.
 
 
  What exactly are you referring to?  On the older 802.11a/b/g devices I
 see
  Multicast Rate.
  But on the Rocket/Bullet/Nano N-series (M series) I don't see Multicast
  Rate, just Allow all

 Yup the M's I have do not allow you to set a fixed rate. I should have been
 clearer in that I meant that the AirMax stuff was different then the AirOS
 stuff.


 
  On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:20 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net 
  jree...@18-30chat.net wrote:
 
  I will need to test that. The setting lets you use any valid modulation
 for
  the
  RF mode your in. I will also test with my B5M's.
 
  Jayson Baker wrote:
  IIRc, multicast is limited at the 6Mbps modulation on WiFi
 
  Tell me I'm wrong, please.  But I've read it a couple times--compeltely
  forgot until we started doing this.
 
  Before, when we were watching IPTV off our fiber headend, we were doing
  it
  over EoIP.
 
  On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 9:19 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net 
  jree...@18-30chat.net wrote:
 
  You can change the multicast rate on the non airmax units. Mine are
  enroute
  so
  have not tried with the airmax gear.
 
 
  I have not heard back about the units.
 
  At 130 ea, a Roku with the same features as the low end unit, will be
  more
  cost
  effective. I am still researching about the licensing requirements of
  securing
  the data stream for non OTA channels.
 
 
  Jayson Baker wrote:
  I seem to remember the low-end ones were around $130/ea.  Not sure
  about
  the
  others.  Price will vary based on where you buy and in what quantity
 I
  assume.
 
  Remembered that standard 802.11 will only multicast at around 1Mbps.
   So
  that's why we were having the problem with the multicast over AirMax
  equipment.
 
  On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:59 AM, richard sterne 
  wireless.r...@gmail.comwrote:
  Did you get any pricing for the Amino STB's?
  I would like to know more about your setup.
 
  Richard
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

Probably would not be profitable for us, either, in all actuality.
We'd like to just offer some basic channels.  Maybe 30 or 40.  For those
people who really just want basic TV
Networks, Disney, ESPN, etc.  But I think the programmers would force you to
carry all their other stupid channels.

*shrug*

On Mon, Feb 8, 2010 at 11:25 AM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 To this day I've heard of countless people that do it to compete (the
 triple
 bundle) but none that make any money.

 6mbps multicast...per active channel.

 Usually it happens in such a way that if someone starts watching a channels
 20-25 the channel will multicast through the network up until no one is
 watching it for ~5 minutes.

 Super bandwidth hog.

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue
 that counts.”
 --- Winston Churchill


 On Mon, Feb 8, 2010 at 1:22 PM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
 wrote:

  So what's the latest with this?
 
  We essentially have an IPTV headend running in the shop.  It's nice being
  able to sit in my office and work on the computer, while watching TV
  streamed over the LAN.
 
  But that doesn't make much money.
 
  At the UBNT AirMax conference they said they're doing IPTV over the new M
  stuff.  But... I still run into that little issue of 6Mbps multicast
 rates.
 
  On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 9:56 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net 
  jree...@18-30chat.net wrote:
 
  
  
   Jayson Baker wrote:
I will need to test that. The setting lets you use any valid
  modulation
   for
the
RF mode your in. I will also test with my B5M's.
   
   
What exactly are you referring to?  On the older 802.11a/b/g devices
 I
   see
Multicast Rate.
But on the Rocket/Bullet/Nano N-series (M series) I don't see
 Multicast
Rate, just Allow all
  
   Yup the M's I have do not allow you to set a fixed rate. I should have
  been
   clearer in that I meant that the AirMax stuff was different then the
  AirOS
   stuff.
  
  
   
On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:20 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net 
jree...@18-30chat.net wrote:
   
I will need to test that. The setting lets you use any valid
  modulation
   for
the
RF mode your in. I will also test with my B5M's.
   
Jayson Baker wrote:
IIRc, multicast is limited at the 6Mbps modulation on WiFi
   
Tell me I'm wrong, please.  But I've read it a couple
  times--compeltely
forgot until we started doing this.
   
Before, when we were watching IPTV off our fiber headend, we were
  doing
it
over EoIP.
   
On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 9:19 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net 
jree...@18-30chat.net wrote:
   
You can change the multicast rate on the non airmax units. Mine
 are
enroute
so
have not tried with the airmax gear.
   
   
I have not heard back about the units.
   
At 130 ea, a Roku with the same features as the low end unit, will
  be
more
cost
effective. I am still researching about the licensing requirements
  of
securing
the data stream for non OTA channels.
   
   
Jayson Baker wrote:
I seem to remember the low-end ones were around $130/ea.  Not
 sure
about
the
others.  Price will vary based on where you buy and in what
  quantity
   I
assume.
   
Remembered that standard 802.11 will only multicast at around
  1Mbps.
 So
that's why we were having the problem with the multicast over
  AirMax
equipment.
   
On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:59 AM, richard sterne 
wireless.r...@gmail.comwrote:
Did you get any pricing for the Amino STB's?
I would like to know more about your setup.
   
Richard
   
   
   
   
   
  
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show

[Jayson Baker]

I'm down with Denver, since it's about an hour away.  But really, Vegas is
usually the cheapest to fly into, and cheap to stay at; with plenty to do
with a short walk from your hotel.  I've been in every casino in Vegas and
never taken a cab or had to drive.  Denver... ehh, not so much.

On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 10:17 AM, Chuck Profito cprof...@cv-access.comwrote:

 How come we don't hear any one suggesting a show in Denver or Salt Lake?
 Pretty much the center of the country with MAJOR airline hubs direct to all
 points.

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Josh Luthman
 Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 9:03 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show

 I have a fridge full of beer you are welcome to.  I'll bring the whole
 fridge if I can go somewhere the weather isn't disgusting.

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue
 that counts.
 --- Winston Churchill


 On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 11:59 AM, Robert West
 robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote:

  Yes, and notice how Josh suddenly clammed up once it was settled to all
  crash at his house and drink his beer, break his Playstation3 and
 embarrass
  him in front of all his neighbors at 3 in the morning..
 
  I see how things are, Josh.  After all we've been through together you
 have
  to turn into this.
 
  Bob
 
 
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of Stuart Pierce
  Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 11:23 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
 
 
  Hey now, the weather is nice today. Granted Columbus isn't Kettering, but
  hey, it's got more food.
 
  -- Original Message --
  From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com
  Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
  Date:  Fri, 5 Feb 2010 10:44:30 -0500
 
  Ohio weather sucks.  Zipline would be fun!
  
  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373
  
  Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to
 continue
  that counts.
  --- Winston Churchill
  
  
  On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 10:43 AM, Robert West
  robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote:
  
   Me thinks Stuart likes Columbus.
  
   OSU grad, Stuart?
  
   I like the town too.  A lot less than a cow town as it used to be.
  
   Bob-
  
  
  
   -Original Message-
   From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
 On
   Behalf Of Stuart Pierce
   Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 9:37 AM
   To: WISPA General List
   Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
  
   Have I mentioned Columbus Ohio ? Downtown has everything, German
  Village,
   Italian Village, Victorian Village and Campus.
  
   Oh food, wine and song as well.
  
   -- Original Message --
   From: Chuck Hogg ch...@shelbybb.com
   Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
   Date:  Thu, 4 Feb 2010 12:10:24 -0500
  
   I agree here with Marlon that I am afraid that it will turn into an
   ISPCon event.  I learn and enjoy a show like MUM or AFMUG much better
   than ISPCon.  As both a Vendor and an ISP member, shows like ISPCon
   don't have the intimacy like a smaller show does.  I could care less
 if
   it is in Vegas, or some other place, so long as it provides:
   
   1) A chance to meet with other companies in our industry, large,
  medium,
   or small.
   2) A chance to meet with other vendors and work with their special
  niche
   in the market, and have those vendors be WISPA member vendors, not
 just
   any vendor.
   3) A highspeed internet connection to make sure I can stay in touch
  with
   home to make sure business continues.
   4) Close to the airport, reasonable accommodations, and good food is
 a
   plus.
   5) Be reasonable in price.  $250 is WAY too much for me to attend
  as
   an ISP to a tradeshow.
   
   Regards,
   Chuck Hogg
   Shelby Broadband
   502-722-9292
   ch...@shelbybb.com
   http://www.shelbybb.com
   
   
   -Original Message-
   From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
  On
   Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
   Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 12:00 PM
   To: WISPA General List
   Cc: wispas...@wispa.org
   Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
   
   Hi Matt,
   
   I'm moving this back to the show list.  I still request that
 wispashow
   emails reply to that list not the public one :-).
   
   Anyway, I understand what you are saying.  As our local Chamber of
   Commerce
   president here's my latest project:
   http://www.odessachamber.net/bikeweek
   
   Almost all I'm doing is managing the folks doing the leg work.
 Herding
 

Re: [WISPA] Temporarily replace Atlas 5010 with Ubiquity Bullet

[Jayson Baker]

3.5 is for legacy products
5.1 is the latest for N products

On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 10:46 AM, Jerry Richardson
jrichard...@aircloud.comwrote:

 Thanks,
 It's not an M - Ubiquity's firware site makes 3.5 the highest available
 version.



 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Nick Olsen
 Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 9:45 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Temporarily replace Atlas 5010 with Ubiquity Bullet

 I've got it if you/anyone needs it. you=op

 Nick Olsen
 Network Engineer / Customer Support
 (321) 205-1100 x106

 

 From: Michael Baird m...@tc3net.com
 Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 12:05 PM
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Temporarily replace Atlas 5010 with Ubiquity Bullet

 I've got BulletM's doing 30 mb over a 10 mile shot on 20mhz wide
 channel. Make sure you get the latest super secret firmware (5.1.1)
 though, to avoid the WDS/Arp issues.

 Regards
 Michael Baird
  Atlas link went down AGAIN! Probably my fault this time but have no
 spare.
 
  I have a pair of the Bullet that I could slap in there to get through the
 weekend. Think it will work out?
 
  The Trangos were passing ~25Mbps of traffic aggregate.
 
  [cid:image001.gif@01CAA63F.65692320]
  Broadband for Business
  Public and Private WiFi
 
  Jerry Richardson
  VP Operations
  925-260-4119 x2
  Websitehttp://www.aircloud.com/   Bloghttp://weblog.aircloud.com/
 Twitterhttp://www.twitter.com/aircloudbband
 LinkedInhttp://www.linkedin.com/pub/jerry-richardson/6/372/354
 
 
 
  
 
 
 
 

 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Semi-OT: Mobile phone platform questions

[Jayson Baker]

iPhone has all that

On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.netwrote:

 Do any of the mobile phone platforms support VPN at all from the phone
 itself?  Any have a Remote Desktop client?


 -
 Mike Hammett
 Intelligent Computing Solutions
 http://www.ics-il.com




 
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Re: [WISPA] Extra jacketed CAT5e

[Jayson Baker]

We get outs from Sean at CTI.  It's dual-jacketed, shielded, has a drain
wire, and the outer jacket is UV resistent.  Plus, it's cheaper than the
other stuff, and excellent quality.
Let him know I sent you.  :-)

On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 9:21 AM, Kurt Fankhauser k...@wavelinc.com wrote:

 I seen some cat5e once that had a second jacket around it, it was obviously
 made for outdoors and was very durable and it was running through a woods
 just laying on the ground. I think it was made by Belkin. Does anyone know
 what this is and if you have a link where I can get it that would be great.



 Kurt Fankhauser
 WAVELINC
 P.O. Box 126
 Bucyrus, OH 44820
 419-562-6405
 www.wavelinc.com










 
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Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show

[Jayson Baker]

Why would you not have it at Vegas, like most other conventions?  Most days
we can fly there and back for under $100 total round-trip.  Rooms are cheap,
and there is plenty of other stuff to do.  Oh, and free booze.  :-)

On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 9:36 PM, Blake Bowers bbow...@mozarks.com wrote:

 I have never had a problem finding rooms at Dayton, usually with my
 normal reservations taking place 2-3 days before the show.  Never.

 Now, the hamvention, like all the other hamfests, is no where near as
 packed
 as
 it was 10 years ago too.

 4 years ago I did not even have reservations and found rooms at the first
 place I stopped at, a Drury.

 Don't take your organs to heaven,
 heaven knows we need them down here!
 Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.

 - Original Message -
 From: Brian Webster bwebs...@wirelessmapping.com
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2010 9:04 PM
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show


  Not a bad idea, Dayton would be problematic as it has limited lodging in
  the
  area and the hams already book that capacity up long before the
  convention.
  There are other large regional hamfests that might be a good fit for your
  idea however. The one problem that may arise from those is that the
  locations in many cases won't be in areas where the airports have a lot
 of
  competition so the WISP attendees would more than likely have to pay
  higher
  airfare.
 
 
 
  Thank You,
  Brian Webster
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on
  Behalf Of Robert West
  Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2010 9:06 PM
  To: 'WISPA General List'
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
 
 
  Okay, I'd like to throw an idea out there and see who yells..
 
  I had a thought that maybe it could be held at the same time as one of
 the
  large Ham conventions, like the one they hold in Dayton, Ohio.  Only so
  much
  I can see and do at a 3 day event, would be great to be able to go across
  town or wherever to another event that would have a lot of the same sort
  of
  towers, tools, safety gear that we use as Wisp operators.  No way would
 we
  get these type of vendors to come to a Wisp only show, in my opinion.
  The
  bonus is, it could be used as a marketing tool to bring in even more
  people
  without any more effort.  I'd certainly go out of my way for an event
 that
  would cover radio gear as well as the hardware and safety.  A lot of us
  WISP
  operators deal with HAMS and go to their conventions anyhow.  Unless, of
  course, the WISPA show is stuffed with a full assortment of what we use.
  :)
 
 
  Anyway, just an idea.
 
  Bob-
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of Matt Larsen - Lists
  Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2010 1:31 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
 
  All due respect Marlon, but I'm going to disagree with your assumptions.
 
  I have spent the last three months researching the possibility of
  putting on a show and evaluating our options.   Before I started on that
  process, I felt the same way that you do about WISPA putting on our own
  show.   I thought that it would be some work, but doable, and had some
  potential as a fund raiser.
 
  What was truly eye opening to me is the amount of work that is needed to
  put a show on properly.   IMHO, WISPCON got lucky on the first show and
  then it degraded when the organizational and sales efforts did not scale
  up to the potential of the show.   The market is quite different right
  now, and I don't think that we would be as lucky as P-15 was back in the
  day.
 
  Ed's group puts on trade shows - that is their focus.   They are willing
  to do it at no cost to us, and to help us build our membership up so
  that both sides will benefit.   They don't know much about the WISP
  business, so we have an opportunity to work with them to design a show
  that our members would all like to go to.They are going to do it on
  a much larger scale than what we had planned on doing, so we can spread
  WISPAs message beyond our own little community.Those are strong
  positives.
 
  Most importantly, we will not have to commit our money or manpower to
  the project.Money is not that big of a deal, but manpower is.We
  will not be able to put on a show with volunteer manpower, and it isn't
  really a question of just hiring someone because the job requirements go
  far beyond just being an ED type or a sales person.   These guys have a
  staff of people who specialize in this kind of work and can get it done
  more effectively and at a larger scale than we could ever dream of doing
  on our own.
 
  All this being said - if the show is a flop, there will be an out so
  that we can go back to plan A next year if that is what needs to
  happen.   For 

Re: [WISPA] power

[Jayson Baker]

That's not a good idea.  You will create multipath interference, which will
have an overall negative impact.

On Mon, Feb 1, 2010 at 8:09 PM, Jeremie Chism jchi...@gmail.com wrote:

 You may have to rotate your cpe to get a lower signal from the tower.
 I have one that is pointed at a 45 degree angle away from the tower.

 Sent from my iPhone

 On Feb 1, 2010, at 9:06 PM, RickG rgunder...@gmail.com wrote:

  It's a PtMP environment. I have some customers much further away
  running
  high -70's.
  If I drop the AP side, dont I risk loosing them or affecting their
  throughput?
  What about using an attenuator and padding it down some?
  Thanks! -RickG
 
  On Mon, Feb 1, 2010 at 9:02 PM, Nick Olsen
  n...@brevardwireless.com wrote:
 
  Like we said, Drop both sides till the signal gets in the -55 to
  -65 range.
  Doesn't matter what the power is, as long as the signal is around
  there. As
  its where your going to get your best throughput, Barring any other
  interference.
 
  Nick Olsen
  Network Engineer / Customer Support
  (321) 205-1100 x106
 
  
 
  From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com
  Sent: Monday, February 01, 2010 8:56 PM
  To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] power
 
  Ya, thats what I do. I'm just concerned about what the best power
  level
  is?
  I hate to create a monster based on the wrong settings.
 
  On Mon, Feb 1, 2010 at 8:21 PM, Robert West
  robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote:
 
  I have a few like that.  Cheap and quick for low density
  population.  Use
  a
  pac grid for the backhaul and a bullet with an omni for the AP.
  Check
  your
  polarity, make sure you're on the right orientation and right
  radio.  My
  grids are horz. Pol and the omnis, well.  Vertical of course!
 
  Bob-
 
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-
  boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of RickG
  Sent: Monday, February 01, 2010 8:08 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: [WISPA] power
 
  OK, I need a little input. I've got several poor mans repeaters
  around
  by
  using a pair of bullets, one for backhaul and the other for the AP.
  Today,
  I
  installed a Bullet on a new customer that was a stones throw away
  from
  the
  AP. At full power, he got just under 1Mbps. Turning down the
  power, he
  got
  3Mbps+. Is turning down the power on the CPE side on a test and
  trial
  basis
  or is there some kind of method to it?
  -RickG
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul

[Jayson Baker]

True.  All our links are redundant and have multiple diverse paths.

On Sun, Jan 31, 2010 at 6:34 AM, Bret Clark bcl...@spectraaccess.comwrote:

  No critical link should ever be standalone whether using expensive
 equipment or using lower cost equipment. Always a good idea to put a second
 redundant link in running something like RSTP or OSPF.


 Gino Villarini wrote:

 Whatever rocks your world!

 Gino A. villarini...@aeronetpr.com
 Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
 787.273.4143

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org 
 wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of George Morris
 Sent: Sunday, January 31, 2010 12:54 AM
 To: 'WISPA General List'
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul

 Actually, we do Gino and have never had a problem.

 The latest generation of MT gear is pretty near bulletproof if deployed
 properly.

 I suspect there are quite a few people here that run their businesses on
 gear that you would turn you nose up at, so your condescension isn't
 really
 necessary.

 Yikes right back at ya.
 George

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org 
 wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Gino Villarini
 Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 11:38 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul

 Not to sound like a jerk, but who would trust they're main backbone feed
 to a Mikrotik or Ubiquiti

 Yikes! Please get something reliable like a Bridgewave or a Licensed DS3
 Link!

 Gino A. villarini...@aeronetpr.com
 Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
 787.273.4143

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org 
 wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
 Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 11:24 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul

 Thanks for the suggestion. I will take a look and contact you off list.

 Sent from my iPhone

 Begin forwarded message:



  From: Chuck Hogg ch...@shelbybb.com ch...@shelbybb.com
 Date: January 30, 2010 9:20:01 PM CST
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
 Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org wireless@wispa.org

 We are a vendor member and a WISP.  On a short range, you should be
 able
 to use this MT kit just fine.  We will support and configure it for
 you
 for free if you wish.
 http://tinyurl.com/ydzrgfn

 WISPA Members get free assembly.

 Regards,
 Chuck Hogg
 Shelby Broadband
 502-722-9292ch...@shelbybb.comhttp://www.shelbybb.com


 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org 
 wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
 On
 Behalf Of Robert West
 Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 10:16 PM
 To: 'WISPA General List'
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Short range backhaul

 The UBNT Rocket dish but at such short range, overkill.  Really, at
 such
 a
 short hop even a bullet and a grid or the AirGrid would work it fine.

 Bob-


 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org 
 wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
 On
 Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
 Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 6:47 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] Short range backhaul

 I have a pop across the street from one of my towers. The phone
 company there is giving me a great deal on bandwidth but I have to get
 it across to the tower. Any recommendations for something reliable at
 that range.

 Sent from my iPhone


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Re: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul

[Jayson Baker]

Wait until you see the next release of firmware for the Ubiquiti MIMO
equipment.
Built-in spectrum analyzer, 1x better than Mikrotik, and almost as good
as our $30k HP analyzer.
Runs on the unit itself, while it's installed, in place, connected to the
antenna.
Can even run while the radio is in use and connected, but at a slower rate.
It's sweet.  I can't wait.

On Sun, Jan 31, 2010 at 11:18 AM, Tom DeReggi wirelessn...@rapiddsl.netwrote:

 MT is not a replacement for an APEX, since the value of the APEX is
 LICENSED
 spectrum.

 But, I share Chuck's praise for MT. WISPs have been running reliable
 backbones on unlicenced spectrum and MT successfully for years.
 The new MT hardware and Firmwares are really nice and plenty reliable. For
 any link 50mbps or less, I'd select an Unlicensed solution without
 hesitation.
 Specifically, MT w/ WDS and NStreme will do 30mbps HDX on a 20Mhz channel
 easilly. As well, if you use the latest N class mPCI, you can set it up
 with
 a Dual Pol panel.
 I personally do not like Mimo configs much, but I like using N cards for
 manual on-the-fly polarity change/selection.

 I prefer the MT over the Ubiquiti, because the MT can do channel scans now,
 and thats important to be able to quickly identify free channels if
 Interference is ever received.
 But I really like the Ubiquiti antennas, that make DP inexpensive.

 I personally prefer Tlink-45s, which are a great radio, because they are a
 ready to go solution.  But off-promo MT can save you a few dollars.

 Tom DeReggi
 RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
 IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


 - Original Message -
 From: Chuck Hogg ch...@shelbybb.com
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Sunday, January 31, 2010 10:13 AM
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul


  We do as well. One of our MT links has more stability and reliability
  than a neighboring Trango Apex link.
 
  Regards,
  Chuck
 
  On Jan 30, 2010, at 11:38 PM, Gino Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com
  wrote:
 
  Not to sound like a jerk, but who would trust they're main backbone
  feed
  to a Mikrotik or Ubiquiti
 
  Yikes! Please get something reliable like a Bridgewave or a Licensed
  DS3
  Link!
 
  Gino A. Villarini
  g...@aeronetpr.com
  Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
  787.273.4143
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
  On
  Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
  Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 11:24 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul
 
  Thanks for the suggestion. I will take a look and contact you off
  list.
 
  Sent from my iPhone
 
  Begin forwarded message:
 
  From: Chuck Hogg ch...@shelbybb.com
  Date: January 30, 2010 9:20:01 PM CST
  To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
  Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 
 
  We are a vendor member and a WISP.  On a short range, you should be
  able
  to use this MT kit just fine.  We will support and configure it for
  you
  for free if you wish.
 
  http://tinyurl.com/ydzrgfn
 
  WISPA Members get free assembly.
 
  Regards,
  Chuck Hogg
  Shelby Broadband
  502-722-9292
  ch...@shelbybb.com
  http://www.shelbybb.com
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
  On
  Behalf Of Robert West
  Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 10:16 PM
  To: 'WISPA General List'
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
 
  The UBNT Rocket dish but at such short range, overkill.  Really, at
  such
  a
  short hop even a bullet and a grid or the AirGrid would work it fine.
 
  Bob-
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
  On
  Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
  Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 6:47 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
 
  I have a pop across the street from one of my towers. The phone
  company there is giving me a great deal on bandwidth but I have to
  get
  it across to the tower. Any recommendations for something reliable at
  that range.
 
  Sent from my iPhone
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Short range backhaul

[Jayson Baker]

I'll second that.  Or is it 3 now?  We have MT links that have been in
places for years running dual-nstreme and get 70Mbps out of them all day,
everyday.

On Sat, Jan 30, 2010 at 9:54 PM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 This guy.

 Out of every backhaul in the network the most reliable has been the
 rb333 with engenius cards followed by an rb532 (yes 532 the piece of
 junk).  Tied for third are the smaller 411/r52 links (only a year on
 one and a few weeks on the other, but so far 100%).

 This includes Ceragon/Radwin links and Redline.

 On 1/30/10, Gino Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com wrote:
  Not to sound like a jerk, but who would trust they're main backbone feed
  to a Mikrotik or Ubiquiti
 
  Yikes! Please get something reliable like a Bridgewave or a Licensed DS3
  Link!
 
  Gino A. Villarini
  g...@aeronetpr.com
  Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
  787.273.4143
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
  Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 11:24 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul
 
  Thanks for the suggestion. I will take a look and contact you off list.
 
  Sent from my iPhone
 
  Begin forwarded message:
 
  From: Chuck Hogg ch...@shelbybb.com
  Date: January 30, 2010 9:20:01 PM CST
  To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
  Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 
 
  We are a vendor member and a WISP.  On a short range, you should be
  able
  to use this MT kit just fine.  We will support and configure it for
  you
  for free if you wish.
 
  http://tinyurl.com/ydzrgfn
 
  WISPA Members get free assembly.
 
  Regards,
  Chuck Hogg
  Shelby Broadband
  502-722-9292
  ch...@shelbybb.com
  http://www.shelbybb.com
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
  On
  Behalf Of Robert West
  Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 10:16 PM
  To: 'WISPA General List'
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
 
  The UBNT Rocket dish but at such short range, overkill.  Really, at
  such
  a
  short hop even a bullet and a grid or the AirGrid would work it fine.
 
  Bob-
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
  On
  Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
  Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 6:47 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
 
  I have a pop across the street from one of my towers. The phone
  company there is giving me a great deal on bandwidth but I have to get
  it across to the tower. Any recommendations for something reliable at
  that range.
 
  Sent from my iPhone
 
 
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 --
 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 “Success is not final, 

Re: [WISPA] Ubnt and OSPF

[Jayson Baker]

Broadcast, I guess.  Whatever is default on MT.

On Tue, Jan 12, 2010 at 6:58 PM, Jeremy Parr jeremyp...@gmail.com wrote:

 2010/1/12 Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com:
  Make sure you have Multicast Data enabled or whatever on the Advanced
 tab.
  Pulled my hair out over this for a couple days, then realized if it's not
  checked, you get one-way OSPF.
  Checked it, rebooted, and everything has been happy since.

 Multicast is enabled. Are you running OSPF in broadcast or ptmp?



 
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Re: [WISPA] Ubnt and OSPF

[Jayson Baker]

Oh, yeah, that's a requirement too.  You can't bridge without WDS.

On Tue, Jan 12, 2010 at 7:45 PM, Jeremy Parr jeremyp...@gmail.com wrote:

 2010/1/12 Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com:
  Broadcast, I guess.  Whatever is default on MT.

 Default is broadcast. I think I may have resolved the issue by setting
 the AP (Rocket) and client (Nanostation) to WDS mode. The Ubiquiti is
 staying out of the IP path now.



 
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Re: [WISPA] How to block p2p traffic in public Wi-Fi hotspot?

[Jayson Baker]

MikroTik firewall filter rule using the all-p2p matcher and drop as action?

On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 4:34 AM, Roman consulttele...@gmail.com wrote:

 Dear readers,

 Do you have any experience with successful blocking of P2P (eDonkey,
 Torrents etc.) traffic in your wireless networks?

 Any user who uses torrent client at his PC can effectively consume a lot of
 bandwidth of Wi-Fi access point, leaving other honest users with small
 portion of throughput. Port blocking does not help because nowadays P2P
 clients use random ports, encryption and other means to hide traffic
 patterns. I suppose that only one distinctive feature of such traffic
 exists: its ability to consume effective bandwidth.

 Do you happen to know or use any traffic shaping tools which can limit
 throughput per user?
 Thank you in advance for any thoghts, ideas etc...



 
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Re: [WISPA] Ubnt and OSPF

[Jayson Baker]

Make sure you have Multicast Data enabled or whatever on the Advanced tab.
Pulled my hair out over this for a couple days, then realized if it's not
checked, you get one-way OSPF.
Checked it, rebooted, and everything has been happy since.

On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 9:56 PM, Jeremy Parr jeremyp...@gmail.com wrote:

 I'm having issues with OSPF (Mikrotik) traversing an Airmax sector.
 Network consists of a Routerboard running 4.1, connected to a Rocket
 sector running XM.v5.1. Client radio is a Nanostation also running
 XM.v5.1, connected to a Routerboard running 4.2. The first routerboard
 has a number of ospf neighbors on the same interface the Rocket is
 connected to (there is a switch between the physical interface and the
 Rocket) but when a neighbor relationship is established over the UBNT
 link, strange things happen. Running a traceroute to the loopback
 address of the MT results in a routing loop, with the Nanostation
 showing up as a L3 hop. I have yet to do a packet dump, but my guess
 is that somehow the UBNT radio is mangling the OSPF multicast traffic
 and inserting itself in to the path. The notes on the UBNT forum
 regarding OSPF seem to indicate that enabling multicast forwarding on
 the radio is all that is required. See below for the MT OSPF config.

 /routing ospf instance
 set default comment= disabled=no distribute-default=never
 in-filter=ospf-in metric-bgp=20 metric-connected=20 metric-default=1
 metric-other-ospf=\
auto metric-rip=20 metric-static=20 name=default
 out-filter=ospf-out redistribute-bgp=no redistribute-connected=no
 redistribute-other-ospf=no \
redistribute-rip=no redistribute-static=no router-id=10.254.12.3
 /routing ospf area
 set backbone area-id=0.0.0.0 comment= disabled=no instance=default
 name=backbone type=default
 add area-id=0.0.0.1 comment= disabled=no instance=default name=1
 type=default
 /routing ospf interface
 add authentication=md5 authentication-key=secret
 authentication-key-id=1 comment= cost=10 dead-interval=40s
 disabled=no hello-interval=10s \
instance-id=0 interface=wlan1 network-type=broadcast passive=no
 priority=1 retransmit-interval=5s transmit-delay=1s
 add authentication=md5 authentication-key=secret
 authentication-key-id=1 comment= cost=10 dead-interval=40s
 disabled=no hello-interval=10s \
instance-id=0 interface=ether1 network-type=broadcast passive=no
 priority=1 retransmit-interval=5s transmit-delay=1s
 /routing ospf network
 add area=1 comment= disabled=no network=10.0.0.0/8



 
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Re: [WISPA] Why the telco's will never be true competitors to us

[Jayson Baker]

So lie to them, and tell them you're standing there and the DSL light is
blinking.  Or whatever they want to hear.
That person is probably a $10/hr individual paid to follow a flow chart, and
doesn't know what to do if your answers don't fall in-line with that chart.
I've done this many times.  Even just the other day I chatted with Dell
tech support and said I need a new hard drive, it's making scraping and
clunking noises in less than 5 minutes I had a new hard drive on the way,
and less than 24 hours later it was installed in the machine.  Had I told
them what was really going on, I'd of been working with them for an hour via
chat running a chkdsk and all sorts of other diagnostic tools.  In all
actuality, the thing was bad... I was just skipping all the mundane steps
they are supposed to follow, in order to determine something I already knew.

On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 2:41 PM, Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.comwrote:

 I have a tower down.  It's fed by a *business* grade DSL link.

 Can't get to the main router at that local.

 So I log onto the Century Tel (century link nowadays) web site go find a
 phone number for tech support.

 IF there is a phone number on their Microsoft Bing cloan of a web site, I
 couldn't find it.  So, I decided to try the online chat thingy.

 Up pops a page with a spot for a the username, phone number and zip code.
 Naturally, I put the right things in the boxes.  Only to get an error.  So
 I
 tried again, and again.  Finally I actually READ what the smallish print
 said you can ONLY put in ONE of the fields, not all of them.  Hate to allow
 any answer to work rather than make people only fill in one field where
 they
 usually have to fill in all of them.  My fault for not reading the fine
 print, but then again, I shouldn't have to

 Next, I finally get a tech on the screen.  Well, kinda, the web site
 doesn't
 have anything but an error at the top.  But the chat part eventually came
 up
 and a tech was on the line.  We quickly established that the tech support
 guy wasn't able to see if there was a dsl connection or not.  ug

 So, he gave me a phone number for tech support.

 I called that number only to sit on hold for a while (not t bad though)
 and then find out that that wasn't the right number for a business account.

 Called the next number.  Sat on hold a bit longer this time, but still only
 a few minutes.  We quickly got through all of the who are you type stuff.
 Then the gal on the support end asked me to tell her what lights were on on
 the modem.  Um, I'm an hour and a half form there.  Well, sir, I'm
 unable
 help you unless someone is on at the site.

 Sigh.  The home owner at this site is a snow bird and won't be home for
 months yet.

 The tech support people aren't able to tell if there is a connection or
 not.
 It's not like this is a little, rinky dink company like mine.  This is a
 HUGE telco!  Ug.

 They won't even try to fix a business account that I pay $1200.00 per year
 for.  Probably even more than that.  Amazing.

 Have a great day, I know I will.
 marlon




 
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Re: [WISPA] Burnt CPE from House Fire

[Jayson Baker]

Isn't that fraud?

On Wed, Jan 6, 2010 at 11:03 PM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote:

 Gives me an idea  old lightning zapped cpe's  find a house
 fire.  Offer owner of house free installation of 6 or 7 or whatever
 number
 messed up units one may have, after the fact of course...

 Dang shame, house burned down and all burned up them 47 CPE's and cisco
 router...

 Bob-


 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of RickG
 Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 12:14 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Burnt CPE from House Fire

 So far I've had this happen twice. Both times the customers volunteered to
 turn it into their insurance. -RickG

 On Wed, Jan 6, 2010 at 11:38 PM, Chuck Hogg ch...@shelbybb.com wrote:

  Lost our first CPE from a house fire.  Guy was so down on the phone, I
  couldn't bear to bother him with an insurance claim on the CPE.  What
  have you done?
 
 
 
  Regards,
 
  Chuck Hogg
 
  Shelby Broadband
  502-722-9292
  ch...@shelbybb.com mailto:ch...@shelbybb.com
 
  http://www.shelbybb.com http://www.shelbybb.com
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.

[Jayson Baker]

Something like $30/meg for blended Qwest, Level(3), TW Telecom, Cogent.

On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 9:38 PM, RickG rgunder...@gmail.com wrote:

 Jayson,

 Really, I guess it doesnt matter. It's just that your offerings are so
 remarkable, its hard to believe its true. Most people are on this list to
 be
 helpful and to get helped. It would be helpful to know who you are, your
 business model, and how you do it. My first question would be, how much are
 you paying for bandwidth?

 Thanks in advance.
 -RickG (KyWiFi)

 On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 12:40 AM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
 wrote:

  I don't think I ever got a response to my question though... what *does*
 it
  matter?
 
  We were the first broadband ISP in our area in 2001.  We were one of the
  first ISPs to use (5.7) Canopy.  One of the very first to deploy 2.4GHz.
   One of the very first to deploy 900MHz.  We saw the writing on the wall
 in
  2005--Canopy was starting to fall behind in speed compared to it's cost
 per
  unit.  We sold the network.  I consulted for 4 years, did software
  development, setup a WISP in Costa Rica.  Last year we started offering
  service again, and are again growing very quickly.
 
  Less than 30 seconds on Google and I came up with this: peakinter.net
 
  On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 10:02 PM, Travis Johnson t...@ida.net wrote:
 
   Oh boy... here we go...
  
   Just a few weeks ago we tried to track down Jayson on the Motorola
   mailing list (because several people had issues of knowing where his
   expertise and experience was coming from). We have never been able to
   get an idea of how many subs, his real website, company name or any
   other information about him or the companies he works or consults for.
   And when asked, all he says is why does it matter?.
  
   Travis
   Microserv
  
   RickG wrote:
Jayson,
   
You dont offer speed packages?
I cant find your website at www.spectrasurf.com?
   
-RickG
   
On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 9:21 PM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
 
   wrote:
   
   
All users get limited at 12Mbps.  Most are capable of 8-10ish.
   
On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 7:16 PM, Robert West 
  robert.w...@just-micro.com
   
wrote:
   
What's your average speed tier?  Maybe it's more noticeable by
 those
   who
offer slower speeds sue to lack of affordable bandwidth?  Just a
  guess.
   
Yes, I know, bandwidth is bandwidth but someone who is married to
  their
network trying to squeeze each kb out of it will be more sensitive
 to
upward
swings in the usage as opposed to someone who is more endowed in
 the
bandwidth area.
   
Visuals unintended but it happened and seems to make sense..
   
Bob-
   
   
   
-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:
 wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
   On
Behalf Of can...@believewireless.net
Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 9:11 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.
   
We really aren't seeing much of a change either.   We are seeing a
small number of users using more bandwidth but nothing crazy.
However, we have plenty of cheap bandwidth with two redundant fiber
connections and 60GHz/licensed connection to tower.
   
Our main concern is the limitation of the APs.  Some nights our
  Canopy
APs are maxed out on bandwidth.  However, we use the Mikrotik
suggested QoS in our routers and we haven't had a single call
complaining of slow speeds.
   
   
   
   
   
   
  
 
 
   

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Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.

[Jayson Baker]

Weird.  Ours is completely the opposite.  We keep adding customers by the
truck load, but bandwidth only slowly climbs.

*knock on wood*  Never said I minded, though!

On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 12:55 PM, MDK rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote:

 I'm seeing the same thing.

 I can literally track it month to month and show the bill and useage going
 up each month by far more than the growth of our customer base.

 In 3 months I've added 25% to my useage.

 KA-POW!   That's one serious bunch of data useage.



 --
 From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com
 Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 10:58 AM
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] 2010: One Question for WISPs

  LOL
 
  What kind of question is that?  big grin
 
  The short answer is, it depends.
 
  I'm much more excited about the technology in use.  I'm much more excited
  about how many customers we can take care of with the same amount of
 staff
  etc.  Technologically life is better than ever.
 
  I'm not excited about usage.  This netflix thing is looking like it'll
  have
  a bigger impact than Napster had in the past.  With the new usage there
 is
  NO incentive for the customer to purchase new faster services like there
  was
  when we went from dialup to broadband.
 
  My bill for upstream went up by nearly 10% last month alone!  This based
  on
  the 95% usage mechanism we're billed for.  It's up by almost twice over
  the
  last 12 months.  This in spite of a 50% DROP in per mb/s costs from that
  particular provider.
 
  Unless costs go WAY down or we find a way to bill the content providers
  for
  the traffic that's being generated I'm not sure what will happen over the
  next 3 to 5 years.  Per bit billing only works if everyone (or nearly
  everyone) does it.
 
  Xbox is also a problem these days.  No other gaming system out there is
 as
  picky with the network design or performance.  Not even close.  Xbox
  requires very nearly perfect connections between the gamers or there are
  significant lag issues that drive the gamers nuts.
 
  I don't see any trend in the content providers giving a rats behind about
  what their crappy encryption mechanisms etc. do to the transport people.
  I
  don't see any improvements on the horizon.
 
  On a good note though, this has to be just KILLING the big players.  At
  least we have a somewhat captive audience, often a forgiving and tech
  savvy
  one at that.  People who just don't get it don't often last long in the
  sticks, they have to be able to hire help for everything they need so
 they
  end up in the cities :-).
 
  If we last the next 5 years I think we'll be in good shape.  But for the
  first time since I've been in business I'm worried about the business
  models.  I just can't find one that works for us and the customer.
 
  laters,
  marlon
 
 
 
  - Original Message -
  From: Patrick Leary ple...@apertonet.com
  To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
  Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 8:47 AM
  Subject: [WISPA] 2010: One Question for WISPs
 
 
  Happy New Year folks. One simple multiple choice question:
 
  For 2010, are you more or less optimistic than you were in 2009?
 
  A - Much more
  B - Somewhat more
  C - Same
  D - More pessimistic
 
  If you'd care to explain your answer, that's be great.
 
  Thank,
 
  Patrick
 
 
  Patrick Leary
  Aperto Networks
  813.426.4230 mobile
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.

[Jayson Baker]

All users get limited at 12Mbps.  Most are capable of 8-10ish.

On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 7:16 PM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote:

 What's your average speed tier?  Maybe it's more noticeable by those who
 offer slower speeds sue to lack of affordable bandwidth?  Just a guess.

 Yes, I know, bandwidth is bandwidth but someone who is married to their
 network trying to squeeze each kb out of it will be more sensitive to
 upward
 swings in the usage as opposed to someone who is more endowed in the
 bandwidth area.

 Visuals unintended but it happened and seems to make sense..

 Bob-



 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of can...@believewireless.net
 Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 9:11 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.

 We really aren't seeing much of a change either.   We are seeing a
 small number of users using more bandwidth but nothing crazy.
 However, we have plenty of cheap bandwidth with two redundant fiber
 connections and 60GHz/licensed connection to tower.

 Our main concern is the limitation of the APs.  Some nights our Canopy
 APs are maxed out on bandwidth.  However, we use the Mikrotik
 suggested QoS in our routers and we haven't had a single call
 complaining of slow speeds.



 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.

[Jayson Baker]

I'm not the one seeing issues.  :-)  Unless you mean, my overall usage isn't
matching our overall new sub count.

On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 7:35 PM, Marco Coelho coelh...@gmail.com wrote:

 That might be where you're seeing the issue.

 What is the typical max throughput both up and down of your AP?
 How many customers do you typically have per AP?

 mc

 On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 8:21 PM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
 wrote:
  All users get limited at 12Mbps.  Most are capable of 8-10ish.
 
  On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 7:16 PM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com
 wrote:
 
  What's your average speed tier?  Maybe it's more noticeable by those who
  offer slower speeds sue to lack of affordable bandwidth?  Just a guess.
 
  Yes, I know, bandwidth is bandwidth but someone who is married to their
  network trying to squeeze each kb out of it will be more sensitive to
  upward
  swings in the usage as opposed to someone who is more endowed in the
  bandwidth area.
 
  Visuals unintended but it happened and seems to make sense..
 
  Bob-
 
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of can...@believewireless.net
  Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 9:11 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.
 
  We really aren't seeing much of a change either.   We are seeing a
  small number of users using more bandwidth but nothing crazy.
  However, we have plenty of cheap bandwidth with two redundant fiber
  connections and 60GHz/licensed connection to tower.
 
  Our main concern is the limitation of the APs.  Some nights our Canopy
  APs are maxed out on bandwidth.  However, we use the Mikrotik
  suggested QoS in our routers and we haven't had a single call
  complaining of slow speeds.
 
 
 
 
 
  
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  http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 
 
  
 
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 --
 Marco C. Coelho
 Argon Technologies Inc.
 POB 875
 Greenville, TX 75403-0875
 903-455-5036



 
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Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.

[Jayson Baker]

I don't think I ever got a response to my question though... what *does* it
matter?

We were the first broadband ISP in our area in 2001.  We were one of the
first ISPs to use (5.7) Canopy.  One of the very first to deploy 2.4GHz.
 One of the very first to deploy 900MHz.  We saw the writing on the wall in
2005--Canopy was starting to fall behind in speed compared to it's cost per
unit.  We sold the network.  I consulted for 4 years, did software
development, setup a WISP in Costa Rica.  Last year we started offering
service again, and are again growing very quickly.

Less than 30 seconds on Google and I came up with this: peakinter.net

On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 10:02 PM, Travis Johnson t...@ida.net wrote:

 Oh boy... here we go...

 Just a few weeks ago we tried to track down Jayson on the Motorola
 mailing list (because several people had issues of knowing where his
 expertise and experience was coming from). We have never been able to
 get an idea of how many subs, his real website, company name or any
 other information about him or the companies he works or consults for.
 And when asked, all he says is why does it matter?.

 Travis
 Microserv

 RickG wrote:
  Jayson,
 
  You dont offer speed packages?
  I cant find your website at www.spectrasurf.com?
 
  -RickG
 
  On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 9:21 PM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
 wrote:
 
 
  All users get limited at 12Mbps.  Most are capable of 8-10ish.
 
  On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 7:16 PM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com
 
  wrote:
 
  What's your average speed tier?  Maybe it's more noticeable by those
 who
  offer slower speeds sue to lack of affordable bandwidth?  Just a guess.
 
  Yes, I know, bandwidth is bandwidth but someone who is married to their
  network trying to squeeze each kb out of it will be more sensitive to
  upward
  swings in the usage as opposed to someone who is more endowed in the
  bandwidth area.
 
  Visuals unintended but it happened and seems to make sense..
 
  Bob-
 
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
 On
  Behalf Of can...@believewireless.net
  Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 9:11 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.
 
  We really aren't seeing much of a change either.   We are seeing a
  small number of users using more bandwidth but nothing crazy.
  However, we have plenty of cheap bandwidth with two redundant fiber
  connections and 60GHz/licensed connection to tower.
 
  Our main concern is the limitation of the APs.  Some nights our Canopy
  APs are maxed out on bandwidth.  However, we use the Mikrotik
  suggested QoS in our routers and we haven't had a single call
  complaining of slow speeds.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
  
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 
 
 
 
 
  
 
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Re: [WISPA] power management tools for cell sites

[Jayson Baker]

If you're looking to monitor only, check these out:
http://www.theenergydetective.com/index.html

They talk to Google.  Yes, Google is now tracking your power consumption as
well.  Who knew.
http://www.google.org/powermeter/

On Sun, Dec 27, 2009 at 10:58 AM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 I just installed one of those dot net WattsUp ethernet meters on a
 vending machine a few weeks ago.  Pretty neat!

 On 12/27/09, Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com wrote:
  I use them all over the place these days.  Saves a LOT of driving.
 
  Also, the bigger unit does give you the current voltage at the site.
  marlon
 
  - Original Message -
  From: Mike m...@aweiowa.com
  To: scubac...@gmail.com; WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
  Sent: Thursday, December 24, 2009 7:25 PM
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] power management tools for cell sites
 
 
  Check out DigitalLoggers:  http://www.digital-loggers.com/din.html
 
  They have some cool devices.  I use them at tower sites and can
  reboot individual devices.  The DIN relays might work for you.  I use
  the web switches a couple places.
 
  Mike
 
 
  At 08:24 PM 12/24/2009, you wrote:
 I'm hoping someone on this list might recommend me some power
 management options for cell sites.
 
 Ideally, I would like something that does the following:
 
 --auto-reboots a device when an IP address does not ping
 --is ruggedized for outdoor environments (or is easy to stuff in a
 NEMA 4X box)
 --let's me http or ssh in and reboot certain ports
 --is affordable enough where I could just budget it in with all of the
 cameras and wireless devices
 
 Tools like iBoot are a step in the right direction, but it doesn't
 seem to have very many features, and I will likely want some SNMP
 features so I could, say, graph the power levels in Cacti .
 
 (The idea here is to be able to proactively troubleshoot stuff to
 avoid a truck roll, and if I do have to do a truck roll, I know that
 the most obvious power-related stuff has been done first)
 
 

 
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 --
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 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
 --- Albert Einstein



 
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Re: [WISPA] 5.8 dishes

[Jayson Baker]

Us too.  We have used a lot of the 2' and 3' PacWireless dishes.  Work fine.
Used a couple 4' RadioWaves dishes and those worked fine too.  Although the
feedhorn mount is kinda flimsy and was bent on arrival.

On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 6:06 PM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 I've been happy with both pairs of 2 foot Pac dishes.

 On 12/23/09, Philip Dorr wirel...@judgementgaming.com wrote:
  We use Pac Wireless 3 foot dishes with ray dome on most of our PTP links
 
  On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 6:31 PM, Michael Baird m...@tc3net.com wrote:
  I'm looking for opinions on 5.8 dishes, if you've got any extra you are
  looking to dump message me, I've got a 28db dish and some 26db/30 db
  grids, neither of the grids work as well as 2 foot dish. Would like 32
  db on up, I just need one to compare to my existing dishes.
 
  Regards
  Michael Baird
 
 
 
 
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 --
 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
 --- Albert Einstein



 
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Re: [WISPA] 5.8 dishes

[Jayson Baker]

TWELVE FOOT for a 7 mile link?  What's your signal like on the other end,
-0?  Holy cow!

On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 7:17 PM, Philip Dorr
wirel...@judgementgaming.comwrote:

 We are also using a 12 foot Andrew dish with 6GHz feed horn for a
 5.8GHz 7 mile link (the other side is a Pac Wireless 3 foot dish)

 On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 7:09 PM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
 wrote:
  Us too.  We have used a lot of the 2' and 3' PacWireless dishes.  Work
 fine.
  Used a couple 4' RadioWaves dishes and those worked fine too.  Although
 the
  feedhorn mount is kinda flimsy and was bent on arrival.
 
  On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 6:06 PM, Josh Luthman
  j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:
 
  I've been happy with both pairs of 2 foot Pac dishes.
 
  On 12/23/09, Philip Dorr wirel...@judgementgaming.com wrote:
   We use Pac Wireless 3 foot dishes with ray dome on most of our PTP
 links
  
   On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 6:31 PM, Michael Baird m...@tc3net.com
 wrote:
   I'm looking for opinions on 5.8 dishes, if you've got any extra you
 are
   looking to dump message me, I've got a 28db dish and some 26db/30 db
   grids, neither of the grids work as well as 2 foot dish. Would like
 32
   db on up, I just need one to compare to my existing dishes.
  
   Regards
   Michael Baird
  
  
  
 
 
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  --
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  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373
 
  The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
  --- Albert Einstein
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti Bullet2HP

[Jayson Baker]

Why would you want the connector on the bottom?  So it can fill up with
water?
Being on the top, the water will run over the connector and not fill it.
 Makes sense to me.
Of course, we still seal them up.

On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 9:06 AM, Jeremy Parr jeremyp...@gmail.com wrote:

 No, but they could have put the connectors on the bottom of the
 antenna, and on the bottom of the radio (where they belong!) And used
 a 12 piece of lmr240.

 On 12/18/09, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com wrote:
  Yeah, that would be a nicer cable.  Honestly I'm afraid of popping the
  connector off the UBNT ones when I have to bend it so sharply.  It must
 have
  been another tradeoff since the area between the rocket and the connector
 on
  the antenna is so small, you probably couldn’t bend a much thicker cable
 in
  such a tight loop.
 
  Bob-
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of Jeremy Parr
  Sent: Friday, December 18, 2009 10:34 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti Bullet2HP
 
  Trango uses SMA connectors for their external antennas, but with
  LMR240, rather than whatever it is that UBNT uses.
 
  2009/12/18 Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com:
  I haven't come across that little issue yet, thanks for the heads up!  I
  like the price and some of the shortcuts contribute to that but you're
  right, some things need to be more rugged for where they are installed
 and
  even HOW they are installed.  The mounting brackets are fantastic, I was
  impressed by them but the connectors are the opposite.  I can accept the
  SMA
  connectors but only if they're going to the attached rocket.  I still
  shake
  my head at it though.  Must be my old way of thinking.
 
  Bob-
 
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of Jeremy Parr
  Sent: Friday, December 18, 2009 9:48 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti Bullet2HP
 
  We found the same problem with the sna cables on the airmax sectors.
  Pull just a little bit too hand and the cable pulls out of the
  connecter. Why any manufacturer would think that cables that small are
  suitable for outdoor use is beyond me.
 
  On 12/18/09, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com wrote:
  I've had 2 of the Bullet5HP's have bad connectors, not the 2's.  Being
  the
  geek type, took them apart and found that the fingers coming off the
  connector had very little solder on them and none was only under the
  connector and not on the sides or top.  Essentially only enough to tack
  it
  on.  The first one that came loose I thought it was my fault for
 pushing
  it
  too hard so I didn't do an RMA and just fixed it myself and when the
  second
  happened, fixed that one too.  Easier than an RMA just for solder.
  Personally I'd like to see a more robust LAN connector and have it
  attached
  better in the front to avoid rocking.
 
  Bob-
 
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
 On
  Behalf Of RickG
  Sent: Friday, December 18, 2009 2:57 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti Bullet2HP
 
  I'll double-check the connectors and let you know.
 
  On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 8:49 AM, Michael Baird m...@tc3net.com
 wrote:
 
  Rick,
 
  I read something about guys complaining about high rates of failure
 with
  the connectors on the latest batch 10/22/2009 or something.
 
  Regards
  Michael Baird
   Anyone having issues with flaky Bullet2HP units? The last batch I
 got
  wont
   connect to my StarOS/WRAP's. Actually, I discovered they do connect
  but
  have
   80+% packet loss. I updated them to 3.5 firmware but no help.
 Previous
   shipments have worked great. -RickG
  
  
  
 
 
 
 
 
  
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Re: [WISPA] I'm an idiot

[Jayson Baker]

Wear latex gloves.  Keeps the wind off your fingers and actually makes a BIG
difference.
When I climb, I wear latex and then some brand they sell at Home Depot as
Handyman gloves with velcro, but I got them from Tessco and they're
sticky on the palms.  They were like $40.
When I take the other gloves off to do work I leave the latex on.  Even that
little separation from the metal makes a big difference too.

I know it sounds dumb.  But try it.

On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 4:15 PM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote:

 I'm an idiot.



 Had to climb to the top of a tower this afternoon.  300 foot tower.  Drive
 to the tower, put on the harness and all the other crap, grab the hat, all
 good.  No gloves.  Figures.  Where are the gloves?  The NEW gloves?  Home.
 All I had was a thin pair of leather work gloves.  Did I go up?  Certainly,
 because I'm an idiot.



  I can now almost feel my fingers.



 Was a balmy 28 degrees out with winds to 17 mph.



 Just had to share my utter stupidity.  Never again.



 Robert West

 Just Micro Digital Services Inc.

 740-335-7020






 
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Re: [WISPA] I'm an idiot

[Jayson Baker]

ROFL!!  No, I just carry a large 16oz bottle of Germ-X (the one with the
pump) in my front pocket.
Makes it easy to squirt.  In fact, one in each pocket.  Right hand, left
hand.  ROFLMAO

Anyway... a guy that did our climbing 10 years ago wore them while climbing
80' during a snowstorm and wind.
His hands never got cold.  Then I saw that Tessco sold them, so I figured
maybe it was a neat trick.
Tried it, and sure enough.  Keeps the moisture in, but doesn't let the wind
hit your fingers I guess.

Next time I go into the truck I'll see who makes those gloves.  They don't
sell this model at Home Depot.
That same manufacturer sells gloves at home depot, but are labeled
Handyman and don't have the little sticky pads.
Not really sticky either, but they grip very well.

On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 10:57 PM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote:

 And then we find out later that Jayson actually wears latex gloves 24 hours
 a day and rationalizes it to himself and everyone around him with tips and
 stories such as this one.

 Jayson, it's a phobia.  The germs will always be with us and they aren't
 here to hurt you.  Step out of your protective cocoon of lies and join us
 in
 the germs.  It's okay



 But seriously, sounds like the latex has merit.  Sticky palms on the
 gloves?
 I'll look for those next time I'm spending the traditional one hundred
 bucks
 per visit at the Home Depot.

 Bob-


 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Jayson Baker
 Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 12:46 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] I'm an idiot

 Wear latex gloves.  Keeps the wind off your fingers and actually makes a
 BIG
 difference.
 When I climb, I wear latex and then some brand they sell at Home Depot as
 Handyman gloves with velcro, but I got them from Tessco and they're
 sticky on the palms.  They were like $40.
 When I take the other gloves off to do work I leave the latex on.  Even
 that
 little separation from the metal makes a big difference too.

 I know it sounds dumb.  But try it.

 On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 4:15 PM, Robert West
 robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote:

  I'm an idiot.
 
 
 
  Had to climb to the top of a tower this afternoon.  300 foot tower.
  Drive
  to the tower, put on the harness and all the other crap, grab the hat,
 all
  good.  No gloves.  Figures.  Where are the gloves?  The NEW gloves?
  Home.
  All I had was a thin pair of leather work gloves.  Did I go up?
 Certainly,
  because I'm an idiot.
 
 
 
   I can now almost feel my fingers.
 
 
 
  Was a balmy 28 degrees out with winds to 17 mph.
 
 
 
  Just had to share my utter stupidity.  Never again.
 
 
 
  Robert West
 
  Just Micro Digital Services Inc.
 
  740-335-7020
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Anyone have nanostation m5 in stock?

[Jayson Baker]

Sean at CTI probably has them.
svanwor...@cticonnect.com

On Fri, Dec 11, 2009 at 9:29 AM, os10ru...@gmail.com wrote:

 Just need two.

 Greg



 
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Re: [WISPA] Wind!

[Jayson Baker]

Maybe the wind is blowing the 1's away before they get to the other end.  I
think 0's are good up to about 100MPH.

On Wed, Dec 9, 2009 at 9:12 AM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote:

 Windy today, supposed to have gusts up to 50mph before days end.  I was
 monitoring some backhaul links, had one bouncing from -72 to -83.  Up and
 down.  I'm thinking, uh-oh, got a grid loose someplace, better go fix it
 now
 before it gets worse.  I go out, first end solid as can be.  I even shake
 the heck out of it, all good.  I guess the other end is messed up.  Go out,
 also solid.  Look at the laptop, still bouncing.  Using pac 28dbi grids
 with
 411 boards R52h cards on both sides.  First grid is at 60', second at 100'
 No trees, heck I can almost see the other end with my naked and cold eye.
 It's only 4 miles out.  Link is normally -72.  Maybe junk being tossed up
 in
 the wind?  That would be a lot ot junk for -10 drop in RSSI I would think.



 Just sharing.  Weird.





 Robert West

 Just Micro Digital Services Inc.

 740-335-7020






 
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Re: [WISPA] Wind! - RMA on a Mikrotik 411 board, anyone?

[Jayson Baker]

MT can tell you who they sold the board to by the license key.
Of, if you're cool and have a login to their site, you can request the key
to be added to your account, and it'll tell you where it came from.

On Wed, Dec 9, 2009 at 6:45 PM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote:

 Turned out to be

 The 411 card.  HUH?  I hear ya say.  I dunno either.  I attacked the
 cables first thing, replaced the pig tail, the short extension of lmr-400
 from the pac grid to enclosure, cat5 to router.  Man!  Still dead!  So I
 connected my laptop directly into the 411 board and no response. Reset,
 still nothing.  Lights up, gives me one beep but never completes the boot,
 no cute beep beep of satisfaction.  Got it here at home, no manner of
 resetting gets it, can't get in via serial.  Could go with the jtag but I
 don't want to deal with putting the pins on it.  Bummer.

 Only 4 months old, this one is. Now where did I buy the thing? is what
 I'm
 asking myself.   MT says to RMA through the distributor but I pick these
 things up from whoever has the UBNT stuff in stock at the time, I just add
 to the order.  The invoices don't list the MAC ID or serial number, not
 that
 I can see.  Could be Streakwave, Wlanparts or Wisp-router.  I think I
 bought
 a few things form Jeffs Soho, might have just been 433's

 Anyhow, any tips on the RMA on these things?  Does it really matter who
 gets
 the hit?  I'd vote for Streakwave, they're closer.

 Bob-



 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of MDK
 Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 1:45 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Wind!

 The last time I experienced that, it was a bad cable end, where the wind
 had

 shaken the last 18 inches of 400 size cable - the distance from the last
 clamp to the N connector, and the N connector had literally shaken apart.
 The entire braiding had broken loose and the compression on the foam inner
 had crushed until the whole cable began creeping out of the connector.
  It

 was cold, and even the shrink wrap had cracked, and the tape wrapped over
 that was just slowly stretching...







 --
 From: Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com
 Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 8:12 AM
 To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: [WISPA] Wind!

  Windy today, supposed to have gusts up to 50mph before days end.  I was
  monitoring some backhaul links, had one bouncing from -72 to -83.  Up and
  down.  I'm thinking, uh-oh, got a grid loose someplace, better go fix it
  now
  before it gets worse.  I go out, first end solid as can be.  I even shake
  the heck out of it, all good.  I guess the other end is messed up.  Go
  out,
  also solid.  Look at the laptop, still bouncing.  Using pac 28dbi grids
  with
  411 boards R52h cards on both sides.  First grid is at 60', second at
 100'
  No trees, heck I can almost see the other end with my naked and cold eye.
  It's only 4 miles out.  Link is normally -72.  Maybe junk being tossed up
  in
  the wind?  That would be a lot ot junk for -10 drop in RSSI I would
 think.
 
 
 
  Just sharing.  Weird.
 
 
 
 
 
  Robert West
 
  Just Micro Digital Services Inc.
 
  740-335-7020
 
 
 
 
 
 

 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Rocket range

[Jayson Baker]

Depends on what the customer will be using.  NanoM?  BulletM?  What kind of
antenna?

As a rule, should be fine.  Rocket M - Nano M should work at that range
decent.

On Tue, Dec 8, 2009 at 12:11 PM, Forbes Mercy
forbes.me...@wabroadband.comwrote:

 We want to put up an M Rocket in 5gig frequency range and have four
 customers between 6-8 miles.  Will our 17dbi 120 degree antenna reach
 them?



 
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Re: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure

[Jayson Baker]

Yeah, they're bad.  Trust me.  When we very first started using MT that was
all that was available.  They're total garbage.

On Thu, Dec 3, 2009 at 9:01 AM, os10ru...@gmail.com wrote:

 I know some special purpose plastic enclosures made for RF work have
 conductive/shielding qualities to them. There's even conductive/shielding
 paint one can buy for RF projects. So those plastic boxes might not be as
 bad as you think.

 Greg


 On Dec 3, 2009, at 10:50 AM, Josh Luthman wrote:

  More along the lines of plastic enclosures versus metal enclosures.
 
  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373
 
  The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
  --- Albert Einstein
 
 
  On Thu, Dec 3, 2009 at 10:47 AM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com
 wrote:
 
  Plastic next to the antennas???  CRAZY!  So the radios pretty much talk
 to
  themselves a lot, huh.  Hearing voices in their heads.
 
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of Jayson Baker
  Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 10:36 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure
 
  I have to laugh at one of our competitors who uses PLASTIC enclosures
 next
  to their antennas on the tower.  Even on the most RF-jam packed sites.
  One
  site in particular you can almost get a fluorescent light to glow just
  holding it in your hands.  And there they are with their plastic
  enclosures.  And can't figure out why their system sucks ass.
 
  Oh well.  They burned us for over $100k in consulting fees and
 equipment.
  It makes me laugh everytime I see it.
 
  On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 8:30 PM, Marlon K. Schafer
  o...@odessaoffice.comwrote:
 
  I've given up on this.  There is just too much cross talk.  I put all
  radios
  in the same band in their own METAL enclosure nowadays.  I try to keep
  them
  at least 3 or 6 feet apart too.  Life is much much nicer.
  marlon
 
  - Original Message -
  From: Mike m...@aweiowa.com
  To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
  Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 8:13 AM
  Subject: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure
 
 
  Since I am probably one of the veterans called out yesterday for my
  messaging etiquette, I am changing the subject.
 
  I am interested in the multiple radios in an enclosure idea.  I do
  have a couple with 5.8 and 2.4 gear in the same box, but have been
  afraid to put cards in the same band in the same case.
 
  The foil spacer you put between cards Bob, do you then ground it to
  create a sort of Faraday shield?  I know the XRx cards do a good job
  of shielding if you attach the pigtail.
 
  How about the receive sensitivity on the 411 cards?  Has that been an
  issue?  I think the XR cards have better specs.  Wouldn't having
  multiple 411 cards in the same box possibly have desense issues too?
 
  Mike
 
 
  At 09:41 AM 12/2/2009, you wrote:
  Forgot to add, if you're concerned with any RF collisions inside the
  box,
  the other thing I talked about earlier, having just 3 411 cards in
  their
  own
  box at the sector then running Cat5 to transparent bridge the 411's
 to
  a
  central RouterOS device would take any of that issue totally away.
  That's
  one that I'm doing just to do it, basically.  Was an idea from
 someone
  a
  couple of months ago.  (I actually listen to you guys)  Had a 600a
  doing
  nothing and some 411 cards so why not play? was my thinking.
 
  Bob-
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
  On
  Behalf Of Mike
  Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:48 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors
 
  Have you had any issues with putting 3 radio cards in the same
  spectrum in the same box?  I've thought about that but wondered if
  there would be desense issues where one transmitting desensitizes
  another one listening.
 
 
  At 08:38 AM 12/2/2009, you wrote:
  Yep, looks like you're hitting the wall.  We aren't lucky enough to
  push
  3
  meg here, the most is usually 1 so again, all depends on your
  customer
  base.
 
  I'd say if you already have 35 on that one AP, just splitting it
 into
  2
  180
  degree sectors will just cost you cash as soon as you gain a few
 more
  customers.  You already have 35 pulling it down, sounds like if you
  just
  do
  2 180's, if split evenly (and it never will be) that would put you
 to
  where
  you probably want to be for smooth delivery but not much room for
  more
  growth.  I'd go with 3 120's and a 433AH with 3 cards on it, one per
  sector.
  I have a few like that and it works fine for what I do but again, I
  only
  dole out 1mb per sub typically.  I've also been upgrading some of my
  remote
  AP's to one 433AH with only one radio installed and an Omni.  The
  anticipated upgrade path is to just add a sector or 2 and radio card

Re: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure

[Jayson Baker]

I have to laugh at one of our competitors who uses PLASTIC enclosures next
to their antennas on the tower.  Even on the most RF-jam packed sites.  One
site in particular you can almost get a fluorescent light to glow just
holding it in your hands.  And there they are with their plastic
enclosures.  And can't figure out why their system sucks ass.

Oh well.  They burned us for over $100k in consulting fees and equipment.
It makes me laugh everytime I see it.

On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 8:30 PM, Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.comwrote:

 I've given up on this.  There is just too much cross talk.  I put all
 radios
 in the same band in their own METAL enclosure nowadays.  I try to keep them
 at least 3 or 6 feet apart too.  Life is much much nicer.
 marlon

 - Original Message -
 From: Mike m...@aweiowa.com
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 8:13 AM
 Subject: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure


  Since I am probably one of the veterans called out yesterday for my
  messaging etiquette, I am changing the subject.
 
  I am interested in the multiple radios in an enclosure idea.  I do
  have a couple with 5.8 and 2.4 gear in the same box, but have been
  afraid to put cards in the same band in the same case.
 
  The foil spacer you put between cards Bob, do you then ground it to
  create a sort of Faraday shield?  I know the XRx cards do a good job
  of shielding if you attach the pigtail.
 
  How about the receive sensitivity on the 411 cards?  Has that been an
  issue?  I think the XR cards have better specs.  Wouldn't having
  multiple 411 cards in the same box possibly have desense issues too?
 
  Mike
 
 
  At 09:41 AM 12/2/2009, you wrote:
 Forgot to add, if you're concerned with any RF collisions inside the box,
 the other thing I talked about earlier, having just 3 411 cards in their
 own
 box at the sector then running Cat5 to transparent bridge the 411's to a
 central RouterOS device would take any of that issue totally away.
  That's
 one that I'm doing just to do it, basically.  Was an idea from someone a
 couple of months ago.  (I actually listen to you guys)  Had a 600a doing
 nothing and some 411 cards so why not play? was my thinking.
 
 Bob-
 
 
 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Mike
 Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:48 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors
 
 Have you had any issues with putting 3 radio cards in the same
 spectrum in the same box?  I've thought about that but wondered if
 there would be desense issues where one transmitting desensitizes
 another one listening.
 
 
 At 08:38 AM 12/2/2009, you wrote:
  Yep, looks like you're hitting the wall.  We aren't lucky enough to
 push
  3
  meg here, the most is usually 1 so again, all depends on your customer
 base.
  
  I'd say if you already have 35 on that one AP, just splitting it into 2
  180
  degree sectors will just cost you cash as soon as you gain a few more
  customers.  You already have 35 pulling it down, sounds like if you
 just
  do
  2 180's, if split evenly (and it never will be) that would put you to
  where
  you probably want to be for smooth delivery but not much room for more
  growth.  I'd go with 3 120's and a 433AH with 3 cards on it, one per
 sector.
  I have a few like that and it works fine for what I do but again, I
 only
  dole out 1mb per sub typically.  I've also been upgrading some of my
  remote
  AP's to one 433AH with only one radio installed and an Omni.  The
  anticipated upgrade path is to just add a sector or 2 and radio card as
  needed to the point where I have 3 sectors.  Keeping the Omni of course
  until the third sector is needed.  That's something someone already
  suggested doing and I like the economics of it.
  
  Bob-
  
  
  
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
 On
  Behalf Of Jason Hensley
  Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:26 AM
  To: 'WISPA General List'
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors
  
  Max 3meg - b only mode on this particular AP.  Most are still able to
  get
  that, but we're seeing a decline on how many can pull 3meg.  At peak
  times,
  we've seen it to where users aren't able to get much over 1meg, but
  that's
  not happening very often right now.
  
  
  
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
 On
  Behalf Of Robert West
  Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 8:23 AM
  To: 'WISPA General List'
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors
  
  Yeah, how much bandwidth are you passing to those 35 customers, Jason?
 Just
  curious.
  
  Bob-
  
  
  
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
 On
  Behalf Of os10ru...@gmail.com
  Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:10 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors
  
  Do you think 

Re: [WISPA] Large Monitors with high resolution forMappingPrograms...

[Jayson Baker]

Chuck,
This: *http://tinyurl.com/ycrnc2f ??*

On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 10:16 PM, Chuck Profito cprof...@cv-access.comwrote:

 I am very satisfied with the Hanns-G monitor from costco.com 28 1080 wide
 screen $300.00

 

 http://www.costco.com/Browse/Product.aspx?Prodid=11503005cm_mmc=BCEmail_475
 -_-FOCUS-_-27-_-HannsG28Monitor 



 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of e...@wisp-router.com
 Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 7:48 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Large Monitors with high resolution
 forMappingPrograms...

 On top of it the samsung units play nice together. Got samsung led TV,
 samsung blueray and a samsung soundbar. And wireless subwoffer. Turn on the
 TV and sound and tv comes on, select blueray source and blue ray comes on.
 Don't matter if you use the blue ray remote opr the tv remote. Ahh the
 relif
 and ease to make all the cool stuff work ubiquisily.
 Out of the box on top of everything (getting spoiled with old age)

 /Eje
 Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

 -Original Message-
 From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com
 Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 19:33:16
 To: WISPA General Listwireless@wispa.org
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Large Monitors with high resolution for
MappingPrograms...

 We've moved to Samsung monitors.  And the home TV is Samsung too.  I LOVE
 these units.  Much much better on the eyes than anything I've ever used
 short of a good quality CRT.
 marlon

 - Original Message -
 From: AJ aj.grant...@gmail.com
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:03 AM
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Large Monitors with high resolution for
 MappingPrograms...


 I have a pair of 48 Vizio LCDs mounted on the wall for various
  infrastructure monitoring using the RGB inputs and a dual output card in
 a
  Dell desktop. They work pretty well but they both had issues with dim
  picture after about 3 months... Replaced the power outlet to them and the
  warrenty replaced both displays. So far so good for the last year or so.
  Makes it MUCH easier to monitor at a glance critical systems without
  having
  to use up more of my primary PC's desktop (tri monitor setup)...
 
  Picture attached - we usually have a number of telemetry monitoring
  applications up...
 
  On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 9:53 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote:
 
  Agreed, resolution is key for me too.  I keep the right monitor open
 with
  Wispmon or RadioMobile running or sometimes I just have six or more
  Winbox
  windows open on it monitoring client routers etc...
 
  I don't know what I'd do without the desktop space I have now and have
  even
  found myself looking for more on occasion!
 
  We have a projector setup in my brothers office that has decent
  resolution,
  but no way I'd want that over my 30 monitors.  However, playing any
  first
  person shooter game is impressive.   LOL!
 
  My other brother uses his 1080p 46-47 LCD Vizio on his wall as a second
  monitor.  It's ok too, but again resolution is lacking for much of
  anything
  other than network status information or general web browsing.
 
  Best,
 
 
  Brad
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of Mike Hammett
  Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 10:36 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link
 
  I believe there are bigger\better monitors, but I believe you're going
 up
  exponentially in price.  I know I've seen a DLP projector whose smaller
  resolution was 3000 or 4000, but it was about $125k.
 
  I'd rather have 30 monitors than larger TVs because of resolution, but
  I'm
  thinking a large 1080p TV mounted to a wall would make a nice display
 for

  a
  rolling network status presentation (network maps of different parts,
  server
 
  status, network utilizations, etc.).
 
 
  -
  Mike Hammett
  Intelligent Computing Solutions
  http://www.ics-il.com
 
 
 
  --
  From: Brad Belton b...@belwave.com
  Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 10:23 AM
  To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link
 
   Funny you mention this...yes, viewing RadioMobile or Wispmon on my
 twin
   30
   monitors running 2560 x 1600 each makes for a fair amount of
   playground.
   grin
  
   Hmmm...twin 52 monitors would be nice, but I doubt there is a display
   larger than 30 that will support 2560 x 1600.   Dang it!
  
  
   Brad
  
  
  
   -Original Message-
   From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
 On
   Behalf Of Robert West
   Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:57 AM
   To: 'WISPA General List'
   Subject: Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link
  
   You mean you don't have a 52 widescreen monitor?  Until you get the
   technology that you are SUPPOSED to have, stop your belly aching just
   because you can't read 8pt type!

Re: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure

[Jayson Baker]

Interesting.  I don't doubt it, but have to think about that for a bit to
wrap my head around it.

Anyway... we use the PacWireless DCE enclosures for 90% of things (we use
411-form-factor boards in almost everything).  We bought like 100 of them,
and still have a few around for this or that.
If you're running 433/333/600 you need a larger enclosure.  There is a new
one out, I think Microcom was claiming it, but I've seen it on Streakwave
and WISP I think?  It's f'ing expensive though.

We also used some of the larger ones sold by WISP.  They have 4 hex-screws
in each corner, and either 2 or 4 N-holes in the bottom.  The Ethernet
pass-thru is JUNK and unshielded.  Better yet, the last box we installed,
when we went to service it on a tower, opened and the climber got doused
(not douched!) with water.  It was full.  Stay away from those.

On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 10:41 PM, MDK rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote:

 Aluminum is moderately effective at attenuating microwave rf.

 Steel is needed to dampen EMP (from lightning strikes).



 --
 From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com
 Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 8:35 PM
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure

  Does die cast aluminum count as metal in this case?  Do you normally use
  steel if not?
 
  I use these:
  http://quicklinkwireless.com/Itemdesc.asp?ic=DCE-H-LG-2eq=Tp=
 
  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373
 
  The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
  --- Albert Einstein
 
 
  On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 10:30 PM, Marlon K. Schafer
  o...@odessaoffice.comwrote:
 
  I've given up on this.  There is just too much cross talk.  I put all
  radios
  in the same band in their own METAL enclosure nowadays.  I try to keep
  them
  at least 3 or 6 feet apart too.  Life is much much nicer.
  marlon
 
  - Original Message -
  From: Mike m...@aweiowa.com
  To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
  Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 8:13 AM
  Subject: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure
 
 
   Since I am probably one of the veterans called out yesterday for my
   messaging etiquette, I am changing the subject.
  
   I am interested in the multiple radios in an enclosure idea.  I do
   have a couple with 5.8 and 2.4 gear in the same box, but have been
   afraid to put cards in the same band in the same case.
  
   The foil spacer you put between cards Bob, do you then ground it to
   create a sort of Faraday shield?  I know the XRx cards do a good job
   of shielding if you attach the pigtail.
  
   How about the receive sensitivity on the 411 cards?  Has that been an
   issue?  I think the XR cards have better specs.  Wouldn't having
   multiple 411 cards in the same box possibly have desense issues too?
  
   Mike
  
  
   At 09:41 AM 12/2/2009, you wrote:
  Forgot to add, if you're concerned with any RF collisions inside the
  box,
  the other thing I talked about earlier, having just 3 411 cards in
  their
  own
  box at the sector then running Cat5 to transparent bridge the 411's to
  a
  central RouterOS device would take any of that issue totally away.
   That's
  one that I'm doing just to do it, basically.  Was an idea from someone
  a
  couple of months ago.  (I actually listen to you guys)  Had a 600a
  doing
  nothing and some 411 cards so why not play? was my thinking.
  
  Bob-
  
  
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
 On
  Behalf Of Mike
  Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:48 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors
  
  Have you had any issues with putting 3 radio cards in the same
  spectrum in the same box?  I've thought about that but wondered if
  there would be desense issues where one transmitting desensitizes
  another one listening.
  
  
  At 08:38 AM 12/2/2009, you wrote:
   Yep, looks like you're hitting the wall.  We aren't lucky enough to
  push
   3
   meg here, the most is usually 1 so again, all depends on your
   customer
  base.
   
   I'd say if you already have 35 on that one AP, just splitting it
 into
   2
   180
   degree sectors will just cost you cash as soon as you gain a few
 more
   customers.  You already have 35 pulling it down, sounds like if you
  just
   do
   2 180's, if split evenly (and it never will be) that would put you
 to
   where
   you probably want to be for smooth delivery but not much room for
   more
   growth.  I'd go with 3 120's and a 433AH with 3 cards on it, one per
  sector.
   I have a few like that and it works fine for what I do but again, I
  only
   dole out 1mb per sub typically.  I've also been upgrading some of my
   remote
   AP's to one 433AH with only one radio installed and an Omni.  The
   anticipated upgrade path is to just add a sector or 2 and radio card
   as
   needed to the 

Re: [WISPA] Iowa Telecom a.k.a Windstream

[Jayson Baker]

If this is their install truck, I don't think you have to worry about much.

[image:
?ui=2view=attth=1254ad61273873f9attid=0.1disp=attdrealattid=ii_1254ad61273873f9zw]

LOL



On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 8:04 AM, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote:

 My primary competition for the past few years has been Iowa
 Telecom.  They have been purchased by Windstream.  I knew what to
 expect from Iowa Telecom, but don't now.

 Have any of you had experience with Windstream?  Should I be bracing
 for some real competition?

 Iowa Telecom decisions, in my analysis are based mostly on use of
 their wired facilities.  DSL, phone service are primary, and their
 wireless offerings, with phone and Dish, have been secondary.

 Should I expect the same from Winstream?

 Mike





 
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Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link

[Jayson Baker]

George,

Glad to see it's not just us.  We put in some MT N links when 4 was still
beta.  It worked awesome.  Awesome.
Then, somehow, the units have found their way into the upgrade stream, and
performance sucks now.

After pulling our hair out trying to figure out the problem, we choked it up
to firmware.
Like I said, glad to see it's not just us.

We've already made the decision to more most of those to Rocket M links.
We'll see.

Jayson

On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 8:35 AM, George Morris ghmor...@candlelight.cawrote:

 I think the Rockets are going to be great, but right now today the best
 software is a beta version of 5.1. That pretty much says it all.

 We have pulled all our MikroTik N links back out. 4.0beta3 was pretty good,
 but N wireless performance and stability took a real nosedive with the
 release version of 4.0-4.2 IMHO.

 We are back on XR-5s with either 20 or 40MHz channels for backhaul and get
 a
 rock-solid 30-60Mbits as a result.

 I don't see moving to anything else until MT resolves their N driver
 issues,
 plus releases the new version of Nstreme that is compatible with N cards,
 or
 UBNT completes their M series firmware tuning.

 Not sure which will happen first, but with the AH series RouterBoards and
 XR-5s we are sitting pretty in the meantime.

 PS We think the AH boards are worth the extra money if you have to run
 Torch
 or the Bandwidth Tester for troubleshooting. Both tools run much better on
 the bigger processors, and the cost differential to get this extra
 performance is minimal for a major backhaul.

 George

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Robert West
 Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 10:23 AM
 To: 'WISPA General List'
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link

 At first I was like huh?  but thinking of the now and present, the
 Rockets
 are new and the longevity has yet to be tested.  I have both UBNT and MT
 backhauls, love UBNT to no end but it's from the ease of use aspect.  My
 UBNT needs to be taken care of from time to time, the MT is just put up and
 forgotten about.  Sucks but that's how it is.  Not sure why that is, maybe
 Ubiquiti seems to always be pushing the envelope so logically they'll hit
 snags.  I'm a geek, I like the unknown so I put up with the snags but as
 Travis said in a roundabout way, if you want stability and something you
 don't want to worry about, go with the MT.  I'd go one further with his
 list
 though and use the R52N cards.



 Bob-





 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Travis Johnson
 Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 12:44 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link



 I guess if you don't need a reliable, stable product, this is the answer.
 However, I have MT backhaul links that have been up solid for over 3 years
 now. No ethernet issues, no heat issues, no firmware issues.

 Travis
 Microserv

 Jayson Baker wrote:

 (2) Rocket5M @ $90/ea
 (2) RocketDish @ $145/ea

 $470

 On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 10:00 PM, Travis Johnson  mailto:t...@ida.net
 t...@ida.net wrote:



  I would agree. Except the 411ah is overkill in my testing, the regular
 411 shows as much throughput as the 411ah. So, here's the list:

 2 x RB411
 2 x PacWireless 2ft dishes with radomes
 2 x PacWireless enclosures
 2 x wireless cards (XR5 would be my choice)
 2 x pigtails
 2 x LMR jumpers
 2 x 18v PoE

 Total cost would be less than $900 and would do 30Mbps in a 20mhz channel
 (or 15Mbps in a 10mhz channel).

 Travis
 Microserv


 Josh Luthman wrote:

 If spectrum is available you can use a 411ah pair and get 30 megs in
 20mhz.  Like 500 bucks in gear...

 On 11/30/09, RickG  mailto:rgunder...@gmail.com rgunder...@gmail.com
 mailto:rgunder...@gmail.com rgunder...@gmail.com wrote:


  Daniel, great questions!

 Throughput: As fast as possible :) Seriously, a couple of megs minimum.
 10Mbps would be plenty.
 Dishes: As big as necessary. Naturally, on the tower I'll be limited by
 wind
 loading. The other end is a solid water tank but I imagine the water
 company
 wont like a 10' dish :)
 Budget: $10k including tower.
 Licensed or unlicensed. I'm open to either but my budget probably wont
 allow
 licensed.
 POE or?: No preference.
 Noise floor: On 2.4GHz, -97. On 5GHz, -94.
 Currently deploying: Ubiquiti CPE on Mikrotik AP's. Was Tranzeo's on
 WRAP/StarOS.
 Comfort level: I've got experience with almost everything mainstream.

 Thanks! -RickG

 On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 10:42 PM, 3-dB Networks  mailto:wi...@3-db.net
 wi...@3-db.net  mailto:wi...@3-db.net wi...@3-db.net wrote:



  Depends...

 What type of throughput do you need?  What size dishes can you use?  What
 is
 the budget?  Licensed or Unlicensed?  PoE or some other configuration?
  What
 does the noise floor look like?  What type of equipment do you already
 primarily use (i.e. what will you be the most comfortable deploying).

 My recommendation would be based

Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link

[Jayson Baker]

Why can't you?  We've got a bunch of them recently, and have more on the way
from distro right now.

On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 4:13 PM, Scott Carullo sc...@brevardwireless.comwrote:

 I would not concern yourself with this option because you can't buy one if
 you wanted to right now.

 Scott Carullo
 Brevard Wireless
 321-205-1100 x102


 

 From: Jerry Richardson jrichard...@aircloud.com
 Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 12:57 PM
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link

 I am really, really having a hard time getting my head around using $90
 radios for must work links.

 Maybe I'm being obstinate, I don't know.

 Just seems wrong somehow.

 Jerry

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Jayson Baker
 Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 9:04 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link

 (2) Rocket5M @ $90/ea
 (2) RocketDish @ $145/ea

 $470

 On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 10:00 PM, Travis Johnson t...@ida.net wrote:

   I would agree. Except the 411ah is overkill in my testing, the
 regular
  411 shows as much throughput as the 411ah. So, here's the list:
 
  2 x RB411
  2 x PacWireless 2ft dishes with radomes
  2 x PacWireless enclosures
  2 x wireless cards (XR5 would be my choice)
  2 x pigtails
  2 x LMR jumpers
  2 x 18v PoE
 
  Total cost would be less than $900 and would do 30Mbps in a 20mhz
 channel
  (or 15Mbps in a 10mhz channel).
 
  Travis
  Microserv
 
 
  Josh Luthman wrote:
 
  If spectrum is available you can use a 411ah pair and get 30 megs in
  20mhz.  Like 500 bucks in gear...
 
  On 11/30/09, RickG rgunder...@gmail.com rgunder...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 
   Daniel, great questions!
 
  Throughput: As fast as possible :) Seriously, a couple of megs minimum.
  10Mbps would be plenty.
  Dishes: As big as necessary. Naturally, on the tower I'll be limited by
 wind
  loading. The other end is a solid water tank but I imagine the water
 company
  wont like a 10' dish :)
  Budget: $10k including tower.
  Licensed or unlicensed. I'm open to either but my budget probably wont
 allow
  licensed.
  POE or?: No preference.
  Noise floor: On 2.4GHz, -97. On 5GHz, -94.
  Currently deploying: Ubiquiti CPE on Mikrotik AP's. Was Tranzeo's on
  WRAP/StarOS.
  Comfort level: I've got experience with almost everything mainstream.
 
  Thanks! -RickG
 
  On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 10:42 PM, 3-dB Networks wi...@3-db.net
 wi...@3-db.net wrote:
 
 
 
   Depends...
 
  What type of throughput do you need?  What size dishes can you use?
 What
  is
  the budget?  Licensed or Unlicensed?  PoE or some other configuration?
   What
  does the noise floor look like?  What type of equipment do you already
  primarily use (i.e. what will you be the most comfortable deploying).
 
  My recommendation would be based on the answer to all of those
 questions.
 
  Daniel White
  3-dB Networkshttp://www.3dbnetworks.com
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org
 wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of RickG
  Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 8:23 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: [WISPA] 20 mile link
 
  Planning my first 20 mile PTP link. Path analysis shows clear. Customer
 is
  building a 100' tower just for this therefore the equipment I choose
 must
  work. I'm free to use whatever I want. Suggestions?
  -RickG
 
 
 
 

 

  
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Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link

[Jayson Baker]

Rocket 5M w/ Rocket Dish (or whatever it's called)

On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 8:22 PM, RickG rgunder...@gmail.com wrote:

 Planning my first 20 mile PTP link. Path analysis shows clear. Customer is
 building a 100' tower just for this therefore the equipment I choose must
 work. I'm free to use whatever I want. Suggestions?
 -RickG



 
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Re: [WISPA] FreeBSD hackers.... Needed for WISP related product...

[Jayson Baker]

Is there really much need for this, given the new AirMax product line?
I'm just saying...

On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 9:19 PM, MDK rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote:

 What would you call a totally proprietary,  TDMA based protocol, without
 ACK
 or CSMA?

 Doesn't look a whole lot like 802.11x, but if you wish to say it is, then,
 for you it is :)



 --
 From: Travis Johnson t...@ida.net
 Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 7:36 PM
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] FreeBSD hackers Needed for WISP related product...

  If you are using Atheros based hardware, it's still 802.11... regardless
  of what software you put on top of it.
 
  Travis
  Microserv
 
  MDK wrote:
  If you're a WISP and have interest in using commodity - off the shelf -
  Atheros based hardware to achieve higher than ethernet speeds over
  wireless... This is not a tweak of 802.11, it is a completely
  different
  mode...
 
  There is currently an opportunity to do so, where most of the work has
  been
  done by various others in the FreeBSd community, but it is not
 integrated
  or
  packaged as a useful WISP product, and that's what needs to be done.
 
  This does not need to result in an open source release, due to the
  relaxed
  BSD license. Or, it can.   But I'm looking for some people who have
  experience with freebsd, and have an interest in integrating what could
  be
  an awesome performing product using inexpensive commodity hardware.
 
  email me at pda  at neofast dot net or mark at neofast dot net
 
 
  --
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Outdoor UPS

[Jayson Baker]

Just saw this.  Sorry.
http://www.provantage.com/cyberpower-systems-cs24c12v2-e~7CYPR047.htm


On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 5:06 PM, Michael Baird m...@tc3net.com wrote:

 Jayson,

 Do you have the model numbers on these? I need 48v output.

 Regards
 Michael Baird
  APC and Cyberpower makes some.  12V or 48V output.  Outdoor mounted.  AC
  power input.
  We used them for a FTTH project once.
 
  On Thu, Oct 29, 2009 at 1:27 PM, Scott Parsons sc...@e-zy.net wrote:
 
 
  Michael,
  These systems are powered by POE.
  Not sure if that works for you.
  http://tyconpower.com/products/systems.htm
 
  Scott
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of Michael Baird
  Sent: Thursday, October 29, 2009 1:13 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: [WISPA] Outdoor UPS
 
  Looking for recommendations on an Outdoor UPS, not concerned about a
  long run time, just to handle the occasional blips. Form factor and
  mounting considerations are one of the main concerns with this install.
  Will be fed by AC power, but it can distribute as a single AC or DC
  feed, something that can do 100-250 watts would probably be fine.
 
  Regards
  Michael Baird
 
 
 
 
 
  
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

CableCARD's don't accept Ethernet...?

On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 8:11 AM, David E. Smith d...@mvn.net wrote:

 Out of idle curiosity, have any of you IPTV folks priced CableCARDs?
 There's
 a certain appeal in having customers provide their own equipment.

 David Smith
 MVN.net



 
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

Tonight we spent a few more hours on this project.

We're now streaming live satellite TV programming via multicast over our
network.
Unencrypted, and only MPEG 2 for now.

The stream is about 6Mbps.  It's going over a wireless backhaul, and into a
UBNT AirMax system.
It's being received over the AirMax system, but not being decoded properly.

Not sure if it's the AirMax, or this laptop that's the issue.  Leaning
towards the laptop.
When on the same network as the streambox the feed looks great, time-shift
works perfect.

We're using a PIII 933MHz machine with 1GB of RAM.  It was laying around

I will investigate more soon as to why it's not working via the AirMax.
I'll also try to get the MPEG 4 codec situated on the encoder.

I did find out from Amino that their STB's should work without 3rd party
middleware.
Basically, they have embedded browsers--point to your HTML server, which has
pages to streams.

You could fashion up your own guide and program info, etc.
This would work especially well if you're not broadcasting networks with
requirements, but just OTA.

On Fri, Nov 20, 2009 at 11:52 AM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.netwrote:

 So we're looking at $25k for the hardware to do an MPEG-4 H.264 IPTV system
 for up to 100 channels?

 Remaining items needed (or desired):

 1)  Middleware (Minerva)
 2)  Licensing (only your past seems to indicate that this can be done)
 3)  VoD
 4)  Content stream from Avail or Echostar

 Missing anything?

 Costs for the others?


 -
 Mike Hammett
 Intelligent Computing Solutions
 http://www.ics-il.com



 --
 From: Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
 Sent: Monday, November 16, 2009 12:20 PM
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

  Interestingly enough, I've had a project lying on my desk for a couple
  weeks
  now which requires streaming live content to a large group of people in a
  neighborhood (think of it as a neighborhood association wanting to
  broadcast
  their meetings to their residents).  I don't know why I didn't see the
  similarity between this post and that project.
 
  I just spent the last couple hours working on this, and now have a Linux
  server streaming the content out over the wireless network multicast
  without
  any issues.
 
  Taking a deeper look...
  We have ASI-input cards from Linear Systems.  They take 4 ASI streams...
  maybe 32 each?  I can't remember.
 
  A quick look on eBay found some Moto C-Band receivers that output 32 ASI
  streams for under $1000.
 
  An entire receiving, encoding, streaming headend for under 100 channels
  could be built for probably under $25,000.
 
  I don't know what you're after, but if there is some serious interest in
  putting effort into something like this, we might be on board.
 
  Jayson
 
  On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 9:31 AM, Jack Unger jun...@ask-wi.com wrote:
 
  Blake,
 
  In general the IPTV principles being discussed would apply to any
  broadband wireless system either license-free, licensed, or
  licensed-lite.
 
  jack
 
 
  Blake Covarrubias wrote:
   I've read the responses from others who are running IPTV over
 wireless.
  
   My question is when you all are saying wireless, do you mean
 unlicensed
  2.4ghz or 5.8ghz, or do you mean wireless technology in general?
  
   My company utilizes 2.5 and 3.65ghz, which are the same frequencies
   we'd
  be looking to use to deploy IPTV.
  
   --
   Blake Covarrubias
  
   On Nov 15, 2009, at 4:03 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:
  
  
   Every time this comes up, I say the same thing.  You can't over
  wireless.
   The content owners WILL NOT license it for wireless use.  I've tried
   numerous times
 
  --
  Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
  Author - Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs
  Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
  www.ask-wi.com  818-227-4220  jun...@ask-wi.com
 
  Sent from my Pizzicato PluckString...
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

I seem to remember the low-end ones were around $130/ea.  Not sure about the
others.  Price will vary based on where you buy and in what quantity I
assume.

Remembered that standard 802.11 will only multicast at around 1Mbps.  So
that's why we were having the problem with the multicast over AirMax
equipment.

On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:59 AM, richard sterne wireless.r...@gmail.comwrote:

 Did you get any pricing for the Amino STB's?
 I would like to know more about your setup.

 Richard



 
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

IIRc, multicast is limited at the 6Mbps modulation on WiFi

Tell me I'm wrong, please.  But I've read it a couple times--compeltely
forgot until we started doing this.

Before, when we were watching IPTV off our fiber headend, we were doing it
over EoIP.

On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 9:19 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net 
jree...@18-30chat.net wrote:

 You can change the multicast rate on the non airmax units. Mine are enroute
 so
 have not tried with the airmax gear.


 I have not heard back about the units.

 At 130 ea, a Roku with the same features as the low end unit, will be more
 cost
 effective. I am still researching about the licensing requirements of
 securing
 the data stream for non OTA channels.


 Jayson Baker wrote:
  I seem to remember the low-end ones were around $130/ea.  Not sure about
 the
  others.  Price will vary based on where you buy and in what quantity I
  assume.
 
  Remembered that standard 802.11 will only multicast at around 1Mbps.  So
  that's why we were having the problem with the multicast over AirMax
  equipment.
 
  On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:59 AM, richard sterne 
 wireless.r...@gmail.comwrote:
 
  Did you get any pricing for the Amino STB's?
  I would like to know more about your setup.
 
  Richard
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] 10MHz, 5MHz - unstable for voice?

[Jayson Baker]

IIRC, 5MHz and 10MHz is more sucepstible to interference than 20MHz.

On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 7:38 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS 
ilopezli...@sandboxitsolutions.com wrote:

 I'm gonna have to set up the environment again.  Only thing I cant
 simulate right now is distance.

 As long as it wasnt some voodoo config setting that made it work better,
 I might have to play with the Mobile NS2's settings for it to play nicely.

 OT:  What is CCQ?

 -Israel

 Josh Luthman wrote:
  It is very weird isn't it?
 
  Vi is better the Emacs.
 
  On 11/22/09, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote:
 
  Josh:
 
  I thought that too.  I have a handful of customers on a 5 MHz
  sector.  Winbox shows this:
 
  Emacs!
 
 
  Mike
 
  At 07:32 PM 11/22/2009, you wrote:
 
  I believe when you half the channels the rates also get halved - from
  54mbit
  to 27mbit max (that is from 20mhz to 10mhz channels).
 
  I also can't see why you're voice would be having problems in half or
  quarter channels unless there is a software bug.  It should only
 improve
  unless you're using all available bandwidth.
 
  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373
 
  The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
  --- Albert Einstein
 
 
  On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 8:08 PM, Chuck Hogg ch...@shelbybb.com
 wrote:
 
 
  First, you should have a better signal than -70 at 5Miles away with a
  24dB/NS2 antenna and a B2HP/9dB omni.  I get 65 or better with a 19dB
  panel.
 
  Don't forget, 10MHz channel is 1/2 available bandwidth and 5MHz is 1/4
  available bandwidth.  Really, you will get about 7-10MBit aggregate
  (depending on how many customers) on a 5MHz channel connected at
 54MBit,
  which requires signals at -74dBm with a good fade margin (10dB).
  Also,
  the TX power is significantly less for 54MBps (23dBm) vs
 24MBps(28dBm),
  less than half.  Likely, you are connecting at 48MBps or 36Mbps, which
  at that rate your total available real case bandwidth is as little
 as
  4MBps, while at 20MHz you are at 15+.
 
  A narrower channel should not affect your transmission, likely will
 make
  signals better, roughly double (+3dBm) from 20-10, and double from
  10-5(total +6dBm).
 
  Regards,
  Chuck Hogg
  Shelby Broadband
  502-722-9292
  ch...@shelbybb.com
  http://www.shelbybb.com
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
 On
  Behalf Of os10ru...@gmail.com
  Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2009 6:20 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] 10MHz, 5MHz - unstable for voice?
 
  Well next time definitely bring more food! Beef jerky and granola
 bars.
 
  In my testing the narrower channels just made things slower. I was
  testing in a pristine area where there was no other 5.8GHz going on.
  From what I hear if the environment had been polluted performance
 might
  have actually gone up with the narrower channels.
 
  From what I've read narrower channels doesn't effect packet size or
  transport. But switching to WDS bridged does.
 
  Greg
  On Nov 22, 2009, at 6:15 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS wrote:
 
 
  Its not in the field, but it is sitting here in my bedroom looking
 
  cool :).
 
  I was thinking that using the 10/5MHz bandwidth required one to setup
  something else.  I'm not that familiar with the use of half/quarter
 
  rate
 
  channels and how that affects the frame transport/packet size etc,.
 
  I wonder if it was environment based rather than
  'software/configuration' based.  If I get some time this evening I
 
  might
 
  setup the gear again for more focused testing (Testing in the field
 
  with
 
  volunteers who are cold and hungry dont usually respond well to
 
  testing
 
  plans).
 
  -Israel
 
  os10ru...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  Just for kicks I'd try WDS bridged. Do you have control from where
 
  you're at now? Is the equipment still set up?
 
  Greg
 
  On Nov 22, 2009, at 6:02 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS wrote:
 
 
 
  @Travis Johnson - Yes Upgraded to newest firmware for the two units
 
  @os10rules - Nope, Fixed was simple AP and Mobile was Station modes
 
  os10ru...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 
  Running WDS bridged?
 
  Greg
  On Nov 22, 2009, at 5:37 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS wrote:
 
 
 
 
  Hey All,
 
  I did some field tests (for overseas volunteer project) with some
  Ubituiti gear; Nanostation2  Bullet2HP.
 
  One thing that was surprising was the performance degradation
 when
 
  switching from 20MHz to 10MHz/5MHz.  Our tests were Raw Bandwidth
  Tests(AirOS), Video (VLC UDP Stream), Voice (Trixbox G711 Voice
 
  Call),
 
  and MTR (Latency, Jitter)
 
  I still have data to collect and prepare a report for the tech
 
  team, but
 
  we did notice that when we switched to 10 or 5MHz bandwidth our
 
  voice
 
  calls was greatly degraded. Only one way; from Fixed to Mobile I
 
  could
 
  hear the Fixed station easily.  Mobile to Fixed the voice was
 
  choppy.
 
  We started to get packet loss  massive 

Re: [WISPA] 10MHz, 5MHz - unstable for voice?

[Jayson Baker]

Yes, you get more signal, but you have much less spectrum for your spread
spectrum radio to operate in.
Spread spectrum doesn't always use the full 20MHz, it will skip around --
that's the spread part of it.
So if you lower that to 5MHz, then you have virtually no spread and
anything that may be inside that 5MHz
will cause you a much more deteriorated performance than if it was in your
20MHz.

On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 9:08 PM, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote:

 I should think the opposite is true.  Halve the signal, improve
 signal to noise 3 dB.  Half it again and the improvement is 6 dB
 signal to noise.  Should give you way more margin.  My tests prove that
 out.


 At 08:44 PM 11/22/2009, you wrote:
 IIRC, 5MHz and 10MHz is more sucepstible to interference than 20MHz.
 
 On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 7:38 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS 
 ilopezli...@sandboxitsolutions.com wrote:
 
   I'm gonna have to set up the environment again.  Only thing I cant
   simulate right now is distance.
  
   As long as it wasnt some voodoo config setting that made it work
 better,
   I might have to play with the Mobile NS2's settings for it to play
 nicely.
  
   OT:  What is CCQ?
  
   -Israel
  
   Josh Luthman wrote:
It is very weird isn't it?
   
Vi is better the Emacs.
   
On 11/22/09, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote:
   
Josh:
   
I thought that too.  I have a handful of customers on a 5 MHz
sector.  Winbox shows this:
   
Emacs!
   
   
Mike
   
At 07:32 PM 11/22/2009, you wrote:
   
I believe when you half the channels the rates also get halved -
 from
54mbit
to 27mbit max (that is from 20mhz to 10mhz channels).
   
I also can't see why you're voice would be having problems in half
 or
quarter channels unless there is a software bug.  It should only
   improve
unless you're using all available bandwidth.
   
Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373
   
The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
--- Albert Einstein
   
   
On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 8:08 PM, Chuck Hogg ch...@shelbybb.com
   wrote:
   
   
First, you should have a better signal than -70 at 5Miles away
 with a
24dB/NS2 antenna and a B2HP/9dB omni.  I get 65 or better with a
 19dB
panel.
   
Don't forget, 10MHz channel is 1/2 available bandwidth and 5MHz is
 1/4
available bandwidth.  Really, you will get about 7-10MBit
 aggregate
(depending on how many customers) on a 5MHz channel connected at
   54MBit,
which requires signals at -74dBm with a good fade margin (10dB).
Also,
the TX power is significantly less for 54MBps (23dBm) vs
   24MBps(28dBm),
less than half.  Likely, you are connecting at 48MBps or 36Mbps,
 which
at that rate your total available real case bandwidth is as
 little
   as
4MBps, while at 20MHz you are at 15+.
   
A narrower channel should not affect your transmission, likely
 will
   make
signals better, roughly double (+3dBm) from 20-10, and double from
10-5(total +6dBm).
   
Regards,
Chuck Hogg
Shelby Broadband
502-722-9292
ch...@shelbybb.com
http://www.shelbybb.com
   
   
-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:
 wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
   On
Behalf Of os10ru...@gmail.com
Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2009 6:20 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] 10MHz, 5MHz - unstable for voice?
   
Well next time definitely bring more food! Beef jerky and granola
   bars.
   
In my testing the narrower channels just made things slower. I was
testing in a pristine area where there was no other 5.8GHz going
 on.
From what I hear if the environment had been polluted performance
   might
have actually gone up with the narrower channels.
   
From what I've read narrower channels doesn't effect packet size
 or
transport. But switching to WDS bridged does.
   
Greg
On Nov 22, 2009, at 6:15 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS wrote:
   
   
Its not in the field, but it is sitting here in my bedroom
 looking
   
cool :).
   
I was thinking that using the 10/5MHz bandwidth required one to
 setup
something else.  I'm not that familiar with the use of
 half/quarter
   
rate
   
channels and how that affects the frame transport/packet size
 etc,.
   
I wonder if it was environment based rather than
'software/configuration' based.  If I get some time this evening
 I
   
might
   
setup the gear again for more focused testing (Testing in the
 field
   
with
   
volunteers who are cold and hungry dont usually respond well to
   
testing
   
plans).
   
-Israel
   
os10ru...@gmail.com wrote:
   
Just for kicks I'd try WDS bridged. Do you have control from
 where
   
you're at now? Is the equipment still set up?
   
Greg
   
On Nov 22, 2009, at 6:02 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS 

Re: [WISPA] 10MHz, 5MHz - unstable for voice?

[Jayson Baker]

Doesn't matter.  If the interference is there, it's there.  If your radio
has no where to spread out the signal and avoid that interference, you're
dead.

On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 10:08 PM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 Right but you have another 6db to get a stronger signal.

 On 11/22/09, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com wrote:
  Yes, you get more signal, but you have much less spectrum for your spread
  spectrum radio to operate in.
  Spread spectrum doesn't always use the full 20MHz, it will skip around --
  that's the spread part of it.
  So if you lower that to 5MHz, then you have virtually no spread and
  anything that may be inside that 5MHz
  will cause you a much more deteriorated performance than if it was in
 your
  20MHz.
 
  On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 9:08 PM, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote:
 
  I should think the opposite is true.  Halve the signal, improve
  signal to noise 3 dB.  Half it again and the improvement is 6 dB
  signal to noise.  Should give you way more margin.  My tests prove that
  out.
 
 
  At 08:44 PM 11/22/2009, you wrote:
  IIRC, 5MHz and 10MHz is more sucepstible to interference than 20MHz.
  
  On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 7:38 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS 
  ilopezli...@sandboxitsolutions.com wrote:
  
I'm gonna have to set up the environment again.  Only thing I cant
simulate right now is distance.
   
As long as it wasnt some voodoo config setting that made it work
  better,
I might have to play with the Mobile NS2's settings for it to play
  nicely.
   
OT:  What is CCQ?
   
-Israel
   
Josh Luthman wrote:
 It is very weird isn't it?

 Vi is better the Emacs.

 On 11/22/09, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote:

 Josh:

 I thought that too.  I have a handful of customers on a 5 MHz
 sector.  Winbox shows this:

 Emacs!


 Mike

 At 07:32 PM 11/22/2009, you wrote:

 I believe when you half the channels the rates also get halved -
  from
 54mbit
 to 27mbit max (that is from 20mhz to 10mhz channels).

 I also can't see why you're voice would be having problems in
 half
  or
 quarter channels unless there is a software bug.  It should only
improve
 unless you're using all available bandwidth.

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
 --- Albert Einstein


 On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 8:08 PM, Chuck Hogg ch...@shelbybb.com
 
wrote:


 First, you should have a better signal than -70 at 5Miles away
  with a
 24dB/NS2 antenna and a B2HP/9dB omni.  I get 65 or better with
 a
  19dB
 panel.

 Don't forget, 10MHz channel is 1/2 available bandwidth and 5MHz
 is
  1/4
 available bandwidth.  Really, you will get about 7-10MBit
  aggregate
 (depending on how many customers) on a 5MHz channel connected
 at
54MBit,
 which requires signals at -74dBm with a good fade margin
 (10dB).
 Also,
 the TX power is significantly less for 54MBps (23dBm) vs
24MBps(28dBm),
 less than half.  Likely, you are connecting at 48MBps or
 36Mbps,
  which
 at that rate your total available real case bandwidth is as
  little
as
 4MBps, while at 20MHz you are at 15+.

 A narrower channel should not affect your transmission, likely
  will
make
 signals better, roughly double (+3dBm) from 20-10, and double
 from
 10-5(total +6dBm).

 Regards,
 Chuck Hogg
 Shelby Broadband
 502-722-9292
 ch...@shelbybb.com
 http://www.shelbybb.com


 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:
  wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
On
 Behalf Of os10ru...@gmail.com
 Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2009 6:20 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] 10MHz, 5MHz - unstable for voice?

 Well next time definitely bring more food! Beef jerky and
 granola
bars.

 In my testing the narrower channels just made things slower. I
 was
 testing in a pristine area where there was no other 5.8GHz
 going
  on.
 From what I hear if the environment had been polluted
 performance
might
 have actually gone up with the narrower channels.

 From what I've read narrower channels doesn't effect packet
 size
  or
 transport. But switching to WDS bridged does.

 Greg
 On Nov 22, 2009, at 6:15 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS wrote:


 Its not in the field, but it is sitting here in my bedroom
  looking

 cool :).

 I was thinking that using the 10/5MHz bandwidth required one
 to
  setup
 something else.  I'm not that familiar with the use of
  half/quarter

 rate

 channels and how that affects the frame transport/packet size
  etc,.

 I wonder

Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

The biggest ones are getting the rights to the content, and getting the
content.
I don't remember what we paid for Mineva.  Before that, we used Espial (
http://www.espial.com/)  Might want to check them out.  No idea what they're
cost is now either.
I've never worked with any VoD content.

On Fri, Nov 20, 2009 at 11:52 AM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.netwrote:

 So we're looking at $25k for the hardware to do an MPEG-4 H.264 IPTV system
 for up to 100 channels?

 Remaining items needed (or desired):

 1)  Middleware (Minerva)
 2)  Licensing (only your past seems to indicate that this can be done)
 3)  VoD
 4)  Content stream from Avail or Echostar

 Missing anything?

 Costs for the others?


 -
 Mike Hammett
 Intelligent Computing Solutions
 http://www.ics-il.com



 --
 From: Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
 Sent: Monday, November 16, 2009 12:20 PM
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

  Interestingly enough, I've had a project lying on my desk for a couple
  weeks
  now which requires streaming live content to a large group of people in a
  neighborhood (think of it as a neighborhood association wanting to
  broadcast
  their meetings to their residents).  I don't know why I didn't see the
  similarity between this post and that project.
 
  I just spent the last couple hours working on this, and now have a Linux
  server streaming the content out over the wireless network multicast
  without
  any issues.
 
  Taking a deeper look...
  We have ASI-input cards from Linear Systems.  They take 4 ASI streams...
  maybe 32 each?  I can't remember.
 
  A quick look on eBay found some Moto C-Band receivers that output 32 ASI
  streams for under $1000.
 
  An entire receiving, encoding, streaming headend for under 100 channels
  could be built for probably under $25,000.
 
  I don't know what you're after, but if there is some serious interest in
  putting effort into something like this, we might be on board.
 
  Jayson
 
  On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 9:31 AM, Jack Unger jun...@ask-wi.com wrote:
 
  Blake,
 
  In general the IPTV principles being discussed would apply to any
  broadband wireless system either license-free, licensed, or
  licensed-lite.
 
  jack
 
 
  Blake Covarrubias wrote:
   I've read the responses from others who are running IPTV over
 wireless.
  
   My question is when you all are saying wireless, do you mean
 unlicensed
  2.4ghz or 5.8ghz, or do you mean wireless technology in general?
  
   My company utilizes 2.5 and 3.65ghz, which are the same frequencies
   we'd
  be looking to use to deploy IPTV.
  
   --
   Blake Covarrubias
  
   On Nov 15, 2009, at 4:03 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:
  
  
   Every time this comes up, I say the same thing.  You can't over
  wireless.
   The content owners WILL NOT license it for wireless use.  I've tried
   numerous times
 
  --
  Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
  Author - Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs
  Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
  www.ask-wi.com  818-227-4220  jun...@ask-wi.com
 
  Sent from my Pizzicato PluckString...
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Need a new AP

[Jayson Baker]

UBNT Bullet M2?

On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 2:59 PM, pat p...@inlandnet.com wrote:

 I have one small group on an old Cisco Aironet 350, which only does
 802.11b.

 1)  I want to have at least a b/g mix, n capable a bonus.

 2)  Must support WEP encryption, but be able to handle a mix of WEP and
 WPA simultaneously.  (WEP for legacy clients that I haven't upgraded)

 3)  Must play nice with Tranzeo CPQ and CPE200.

 You input is helpful.

 TIA,

 Pat




 
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Re: [WISPA] Need a new AP

[Jayson Baker]

In that case, use a MikroTik RB411R.
Integrated radio, and MT can do various encryptions you need.

Sorry, I overlooked that part of the request.

On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 3:16 PM, pat p...@inlandnet.com wrote:

 Bullet M2's won't do WEP until the release of firmware version 5.1 which
 has been in just a couple of weeks for at least the last two months.



 Jayson Baker wrote:
  UBNT Bullet M2?
 
  On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 2:59 PM, pat p...@inlandnet.com wrote:
 
 
  I have one small group on an old Cisco Aironet 350, which only does
  802.11b.
 
  1)  I want to have at least a b/g mix, n capable a bonus.
 
  2)  Must support WEP encryption, but be able to handle a mix of WEP and
  WPA simultaneously.  (WEP for legacy clients that I haven't upgraded)
 
  3)  Must play nice with Tranzeo CPQ and CPE200.
 
  You input is helpful.
 
  TIA,
 
  Pat
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

We got OK to do it over MT equipment in unlicensed bands.

Their concern was that A) they didn't want it going over any sort of public
network (i.e. WiFi Hotspot) and B) encryption remained in-tact from the
headend to the STB.

On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 1:19 AM, Blake Covarrubias bl...@beamspeed.comwrote:

 I've read the responses from others who are running IPTV over wireless.

 My question is when you all are saying wireless, do you mean unlicensed
 2.4ghz or 5.8ghz, or do you mean wireless technology in general?

 My company utilizes 2.5 and 3.65ghz, which are the same frequencies we'd be
 looking to use to deploy IPTV.

 --
 Blake Covarrubias

 On Nov 15, 2009, at 4:03 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:

  Every time this comes up, I say the same thing.  You can't over wireless.
  The content owners WILL NOT license it for wireless use.  I've tried
  numerous times.




 
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Re: [WISPA] Anyone else wish for this?

[Jayson Baker]

MikroTik used to support some sort of VoIP interface; I forget what it was.
I'm sure this is possible as well, if they wanted to.  We'd love to have
something like this too--but think it's a little further off.  In fact, even
if it was just a device like the IAXy that'd be fine.  But then you get into
all sorts of other ideas like having it mountable outside, so you could
mount it near their existing telco NIU.  Ideas and requestsare endless, I
guess.  :-)

FYI, we buy PAP2-NA's and SPA2102-NA's (the unlocked versions) all day long
online, in quantities as small as 1 at a time.  We used to get them all
through IngramMicro, but found that just Googleing for X-NA is cheaper than
buying wholesale.

On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 7:20 AM, can...@believewireless.net 
p...@believewireless.net wrote:

 I've been asking for something like this for years.  Now if you could
 throw in a SIP ATA as well with battery backup, it would be perfect!

 Linksys only sells the VoIP routers to the big boys and I have no idea
 why we can't get them.  (New, not hacked)

 On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 2:26 AM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
 wrote:
  I don't know.  Seems so simple.  I believe the new UBNT Nano M's have a
  controllable PoE port on them.
  At least, that's how I read their site.  Haven't toyed with it yet.  If
 UBNT
  can do it, MT can do it better.  :-)
 
  On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 12:25 AM, Josh Luthman
  j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:
 
  That would be amazing.  Never seen any device like this provide power,
  wonder why.
 
  On 11/16/09, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com wrote:
   What we *really* want, and would buy a *lot* of is an indoor router
 with
  PoE
   OUTPUT (or passthru, whatever you want to call it).
   i.e. a RB750 inside the home, with integrated wireless (802.11g,
 standard
   power is fine), 4-port switch, standard DC input.
   But, here's the wishful part!  On the WAN port, it'd pass-thru
 whatever
   voltage it was getting input on the DC input plug.
   That means we could install a managed-router for the customer, and use
  only
   a single wall-wart power supply.
   I'm sure if MT came out with something like this the PoE pass-thru
 port
   would be software controllable, and probably watchdog'able.
   So if the antenna outside locked up, lost connectivity, whatever--the
  inside
   router could powercycle it.
   We could care less about a web interface.  We'd provide these as a
  managed
   service to the customer, they'd never login to it anyway.
   If something like this came along, we'd install one at every single
  install
   and require the customer use it.
  
   On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 8:09 PM, os10ru...@gmail.com wrote:
  
   Something like the MT RB750 but with 802.11n. Top it off with an
 easier
   web
   interface which would make basic setup as a home router/AP simple for
  the
   uninitiated. I'm thinking something of quality with the power of a
   RouterOS
   level 4 license to compete with the crappy dlink/linksys/netgear
  consumer
   grade router/APs.
  
   With the current MT lineup if one does this piecemeal they have to
 start
   with a routerboard with way more ethernet ports and three wireless
 card
   slots and you still have to add the case, power supply, wireless card
  and
   antennas and it ends up being pricey.
  
   Greg
  
  
  
  
 
 
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  --
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  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373
 
  The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
  --- Albert Einstein
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

 1) Content streams from Avail (or possibly EchoStar)

Yes


 2) Independent licensing process

Yes, in some cases.  Never worked with E*.


 3) Home built headend (though reading back through your previous posts, I

get the impression you used one from Avail)

We used Avail's headend.  Initially, it was total garbage.  When I left that
company, they were still trying to get simple things done reliably.  I'm
sure it's resolved by now.  If I were to do it again, I'd build my own, and
save about $250k.


 4) Minerva middleware (I understand that to be the best one)

Yes, indeed.  They do have the best in my opinion.  But there are cheaper
ones, that will do the trick.  I wish I could remember what we initially
used.  Started with an E...  *shrug*


 5) Moto STBs

Yes, but again there are cheaper ones.  The Mood (or i3, I think they're
one-in-the-same now) boxes work just as good, and are much cheaper.

I'm trying to remember the name of the company/guy we bought a lot of this
equipment from.  If I think of it, I'll post it.

On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 8:37 AM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.netwrote:

 So:

 1) Content streams from Avail (or possibly EchoStar)
 2) Independent licensing process
 3) Home built headend (though reading back through your previous posts, I
 get the impression you used one from Avail)
 4) Minerva middleware (I understand that to be the best one)
 5) Moto STBs


 -
 Mike Hammett
 Intelligent Computing Solutions
 http://www.ics-il.com



 --
 From: Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
 Sent: Monday, November 16, 2009 1:09 AM
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

  I cannot comment on the contracts.
 
  As I have mentioned previously, we bought the aggregated content from
  Avail
  Media.  They can probably help you.
 
  We did still have direct contracts with the networks though.  Ultimately,
  they were the ones who agreed to allow us to distribute via wireless.
 
  On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 8:19 PM, RickG rgunder...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  Jayson,
 
  Can you elaborate on the contracts and the system you have in place to
  provide this?
 
  -RickG
 
  On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 7:43 PM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
  wrote:
 
   Actually, you're completely wrong.  We got all of our networks to
 agree
  to
   allow us to transport it wirelessly.
   The requirement was that we own the network entirely, from end A to
 end
  Z,
   and that we control every part of it.
   The ones that are concerned about theft (i.e. ESPN/Disney, HBO, etc.)
   already had encrypted stream anyway.
  
   We successfuly transmitted all of our programming over MikroTik
   wireless
   links without any problems.  Including HD.
  
   On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 4:03 PM, Mike Hammett 
 wispawirel...@ics-il.net
   wrote:
  
Every time this comes up, I say the same thing.  You can't over
  wireless.
The content owners WILL NOT license it for wireless use.  I've tried
numerous times.
   
Expect to dump about $500k into a real system to do IPTV.
   
   
-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com
   
   
   
--
From: jree...@18-30chat.net
Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 8:44 AM
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Subject: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?
   
 I have been looking at some IPTV options and basically, there does
  not
 seam to
 be a whole lot of options. I can A) build my own IP headend B)
 nada
 .
I
 can not
 find a single IPTV provider that truly caters to the resident,
 soho,
   etc.
 There
 is one that does so for huge cable op's but thats not where I am
 at,
   yet
 =)

 I can build my own head end no problem. Licensing is the primary
  issues
 there. I
 am guessing that is what is stopping the explosion of retail IPTV
 and
 instead
 pushing the more a la carte IP video streamers like NetFlix, HuLu,
 et
   al.

 So, what options exist for IPTV ?



   
  
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

Interestingly enough, I've had a project lying on my desk for a couple weeks
now which requires streaming live content to a large group of people in a
neighborhood (think of it as a neighborhood association wanting to broadcast
their meetings to their residents).  I don't know why I didn't see the
similarity between this post and that project.

I just spent the last couple hours working on this, and now have a Linux
server streaming the content out over the wireless network multicast without
any issues.

Taking a deeper look...
We have ASI-input cards from Linear Systems.  They take 4 ASI streams...
maybe 32 each?  I can't remember.

A quick look on eBay found some Moto C-Band receivers that output 32 ASI
streams for under $1000.

An entire receiving, encoding, streaming headend for under 100 channels
could be built for probably under $25,000.

I don't know what you're after, but if there is some serious interest in
putting effort into something like this, we might be on board.

Jayson

On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 9:31 AM, Jack Unger jun...@ask-wi.com wrote:

 Blake,

 In general the IPTV principles being discussed would apply to any
 broadband wireless system either license-free, licensed, or licensed-lite.

 jack


 Blake Covarrubias wrote:
  I've read the responses from others who are running IPTV over wireless.
 
  My question is when you all are saying wireless, do you mean unlicensed
 2.4ghz or 5.8ghz, or do you mean wireless technology in general?
 
  My company utilizes 2.5 and 3.65ghz, which are the same frequencies we'd
 be looking to use to deploy IPTV.
 
  --
  Blake Covarrubias
 
  On Nov 15, 2009, at 4:03 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:
 
 
  Every time this comes up, I say the same thing.  You can't over
 wireless.
  The content owners WILL NOT license it for wireless use.  I've tried
  numerous times

 --
 Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
 Author - Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs
 Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
 www.ask-wi.com  818-227-4220  jun...@ask-wi.com

 Sent from my Pizzicato PluckString...







 
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

Actually, you're completely wrong.  We got all of our networks to agree to
allow us to transport it wirelessly.
The requirement was that we own the network entirely, from end A to end Z,
and that we control every part of it.
The ones that are concerned about theft (i.e. ESPN/Disney, HBO, etc.)
already had encrypted stream anyway.

We successfuly transmitted all of our programming over MikroTik wireless
links without any problems.  Including HD.

On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 4:03 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.netwrote:

 Every time this comes up, I say the same thing.  You can't over wireless.
 The content owners WILL NOT license it for wireless use.  I've tried
 numerous times.

 Expect to dump about $500k into a real system to do IPTV.


 -
 Mike Hammett
 Intelligent Computing Solutions
 http://www.ics-il.com



 --
 From: jree...@18-30chat.net
 Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 8:44 AM
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

  I have been looking at some IPTV options and basically, there does not
  seam to
  be a whole lot of options. I can A) build my own IP headend B) nada .  I
  can not
  find a single IPTV provider that truly caters to the resident, soho, etc.
  There
  is one that does so for huge cable op's but thats not where I am at, yet
  =)
 
  I can build my own head end no problem. Licensing is the primary issues
  there. I
  am guessing that is what is stopping the explosion of retail IPTV and
  instead
  pushing the more a la carte IP video streamers like NetFlix, HuLu, et al.
 
  So, what options exist for IPTV ?
 
 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Anyone else wish for this?

[Jayson Baker]

What we *really* want, and would buy a *lot* of is an indoor router with PoE
OUTPUT (or passthru, whatever you want to call it).
i.e. a RB750 inside the home, with integrated wireless (802.11g, standard
power is fine), 4-port switch, standard DC input.
But, here's the wishful part!  On the WAN port, it'd pass-thru whatever
voltage it was getting input on the DC input plug.
That means we could install a managed-router for the customer, and use only
a single wall-wart power supply.
I'm sure if MT came out with something like this the PoE pass-thru port
would be software controllable, and probably watchdog'able.
So if the antenna outside locked up, lost connectivity, whatever--the inside
router could powercycle it.
We could care less about a web interface.  We'd provide these as a managed
service to the customer, they'd never login to it anyway.
If something like this came along, we'd install one at every single install
and require the customer use it.

On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 8:09 PM, os10ru...@gmail.com wrote:

 Something like the MT RB750 but with 802.11n. Top it off with an easier web
 interface which would make basic setup as a home router/AP simple for the
 uninitiated. I'm thinking something of quality with the power of a RouterOS
 level 4 license to compete with the crappy dlink/linksys/netgear consumer
 grade router/APs.

 With the current MT lineup if one does this piecemeal they have to start
 with a routerboard with way more ethernet ports and three wireless card
 slots and you still have to add the case, power supply, wireless card and
 antennas and it ends up being pricey.

 Greg



 
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

I cannot comment on the contracts.

As I have mentioned previously, we bought the aggregated content from Avail
Media.  They can probably help you.

We did still have direct contracts with the networks though.  Ultimately,
they were the ones who agreed to allow us to distribute via wireless.

On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 8:19 PM, RickG rgunder...@gmail.com wrote:

 Jayson,

 Can you elaborate on the contracts and the system you have in place to
 provide this?

 -RickG

 On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 7:43 PM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
 wrote:

  Actually, you're completely wrong.  We got all of our networks to agree
 to
  allow us to transport it wirelessly.
  The requirement was that we own the network entirely, from end A to end
 Z,
  and that we control every part of it.
  The ones that are concerned about theft (i.e. ESPN/Disney, HBO, etc.)
  already had encrypted stream anyway.
 
  We successfuly transmitted all of our programming over MikroTik wireless
  links without any problems.  Including HD.
 
  On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 4:03 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.net
  wrote:
 
   Every time this comes up, I say the same thing.  You can't over
 wireless.
   The content owners WILL NOT license it for wireless use.  I've tried
   numerous times.
  
   Expect to dump about $500k into a real system to do IPTV.
  
  
   -
   Mike Hammett
   Intelligent Computing Solutions
   http://www.ics-il.com
  
  
  
   --
   From: jree...@18-30chat.net
   Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 8:44 AM
   To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
   Subject: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?
  
I have been looking at some IPTV options and basically, there does
 not
seam to
be a whole lot of options. I can A) build my own IP headend B) nada .
   I
can not
find a single IPTV provider that truly caters to the resident, soho,
  etc.
There
is one that does so for huge cable op's but thats not where I am at,
  yet
=)
   
I can build my own head end no problem. Licensing is the primary
 issues
there. I
am guessing that is what is stopping the explosion of retail IPTV and
instead
pushing the more a la carte IP video streamers like NetFlix, HuLu, et
  al.
   
So, what options exist for IPTV ?
   
   
   
  
 
 
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http://signup.wispa.org/
   
  
 
 
   
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Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
   
  
  
  
  
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] 100Mbps over 10 miles

[Jayson Baker]

532's don't compare to 333, 433, even 411 on processor speed and ability.

On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 7:38 PM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 What I meant to describe was that I have not seen a Mikrotik wireless link
 exceed 30 megs in 20 mhz or 60 megs in 40 mhz.

 I'll have to do some experimenting.  I have a pair of 532s that get 30 megs
 and have something like -55 (not even half mile link).

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
 --- Albert Einstein


 On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 9:34 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.net
 wrote:

   30 as he typed would include 256 kbit.
 
  You both probably mean  30...  which it also can do, just fine.  Even
  reliably.
 
 
  -
  Mike Hammett
  Intelligent Computing Solutions
  http://www.ics-il.com
 
 
 
  --
  From: Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
  Sent: Friday, November 13, 2009 11:24 PM
  To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] 100Mbps over 10 miles
 
   Why 30 surprise you?  We have a very old Nstreme-Dual link going about
 1
   mile and it has been getting 90Mbps w/ 1ms latency for YEARS.
   90% of the problem with MikroTik is that people have no idea how to use
   it.
   You don't just plug it in and go.  We spent about 3 years learning,
   tweaking, deploying and testing.
  
   Anyway, to answer your question, yes the 1mile 180Mbps link is using
 R52N
   card, and Nstreme.
  
   On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 10:00 PM, Josh Luthman
   j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:
  
   With the 180meg 1 mile link - I assume that is also r5(2)n?  Are you
   doing
   N
   or nstreme?
  
   I'm surprised to see anything 30 megs when it comes to Mikrotik.
  
   Josh Luthman
   Office: 937-552-2340
   Direct: 937-552-2343
   1100 Wayne St
   Suite 1337
   Troy, OH 45373
  
   The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
   --- Albert Einstein
  
  
   On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 11:47 PM, Jayson Baker 
 jay...@spectrasurf.com
   wrote:
  
Yes, 40MHz.
   
We have a pair of RB333's that go about 1 mile, and get around
  180Mbps.
 Too
bad they only have 100Mbps Ethernet.
   
On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 9:41 PM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:
   
 120 megs through one pair of r52n?!  I'm assuming this is 40mhz?

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
 --- Albert Einstein


 On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 11:39 PM, Jayson Baker
 jay...@spectrasurf.com
 wrote:

  I think we get something in the range of 120Mbps through a pair
 of
 MikroTik
  411's and R52N wireless cards with 3' PacWireless dishes at 12
  miles.
  120Mbps on the wireless.  Those boards only have 100Mbps
 Ethernet,
  so
  that's
  a limiting factor.
 
  Total cost: $1000
 
  If you're concerned that MT isn't reliable enough, spend $2000
  and
put
 up
  2 completely diverse links.
  Though, we have some MT's that have been in service since 2004
 and
   are
  still
  cranking away without issue.
 
  On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 5:57 PM, my_em...@webjogger.net 
  my_em...@webjogger.net wrote:
 
   Looking to setup a 100Mbps or more link over 10 miles
 distance.
  
   Anyone have comments about what brand they think is good and
reliable?
  
   It can be either licensed or unlicensed.
  
   So far I'm looking at Exalt, Trango, and Dragonwave, but do
 know
which
   to choose.
  
   Thanks,
  
   --
   Jon Roux
   Webjogger Internet Services
   http://www.webjogger.net
   845.757.4000
  
  
  
  
  
  
 

   
  
 
 
   WISPA Wants You! Join today!
   http://signup.wispa.org/
  
  
 

   
  
 
 
  
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Re: [WISPA] Anyone else wish for this?

[Jayson Baker]

I don't know.  Seems so simple.  I believe the new UBNT Nano M's have a
controllable PoE port on them.
At least, that's how I read their site.  Haven't toyed with it yet.  If UBNT
can do it, MT can do it better.  :-)

On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 12:25 AM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 That would be amazing.  Never seen any device like this provide power,
 wonder why.

 On 11/16/09, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com wrote:
  What we *really* want, and would buy a *lot* of is an indoor router with
 PoE
  OUTPUT (or passthru, whatever you want to call it).
  i.e. a RB750 inside the home, with integrated wireless (802.11g, standard
  power is fine), 4-port switch, standard DC input.
  But, here's the wishful part!  On the WAN port, it'd pass-thru whatever
  voltage it was getting input on the DC input plug.
  That means we could install a managed-router for the customer, and use
 only
  a single wall-wart power supply.
  I'm sure if MT came out with something like this the PoE pass-thru port
  would be software controllable, and probably watchdog'able.
  So if the antenna outside locked up, lost connectivity, whatever--the
 inside
  router could powercycle it.
  We could care less about a web interface.  We'd provide these as a
 managed
  service to the customer, they'd never login to it anyway.
  If something like this came along, we'd install one at every single
 install
  and require the customer use it.
 
  On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 8:09 PM, os10ru...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  Something like the MT RB750 but with 802.11n. Top it off with an easier
  web
  interface which would make basic setup as a home router/AP simple for
 the
  uninitiated. I'm thinking something of quality with the power of a
  RouterOS
  level 4 license to compete with the crappy dlink/linksys/netgear
 consumer
  grade router/APs.
 
  With the current MT lineup if one does this piecemeal they have to start
  with a routerboard with way more ethernet ports and three wireless card
  slots and you still have to add the case, power supply, wireless card
 and
  antennas and it ends up being pricey.
 
  Greg
 
 
 
 
 
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 --
 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
 --- Albert Einstein



 
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Re: [WISPA] About Hulu and Netflix and youtube... increased data delivery is here to stay.

[Jayson Baker]

Surely you mean 20MHz with extension channel thus making it about 40MHz.

On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Matt lm7...@gmail.com wrote:

  I've found the rocket5m to work pretty good with 2' dishes for ptp
  links. The speed is real and it runs well. It does needs a minor work
  around in that the automatic distance setting does not work, you need to
  manually set it, plus 15%. I can get 100mbit no problem with 20mhz
  spectrum.

 I am just amazed you are getting 100mbit in 20mhz even if using both
 polarities.  I tried the Bullet5m's and had mostly bad results on a 12
 mile link with 2 foot dishes.  Tried many tweaks on modems with no
 results.  I am in the pressence of alot of other 5.8ghz gear though.
 Am looking at a PTP500 to replace it for alot more money.  They are
 supposed to be much more tolerent of interference I hear.

 Matt



 
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Re: [WISPA] 100Mbps over 10 miles

[Jayson Baker]

I think we get something in the range of 120Mbps through a pair of MikroTik
411's and R52N wireless cards with 3' PacWireless dishes at 12 miles.
120Mbps on the wireless.  Those boards only have 100Mbps Ethernet, so that's
a limiting factor.

Total cost: $1000

If you're concerned that MT isn't reliable enough, spend $2000 and put up
2 completely diverse links.
Though, we have some MT's that have been in service since 2004 and are still
cranking away without issue.

On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 5:57 PM, my_em...@webjogger.net 
my_em...@webjogger.net wrote:

 Looking to setup a 100Mbps or more link over 10 miles distance.

 Anyone have comments about what brand they think is good and reliable?

 It can be either licensed or unlicensed.

 So far I'm looking at Exalt, Trango, and Dragonwave, but do know which
 to choose.

 Thanks,

 --
 Jon Roux
 Webjogger Internet Services
 http://www.webjogger.net
 845.757.4000





 
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Re: [WISPA] 100Mbps over 10 miles

[Jayson Baker]

Yes, 40MHz.

We have a pair of RB333's that go about 1 mile, and get around 180Mbps.  Too
bad they only have 100Mbps Ethernet.

On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 9:41 PM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 120 megs through one pair of r52n?!  I'm assuming this is 40mhz?

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
 --- Albert Einstein


 On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 11:39 PM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
 wrote:

  I think we get something in the range of 120Mbps through a pair of
 MikroTik
  411's and R52N wireless cards with 3' PacWireless dishes at 12 miles.
  120Mbps on the wireless.  Those boards only have 100Mbps Ethernet, so
  that's
  a limiting factor.
 
  Total cost: $1000
 
  If you're concerned that MT isn't reliable enough, spend $2000 and put
 up
  2 completely diverse links.
  Though, we have some MT's that have been in service since 2004 and are
  still
  cranking away without issue.
 
  On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 5:57 PM, my_em...@webjogger.net 
  my_em...@webjogger.net wrote:
 
   Looking to setup a 100Mbps or more link over 10 miles distance.
  
   Anyone have comments about what brand they think is good and reliable?
  
   It can be either licensed or unlicensed.
  
   So far I'm looking at Exalt, Trango, and Dragonwave, but do know which
   to choose.
  
   Thanks,
  
   --
   Jon Roux
   Webjogger Internet Services
   http://www.webjogger.net
   845.757.4000
  
  
  
  
  
  
 
 
   WISPA Wants You! Join today!
   http://signup.wispa.org/
  
  
 
 
  
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   Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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Re: [WISPA] 100Mbps over 10 miles

[Jayson Baker]

I said 40MHz.

On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 10:49 PM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 You must have some secret that neither Butch nor I have - I've not
 seen any more then 30 megs on a single 20mhz wireless link.

 On 11/14/09, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com wrote:
  Why 30 surprise you?  We have a very old Nstreme-Dual link going about 1
  mile and it has been getting 90Mbps w/ 1ms latency for YEARS.
  90% of the problem with MikroTik is that people have no idea how to use
 it.
   You don't just plug it in and go.  We spent about 3 years learning,
  tweaking, deploying and testing.
 
  Anyway, to answer your question, yes the 1mile 180Mbps link is using R52N
  card, and Nstreme.
 
  On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 10:00 PM, Josh Luthman
  j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:
 
  With the 180meg 1 mile link - I assume that is also r5(2)n?  Are you
 doing
  N
  or nstreme?
 
  I'm surprised to see anything 30 megs when it comes to Mikrotik.
 
  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373
 
  The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
  --- Albert Einstein
 
 
  On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 11:47 PM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com
  wrote:
 
   Yes, 40MHz.
  
   We have a pair of RB333's that go about 1 mile, and get around
 180Mbps.
Too
   bad they only have 100Mbps Ethernet.
  
   On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 9:41 PM, Josh Luthman
   j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:
  
120 megs through one pair of r52n?!  I'm assuming this is 40mhz?
   
Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373
   
The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources.
--- Albert Einstein
   
   
On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 11:39 PM, Jayson Baker 
 jay...@spectrasurf.com
wrote:
   
 I think we get something in the range of 120Mbps through a pair of
MikroTik
 411's and R52N wireless cards with 3' PacWireless dishes at 12
 miles.
 120Mbps on the wireless.  Those boards only have 100Mbps Ethernet,
 so
 that's
 a limiting factor.

 Total cost: $1000

 If you're concerned that MT isn't reliable enough, spend $2000
 and
   put
up
 2 completely diverse links.
 Though, we have some MT's that have been in service since 2004 and
  are
 still
 cranking away without issue.

 On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 5:57 PM, my_em...@webjogger.net 
 my_em...@webjogger.net wrote:

  Looking to setup a 100Mbps or more link over 10 miles distance.
 
  Anyone have comments about what brand they think is good and
   reliable?
 
  It can be either licensed or unlicensed.
 
  So far I'm looking at Exalt, Trango, and Dragonwave, but do know
   which
  to choose.
 
  Thanks,
 
  --
  Jon Roux
  Webjogger Internet Services
  http://www.webjogger.net
  845.757.4000
 
 
 
 
 
 

   
  
 
 
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