et the class
on
> the JSF application object using the appropriate setter.
>
> --Chris
>
>
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eady have a good start on the code for the integrated lifecycle
part,
> thanks in part to Rod Browns efforts. Let me know if I should continue
to
> work on this.
>
> Thank You,
> --Chris Waring
>
>
>
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f2051594.html#a5687736
Sent from the Struts - Dev forum at Nabble.com.
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r but you cannot make it float on its back."
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n to
> make that happen.
>
> Don
>
> [1]
http://www.oreillynet.com/onjava/blog/2006/06/isnt_rails_supposed_to_change.html
>
>
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ake web
development
> easier, faster, with less hassles. I think this proposal provides the
vision to
> make that happen.
>
> Don
>
> [1]
http://www.oreillynet.com/onjava/blog/2006/06/isnt_rails_supposed_to_change.html
>
>
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ng but make people scratch their heads even
more.
> -Ted.
Frank
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; Don
>
>
> Craig
>
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roblem to the MyFaces and RI teams to compete on quality and
features. I'd rather add value by leveraging concepts that a JSF-oriented
developer already has to know about, rather than adding abstraction layers
so I can be agnostic about the front controller that is under the covers.
Don
Craig
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tion, then they have my support. But, I do think it is
healthy to ask the question.
-Ted.
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er Shale
> would be a better fit as a top-level ASF project, a subproject of
> MyFaces, or somewhere else entirely?
>
> -Ted.
>
> -
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ow would this benefit the Struts community? Finally, Struts returns to
>> its
>> roots as a single framework. While pieces of it may be usable outside
>> the
>> Action-based controller like Shale, it becomes the single place you go
to
>> solve
>> your application development needs. The documentation would be unified
>> and the
>> supporting committer community in step. If you wanted the whole
>> framework, you
>> download Struts. If you just want one of the libraries, they are
>> available ala
>> carte as well.
>>
>> This proposed change is primarily one of message and vision, and should
>> have
>> minimal impact on current development activity. With the next
generation
>> of
>> books and conferences in the works, I think it is important to develop
a
>> clear
>> message to the Struts community and minimize any confusion.
>>
>> The bottom line is we want Struts to be the place to go to make web
>> development
>> easier, faster, with less hassles. I think this proposal provides the
>> vision to
>> make that happen.
>>
>> Don
>>
>> [1]
>>
http://www.oreillynet.com/onjava/blog/2006/06/isnt_rails_supposed_to_change.html
>>
>>
>>
>>
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nferences in the works, I think it is important to develop a
> clear
> message to the Struts community and minimize any confusion.
>
> The bottom line is we want Struts to be the place to go to make web
> development
> easier, faster, with less hassles. I think this proposal provides the
> vision to
> make that happen.
>
> Don
>
> [1]
http://www.oreillynet.com/onjava/blog/2006/06/isnt_rails_supposed_to_change.html
>
>
>
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it happen. But, for phase 2, sure!
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se to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
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s.apache.org/struts/browse/SHALE-136
>
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pache.org/struts/browse/SHALE-136
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ly interested in feedback from the JSF folks,
> as I'm pretty new to the framework.
>
> Don
>
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t does not belong. Anyone who brings JSF to Struts
cannot be working on too much voltage.
On 5/21/06, Gary VanMatre <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>From: "Dakota Jack" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> Of course you aren't, Gary, because my panties are not in a bunch.
> Yo
t;[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>From: "Dakota Jack" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> You are right, for once. I only speak for myself. Those who are
> unwilling to listen to others are condemned by their own choice to a
> life of ignorance.
>
Sheese, sorry this got your panties i
ak for anyone, and is only here to confuse people.
K.
On 5/21/06, Dakota Jack <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I have seen no "very popular need". This is like Bush-Speak. Baloney
> parading as truth.
>
> On 5/21/06, Don Brown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> &g
This post shows who the limited person is. It is you, Ma'am.
On 5/21/06, Kimani Darisha <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Oh wonderful, more comments from the list idiot.
K.
On 5/21/06, Dakota Jack <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Who wants these frameworks combined? This is w
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most anyone here can say is "Looks cool, show us the
code" or "Here's the code, how do you like it?".
-Ted.
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This is silly, whomever you are.
On 5/3/06, netsql <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
"and that is why you will kill me last"?
:-0
.V
Dakota Jack wrote:
>
> At least you are civil. That part is good.
>
>
---
e.
hth,
.V
Dakota Jack wrote:
> What is amazing to me is that the people who are called "trolls" are
> only those in some way contrary to the status quo. Others in favor of
> the status quo who do nothing but use invective and display 10 year
> old conduct are never mentioned
stupid means that it requires no additional discussion. Read useless
responses like that about 50 times and it really starts to grate.
-Paul
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> >
>
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>
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our attempts at sarcasm, you
> actually have a point. All the rhetoric about the "Apache Way" is not
> useful or productive.
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st those?! :)
>
> Besides, it is a slow morning for me, and I do not feel like just
> lurking as usual. :) I will understand if you all think less of me
> for this utterly juvenile email. I think less of me too. Today is
> not a good self-control day. :(
>
> On 4/27/06, Dak
in incubation. It's not even actually part
> of Struts yet.
> 3) The Struts PMC currently oversees Shale, Tiles, and SAF 1. WebWork
> is not the only project here.
--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
--
brought
on for Shale and not for Struts.
On 4/25/06, Martin Cooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On 4/25/06, Dakota Jack <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > This is the kind of stupid, assinine comment
>
>
> What is stupid or assinine about pointing out t
TED]> wrote:
>
> Yep, I agree. You wouldn't believe the commission percentage that
> Craig gets whenever he sells a free copy of Java Studio Creator. I'm
> impressed that you noticed that toowow.
>
> --
> James Mitchell
>
>
>
>
> On Apr 25, 2006,
; product you'd like to sell?
>
> --
> James Mitchell
>
>
>
>
> On Apr 25, 2006, at 7:51 AM, Dakota Jack wrote:
>
> > We can advertise our wares here? I did not know that. I thought
> > this list
> > was about Struts and not about Ted's busin
Also, by the way, it is mostly about getting tiles to shale, etc, and
clearly is not based on Struts.
On 4/25/06, Martin Cooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On 4/25/06, Dakota Jack <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > Here is a case in point: I count four (4)
On 4/25/06, Martin Cooper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On 4/25/06, Dakota Jack <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > Here is a case in point: I count four (4) posts to the dev list in Greg
> > Reddin's history.
>
>
> Pity you can't count.
>
>
majority of the commiters want it that way.
>
> Craig
>
>
--
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and isolated reason for wanting to see the
> dirty
> > > laundry.)
> >
> > I still have the concerns about people being embarassed by
> this. However,
> > I think the idea of a nominee accepting the nomination first is a fair
> > idea. Putting aside the original proposal, how would that simple
> change,
> > along with opening the vote process discussion for all to see, sit with
> > everyone?
> >
> > > I guess I have trouble seeing how things could be improved much by
> your
> > > proposal... especially since I understood there to be nothing wrong
> with
> > > nominations coming from anywhere. It was just explained to be easier
> > > with a committer's support. I don't follow this list too closely, so
> > > maybe I missed someone who has been contributing lots of stuff and
> still
> > > was overlooked.
> >
> > Agreed, once Ted explained that point to me, the proposal isn't quite as
> > strong as I thought at first. I still think there is the issue of
> > transparency that could do with further discussion, but it seems the
> > nomination part of it is, more or less, already present. Codifying it
> > would be nice, but I can live with it not being written anywhere.
> >
> > Thanks for commenting, you are always welcome as far as I'm concerned :)
> >
> > > -Paul
> >
> > Frank
> >
> > -
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> >
>
>
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the community appearing to be closed, but I think there should
> be a barrier to entry. Maybe it's too high, but it seems to me that
> it should exist. After all it's basically a lifetime appointment and
> revocations are very rare if one has ever happened at all.
>
> Greg
>
> -
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Ok, let's review shall we.
>
> >> ... for our committers to use on open source projects...
> >>
>
> What part of that says anything about personal gain?
>
>
> --
> James Mitchell
>
>
>
>
> On Apr 25, 2006, at 12:50 AM, Dakota Jack wrote:
&g
ng on open source projects. The
> licenses are not for our personal use, but to help us with the
> volunteer work we do for the foundation.
>
> -Ted.
>
> -
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>
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g/repos/private/committers/pmc/struts/agitator-keys.txt
>
> Access to this file is resticted to Struts committers.
>
> -Ted.
>
> -
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gt;
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~Dakota Jack~
Chain command chain). This
> takes care of global pipeline customization.
>
> The first scenario seems pretty straightforward. I don't know XWork well
> enough to know whether the second strategy can actually be implemented the
> way I think it should (it would be necessary to split the "before" and
> "after" parts of the interceptor chain), but that'll become obvious when
> it
> gets attempted :-).
>
> The gain for the end user is to be able to reuse (or migrate) existing
> interceptors without having to rewrite everything.
>
> This is a good discussion, and I hope it can continue and be a benefit to
> > both communities.
> >
> > Don
>
>
> Craig
>
>
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or free?
>
> Sean
>
> -
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>
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MVC framework to fill in the gaps left by JSR 127, just like Struts
> Action fills in the gaps left by the servlet platform
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Following is a sample implementation of a real CoR pattern. Notice how
different it looks? Notice how data driven it is?
On 2/18/06, Frank W. Zammetti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Dakota Jack wrote:
> > The flexibility is clear. But, from what I can see the pattern is
Forward instance
processActionForward(request, response, forward);
}
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n ignorant of the rest. Now, go look at
ChainBase in commons and you will see that this is NOT the API design in
commons chain. The Command, hopefully, but NOT, would be part of a command
pattern. ChainBase, NOT Command, hopefully, but NOT, would be part of a
chain pattern.
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ommand="MyCommand"/>
> >
> > or am I misunderstanding?
> >
> > --
> > Martin Cooper
> >
> >
> > Michael.
> >>
> >> Craig
> >>
> >>
> >
>
> -
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interceptors)? If it defines the head of chain, is it still possible
> to sneak interceptors into an arbitrary chain?
>
> Michael.
>
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to change in the concrete
classes. There are much deeper problems which it not only does not address
but exascerbates.
Why don't you look at the code and see where there is iteration? I don't
think I should have to go to the code and show you. If you insist you don't
want to even look at the code and still defend it, then that's your
perogative.
--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack
in conjunction with Composite.
There, a component's parent can act as its successor. [GOF, p232]
-----
On 2/18/06, Frank W. Zammetti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Dakota Jack wrote:
> > The flexibility is clear. But, from what I can see the pattern is
their eyes. They flipped! CoR makes that flexibility very easy to do.
>
> > Craig
>
> Frank
>
> -
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>
>
--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
me last night, but, hopefully, I can
> > wrap up the review of the Release Notes tonight. We can then tag the
> > repository for STRUTS_1_3_0 as well as for each of the subprojects
> > (STRUTS_ACTION_1_3_0 ... STRUTS_TILES_1_3_0), and take it from there.
> >
> > -- HTH, Ted.
> > ** http://www.husted.com/ted/blog/
> >
> > -
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> >
> >
>
>
--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
gt; ** http://www.husted.com/ted/blog/
>
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--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
accepted because most people approve of the claim. In the
case
of an Appeal to Emotion the claim is accepted because the individual
approves of the claim because of the emotion of approval he feels in regards
to the claim.
Examples of Appeal to Emotion
1. The new PowerTangerine computer gives
gies
> >> http://www.omnytex.com
> >> AIM: fzammetti
> >> Yahoo: fzammetti
> >> MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >>
> >> On Fri, December 16, 2005 10:37 am, Patrick Lightbody said:
> >> > This sounds familiar :)
> >> >
> >> >
December 16, 2005 10:37 am, Patrick Lightbody said:
> > > This sounds familiar :)
> > >
> > > I definitely would recommend changing the slides and title of the
> > > presentation. Just yesterday I ran in to this:
> > >
> > >
> http://javasymp
21&w=2
>
> -- Paul
>
>
> Craig
>
>
--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
> http://people.apache.org/~craigmcc/apachecon-2005-shale.pdf].
>
> For more about Shale, visit the Struts Shale website [
> http://struts.apache.org/struts-shale/].
>
>
--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
d architecture
>
>
> may be my question are repeated but help me out in clearing this confusion
>
> -Thanks
> Jeevan
>
>
> -
> Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
t; developed (I will still support the original version as much as I can, but
> at a lower priority than the version in JWP).
> +
>
> -
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>
--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
gnment Group -
> http://opensource2.atlassian.com/confluence/oss/display/WAG/Home
>
> [3] Quick Topic Thread -
> http://www.quicktopic.com/33/H/KBfrHFUehSj/p16.1#QTmsg4
>
> [4] Confluence space -
> http://opensource.atlassian.com/confluence/oss/x/kQY
>
> -----
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>
>
--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
rary
> >> - Struts Distribution
> >>
> >> Any other options, and which do you prefer?
> >>
> >> --
> >> Wendy
> >>
> >> -
> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
>
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>
>
--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
do.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> IIRC it was Martin's suggestion, I think it got lost in the Great
> >> Version Debate. :)
> >>
> >> So far we have
> >> - Struts Classic
> >> - Struts Core Library
> >> - Struts Distribution
> >>
> >> Any other options, and which do you prefer?
> >>
> >> --
> >> Wendy
> >>
> >> -
> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
>
> -
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>
>
--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
gt; >
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> Frank W. Zammetti
> Founder and Chief Software Architect
> Omnytex Technologies
> http://www.omnytex.com
> AIM: fzammetti
> Yahoo: fzammetti
> MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> -
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>
>
--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
) and then raise actions on the controller to navigate to other
> pages (and to run app-level code that your pages shouldn't know about).
> It fits nicely, and in a lot of ways it's like using JSP as your view
> tier... only with much more capable pages.
>
> Rich
>
> Dakota
; > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >>It would be as open as the wikis, mailing lists, repositories, etc. of
> > >>the rest of the projects, right?
> > >>
> > >> [additional item -- maybe falls under #4] Agree on general features
> > >>and characteristics of the framework. Some examples (note: I'm not
> > >>assuming everyone would agree to these particular ones :) ):
> > >>- support entities that are flow controllers as first class
> > >>citizens
> > >>- support the association of per-user state with a flow controller
> > >>- allow Java 5 annotations as a way to configure controllers
> > >>- provide a fast no-redeploy iterative dev experience
> > >>
> > >> [additional item -- maybe falls under #4] Mock up some files/
> > >>artifacts
> > >>as the user would see/write them. Like what Don did early on in Ti
> > >>(http://wiki.apache.org/struts/StrutsTi/ControllerMock ).
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>4) Now for the hard part: map out a technical implementation.
> > >>>
> > >>>5) Release and re-establish Java as the place to build web
> > >>>applications. I hope for this to happen within 8-12 months time,
> > >>>starting today.
> > >>>
> > >>>So here are my ideal set of rules. Please adjust as you see fit:
> > >>>
> > >>> - Above all else, we recognize that consolidation is the overriding
> > >>>goal.
> > >>> - We recognize that we'll all have to compromise on items we are
> > >>>passionate about, but that the overall project success is more
> > >>>important.
> > >>> - This project aims to unify WebWork, Struts, Spring MVC, Beehive,
> > >>>and Spring WebFlow in to a single project that establishes clear
> > >>>leadership in the web development space.
> > >>> - All project leaders understand that once this project is
> > >>>releases,
> > >>>future work their own projects should cease (other than supporting
> > >>>it, minor releases, migration path to Clarity, etc).
> > >>> - Technical disputes should be coordinated by those _least_
> > >>>familiar
> > >>>with the topic, and therefore least biased.
> > >>> - When criticizing or proposing alternatives or otherwise "stopping
> > >>>forward progress" - we promise to ask ourselves if this issue we're
> > >>>about to raise is really "worth it".
> > >>> - We recognize that not everyone works the way we do and we
> > >>>understand that we may have to work hard to find common ground.
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >> The rules... I agree, for us to succeed, we need these. We'll all
> > >>have to take as a prime goal compromise/progress over dogma. My main
> > >>comment is about consolidation and ceasing development on the ancestor
> > >>projects. Beehive has components that I assume are far outside the
> > >>mission of Clarity (e.g., JSR 181 Web Services Metadata
> > >>implementation). Just want to make sure we're not trumpeting the
> > >>death
> > >>of entire frameworks that don't overlap. Relatedly, I feel that the
> > >>cease-development clause should go something like this:
> > >>"... will cease developing features that overlap with features
> > >>in Clarity."
> > >>It's clearly not in the interest of any project to keep plugging
> > >>along with a redundant framework (c'mon, how can you compete with
> > >>Clarity? :) ), but I imagine that many features will fall outside the
> > >>scope of what's done here.
> > >>
> > >>A final question: would people agree that we should start core/focused
> > >>(e.g., controller tier, view agnostic, not trying to define an entire
> > >>stack)? Seems like this is something that would help us move forward
> > >>more quickly, and would prevent us from trying to make too many leaf
> > >>nodes part of the trunk.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>So what's next? Let's nail down the rules and then move on to a
> > >>>mission statement that we can announce. Remember: once we announce
> > >>>this, there's no going back, so let's spend some time on the rules
> > >>>and the mission statement. For now, please email back and forth any
> > >>>edits/additions to the rules.
> > >>>
> > >>>This is really exciting! Sorry for the long email and the (likely
> > >>>very) bureaucratic approach I'm taking with this -- I hope it adds
> > >>>some value.
> > >>>
> > >>>Patrick
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >>Exciting stuff!
> > >>
> > >>Rich
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -
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> >
> >
> >
> >
>
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"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
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on here without making at least a cursory check. Anyway, your
suggestion is clearly mistaken.
On 8/25/05, David Durham <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Dakota Jack wrote:
> > First, comparing Struts and JSF is like comparing C++ and Visual
> > Basic. Struts is REQUEST-DRIVEN
s done, the volunteers might decide to continue work under the Struts
> repository, or somewhere else. But, whatever they decide, the decision
> will be driven by the simple question: Where will we find other
> volunteers to help?
>
> -Ted
>
> -----
son and many others. But, that should be a start to
> > think about, Dave.
>
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--
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its bac
Rod Johnson and many others. But, that should be a start to think about, Dave.
On 8/23/05, David Durham <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Dakota Jack wrote:
> > That would be, James, not Dakota but the list. This is the most
> > unusual committer nomination I have ever seen. J
>
> --
> James Mitchell
> Software Engineer / Open Source Evangelist
> Consulting / Mentoring / Freelance
> EdgeTech, Inc.
> http://www.edgetechservices.net/
> 678.910.8017
> AIM: jmitchtx
> Yahoo: jmitchtx
> MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Skype: jmitchtx
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>
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"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
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~Dakota Jack~
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g
> code diffs :-).
>
> PMC vote: 4 +1
>
> Craig
>
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