Great Leap

[Jeff Schweiner]

Murray,

We upgraded in April 08 and use unstructured FM only.  Had a few initial
problems with FM8 crashing (once a day).  New patches seems to have
taken care of that, I don't even remember my last crash.  Just make sure
you get all the patches.

The FM8 User Guide tells you to round trip to mif if opening files older
than FM7.  I did this as a precautionary.

Couple of additional changes/improvements:

* Vista and Office 2007 compatible (FM6 was Office 2000 I believe)  Much
better Word filter.
* Ability to lock master page usage to paragraph tags (great for locking
wide tables to landscape pages)
* Option to display a Tab bar (similar to a Tab bar in a web browser)
* Can embed 3D flash
* While the Undo History is an improvement over the single Undo in FM6,
I was a little disappointed that actions such as saving a file clear the
Undo history.  As Dave mentioned, you get a warning that can be turned
off.
* My mouse scroll wheel didn't work in FM6, but works in FM8.

Bottom line, we're very happy with the upgrade.

--
Jeff Schweiner
Hardware Engineering Writer
Cray Inc.
(715) 726-4801


From: Dave Reynolds [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Great Leap
To: Murray Moore [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=ISO-8859-1

Hi Murray

We also upgraded from FM6 to FM8 (on Win XP and 2000).  I don't remember

encountering any problems.  I tested FM8 for our Tech Pubs group, and I 
made the following notes about what I noticed was different: 

* The Page Up and Page Down keys move the file up or down by one
  screen, not by one page. If you don't like this you can use the
  customui.cfg file to change it.
* The Print  PDF Setup dialog has more options.
*  Document Info (for a PDF file) is no longer set from the Print
PDF Setup dialog. To enter Document Info in FM8:
  o from an open file select File  File Info
  o from a book select the file(s) and select File  File info,
or right click on the selected file(s) and select File Info.
* When selecting a font from the drop-down list in Paragraph
  Designer  Default Font  Family, you get a pop-up showing the
  font name in that font.
* The file names in the book window are in a smaller font, or else
  they just look smaller because they're not bold anymore.
* The page background in an open file now picks up the Window
  background colour from your Windows colour scheme.
* The tool bar icons are slightly different.
* If you get sick of the Undo history will be lost warning popping
  up every time you close and save a file, you can turn it off in
  File  Preferences  General.

I don't think you will have any problems, but you should probably do 
some testing first.

Cheers

Dave

Murray Moore wrote, on 2/12/2008 7:53 a.m.:
 I have an opportunity to leap several versions and upgrade from FM 6
to FM 8.

 My manager wants to know Do you see any issues migrating to 8 - it is
 seamless? All our old files are compatible?

 Any gotchas about which to beware?

 /\/\
 Murray
___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

FILENAME markers for mid-topic IDs

[Olga Klenner]

Hello,

Tools: FM 7.0, WWP 2003

We use filename markers in FM  to generate context-sensitive help with 
WWP.
How can I create a filename marker for a mid-topic ID?

e.g. 
Help page is  About.html = FILENAME marker input is About. This is 
easy.
But: Help page is Options.html#General = what do I have to enter into 
the FILENAME marker? If I type Options#General into the FILENAME marker 
a page is created called Options#General.html which in not what is 
needed.

Does any one use this funtion?

Best regards,
Olga 


Olga Klenner
Technical Writer
Utimaco Safeware AG  - A member of the Sophos Group
Elektrastrasse 6a
DE-81925 München
Phone: +49 89 992881 - 117
FAX: +49 89 992881 - 200
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.utimaco.com

___

Registergericht Bad Homburg HRB 5302
WEEE-Reg.Nr.: DE39805015
Sitz: Oberursel
Vorstandsmitglieder: Martin Wülfert (Vorsitzender),Christian Bohne, Malte 
Pollmann, Olaf Siemens
Aufsichtsratsvorsitzender: Dr. Peter Lammer
___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[Les Winberg]

Hello Framers

 

I recently started a new job, 2 days ago, and I noticed that a document I
was given is Standard FM but has Structured FM selected in the Preferences.
My boss told me it was OK but I think it could cause a problem.

 

I am too new to push it. We are working on a small book.

 

Are there any serious problems with this??

 

Thanks

 

Les Winberg

 

___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Re: Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[Rick Quatro]

Hi Les,

This is no problem whatsoever. If you don't like it, simply change it in the 
Preferences, restart FrameMaker and away you go. You can always change it 
back.

Rick Quatro
Carmen Publishing Inc
585-659-8267
www.frameexpert.com


 Hello Framers



 I recently started a new job, 2 days ago, and I noticed that a document I
 was given is Standard FM but has Structured FM selected in the 
 Preferences.
 My boss told me it was OK but I think it could cause a problem.



 I am too new to push it. We are working on a small book.



 Are there any serious problems with this??



 Thanks



 Les Winberg

___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Re: Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[David Spreadbury]

Les,
You shouldn't encounter any problems working in an Unstructured (Standard) FM 
document while FrameMaker is set for Structured.
 
Obviously, you won't be able to use any of the Structured features while 
editing an Unstructured document, i.e., Structured View, Element Catalog won't 
display anything.

--- On Wed, 12/3/08, Les Winberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

From: Les Winberg [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Structured and Standard FM 7.2
To: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Date: Wednesday, December 3, 2008, 3:29 PM

Hello Framers

 

I recently started a new job, 2 days ago, and I noticed that a document I
was given is Standard FM but has Structured FM selected in the Preferences.
My boss told me it was OK but I think it could cause a problem.

 

I am too new to push it. We are working on a small book.

 

Are there any serious problems with this??

 

Thanks

 

Les Winberg

 

___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/dspreadb%40yahoo.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.



  
___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

IXGen with Structured FrameMaker

[Indira Rimkeit]

Hi Jennifer,

We also used IXGen for editing indexes before we moved to structure, but found 
that is doesn't work with structured markers. You could ask the developer, 
Frank Stearns http://www.fsatools.com/, if he now has plans to support them, 
but as far as I know, he doesn't.

Rick Quatro created a FrameScript for us to replace the IXGen functionality to 
generate a list of markers that you can edit and update, which works with 
structured markers.

Indira Rimkeit
Technical Publications
Redback Networks, an Ericsson company


Jennifer Collier [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
11/28/2008 07:49 PM

To
framers@lists.frameusers.com
cc

Subject
IXgen with Structured FrameMaker?






Does anyone out there have experience using IXgen with Structured
FrameMaker? We are currently using FrameMaker 6.0 (unstructured). We're
in the process of moving to FrameMaker 8 (structured). We want to make
sure as we begin using IXgen to index our documents, we do it the best
way for making it work with structured. I know IXgen doesn't officially
work with structure but we've been told that there are people that are
making it work well. Any tips, guidelines, or processes I should be
following? Thanks for all the help in advance!



Jen Collier

___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

RE: Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[Fred Ridder]

Les Winberg wrote: I recently started a new job, 2 days ago, and I noticed 
that a document I
 was given is Standard FM but has Structured FM selected in the Preferences.
 My boss told me it was OK but I think it could cause a problem.
 
Note that the Preferences apply on a per-user basis rather than a per-file 
basis.
The Preferences settings get written into the secondary maker.ini file that is
in your user directory and are read each time you launch FrameMaker.  In 
other words, it's actualy your installation that is set to open with the 
structured
user interface as the default rather than any property that is set in the file. 
And as others have noted, having the structured interface as the default does 
not preclude you from working normally with non-structured files.
 
-Fred Ridder
___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Mif2Go FM template import: flags issue

[Jim Owens]

I'm importing a template in a Mif2Go project, with the flags set to 128 
to import cross-reference formats only.

For the first two chapters of the book, this works fine. FM variable 
values are not imported from the template, as expected. For the rest of 
the book, variable values are imported from the template, even though 
the flag for them is not set in the config file. The document name in my 
HTML topics changes from Administrator's Guide in the first few topics 
to Document Name, the generic value from the template, in the rest of 
the topics.

I see this behaviour for only one of our books. The Operator's Guide 
doesn't have this problem.

Has anyone else seen anything like this?





___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Re: Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[Klaus Mueller]

Les, David, Rick,

 You shouldn't encounter any problems working in an
 Unstructured (Standard) FM document while FrameMaker
 is set for Structured.

 This is no problem whatsoever.

Actually, I regularly encounter an annoying problem when
working with unstructured documents while FrameMaker is
set for Structured:
When saving unstructured documents with structured FM
as MIF and those MIFs are opened in unstructured FM,
the Document is Structured error message does occur.

You can reproduce this the following way:
- Start FM in structured mode
- Create  save a new document
- Create  save a new book
- Add the document to the book
- Update the book
- Save the document as MIF
- Change the FM product interface to (unstructured) FrameMaker
- Restart FrameMaker
- Open the saved MIF file
= The follwing message does occur

  This document contains structure information.
  The current interface does not read structure information.
  If you continue, the structure information will be
  removed. Editing and saving this document may result
  in a loss of information. [...]
  Options:
  (•) Open as View Only
  ( ) Open for Editing
  [Continue]   [Cancel]

If multiple people (with differently set FM structure modes)
are working with such documents, this can be pretty annoying,
because it is not obvious that this error message is
inaccurate and the document is actually unstructured.

A 'usual' workflow in a translation environment:
- Person A does a quality check of the documents to translate
  (with structured FM) and saves the docs as MIF.
- After translation into multiple languages, the layout
  persons B, C and D are irritated because they get those
  error messages.

The error message is caused by the DBookElementHierarchy /
ElementContext entries in the Document node that are
written into the MIF file.

When saving documents with FrameScript as MIF, there is
unfortunately no option to strip/suppress this gratuitous
structure information.

Kind regards,
Klaus Müller, itl AG


--- Original Message ---
From: David Spreadbury
Date: 04.12.2008 16:57
 Les,
 You shouldn't encounter any problems working in an Unstructured (Standard) FM 
 document while FrameMaker is set for Structured.
  
 Obviously, you won't be able to use any of the Structured features while 
 editing an Unstructured document, i.e., Structured View, Element Catalog 
 won't display anything.
___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Re: IXGen with Structured FrameMaker

[Scott Prentice]

Hi...

Our plugin MarkerTools, supports structured markers. It is in no way a 
replacement for IXGen, but it does provide a number of similar features, 
as well as many other useful features.

http://leximation.com/tools/info/markertools.php

Cheers,

...scott

Scott Prentice
Leximation, Inc.
www.leximation.com
+1.415.485.1892



Indira Rimkeit wrote:
 Hi Jennifer,

 We also used IXGen for editing indexes before we moved to structure, but 
 found that is doesn't work with structured markers. You could ask the 
 developer, Frank Stearns http://www.fsatools.com/, if he now has plans to 
 support them, but as far as I know, he doesn't.

 Rick Quatro created a FrameScript for us to replace the IXGen functionality 
 to generate a list of markers that you can edit and update, which works with 
 structured markers.

 Indira Rimkeit
 Technical Publications
 Redback Networks, an Ericsson company


 Jennifer Collier  
 Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 11/28/2008 07:49 PM

 To
 framers@lists.frameusers.com
 cc

 Subject
 IXgen with Structured FrameMaker?






 Does anyone out there have experience using IXgen with Structured
 FrameMaker? We are currently using FrameMaker 6.0 (unstructured). We're
 in the process of moving to FrameMaker 8 (structured). We want to make
 sure as we begin using IXgen to index our documents, we do it the best
 way for making it work with structured. I know IXgen doesn't officially
 work with structure but we've been told that there are people that are
 making it work well. Any tips, guidelines, or processes I should be
 following? Thanks for all the help in advance!



 Jen Collier


   
___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Re: Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[Rick Quatro]

Hi Klaus,

Thanks for the information. I wasn't aware of these problems.

Rick

Rick Quatro
Carmen Publishing Inc
585-659-8267
www.frameexpert.com


Les, David, Rick,

 You shouldn't encounter any problems working in an
 Unstructured (Standard) FM document while FrameMaker
 is set for Structured.

 This is no problem whatsoever.

Actually, I regularly encounter an annoying problem when
working with unstructured documents while FrameMaker is
set for Structured:
When saving unstructured documents with structured FM
as MIF and those MIFs are opened in unstructured FM,
the Document is Structured error message does occur.

You can reproduce this the following way:
- Start FM in structured mode
- Create  save a new document
- Create  save a new book
- Add the document to the book
- Update the book
- Save the document as MIF
- Change the FM product interface to (unstructured) FrameMaker
- Restart FrameMaker
- Open the saved MIF file
= The follwing message does occur

  This document contains structure information.
  The current interface does not read structure information.
  If you continue, the structure information will be
  removed. Editing and saving this document may result
  in a loss of information. [...]
  Options:
  (•) Open as View Only
  ( ) Open for Editing
  [Continue]   [Cancel]

If multiple people (with differently set FM structure modes)
are working with such documents, this can be pretty annoying,
because it is not obvious that this error message is
inaccurate and the document is actually unstructured.

A 'usual' workflow in a translation environment:
- Person A does a quality check of the documents to translate
  (with structured FM) and saves the docs as MIF.
- After translation into multiple languages, the layout
  persons B, C and D are irritated because they get those
  error messages.

The error message is caused by the DBookElementHierarchy /
ElementContext entries in the Document node that are
written into the MIF file.

When saving documents with FrameScript as MIF, there is
unfortunately no option to strip/suppress this gratuitous
structure information.

Kind regards,
Klaus Müller, itl AG

___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Re: Layoffs and Frame 9?

[Alan Houser]

This morning I spoke with Adobe's Group Product Manager for the 
Technical Communication Suite, FrameMaker, and Robohelp. With his 
permission, I can say that the development teams for these products were 
not affected by yesterday's Adobe announcement.

Adobe's historical release cycle of approximately 18 months is 
documented elsewhere. FrameMaker 8 was released in July 2007. RoboHelp 7 
and Adobe Technical Communication Suite were released in October 2007.

-Alan
---

Alan Houser, President
Group Wellesley, Inc.
412-363-3481
www.groupwellesley.com


___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Re: Merged project

[Art Campbell]

This probably isn't the kind of advice that you're hoping to get, but
the way that you're setting stuff up is so far from the standard way
that FM and RH work that you're way off the edge.

As you probably know, the normal way to work, and the way the programs
work best, is to build a book in FM that contains all the chapter
files. IF... it really takes forever to update files and that's your
reason for not using a standard workflow, that would tell me that
there's something wrong with your setup. I know that I'm working on
several books with 500-600 pages and all the files are on a server...
and it takes maybe 2-3 minutes to update all insets, graphics, and
generate the TOC and Index. Which I can live with.

Your note that the system fails when you try to work correctly is
another key that you've got basic system or configuration problems.
Normal work doesn't cause systems to fail.

So the right direction would be to find and fix the underlying
problem, rather than look for additional kludges. Which would involve
supplying a lot more details about your system, RAM, free space,
network config and so on...

Art


Art Campbell
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  ... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52
Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson
  No disclaimers apply.
   DoD 358



On Wed, Dec 3, 2008 at 5:57 PM, Judy Bragg [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I'm using Tech. Comm. Suite ( FM8 ver. 8.0p277  RH7 ver. 7.02.001) to 
 generate multiple user manuals (a full manual and 3 quickstarts) as well as 
 CHM Help files.  (Windows XP SP3 if it matters.)
 The manual has 10 chapters, each in its own FM book, complete with TOC and 
 IX.  All chapters are added to RH by reference and each is compiled to a CHM. 
  So far so good!
 The problem comes when I try to merge them.  The TOC is OK, but the Index is 
 wrong.
 Here's what I did:
 I used the first chapter as the master and merged the other 9 onto the end of 
 it.  (In the ch. 1 TOC, I clicked the New Merged Project icon and added the 
 ch. 2 chm.  Repeat the process for chapters 3-10.)  In the HTML Single Source 
 Layout, I used the merged TOC...what should I do with the IX field?
 I tried adding IX placeholders to the end of the ch 1 IX, but the result was 
 10 catenated IX files.   They don't merge.
 Theoretically, I suppose I could generate the full manual in 1 FM book and 
 reference it in RH, but it takes forever to update that many files and I've 
 noticed the system tends to fail one way or another when I attempt to do too 
 much.  Also, I have to produce a modular system patterned after the previous 
 one.  Changing the help calls in the numerous program modules of our software 
 would be our last resort at this point. This way I can do 1 chapter at a time 
 and the TOC's  are easily updated from the FM file.  Now if I can just get 
 the index to merge...
 Can anyone please steer me in the right direction?  I would be forever 
 grateful!
 Judy Bragg
 Technical Writer
 Hypack, Inc.

 ___


 You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 To unsubscribe send a blank email to
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 or visit 
 http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail.com

 Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
 http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.


___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Re: Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[David Spreadbury]

Klaus,
 
Like Rick, I was not aware of these issues. Very good information. Thanks for 
the heads-up on these issues.

--- On Thu, 12/4/08, Rick Quatro [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

From: Rick Quatro [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Structured and Standard FM 7.2
To: Klaus Mueller [EMAIL PROTECTED], Framers List [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Thursday, December 4, 2008, 12:00 PM

Hi Klaus,

Thanks for the information. I wasn't aware of these problems.

Rick

Rick Quatro
Carmen Publishing Inc
585-659-8267
www.frameexpert.com


Les, David, Rick,

 You shouldn't encounter any problems working in an
 Unstructured (Standard) FM document while FrameMaker
 is set for Structured.

 This is no problem whatsoever.

Actually, I regularly encounter an annoying problem when
working with unstructured documents while FrameMaker is
set for Structured:
When saving unstructured documents with structured FM
as MIF and those MIFs are opened in unstructured FM,
the Document is Structured error message does occur.

You can reproduce this the following way:
- Start FM in structured mode
- Create  save a new document
- Create  save a new book
- Add the document to the book
- Update the book
- Save the document as MIF
- Change the FM product interface to (unstructured) FrameMaker
- Restart FrameMaker
- Open the saved MIF file
= The follwing message does occur

  This document contains structure information.
  The current interface does not read structure information.
  If you continue, the structure information will be
  removed. Editing and saving this document may result
  in a loss of information. [...]
  Options:
  (•) Open as View Only
  ( ) Open for Editing
  [Continue]   [Cancel]

If multiple people (with differently set FM structure modes)
are working with such documents, this can be pretty annoying,
because it is not obvious that this error message is
inaccurate and the document is actually unstructured.

A 'usual' workflow in a translation environment:
- Person A does a quality check of the documents to translate
  (with structured FM) and saves the docs as MIF.
- After translation into multiple languages, the layout
  persons B, C and D are irritated because they get those
  error messages.

The error message is caused by the DBookElementHierarchy /
ElementContext entries in the Document node that are
written into the MIF file.

When saving documents with FrameScript as MIF, there is
unfortunately no option to strip/suppress this gratuitous
structure information.

Kind regards,
Klaus Müller, itl AG

___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/dspreadb%40yahoo.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.



  
___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source

[Duncan, Gary]

Hi everyone,

 

We create PDFs from Frame sources and include PDF bookmarks for chapter
titles and headings. We also include a book mark for the TOC. The
problem I am seeing (and have seen before but can't remember how I fixed
it) is that the Contents book mark is expandable. It includes all of
the chapter titles and when you click on a chapter title, it takes you
to that spot in the TOC. This is redundant and not useful since the
chapter titles are listed as book marks under the Contents bookmark.

 

For example, we include:

 

ChapTitle

ChapTitleNoNum

H1

H2

TOCTitle

 

with appropriate indenting.

 

The bookmark that results from including TOCTitle is Contents which
also includes the chapter titles in the contents. (As you know, the text
of the chapter title in the TOC would be tagged ChapTitleTOC.)

 

It is easy enough to remove the unneeded entries in the PDF after it is
generated, but I know there is a fix.

 

Can anyone help?

 

Thank you very much...

 

Gary

___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

RE: FILENAME markers for mid-topic IDs

[Combs, Richard]

Olga Klenner wrote:
 
 We use filename markers in FM  to generate context-sensitive help with
 WWP.
 How can I create a filename marker for a mid-topic ID?
 
 e.g.
 Help page is  About.html = FILENAME marker input is About. This
is
 easy.
 But: Help page is Options.html#General = what do I have to enter
into
 the FILENAME marker? If I type Options#General into the FILENAME
marker
 a page is created called Options#General.html which in not what is
 needed.

I recently needed to do something like that in ePublisher Pro 9.2. The
solution there was to insert TopicAlias markers, not Filename markers,
in FM. 

In ePP, the TopicAlias marker type is set to a value of Topic alias.
Since I started from an existing FM/ePP project, I'm not sure if someone
had to set this up manually or it's there by default.

I still have a minor annoyance, though (and maybe some WebWorks guru can
straighten me out). Although ePP obediently inserts an anchor tag in the
HTML where the TopicAlias marker was, the anchor's name attribute is a
numeric value instead of my marker text. 

In the application's onlinehelp.props file, which provides the
context-sensitive help mapping, I'd much rather specify the topic as,
say, Options.html#General instead of Options.html#123456. Is there a
simple way to tell ePP to use the marker text for the anchor name? 

Richard


Richard G. Combs
Senior Technical Writer
Polycom, Inc.
richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom
303-223-5111
--
rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom
303-777-0436
--





___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Re: Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[Klaus Mueller]

Hello Framers,

Maybe someone of the FM9 beta participants could check
this issue with the current version?
(FM8 Structured does also write those structured book
component information into unstructured MIF documents.)

Thanks,
Klaus



--- Original Message ---
From: Rick Quatro
Date: 04.12.2008 19:00
 Hi Klaus,
 
 Thanks for the information. I wasn't aware of these problems.
 
 Rick
 
 Rick Quatro
 Carmen Publishing Inc
 585-659-8267
 www.frameexpert.com
 
 
 Les, David, Rick,
 
 You shouldn't encounter any problems working in an
 Unstructured (Standard) FM document while FrameMaker
 is set for Structured.
 
 This is no problem whatsoever.
 
 Actually, I regularly encounter an annoying problem when
 working with unstructured documents while FrameMaker is
 set for Structured:
 When saving unstructured documents with structured FM
 as MIF and those MIFs are opened in unstructured FM,
 the Document is Structured error message does occur.
 
 You can reproduce this the following way:
 - Start FM in structured mode
 - Create  save a new document
 - Create  save a new book
 - Add the document to the book
 - Update the book
 - Save the document as MIF
 - Change the FM product interface to (unstructured) FrameMaker
 - Restart FrameMaker
 - Open the saved MIF file
 = The follwing message does occur
 
  This document contains structure information.
  The current interface does not read structure information.
  If you continue, the structure information will be
  removed. Editing and saving this document may result
  in a loss of information. [...]
  Options:
  (•) Open as View Only
  ( ) Open for Editing
  [Continue]   [Cancel]
 
 If multiple people (with differently set FM structure modes)
 are working with such documents, this can be pretty annoying,
 because it is not obvious that this error message is
 inaccurate and the document is actually unstructured.
 
 A 'usual' workflow in a translation environment:
 - Person A does a quality check of the documents to translate
   (with structured FM) and saves the docs as MIF.
 - After translation into multiple languages, the layout
   persons B, C and D are irritated because they get those
   error messages.
 
 The error message is caused by the DBookElementHierarchy /
 ElementContext entries in the Document node that are
 written into the MIF file.
 
 When saving documents with FrameScript as MIF, there is
 unfortunately no option to strip/suppress this gratuitous
 structure information.
 
 Kind regards,
 Klaus Müller, itl AG

___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Re: PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source

[Art Campbell]

What version FM and Acrobat are you using?

And... where did the list of included headings come from? Did you copy
it from the Book's PDF Setup Window, or somewhere else?

Art

Art Campbell
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  ... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52
Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson
  No disclaimers apply.
   DoD 358



On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 1:54 PM, Duncan, Gary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hi everyone,



 We create PDFs from Frame sources and include PDF bookmarks for chapter
 titles and headings. We also include a book mark for the TOC. The
 problem I am seeing (and have seen before but can't remember how I fixed
 it) is that the Contents book mark is expandable. It includes all of
 the chapter titles and when you click on a chapter title, it takes you
 to that spot in the TOC. This is redundant and not useful since the
 chapter titles are listed as book marks under the Contents bookmark.



 For example, we include:



 ChapTitle

 ChapTitleNoNum

 H1

 H2

 TOCTitle



 with appropriate indenting.



 The bookmark that results from including TOCTitle is Contents which
 also includes the chapter titles in the contents. (As you know, the text
 of the chapter title in the TOC would be tagged ChapTitleTOC.)



 It is easy enough to remove the unneeded entries in the PDF after it is
 generated, but I know there is a fix.



 Can anyone help?



 Thank you very much...



 Gary

 ___


 You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 To unsubscribe send a blank email to
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 or visit 
 http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail.com

 Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
 http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Re: PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source

[quills]

Don't include the *TOC tags in your generation of PDFs. You can 
choose which ones during your setup for PDF markers to include or 
exclude.

Scott

At 1:54 PM -0500 12/4/08, Duncan, Gary wrote:
Hi everyone,



We create PDFs from Frame sources and include PDF bookmarks for chapter
titles and headings. We also include a book mark for the TOC. The
problem I am seeing (and have seen before but can't remember how I fixed
it) is that the Contents book mark is expandable. It includes all of
the chapter titles and when you click on a chapter title, it takes you
to that spot in the TOC. This is redundant and not useful since the
chapter titles are listed as book marks under the Contents bookmark.



For example, we include:



ChapTitle

ChapTitleNoNum

H1

H2

TOCTitle



with appropriate indenting.



The bookmark that results from including TOCTitle is Contents which
also includes the chapter titles in the contents. (As you know, the text
of the chapter title in the TOC would be tagged ChapTitleTOC.)



It is easy enough to remove the unneeded entries in the PDF after it is
generated, but I know there is a fix.



Can anyone help?



Thank you very much...



Gary
___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

RE: PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source

[Duncan, Gary]

Hi Art,

I am using Frame version 7.1p116, and Acrobat version 7.0.5.

I selected the bookmarks in PDF Setup from the Frame Print Document
dialog. I have triple-checked that I did not include the tags appended
with TOC that are created in the Frame TOC.

Gary

-Original Message-
From: Art Campbell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2008 2:07 PM
To: Duncan, Gary
Cc: framers@lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Re: PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source

What version FM and Acrobat are you using?

And... where did the list of included headings come from? Did you copy
it from the Book's PDF Setup Window, or somewhere else?

Art

Art Campbell
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  ... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52
Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson
  No disclaimers
apply.
   DoD 358



On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 1:54 PM, Duncan, Gary [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
 Hi everyone,



 We create PDFs from Frame sources and include PDF bookmarks for
chapter
 titles and headings. We also include a book mark for the TOC. The
 problem I am seeing (and have seen before but can't remember how I
fixed
 it) is that the Contents book mark is expandable. It includes all of
 the chapter titles and when you click on a chapter title, it takes you
 to that spot in the TOC. This is redundant and not useful since the
 chapter titles are listed as book marks under the Contents bookmark.



 For example, we include:



 ChapTitle

 ChapTitleNoNum

 H1

 H2

 TOCTitle



 with appropriate indenting.



 The bookmark that results from including TOCTitle is Contents which
 also includes the chapter titles in the contents. (As you know, the
text
 of the chapter title in the TOC would be tagged ChapTitleTOC.)



 It is easy enough to remove the unneeded entries in the PDF after it
is
 generated, but I know there is a fix.



 Can anyone help?



 Thank you very much...



 Gary

 ___


 You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 To unsubscribe send a blank email to
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 or visit
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail
.com

 Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
 http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Re: Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[Art Campbell]

Well,

I'd venture the minority opinion that I'd rather have the warning
messages display, even if they're a false warning... If I'm opening a
new document, I'd much rather know that I may be blowing away
structured info (the warning appears when you're opening a correctly
structured doc too, as far as I know) before I do it.

And... I think a key statement is: If multiple people (with
differently set FM structure modes) are working with such documents, 
-- in most production environments, including those that include
routine translation, there should be tight enough control that only
one flavor of a program (in this case, the structured interface of FM
is in use).

Art


Art Campbell
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  ... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52
Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson
  No disclaimers apply.
   DoD 358



On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 2:02 PM, Klaus Mueller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hello Framers,

 Maybe someone of the FM9 beta participants could check
 this issue with the current version?
 (FM8 Structured does also write those structured book
 component information into unstructured MIF documents.)

 Thanks,
 Klaus



 --- Original Message ---
 From: Rick Quatro
 Date: 04.12.2008 19:00
 Hi Klaus,

 Thanks for the information. I wasn't aware of these problems.

 Rick

 Rick Quatro
 Carmen Publishing Inc
 585-659-8267
 www.frameexpert.com


 Les, David, Rick,

 You shouldn't encounter any problems working in an
 Unstructured (Standard) FM document while FrameMaker
 is set for Structured.

 This is no problem whatsoever.

 Actually, I regularly encounter an annoying problem when
 working with unstructured documents while FrameMaker is
 set for Structured:
 When saving unstructured documents with structured FM
 as MIF and those MIFs are opened in unstructured FM,
 the Document is Structured error message does occur.

 You can reproduce this the following way:
 - Start FM in structured mode
 - Create  save a new document
 - Create  save a new book
 - Add the document to the book
 - Update the book
 - Save the document as MIF
 - Change the FM product interface to (unstructured) FrameMaker
 - Restart FrameMaker
 - Open the saved MIF file
 = The follwing message does occur

  This document contains structure information.
  The current interface does not read structure information.
  If you continue, the structure information will be
  removed. Editing and saving this document may result
  in a loss of information. [...]
  Options:
  (•) Open as View Only
  ( ) Open for Editing
  [Continue]   [Cancel]

 If multiple people (with differently set FM structure modes)
 are working with such documents, this can be pretty annoying,
 because it is not obvious that this error message is
 inaccurate and the document is actually unstructured.

 A 'usual' workflow in a translation environment:
 - Person A does a quality check of the documents to translate
   (with structured FM) and saves the docs as MIF.
 - After translation into multiple languages, the layout
   persons B, C and D are irritated because they get those
   error messages.

 The error message is caused by the DBookElementHierarchy /
 ElementContext entries in the Document node that are
 written into the MIF file.

 When saving documents with FrameScript as MIF, there is
 unfortunately no option to strip/suppress this gratuitous
 structure information.

 Kind regards,
 Klaus Müller, itl AG

 ___


 You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 To unsubscribe send a blank email to
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 or visit 
 http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail.com

 Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
 http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Re: PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source

[Art Campbell]

Gary,

Was the PDF Setup Bookmark window you used from the Print  Book File,
or from the TOC's? The Book File should rule, but it may be worth
checking both of them, to ensure that the correct settings aren't
being corrupted somehow.

If the settings match, one quick thing you could try... create a new
book file in FM, and copy in the files from the original book file.
Then print from the new book file -- you'll need to create a new set
up for it, and you can do it step by step, starting with just the
Chapter and TOC title tags. If that works, add the H1s, and then the
H2s.

Art

Art Campbell
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  ... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52
Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson
  No disclaimers apply.
   DoD 358



On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 2:13 PM, Duncan, Gary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hi Art,

 I am using Frame version 7.1p116, and Acrobat version 7.0.5.

 I selected the bookmarks in PDF Setup from the Frame Print Document
 dialog. I have triple-checked that I did not include the tags appended
 with TOC that are created in the Frame TOC.

 Gary

 -Original Message-
 From: Art Campbell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2008 2:07 PM
 To: Duncan, Gary
 Cc: framers@lists.frameusers.com
 Subject: Re: PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source

 What version FM and Acrobat are you using?

 And... where did the list of included headings come from? Did you copy
 it from the Book's PDF Setup Window, or somewhere else?

 Art

 Art Campbell
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  ... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52
 Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson
  No disclaimers
 apply.
   DoD 358



 On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 1:54 PM, Duncan, Gary [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:
 Hi everyone,



 We create PDFs from Frame sources and include PDF bookmarks for
 chapter
 titles and headings. We also include a book mark for the TOC. The
 problem I am seeing (and have seen before but can't remember how I
 fixed
 it) is that the Contents book mark is expandable. It includes all of
 the chapter titles and when you click on a chapter title, it takes you
 to that spot in the TOC. This is redundant and not useful since the
 chapter titles are listed as book marks under the Contents bookmark.



 For example, we include:



 ChapTitle

 ChapTitleNoNum

 H1

 H2

 TOCTitle



 with appropriate indenting.



 The bookmark that results from including TOCTitle is Contents which
 also includes the chapter titles in the contents. (As you know, the
 text
 of the chapter title in the TOC would be tagged ChapTitleTOC.)



 It is easy enough to remove the unneeded entries in the PDF after it
 is
 generated, but I know there is a fix.



 Can anyone help?



 Thank you very much...



 Gary

 ___


 You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 To unsubscribe send a blank email to
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 or visit
 http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail
 .com

 Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
 http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.


___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

RE: PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source

[Fred Ridder]

Gary Duncan wrote:
 
 I selected the bookmarks in PDF Setup from the Frame Print Document
 dialog. I have triple-checked that I did not include the tags appended
 with TOC that are created in the Frame TOC.
 
An undocumented feature is that the PDF Setup paragraph lists are additive.
The book-level list specifies the baseline set of tags that will be picked up
as PDF bookmarks; but if any individual file in the book specifies additional
tags, those will be picked up in that file as well as the base set. So you 
need to look at the PDF Setup dialog for the TOC file itself. I'll bet you
that you find the ...TOC tags included in that PDF bookmark list.
 
-Fred Ridder
___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Re: Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[Klaus Mueller]

Hello Art,

I totally agree: When opening structured documents with
unstructured FrameMaker, a warning message should appear.

The only problem is that Structured FrameMaker does
unnecessarily and counterproductively write structure
information in unstructured documents when creating
MIF files which is causing unneeded error messages in
different workflows.

Kind regards,
Klaus


--- Original Message ---
From: Art Campbell
Date: 04.12.2008 20:21
 Well,
 
 I'd venture the minority opinion that I'd rather have the warning
 messages display, even if they're a false warning... If I'm opening a
 new document, I'd much rather know that I may be blowing away
 structured info (the warning appears when you're opening a correctly
 structured doc too, as far as I know) before I do it.
 
 And... I think a key statement is: If multiple people (with
 differently set FM structure modes) are working with such documents, 
 -- in most production environments, including those that include
 routine translation, there should be tight enough control that only
 one flavor of a program (in this case, the structured interface of FM
 is in use).
 
 Art
___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Cross reference links - Loss of color formatting

[Venkat]

Hello,

I was wonder if this problem can be solved.

I have a large amount of cross-references in my documents. I am using 2
formatting instructions

1. BlueItalic$paratextDefault ¶ Font
2. BlueItalicAppendix $paranum[Chapter Num],
Italic$paratextDefault ¶ Font

This cross-ref formats are used predominantly through the document.

The above formats are not applied in some cases and in most of the others it
is applied properly. I do update references every time. I do not get
consistent results.

What could be the issue and how can i solve this ?

Regards,
Venkatesh Parthasarathy,
Motorola Inc,
Bangalore.
---
First Do No Harm
---
___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Re: Cross reference links - Loss of color formatting

[Shlomo Perets]

Venkatesh,

You wrote:

I have a large amount of cross-references in my documents. I am using 2
formatting instructions

1. BlueItalic$paratextDefault ¶ Font
2. BlueItalicAppendix $paranum[Chapter Num],
Italic$paratextDefault ¶ Font

This cross-ref formats are used predominantly through the document.

The above formats are not applied in some cases and in most of the others it
is applied properly. I do update references every time. I do not get
consistent results.

What could be the issue and how can i solve this ?

When the cross-reference format uses multiple character formats, the book's 
Generate/Update function ignores the first one.
(This applies to FM5 through FM8).

Workaround: Create a single character format that has all the properties 
you need, and modify the cross-reference format accordingly.

For example: Define a Link character format that sets both blue and 
italic, and modify the cross-reference format to Link$paratext


Shlomo Perets

MicroType * http://www.microtype.com
FrameMaker training  consulting * FM-to-Acrobat TimeSavers

Improve Your FrameMaker Skills live web-based training sessions



___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
or visit 
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com

Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Layoffs and Frame 9?

[Alan Litchfield]

As I gaze deep into my crystal ball I see that Adobe's plans to release Frame
9 on the current planned date will not be met and the extension of time is
required to ensure quality is maintained. I see that some fixes to bugs found
in current and previous versions will be applied and called 'exciting new
features', but that new bugs will also be included to temper dangerous levels
of enthusiasm. And some selected bugs will be retained so that user forums can
be found to have justification for their existence.

Alan

John Hedtke wrote:
>
>
> Does anyone know if the Adobe layoffs are going to affect the release
> of Frame 9?  I'm still hoping that it'll fix the problems in Frame 8,
> so I'm very keen to see it happen.
>
> Yours truly,
>
> John Hedtke
> Author/Consultant/Contract Writer
> www.hedtke.com <-- website
> 541-685-5000 (office landline)
> 541-554-2189 (cell)
> john at hedtke.com (primary email)
> johnhedtke at aol.com (secondary email)
>
> ___
>
>
> You are currently subscribed to Framers as alan at alphabyte.co.nz.
>
> Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.
>
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to
> framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
> or visit
> http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/alan%40alphabyte.co.nz
>
> Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit
> http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
>


-- 
Alan Litchfield MBus (Hons), MNZCS
AlphaByte
PO Box 1941, Auckland
http://www.alphabyte.co.nz

RGB Color Definitions

[Jacob Schäffer]

See http://www.grafikhuset.net/publipdf/whitepaper_difficult_pdf_documents.html 
for an explanation.

Best regards / Med venlig hilsen
Jacob Sch?ffer  |  Chief Developer
Paradis All? 22, Raml?se
DK-3200 Helsinge, Denmark
Phone: +45 4439 4400
Email: js at grafikhuset.dk
Web: www.grafikhuset.net



> -Oprindelig meddelelse-
> Fra: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com 
> [mailto:framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com] P? vegne af Howard Rauch
> Sendt: 3. december 2008 22:02
> Til: framers at lists.frameusers.com
> Emne: RGB Color Definitions
> 
> 
> The individual files in a book have a varying number of RGB 
> color definitions. I want to delete those for several 
> reasons, one being that the printer wants only CMYK colors. 
> None of the RGB colors are used (that I know of), but every 
> time I try to delete an RGB color, Frame restores it again. 
> The only color used in my files is a spot color -- Pantone 
> 131. Does anyone have a suggestion for getting rid of the RGB colors?
> 
> FrameMaker 7.0p576; Windows XP Professional 
> 
> Howard Rauch
> 
> Technology Transfer, Inc.
> "Linking Creators and Users of Technology"
> 933 North 18th Street
> Manitowoc WI 54220
> Office: 920-682-1528
> Cell: 920-629-0080 ___
> 
> 
> You are currently subscribed to Framers as js at grafikhuset.dk.
> 
> Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.
> 
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
> framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
> or visit 
> http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/js%40grafi
khuset.dk

Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit 
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[Rick Quatro]

Hi Les,

This is no problem whatsoever. If you don't like it, simply change it in the 
Preferences, restart FrameMaker and away you go. You can always change it 
back.

Rick Quatro
Carmen Publishing Inc
585-659-8267
www.frameexpert.com


> Hello Framers
>
>
>
> I recently started a new job, 2 days ago, and I noticed that a document I
> was given is Standard FM but has Structured FM selected in the 
> Preferences.
> My boss told me it was OK but I think it could cause a problem.
>
>
>
> I am too new to push it. We are working on a small book.
>
>
>
> Are there any serious problems with this??
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
> Les Winberg

Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[David Spreadbury]

Les,
You shouldn't encounter any problems working in an Unstructured (Standard) FM 
document while FrameMaker is set for Structured.
?
Obviously, you won't be able to use any of the Structured features while 
editing an Unstructured document, i.e., Structured View, Element Catalog won't 
display anything.

--- On Wed, 12/3/08, Les Winberg  wrote:

From: Les Winberg 
Subject: Structured and Standard FM 7.2
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com
Date: Wednesday, December 3, 2008, 3:29 PM

Hello Framers



I recently started a new job, 2 days ago, and I noticed that a document I
was given is Standard FM but has Structured FM selected in the Preferences.
My boss told me it was OK but I think it could cause a problem.



I am too new to push it. We are working on a small book.



Are there any serious problems with this??



Thanks



Les Winberg



___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as dspreadb at yahoo.com.

Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
or visit
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/dspreadb%40yahoo.com

Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

IXGen with Structured FrameMaker

[Indira Rimkeit]

Hi Jennifer,

We also used IXGen for editing indexes before we moved to structure, but found 
that is doesn't work with structured markers. You could ask the developer, 
Frank Stearns http://www.fsatools.com/, if he now has plans to support them, 
but as far as I know, he doesn't.

Rick Quatro created a FrameScript for us to replace the IXGen functionality to 
generate a list of markers that you can edit and update, which works with 
structured markers.

Indira Rimkeit
Technical Publications
Redback Networks, an Ericsson company


"Jennifer Collier" 
Sent by: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com
11/28/2008 07:49 PM

To

cc

Subject
IXgen with Structured FrameMaker?






Does anyone out there have experience using IXgen with Structured
FrameMaker? We are currently using FrameMaker 6.0 (unstructured). We're
in the process of moving to FrameMaker 8 (structured). We want to make
sure as we begin using IXgen to index our documents, we do it the best
way for making it work with structured. I know IXgen doesn't officially
work with structure but we've been told that there are people that are
making it work well. Any tips, guidelines, or processes I should be
following? Thanks for all the help in advance!



Jen Collier

Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[Fred Ridder]

Les Winberg wrote:> I recently started a new job, 2 days ago, and I noticed 
that a document I
> was given is Standard FM but has Structured FM selected in the Preferences.
> My boss told me it was OK but I think it could cause a problem.

Note that the Preferences apply on a per-user basis rather than a per-file 
basis.
The Preferences settings get written into the secondary maker.ini file that is
in your user directory and are read each time you launch FrameMaker.  In 
other words, it's actualy your installation that is set to open with the 
structured
user interface as the default rather than any property that is set in the file. 
And as others have noted, having the structured interface as the default does 
not preclude you from working normally with non-structured files.

-Fred Ridder

Mif2Go FM template import: flags issue

[Jim Owens]

I'm importing a template in a Mif2Go project, with the flags set to 128 
to import cross-reference formats only.

For the first two chapters of the book, this works fine. FM variable 
values are not imported from the template, as expected. For the rest of 
the book, variable values are imported from the template, even though 
the flag for them is not set in the config file. The document name in my 
HTML topics changes from "Administrator's Guide" in the first few topics 
to "Document Name", the generic value from the template, in the rest of 
the topics.

I see this behaviour for only one of our books. The Operator's Guide 
doesn't have this problem.

Has anyone else seen anything like this?

IXGen with Structured FrameMaker

[Etzel, Gary]

Can you explain what you mean by "structured" markers? I thought markers
were the same regardless of whether or not you are using structure.

> We also used IXGen for editing indexes before we moved to structure,
but found that is doesn't work with structured markers.



This e-mail, and any attachments are strictly confidential and intended for the 
addressee(s) only. The content may also contain legal, professional or other 
privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify 
the sender immediately, by return of email, and then delete the e-mail and any 
attachments. You should not disclose, copy or take any action in reliance on 
this transmission.
Please ensure you have adequate virus protection before you open or detach any 
documents from this transmission.

Advantica, Inc. is a company incorporated in Delaware with its headquarters at 
600 Bent Creek Blvd., Suite 100, Mechanicsburg, PA  17050 U.S.A.

Advantica Ltd. is a company registered in England and Wales with company No. 
3294136 and registered office at Holywell Park, New Ashby Road, Loughborough, 
Leicestershire, LE11 3GR, United Kingdom. 

__
This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System.
For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email 
__

Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[Klaus Mueller]

Les, David, Rick,

> You shouldn't encounter any problems working in an
> Unstructured (Standard) FM document while FrameMaker
> is set for Structured.

> This is no problem whatsoever.

Actually, I regularly encounter an annoying problem when
working with unstructured documents while FrameMaker is
set for Structured:
When saving unstructured documents with structured FM
as MIF and those MIFs are opened in unstructured FM,
the "Document is Structured" error message does occur.

You can reproduce this the following way:
- Start FM in structured mode
- Create & save a new document
- Create & save a new book
- Add the document to the book
- Update the book
- Save the document as MIF
- Change the FM product interface to (unstructured) FrameMaker
- Restart FrameMaker
- Open the saved MIF file
=> The follwing message does occur

>  This document contains structure information.
>  The current interface does not read structure information.
>  If you continue, the structure information will be
>  removed. Editing and saving this document may result
>  in a loss of information. [...]
>  Options:
>  (?) Open as View Only
>  ( ) Open for Editing
>  [Continue]   [Cancel]

If multiple people (with differently set FM structure modes)
are working with such documents, this can be pretty annoying,
because it is not obvious that this error message is
inaccurate and the document is actually unstructured.

A 'usual' workflow in a translation environment:
- Person A does a quality check of the documents to translate
  (with structured FM) and saves the docs as MIF.
- After translation into multiple languages, the layout
  persons B, C and D are irritated because they get those
  error messages.

The error message is caused by the "DBookElementHierarchy /
ElementContext" entries in the "Document" node that are
written into the MIF file.

When saving documents with FrameScript as MIF, there is
unfortunately no option to strip/suppress this gratuitous
structure information.

Kind regards,
Klaus M?ller, itl AG


--- Original Message ---
From: David Spreadbury
Date: 04.12.2008 16:57
> Les,
> You shouldn't encounter any problems working in an Unstructured (Standard) FM 
> document while FrameMaker is set for Structured.
>  
> Obviously, you won't be able to use any of the Structured features while 
> editing an Unstructured document, i.e., Structured View, Element Catalog 
> won't display anything.

IXGen with Structured FrameMaker

[Scott Prentice]

Hi...

Our plugin MarkerTools, supports structured markers. It is in no way a 
replacement for IXGen, but it does provide a number of similar features, 
as well as many other useful features.

http://leximation.com/tools/info/markertools.php

Cheers,

...scott

Scott Prentice
Leximation, Inc.
www.leximation.com
+1.415.485.1892



Indira Rimkeit wrote:
> Hi Jennifer,
>
> We also used IXGen for editing indexes before we moved to structure, but 
> found that is doesn't work with structured markers. You could ask the 
> developer, Frank Stearns http://www.fsatools.com/, if he now has plans to 
> support them, but as far as I know, he doesn't.
>
> Rick Quatro created a FrameScript for us to replace the IXGen functionality 
> to generate a list of markers that you can edit and update, which works with 
> structured markers.
>
> Indira Rimkeit
> Technical Publications
> Redback Networks, an Ericsson company
>
>
> "Jennifer Collier"  
> Sent by: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com
> 11/28/2008 07:49 PM
>
> To
> 
> cc
>
> Subject
> IXgen with Structured FrameMaker?
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Does anyone out there have experience using IXgen with Structured
> FrameMaker? We are currently using FrameMaker 6.0 (unstructured). We're
> in the process of moving to FrameMaker 8 (structured). We want to make
> sure as we begin using IXgen to index our documents, we do it the best
> way for making it work with structured. I know IXgen doesn't officially
> work with structure but we've been told that there are people that are
> making it work well. Any tips, guidelines, or processes I should be
> following? Thanks for all the help in advance!
>
>
>
> Jen Collier
>
>
>   

Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[Rick Quatro]

Hi Klaus,

Thanks for the information. I wasn't aware of these problems.

Rick

Rick Quatro
Carmen Publishing Inc
585-659-8267
www.frameexpert.com


Les, David, Rick,

> You shouldn't encounter any problems working in an
> Unstructured (Standard) FM document while FrameMaker
> is set for Structured.

> This is no problem whatsoever.

Actually, I regularly encounter an annoying problem when
working with unstructured documents while FrameMaker is
set for Structured:
When saving unstructured documents with structured FM
as MIF and those MIFs are opened in unstructured FM,
the "Document is Structured" error message does occur.

You can reproduce this the following way:
- Start FM in structured mode
- Create & save a new document
- Create & save a new book
- Add the document to the book
- Update the book
- Save the document as MIF
- Change the FM product interface to (unstructured) FrameMaker
- Restart FrameMaker
- Open the saved MIF file
=> The follwing message does occur

>  This document contains structure information.
>  The current interface does not read structure information.
>  If you continue, the structure information will be
>  removed. Editing and saving this document may result
>  in a loss of information. [...]
>  Options:
>  (?) Open as View Only
>  ( ) Open for Editing
>  [Continue]   [Cancel]

If multiple people (with differently set FM structure modes)
are working with such documents, this can be pretty annoying,
because it is not obvious that this error message is
inaccurate and the document is actually unstructured.

A 'usual' workflow in a translation environment:
- Person A does a quality check of the documents to translate
  (with structured FM) and saves the docs as MIF.
- After translation into multiple languages, the layout
  persons B, C and D are irritated because they get those
  error messages.

The error message is caused by the "DBookElementHierarchy /
ElementContext" entries in the "Document" node that are
written into the MIF file.

When saving documents with FrameScript as MIF, there is
unfortunately no option to strip/suppress this gratuitous
structure information.

Kind regards,
Klaus M?ller, itl AG

Layoffs and Frame 9?

[Alan Houser]

This morning I spoke with Adobe's Group Product Manager for the 
Technical Communication Suite, FrameMaker, and Robohelp. With his 
permission, I can say that the development teams for these products were 
not affected by yesterday's Adobe announcement.

Adobe's historical release cycle of approximately 18 months is 
documented elsewhere. FrameMaker 8 was released in July 2007. RoboHelp 7 
and Adobe Technical Communication Suite were released in October 2007.

-Alan
---

Alan Houser, President
Group Wellesley, Inc.
412-363-3481
www.groupwellesley.com

Merged project

[Art Campbell]

This probably isn't the kind of advice that you're hoping to get, but
the way that you're setting stuff up is so far from the standard way
that FM and RH work that you're way off the edge.

As you probably know, the normal way to work, and the way the programs
work best, is to build a book in FM that contains all the chapter
files. IF... it really "takes forever" to update files and that's your
reason for not using a standard workflow, that would tell me that
there's something wrong with your setup. I know that I'm working on
several books with 500-600 pages and all the files are on a server...
and it takes maybe 2-3 minutes to update all insets, graphics, and
generate the TOC and Index. Which I can live with.

Your note that the system fails when you try to work correctly is
another key that you've got basic system or configuration problems.
Normal work doesn't cause systems to fail.

So the right direction would be to find and fix the underlying
problem, rather than look for additional kludges. Which would involve
supplying a lot more details about your system, RAM, free space,
network config and so on...

Art


Art Campbell
  art.campbell at gmail.com
  "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52
Vincent and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson
  No disclaimers apply.
   DoD 358



On Wed, Dec 3, 2008 at 5:57 PM, Judy Bragg  wrote:
> I'm using Tech. Comm. Suite ( FM8 ver. 8.0p277 & RH7 ver. 7.02.001) to 
> generate multiple user manuals (a full manual and 3 quickstarts) as well as 
> CHM Help files.  (Windows XP SP3 if it matters.)
> The manual has 10 chapters, each in its own FM book, complete with TOC and 
> IX.  All chapters are added to RH by reference and each is compiled to a CHM. 
>  So far so good!
> The problem comes when I try to merge them.  The TOC is OK, but the Index is 
> wrong.
> Here's what I did:
> I used the first chapter as the master and merged the other 9 onto the end of 
> it.  (In the ch. 1 TOC, I clicked the New Merged Project icon and added the 
> ch. 2 chm.  Repeat the process for chapters 3-10.)  In the HTML Single Source 
> Layout, I used the merged TOC...what should I do with the IX field?
> I tried adding IX placeholders to the end of the ch 1 IX, but the result was 
> 10 catenated IX files.   They don't merge.
> Theoretically, I suppose I could generate the full manual in 1 FM book and 
> reference it in RH, but it takes forever to update that many files and I've 
> noticed the system tends to fail one way or another when I attempt to do too 
> much.  Also, I have to produce a modular system patterned after the previous 
> one.  Changing the help calls in the numerous program modules of our software 
> would be our last resort at this point. This way I can do 1 chapter at a time 
> and the TOC's  are easily updated from the FM file.  Now if I can just get 
> the index to merge...
> Can anyone please steer me in the right direction?  I would be forever 
> grateful!
> Judy Bragg
> Technical Writer
> Hypack, Inc.
>
> ___
>
>
> You are currently subscribed to Framers as art.campbell at gmail.com.
>
> Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.
>
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to
> framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
> or visit 
> http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail.com
>
> Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit
> http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
>
>

Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[David Spreadbury]

Klaus,
?
Like Rick, I was not aware of these issues. Very good information. Thanks for 
the heads-up on these issues.

--- On Thu, 12/4/08, Rick Quatro  wrote:

From: Rick Quatro 
Subject: Re: Structured and Standard FM 7.2
To: "Klaus Mueller" , "Framers List" 
Date: Thursday, December 4, 2008, 12:00 PM

Hi Klaus,

Thanks for the information. I wasn't aware of these problems.

Rick

Rick Quatro
Carmen Publishing Inc
585-659-8267
www.frameexpert.com


Les, David, Rick,

> You shouldn't encounter any problems working in an
> Unstructured (Standard) FM document while FrameMaker
> is set for Structured.

> This is no problem whatsoever.

Actually, I regularly encounter an annoying problem when
working with unstructured documents while FrameMaker is
set for Structured:
When saving unstructured documents with structured FM
as MIF and those MIFs are opened in unstructured FM,
the "Document is Structured" error message does occur.

You can reproduce this the following way:
- Start FM in structured mode
- Create & save a new document
- Create & save a new book
- Add the document to the book
- Update the book
- Save the document as MIF
- Change the FM product interface to (unstructured) FrameMaker
- Restart FrameMaker
- Open the saved MIF file
=> The follwing message does occur

>  This document contains structure information.
>  The current interface does not read structure information.
>  If you continue, the structure information will be
>  removed. Editing and saving this document may result
>  in a loss of information. [...]
>  Options:
>  (?) Open as View Only
>  ( ) Open for Editing
>  [Continue]   [Cancel]

If multiple people (with differently set FM structure modes)
are working with such documents, this can be pretty annoying,
because it is not obvious that this error message is
inaccurate and the document is actually unstructured.

A 'usual' workflow in a translation environment:
- Person A does a quality check of the documents to translate
  (with structured FM) and saves the docs as MIF.
- After translation into multiple languages, the layout
  persons B, C and D are irritated because they get those
  error messages.

The error message is caused by the "DBookElementHierarchy /
ElementContext" entries in the "Document" node that are
written into the MIF file.

When saving documents with FrameScript as MIF, there is
unfortunately no option to strip/suppress this gratuitous
structure information.

Kind regards,
Klaus M?ller, itl AG

___


You are currently subscribed to Framers as dspreadb at yahoo.com.

Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.

To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
or visit
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/dspreadb%40yahoo.com

Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit
http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.

PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source

[Duncan, Gary]

Hi everyone,



We create PDFs from Frame sources and include PDF bookmarks for chapter
titles and headings. We also include a book mark for the TOC. The
problem I am seeing (and have seen before but can't remember how I fixed
it) is that the "Contents" book mark is expandable. It includes all of
the chapter titles and when you click on a chapter title, it takes you
to that spot in the TOC. This is redundant and not useful since the
chapter titles are listed as book marks under the "Contents" bookmark.



For example, we include:



ChapTitle

ChapTitleNoNum

H1

H2

TOCTitle



with appropriate indenting.



The bookmark that results from including TOCTitle is "Contents" which
also includes the chapter titles in the contents. (As you know, the text
of the chapter title in the TOC would be tagged "ChapTitleTOC.")



It is easy enough to remove the unneeded entries in the PDF after it is
generated, but I know there is a fix.



Can anyone help?



Thank you very much...



Gary

FILENAME markers for mid-topic IDs

[Combs, Richard]

Olga Klenner wrote:

> We use filename markers in FM  to generate context-sensitive help with
> WWP.
> How can I create a filename marker for a mid-topic ID?
> 
> e.g.
> Help page is  "About.html" => FILENAME marker input is "About". This
is
> easy.
> But: Help page is "Options.html#General" => what do I have to enter
into
> the FILENAME marker? If I type "Options#General" into the FILENAME
marker
> a page is created called "Options#General.html which in not what is
> needed.

I recently needed to do something like that in ePublisher Pro 9.2. The
solution there was to insert TopicAlias markers, not Filename markers,
in FM. 

In ePP, the TopicAlias marker type is set to a value of "Topic alias."
Since I started from an existing FM/ePP project, I'm not sure if someone
had to set this up manually or it's there by default.

I still have a minor annoyance, though (and maybe some WebWorks guru can
straighten me out). Although ePP obediently inserts an anchor tag in the
HTML where the TopicAlias marker was, the anchor's name attribute is a
numeric value instead of my marker text. 

In the application's onlinehelp.props file, which provides the
context-sensitive help mapping, I'd much rather specify the topic as,
say, "Options.html#General" instead of "Options.html#123456." Is there a
simple way to tell ePP to use the marker text for the anchor name? 

Richard


Richard G. Combs
Senior Technical Writer
Polycom, Inc.
richardDOTcombs AT polycomDOTcom
303-223-5111
--
rgcombs AT gmailDOTcom
303-777-0436
--

Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[Klaus Mueller]

Hello Framers,

Maybe someone of the FM9 beta participants could check
this issue with the current version?
(FM8 Structured does also write those structured book
component information into unstructured MIF documents.)

Thanks,
Klaus



--- Original Message ---
From: Rick Quatro
Date: 04.12.2008 19:00
> Hi Klaus,
> 
> Thanks for the information. I wasn't aware of these problems.
> 
> Rick
> 
> Rick Quatro
> Carmen Publishing Inc
> 585-659-8267
> www.frameexpert.com
> 
> 
> Les, David, Rick,
> 
>> You shouldn't encounter any problems working in an
>> Unstructured (Standard) FM document while FrameMaker
>> is set for Structured.
> 
>> This is no problem whatsoever.
> 
> Actually, I regularly encounter an annoying problem when
> working with unstructured documents while FrameMaker is
> set for Structured:
> When saving unstructured documents with structured FM
> as MIF and those MIFs are opened in unstructured FM,
> the "Document is Structured" error message does occur.
> 
> You can reproduce this the following way:
> - Start FM in structured mode
> - Create & save a new document
> - Create & save a new book
> - Add the document to the book
> - Update the book
> - Save the document as MIF
> - Change the FM product interface to (unstructured) FrameMaker
> - Restart FrameMaker
> - Open the saved MIF file
> => The follwing message does occur
> 
>>  This document contains structure information.
>>  The current interface does not read structure information.
>>  If you continue, the structure information will be
>>  removed. Editing and saving this document may result
>>  in a loss of information. [...]
>>  Options:
>>  (?) Open as View Only
>>  ( ) Open for Editing
>>  [Continue]   [Cancel]
> 
> If multiple people (with differently set FM structure modes)
> are working with such documents, this can be pretty annoying,
> because it is not obvious that this error message is
> inaccurate and the document is actually unstructured.
> 
> A 'usual' workflow in a translation environment:
> - Person A does a quality check of the documents to translate
>   (with structured FM) and saves the docs as MIF.
> - After translation into multiple languages, the layout
>   persons B, C and D are irritated because they get those
>   error messages.
> 
> The error message is caused by the "DBookElementHierarchy /
> ElementContext" entries in the "Document" node that are
> written into the MIF file.
> 
> When saving documents with FrameScript as MIF, there is
> unfortunately no option to strip/suppress this gratuitous
> structure information.
> 
> Kind regards,
> Klaus M?ller, itl AG

PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source

[Art Campbell]

What version FM and Acrobat are you using?

And... where did the list of included headings come from? Did you copy
it from the Book's PDF Setup Window, or somewhere else?

Art

Art Campbell
  art.campbell at gmail.com
  "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52
Vincent and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson
  No disclaimers apply.
   DoD 358



On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 1:54 PM, Duncan, Gary  wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> We create PDFs from Frame sources and include PDF bookmarks for chapter
> titles and headings. We also include a book mark for the TOC. The
> problem I am seeing (and have seen before but can't remember how I fixed
> it) is that the "Contents" book mark is expandable. It includes all of
> the chapter titles and when you click on a chapter title, it takes you
> to that spot in the TOC. This is redundant and not useful since the
> chapter titles are listed as book marks under the "Contents" bookmark.
>
>
>
> For example, we include:
>
>
>
> ChapTitle
>
> ChapTitleNoNum
>
> H1
>
> H2
>
> TOCTitle
>
>
>
> with appropriate indenting.
>
>
>
> The bookmark that results from including TOCTitle is "Contents" which
> also includes the chapter titles in the contents. (As you know, the text
> of the chapter title in the TOC would be tagged "ChapTitleTOC.")
>
>
>
> It is easy enough to remove the unneeded entries in the PDF after it is
> generated, but I know there is a fix.
>
>
>
> Can anyone help?
>
>
>
> Thank you very much...
>
>
>
> Gary
>
> ___
>
>
> You are currently subscribed to Framers as art.campbell at gmail.com.
>
> Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.
>
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to
> framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
> or visit 
> http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail.com
>
> Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit
> http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
>

PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source

[qui...@airmail.net]

Don't include the *TOC tags in your generation of PDFs. You can 
choose which ones during your setup for PDF markers to include or 
exclude.

Scott

At 1:54 PM -0500 12/4/08, Duncan, Gary wrote:
>Hi everyone,
>
>
>
>We create PDFs from Frame sources and include PDF bookmarks for chapter
>titles and headings. We also include a book mark for the TOC. The
>problem I am seeing (and have seen before but can't remember how I fixed
>it) is that the "Contents" book mark is expandable. It includes all of
>the chapter titles and when you click on a chapter title, it takes you
>to that spot in the TOC. This is redundant and not useful since the
>chapter titles are listed as book marks under the "Contents" bookmark.
>
>
>
>For example, we include:
>
>
>
>ChapTitle
>
>ChapTitleNoNum
>
>H1
>
>H2
>
>TOCTitle
>
>
>
>with appropriate indenting.
>
>
>
>The bookmark that results from including TOCTitle is "Contents" which
>also includes the chapter titles in the contents. (As you know, the text
>of the chapter title in the TOC would be tagged "ChapTitleTOC.")
>
>
>
>It is easy enough to remove the unneeded entries in the PDF after it is
>generated, but I know there is a fix.
>
>
>
>Can anyone help?
>
>
>
>Thank you very much...
>
>
>
>Gary

PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source

[Duncan, Gary]

Hi Art,

I am using Frame version 7.1p116, and Acrobat version 7.0.5.

I selected the bookmarks in "PDF Setup" from the Frame Print Document
dialog. I have triple-checked that I did not include the tags appended
with "TOC" that are created in the Frame TOC.

Gary

-Original Message-
From: Art Campbell [mailto:art.campb...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2008 2:07 PM
To: Duncan, Gary
Cc: framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Re: PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source

What version FM and Acrobat are you using?

And... where did the list of included headings come from? Did you copy
it from the Book's PDF Setup Window, or somewhere else?

Art

Art Campbell
  art.campbell at gmail.com
  "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52
Vincent and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson
  No disclaimers
apply.
   DoD 358



On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 1:54 PM, Duncan, Gary 
wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> We create PDFs from Frame sources and include PDF bookmarks for
chapter
> titles and headings. We also include a book mark for the TOC. The
> problem I am seeing (and have seen before but can't remember how I
fixed
> it) is that the "Contents" book mark is expandable. It includes all of
> the chapter titles and when you click on a chapter title, it takes you
> to that spot in the TOC. This is redundant and not useful since the
> chapter titles are listed as book marks under the "Contents" bookmark.
>
>
>
> For example, we include:
>
>
>
> ChapTitle
>
> ChapTitleNoNum
>
> H1
>
> H2
>
> TOCTitle
>
>
>
> with appropriate indenting.
>
>
>
> The bookmark that results from including TOCTitle is "Contents" which
> also includes the chapter titles in the contents. (As you know, the
text
> of the chapter title in the TOC would be tagged "ChapTitleTOC.")
>
>
>
> It is easy enough to remove the unneeded entries in the PDF after it
is
> generated, but I know there is a fix.
>
>
>
> Can anyone help?
>
>
>
> Thank you very much...
>
>
>
> Gary
>
> ___
>
>
> You are currently subscribed to Framers as art.campbell at gmail.com.
>
> Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.
>
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to
> framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
> or visit
http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail
.com
>
> Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit
> http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
>

Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[Art Campbell]

Well,

I'd venture the minority opinion that I'd rather have the warning
messages display, even if they're a false warning... If I'm opening a
new document, I'd much rather know that I may be blowing away
structured info (the warning appears when you're opening a correctly
structured doc too, as far as I know) before I do it.

And... I think a key statement is: "If multiple people (with
differently set FM structure modes) are working with such documents, "
-- in most production environments, including those that include
routine translation, there should be tight enough control that only
one flavor of a program (in this case, the structured interface of FM
is in use).

Art


Art Campbell
  art.campbell at gmail.com
  "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52
Vincent and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson
  No disclaimers apply.
   DoD 358



On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 2:02 PM, Klaus Mueller  wrote:
> Hello Framers,
>
> Maybe someone of the FM9 beta participants could check
> this issue with the current version?
> (FM8 Structured does also write those structured book
> component information into unstructured MIF documents.)
>
> Thanks,
> Klaus
>
>
>
> --- Original Message ---
> From: Rick Quatro
> Date: 04.12.2008 19:00
>> Hi Klaus,
>>
>> Thanks for the information. I wasn't aware of these problems.
>>
>> Rick
>>
>> Rick Quatro
>> Carmen Publishing Inc
>> 585-659-8267
>> www.frameexpert.com
>>
>>
>> Les, David, Rick,
>>
>>> You shouldn't encounter any problems working in an
>>> Unstructured (Standard) FM document while FrameMaker
>>> is set for Structured.
>>
>>> This is no problem whatsoever.
>>
>> Actually, I regularly encounter an annoying problem when
>> working with unstructured documents while FrameMaker is
>> set for Structured:
>> When saving unstructured documents with structured FM
>> as MIF and those MIFs are opened in unstructured FM,
>> the "Document is Structured" error message does occur.
>>
>> You can reproduce this the following way:
>> - Start FM in structured mode
>> - Create & save a new document
>> - Create & save a new book
>> - Add the document to the book
>> - Update the book
>> - Save the document as MIF
>> - Change the FM product interface to (unstructured) FrameMaker
>> - Restart FrameMaker
>> - Open the saved MIF file
>> => The follwing message does occur
>>
>>>  This document contains structure information.
>>>  The current interface does not read structure information.
>>>  If you continue, the structure information will be
>>>  removed. Editing and saving this document may result
>>>  in a loss of information. [...]
>>>  Options:
>>>  (?) Open as View Only
>>>  ( ) Open for Editing
>>>  [Continue]   [Cancel]
>>
>> If multiple people (with differently set FM structure modes)
>> are working with such documents, this can be pretty annoying,
>> because it is not obvious that this error message is
>> inaccurate and the document is actually unstructured.
>>
>> A 'usual' workflow in a translation environment:
>> - Person A does a quality check of the documents to translate
>>   (with structured FM) and saves the docs as MIF.
>> - After translation into multiple languages, the layout
>>   persons B, C and D are irritated because they get those
>>   error messages.
>>
>> The error message is caused by the "DBookElementHierarchy /
>> ElementContext" entries in the "Document" node that are
>> written into the MIF file.
>>
>> When saving documents with FrameScript as MIF, there is
>> unfortunately no option to strip/suppress this gratuitous
>> structure information.
>>
>> Kind regards,
>> Klaus M?ller, itl AG
>
> ___
>
>
> You are currently subscribed to Framers as art.campbell at gmail.com.
>
> Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.
>
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to
> framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
> or visit 
> http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail.com
>
> Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit
> http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
>

PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source

[Art Campbell]

Gary,

Was the PDF Setup Bookmark window you used from the Print > Book File,
or from the TOC's? The Book File should rule, but it may be worth
checking both of them, to ensure that the correct settings aren't
being corrupted somehow.

If the settings match, one quick thing you could try... create a new
book file in FM, and copy in the files from the original book file.
Then print from the new book file -- you'll need to create a new set
up for it, and you can do it step by step, starting with just the
Chapter and TOC title tags. If that works, add the H1s, and then the
H2s.

Art

Art Campbell
  art.campbell at gmail.com
  "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52
Vincent and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson
  No disclaimers apply.
   DoD 358



On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 2:13 PM, Duncan, Gary  wrote:
> Hi Art,
>
> I am using Frame version 7.1p116, and Acrobat version 7.0.5.
>
> I selected the bookmarks in "PDF Setup" from the Frame Print Document
> dialog. I have triple-checked that I did not include the tags appended
> with "TOC" that are created in the Frame TOC.
>
> Gary
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Art Campbell [mailto:art.campbell at gmail.com]
> Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2008 2:07 PM
> To: Duncan, Gary
> Cc: framers at lists.frameusers.com
> Subject: Re: PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source
>
> What version FM and Acrobat are you using?
>
> And... where did the list of included headings come from? Did you copy
> it from the Book's PDF Setup Window, or somewhere else?
>
> Art
>
> Art Campbell
>  art.campbell at gmail.com
>  "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52
> Vincent and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson
>  No disclaimers
> apply.
>   DoD 358
>
>
>
> On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 1:54 PM, Duncan, Gary 
> wrote:
>> Hi everyone,
>>
>>
>>
>> We create PDFs from Frame sources and include PDF bookmarks for
> chapter
>> titles and headings. We also include a book mark for the TOC. The
>> problem I am seeing (and have seen before but can't remember how I
> fixed
>> it) is that the "Contents" book mark is expandable. It includes all of
>> the chapter titles and when you click on a chapter title, it takes you
>> to that spot in the TOC. This is redundant and not useful since the
>> chapter titles are listed as book marks under the "Contents" bookmark.
>>
>>
>>
>> For example, we include:
>>
>>
>>
>> ChapTitle
>>
>> ChapTitleNoNum
>>
>> H1
>>
>> H2
>>
>> TOCTitle
>>
>>
>>
>> with appropriate indenting.
>>
>>
>>
>> The bookmark that results from including TOCTitle is "Contents" which
>> also includes the chapter titles in the contents. (As you know, the
> text
>> of the chapter title in the TOC would be tagged "ChapTitleTOC.")
>>
>>
>>
>> It is easy enough to remove the unneeded entries in the PDF after it
> is
>> generated, but I know there is a fix.
>>
>>
>>
>> Can anyone help?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you very much...
>>
>>
>>
>> Gary
>>
>> ___
>>
>>
>> You are currently subscribed to Framers as art.campbell at gmail.com.
>>
>> Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com.
>>
>> To unsubscribe send a blank email to
>> framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com
>> or visit
> http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail
> .com
>>
>> Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit
>> http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
>>
>

PDF Bookmarks from Frame Source

[Fred Ridder]

Gary Duncan wrote:

> I selected the bookmarks in "PDF Setup" from the Frame Print Document
> dialog. I have triple-checked that I did not include the tags appended
> with "TOC" that are created in the Frame TOC.

An undocumented feature is that the PDF Setup paragraph lists are additive.
The book-level list specifies the baseline set of tags that will be picked up
as PDF bookmarks; but if any individual file in the book specifies additional
tags, those will be picked up in that file as well as the base set. So you 
need to look at the PDF Setup dialog for the TOC file itself. I'll bet you
that you find the ...TOC tags included in that PDF bookmark list.

-Fred Ridder

Structured and Standard FM 7.2

[Klaus Mueller]

Hello Art,

I totally agree: When opening structured documents with
unstructured FrameMaker, a warning message should appear.

The only problem is that Structured FrameMaker does
unnecessarily and counterproductively write structure
information in unstructured documents when creating
MIF files which is causing unneeded error messages in
different workflows.

Kind regards,
Klaus


--- Original Message ---
From: Art Campbell
Date: 04.12.2008 20:21
> Well,
> 
> I'd venture the minority opinion that I'd rather have the warning
> messages display, even if they're a false warning... If I'm opening a
> new document, I'd much rather know that I may be blowing away
> structured info (the warning appears when you're opening a correctly
> structured doc too, as far as I know) before I do it.
> 
> And... I think a key statement is: "If multiple people (with
> differently set FM structure modes) are working with such documents, "
> -- in most production environments, including those that include
> routine translation, there should be tight enough control that only
> one flavor of a program (in this case, the structured interface of FM
> is in use).
> 
> Art