Re: (Open|Net)BSD local root exploit
On Mon, 18 Jun 2001, Jonathan Peterson wrote: However, after playing Baldurs Gate 2 all weekend, I'm obliged to say that really if you have a priceless artifact that you don't want found, the trick is to give to a peasant, because no adventurer is going to go round killing every peasant in the land to find the one with the treasure. See That is unless you're Herod. Then Herod, when he saw that he had been tricked by the wise men, was in a furious rage, and he sent and killed all the male children in Bethlehem and in all that region who were two years old or under, according to the time which he had ascertained from the wise men. I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. That's the only way to be sure. Later. Mark. -- s'' Mark Fowler London.pm Bath.pm http://www.twoshortplanks.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ';use Term'Cap;$t=Tgetent Term'Cap{};print$t-Tputs(cl);for$w(split/ +/ ){for(0..30){$|=print$t-Tgoto(cm,$_,$y). $w;select$k,$k,$k,.03}$y+=2}
Re: Training anyone ?
On Wed, 13 Jun 2001, Lucy McWilliam wrote: Beer good. Beer Foamy. -- s'' Mark Fowler London.pm Bath.pm http://www.twoshortplanks.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ';use Term'Cap;$t=Tgetent Term'Cap{};print$t-Tputs(cl);for$w(split/ +/ ){for(0..30){$|=print$t-Tgoto(cm,$_,$y). $w;select$k,$k,$k,.03}$y+=2}
Re: rewind elector
On Fri, 8 Jun 2001, jo walsh wrote: gah, i feel old and sleepy As does anyone who got home at 4am ;-) so nothing changes, but it was nice to realise that in the company of perlmongers. Yey. Thanks dave it was much fun, and I only inaproperatly fell asleep three times... Interesting ride home in the minicab with the driver not knowing where brick lane or highbury corner was...and me much leafing through his A-Z and attempting not to notice him getting flashed by speed cameras Now all I've got to do is actually get up, tear myself away from the three tvs (showing breakfast, bbc text, sky news and gmtv) and internet connection the gareth seems to have set my front room and get to work. Thanks again Davewas great. -- s'' Mark Fowler London.pm Bath.pm http://www.twoshortplanks.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ';use Term'Cap;$t=Tgetent Term'Cap{};print$t-Tputs(cl);for$w(split/ +/ ){for(0..30){$|=print$t-Tgoto(cm,$_,$y). $w;select$k,$k,$k,.03}$y+=2}
Re: old pictures
On Wed, 6 Jun 2001, Lucy McWilliam wrote: On Sun, 3 Jun 2001, Greg McCarroll wrote: just looking at some old pictures of london.pm meetings and YAPC::Europe and i came across the classic, London.pm drinking in a hair dressing salon, Why oh why? Infact, more to the point, where is this? I seem to be in shot, though I have no recollection of any hair dressing salons. And I wasn't that drunk at YAPC::E (unfortunately) -- s'' Mark Fowler London.pm Bath.pm http://www.twoshortplanks.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ';use Term'Cap;$t=Tgetent Term'Cap{};print$t-Tputs(cl);for$w(split/ +/ ){for(0..30){$|=print$t-Tgoto(cm,$_,$y). $w;select$k,$k,$k,.03}$y+=2}
Re: Windows Perl - how?
On Thu, 31 May 2001, Roger Burton West wrote: It makes a certain amount of sense. Rather than having to distribute an installer program with every package, have a standard installer program that you only need to download once. Copying files, of course, is _much_ too difficult. Hmm..all working now (well, apart from GD crashing every time I try and write out a JPEG - but that's another converstation) I supose the real question is a) Why don't activestate mirror the latest installer on their site, or.. b) At least link to it whenever you offer a MSI package to download (or at least on the 'downloads' page From my point of view I clicked on the 'activeperl' link on their front page and was simply offered a load of files that I had no idea how to download. Grr. Mark. (back to coding under 'nix) -- s'' Mark Fowler London.pm Bath.pm http://www.twoshortplanks.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ';use Term'Cap;$t=Tgetent Term'Cap{};print$t-Tputs(cl);for$w(split/ +/ ){for(0..30){$|=print$t-Tgoto(cm,$_,$y). $w;select$k,$k,$k,.03}$y+=2}
Re: Slow disks under linux
On Thu, 31 May 2001, Paul Makepeace wrote: OK, getting more esoteric now -- is anyone running dual monitors? I finally got my G450 running with KDE2 but the window manager doesn't add decoration to the windows on the 2ndary monitor, i.e. I can't move windows and they don't get mouse focus. Are you using xinerama (i.e. so your monitors are spliced together into one display?) E (still 0.15.5...) runs fine with this[1] on my G400 and XFree86 4.0 (with dem beta drivers) Later. Mark. [1] Actually sometimes it moves a windows I'm resizing on my secondary monitor onto my first, but that's only once in a very blue moon. -- s'' Mark Fowler London.pm Bath.pm http://www.twoshortplanks.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ';use Term'Cap;$t=Tgetent Term'Cap{};print$t-Tputs(cl);for$w(split/ +/ ){for(0..30){$|=print$t-Tgoto(cm,$_,$y). $w;select$k,$k,$k,.03}$y+=2}
Re: Slow disks under linux
On Thu, 31 May 2001, Paul Makepeace wrote: I have, Section ServerLayout Identifier Default Layout Screen Primary Screen Secondary LeftOf Primary InputDevice Generic Keyboard InputDevice Configured Mouse EndSection Look, look, bad Text::Autoformat setup. I suck. Anyway.. And I have Section ServerLayout Identifier another layout Screen Primary Screen Secondary RightOf Primary InputDevice Mouse1 CorePointer InputDevice Keyboard1 CoreKeyboard EndSection You really only have to change LeftOf and RightOf to switch the monitors around (which I did last time I moved desk as I went from having one monitor to the left of the primary console monitor to having one monitor to the right.) You can't do that in Windows. Ha. -- s'' Mark Fowler London.pm Bath.pm http://www.twoshortplanks.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ';use Term'Cap;$t=Tgetent Term'Cap{};print$t-Tputs(cl);for$w(split/ +/ ){for(0..30){$|=print$t-Tgoto(cm,$_,$y). $w;select$k,$k,$k,.03}$y+=2}
RE: [PUB] Possible candidate
On Wed, 30 May 2001, Cross David - dcross wrote: Maybe I should have said a pint to the first person WHO WASN'T IN THE PUB LAST NIGHT LEARNING ALL ABOUT THE HISTORY to explain the name. Okay. I was sitting on my sofa last night. The right to wear Doggett's Coat and Badge is the prize in a rowing race held yearly since 1715 between London Bridge and Cadogan Pier, Chelsea in London. It was initiated by Thomas Doggett to commemorate the coronation of George I. The badge is silver and shows the white horse of Hannover. The race is now held in July. Later. Mark. -- s'' Mark Fowler Technology Developer Profero Ltd http://www.profero.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] 020 7700 9960 ';use Term'Cap;$t=Tgetent Term'Cap{};print$t-Tputs(cl);for$w(split/ +/ ){for(0..30){$|=print$t-Tgoto(cm,$_,$y). $w;select$k,$k,$k,.03}$y+=2}
Re: Buffy moves to London to do Eastenders
On Mon, 28 May 2001, Redvers Davies wrote: Well, not quite... but nearly: http://www.bbc.co.uk/eastenders/features/exclusive.shtml There seems to be something wrong with this URL...where's the @decimalipaddress after the domain name? Later Mark -- s'' Mark FowlerTechnology Developer Profero Ltd http://www.profero.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] 020 7700 9960 ';use Term'Cap;$t=Tgetent Term'Cap{};print$t-Tputs(cl);for$w(split/ +/ ){for(0..30){$|=print$t-Tgoto(cm,$_,$y). $w;select$k,$k,$k,.03}$y+=2}
Re: [Announce] Hackspoitation film fest
On Thu, 24 May 2001, Greg McCarroll wrote: and i can't buy it, because its still on boring old VHS - Greg 'DVD' McCarroll It *was* released on DVD (in the US, but we don't care about that, do we boys and girls) but this was a while back, and it's now out of stock (everywhere.) I think this might be the one film I'd be prepared to have a copy on VHS and on DVD. Hmmm. Mark. -- Spontaneity has its time and place. - The Sure Thing
Re: Election Manifestos
On Thu, 24 May 2001, Richard Clamp wrote: On Thu, May 24, 2001 at 09:13:12AM +0100, Robert Shiels wrote: Typical quotes from Simon this week: Ah, he'd be fine if it weren't for those fucking mood swings. You see, this is why we don't need to make a london-perl-mongers movie. If we did, it's just turn out like SPACED. Later. Mark.
Re: Election Manifestos
On Thu, 24 May 2001, Simon Wistow wrote: Have no problem with them making money out of it it was just that it was ripped off and not released under the GPL and/or the changes sent back to us. They don't have to under the artistic licence. However, they do have to duplicate all of the original copyright notices and associated disclaimers. which they did not do; Credit where credit is due. Anyway, in the end IIRC the response was 'fuck it' let's have another beer and think up some more madcap schemes. Which brings us back around nicely to NMS and how we're going to licence that stuff. I think Leon will agree with me here that we should just simply go for the 'do what the hell you want' licence. If someone else 'steals' our code and makes a commercial library out of it, then so be it. quote person=me Oh sod this discussion for a lark, I'm off to write some free software... /quote Later. Mark. -- This is my signature. There are many like it, but this is mine. Disclaimer: I'm not a lawyer and am speaking on my behalf and my behalf alone. I didn't do it, nobody saw me do it, you can't prove anything
Re: [Announce] Hackspoitation film fest
On 24 May 2001, Dave Hodgkinson wrote: Simon Wistow [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I also have D.A.R.Y.L (Data Analyising Robot Youth Lifeform) but I thinkt hat's pushing it a bit. If that counts, then Weird Science counts too! That's more geeksploitation or nerdsplotitation... Later. Mark. -- Do you realize that it is snowing in my room, goddammit! - Chet, Weird Science
Re: Email Style (was: Re: Election Manifestos)
On Thu, 24 May 2001, Leon Brocard wrote: Paul Makepeace sent the following bits through the ether: Have you integrated into a mail server (module, procmail, whatever) .muttrc: set editor=/home/acme/bin/autoformat %s; xemacs -nw %s Leon in PINE S SETUP - C Config display-filters: ~mark/bin/autoformat where autoformat is simply perl #!/usr/bin/perl use strict; use Text::Autoformat; $_ = ; # don't process the headers if (/^Subject/) { print; print while (); exit; } # slurp in text and process my $foo = $_; $foo .= $_ while (); $_ = autoformat($foo, {all = 1}); # begon disclaimers s/The information contained in this communication.*//si; print; /perl Later Mark -- My other mail program has a .muttrc
Re: [Announce] Hackspoitation film fest
Piers asked: The sure thing Ooh. Not seen that one. Is it any good? And that's Anthony TopGun, Northern Exposure, ER Edwards to you. Any good, any good? It's only my all time favourite film of all time[1]. Where frat movie meets romantic comedy, on a road trip. Quite a few good one liners. John Cusack being John Cusack very well. Zuniga being Zuniga, also very well. Later. Mark. [1] Not sure why. It just is. -- I didn't sleep with you, I slept in a bed you happened to be in! - The Sure Thing
Re: Election Manifestos
On Wed, 23 May 2001, Simon Cozens wrote: On Wed, May 23, 2001 at 11:17:14AM +0100, Simon Wistow wrote: But Mail::Cclient is also unbeleivably powerful. Lying round on my HD there's a Mail::Cclient::Simple which amkes everything much easier but it's one of many projects I've never got round to finishing. Why reinvent the wheel by rolling my own or using 5 or 6 different modules when one will do. Because it doesn't exist? :) OTOH, Mail::Cclient does do NNTP as well, which would be a boost, because WING is meant to be the Web IMAP and NNTP Gateway. Mail::Cclient was (not sure if it is still) a bitch to install. Requires c headers from IMAP libraries. How likely is it that you have these (still) lying around on your client machine[1]? Most people opt for something that they can get to install easily[2] rather than something more powerful. If I can't just write a bundle for cpan then it's probably not worth the bother... Oh, let's just add it to the list of things to do once we've done NMS, the new website for london.pm.org and conferences are out of the way... Later. Mark. [1] Rhetorical question, not flame bait. [2] in under 2 hours -- My other mail has a signature
Re: [gnat@frii.com: Damian Conway's Exegesis 2]
On Wed, 16 May 2001, Greg McCarroll wrote: I don't think Perl 6 can be a tremendous leap forward, not because of RFC's along the lines of `Perl must stay Perl', but because the next leap forward is VisualPerl which will be as much about IDE as core language. Now lets not get hung up on the IDE bit of that statement, its more about how people build programs than the interface they use, the IDE merely focuses them towards a certain methodology of building software. Greg, I was wondering if you've used Glade with Perl. I think it's everything that VisualBasic is. It allows you very simple access to the vast range of really complex components and provides very simple access to the code both via generated 'only edit me if you know what you're doing' code and 'ignore the rest of the program and just write what you want me to do when you click here' callbacks. This of course comes with all the advantages and disadvantages of such an approach. It's very easy and quick to build a GUI that functions well and stops you making so many GUI bloopers, but it's a very fixed approach that doesn't lend itself to too much dynamic GUI creation. Later. Mark. -- perl is my itch (Simon, did you recently do an advertising campaign for divorce laywers?)
Re: TPC Quiz Team
On Thu, 17 May 2001, Cross David - dcross wrote: I need three volunteers to join me in the london.pm team for Jon Orwant's Internet Quiz at The Perl Conference. Does it have questions on Buffy and drinking competitions? Later Mark. -- The use of the beer glass image in association with the Perl language is a trademark of the London Perl Mongers.
Log::Agent
Has anyone used Log::Agent, or for that matter any of the other logging modules? I'm just looking for a consistent way to do logging. I've got a wheel that I reinvented, but it's a very simple one (no tyre or inner tube yet) and before I make any improvements I was just wondering if it was time to switch to one of the established brand of wheel manufactures. Recommendations anyone? (look, a perl question) Later. Mark.
Re: Perl training
On Mon, 14 May 2001, Martin Ling wrote: On Mon, May 14, 2001 at 12:27:20PM +0100, Chris Ball wrote: OoOoOoh, Red Snapper! Very tasty! /obscure_quoting Heh. It's *so* good, and has even managed to remain obscure. This is probably because you can't get it anywhere any more, of course... It's not that obscure, though admitadly you can't get hold of it anymore. Anyone who finds me a copy gets to drink from the firehose. Later. Mark.
Politikal Disskusion
Hmm. Leon once complained that I always read everything and then post and unknowingly summed up the point everyone was trying to make by simply rephrasing and clarifying a few issues (in the real world they call this 'plagiarism'.) He said this was a problem, because he always ended up linking to me rather than people who came up with original ideas. However, for the political discussion, I think I can sum up and point out that we oddly enough have seen to made our usual points... * All Operating Systems Suck in various ways (Democracy, Dictatorship) * All Distributions Suck in various ways (Labour, The Conservatives) * All Licensing Systems Suck As They All End Up Having Restricting Addenda As Well As Trying To Promote What They're About (The Left, The Right, etc) * All Content Management Systems Suck (Parties, Media, other vectors for and systems for change) * Throwing Money at Something Doesn't Help If You Don't Have The Good Programmers And/Or Good Management Systems (The NHS, Schools) Later. Mark. -- These are my views, not my company's. You may copy these views and alter them under the same licence as perl itself.
New Mongers' Script Archive Update
I am posting an update of what's going on with this to the list because, erm, dave told me to. Right, this is what has happened/will happen: At the technical meeting it was decided that we need a developers site; This site should be used primarily to disseminate information about the state of each part of the NMS Archive Project. The proposed format for this site is that for each of the sections will have a page that will have a) a short description of the section b) a summary of the current state of affairs c) a list of *current* files d) a weblog of the recent changes e) a pumpking The sections will be * the website itself * the unix install * the windows install * the mac install * one for each script The front page will have, in addition to a link to each of the pages, a quick summary of the state of affairs of the project and a collection of the most recent entries from all the weblogs The technology to do all of this will be quick and dirty. The reasoning for this is simple: 1) Let's do it quickly, and we can refactor later. 2) The code we're using isn't that complicated and something like CVS would probably be an overkill. Likewise for a proper bugzilla system. 3) All changes should be go through the pumpking for each of the individual sections so this shouldn't be a problem People that have agreed to be pumpkings so far: Mark Fowler (that's me) agreed to be website pumpking Simon Batistoni agreed to be windows install pumpking. Paul Mison agreed to be mac install pumpking If you agreed to write a script, you're pumpking for that (note that pumpkings can hand the responsibility to other people if they want) The developers website is working now, and it's just a matter of slapping in the code for listing files, editing the weblogs, and um the sections. Shouldn't take that long then ;-) The trial website should be up in the next week or so[1] and I'll post more info to the list once it's done. Later. Mark. NRN. [1] Damn nice weather making me want to sit in the sun. -- dammit jim I'm a doctor not a signature line
Re: Monitors
On Fri, 11 May 2001, Dominic Mitchell wrote: How many things do you have on top of your monitor? Hmm. I usually have a technic lego bike (thanks secret santa.) Also floating around in my geek sphere at the moment is: - A wind up clockwork chick (as in 'chicken,' not as in 'woman') - Coffee Mug (extra large) Empty Caffinated Mints boxes. - A Beach ball - A copy of 'e' and the 'bofh' books - Various O'Reilly books (mostly blue) and a Manning Book (the other one is on the main bookshelf) - A SPACED DVD, A copy of the 'Worms World Party' computer game. - A large card that has 'Horror' printed on one side and 'Beauty' on the other. - Simpsons' daily desk calendar - One arm of my chair (that I removed because it was annoying me and now use as a book holder) - Palms (multiple,) Laptop, flash memory and other computer hardware items (such as a PCMICA network card that I borrowed off of leon and then never returned.) At home on top of my monitor is a Mars Bar that I was presented for 'putting up the most from another perl monger while they were in another country' (I don't eat chocolate.) Later. Mark.
Re: Bah!
On Thu, 10 May 2001, David Cantrell wrote: thinks has anyone done TeX goodness with Template Toolkit? See the latest post to the TT mailing list: http://www.template-toolkit.org/pipermail/templates/2001-May/000931.html Later. Mark.
RE: sing if you're happy that way
On Tue, 8 May 2001, Lucy McWilliam wrote: L. Never argue with a biologist. Why not? Not that I ever would, you understand...just wondering what the exact precedent for this is? -- mark wrote this Disclaimer: The above statement is not intended to be legally binding
Re: Not Matt's Scripts
On 30 Apr 2001, Dave Hodgkinson wrote: I've got someone needing a form to mail script. Where's ours[0]? According to my records, Dave C was doing it. Dave? Later. Mark. -- mark typed this
Re: MySQL - Oracle wrapper/compat. libs
On Fri, 27 Apr 2001, Robin Szemeti wrote: On Fri, 27 Apr 2001, someone who Robin's attrib to fscked up wrote: [side note: I did just see a bizarre thread in macosx-dev where one guy claimed his FFT code was executing faster in Java than C because its interpreter used runtime info to optimize it. Search on 'informal benchmarks'] uh huh .. but he's a Java programmer .. his C could be *REALLY* bad ;) .. favourite Java quote 'If javas garbage collector is damn good, how come the whole thing doesn't delete itself upon execution?' Don't see why this isn't possible. The idea is that you factor out *all* really unlikely cases (how you know this is based on past performance) and catch them all with some simple test. Then you (more expensively, but who cares since this happens only once in a blue moon) deal with it and work out exactly what was the problem. Another example, you could use a processor level exception to catch those pesky divide by zero errors (which is very expensive if it fires, but much much cheaper each time round than explictly checking it.) The advantage is that a compiler doesn't have this information lying around - you can't tell from the code how often cases come up; You need to profile at run time as you go. Sorry if this is all babble. I haven't had much sleep. Later. Mark. -- who *still* hasn't got round to getting a new .signature
Re: MySQL - Oracle wrapper/compat. libs
On Wed, 25 Apr 2001, David Cantrell wrote: Trouble is, they all have non-standard extensions, which are *really* handy and which you *will* use if you don't know any better. For example, MySQL has AUTO_INCREMENT fields which are dead useful for id fields; the closest Oracle equivalent would be using a sequence. Why you say don't know better, what should I use instead of this. Is there any sensible way to do this in bog standard SQL that won't have a massive perfomance hit on mysql? Later. Mark. -- mark still hasn't replaced his sig.
Template Toolkit and XPath notes
Have been uploaded to london.pm.org. And by jove, with a ickle bit of httpd.conf bashing they even render out okay. Shame about the spelling mistakes though. http://london.pm.org/~mark/ttxpath/ Later. Mark.
Re: Mutagenic modules: online slides
On Fri, 20 Apr 2001, Robin Houston wrote: On Thu, Apr 19, 2001 at 11:57:01PM +0100, Simon Cozens wrote: Funny. You've come across the same idea I did. http://simon-cozens.org/pg.pdf Having now read your paper, I think that in some ways it's the *opposite* idea; or at least a complementary one. You want to take arbitrary languages, and execute them as if they were Perl. I want to take Perl and execute it as if it were an arbitrary language :-) Here be dragons. Later. Mark. P.S. You might want to have a look at File::Remote (as this 'overrides' open and changes it's meaning.) Oh and http://www.mail-archive.com/london-pm%40lists.dircon.co.uk/msg03442.html -- ENOSIGSIGONOTHERMACHINE
RE: Mutagenic modules: online slides
On Fri, 20 Apr 2001, dcross - David Cross wrote: Mark Fowler wrote on the 20th April: On Fri, 20 Apr 2001, Robin Houston wrote: You want to take arbitrary languages, and execute them as if they were Perl. I want to take Perl and execute it as if it were an arbitrary language :-) Here be dragons. "You can't just make up any old shit and expect the computer to know what you mean, retardo!" It's more like DWRM programming (do what robin means.) Later. Mark. -- ESIGSTILLONOTHERCOMPUTER EUSERTOOLAZYTOUSESCP
Tk::Canvas Rectangles
Watching veeg's really cool music program in Tk last night reminded me that I've got a slight problem with something I was writing with Tk::Canvas... If I create a rectangle, how do I go about changing its width and height? Any ideas? Mark. -- ENOSIGSIGSTILLONOTHERSERVER
RE: Tech mtg?
On Wed, 18 Apr 2001, Dave Cross wrote: At 17:08 18/04/2001, jo walsh wrote: this all gives me a creeping sense of deja type yeah, i've just looked and realised it says almost exactly the same thing on the website, except in more detail: http://london.pm.org/WhatDo.shtml Did _I_ do that? Whatever happened to my memory? (rhetorical!) Kind of. I noticed that you'd cunningly left it in elite web reader mode with the directions still there from last time, just commented out. Of course, as we all read the web by using telnet or (for the advanced) GET we all saw this an knew what was actually going on. But I thought I'd better just alter it an ickle for those damn mozilla/netscape/ie/opera/lynx users who wern't seeing it. Hope you don't mind. Later. Mark. (tech support ninja in training) ESIGONOTHERMACHINE
Re: London.pm List Weekly Summary 2001-04-16
On Thu, 19 Apr 2001, Greg McCarroll wrote: On Thu, 19 Apr 2001, Simon Wistow wrote: This is the thirteenth of hopefully many weekly summaries of the London Perl Mongers mailing list. For the week starting 2001-04-16: Greg McCarroll asked about online brokers, Robert and *GUNSHOT* *queue eastenders theme track* ( or dallas if you really want ) voice_over Tune in next week to find out who shot Simon! Was it a Randal? Was it the father of his ex-girlfriend? Was it a crazed YAPC::Europe organiser remembering the aniversary of PIMB fiasco? /voice_over Oh don't start that again. I had enough of that last time round. Later. Mark Fowler.
Re: NWS (was Re: Technical Meeting - 19th April)
On Tue, 17 Apr 2001, Struan Donald wrote: * at 17/04 14:00 +0200 Philip Newton said: Mark Fowler wrote: 3) Write a set of scripts that are all basically the same but have different #!/usr/bin/perl lines on the top and tell you the with a bunch of different extensions such as .pl .plx .cgi for combinations of "operating system" + web server that map scripts to interpreters by extension and/or directory rather than by shebang line... surely there should be a better way than this? after all the combinations involved are quite numerous. is the notion of something that does : #!/bin/sh if [ -e /usr/bin/perl ]; then exec './bin_perl.pl' fi or equivalent too silly? although not sure this sort of thing is possible on non unix type systems. OTOH would at least cut down the number of files that the person installing needs to worry about. I don't particularly see the number of scripts this person is installing as a problem. The key concept is that these scripts are designed so that someone who knows *nothing* about their system can basically upload them all then see which one works. Once they've got this script working the script should contain instructions on how to modify any of the other scripts to work with their server. I don't think what you're suggesting will work at all on windows. Or pure mod_perl... Feel free to disagree, I'm just suggesting ideas here. Honestly, I'm not sure what's the best way... Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Technical Meeting - 19th April
On Mon, 9 Apr 2001, dcross - David Cross wrote: As usual I'll aim at having four or five lightning talks and two or three longer talks. I could do a lightening talk on playing around with skinning stuff with Template Toolkit's brand spanking new VIEW directive. This would be very quick as we've seen Andy do this kind of thing before in the pre-release version. I'd be skinning XML again in my example, but this time I'd be using XML::XPath... I'll also be able to give a quick status update on the website for NMS (probably at the same time as I'll be using it as my example) Later. Mark. (Who thinks this is almost a show 'n' tell situation) -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
RE: the 2nd best london.pm meeting of all time
On Fri, 6 Apr 2001, dcross - David Cross wrote: The stolen wine by the thames at 1am was a particularly nice feature. Oh $deity. Are we going to be barred from Vinopolis now? To clarify: We did actually pay for the wine IIRC, but strictly speaking we shouldn't have removed it from the resturant. Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Test
On Fri, 6 Apr 2001, Merijn Broeren wrote: # Else use lynx to view it as text text/html; lynx -dump %s; copiousoutput Quick question for us non mutt users that may one day consider using it. Does this run throgh the shell? And what's %s in this? I'm kinda hoping it's not able to be '; rm -rf ~/*' or worse, if you get my drift Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Backslash
Slashdot, and everything else running Slash (i.e. use.perl.org) seem to no longer be doing XML RSS feeds, but a custom DTD called 'backslash'. I was wondering if anyone knows anything about this. I'm currently working on building summaries of sites, and then things from these summaries. I was planning to build RSS documents for each of them using XML::RSS (following the helpful section in dmwp.) I was wondering: a) What and Why is backslash? b) Is this better/worse/indifferent? Should I use it instead? c) How do I parse it (XML::RSS doesn't work, am I going to have to code it from hand?) Dipsy seems to be able to cope with this.. Later. Mark. http://slashdot.org/slashdot.xml http://slashdot.org/backslash.dtd -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Grammar (was: Re: Linux.com Online Chat)
On 4 Apr 2001, Dave Hodgkinson wrote: Dominic Mitchell [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: ObPerl: So which is harder to parse? Perl or English? Time flies like an arrow Fruit flies like a banana Parse that and stay fashionable... They're both Type 0, though one *could* argue that Perl was really type 1 and the grammar is defined by a really really big C program Perl is easier to parse simply because all the irregularities are known and documented. They're not in English. In addition to the above example, consider "The British Left Waffles on Argentina" Which requires you to know about the concepts of political persuasion, waffling as talking at length, usage of 'on' as 'about' etc, or you end up with some careless people leaving behind breakfast items in a far off land... Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Linux.com Online Chat
On Wed, 4 Apr 2001, dcross - David Cross wrote: Tue Apr 17th, 2001 (12:00 pm US/Pacific) In english? -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Grammar (was: Re: Linux.com Online Chat)
On Wed, 4 Apr 2001, Simon Cozens wrote: On Wed, Apr 04, 2001 at 10:31:41AM +0100, Mark Fowler wrote: Perl is easier to parse simply because all the irregularities are known and documented. They're not in English. In addition to the above ^^ Uhm, where? The perl source code *is* the documentation. There is no direct equivalent for the English language, as it is really whatever we think is the case at the time - or, more accurately, what the largest number of the intended audience would understand it to mean. Perl requires a similar amount of knowledge to parse, although the knowledge is rather more domain specific - what subs are defined, what globs are available, what packages are defined, what filehandles are open, and so on. Ah, but with perl code there is a definite 'correct' parsing (whatever /usr/bin/perl does[1]) but with the English language that isn't true. Later. Mark. (Waving hands around in the air as he speaks) [1] This is that there is only one 'correct' parsing. This may not be what you thought you meant, or the coders who coded perl itself thought you would have meant...but it is what you said. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Grammar (was: Re: Linux.com Online Chat)
On Wed, 4 Apr 2001, Simon Cozens wrote: On Wed, Apr 04, 2001 at 02:10:11PM +0100, Mark Fowler wrote: Ah, but with perl code there is a definite 'correct' parsing (whatever /usr/bin/perl does[1]) but with the English language that isn't true. I'm afraid that's as silly as me declaring that there's only one correct parsing of English, and that's how *I* parse it. No it's not that silly ;-) Maybe it's on the same level of silliness as the concept of 'the Queen's English' (the idea being that the Queen 'owns' the language and anyone else has to speak/parse as the queen does) as you could consider that /usr/bin/perl 'owns' the language and that all other perl processors better do the same thing as /usr/bin/perl or get scoffed at down the local for talking funny... Anyway, we're getting off topic. I was just saying that the reason we can parse perl and not English is that though they are both type 0 grammars is that perl is defined by 'what /usr/bin/perl currently parses' and we have *all* of that written down as the source code (though not all of it produces expected results) where we don't have a definitive list of the entire of English because that requires a *huge* degree of cultural background information. I'm sure there's a point here in replacing all Human - computer speech interfaces that use English as a command language to making everyone talk perl, but this topic is getting silly enough. Beer, Buffy, Beer, Buffy. Later. Mark. (going back to writing HTML for NMS now) -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: [schwern@pobox.com: DNA.pm]
On Sun, 1 Apr 2001, Greg McCarroll wrote: Actually, i'm quite pleased Leon implemented Buffy.pm and took up the namespace before we started inventing modules for all of Sunnydale, along the lines of I was so going to have a Buffy.pm that slayed out of control deamons. And of course, it'd need a Giles.pm that kept track of deamons and noticed when one was using too much CPU/memory, etc. And a Willow.pm to invoke new deamons when Buffy.pm had killed them all... ..Oh and a Xander.pm that did absolutly nothing apart from check that Buffy.pm, Giles.pm and Willow.pm themselves hadn't gone out of control. Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Buffy
On Sun, 1 Apr 2001, Leon Brocard wrote: http://www.astray.com/Buffy/ First diff. And it's a documentation patch for us pedantic people. 40c40 Buffy - An encryption scheme for Buffy the Vampire Slayer fans --- Buffy - An encoding scheme for Buffy the Vampire Slayer fans -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Job: I'm looking for one..
On Wed, 28 Mar 2001, Paul Makepeace wrote: On Wed, Mar 28, 2001 at 02:58:36PM +0100, Greg McCarroll wrote: Also i think the lack of Perl certification, is one of the biggest problems with Perl work in london, Are employers there too stupid to read CVs? Or too lazy? I'm too lazy. Speaking as someone who has recently spent a while vetting CVs for people for a job, it's hell. For a experienced perl programmer it's easier for me to tell if you've had the experience by what jobs you've done before. For a mid range programmer (who may have only worked at one company before) it's really hard. CVs are the first step through the door. I'm just trying to assess if you're good enough to have in for an interview. That's where I, and my boss, and probably my bosses boss will actually make the decision. A certification system I could trust would be really helpful. It would save so much time trying to get rid of the guy that came in and said 'I don't use modules, I prefer to write my own code in the script.' et al. Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Still screwing up References: (was Re: Job: I'm looking for one..)
On Thu, 29 Mar 2001, Dave Cross wrote: You're right, the referencing is a bit screwed up. I'll take a look at it today. Your webmail CC is screwed up too. On my mails there's now new line after the Cc: so I get a line that says Cc: X-Mailer: foo which my mail client (PINE) wants to reply to... Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Perl Auto-RPC
Code I wrote to do most of what you people are talking about a couple of weeks back, loading over ssh. This does not work for non-pure perl code. i.e. XS is a no-no The idea I was using it for: a) User presses a button in the web browser b) Downloads .config.html from that directory the site which contains i) The current directory from the server's point of view ii) The address of the perl code to configure this site Both of which have RC5 checksums c) The perl code is downloaded to configure said site and run This starts a Tk widget that can be used to edit config stuff remotely. The key idea behind this is that you need nothing special on the server bar ssh and httpd. And your client need have no special idea of what it needs to have installed. Anyway, the code: use File::Remote; # then later # Setting up the @INC trap # right now we modify @INC so that it will load files from afar # this stolen from p5p - http://www.perl.com/pub/2001/03/ # p5pdigest/THISWEEK-20010305.html push @INC, sub { my $foo = shift; my $modname = shift; # this is going through scp - make all :: into / $modname =~ s|::|/|; # combine the paths my $filename = $codepath.$modname; # create a $remote object my $remote = File::Remote-new( rsh = '/usr/bin/ssh', rcp = '/usr/bin/scp',); my $fh = new IO::Handle; # open the thingy as if by magic, returning # undef if there is a problem $remote-open($fh, $filename) or return undef; return $fh; } -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: originality
On Tue, 27 Mar 2001, Greg McCarroll wrote: * Dave Cross ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: At Tue, 27 Mar 2001 11:41:05 +0100, Chris Heathcote [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sunday morning Perl advocacy at Speaker's Corner This _really_ should happen. well then, lets store it up - next time we get a visitor whos up for it, we will do it, then retire to somewhere for sunday lunch. Okay, may I suggest the summer? Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: That book
L. said: World domination is ours. Muahahaha! Not if we can't come up with a good name for not matt's script archive it won't be. Ideas to the usual address. *Please* Later. Mark. (damnit Jim, I'm a Technology Developer, not a Copywriter) -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: That book
On Fri, 23 Mar 2001, Matthew Byng-Maddick wrote: On Fri, 23 Mar 2001, Mark Fowler wrote: World domination is ours. Muahahaha! Not if we can't come up with a good name for not matt's script archive it won't be. I don't think we tried "London.pm's Script Archive", did we? :) Okay, I can live with that. How at http://london.pm.org/scripts/ Later. Mark. (Who will do some HTML this weekend) -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Debuggers (was Re: Perl Training Courses)
On 2001, Mar, 22, Thu, Cross, Dave wrote: Now with added pointy and clickyness. Now with added Ludditeness. Dave. Luddite n 1 : any opponent of technological progress [syn: {Luddite}] 2: one of the 19th century English workman who destroyed labor-saving machinery that they thought would cause unemployment [syn: {Luddite}] You're sounding a little too much like a heretic to me Dave...all that crashing and destroying of stuff ;-) Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: ISO8601 [was] Re: Pointless, Badly-Written Module.
On 2001, Mar, 21, Wed Pauley, Marley wrote: That would work if 'significant' was well defined in relation to names, but it isn't. It works with dates because 'significant' has a well defined meaning in relation to numerical quantities. I wonder what Larry thinks about this. Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Matt's Scripts Projects
On the subject of having zip archives as well as tarballs on the server, Gareth Harper said: Winzip (what most windows users these days use to unzip) handlers tar.gz by default so that may not be neccesary. Not neccesary from a techical point of view. Neccesary from a social point of view (What's this extension! I don't understand! What's going on! What are all these weird charges from AOL? etc) Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Pointless, Badly-Written Module.
On Tue, 20 Mar 2001, Dave Cross wrote: Take a look at this http://search.cpan.org/search?dist=Date-MMDDYY. Now give me: a) a two reasons why this module should never have been written, and 1) I'm English. MMDDYY makes not sense. Maybe that's just a gripe about the name. 2) Time::Object rocks. b) as many flaws as possible in the implementation. no 'use strict' should use prototypes to force scalar context on the string passed (but see below for gripe) Spliting up the string representation of a time is a bad thing and why not just use the array format of gmtime/localtime. no 'my @format' no 'my $delem' no 'my @time_array' The whole string with delimeters thing is silly and just let people pass each formating thing in @_ directly. no 'my @final_date' # but with an undef! does not die, or return undef, or do anything sensible with an error, just returns 'Error'. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
RE: Pointless, Badly-Written Module.
Oh it's dreadful. We need quality control on CPAN before more of this gets through. Hmm. Karma would workOr sponsorship. 'Larry Wall uses $modulename, you should too' Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Dedrat 7.0 and PGP
On Sat, 17 Mar 2001, David Cantrell wrote: On Sat, Mar 17, 2001 at 02:01:11PM +, Robin Szemeti wrote: On Sat, 17 Mar 2001, someone wrote: I'm using 7.0, and hating it. I should never have upgraded. I am beginning to wonder whether we should have gone that route on the swerver .. bu still.. too late now. What I'm really hating is the stuff that broke when I upgraded from 6.2. Mainly X font stuff, and I rally can't be bothered to dig through the gazillion different places that X puts stuff so I can fix it. Hmm. Both my laptop and desktop are running 6.2 atm. I find that whenever I do a helix-gnome update (or whatever they're calling it this week) it breaks the fonts. The server works fine, it's just that the /etc/rc.d/init.d/xfs file is knackered. Typing xfs from the command line still works fine for me, so I'd check that first as it's probably the same b0rken RPM they both install. I'm running 6.2 with the following key additions: helix-gnome, perl 5.6, new apache (with mod_perl), sudo, and the 2.4.2 kernel. I recently installed my laptop from scratch and this took me about a day to install (+ a day fscking around with partition magic and windows.) It Works For Me(tm) but I'm sure there's a better way. Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Matt's Scripts Projects
On Mon, 19 Mar 2001, Dave Cross wrote: * Web page. Need somewhere to point potential users at. Probably two versions - one for the developers and one for the users. This can be a subdirectory on london.pm.org. I don't mind doing this bit of it. I would quite like the idea of creating a few web pages for someone other than myself or for work for a bit, unless anyone's got any objections... Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Matt's Scripts Projects
It has occured to us we need a decent name for this. Discussion on IRC has concluded that: a) It shouldn't mention Matt in the title. b) That is should have a name that appeals to newbies. c) It should sound at least semi-professional[1]. But apart from that we've been useless Later. Mark. [1] Okay, so I added this one myself, but I think it's a good idea. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: wasn't someone looking for some diagramming - SQL stuff recently?
On Fri, 16 Mar 2001, James Powell wrote: http://freshmeat.net/projects/dia2sql/ I was looking for some tools to create diagrams with but Ooooh! Anyhow, now all we need is a GraphViz to dia tool ;-). Which reminds me, how's things going with your Perl-UML Aaron? Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
RE: Matt's Scripts
Finding out where perl is parody Stop, stop, this script archive is not ready yet! Where are the Hello world examples? Where are the detailed instructions? And why are you actually working on these scripts yet! /parody You're all getting ahead of yourselves. We need to write a set of helloWorld scripts that the script user can upload first to find out the basic facts about their server and check everything is working. a) You have multiple copys of the script with different shebang lines on the top. Only one of these will work and one of the things it'll do is print our is "The first line of programs you upload to this server should be #!/blah/perl" b) It checks your perl version is reasonable. Actually it probably should do this before a) in case there are several versions installed. c) It tests if you've got a borken version of CGI.pm (or CGI.pm at all) by looking at version numbers, etc. Same for other modules. d) It links to an image in the same directory as itself and explains that if the image isn't viewable then you do not have inplace cgi and the things you have to know about this e) It prints out the time, and GMT time thus highlighting to the user any problems they might have if this is wrong f) It prints out a hunk of diagnostic information (e.g. perl version, module versions, url, etc, etc) Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Matt's Scripts
(What do you mean with "not-inplace cgi"?) Some servers (like my own) are configured to allow you to run perl scripts anywhere. Some servers (especially in the paranoid ISP land) are configured to have a /cgi-bin/ where you have to put files in that will be 'executed'. Typically you cannot read from these dirs with a web server (you can only execute the program and read their output.) This is so that if you have passwords in your scripts it's very hard for the bad guys to read these files and get the script via the webserver no matter what mistakes you make (e.g. if you accidentlally leave backup files around.) The main drawback of this is that you can't serve normal files (like images) from the same directory. I call the first 'in place cgi' and the latter 'cgi-bin' Hope that's clear. Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Matt's Scripts
is there an idiot-proof graphical front-end for scp? windows? On Windows I use pscp which comes from the same people as putty. It works well, but it doesn't have a pretty graphical front-end. Yes there is. http://www.i-tree.org/ixplorer.htm. I suggest you peeps read http://www.openssh.org/windows.html which lists alternatives -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Matt's Scripts
On Wed, 14 Mar 2001, Greg McCarroll wrote: * Dave Cross ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: At Wed, 14 Mar 2001 14:34:32 + (GMT), Jon Eyre [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My several users use scp. is there an idiot-proof graphical front-end for scp? windows clients? my several users require them, or they'll just continue using ftp, because it's *easier*... They won't if you stop running the ftp daemon on the server :) Rule one of security: Ensure availability for authorised users this breaks it ;-) Do what we do. Keep everything running, but shove a whopping great ipchains (or firewall of choice) in the way. If you want to access it, ssh tunnel it first. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Matt's Scripts
Yes there is. http://www.i-tree.org/ixplorer.htm. I've since installed WinSCP, from the list of alternatives on OpenSSH This is also based on PuTTY and isn't so, well, dodgy as iXplorer. Forget I ever mentioned it. Seems to work well for me. The interface is clunky (i.e. you have to press F5 to copy rather than drag and drop) but is still something your average windows user would have no problems using. http://winscp.vse.cz/eng/ (we should have just googled for winscp in the first place) Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: London.pm List Weekly Summary 2001-03-12
Leo Lapworth was trying to debug something with Devel::DProf and couldn't understand why BEGIN was called more than once. Robert Price and Mark Fowler pointed out that 'use Module LIST' is exactly equivalent to 'BEGIN { require Module; import Module LIST; }', so the module was being use-d in multiple places, which is fine: http://www.mail-archive.com/london-pm%40lists.dircon.co.uk/msg02667.html Did I? It's not you know. You forgot this bit of the perldoc -f use as well: If you don't want your namespace altered, explicitly supply an empty list: use Module (); That is exactly equivalent to BEGIN { require Module } i.e. that use Module and use Module() are ne. Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: London.pm List Weekly Summary 2001-03-12
Content-type: matter-transport/beer-stream That's not right. MIMEs do type/format (e.g. image/gif.) So it'd more likely be: Content-type: beer/guinness Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Strange Request
and here we get back to the ROPE project as discussed before, where we could do a standard distribution of Apache/Mod Perl/Perl/Perl modules, with TT, XML::*, etc.,etc. already there Might not be a bad idea doing each of these in each of the technologies anyhow. It might prove a good way of showing how each of these work. The biggest problem I have with using these 'branches' of perl is knowing where to start. If we had a collection of standard scripts that was re-written each time in TT, XML::* or whatever, then I (or other clueless monkeys like me) could work from what they know how to start, where to go, etc, etc. Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Matt's Scripts
Textclock Mark Countdown Mark Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Kevin Smith Film Fest
I'll also draw a map at some point Details at http://www.twoshortplanks.com/simon/filmfest/ In order to try and finish at a vaguely reasonable hour I'm going to start early. So, my house, 2pm for a 2:30 start on Saturday. Want us to bring anything? Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Am I going nutts ? - read before answering!
Yup, that's right. So to get it to only have the one call, change your "use" to a require and put it in the BEGIN block. nitpick number="1" use fred; Will also call fred-import(), so you might want to emulate that too. /nitpick nitpick number="2" type="lesser" -- Robert Price - Technical Manager - EMAP Digital Travel | Tel: 0207 3092711 Priory Court, 30-32 Farringdon Lane, London, EC1R 3AW | Fax: 0207 3092718 Shouldn't these numbers be formatted 020 7XXX Later. Mark. /nitpick -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Graphical Documentation
On Tue, 6 Mar 2001, Marcel Grunauer wrote: 1. Thingys showing SQL tables. Have a look at http://www.codewerk.com. On the projects page, download GraphViz::DBI and dbigraph.pl. See the sample database table graph linked from that page. I'm working on making it more flexible and pretty. Oooh, ahhh. Looks really nice. Now the only problem with this is that it requires me to actually have created the database. We're not at this stage yet (though I will see if I can knock up a diagram of our current old database schema so we can have some reference.) Oh, there seems to be something odd with that server set up. Because my copy of Gnome-Terminal does url catching I can Ctrl-Click on any url and it pops up in netscape. However, being a good url catcher it matches the '.' at the end of the url (as it should do.) Now this is really odd, as 'http://www.codewerk.com./' does not show the same thing as 'http://www.codewerk.com/' (which it should do as 'www.codewerk.com.profero.com' or 'www.codewerk.com.loc0.profero.com' doesn't exist on our network.) This is most odd. I've tried it from other locations (via the wonders of ssh tunnelling) and I get the same thing. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Graphical Documentation
ELLO london.pm.org. Long time no C[1]. I'm needing some programs to produce graphical documentation[2], and as I'm feeling lazy (which is a good thing, right,) so rather than writing my own, I thought I'd ask you lot what you thought were the best tools out there. I need to produce: 1. Thingys showing SQL tables. 2. Thingys showing OO abstraction Nethier of these need to be in any particular form. They just have to make sense to me. Ideally, I'd like somehthing that would run on Windows or Linux (i.e. written in Perl) but you get the idea. Later. Marks. [1] Or no Perl, more to the point. I'm back online. As for a week offline: Let us never talk of it again) [2] This is a 'oh, god this is complicated and I need to see what's going on' kind of problem not a 'management don't get it' kinda problem -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Off the grid.
Right, that's it. I've had enough. I'm off the 'net for little over a week - I'm trying an experiment to see what happens if I don't use a computer for a week. This is a sanity recovering exercise. I'll let you know what happens. See you at the meetings. Those of you that I've arranged to do stuff, call me about it, okay? Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: t-shirts
Perl t-shirt ideas =pod =head1 Bad Perl T-Shirt Ideas Sorry. =head2 perl related * "My other t-shirt has a camel on it" * "I know perl" "Show me" * "If you programmed in perl you'd be home by now" * "You don't have to be mad to program perl, but it helps" * "95% of cats prefer programming perl over any other language" * "Perl. There is no a." * "mod_perl. It's not a quake add on. It's more fun than that" =head2 lpm related * "London.pm: we camels" * "I want a PONY!", on the back (("PONY"x10)."\n")x40 =head2 joke within a joke (PIMB ref) * "#! perl is my programming language of choice" * "#! perl is my itch" (preferably in the same blue, same font) * "Smack my perl up" * "Muttley is a Arsehole" (let's see Randall complain about that) * "I blame Wistow for *everything*" =head2 random * "XP programmers do it in pairs" * "This is not a credit or debit card" * "Just another local who happened to be in your holiday photo" * "If you lived here you'd be like all the other voices" * Front: "Why?" Back: "Why not?" * On front and back "humorous slogan on other side" * "This is a t-shirt. There are many like it. But this is mine" * on the back "Stop following me" =head2 and finally #!/usr/bin/perl $shop = undef; { local $shop = {}; $this = $shop; local @people = residents; for (@people) {$this-{$_}=\$PreciousThings;} } print HERE $shop-{You}; $shop-{You}-touch if defined($shop-{You}) =cut -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: t-shirts
... I mean .. people will laugh and mock us how could you .. it should be "Muttley is an Arsehole" .. I dunno, such poor grammar these days :)) No, just poor typing I'm afraid. This would only work however if Simon printed and distributed the T-shirts ;-) -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: DMP
Micheal claimed that: amazon uk have started shipping data munging with perl. I have my copy. Indeed they have. I've got mine now. They're also shipping the mod_perl pocket reference. [% UNLESS office_policy_to_use_amazon %] [% INCLUDE standard_reasons_not_to_use_amazon_text %] [% END %] Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: DMP
[% UNLESS office_policy_to_use_amazon %] [% INCLUDE standard_reasons_not_to_use_amazon_text %] [% END %] Someone tell Andy, this doesn't seem to be working. Either that or you lot felt the need to rehash it all again ;-) Didn't anyone tell you guys that perl automatically rehashes stuff when it gets too big to handle anyway... Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Pony and Buffy (was Re: Mailing List Stuff)
On Fri, 2 Feb 2001, Michael Stevens wrote: On Fri, Feb 02, 2001 at 12:34:15PM +, Robin Houston wrote: what is it with ponys? I've wondered that too. Seems to be a #perl obsession... purl pony [purl] pony is replyGimme a Pony! Pony! Pony! Pony Pony Pony! Pony Pony Pony! Pony Pony Pony! Pony Pony Pony! Pony Pony Pony! Pony Pony Pony! Pony Pony Pony! Michael Obviously one good meme deserves another: - *dipsy* buffy? *dipsy* trelane: wish i knew *dipsy* purl knew: buffy is reply I want BUFFY! Buffy! Buffy! Buffy! Buffy +Buffy Buffy! Buffy Buffy Buffy! Buffy Buffy Buffy! Buffy Buffy Buffy! Okay, own up, who was this ;-) ? And more importantly, who told dipsy to forget Buffy... -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
OT: Buffy (or not OT, depending on your point of view)
So I watched the Buffy film for the first time, and I don't see what you're all complaining about - or rather I do, but I don't care. Sure, the first 40 minutes are a bit painful, and the vampires are a bit daft, but I can see where we're going. There's even some good banter in there and some truly excellent backflips by the end - it just takes that long for Buffy to turn into Buffy (rather than some Cordelia like creature) The one thing that gets me is that does anyone remember the trailer for this film? I seem to remember this bit where Donald Sutherland throws a knife at Kirsy Swanson and she catches it between two palms in front of her head. Now I didn't see this in the movie. Does anyone else remember this? Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Bad programming considered harmless
Look at what Sun says Java is not suitable for to get a short list. IIRC they included stuff such as life support machinery in hospitals, air traffic control, and nuclear reactors. Space Shuttle or manned-space-flight rocket I think this is primarily because Java is not a real-time language (as in specifiable bounded time for each operation) on account of Java insisting on providing garbage collection which is almost impossible to do efficiently in real time. This is primarily because the code that makes up Java hasn't ever been proven (in a maths sense) to work. GCC comes with the following disclaimer too: this program is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. As for the real time nature of garbage collectors, Shevek and I (and some others) wrote a paper together on this, so I could say a lot here. Especially about how Perl is much more real time as it can do better at allocating and deallocating the same bit of memory (as it instantly knows when memory is free, unlike mark and sweep) and is a lot less likely to cause page faults. Of course, reference counting suffers from the dreaded deep free problem so if you don't program carefully you can very very easily shoot yourself in the time constraint foot too. control logic probably should also be bug free. cue story="the misplaced colon in a Fortran DO loop causing Apollo ?? to crash" / That's an implementation problem. Control logic problems are ones like 'The spacecraft doors shall not be able to be opened manually and shall remain in computer control incase human error causes the inside to be depressurised' and then not realising that in some situations you need to be able to open them both (e.g. internal fire, meteor strike, HAL going nuts) Most problems are control logic problems. The computer implementation ones make better reading though... Later. Mark. P.S. Scary thought: During a transatlantic flight on average cosmic radiation flips at least one bit of the control systems memory. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Xinerama
Question 1. Can I make a second X server into a second monitor (well, in my case a third one) I doubt it, so here's question two Question 2. If I can't, is there any easy way to control client placement/move stuff around in Perl remotely? I've played with eesh before (I'm runnin E) but I wondered if there was a better way that talking in some weird way to do this that isn't so icky. I forsee many problems with running multiple copies of X on the same machine. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: irc problems
IRC's IP, anyone? 195.82.114.160 london.rhizomatic.net === astray.com === twoshortplanks.com === huckvale.net (which is easier to remeber than IP numbers Shirley) Should really get round to seconding the DNS methinks. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Fwd: [uri@sysarch.com: free copy of data munging with perl]
It's starting to sound like I@m the only bugger who _hasn't_ got a copy of my book yet :( Fret not, fearless nominal leader. Mine hasn't arrived yet either. Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: 33 mails
grep complained: how the f*** did you lot send 33 mails to this list between when i left work and now? sheesh Practice? We learn quickly, o wise teacher. Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Mailing List Archive
This is my two pence worth: 1. I stand by everything I've ever said on the the list. If I didn't mean it I wouldn't have said it. 2. However, I can see problems with people taking things I've said out of context. Pah, so be it. This is the problem with the world. 3. If I wanted to say something in private, I'd do it off list. Or on irc. Or on one of the private lists I'm a member of. 4. However, it is apparent that certain people (read headhunters) are reading this list and taking advantage of it (using my phone number.) 5. As far as stuff getting back to my employer, well my employer has benefited from me being on list something chronic. The knowledge I've gained, amongst other things, has been highly useful. P.S. I'm late for work. Daryl, if you're reading this then I owe you an extra hour ;-) So in conclusion, I'm for an open list. But I don't care enough to object either way. joke I think the real question should be, do we munge reply-tos or not /joke Later. Mark. P.S. Oi, recruiters. I'm happy where I work. Ta. 1984: These are my personal opinions, and do not represent my employer. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Mailing List Archive
Dave Cross wibbled: The other week I dug out the original comp.lang.perl.misc post. I think I have a recording of someone bashing a stick near a big black rectangle somewhere too... Is this a collective attempt to crash mail archiving bots by posting so much that they get overloaded and fall over? ;-) Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: odd -w effect
As I seemed to be destined to be ignored, I'll do what I should have done and shoult a little louder: UltraEdit32 is a really good windows editor[1] if you like the way of Windows. It does all the right things (in the way that perl does all the right things) with line endings. And a lot more (but in a good way, not in a bloat way) If you're on Windows and you want to be on Linux then get emacs or whatever, which do work, but don't bitch about the people using their metophor of choice not using emacs. Just bitch at them for using a shit program (e.g. notepad) and give them a really nice windows style program (e.g. ultraedit). TMTOWTDI. Later. Mark. [1] It's shareware. It's actually the last commerical software (excluding games) I bought. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Mail-To Munging - was Re: Conslutancy
Grep ignored with : Si wibbled at grep : No. When you reply-all it replies to the sender *AND* the list. So the sender gets two copies of everything. Which is just fricking irritating *AND* a waste of bandwidth. la la la la *has hands over ears* i cant here you, la la la la Worse than this, the person who you are replying to tends to get their copy not via the list. With a slow list server it means the sender gets a copy *way* before the rest of the group. This tends to lead to 'tit-for-tat' type discussions that are simply 'broadcast' to the list as the rest of the list don't even have a hope of keeping up and jumping in - they're still getting the original message when another six or so have been sent. This defeats the whole point of the the list. Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Consultancy company
Roger claimed that: This XP approach seems to require a lot more firmness in customer relations than I've ever seen - and if that firmness were present, we wouldn't need XP anyway... One of the main problems with full disclosure with the client is that it can only ever work when you've only got one client. In my job you tend to be working on more than one project at any given time; I certainly don't think I'd like to be the one to tell the client 'sorry this is late, but there was this unexpected problem with some work we were doing for another client and it took up all our time'. Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Consultancy company
On Mon, 22 Jan 2001, Leon Brocard wrote: Dave Mee sent the following bits through the ether: One of the best solutions I've come accross to this problem is to take an iterative approach to development. Inded. Look at XP. The whole idea is that at the end of every day / week you have changed something and can show it to the client again. This way the client really understands what he really wants. This even works well if you are working on projects for yourself. It's a very good way of maintaining focus and not going off on tangents when you're programming. Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Hardware Upgrade Fund
[1] My first name is actually Christopher, but handily my parents changed [Oddly enough, same here. I'm Chris Paul ... It's an absolute pain in the arse. Note to parents: don't do this.] I know a Andrew Christopher Jackson that's known as Chris. So it's not just Christopher that's shunned... 128MB RAM and a K6 is quite enough to run a decently hammered mod_perl site. You only need more memory if you end up using a large database or doing something rash like install Oracle. Assuming you're not on an OC-12 backbone and you're not doing finite element analysis of an F15 jet per form submission, your IO bottleneck will be the net. I would think that more RAM is a good idea. This is because: 1. It's cheap right now 2. We're a varied range of people so will probably want to load a whole host of modules in mod-perl. This will probably make our httpd rather fat and take up a lot of memory - much more if it was a simple production machine. Building reliability is probably your best aim: does it have a UPS? does it have a RAID 1/0 config? Dual PSUs? Tape drive backup policy? Those things are way more important than a faster chip or RAM. Along these lines I'd buy another hard drive. Having lots of hard drive space is good for backups - most time data is lost not due to hardware failure but the directory stucture it's in being trashed through human/coding error. Simply back up to another area. Also if we keep the original drive we can simply backup to that nightly. Quicker and easier than tapes - and as we've said any long term data should really be backed up by individual users anyway, so we need not worry about things like state51 burning down (well, as far as the server data is concerned) For the record, my box, heavly used used by myself, Leon, Simon, Shevek, and Magnus for 2shortplanks.com / astray.com / huckvale.net / anarres.org is: model name : AMD-K6(tm) 3D processor stepping: 12 cpu MHz : 501.143806 total:used:free: shared: buffers: cached: Mem: 264376320 208822272 4048 47583232 25063424 128712704 Swap: 542826496 32563200 510263296 (Leon, thanks for the memory) Filesystem 1k-blocks Used Available Use% Mounted on /dev/hda6821340164 816634860 3890812 100% / /dev/hda115522 3540 11181 24% /boot (actually, that's a lie - df very broke - it's only 18GB - but you get the idea) Later Mark (off to see the offspring) -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Feelers for London Open Source Convention
Take a look at http://www.bath.ac.uk/~bssnrw/getchart.html for a differing viewpoint. Nice BLINK tags. bss? Biological Sciences Staff? Hmmm. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Access Control Lists and Functions
Dieing's probably a bad idea. The idea was for it to set an error stack so that even if you were using this module you would do stuff like my $do = new DO; $do-something(); warn ACL::last_error()."\n" if ACL::error(); which would print out something like "Access to DO::something denied for user x"; Why can't you do this with the standard die semantics? eval { my $do = new DO; $do-something(); } if ($@) { warn $@; } (will work if both $@ is a string or a object that is overriden) Of course if you were using Error.pm you could even use 'try' and 'catch' as syntatic suger. See the Error perldoc. Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Kung Foo and PIMB
Aaron said: [Where is the kung foo night?] anyone? David Hodgkinson wrote: [PIMB T-Shirts] Are there any of these left? New t-shirt idea : "I know Perl!" "Show me!" On the back use Wutan::Style; Later. Mark. P.S. PINE may be silly, but the multiple reply option rocks. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Perl commandments
Thou shalt optimise for programmer time unless absolutely necessary, Thou shalt optimise for programmer time unless O(x(n)) O(y(n)) and n is a suitably large value, where programmer time is both the time for the current programming task and any future programming time that may be expended maintaining this code. Maybe that's not quite as snappy as the Brocard's. Hmm. It would be easier if I could type omegas and stuff. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
JOB: Re: Hiring (not another one :) )
While hiring seems to be the order of the day, just to let you know that AL Digital are hiring at the moment .. (permies only at the moment) ... I can't believe that you didn't mention the really cool arcade machine in reception[1] in the sales pitch. I think that most Perl Mongers would be swayed by this as much as by anything else ;-) Later Mark. (Happily Employed) [1] Table top cabinet[2] with a PC running MAME inside. [2] The kind you can rest a pint on. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Perl commandments
what are O(x(n)) and O(y(n)), i'm not familiar with the x and y notation Okay, I was making it up on the fly; - They're meant to be the functions you're implementing. Hence O(x(n)) is running time of x on the data n, and the same for y. I think the point I was trying to make about future programming time was much more important. Pah...I'm going to read some comics and install FreeBSD now... Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Perl Geek Code
PLPM++I answer questions (correctly) on #london.pm But aren't most of the questions on #london.pm of the form "shall we go down the pub then?", to which there is a simple answer that's almost always correct... I toyed with the idea of taking this out, but I wanted it to be the same as for PP, so that someone who is PP+++ is basically the same as someone who is HLPM++ or suchlike... Later. Mark. -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )
Re: Apache Mods in use
On Wed, 3 Jan 2001, Dean S Wilson wrote: Mod_Perl is third on the list, beaten by FrontPage! Oh the shame ;) http://www.securityspace.com/s_survey/data/man.200012/apachemods.html I agree with Eric Eisenhart's comments on use.perl.org (http://use.perl.org/article.pl?sid=01/01/01/2044233mode=flat) To quote: I think there's one very significant contributing factor: you don't have to install a module to use Perl and installing a module is the easiest way to use PHP. IOW: if you just want to allow people to use Perl and PHP, you only install mod_php, not mod_perl. Once you've reached a point where performance of Perl programs is an issue (or you want to do something more interesting than a CGI) mod_perl is likely to get installed. Later. Mark. P.S. Magnus, why don't you people do this kind of stuff? -- print "\n",map{my$a="\n"if(length$_6);' 'x(36-length($_)/2)."$_\n$a"} ( Name = 'Mark Fowler',Title = 'Technology Developer' , Firm = 'Profero Ltd',Web = 'http://www.profero.com/' , Email = '[EMAIL PROTECTED]', Phone = '+44 (0) 20 7700 9960' )