[qubes-users] Re: How to add "nouveau.modeset=0" to boot settings in Qubes 4.x? (ASUS ROG GL552VW-DM141 laptop)

[@LeeteqXV]

On Friday, February 23, 2018 at 9:29:55 PM UTC+1, Yuraeitha wrote:
> On Friday, February 23, 2018 at 12:10:03 AM UTC+1, @LeeteqXV wrote:
> > Hi all. I initially thought to save some time and cleared a reply
> >   to an existing thread to do a new post, but that did not work.
> >   Sorry about the wrong post. Reposting it here now. Thanks for the
> >   reply and pointing it out, Yuraeitha.
> > 
> > See my reply + follow-up question at the bottom, below the quoted
> >   posts:
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ##
> > 
> > My original post, incl. a reply by "Yuraeitha" below..:
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > "I am considering Qubes 4.x for an ASUS ROG GL552VW-DM141 laptop
> >   with NVIDIA graphics and built-in/onboard "fallback" Intel
> >   graphics.
> >   
> > 
> >   
> > 
> >   In order to get for example Ubuntu Mate installed onto it, to get
> >   past the installer incompatibilities with NVidia, it is necessary
> >   to edit the boot menu and add "nouveau.modeset=0" to the startup
> >   command. Then Ubuntu boots fine.
> >   
> > 
> >   
> > 
> >   Can this be done with Qubes 4.x?
> >   
> > 
> >   How/where to affect such boot commands; can that be done from the
> >   boot media/USB stick directly, as we do with other Linux live USB
> >   sticks?
> >   
> > 
> >   
> > 
> >   Thanks,
> >   "
> > 
> > 
> > -- 
> > https://mastodon.technology/@LeeteqXV/
> > 
> > ###
> > 
> > Reply from "Yuraeitha" on Feb. 19th..:
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > - show
> > quoted text -
> > 
> > 
> > "@LeeteqXV
> > 
> >   It's probably best you start a new thread, this thread is
> >   about a whole different issue altogether.
> > 
> > But since this is an old thread, I'll briefly answer
> >   you. 
> > 
> >   This what you seek, directing a GPU directly into an
> >   AppVM, or any other work arounds, can currently be done in
> >   Qubes 3.2. nor Qubes 4.0.
> > 
> > However, it is planned for Qubes 4.1, which may reach
> >   release. Just don't get hyped yet, things can change, 4.0.
> >   is barely finished and 4.1. is currently only on the
> >   drawing board. Look here for quick information about 4.1. 
> > https://github.com/rootkovska/qubes-roadmap you
> >   can see the GTX passthrough ability on the map.
> > 
> > Also, you don't really need Ubuntu for these kind of
> >   things, it can easily be fixed up in both Debian and
> >   Fedora. You can use Intel graphics just fine for 4k
> >   videos, you don't need nvidia for stuff like that on
> >   modern motherboard/CPU systems. You may need powerful
> >   graphic cards for gaming and high end graphics, but this
> >   too isn't possible, at least before Qubes 4.1. anyway. If
> >   you didn't need these in Qubes 4, then it will likely make
> >   no difference to you to use Intel graphics. Also Qubes
> >   dom0 frequently has nvidia graphic issues and may require
> >   a full properitary driver download/install, with a manual
> >   install.
> > 
> > To get a bit back on-topic, it saves you whole lot of
> >   hassle if you get adjusted to not be depending too much on
> >   Ubuntu and others that give everything on a silverplate.
> >   Although DVM protected content is never stable regardless
> >   of the Linux distribution, unless you download the Google
> >   Chrome browser from Google (Not Chromium), which usually
> >   always have working DVM videos in any Linux. Issue being,
> >   that Firefox and others, often loose the ability to play
> >   the video, especially Microsoft silverlight videos, which
> >   the work-arounds frequently break.
&g

[qubes-users] How to add "nouveau.modeset=0" to boot settings in Qubes 4.x? (ASUS ROG GL552VW-DM141 laptop)

[@LeeteqXV (Twitter & Mastodon.technology)]

Hi all. I initially thought to save some time and cleared a reply to an 
existing thread to do a new post, but that did not work. Sorry about the 
wrong post. Reposting it here now. Thanks for the reply and pointing it 
out, Yuraeitha.


See my reply + follow-up question at the bottom, below the quoted posts:

##

My original post, incl. a reply by "Yuraeitha" below..:



"I am considering Qubes 4.x for an ASUS ROG GL552VW-DM141 laptop with 
NVIDIA graphics and built-in/onboard "fallback" Intel graphics.


In order to get for example Ubuntu Mate installed onto it, to get past 
the installer incompatibilities with NVidia, it is necessary to edit the 
boot menu and add "nouveau.modeset=0" to the startup command. Then 
Ubuntu boots fine.


Can this be done with Qubes 4.x?
How/where to affect such boot commands; can that be done from the boot 
media/USB stick directly, as we do with other Linux live USB sticks?


Thanks, "

--
https://mastodon.technology/@LeeteqXV/

###

Reply from "Yuraeitha" on Feb. 19th..:

- show quoted text -

"@LeeteqXV
It's probably best you start a new thread, this thread is about a whole 
different issue altogether.


But since this is an old thread, I'll briefly answer you.
This what you seek, directing a GPU directly into an AppVM, or any other 
work arounds, can currently be done in Qubes 3.2. nor Qubes 4.0.


However, it is planned for Qubes 4.1, which may reach release. Just 
don't get hyped yet, things can change, 4.0. is barely finished and 4.1. 
is currently only on the drawing board. Look here for quick information 
about 4.1. https://github.com/rootkovska/qubes-roadmap 
<https://github.com/rootkovska/qubes-roadmap> you can see the GTX 
passthrough ability on the map.


Also, you don't really need Ubuntu for these kind of things, it can 
easily be fixed up in both Debian and Fedora. You can use Intel graphics 
just fine for 4k videos, you don't need nvidia for stuff like that on 
modern motherboard/CPU systems. You may need powerful graphic cards for 
gaming and high end graphics, but this too isn't possible, at least 
before Qubes 4.1. anyway. If you didn't need these in Qubes 4, then it 
will likely make no difference to you to use Intel graphics. Also Qubes 
dom0 frequently has nvidia graphic issues and may require a full 
properitary driver download/install, with a manual install.


To get a bit back on-topic, it saves you whole lot of hassle if you get 
adjusted to not be depending too much on Ubuntu and others that give 
everything on a silverplate. Although DVM protected content is never 
stable regardless of the Linux distribution, unless you download the 
Google Chrome browser from Google (Not Chromium), which usually always 
have working DVM videos in any Linux. Issue being, that Firefox and 
others, often loose the ability to play the video, especially Microsoft 
silverlight videos, which the work-arounds frequently break.


Essentially you can play the codecs fine, HTML5 is for example extremely 
easy to install in Fedora through enabling the RPMFusion repositories, 
which can easily be done in Qubes fedora template (best make a copy 
first). But it does not include HTML5-DVM.


Essentially, DVM is so messed up, you ma/y just want to download the 
Google Browser specifically for these videos, and just be done with the 
crapware copyright protectors throw at us. It's not like they care about 
Linux anyway, so why would changing to Ubuntu make any difference? 
Ubuntu is just as unstable in this regard of protected content due to 
lack of developer support of protected contents.


However, Fedora+Firefox+RPMFusionRepositories+ffmpeg+Firefox's own DVM = 
Netflix and all HTML5 videos on youtube, and similar modern websites, 
works smoothly without issues.


Try not to get too dependent on a system, really it makes little 
difference if you adjust yourself to it.


Also install Qubes with LegacyBIOS/Grub and press the E key during the 
Grub menu, then add after or before "quiet" on the module code-line. Or 
just temporarily disable nvidia in your UEFI, works too, more or less 
does the same as nouveau.modeset=0."'


###

The final part of Yuraeitha's answer is relevant for my case as it is 
about installing Qubes itself, not inside a VM..:


Also install Qubes with LegacyBIOS/Grub and press the E key during the 
Grub menu, then add after or before "quiet" on the module code-line. Or 
just temporarily disable nvidia in your UEFI, works too, more or less 
does the same as nouveau.modeset=0."


So; 1. That (ASUS ROG GL552VW-DM141 laptop) AMI BIOS does not have any 
function to disable NVIDIA for UEFI (or anything about disabling 
graphics at all), as far as I can see.


2. I add the modeset to the startup, then get to the actual startup GUI 
first page, but then cann

[qubes-users] How to add "nouveau.modeset=0" to boot settings in Qubes 4.x?

[@LeeteqXV (Twitter & Mastodon.technology)]

I am considering Qubes 4.x for an ASUS ROG GL552VW-DM141 laptop with 
NVIDIA graphics and built-in/onboard "fallback" Intel graphics.


In order to get for example Ubuntu Mate installed onto it, to get past 
the installer incompatibilities with NVidia, it is necessary to edit the 
boot menu and add "nouveau.modeset=0" to the startup command. Then 
Ubuntu boots fine.


Can this be done with Qubes 4.x?
How/where to affect such boot commands; can that be done from the boot 
media/USB stick directly, as we do with other Linux live USB sticks?


Thanks,

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[qubes-users] How to add "nouveau.modeset=0" to boot settings in Qubes 4.x?

[@LeeteqXV (Twitter & Mastodon.technology)]

I am considering Qubes 4.x for an ASUS ROG GL552VW-DM141 laptop with 
NVIDIA graphics and built-in/onboard "fallback" Intel graphics.


In order to get for example Ubuntu Mate installed onto it, to get past 
the installer incompatibilities with NVidia, it is necessary to edit the 
boot menu and add "nouveau.modeset=0" to the startup command. Then 
Ubuntu boots fine.


Can this be done with Qubes 4.x?
How/where to affect such boot commands; can that be done from the boot 
media/USB stick directly, as we do with other Linux live USB sticks?


Thanks,

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Re: [qubes-users] Relation between increasing RAM and the increased need for display memory

[@LeeteqXV (Twitter & Mastodon.technology)]

RAM, for the high-end computers.

Will it be possible to use a (compatible) laptop in the sub-€1000 range 
as long as it has enough RAM, or should one also verify that the display 
card meet some kind of minimum specifications (for the scenario where we 
are going to run a LOT of VMs, only limited by the available RAM)?


+ How is this different with Qubes 4.x compared to 3.2?

--

Regards,
https://mastodon.technology/@LeeteqXV/
https://twitter.com/@LeeteqXV/
https://Leeteq.com/

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Re: [qubes-users] Qubes OS 4.0 first release candidate (rc1) has been released!

[@LeeteqXV (Twitter & Mastodon.technology)]

On 04/08/17 18:18, Micah Lee wrote:

On 08/04/2017 07:19 AM, Zrubi wrote:

But still feels like a bare naked login screen. IMHO this should
be just as important as the Qubes boot (splash) screen.

Which also have similar aesthetic. Do you think about just some
better background there, or some bigger change?

A would say it's needs a bigger change.
But of course this is really subjective, and currently do not have
time to design a qubes related skin for the login manager :(

So this is just my (and my surroundings) opinion.
Handle with sustenance ;)

On a related note, I would love to see some better Qubes graphics
design. Especially, in my opinion, better built-in choices for the
desktop wallpaper.

Good default wallpaper makes a big difference in first impression of an
OS. (And until #215 is implemented, users who aren't comfortable with
Linux will have a hard time figuring out how to set a custom dom0
wallpaper themselves, and will probably expose dom0 to an untrusted
image in any case.)

Maybe there are some graphics designers or professional photographers in
the Qubes community. I wonder if a call for wallpaper submissions or
something similar could help?
Wallpapers (and first impressions...) are really important, even more so 
with less GUI snacks.
There are many great, suitable and royalty-free wallpaper images at 
www.Pixabay.com .
Just need to select some that have some practical areas where the Qubes 
logo can be added.


I think that Qubes should come with a decent collection with various 
categories to choose from (5-15 options in each category? nature, 
animals, urban, countryside, skyline, linux, tech, future, ... etc.)


Here are 10 potential wallpapers from Pixabay (royalty-free):
https://pixabay.com/en/coast-concrete-lighthouse-ocean-1838593/
https://pixabay.com/en/lighthouse-night-beacon-historic-1969705/
https://pixabay.com/en/human-group-clock-time-silhouette-439149/
https://pixabay.com/en/path-road-unknown-sand-dessert-1461447/
https://pixabay.com/en/fractals-background-mathematics-1800242/
https://pixabay.com/en/sunset-beach-hype-mijas-costa-1226113/
https://pixabay.com/en/anonymous-protect-campaign-2023760/
https://pixabay.com/en/water-flowing-whitewater-splash-195926/
https://pixabay.com/en/finger-fingerprint-security-digital-2081169/
https://pixabay.com/en/titan-3-super-computer-large-fast-79578/

Regards,
https://mastodon.technology/@LeeteqXV/
https://twitter.com/@LeeteqXV/
https://Leeteq.com/

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[qubes-users] How to attach a Yubikey as a normal, extra usb keyboard only to specific AppVMs?

[@LeeteqXV (Twitter)]

I have followed this guide: https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/usb/

And I can see the Yubikey, and attach it to the AppVM, then see that it 
is attached to the AppVM with the qvm-usb command.


However, nothing happens inside the AppVM when I push the Yubikey button 
to send the password to the field with the cursor, neither in a browser 
window nor in Gedit.


As far as I know, the Yubikeys are identifying themselves as a 100% 
standard keyboard without the need for any driver on any system, so the 
push of its button should be understood by the Qube to be normal 
keyboard key presses.


What may be wrong?

Regards,

@LeeteqXV

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Re: [qubes-users] Strategy: Qubes needs flexible automation more than other OSes due to its security-by-separation architecture: Should we initiate a cross-platform project?

[@LeeteqXV (Twitter)]

On 23/12/16 09:43, Andrew David Wong wrote:

(Copying my reply from the other thread.)
You can simply change sys-firewall's NetVM to "none," restart sys-net,
then switch it back again. Sample script:

```
#!/bin/bash
echo "Restarting sys-net..."
qvm-prefs -s sys-firewall netvm none
sleep 3
qvm-shutdown sys-net
sleep 3
qvm-start sys-net
sleep 3
qvm-prefs -s sys-firewall netvm sys-net
sleep 1
echo "Done."
```

We don't need AI-level automation to solve this one. :)


Heh, so that was a bad example to throw into this suggestion, ok. :-)
Thanks for the script sample, will come in handy I think.

Regardless of this bad example, my suggestion stands:
I think there are good reasons / perspectives for why Qubes should 
consider taking this kind of initiative.


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[qubes-users] Template updates: "cannot execute qrexec-deamon" for sys-net - Documentation improvement/addition (or just link update?)

[@LeeteqXV (Twitter)]

For the record; my shift from Fedora-23 to Fedora-24 went 
painlessly/successfully, thanks to the existing, good documentation.


Only thing I had to figure out logically (by experience, luckily, or I 
would have started wasting time unnecessarily) was that I should try to 
reboot when sys-* failed to start afterwards, which then worked, and all 
was fine.


*Suggested documentation addition:**
*

So I think the main docs page should have a top-level link both in the 
"Upgrade guides" section to "updating template association for 
sys-net/sys-firewall" and also from the existing Fedora 23-to-24 doc 
page, especially for some time now that Fedora-23 is EoL/End-of-Life. As 
this is not specific to any particular version number, it should be easy 
to find regardless of which upgrade one is performing, therefore I think 
it should have its own page and be linked from the Upgrades section.


In particular, it should be easy to spot the information about the need 
to reboot the computer immediately after changing the template 
association for sys-firewall and sys-net, as that is not entirely 
obvious for everyone.


The existing page does not mention sys-firewall/sys-net , neither does 
it link to any other page that deals with that:


https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/template/fedora/upgrade-23-to-24/

And, if someone is coming to those pages AFTER having bravely tried to 
update the system without searching (sufficiently?) through all the docs 
(...), they just might be searching for this error message: "cannot 
execute qrexec-deamon", which also should offer a hit to this suggested 
new page among the top search results...


(I seached briefly myself, but did not find a page describing this 
template switch for sys-net/sys-firewall .)


In case there is such a page that I did not find, here is some info that 
it 'should' include:



*Doc text suggestion:*

Disable both sys-firewall and sys-net so that only dom0 is running, then 
change the template association to the new template in each one's VM 
settings. Restart the computer.


PS. If you do not restart the computer right afterwards, but instead try 
to start either one of them, you may get this error:


"Error starting VM 'sys-firewall'" / "Error starting VM 'sys-net'": 
"cannot execute qrexec-deamon"


(This may also be the error you get if running the commands 'qvm-start 
sys-firewall' / 'qvm-start sys-net' in this scenario)




Happy xmas everyone :-)

@LeeteqXV

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[qubes-users] Strategy: Qubes needs flexible automation more than other OSes due to its security-by-separation architecture: Should we initiate a cross-platform project?

[Leeteqxv]

*Below is a Spinoff* from "[qubes-users] When Wi-Fi disconnects, it 
fails to reconnect: How to reset the Network interface (conveniently) 
without restarting everything?"


(Ref. "I wish there was a magical menu entry that could do this:"
- "Enforce restarting sys-net/sys-Firewall and temporarily take down any 
open VM that are blocking the restart, and then subsequently start them 
all again afterwards WITH all the software that was running inside each 
one too...")


(To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/9cd39d03-b9db-1a2a-a2ac-938031621b99%40leeteq.com 
<https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/9cd39d03-b9db-1a2a-a2ac-938031621b99%40leeteq.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>.)




(If that is too much to ask for a script, then imagine the daunting task 
every time one has to do that manually.)


*Qubes has a deeper motivation for this kind of automation than other 
OSes due to the consequences of security dilemmas stemming from the 
separation of tasks/VMs etc.**

*

*Maybe Qubes does not have a choice, but to actually tackle this 
challenge at it roots.*


*If I am right about that, then we can look at this from a strategic 
point of view, as an oppurtunity to take the lead:**

*

The above linked other issue is a good example on exactly what we want a 
computer to automate in general.


The world does not need the (overhyped) "Artificial Intelligence" 
developments so much as really flexible automation like this example. We 
are far away from creating anything intelligence-like, but these 
automation bits are well within our reach even without any "A.I."


Because we are all in the same boat regarding all the dilemmas, caveats 
and workarounds in the struggle to stay as secure as possibl as 
convenient as possible, Qubes has a unique challenge that is much larger 
and much more deep felt than any other OS users has: for a workable 
interface to this kind of automation.


*Maybe an opportunity or potential benefit lies within this challenge:*

Could we invite A.I. developers into a cross-platform Linux project that 
aims at providing tools to let users manage, configure, schedule, etc. 
automation like this through the GUI, so we make sure we are at the helm 
of such developments and thus have even greater influence to affect its 
direction to cover our (extra) needs?


- LeeteqXV

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[qubes-users] When Wi-Fi disconnects, it fails to reconnect: How to reset the Network interface (conveniently) without restarting everything?

[Leeteqxv]

On a test laptop I have a problem with the network hardware. It is an 
old one, and I know that this is a case of almost-broken hardware, so 
not really a Qubes problem.


If I restart the Sys-net, then it works again, so no need for a full 
restart of the laptop.
However, I wonder if there is a way to get around the real annoyance in 
this case:


a) I cannot restart Sys-net as long as sys-Firewall is running, and..:
b) I cannot restart/stop sys-Firewall as long as there are ANY AppVMs 
using it, so:

c)  do I REALLY have to shut down all programs and all VMs just to do this?

If I have to, can I at least be automated somehow?

*I wish there was a magical menu entry that could do this:*
- "Enforce restarting sys-net/sys-Firewall and temporarily take down any 
open VM that are blocking the restart, and then subsequently start them 
all again afterwards WITH all the software that was running inside each 
one too..."


(Or is there another, less dramatic way to re-initiate the Wi-Fi system?)

- LeeteqXV

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Re: [qubes-users] I recently installed Qubes and I now have several problems

[Leeteqxv]

THIS message has NO further comments below, just FYI:

I have spun off a new discussion for the Grub issue:

"[qubes-users] GRUB fix GUI: Qubes community invitation to the other 
Linuxes for a collaboration?"


To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/c372c227-c00d-ecdc-6abb-db65c40b2690%40leeteq.com 
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LeeteqXV

On 18/12/16 00:18, explodingbee . wrote:



On Sat, Dec 17, 2016 at 4:26 PM, <raahe...@gmail.com 
<mailto:raahe...@gmail.com>> wrote:


On Wednesday, December 14, 2016 at 12:42:28 PM UTC-5, explodingbee
. wrote:
> -- Forwarded message --
> From: explodingbee . <explod...@gmail.com <mailto:explod...@gmail.com>>
> Date: Wed, Dec 14, 2016 at 12:23 PM
> Subject: Fwd: [qubes-users] I recently installed Qubes and I now
have several problems
> To: Andrew David Wong <a...@qubes-os.org <mailto:a...@qubes-os.org>>, 
Foppe de Haan
<0spin...@gmail.com <mailto:0spin...@gmail.com>>, dumbcyber
<dumb...@riseup.net <mailto:dumb...@riseup.net>>
>
>
>
>
>
> -- Forwarded message --
> From: explodingbee . <explod...@gmail.com <mailto:explod...@gmail.com>>
>
>
> Date: Wed, Dec 14, 2016 at 11:17 AM
> Subject: Re: [qubes-users] I recently installed Qubes and I now
have several problems
> To: Andrew David Wong <a...@qubes-os.org <mailto:a...@qubes-os.org>>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Andrew Wong,
>
> See my comments below.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 14, 2016 at 9:20 AM, Andrew David Wong
<a...@qubes-os.org <mailto:a...@qubes-os.org>> wrote:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>
> Hash: SHA512
>
>
>
> On 2016-12-13 18:29, explodingbee . wrote:
>
> > [...]
>
> >
>
> > 2) *In Qubes the computer often gets slow as molasses.*  I get
>
> > error messages saying "Warning: unresponsive script" sometimes.
>
> > When I try to open a VM it says that there is not enough
memory and
>
> > that I should close a VM first.  When the computer gets like this
>
> > sometimes I click on things and nothing happens or it takes
forever
>
> > for something to happen; sometimes I can't even close windows
>
> > because they don't respond.  (I am using an HP Elitebook 8540w
>
> > laptop.  It has 4 GB of RAM and an i7 CPU.) Also, when I shut down
>
> > the computer sometimes it gets stuck and does not shut down
all the
>
> > way.  It freezes with the Qubes splash screen there and the
>
> > progress bar indicating partial or complete progress.
>
> >
>
>
>
> I think this is just due to a lack of RAM. 4 GB is the bare minimum.
>
> Any chance you can add some more?
>
>
>
> I have not had any problems with lack of RAM in Windows 7. 
Maybe Qubes needs more RAM than Windows 7?  If you are correct I

can certainly get more RAM. After I reinstall Qubes if the problem
persists I may get more RAM.
>
>
>
> > 3) *Problem relating to program installation:*  When I install
>
> > programs in the Fedora or Debian templates they don't appear
in the
>
> > list of available programs in the templates or in the VMs based on
>
> > those templates so I don't see how I can create shortcuts for
>
> > programs in my VMs.
>
> >
>
>
>
> Are you installing these programs from the Fedora and Debian
repos? If
>
> so, are you fully shutting down the template after installing the
>
> program? This should trigger qvm-sync-appmenus, but you can try
to run
>
> it manually from dom0:
>
>
>
> qvm-sync-appmenus 
>
>
>
> Yes, I was installing from within the Fedora VM (which is what I
think you mean).  Yes, I fully shut everything down, including the
whole computer, after installing the programs and then at no time
did the installed programs appear on the list of available
programs in the Fedora VM or in the AppVMs.  If the problem
persists after I reinstall Qubes I may try to manually enter the
phrase you provided above.
>
>
>
> > 4) *Problem in getting

[qubes-users] GRUB fix GUI: Qubes community invitation to the other Linuxes for a collaboration?

[Leeteqxv]

I have long wondered when the various Linux communities will finally be 
able to co-operate and make a common solution for having the system fix 
Grub by itself through a GUI that newcomers have a chance of using 
without technical knowledge.


Something like a simple menu with "fix Grub" options like "Update the 
menu with entries for all the found operating systems."


See the examples below, they all seem to be of the kind that a system 
function should be able to provide now in 2016.


Is this a good moment in history for Qubes to reach out to the other 
Linuxes and ask for a collaboration to fix this once and for all? It 
would remove a huge barrier for loads of people wanting to explore the 
options of getting away from Windows.


I know this defeats the purpose of the SECURITY aspect of Qubes, but 
bear with me a moment:


This is for EVALUATION purposes, for the time where a normal user that 
runs Windows or the like already without much protection. It is only to 
provide a testing ground. After a while, the users will familiarize 
themselves with Qubes and for sure get to understand the Security 
implications communiacated by the Qubes community and docs. Then, when 
each user gets ready, it becomes possible to let Qubes take over the 
whole system and have some serious security.


But that is not the point at all during evaluation.

I think we would benefit from lowering the barrier here, to reach 
critical mass, which could help finance further developments, etc. etc...


LeeteqXV

**

Related thread: "[qubes-users] I recently installed Qubes and I now have 
several problems"


"Last night I was able to install Linux Mint beside the other operating 
systems.  It is not that I wanted to use Mint, it is just that by 
installing it it redid the GRUB file so now I can boot to Windows 7 or 
Qubes (or Mint).  So that solves the first problem."


"Also, I just realized that I may have the same problem again when I 
reinstall Qubes; I don't want it to change the GRUB file so that again I 
can only go into Qubes and not Windows 7.  I guess I will have to study 
this page [https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/multiboot/] to try to not have 
that problem repeat."


"To triple boot mint, qubes and win 7 with the mint grub.   edit the 
/etc/grub.d/40_custom file in mint.   append in there everything between 
the xen sections of the grub.config file located on the qubes boot 
partition.
Then update grub on mint and reboot and qubes should boot from menu.  
You will have to do this everytime qubes updates kernel or it errors again."


(To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/CAEgwnuSSNfbsP2nYfPp24LKwrGpAaho_ddreqL84_q9mPinYBQ%40mail.gmail.com 
<https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/qubes-users/CAEgwnuSSNfbsP2nYfPp24LKwrGpAaho_ddreqL84_q9mPinYBQ%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>.)


***


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Re: [qubes-users] Re: [qubes-devel] Re: Announcement: Qubes OS Begins Commercialization and Community Funding Efforts

[Leeteqxv]

On 15/12/16 23:46, je wrote:


> I do not believe that developing a commercial operating system 
based on an

> open source foundation will pay off on a long run.

Is there a specific reason you think it will not? Just curious.


1. Selling a license provides a one time payment. Even if you are able 
to sell 100_000 licenses for 40 you would earn
4_000_000, but the same companies will not buy a license the year 
after that. Which means no constant income for the long run.


Most companies will stick with one version of the product till they 
really have a reason to upgrade.
Because, the costs for upgrading are actually higher than the costs of 
the license and upgrades involve the risk of causing
disruption (problems during the upgrade, which blocks employees from 
getting their work done. Which again means I loose money).

With other words Qubes OS will be stuck with one version for years.

2. The simple question is how can you sell a product which contains 
mostly GPL licensed code (Xen, Linux Kernel)

which everybody can download and compile for free?

RHEL sells support subscriptions. They offer support (10 years 
backporting, customer support etc.) and most important they offer a 
platform for other business software.
The work RedHat constantly invests in their RHEL can not be easily 
replicated and that is the reason why CentOS is not a competitor.


3. Security is a process and not a product. As an enterprise customer 
I want to have constant updates and upgrades, security bulletins and 
other security information.
I want to know if DirtyCOW, hardbleed or other security flaws affect 
my business if I use Qubes OS or not?


Furthermore, I believe that the Qubes OS team and ITL does not 
understand what Qubes OS could offer on an enterprise level.

--
I am working with IT strategy myself. Enterprise needs are clearly 
completely different from SMB, etc., so in that sense we are talking 
about two entirely different strategies and support models. I think 
Qubes should pursue both, but with two distinctly different teams in 
charge, with the suitable understanding of each area.


As the whole industry (and society at large) continues to mature into 
various ways of readiiness for Open-Source things, I am quite sure that 
we will see a growing market among SMB's that are willing to pay for 
support and related peace-of-mind aspects even if it is possible to 
compile everything oneself. It is worth paying to "delegate" both such 
manual work and to avoid keeping up on the related competence race.


A license is one thing, perhaps even limited in time, but an 
accompanying support agreement is yet another. Both are needed, IMO.


There is also a middle ground here - Take for example me:
I would like to offer entry-level services to clients, who all will pay 
the license + pay for my services. In turn, I want to be a 
professional-level client of Qubes support, so that I can get their 
backup when there is something I run into which I cannot answer or solve 
properly for my entry-level clientele. So I would be willing to pay a 
professional support membership of some sorts.


I strongly believe memberships-based support services (premium 
communities) is a good business model for this, atop of whatever 
licensing scheme one may have.


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Re: [qubes-users] How to move/migrate a VM with a Fedora-23 custom template from 3.1 to 3.2?

[Leeteqxv]

On 11/12/16 21:48, Andrew David Wong wrote:

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA512

On 2016-12-11 09:10, Leeteqxv wrote:

I have a previous test installation of Qubes 3.1 on a separate HDD
(now external USB), which cointains a customised (cloned+extra sw
installs) Fedora-23 template used with a dedicated AppVM.

Now I have Qubes 3.2 installed on a new HDD on that machine and
before we move on to Fedora-24 (when F23 "expires" later this
month), I would like to "import" that custom template AND the
related VM into the new (fresh) 3.2 install.

I cannot be sure if I have all the necessary insights into Qubes
to assume I can just copy / paste some folders/files into the new
installation, so I would like to know exactly which folders/files
are involved, and if there are any special order/steps to take, and
whatever else is needed for this. I also think that the resulting
How-To list should be fitted into the documentation somewhere.

(PS. I have not yet upgraded the new 3.2 system to Fedora-24, so
that part is not the question here. I will do the upgrade to F24
after the migration of the template/VM along with the rest of the
system. Hence, my question here is regarding a "migrate" between
two F23-based systems, from Q3.1 to Q3.2)

I am aware of the following docs:

https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/template/fedora/upgrade-23-to-24/
https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/upgrade-to-r3.2/

Can someone provide an ordered list of steps for this?

Thanks.


If I understand you correctly, it sounds like the built-in Qubes
backup tool (qvm-backup from the command-line, also available from the
Qubes Manager GUI) is the right tool for the job:

https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/backup-restore/

Especially this part:

https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/backup-restore/#migrating-between-two-physical-machines

- -- 
Andrew David Wong (Axon)

Community Manager, Qubes OS
https://www.qubes-os.org


Thanks for the quick response.
That method would work while still having the old system available/bootable.
But in my case, I have replaced the old HDD with a new one (on a 
laptop), and need to access the old installation by simply adding that 
physical disk as a USB disk into the new system.


So I am really looking for which files/folders I need to copy from the 
old system into the new installation, or, alternatively, if I can 
"migrate" or point the new system to create a new Template and a new 
AppVM by pointing it to a folder on the old disk to use as a template 
for the creation.

How can this be done?

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[qubes-users] How to move/migrate a VM with a Fedora-23 custom template from 3.1 to 3.2?

[Leeteqxv]

I have a previous test installation of Qubes 3.1 on a separate HDD (now 
external USB), which cointains a customised (cloned+extra sw installs) 
Fedora-23 template used with a dedicated AppVM.


Now I have Qubes 3.2 installed on a new HDD on that machine and before 
we move on to Fedora-24 (when F23 "expires" later this month), I would 
like to "import" that custom template AND the related VM into the new 
(fresh) 3.2 install.


I cannot be sure if I have all the necessary insights into Qubes to 
assume I can just copy / paste some folders/files into the new 
installation, so I would like to know exactly which folders/files are 
involved, and if there are any special order/steps to take, and whatever 
else is needed for this. I also think that the resulting How-To list 
should be fitted into the documentation somewhere.


(PS. I have not yet upgraded the new 3.2 system to Fedora-24, so that 
part is not the question here. I will do the upgrade to F24 after the 
migration of the template/VM along with the rest of the system. Hence, 
my question here is regarding a "migrate" between two F23-based systems, 
from Q3.1 to Q3.2)


I am aware of the following docs:

https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/template/fedora/upgrade-23-to-24/
https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/upgrade-to-r3.2/

Can someone provide an ordered list of steps for this?

Thanks.

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Re: [qubes-users] Templates: can a template be replaced by another with the same name?

[Leeteqxv]

On 02/12/16 00:03, yaqu wrote:

On Thu, 1 Dec 2016 14:10:08 -0800, Andrew David Wong 
wrote:


1. delete the cloned template.

2. clone fedora23 again onto a new clone using EXACTLY the same
name as the first clone that was deleted in step 1.

Question:

- the existing AppVMs that are already based on a template with
that name, will they now just continue to work against the new
clone, or is there anything else than the template NAME that
affects the link between AppVMs and their templates?


Qubes won't let you delete a template while AppVMs are still based on
it. You'll have to temporarily switch those one or two AppVMs to a
different template, delete the one you don't want, clone the one you
want, then switch them to the new clone.

Or, to avoid switching AppVM's template multiple times, one could:

1. clone template (under temporary name)
2. switch AppVMs to the new template
3. delete the old template
4. rename cloned template to the final name



Thanks for the explanation. 1-3 is probably enough unless the original 
name is important for some reason.


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[qubes-users] Templates: can a template be replaced by another with the same name?

[Leeteqxv]

I have a relatively newly cloned template of fedora23 used by only one 
or two AppVMs, but never really gotten any special customisations.


Meanwhile, I have done some updates/additional software installs in the 
main fedora23 template, so if I want to save time I hope I can just 
clone it again without having to update the existing clone? Can I do it 
like this..:


1. delete the cloned template.

2. clone fedora23 again onto a new clone using EXACTLY the same name as 
the first clone that was deleted in step 1.


Question:

- the existing AppVMs that are already based on a template with that 
name, will they now just continue to work against the new clone, or is 
there anything else than the template NAME that affects the link between 
AppVMs and their templates?


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[qubes-users] After cloning Fedora23 template, the same applications does not install on the clone.

[Leeteqxv]

Hi, I have a strange issue:

I have copied Google Chrome and Opera browser installation files (.rpm) 
into the Fedora-23 template, and then I cloned it.
When I then open a Files window on the Fedora23b (clone), and try to 
right-click and "open with Software installer" to install the 
applications there, after a long while with status "installing" (I get 
to click on the blue Install "button") I get an error messaage saying 
that the install failed due to dependency problem.


The thing that puzzles me is that the very same files could be installed 
successfully in the Untrusted AppVM that is based on Fedora23... How can 
it be that I get different results? The template is a clone of the same 
thing that the Untrusted AppVM is based on...


Regards,

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