Re: [WISPA] making money from voip
When I spoke to them last (only about 4 weeks ago) Ron Harden said they didn't support hunt groups (the name was eluding me when I first posted to this thread-odd given that hunt groups were fundamental to any ISP for so many years! ;-), though they could do line forwarding. Are you saying Vox DOES support hunt groups? That'd be so odd since Ron is the executive VP or something I thought. That or I'm royally messed up... Chuck On Nov 11, 2010, at 10:20 PM, Jeremie Chism wrote: > You have to get them to enable hunting. It's not the same as forwarding. > > Sent from my iPhone4 > > On Nov 11, 2010, at 9:09 PM, Chuck Bartosch wrote: > >> How do you handle the line pool problem? It's the only issue keeping me from >> going to Vox for business customers-most businesses have multiple lines >> where a customer calls in and gets whatever line is free in the pool. Vox >> can do line forwarding, but that means the customer has to call the first >> line in the forwarding sequence and there's a delay while each line is found >> to be busy before it's forwarded (I assume), so it isn't the same as normal >> line pool. >> >> Would love a practical solution to this problem. >> >> Chuck >> >> On Nov 11, 2010, at 9:08 PM, Jeremie Chism wrote: >> >>> Everything we use is branded in our name including the LOA's and the >>> portal. Vox handles everything up front during the setup process. Since 95% >>> of our lines are ported from other companies it was important for this to >>> all have our company name. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone4 >>> >>> On Nov 11, 2010, at 7:27 PM, Roger Howard wrote: >>> >>>> If you use VOX, do you still have to do all the FCC stuff, since you >>>> are not the provider? >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> Roger >>>> >>>> On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 7:21 PM, Jeremie Chism wrote: >>>>> Tried Telemedium. They were horrible. As a matter of fact they are out of >>>>> business now. We use VOX. They are a wispa member. I have yet to get a >>>>> call from anyone complaining about voice quality b >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone4 >>>>> >>>>> On Nov 11, 2010, at 6:24 PM, Ryan Goldberg >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Whose service do you use? Who if anyone did you try before current >>>>>> provider? >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks- >>>>>> Ryan >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Nov 11, 2010, at 5:07 PM, Jeremie Chism wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Our approach is white label to business only bundled with our Internet >>>>>>> usually and other Internet outside of our coverage. We include email, >>>>>>> webhosting, data backup with all packages to make us "sticky". Also we >>>>>>> definitely aren't the cheapest. We went that route in the beginning but >>>>>>> sales didn't take off until we raised our price. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone4 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Nov 11, 2010, at 5:02 PM, Ryan Goldberg >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Curious what models you guys are working. Hosted PBX, white label, >>>>>>>> etc. What approach for SMB v. residential v enterprise. And so on. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> TIA >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Ryan >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>>>> >>>&
Re: [WISPA] making money from voip
How do you handle the line pool problem? It's the only issue keeping me from going to Vox for business customers-most businesses have multiple lines where a customer calls in and gets whatever line is free in the pool. Vox can do line forwarding, but that means the customer has to call the first line in the forwarding sequence and there's a delay while each line is found to be busy before it's forwarded (I assume), so it isn't the same as normal line pool. Would love a practical solution to this problem. Chuck On Nov 11, 2010, at 9:08 PM, Jeremie Chism wrote: > Everything we use is branded in our name including the LOA's and the portal. > Vox handles everything up front during the setup process. Since 95% of our > lines are ported from other companies it was important for this to all have > our company name. > > Sent from my iPhone4 > > On Nov 11, 2010, at 7:27 PM, Roger Howard wrote: > >> If you use VOX, do you still have to do all the FCC stuff, since you >> are not the provider? >> >> Thanks, >> Roger >> >> On Thu, Nov 11, 2010 at 7:21 PM, Jeremie Chism wrote: >>> Tried Telemedium. They were horrible. As a matter of fact they are out of >>> business now. We use VOX. They are a wispa member. I have yet to get a call >>> from anyone complaining about voice quality b >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone4 >>> >>> On Nov 11, 2010, at 6:24 PM, Ryan Goldberg wrote: >>> >>>> Whose service do you use? Who if anyone did you try before current >>>> provider? >>>> >>>> Thanks- >>>> Ryan >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Nov 11, 2010, at 5:07 PM, Jeremie Chism wrote: >>>> >>>>> Our approach is white label to business only bundled with our Internet >>>>> usually and other Internet outside of our coverage. We include email, >>>>> webhosting, data backup with all packages to make us "sticky". Also we >>>>> definitely aren't the cheapest. We went that route in the beginning but >>>>> sales didn't take off until we raised our price. >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone4 >>>>> >>>>> On Nov 11, 2010, at 5:02 PM, Ryan Goldberg >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Curious what models you guys are working. Hosted PBX, white label, etc. >>>>>> What approach for SMB v. residential v enterprise. And so on. >>>>>> >>>>>> TIA >>>>>> >>>>>> Ryan >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>> >>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>> >>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>> >>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>> >>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> ----
Re: [WISPA] Licensed 11ghz Hops
I'll hazard a guess here that Radwin was OEMing boxes from Ceragon at the time then. That's like me complaining about Redline if I had problems with Alvarion's old "Link Blaster", which was an OEM'd Redline point-to-point product. If I bought it from Alvarion and didn't get support, then it's Alvarion's problem, not Redline's. (For the record here, we were perfectly happy with the Link Blaster-just using that as an example). It wouldn't be right or fair for me to sling mud at Redline for it, especially *years* later. We all get a bug up our butts about something or another, but I think its bad practice if nothing else to go out of your way to hurt a company you never even bought anything from (remember, your main problem was with the "zero support", which was a Radwin issue, not a Ceragon issue) when those of us who actually have experience buying from the company seem to be quite happy. Either way, your experience was from years ago. We all know companies go through problems at times. If they fix them, great. If not, they'll pay the price in the marketplace. And if you had current, direct experiences to report, that's useful information. But it's worth it to give even companies that have messed up a chance to prove they can fix themselves. I'd defend Redline the same way if the circumstances were similar. Chuck On Nov 5, 2010, at 12:15 AM, Josh Luthman wrote: > Says Ceragon on the boxes. > > They appear identical in hardware and software to the Radwins we bought with > the company. Just FYI. > On Nov 5, 2010 12:03 AM, "Chuck Bartosch" wrote: >> To be honest Josh, didn't you tell me your problems were with what was at > one time a sister company, Radwin, and not Ceragon? Yet you call the company > "Ceragon" when you've told me it was really Radwin. It really isn't fair to > be tarring and feathering Ceragon due to the problems with Radwin-which was > years ago and not even the same company. >> >> Ceragon products in the licensed sphere are _strictly_ Ceragon designed > and manufactured (I followed up on this the last time you were panning > Ceragon so I could independently understand the situation). They are not > even OEM'd from Radwin. Ceragon is an independent, publicly traded company. > It was *started*, years ago by the same investment group that started > Radwin. >> >> For the record, we've been quite happy with Ceragon's products. The > interface hasn't been a problem, but like Brad, I believe we tend to use the > telnet interface. I've also been happy with Alvarion and Ubiquity in the > unlicensed space. I have no personal interest in any of these companies, but > don't think it's fair to malign a manufacturer when you don't actually have > any experience with them as far as I can tell. When you did have problems it > was with a related company, not this company, it was years ago (things DO > change), and this company at least is no longer even a "sister" company (in > the sense at least that it is now publicly traded). >> >> Chuck >> >> On Nov 4, 2010, at 10:15 PM, Josh Luthman wrote: >> >>> The air must be different there. I can't stand Ceragon stuff. Nothing but >>> problems. Zero support. The firmware is terrible as is the interface. >>> On Nov 4, 2010 9:58 PM, "Brad Belton" wrote: >>>> Agreed. We have had Ser# 0001 11GHz Trango GigaLINK in service since >>> early 2008 among several others since then with great service. The few > times >>> we’ve needed Trango support they have been extremely responsive and > helpful. >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I think we also have one of the first if not the first 18GHz GigaLINK in >>> service too since mid 2007. We’ll be hanging three more Trango Giga’s & >>> Apex’s in the next few weeks. We have always been early adopters of >>> Sunstream/Trango equipment. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> We have DragonWave, BridgeWave, Trango, DMC, Ceragon and PCOM licensed >>> gear deployed and active in 6GHz, 11GHz, 18GHz, 23GHz, 38GHz and 70-80GHz > on >>> our network. By far the Trango, BridgeWave and Ceragon links are our >>> favorites. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Best, >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Brad >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireles
Re: [WISPA] Licensed 11ghz Hops
t;> >> MVN.net >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] contract for use or tower
If you're a WISPA member, I think the wiki has a number of sample contracts. Chuck Sent from my iPad On Aug 2, 2010, at 8:50 AM, "Liam Cummings" wrote: > I’m looking for a good contract to use for exclusive use of someone’s tower. > Anyone want to share what they have with us? Would save me tons of time. J > > > > > > TX > > > > Liam > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Broadband Stimulus to lose $602 Million?
I've contacted the two congressman in our area already. Haven't reached out yet to the Senators. Chuck On Jul 2, 2010, at 1:12 PM, St. Louis Broadband wrote: > Just expressed that sentiment with our Senator, suggest you do the same ;-) > > ~V~ > > -Original Message----- > From: Chuck Bartosch [mailto:ch...@clarityconnect.com] > Sent: Friday, July 02, 2010 12:02 PM > To: li...@stlbroadband.com; WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Broadband Stimulus to lose $602 Million? > > Of course that wouldn't be particular fair given that NTIA got 2/3rds of the > funding in the first place. I'd hope they'd have to cough up 2/3rds of the > give back. > > Chuck > > On Jul 2, 2010, at 12:04 PM, St. Louis Broadband wrote: > >> Was just informed by our Senator's Aid that this has not been decided yet. >> If it is approved half of the funds would come out of the NTIA and the > other >> RUS. This would still leave the RUS fund @ <$1.5B. >> >> And yes Robert, I hate to see tax dollars spent on a war. >> >> ~V~ >> >> -Original Message- >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >> Behalf Of Robert West >> Sent: Friday, July 02, 2010 10:46 AM >> To: 'WISPA General List' >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Broadband Stimulus to lose $602 Million? >> >> Nice. And for such a great cause, too. >> >> Bob- >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >> Behalf Of Mike Hammett >> Sent: Friday, July 02, 2010 11:42 AM >> To: WISPA General List >> Subject: [WISPA] Broadband Stimulus to lose $602 Million? >> >> http://broadbandbreakfast.com/?p=9684 >> >> >> -- >> >> >> - >> Mike Hammett >> Intelligent Computing Solutions >> http://www.ics-il.com >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> > >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 9.0.830 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2977 - Release Date: 07/02/10 >> 01:35:00 >> >> >> >> > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > > >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > -- > Chuck Bartosch > Clarity Connect, Inc. > 200 Pleasant Grove Road > Ithaca, NY 14850 > (607) 257-8268 > > "When the stars threw down their spears, > and water'd heaven with their tears, > Did He smile, His work to see? > Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" > > From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.830 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2977 - Release Date: 07/02/10 > 01:35:00 > -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Broadband Stimulus to lose $602 Million?
Of course that wouldn't be particular fair given that NTIA got 2/3rds of the funding in the first place. I'd hope they'd have to cough up 2/3rds of the give back. Chuck On Jul 2, 2010, at 12:04 PM, St. Louis Broadband wrote: > Was just informed by our Senator's Aid that this has not been decided yet. > If it is approved half of the funds would come out of the NTIA and the other > RUS. This would still leave the RUS fund @ <$1.5B. > > And yes Robert, I hate to see tax dollars spent on a war. > > ~V~ > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Robert West > Sent: Friday, July 02, 2010 10:46 AM > To: 'WISPA General List' > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Broadband Stimulus to lose $602 Million? > > Nice. And for such a great cause, too. > > Bob- > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Mike Hammett > Sent: Friday, July 02, 2010 11:42 AM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: [WISPA] Broadband Stimulus to lose $602 Million? > > http://broadbandbreakfast.com/?p=9684 > > > -- > > > - > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions > http://www.ics-il.com > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.830 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2977 - Release Date: 07/02/10 > 01:35:00 > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > ---- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Documentation Methods
You should add (in my opinion): (1) photo of installation location BEFORE you do the install, not just a post install photo. (2) a sign-off from the customer saying your installation was acceptable. That goes a LONG ways when the wife gets home and complains. You got the husband's sign-off (or vice versa). Chuck On Apr 22, 2010, at 11:05 PM, Steven G McGehee wrote: > Thought of another question I wanted to pose to you gents regarding > documentation on installations, primarily customer installations (as > opposed to PoP/tower installations). I was curious what methods you > employed during and/or after the install to best 'capture' the details > of the installation. > > For example, some of the things we do are take notes of any specific > 'gotchas' on site like needing to park in a certain area, what type of > ladder or roof access there is, if you have to sign in or be escorted by > a rep. of the business - etc. We also take photos of the installation > when we're finished and write up notes afterwards on their account > detailing the length and path of the cable that goes from the unit into > the structure, what other PoPs we could see at the time, what > signal/speeds we were getting, etc. > > If any of you would share your methods on what you do, I'd appreciate > it. I think we're doing enough, but I'm always open to other suggestions > and interested in seeing what others in the business are doing. > > Thanks. > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Alvarion 3.65ghz NLOS as good as 900mhz?
On Apr 20, 2010, at 12:00 PM, Tom DeReggi wrote: > My point here is that Diversity can make a huge difference, "diversity" is > the differenciator, but that the benefit of diversity can vary dependant on > the Freq used and environment tackling, based on past experience. Without looking up the math on this, I would speculate that the reason is wavelength. At 3.65 we're about 4' apart. To get the same advantage at 900 MHz I'd willing to bet you might need to be quite a bit further apart-which isn't practical in most cases. I'm not willing to say it scales with wavelength (not without looking at the actual equations that is) but wavelength is going to be a factor in how effective diversity is at any given distance between two antennas. On the other hand, moving the antennas further apart at lower frequencies should be able to re-create the advantage. Chuck > > Tom DeReggi > RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc > IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband > > > - Original Message - > From: "Chuck Bartosch" > To: "WISPA General List" > Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2010 11:05 AM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Alvarion 3.65ghz NLOS as good as 900mhz? > > >> We did not find that WiMax in general was better than 900. The key isn't >> WiMax, per se, but diversity antennas. Performance is *helped* by being >> 3.65 WiMax but that alone does NOT obviate the need for 900 in our >> experience. Diversity is key. >> >> Chuck >> >> On Apr 19, 2010, at 9:23 AM, Jeremie Chism wrote: >> >>> I am not using alvarion 3.65 but I am using wimax. I have a couple >>> customers with lower modulation because of non line of site situations >>> and have seen no impact on the entire system in general. "Supposedly" >>> wimax is engineered to handle some of this better than my alvarion 900. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Apr 19, 2010, at 8:15 AM, Rubens Kuhl wrote: >>> >>>> That would only be true if the data services are somewhat >>>> purpose-specific and not Internet access. Doing what this vendor told >>>> you would seriously affect aggregate performance of the cell because >>>> of low rate modulation of the NLOS and/or distant customers. >>>> >>>> If you are doing sensor networks or POS connection you will be fine >>>> with all those BPSK/QPSK customers, indeed. >>>> >>>> >>>> Rubens >>>> >>>> >>>> On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 10:09 AM, Kurt Fankhauser >>>> wrote: >>>>> Has anyone seen the Alvarion 3.65ghz 802.16e equipment in >>>>> operation? Was >>>>> talking to one vendor that claimed if you run the system in MIMO >>>>> that with >>>>> the diversity you can do NLOS as good as 900mhz and if you get the >>>>> AP on a >>>>> 300ft tower that it starts to "feel" like 700mhz. He claimed the >>>>> NLOS was so >>>>> good that people are ripping out complete old systems of 900mhz and >>>>> 2.4ghz >>>>> and putting in the single system of 3.65ghz to serve their entire >>>>> customer >>>>> base. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Just wondering if anyone has experience or having seen this >>>>> firsthand. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Kurt Fankhauser >>>>> WAVELINC >>>>> P.O. Box 126 >>>>> Bucyrus, OH 44820 >>>>> 419-562-6405 >>>>> www.wavelinc.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> --- >>>>> --- >>>>> --- >>>>> --- >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>> --- >>>>> --- >>>>> --- >>>>> --- >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>> >>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>> >>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/p
Re: [WISPA] Alvarion 3.65ghz NLOS as good as 900mhz?
We did not find that WiMax in general was better than 900. The key isn't WiMax, per se, but diversity antennas. Performance is *helped* by being 3.65 WiMax but that alone does NOT obviate the need for 900 in our experience. Diversity is key. Chuck On Apr 19, 2010, at 9:23 AM, Jeremie Chism wrote: > I am not using alvarion 3.65 but I am using wimax. I have a couple > customers with lower modulation because of non line of site situations > and have seen no impact on the entire system in general. "Supposedly" > wimax is engineered to handle some of this better than my alvarion 900. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Apr 19, 2010, at 8:15 AM, Rubens Kuhl wrote: > >> That would only be true if the data services are somewhat >> purpose-specific and not Internet access. Doing what this vendor told >> you would seriously affect aggregate performance of the cell because >> of low rate modulation of the NLOS and/or distant customers. >> >> If you are doing sensor networks or POS connection you will be fine >> with all those BPSK/QPSK customers, indeed. >> >> >> Rubens >> >> >> On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 10:09 AM, Kurt Fankhauser >> wrote: >>> Has anyone seen the Alvarion 3.65ghz 802.16e equipment in >>> operation? Was >>> talking to one vendor that claimed if you run the system in MIMO >>> that with >>> the diversity you can do NLOS as good as 900mhz and if you get the >>> AP on a >>> 300ft tower that it starts to "feel" like 700mhz. He claimed the >>> NLOS was so >>> good that people are ripping out complete old systems of 900mhz and >>> 2.4ghz >>> and putting in the single system of 3.65ghz to serve their entire >>> customer >>> base. >>> >>> >>> >>> Just wondering if anyone has experience or having seen this >>> firsthand. >>> >>> >>> >>> Kurt Fankhauser >>> WAVELINC >>> P.O. Box 126 >>> Bucyrus, OH 44820 >>> 419-562-6405 >>> www.wavelinc.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> --- >>> --- >>> --- >>> --- >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> --- >>> --- >>> --- >>> --- >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >> >> >> --- >> --- >> --- >> --- >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> --- >> --- >> --- >> --- >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Alvarion 3.65ghz NLOS as good as 900mhz?
I have no experience with 802.16e, but have lots with 802.16d. 16d does not support MIMO. However, even without MIMO, we are "ripping out 900/5.x" and putting in Alvarion .16d. The diversity alone gives it penetration characteristics equal to or better than 900. WiMax does cost more, as we all know, but it also supports more clients (we're projecting close to 200 per base station. I hope we're right... ;-). We can't put it in where 900 is serving just a few customers. Chuck On Apr 19, 2010, at 9:09 AM, Kurt Fankhauser wrote: > Has anyone seen the Alvarion 3.65ghz 802.16e equipment in operation? Was > talking to one vendor that claimed if you run the system in MIMO that with > the diversity you can do NLOS as good as 900mhz and if you get the AP on a > 300ft tower that it starts to "feel" like 700mhz. He claimed the NLOS was so > good that people are ripping out complete old systems of 900mhz and 2.4ghz > and putting in the single system of 3.65ghz to serve their entire customer > base. > > > > Just wondering if anyone has experience or having seen this firsthand. > > > > Kurt Fankhauser > WAVELINC > P.O. Box 126 > Bucyrus, OH 44820 > 419-562-6405 > www.wavelinc.com > > > > > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Does anybody have any ideas?
Chuck, You hope we don't *think* you're nuts?! ;-) Chuck On Mar 31, 2010, at 9:48 PM, Chuck Profito wrote: > Forbes, > Hope the rest of the list doesn't think I'm nuts: > Do you see any large, hi gain CB or Ham beam antennas or Truckers from the > southern area parked or loading nearby? > Within say 1/4 mile of B tower? The new mobile 70KW class C Linear's are > about as dirty as they come. Some of those > drivers from Mexico and AZ are talking direct, no skip, 500 miles on the > lower vertical channels. That much bleed over > in radiated power may trip ground on your switch and or MT boards. It could > come right thru your tower grounding, let alone your antennas and CAt5. > Could you try batteries there? Say a smart charger thru a UPS, then to > batteries. i.e. no common ground. > > Chuck Profito > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Forbes Mercy > Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 10:06 AM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: [WISPA] Does anybody have any ideas? > > We have been plagued with an ongoing issue in our Mikrotik backhauls. > It happens about once a month and only on three radios that feed each > other, all other sites work fine. Site A is my head end, it is a > Mikrotik 433 with an XR5 chip that feeds about five miles to another > site to Site B. Site B has the same equipment that goes through a > managed switch then passes on to Site C about 7 miles further. > > What happens is we are suddenly paged that all three are down. > Sometimes Site A stays up, most times not, we can get into Site A since > it's the head end and we reboot it, it comes right back up. Site B and > C stay down, we have to drive to Site B and reboot it, it comes back up > but Site C stays down. We have a remote reboot for it from a redundant > feed so after rebooting it C reconnects to B and they are all up. This > will happen three or four more times in a single day or not at all again > for a month, it's totally unpredictable. The boards are up but not > communicating, it also takes down the other 2.4 Mikortik AP's at Site B > and that has to be rebooted. We normally run arp -d to clear up any > residual, it sure appears to be traffic related and we are on a bridged > not routed network. > > The only similarities is it's only this feed, it usually happens in > spurts of a day or two then stops for a long time, it always happens > during the working day leading me to believe it's coming from a day > user. We run Wireshark but see nothing, we torch the towers and they > don't show much unusual. We're thinking it might be a deluge of traffic > between Site B and C and are thinking of putting a PC at the C tower to > run diagnostics there. This is very manpower heavy as we have to send > people two places and average down time is one hour to do this. We are > going to turn our network into a routed network this Summer but that > doesn't help now. Any ideas would be appreciated. > > Forbes > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti Sector Tilt angle
near' customers less than 1 or 2 miles... then you can pretty > much >>>> leave the sectors at '0' tilt.. and you have coverage to the > horizon >>>> >>>> The built-in electrical down-tilt typically throws folks off.. > only >>>> becomes a factor if you are needing to down tilt for near customers.. >>>> >>>> Faisal. >>>> >>>> On 3/29/2010 1:36 PM, Robert West wrote: >>>>> I'm having a heck of a time with the large UBNT sectors getting the > tilt >>>>> angle to jive. With the smaller sectors, they behave perfectly and > go >>> right >>>>> where the calculations say they will however, with the larger ones, >>> nothing >>>>> I do other than have someone 10 miles out with a CPE check levels > while >>>>> I >>>>> tilt up and down seems to be good. I REALLY don't want to have to > do >>> that >>>>> with all of them... >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Anyone having any success or insight with the proper tilt of these >>> things? >>>>> Using the 120 degree 5GHz flavors. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Thanks! >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Robert West >>>>> >>>>> Just Micro Digital Services Inc. >>>>> >>>>> 740-335-7020 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Logo5 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>> -- > -- >>> >>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>> >>> -- > -- >>> >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>> >>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>> >>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>>> >>>> - > -- >>> - >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> - > -- >>> - >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> -- >>> l...@iridescent.org >>> >>> >>> >>> -- > -- >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> -- > -- >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> -- > -- >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> ------ > -- >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> --- >>> [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] >>> >>> >> >> Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >> $30.00/mth. >> Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. >> >> >> > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > > >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > -- > Josh Luthman > Office: 937-552-2340 > Direct: 937-552-2343 > 1100 Wayne St > Suite 1337 > Troy, OH 45373 > > "Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to > continue that counts." > --- Winston Churchill > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.791 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2752 - Release Date: 03/30/10 > 01:32:00 > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Building Heights?
Hey, that's a great tool! Thanks for pointing it out. Chuck On Mar 30, 2010, at 11:07 AM, jp wrote: > Use the profiler on here: > http://www.heywhatsthat.com/ > > The website author made it usable for wireless for us. He'll do custom > sites that show only your tower locations too if you want. > > On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 04:42:27PM -0700, Forbes Mercy wrote: >> Wouldn't it be cool if when using Google Earth you could draw a straight >> line between two points and it would calculate the altitude of each >> origin point then mark in red any place where altitude is higher than >> the beginning and end points along the line? For long legs in mixed >> altitude areas that would really be nice. >> >> Forbes >> >> On 3/29/2010 1:12 PM, Jim Patient wrote: >>> Well, it prolly isn't good every place but I just selected 3d buildings >>> on google earth and drug my mouse from the street to top of Met Square >>> in St Louis. It shows the elevation at street level and the top of the >>> building. >>> The difference is the elevation of the building height in this case. >>> >>> Jim >>> >>> >>> On 3/29/2010 2:03 PM, Cameron Crum wrote: >>> >>>> Not for free. This info is usually pretty expensive for good high res >>>> data. That being said, one interesting flaw in the SRTM data is that is >>>> contains "building canopy" within the data. The radar they used bounced >>>> off man made structures and make them appear to be part of the terrain. >>>> So, in big cities, or even small ones in core areas, if you are running >>>> propagation plots, you would not want to add additional building >>>> heights. If you want the most accurate results, I suggest 10m DEM's >>>> (where available) with a good set of building elevation data (the >>>> expensive stuff). If you are just looking to run propagation plots for >>>> your unlicensed network, The SRTM data is probably good enough. >>>> >>>> Cameron >>>> >>>> On 3/29/2010 12:07 PM, Charles Hooper wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>>> Hello, >>>>> >>>>> Does anyone know a reliable source/method of getting building heights? >>>>> Something like a topographical map that included buildings would be >>>>> excellent, but I haven't been able to find anything like this. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks! >>>>> Charles >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>> >>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>> >>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>
Re: [WISPA] [WISPA Members] How the National Broadband Plan can kill whitespace for WISPs or make it great!
Assuming we're talking about the same thing, I think they are proposing to do reverse auctions for the spectrum. Chuck On Mar 18, 2010, at 5:42 PM, Tony Morella wrote: > Hello > > I was reading thought the National Broadband Plan and these two sections > caught my attention: > > "Auction of overlay licenses. Under its current authority,117 the FCC > could auction overlay, flexible-use licenses with secondary rights in > the broadcast TV bands. Overlay auction winners would negotiate with > broadcast TV stations and other licensed users to clear their respective > bands.118 Proceeds from the overlay auction would go to the U.S. > Treasury but could be significantly lower than the proceeds > of an incentive auction, primarily due to greater uncertainty over the > amount and timing of spectrum recovered.119" > > "118 Stations could clear the overlay license bands by ceasing to > broadcast over-the-air or by relocating to another broadcast TV band > with or without overlay licenses. As part of the agreement to cease > over-the-air broadcasts, stations or overlay license winners could reach > private contractual carriage agreements with MVPDs to reach the > remaining 85-90% of households. Thomas Hazlett Comments in re NBP PN > #26, filed Dec. 18, 2009, at 9. With FCC approval, relocating to another > band could involve either occupying another available 6-megahertz > channel or sharing a channel with another station." > > "The FCC should conduct an auction of some or all of the nationwide, > contiguous spectrum recovered through the repacking described above and > through decisions by stations to voluntarily relinquish some or all of > their bandwidth. Stations would receive a share of the proceeds from the > spectrum they directly contribute to the auction." > > If this is adopted it could kill an unlicensed whitespace device as the > overlay licenses would have first rights after the main holder. Also if > they auction off "some or all" of the spectrum recovered this will > reduce the white space dramatically. Also the are not recommending any > changes to how auctions are done to include small business. > > Comments? > > Sincerely, Tony Morella > Demarc Technology Group, A Wireless Solution Provider > Office: 207-667-7583 Fax: 207-433-1008 > http://www.demarctech.com/ > Need to sell off over stock!! Major discounts no quanity needed! 600mW > Atheros CPEs, Starting at $59.95!! > ___ > > WISPA Membership Mailing List > > --- -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 3.65 GHz WiMAX deal
I'm pretty sure Alvarion's 802.16e is using MIMO. (But I'm using their .16d stuff so I'm not an expert in the .16e production line). Chuck On Mar 18, 2010, at 3:23 PM, Forbes Mercy wrote: > I have to admit if MIMO is made available in the 3.65 range I'm going to > use it in my city. I've been catering to my rural customers because 2.4 > and 5GHZ isn't clogged out there. We already have a 3.65 license but > haven't deployed it yet, I anxiously await the MIMO gear on that frequency. > > Forbes > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL
If I'm being charged $7000/month just to get to Syracuse by this new build out, I can't imagine what they'd charge to go to NYC. Chuck On Mar 17, 2010, at 9:02 AM, Mike Hammett wrote: > That is the purpose of a middle mile BTOP grant... to take you from Ithaca, > Syracuse, Binghamton, or Rochester to 60 Hudson St. or 111 8th Ave., New > York. > > > - > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions > http://www.ics-il.com > > > > ------ > From: "Chuck Bartosch" > Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 10:31 PM > To: "WISPA General List" > Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL > >> But He.net isn't in Syracuse so that doesn't do me a whole lot of good. >> They aren't in Binghamton either. Nor are they in Rochester (which is >> really too far but is the next closest meet point). >> >> Chuck >> >> On Mar 16, 2010, at 11:21 PM, char...@knownelement.com wrote: >> >>> He.net will do $1 per Meg with 1 gig minimum commit. >>> >>> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile >>> >>> -Original Message- >>> From: Chuck Bartosch >>> Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 22:49:09 >>> To: WISPA General List >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL >>> >>> I can't use a gig right now. However, to *get* that gig would cost us >>> $7000/month for a wavelength on one provider's new network. Suddenly the >>> gig that I can't really use isn't cheap at all. The costs for what I *do* >>> use would more than double. >>> >>> Even in the carrier hotels in the bigger cities, bandwidth is not >>> available at $1/Mbps. Most quotes, aside from Cogent's end-of-the-year >>> special, are for about $8/Mbps (though that'd be for 100 Mbps scale >>> purchases, not gig purchases). >>> >>> Chuck >>> >>> On Mar 16, 2010, at 10:32 PM, Mike Hammett wrote: >>> >>>> So having a gig transport to $1/megabit transit doesn't deploy access to >>>> needed areas? >>>> >>>> The middle mile could be built wherever. >>>> >>>> The best middle mile project we could see is a hybrid of fiber and >>>> wireless. >>>> Mostly fiber with fiber or microwave down to clients. >>>> >>>> >>>> - >>>> Mike Hammett >>>> Intelligent Computing Solutions >>>> http://www.ics-il.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> From: "Chuck Bartosch" >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 9:04 PM >>>> To: ; "WISPA General List" >>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL >>>> >>>>> In my experience, >>>>> >>>>> (1) the problem for rolling out to a new area IS NOT cost of backhaul, >>>>> it's the cost of the equipment. Sure we all like cheaper backhaul, but >>>>> it >>>>> doesn't prevent a roll out to an unserved area. I'm sure there are >>>>> exceptions to that-but they are going to be very very rare. >>>>> >>>>> (2) the prices I'm seeing for the new backhauls from buildouts funded >>>>> by >>>>> NTIA are not cheaper than what already exists in an area. Again, I'm >>>>> sure >>>>> there are exceptions, but I'm willing to bet they are also rare. >>>>> >>>>> As I'm sure you can figure out, I'm not free to disclose which >>>>> applications I'm familiar with. >>>>> >>>>> Chuck >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 16, 2010, at 4:17 PM, char...@knownelement.com wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Citations needed? >>>>>> >>>>>> I have seen many many many posts on this list discussing/complaining >>>>>> about middle mile/back haul issues including access and expense. >>>>>> >>>>>> If the vast majority of wisps have access to sufficient back haul at >>>>>> competive prices then I stand corrected. Do the wisps on this list >>>>>> feel >>>>>> that your back haul needs are being adequately met with existing >>>>>> infestructure?
Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL
But He.net isn't in Syracuse so that doesn't do me a whole lot of good. They aren't in Binghamton either. Nor are they in Rochester (which is really too far but is the next closest meet point). Chuck On Mar 16, 2010, at 11:21 PM, char...@knownelement.com wrote: > He.net will do $1 per Meg with 1 gig minimum commit. > > Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile > > -Original Message- > From: Chuck Bartosch > Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 22:49:09 > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL > > I can't use a gig right now. However, to *get* that gig would cost us > $7000/month for a wavelength on one provider's new network. Suddenly the gig > that I can't really use isn't cheap at all. The costs for what I *do* use > would more than double. > > Even in the carrier hotels in the bigger cities, bandwidth is not available > at $1/Mbps. Most quotes, aside from Cogent's end-of-the-year special, are for > about $8/Mbps (though that'd be for 100 Mbps scale purchases, not gig > purchases). > > Chuck > > On Mar 16, 2010, at 10:32 PM, Mike Hammett wrote: > >> So having a gig transport to $1/megabit transit doesn't deploy access to >> needed areas? >> >> The middle mile could be built wherever. >> >> The best middle mile project we could see is a hybrid of fiber and wireless. >> Mostly fiber with fiber or microwave down to clients. >> >> >> - >> Mike Hammett >> Intelligent Computing Solutions >> http://www.ics-il.com >> >> >> >> -- >> From: "Chuck Bartosch" >> Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 9:04 PM >> To: ; "WISPA General List" >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL >> >>> In my experience, >>> >>> (1) the problem for rolling out to a new area IS NOT cost of backhaul, >>> it's the cost of the equipment. Sure we all like cheaper backhaul, but it >>> doesn't prevent a roll out to an unserved area. I'm sure there are >>> exceptions to that-but they are going to be very very rare. >>> >>> (2) the prices I'm seeing for the new backhauls from buildouts funded by >>> NTIA are not cheaper than what already exists in an area. Again, I'm sure >>> there are exceptions, but I'm willing to bet they are also rare. >>> >>> As I'm sure you can figure out, I'm not free to disclose which >>> applications I'm familiar with. >>> >>> Chuck >>> >>> >>> On Mar 16, 2010, at 4:17 PM, char...@knownelement.com wrote: >>> >>>> Citations needed? >>>> >>>> I have seen many many many posts on this list discussing/complaining >>>> about middle mile/back haul issues including access and expense. >>>> >>>> If the vast majority of wisps have access to sufficient back haul at >>>> competive prices then I stand corrected. Do the wisps on this list feel >>>> that your back haul needs are being adequately met with existing >>>> infestructure? >>>> Maybe someone should setup a poll on a website and let wisps vote? >>>> >>>> >>>> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile >>>> >>>> -Original Message- >>>> From: Chuck Bartosch >>>> Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 16:00:04 >>>> To: WISPA General List >>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL >>>> >>>> I think largely the middle mile funds are wasted. Most areas already have >>>> at least *some* fiber. The cost, and the problem, is in getting last mile >>>> done, not middle mile done. From my direct experience and observation, a >>>> lot of the middle mile projects NTIA is funding is really for redundant >>>> fiber. Where it isn't redundant it isn't really providing functionality >>>> that would help last mile access in the projects I've looked at. Worse, >>>> the middle mile projects are NOT being designed intimately with last mile >>>> providers. They are going to "key community institutions" which (1) >>>> mostly already have fiber connections and (2) really have no impact on >>>> where service is needed for last mile access. >>>> >>>> Chuck >>>> >>>> On Mar 16, 2010, at 1:40 PM, Charles N Wyble wrote: >>>> >>>>> This
Re: [WISPA] Here comes the really BIG WAVE
If I go out and shoot a deer, I "took" it's life (and it's meat ;-). If I give you some, I'm giving you some, whether or not I took it from someone else. If you're my kid and I give you bread, I'm giving it to you whether or not I paid for it or I broke into a store and stole it. Chuck On Mar 16, 2010, at 8:55 PM, RickG wrote: > websters.com > –give (used with object) > 1.to present voluntarily and without expecting compensation; bestow: > to give a birthday present to someone. > > The government cant "give" anything because they get the money to pay > for such things from us, the US taxpayer. They simply take and > transfer ownership. > > On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 8:47 PM, Jack Unger wrote: >> Chuck, >> >> Thanks. You just reminded me that the government gave us the Internet too. >> From Wikipedia - >> >> The origins of the Internet reach back to the 1960s when the United States >> funded research projects of its military agencies to build robust, >> fault-tolerant and distributed computer networks. This research and a period >> of civilian funding of a new U.S. backbone by the National Science >> Foundation spawned worldwide participation in the development of new >> networking technologies and led to the commercialization of an international >> network in the mid 1990s, and resulted in the following popularization of >> countless applications in virtually every aspect of modern human life. As of >> 2009, an estimated quarter of Earth's population uses the services of the >> Internet. >> >> jack >> >> >> Chuck Bartosch wrote: >> >> On Mar 16, 2010, at 2:27 AM, MDK wrote: >> >> >> >> Government "Gave" me my life? Really? >> >> Telephone? Until we got the government out of it, it was horrendously >> expensive and advanced none at all. >> >> >> That isn't really true Mark. Before the government got involved you had >> multiple non-interworking telephone systems. I remember my grandfather >> telling me when I was young that people had to have a "red telephone" and a >> "blue telephone" in Minneapolis where we grew up for the two phone companies >> if you wanted to be able to call everyone with a phone. Talk about >> horrendously expensive (and not just in cost, but in time). Government >> forced a monopoly situation that for many many decades worked to our >> advantage. Eventually that was broken up when it no longer served the >> public's interest. >> >> I also remember that friends who travelled around the world coming back >> always commenting about how much more advanced and how much more reliable >> our telecom systems were than anyone else's. >> >> And no advances? Geeze, when I was a kid everyone I knew had party lines. >> Not long before that you had operators connecting calls. There were a LOT of >> advances given the core technology that was available. >> >> It is hard to see just what kind of other advances you could have had in the >> 30's, 40's, 50's and early 60's. The internet wasn't possible back then >> because home computers didn't exist and the protocols that allowed it to >> emerge didn't exist. >> >> It wasn't until the later 60's that transistors really became viable and >> allowed a lot of the dynamic advances that breaking the monopoly enabled. >> Yes, it took a decade or two to undo the the regulatory environment that by >> that point WAS holding back progress, but I respectfully submit that doing >> it decades earlier than that would have had no particular beneficial effect >> and the original intervention was hugely beneficial. >> >> Reflexively painting everything government does as bad is simplistic though >> has the benefit that it doesn't take a lot of thought. But it's a disservice >> to your own arguments and restricts your ability to influence debate and the >> position of others. It might be more useful to take a more balanced view >> that more accurately reflects reality. >> >> Chuck >> >> >> >> Now, we have services that WERE NOT >> EVEN CONCEIVABLE to me the year I got married. We've come that far since >> then. >> >> Copper to my house? Obsolete. >> >> Long distance?I haven't paid that in years. All it took was someone >> with a big enough club to force government to undo what it did "for" us. >> It could be so cheap and so competitive the cost would be
Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL
Right, I've been as proactive as anyone. However, in our regional rate centers those prices simply are not available. And the transport you're being quoted is 1/10th the rate we're seeing-for a similar distance I might add. And that's from one of the Round 1 winners. Chuck On Mar 16, 2010, at 10:56 PM, Mike Hammett wrote: > That middle mile would bring that $1 megabit to you more affordably. If a > middle mile project that I'm "working" with goes through, I'll have > $871/month transport for 1 gigabit 60 driving miles into 350 Cermak, one of > the top 4 or 5 connected buildings in the country. > > Yes, I have personally received multiple $1 and below quotes and I haven't > been as proactive as others on this list have been. > > > - > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions > http://www.ics-il.com > > > > -- > From: "Chuck Bartosch" > Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 9:49 PM > To: "WISPA General List" > Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL > >> I can't use a gig right now. However, to *get* that gig would cost us >> $7000/month for a wavelength on one provider's new network. Suddenly the >> gig that I can't really use isn't cheap at all. The costs for what I *do* >> use would more than double. >> >> Even in the carrier hotels in the bigger cities, bandwidth is not >> available at $1/Mbps. Most quotes, aside from Cogent's end-of-the-year >> special, are for about $8/Mbps (though that'd be for 100 Mbps scale >> purchases, not gig purchases). >> >> Chuck >> >> On Mar 16, 2010, at 10:32 PM, Mike Hammett wrote: >> >>> So having a gig transport to $1/megabit transit doesn't deploy access to >>> needed areas? >>> >>> The middle mile could be built wherever. >>> >>> The best middle mile project we could see is a hybrid of fiber and >>> wireless. >>> Mostly fiber with fiber or microwave down to clients. >>> >>> >>> - >>> Mike Hammett >>> Intelligent Computing Solutions >>> http://www.ics-il.com >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> From: "Chuck Bartosch" >>> Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 9:04 PM >>> To: ; "WISPA General List" >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL >>> >>>> In my experience, >>>> >>>> (1) the problem for rolling out to a new area IS NOT cost of backhaul, >>>> it's the cost of the equipment. Sure we all like cheaper backhaul, but >>>> it >>>> doesn't prevent a roll out to an unserved area. I'm sure there are >>>> exceptions to that-but they are going to be very very rare. >>>> >>>> (2) the prices I'm seeing for the new backhauls from buildouts funded by >>>> NTIA are not cheaper than what already exists in an area. Again, I'm >>>> sure >>>> there are exceptions, but I'm willing to bet they are also rare. >>>> >>>> As I'm sure you can figure out, I'm not free to disclose which >>>> applications I'm familiar with. >>>> >>>> Chuck >>>> >>>> >>>> On Mar 16, 2010, at 4:17 PM, char...@knownelement.com wrote: >>>> >>>>> Citations needed? >>>>> >>>>> I have seen many many many posts on this list discussing/complaining >>>>> about middle mile/back haul issues including access and expense. >>>>> >>>>> If the vast majority of wisps have access to sufficient back haul at >>>>> competive prices then I stand corrected. Do the wisps on this list feel >>>>> that your back haul needs are being adequately met with existing >>>>> infestructure? >>>>> Maybe someone should setup a poll on a website and let wisps vote? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile >>>>> >>>>> -Original Message- >>>>> From: Chuck Bartosch >>>>> Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 16:00:04 >>>>> To: WISPA General List >>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL >>>>> >>>>> I think largely the middle mile funds are wasted. Most areas already >>>>> have >>>>&
Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL
On Mar 16, 2010, at 10:49 PM, Chuck Bartosch wrote: > I can't use a gig right now. However, to *get* that gig would cost us > $7000/month for a wavelength on one provider's new network. Suddenly the gig > that I can't really use isn't cheap at all. The costs for what I *do* use > would more than double. > > Even in the carrier hotels in the bigger cities, bandwidth is not available > at $1/Mbps. I meant in our area by the way (I'm sure that was obvious, but just in case). Chuck > Most quotes, aside from Cogent's end-of-the-year special, are for about > $8/Mbps (though that'd be for 100 Mbps scale purchases, not gig purchases). > > Chuck > > On Mar 16, 2010, at 10:32 PM, Mike Hammett wrote: > >> So having a gig transport to $1/megabit transit doesn't deploy access to >> needed areas? >> >> The middle mile could be built wherever. >> >> The best middle mile project we could see is a hybrid of fiber and wireless. >> Mostly fiber with fiber or microwave down to clients. >> >> >> - >> Mike Hammett >> Intelligent Computing Solutions >> http://www.ics-il.com >> >> >> >> -- >> From: "Chuck Bartosch" >> Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 9:04 PM >> To: ; "WISPA General List" >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL >> >>> In my experience, >>> >>> (1) the problem for rolling out to a new area IS NOT cost of backhaul, >>> it's the cost of the equipment. Sure we all like cheaper backhaul, but it >>> doesn't prevent a roll out to an unserved area. I'm sure there are >>> exceptions to that-but they are going to be very very rare. >>> >>> (2) the prices I'm seeing for the new backhauls from buildouts funded by >>> NTIA are not cheaper than what already exists in an area. Again, I'm sure >>> there are exceptions, but I'm willing to bet they are also rare. >>> >>> As I'm sure you can figure out, I'm not free to disclose which >>> applications I'm familiar with. >>> >>> Chuck >>> >>> >>> On Mar 16, 2010, at 4:17 PM, char...@knownelement.com wrote: >>> >>>> Citations needed? >>>> >>>> I have seen many many many posts on this list discussing/complaining >>>> about middle mile/back haul issues including access and expense. >>>> >>>> If the vast majority of wisps have access to sufficient back haul at >>>> competive prices then I stand corrected. Do the wisps on this list feel >>>> that your back haul needs are being adequately met with existing >>>> infestructure? >>>> Maybe someone should setup a poll on a website and let wisps vote? >>>> >>>> >>>> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile >>>> >>>> -Original Message- >>>> From: Chuck Bartosch >>>> Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 16:00:04 >>>> To: WISPA General List >>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL >>>> >>>> I think largely the middle mile funds are wasted. Most areas already have >>>> at least *some* fiber. The cost, and the problem, is in getting last mile >>>> done, not middle mile done. From my direct experience and observation, a >>>> lot of the middle mile projects NTIA is funding is really for redundant >>>> fiber. Where it isn't redundant it isn't really providing functionality >>>> that would help last mile access in the projects I've looked at. Worse, >>>> the middle mile projects are NOT being designed intimately with last mile >>>> providers. They are going to "key community institutions" which (1) >>>> mostly already have fiber connections and (2) really have no impact on >>>> where service is needed for last mile access. >>>> >>>> Chuck >>>> >>>> On Mar 16, 2010, at 1:40 PM, Charles N Wyble wrote: >>>> >>>>> This is why I have said that the stimulus dollars need to go to middle >>>>> milte build outs. Wireless as a last mile medium is very well understood >>>>> and gives best bang for the buck in a lot of scenarios. >>>>> >>>>> Justin Wilson wrote: >>>>>> I think part of the issue is economies of scale. Many rural ISPs >>>>>> have
Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL
I can't use a gig right now. However, to *get* that gig would cost us $7000/month for a wavelength on one provider's new network. Suddenly the gig that I can't really use isn't cheap at all. The costs for what I *do* use would more than double. Even in the carrier hotels in the bigger cities, bandwidth is not available at $1/Mbps. Most quotes, aside from Cogent's end-of-the-year special, are for about $8/Mbps (though that'd be for 100 Mbps scale purchases, not gig purchases). Chuck On Mar 16, 2010, at 10:32 PM, Mike Hammett wrote: > So having a gig transport to $1/megabit transit doesn't deploy access to > needed areas? > > The middle mile could be built wherever. > > The best middle mile project we could see is a hybrid of fiber and wireless. > Mostly fiber with fiber or microwave down to clients. > > > - > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions > http://www.ics-il.com > > > > -- > From: "Chuck Bartosch" > Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 9:04 PM > To: ; "WISPA General List" > Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL > >> In my experience, >> >> (1) the problem for rolling out to a new area IS NOT cost of backhaul, >> it's the cost of the equipment. Sure we all like cheaper backhaul, but it >> doesn't prevent a roll out to an unserved area. I'm sure there are >> exceptions to that-but they are going to be very very rare. >> >> (2) the prices I'm seeing for the new backhauls from buildouts funded by >> NTIA are not cheaper than what already exists in an area. Again, I'm sure >> there are exceptions, but I'm willing to bet they are also rare. >> >> As I'm sure you can figure out, I'm not free to disclose which >> applications I'm familiar with. >> >> Chuck >> >> >> On Mar 16, 2010, at 4:17 PM, char...@knownelement.com wrote: >> >>> Citations needed? >>> >>> I have seen many many many posts on this list discussing/complaining >>> about middle mile/back haul issues including access and expense. >>> >>> If the vast majority of wisps have access to sufficient back haul at >>> competive prices then I stand corrected. Do the wisps on this list feel >>> that your back haul needs are being adequately met with existing >>> infestructure? >>> Maybe someone should setup a poll on a website and let wisps vote? >>> >>> >>> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile >>> >>> -Original Message- >>> From: Chuck Bartosch >>> Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 16:00:04 >>> To: WISPA General List >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL >>> >>> I think largely the middle mile funds are wasted. Most areas already have >>> at least *some* fiber. The cost, and the problem, is in getting last mile >>> done, not middle mile done. From my direct experience and observation, a >>> lot of the middle mile projects NTIA is funding is really for redundant >>> fiber. Where it isn't redundant it isn't really providing functionality >>> that would help last mile access in the projects I've looked at. Worse, >>> the middle mile projects are NOT being designed intimately with last mile >>> providers. They are going to "key community institutions" which (1) >>> mostly already have fiber connections and (2) really have no impact on >>> where service is needed for last mile access. >>> >>> Chuck >>> >>> On Mar 16, 2010, at 1:40 PM, Charles N Wyble wrote: >>> >>>> This is why I have said that the stimulus dollars need to go to middle >>>> milte build outs. Wireless as a last mile medium is very well understood >>>> and gives best bang for the buck in a lot of scenarios. >>>> >>>> Justin Wilson wrote: >>>>> I think part of the issue is economies of scale. Many rural ISPs >>>>> have >>>>> T1s and T3s at best. The cost of transport and bandwidth doesn¹t allow >>>>> them >>>>> to scale as well as they could if they had fiber or some other high >>>>> capacity >>>>> transport. With providers such as Cogent well under $10 a meg in bulk >>>>> you >>>>> can afford to up the speed (providing your network can support it) if >>>>> you >>>>> have access to such things. >>>>&
Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL
In my experience, (1) the problem for rolling out to a new area IS NOT cost of backhaul, it's the cost of the equipment. Sure we all like cheaper backhaul, but it doesn't prevent a roll out to an unserved area. I'm sure there are exceptions to that-but they are going to be very very rare. (2) the prices I'm seeing for the new backhauls from buildouts funded by NTIA are not cheaper than what already exists in an area. Again, I'm sure there are exceptions, but I'm willing to bet they are also rare. As I'm sure you can figure out, I'm not free to disclose which applications I'm familiar with. Chuck On Mar 16, 2010, at 4:17 PM, char...@knownelement.com wrote: > Citations needed? > > I have seen many many many posts on this list discussing/complaining about > middle mile/back haul issues including access and expense. > > If the vast majority of wisps have access to sufficient back haul at > competive prices then I stand corrected. Do the wisps on this list feel that > your back haul needs are being adequately met with existing infestructure? > Maybe someone should setup a poll on a website and let wisps vote? > > > Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile > > -Original Message- > From: Chuck Bartosch > Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 16:00:04 > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL > > I think largely the middle mile funds are wasted. Most areas already have at > least *some* fiber. The cost, and the problem, is in getting last mile done, > not middle mile done. From my direct experience and observation, a lot of the > middle mile projects NTIA is funding is really for redundant fiber. Where it > isn't redundant it isn't really providing functionality that would help last > mile access in the projects I've looked at. Worse, the middle mile projects > are NOT being designed intimately with last mile providers. They are going to > "key community institutions" which (1) mostly already have fiber connections > and (2) really have no impact on where service is needed for last mile access. > > Chuck > > On Mar 16, 2010, at 1:40 PM, Charles N Wyble wrote: > >> This is why I have said that the stimulus dollars need to go to middle >> milte build outs. Wireless as a last mile medium is very well understood >> and gives best bang for the buck in a lot of scenarios. >> >> Justin Wilson wrote: >>> I think part of the issue is economies of scale. Many rural ISPs have >>> T1s and T3s at best. The cost of transport and bandwidth doesn¹t allow them >>> to scale as well as they could if they had fiber or some other high capacity >>> transport. With providers such as Cogent well under $10 a meg in bulk you >>> can afford to up the speed (providing your network can support it) if you >>> have access to such things. >>> >>> I have seen several providers start offering better speeds once they had >>> access to a bigger pipe. I know in my area a T1 is still around $450 a >>> month. Get 4 bonded t1s and you are looking at $300 a meg. If you had >>> access to fiber and your transport + bandwidth cost you say $75 a meg you >>> could afford to up the subscriber speeds. >>> >>> Just my thoughts. >>> >>> Justin >>> >> >> >> >> ---- >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > -- > Chuck Bartosch > Clarity Connect, Inc. > 200 Pleasant Grove Road > Ithaca, NY 14850 > (607) 257-8268 > > "When the stars threw down their spears, > and water'd heaven with their tears, > Did He smile, His work to see? > Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" > >> From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > >
Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL
I think largely the middle mile funds are wasted. Most areas already have at least *some* fiber. The cost, and the problem, is in getting last mile done, not middle mile done. From my direct experience and observation, a lot of the middle mile projects NTIA is funding is really for redundant fiber. Where it isn't redundant it isn't really providing functionality that would help last mile access in the projects I've looked at. Worse, the middle mile projects are NOT being designed intimately with last mile providers. They are going to "key community institutions" which (1) mostly already have fiber connections and (2) really have no impact on where service is needed for last mile access. Chuck On Mar 16, 2010, at 1:40 PM, Charles N Wyble wrote: > This is why I have said that the stimulus dollars need to go to middle > milte build outs. Wireless as a last mile medium is very well understood > and gives best bang for the buck in a lot of scenarios. > > Justin Wilson wrote: >>I think part of the issue is economies of scale. Many rural ISPs have >> T1s and T3s at best. The cost of transport and bandwidth doesn¹t allow them >> to scale as well as they could if they had fiber or some other high capacity >> transport. With providers such as Cogent well under $10 a meg in bulk you >> can afford to up the speed (providing your network can support it) if you >> have access to such things. >> >>I have seen several providers start offering better speeds once they had >> access to a bigger pipe. I know in my area a T1 is still around $450 a >> month. Get 4 bonded t1s and you are looking at $300 a meg. If you had >> access to fiber and your transport + bandwidth cost you say $75 a meg you >> could afford to up the subscriber speeds. >> >>Just my thoughts. >> >>Justin >> > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] iPhone ssh app
Okay, the answer I got was: "blackra1n works in a flash and you don't even need to restore your stuff" http://www.blackra1n.org/ She discussed several others but that's her clear preference. Chuck On Mar 16, 2010, at 1:04 AM, Jerry Richardson wrote: > any recommendations on the best jailbreak program? > > I used Backra1n and it ran fine for a couple of weeks then crashed for no > apparent reason. > > > > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Josh Luthman > Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 8:34 AM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] iPhone ssh app > > Jerry, > > Yes you need to jailbreak. Jailbreaking basically gives you access to > the underlying OS rather then being tied to the pretty skined app on > top of it. > > Josh Luthman > Office: 937-552-2340 > Direct: 937-552-2343 > 1100 Wayne St > Suite 1337 > Troy, OH 45373 > > "Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to > continue that counts." > --- Winston Churchill > > > > On Fri, Mar 12, 2010 at 10:44 AM, Jerry Richardson > wrote: >> how do you access the shell? do I need to jailbreak ? >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 11, 2010, at 1:58 PM, "Sales" wrote: >> >>> Hmm I just goto my iPhones command line via shell and type ssh >>> works like a charm. >>> >>> John Buwa >>> Michiana Wireless,Inc >>> 574-233-7170 >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 11, 2010, at 4:54 PM, Data Technology wrote: >>> >>>> I know in the last couple of weeks there was a discussion about an >>>> ssh >>>> app for the iPhone. >>>> I did not save the emails because I thought I would never need >>>> something >>>> like because I don't have an iPhone. >>>> >>>> But, I bought an iPhone last night and now I am looking for an ssh >>>> app. >>>> >>>> I have found iSSH and the reviews are good about it. I know that >>>> $7.99 >>>> for an app is a lot of money but if this is the one to have then I >>>> don't >>>> mind spending the money. This also appears to have a vnc client as >>>> well. >>>> >>>> Any input as far as SSH utilities or any other iPhone apps for WISP >>>> operations would be appreciated. >>>> >>>> LaRoy McCann >>>> Data Technology >>>> >>>> >>>> --- >>>> --- >>>> --- >>>> --- >>>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> --- >>>> --- >>>> --- >>>> --- >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> --- >>> --- >>> --- >>> --- >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> --- >>> --- >>> --- >>> --- >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > -
Re: [WISPA] Here comes the really BIG WAVE
>>>> >>>> >>>> ++ >>>> Neofast, Inc, Making internet easy >>>> 541-969-8200 509-386-4589 >>>> ++ >>>> >>>> -- >>>> From: "Jack Unger" >>>> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 9:26 AM >>>> To: "WISPA General List" ; >>>> Subject: [WISPA] Here comes the really BIG WAVE >>>> >>>>> >>>>> <http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/13/business/media/13fcc.html?hp=&adxnnl=1&adxnnlx=1268486085-Jt93CAOuKUSJEQR/ZmVkzg >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. >>>>> Network Design - Technical Training - Technical Writing >>>>> Serving the Broadband Wireless, Networking and Telecom Communities >>>>> since >>>>> 1993 >>>>> www.ask-wi.com 818-227-4220 jun...@ask-wi.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>> >>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>> >>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] iPhone ssh app
I'll ask and get back to you. My gf has tried them all 'cause that's what she does for fun... Chuck On Mar 16, 2010, at 1:04 AM, Jerry Richardson wrote: > any recommendations on the best jailbreak program? > > I used Backra1n and it ran fine for a couple of weeks then crashed for no > apparent reason. > > > > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Josh Luthman > Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 8:34 AM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] iPhone ssh app > > Jerry, > > Yes you need to jailbreak. Jailbreaking basically gives you access to > the underlying OS rather then being tied to the pretty skined app on > top of it. > > Josh Luthman > Office: 937-552-2340 > Direct: 937-552-2343 > 1100 Wayne St > Suite 1337 > Troy, OH 45373 > > "Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to > continue that counts." > --- Winston Churchill > > > > On Fri, Mar 12, 2010 at 10:44 AM, Jerry Richardson > wrote: >> how do you access the shell? do I need to jailbreak ? >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Mar 11, 2010, at 1:58 PM, "Sales" wrote: >> >>> Hmm I just goto my iPhones command line via shell and type ssh >>> works like a charm. >>> >>> John Buwa >>> Michiana Wireless,Inc >>> 574-233-7170 >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Mar 11, 2010, at 4:54 PM, Data Technology wrote: >>> >>>> I know in the last couple of weeks there was a discussion about an >>>> ssh >>>> app for the iPhone. >>>> I did not save the emails because I thought I would never need >>>> something >>>> like because I don't have an iPhone. >>>> >>>> But, I bought an iPhone last night and now I am looking for an ssh >>>> app. >>>> >>>> I have found iSSH and the reviews are good about it. I know that >>>> $7.99 >>>> for an app is a lot of money but if this is the one to have then I >>>> don't >>>> mind spending the money. This also appears to have a vnc client as >>>> well. >>>> >>>> Any input as far as SSH utilities or any other iPhone apps for WISP >>>> operations would be appreciated. >>>> >>>> LaRoy McCann >>>> Data Technology >>>> >>>> >>>> --- >>>> --- >>>> --- >>>> --- >>>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> --- >>>> --- >>>> --- >>>> --- >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> --- >>> --- >>> --- >>> --- >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> --- >>> --- >>> --- >>> --- >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mai
Re: [WISPA] here it come$
Well, for what it's worth I hope *you* are right and *I* am wrong ;-). Damn I hate betting against the outcome I _want_ to see! Chuck On Mar 13, 2010, at 11:37 AM, RickG wrote: > Chuck, > > You're perceptive on the reasons I didnt "hear" of it, I probably just > didnt pay attention as it didnt seem to apply or it just got lost in > all the topics. > > As I've mentioned before, I did "pay by the bit" back in '98 when I > was GM at a small cable co. I only imposed it on bandwidth hogs and it > worked well. The reason I havent switched to it with this company is > that so far its not worth the hassle. > > With that said, I'll see your prediction and raise you:) > TCP/IP will eventually be the only pipe for all communications. Once > that happens, the cable co will utilize their billing model for > television. It may not be bill by the bit but they will certainly > charge a premium for advanced services. > > -RickG > > On Sat, Mar 13, 2010 at 11:21 AM, Chuck Bartosch > wrote: >> >> On Mar 12, 2010, at 11:20 PM, RickG wrote: >> >>> Actually, yes, this is the first I've heard about it. Obviously, I'm >>> not a sports fan :) >> >> I was initially surprised you hadn't heard of it before too because you're >> pretty active on list and it's been discussed numerous times and in detail >> over the past 15 months but maybe it was on another list (the WISPA members >> list?). Or, like the Form 477 discussions a few years ago that I personally >> skipped over for a long time, maybe it was just an ignored thread topic >> (given our propensity to not start new threads for new topics, that wouldn't >> be surprising). Most of us heard of it either due to customer complaints or >> because of the list discussion. >> >> For what it's worth, I honestly don't think the industry will ever move >> en-mass to a pay-by-the-bit model. True, it makes the most sense from an >> operator standpoint, but it's just too easy to get undercut by a competitor >> who doesn't do it, the big companies that would have to do it first for it >> to go mainstream invariably chicken out too quickly or mess it up by doing >> it in a high-handed fashion that pisses everyone off, or politicians will >> get involved to defeat the model. That's *my* prediction. >> >> Chuck >> >>> I've never had a customer request. I've have mixed feelings about >>> this. Coming from the cable world, I was used to paying providers for >>> channel content. The difference was, we didnt have to pay for >>> bandwidth. Now, everyone wants to ride the bandwidth that we pay for >>> to get to our customer. Maybe big bad ESPN should pay us? >>> .05/sub/month doesnt sound like much but it adds up real fast. Worse >>> yet, you still pay even though not everyone wants or needs it. Oh, and >>> just what we need, another paper to fill out. >>> I've been predicting since '97 that we'll have to charge the billing >>> model to charge by the bit and that day is getting closer each time >>> things like this occur. >>> -RickG >>> BTW: I did dial-up back in '93 and never paid for a TCP/IP stack or >>> the Browser :) >>> >>> On Fri, Mar 12, 2010 at 8:24 PM, Tim Sylvester >>> wrote: >>>> I'm confused by this message. Are you saying you just heard of ESPN360? It >>>> has been around since 2007. >>>> >>>> How much do you think big bad ESPN charges for ESPN360? I have seen >>>> estimates between $0.05/sub/month to $0.25/sub/month. As far as I can tell, >>>> any ISP can contact ESPN and sign-up to offer ESPN360 to their subscribers. >>>> Here's a link to the current list of ISPs offering ESPN360: >>>> http://espn.go.com/broadband/espn360/affList. The list of providers ranges >>>> from ATT and Verizon each with over 10M subs. Down to the Spencer Iowa >>>> Municipal Utilities and Spruce Knob Seneca Rocks Telephone, each with a few >>>> thousand subs. >>>> >>>> The list includes cable, DSL and FTTH ISPs. The only thing that might >>>> prevent a WISP from offering ESPN360 is bandwidth. >>>> >>>> ESPN360 is just an add-on service that an ISP can bundle with their service >>>> offerings to customers. Think of it like offering e-mail accounts or web >>>> sites. In the mid 90s, ISPs had to pay to provide a TCP/IP stack and a web >>>> browser t
Re: [WISPA] here it come$
; WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] iPhone ssh app
Yeah, I haven't found tethering to make all that much sense either. My gf has her iPhone jail broken, but honestly, I think she does it just because she can...I haven't seen her do anything with it that actually mattered. I haven't had a problem doing anything I needed (or wanted) to do without jail breaking. I also have a Droid at the moment, but damn, I'll tell you, it's a annoying as hell in comparison. And I really hate the little feedback vibration every time I touch one of the permanent keys (maybe that can be turned off-I haven't taken the time to delve too much into the options yet). I'll keep using it for a few more days but so far it doesn't compare, even though Verizon's 3G coverage IS a little but broader out this way (but, it's not as much broader as I'd thought it was supposed to be). However, if I didn't have the iPhone as an option, I'd probably love the Droid. Sure beats what I used to use, even if it doesn't quite meet (for me) the iPhone standards. As always with this kind of thing, I'm sure YMMV. Chuck On Mar 11, 2010, at 6:04 PM, Data Technology wrote: > Justin Wilson wrote: >>The only benefit I have seen so far of Jailbreaking an iphone is being >> able to tether it. Every App I have wanted to run I can find in the store. >> >>Justin >> > I had thought that would be a great thing to have, then I could connect > the laptop and have a bigger screen and kbd to browse with. > But around here I don't have 3g available, so AT&T is slow for the internet. > > I then thought that I could just use a wi-fi connection (surly I could > find one of those!) but then I thought, "you big dummy", if I can get a > wi-fi connection on the phone to tether to the laptop then I could just > connect to the wi-fi with the laptop ;) > > So I dont't think I really need tethering. > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] USF Changes
t;> "intercarrier compensation" system, the Byzantine menu of charges that >>> telecom carriers pay to access each other's networks and connect >>> calls. Any changes to the Universal Service Fund would also require >>> changes to intercarrier compensation because rural phone companies >>> tend to rely heavily on both funding sources. >>> >>> The FCC's latest proposals will be part of a sweeping national roadmap >>> for bringing universal, affordable broadband connections to all >>> Americans. >>> >>> Although the plan is due on March 17, the agency has already begun >>> releasing details, including a proposal to make more wireless spectrum >>> available for mobile broadband connections by letting television >>> broadcasters and others voluntarily cede some airwaves. >>> >>> Some of the proposals will likely require congressional action, while >>> others might be up to the FCC to implement. >>> >>> Yahoo article: >>> >>> http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100305/ap_on_hi_te/us_tec_fcc_universal_service;_ylt=AgSGtpiLKKQbXooR3LKvT.cPLBIF;_ylu=X3oDMTMzNGcwMmcyBGFzc2V0Ay9hcC8yMDEwMDMwNS9hcF9vbl9oaV90ZS91c190ZWNfZmNjX3VuaXZlcnNhbF9zZXJ2aWNlBHBvcwM3BHNlYwN5bl90b21ic3RvbmUEc2xrA2ZjY3RvcHJvcG9zZQ-- >>> >>> -- >>> Marco C. Coelho >>> Argon Technologies Inc. >>> POB 875 >>> Greenville, TX 75403-0875 >>> 903-455-5036 >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> --- >> [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] >> >> > > > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] USF Changes
gt;> Although the plan is due on March 17, the agency has already begun >> releasing details, including a proposal to make more wireless spectrum >> available for mobile broadband connections by letting television >> broadcasters and others voluntarily cede some airwaves. >> >> Some of the proposals will likely require congressional action, while >> others might be up to the FCC to implement. >> >> Yahoo article: >> >> http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100305/ap_on_hi_te/us_tec_fcc_universal_service;_ylt=AgSGtpiLKKQbXooR3LKvT.cPLBIF;_ylu=X3oDMTMzNGcwMmcyBGFzc2V0Ay9hcC8yMDEwMDMwNS9hcF9vbl9oaV90ZS91c190ZWNfZmNjX3VuaXZlcnNhbF9zZXJ2aWNlBHBvcwM3BHNlYwN5bl90b21ic3RvbmUEc2xrA2ZjY3RvcHJvcG9zZQ-- >> >> -- >> Marco C. Coelho >> Argon Technologies Inc. >> POB 875 >> Greenville, TX 75403-0875 >> 903-455-5036 >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> ---- >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] BIP/BTOP
Monday, March 29th for BIP and Friday, March 26th for BTOP (for the infrastructure builds that WISPs would be concerned with). Chuck On Mar 2, 2010, at 12:51 PM, Jack Unger wrote: > What's the new date? > > Chuck Bartosch wrote: >> >> Odd, it's not in the press releases updates section...but it IS in the FAQ! >> >> Thanks Chris! >> >> Chuck >> >> On Mar 2, 2010, at 11:51 AM, ccoo...@intelliwave.com wrote: >> >> >>> For those of you following the game, BB USA advises that they have >>> extended the deadline on both BIP and BTOP applications. >>> >>> Chris Cooper >>> Intelliwave >>> >>> >>> This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >> >> -- >> Chuck Bartosch >> Clarity Connect, Inc. >> 200 Pleasant Grove Road >> Ithaca, NY 14850 >> (607) 257-8268 >> >> "When the stars threw down their spears, >> and water'd heaven with their tears, >> Did He smile, His work to see? >> Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >> >> >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! >> >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> > > -- > Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. > Network Design - Technical Training - Technical Writing > Serving the Broadband Wireless, Networking and Telecom Communities since 1993 > www.ask-wi.com 818-227-4220 jun...@ask-wi.com > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] BIP/BTOP
Odd, it's not in the press releases updates section...but it IS in the FAQ! Thanks Chris! Chuck On Mar 2, 2010, at 11:51 AM, ccoo...@intelliwave.com wrote: > For those of you following the game, BB USA advises that they have > extended the deadline on both BIP and BTOP applications. > > Chris Cooper > Intelliwave > > > This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] BIP/BTOP
I don't see anything about that listed on broadbandusa.gov. The only posting for today is the latest winners from round one. Where are you looking? Chuck On Mar 2, 2010, at 11:51 AM, ccoo...@intelliwave.com wrote: > For those of you following the game, BB USA advises that they have > extended the deadline on both BIP and BTOP applications. > > Chris Cooper > Intelliwave > > > This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Reminder - 477 Utility
Where is the utility again? Chuck On Mar 1, 2010, at 12:33 PM, Cameron Crum wrote: > To date only a handful of people have used the FCC utility we posted the > other day. I'm surprised given the discussion that went on two weeks ago > about the issue. If you are having trouble or need help with getting > this going, please feel free to email me at cc...@wispmon.com or just > call us 817-764-0956 if you have questions or problems. It's raining > here today so I'll be around. Remember, the filing is due today. > > Cameron > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Buying co-op
It's been a very active topic recently on the WISPA member list. Chuck On Feb 27, 2010, at 1:58 PM, Jeremie Chism wrote: > I'm sure this has been brought up or may already be one, but has > anyone thought of starting a buying co-op between several wisps to > pool the buying power and get bulk rates. I run into businesses all > the time that participate in things like this to be able to buy like > the big guys. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] new FCC report out
Or how many people think they have "fiber" access to the Internet because they have cable. We all know the cable companies upgraded their networks to fiber a few years ago, right? Chuck On Feb 24, 2010, at 8:40 AM, Bret Clark wrote: > On Tue, 2010-02-23 at 13:21 -0600, David E. Smith wrote: > > >> >> For all we know, most of these folks think that since cousin Jed fixed 'em >> up a wireless router, that's "fixed wireless." >> >> David Smith >> MVN.net > > > Yup...can't even begin to tell you that when I worked at a CLEC how > many customers thought they had a wireless Internet connection because > we'd provide them a wi-fi Linksys CPE. I'd tell them they have a DSL > connection and they would say something to the effect "yes and the > wireless DSL is not working". It's not much different then when you > tell someone on cable they have a copper Internet connection and > inevitably they will argue with you that they don't get their Internet > on copper, they get it through their cable company...can't tell you home > many times I've gotten that argument :)! > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Regulators may drop broadband line-sharing bombshell
I actually have a tape of that statement from the Cable Show in Washington last spring where it was being recommended as sound strategy to cable companies. Chuck On Feb 16, 2010, at 5:07 PM, David Hulsebus wrote: > Not sure it would be good, maybe. > > It made me think of a post last year where the president of a cable > company discussed providing middle mile to their competitors. I > paraphrase "We know who is growing, and who is not; we know what and > where their need is, and when we want to we can cut them off". > > I'm not sure I want to buy from my direct competition. > > Dave Hulsebus > > Scottie Arnett wrote: >> < >> http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2010/02/regulators-may-drop-broadband-line-sharing-bombshell.ars?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=rss >> > >> >> Could be good? >> >> Scottie >> >> Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >> $30.00/mth. >> Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > ---- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's rolein regulationof net-neutrality
On Feb 5, 2010, at 10:13 PM, RickG wrote: > Now they dont fist fight, they pull out the guns and shoot ya! Are you saying things are better now? LOL! Well, you DO have a point there, depending on where you live ;-). The problem with the arguments on either side of this (and I thought about this as I replied) is that we're not just one group with one set of mores and one set way of doing things or one outlook. 50 or 60 years ago *maybe* it was easier, but it's pretty hard now. Though the battles with the mobs in places like Chicago do spring to mind from even back then... Where I come from, even though practically everyone had a gun, it was pretty much unthinkable to shoot a *person* with it unless it was a home invasion (and those never really happened that I ever knew). On the other hand, if you were in a gang in a prototypical inner city...well, let's just say that culture is very very different. So, making generalized statements, even the ones I made are always "false" in some sense. The one thing that I forgot to say before though was that in those early books, editorials, etc. that I read, what amazed me was the level of the vocabulary they used back then. It was sooo much larger than what is used now that it boggled my mind. It wasn't just a different set of words...it was a larger set of words. Chuck On Feb 5, 2010, at 10:13 PM, RickG wrote: > Now they dont fist fight, they pull out the guns and shoot ya! Are you > saying things are better now? > > On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 11:33 AM, Chuck Bartosch > wrote: > >> >> On Feb 5, 2010, at 10:17 AM, Scottie Arnett wrote: >> >>> I am not going to go into the political side, but what this country needs >> more than anything IMHO is the moral and ethical standards that were in this >> country 50 to 60 years ago. >> >> Funny you should say that. >> >> I did some reading when I was a kid from books written from 1910 to 1935. >> Admittedly, I was an odd kid to be fascinated by how people saw the world 40 >> to 60 years earlier (this was the mid-to-late 1970's). The statements you're >> making here were almost exactly what people were saying then about >> generations that preceded them. >> >> Also, I spent a great deal of time talking to my grandfather (and later >> some of his friends) about what life was like when he grew up (born in 1913) >> and his experiences in the great depression (he worked in the CCC camps and >> was a train-vagabound, traveling across the country). They spent a LOT of >> time unemployed and just causing trouble or getting into trouble. Heavy >> drinking was much more accepted then than now. >> >> There are some interesting things that HAVE changed a lot since then. >> >> People got into fist fights a heck of a lot more easily back then ;-). >> >> There was a much greater sense of belonging to a neighborhood then compared >> to now. I see that as a loss but probably unavoidable. >> >> Moral and ethical standards have shifted some, but if anything, they are >> higher now. For example, people thought nothing of calling blacks the >> "n-word" and segregating them from whites. The definition of what is "white" >> itself has greatly expanded. >> >> This has changed even since I was a kid. I remember when in the 1960's we >> were moving from an all-catholic, white neighborhood, that we got obscene >> phone calls and rocks through our windows when a black family made an offer >> on our house (which we intended to accept until a neighbor topped their >> offer by 10%) to keep the house 'white'). If you don't see this as a >> dramatic, and important, shift in morals/ethics then I don't know what is. I >> see this as strongly positive. >> >> The level of volunteerism amongst men seems to be a lot higher now than it >> was then. Women being in the working world has decreased their >> participation, but I would count that as a higher level of ethics among men >> (because it represents a greater level of consciousness, not just a greater >> amount of time) and neutral among women. I see this as strongly positive. >> >> Men 50 and 60 years ago thought nothing about bingeing with the guys Friday >> nights (or every night). Abuse of drugs (including alcohol) has waxed and >> wained over time but is certainly lower now than it was 40 years ago, for >> example. Though I'm sure that still happens, it's really not considered >> normal any more. I see this as a strong change in morals/ethics. >> >> I'd honestly hate to see a world that reverted to the morals and et
Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in regulation of net-neutrality
uence is the >>> >>> big-corporation money that finances the election campaigns for each new >>> >>> crop of political nominees. The big-money lobbyists remain when each old >>> >>> group of politicians is voted out so the big-money corporation's power >>> >>> actually becomes greater and greater as time goes on. >>> >>> >>> >>> The solution that I propose is equal public financing for ALL political >>> >>> campaigns. Each nominee (and incumbent) would receive an equal number of >>> >>> taxpayer dollars to run their campaign. This will help ALL candidates >>> >>> remember who they are supposed to be working for (working-class >>> >>> taxpayers, not large corporations). >>> >>> >>> >>> As to regaining some influence for working people with regard to banks, >>> >>> I'd recommend that everyone put their money in a local credit union or >>> >>> small local community bank. My money has been kept in a local community >>> >>> credit union for over 20 years and I feel good about it being there. >>> >>> It's contributing to the community instead of being used in an >>> >>> irresponsible fashion and/or used against the best interests of the >>> >>> community. >>> >>> >>> >>> Best, >>> >>>jack >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Brad Belton wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> The fundamental difference that Jack fails to recognize is if a bank (or >>> >>> organization other than the government) does treat you unfairly you have >>> >>> recourse. If your own government treats you unfairly, you have little to >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> no >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> recourse. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Yes, we can all only hope the majority of Americans will continue to >>> stand >>> >>> up and say no more to big government. A smaller less intrusive >>> government >>> >>> is what America needs. In order to achieve this we have to remove the >>> >>> career politicians from office that have clearly lost touch with the >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> people >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> that elected them. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Brad >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >>> >>> Behalf Of Jack Unger >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 3:01 PM >>> >>> To: WISPA General List >>> >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in regulation >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> of >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> net-neutrality >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> So, now that government has been drowned, the huge banks, insurance >>> >>> companies, telecoms can do whatever they want to you whenever they want >>> to >>> >>> do it. >>> >>> >>> >>> BWh, haaa, h, haaa, hh >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Frank Crawford wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> YES >>> >>> >>> >>> Jack Unger wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> I trust that government will be able to keep up just fine. Do you >>> >>> support the alternative of making government so small that you can drown >>> >>> it in a bathtub? >>> >>> >>> >>> Glenn Kelley wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Title II of the Communications Act-the section that regulates >>> >>> telecommunications common carriers is now being considered by the FCC to >>> >>> oversee broadband. FCC Commissioner Robert M. McDowell during a talk he >>> >>> gave to the Free State Foundation asked: (see First Do No Harm: A >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> broadband >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> plan for Amercia) >>> >>> "Exactly what kind of companies might get tangled up into this regulatory >>> >>> Rubik's Cube?.Any Internet company that offers a voice application?" . >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> "With >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> this newfound authority, why stop at voice apps? Isn't voice just another >>> >>> type of data app? As the distinction between network operators and >>> >>> application providers continues to blur at an eye-popping rate, how will >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> the >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> government be able to keep up?" >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Much more on the blog: www.HostMedic.com --> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _ >>> >>> Glenn Kelley | Principle | HostMedic |www.HostMedic.com >>> >>>Email: gl...@hostmedic.com >>> >>> Pplease don't print this e-mail unless you really need to. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. >> Network Design - Technical Training - Technical Writing >> Serving the Broadband Wireless, Networking and Telecom Communities since >> 1993 >> www.ask-wi.com 818-227-4220 jun...@ask-wi.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in regulation of net-neutrality
I agree-I've worked for essential monopolies (like defense contractors). Or maybe it's just big companies. In any case, the waste boggled my mind. To be clear my natural tendency is to want to "own" a market. However, I also recognize that you can't ever really do that, and if you do, no matter how good you are, people hate you because you're their only choice. If they have even a bad choice, you're fine, but they have to have a reasonable choice. I've seen examples of significant abuse of market position in a "past life" from the inside (which I won't enumerate for fear of legal repercussions, though the details are pretty fascinating, to me anyways...). What's interesting to me though is that the perpetrating company in this case is today ridiculed for its lack of innovation and not leading markets anymore. In other words, even though I believe the governments anti-monopoly powers are important, in this case I think the market corrected itself. Those abusive positions become addictive and then destructive. Chuck On Feb 5, 2010, at 10:10 PM, RickG wrote: > Then I fail your test. I dont want a monopoly. In th epast, I've worked for > both electric and phone companies and all it breeds is laziness and waste. > In competitive markets, I find the challenge invigorating. -RickG > > On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 11:18 AM, Matt Liotta wrote: > >> >> On Feb 5, 2010, at 11:04 AM, Chuck Bartosch wrote: >> >>> That statement completely ignores history. The tendency of any >> unconstrained capitalist is to form a monopoly. Hell, *I'd* do it if I could >> ;-). And unconstrained capitalism that achieves a monopoly rarely acts in >> its customers own best interests. >>> >>> If nothing else, it's in our society's interest to prevent monopolies >> because innovation stagnates in a monoploy situation. >>> >> It should be every capitalist desire to become a monopolist. The >> government's role should be to encourage businesses to innovate and grow >> towards being a monopoly while hoping the market has sufficient competition >> to stop that ultimate result. If not, then step in to prevent the monopoly >> from abusing its position. The government must only set the rules of the >> game and ensure market fairness through their rules. The government >> shouldn't participate in the market either with its own entity or by picking >> winners and losers through its actions. >> >> -Matt >> >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > ---- > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in regulation of net-neutrality
The restraint is government. How do you restrain capitalism without the restraint of laws, including those that restrain monopolies? The implication of saying the only companies that have monopolies are the ones that government gives monopolies to is that without government monopolies, and without government interference, there would be no monopolies. I'm saying that government *has* to play a role in restraining capitalism from self-destructing. There's no question in my mind that I want as much freedom as possible...but I fully realize that if I'm given complete "freedom" to do as I want, I'll do things that are bad for me. Or bad for everyone else anyway. That's why wives and girlfriends are good for those of us who are men. Or for those of us who are women too I suppose ;-). Chuck On Feb 5, 2010, at 6:48 PM, RickG wrote: > Chuck, where did I say "unrestrained? The rest of my post is questions. So, > I agree with your reply in as much as that nobody should be unrestrained. As > far as history, to what do you refer to? > -RickG > > On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 11:04 AM, Chuck Bartosch > wrote: > >> >> On Feb 5, 2010, at 10:34 AM, RickG wrote: >> >>> Jack, The only companies that "can do whatever they want to you whenever >>> they want to do it" are the ones given a monopoly and power by guess who >> - >>> big government! So, where is the problem? Is it the companies or the >>> government? >> >> That statement completely ignores history. The tendency of any >> unconstrained capitalist is to form a monopoly. Hell, *I'd* do it if I could >> ;-). And unconstrained capitalism that achieves a monopoly rarely acts in >> its customers own best interests. >> >> If nothing else, it's in our society's interest to prevent monopolies >> because innovation stagnates in a monoploy situation. >> >> Some restraint by government is necessary to keep the system from damaging >> itself. Part of your argument is specious since by definition once >> government restrains most monopolies, the only ones left are the ones it >> allows (but there's no real content in that statement). There are very few >> created monopolies (mail still and phones from a long time ago being two of >> them). >> >> Chuck >> >> >>> >>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2010 at 4:01 PM, Jack Unger wrote: >>> >>>> So, now that government has been drowned, the huge banks, insurance >>>> companies, telecoms can do whatever they want to you whenever they want >> to >>>> do it. >>>> >>>> BWh, haaa, h, haaa, hh >>>> >>>> >>>> Frank Crawford wrote: >>>> >>>> YES >>>> >>>> Jack Unger wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> I trust that government will be able to keep up just fine. Do you >>>> support the alternative of making government so small that you can drown >>>> it in a bathtub? >>>> >>>> Glenn Kelley wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Title II of the Communications Act—the section that regulates >> telecommunications common carriers is now being considered by the FCC to >> oversee broadband. FCC Commissioner Robert M. McDowell during a talk he >> gave to the Free State Foundation asked: (see First Do No Harm: A broadband >> plan for Amercia) >>>> “Exactly what kind of companies might get tangled up into this >> regulatory Rubik’s Cube?…Any Internet company that offers a voice >> application?” … “With this newfound authority, why stop at voice apps? Isn’t >> voice just another type of data app? As the distinction between network >> operators and application providers continues to blur at an eye-popping >> rate, how will the government be able to keep up?” >>>> >>>> >>>> Much more on the blog: www.HostMedic.com --> >>>> >> _ >>>> Glenn Kelley | Principle | HostMedic |www.HostMedic.com >>>> Email: gl...@hostmedic.com >>>> Pplease don't print this e-mail unless you really need to. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >> >>>>
Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in regulation of net-neutrality
Yep, I agree with your statement (which was well put). Chuck On Feb 5, 2010, at 11:18 AM, Matt Liotta wrote: > > On Feb 5, 2010, at 11:04 AM, Chuck Bartosch wrote: > >> That statement completely ignores history. The tendency of any unconstrained >> capitalist is to form a monopoly. Hell, *I'd* do it if I could ;-). And >> unconstrained capitalism that achieves a monopoly rarely acts in its >> customers own best interests. >> >> If nothing else, it's in our society's interest to prevent monopolies >> because innovation stagnates in a monoploy situation. >> > It should be every capitalist desire to become a monopolist. The government's > role should be to encourage businesses to innovate and grow towards being a > monopoly while hoping the market has sufficient competition to stop that > ultimate result. If not, then step in to prevent the monopoly from abusing > its position. The government must only set the rules of the game and ensure > market fairness through their rules. The government shouldn't participate in > the market either with its own entity or by picking winners and losers > through its actions. > > -Matt > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC'srolein regulationof net-neutrality
gt;>> >>>>>> >>>>>> So, now that government has been drowned, the huge banks, insurance >>>>>> companies, telecoms can do whatever they want to you whenever they >>>>>> want to do it. >>>>>> >>>>>> BWh, haaa, h, haaa, hh >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Frank Crawford wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> YES >>>>>> >>>>>> Jack Unger wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I trust that government will be able to keep up just fine. Do you >>>>>> support the alternative of making government so small that you can >>>>>> drown it in a bathtub? >>>>>> >>>>>> Glenn Kelley wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Title II of the Communications Act-the section that regulates >>>>>> telecommunications common carriers is now being considered by the FCC >>>>>> to oversee broadband. FCC Commissioner Robert M. McDowell during a >>>>>> talk he gave to the Free State Foundation asked: (see First Do No >>>>>> Harm: A >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> broadband >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> plan for Amercia) >>>>>> "Exactly what kind of companies might get tangled up into this >>>>>> regulatory Rubik's Cube?.Any Internet company that offers a voice >>>> application?" . >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> "With >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> this newfound authority, why stop at voice apps? Isn't voice just >>>>>> another type of data app? As the distinction between network >>>>>> operators and application providers continues to blur at an >>>>>> eye-popping rate, how will >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> the >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> government be able to keep up?" >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Much more on the blog: www.HostMedic.com --> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _ >>>>>> ___ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _ >>>>>> Glenn Kelley | Principle | HostMedic |www.HostMedic.com >>>>>> Email: gl...@hostmedic.com >>>>>> Pplease don't print this e-mail unless you really need to. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> - >>>>>> --- >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> - >>>>>> --- >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>> >>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>> >>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> - >>>>>> --- >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> - >>>>>> --- >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>> >>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>> >>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. >>>>> Network Design - Technical Training - Technical Writing Serving the >>>>> Broadband Wireless, Networking and Telecom Communities since >>>>> 1993 >>>>> www.ask-wi.com 818-227-4220 jun...@ask-wi.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> -- >>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>> -- >>>>> -- >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>> >>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>> >>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> --- >>>> [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] >>>> >>>> >>> >>> Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >>> $30.00/mth. >>> Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. >>> >>> >>> >> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's rolein regulationof net-neutrality
>>>> recourse. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Yes, we can all only hope the majority of Americans will continue to >>>> stand up and say no more to big government. A smaller less intrusive >>>> government is what America needs. In order to achieve this we have >>>> to remove the career politicians from office that have clearly lost >>>> touch with the >>>> >>>> >>>> people >>>> >>>> >>>> that elected them. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Brad >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] >>>> On Behalf Of Jack Unger >>>> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 3:01 PM >>>> To: WISPA General List >>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in >>>> regulation >>>> >>>> >>>> of >>>> >>>> >>>> net-neutrality >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> So, now that government has been drowned, the huge banks, insurance >>>> companies, telecoms can do whatever they want to you whenever they >>>> want to do it. >>>> >>>> BWh, haaa, h, haaa, hh >>>> >>>> >>>> Frank Crawford wrote: >>>> >>>> YES >>>> >>>> Jack Unger wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> I trust that government will be able to keep up just fine. Do you >>>> support the alternative of making government so small that you can >>>> drown it in a bathtub? >>>> >>>> Glenn Kelley wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Title II of the Communications Act-the section that regulates >>>> telecommunications common carriers is now being considered by the FCC >>>> to oversee broadband. FCC Commissioner Robert M. McDowell during a >>>> talk he gave to the Free State Foundation asked: (see First Do No >>>> Harm: A >>>> >>>> >>>> broadband >>>> >>>> >>>> plan for Amercia) >>>> "Exactly what kind of companies might get tangled up into this >>>> regulatory Rubik's Cube?.Any Internet company that offers a voice >> application?" . >>>> >>>> >>>> "With >>>> >>>> >>>> this newfound authority, why stop at voice apps? Isn't voice just >>>> another type of data app? As the distinction between network >>>> operators and application providers continues to blur at an >>>> eye-popping rate, how will >>>> >>>> >>>> the >>>> >>>> >>>> government be able to keep up?" >>>> >>>> >>>> Much more on the blog: www.HostMedic.com --> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _ >>>> ___ >>>> >>>> >>>> _ >>>> Glenn Kelley | Principle | HostMedic |www.HostMedic.com >>>> Email: gl...@hostmedic.com >>>> Pplease don't print this e-mail unless you really need to. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> - >>>> --- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> - >>>> --- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> - >>>> --- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> - >>>> --- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. >>> Network Design - Technical Training - Technical Writing Serving the >>> Broadband Wireless, Networking and Telecom Communities since >>> 1993 >>> www.ask-wi.com 818-227-4220 jun...@ask-wi.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> -- >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> -- >>> -- >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> --- >> [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] >> >> > > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in regulation of net-neutrality
On Feb 5, 2010, at 10:34 AM, RickG wrote: > Jack, The only companies that "can do whatever they want to you whenever > they want to do it" are the ones given a monopoly and power by guess who - > big government! So, where is the problem? Is it the companies or the > government? That statement completely ignores history. The tendency of any unconstrained capitalist is to form a monopoly. Hell, *I'd* do it if I could ;-). And unconstrained capitalism that achieves a monopoly rarely acts in its customers own best interests. If nothing else, it's in our society's interest to prevent monopolies because innovation stagnates in a monoploy situation. Some restraint by government is necessary to keep the system from damaging itself. Part of your argument is specious since by definition once government restrains most monopolies, the only ones left are the ones it allows (but there's no real content in that statement). There are very few created monopolies (mail still and phones from a long time ago being two of them). Chuck > > On Thu, Feb 4, 2010 at 4:01 PM, Jack Unger wrote: > >> So, now that government has been drowned, the huge banks, insurance >> companies, telecoms can do whatever they want to you whenever they want to >> do it. >> >> BWh, haaa, h, haaa, hh >> >> >> Frank Crawford wrote: >> >> YES >> >> Jack Unger wrote: >> >> >> I trust that government will be able to keep up just fine. Do you >> support the alternative of making government so small that you can drown >> it in a bathtub? >> >> Glenn Kelley wrote: >> >> >> >> Title II of the Communications Act—the section that regulates >> telecommunications common carriers is now being considered by the FCC to >> oversee broadband. FCC Commissioner Robert M. McDowell during a talk he >> gave to the Free State Foundation asked: (see First Do No Harm: A broadband >> plan for Amercia) >> “Exactly what kind of companies might get tangled up into this regulatory >> Rubik’s Cube?…Any Internet company that offers a voice application?” … “With >> this newfound authority, why stop at voice apps? Isn’t voice just another >> type of data app? As the distinction between network operators and >> application providers continues to blur at an eye-popping rate, how will the >> government be able to keep up?” >> >> >> Much more on the blog: www.HostMedic.com --> >> _ >> Glenn Kelley | Principle | HostMedic |www.HostMedic.com >> Email: gl...@hostmedic.com >> Pplease don't print this e-mail unless you really need to. >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> -- >> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. >> Network Design - Technical Training - Technical Writing >> Serving the Broadband Wireless, Networking and Telecom Communities since >> 1993www.ask-wi.com 818-227-4220 jun...@ask-wi.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > ---
Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in regulation of net-neutrality
On Feb 5, 2010, at 9:02 AM, Jeff Broadwick wrote: make campaigns post their contributions on the > internet. That's already available if the donation is over $99. Chuck WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Follow up article
ll as for safety, security and our standing as a great >>> power that values freedom and the free exchange of ideas and > information. >>> >>> As far as I am concerned, America is still the last best hope for a more >>> peaceful and prosperous world and our president should not be looking > for >>> ways to weaken us. Rather, his job is to work to strengthen us and >> protect >>> our nation's greatest asset our people's creativity and ingenuity. >>> >>> >>> Bradley A. Blakeman, who was a deputy assistant to President George W. >> Bush >>> from 2001-20004, teaches Public Policy & Politics & International > Affairs >>> at >>> Georgetown University. >>> >>> >>> C Newsmax. All rights reserved. >>> >>> -Original Message- >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >>> Behalf Of RickG >>> Sent: Monday, February 01, 2010 4:58 PM >>> To: WISPA General List >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Commissioner Robert McDowell's statement on >>> Broadband... >>> >>> I wonder what the catch is :) >>> -RickG >>> >>> On Mon, Feb 1, 2010 at 4:07 PM, MDK wrote: >>> >>>> "First, do harm". >>>> >>>> http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DOC-296081A1.pdf >>>> >>>> This speech was made at the end of January... At least ONE >>> commissioner's >>>> got his head on straight... >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >> > >>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >> > >>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >> > >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > > >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >> > > >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >> >> >> >> > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> > > >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] From Today's WSJ
The counties out here are apparently a lot bigger than your counties. One of the counties we have service in (but not one of the counties I was looking at for this grant) is 18% bigger than the State of Rhode Island. Chuck On Jan 21, 2010, at 4:54 PM, Marlon K. Schafer wrote: > You've got an area with 25k households close by and you don't have anything > in there? No one else has anything there either? > > That's 2.5 times MORE than my ENTIRE COUNTY has in it! > > Man I could be making a lot more money if I lived nearly anywhere else! > marlon > > ----- Original Message - > From: "Chuck Bartosch" > To: "WISPA General List" > Sent: Thursday, January 21, 2010 11:04 AM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] From Today's WSJ > > >> In my 3 county area that I was developing an application for, there were >> 25,000 households without access to service and in one of those counties I >> was only covering the lower half of the unserved areas of the county. (And >> one partially unserved town in the County I live in was counting on a >> different provider to include them in their application, but that provider >> chose not to include them for one reason or another). It's very easy for >> me to believe the 24 million number since I'm in upstate NY. >> >> What was particularly interesting to me is that in the detailed census >> block studies I did, you would often see half of a census block >> (geographical half) had service and the other did not. 2/3rds of the >> houses in the census block were on the covered side, but it's very >> difficult to see how the other third would ever get service since it >> doesn't fit cable's density plan but isn't enough to justify anyone else >> building out to them either. >> >> Chuck >> >> On Jan 21, 2010, at 11:08 AM, Marlon K. Schafer wrote: >> >>> I think so. >>> >>> 24 million just seems to be such a large number when you take into >>> account >>> the well known underreporting of our industry segment (and perhaps >>> others?). >>> >>> It's hard to imagine that all of our hard work thus far has left so many >>> homes untouched. >>> >>> At a lowly 40% take rate and $20 per month per account that's >>> $288,000,000 >>> in MONTHLY revenue left sitting idle. It just makes no sense to me. I >>> can't get my arms around the idea that we've left that many homes with no >>> options. >>> >>> I can see 24 million households with no service. I just can't see that >>> many >>> with no access to service. Heck, I have people that still have dialup >>> internet even though they are within spitting distance of a tower. Do >>> they >>> count as one of the 24 million? >>> >>> laters, >>> marlon >>> >>> - Original Message - >>> From: "Chuck Bartosch" >>> To: "WISPA General List" >>> Sent: Thursday, January 21, 2010 3:06 AM >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] From Today's WSJ >>> >>> >>>> So, the salient points are, as I understand it (correct me if I'm >>>> wrong): >>>> >>>> (1) Brian's numbers are 24 million currently HAVE NO ACCESS TO SERVICE. >>>> His number DOES NOT INCLUDE the number who have access but have chosen >>>> not >>>> to subscribe. >>>> >>>> (2) You haven't seen the underlying data yourself because much of it is >>>> private data that you didn't purchase yourself. You get to see the >>>> analysis from it because Brian HAS purchased it and combined it with >>>> publicly available data. >>>> >>>> Chuck >>>> >>>> On Jan 20, 2010, at 11:46 PM, Marlon K. Schafer wrote: >>>> >>>>> Heya Brian, >>>>> >>>>> That's the take I had on this. That the number of households services >>>>> was >>>>> based on the 477 data. I didn't see any other data sets that would >>>>> give >>>>> an >>>>> indication of the number of actually services households. >>>>> >>>>> If the study is based only on the consumers reported via the 477 it's >>>>> likely >>>>> to be quite inaccurate. >>>>> >>>>> People in government etc. are often quite amazed at
Re: [WISPA] From Today's WSJ
In my 3 county area that I was developing an application for, there were 25,000 households without access to service and in one of those counties I was only covering the lower half of the unserved areas of the county. (And one partially unserved town in the County I live in was counting on a different provider to include them in their application, but that provider chose not to include them for one reason or another). It's very easy for me to believe the 24 million number since I'm in upstate NY. What was particularly interesting to me is that in the detailed census block studies I did, you would often see half of a census block (geographical half) had service and the other did not. 2/3rds of the houses in the census block were on the covered side, but it's very difficult to see how the other third would ever get service since it doesn't fit cable's density plan but isn't enough to justify anyone else building out to them either. Chuck On Jan 21, 2010, at 11:08 AM, Marlon K. Schafer wrote: > I think so. > > 24 million just seems to be such a large number when you take into account > the well known underreporting of our industry segment (and perhaps others?). > > It's hard to imagine that all of our hard work thus far has left so many > homes untouched. > > At a lowly 40% take rate and $20 per month per account that's $288,000,000 > in MONTHLY revenue left sitting idle. It just makes no sense to me. I > can't get my arms around the idea that we've left that many homes with no > options. > > I can see 24 million households with no service. I just can't see that many > with no access to service. Heck, I have people that still have dialup > internet even though they are within spitting distance of a tower. Do they > count as one of the 24 million? > > laters, > marlon > > - Original Message - > From: "Chuck Bartosch" > To: "WISPA General List" > Sent: Thursday, January 21, 2010 3:06 AM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] From Today's WSJ > > >> So, the salient points are, as I understand it (correct me if I'm wrong): >> >> (1) Brian's numbers are 24 million currently HAVE NO ACCESS TO SERVICE. >> His number DOES NOT INCLUDE the number who have access but have chosen not >> to subscribe. >> >> (2) You haven't seen the underlying data yourself because much of it is >> private data that you didn't purchase yourself. You get to see the >> analysis from it because Brian HAS purchased it and combined it with >> publicly available data. >> >> Chuck >> >> On Jan 20, 2010, at 11:46 PM, Marlon K. Schafer wrote: >> >>> Heya Brian, >>> >>> That's the take I had on this. That the number of households services >>> was >>> based on the 477 data. I didn't see any other data sets that would give >>> an >>> indication of the number of actually services households. >>> >>> If the study is based only on the consumers reported via the 477 it's >>> likely >>> to be quite inaccurate. >>> >>> People in government etc. are often quite amazed at the number of >>> customers >>> that I service out here. And I'm just one of a great many companies >>> offering services in the area. >>> >>> I'm trying to get a handle on what additional sources of fact based >>> information are out there. It's important to know what the real number >>> is >>> and yours seems very high to me. I don't think it'll be helpful in the >>> long >>> term if we have a number that gets blown out of the water in the upcoming >>> census. >>> >>> marlon >>> >>> - Original Message - >>> From: "Brian Webster" >>> To: "WISPA General List" >>> Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2010 8:00 PM >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] From Today's WSJ >>> >>> >>>> Marlon, >>>> Read this take rate brief I wrote with one of the data companies I work >>>> with. It will take you about 10 minutes. It goes in to specific detail >>>> of >>>> how the study was conducted and the sources of the data. It was written >>>> for >>>> the 10 minute managers of the world. The key to being able to come up >>>> with >>>> the numbers was having the data at the census block level in the first >>>> place. Prior to July of this year there were no sources that I am aware >>>> of.
Re: [WISPA] From Today's WSJ
-- >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> -- >> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. >> Network Design - Technical Writing - Technical Training >> Serving the Broadband Wireless, Networking and Telecom Communities Since >> 1993 >> www.ask-wi.com 818-227-4220 jun...@ask-wi.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. >> Network Design - Technical Writing - Technical Training >> Serving the Broadband Wireless, Networking and Telecom Communities Since >> 1993 >> www.ask-wi.com 818-227-4220 jun...@ask-wi.com >> >> >> >> >> >> ---- >> -- >> >> >> >> >> -- >> -- >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> -- >> -- >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > > >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Connected Nation
Been lots of discussion about this. Without repeating all that discussion, I think the conclusion has been, "bad for us". Telco tool. Chuck On Dec 16, 2009, at 2:30 PM, Mike Hammett wrote: > Has anyone determined whether Connected Nation is good or bad for us? > > My state hired them for the map, but I don't want to respond with any > information if the things I heard in the past are still true. I don't > remember the points, I just remembered that they were bad news, so to avoid > them. They sent me an NDA, but I never really read any of that stuff anyway. > Most any contract is about as effective as a paper bag holding water. > > > - > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions > http://www.ics-il.com > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] This comes up again and again - value of network
10 months only if the $49.95 is pure profit. Presumably the ROI is really more like 40 months assuming you keep the customer for that long. That or I'm having a brain melt-down and confusing something. There was just recently (in the past week or so) a long discussion of valuations on the WISPA members list. You might look in the archives for a range of ways to look at the question. Chuck On Dec 16, 2009, at 2:20 PM, Chuck Profito wrote: > Well at $49.95 monthly your ROI is 10monthswill he finance out of > income? > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of MDK > Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 11:09 AM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: [WISPA] This comes up again and again - value of network > > There's a guy started a small network in an area I serve, but quite distant > from me, and he's wanting to get out. > > He offered to sell me his customers and his network, and then finally he > quoted me a price for his network.Not "the customers" but just "the > network" and the customer owns his own cpe.I buy the network and inherit > > his customers - that was the "deal". > > It works out to $500 / customer. > > For infrastructure, that seems... well... REALLY high to me. > > It consists MOSTLY of UBNT stuff and some bandwidth controls, etc, I don't > really understand. It's mostly bridged, and has no public IP's, it was > apparently NAT'd to a cable connection somewhere. > > Looking at my rural deployments and the approximate cost- even of the > solar/wind powered sites... I'm well under $100/customer for network > infrastructure outside of the CPE. > > Am I the one way different, or is he? Or, is this wide range normal? > > > > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > ---- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Broadband compared to electricity of the early 1900's
to absorb our hard earned wealth at immoral rates until >>> people stop thinking that "public" = righteous. >>> >>> There's always going to be excuses for those have an ideological belief >>> in >>> superiority of socialized services to advocate them with emotional >>> appeals. >>> There's just no reason for any person with an IQ above refrigerator >>> temperature to fall for it.There is only one reason to advocate >>> socialized services, and that's because there's political and partisan >>> power >>> to be derived from controlling essential services with political power. >>> When the mob does it by intimidation, we call it criminal. When >>> Congress >>> does it, a certain number of people swoon in awe of their righteousness, >>> while the rest of us recoil in disgust.There is, however, no actual >>> difference between Congress controlling access to our needs and the mob >>> doing it. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> From: "Brian Webster" >>> Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 8:42 AM >>> To: "WISPA List" ; ; >>> ; "WISPA Board Members List" >>> Subject: [WISPA] Broadband compared to electricity of the early 1900's >>> >>>> I have been of the thought process that Broadband needs to be compared >>>> to >>>> electricity and telephone service expansion and deployments of the >>>> early >>>> 1900's. Here is a nice article that draws a direct comparison to >>>> electricity >>>> (and municipal networks). Should be good food for though to all: >>>> >>>> The Killer App of 1900 <http://publicola.net/?p=20687> >>>> by Glenn Fleishman , 12/11/2009, 11:18 AM >>>> >>>> It’s instructional to look back 100 years, not long after the first >>>> electrical generation plants were built to bring power to towns and >>>> cities, >>>> to assess the situation we find ourselves in with broadband >>>> availability >>>> today. >>>> >>>> http://publicola.net/?p=20687 >>>> >>>> Thank You, >>>> Brian Webster >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Nicely put. The same thought has crossed my mind about the diatribes people write on these lists. Chuck On Dec 13, 2009, at 8:27 PM, Tim Sylvester wrote: > Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on > this list by people who ... > > - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated to > them by the FCC for free or low cost. > - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed by > DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. > - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the > government. > - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in > government subsidies per year. > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural > Electric Administration. > - use VA health services. > - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. > - call the police and fire department when they need help. > - send their kids to public schools. > > Amazing. > > Tim > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
On Dec 14, 2009, at 12:05 PM, RickG wrote: > I workde for an REA. One of the most wasteful companies I've ever seen. > Private companies could do a much better job. Hard to know that for sure. I used to work for Lockheed. Damn they were wasteful. And stupid too... Certainly there is more fraud and hidden market manipulation in the private sector (think Enron, World Comm and Madoff). And when you get into duopoly situations (which is common in the ISP world), it can be very difficult for small businesses to compete even with an otherwise strong business proposition. We can discuss on Wispa Chat something the good and bad of government, regulations, and bureaucracies. The point here is, it's just way too simplistic to say "business is better" or "business is less wasteful". Sure, WE might be less wasteful-but that isn't true in many cases. And recent history is replete with problems in the private sector, from fraud to foolish risk decisions that hurt not just the offending companies, but our entire economy. Chuck > Besides, I agree with our > forefathers who repeatedly said that they see no reason for the government > to take money from some to give to others. -RickG > > On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 11:11 AM, David E. Smith wrote: > >> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 20:42, RickG wrote: >> >>> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 8:27 PM, Tim Sylvester >>> wrote: >>>> - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the >>> Rural >>>> Electric Administration. >>>> >>> >>> Another bad deal. >>> >>> >> I'm gonna have to call you out on this. How was the Rural Electrification >> Act a bad idea? Are you going to argue that the most remote areas would >> have >> affordable electricity in the absence of the REA? (Keep in mind there was >> 20-30 years of history saying exactly the opposite before that act was >> passed. Parallels between that and some hypothetical Rural Fiber Act are >> purely intentional.) >> >> David Smith >> MVN.net >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
On Dec 13, 2009, at 8:42 PM, Brad Belton wrote: > No, what's really amazing is people think the Government pays for these > services from a bottomless pot of money. I know it's real popular to say that. However, I've never met anyone who thinks that. Not even the politicians think that way. Chuck > When in fact that pot of money is > funded dearly with the blood, sweat and tears from you, me and the rest of > the USA citizens. > > The only positive in all this is Americans are starting to wake up, put > their foot down and say no more! Hopefully it isn't too late, but we do > have a chance to vote any and all the spending freak incumbents out of > office next year. > > > Brad > > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Tim Sylvester > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 7:28 PM > To: 'WISPA General List' > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on > this list by people who ... > > - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated to > them by the FCC for free or low cost. > - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed by > DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. > - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the > government. > - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in > government subsidies per year. > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural > Electric Administration. > - use VA health services. > - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. > - call the police and fire department when they need help. > - send their kids to public schools. > > Amazing. > > Tim > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > ---- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] health insurance
d have the >>>>>>> Employee >>>>>>> pay the other 10% ? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> What are your current costs for Health Insurnace ? We are seeing >>>>>> typically >>>>>>> $300-$400 / month for a single male, and $1300-$1450 /month for a >>>>>>> family >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> From what we have been seeing in the last few years, including our >>>>>>>> present >>>>>>> coverage increase (approx $8100/year for 3 families)... $412 /year >>>>>>> increase would be a Blessing and a Christmas present... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> --- >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Just a thought. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Faisal Imtiaz >>>>>>> Computer Office Solutions Inc. /SnappyDSL.net >>>>>>> Ph: (305) 663-5518 x 232 >>>>>>> -Original Message- >>>>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] >>>>>>> On Behalf Of Travis Johnson >>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, December 05, 2009 7:50 PM >>>>>>> To: WISPA General List >>>>>>> Subject: [WISPA] health insurance >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> What are everyone else's plans if this new health insurance plan >>>>>>> gets >>>>>>> passed in Congress? We fall in the 25-100 employee category, so they >>>>>>> are estimating our health insurance costs would go up $412 per >>>>>>> employee for us (we already cover 100% of the costs for our >>>>>>> employees). So, basically this would force us to go to a >>>>>>> subcontractor >>>>>>> type work-force (at least for 5-10 of our current employees) to get >>>>>>> us >>>>>>> under the 25 employee limit and offer less benefits for everyone in >>>>>>> the >>>>>> company. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Once again, it seems our government is stepping in where it doesn't >>>>>> belong. >>>>>>> Either take over the health care system 100% (including funding it), >>>>>>> or leave it alone. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Travis >>>>>>> Microserv >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> > -- >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>>> > -- >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> > -- >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>>> > -- >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> >>>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> > >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> > >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>> >>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>> >>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> > >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> > >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>> >>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>> >>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> > >>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> > >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>> >>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>> >>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> > > >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> > > >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> > > >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> > > >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >> >> >> > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > > >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] health insurance
On Dec 7, 2009, at 2:48 PM, Brad Belton wrote: > If the current draft now says you can't be jailed for not paying this > particular tax/fine then ok, but that's not the way it was written earlier. > I wouldn't be surprised if this is flipped back...sooner or later. The bill has ALWAYS had this provision in Brad. It's okay, you can admit that someone else apparently read more of the bill than you did after all . The problem with your repeated statements about being forced to buy insurance even "if you don't need it" is, a lot of people think they don't need it...until they do. If they don't have it, and can't afford the care, they end up being a drain on everyone else anyway. Unlike car insurance, there really is no such thing as "no one" needing it. Unless you're dead of course. Anything else and you're just taking a bet that nothing's going to happen to you and anyone else who happens to be living but thinks they don't need it. Reminds me of when I was a kid where friends would say "I'm a good driver. *I* don't need to buy auto-insurance." I guess it's true until someone else hits you. Chuck > > Regardless, the government is forcing you to buy something from them at a > price they determine with services they see fit. Doesn't sound like a good > idea to me... > > > Brad > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of David E. Smith > Sent: Monday, December 07, 2009 11:09 AM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] health insurance > > On Mon, Dec 7, 2009 at 10:57, Brad Belton wrote: > >> While I haven't read the entire 2000+ page proposed bill I apparently have >> read more of it than you. > > > Clearly not, or else you'd know that the "fine" actually is just a tax > penalty, and that the current draft of the Senate Finance Committee bill > actually includes an explicit provision saying the exact opposite (i.e. you > explicitly cannot be jailed for failure to pay this specific tax). > http://www.factcheck.org/2009/11/imprisoned-for-not-having-health-care/ > > Don't get me wrong, the bill still is a travesty, but that's because it > doesn't go far enough in providing effective health care to tens of millions > of Americans. > > David Smith > MVN.net > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] health insurance
On Dec 6, 2009, at 3:24 AM, MDK wrote: > > It's my understanding that for purposes of insurance, the rules that govern > 1099 work are being changed dramatically.The "subcontractor" status is > mostly going to go away. This will mean that if someone runs his own > business, but only works for you, bye bye status... and that includes > workman's comp, unemployment, withholdings, etc. That has always been true, at least in New York State (I don't know when it's a state issue or a fed issue, but either way, that is a serious no-no out here). I guess Fed. Ex. seems to do it, but I think that's a different set of rules. > Heaven only knows if this is in whatever abomination I guess I buy into the fact that there's a problem and a solution is needed. Unfortunately, when there are 100 different views about the solution, you do end up with something less than ideal. Personally, I wish it was single payer, period, and I could forget about it. With how fast the costs rise out here, and with the changes in the programs every year (including what is, and is not, covered), I'd give a lot to get out of having to deal with it. Chuck > is finally produced, > but the intent is definitely to pretty much end this kind of stuff. One of > the ways that was in one of the bills, was to force all individuals who work > under that status to buy insurance. > > -- > From: "Robert West" > Sent: Saturday, December 05, 2009 5:15 PM > To: "'WISPA General List'" > Subject: Re: [WISPA] health insurance > >> H.. I feel an increase in the use of the 1099 form would >> be >> the easy answer. I lived as a 1099 for many years. >> >> I'm with you on your feelings of "get all the way in or get all the way >> out". I'd prefer they get all the way in and just do it because, >> honestly, >> it will happen in the end anyhow. Why put it off and cause more >> suffering? >> I know, politics doesn't belong here usually and I won't be hit like that >> but it is an issue for some of us. (And as far as I'm concerned they can >> give gays marriage also and just get it the heck out of the way finally, >> sheeesh! Why should I be the only one to suffer through marriage???) >> >> But the reality is that many companies are going to go to making who they >> can a 1099 contractor and that's going to open up another can of left in >> the >> sun worms. >> >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >> Behalf Of Travis Johnson >> Sent: Saturday, December 05, 2009 7:50 PM >> To: WISPA General List >> Subject: [WISPA] health insurance >> >> Hi, >> >> What are everyone else's plans if this new health insurance plan gets >> passed in Congress? We fall in the 25-100 employee category, so they are >> estimating our health insurance costs would go up $412 per employee for >> us (we already cover 100% of the costs for our employees). So, basically >> this would force us to go to a subcontractor type work-force (at least >> for 5-10 of our current employees) to get us under the 25 employee limit >> and offer less benefits for everyone in the company. >> >> Once again, it seems our government is stepping in where it doesn't >> belong. Either take over the health care system 100% (including funding >> it), or leave it alone. >> >> Travis >> Microserv >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > ---
Re: [WISPA] FCC plans to turn over private data to aid broadband stimulus.
Knew it would happen? Isn't that kind of what the data is FOR in the first place? To determine where there's service and where there isn't...and they don't want to be funding applications where there's already sufficient documented service. Seems to me it's exactly the right thing to do. Chuck On Dec 2, 2009, at 11:29 PM, RickG wrote: > I knew this would happen. And thats only what they admit to. > > On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 10:50 PM, Scottie Arnett wrote: > >> >> >> < >> http://blog.telephonyonline.com/unfiltered/2009/12/01/fcc-plans-to-turn-over-private-data-to-aid-broadband-stimulus/> >> >> Scottie >> >> Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >> $30.00/mth. >> Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > ---- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Alvarion VL Access Control
12394.1.1.2.8.2.0 s "alsochangeme" > $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.2.8.3.0 s "changeme" > $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.4.1.0 a $IP > $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.4.2.0 a 255.255.255.0 > $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.4.3.0 a $GW > > echo -e "Name"`$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.2.3.0` > echo -e "Inst PW"`$SG private 10.0.0.1 > .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.2.8.2.0` > echo -e "Admin PW"`$SG private 10.0.0.1 > .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.2.8.3.0` > echo -e "IP address "`$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.4.1.0` > echo -e "Netmask "`$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.4.2.0` > echo -e "Gateway "`$SG private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.4.3.0` > > echo -e "Done setting up manamgent items" > > echo -e > "|--|" > echo -e "| Setting up filter and network management > |" > echo -e > "|--|" > > $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.8.1.0 i 1 > $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.3.1.0 i 3 > $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.3.2.0 i 1 > echo -e "UserFilteringOption "`$SG private 10.0.0.1 > .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.8.1.0` > echo -e "AccessToNwMng "`$SG private 10.0.0.1 > .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.3.1.0` > echo -e "NwMngFilter "`$SG private 10.0.0.1 > .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.3.2.0` > > echo -e "Network Filtering all setup" > > echo -e > "|--|" > echo -e "| rebooting radio to new settings - please wait 60 seconds > |" > echo -e > "|--|" > > $SP private 10.0.0.1 .1.3.6.1.4.1.12394.1.1.2.1.0 i 2 > > sleep 60s > > echo -e > "|--|" > echo -e "| pinging radio with new IP number > |" > echo -e > "|--|" > ping -n -c 4 $IP > > echo -e > "|--|" > echo -e "| done. ready for use > |" > echo -e > "|--|" > > > > On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 02:22:57PM -0500, Jeremy Parr wrote: >> Before I reinvent the wheel with an Expect script or SNMP query, does >> anyone have scripts written for automating bandwidth/MAC allocations >> for the VL? It does not support RADIUS, so any automated changes need >> to be pushed via telnet or SNMP. >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > -- > /* > Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL >KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting > http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ > */ > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] test
Dammit Robert. We _all_ agreed, including you, that we weren't going to tell him that! Chuck ;-) On Nov 24, 2009, at 9:11 PM, Robert West wrote: > We were ignoring you. We've been telling secrets. > > > > > > > > > > > > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Blair Davis > Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2009 6:47 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: [WISPA] test > > > > have not seen any msg for a few days... > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Billing (time of use billing)
On Nov 15, 2009, at 11:47 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net wrote: > Oh my that is insane kw/h pricing. Happen to know what there buy back rates > are? > Here I pay .07 kw/h with a buy back of .02 kw/h. New York State requires buyback at the same rate as the sell rate. So it'd be .07 kw/h both ways. The utilities hate it of course, but NYS's philosophy is, you've built the grid with guaranteed returns and we need to diversify the supply, so tough. I know they (the utilities) tried to get this changed a few years ago but I don't think they were successful (I haven't been following it lately so maybe it changed and I missed it). Chuck > > I have thought of doing time rates, but for now I turn down p2p, etc, during > peek times and kick it up at off peek. This worked well till the major push > over > to encrypted connections > > Tim Sylvester wrote: >> Talking about electric billing in this thread made me think of time-of-use >> billing and tiered billing rate schedules for electrical usage. PG&E has >> multiple rate schedules. The standard consumer rate schedule starts at >> $0.115 per KWh and grows to $0.44 per KWh for usage over 300% of the >> baseline. They also have time-of-use billing schedules which start at $0.087 >> per KWh during off-peak times in the summer and move up to $0.297 per KWh >> during peak times. >> >> Has anyone considered tiered usage billing or time-of-use billing for >> Internet access? It would be complicated to implement and also difficult to >> explain to customers. If Bit Torrent users are the biggest consumers of >> bandwidth on a network you could benefit by encouraging them to use the >> network during off hours. >> >> Tim >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > ---- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Billing (time of use billing)
It seems to me a long time ago (back in the dial up days), we restricted people from 8 AM to midnight but let them go full out and abuse the heck out of their connection if they so desired from midnight to 8 AM. We didn't *bill* differently. Or maybe we just wanted to. I know we *told* customers that's what we did ;-). Chuck On Nov 15, 2009, at 6:02 PM, Tim Sylvester wrote: > Talking about electric billing in this thread made me think of time-of-use > billing and tiered billing rate schedules for electrical usage. PG&E has > multiple rate schedules. The standard consumer rate schedule starts at > $0.115 per KWh and grows to $0.44 per KWh for usage over 300% of the > baseline. They also have time-of-use billing schedules which start at $0.087 > per KWh during off-peak times in the summer and move up to $0.297 per KWh > during peak times. > > Has anyone considered tiered usage billing or time-of-use billing for > Internet access? It would be complicated to implement and also difficult to > explain to customers. If Bit Torrent users are the biggest consumers of > bandwidth on a network you could benefit by encouraging them to use the > network during off hours. > > Tim > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] example of needing middle mile
Ironically, years ago, they offered to buy us for $5.5 million or something like that. Had a *great* meal at the Gothem Bar and Grill in Manhatten, including a $250 bottle of Petite Syrah as they wooed us... ;-). Guess I'm glad we demurred. Though having a few mil in cash might have been nice too... Chuck On Nov 13, 2009, at 12:14 PM, jp wrote: > http://pressherald.mainetoday.com/story.php?id=295654&ac=PHnws > > Bankrupt Fairpoint backbilling and threatening an ISP/CLEC because > Fairpoint doesn't want to continue an interconnection agreement. > > It's a bit sensationalized (according to my conversation with the > ISP in > the story), but shows how the big telcos care more about protecting > their monopoly than promoting business, broadband, or innovation. > > This is why Maine needs a middle mile ARRA network such as has been > applied for. Some states probably do not, but we do in Maine. > Fairpoint > is hopeless in every respect. > > -- > /* > Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL >KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting > http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ > */ > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Billing
On Nov 12, 2009, at 2:14 PM, RickG wrote: > LOL, All in good fun! To be clear, I really dont want free > electricity, gas, > or water because you get what you pay for every time. > On the serious side, i disagree with your statement. Really, it's just a quote, not a statement by me per se. I don't agree with it entirely either-though the meaning is that the replication cost for information has gone to nearly zero with modern technology. Chuck > Some information wants > or needs to be free. Especially public domain info such is how to > get your > drivers license, or info on the nearest state park, etc. But on the > other > hand, proprietary information should not be free. Such as Coca-Colas > recipe > or make Pyrex dishes. Contrary to the recent generations thought > process > that everything should be free - that model doesnt not work in a > capitalist > environment. We are still capitalist arent we? > -RickG > > On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 12:14 PM, Chuck Bartosch > wrote: > >> >> On Nov 7, 2009, at 9:35 PM, RickG wrote: >> >>> For $100 a month per phone and the internet access is relatively >>> slow. Not >>> really an "apples to apples" comparison. >>> >>> In my home, I want unlimited electicity, natural gas, and water too! >> >> Ah, but information wants to be free! >> >> See, we can all trade quips ! >> >> Chuck >> >> >>> >>> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 4:24 PM, Travis Johnson wrote: >>> >>>> The cellular guys don't charge by the minute... I have an unlimited >>>> plan >>>> on my cell phone. I can also get unlimited text and internet access >>>> for >>>> $9.95/mo extra. >>>> >>>> People don't want to guess what their internet bills are going to >>>> be from >>>> month to month. Would you want that at your own home? >>>> >>>> Travis >>>> Microserv >>>> >>>> Gary Garrett wrote: >>>> >>>> You sound like the cell phone company. >>>> I am convinced the big failure in my business model is I charge by >>>> the >>>> month while the cellular guys charge by the minute. >>>> >>>> >>>> Travis Johnson wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> You are talking about having to add additional resources (radius, >>>> etc.) >>>> to track it. Then you have to bill it. Then you get to deal with >>>> the >>>> phone calls from users that say "My computer wasn't even turned on >>>> during those times. Remove the charge or I will go elsewhere." So, >>>> even >>>> that one extra phone call costs you money (because you have to >>>> think >>>> about scaling). Imagine if you have 100x the number of customers >>>> you >>>> have now... does the same solution work? Probably not. >>>> >>>> The easier solution would be to call that customer and get them to >>>> upgrade to the next plan up (which would provide higher speed as >>>> well). >>>> This works very well for us... and then I have that guaranteed >>>> extra >>>> income each month, even if they don't use it. >>>> >>>> >>>> >> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/ >>>> wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>>> >> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/w
Re: [WISPA] Metered Billing
On Nov 12, 2009, at 2:02 PM, RickG wrote: > Chuck, > > That's the point. The consumer is NOT paying for excessive bandwidth > use. > When bandwidth runs us over $100/meg and one customer uses $300's > worth for > $50/month there is something wrong. Right, but if that's the case you either charge them or lose the customer (on purpose I mean). You don't try to charge the organization they are downloading from. > The unlimited bandwidth model only works > when you can oversubscribe the bandwidth. With bandwidth usage > climbing > exponentially, the model will soon break. Furthermore, some educated > consumers are finally realizing that they are subsidizing the > bandwidth > hogs. They ask how is that fair? > As far as my Netflix idea, I agree my original idea is probably not > a good > solution. Yep, that's what I was trying to say. I know you're just batting ideas around, which is always healthy. Chuck > I was also a GM at a cable company and maybe we should use them as > a template? HBO, and the other premium channels charge the cable cos > for the > customer's usage which we passed on to the customer for a profit. > Both HBO > and the cable co makes money and everyone wins. > Really, I'm just kicking around ideas because something has to > happen. I'm > not saying I have the right ideas. > As far as the phone companies, AFAIK the LECS still have an exchange > rates > for calls that terminate on another network. It's just transparent > to the > end users. At any rate, this discussion is much needed. > > Thanks to all on this list for their ingenuity which makes this the > best > business field to be in (IMHO)! > -RickG > > On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 12:10 PM, Chuck Bartosch > wrote: > >> >> On Nov 7, 2009, at 2:25 PM, RickG wrote: >> >>> In the past, l worked for two electric companies. Their business >>> models were >>> dependant on meters. As far as internet access, Compuserve and AOL >>> had the >>> right idea from the start. Instead entrepanuers took advantage of >>> their >>> weakness at the time. What we are now seeing is the downside of the >>> $50/month "all you can eat" business model. When usage was low due >>> to less >>> apps, it worked fine but were now seeing exponential growth of >>> usage. >>> Besides that, one thing we (ISP's) are really missing, are >>> agreements >>> between each other for payment of access to our networks. For >>> instance, the >>> phone companies pay each other for access to each others networks. I >>> realize >>> this is very complex but shouldnt Netflix (or their provider) pay us >>> for >>> utilziation of our networks? >> >> I do not see why they (Netflix) should, no. The consumer is already >> paying you for it. Netflix is not another ISP. It's a "phone call". >> My >> phone company does not charge my local hardware store for calling >> them >> if they are with a different phone company any more than it charges >> my >> mom when I call her back in Minnesota (I live in New York). My >> *mom's* >> phone company might charge her for the the call, depending on the >> plan, but that's about as far as it goes. >> >> The provider idea could bite us hard. >> >> Note that originally the settlement fees were demanded by the >> established phone companies to mild the upstart cell companies for >> revenues. They weren't smart when they started those agreements and >> it >> came back to bite them later when CLECs exploited the ideas in novel >> ways with the advent of the Internet where you could guarantee >> certain >> incoming-only calls. But they aren't going to be so stupid as to not >> think of those loop holes a second time ;-). >> >> Chuck >> >>> -RickG >>> >>> On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 1:59 PM, Eric Rogers >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I do agree with you and that works if there are other options. One >>>> customer who was downloading 160G, came from DSL and moved into >>>> this >>>> neighborhood and now wants high speed where we are the only >>>> option. It >>>> is only a matter of time before others are using Netflix and >>>> others. >>>> They come in all gaming consoles now. Why not have the customers >>>> pay >>>> for upgrades? If there is a high demand for services, the demand >>&
Re: [WISPA] Metered Billing
chives: >>>>> <http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/>http:// >>>>> lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>> <http://signup.wispa.org/>http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wireless List: <mailto:wireless@wispa.org>wireless@wispa.org >>>>> >>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>> <http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless>http:// >>>>> lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>> >>>>> Archives: >>>>> <http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/>http:// >>>>> lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -------- >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> <http://signup.wispa.org/>http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: <mailto:wireless@wispa.org>wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> <http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless>http:// >>>> lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: >>>> <http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/>http:// >>>> lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Billing
On Nov 7, 2009, at 9:35 PM, RickG wrote: > For $100 a month per phone and the internet access is relatively > slow. Not > really an "apples to apples" comparison. > > In my home, I want unlimited electicity, natural gas, and water too! Ah, but information wants to be free! See, we can all trade quips ! Chuck > > On Sat, Nov 7, 2009 at 4:24 PM, Travis Johnson wrote: > >> The cellular guys don't charge by the minute... I have an unlimited >> plan >> on my cell phone. I can also get unlimited text and internet access >> for >> $9.95/mo extra. >> >> People don't want to guess what their internet bills are going to >> be from >> month to month. Would you want that at your own home? >> >> Travis >> Microserv >> >> Gary Garrett wrote: >> >> You sound like the cell phone company. >> I am convinced the big failure in my business model is I charge by >> the >> month while the cellular guys charge by the minute. >> >> >> Travis Johnson wrote: >> >> >> Hi, >> >> You are talking about having to add additional resources (radius, >> etc.) >> to track it. Then you have to bill it. Then you get to deal with the >> phone calls from users that say "My computer wasn't even turned on >> during those times. Remove the charge or I will go elsewhere." So, >> even >> that one extra phone call costs you money (because you have to think >> about scaling). Imagine if you have 100x the number of customers you >> have now... does the same solution work? Probably not. >> >> The easier solution would be to call that customer and get them to >> upgrade to the next plan up (which would provide higher speed as >> well). >> This works very well for us... and then I have that guaranteed extra >> income each month, even if they don't use it. >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/ >> wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Billing
Actually, that is not what Rick was suggesting as I understood it. At one level he's saying he should be able to charge the company who is NOT in his service territory for responding to a customer enquiry (looking at a web page, downloading a movie). Your cell company charges *you* for your minutes, not the person you're calling. The person you're calling might, or might not, be charged for your call, but your cell company cannot charge them unless it's the same cell company. Rick's other argument (in parenthesis) was that we should charge the local ISP that hosts the business (say Netflix). Though that might be possible I'd sure hate to start getting bills from Verizon because one of my customers hosts a web site that is popular with Verizon customers. I don't see anything good coming out of that ;-). Chuck On Nov 7, 2009, at 2:25 PM, Gary Garrett wrote: > You sound like the cell phone company. > I am convinced the big failure in my business model is I charge by the > month while the cellular guys charge by the minute. > -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Billing
rs >>> >>> Precision Data Solutions, LLC >>> >>> (317) 831-3000 x200 >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >> >> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >> >> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> -------- >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] customers dogs chewing on CAT5
Feed and Grain stores sell bitters, but I find that any determined dog will ignore the bitters and chew away. In fact, just this morning I coincidentally happened to have some bitters (gf bought it a while back) and thought "oh what the hell" and sprayed it on something a dog was chewing on. The dog went right back to it, licked it, shook his head, licked his chops, and licked the wood again. Kept doing this, whining at times, until it was "all clean" and he could chew again ;-). However, I *have* found that Habanero Tabasco Hot Sauce works 100% of the time. That's like 10,000 times hotter than normal jalapeno hot sauce and they do not like and do not go back for a second lick. Chuck On Nov 9, 2009, at 10:18 AM, Greg wrote: > Your local feed and grain or pet store should have aerosol dog > repellent. > > Greg > > On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 10:43 AM, Kurt Fankhauser > wrote: > >> I've had several customers that have had their dog chew on the Cat5 >> going >> from the house to the TV tower and some of them multiple times. >> >> >> >> Anyone have ideas on how to keep the dog from chewing on the wire? >> I've got >> one customer on their 3rd Cat5 run and going out right now to >> replace a >> different customer that will be his 3rd one as well. >> >> >> >> I'm about ready to shoot the stinking dog.. >> >> >> >> Kurt Fankhauser >> WAVELINC >> P.O. Box 126 >> Bucyrus, OH 44820 >> 419-562-6405 >> www.wavelinc.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > ---- > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Ideas on Police Department Wireless Link from Station to Cruiser
Josh, It kind of depends where you live, just like it does for any 3G service. Where I personally live, AT&T's 3G service is excellent. I switched from Verizon and have better coverage and better performance. I'm sure the reverse is true in other areas...but you really cannot legitimately make blanket statements like that when they need coverage in a specific relatively small area. Chuck On Oct 17, 2009, at 1:45 PM, Josh Luthman wrote: > I strongly advise avoiding AT&T's 3G service. I haven't been > impressed at > all. > > Josh Luthman > Office: 937-552-2340 > Direct: 937-552-2343 > 1100 Wayne St > Suite 1337 > Troy, OH 45373 > > "When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however > improbable, must be the truth." > --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle > > > On Sat, Oct 17, 2009 at 1:37 PM, Jayson Baker > wrote: > >> We currently do this for a local PD. They have 13 of those >> ruggedized Dell >> laptops, mounted in all the cars. >> We looked at 2.4GHz and 900MHz. Even though the town is only >> 5sqmi, we >> decided to go with Verizon Aircards. >> >> Worked out well, because the laptops are tied directly into their CAD >> system, which is tied into the whole state. >> So now they could, theoretically, go anywhere in the state and be >> dispatched >> on a call, run plates/people through NCIC, etc. >> >> I believe that because of that, they actually got the state to pay >> for a >> lot >> of it. >> >> Sure, we don't make anything on the Verizon service, but we do on the >> backend by tying their CAD into the Internet. >> >> Just something to keep in mind, if you have any sort of 3G service >> in that >> area. >> >> Jayson >> >> On Sat, Oct 17, 2009 at 9:05 AM, Robert West >> wrote: >> >>> I got a call Friday afternoon from the police chief of a small >>> little >> spot >>> in the road asking about the possibility of connecting his >>> cruisers to >> the >>> station network via a wireless link. (He is the "Police Chief" >>> but I >>> suspect he is also the entire police force) He said that the local >>> Wal-Mart >>> has agreed to donate to him a few of those little Acer 7" screen >>> laptops, >>> which are a big piece of crap from the number of repairs we've had >>> to do >> on >>> them... Anyhow, he wants to be able to be in the cruiser and >>> connect to >>> the >>> network back at the station and use the websites from the Attorney >>> General's >>> office where he can run plates, drivers license info and also fill >>> out >> his >>> reports. >>> >>> >>> >>> Here's the setup.. >>> >>> >>> >>> This Burg is a bit less than 2 miles long and about one and a half >>> miles >>> wide. The town hall is equivalent to a 4 story building and they >>> also >> have >>> a water tower that looks to be 100 foot tall. The terrain is flat >>> as can >>> be >>> and they have the normal scattering of trees. The Town Hall and >>> water >>> tower >>> are the tallest structures by far aside from a large grain >>> elevator right >>> outside of town. Boy wants to connect to his network anywhere in >>> town >> from >>> his cop-mobile as well as when he is at home, also within the town. >>> >>> >>> >>> We've done plenty of private networks but it's all been in the 2.4 >>> and >> 5ghz >>> band. He was thinking he could just throw up a 2.4ghz link and be >>> good >> but >>> I told him to hold on, I didn't think he could broadcast the >>> Attorney >>> Generals network to every antenna in town, I had to do some >>> research. So >>> this, because of my utterly blatant laziness, is my research. J >>> >>> >>> >>> Has anyone been down this path? What can we do and not do? >>> >>> >>> >>> I have a meeting with the guy next Wednesday and want to have some >>> idea >> of >>> what we're up against on this one. (Hopefully he doesn't >>> recognize me as >>> the guy who took him to court over a ticket he wrote for a crooked >> license >>> plate... I won that one by the way) >>> >>> >>> >>> Thanks for any help! >>> >>> >>> >>> Robert West >>> >>> Just Micro Digital Services Inc. >>> >>> 740-335-7020 >>> -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Broadband Internet Access Deemed a Legal Right
On Oct 16, 2009, at 4:46 PM, Robert West wrote: > I can see somewhere in the near future, after all major technologies > converge into devices that run on whatever version of the "internet" > we will > have at that time, that this would be a feasible argument however at > this > moment and probably in the next 10 years the vast majority of us > will be > able to live and survive perfectly fine with no internet. > > I don't understand the 1mg limit for the human right. Keep in mind, it's a *legal* right (soon) in Finland, not a human right. People are conflating the French decree with Finland's. Chuck > Most information, > other than video, can be had at mere dial up speed. How would slower > internet speeds be the difference between life or death? > > My 15 year old. > > "Dad! If I can't see the Whack-a-kitty video on YouTube I'm just > gonna > die!" > > Okay, that much I DO understand. > > Bob- > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > On > Behalf Of David Hulsebus > Sent: Friday, October 16, 2009 3:44 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: [WISPA] Broadband Internet Access Deemed a Legal Right > > FYI > > From SANS Newsbites Vol. 11 Num. 82 : Broadband Internet Access Deemed > a Legal Right > > --Finland Declares 1Mb Broadband Access a Legal Right > (October 14 & 15, 2009) > The Finnish government has enacted a law making 1Mb broadband Internet > access a legal right. The law will take effect in July 2010. The > country may eventually guarantee its citizens the right to 100Mb > broadband connections. Finland's Transport and Communications > Ministry > spokesperson Laura Vikkonen was quoted as saying that "We think [the > Internet is] something you cannot live without in modern society. > Like > banking services or water or electricity, you need an Internet > connection." Earlier this year, France declared Internet access to be > a human right. > http://news.cnet.com/8301-17939_109-10374831-2.html > http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/posted/archive/2009/10/15/finland-m > akes-broadband-internet-a-legal-right.aspx > > > > Dave Hulsebus > Portative Technologies, LLC > www.portative.com > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Broadband Internet Access Deemed a Legal Right
Dude, you're talking about France. What do you expect? ;-) Chuck On Oct 16, 2009, at 4:45 PM, Jayson Baker wrote: > My thoughts exactly. A human right. Duh? > > On Fri, Oct 16, 2009 at 2:25 PM, Josh Luthman > wrote: > >> Seriously my brain hurts that is so dumb. >> >> A human right? >> >> Josh Luthman >> Office: 937-552-2340 >> Direct: 937-552-2343 >> 1100 Wayne St >> Suite 1337 >> Troy, OH 45373 >> >> "When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however >> improbable, must be the truth." >> --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle >> >> >> On Fri, Oct 16, 2009 at 4:13 PM, Jack Unger >> wrote: >> >>> Thanks for your post Dave. I didn't know this was going on. >>> >>> David Hulsebus wrote: >>>> FYI >>>> >>>> From SANS Newsbites Vol. 11 Num. 82 : Broadband Internet Access >>>> Deemed >>>> a Legal Right >>>> >>>> --Finland Declares 1Mb Broadband Access a Legal Right >>>> (October 14 & 15, 2009) >>>> The Finnish government has enacted a law making 1Mb broadband >>>> Internet >>>> access a legal right. The law will take effect in July 2010. The >>>> country may eventually guarantee its citizens the right to 100Mb >>>> broadband connections. Finland's Transport and Communications >>>> Ministry >>>> spokesperson Laura Vikkonen was quoted as saying that "We think >>>> [the >>>> Internet is] something you cannot live without in modern >>>> society. Like >>>> banking services or water or electricity, you need an Internet >>>> connection." Earlier this year, France declared Internet access >>>> to be >>>> a human right. >>>> http://news.cnet.com/8301-17939_109-10374831-2.html >>>> >>> >> http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/posted/archive/2009/10/15/finland-makes-broadband-internet-a-legal-right.aspx >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Dave Hulsebus >>>> Portative Technologies, LLC >>>> www.portative.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> -- >>> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. >>> Author - "Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs" >>> Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993 >>> www.ask-wi.com 818-227-4220 jun...@ask-wi.com >>> >>> Sent from my Pizzicato PluckString... >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Barriers to WISP growth
On Oct 11, 2009, at 1:33 AM, Marlon K. Schafer wrote: > > - Original Message - > From: "Chuck Bartosch" > To: "WISPA General List" > Sent: Saturday, October 10, 2009 9:43 AM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Barriers to WISP growth > > >> >> On Oct 9, 2009, at 9:18 PM, Marlon K. Schafer wrote: >> >>> I didn't apply for two main reasons. >>> >>> 1: they want the whole company and don't tell you when (if ever) >>> you'll get >>> it back. >> >> You can't sell the company without approval for 10 years. The general >> terms of that approval were that you couldn't be asking for so little >> for the company that it resulted in a windfall for the buyer and the >> buyer had to maintain the terms of the contract you sign with the >> government to get the money. > > I keep hearing that, but I don't remember seeing it anywhere in the > NOFA. > It's not in the ARRA, and I asked that specific question in > Billings. I got > a shrug of the shoulders. IIRC, it's in the FAQ. Originally the statements (and I think this is what the NOFA said) were "for the life of the equipment" being purchased. However, that was later clarified to be "10 years". I'm not sure 10 years is better than "life" but . >> It isn't unreasonable. The final terms of this requirement are worked >> out in the contract you negotiate once you're "awarded" the funds >> (you >> don't actually get anything just because you won the award...you have >> to sign a mutual contract first). > > As I understand it, it's far more than that. You can't sell any > assets > without government approval either. Want to trade in that old > install van? > Make sure you clear it with the "boss" first. What about old gear > that you > upgrade from? Just think about how hard it would be to get anything > done if > you had to ask permission for nearly all of it, from a desk jocky, > in DC. You can sell any asset that didn't come from the grant. If you had that van before, or bought the van not-on-the-grant, then you do with it as you please. If they paid for the equipment, it's only fair and right that they make sure you're not just buying it, and then selling it to make a profit that has nothing to do with providing the service they are paying you to provide. They have some ownership rights on the equipment you're trying to sell since they paid for at least half, and up to 80%, of its cost. As a taxpayer, I just don't see this as an unreasonable attempt to prevent fraud or unjust enrichment at "my" expense. I'd be upset if something like this *weren't* in the requirements. >>> 2: My areas are already covered better than what's allowed under the >>> grants. >>> We've done a good job in the past and our reward is government >>> funded >>> potential competition, gotta love that one. >> >> Yeah, having government funded competition sucks. So does having >> competition that is cross-subsidized by phone service revenues. Or >> television revenues. Or investors that don't know what they are >> doing. >> >> In the end there isn't anything really special about the funding >> coming from the Feds versus many other sources we have to compete >> around. It hurts the same either way. >> >>> Oh yeah, >>> 3: If you take Obama money you are required to wholesale access to >>> the >>> network at fair and reasonable rates. >> >> You're said this before and you've been told before this is not the >> case. > > Yest it is. It's in the NOFA. You have to open your network at > "fair and > reasonable rates". I asked about this in Billings too. Again, I > was told > to submit the question in writing as there is no definition of fair > and > reasonable already established. You're conflating two separate statements in the NOFA and you apparently either didn't ask a clear question or you didn't ask someone who understood the question (neither are your fault of course...if it wasn't clear to you it's hard to ask a clear question, and you can't help the understanding of the designated responder to your question) or the answer hadn't been determined yet. In any case, there are TWO separate issues. The first is interconnection. The second is wholesale. You DO NOT HAVE TO OPEN YOUR NETWORK TO WHOLESALE ACCESS. In fact, in the application it is two separate questions. The first you
Re: [WISPA] Barriers to WISP growth
On Oct 9, 2009, at 9:18 PM, Marlon K. Schafer wrote: > I didn't apply for two main reasons. > > 1: they want the whole company and don't tell you when (if ever) > you'll get > it back. You can't sell the company without approval for 10 years. The general terms of that approval were that you couldn't be asking for so little for the company that it resulted in a windfall for the buyer and the buyer had to maintain the terms of the contract you sign with the government to get the money. It isn't unreasonable. The final terms of this requirement are worked out in the contract you negotiate once you're "awarded" the funds (you don't actually get anything just because you won the award...you have to sign a mutual contract first). > 2: My areas are already covered better than what's allowed under the > grants. > We've done a good job in the past and our reward is government funded > potential competition, gotta love that one. Yeah, having government funded competition sucks. So does having competition that is cross-subsidized by phone service revenues. Or television revenues. Or investors that don't know what they are doing. In the end there isn't anything really special about the funding coming from the Feds versus many other sources we have to compete around. It hurts the same either way. > Oh yeah, > 3: If you take Obama money you are required to wholesale access to the > network at fair and reasonable rates. You're said this before and you've been told before this is not the case. You are required to support Interconnection at reasonable rates on the part of the network you built with government funds. For a small provider that's an almost completely meaningless requirement. For large multi-region buildouts, that's got some meaning. You were NOT, however, required to support wholesale. That's a bonus. > Anyone know what that really means? > Me neither. I figure if someone comes here I'll just make them sell > to me > at good rates and I'll not have to deal with the grant hassles. You can interconnect with their network. If they are small it presumably means you set up a direction connection with them so that your traffic goes directly to them and vice versa without needing to transit to the outside world. Interconnection wasn't defined really well in the NOFA however. It could also mean another provider could ask to use your network to reach the outside world. However, you get to negotiate for that access on reasonable terms, which means you could make a profit on whatever it is you provide them. Unless you agreed to arbitration (an option in the application), you couldn't be forced to do it really (since it'd be easy enough to set unworkable terms). A starting point for the negotiation would probably have been "what would access cost from the big guys" to your location? since that's presumably a reasonable place to be price wise. Chuck > marlon > > - Original Message - > From: "Tim Sylvester" > To: "'WISPA General List'" > Sent: Thursday, October 08, 2009 9:42 AM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Barriers to WISP growth > > >>> Stimulus: I don't believe in it and did not apply. >> >> I want to understand people's opposition to the Broadband Stimulus >> programs. >> >> >> Rick and other people opposed to the stimulus, can you expand on >> why you >> don't believe in the Stimulus and why you didn't apply? Are there >> things >> you >> think the government - FCC, congress, etc. - could do to help ISPs >> and >> expanding broadband? >> >> Tim >> >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grov
Re: [WISPA] American Dollar. Was: Re: Barriers to WISP growth
That brings up an interesting factor. China is completely stuck with us as long as the dollar is cheap. They bought them when the dollar was dear (over time of course, and with a sliding range of values) but if they even started to unload now, not only would they take a huge hit compared to what they comparatively paid, they would also drive down the dollar's value even further making it even more difficult for them to unload. In other words, at a whim they could screw us royally...but they'd have to screw themselves to do it. Definitely an interesting problem. And they don't have a short term fix to this issue. As much as they talk about an alternative currency, they can't afford to have that happen when the dollar is down. And they are more-or-less forced to keep loaning to the US government for the same basic reason, until they decide to bite the bullet anyway. So, the sky isn't falling. Yet. Chuck On Oct 9, 2009, at 3:29 PM, Daniel Mullen wrote: > I just cannot keep quiet on this any more. > > Gold, in US Dollars, was $1045 and change this morning. That sounds > high, but it was higher, in constant currency terms when you look at a > basket of currencies. > > Yes, oil still is priced in nice U.S. Dollars, and everyone is glad to > have them. > > So far, so good. > > The folks in the Middle East buy German cars, use European adult > personal entertainment, and go shopping - either in the sparkling new > massive shopping mall in town, or again, somewhere in Europe - and the > dollars get converted eventually into Euros. > > I used to get 80¢ to the Euro. Now it is $1.46. > > You can do the math on that. > > As long as China continues to be the 'sister nation' to the United > States of America, keeping its currency fairly closely pegged to the > U.S. Dollar, then everything will be fine. All the Asian countries > will do their best to work on U.S. Dollar terms so as to stay > competitive vis-a-vis China. > > But China is now sitting on TWO TRILLION - that is 2,000,000,000,000 - > U.S. Dollars, and wondering what to do. If they wanted to take over > the world today, instead of merely the entire Asia-Pacific region and > Africa, they could simply cut the line and then let the U.S.A. dangle > in the wind. > > As it is, China is going around the world buying everything you can > imagine: years worth of factory equipment from Germany, minerals in > Africa, oil and gas everywhere, iron ore from Brazil, uranium from > Australia, and on and on. > > You should see the pictures: gigantic barges being loaded with > enormous open spools of copper, a good ten feet in diameter, to be > stockpiled in China, and more ore than you could possibly fathom. > > And now they are buying gold: gold and more gold, and the government > is telling its citizens to also buy gold. > > Simply put, they are turning the greenbacks into hard assets. > > None of this will bother you, because all your gear is made from parts > which are priced in U.S. Dollars, and China is keeping a good lid on > things - until they stop. > > When the Sheiks - or Mr. Chavez - decides they want some pretty thing > from Europe, and see how small their wallets are, the price of oil - > yes, in U.S. Dollars - will go to the moon. > > The fact that oil is priced in dollars really means nothing. It is the > value that the producer gets for the specific volume sold that > matters, and as long as the rest of the world is getting more > expensive by comparison, the more dollars the sellers will want to > ensure they can keep on buying those things, regardless of what the > dollar buys for you in your own backyard. > > By the way, milk is cheap everywhere now - in Belgium the farmers > started to spray it on their fields rather than sell it, just to make > demonstrate how low it has gone. > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > -------- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] American Dollar. Was: Re: Barriers to WISP growth
Yep, very true. How come we never use the "Chat" list for these discussions? ;-) Chuck On Oct 9, 2009, at 12:29 PM, Randy Cosby wrote: > What gets scary is when countries like China and Saudi Arabia start > talking about not pegging to the dollar, or even selling commodities > based on the dollar. Then it's a whole new ball game and who knows > who > will set the "standard". We have an artificial advantage with the > dollar, and if that goes away, we don't have as much fudge room. > > Randy > > Chuck Bartosch wrote: >> On Oct 9, 2009, at 11:20 AM, Robert West wrote: >> >> >>> It will never, stay worth what it is today. As long as there are >>> people out >>> there looking to make a little extra cash, it will always creep up. >>> It's >>> the nature of free enterprise. >>> >> >> There have been times when the dollar's value has gone up, not down. >> By policy on a national level we don't ever want to see the 1930's >> again though. >> >> The dollar's value creeps down from inflation because in general we >> want inflation...just not very much of it. If the dollar's value is >> rising, then spending money today instead of tomorrow means you lose >> value. That has the effect of dampening economic growth in those rare >> times when people are acting rationally (though perhaps rare, it does >> act like a general force). With some mild inflation, you're better >> off >> to some extent spending money now, compared to putting it in a >> mattress at least. >> >> Anyway, deflation is often described as a bigger threat to us, if it >> were to occur again, than inflation. The struggle with inflation >> isn't >> to eliminate it but to keep it predictable and relatively low-but not >> zero. >> >> Chuck >> >> >> >>> Let's just admit we're old. :) >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -Original Message- >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] >>> On >>> Behalf Of Josh Luthman >>> Sent: Friday, October 09, 2009 10:39 AM >>> To: WISPA General List >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] American Dollar. Was: Re: Barriers to WISP >>> growth >>> >>> 5% increase of costs don't stop at just bread. It costs 5% more to >>> ship. >>> Your WISP gear. Gas and truck. Payroll. >>> >>> If it costs more to get into the US it costs more to get to you. >>> >>> Josh Luthman >>> Office: 937-552-2340 >>> Direct: 937-552-2343 >>> 1100 Wayne St >>> Suite 1337 >>> Troy, OH 45373 >>> >>> "When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, >>> however >>> improbable, must be the truth." >>> --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 10:36 AM, Travis Johnson >>> wrote: >>> >>> >>>> I understand that so instead of bread costing $2.00 per loaf, >>>> it >>>> goes up to $2.10. >>>> >>>> So because of that "fear", everyone wants to find a different place >>>> to >>>> put money besides a bank? Seems strange to me. >>>> >>>> Travis >>>> Microserv >>>> >>>> Jeff Ehman wrote: >>>> >>>>> Imports cost us way more money. That may not directly affect any >>>>> >>>> individual consumer, but it does impact nearly every manufacturer. >>>> Cost >>>> >>> of >>> >>>> production increases greatly. The only way they can make money >>>> is to >>>> increase their prices to distributors who in turn have to raise the >>>> price >>>> >>> to >>> >>>> individual consumers. It creates inflation. >>>> >>>>> -Jeff Ehman >>>>> >>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- >>>>> boun...@wispa.org] On >>>>> >>>> Behalf Of Travis Johnson >>>> >>>>> Sent: Friday, October 09, 2009 8:26 AM >>>>> To: WISPA General List >>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] American Dollar. Was: Re: Barriers to WISP >>>>> growth >>>>> >>>>> I've never understood this thinking... who cares if the dollar is >>>>> &q
Re: [WISPA] American Dollar. Was: Re: Barriers to WISP growth
ribe: >>> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > > >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >> > > >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org<mailto:wireless@wispa.org> >>> >>> >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> Marco C. Coelho >>> >>> Argon Technologies Inc. >>> >>> POB 875 >>> >>> Greenville, TX 75403-0875 >>> >>> 903-455-5036 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > > >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >> > > >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org<mailto:wireless@wispa.org> >>> >>> >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > > >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >> > > >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org<mailto:wireless@wispa.org> >>> >>> >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > > >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >> > > >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org<mailto:wireless@wispa.org> >>> >>> >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > > >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >> > > >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >> >> >> >> > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> > > >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] American Dollar. Was: Re: Barriers to WISP growth
gt;> Archives: > href="http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> ">http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: > href="mailto:wireless@wispa.org >> ">wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> > href="http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> ">http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: > href="http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> ">http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > -- > /* > Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL >KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting > http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ > */ > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] American Dollar. Was: Re: Barriers to WISP growth
> Marco C. Coelho >> >> Argon Technologies Inc. >> >> POB 875 >> >> Greenville, TX 75403-0875 >> >> 903-455-5036 >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> -- >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> -- >> -- >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org<mailto:wireless@wispa.org> >> >> >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> -- >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> -- >> -- >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org<mailto:wireless@wispa.org> >> >> >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> -- >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> -- >> -- >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org<mailto:wireless@wispa.org> >> >> >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> -- >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> -- >> -- >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Barriers to WISP growth
In general, in the rural areas I work in, spectrum availability isn't ever the issue. In cities and sometimes village centers, yes, but not in the areas that should be addressed with broadband funding. Chuck On Oct 8, 2009, at 1:32 PM, Robert West wrote: > Yes. However my point in it all is that if the government wants to > help > then cash really isn't the answer. You can throw money at anything > and > still have no useable result. Cash versus spectrum. I need tools, > not > money. With the correct spectrum we wouldn't have to worry about > cherry > picking. I know, I know, everyone gripes about spectrum > availability but > it's because it's true. That would change the entire makeup of > wireless > internet. That would be in the public good and, after all, the > public DOES > own the airwaves but our representatives use it as a profit center > instead > of the original intent of "serving the public good". > > > > -Original Message----- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > On > Behalf Of Chuck Bartosch > Sent: Thursday, October 08, 2009 1:16 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Barriers to WISP growth > > The problem I've seen in general is that a lot of areas are cherry- > picked. Anything with any reasonable density (say, the Village centers > in a Town) already have access. You can't really make a business case > based on what people can afford to roll out service in many areas out > here because of the geography. > > Yet, there's public good, not just individual good, done by providing > access to these folks. > > So, yes, I think the stimulus funding can be a good thing. The problem > is, I fear it's going to be co-opted for applications that really > didn't need the funding in the first place. > > Chuck > > On Oct 8, 2009, at 1:06 PM, Robert West wrote: > >> One of my issues is that it isn't necessary. We make money at this >> business, or at least try to. If an area is underserved or not >> served, >> that's usually because of middle mile issues or terrain. It's all >> line of >> sight and no one, not even the people trying to start up a wisp with >> this >> "free" money, are going to put up towers every mile or so just to >> pump a >> signal into a valley with 2 or 3 homes if even that. So they will >> obviously >> be going for the "easy" areas and those are ones that we can service >> just >> fine already and probably do. The motivation is profit, it >> shouldn't be >> free money. As someone mentioned before, the majority of these new >> startups >> will be here and gone and they will no doubt give a black eye to the >> wireless business from their lack of experience and sense of >> responsibility >> to both their customer and the reputation of the industry they >> represent. >> >> The only true Broadband Stimulus would be to open up enough usable >> white >> space spectrum and the market will take care of it from there. >> >> Guaranteed. >> >> >> Robert West >> Just Micro Digital Services Inc. >> >> >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] >> On >> Behalf Of Tim Sylvester >> Sent: Thursday, October 08, 2009 12:43 PM >> To: 'WISPA General List' >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Barriers to WISP growth >> >>> Stimulus: I don't believe in it and did not apply. >> >> I want to understand people's opposition to the Broadband Stimulus >> programs. >> >> >> Rick and other people opposed to the stimulus, can you expand on why >> you >> don't believe in the Stimulus and why you didn't apply? Are there >> things you >> think the government - FCC, congress, etc. - could do to help ISPs >> and >> expanding broadband? >> >> Tim >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > ---- >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >
Re: [WISPA] Barriers to WISP growth
The problem I've seen in general is that a lot of areas are cherry- picked. Anything with any reasonable density (say, the Village centers in a Town) already have access. You can't really make a business case based on what people can afford to roll out service in many areas out here because of the geography. Yet, there's public good, not just individual good, done by providing access to these folks. So, yes, I think the stimulus funding can be a good thing. The problem is, I fear it's going to be co-opted for applications that really didn't need the funding in the first place. Chuck On Oct 8, 2009, at 1:06 PM, Robert West wrote: > One of my issues is that it isn't necessary. We make money at this > business, or at least try to. If an area is underserved or not > served, > that's usually because of middle mile issues or terrain. It's all > line of > sight and no one, not even the people trying to start up a wisp with > this > "free" money, are going to put up towers every mile or so just to > pump a > signal into a valley with 2 or 3 homes if even that. So they will > obviously > be going for the "easy" areas and those are ones that we can service > just > fine already and probably do. The motivation is profit, it > shouldn't be > free money. As someone mentioned before, the majority of these new > startups > will be here and gone and they will no doubt give a black eye to the > wireless business from their lack of experience and sense of > responsibility > to both their customer and the reputation of the industry they > represent. > > The only true Broadband Stimulus would be to open up enough usable > white > space spectrum and the market will take care of it from there. > > Guaranteed. > > > Robert West > Just Micro Digital Services Inc. > > > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > On > Behalf Of Tim Sylvester > Sent: Thursday, October 08, 2009 12:43 PM > To: 'WISPA General List' > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Barriers to WISP growth > >> Stimulus: I don't believe in it and did not apply. > > I want to understand people's opposition to the Broadband Stimulus > programs. > > > Rick and other people opposed to the stimulus, can you expand on why > you > don't believe in the Stimulus and why you didn't apply? Are there > things you > think the government - FCC, congress, etc. - could do to help ISPs and > expanding broadband? > > Tim > > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > ---- > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Barriers to WISP growth
No please, let's not go there Josh. Obviously lots of people in the world, not just in the US are going to disagree vehemently with you. That's a completely useless conversation for a public list. Private conversation over a beer? Sure ;-). In a worst case, what you see as a banana gone bad someone else will see as a banana at perfect ripeness. One thing maybe the FCC or other branch of government could do is issue regulations that would help expedite tower zoning approvals. Right now a large part of the review process just drives up the cost for no discernible benefit. As an example, in upstate NY a firm a few years ago shopped a boiler plate zoning requirement to many of the little towns up this way. As a result, if you want to merely change the type of antenna on a tower, or just add to it, you (legally, though I know a lot of firms don't actually do it) have to go through a full zoning hearing, which requires a $5K to $7.5K fee and includes paying a town's "consultant" to review the application. Crazy waste of time and money. (Yes, you can blame the problem on the town government, but people do have a right to set up their own rules by-and-large, and that's what these towns have done, even though they don't understand what they've done exactly. It's a place where the Fed. government might be able to step in though and set some intelligent ground rules). Chuck On Oct 8, 2009, at 12:55 PM, Josh Luthman wrote: >> Are there things you think the government - FCC, congress, etc. - >> could do > to help ISPs and expanding broadband? > > Seriously? Name one thing the government has done right in the last > 200 > years. The list should start and end with the military and that can > be > argued either way. The only thing the government could do to help > is to not > do anything at all. > > Josh Luthman > Office: 937-552-2340 > Direct: 937-552-2343 > 1100 Wayne St > Suite 1337 > Troy, OH 45373 > > "When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however > improbable, must be the truth." > --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle > > > On Thu, Oct 8, 2009 at 12:42 PM, Tim Sylvester >wrote: > >>> Stimulus: I don't believe in it and did not apply. >> >> I want to understand people's opposition to the Broadband Stimulus >> programs. >> >> >> Rick and other people opposed to the stimulus, can you expand on >> why you >> don't believe in the Stimulus and why you didn't apply? Are there >> things >> you >> think the government - FCC, congress, etc. - could do to help ISPs >> and >> expanding broadband? >> >> Tim >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > ---- > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Waverider Vs Alvarion VL 900
You shouldn't have to worry too much about the old product because I think they did a 100% field upgrade at no cost to owners of those AUs, right? You should still check, but I would hope it'd be unusual to find an upgraded unit for sale. Chuck On Sep 29, 2009, at 12:30 AM, Nick Huanca wrote: > Hi Jon, > > We've had extensive experience with the VL900 product line, even > through its > rough release to market. After Alvarion fixed their hardware and > software > bugs I could recommend this product hands down based on our > experience. > Beware of used equipment that may not operate *at all* in minimal > noise. > There was a revision to the hardware on the AUs to remedy this. > > Thanks, > --Nick Huanca > > On Mon, Sep 28, 2009 at 9:56 PM, Chuck Bartosch >wrote: > >> I have no experience with the Waverider equipment, but Alvarion's >> pretty darn good (and we do have experience with that). >> >> Chuck >> >> On Sep 28, 2009, at 5:24 PM, my_em...@webjogger.net wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> >>> We're planning to upgrade a lot of our 900MHz equipment which is >>> currently predominantly Alvarion Breeze Access 900. The main goal is >>> to >>> provide the customer with better speeds >>> >>> The 2 options I'm considering are Alvarion VL900 and Waverider >>> CCU8000 >>> >>> I was wondering if anyone has experience with using both of these >>> radios, and if so, all considered which one do you think is >>> generally >>> better? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> -- >>> Jon Roux >>> Webjogger Internet Services >>> http://www.webjogger.net >>> 845.757.4000 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> ---- >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> -- >> Chuck Bartosch >> Clarity Connect, Inc. >> 200 Pleasant Grove Road >> Ithaca, NY 14850 >> (607) 257-8268 >> >> "When the stars threw down their spears, >> and water'd heaven with their tears, >> Did He smile, His work to see? >> Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >> >> From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> ---- >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > -- > Nick Huanca > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Waverider Vs Alvarion VL 900
I have no experience with the Waverider equipment, but Alvarion's pretty darn good (and we do have experience with that). Chuck On Sep 28, 2009, at 5:24 PM, my_em...@webjogger.net wrote: > Hi, > > We're planning to upgrade a lot of our 900MHz equipment which is > currently predominantly Alvarion Breeze Access 900. The main goal is > to > provide the customer with better speeds > > The 2 options I'm considering are Alvarion VL900 and Waverider CCU8000 > > I was wondering if anyone has experience with using both of these > radios, and if so, all considered which one do you think is generally > better? > > Thanks, > > -- > Jon Roux > Webjogger Internet Services > http://www.webjogger.net > 845.757.4000 > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Link Planning Software
On Sep 28, 2009, at 11:37 AM, Marlon K. Schafer wrote: > Actually for most of that Jerry helped me. Yep, Jerry corrected that comment already. Chuck > > I certainly agree that RM is very powerful but it's a POS from a > usability > standpoint. If it were cleaned up and made easier to use I'd have > dropped > the better part of $500 on it. Software that'll do what it does > that's as > easy to figure out as TopoUSA or any linksys router would be a no > brainer > here. > > Brian helps me with Census tract stuff mostly. > marlon > > - Original Message - > From: "Chuck Bartosch" > To: "WISPA General List" > Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 8:13 AM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Link Planning Software > > >> Marlon used Brian Webster. >> >> Chuck >> >> On Sep 23, 2009, at 10:29 PM, Scott Reed wrote: >> >>> Not to be repetitive, but you are describing RadioMobile >>> John the RM Yahoo group and see if you can't get it to do just what >>> you >>> are looking for. >>> Seems to me Marlon Schaffer found someone to help him learn it a few >>> months ago. I don't remember who. >>> I can help some if you want to ask questions off-list. >>> >>> Robert West wrote: >>>> I was holding this chunk of Organite and praying for such a thing >>>> and now >>>> here it is. >>>> >>>> Spooky. >>>> >>>> Get ready for the list, Shaddi. >>>> >>>> For one, this browser based software should not depend on the >>>> internet, yes? >>>> The term browser speaks internet to me. If I'm out in the field >>>> trying to >>>> figure out a link I obviously don't have internet there. Not that >>>> I see >>>> myself out in the middle of a corn field with my laptop trying to >>>> figure it >>>> out but hey, who knows. >>>> >>>> The basics of course is terrain and elevation but I'd like to see >>>> how a link >>>> over water is taken into account rolled into the thing. >>>> >>>> I also have to guess at trees. If I'm only able to get 70 feet or >>>> so up and >>>> the trees around here are also around 70 feet, it might say yes but >>>> the >>>> trees would say no. Could it possibly have a variable where you >>>> could set >>>> an average height for stands of trees? Where I am at, Southern >>>> Ohio, all >>>> the patches of trees are pretty much a single average height. If >>>> the >>>> software could distinguish a large green patch as trees and you >>>> tell the >>>> software that the average height is whatever, it could possibly add >>>> that >>>> height to the land elevation. Would be good to have a database of >>>> various >>>> antennas and radios to pull from as well. >>>> >>>> Hey! IDEA! A new game, Wireless Internet Tycoon!!! What do ya >>>> think? >>>> I've kinda ran off the rails here, sorry. >>>> >>>> >>>> You want a wish list? Grab some paper, pal. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -Original Message- >>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- >>>> boun...@wispa.org] On >>>> Behalf Of Shaddi Hasan >>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 5:37 PM >>>> To: WISPA General List >>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Link Planning Software >>>> >>>> Howdy WISPA! >>>> >>>> Just joined today but wanted to chime in -- some students here at >>>> UNC Chapel >>>> Hill are working on a browser-based link planning tool as a >>>> semester >>>> project. It will be released as open-source at the end of the >>>> semester, so >>>> we'd like it to be useful not only for our projects but for the >>>> community at >>>> large. While primarily geared towards community wireless projects, >>>> it'd be >>>> great if it could be useful for the professional WISP community. >>>> So, if you >>>> have any feedback on what features you'd like to see in such a >>>> tool, lesso
Re: [WISPA] BIP/BTOP Mapping Tool Online
The comment period can't open until they've announced the finalists. They are supposed to start doing that on Wed. (though we'll find out if they are on schedule or not in a couple of days I guess). They've said it's a rolling announcement-meaning they *start* announcing on Wed (if they are on schedule) but won't finish until they say they are finished. They haven't said if you can start commenting when they start announcing or if they'll wait until everyone is announced and then open up the 30 day period for everyone. The latter approach would make more sense of course. Chuck On Sep 28, 2009, at 8:54 AM, Steve Barnes wrote: > When Is the comment period supposed to be opened? > > Steve Barnes > Manager > PCS-WIN > RC-WiFi Wireless Internet Service > > Character cannot be developed in ease and quiet. Only through > experience of trial and suffering can the soul be strengthened, > vision cleared, ambition inspired, and success achieved. > - Helen Keller > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > On Behalf Of Charles Wu > Sent: Saturday, September 26, 2009 3:41 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: [WISPA] BIP/BTOP Mapping Tool Online > > Posting to multiple lists -- apologies if anyone gets this twice > > At some point last evening, RUS and NTIA released a modified version > of the BIP/BTOP applicant mapping tool, which now provides public > access to applicant mapping data. Right now, nothing has been > loaded in terms of public notices or on the map, so the 30 day > comment period has not yet started. The tool can be accessed at > http://broadbandsearch.sc.egov.usda.gov/DefaultARRA.aspx > . > > -Charles > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Micropops
Not really. That's the point of mentioning the train trip up the Mississippi and over to Chicago. That trip is over 1000 miles and there are very long stretches with not much there. Chuck On Sep 27, 2009, at 6:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote: > Well you're comparing cities to a few miles outside cities. I'd be > very disappointed if it didn't work downtown or something. > > On 9/27/09, Chuck Bartosch wrote: >> I don't use tethering since I haven't otherwise felt the need to >> jailbreak my phone. On the other hand, I've been extremely pleased >> with AT&T's network for Internet access. I took a train from New >> Orleans (still doing reconstruction trips to the Katrina damaged >> areas) to Minneapolis (via Chicago), and then on to Syracuse, NY last >> year and never had a problem using my "dongle" to get access on my >> laptop (I wasn't using my iPhone for email back then, though I do >> now). The coverage was surprisingly solid. Here in upstate NY I have >> at least Edge coverage wherever I need it. >> >> I know that's not true in the most rural areas in our territory, but >> all the typical cities, towns, and villages have usable access. >> >> Chuck >> >> On Sep 27, 2009, at 12:12 AM, Josh Luthman wrote: >> >>> Maybe it's just ATT that has problems everywhere... >>> >>> On 9/26/09, Mike Hammett wrote: >>>> I've never had a problem tethering with my Sprint phone. It has >>>> worked over >>>> EVDO and whatever their 2.5G was. Unfortunately, I got a new phone >>>> that >>>> Sprint hasn't made it easy to unlock the tethering (last one was >>>> just >>>> install USB drivers). >>>> >>>> >>>> - >>>> Mike Hammett >>>> Intelligent Computing Solutions >>>> http://www.ics-il.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> From: "Josh Luthman" >>>> Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 5:17 PM >>>> To: "WISPA General List" >>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Micropops >>>> >>>>> I have an AT&T aircard built into my laptop (Thinkpad t500; >>>>> Ericsson >>>>> f3507g) >>>>> and if it worked half of the places I try I'd be happy. Many >>>>> places just >>>>> don't seem offer a strong enough signal and the rest associate but >>>>> never >>>>> get >>>>> pppoe operating. There have been a few places where their DNS was >>>>> down, >>>>> but >>>>> I got online and used my own DNS. >>>>> >>>>> Don't count on aircards for remote connectivity (or your cell >>>>> phone for >>>>> data, tethered or not). >>>>> >>>>> Josh Luthman >>>>> Office: 937-552-2340 >>>>> Direct: 937-552-2343 >>>>> 1100 Wayne St >>>>> Suite 1337 >>>>> Troy, OH 45373 >>>>> >>>>> "When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, >>>>> however >>>>> improbable, must be the truth." >>>>> --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 5:55 PM, Robert West >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I usually just sit down and cry for a few minutes, somehow find a >>>>>> way to >>>>>> blame the customer, cry again for a few minutes, etc. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -Original Message- >>>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- >>>>>> boun...@wispa.org] On >>>>>> Behalf Of Josh Luthman >>>>>> Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 3:05 PM >>>>>> To: WISPA General List >>>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Micropops >>>>>> >>>>>> Call the office. Think it out. What else are you going to do? >>>>>> Turn >>>>>> into >>>>>> a >>>>>> brain dead company like Big Cable Co and scramble when things >>>>>> don't work? >>>>>> >>>>>> Josh Luthman >>>>>> Office: 937-552-2340 >>>>&
Re: [WISPA] Micropops
ll pockets of houses, 6-12, without putting >>>>>>>>>> up a >>>>>>>>>> full >>>>>>>>>> blown AP/BH setup. Any one else doing this? I normally use >>>>>>>>>> 5.8 >>>>>>>>>> for >>>> BH >>>>>>>>>> typically and 2.4 for clients, I was thinking of maybe >>>>>>>>>> using a >>>>>>>>>> PS2 >>>> to >>>>>>>>>> receive/BH and connect it to an NS2 with small omni to >>>> redistribute. >>>>>>>>>> Both would be in a bridge and allow the clients connected to >>>> connect >>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>> the main AP for PPPoE authentication. Is this a reasonable or >>>>>>> ridiculous >>>>>>>>>> solution? Any other solutions others are using that might be >>>> better? >>>>> I >>>>>>>>>> know I could use MT but that would add complexity to the >>>>>>>>>> mix I >>>> don't >>>>>>>>>> need. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Mark >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>> >>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>> >>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>>> >>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>>> >>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Josh Cheney >>>>> josh.che...@gmail.com >>>>> http://www.joshcheney.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>> >>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>> >>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > -- > Josh Luthman > Office: 937-552-2340 > Direct: 937-552-2343 > 1100 Wayne St > Suite 1337 > Troy, OH 45373 > > "When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however > improbable, must be the truth." > --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] leaky coax
Rather unlikely since the iPhone operates at 850, 900, 1800, 1900, and 2100 MHz for the cell network (it also supports bluetooth and 802.11 b/ g of course). Chuck On Sep 26, 2009, at 12:14 PM, Josh Luthman wrote: > Is this for the purpose of interfering with the iPhones? > > On 9/26/09, Jerry Richardson wrote: >> We used LC quite a bit about 10 years ago in apartments and hotels. >> Worked >> pretty well. >> >> Cisco BR342 --> YDI amp --> 200' >> >> No reason you could not use a splitter and put 2.4 and 5.8 on the >> same run. >> >> -Original Message- >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- >> boun...@wispa.org] On >> Behalf Of Rogelio >> Sent: Saturday, September 26, 2009 7:54 AM >> To: WISPA General List >> Subject: [WISPA] leaky coax >> >> I've got an area of a college football stadium (100K+ people) that >> has a >> student section with an expected 50% iPhone usage rate, so I'm >> considering a leaky coax solution. >> >> Does anyone have any experience (good or bad) with such a solution? >> Also, say I want the leaky coax to work on both 2.4 and 5.8, is >> there a >> special multiplexer thing I gotta put it? >> >> (I'm new at this and am still researching it) >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > -- > Josh Luthman > Office: 937-552-2340 > Direct: 937-552-2343 > 1100 Wayne St > Suite 1337 > Troy, OH 45373 > > "When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however > improbable, must be the truth." > --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Link Planning Software
Ah, my apologies! I guess I should have checked that then . Chuck On Sep 24, 2009, at 11:31 AM, Jerry Richardson wrote: > Actually, that was me. > > Jerry > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > On Behalf Of Chuck Bartosch > Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 8:14 AM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Link Planning Software > > Marlon used Brian Webster. > > Chuck > > On Sep 23, 2009, at 10:29 PM, Scott Reed wrote: > >> Not to be repetitive, but you are describing RadioMobile >> John the RM Yahoo group and see if you can't get it to do just what >> you >> are looking for. >> Seems to me Marlon Schaffer found someone to help him learn it a few >> months ago. I don't remember who. >> I can help some if you want to ask questions off-list. >> >> Robert West wrote: >>> I was holding this chunk of Organite and praying for such a thing >>> and now >>> here it is. >>> >>> Spooky. >>> >>> Get ready for the list, Shaddi. >>> >>> For one, this browser based software should not depend on the >>> internet, yes? >>> The term browser speaks internet to me. If I'm out in the field >>> trying to >>> figure out a link I obviously don't have internet there. Not that >>> I see >>> myself out in the middle of a corn field with my laptop trying to >>> figure it >>> out but hey, who knows. >>> >>> The basics of course is terrain and elevation but I'd like to see >>> how a link >>> over water is taken into account rolled into the thing. >>> >>> I also have to guess at trees. If I'm only able to get 70 feet or >>> so up and >>> the trees around here are also around 70 feet, it might say yes but >>> the >>> trees would say no. Could it possibly have a variable where you >>> could set >>> an average height for stands of trees? Where I am at, Southern >>> Ohio, all >>> the patches of trees are pretty much a single average height. If >>> the >>> software could distinguish a large green patch as trees and you >>> tell the >>> software that the average height is whatever, it could possibly add >>> that >>> height to the land elevation. Would be good to have a database of >>> various >>> antennas and radios to pull from as well. >>> >>> Hey! IDEA! A new game, Wireless Internet Tycoon!!! What do ya >>> think? >>> I've kinda ran off the rails here, sorry. >>> >>> >>> You want a wish list? Grab some paper, pal. >>> >>> >>> >>> -Original Message- >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- >>> boun...@wispa.org] On >>> Behalf Of Shaddi Hasan >>> Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 5:37 PM >>> To: WISPA General List >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Link Planning Software >>> >>> Howdy WISPA! >>> >>> Just joined today but wanted to chime in -- some students here at >>> UNC Chapel >>> Hill are working on a browser-based link planning tool as a semester >>> project. It will be released as open-source at the end of the >>> semester, so >>> we'd like it to be useful not only for our projects but for the >>> community at >>> large. While primarily geared towards community wireless projects, >>> it'd be >>> great if it could be useful for the professional WISP community. >>> So, if you >>> have any feedback on what features you'd like to see in such a >>> tool, lessons >>> you all have learned that should be incorporated into its design, >>> or the >>> concept generally, please contact me. >>> >>> To the OP, check back in December and we might have something to >>> offer you! >>> >>> Shaddi >>> >>> On Wed, Sep 23, 2009 at 5:23 PM, Robert West >>> wrote: >>> >>> >>>> What are you folks using to verify the viability of a link before >>>> you plan >>>> the build? I've tried using Radio Mobile but I'll be darned if I >>>> can't >>>> >>> get >>> >>>> that thing to work even with the step by step instructions. I've >>>&g
Re: [WISPA] Link Planning Software
gt;> >> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.112/2390 - Release Date: >> 09/23/09 05:52:00 >> >> > > -- > Scott Reed > Sr. Systems Engineer > GAB Midwest > 1-800-363-1544 x4000 > Cell: 260-273-7239 > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Link Planning Software
Why not contract with Brian Webster for a couple of hours. He's a true expert with the software and it won't take much for him to help you through the rough patches...and probably show you tricks you'd never figure out on your own. His contact info is: Brian Webster (607) 286-3465 work (607) 435-3988 cell bwebs...@wirelessmapping.com Chuck On Sep 23, 2009, at 6:18 PM, Robert West wrote: > You know, I haven't a clue! It looks simple, heck yes! Everyone > says it's > easy but I'll be darned if I can't get anything out of it. Now you > also > have to understand, when I try to work with it I have 3 kids, a cat > and the > wife all wanting something. Time was not well spent when I've tried > it. > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > On > Behalf Of David E. Smith > Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2009 5:45 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Link Planning Software > > Robert West wrote: >> What are you folks using to verify the viability of a link before >> you plan >> the build? I've tried using Radio Mobile but I'll be darned if I >> can't > get >> that thing to work even with the step by step instructions. I've >> been >> finding myself just plotting elevations all the way along the link in > Google >> Earth. > > Where are you getting hung up? Radio Mobile is probably the best free > tool you're gonna get, and once set up, works pretty well. (The > trickiest part probably is getting the terrain data you need, but you > only have to do that once.) > > David Smith > MVN.net > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > ---- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] The Net Neutrality speech we've all been waiting for
If you're rate limiting in a neutral way, why would it bring your network to its knees? Doesn't matter who the packets are coming from or going to if you rate limit the total number of packets a user can generate/receive, right? Chuck On Sep 21, 2009, at 12:33 PM, David E. Smith wrote: > http://openinternet.gov/read-speech.html > > In addition to the four classic "Network neutrality" principles, the > FCC > plans to pursue two more. Quotes from the speech: > > * "The fifth principle is one of non-discrimination -- stating that > broadband providers cannot discriminate against particular Internet > content or applications." > * "The sixth principle is a transparency principle -- stating that > providers of broadband Internet access must be transparent about their > network management practices." > > I love the sixth one, but number five gives me the willies. "Nope, > doesn't matter that BitTorrent users bring your network to its knees, > you're not allowed to do anything about it." Please tell me I'm > missing > something. > > David Smith > MVN.net > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Searchable Map of Stimulus projects
I absolutely agree. The open access stuff really only has meaning for us on fiber where total capacity is functionally unlimited in a new build out. Chuck On Sep 19, 2009, at 5:58 PM, Tom DeReggi wrote: > The issue is that access to bandwidth can only be sold if it is still > available and not already sold to someon else. > > Open Access is very relevent for fiber networks, but for wireless > middle > mile grants, it will be very easy to simply say the capacity has > been sold > already. > > Example: > Grant winner builds out 300mbps licensed link. Grant winner agrees > to open > access. Grant winner sells 300mbps of capacity to Wholesale partner. > Grant winner no longer has to sell bandwidth to anyone else, its > already all > been sold. Wholesale partner reserves it all, and sells it to subs as > ordered over time. The grant winner itself is subject to the sharing > rules, > but the wholesale partner that capacity was sold to, will not > necessarilly > be subject to sharing. I see so many possibilities for games, to > control > who does and doesn't get access to the bandwidth. > > In our unsubmitted application, we legitimately wanted multiple > wholesale > partners, and pre-defined who we'd sell it to, and pre-allocated > capacity > for that. > I'm not so sure other grant applicants equally embrace the wholesale > open > access principles. In my mind, I think history should be the ruling > factor. > If someone preveiously whoesaled, they are likely to continue > wanting to > wholesale. If they didn;t before, they probably wont want to > afterwords, and > will likely play games. Just my opinion. > > Tom DeReggi > RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc > IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband > > > - Original Message - > From: "Charles Wu" > +20+28fydibohf23spdlt+29_cn=recipients_cn=char...@converge-tech.com> > To: "WISPA General List" > Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 2:33 AM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Searchable Map of Stimulus projects > > >>> In our case, our competitor applied for a shade under a million >>> bucks to >>> provide middle mile into the area, as in to bring cheaper >>> broadband to the >>> masses. That doesn't sound like it will benefit us, the cheaper >>> broadband >>> is for their system. >> >> If it's a middle mile application, they would be in violation of >> their >> funding contract if they bandwidth wasn't available to you for the >> same >> price that they're buying it for -- IMO, you would win either way >> >> 1. You get access to cheap bandwidth for the same price as them >> 2. They deny you access, you report them to the government, they get >> audited, shut down, thrown in jail, you have one less competitor, >> and you >> get to buy their system for pennies on the dollar =) >> >> -Charles >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- >> boun...@wispa.org] On >> Behalf Of Chuck Bartosch >> Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 6:28 PM >> To: sarn...@info-ed.com; WISPA General List >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Searchable Map of Stimulus projects >> >> Though it is a requirement (as Tim set out), the requirement doesn't >> really have a lot of teeth in my view. If a competitor doesn't want >> you on, they can design it so it's hard to get on. >> >> For example, a fiber carrier has to have an attachment point built in >> for you to attach at a given location. If there isn't one nearby, >> well >> tough. >> >> If there is an attachment point but you can't come to terms, it goes >> to arbitration. However, they aren't obligated to give you wholesale >> access...just "attachment", whatever the heck that means. There just >> seems to me to be 100 ways to Sunday for a large carrier to play >> their >> usual games with this stuff and block the intent. >> >> So basically, based on the wording of the rule, it's hard to see how >> they are going to achieve the intent behind the goal unless the >> provider is willing to and interested in doing so. >> >> Chuck >> >> >> On Sep 15, 2009, at 10:39 PM, Scottie Arnett wrote: >> >>> Does the process explicitly say that an awarded company has to open >>> their network to competition? Or is this sort of a vague rule? >>> >>> Scottie >>> >>> -- Original Message -- &
Re: [WISPA] Searchable Map of Stimulus projects
It depends on what you're buying from them, but the basic answer is "no they do not have to sell at their cost". If you're buying transit, you strike your own deal with the bandwidth supplier. In that sense you're just paying "cost" on the bandwidth. But, they have to determine the transit terms for the application. That will include a profit number for them. But, they have to live with the proposal they make. They can also sell bandwidth, at a predesigned schedule. They make a profit there too, but they have to live with their proposed schedule. That or I missed something big in the NOFA. Chuck Sent from my iPhone On Sep 19, 2009, at 10:08 AM, "Robert West" wrote: > Okay, so for the grant they MUST provide the bandwidth for the same > price > they are paying for it??? But are they then able to throw a bunch > of BS > fees on top of it? If they have to provide at the same price, then > it's not > bad but I suspect it will be more cumbersome. > > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > On > Behalf Of Charles Wu > Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 2:33 AM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Searchable Map of Stimulus projects > >> In our case, our competitor applied for a shade under a million >> bucks to >> provide middle mile into the area, as in to bring cheaper broadband >> to the >> masses. That doesn't sound like it will benefit us, the cheaper >> broadband >> is for their system. > > If it's a middle mile application, they would be in violation of their > funding contract if they bandwidth wasn't available to you for the > same > price that they're buying it for -- IMO, you would win either way > > 1. You get access to cheap bandwidth for the same price as them > 2. They deny you access, you report them to the government, they get > audited, shut down, thrown in jail, you have one less competitor, > and you > get to buy their system for pennies on the dollar =) > > -Charles > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] > On > Behalf Of Chuck Bartosch > Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 6:28 PM > To: sarn...@info-ed.com; WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Searchable Map of Stimulus projects > > Though it is a requirement (as Tim set out), the requirement doesn't > really have a lot of teeth in my view. If a competitor doesn't want WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
