Re: [WISPA] [Wisp] Baicells question

[Jayson Baker]

Unless you have your own EPC. In which case you don't use the LGW. IPs are
then assigned by the EPC and you should be able to assign a Static IP and
route a subnet to it just fine.

Best Wishes,
Jayson A. Baker
Peak Internet

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 5, 2017, at 6:18 AM, Josh Luthman via WISP  wrote:

I think bridging is in beta.  Right now officially it's NAT only.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Jul 5, 2017 1:36 AM, "mike.lyon--- via WISP"  wrote:

> When deploying a Baicells eNb and Baicells CPE, is it possible to route a
> subnet to a specific CPE without it getting NAT'd at the CPE or eNb?
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> -Mike
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Re: [WISPA] PtP Dish Alignment

[Jayson Baker]

1 person on each end with a small hand-held mirror.  Flash the person on the
other tower.
When it's sunny out, you'd be surprised how far away you can see that.

On Wed, Oct 20, 2010 at 12:39 PM, Chuck Profito wrote:

>  Well in my area if its e-w about a turn, n-s  2 or 3.  But what do I
> know, Tim's doing the turning, I'm calling the signal levels to him.  I'm
> the tower bender!  :-)
>
>
>
> *From:* wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] *On
> Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Wednesday, October 20, 2010 11:05 AM
>
> *To:* WISPA General List
> *Subject:* Re: [WISPA] PtP Dish Alignment
>
>
>
> So it's 50 foot higher and 10 miles away...what angle is that?
>
> On Oct 20, 2010 1:38 PM, "Chuck Profito"  wrote:
> > Come on Josh,
> >
> > get a couple of land marks from Google Earth, that takes care of left and
> > right, and Google Earth tells you altitude at the base of each plus your
> > height, now it's just up or down from level, a few turns.
> >
> > Google is your friend!
> >
> >
> >
> > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> > Behalf Of Josh Luthman
> > Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2010 10:02 AM
> > To: WISPA General List
> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] PtP Dish Alignment
> >
> >
> >
> > I just filled a printer page with trig figuring out hoe I'm going to
> place
> > my projector. There are more uses then people think.
> >
> > On Oct 20, 2010 12:55 PM, "Mark Nash"  wrote:
> >> YES LOL ;)
> >>
> >> Only once did I know of a a practical use for trig. A friend of mine was
> > trying to make a cut pattern in sheet metal to make a cone. The cone had
> to
> > fit a certain size at the top and a certain size at the bottom.
> >>
> >> The cone was a pivotal part of his home brewing system. He is the kind
> of
> > guy who can buy this stuff pre-made but preferred to do it himself. I
> don't
> > have that kind of time on my hands, I just buy the stuff. Though he is a
> bit
> > prouder of HIS homebrew system than I am, and that's the difference.
> Nobody
> > else who opens my fridge knows, though.
> >> - Original Message -
> >> From: Josh Luthman
> >> To: WISPA General List
> >> Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2010 9:16 AM
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] PtP Dish Alignment
> >>
> >>
> >> Am I the only one that uses Trigonometry for vertical alignment?
> >>
> >> Josh Luthman
> >> Office: 937-552-2340
> >> Direct: 937-552-2343
> >> 1100 Wayne St
> >> Suite 1337
> >> Troy, OH 45373
> >>
> >>
> >> permail/wireless/
> >
>
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] [Mikrotik] FTTH Show

[Jayson Baker]

Wanted to go.  Registered.  Went there.  They never took the money.  So I
used it to gamble instead.  :-)

On Mon, Aug 30, 2010 at 10:39 AM, Matt Larsen - Lists
wrote:

>  Anyone here going to this show?
>
> http://www.ftthconference.com/FTTH10/public/enter.aspx
>
> Still deciding whether I should go or not.
>
> Matt Larsen
> vistabeam.com
>
> ___
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> http://www.butchevans.com/mailman/listinfo/mikrotik
>
> Visit http://blog.butchevans.com/ for tutorials related to Mikrotik
> RouterOS
>



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Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti RMA Process

[Jayson Baker]

Yeah, they rock.  Although, the last two times we RMA'ed Loco2's they sent
us Nano2's.
We told them.  They said "you sent us Nano2s"  I said no, we didn't.  They
said "there's nothing more we can do"

Ok.  Fine.  I'll keep the more expensive product.  Thanks!

On Fri, Sep 17, 2010 at 3:37 PM, Robert West wrote:

> I think they figured out that the cost of a bad and argumentative RMA
> process is greater than a smooth one.
>
> I have enough frustration and the UBNT RMA process is good for my mood.
>
> Bob-
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Michael Baird
> Sent: Friday, September 17, 2010 1:06 PM
> To: wireless@wispa.org
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti RMA Process
>
> Ubiquiti used to be hit and miss with RMA's, they have improved the
> process over time.
>
> Regards
> Michael Baird
> > I have been throughly impressed with the RMA process at Ubiquiti.  I had
> > some blown up Bullets and they processed the RMA very quickly and had
> > new units back to me within a few weeks.  After dealing with the
> > extremely long RMA process that Tranzeo has, it's refreshing to see a
> > company like Ubiquiti stand behind there product.  It's definitely one
> > more reason to use their equipment.
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Things i say to customers..... And they actually believethem............

[Jayson Baker]

Shame on you for picking on the old lady!

On Sun, Sep 19, 2010 at 7:55 PM,  wrote:

> Like
> Sent from my BlackBerry®
>
> -Original Message-
> From: "Robert West" 
> Sender: wireless-boun...@wispa.org
> Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2010 21:52:08
> To: WISPA General List
> Reply-To: WISPA General List 
> Subject: [WISPA] Things i say to customers. And they actually believe
>them
>
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] UBNT Grounding

[Jayson Baker]

I've never seen shielded cable with no drain wire.  But I suppose it could
exist.
Get better cable, with a drain wire.

On Sat, Aug 14, 2010 at 4:11 PM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> What if there is no drain wire?
>
> On Aug 14, 2010 6:09 PM, "Jayson Baker"  wrote:
>
> Shielded cable that is not attached properly to the RJ45 will do nothing
> but pick up MORE static.
> We solder the drain wire onto the edge of the RJ45 connector after we crimp
> it on the wire.
>
>
>
> On Sat, Aug 14, 2010 at 7:49 AM, can...@believewireless.net <
> p...@believewireless.net> wrote:
> >
> > ...
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] UBNT Grounding

[Jayson Baker]

Shielded cable that is not attached properly to the RJ45 will do nothing but
pick up MORE static.
We solder the drain wire onto the edge of the RJ45 connector after we crimp
it on the wire.

On Sat, Aug 14, 2010 at 7:49 AM, can...@believewireless.net <
p...@believewireless.net> wrote:

> We've had the same problem even using shielded cable.  We've found
> that we need to wrap the drain wire around the ground lug of both
> wires to fix the problem.
>
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] Wierd StarOS/OLSR - Ubiquity RocketM5 bridge - Cisco issue

[Jayson Baker]

I can't comment on the OP, but I can tell you that we are.  OSPF talks, but
never goes Full and exchanges routes.
Latest FW on both ends.  Like I said, same exact config as the other links
which work perfect.

On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 7:20 AM, Faisal Imtiaz  wrote:

> Make sure you are running the most recent version of 5.2 firmware.also
> you need to be running then in AP-WDS and CPE-WDS mode.
>
> Faisal
>
> On Jun 24, 2010, at 9:08 AM, Jayson Baker  wrote:
>
> > I didn't quite follow all of that, it must be too early.
> > But I can tell you we have 4 of the PtP UBNT links using their M-series.
>  3
> > of those OSPF fine.  The other won't OSPF for the life of me.  All same
> > config and firmware on all units.
> >
> > On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 4:38 AM, Scott Lambert  >wrote:
> >
> >> We have been putting up some Ubiquity RocketM5 point-to-point bridge
> >> links, running airos 5.2, lately to replace some overloaded StarOS
> >> backhauls.  Where these links have gone in, we static route the traffic
> >> across them.  They happen to be on the OSPF/OLSR divider boundry.  I
> >> would like to find a good way to redistribute between the routing
> >> protocols, but that's for another day.  When I get time, I'll probably
> >> just convert the 20 odd OLSR towers to OSPF.
> >>
> >> These are our first experience with Ubiquity.  The first two were no
> >> muss, no fuss.  The third link went up nicely.  It's configured the same
> >> as the other two links.  About an hour after we plugged the local end
> >> at our office into the main switch, rather than a laptop, we started
> >> loosing routes to sites which pass through the tower at the far end of
> >> the link.
> >>
> >> All hosts on the tower LAN can see each other.  We can reach all of
> >> them from anywhere else on our network.  It is just routes for hosts
> >> connected wirelessly to that tower which are no longer known to the
> >> staros box which has the existing backhaul to our office.
> >>
> >> We rebooted everything at the remote tower.  The links came up.  The
> >> routes were good.  Approximately an hour later, the same routes fell
> >> out.  So, we decided it must be due to some sort of wierd multicast OLSR
> >> issue when these towers were suddenly able to see each other across
> >> the bridges.  I unplugged the ethernet at the office and waited until
> >> tonight to try again.  The routes straightened themselves out as soon as
> >> I unplugged the office end.  Wild.
> >>
> >> This afternoon, I setup a seperate VLAN on the switch for this link.
> >> Before I left the office I plugged it in about, 8:00pm.  I didn't have
> >> any other devices configured on that VLAN.
> >>
> >> There were no problems for several hours until I configured the new VLAN
> >> on the Cisco that was sometime between 1:01 and 1:10am.  The RANCID
> >> run at 1:01 didn't see any changes but the run at 2:01 found them.  At
> >> 1:10am Nagios noticed that it couldn't reach the equipment through those
> >> same routes.
> >>
> >> + interface GigabitEthernet0/3.13
> >> +  description "Wireless VPN 3
> >> +  encapsulation dot1Q 13
> >> +  ip address 10.127.3.1 255.255.255.0
> >> +  no cdp enable
> >> + !
> >>
> >> That's the subnet for the RocketM5s.  The StarOS gear on the tower uses
> >> a public /29 subnet.
> >>
> >> I tried various things with reboots and restarts of OLSR on the staros
> >> gear at the tower.  The routes came back for four or five minutes then
> >> went away again.  No good.
> >>
> >> So, at about 2:10am, I logged into the RocketM5 at the tower and
> >> disabled it's ethernet interface.  Within a few seconds, my pings to
> >> equipment through the lost routes began succeeding.
> >>
> >> It's now 3:25, and all's well.  I am puzzled.  We really need the
> >> additional bandwidth the ubiquity link can give us on this link.
> >>
> >> At 3:26 I enabled the LAN at the tower just to make sure.  Within 2
> >> minutes, splat.  This time I left the LAN enabled at the tower and
> >> disabled the WLAN interface at the office.  All better in seconds.
> >>
> >> Administratively shutting down interface gig0/3.13 at the office seems
> >> to be enough to heal OLSR at the tower.  If the tower LAN can see the
> >> cisco, we drop routes.  But the other ubiqui

Re: [WISPA] Wierd StarOS/OLSR - Ubiquity RocketM5 bridge - Cisco issue

[Jayson Baker]

I didn't quite follow all of that, it must be too early.
But I can tell you we have 4 of the PtP UBNT links using their M-series.  3
of those OSPF fine.  The other won't OSPF for the life of me.  All same
config and firmware on all units.

On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 4:38 AM, Scott Lambert wrote:

> We have been putting up some Ubiquity RocketM5 point-to-point bridge
> links, running airos 5.2, lately to replace some overloaded StarOS
> backhauls.  Where these links have gone in, we static route the traffic
> across them.  They happen to be on the OSPF/OLSR divider boundry.  I
> would like to find a good way to redistribute between the routing
> protocols, but that's for another day.  When I get time, I'll probably
> just convert the 20 odd OLSR towers to OSPF.
>
> These are our first experience with Ubiquity.  The first two were no
> muss, no fuss.  The third link went up nicely.  It's configured the same
> as the other two links.  About an hour after we plugged the local end
> at our office into the main switch, rather than a laptop, we started
> loosing routes to sites which pass through the tower at the far end of
> the link.
>
> All hosts on the tower LAN can see each other.  We can reach all of
> them from anywhere else on our network.  It is just routes for hosts
> connected wirelessly to that tower which are no longer known to the
> staros box which has the existing backhaul to our office.
>
> We rebooted everything at the remote tower.  The links came up.  The
> routes were good.  Approximately an hour later, the same routes fell
> out.  So, we decided it must be due to some sort of wierd multicast OLSR
> issue when these towers were suddenly able to see each other across
> the bridges.  I unplugged the ethernet at the office and waited until
> tonight to try again.  The routes straightened themselves out as soon as
> I unplugged the office end.  Wild.
>
> This afternoon, I setup a seperate VLAN on the switch for this link.
> Before I left the office I plugged it in about, 8:00pm.  I didn't have
> any other devices configured on that VLAN.
>
> There were no problems for several hours until I configured the new VLAN
> on the Cisco that was sometime between 1:01 and 1:10am.  The RANCID
> run at 1:01 didn't see any changes but the run at 2:01 found them.  At
> 1:10am Nagios noticed that it couldn't reach the equipment through those
> same routes.
>
> + interface GigabitEthernet0/3.13
> +  description "Wireless VPN 3
> +  encapsulation dot1Q 13
> +  ip address 10.127.3.1 255.255.255.0
> +  no cdp enable
> + !
>
> That's the subnet for the RocketM5s.  The StarOS gear on the tower uses
> a public /29 subnet.
>
> I tried various things with reboots and restarts of OLSR on the staros
> gear at the tower.  The routes came back for four or five minutes then
> went away again.  No good.
>
> So, at about 2:10am, I logged into the RocketM5 at the tower and
> disabled it's ethernet interface.  Within a few seconds, my pings to
> equipment through the lost routes began succeeding.
>
> It's now 3:25, and all's well.  I am puzzled.  We really need the
> additional bandwidth the ubiquity link can give us on this link.
>
> At 3:26 I enabled the LAN at the tower just to make sure.  Within 2
> minutes, splat.  This time I left the LAN enabled at the tower and
> disabled the WLAN interface at the office.  All better in seconds.
>
> Administratively shutting down interface gig0/3.13 at the office seems
> to be enough to heal OLSR at the tower.  If the tower LAN can see the
> cisco, we drop routes.  But the other ubiquity links connect back to the
> same cisco at the office.
>
> I think we will probably replace the switch at the tower tomorrow to see
> if it has problems we haven't tickled before.  I'm stumped.  Does anyone
> else have any ideas?
>
>
> --
> Scott LambertKC5MLE   Unix SysAdmin
> lamb...@lambertfam.org
>
>
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti - Success Feels Good

[Jayson Baker]

Both chains are both two-way streets
2x2 MIMO

On Fri, Jun 18, 2010 at 6:41 AM, Greg Ihnen  wrote:

> My question (still in topic I think) is will the one chain that's still
> viable become a duplex channel and still keep passing traffic? Or are the
> chains just a one way street?
>
> Greg
>
> On Jun 18, 2010, at 8:06 AM, Jayson Baker wrote:
>
> > What will any radio do when it's channel gets jammed with noise.
> >
> > On Sat, Jun 12, 2010 at 11:08 AM, Travis Johnson  wrote:
> >
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> I would still like to know what it's going to do when an entire
> >> polarization gets jammed with noise? Will the radio still pass traffic?
> >> Or will there be so many errors that it will overtake the link and
> >> nothing will work?
> >>
> >> Travis
> >> Microserv
> >>
> >> Tom DeReggi wrote:
> >>> I jsut wanted to mention, that it really does give peice of mind
> knowing
> >>> that there is a MIMO technology out there that I can count on, that is
> >>> inexpensive.
> >>> I just finished my 4th Ubiquiti PTP link (over last two weeks).  Once
> >> again,
> >>> Painless and perfect.
> >>> I got 38mb one way 22mb the other with 10Mhz Channel MCS 15.  And with
> >> 20Mhz
> >>> channel up to 69mbps one way, and 80 the other.
> >>> Link Quality nad Capacity showed like 96%.  LAtency was also down under
> >> 2ms.
> >>> But my point here is not the speed. It was that it was easy. I just put
> >> it
> >>> up, and it worked. Air view was helpful, finding channel. All 4
> installs
> >>> worked that way. No hassle, no fuss.
> >>> This last one was a 15 mile link, Rocket5M on each side, with
> PACWireless
> >>> 2ft dish on one end and a 23 db panel on the other.
> >>> Nothing has ever been this easy.
> >>>
> >>> With that said There were some confusing things. I ran V on Chain0,
> >> and
> >>> H on Chain1 got -66, then for grins swapped conectors on CPE side only,
> >> so
> >>> Chain0 was H and Chain1 was V and got -65.
> >>> I do not understand why this happened. I would have thought signal
> should
> >>> have dropped by -20 db or so? Wierd. This did not just happen when in
> >>> Alignment mode. I may have been in MCS7 mode at the time though.
> >>> So it appears it must be transmitting on both pols in MCS7 mode, I dont
> >> have
> >>> any other way to explain it. But none the less, it just worked.
> >>>
> >>> I'm concern about using it at PtMP, because we use Station WDS, and AP
> >> only
> >>> supports up to 6 WDS clients. So it wont scale for PTMP Briding
> clients.
> >>> Unless that can be curred. But I tell you for PTP, or a couple
> >> associations,
> >>> its pretty sweet.
> >>>
> >>> (I still like T-Link-45s better when I only need 25-30mbps, but  the
> UBNT
> >>> has shown to be a wonderful experience, also.)
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Tom DeReggi
> >>> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
> >>> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> 
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> >>>
> >>
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Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti - Success Feels Good

[Jayson Baker]

What will any radio do when it's channel gets jammed with noise.

On Sat, Jun 12, 2010 at 11:08 AM, Travis Johnson  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I would still like to know what it's going to do when an entire
> polarization gets jammed with noise? Will the radio still pass traffic?
> Or will there be so many errors that it will overtake the link and
> nothing will work?
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Tom DeReggi wrote:
> > I jsut wanted to mention, that it really does give peice of mind knowing
> > that there is a MIMO technology out there that I can count on, that is
> > inexpensive.
> > I just finished my 4th Ubiquiti PTP link (over last two weeks).  Once
> again,
> > Painless and perfect.
> > I got 38mb one way 22mb the other with 10Mhz Channel MCS 15.  And with
> 20Mhz
> > channel up to 69mbps one way, and 80 the other.
> > Link Quality nad Capacity showed like 96%.  LAtency was also down under
> 2ms.
> > But my point here is not the speed. It was that it was easy. I just put
> it
> > up, and it worked. Air view was helpful, finding channel. All 4 installs
> > worked that way. No hassle, no fuss.
> > This last one was a 15 mile link, Rocket5M on each side, with PACWireless
> > 2ft dish on one end and a 23 db panel on the other.
> > Nothing has ever been this easy.
> >
> > With that said There were some confusing things. I ran V on Chain0,
> and
> > H on Chain1 got -66, then for grins swapped conectors on CPE side only,
> so
> > Chain0 was H and Chain1 was V and got -65.
> > I do not understand why this happened. I would have thought signal should
> > have dropped by -20 db or so? Wierd. This did not just happen when in
> > Alignment mode. I may have been in MCS7 mode at the time though.
> > So it appears it must be transmitting on both pols in MCS7 mode, I dont
> have
> > any other way to explain it. But none the less, it just worked.
> >
> > I'm concern about using it at PtMP, because we use Station WDS, and AP
> only
> > supports up to 6 WDS clients. So it wont scale for PTMP Briding clients.
> > Unless that can be curred. But I tell you for PTP, or a couple
> associations,
> > its pretty sweet.
> >
> > (I still like T-Link-45s better when I only need 25-30mbps, but  the UBNT
> > has shown to be a wonderful experience, also.)
> >
> >
> > Tom DeReggi
> > RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
> > IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Documentation Methods

[Jayson Baker]

We do this as well.  Have for quite some time.

No contract--that's all electronically done and accepted by our activation
system once the system is online.

But when we arrive we discuss with customer how it's going to work, where
it's going to be mounted, etc.
They sign a one-page "authorization to install" which outlines costs, and
limits our liability.

Installer takes pictures of antenna, looking towards tower, cable run, and
inside penetration.
That is attached to customer account for future reference.

On Thu, Apr 22, 2010 at 9:18 PM, Robert West wrote:

> OH!  Something I recently started doing, a signed "OK" for any hole drilled
> BEFORE it's drilled.
>
> A suggestion from my insurance boy.,  Sounded like a good idea.
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Chuck Bartosch" 
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2010 11:12 PM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Documentation Methods
>
>
> > You should add (in my opinion):
> >
> > (1) photo of installation location BEFORE you do the install, not just a
> > post install photo.
> >
> > (2) a sign-off from the customer saying your installation was acceptable.
> > That goes a LONG ways when the wife gets home and complains. You got the
> > husband's sign-off (or vice versa).
> >
> > Chuck
> >
> > On Apr 22, 2010, at 11:05 PM, Steven G McGehee wrote:
> >
> >> Thought of another question I wanted to pose to you gents regarding
> >> documentation on installations, primarily customer installations (as
> >> opposed to PoP/tower installations). I was curious what methods you
> >> employed during and/or after the install to best 'capture' the details
> >> of the installation.
> >>
> >> For example, some of the things we do are take notes of any specific
> >> 'gotchas' on site like needing to park in a certain area, what type of
> >> ladder or roof access there is, if you have to sign in or be escorted by
> >> a rep. of the business - etc. We also take photos of the installation
> >> when we're finished and write up notes afterwards on their account
> >> detailing the length and path of the cable that goes from the unit into
> >> the structure, what other PoPs we could see at the time, what
> >> signal/speeds we were getting, etc.
> >>
> >> If any of you would share your methods on what you do, I'd appreciate
> >> it. I think we're doing enough, but I'm always open to other suggestions
> >> and interested in seeing what others in the business are doing.
> >>
> >> Thanks.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
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> >>
> 
> >>
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> >>
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> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
> > --
> > Chuck Bartosch
> > Clarity Connect, Inc.
> > 200 Pleasant Grove Road
> > Ithaca, NY 14850
> > (607) 257-8268
> >
> > "When the stars threw down their spears,
> > and water'd heaven with their tears,
> > Did He smile, His work to see?
> > Did He who made the Lamb make thee?"
> >
> >>From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
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Re: [WISPA] what to use with Mikrotik as AP

[Jayson Baker]

PPPoE

On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 3:44 PM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> I really prefer MT APs to Ubnt APs.
>
> On 4/19/10, Mark Dueck  wrote:
> > That brings me to another question.  So far I've just been putting
> > manaul IP, no DHCP.  I've been looking at putting up a radius server,
> > but don't quite see how I can setup the clients.  How is this done?  the
> > Tranzeo clients have no radius client configuration.  Or is there not a
> > need to configure each client?
> >
> > What's better, or is there a difference between radius or radius with
> > PPPoE?  -- I think I read that it's possible to setup the latter.
> > Tranzeo supports PPPoE on the clients.
> >
> >
> > On 04/19/2010 02:50 PM, Forbes Mercy wrote:
> >> I have lots of MT AP's, in fact most of them are, I do use a couple of
> >> UBNT AP (and I'm talking about 2.4, almost all of my 5GHZ AP's are
> >> UBNT).  The thing I hate is the ACL list which I can't put in the
> >> customer name and IP so I can easily diagnosis it. I guess it's forcing
> >> me to put up a radius server and control them all from the billing
> >> system.  Lots of work but we need easy access to see who's causing what
> >> in the towers, MT provides for that Ubiquiti doesn't.
> >>
> >> On 4/19/2010 1:28 PM, Jayson Baker wrote:
> >>
> >>> If you have to use MT as the AP, yes go with the UBNT cards.
> >>> MT cards are "ok" for CPE stuff.  Certainly not tower stuff.
> >>>
> >>> But I was moreso saying don't use MT as the AP.
> >>> Use the UBNT Rockets or Nano's as APs.
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 2:04 PM, Mark Dueck  wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> On 04/19/2010 01:41 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> On the subject of strictly MT backhauls what kind of throughput are
> you
> >>>>> looking for?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>> My throughput requirements are minimal at this point.  I'm in Belize,
> >>>> and clients here generally get 128 to 512kbps connections. If I get a
> >>>> 36Mbit backhaul link, I'm good for a while.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> I always use this enclosure
> >>>>> http://quicklinkwireless.com/Itemdesc.asp?ic=DCE-H-LG-2&eq=&Tp=
> >>>>>
> >>>>> For a backhaul with 1 card a 411ah is fine.  433ah for two cards.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Ubnt for xr2/xr5 cards.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>> So you'd rather go with ubnt cards than Mikrotik?
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> I've used Arc antenna/enclosure for 5ghz small backhauls and they
> work
> >>>>> as
> >>>>> expected.  I've used Pac dishes for extra punch.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Josh Luthman
> >>>>> Office: 937-552-2340
> >>>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
> >>>>> 1100 Wayne St
> >>>>> Suite 1337
> >>>>> Troy, OH 45373
> >>>>>
> >>>>> “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>> continue
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> that counts.”
> >>>>> --- Winston Churchill
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 2:35 PM, Dennis Burgess<
> dmburg...@linktechs.net
> >>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> your MT vendor or hardware vendor can help you with this.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ---
> >>>>>> Dennis Burgess, CCNA, Mikrotik Certified Trainer, MTCNA, MTCRE,
> MTCWE,
> >>>>>> MTCTCE, MTCUME
> >>>>>> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik&  WISP Support Services
> >>>>>> Office: 314-735-0270 Website: http://www.linktechs.net
> >>>>>> LIVE On-Line Mikrotik Training - 

Re: [WISPA] what to use with Mikrotik as AP

[Jayson Baker]

If you have to use MT as the AP, yes go with the UBNT cards.
MT cards are "ok" for CPE stuff.  Certainly not tower stuff.

But I was moreso saying don't use MT as the AP.
Use the UBNT Rockets or Nano's as APs.

On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 2:04 PM, Mark Dueck  wrote:

> On 04/19/2010 01:41 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
> > On the subject of strictly MT backhauls what kind of throughput are you
> > looking for?
> >
> My throughput requirements are minimal at this point.  I'm in Belize,
> and clients here generally get 128 to 512kbps connections. If I get a
> 36Mbit backhaul link, I'm good for a while.
> > I always use this enclosure
> > http://quicklinkwireless.com/Itemdesc.asp?ic=DCE-H-LG-2&eq=&Tp=
> >
> > For a backhaul with 1 card a 411ah is fine.  433ah for two cards.
> >
> > Ubnt for xr2/xr5 cards.
> >
> So you'd rather go with ubnt cards than Mikrotik?
> > I've used Arc antenna/enclosure for 5ghz small backhauls and they work as
> > expected.  I've used Pac dishes for extra punch.
> >
> > Josh Luthman
> > Office: 937-552-2340
> > Direct: 937-552-2343
> > 1100 Wayne St
> > Suite 1337
> > Troy, OH 45373
> >
> > “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to
> continue
> > that counts.”
> > --- Winston Churchill
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 2:35 PM, Dennis Burgess  >wrote:
> >
> >
> >> your MT vendor or hardware vendor can help you with this.
> >>
> >> ---
> >> Dennis Burgess, CCNA, Mikrotik Certified Trainer, MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE,
> >> MTCTCE, MTCUME
> >> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
> >> Office: 314-735-0270 Website: http://www.linktechs.net
> >> LIVE On-Line Mikrotik Training - Author of "Learn RouterOS"
> >>
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> >> Behalf Of Mark Dueck
> >> Sent: Monday, April 19, 2010 1:20 PM
> >> To: WISPA General List
> >> Subject: [WISPA] what to use with Mikrotik as AP
> >>
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> I'm running a small WISP and I've been using only Tranzeo till now.  I
> >> would like to start using something that support MIMO.  What should I
> >> consider?  Been reading a lot on this list about UBNT and Mikrotik.
> >> What boards do you use if you go with Mikrotik?  Will I get any benefit
> >> if I put some MIMO clients, but still mostly use Tranzeo clients?
> >>
> >>
> >> Also for Mikrotik backhauls, can someone give details of the boards,
> >> cards and enclosures you use for them?
> >>
> >> many thanks,
> >> Mark
> >>
> >>
> >> 
> >> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
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> >> 
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> >>
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> >>
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> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
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> >>
> >>
> >
> >
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Re: [WISPA] VoIP

[Jayson Baker]

So put 2 garage sale PC's at the tower.  :-)

On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 1:42 PM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> I'm not suggesting you need a high end machine but rather you need to make
> sure that box is working.  When it comes to someones phone calls the last
> thing I want to be the case is the garage sale PC at the tower has a
> hardware problem.
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue
> that counts.”
> --- Winston Churchill
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 2:59 PM, Jayson Baker  >wrote:
>
> > True.  But it doesn't take much.  We have a bunch of P4 2.4GHz/1GB RAM
> > machines that are "old" by todays standards, but run Asterisk just fine
> > with
> > never more than about 10% CPU load during peak hours.
> > As long as you don't transcode, you could even run it on a Linksys WRT54G
> > router with Linux flashed.
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 10:11 AM, Josh Luthman
> > wrote:
> >
> > > The software costs nothing but you have to pay for that hardware.  Then
> > > maintain it.
> > >
> > > Josh Luthman
> > > Office: 937-552-2340
> > > Direct: 937-552-2343
> > > 1100 Wayne St
> > > Suite 1337
> > > Troy, OH 45373
> > >
> > > “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to
> > continue
> > > that counts.”
> > > --- Winston Churchill
> > >
> > >
> > > On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 12:07 PM, Jayson Baker  > > >wrote:
> > >
> > > > PRI is something like $600/mo.  On one particularly busy site we have
> > > about
> > > > 200 users on it, and never seen it go above 12 active channels.
> > > >
> > > > The ATA connects to the antenna.  In our case, most are UBNT units.
> >  The
> > > > UBNT does PPPoE and NAT for the customer, but VLAN 999 is passed
> > straight
> > > > through.  The ATA picks this up and bridges the rest.  VoIP switch at
> > the
> > > > tower is on VLAN 999, so the ATA gets it's IP from the switch and
> > > connects
> > > > directly to it without any routers.
> > > >
> > > > Use something like Trix if you think Asterisk is too much work.
> >  Cost...
> > > I
> > > > don't know... we downloaded Asterisk for free, so it didn't cost us
> > > > anything.
> > > >
> > > > On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 10:03 AM, Josh Luthman
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > How much is a PRI for each tower?
> > > > >
> > > > > What is the ATA connecting to?
> > > > >
> > > > > I've tried Asterisk and there is absolutely no comparison versus my
> > > > current
> > > > > platform in simplicity.  Way too much work and cost in my
> opinion...
> > > > >
> > > > > Josh Luthman
> > > > > Office: 937-552-2340
> > > > > Direct: 937-552-2343
> > > > > 1100 Wayne St
> > > > > Suite 1337
> > > > > Troy, OH 45373
> > > > >
> > > > > “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to
> > > > continue
> > > > > that counts.”
> > > > > --- Winston Churchill
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 11:58 AM, Jayson Baker <
> > jay...@spectrasurf.com
> > > > > >wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Roll you own.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > We have PRI's at our tower sites (at least the primary sites),
> and
> > > > > > redundant
> > > > > > Asterisk switches.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The switches have a VLAN, which is common throughout the entire
> > > network
> > > > > > down
> > > > > > to the ATA/IP Phone.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > VoIP doesn't touch any router.  The ATA at customers house is on
> > the
> > > > same
> > > > > > VLAN as the switch, so no NAT issues or anything.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Because switch is at the tower, it's only the last mile of QoS we
> > > have
> > > > to
> > > > > > worry about.
> >

Re: [WISPA] what to use with Mikrotik as AP

[Jayson Baker]

MIMO/802.11N on MT sucks.  Use UBNT.

On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 12:20 PM, Mark Dueck  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I'm running a small WISP and I've been using only Tranzeo till now.  I
> would like to start using something that support MIMO.  What should I
> consider?  Been reading a lot on this list about UBNT and Mikrotik.
> What boards do you use if you go with Mikrotik?  Will I get any benefit
> if I put some MIMO clients, but still mostly use Tranzeo clients?
>
>
> Also for Mikrotik backhauls, can someone give details of the boards,
> cards and enclosures you use for them?
>
> many thanks,
> Mark
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Ubiquity VLAN Capability

[Jayson Baker]

You can telnet into the unit and run vconfig to do whatever kind of VLAN'ing
you want.  This is what we do, via an rc. script put in the /etc/persistent
directory.
Check the forum.

On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 12:42 PM, Tracy Tippett <
tracytipp...@swiftwireless.com> wrote:

>
> Has anyone had experience getting the Nano products to support multiple
> VLANs I looked at the forum but wasn't able to decipher a clear answer.
>  Does it require a third party software patch?
>
> Tracy Tippett
>
> --Original Mail--
> From: "Jeremy Parr" 
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Tue, 13 Apr 2010 14:26:15 -0400
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti AirOS Comparison
>
> On 13 April 2010 11:52, MDK  wrote:
> > Did you do a throughput comparison?
>
> It was mostly a joke, but I'll bite. A throughput comparison is not
> fair, since they both just leverage someone else's chipset. My point
> was simply that if a low end wifi based product had these features 10+
> years ago, why the hell does UBNT see fit to release something today
> that is shiny and fast, but lacking core functionality. I guess the
> market demands cheap.
>
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] Ubnt vs Moto vs ... your brand

[Jayson Baker]

We have hundreds of legacy 802.11a/g UBNT equipment deployed in Colorado and
Costa Rica.
In Colorado we offer 12Mbps/6Mbps service over 802.11g--it works great.  We
use NS2 and PS2 as AP, MT behind that to do things like QoS/routing.
Latency does spike and is not consistent.  We have seen no issues with
hidden node or problems like that.  The stuff just works and has for years.

The newer AirMax stuff is very impressive.  Only a small deployment in
Colorado so far.
Latency is awesome.  Usually 1-2ms from client to tower, even during load.
 Maxing the upload will sometimes spike latency to 30ms.

There have been some firmware issues along the way, but so long as you're
using good software, you'll be very happy.
It doesn't sync like Canopy does, true.  But we've never found that to be an
issue for us.

On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 6:29 PM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> It's not so much what you're discussing there as much as the capabilities
> of
> the ptmp products.
>
> You simply can not offer the latency guarantees using Ubiquiti/802.11 that
> Canopy provides.
>
> Now if you've got 3 people to serve I think it's financially ridiculous to
> get a Canopy system involved...
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue
> that counts.”
> --- Winston Churchill
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 8:23 PM, Glenn Kelley  wrote:
>
> > In trying to make the right buying decision - some simple answers may
> > help.
> >
> >
> >
> > 1.  What is the meantime failure rate for your ubiquity equipment
> >
> > 2.  What is the avg amount of truck rolls per week you run to fix an
> > issue vs the # of customers you have?
> > ie- if you have say 1500 clients and do 8 troubleshooting calls a week
> > then it would be 1500/8 = .0053% )
> >
> > 3.  how often does a tech call come in (w/o a truck roll) that is
> > equipment related...  For some reason I think some of the ubiquity
> > radios just need a power cycle and voila - they behave much better...
> > so - what is the average # of calls per total clients that come in
> > that are fixed w/ simple methods vs a truck roll for the ubiquity
> > users ...
> >
> >
> >
> > Moto Users - do you have this info as well:
> >
> > Reason I ask is because I am wondering - if the cost of Moto is
> > actually worth it...  as a smaller operator - this information would
> > be most beneficial for sure.
> >
> > Buying a Moto radio - even if 2 or 3 times the $$ if - the service
> > calls on the back side are much less - might be worth it.
> >
> > Perhaps the cost of Radio vs People (both in manpower as well as
> > client satisfaction for uptime) make the buying decision much
> > easier...  but having some numbers to go along with this would be great.
> >
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
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Re: [WISPA] VoIP

[Jayson Baker]

True.  But it doesn't take much.  We have a bunch of P4 2.4GHz/1GB RAM
machines that are "old" by todays standards, but run Asterisk just fine with
never more than about 10% CPU load during peak hours.
As long as you don't transcode, you could even run it on a Linksys WRT54G
router with Linux flashed.

On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 10:11 AM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> The software costs nothing but you have to pay for that hardware.  Then
> maintain it.
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue
> that counts.”
> --- Winston Churchill
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 12:07 PM, Jayson Baker  >wrote:
>
> > PRI is something like $600/mo.  On one particularly busy site we have
> about
> > 200 users on it, and never seen it go above 12 active channels.
> >
> > The ATA connects to the antenna.  In our case, most are UBNT units.  The
> > UBNT does PPPoE and NAT for the customer, but VLAN 999 is passed straight
> > through.  The ATA picks this up and bridges the rest.  VoIP switch at the
> > tower is on VLAN 999, so the ATA gets it's IP from the switch and
> connects
> > directly to it without any routers.
> >
> > Use something like Trix if you think Asterisk is too much work.  Cost...
> I
> > don't know... we downloaded Asterisk for free, so it didn't cost us
> > anything.
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 10:03 AM, Josh Luthman
> > wrote:
> >
> > > How much is a PRI for each tower?
> > >
> > > What is the ATA connecting to?
> > >
> > > I've tried Asterisk and there is absolutely no comparison versus my
> > current
> > > platform in simplicity.  Way too much work and cost in my opinion...
> > >
> > > Josh Luthman
> > > Office: 937-552-2340
> > > Direct: 937-552-2343
> > > 1100 Wayne St
> > > Suite 1337
> > > Troy, OH 45373
> > >
> > > “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to
> > continue
> > > that counts.”
> > > --- Winston Churchill
> > >
> > >
> > > On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 11:58 AM, Jayson Baker  > > >wrote:
> > >
> > > > Roll you own.
> > > >
> > > > We have PRI's at our tower sites (at least the primary sites), and
> > > > redundant
> > > > Asterisk switches.
> > > >
> > > > The switches have a VLAN, which is common throughout the entire
> network
> > > > down
> > > > to the ATA/IP Phone.
> > > >
> > > > VoIP doesn't touch any router.  The ATA at customers house is on the
> > same
> > > > VLAN as the switch, so no NAT issues or anything.
> > > >
> > > > Because switch is at the tower, it's only the last mile of QoS we
> have
> > to
> > > > worry about.
> > > >
> > > > We've done it many different ways--started out wholesaling,
> rebranding,
> > > > etc.
> > > >  So far this has been the simpliest and best-working solution yet.
> > > >
> > > > On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 9:33 AM, Kevin Sullivan
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > We'd like to start offering VoIP to our wireless customers, and
> we've
> > > > taken
> > > > > a look at a couple of packaged soultions like NetSapiens. What is
> > > > everyone
> > > > > else using? We'd like to start at a lower $$ than the $17,000 that
> > > we've
> > > > > been hearing from the packaged deals.
> > > > >
> > > > > Kevin
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> 
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> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti AirOS Comparison

[Jayson Baker]

Weird.  We use the Rocket APs and Nano5M CPE's heavily and for a TON of
VoIP.  No problems.
Occasionally we'll see PPPoE re-connect, but since we VLAN the VoIP straight
through, it's unaffected.

On Wed, Apr 14, 2010 at 6:10 AM, can...@believewireless.net <
p...@believewireless.net> wrote:

> Upgraded the AP and all CPE to Beta 5 this morning and latency still
> sucks.  Signal is a -57 on one side and -59 on the other.  Every one
> of our VoIP customers on this tower is complaining.
>
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] VoIP

[Jayson Baker]

PRI is something like $600/mo.  On one particularly busy site we have about
200 users on it, and never seen it go above 12 active channels.

The ATA connects to the antenna.  In our case, most are UBNT units.  The
UBNT does PPPoE and NAT for the customer, but VLAN 999 is passed straight
through.  The ATA picks this up and bridges the rest.  VoIP switch at the
tower is on VLAN 999, so the ATA gets it's IP from the switch and connects
directly to it without any routers.

Use something like Trix if you think Asterisk is too much work.  Cost... I
don't know... we downloaded Asterisk for free, so it didn't cost us
anything.

On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 10:03 AM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> How much is a PRI for each tower?
>
> What is the ATA connecting to?
>
> I've tried Asterisk and there is absolutely no comparison versus my current
> platform in simplicity.  Way too much work and cost in my opinion...
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue
> that counts.”
> --- Winston Churchill
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 11:58 AM, Jayson Baker  >wrote:
>
> > Roll you own.
> >
> > We have PRI's at our tower sites (at least the primary sites), and
> > redundant
> > Asterisk switches.
> >
> > The switches have a VLAN, which is common throughout the entire network
> > down
> > to the ATA/IP Phone.
> >
> > VoIP doesn't touch any router.  The ATA at customers house is on the same
> > VLAN as the switch, so no NAT issues or anything.
> >
> > Because switch is at the tower, it's only the last mile of QoS we have to
> > worry about.
> >
> > We've done it many different ways--started out wholesaling, rebranding,
> > etc.
> >  So far this has been the simpliest and best-working solution yet.
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 9:33 AM, Kevin Sullivan
> > wrote:
> >
> > > We'd like to start offering VoIP to our wireless customers, and we've
> > taken
> > > a look at a couple of packaged soultions like NetSapiens. What is
> > everyone
> > > else using? We'd like to start at a lower $$ than the $17,000 that
> we've
> > > been hearing from the packaged deals.
> > >
> > > Kevin
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> 
> > > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
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> >
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> > >
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> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
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Re: [WISPA] VoIP

[Jayson Baker]

Roll you own.

We have PRI's at our tower sites (at least the primary sites), and redundant
Asterisk switches.

The switches have a VLAN, which is common throughout the entire network down
to the ATA/IP Phone.

VoIP doesn't touch any router.  The ATA at customers house is on the same
VLAN as the switch, so no NAT issues or anything.

Because switch is at the tower, it's only the last mile of QoS we have to
worry about.

We've done it many different ways--started out wholesaling, rebranding, etc.
 So far this has been the simpliest and best-working solution yet.

On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 9:33 AM, Kevin Sullivan
wrote:

> We'd like to start offering VoIP to our wireless customers, and we've taken
> a look at a couple of packaged soultions like NetSapiens. What is everyone
> else using? We'd like to start at a lower $$ than the $17,000 that we've
> been hearing from the packaged deals.
>
> Kevin
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] monitoring product (was Re: Ubiquiti Beta 5.2.4 Released)

[Jayson Baker]

We do this now.  From NOAA weather stations.  All our backhaul links are
polled every 60 seconds for just about everything they spit out (i.e. bits
in/out, signals, errors, temperature, etc.) as well as NOAA weather info
(temp, humidity, pressure, etc.) for the nearest station.  It's all
available on a graph to us through extranet.  Works very well.

On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 8:07 AM, Matt Liotta  wrote:

> This makes me think about a cool product someone needs to produce. Some
> sort of device that could be deployed at a wireless colocation site that
> would simply listen on a variety of bands and collect weather information.
> The device would make all this data available via some reasonable API;
> possibly SNMP. Then a monitoring system to collect this data and graph it
> historically. This would allow the operator to have a much better view of
> the environment for which their network is operating in.
>
> -Matt
>
> On Apr 9, 2010, at 10:00 AM, John Scrivner wrote:
>
> > I am not a huge UBNT fan but I might be persuaded to buy one of these for
> > each tower to setup as a remote Spectrum Analyzer for each tower
> location.
> > How much do these radios run and who sells them on here?
> > Scriv
>
>
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] 3.65 GHz WiMAX deal

[Jayson Baker]

Why would you use this in rural deployment, as opposed to something like a
cheaper UBNT MIMO system, which will give you better penetration?

On Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 9:04 AM, Patrick Leary  wrote:

> Indeed MIMO does help through trees according to people I trust, but
> again we default to the "but at what cost" question. We believe this to
> be especially true in more rural deployments.
>
>
> Patrick Leary
> Aperto Networks
> 813.426.4230 mobile
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
> Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2010 7:52 AM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] 3.65 GHz WiMAX deal
>
> Subchannelization should help penetration a little also.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Mar 18, 2010, at 9:43 AM, Matt  wrote:
>
> > Do you support PPPoE in the SM?  Heard that MIMO helps tree
> > penetration.
> >
> > Matt
> >
> >
> >> Yes, but you won't pay $200 for their CPE complete and our base
> >> station costs are less or similar and we are getting much better
> >> uplink speed according to what I have seen so far from reports about
> >> the Moto 320 so far.
> >>
> >>
> >> Patrick Leary
> >> Aperto Networks
> >> 813.426.4230 mobile
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- boun...@wispa.org]
>
> >> On Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
> >> Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2010 7:30 AM
> >> To: WISPA General List
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] 3.65 GHz WiMAX deal
> >>
> >> I think the new motorola is mimo.
> >>
> >> Sent from my iPhone
> >>
> >> On Mar 18, 2010, at 9:29 AM, Matt  wrote:
> >>
>  We don't know about you, but we at California-based Aperto Networks
>
>  are tired of waiting for stimulus dollars to trickle into the WISP
>  business, so we are taking matters into our own hands. So Aperto
>  Networks -- the
>  802.16 pioneer and WiMAX leader -- is excited to offer the 3.65 and
>
>  5
> >>
>  GHz carrier class and commercial grade (not the residential CPE)
>  PM320 PacketMAX CPE for only $199 each to the WISP. Effective
>  immediately, the price applies to all N type CPE in either band and
>  17 dbi integrated
>  (3.65 GHz) and 20 dBi (5 GHz). 5 GHz with integrated 21 dBi and
>  3.65 GHz
>  with integrated 20 dBi are $220 to the WISP. There are no packs and
>
>  no minimum quantities to get this price -- buy even just one, same
>  price.
> >>>
> >>> Is there 3.65 stuff MIMO?
> >>>
> >>> Matt
> >
> >
> > ---
> > ---
> > ---
> > ---
> > 
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Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL

[Jayson Baker]

That's what we did.  $24.95/mo gets you 12Mbps/6Mbps.  $49.95/mo gets you
20Mbps/6Mbps.
We guarantee minimums--not just an "up to" speed.  A lot of people really
like that too.
Our packages: www.peakinter.net

On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 11:14 PM, MDK  wrote:

> One of the things you have to keep in mind, is that you really do have to
> offer your customers a decent value for their dollars.35 Bux for a
> fraction of a meg is darn steep pricing these days.   We offer a 300K for
> 25
> and 2 meg for 38.50, which is reasonably competitive.
>
> You don't' need to be the cheapest to be "competitive", but you can't be
> way
> outside of normal pricing.
>
> I'm thinking of throwing up some MIMO gear and offering something like a 7
> meg service.Was thinking of making it about 75 / mo.Not the
> cheapest.   Not the most expensive, either. What would 7 meg be in your
> area?
>
>
>
> ++
> Neofast, Inc, Making internet easy
> 541-969-8200  509-386-4589
> ++
>
> --
> From: "Kurt Fankhauser" 
> Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 8:05 AM
> To: "'WISPA General List'" 
> Subject: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL
>
> > Local phone company here just expanded their DSL coverage area and mailed
> > out fliers to everyone for $15 DSL. I see no mention of it being a
> > promotional price. One person said as long as you have it they will not
> > raise the rate from $15. Think its for 768k service. Anyways we are
> > getting
> > about 1 person a day switching from our $35/month/768k wireless service
> to
> > this DSL. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how to retain these
> > customers They are not even giving us a chance to offer them a lower
> > price as they all already have the DSL turned on and been using it for a
> > month before they cancel ours.
> >
> >
> >
> > Kurt Fankhauser
> > WAVELINC
> > P.O. Box 126
> > Bucyrus, OH 44820
> > 419-562-6405
> > www.wavelinc.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
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Re: [WISPA] UBNT WDS Bridge mode for transparency

[Jayson Baker]

Actually, at the Vegas conference UBNT said you should *never* specify MACs.
I don't remember why, but you may want to check into it first!

On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 5:51 PM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> Depends on what you're using.
>
> If they're both AP and you want them both to broadcast, AP WDS is what you
> want.  I suggest you specify MACs and not use the auto feature.  If there
> are 3 or more APs you absolutely can not use auto as it will create a loop
> (ignoring STP for now...).
>
> If you want to have an AP, then a customer radio and finally their PC and
> see the PC's mac as if the customer radio is just a switch you need station
> wds.
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue
> that counts.”
> --- Winston Churchill
>
>
> On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 7:46 PM, Greg Ihnen  wrote:
>
> > UBNT says you have to use WDS with Bridge mode if you want transparent
> > packet transport with no funny business. Does that apply to one end being
> AP
> > and the other being "station" WDS? Or do they both have to be AP?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> >
> 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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> >
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> >
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] Optoisolator for Ethernet?

[Jayson Baker]

How weird.  We need exactly this too.  A building we're in that used to be
two, but were combined, and each have their own service drops.  There's a
difference in ground potential.

On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 6:30 PM, Greg Ihnen  wrote:

> I've seen a telephone (copper pair) optoisolator which had a short piece of
> fiberoptic cable inside. Each circuit on both sides of the cable had their
> own highly isolated power supplies. This was the only thing that worked in
> the Amazon region to stop phone equipment from getting wiped out during the
> intense electrical storms. The beauty of this device was it didn't require a
> first class ground system to work, in fact it didn't require any ground. A
> ground would just present up a difference in potential between the phone
> line and ground and encourage destruction. The telco side of this thing
> would just float at what ever potential the telco's lines were presenting
> and the on site equipment on the other side of this thing never saw that
> potential. Has anyone seen such a thing for Ethernet?
>
> Greg
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL

[Jayson Baker]

But if they just truly just don't like you and don't want your service, they
are penalized to get out of a contract.
We switch a LOT of people over from the local telco, who has been
contracting people as much as they can.
People HATE that company for that.  And bad mouth them all over town for it.

On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 10:34 AM, Travis Johnson  wrote:

> I disagree with no contracts. Many times people get upset for reasons
> outside of our control (viruses, antenna damage, water in broken cable).
> If we didn't have a contract in place, they would just cancel.
> Otherwise, we at least have a chance to talk to them and see if we can
> fix it _before_ they switch.
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Jayson Baker wrote:
> > Oh yeah--that helps too.  We flat-rate everything.
> > $24.95/mo for your Internet includes your taxes, your fees, your
> equipment
> > rental.
> > $19.95/mo for your Phone includes taxes, fees, equipment rental, E911,
> and
> > everything else.
> > And we don't have contracts.  We tell everyone, "if you like us you'll
> stay,
> > if you don't we're not going to penalize you"
> > Talking straight-up to the customer when they call and flat out saying
> > things like that makes most people go, "damn... you guys are pretty
> cool!"
> >
> > :-)
> >
> > On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 9:56 AM, Kurt Fankhauser 
> wrote:
> >
> >
> >> I was wrong I guess the $15 is only for 12 months. Also looks like their
> >> $29.95 after the 12 months and there is probably taxes on that. We have
> >> been
> >> thinking of lowering our price to the $29 range though.
> >>
> >> Kurt Fankhauser
> >> WAVELINC
> >> P.O. Box 126
> >> Bucyrus, OH 44820
> >> 419-562-6405
> >> www.wavelinc.com
> >>
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> >> Behalf Of Jayson Baker
> >> Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 11:26 AM
> >> To: WISPA General List
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL
> >>
> >> We offer something the telco never will...
> >> A local business with local, friendly support staff.  All calls are
> >> answered
> >> and handled locally.
> >> We promote this heavily--and a lot of people are willing to pay more for
> >> it.
> >>
> >> On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 9:24 AM, Steven G McGehee 
> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>> Hi Kurt,
> >>>
> >>> What we decided to do a few years ago was let the residential users
> >>> "go," basically. We knew we couldn't compete with the telcos/cable co.
> >>> increasingly lower prices so our sales guys (I'm a tech) changed
> tactics
> >>> and just focused on businesses -- offering them multi-megabit upstream
> >>> speeds, carrier grade uptime with SLAs whereby they get a credit for
> >>> every hour they're down (which is quite rare, but customers like the
> >>> sound of it). We often also throw offer a second backup wireless link
> >>> (usually connecting on to a different PoP on a different frequency) and
> >>> setup EIGRP for them. Hosting/email services/24-7
> >>> monitoring/colocation/voip are on the menu too so those get put into
> >>> negotiations with the potential clients.
> >>>
> >>> Residential users don't have a need for a lot of that though, so we too
> >>> were wondering how to compete. While we still do dialup/DSL for them,
> >>> our strategy was to go for the businesses...a few years behind us,
> we're
> >>> happy with that decision. Good luck!
> >>>
> >>> -Steven
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Kurt Fankhauser wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Local phone company here just expanded their DSL coverage area and
> >>>>
> >> mailed
> >>
> >>>> out fliers to everyone for $15 DSL. I see no mention of it being a
> >>>> promotional price. One person said as long as you have it they will
> not
> >>>> raise the rate from $15. Think its for 768k service. Anyways we are
> >>>>
> >>> getting
> >>>
> >>>> about 1 person a day switching from our $35/month/768k wireless
> service
> >>>>
> >>> to
> >>>
> >>>> t

Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL

[Jayson Baker]

Bassturds!

On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 10:00 AM, Marlon K. Schafer 
wrote:

> Gotta offer higher speeds.
>
> Better service (customer service especially).
>
> Get a REAL bill from one of your customers.  It won't be for $15.  They'll
> have taxes, usage fees, modem rental etc. tacked on there.
>
> I've asked people that have switched from us to give us a copy of the bill
> so we can see just how much they are really "saving".  No one has ever
> brought in a bill.  I don't think they save one red cent.
>
> BTW, you can thank USF for this.  The telco will give away internet to keep
> the subsidies on the land line rolling in.
>
> Out here Century Tel/link gets between $60 and $100 per month per line in
> USF funds (depends on who you ask).  One of my congressional staff folks
> told me that Century Tel gets 2/3rds of it's income from subsidies of one
> kind or another.  Heck, that makes them a government agency, not a private
> phone company :-).
>
> deep sigh
> marlon
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Kurt Fankhauser" 
> To: "'WISPA General List'" 
> Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 8:05 AM
> Subject: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL
>
>
> > Local phone company here just expanded their DSL coverage area and mailed
> > out fliers to everyone for $15 DSL. I see no mention of it being a
> > promotional price. One person said as long as you have it they will not
> > raise the rate from $15. Think its for 768k service. Anyways we are
> > getting
> > about 1 person a day switching from our $35/month/768k wireless service
> to
> > this DSL. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how to retain these
> > customers They are not even giving us a chance to offer them a lower
> > price as they all already have the DSL turned on and been using it for a
> > month before they cancel ours.
> >
> >
> >
> > Kurt Fankhauser
> > WAVELINC
> > P.O. Box 126
> > Bucyrus, OH 44820
> > 419-562-6405
> > www.wavelinc.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
>
>
> 
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>
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Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL

[Jayson Baker]

Oh yeah--that helps too.  We flat-rate everything.
$24.95/mo for your Internet includes your taxes, your fees, your equipment
rental.
$19.95/mo for your Phone includes taxes, fees, equipment rental, E911, and
everything else.
And we don't have contracts.  We tell everyone, "if you like us you'll stay,
if you don't we're not going to penalize you"
Talking straight-up to the customer when they call and flat out saying
things like that makes most people go, "damn... you guys are pretty cool!"

:-)

On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 9:56 AM, Kurt Fankhauser  wrote:

> I was wrong I guess the $15 is only for 12 months. Also looks like their
> $29.95 after the 12 months and there is probably taxes on that. We have
> been
> thinking of lowering our price to the $29 range though.
>
> Kurt Fankhauser
> WAVELINC
> P.O. Box 126
> Bucyrus, OH 44820
> 419-562-6405
> www.wavelinc.com
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Jayson Baker
> Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 11:26 AM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL
>
> We offer something the telco never will...
> A local business with local, friendly support staff.  All calls are
> answered
> and handled locally.
> We promote this heavily--and a lot of people are willing to pay more for
> it.
>
> On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 9:24 AM, Steven G McGehee  wrote:
>
> > Hi Kurt,
> >
> > What we decided to do a few years ago was let the residential users
> > "go," basically. We knew we couldn't compete with the telcos/cable co.
> > increasingly lower prices so our sales guys (I'm a tech) changed tactics
> > and just focused on businesses -- offering them multi-megabit upstream
> > speeds, carrier grade uptime with SLAs whereby they get a credit for
> > every hour they're down (which is quite rare, but customers like the
> > sound of it). We often also throw offer a second backup wireless link
> > (usually connecting on to a different PoP on a different frequency) and
> > setup EIGRP for them. Hosting/email services/24-7
> > monitoring/colocation/voip are on the menu too so those get put into
> > negotiations with the potential clients.
> >
> > Residential users don't have a need for a lot of that though, so we too
> > were wondering how to compete. While we still do dialup/DSL for them,
> > our strategy was to go for the businesses...a few years behind us, we're
> > happy with that decision. Good luck!
> >
> > -Steven
> >
> >
> >
> > Kurt Fankhauser wrote:
> > > Local phone company here just expanded their DSL coverage area and
> mailed
> > > out fliers to everyone for $15 DSL. I see no mention of it being a
> > > promotional price. One person said as long as you have it they will not
> > > raise the rate from $15. Think its for 768k service. Anyways we are
> > getting
> > > about 1 person a day switching from our $35/month/768k wireless service
> > to
> > > this DSL. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how to retain these
> > > customers They are not even giving us a chance to offer them a
> lower
> > > price as they all already have the DSL turned on and been using it for
> a
> > > month before they cancel ours.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Kurt Fankhauser
> > > WAVELINC
> > > P.O. Box 126
> > > Bucyrus, OH 44820
> > > 419-562-6405
> > > www.wavelinc.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
> 
> 
> > > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > > http://signup.wispa.org/
> > >
> >
>
> 
> 
> > >
> > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> > >
> > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> > >
> > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> 
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> >
>
> 
> 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> &g

Re: [WISPA] how to compete with $15 DSL

[Jayson Baker]

We offer something the telco never will...
A local business with local, friendly support staff.  All calls are answered
and handled locally.
We promote this heavily--and a lot of people are willing to pay more for it.

On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 9:24 AM, Steven G McGehee  wrote:

> Hi Kurt,
>
> What we decided to do a few years ago was let the residential users
> "go," basically. We knew we couldn't compete with the telcos/cable co.
> increasingly lower prices so our sales guys (I'm a tech) changed tactics
> and just focused on businesses -- offering them multi-megabit upstream
> speeds, carrier grade uptime with SLAs whereby they get a credit for
> every hour they're down (which is quite rare, but customers like the
> sound of it). We often also throw offer a second backup wireless link
> (usually connecting on to a different PoP on a different frequency) and
> setup EIGRP for them. Hosting/email services/24-7
> monitoring/colocation/voip are on the menu too so those get put into
> negotiations with the potential clients.
>
> Residential users don't have a need for a lot of that though, so we too
> were wondering how to compete. While we still do dialup/DSL for them,
> our strategy was to go for the businesses...a few years behind us, we're
> happy with that decision. Good luck!
>
> -Steven
>
>
>
> Kurt Fankhauser wrote:
> > Local phone company here just expanded their DSL coverage area and mailed
> > out fliers to everyone for $15 DSL. I see no mention of it being a
> > promotional price. One person said as long as you have it they will not
> > raise the rate from $15. Think its for 768k service. Anyways we are
> getting
> > about 1 person a day switching from our $35/month/768k wireless service
> to
> > this DSL. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how to retain these
> > customers They are not even giving us a chance to offer them a lower
> > price as they all already have the DSL turned on and been using it for a
> > month before they cancel ours.
> >
> >
> >
> > Kurt Fankhauser
> > WAVELINC
> > P.O. Box 126
> > Bucyrus, OH 44820
> > 419-562-6405
> > www.wavelinc.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
>
>
>
>
> 
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> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
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Re: [WISPA] [Motorola II] Ubiquity AirMax - rehashed?

[Jayson Baker]

We use a lot of Loco2's - as you mention, they work great.

We're starting to deploy a lot of AirMax 5GHz stuff - it works even better.
 We regularly see customers getting speedtest of 80Mbps (down and up).
 Latency is good.  We're in a very heavily crowded 5GHz area, and it doesn't
seem to affect it at all once you turn on AirMax.

On Thu, Mar 4, 2010 at 10:43 AM, Jerry Richardson
wrote:

>  Can I get some feedback on those using AirMax procucts?
>
>
>
> We've use the NS2's in situations where we there are not many clients and
> the CPE's can all hear each which seems seems to work well.
>
>
>
> The form factor, design, price, and performance combination of the M series
> hard to ignore and if it works as well as the NS2's have I'm game for trying
> it on a small scale where I need a lot of bandwidth and resistence to
> interference.
>
>
>
> I'm willing to let my bad Bullet experience go as a fluke.
>
>
>
>
>
> [image: aircloud_WebTiny_color_white_back_120x45]
>
> *Broadband for Business*
>
> *Public and Private WiFi*
>
>
>
> Jerry Richardson
>
> VP Operations
>
> 925-260-4119 x2
>
> Website    Blog 
> Twitter    
> LinkedIn
>
>
>
<>


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Re: [WISPA] Clear

[Jayson Baker]

They've met with our datacenter folks and been on the roof numerous times.
To me, that says they're getting ready to make some sort of move.

On Wed, Feb 24, 2010 at 6:39 AM, Dylan Bouterse wrote:

> Interesting. They are installing equipment on towers in our area (after
> having leases for 4+ years) but I'm not seeing Orlando as a current or
> future area. Actually I'm not seeing future areas (just in the legend).
> Maybe I have the wrong map.
>
> http://www.clear.com/coverage
>
> Dylan
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Mike Hammett
> Sent: Tuesday, February 23, 2010 11:20 PM
> To: wireless@wispa.org
> Subject: [WISPA] Clear
>
> In looking at Clear's web site, they have a green for areas that are
> covered now and a dark grey for future coverage.  Does anyone know how
> quickly they expect to fill that coverage?  How quickly they'll expand
> beyond their future coverage?
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
>
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
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>
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Re: [WISPA] Clear

[Jayson Baker]

I haven't seen their site, but I know they've been sniffing around Colorado
Springs quite a bit the last year.  I think they're getting ready to make a
move.

On Tue, Feb 23, 2010 at 9:19 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:

> In looking at Clear's web site, they have a green for areas that are
> covered now and a dark grey for future coverage.  Does anyone know how
> quickly they expect to fill that coverage?  How quickly they'll expand
> beyond their future coverage?
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Reflector grid or dish for NS2/NS2L

[Jayson Baker]

I wouldn't use a dish on the NS2, maybe the NS2L is ok.  NS2 has two patch
antennas internally, which will cause a really screwed up pattern out of a
dish.  Even though people claim to do it, I would not.  NS2L has only a
single patch, and should be better, but still not perfect.  Keep in mind
these are not FCC certified.

On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 5:49 PM, Rick Harnish  wrote:

> Blair,
>
>
>
> http://www.wispa.org/?page_id=325  SecurAlign is a WISPA Vendor member who
> makes reflector dishes for this exact purpose.  Their website is
> http://www.securalign.com/  Ask for Layne Christianson.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Rick
>
>
>
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Blair Davis
> Sent: Monday, February 15, 2010 7:40 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: [WISPA] Reflector grid or dish for NS2/NS2L
>
>
>
> I am looking for reflectors that can be used with the NS2 or NS2L to
> increase gain and directionality.
>
> Has anyone seen or heard of something like this?  It seems to me to be an
> obvious add-on to the radios and a much better way to get more gain than
> using the external antenna port on the NS2.  I expect it would be less
> expensive than grid and pigtail as well.
>
> Blair
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 8.5.435 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2687 - Release Date: 02/15/10
> 19:35:00
>
>
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

Probably would not be profitable for us, either, in all actuality.
We'd like to just offer some basic channels.  Maybe 30 or 40.  For those
people who really just want "basic TV"
Networks, Disney, ESPN, etc.  But I think the programmers would force you to
carry all their other stupid channels.

*shrug*

On Mon, Feb 8, 2010 at 11:25 AM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> To this day I've heard of countless people that do it to compete (the
> triple
> bundle) but none that make any money.
>
> 6mbps multicast...per active channel.
>
> Usually it happens in such a way that if someone starts watching a channels
> 20-25 the channel will multicast through the network up until no one is
> watching it for ~5 minutes.
>
> Super bandwidth hog.
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue
> that counts.”
> --- Winston Churchill
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 8, 2010 at 1:22 PM, Jayson Baker 
> wrote:
>
> > So what's the latest with this?
> >
> > We essentially have an IPTV headend running in the shop.  It's nice being
> > able to sit in my office and "work" on the computer, while watching TV
> > streamed over the LAN.
> >
> > But that doesn't make much money.
> >
> > At the UBNT AirMax conference they said they're doing IPTV over the new M
> > stuff.  But... I still run into that little issue of 6Mbps multicast
> rates.
> >
> > On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 9:56 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net <
> > jree...@18-30chat.net> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Jayson Baker wrote:
> > > >> I will need to test that. The setting lets you use any valid
> > modulation
> > > for
> > > >> the
> > > >> RF mode your in. I will also test with my B5M's.
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > > What exactly are you referring to?  On the older 802.11a/b/g devices
> I
> > > see
> > > > Multicast Rate.
> > > > But on the Rocket/Bullet/Nano N-series (M series) I don't see
> Multicast
> > > > Rate, just "Allow all"
> > >
> > > Yup the M's I have do not allow you to set a fixed rate. I should have
> > been
> > > clearer in that I meant that the AirMax stuff was different then the
> > AirOS
> > > stuff.
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:20 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net <
> > > > jree...@18-30chat.net> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> I will need to test that. The setting lets you use any valid
> > modulation
> > > for
> > > >> the
> > > >> RF mode your in. I will also test with my B5M's.
> > > >>
> > > >> Jayson Baker wrote:
> > > >>> IIRc, multicast is limited at the 6Mbps modulation on "WiFi"
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Tell me I'm wrong, please.  But I've read it a couple
> > times--compeltely
> > > >>> forgot until we started doing this.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Before, when we were watching IPTV off our fiber headend, we were
> > doing
> > > >> it
> > > >>> over EoIP.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 9:19 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net <
> > > >>> jree...@18-30chat.net> wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>>> You can change the multicast rate on the non airmax units. Mine
> are
> > > >> enroute
> > > >>>> so
> > > >>>> have not tried with the airmax gear.
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> I have not heard back about the units.
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> At 130 ea, a Roku with the same features as the low end unit, will
> > be
> > > >> more
> > > >>>> cost
> > > >>>> effective. I am still researching about the licensing requirements
> > of
> > > >>>> securing
> > > >>>> the data stream for non OTA channels.
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> Jayson Baker wrote:
> > > >>>>> I seem to remember the 

Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

So what's the latest with this?

We essentially have an IPTV headend running in the shop.  It's nice being
able to sit in my office and "work" on the computer, while watching TV
streamed over the LAN.

But that doesn't make much money.

At the UBNT AirMax conference they said they're doing IPTV over the new M
stuff.  But... I still run into that little issue of 6Mbps multicast rates.

On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 9:56 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net <
jree...@18-30chat.net> wrote:

>
>
> Jayson Baker wrote:
> >> I will need to test that. The setting lets you use any valid modulation
> for
> >> the
> >> RF mode your in. I will also test with my B5M's.
> >>
> >
> > What exactly are you referring to?  On the older 802.11a/b/g devices I
> see
> > Multicast Rate.
> > But on the Rocket/Bullet/Nano N-series (M series) I don't see Multicast
> > Rate, just "Allow all"
>
> Yup the M's I have do not allow you to set a fixed rate. I should have been
> clearer in that I meant that the AirMax stuff was different then the AirOS
> stuff.
>
>
> >
> > On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:20 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net <
> > jree...@18-30chat.net> wrote:
> >
> >> I will need to test that. The setting lets you use any valid modulation
> for
> >> the
> >> RF mode your in. I will also test with my B5M's.
> >>
> >> Jayson Baker wrote:
> >>> IIRc, multicast is limited at the 6Mbps modulation on "WiFi"
> >>>
> >>> Tell me I'm wrong, please.  But I've read it a couple times--compeltely
> >>> forgot until we started doing this.
> >>>
> >>> Before, when we were watching IPTV off our fiber headend, we were doing
> >> it
> >>> over EoIP.
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 9:19 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net <
> >>> jree...@18-30chat.net> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> You can change the multicast rate on the non airmax units. Mine are
> >> enroute
> >>>> so
> >>>> have not tried with the airmax gear.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> I have not heard back about the units.
> >>>>
> >>>> At 130 ea, a Roku with the same features as the low end unit, will be
> >> more
> >>>> cost
> >>>> effective. I am still researching about the licensing requirements of
> >>>> securing
> >>>> the data stream for non OTA channels.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Jayson Baker wrote:
> >>>>> I seem to remember the low-end ones were around $130/ea.  Not sure
> >> about
> >>>> the
> >>>>> others.  Price will vary based on where you buy and in what quantity
> I
> >>>>> assume.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Remembered that standard 802.11 will only multicast at around 1Mbps.
> >>  So
> >>>>> that's why we were having the problem with the multicast over AirMax
> >>>>> equipment.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:59 AM, richard sterne <
> >>>> wireless.r...@gmail.com>wrote:
> >>>>>> Did you get any pricing for the Amino STB's?
> >>>>>> I would like to know more about your setup.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Richard
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>
> 
> >>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>
> 
> >>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>
> 
> >>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>>>>
> >>
> 

Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show

[Jayson Baker]

You're wanting to go on a family vacation?  I thought this was to be a WISP
conference.  Like, for WISP operators.
I, personally, have no intention of spending that much for airline tickets,
and going to play with Mickey Mouse while I'm at a conference.

On Mon, Feb 8, 2010 at 6:44 AM, Dylan Bouterse wrote:

> Orlando!
>
> We have the 4 Disney parks, Universal Studios, Blue Men, Sea World, I-Drive
> area, Kissimmee area and a WHOLE lot more. I'm not aware of any zip lines
> though. :oP
>
> Dylan
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Mike
> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 8:29 AM
> To: 'WISPA General List'
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
>
> Phoenix.  Dry and warm.
>
> *OR* I live 5 minutes up the hill from a world class casino and hotel
> complex. http://www.meskwaki.com/
>
> I could host, and you could take turns climbing my towers, and riding the
> zip lines here at Gilly Hollow.  One of them is a terror at 750 feet.
>
> Mike
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Robert West
> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 11:18 PM
> To: 'WISPA General List'
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
>
> I'm the same.  If Vegas, I'd pass.  Having shows in Vegas isn't about the
> show, it's about Vegas.  The show is just the vehicle to use to get there.
> A show in Vegas has become a cliché.
>
> Bob-
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Glenn Kelley
> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 11:39 AM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
>
> I was just in Vegas for the Ubiquity meeting
>
> If you are planning to take your family anywhere - VEGAS is not the place -
> IMHO
>
> When you get off the plane and exit the airport you are handed pamphlets
> for
> prostitutes to come to your hotel room from $25/ hr
> Having 3 daughters and 1 son ... I can tell you - this is hardly the place
> I
> would like to take my family on vacation.
>
> Disney sounds better ;-)
>
> Of course this is all business - - going out to Columbus, Philadelphia,
> Indy, Chicago, Denver - yeah - much nicer...
>
>
>
> 
> _
> Glenn Kelley | Principle | HostMedic |www.HostMedic.com
>  Email: gl...@hostmedic.com
> Pplease don't print this e-mail unless you really need to.
>
> On Feb 4, 2010, at 11:23 AM, Randy Cosby wrote:
>
> > Next time, drive up to Mesquite  (1.25 hours) or St. George - Great
> > rooms / prices you can feel good about taking the family to. :)
> >
> > Randy
> >
> >
> > On 2/4/2010 9:12 AM, Eje Gustafsson wrote:
> >> *shudder* Reminds me of WISPCon in Vegas. The WISPCon hotel screwed up
> my
> >> families reserveration. Roadeo show in town and one other large
> conference.
> >> There was not a hotel room in entire Vegas, Henderson or anywhere close
> >> enough to drive to. Got to the hotel around 7pm to find out there was no
> >> available room for us. We called probably 100 different places and
> visited
> >> probably another 40+ places, pleading and begging for a room. We didn't
> even
> >> find any rooms at the ones that only rented per week.
> >> Me, my wife, one baby and one toddler.
> >> Finally about 2:30am we gave up and ended up sleeping in our rental
> minivan
> >> on the parking lot. In the middle of the night by accident set of the
> car
> >> alarm. Got kicked off the lot by the Casino security guards. Dumb ass
> >> suggested we drive downtown and take in on a hotel that charge by the
> hour.
> >> Yeah exactly the place I want to take 2 small children.. Parking the car
> on
> >> a street and sleeping in it was out of the question. We circled the
> block
> >> parked at a different location at the Casino parking area and went back
> to
> >> sleep.
> >>
> >> The memories.. Might have to do that again but without the kids ;)
> >>
> >> / Eje
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> >> Behalf Of lakel...@gbcx.net
> >> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 10:00 AM
> >> To: WISPA General List
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
> >>
> >> 10+ years ago I remember making a deal with a hotel to take a shower in
> a
> >> room that was being refurbished after driving through he night from NY.
> No
> >> available rooms for 50 miles.
> >>
> >> I should throw all my crap into a U-haul truck, drive it out there and
> >> abandon the thing!  LOL
> >>
> >> -B-
> >> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: "Blake Bowers"
> >> Date: Wed, 3 Feb 2010 22:36:47
> >> To:; WISPA General List<
> wireless@wispa.org>
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
> >>
> >> I have never had a problem fi

Re: [WISPA] Temporarily replace Atlas 5010 with Ubiquity Bullet

[Jayson Baker]

3.5 is for legacy products
5.1 is the latest for N products

On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 10:46 AM, Jerry Richardson
wrote:

> Thanks,
> It's not an M - Ubiquity's firware site makes 3.5 the highest available
> version.
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Nick Olsen
> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 9:45 AM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Temporarily replace Atlas 5010 with Ubiquity Bullet
>
> I've got it if you/anyone needs it. you=op
>
> Nick Olsen
> Network Engineer / Customer Support
> (321) 205-1100 x106
>
> 
>
> From: "Michael Baird" 
> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 12:05 PM
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Temporarily replace Atlas 5010 with Ubiquity Bullet
>
> I've got BulletM's doing 30 mb over a 10 mile shot on 20mhz wide
> channel. Make sure you get the latest super secret firmware (5.1.1)
> though, to avoid the WDS/Arp issues.
>
> Regards
> Michael Baird
> > Atlas link went down AGAIN! Probably my fault this time but have no
> spare.
> >
> > I have a pair of the Bullet that I could slap in there to get through the
> weekend. Think it will work out?
> >
> > The Trangos were passing ~25Mbps of traffic aggregate.
> >
> > [cid:image001.gif@01CAA63F.65692320]
> > Broadband for Business
> > Public and Private WiFi
> >
> > Jerry Richardson
> > VP Operations
> > 925-260-4119 x2
> > Website   Blog
> Twitter
> LinkedIn
> >
> >
> >
> > 
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> 
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
>
> 
> 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
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> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
> 
> 
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>
> 
> 
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>
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show

[Jayson Baker]

I'm down with Denver, since it's about an hour away.  But really, Vegas is
usually the cheapest to fly into, and cheap to stay at; with plenty to do
with a short walk from your hotel.  I've been in every casino in Vegas and
never taken a cab or had to drive.  Denver... ehh, not so much.

On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 10:17 AM, Chuck Profito wrote:

> How come we don't hear any one suggesting a show in Denver or Salt Lake?
> Pretty much the center of the country with MAJOR airline hubs direct to all
> points.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Josh Luthman
> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 9:03 AM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
>
> I have a fridge full of beer you are welcome to.  I'll bring the whole
> fridge if I can go somewhere the weather isn't disgusting.
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> "Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue
> that counts."
> --- Winston Churchill
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 11:59 AM, Robert West
> wrote:
>
> > Yes, and notice how Josh suddenly clammed up once it was settled to all
> > crash at his house and drink his beer, break his Playstation3 and
> embarrass
> > him in front of all his neighbors at 3 in the morning..
> >
> > I see how things are, Josh.  After all we've been through together you
> have
> > to turn into this.
> >
> > Bob
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> > Behalf Of Stuart Pierce
> > Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 11:23 AM
> > To: WISPA General List
> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
> >
> >
> > Hey now, the weather is nice today. Granted Columbus isn't Kettering, but
> > hey, it's got more food.
> >
> > -- Original Message --
> > From: Josh Luthman 
> > Reply-To: WISPA General List 
> > Date:  Fri, 5 Feb 2010 10:44:30 -0500
> >
> > >Ohio weather sucks.  Zipline would be fun!
> > >
> > >Josh Luthman
> > >Office: 937-552-2340
> > >Direct: 937-552-2343
> > >1100 Wayne St
> > >Suite 1337
> > >Troy, OH 45373
> > >
> > >"Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to
> continue
> > >that counts."
> > >--- Winston Churchill
> > >
> > >
> > >On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 10:43 AM, Robert West
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >> Me thinks Stuart likes Columbus.
> > >>
> > >> OSU grad, Stuart?
> > >>
> > >> I like the town too.  A lot less than a cow town as it used to be.
> > >>
> > >> Bob-
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> -Original Message-
> > >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> On
> > >> Behalf Of Stuart Pierce
> > >> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 9:37 AM
> > >> To: WISPA General List
> > >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
> > >>
> > >> Have I mentioned Columbus Ohio ? Downtown has everything, German
> > Village,
> > >> Italian Village, Victorian Village and Campus.
> > >>
> > >> Oh food, wine and song as well.
> > >>
> > >> -- Original Message --
> > >> From: "Chuck Hogg" 
> > >> Reply-To: WISPA General List 
> > >> Date:  Thu, 4 Feb 2010 12:10:24 -0500
> > >>
> > >> >I agree here with Marlon that I am afraid that it will turn into an
> > >> >ISPCon event.  I learn and enjoy a show like MUM or AFMUG much better
> > >> >than ISPCon.  As both a Vendor and an ISP member, shows like ISPCon
> > >> >don't have the intimacy like a smaller show does.  I could care less
> if
> > >> >it is in Vegas, or some other place, so long as it provides:
> > >> >
> > >> >1) A chance to meet with other companies in our industry, large,
> > medium,
> > >> >or small.
> > >> >2) A chance to meet with other vendors and work with their special
> > niche
> > >> >in the market, and have those vendors be WISPA member vendors, not
> just
> > >> >any vendor.
> > >> >3) A highspeed internet connection to make sure I can stay in touch
> > with
> > >> >home to make sure business continues.
> > >> >4) Close to the airport, reasonable accommodations, and good food is
> a
> > >> >plus.
> > >> >5) Be reasonable in price.  $250 is WAY too much for me to attend
> > as
> > >> >an ISP to a tradeshow.
> > >> >
> > >> >Regards,
> > >> >Chuck Hogg
> > >> >Shelby Broadband
> > >> >502-722-9292
> > >> >ch...@shelbybb.com
> > >> >http://www.shelbybb.com
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >-Original Message-
> > >> >From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> > On
> > >> >Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
> > >> >Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 12:00 PM
> > >> >To: WISPA General List
> > >> >Cc: wispas...@wispa.org
> > >> >Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
> > >> >
> > >> >Hi Matt,
> > >> >
> > >> >I'm moving this back to the show list.  I still request that
> wispashow

Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show

[Jayson Baker]

Why would you not have it at Vegas, like most other conventions?  Most days
we can fly there and back for under $100 total round-trip.  Rooms are cheap,
and there is plenty of other stuff to do.  Oh, and free booze.  :-)

On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 9:36 PM, Blake Bowers  wrote:

> I have never had a problem finding rooms at Dayton, usually with my
> normal reservations taking place 2-3 days before the show.  Never.
>
> Now, the hamvention, like all the other hamfests, is no where near as
> packed
> as
> it was 10 years ago too.
>
> 4 years ago I did not even have reservations and found rooms at the first
> place I stopped at, a Drury.
>
> Don't take your organs to heaven,
> heaven knows we need them down here!
> Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Brian Webster" 
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2010 9:04 PM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
>
>
> > Not a bad idea, Dayton would be problematic as it has limited lodging in
> > the
> > area and the hams already book that capacity up long before the
> > convention.
> > There are other large regional hamfests that might be a good fit for your
> > idea however. The one problem that may arise from those is that the
> > locations in many cases won't be in areas where the airports have a lot
> of
> > competition so the WISP attendees would more than likely have to pay
> > higher
> > airfare.
> >
> >
> >
> > Thank You,
> > Brian Webster
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]on
> > Behalf Of Robert West
> > Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2010 9:06 PM
> > To: 'WISPA General List'
> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
> >
> >
> > Okay, I'd like to throw an idea out there and see who yells..
> >
> > I had a thought that maybe it could be held at the same time as one of
> the
> > large Ham conventions, like the one they hold in Dayton, Ohio.  Only so
> > much
> > I can see and do at a 3 day event, would be great to be able to go across
> > town or wherever to another event that would have a lot of the same sort
> > of
> > towers, tools, safety gear that we use as Wisp operators.  No way would
> we
> > get these type of vendors to come to a Wisp only show, in my opinion.
>  The
> > bonus is, it could be used as a marketing tool to bring in even more
> > people
> > without any more effort.  I'd certainly go out of my way for an event
> that
> > would cover radio gear as well as the hardware and safety.  A lot of us
> > WISP
> > operators deal with HAMS and go to their conventions anyhow.  Unless, of
> > course, the WISPA show is stuffed with a full assortment of what we use.
> > :)
> >
> >
> > Anyway, just an idea.
> >
> > Bob-
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> > Behalf Of Matt Larsen - Lists
> > Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2010 1:31 PM
> > To: WISPA General List
> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] [Wispashow] Decision on WISPA Show
> >
> > All due respect Marlon, but I'm going to disagree with your assumptions.
> >
> > I have spent the last three months researching the possibility of
> > putting on a show and evaluating our options.   Before I started on that
> > process, I felt the same way that you do about WISPA putting on our own
> > show.   I thought that it would be some work, but doable, and had some
> > potential as a fund raiser.
> >
> > What was truly eye opening to me is the amount of work that is needed to
> > put a show on properly.   IMHO, WISPCON got lucky on the first show and
> > then it degraded when the organizational and sales efforts did not scale
> > up to the potential of the show.   The market is quite different right
> > now, and I don't think that we would be as lucky as P-15 was back in the
> > day.
> >
> > Ed's group puts on trade shows - that is their focus.   They are willing
> > to do it at no cost to us, and to help us build our membership up so
> > that both sides will benefit.   They don't know much about the WISP
> > business, so we have an opportunity to work with them to design a show
> > that our members would all like to go to.They are going to do it on
> > a much larger scale than what we had planned on doing, so we can spread
> > WISPAs message beyond our own little community.Those are strong
> > positives.
> >
> > Most importantly, we will not have to commit our money or manpower to
> > the project.Money is not that big of a deal, but manpower is.We
> > will not be able to put on a show with volunteer manpower, and it isn't
> > really a question of just hiring someone because the job requirements go
> > far beyond just being an ED type or a sales person.   These guys have a
> > staff of people who specialize in this kind of work and can get it done
> > more effectively and at a larger scale than we could ever dream of doing
> > on our own.
> >
> > All this

Re: [WISPA] Extra jacketed CAT5e

[Jayson Baker]

We get outs from Sean at CTI.  It's dual-jacketed, shielded, has a drain
wire, and the outer jacket is UV resistent.  Plus, it's cheaper than the
other stuff, and excellent quality.
Let him know I sent you.  :-)

On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 9:21 AM, Kurt Fankhauser  wrote:

> I seen some cat5e once that had a second jacket around it, it was obviously
> made for outdoors and was very durable and it was running through a woods
> just laying on the ground. I think it was made by Belkin. Does anyone know
> what this is and if you have a link where I can get it that would be great.
>
>
>
> Kurt Fankhauser
> WAVELINC
> P.O. Box 126
> Bucyrus, OH 44820
> 419-562-6405
> www.wavelinc.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



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Re: [WISPA] Semi-OT: Mobile phone platform questions

[Jayson Baker]

iPhone has all that

On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Mike Hammett wrote:

> Do any of the mobile phone platforms support VPN at all from the phone
> itself?  Any have a Remote Desktop client?
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
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>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



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Re: [WISPA] power

[Jayson Baker]

That's not a good idea.  You will create multipath interference, which will
have an overall negative impact.

On Mon, Feb 1, 2010 at 8:09 PM, Jeremie Chism  wrote:

> You may have to rotate your cpe to get a lower signal from the tower.
> I have one that is pointed at a 45 degree angle away from the tower.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 1, 2010, at 9:06 PM, RickG  wrote:
>
> > It's a PtMP environment. I have some customers much further away
> > running
> > high -70's.
> > If I drop the AP side, dont I risk loosing them or affecting their
> > throughput?
> > What about using an attenuator and padding it down some?
> > Thanks! -RickG
> >
> > On Mon, Feb 1, 2010 at 9:02 PM, Nick Olsen
> >  wrote:
> >
> >> Like we said, Drop both sides till the signal gets in the -55 to
> >> -65 range.
> >> Doesn't matter what the power is, as long as the signal is around
> >> there. As
> >> its where your going to get your best throughput, Barring any other
> >> interference.
> >>
> >> Nick Olsen
> >> Network Engineer / Customer Support
> >> (321) 205-1100 x106
> >>
> >> 
> >>
> >> From: "RickG" 
> >> Sent: Monday, February 01, 2010 8:56 PM
> >> To: "WISPA General List" 
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] power
> >>
> >> Ya, thats what I do. I'm just concerned about what the best power
> >> level
> >> is?
> >> I hate to create a monster based on the wrong settings.
> >>
> >> On Mon, Feb 1, 2010 at 8:21 PM, Robert West
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> I have a few like that.  Cheap and quick for low density
> >>> population.  Use
> >> a
> >>> pac grid for the backhaul and a bullet with an omni for the AP.
> >>> Check
> >> your
> >>> polarity, make sure you're on the right orientation and right
> >>> radio.  My
> >>> grids are horz. Pol and the omnis, well.  Vertical of course!
> >>>
> >>> Bob-
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -Original Message-
> >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-
> >>> boun...@wispa.org] On
> >>> Behalf Of RickG
> >>> Sent: Monday, February 01, 2010 8:08 PM
> >>> To: WISPA General List
> >>> Subject: [WISPA] power
> >>>
> >>> OK, I need a little input. I've got several "poor mans repeaters"
> >>> around
> >> by
> >>> using a pair of bullets, one for backhaul and the other for the AP.
> >> Today,
> >>> I
> >>> installed a Bullet on a new customer that was a stones throw away
> >>> from
> >> the
> >>> AP. At full power, he got just under 1Mbps. Turning down the
> >>> power, he
> >> got
> >>> 3Mbps+. Is turning down the power on the CPE side on a test and
> >>> trial
> >> basis
> >>> or is there some kind of method to it?
> >>> -RickG
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >>
> >>> 
> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >>
> >>> 
> >>>
> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>>
> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>>
> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> 
> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> 
> >>>
> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>>
> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>>
> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> ---
> >> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >
> >
> > ---
> > ---
> > ---
> > ---
> > 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> > ---
> > ---
> > ---
> > ---
> > -

Re: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul

[Jayson Baker]

Wait until you see the next release of firmware for the Ubiquiti MIMO
equipment.
Built-in spectrum analyzer, 1x better than Mikrotik, and almost as good
as our $30k HP analyzer.
Runs on the unit itself, while it's installed, in place, connected to the
antenna.
Can even run while the radio is in use and connected, but at a slower rate.
It's sweet.  I can't wait.

On Sun, Jan 31, 2010 at 11:18 AM, Tom DeReggi wrote:

> MT is not a replacement for an APEX, since the value of the APEX is
> LICENSED
> spectrum.
>
> But, I share Chuck's praise for MT. WISPs have been running reliable
> backbones on unlicenced spectrum and MT successfully for years.
> The new MT hardware and Firmwares are really nice and plenty reliable. For
> any link 50mbps or less, I'd select an Unlicensed solution without
> hesitation.
> Specifically, MT w/ WDS and NStreme will do 30mbps HDX on a 20Mhz channel
> easilly. As well, if you use the latest N class mPCI, you can set it up
> with
> a Dual Pol panel.
> I personally do not like Mimo configs much, but I like using N cards for
> manual on-the-fly polarity change/selection.
>
> I prefer the MT over the Ubiquiti, because the MT can do channel scans now,
> and thats important to be able to quickly identify free channels if
> Interference is ever received.
> But I really like the Ubiquiti antennas, that make DP inexpensive.
>
> I personally prefer Tlink-45s, which are a great radio, because they are a
> ready to go solution.  But off-promo MT can save you a few dollars.
>
> Tom DeReggi
> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Chuck Hogg" 
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Sunday, January 31, 2010 10:13 AM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul
>
>
> > We do as well. One of our MT links has more stability and reliability
> > than a neighboring Trango Apex link.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Chuck
> >
> > On Jan 30, 2010, at 11:38 PM, "Gino Villarini" 
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Not to sound like a jerk, but who would trust they're main backbone
> >> feed
> >> to a Mikrotik or Ubiquiti
> >>
> >> Yikes! Please get something reliable like a Bridgewave or a Licensed
> >> DS3
> >> Link!
> >>
> >> Gino A. Villarini
> >> g...@aeronetpr.com
> >> Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
> >> 787.273.4143
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> >> On
> >> Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
> >> Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 11:24 PM
> >> To: WISPA General List
> >> Subject: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul
> >>
> >> Thanks for the suggestion. I will take a look and contact you off
> >> list.
> >>
> >> Sent from my iPhone
> >>
> >> Begin forwarded message:
> >>
> >>> From: "Chuck Hogg" 
> >>> Date: January 30, 2010 9:20:01 PM CST
> >>> To: "WISPA General List" 
> >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
> >>> Reply-To: WISPA General List 
> >>>
> >>
> >>> We are a vendor member and a WISP.  On a short range, you should be
> >>> able
> >>> to use this MT kit just fine.  We will support and configure it for
> >>> you
> >>> for free if you wish.
> >>>
> >>> http://tinyurl.com/ydzrgfn
> >>>
> >>> WISPA Members get free assembly.
> >>>
> >>> Regards,
> >>> Chuck Hogg
> >>> Shelby Broadband
> >>> 502-722-9292
> >>> ch...@shelbybb.com
> >>> http://www.shelbybb.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -Original Message-
> >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> >>> On
> >>> Behalf Of Robert West
> >>> Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 10:16 PM
> >>> To: 'WISPA General List'
> >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
> >>>
> >>> The UBNT Rocket dish but at such short range, overkill.  Really, at
> >>> such
> >>> a
> >>> short hop even a bullet and a grid or the AirGrid would work it fine.
> >>>
> >>> Bob-
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -Original Message-
> >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> >>> On
> >>> Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
> >>> Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 6:47 PM
> >>> To: WISPA General List
> >>> Subject: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
> >>>
> >>> I have a pop across the street from one of my towers. The phone
> >>> company there is giving me a great deal on bandwidth but I have to
> >>> get
> >>> it across to the tower. Any recommendations for something reliable at
> >>> that range.
> >>>
> >>> Sent from my iPhone
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ---
> >>> -
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>> ---
> >>> -
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>>
> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>>
> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>>
> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ---
> >>> -

Re: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul

[Jayson Baker]

True.  All our links are redundant and have multiple diverse paths.

On Sun, Jan 31, 2010 at 6:34 AM, Bret Clark wrote:

>  No critical link should ever be standalone whether using expensive
> equipment or using lower cost equipment. Always a good idea to put a second
> redundant link in running something like RSTP or OSPF.
>
>
> Gino Villarini wrote:
>
> Whatever rocks your world!
>
> Gino A. villarini...@aeronetpr.com
> Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
> 787.273.4143
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org 
> ] On
> Behalf Of George Morris
> Sent: Sunday, January 31, 2010 12:54 AM
> To: 'WISPA General List'
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul
>
> Actually, we do Gino and have never had a problem.
>
> The latest generation of MT gear is pretty near bulletproof if deployed
> properly.
>
> I suspect there are quite a few people here that run their businesses on
> gear that you would turn you nose up at, so your condescension isn't
> really
> necessary.
>
> Yikes right back at ya.
> George
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org 
> ] On
> Behalf Of Gino Villarini
> Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 11:38 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul
>
> Not to sound like a jerk, but who would trust they're main backbone feed
> to a Mikrotik or Ubiquiti
>
> Yikes! Please get something reliable like a Bridgewave or a Licensed DS3
> Link!
>
> Gino A. villarini...@aeronetpr.com
> Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
> 787.273.4143
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org 
> ] On
> Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
> Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 11:24 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul
>
> Thanks for the suggestion. I will take a look and contact you off list.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> Begin forwarded message:
>
>
>
>  From: "Chuck Hogg"  
> Date: January 30, 2010 9:20:01 PM CST
> To: "WISPA General List"  
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
> Reply-To: WISPA General List  
>
> We are a vendor member and a WISP.  On a short range, you should be
> able
> to use this MT kit just fine.  We will support and configure it for
> you
> for free if you wish.
> http://tinyurl.com/ydzrgfn
>
> WISPA Members get free assembly.
>
> Regards,
> Chuck Hogg
> Shelby Broadband
> 502-722-9292ch...@shelbybb.comhttp://www.shelbybb.com
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org 
> ]
> On
> Behalf Of Robert West
> Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 10:16 PM
> To: 'WISPA General List'
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
>
> The UBNT Rocket dish but at such short range, overkill.  Really, at
> such
> a
> short hop even a bullet and a grid or the AirGrid would work it fine.
>
> Bob-
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org 
> ]
> On
> Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
> Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 6:47 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
>
> I have a pop across the street from one of my towers. The phone
> company there is giving me a great deal on bandwidth but I have to get
> it across to the tower. Any recommendations for something reliable at
> that range.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
> ---
> -
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!http://signup.wispa.org/
> ---
> -
> 
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
>
>
>
> ---
> -
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!http://signup.wispa.org/
> ---
> -
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
> ---
> ---
> ---
> ---
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!http://signup.wispa.org/
> ---
> ---
> ---
> ---
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
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>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>  
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:

Re: [WISPA] Short range backhaul

[Jayson Baker]

I'll second that.  Or is it 3 now?  We have MT links that have been in
places for years running dual-nstreme and get 70Mbps out of them all day,
everyday.

On Sat, Jan 30, 2010 at 9:54 PM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> This guy.
>
> Out of every backhaul in the network the most reliable has been the
> rb333 with engenius cards followed by an rb532 (yes 532 the piece of
> junk).  Tied for third are the smaller 411/r52 links (only a year on
> one and a few weeks on the other, but so far 100%).
>
> This includes Ceragon/Radwin links and Redline.
>
> On 1/30/10, Gino Villarini  wrote:
> > Not to sound like a jerk, but who would trust they're main backbone feed
> > to a Mikrotik or Ubiquiti
> >
> > Yikes! Please get something reliable like a Bridgewave or a Licensed DS3
> > Link!
> >
> > Gino A. Villarini
> > g...@aeronetpr.com
> > Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
> > 787.273.4143
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> > Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
> > Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 11:24 PM
> > To: WISPA General List
> > Subject: [WISPA] Fwd: Short range backhaul
> >
> > Thanks for the suggestion. I will take a look and contact you off list.
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> > Begin forwarded message:
> >
> >> From: "Chuck Hogg" 
> >> Date: January 30, 2010 9:20:01 PM CST
> >> To: "WISPA General List" 
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
> >> Reply-To: WISPA General List 
> >>
> >
> >> We are a vendor member and a WISP.  On a short range, you should be
> >> able
> >> to use this MT kit just fine.  We will support and configure it for
> >> you
> >> for free if you wish.
> >>
> >> http://tinyurl.com/ydzrgfn
> >>
> >> WISPA Members get free assembly.
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >> Chuck Hogg
> >> Shelby Broadband
> >> 502-722-9292
> >> ch...@shelbybb.com
> >> http://www.shelbybb.com
> >>
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> >> On
> >> Behalf Of Robert West
> >> Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 10:16 PM
> >> To: 'WISPA General List'
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
> >>
> >> The UBNT Rocket dish but at such short range, overkill.  Really, at
> >> such
> >> a
> >> short hop even a bullet and a grid or the AirGrid would work it fine.
> >>
> >> Bob-
> >>
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> >> On
> >> Behalf Of Jeremie Chism
> >> Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 6:47 PM
> >> To: WISPA General List
> >> Subject: [WISPA] Short range backhaul
> >>
> >> I have a pop across the street from one of my towers. The phone
> >> company there is giving me a great deal on bandwidth but I have to get
> >> it across to the tower. Any recommendations for something reliable at
> >> that range.
> >>
> >> Sent from my iPhone
> >>
> >>
> >> ---
> >> -
> >> 
> >> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >> ---
> >> -
> >> 
> >> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
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> >>
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> >>
> >>
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> >>
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> >> -
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Re: [WISPA] Ubnt and OSPF

[Jayson Baker]

Oh, yeah, that's a requirement too.  You can't bridge without WDS.

On Tue, Jan 12, 2010 at 7:45 PM, Jeremy Parr  wrote:

> 2010/1/12 Jayson Baker :
> > Broadcast, I guess.  Whatever is default on MT.
>
> Default is broadcast. I think I may have resolved the issue by setting
> the AP (Rocket) and client (Nanostation) to WDS mode. The Ubiquiti is
> staying out of the IP path now.
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Ubnt and OSPF

[Jayson Baker]

Broadcast, I guess.  Whatever is default on MT.

On Tue, Jan 12, 2010 at 6:58 PM, Jeremy Parr  wrote:

> 2010/1/12 Jayson Baker :
> > Make sure you have "Multicast Data" enabled or whatever on the Advanced
> tab.
> > Pulled my hair out over this for a couple days, then realized if it's not
> > checked, you get one-way OSPF.
> > Checked it, rebooted, and everything has been happy since.
>
> Multicast is enabled. Are you running OSPF in broadcast or ptmp?
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Ubnt and OSPF

[Jayson Baker]

Make sure you have "Multicast Data" enabled or whatever on the Advanced tab.
Pulled my hair out over this for a couple days, then realized if it's not
checked, you get one-way OSPF.
Checked it, rebooted, and everything has been happy since.

On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 9:56 PM, Jeremy Parr  wrote:

> I'm having issues with OSPF (Mikrotik) traversing an Airmax sector.
> Network consists of a Routerboard running 4.1, connected to a Rocket
> sector running XM.v5.1. Client radio is a Nanostation also running
> XM.v5.1, connected to a Routerboard running 4.2. The first routerboard
> has a number of ospf neighbors on the same interface the Rocket is
> connected to (there is a switch between the physical interface and the
> Rocket) but when a neighbor relationship is established over the UBNT
> link, strange things happen. Running a traceroute to the loopback
> address of the MT results in a routing loop, with the Nanostation
> showing up as a L3 hop. I have yet to do a packet dump, but my guess
> is that somehow the UBNT radio is mangling the OSPF multicast traffic
> and inserting itself in to the path. The notes on the UBNT forum
> regarding OSPF seem to indicate that enabling multicast forwarding on
> the radio is all that is required. See below for the MT OSPF config.
>
> /routing ospf instance
> set default comment="" disabled=no distribute-default=never
> in-filter=ospf-in metric-bgp=20 metric-connected=20 metric-default=1
> metric-other-ospf=\
>auto metric-rip=20 metric-static=20 name=default
> out-filter=ospf-out redistribute-bgp=no redistribute-connected=no
> redistribute-other-ospf=no \
>redistribute-rip=no redistribute-static=no router-id=10.254.12.3
> /routing ospf area
> set backbone area-id=0.0.0.0 comment="" disabled=no instance=default
> name=backbone type=default
> add area-id=0.0.0.1 comment="" disabled=no instance=default name=1
> type=default
> /routing ospf interface
> add authentication=md5 authentication-key=secret
> authentication-key-id=1 comment="" cost=10 dead-interval=40s
> disabled=no hello-interval=10s \
>instance-id=0 interface=wlan1 network-type=broadcast passive=no
> priority=1 retransmit-interval=5s transmit-delay=1s
> add authentication=md5 authentication-key=secret
> authentication-key-id=1 comment="" cost=10 dead-interval=40s
> disabled=no hello-interval=10s \
>instance-id=0 interface=ether1 network-type=broadcast passive=no
> priority=1 retransmit-interval=5s transmit-delay=1s
> /routing ospf network
> add area=1 comment="" disabled=no network=10.0.0.0/8
>
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] How to block p2p traffic in public Wi-Fi hotspot?

[Jayson Baker]

MikroTik firewall filter rule using the all-p2p matcher and drop as action?

On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 4:34 AM, Roman  wrote:

> Dear readers,
>
> Do you have any experience with successful blocking of P2P (eDonkey,
> Torrents etc.) traffic in your wireless networks?
>
> Any user who uses torrent client at his PC can effectively consume a lot of
> bandwidth of Wi-Fi access point, leaving other honest users with small
> portion of throughput. Port blocking does not help because nowadays P2P
> clients use random ports, encryption and other means to hide traffic
> patterns. I suppose that only one distinctive feature of such traffic
> exists: its ability to consume effective bandwidth.
>
> Do you happen to know or use any traffic shaping tools which can limit
> throughput per user?
> Thank you in advance for any thoghts, ideas etc...
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Why the telco's will never be true competitors to us

[Jayson Baker]

So lie to them, and tell them you're standing there and the DSL light is
blinking.  Or whatever they want to hear.
That person is probably a $10/hr individual paid to follow a flow chart, and
doesn't know what to do if your answers don't fall in-line with that chart.
I've done this many times.  Even just the other day I "chatted" with Dell
tech support and said "I need a new hard drive, it's making scraping and
clunking noises" in less than 5 minutes I had a new hard drive on the way,
and less than 24 hours later it was installed in the machine.  Had I told
them what was really going on, I'd of been working with them for an hour via
chat running a chkdsk and all sorts of other diagnostic tools.  In all
actuality, the thing was bad... I was just skipping all the mundane steps
they are supposed to follow, in order to determine something I already knew.

On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 2:41 PM, Marlon K. Schafer wrote:

> I have a tower down.  It's fed by a *business* grade DSL link.
>
> Can't get to the main router at that local.
>
> So I log onto the Century Tel (century link nowadays) web site go find a
> phone number for tech support.
>
> IF there is a phone number on their Microsoft Bing cloan of a web site, I
> couldn't find it.  So, I decided to try the online chat thingy.
>
> Up pops a page with a spot for a the username, phone number and zip code.
> Naturally, I put the right things in the boxes.  Only to get an error.  So
> I
> tried again, and again.  Finally I actually READ what the smallish print
> said you can ONLY put in ONE of the fields, not all of them.  Hate to allow
> any answer to work rather than make people only fill in one field where
> they
> usually have to fill in all of them.  My fault for not reading the fine
> print, but then again, I shouldn't have to
>
> Next, I finally get a tech on the screen.  Well, kinda, the web site
> doesn't
> have anything but an error at the top.  But the chat part eventually came
> up
> and a tech was on the line.  We quickly established that the tech support
> guy wasn't able to see if there was a dsl connection or not.  ug
>
> So, he gave me a phone number for tech support.
>
> I called that number only to sit on hold for a while (not t bad though)
> and then find out that that wasn't the right number for a business account.
>
> Called the next number.  Sat on hold a bit longer this time, but still only
> a few minutes.  We quickly got through all of the who are you type stuff.
> Then the gal on the support end asked me to tell her what lights were on on
> the modem.  "Um, I'm an hour and a half form there."  "Well, sir, I'm
> unable
> help you unless someone is on at the site."
>
> Sigh.  The home owner at this site is a snow bird and won't be home for
> months yet.
>
> The tech support people aren't able to tell if there is a connection or
> not.
> It's not like this is a little, rinky dink company like mine.  This is a
> HUGE telco!  Ug.
>
> They won't even try to fix a business account that I pay $1200.00 per year
> for.  Probably even more than that.  Amazing.
>
> Have a great day, I know I will.
> marlon
>
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Burnt CPE from House Fire

[Jayson Baker]

Isn't that fraud?

On Wed, Jan 6, 2010 at 11:03 PM, Robert West wrote:

> Gives me an idea  old lightning zapped cpe's  find a house
> fire.  Offer owner of house "free installation" of 6 or 7 or whatever
> number
> messed up units one may have, after the fact of course...
>
> "Dang shame, house burned down and all burned up them 47 CPE's and cisco
> router..."
>
> Bob-
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of RickG
> Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 12:14 AM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Burnt CPE from House Fire
>
> So far I've had this happen twice. Both times the customers volunteered to
> turn it into their insurance. -RickG
>
> On Wed, Jan 6, 2010 at 11:38 PM, Chuck Hogg  wrote:
>
> > Lost our first CPE from a house fire.  Guy was so down on the phone, I
> > couldn't bear to bother him with an insurance claim on the CPE.  What
> > have you done?
> >
> >
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Chuck Hogg
> >
> > Shelby Broadband
> > 502-722-9292
> > ch...@shelbybb.com 
> >
> > http://www.shelbybb.com 
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> 
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
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> >
> >
>
> 
> 
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> >
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Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.

[Jayson Baker]

Something like $30/meg for blended Qwest, Level(3), TW Telecom, Cogent.

On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 9:38 PM, RickG  wrote:

> Jayson,
>
> Really, I guess it doesnt matter. It's just that your offerings are so
> remarkable, its hard to believe its true. Most people are on this list to
> be
> helpful and to get helped. It would be helpful to know who you are, your
> business model, and how you do it. My first question would be, how much are
> you paying for bandwidth?
>
> Thanks in advance.
> -RickG (KyWiFi)
>
> On Tue, Jan 5, 2010 at 12:40 AM, Jayson Baker  >wrote:
>
> > I don't think I ever got a response to my question though... what *does*
> it
> > matter?
> >
> > We were the first broadband ISP in our area in 2001.  We were one of the
> > first ISPs to use (5.7) Canopy.  One of the very first to deploy 2.4GHz.
> >  One of the very first to deploy 900MHz.  We saw the writing on the wall
> in
> > 2005--Canopy was starting to fall behind in speed compared to it's cost
> per
> > unit.  We sold the network.  I consulted for 4 years, did software
> > development, setup a WISP in Costa Rica.  Last year we started offering
> > service again, and are again growing very quickly.
> >
> > Less than 30 seconds on Google and I came up with this: peakinter.net
> >
> > On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 10:02 PM, Travis Johnson  wrote:
> >
> > > Oh boy... here we go...
> > >
> > > Just a few weeks ago we tried to track down Jayson on the Motorola
> > > mailing list (because several people had issues of knowing where his
> > > expertise and experience was coming from). We have never been able to
> > > get an idea of how many subs, his real website, company name or any
> > > other information about him or the companies he works or consults for.
> > > And when asked, all he says is "why does it matter?".
> > >
> > > Travis
> > > Microserv
> > >
> > > RickG wrote:
> > > > Jayson,
> > > >
> > > > You dont offer speed packages?
> > > > I cant find your website at www.spectrasurf.com?
> > > >
> > > > -RickG
> > > >
> > > > On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 9:21 PM, Jayson Baker  >
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >> All users get limited at 12Mbps.  Most are capable of 8-10ish.
> > > >>
> > > >> On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 7:16 PM, Robert West <
> > robert.w...@just-micro.com
> > > >>
> > > >>> wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>> What's your average speed tier?  Maybe it's more noticeable by
> those
> > > who
> > > >>> offer slower speeds sue to lack of affordable bandwidth?  Just a
> > guess.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Yes, I know, bandwidth is bandwidth but someone who is married to
> > their
> > > >>> network trying to squeeze each kb out of it will be more sensitive
> to
> > > >>> upward
> > > >>> swings in the usage as opposed to someone who is more endowed in
> the
> > > >>> bandwidth area.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Visuals unintended but it happened and seems to make sense..
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Bob-
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>> -Original Message-
> > > >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:
> wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> > > On
> > > >>> Behalf Of can...@believewireless.net
> > > >>> Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 9:11 PM
> > > >>> To: WISPA General List
> > > >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> We really aren't seeing much of a change either.   We are seeing a
> > > >>> small number of users using more bandwidth but nothing crazy.
> > > >>> However, we have plenty of cheap bandwidth with two redundant fiber
> > > >>> connections and 60GHz/licensed connection to tower.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Our main concern is the limitation of the APs.  Some nights our
> > Canopy
> > > >>> APs are maxed out on bandwidth.  However, we use the Mikrotik
> > > >>> suggested QoS in our routers and we haven't had a single call
> > > >>> complaining of slow speeds.
> > > >&g

Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.

[Jayson Baker]

I don't think I ever got a response to my question though... what *does* it
matter?

We were the first broadband ISP in our area in 2001.  We were one of the
first ISPs to use (5.7) Canopy.  One of the very first to deploy 2.4GHz.
 One of the very first to deploy 900MHz.  We saw the writing on the wall in
2005--Canopy was starting to fall behind in speed compared to it's cost per
unit.  We sold the network.  I consulted for 4 years, did software
development, setup a WISP in Costa Rica.  Last year we started offering
service again, and are again growing very quickly.

Less than 30 seconds on Google and I came up with this: peakinter.net

On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 10:02 PM, Travis Johnson  wrote:

> Oh boy... here we go...
>
> Just a few weeks ago we tried to track down Jayson on the Motorola
> mailing list (because several people had issues of knowing where his
> expertise and experience was coming from). We have never been able to
> get an idea of how many subs, his real website, company name or any
> other information about him or the companies he works or consults for.
> And when asked, all he says is "why does it matter?".
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> RickG wrote:
> > Jayson,
> >
> > You dont offer speed packages?
> > I cant find your website at www.spectrasurf.com?
> >
> > -RickG
> >
> > On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 9:21 PM, Jayson Baker 
> wrote:
> >
> >
> >> All users get limited at 12Mbps.  Most are capable of 8-10ish.
> >>
> >> On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 7:16 PM, Robert West  >>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> What's your average speed tier?  Maybe it's more noticeable by those
> who
> >>> offer slower speeds sue to lack of affordable bandwidth?  Just a guess.
> >>>
> >>> Yes, I know, bandwidth is bandwidth but someone who is married to their
> >>> network trying to squeeze each kb out of it will be more sensitive to
> >>> upward
> >>> swings in the usage as opposed to someone who is more endowed in the
> >>> bandwidth area.
> >>>
> >>> Visuals unintended but it happened and seems to make sense..
> >>>
> >>> Bob-
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -Original Message-
> >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> On
> >>> Behalf Of can...@believewireless.net
> >>> Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 9:11 PM
> >>> To: WISPA General List
> >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.
> >>>
> >>> We really aren't seeing much of a change either.   We are seeing a
> >>> small number of users using more bandwidth but nothing crazy.
> >>> However, we have plenty of cheap bandwidth with two redundant fiber
> >>> connections and 60GHz/licensed connection to tower.
> >>>
> >>> Our main concern is the limitation of the APs.  Some nights our Canopy
> >>> APs are maxed out on bandwidth.  However, we use the Mikrotik
> >>> suggested QoS in our routers and we haven't had a single call
> >>> complaining of slow speeds.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> 
> >>
> >>> 
> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> 
> >>
> >>> 
> >>>
> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>>
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> >>>
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> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
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> >>
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Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.

[Jayson Baker]

I'm not the one seeing issues.  :-)  Unless you mean, my overall usage isn't
matching our overall new sub count.

On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 7:35 PM, Marco Coelho  wrote:

> That might be where you're seeing the issue.
>
> What is the typical max throughput both up and down of your AP?
> How many customers do you typically have per AP?
>
> mc
>
> On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 8:21 PM, Jayson Baker 
> wrote:
> > All users get limited at 12Mbps.  Most are capable of 8-10ish.
> >
> > On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 7:16 PM, Robert West  >wrote:
> >
> >> What's your average speed tier?  Maybe it's more noticeable by those who
> >> offer slower speeds sue to lack of affordable bandwidth?  Just a guess.
> >>
> >> Yes, I know, bandwidth is bandwidth but someone who is married to their
> >> network trying to squeeze each kb out of it will be more sensitive to
> >> upward
> >> swings in the usage as opposed to someone who is more endowed in the
> >> bandwidth area.
> >>
> >> Visuals unintended but it happened and seems to make sense..
> >>
> >> Bob-
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> >> Behalf Of can...@believewireless.net
> >> Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 9:11 PM
> >> To: WISPA General List
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.
> >>
> >> We really aren't seeing much of a change either.   We are seeing a
> >> small number of users using more bandwidth but nothing crazy.
> >> However, we have plenty of cheap bandwidth with two redundant fiber
> >> connections and 60GHz/licensed connection to tower.
> >>
> >> Our main concern is the limitation of the APs.  Some nights our Canopy
> >> APs are maxed out on bandwidth.  However, we use the Mikrotik
> >> suggested QoS in our routers and we haven't had a single call
> >> complaining of slow speeds.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> >>
> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Marco C. Coelho
> Argon Technologies Inc.
> POB 875
> Greenville, TX 75403-0875
> 903-455-5036
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.

[Jayson Baker]

All users get limited at 12Mbps.  Most are capable of 8-10ish.

On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 7:16 PM, Robert West wrote:

> What's your average speed tier?  Maybe it's more noticeable by those who
> offer slower speeds sue to lack of affordable bandwidth?  Just a guess.
>
> Yes, I know, bandwidth is bandwidth but someone who is married to their
> network trying to squeeze each kb out of it will be more sensitive to
> upward
> swings in the usage as opposed to someone who is more endowed in the
> bandwidth area.
>
> Visuals unintended but it happened and seems to make sense..
>
> Bob-
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of can...@believewireless.net
> Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 9:11 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.
>
> We really aren't seeing much of a change either.   We are seeing a
> small number of users using more bandwidth but nothing crazy.
> However, we have plenty of cheap bandwidth with two redundant fiber
> connections and 60GHz/licensed connection to tower.
>
> Our main concern is the limitation of the APs.  Some nights our Canopy
> APs are maxed out on bandwidth.  However, we use the Mikrotik
> suggested QoS in our routers and we haven't had a single call
> complaining of slow speeds.
>
>
>
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
> 
>
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>
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>
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>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Was question: now bandwidth use.

[Jayson Baker]

Weird.  Ours is completely the opposite.  We keep adding customers by the
truck load, but bandwidth only slowly climbs.

*knock on wood*  Never said I minded, though!

On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 12:55 PM, MDK  wrote:

> I'm seeing the same thing.
>
> I can literally track it month to month and show the bill and useage going
> up each month by far more than the growth of our customer base.
>
> In 3 months I've added 25% to my useage.
>
> KA-POW!   That's one serious bunch of data useage.
>
>
>
> --
> From: "Marlon K. Schafer" 
> Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 10:58 AM
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] 2010: One Question for WISPs
>
> > LOL
> >
> > What kind of question is that?  big grin
> >
> > The short answer is, it depends.
> >
> > I'm much more excited about the technology in use.  I'm much more excited
> > about how many customers we can take care of with the same amount of
> staff
> > etc.  Technologically life is better than ever.
> >
> > I'm not excited about usage.  This netflix thing is looking like it'll
> > have
> > a bigger impact than Napster had in the past.  With the new usage there
> is
> > NO incentive for the customer to purchase new faster services like there
> > was
> > when we went from dialup to broadband.
> >
> > My bill for upstream went up by nearly 10% last month alone!  This based
> > on
> > the 95% usage mechanism we're billed for.  It's up by almost twice over
> > the
> > last 12 months.  This in spite of a 50% DROP in per mb/s costs from that
> > particular provider.
> >
> > Unless costs go WAY down or we find a way to bill the content providers
> > for
> > the traffic that's being generated I'm not sure what will happen over the
> > next 3 to 5 years.  Per bit billing only works if everyone (or nearly
> > everyone) does it.
> >
> > Xbox is also a problem these days.  No other gaming system out there is
> as
> > picky with the network design or performance.  Not even close.  Xbox
> > requires very nearly perfect connections between the gamers or there are
> > significant lag issues that drive the gamers nuts.
> >
> > I don't see any trend in the content providers giving a rats behind about
> > what their crappy encryption mechanisms etc. do to the transport people.
> > I
> > don't see any improvements on the horizon.
> >
> > On a good note though, this has to be just KILLING the big players.  At
> > least we have a somewhat captive audience, often a forgiving and tech
> > savvy
> > one at that.  People who "just don't get it" don't often last long in the
> > sticks, they have to be able to hire help for everything they need so
> they
> > end up in the cities :-).
> >
> > If we last the next 5 years I think we'll be in good shape.  But for the
> > first time since I've been in business I'm worried about the business
> > models.  I just can't find one that works for us and the customer.
> >
> > laters,
> > marlon
> >
> >
> >
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Patrick Leary" 
> > To: "WISPA General List" 
> > Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 8:47 AM
> > Subject: [WISPA] 2010: One Question for WISPs
> >
> >
> >> Happy New Year folks. One simple multiple choice question:
> >>
> >> For 2010, are you more or less optimistic than you were in 2009?
> >>
> >> A - Much more
> >> B - Somewhat more
> >> C - Same
> >> D - More pessimistic
> >>
> >> If you'd care to explain your answer, that's be great.
> >>
> >> Thank,
> >>
> >> Patrick
> >>
> >>
> >> Patrick Leary
> >> Aperto Networks
> >> 813.426.4230 mobile
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> 
> >
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> >
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> >
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>
>
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] power management tools for cell sites

[Jayson Baker]

If you're looking to monitor only, check these out:
http://www.theenergydetective.com/index.html

They talk to Google.  Yes, Google is now tracking your power consumption as
well.  Who knew.
http://www.google.org/powermeter/

On Sun, Dec 27, 2009 at 10:58 AM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> I just installed one of those dot net WattsUp ethernet meters on a
> vending machine a few weeks ago.  Pretty neat!
>
> On 12/27/09, Marlon K. Schafer  wrote:
> > I use them all over the place these days.  Saves a LOT of driving.
> >
> > Also, the bigger unit does give you the current voltage at the site.
> > marlon
> >
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Mike" 
> > To: ; "WISPA General List" 
> > Sent: Thursday, December 24, 2009 7:25 PM
> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] power management tools for cell sites
> >
> >
> >> Check out DigitalLoggers:  http://www.digital-loggers.com/din.html
> >>
> >> They have some cool devices.  I use them at tower sites and can
> >> reboot individual devices.  The DIN relays might work for you.  I use
> >> the web switches a couple places.
> >>
> >> Mike
> >>
> >>
> >> At 08:24 PM 12/24/2009, you wrote:
> >>>I'm hoping someone on this list might recommend me some power
> >>>management options for cell sites.
> >>>
> >>>Ideally, I would like something that does the following:
> >>>
> >>>--auto-reboots a device when an IP address does not ping
> >>>--is ruggedized for outdoor environments (or is easy to stuff in a
> >>>NEMA 4X box)
> >>>--let's me http or ssh in and reboot certain ports
> >>>--is affordable enough where I could just budget it in with all of the
> >>>cameras and wireless devices
> >>>
> >>>Tools like iBoot are a step in the right direction, but it doesn't
> >>>seem to have very many features, and I will likely want some SNMP
> >>>features so I could, say, graph the power levels in Cacti .
> >>>
> >>>(The idea here is to be able to proactively troubleshoot stuff to
> >>>avoid a truck roll, and if I do have to do a truck roll, I know that
> >>>the most obvious power-related stuff has been done first)
> >>>
> >>>
>
> >>>
> >>>WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >>>http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> >>>
> >>>
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> >>>
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> >>>
> >>>Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> 
> >>
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> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
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> >
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> >
>
>
> --
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
> --- Albert Einstein
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] 5.8 dishes

[Jayson Baker]

TWELVE FOOT for a 7 mile link?  What's your signal like on the other end,
-0?  Holy cow!

On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 7:17 PM, Philip Dorr
wrote:

> We are also using a 12 foot Andrew dish with 6GHz feed horn for a
> 5.8GHz 7 mile link (the other side is a Pac Wireless 3 foot dish)
>
> On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 7:09 PM, Jayson Baker 
> wrote:
> > Us too.  We have used a lot of the 2' and 3' PacWireless dishes.  Work
> fine.
> > Used a couple 4' RadioWaves dishes and those worked fine too.  Although
> the
> > feedhorn mount is kinda flimsy and was bent on arrival.
> >
> > On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 6:06 PM, Josh Luthman
> > wrote:
> >
> >> I've been happy with both pairs of 2 foot Pac dishes.
> >>
> >> On 12/23/09, Philip Dorr  wrote:
> >> > We use Pac Wireless 3 foot dishes with ray dome on most of our PTP
> links
> >> >
> >> > On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 6:31 PM, Michael Baird 
> wrote:
> >> >> I'm looking for opinions on 5.8 dishes, if you've got any extra you
> are
> >> >> looking to dump message me, I've got a 28db dish and some 26db/30 db
> >> >> grids, neither of the grids work as well as 2 foot dish. Would like
> 32
> >> >> db on up, I just need one to compare to my existing dishes.
> >> >>
> >> >> Regards
> >> >> Michael Baird
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> 
> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >> >>
> >>
> 
> >> >>
> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >> >>
> >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >> >>
> >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> 
> >> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >> >
> >>
> 
> >> >
> >> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >> >
> >> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >> >
> >> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Josh Luthman
> >> Office: 937-552-2340
> >> Direct: 937-552-2343
> >> 1100 Wayne St
> >> Suite 1337
> >> Troy, OH 45373
> >>
> >> "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
> >> --- Albert Einstein
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> >>
> 
> >>
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> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> 
> >
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> >
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] 5.8 dishes

[Jayson Baker]

Us too.  We have used a lot of the 2' and 3' PacWireless dishes.  Work fine.
Used a couple 4' RadioWaves dishes and those worked fine too.  Although the
feedhorn mount is kinda flimsy and was bent on arrival.

On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 6:06 PM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> I've been happy with both pairs of 2 foot Pac dishes.
>
> On 12/23/09, Philip Dorr  wrote:
> > We use Pac Wireless 3 foot dishes with ray dome on most of our PTP links
> >
> > On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 6:31 PM, Michael Baird  wrote:
> >> I'm looking for opinions on 5.8 dishes, if you've got any extra you are
> >> looking to dump message me, I've got a 28db dish and some 26db/30 db
> >> grids, neither of the grids work as well as 2 foot dish. Would like 32
> >> db on up, I just need one to compare to my existing dishes.
> >>
> >> Regards
> >> Michael Baird
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
>
>
> --
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
> --- Albert Einstein
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti Bullet2HP

[Jayson Baker]

Why would you want the connector on the bottom?  So it can fill up with
water?
Being on the top, the water will run over the connector and not fill it.
 Makes sense to me.
Of course, we still seal them up.

On Fri, Dec 18, 2009 at 9:06 AM, Jeremy Parr  wrote:

> No, but they could have put the connectors on the bottom of the
> antenna, and on the bottom of the radio (where they belong!) And used
> a 12" piece of lmr240.
>
> On 12/18/09, Robert West  wrote:
> > Yeah, that would be a nicer cable.  Honestly I'm afraid of popping the
> > connector off the UBNT ones when I have to bend it so sharply.  It must
> have
> > been another tradeoff since the area between the rocket and the connector
> on
> > the antenna is so small, you probably couldn’t bend a much thicker cable
> in
> > such a tight loop.
> >
> > Bob-
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> > Behalf Of Jeremy Parr
> > Sent: Friday, December 18, 2009 10:34 AM
> > To: WISPA General List
> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti Bullet2HP
> >
> > Trango uses SMA connectors for their external antennas, but with
> > LMR240, rather than whatever it is that UBNT uses.
> >
> > 2009/12/18 Robert West :
> >> I haven't come across that little issue yet, thanks for the heads up!  I
> >> like the price and some of the shortcuts contribute to that but you're
> >> right, some things need to be more rugged for where they are installed
> and
> >> even HOW they are installed.  The mounting brackets are fantastic, I was
> >> impressed by them but the connectors are the opposite.  I can accept the
> > SMA
> >> connectors but only if they're going to the attached rocket.  I still
> > shake
> >> my head at it though.  Must be my old way of thinking.
> >>
> >> Bob-
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> >> Behalf Of Jeremy Parr
> >> Sent: Friday, December 18, 2009 9:48 AM
> >> To: WISPA General List
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti Bullet2HP
> >>
> >> We found the same problem with the sna cables on the airmax sectors.
> >> Pull just a little bit too hand and the cable pulls out of the
> >> connecter. Why any manufacturer would think that cables that small are
> >> suitable for outdoor use is beyond me.
> >>
> >> On 12/18/09, Robert West  wrote:
> >>> I've had 2 of the Bullet5HP's have bad connectors, not the 2's.  Being
> > the
> >>> geek type, took them apart and found that the fingers coming off the
> >>> connector had very little solder on them and none was only under the
> >>> connector and not on the sides or top.  Essentially only enough to tack
> > it
> >>> on.  The first one that came loose I thought it was my fault for
> pushing
> >> it
> >>> too hard so I didn't do an RMA and just fixed it myself and when the
> >> second
> >>> happened, fixed that one too.  Easier than an RMA just for solder.
> >>> Personally I'd like to see a more robust LAN connector and have it
> >> attached
> >>> better in the front to avoid rocking.
> >>>
> >>> Bob-
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -Original Message-
> >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> On
> >>> Behalf Of RickG
> >>> Sent: Friday, December 18, 2009 2:57 AM
> >>> To: WISPA General List
> >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti Bullet2HP
> >>>
> >>> I'll double-check the connectors and let you know.
> >>>
> >>> On Thu, Dec 17, 2009 at 8:49 AM, Michael Baird 
> wrote:
> >>>
>  Rick,
> 
>  I read something about guys complaining about high rates of failure
> with
>  the connectors on the latest batch 10/22/2009 or something.
> 
>  Regards
>  Michael Baird
>  > Anyone having issues with flaky Bullet2HP units? The last batch I
> got
>  wont
>  > connect to my StarOS/WRAP's. Actually, I discovered they do connect
> > but
>  have
>  > 80+% packet loss. I updated them to 3.5 firmware but no help.
> Previous
>  > shipments have worked great. -RickG
>  >
>  >
>  >
> 
> >>>
> >>
> >
> 
> >>> 
>  > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>  > http://signup.wispa.org/
>  >
> 
> >>>
> >>
> >
> 
> >>> 
>  >
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> 
> 
> 
> 
> >>>
> >>
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> 
> >>> 
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Re: [WISPA] I'm an idiot

[Jayson Baker]

ROFL!!  No, I just carry a large 16oz bottle of Germ-X (the one with the
pump) in my front pocket.
Makes it easy to squirt.  In fact, one in each pocket.  Right hand, left
hand.  ROFLMAO

Anyway... a guy that did our climbing 10 years ago wore them while climbing
80' during a snowstorm and wind.
His hands never got cold.  Then I saw that Tessco sold them, so I figured
maybe it was a neat trick.
Tried it, and sure enough.  Keeps the moisture in, but doesn't let the wind
hit your fingers I guess.

Next time I go into the truck I'll see who makes those gloves.  They don't
sell this model at Home Depot.
That same manufacturer sells gloves at home depot, but are labeled
"Handyman" and don't have the little sticky pads.
Not really sticky either, but they grip very well.

On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 10:57 PM, Robert West wrote:

> And then we find out later that Jayson actually wears latex gloves 24 hours
> a day and rationalizes it to himself and everyone around him with tips and
> stories such as this one.
>
> Jayson, it's a phobia.  The germs will always be with us and they aren't
> here to hurt you.  Step out of your protective cocoon of lies and join us
> in
> the germs.  It's okay
>
>
>
> But seriously, sounds like the latex has merit.  Sticky palms on the
> gloves?
> I'll look for those next time I'm spending the traditional one hundred
> bucks
> per visit at the Home Depot.
>
> Bob-
>
>
> -----Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Jayson Baker
> Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 12:46 AM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] I'm an idiot
>
> Wear latex gloves.  Keeps the wind off your fingers and actually makes a
> BIG
> difference.
> When I climb, I wear latex and then some brand they sell at Home Depot as
> "Handyman" gloves with velcro, but I got them from Tessco and they're
> "sticky" on the palms.  They were like $40.
> When I take the other gloves off to do work I leave the latex on.  Even
> that
> little separation from the metal makes a big difference too.
>
> I know it sounds dumb.  But try it.
>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 4:15 PM, Robert West
> wrote:
>
> > I'm an idiot.
> >
> >
> >
> > Had to climb to the top of a tower this afternoon.  300 foot tower.
>  Drive
> > to the tower, put on the harness and all the other crap, grab the hat,
> all
> > good.  No gloves.  Figures.  Where are the gloves?  The NEW gloves?
>  Home.
> > All I had was a thin pair of leather work gloves.  Did I go up?
> Certainly,
> > because I'm an idiot.
> >
> >
> >
> >  I can now almost feel my fingers.
> >
> >
> >
> > Was a balmy 28 degrees out with winds to 17 mph.
> >
> >
> >
> > Just had to share my utter stupidity.  Never again.
> >
> >
> >
> > Robert West
> >
> > Just Micro Digital Services Inc.
> >
> > 740-335-7020
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> 
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
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> >
> >
>
> 
> 
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> >
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> >
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> >
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>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] I'm an idiot

[Jayson Baker]

Wear latex gloves.  Keeps the wind off your fingers and actually makes a BIG
difference.
When I climb, I wear latex and then some brand they sell at Home Depot as
"Handyman" gloves with velcro, but I got them from Tessco and they're
"sticky" on the palms.  They were like $40.
When I take the other gloves off to do work I leave the latex on.  Even that
little separation from the metal makes a big difference too.

I know it sounds dumb.  But try it.

On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 4:15 PM, Robert West wrote:

> I'm an idiot.
>
>
>
> Had to climb to the top of a tower this afternoon.  300 foot tower.  Drive
> to the tower, put on the harness and all the other crap, grab the hat, all
> good.  No gloves.  Figures.  Where are the gloves?  The NEW gloves?  Home.
> All I had was a thin pair of leather work gloves.  Did I go up?  Certainly,
> because I'm an idiot.
>
>
>
>  I can now almost feel my fingers.
>
>
>
> Was a balmy 28 degrees out with winds to 17 mph.
>
>
>
> Just had to share my utter stupidity.  Never again.
>
>
>
> Robert West
>
> Just Micro Digital Services Inc.
>
> 740-335-7020
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
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> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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Re: [WISPA] Anyone have nanostation m5 in stock?

[Jayson Baker]

Sean at CTI probably has them.
svanwor...@cticonnect.com

On Fri, Dec 11, 2009 at 9:29 AM,  wrote:

> Just need two.
>
> Greg
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Wind! - RMA on a Mikrotik 411 board, anyone?

[Jayson Baker]

MT can tell you who they sold the board to by the license key.
Of, if you're "cool" and have a login to their site, you can request the key
to be added to your account, and it'll tell you where it came from.

On Wed, Dec 9, 2009 at 6:45 PM, Robert West wrote:

> Turned out to be
>
> The 411 card.  "HUH?"  I hear ya say.  I dunno either.  I attacked the
> cables first thing, replaced the pig tail, the short extension of lmr-400
> from the pac grid to enclosure, cat5 to router.  Man!  Still dead!  So I
> connected my laptop directly into the 411 board and no response. Reset,
> still nothing.  Lights up, gives me one beep but never completes the boot,
> no cute "beep beep" of satisfaction.  Got it here at home, no manner of
> resetting gets it, can't get in via serial.  Could go with the jtag but I
> don't want to deal with putting the pins on it.  Bummer.
>
> Only 4 months old, this one is. "Now where did I buy the thing?" is what
> I'm
> asking myself.   MT says to RMA through the distributor but I pick these
> things up from whoever has the UBNT stuff in stock at the time, I just add
> to the order.  The invoices don't list the MAC ID or serial number, not
> that
> I can see.  Could be Streakwave, Wlanparts or Wisp-router.  I think I
> bought
> a few things form Jeffs Soho, might have just been 433's
>
> Anyhow, any tips on the RMA on these things?  Does it really matter who
> gets
> the hit?  I'd vote for Streakwave, they're closer.
>
> Bob-
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of MDK
> Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 1:45 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Wind!
>
> The last time I experienced that, it was a bad cable end, where the wind
> had
>
> shaken the last 18 inches of 400 size cable - the distance from the last
> clamp to the N connector, and the N connector had literally shaken apart.
> The entire braiding had broken loose and the compression on the foam inner
> had crushed until the whole cable began creeping out of the connector.
>  It
>
> was cold, and even the shrink wrap had cracked, and the tape wrapped over
> that was just slowly stretching...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> From: "Robert West" 
> Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 8:12 AM
> To: "'WISPA General List'" 
> Subject: [WISPA] Wind!
>
> > Windy today, supposed to have gusts up to 50mph before days end.  I was
> > monitoring some backhaul links, had one bouncing from -72 to -83.  Up and
> > down.  I'm thinking, uh-oh, got a grid loose someplace, better go fix it
> > now
> > before it gets worse.  I go out, first end solid as can be.  I even shake
> > the heck out of it, all good.  I guess the other end is messed up.  Go
> > out,
> > also solid.  Look at the laptop, still bouncing.  Using pac 28dbi grids
> > with
> > 411 boards R52h cards on both sides.  First grid is at 60', second at
> 100'
> > No trees, heck I can almost see the other end with my naked and cold eye.
> > It's only 4 miles out.  Link is normally -72.  Maybe junk being tossed up
> > in
> > the wind?  That would be a lot ot junk for -10 drop in RSSI I would
> think.
> >
> >
> >
> > Just sharing.  Weird.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Robert West
> >
> > Just Micro Digital Services Inc.
> >
> > 740-335-7020
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> 
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
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Re: [WISPA] Wind!

[Jayson Baker]

Maybe the wind is blowing the 1's away before they get to the other end.  I
think 0's are good up to about 100MPH.

On Wed, Dec 9, 2009 at 9:12 AM, Robert West wrote:

> Windy today, supposed to have gusts up to 50mph before days end.  I was
> monitoring some backhaul links, had one bouncing from -72 to -83.  Up and
> down.  I'm thinking, uh-oh, got a grid loose someplace, better go fix it
> now
> before it gets worse.  I go out, first end solid as can be.  I even shake
> the heck out of it, all good.  I guess the other end is messed up.  Go out,
> also solid.  Look at the laptop, still bouncing.  Using pac 28dbi grids
> with
> 411 boards R52h cards on both sides.  First grid is at 60', second at 100'
> No trees, heck I can almost see the other end with my naked and cold eye.
> It's only 4 miles out.  Link is normally -72.  Maybe junk being tossed up
> in
> the wind?  That would be a lot ot junk for -10 drop in RSSI I would think.
>
>
>
> Just sharing.  Weird.
>
>
>
>
>
> Robert West
>
> Just Micro Digital Services Inc.
>
> 740-335-7020
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Lanyards and Rebar Hooks

[Jayson Baker]

Lanyards and such... Tessco.

On Wed, Dec 9, 2009 at 8:59 AM, Robert West wrote:

> Looking for a source for lanyards with rebar hooks but for a decent price,
> as in cheap but not so cheap I'll kill myself using it.Yeah, I can
> Google all day looking, and lots of times I do, but thought if someone is
> happy with a supplier who has good quality and decent price, may as well
> ask.
>
>
>
> ALSO.  Man, I've been trying to buy a tower jack for Rohn 25g sections for
> months!  The guy who makes it, his site is up but phone disconnected, no
> answer to email.  I call Tesco, EXPENSIVE but they tell me out of stock
> anyhow.I call wb0w, they tell me to call the number of the guy who
> makes
> it, the disconnected number of course, and a place north of me also lists
> it
> so I stopped in, and sure enough, we no have, call the guy who makes it.
>
>
>
> Right.  I'm going to go back to hauling a bottle jack and wood 100+ feet up
> on a Rohn 25g.  I'm so flippin' pleased.  I'm about to just haul a saws all
> up and be done with it.
>
>
>
>
>
> Robert West
>
> Just Micro Digital Services Inc.
>
> 740-335-7020
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Rocket range

[Jayson Baker]

Depends on what the customer will be using.  NanoM?  BulletM?  What kind of
antenna?

As a rule, should be fine.  Rocket M -> Nano M should work at that range
decent.

On Tue, Dec 8, 2009 at 12:11 PM, Forbes Mercy
wrote:

> We want to put up an "M" Rocket in 5gig frequency range and have four
> customers between 6-8 miles.  Will our 17dbi 120 degree antenna reach
> them?
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure

[Jayson Baker]

Yeah, they're bad.  Trust me.  When we very first started using MT that was
all that was available.  They're total garbage.

On Thu, Dec 3, 2009 at 9:01 AM,  wrote:

> I know some special purpose plastic enclosures made for RF work have
> conductive/shielding qualities to them. There's even conductive/shielding
> paint one can buy for RF projects. So those plastic boxes might not be as
> bad as you think.
>
> Greg
>
>
> On Dec 3, 2009, at 10:50 AM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>
> > More along the lines of plastic enclosures versus metal enclosures.
> >
> > Josh Luthman
> > Office: 937-552-2340
> > Direct: 937-552-2343
> > 1100 Wayne St
> > Suite 1337
> > Troy, OH 45373
> >
> > "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
> > --- Albert Einstein
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Dec 3, 2009 at 10:47 AM, Robert West  >wrote:
> >
> >> Plastic next to the antennas???  CRAZY!  So the radios pretty much talk
> to
> >> themselves a lot, huh.  Hearing voices in their heads.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> >> Behalf Of Jayson Baker
> >> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 10:36 PM
> >> To: WISPA General List
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure
> >>
> >> I have to laugh at one of our competitors who uses PLASTIC enclosures
> next
> >> to their antennas on the tower.  Even on the most RF-jam packed sites.
>  One
> >> site in particular you can almost get a fluorescent light to glow just
> >> holding it in your hands.  And there they are with their plastic
> >> enclosures.  And can't figure out why their system sucks ass.
> >>
> >> Oh well.  They burned us for over $100k in consulting fees and
> equipment.
> >> It makes me laugh everytime I see it.
> >>
> >> On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 8:30 PM, Marlon K. Schafer
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> I've given up on this.  There is just too much cross talk.  I put all
> >>> radios
> >>> in the same band in their own METAL enclosure nowadays.  I try to keep
> >> them
> >>> at least 3 or 6 feet apart too.  Life is much much nicer.
> >>> marlon
> >>>
> >>> - Original Message -
> >>> From: "Mike" 
> >>> To: "WISPA General List" 
> >>> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 8:13 AM
> >>> Subject: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> Since I am probably one of the veterans called out yesterday for my
> >>>> messaging etiquette, I am changing the subject.
> >>>>
> >>>> I am interested in the multiple radios in an enclosure idea.  I do
> >>>> have a couple with 5.8 and 2.4 gear in the same box, but have been
> >>>> afraid to put cards in the same band in the same case.
> >>>>
> >>>> The foil spacer you put between cards Bob, do you then ground it to
> >>>> create a sort of Faraday shield?  I know the XRx cards do a good job
> >>>> of shielding if you attach the pigtail.
> >>>>
> >>>> How about the receive sensitivity on the 411 cards?  Has that been an
> >>>> issue?  I think the XR cards have better specs.  Wouldn't having
> >>>> multiple 411 cards in the same box possibly have desense issues too?
> >>>>
> >>>> Mike
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> At 09:41 AM 12/2/2009, you wrote:
> >>>>> Forgot to add, if you're concerned with any RF collisions inside the
> >> box,
> >>>>> the other thing I talked about earlier, having just 3 411 cards in
> >> their
> >>>>> own
> >>>>> box at the sector then running Cat5 to transparent bridge the 411's
> to
> >> a
> >>>>> central RouterOS device would take any of that issue totally away.
> >>> That's
> >>>>> one that I'm doing just to do it, basically.  Was an idea from
> someone
> >> a
> >>>>> couple of months ago.  (I actually listen to you guys)  Had a 600a
> >> doing
> >>>>> nothing and some 411 cards "so why not play?" was my thinking.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Bob-
> >>>>>
> >>>&g

Re: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure

[Jayson Baker]

Interesting.  I don't doubt it, but have to think about that for a bit to
wrap my head around it.

Anyway... we use the PacWireless DCE enclosures for 90% of things (we use
411-form-factor boards in almost everything).  We bought like 100 of them,
and still have a few around for this or that.
If you're running 433/333/600 you need a larger enclosure.  There is a new
one out, I think Microcom was claiming it, but I've seen it on Streakwave
and WISP I think?  It's f'ing expensive though.

We also used some of the larger ones sold by WISP.  They have 4 hex-screws
in each corner, and either 2 or 4 N-holes in the bottom.  The Ethernet
pass-thru is JUNK and unshielded.  Better yet, the last box we installed,
when we went to service it on a tower, opened and the climber got doused
(not douched!) with water.  It was full.  Stay away from those.

On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 10:41 PM, MDK  wrote:

> Aluminum is moderately effective at attenuating microwave rf.
>
> Steel is needed to dampen EMP (from lightning strikes).
>
>
>
> --
> From: "Josh Luthman" 
> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 8:35 PM
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure
>
> > Does die cast aluminum count as metal in this case?  Do you normally use
> > steel if not?
> >
> > I use these:
> > http://quicklinkwireless.com/Itemdesc.asp?ic=DCE-H-LG-2&eq=&Tp=
> >
> > Josh Luthman
> > Office: 937-552-2340
> > Direct: 937-552-2343
> > 1100 Wayne St
> > Suite 1337
> > Troy, OH 45373
> >
> > "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
> > --- Albert Einstein
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 10:30 PM, Marlon K. Schafer
> > wrote:
> >
> >> I've given up on this.  There is just too much cross talk.  I put all
> >> radios
> >> in the same band in their own METAL enclosure nowadays.  I try to keep
> >> them
> >> at least 3 or 6 feet apart too.  Life is much much nicer.
> >> marlon
> >>
> >> - Original Message -
> >> From: "Mike" 
> >> To: "WISPA General List" 
> >> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 8:13 AM
> >> Subject: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure
> >>
> >>
> >> > Since I am probably one of the veterans called out yesterday for my
> >> > messaging etiquette, I am changing the subject.
> >> >
> >> > I am interested in the multiple radios in an enclosure idea.  I do
> >> > have a couple with 5.8 and 2.4 gear in the same box, but have been
> >> > afraid to put cards in the same band in the same case.
> >> >
> >> > The foil spacer you put between cards Bob, do you then ground it to
> >> > create a sort of Faraday shield?  I know the XRx cards do a good job
> >> > of shielding if you attach the pigtail.
> >> >
> >> > How about the receive sensitivity on the 411 cards?  Has that been an
> >> > issue?  I think the XR cards have better specs.  Wouldn't having
> >> > multiple 411 cards in the same box possibly have desense issues too?
> >> >
> >> > Mike
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > At 09:41 AM 12/2/2009, you wrote:
> >> >>Forgot to add, if you're concerned with any RF collisions inside the
> >> >>box,
> >> >>the other thing I talked about earlier, having just 3 411 cards in
> >> >>their
> >> >>own
> >> >>box at the sector then running Cat5 to transparent bridge the 411's to
> >> >>a
> >> >>central RouterOS device would take any of that issue totally away.
> >>  That's
> >> >>one that I'm doing just to do it, basically.  Was an idea from someone
> >> >>a
> >> >>couple of months ago.  (I actually listen to you guys)  Had a 600a
> >> >>doing
> >> >>nothing and some 411 cards "so why not play?" was my thinking.
> >> >>
> >> >>Bob-
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>-Original Message-
> >> >>From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> On
> >> >>Behalf Of Mike
> >> >>Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:48 AM
> >> >>To: WISPA General List
> >> >>Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors
> >> >>
> >> >>Have you had any issues with putting 3 radio cards in the same
> >> >>spectrum in the same box?  I've thought about that but wondered if
> >> >>there would be desense issues where one transmitting desensitizes
> >> >>another one listening.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>At 08:38 AM 12/2/2009, you wrote:
> >> >> >Yep, looks like you're hitting the wall.  We aren't lucky enough to
> >> push
> >> >> >3
> >> >> >meg here, the most is usually 1 so again, all depends on your
> >> >> >customer
> >> >>base.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >I'd say if you already have 35 on that one AP, just splitting it
> into
> >> >> >2
> >> >> >180
> >> >> >degree sectors will just cost you cash as soon as you gain a few
> more
> >> >> >customers.  You already have 35 pulling it down, sounds like if you
> >> just
> >> >> >do
> >> >> >2 180's, if split evenly (and it never will be) that would put you
> to
> >> >> >where
> >> >> >you probably want to be for smooth delivery but not much room for
> >> >> >more
> >> >> >growth.  I'd go with 3 120's and a 433AH with 3 cards on it, one per
> >> 

Re: [WISPA] Large Monitors with high resolution forMappingPrograms...

[Jayson Baker]

Chuck,
This: *http://tinyurl.com/ycrnc2f ??*

On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 10:16 PM, Chuck Profito wrote:

> I am very satisfied with the Hanns-G monitor from costco.com 28" 1080 wide
> screen $300.00
>
> <
>
> http://www.costco.com/Browse/Product.aspx?Prodid=11503005&cm_mmc=BCEmail_475
> -_-FOCUS-_-27-_-HannsG28Monitor >
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of e...@wisp-router.com
> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 7:48 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Large Monitors with high resolution
> forMappingPrograms...
>
> On top of it the samsung units play nice together. Got samsung led TV,
> samsung blueray and a samsung soundbar. And wireless subwoffer. Turn on the
> TV and sound and tv comes on, select blueray source and blue ray comes on.
> Don't matter if you use the blue ray remote opr the tv remote. Ahh the
> relif
> and ease to make all the cool stuff work ubiquisily.
> Out of the box on top of everything (getting spoiled with old age)
>
> /Eje
> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
>
> -Original Message-
> From: "Marlon K. Schafer" 
> Date: Wed, 2 Dec 2009 19:33:16
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Large Monitors with high resolution for
>MappingPrograms...
>
> We've moved to Samsung monitors.  And the home TV is Samsung too.  I LOVE
> these units.  Much much better on the eyes than anything I've ever used
> short of a good quality CRT.
> marlon
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "AJ" 
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:03 AM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Large Monitors with high resolution for
> MappingPrograms...
>
>
> >I have a pair of 48" Vizio LCDs mounted on the wall for various
> > infrastructure monitoring using the RGB inputs and a dual output card in
> a
> > Dell desktop. They work pretty well but they both had issues with dim
> > picture after about 3 months... Replaced the power outlet to them and the
> > warrenty replaced both displays. So far so good for the last year or so.
> > Makes it MUCH easier to monitor at a glance critical systems without
> > having
> > to use up more of my primary PC's desktop (tri monitor setup)...
> >
> > Picture attached - we usually have a number of telemetry monitoring
> > applications up...
> >
> > On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 9:53 AM, Brad Belton  wrote:
> >
> >> Agreed, resolution is key for me too.  I keep the right monitor open
> with
> >> Wispmon or RadioMobile running or sometimes I just have six or more
> >> Winbox
> >> windows open on it monitoring client routers etc...
> >>
> >> I don't know what I'd do without the desktop space I have now and have
> >> even
> >> found myself looking for more on occasion!
> >>
> >> We have a projector setup in my brothers office that has decent
> >> resolution,
> >> but no way I'd want that over my 30" monitors.  However, playing any
> >> first
> >> person shooter game is impressive.   LOL!
> >>
> >> My other brother uses his 1080p 46-47" LCD Vizio on his wall as a second
> >> monitor.  It's ok too, but again resolution is lacking for much of
> >> anything
> >> other than network status information or general web browsing.
> >>
> >> Best,
> >>
> >>
> >> Brad
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> >> Behalf Of Mike Hammett
> >> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 10:36 AM
> >> To: WISPA General List
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link
> >>
> >> I believe there are bigger\better monitors, but I believe you're going
> up
> >> exponentially in price.  I know I've seen a DLP projector whose smaller
> >> resolution was 3000 or 4000, but it was about $125k.
> >>
> >> I'd rather have 30" monitors than larger TVs because of resolution, but
> >> I'm
> >> thinking a large 1080p TV mounted to a wall would make a nice display
> for
>
> >> a
> >> rolling network status presentation (network maps of different parts,
> >> server
> >>
> >> status, network utilizations, etc.).
> >>
> >>
> >> -
> >> Mike Hammett
> >> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> >> http://www.ics-il.com
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> From: "Brad Belton" 
> >> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 10:23 AM
> >> To: "'WISPA General List'" 
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link
> >>
> >> > Funny you mention this...yes, viewing RadioMobile or Wispmon on my
> twin
> >> > 30"
> >> > monitors running 2560 x 1600 each makes for a fair amount of
> >> > playground.
> >> > 
> >> >
> >> > Hmmm...twin 52" monitors would be nice, but I doubt there is a display
> >> > larger than 30" that will support 2560 x 1600.   Dang it!
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Brad
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > -Original Message-
> >> > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> On
> >> > Behalf Of Robert West
> >> > Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:57 AM
> >> > To: 'WISPA General List'
> >> > Subject: 

Re: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure

[Jayson Baker]

I have to laugh at one of our competitors who uses PLASTIC enclosures next
to their antennas on the tower.  Even on the most RF-jam packed sites.  One
site in particular you can almost get a fluorescent light to glow just
holding it in your hands.  And there they are with their plastic
enclosures.  And can't figure out why their system sucks ass.

Oh well.  They burned us for over $100k in consulting fees and equipment.
It makes me laugh everytime I see it.

On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 8:30 PM, Marlon K. Schafer wrote:

> I've given up on this.  There is just too much cross talk.  I put all
> radios
> in the same band in their own METAL enclosure nowadays.  I try to keep them
> at least 3 or 6 feet apart too.  Life is much much nicer.
> marlon
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Mike" 
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 8:13 AM
> Subject: [WISPA] Multiple Radio cards in an enclosure
>
>
> > Since I am probably one of the veterans called out yesterday for my
> > messaging etiquette, I am changing the subject.
> >
> > I am interested in the multiple radios in an enclosure idea.  I do
> > have a couple with 5.8 and 2.4 gear in the same box, but have been
> > afraid to put cards in the same band in the same case.
> >
> > The foil spacer you put between cards Bob, do you then ground it to
> > create a sort of Faraday shield?  I know the XRx cards do a good job
> > of shielding if you attach the pigtail.
> >
> > How about the receive sensitivity on the 411 cards?  Has that been an
> > issue?  I think the XR cards have better specs.  Wouldn't having
> > multiple 411 cards in the same box possibly have desense issues too?
> >
> > Mike
> >
> >
> > At 09:41 AM 12/2/2009, you wrote:
> >>Forgot to add, if you're concerned with any RF collisions inside the box,
> >>the other thing I talked about earlier, having just 3 411 cards in their
> >>own
> >>box at the sector then running Cat5 to transparent bridge the 411's to a
> >>central RouterOS device would take any of that issue totally away.
>  That's
> >>one that I'm doing just to do it, basically.  Was an idea from someone a
> >>couple of months ago.  (I actually listen to you guys)  Had a 600a doing
> >>nothing and some 411 cards "so why not play?" was my thinking.
> >>
> >>Bob-
> >>
> >>
> >>-Original Message-
> >>From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> >>Behalf Of Mike
> >>Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:48 AM
> >>To: WISPA General List
> >>Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors
> >>
> >>Have you had any issues with putting 3 radio cards in the same
> >>spectrum in the same box?  I've thought about that but wondered if
> >>there would be desense issues where one transmitting desensitizes
> >>another one listening.
> >>
> >>
> >>At 08:38 AM 12/2/2009, you wrote:
> >> >Yep, looks like you're hitting the wall.  We aren't lucky enough to
> push
> >> >3
> >> >meg here, the most is usually 1 so again, all depends on your customer
> >>base.
> >> >
> >> >I'd say if you already have 35 on that one AP, just splitting it into 2
> >> >180
> >> >degree sectors will just cost you cash as soon as you gain a few more
> >> >customers.  You already have 35 pulling it down, sounds like if you
> just
> >> >do
> >> >2 180's, if split evenly (and it never will be) that would put you to
> >> >where
> >> >you probably want to be for smooth delivery but not much room for more
> >> >growth.  I'd go with 3 120's and a 433AH with 3 cards on it, one per
> >>sector.
> >> >I have a few like that and it works fine for what I do but again, I
> only
> >> >dole out 1mb per sub typically.  I've also been upgrading some of my
> >> >remote
> >> >AP's to one 433AH with only one radio installed and an Omni.  The
> >> >anticipated upgrade path is to just add a sector or 2 and radio card as
> >> >needed to the point where I have 3 sectors.  Keeping the Omni of course
> >> >until the third sector is needed.  That's something someone already
> >> >suggested doing and I like the economics of it.
> >> >
> >> >Bob-
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >-Original Message-
> >> >From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> On
> >> >Behalf Of Jason Hensley
> >> >Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 9:26 AM
> >> >To: 'WISPA General List'
> >> >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors
> >> >
> >> >Max 3meg - b only mode on this particular AP.  Most are still able to
> >> >get
> >> >that, but we're seeing a decline on how many can pull 3meg.  At peak
> >> >times,
> >> >we've seen it to where users aren't able to get much over 1meg, but
> >> >that's
> >> >not happening very often right now.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >-Original Message-
> >> >From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> On
> >> >Behalf Of Robert West
> >> >Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 8:23 AM
> >> >To: 'WISPA General List'
> >> >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Sectors
> >> >
> >> >Yeah, how much bandwidth are you passing to those 35 customers, Jason

Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link

[Jayson Baker]

Why can't you?  We've got a bunch of them recently, and have more on the way
from distro right now.

On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 4:13 PM, Scott Carullo wrote:

> I would not concern yourself with this option because you can't buy one if
> you wanted to right now.
>
> Scott Carullo
> Brevard Wireless
> 321-205-1100 x102
>
>
> 
>
> From: "Jerry Richardson" 
> Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 12:57 PM
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link
>
> I am really, really having a hard time getting my head around using $90
> radios for "must work" links.
>
> Maybe I'm being obstinate, I don't know.
>
> Just seems wrong somehow.
>
> Jerry
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Jayson Baker
> Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 9:04 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link
>
> (2) Rocket5M @ $90/ea
> (2) RocketDish @ $145/ea
>
> $470
>
> On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 10:00 PM, Travis Johnson  wrote:
>
> >  I would agree. Except the 411ah is overkill in my testing, the
> regular
> > 411 shows as much throughput as the 411ah. So, here's the list:
> >
> > 2 x RB411
> > 2 x PacWireless 2ft dishes with radomes
> > 2 x PacWireless enclosures
> > 2 x wireless cards (XR5 would be my choice)
> > 2 x pigtails
> > 2 x LMR jumpers
> > 2 x 18v PoE
> >
> > Total cost would be less than $900 and would do 30Mbps in a 20mhz
> channel
> > (or 15Mbps in a 10mhz channel).
> >
> > Travis
> > Microserv
> >
> >
> > Josh Luthman wrote:
> >
> > If spectrum is available you can use a 411ah pair and get 30 megs in
> > 20mhz.  Like 500 bucks in gear...
> >
> > On 11/30/09, RickG   wrote:
> >
> >
> >  Daniel, great questions!
> >
> > Throughput: As fast as possible :) Seriously, a couple of megs minimum.
> > 10Mbps would be plenty.
> > Dishes: As big as necessary. Naturally, on the tower I'll be limited by
> wind
> > loading. The other end is a solid water tank but I imagine the water
> company
> > wont like a 10' dish :)
> > Budget: $10k including tower.
> > Licensed or unlicensed. I'm open to either but my budget probably wont
> allow
> > licensed.
> > POE or?: No preference.
> > Noise floor: On 2.4GHz, -97. On 5GHz, -94.
> > Currently deploying: Ubiquiti CPE on Mikrotik AP's. Was Tranzeo's on
> > WRAP/StarOS.
> > Comfort level: I've got experience with almost everything mainstream.
> >
> > Thanks! -RickG
> >
> > On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 10:42 PM, 3-dB Networks 
>  wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >  Depends...
> >
> > What type of throughput do you need?  What size dishes can you use?
> What
> > is
> > the budget?  Licensed or Unlicensed?  PoE or some other configuration?
> >  What
> > does the noise floor look like?  What type of equipment do you already
> > primarily use (i.e. what will you be the most comfortable deploying).
> >
> > My recommendation would be based on the answer to all of those
> questions.
> >
> > Daniel White
> > 3-dB Networkshttp://www.3dbnetworks.com
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org
> ] On
> > Behalf Of RickG
> > Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 8:23 PM
> > To: WISPA General List
> > Subject: [WISPA] 20 mile link
> >
> > Planning my first 20 mile PTP link. Path analysis shows clear. Customer
> is
> > building a 100' tower just for this therefore the equipment I choose
> must
> > work. I'm free to use whatever I want. Suggestions?
> > -RickG
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> 
>
> > 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> >
>
> 
>
> > 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> 
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> >
>
&

Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link

[Jayson Baker]

George,

Glad to see it's not just us.  We put in some MT N links when 4 was still
beta.  It worked awesome.  Awesome.
Then, somehow, the units have found their way into the upgrade stream, and
performance sucks now.

After pulling our hair out trying to figure out the problem, we choked it up
to firmware.
Like I said, glad to see it's not just us.

We've already made the decision to more most of those to Rocket M links.
We'll see.

Jayson

On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 8:35 AM, George Morris wrote:

> I think the Rockets are going to be great, but right now today the best
> software is a beta version of 5.1. That pretty much says it all.
>
> We have pulled all our MikroTik N links back out. 4.0beta3 was pretty good,
> but N wireless performance and stability took a real nosedive with the
> release version of 4.0-4.2 IMHO.
>
> We are back on XR-5s with either 20 or 40MHz channels for backhaul and get
> a
> rock-solid 30-60Mbits as a result.
>
> I don't see moving to anything else until MT resolves their N driver
> issues,
> plus releases the new version of Nstreme that is compatible with N cards,
> or
> UBNT completes their M series firmware tuning.
>
> Not sure which will happen first, but with the AH series RouterBoards and
> XR-5s we are sitting pretty in the meantime.
>
> PS We think the AH boards are worth the extra money if you have to run
> Torch
> or the Bandwidth Tester for troubleshooting. Both tools run much better on
> the bigger processors, and the cost differential to get this extra
> performance is minimal for a major backhaul.
>
> George
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Robert West
> Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 10:23 AM
> To: 'WISPA General List'
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link
>
> At first I was like "huh? " but thinking of the now and present, the
> Rockets
> are new and the longevity has yet to be tested.  I have both UBNT and MT
> backhauls, love UBNT to no end but it's from the ease of use aspect.  My
> UBNT needs to be taken care of from time to time, the MT is just put up and
> forgotten about.  Sucks but that's how it is.  Not sure why that is, maybe
> Ubiquiti seems to always be pushing the envelope so logically they'll hit
> snags.  I'm a geek, I like the unknown so I put up with the snags but as
> Travis said in a roundabout way, if you want stability and something you
> don't want to worry about, go with the MT.  I'd go one further with his
> list
> though and use the R52N cards.
>
>
>
> Bob-
>
>
>
>
>
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Travis Johnson
> Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 12:44 AM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link
>
>
>
> I guess if you don't need a reliable, stable product, this is the answer.
> However, I have MT backhaul links that have been up solid for over 3 years
> now. No ethernet issues, no heat issues, no firmware issues.
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Jayson Baker wrote:
>
> (2) Rocket5M @ $90/ea
> (2) RocketDish @ $145/ea
>
> $470
>
> On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 10:00 PM, Travis Johnson  <mailto:t...@ida.net>
>  wrote:
>
>
>
>  I would agree. Except the 411ah is overkill in my testing, the regular
> 411 shows as much throughput as the 411ah. So, here's the list:
>
> 2 x RB411
> 2 x PacWireless 2ft dishes with radomes
> 2 x PacWireless enclosures
> 2 x wireless cards (XR5 would be my choice)
> 2 x pigtails
> 2 x LMR jumpers
> 2 x 18v PoE
>
> Total cost would be less than $900 and would do 30Mbps in a 20mhz channel
> (or 15Mbps in a 10mhz channel).
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
>
> Josh Luthman wrote:
>
> If spectrum is available you can use a 411ah pair and get 30 megs in
> 20mhz.  Like 500 bucks in gear...
>
> On 11/30/09, RickG  <mailto:rgunder...@gmail.com> 
> <mailto:rgunder...@gmail.com>  wrote:
>
>
>  Daniel, great questions!
>
> Throughput: As fast as possible :) Seriously, a couple of megs minimum.
> 10Mbps would be plenty.
> Dishes: As big as necessary. Naturally, on the tower I'll be limited by
> wind
> loading. The other end is a solid water tank but I imagine the water
> company
> wont like a 10' dish :)
> Budget: $10k including tower.
> Licensed or unlicensed. I'm open to either but my budget probably wont
> allow
> licensed.
> POE or?: No preference.
> Noise floor: On 2.4GHz, -97. On 5GHz, -94.
> Currently deploying: Ubiquiti CPE on Mikrotik AP's. Was Tranzeo's on
> WRAP/StarOS.

Re: [WISPA] Iowa Telecom a.k.a Windstream

[Jayson Baker]

If this is their install truck, I don't think you have to worry about much.

[image:
?ui=2&view=att&th=1254ad61273873f9&attid=0.1&disp=attd&realattid=ii_1254ad61273873f9&zw]

LOL



On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 8:04 AM, Mike  wrote:

> My primary competition for the past few years has been Iowa
> Telecom.  They have been purchased by Windstream.  I knew what to
> expect from Iowa Telecom, but don't now.
>
> Have any of you had experience with Windstream?  Should I be bracing
> for some "real" competition?
>
> Iowa Telecom decisions, in my analysis are based mostly on use of
> their wired facilities.  DSL, phone service are primary, and their
> wireless offerings, with phone and Dish, have been secondary.
>
> Should I expect the same from Winstream?
>
> Mike
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
<>


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Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link

[Jayson Baker]

(2) Rocket5M @ $90/ea
(2) RocketDish @ $145/ea

$470

On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 10:00 PM, Travis Johnson  wrote:

>  I would agree. Except the 411ah is overkill in my testing, the regular
> 411 shows as much throughput as the 411ah. So, here's the list:
>
> 2 x RB411
> 2 x PacWireless 2ft dishes with radomes
> 2 x PacWireless enclosures
> 2 x wireless cards (XR5 would be my choice)
> 2 x pigtails
> 2 x LMR jumpers
> 2 x 18v PoE
>
> Total cost would be less than $900 and would do 30Mbps in a 20mhz channel
> (or 15Mbps in a 10mhz channel).
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
>
> Josh Luthman wrote:
>
> If spectrum is available you can use a 411ah pair and get 30 megs in
> 20mhz.  Like 500 bucks in gear...
>
> On 11/30/09, RickG   wrote:
>
>
>  Daniel, great questions!
>
> Throughput: As fast as possible :) Seriously, a couple of megs minimum.
> 10Mbps would be plenty.
> Dishes: As big as necessary. Naturally, on the tower I'll be limited by wind
> loading. The other end is a solid water tank but I imagine the water company
> wont like a 10' dish :)
> Budget: $10k including tower.
> Licensed or unlicensed. I'm open to either but my budget probably wont allow
> licensed.
> POE or?: No preference.
> Noise floor: On 2.4GHz, -97. On 5GHz, -94.
> Currently deploying: Ubiquiti CPE on Mikrotik AP's. Was Tranzeo's on
> WRAP/StarOS.
> Comfort level: I've got experience with almost everything mainstream.
>
> Thanks! -RickG
>
> On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 10:42 PM, 3-dB Networks  
>  wrote:
>
>
>
>  Depends...
>
> What type of throughput do you need?  What size dishes can you use?  What
> is
> the budget?  Licensed or Unlicensed?  PoE or some other configuration?
>  What
> does the noise floor look like?  What type of equipment do you already
> primarily use (i.e. what will you be the most comfortable deploying).
>
> My recommendation would be based on the answer to all of those questions.
>
> Daniel White
> 3-dB Networkshttp://www.3dbnetworks.com
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org 
> ] On
> Behalf Of RickG
> Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 8:23 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: [WISPA] 20 mile link
>
> Planning my first 20 mile PTP link. Path analysis shows clear. Customer is
> building a 100' tower just for this therefore the equipment I choose must
> work. I'm free to use whatever I want. Suggestions?
> -RickG
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Outdoor UPS

[Jayson Baker]

Just saw this.  Sorry.
http://www.provantage.com/cyberpower-systems-cs24c12v2-e~7CYPR047.htm


On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 5:06 PM, Michael Baird  wrote:

> Jayson,
>
> Do you have the model numbers on these? I need 48v output.
>
> Regards
> Michael Baird
> > APC and Cyberpower makes some.  12V or 48V output.  Outdoor mounted.  AC
> > power input.
> > We used them for a FTTH project once.
> >
> > On Thu, Oct 29, 2009 at 1:27 PM, Scott Parsons  wrote:
> >
> >
> >> Michael,
> >> These systems are powered by POE.
> >> Not sure if that works for you.
> >> 
> >>
> >> Scott
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> >> Behalf Of Michael Baird
> >> Sent: Thursday, October 29, 2009 1:13 PM
> >> To: WISPA General List
> >> Subject: [WISPA] Outdoor UPS
> >>
> >> Looking for recommendations on an Outdoor UPS, not concerned about a
> >> long run time, just to handle the occasional blips. Form factor and
> >> mounting considerations are one of the main concerns with this install.
> >> Will be fed by AC power, but it can distribute as a single AC or DC
> >> feed, something that can do 100-250 watts would probably be fine.
> >>
> >> Regards
> >> Michael Baird
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> 
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Re: [WISPA] FreeBSD hackers.... Needed for WISP related product...

[Jayson Baker]

Availability is supposedly resolved.  We'll see.

Routing... there is a full SDK.  You can do anything you want on those
things.  The new ones have 400+MHz proc's, plenty to do some
routing/firewalling.

I just can't see a home grown solution like you're proposing being
cost-effective.  We spent about 2 months on a project just like this, and
started to have some pretty awesome performance and results.

Then UBNT stuff came out.

On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 9:39 PM, MDK  wrote:

> Given UBNT's  record of unavailability of product, and the inability to
> route via the interface, I vastly prefer this to UBNT's products.
>
> Now, mind you, I'm not really putting them down, but this is an excellent
> infrastructure tool...Routing and other capabilities that vastly exceed
> some better known...
>
>
>
> ------
> From: "Jayson Baker" 
> Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 8:25 PM
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] FreeBSD hackers Needed for WISP related product...
>
> > Is there really much need for this, given the new AirMax product line?
> > I'm just saying...
> >
> > On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 9:19 PM, MDK  wrote:
> >
> >> What would you call a totally proprietary,  TDMA based protocol, without
> >> ACK
> >> or CSMA?
> >>
> >> Doesn't look a whole lot like 802.11x, but if you wish to say it is,
> >> then,
> >> for you it is :)
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> From: "Travis Johnson" 
> >> Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 7:36 PM
> >> To: "WISPA General List" 
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] FreeBSD hackers Needed for WISP related
> >> product...
> >>
> >> > If you are using Atheros based hardware, it's still 802.11...
> >> > regardless
> >> > of what software you put on top of it.
> >> >
> >> > Travis
> >> > Microserv
> >> >
> >> > MDK wrote:
> >> >> If you're a WISP and have interest in using commodity - off the
> >> >> shelf -
> >> >> Atheros based hardware to achieve higher than ethernet speeds over
> >> >> wireless... This is not a tweak of 802.11, it is a completely
> >> >> different
> >> >> mode...
> >> >>
> >> >> There is currently an opportunity to do so, where most of the work
> has
> >> >> been
> >> >> done by various others in the FreeBSd community, but it is not
> >> integrated
> >> >> or
> >> >> packaged as a useful WISP product, and that's what needs to be done.
> >> >>
> >> >> This does not need to result in an open source release, due to the
> >> >> relaxed
> >> >> BSD license. Or, it can.   But I'm looking for some people who
> >> >> have
> >> >> experience with freebsd, and have an interest in integrating what
> >> >> could
> >> >> be
> >> >> an awesome performing product using inexpensive commodity hardware.
> >> >>
> >> >> email me at pda  at neofast dot net or mark at neofast dot net
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> --
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] FreeBSD hackers.... Needed for WISP related product...

[Jayson Baker]

Is there really much need for this, given the new AirMax product line?
I'm just saying...

On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 9:19 PM, MDK  wrote:

> What would you call a totally proprietary,  TDMA based protocol, without
> ACK
> or CSMA?
>
> Doesn't look a whole lot like 802.11x, but if you wish to say it is, then,
> for you it is :)
>
>
>
> --
> From: "Travis Johnson" 
> Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 7:36 PM
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] FreeBSD hackers Needed for WISP related product...
>
> > If you are using Atheros based hardware, it's still 802.11... regardless
> > of what software you put on top of it.
> >
> > Travis
> > Microserv
> >
> > MDK wrote:
> >> If you're a WISP and have interest in using commodity - off the shelf -
> >> Atheros based hardware to achieve higher than ethernet speeds over
> >> wireless... This is not a tweak of 802.11, it is a completely
> >> different
> >> mode...
> >>
> >> There is currently an opportunity to do so, where most of the work has
> >> been
> >> done by various others in the FreeBSd community, but it is not
> integrated
> >> or
> >> packaged as a useful WISP product, and that's what needs to be done.
> >>
> >> This does not need to result in an open source release, due to the
> >> relaxed
> >> BSD license. Or, it can.   But I'm looking for some people who have
> >> experience with freebsd, and have an interest in integrating what could
> >> be
> >> an awesome performing product using inexpensive commodity hardware.
> >>
> >> email me at pda  at neofast dot net or mark at neofast dot net
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
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> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
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> >>
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> >
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Re: [WISPA] 20 mile link

[Jayson Baker]

Rocket 5M w/ Rocket Dish (or whatever it's called)

On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 8:22 PM, RickG  wrote:

> Planning my first 20 mile PTP link. Path analysis shows clear. Customer is
> building a 100' tower just for this therefore the equipment I choose must
> work. I'm free to use whatever I want. Suggestions?
> -RickG
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

>
> I will need to test that. The setting lets you use any valid modulation for
> the
> RF mode your in. I will also test with my B5M's.
>

What exactly are you referring to?  On the older 802.11a/b/g devices I see
Multicast Rate.
But on the Rocket/Bullet/Nano N-series (M series) I don't see Multicast
Rate, just "Allow all"

On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:20 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net <
jree...@18-30chat.net> wrote:

> I will need to test that. The setting lets you use any valid modulation for
> the
> RF mode your in. I will also test with my B5M's.
>
> Jayson Baker wrote:
> > IIRc, multicast is limited at the 6Mbps modulation on "WiFi"
> >
> > Tell me I'm wrong, please.  But I've read it a couple times--compeltely
> > forgot until we started doing this.
> >
> > Before, when we were watching IPTV off our fiber headend, we were doing
> it
> > over EoIP.
> >
> > On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 9:19 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net <
> > jree...@18-30chat.net> wrote:
> >
> >> You can change the multicast rate on the non airmax units. Mine are
> enroute
> >> so
> >> have not tried with the airmax gear.
> >>
> >>
> >> I have not heard back about the units.
> >>
> >> At 130 ea, a Roku with the same features as the low end unit, will be
> more
> >> cost
> >> effective. I am still researching about the licensing requirements of
> >> securing
> >> the data stream for non OTA channels.
> >>
> >>
> >> Jayson Baker wrote:
> >>> I seem to remember the low-end ones were around $130/ea.  Not sure
> about
> >> the
> >>> others.  Price will vary based on where you buy and in what quantity I
> >>> assume.
> >>>
> >>> Remembered that standard 802.11 will only multicast at around 1Mbps.
>  So
> >>> that's why we were having the problem with the multicast over AirMax
> >>> equipment.
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:59 AM, richard sterne <
> >> wireless.r...@gmail.com>wrote:
> >>>> Did you get any pricing for the Amino STB's?
> >>>> I would like to know more about your setup.
> >>>>
> >>>> Richard
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

CableCARD's don't accept Ethernet...?

On Fri, Nov 27, 2009 at 8:11 AM, David E. Smith  wrote:

> Out of idle curiosity, have any of you IPTV folks priced CableCARDs?
> There's
> a certain appeal in having customers provide their own equipment.
>
> David Smith
> MVN.net
>
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

IIRc, multicast is limited at the 6Mbps modulation on "WiFi"

Tell me I'm wrong, please.  But I've read it a couple times--compeltely
forgot until we started doing this.

Before, when we were watching IPTV off our fiber headend, we were doing it
over EoIP.

On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 9:19 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net <
jree...@18-30chat.net> wrote:

> You can change the multicast rate on the non airmax units. Mine are enroute
> so
> have not tried with the airmax gear.
>
>
> I have not heard back about the units.
>
> At 130 ea, a Roku with the same features as the low end unit, will be more
> cost
> effective. I am still researching about the licensing requirements of
> securing
> the data stream for non OTA channels.
>
>
> Jayson Baker wrote:
> > I seem to remember the low-end ones were around $130/ea.  Not sure about
> the
> > others.  Price will vary based on where you buy and in what quantity I
> > assume.
> >
> > Remembered that standard 802.11 will only multicast at around 1Mbps.  So
> > that's why we were having the problem with the multicast over AirMax
> > equipment.
> >
> > On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:59 AM, richard sterne <
> wireless.r...@gmail.com>wrote:
> >
> >> Did you get any pricing for the Amino STB's?
> >> I would like to know more about your setup.
> >>
> >> Richard
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
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> >
> >
> >
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

I seem to remember the low-end ones were around $130/ea.  Not sure about the
others.  Price will vary based on where you buy and in what quantity I
assume.

Remembered that standard 802.11 will only multicast at around 1Mbps.  So
that's why we were having the problem with the multicast over AirMax
equipment.

On Wed, Nov 25, 2009 at 11:59 AM, richard sterne wrote:

> Did you get any pricing for the Amino STB's?
> I would like to know more about your setup.
>
> Richard
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

Tonight we spent a few more hours on this project.

We're now streaming live satellite TV programming via multicast over our
network.
Unencrypted, and only MPEG 2 for now.

The stream is about 6Mbps.  It's going over a wireless backhaul, and into a
UBNT AirMax system.
It's being received over the AirMax system, but not being decoded properly.

Not sure if it's the AirMax, or this laptop that's the issue.  Leaning
towards the laptop.
When on the same network as the streambox the feed looks great, time-shift
works perfect.

We're using a PIII 933MHz machine with 1GB of RAM.  It was "laying around"

I will investigate more soon as to why it's not working via the AirMax.
I'll also try to get the MPEG 4 codec situated on the encoder.

I did find out from Amino that their STB's should work without 3rd party
middleware.
Basically, they have embedded browsers--point to your HTML server, which has
pages to streams.

You could fashion up your own guide and program info, etc.
This would work especially well if you're not broadcasting networks with
requirements, but just OTA.

On Fri, Nov 20, 2009 at 11:52 AM, Mike Hammett wrote:

> So we're looking at $25k for the hardware to do an MPEG-4 H.264 IPTV system
> for up to 100 channels?
>
> Remaining items needed (or desired):
>
> 1)  Middleware (Minerva)
> 2)  Licensing (only your past seems to indicate that this can be done)
> 3)  VoD
> 4)  Content stream from Avail or Echostar
>
> Missing anything?
>
> Costs for the others?
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
>
> --
> From: "Jayson Baker" 
> Sent: Monday, November 16, 2009 12:20 PM
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?
>
> > Interestingly enough, I've had a project lying on my desk for a couple
> > weeks
> > now which requires streaming live content to a large group of people in a
> > neighborhood (think of it as a neighborhood association wanting to
> > broadcast
> > their meetings to their residents).  I don't know why I didn't see the
> > similarity between this post and that project.
> >
> > I just spent the last couple hours working on this, and now have a Linux
> > server streaming the content out over the wireless network multicast
> > without
> > any issues.
> >
> > Taking a deeper look...
> > We have ASI-input cards from Linear Systems.  They take 4 ASI streams...
> > maybe 32 each?  I can't remember.
> >
> > A quick look on eBay found some Moto C-Band receivers that output 32 ASI
> > streams for under $1000.
> >
> > An entire receiving, encoding, streaming headend for under 100 channels
> > could be built for probably under $25,000.
> >
> > I don't know what you're after, but if there is some serious interest in
> > putting effort into something like this, we might be on board.
> >
> > Jayson
> >
> > On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 9:31 AM, Jack Unger  wrote:
> >
> >> Blake,
> >>
> >> In general the IPTV principles being discussed would apply to any
> >> broadband wireless system either license-free, licensed, or
> >> licensed-lite.
> >>
> >> jack
> >>
> >>
> >> Blake Covarrubias wrote:
> >> > I've read the responses from others who are running IPTV over
> wireless.
> >> >
> >> > My question is when you all are saying wireless, do you mean
> unlicensed
> >> 2.4ghz or 5.8ghz, or do you mean wireless technology in general?
> >> >
> >> > My company utilizes 2.5 and 3.65ghz, which are the same frequencies
> >> > we'd
> >> be looking to use to deploy IPTV.
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > Blake Covarrubias
> >> >
> >> > On Nov 15, 2009, at 4:03 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >> Every time this comes up, I say the same thing.  You can't over
> >> wireless.
> >> >> The content owners WILL NOT license it for wireless use.  I've tried
> >> >> numerous times
> >>
> >> --
> >> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
> >> Author - "Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs"
> >> Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
> >> www.ask-wi.com  818-227-4220  jun...@ask-wi.com
> >>
> >> Sent from my Pizzicato PluckString...
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
&g

Re: [WISPA] Dual Pol Grid Parabolic

[Jayson Baker]

We've been buying it from CTI without issue.

On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 11:14 PM, MDK  wrote:

> the UBNT stuff is just not available, and doesn't appear to be until
> sometime perhaps in February.
>
> the prices are very good, the gain and having nice sector widths is great,
> but, the distributors only have air to put in boxes to send to you
>
>
> --
> From: "Paul Hendry" 
> Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2009 8:01 PM
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Dual Pol Grid Parabolic
>
> > Any reason the UBNT ones are not an option or is it just availability?
> >
> > -original message-
> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Dual Pol Grid Parabolic
> > From: "Tom DeReggi" 
> > Date: 25/11/2009 3:49 am
> >
> > yes they do for $1200. each :-(
> >
> > Tom DeReggi
> > RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
> > IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
> >
> >
> > - Original Message -
> > From: 
> > To: "WISPA General List" 
> > Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2009 8:36 PM
> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Dual Pol Grid Parabolic
> >
> >
> >> Radiowaves does I believe
> >> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: "MDK" 
> >> Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:26:58
> >> To: WISPA General List
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Dual Pol Grid Parabolic
> >>
> >> Arc wireless makes 20 and 23 db panels and pacwireless makes a 2 and 3
> >> foot
> >> solid dish w/dual polarity.
> >>
> >> Does ANYONE make dual pol sectors for 5 ghz besides UBNT, whose antennas
> >> are
> >> made of 99 44/100 % pure unobtanium?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> From: "Phil Curnutt" 
> >> Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2009 5:12 PM
> >> To: "WISPA General List" 
> >> Subject: [WISPA] Dual Pol Grid Parabolic
> >>
> >>> Anybody have a suggestion for a 5.8 Ghz Grid Parabolic, Dual Polarity,
> >>> 24
> >>> to
> >>> 30 dB?
> >>>
> >>> Phil
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> 
> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>>
> 
> >>>
> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>>
> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>>
> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
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> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
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> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> 
> >>
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> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
> > --
> > This message has been scanned for viruses and
> > dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
> > believed to be clean.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> 
> >
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> >
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> >
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>
>
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Re: [WISPA] 10MHz, 5MHz - unstable for voice?

[Jayson Baker]

Doesn't matter.  If the interference is there, it's there.  If your radio
has no where to spread out the signal and "avoid" that interference, you're
dead.

On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 10:08 PM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> Right but you have another 6db to get a stronger signal.
>
> On 11/22/09, Jayson Baker  wrote:
> > Yes, you get more signal, but you have much less spectrum for your spread
> > spectrum radio to operate in.
> > Spread spectrum doesn't always use the full 20MHz, it will skip around --
> > that's the "spread" part of it.
> > So if you lower that to 5MHz, then you have virtually no "spread" and
> > anything that may be inside that 5MHz
> > will cause you a much more deteriorated performance than if it was in
> your
> > 20MHz.
> >
> > On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 9:08 PM, Mike  wrote:
> >
> >> I should think the opposite is true.  Halve the signal, improve
> >> signal to noise 3 dB.  Half it again and the improvement is 6 dB
> >> signal to noise.  Should give you way more margin.  My tests prove that
> >> out.
> >>
> >>
> >> At 08:44 PM 11/22/2009, you wrote:
> >> >IIRC, 5MHz and 10MHz is more sucepstible to interference than 20MHz.
> >> >
> >> >On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 7:38 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS <
> >> >ilopezli...@sandboxitsolutions.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > I'm gonna have to set up the environment again.  Only thing I cant
> >> > > simulate right now is distance.
> >> > >
> >> > > As long as it wasnt some voodoo config setting that made it work
> >> better,
> >> > > I might have to play with the Mobile NS2's settings for it to play
> >> nicely.
> >> > >
> >> > > OT:  What is CCQ?
> >> > >
> >> > > -Israel
> >> > >
> >> > > Josh Luthman wrote:
> >> > > > It is very weird isn't it?
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Vi is better the Emacs.
> >> > > >
> >> > > > On 11/22/09, Mike  wrote:
> >> > > >
> >> > > >> Josh:
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> I thought that too.  I have a handful of customers on a 5 MHz
> >> > > >> sector.  Winbox shows this:
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> Emacs!
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> Mike
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> At 07:32 PM 11/22/2009, you wrote:
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >>> I believe when you half the channels the rates also get halved -
> >> from
> >> > > >>> 54mbit
> >> > > >>> to 27mbit max (that is from 20mhz to 10mhz channels).
> >> > > >>>
> >> > > >>> I also can't see why you're voice would be having problems in
> half
> >> or
> >> > > >>> quarter channels unless there is a software bug.  It should only
> >> > > improve
> >> > > >>> unless you're using all available bandwidth.
> >> > > >>>
> >> > > >>> Josh Luthman
> >> > > >>> Office: 937-552-2340
> >> > > >>> Direct: 937-552-2343
> >> > > >>> 1100 Wayne St
> >> > > >>> Suite 1337
> >> > > >>> Troy, OH 45373
> >> > > >>>
> >> > > >>> "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
> >> > > >>> --- Albert Einstein
> >> > > >>>
> >> > > >>>
> >> > > >>> On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 8:08 PM, Chuck Hogg  >
> >> > > wrote:
> >> > > >>>
> >> > > >>>
> >> > > >>>> First, you should have a better signal than -70 at <5Miles away
> >> with a
> >> > > >>>> 24dB/NS2 antenna and a B2HP/9dB omni.  I get 65 or better with
> a
> >> 19dB
> >> > > >>>> panel.
> >> > > >>>>
> >> > > >>>> Don't forget, 10MHz channel is 1/2 available bandwidth and 5MHz
> >> > > >>>> is
> >> 1/4
> >> > > >>>> available bandwidth.  Really, you

Re: [WISPA] 10MHz, 5MHz - unstable for voice?

[Jayson Baker]

Yes, you get more signal, but you have much less spectrum for your spread
spectrum radio to operate in.
Spread spectrum doesn't always use the full 20MHz, it will skip around --
that's the "spread" part of it.
So if you lower that to 5MHz, then you have virtually no "spread" and
anything that may be inside that 5MHz
will cause you a much more deteriorated performance than if it was in your
20MHz.

On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 9:08 PM, Mike  wrote:

> I should think the opposite is true.  Halve the signal, improve
> signal to noise 3 dB.  Half it again and the improvement is 6 dB
> signal to noise.  Should give you way more margin.  My tests prove that
> out.
>
>
> At 08:44 PM 11/22/2009, you wrote:
> >IIRC, 5MHz and 10MHz is more sucepstible to interference than 20MHz.
> >
> >On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 7:38 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS <
> >ilopezli...@sandboxitsolutions.com> wrote:
> >
> > > I'm gonna have to set up the environment again.  Only thing I cant
> > > simulate right now is distance.
> > >
> > > As long as it wasnt some voodoo config setting that made it work
> better,
> > > I might have to play with the Mobile NS2's settings for it to play
> nicely.
> > >
> > > OT:  What is CCQ?
> > >
> > > -Israel
> > >
> > > Josh Luthman wrote:
> > > > It is very weird isn't it?
> > > >
> > > > Vi is better the Emacs.
> > > >
> > > > On 11/22/09, Mike  wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> Josh:
> > > >>
> > > >> I thought that too.  I have a handful of customers on a 5 MHz
> > > >> sector.  Winbox shows this:
> > > >>
> > > >> Emacs!
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> Mike
> > > >>
> > > >> At 07:32 PM 11/22/2009, you wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>> I believe when you half the channels the rates also get halved -
> from
> > > >>> 54mbit
> > > >>> to 27mbit max (that is from 20mhz to 10mhz channels).
> > > >>>
> > > >>> I also can't see why you're voice would be having problems in half
> or
> > > >>> quarter channels unless there is a software bug.  It should only
> > > improve
> > > >>> unless you're using all available bandwidth.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Josh Luthman
> > > >>> Office: 937-552-2340
> > > >>> Direct: 937-552-2343
> > > >>> 1100 Wayne St
> > > >>> Suite 1337
> > > >>> Troy, OH 45373
> > > >>>
> > > >>> "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
> > > >>> --- Albert Einstein
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>> On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 8:08 PM, Chuck Hogg 
> > > wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > >  First, you should have a better signal than -70 at <5Miles away
> with a
> > >  24dB/NS2 antenna and a B2HP/9dB omni.  I get 65 or better with a
> 19dB
> > >  panel.
> > > 
> > >  Don't forget, 10MHz channel is 1/2 available bandwidth and 5MHz is
> 1/4
> > >  available bandwidth.  Really, you will get about 7-10MBit
> aggregate
> > >  (depending on how many customers) on a 5MHz channel connected at
> > > 54MBit,
> > >  which requires signals at -74dBm with a good fade margin (10dB).
> > >  Also,
> > >  the TX power is significantly less for 54MBps (23dBm) vs
> > > 24MBps(28dBm),
> > >  less than half.  Likely, you are connecting at 48MBps or 36Mbps,
> which
> > >  at that rate your total available "real case" bandwidth is as
> little
> > > as
> > >  4MBps, while at 20MHz you are at 15+.
> > > 
> > >  A narrower channel should not affect your transmission, likely
> will
> > > make
> > >  signals better, roughly double (+3dBm) from 20-10, and double from
> > >  10-5(total +6dBm).
> > > 
> > >  Regards,
> > >  Chuck Hogg
> > >  Shelby Broadband
> > >  502-722-9292
> > >  ch...@shelbybb.com
> > >  http://www.shelbybb.com
> > > 
> > > 
> > >  -Original Message-
> > >  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:
> wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> > > On
> > >  Behalf Of os10ru...@gmail.com
> > >  Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2009 6:20 PM
> > >  To: WISPA General List
> > >  Subject: Re: [WISPA] 10MHz, 5MHz - unstable for voice?
> > > 
> > >  Well next time definitely bring more food! Beef jerky and granola
> > > bars.
> > > 
> > >  In my testing the narrower channels just made things slower. I was
> > >  testing in a pristine area where there was no other 5.8GHz going
> on.
> > >  >From what I hear if the environment had been polluted performance
> > > might
> > >  have actually gone up with the narrower channels.
> > > 
> > >  >From what I've read narrower channels doesn't effect packet size
> or
> > >  transport. But switching to WDS bridged does.
> > > 
> > >  Greg
> > >  On Nov 22, 2009, at 6:15 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS wrote:
> > > 
> > > 
> > > > Its not in the field, but it is sitting here in my bedroom
> looking
> > > >
> > >  cool :).
> > > 
> > > > I was thinking that using the 10/5MHz bandwidth required one to
> setup
> > > > something else.  I'm not that familiar with the use of
> half/quarter
> > > >
> > >  rate
> > >

Re: [WISPA] 10MHz, 5MHz - unstable for voice?

[Jayson Baker]

IIRC, 5MHz and 10MHz is more sucepstible to interference than 20MHz.

On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 7:38 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS <
ilopezli...@sandboxitsolutions.com> wrote:

> I'm gonna have to set up the environment again.  Only thing I cant
> simulate right now is distance.
>
> As long as it wasnt some voodoo config setting that made it work better,
> I might have to play with the Mobile NS2's settings for it to play nicely.
>
> OT:  What is CCQ?
>
> -Israel
>
> Josh Luthman wrote:
> > It is very weird isn't it?
> >
> > Vi is better the Emacs.
> >
> > On 11/22/09, Mike  wrote:
> >
> >> Josh:
> >>
> >> I thought that too.  I have a handful of customers on a 5 MHz
> >> sector.  Winbox shows this:
> >>
> >> Emacs!
> >>
> >>
> >> Mike
> >>
> >> At 07:32 PM 11/22/2009, you wrote:
> >>
> >>> I believe when you half the channels the rates also get halved - from
> >>> 54mbit
> >>> to 27mbit max (that is from 20mhz to 10mhz channels).
> >>>
> >>> I also can't see why you're voice would be having problems in half or
> >>> quarter channels unless there is a software bug.  It should only
> improve
> >>> unless you're using all available bandwidth.
> >>>
> >>> Josh Luthman
> >>> Office: 937-552-2340
> >>> Direct: 937-552-2343
> >>> 1100 Wayne St
> >>> Suite 1337
> >>> Troy, OH 45373
> >>>
> >>> "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
> >>> --- Albert Einstein
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 8:08 PM, Chuck Hogg 
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
>  First, you should have a better signal than -70 at <5Miles away with a
>  24dB/NS2 antenna and a B2HP/9dB omni.  I get 65 or better with a 19dB
>  panel.
> 
>  Don't forget, 10MHz channel is 1/2 available bandwidth and 5MHz is 1/4
>  available bandwidth.  Really, you will get about 7-10MBit aggregate
>  (depending on how many customers) on a 5MHz channel connected at
> 54MBit,
>  which requires signals at -74dBm with a good fade margin (10dB).
>  Also,
>  the TX power is significantly less for 54MBps (23dBm) vs
> 24MBps(28dBm),
>  less than half.  Likely, you are connecting at 48MBps or 36Mbps, which
>  at that rate your total available "real case" bandwidth is as little
> as
>  4MBps, while at 20MHz you are at 15+.
> 
>  A narrower channel should not affect your transmission, likely will
> make
>  signals better, roughly double (+3dBm) from 20-10, and double from
>  10-5(total +6dBm).
> 
>  Regards,
>  Chuck Hogg
>  Shelby Broadband
>  502-722-9292
>  ch...@shelbybb.com
>  http://www.shelbybb.com
> 
> 
>  -Original Message-
>  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
> On
>  Behalf Of os10ru...@gmail.com
>  Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2009 6:20 PM
>  To: WISPA General List
>  Subject: Re: [WISPA] 10MHz, 5MHz - unstable for voice?
> 
>  Well next time definitely bring more food! Beef jerky and granola
> bars.
> 
>  In my testing the narrower channels just made things slower. I was
>  testing in a pristine area where there was no other 5.8GHz going on.
>  >From what I hear if the environment had been polluted performance
> might
>  have actually gone up with the narrower channels.
> 
>  >From what I've read narrower channels doesn't effect packet size or
>  transport. But switching to WDS bridged does.
> 
>  Greg
>  On Nov 22, 2009, at 6:15 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS wrote:
> 
> 
> > Its not in the field, but it is sitting here in my bedroom looking
> >
>  cool :).
> 
> > I was thinking that using the 10/5MHz bandwidth required one to setup
> > something else.  I'm not that familiar with the use of half/quarter
> >
>  rate
> 
> > channels and how that affects the frame transport/packet size etc,.
> >
> > I wonder if it was environment based rather than
> > 'software/configuration' based.  If I get some time this evening I
> >
>  might
> 
> > setup the gear again for more focused testing (Testing in the field
> >
>  with
> 
> > volunteers who are cold and hungry dont usually respond well to
> >
>  testing
> 
> > plans).
> >
> > -Israel
> >
> > os10ru...@gmail.com wrote:
> >
> >> Just for kicks I'd try WDS bridged. Do you have control from where
> >>
>  you're at now? Is the equipment still set up?
> 
> >> Greg
> >>
> >> On Nov 22, 2009, at 6:02 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>> @Travis Johnson - Yes Upgraded to newest firmware for the two units
> >>>
> >>> @os10rules - Nope, Fixed was simple AP and Mobile was Station modes
> >>>
> >>> os10ru...@gmail.com wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
>  Running WDS bridged?
> 
>  Greg
>  On Nov 22, 2009, at 5:37 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 

Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

The biggest ones are getting the rights to the content, and getting the
content.
I don't remember what we paid for Mineva.  Before that, we used Espial (
http://www.espial.com/)  Might want to check them out.  No idea what they're
cost is now either.
I've never worked with any VoD content.

On Fri, Nov 20, 2009 at 11:52 AM, Mike Hammett wrote:

> So we're looking at $25k for the hardware to do an MPEG-4 H.264 IPTV system
> for up to 100 channels?
>
> Remaining items needed (or desired):
>
> 1)  Middleware (Minerva)
> 2)  Licensing (only your past seems to indicate that this can be done)
> 3)  VoD
> 4)  Content stream from Avail or Echostar
>
> Missing anything?
>
> Costs for the others?
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
>
> --
> From: "Jayson Baker" 
> Sent: Monday, November 16, 2009 12:20 PM
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?
>
> > Interestingly enough, I've had a project lying on my desk for a couple
> > weeks
> > now which requires streaming live content to a large group of people in a
> > neighborhood (think of it as a neighborhood association wanting to
> > broadcast
> > their meetings to their residents).  I don't know why I didn't see the
> > similarity between this post and that project.
> >
> > I just spent the last couple hours working on this, and now have a Linux
> > server streaming the content out over the wireless network multicast
> > without
> > any issues.
> >
> > Taking a deeper look...
> > We have ASI-input cards from Linear Systems.  They take 4 ASI streams...
> > maybe 32 each?  I can't remember.
> >
> > A quick look on eBay found some Moto C-Band receivers that output 32 ASI
> > streams for under $1000.
> >
> > An entire receiving, encoding, streaming headend for under 100 channels
> > could be built for probably under $25,000.
> >
> > I don't know what you're after, but if there is some serious interest in
> > putting effort into something like this, we might be on board.
> >
> > Jayson
> >
> > On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 9:31 AM, Jack Unger  wrote:
> >
> >> Blake,
> >>
> >> In general the IPTV principles being discussed would apply to any
> >> broadband wireless system either license-free, licensed, or
> >> licensed-lite.
> >>
> >> jack
> >>
> >>
> >> Blake Covarrubias wrote:
> >> > I've read the responses from others who are running IPTV over
> wireless.
> >> >
> >> > My question is when you all are saying wireless, do you mean
> unlicensed
> >> 2.4ghz or 5.8ghz, or do you mean wireless technology in general?
> >> >
> >> > My company utilizes 2.5 and 3.65ghz, which are the same frequencies
> >> > we'd
> >> be looking to use to deploy IPTV.
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > Blake Covarrubias
> >> >
> >> > On Nov 15, 2009, at 4:03 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >> Every time this comes up, I say the same thing.  You can't over
> >> wireless.
> >> >> The content owners WILL NOT license it for wireless use.  I've tried
> >> >> numerous times
> >>
> >> --
> >> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
> >> Author - "Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs"
> >> Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
> >> www.ask-wi.com  818-227-4220  jun...@ask-wi.com
> >>
> >> Sent from my Pizzicato PluckString...
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> >>
> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> ---

Re: [WISPA] Need a new AP

[Jayson Baker]

In that case, use a MikroTik RB411R.
Integrated radio, and MT can do various encryptions you need.

Sorry, I overlooked that part of the request.

On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 3:16 PM, pat  wrote:

> Bullet M2's won't do WEP until the release of firmware version 5.1 which
> has been "in just a couple of weeks" for at least the last two months.
>
>
>
> Jayson Baker wrote:
> > UBNT Bullet M2?
> >
> > On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 2:59 PM, pat  wrote:
> >
> >
> >> I have one small group on an old Cisco Aironet 350, which only does
> >> 802.11b.
> >>
> >> 1)  I want to have at least a b/g mix, n capable a bonus.
> >>
> >> 2)  Must support WEP encryption, but be able to handle a mix of WEP and
> >> WPA simultaneously.  (WEP for legacy clients that I haven't upgraded)
> >>
> >> 3)  Must play nice with Tranzeo CPQ and CPE200.
> >>
> >> You input is helpful.
> >>
> >> TIA,
> >>
> >> Pat
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> >>
> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> 
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>
> 
>
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>
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>
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>



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Re: [WISPA] Need a new AP

[Jayson Baker]

UBNT Bullet M2?

On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 2:59 PM, pat  wrote:

> I have one small group on an old Cisco Aironet 350, which only does
> 802.11b.
>
> 1)  I want to have at least a b/g mix, n capable a bonus.
>
> 2)  Must support WEP encryption, but be able to handle a mix of WEP and
> WPA simultaneously.  (WEP for legacy clients that I haven't upgraded)
>
> 3)  Must play nice with Tranzeo CPQ and CPE200.
>
> You input is helpful.
>
> TIA,
>
> Pat
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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>
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>



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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

Interestingly enough, I've had a project lying on my desk for a couple weeks
now which requires streaming live content to a large group of people in a
neighborhood (think of it as a neighborhood association wanting to broadcast
their meetings to their residents).  I don't know why I didn't see the
similarity between this post and that project.

I just spent the last couple hours working on this, and now have a Linux
server streaming the content out over the wireless network multicast without
any issues.

Taking a deeper look...
We have ASI-input cards from Linear Systems.  They take 4 ASI streams...
maybe 32 each?  I can't remember.

A quick look on eBay found some Moto C-Band receivers that output 32 ASI
streams for under $1000.

An entire receiving, encoding, streaming headend for under 100 channels
could be built for probably under $25,000.

I don't know what you're after, but if there is some serious interest in
putting effort into something like this, we might be on board.

Jayson

On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 9:31 AM, Jack Unger  wrote:

> Blake,
>
> In general the IPTV principles being discussed would apply to any
> broadband wireless system either license-free, licensed, or licensed-lite.
>
> jack
>
>
> Blake Covarrubias wrote:
> > I've read the responses from others who are running IPTV over wireless.
> >
> > My question is when you all are saying wireless, do you mean unlicensed
> 2.4ghz or 5.8ghz, or do you mean wireless technology in general?
> >
> > My company utilizes 2.5 and 3.65ghz, which are the same frequencies we'd
> be looking to use to deploy IPTV.
> >
> > --
> > Blake Covarrubias
> >
> > On Nov 15, 2009, at 4:03 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:
> >
> >
> >> Every time this comes up, I say the same thing.  You can't over
> wireless.
> >> The content owners WILL NOT license it for wireless use.  I've tried
> >> numerous times
>
> --
> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc.
> Author - "Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs"
> Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993
> www.ask-wi.com  818-227-4220  jun...@ask-wi.com
>
> Sent from my Pizzicato PluckString...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



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Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

>
> 1) Content streams from Avail (or possibly EchoStar)
>
Yes


> 2) Independent licensing process
>
Yes, in some cases.  Never worked with E*.


> 3) Home built headend (though reading back through your previous posts, I

get the impression you used one from Avail)
>
We used Avail's headend.  Initially, it was total garbage.  When I left that
company, they were still trying to get simple things done reliably.  I'm
sure it's resolved by now.  If I were to do it again, I'd build my own, and
save about $250k.


> 4) Minerva middleware (I understand that to be the best one)
>
Yes, indeed.  They do have the best in my opinion.  But there are cheaper
ones, that will do the trick.  I wish I could remember what we initially
used.  Started with an E...  *shrug*


> 5) Moto STBs
>
Yes, but again there are cheaper ones.  The Mood (or i3, I think they're
one-in-the-same now) boxes work just as good, and are much cheaper.

I'm trying to remember the name of the company/guy we bought a lot of this
equipment from.  If I think of it, I'll post it.

On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 8:37 AM, Mike Hammett wrote:

> So:
>
> 1) Content streams from Avail (or possibly EchoStar)
> 2) Independent licensing process
> 3) Home built headend (though reading back through your previous posts, I
> get the impression you used one from Avail)
> 4) Minerva middleware (I understand that to be the best one)
> 5) Moto STBs
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
>
> --
> From: "Jayson Baker" 
> Sent: Monday, November 16, 2009 1:09 AM
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?
>
> > I cannot comment on the contracts.
> >
> > As I have mentioned previously, we bought the aggregated content from
> > Avail
> > Media.  They can probably help you.
> >
> > We did still have direct contracts with the networks though.  Ultimately,
> > they were the ones who agreed to allow us to distribute via wireless.
> >
> > On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 8:19 PM, RickG  wrote:
> >
> >> Jayson,
> >>
> >> Can you elaborate on the contracts and the system you have in place to
> >> provide this?
> >>
> >> -RickG
> >>
> >> On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 7:43 PM, Jayson Baker  >> >wrote:
> >>
> >> > Actually, you're completely wrong.  We got all of our networks to
> agree
> >> to
> >> > allow us to transport it wirelessly.
> >> > The requirement was that we own the network entirely, from end A to
> end
> >> Z,
> >> > and that we control every part of it.
> >> > The ones that are concerned about theft (i.e. ESPN/Disney, HBO, etc.)
> >> > already had encrypted stream anyway.
> >> >
> >> > We successfuly transmitted all of our programming over MikroTik
> >> > wireless
> >> > links without any problems.  Including HD.
> >> >
> >> > On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 4:03 PM, Mike Hammett <
> wispawirel...@ics-il.net
> >> > >wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > Every time this comes up, I say the same thing.  You can't over
> >> wireless.
> >> > > The content owners WILL NOT license it for wireless use.  I've tried
> >> > > numerous times.
> >> > >
> >> > > Expect to dump about $500k into a real system to do IPTV.
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > -
> >> > > Mike Hammett
> >> > > Intelligent Computing Solutions
> >> > > http://www.ics-il.com
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > --
> >> > > From: 
> >> > > Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 8:44 AM
> >> > > To: "WISPA General List" 
> >> > > Subject: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?
> >> > >
> >> > > > I have been looking at some IPTV options and basically, there does
> >> not
> >> > > > seam to
> >> > > > be a whole lot of options. I can A) build my own IP headend B)
> nada
> >> > > > .
> >> >  I
> >> > > > can not
> >> > > > find a single IPTV provider that truly caters to the resident,
> >> > > > soho,
> >> > etc.
> >> > > > There
> >> > > > is one that does

Re: [WISPA] Anyone else wish for this?

[Jayson Baker]

MikroTik used to support some sort of VoIP interface; I forget what it was.
I'm sure this is possible as well, if they wanted to.  We'd love to have
something like this too--but think it's a little further off.  In fact, even
if it was just a device like the IAXy that'd be fine.  But then you get into
all sorts of other ideas like having it mountable outside, so you could
mount it near their existing telco NIU.  Ideas and requestsare endless, I
guess.  :-)

FYI, we buy PAP2-NA's and SPA2102-NA's (the unlocked versions) all day long
online, in quantities as small as 1 at a time.  We used to get them all
through IngramMicro, but found that just Googleing for X-NA is cheaper than
buying wholesale.

On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 7:20 AM, can...@believewireless.net <
p...@believewireless.net> wrote:

> I've been asking for something like this for years.  Now if you could
> throw in a SIP ATA as well with battery backup, it would be perfect!
>
> Linksys only sells the VoIP routers to the big boys and I have no idea
> why we can't get them.  (New, not hacked)
>
> On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 2:26 AM, Jayson Baker 
> wrote:
> > I don't know.  Seems so simple.  I believe the new UBNT Nano M's have a
> > controllable PoE port on them.
> > At least, that's how I read their site.  Haven't toyed with it yet.  If
> UBNT
> > can do it, MT can do it better.  :-)
> >
> > On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 12:25 AM, Josh Luthman
> > wrote:
> >
> >> That would be amazing.  Never seen any device like this provide power,
> >> wonder why.
> >>
> >> On 11/16/09, Jayson Baker  wrote:
> >> > What we *really* want, and would buy a *lot* of is an indoor router
> with
> >> PoE
> >> > OUTPUT (or passthru, whatever you want to call it).
> >> > i.e. a RB750 inside the home, with integrated wireless (802.11g,
> standard
> >> > power is fine), 4-port switch, standard DC input.
> >> > But, here's the wishful part!  On the WAN port, it'd pass-thru
> whatever
> >> > voltage it was getting input on the DC input plug.
> >> > That means we could install a managed-router for the customer, and use
> >> only
> >> > a single wall-wart power supply.
> >> > I'm sure if MT came out with something like this the PoE pass-thru
> port
> >> > would be software controllable, and probably watchdog'able.
> >> > So if the antenna outside locked up, lost connectivity, whatever--the
> >> inside
> >> > router could powercycle it.
> >> > We could care less about a web interface.  We'd provide these as a
> >> managed
> >> > service to the customer, they'd never login to it anyway.
> >> > If something like this came along, we'd install one at every single
> >> install
> >> > and require the customer use it.
> >> >
> >> > On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 8:09 PM,  wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> Something like the MT RB750 but with 802.11n. Top it off with an
> easier
> >> >> web
> >> >> interface which would make basic setup as a home router/AP simple for
> >> the
> >> >> uninitiated. I'm thinking something of quality with the power of a
> >> >> RouterOS
> >> >> level 4 license to compete with the crappy dlink/linksys/netgear
> >> consumer
> >> >> grade router/APs.
> >> >>
> >> >> With the current MT lineup if one does this piecemeal they have to
> start
> >> >> with a routerboard with way more ethernet ports and three wireless
> card
> >> >> slots and you still have to add the case, power supply, wireless card
> >> and
> >> >> antennas and it ends up being pricey.
> >> >>
> >> >> Greg
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> 
> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> 
> >> >>
> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >> >>
> >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >> >>
> >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >> >>
> >>

Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

We got OK to do it over MT equipment in unlicensed bands.

Their concern was that A) they didn't want it going over any sort of public
network (i.e. WiFi Hotspot) and B) encryption remained in-tact from the
headend to the STB.

On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 1:19 AM, Blake Covarrubias wrote:

> I've read the responses from others who are running IPTV over wireless.
>
> My question is when you all are saying wireless, do you mean unlicensed
> 2.4ghz or 5.8ghz, or do you mean wireless technology in general?
>
> My company utilizes 2.5 and 3.65ghz, which are the same frequencies we'd be
> looking to use to deploy IPTV.
>
> --
> Blake Covarrubias
>
> On Nov 15, 2009, at 4:03 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:
>
> > Every time this comes up, I say the same thing.  You can't over wireless.
> > The content owners WILL NOT license it for wireless use.  I've tried
> > numerous times.
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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>
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>



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Re: [WISPA] Anyone else wish for this?

[Jayson Baker]

I don't know.  Seems so simple.  I believe the new UBNT Nano M's have a
controllable PoE port on them.
At least, that's how I read their site.  Haven't toyed with it yet.  If UBNT
can do it, MT can do it better.  :-)

On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 12:25 AM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> That would be amazing.  Never seen any device like this provide power,
> wonder why.
>
> On 11/16/09, Jayson Baker  wrote:
> > What we *really* want, and would buy a *lot* of is an indoor router with
> PoE
> > OUTPUT (or passthru, whatever you want to call it).
> > i.e. a RB750 inside the home, with integrated wireless (802.11g, standard
> > power is fine), 4-port switch, standard DC input.
> > But, here's the wishful part!  On the WAN port, it'd pass-thru whatever
> > voltage it was getting input on the DC input plug.
> > That means we could install a managed-router for the customer, and use
> only
> > a single wall-wart power supply.
> > I'm sure if MT came out with something like this the PoE pass-thru port
> > would be software controllable, and probably watchdog'able.
> > So if the antenna outside locked up, lost connectivity, whatever--the
> inside
> > router could powercycle it.
> > We could care less about a web interface.  We'd provide these as a
> managed
> > service to the customer, they'd never login to it anyway.
> > If something like this came along, we'd install one at every single
> install
> > and require the customer use it.
> >
> > On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 8:09 PM,  wrote:
> >
> >> Something like the MT RB750 but with 802.11n. Top it off with an easier
> >> web
> >> interface which would make basic setup as a home router/AP simple for
> the
> >> uninitiated. I'm thinking something of quality with the power of a
> >> RouterOS
> >> level 4 license to compete with the crappy dlink/linksys/netgear
> consumer
> >> grade router/APs.
> >>
> >> With the current MT lineup if one does this piecemeal they have to start
> >> with a routerboard with way more ethernet ports and three wireless card
> >> slots and you still have to add the case, power supply, wireless card
> and
> >> antennas and it ends up being pricey.
> >>
> >> Greg
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> >>
> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
>
>
> --
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
> --- Albert Einstein
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
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>
> 
>
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>
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Re: [WISPA] 100Mbps over 10 miles

[Jayson Baker]

532's don't compare to 333, 433, even 411 on processor speed and ability.

On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 7:38 PM, Josh Luthman
wrote:

> What I meant to describe was that I have not seen a Mikrotik wireless link
> exceed 30 megs in 20 mhz or 60 megs in 40 mhz.
>
> I'll have to do some experimenting.  I have a pair of 532s that get 30 megs
> and have something like -55 (not even half mile link).
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
> --- Albert Einstein
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 9:34 PM, Mike Hammett  >wrote:
>
> > < 30 as he typed would include 256 kbit.
> >
> > You both probably mean > 30...  which it also can do, just fine.  Even
> > reliably.
> >
> >
> > -
> > Mike Hammett
> > Intelligent Computing Solutions
> > http://www.ics-il.com
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > From: "Jayson Baker" 
> > Sent: Friday, November 13, 2009 11:24 PM
> > To: "WISPA General List" 
> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] 100Mbps over 10 miles
> >
> > > Why <30 surprise you?  We have a very old Nstreme-Dual link going about
> 1
> > > mile and it has been getting 90Mbps w/ 1ms latency for YEARS.
> > > 90% of the problem with MikroTik is that people have no idea how to use
> > > it.
> > > You don't just plug it in and go.  We spent about 3 years learning,
> > > tweaking, deploying and testing.
> > >
> > > Anyway, to answer your question, yes the 1mile 180Mbps link is using
> R52N
> > > card, and Nstreme.
> > >
> > > On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 10:00 PM, Josh Luthman
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > >> With the 180meg 1 mile link - I assume that is also r5(2)n?  Are you
> > >> doing
> > >> N
> > >> or nstreme?
> > >>
> > >> I'm surprised to see anything <30 megs when it comes to Mikrotik.
> > >>
> > >> Josh Luthman
> > >> Office: 937-552-2340
> > >> Direct: 937-552-2343
> > >> 1100 Wayne St
> > >> Suite 1337
> > >> Troy, OH 45373
> > >>
> > >> "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
> > >> --- Albert Einstein
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 11:47 PM, Jayson Baker <
> jay...@spectrasurf.com
> > >> >wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > Yes, 40MHz.
> > >> >
> > >> > We have a pair of RB333's that go about 1 mile, and get around
> > 180Mbps.
> > >> >  Too
> > >> > bad they only have 100Mbps Ethernet.
> > >> >
> > >> > On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 9:41 PM, Josh Luthman
> > >> > wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> > > 120 megs through one pair of r52n?!  I'm assuming this is 40mhz?
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Josh Luthman
> > >> > > Office: 937-552-2340
> > >> > > Direct: 937-552-2343
> > >> > > 1100 Wayne St
> > >> > > Suite 1337
> > >> > > Troy, OH 45373
> > >> > >
> > >> > > "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
> > >> > > --- Albert Einstein
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 11:39 PM, Jayson Baker
> > >> > >  > >> > > >wrote:
> > >> > >
> > >> > > > I think we get something in the range of 120Mbps through a pair
> of
> > >> > > MikroTik
> > >> > > > 411's and R52N wireless cards with 3' PacWireless dishes at 12
> > >> > > > miles.
> > >> > > > 120Mbps on the wireless.  Those boards only have 100Mbps
> Ethernet,
> > >> > > > so
> > >> > > > that's
> > >> > > > a limiting factor.
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > Total cost: <$1000
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > If you're concerned that MT isn't "reliable" enough, spend $2000
> > >> > > > and
> > >> > put
> > >> > > up
> > >> &

Re: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?

[Jayson Baker]

I cannot comment on the contracts.

As I have mentioned previously, we bought the aggregated content from Avail
Media.  They can probably help you.

We did still have direct contracts with the networks though.  Ultimately,
they were the ones who agreed to allow us to distribute via wireless.

On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 8:19 PM, RickG  wrote:

> Jayson,
>
> Can you elaborate on the contracts and the system you have in place to
> provide this?
>
> -RickG
>
> On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 7:43 PM, Jayson Baker  >wrote:
>
> > Actually, you're completely wrong.  We got all of our networks to agree
> to
> > allow us to transport it wirelessly.
> > The requirement was that we own the network entirely, from end A to end
> Z,
> > and that we control every part of it.
> > The ones that are concerned about theft (i.e. ESPN/Disney, HBO, etc.)
> > already had encrypted stream anyway.
> >
> > We successfuly transmitted all of our programming over MikroTik wireless
> > links without any problems.  Including HD.
> >
> > On Sun, Nov 15, 2009 at 4:03 PM, Mike Hammett  > >wrote:
> >
> > > Every time this comes up, I say the same thing.  You can't over
> wireless.
> > > The content owners WILL NOT license it for wireless use.  I've tried
> > > numerous times.
> > >
> > > Expect to dump about $500k into a real system to do IPTV.
> > >
> > >
> > > -
> > > Mike Hammett
> > > Intelligent Computing Solutions
> > > http://www.ics-il.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > From: 
> > > Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 8:44 AM
> > > To: "WISPA General List" 
> > > Subject: [WISPA] IPTV -- Anyone doing it?
> > >
> > > > I have been looking at some IPTV options and basically, there does
> not
> > > > seam to
> > > > be a whole lot of options. I can A) build my own IP headend B) nada .
> >  I
> > > > can not
> > > > find a single IPTV provider that truly caters to the resident, soho,
> > etc.
> > > > There
> > > > is one that does so for huge cable op's but thats not where I am at,
> > yet
> > > > =)
> > > >
> > > > I can build my own head end no problem. Licensing is the primary
> issues
> > > > there. I
> > > > am guessing that is what is stopping the explosion of retail IPTV and
> > > > instead
> > > > pushing the more a la carte IP video streamers like NetFlix, HuLu, et
> > al.
> > > >
> > > > So, what options exist for IPTV ?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> 
> > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > > > http://signup.wispa.org/
> > > >
> > >
> >
> 
> > > >
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> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
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