JMJM and AL, Zen is not a subset of Chan. Chan is a subset of zen.
Chan, at least as JMJM represents it, it a religion, a subset of Buddhism. JMJM is right when he says zen does not have any spirituality. Spirituality is maya. Karma is maya. Remember, JUST THIS! Zen's difficulty is it is SO SIMPLE and SO BASIC and SO PURE that it is easy to miss when your rational mind is busy being dualistic. JMJM is wrong. Zen is not 'just a mind exercise'. Zen is NO-MIND. JUST THIS! ...Bill! From: [email protected] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jue Miao Jing Ming - ???? Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2008 6:25 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [Zen] Character Building Hi Al, I would not say that HPZ is NOT Chan, but a subset of Chan. Besides, we use the term Content instead of Happy in Chan It is not my position nor mission to academically compare Zen and Chan. This road serves no purpose. I will however explain what Chan is if the readers are interested. Since I brought up the subject however, I will complete it...... I believe Zen could be just a subset of Chan. Zen seems to have all the visible forms -- words, concepts and descriptions of Chan, but not the invisible part of Chan, karma, cause, etc. If so then Zen is incomplete from my understanding of Chan. Chan deals with everything in the universe, whether it is labeled as supernatural, unscientific, energy, field, maya, samsara. Chan is simple and direct. It is taught without words and formalities. And the gate to enter it is absolute stillness and absolute surrender of ego. JM Fitness63 wrote: From: Jue Miao Jing Ming - > I don't seem to understand your comment on what I wrote. I don't find them relate to each other.> OK. You say Chan is about karma and liberation? I agree. I think that HAPPY PEOPLE ZEN is what is now being taught in many places in America. It is NO KARMA, just HAPPY PEOPLE no matter what. Just zazen and BE HAPPY. That is not CHAN. OK? __________ NOD32 3401 (20080829) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ------------------------------------ Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
