swiss collars
I found this website with nice swiss collars, priced very reasonably. Just wanted to share it, I am ordering Tango a red one. http://www.collarshop.com/alcowleatdog.html Tina and Tango Central PA
Re: Prong Collars
We have one and use it only when teaching a young dog to walk at our side. We never have to do any correction with it, just the fact that it is there on the dog tells them we must walk by our master. With a regular collar, leather or choke chain our 10 month old male wants to meet and love each person he meets and does not care who is on the end of the leash. He goes with me often to town and loves the bank as he will set by the tellers counter and when they bring a bone for him he will put his front feet on the counter and take the bone ever so easy.. In fact if I go to town withour him everone wants to know where Shadow is. Ray Burgett Eaglecap Bernese http://users.eoni.com/~eaglecap/ Talee, Lexi, Bell, Shadow Max www.goodbernerfood.com Honest Kitchen Dog Food Dehydrated Raw Dog Food
Re: Prong Collars
I have stayed out of this discussion so far as my experience with prong collars is only second hand. However when we were in Germany in 1990 we watched two good Rottie friends (very experienced trainers) trying to deprogramme a German Shepherd that had been trained on a prong collar. The owner had been told this was the way to go but I think he was very inexperienced and the dog had suffered quite a lot. A great deal of patience and love used to try and get him right again. I was also shocked to see a 6 month old Rottie pup wearing a prong collar at his home. I must say that the training of Rotties that we saw generally was very motivational and kind. Here in S Africa prongs are not allowed by our Kennel Union, although some of the private training groups do use them. In all our training of Rottweilers and now Bernese we have never found it necessary to use such equipment, but I accept the comments of others with perhaps more experience that us that sometimes there are dogs that might benefit from the correct use of them. By the way I am just over 5 feet tall and weight about 53kgs :-) Marion Brown Teversal Bernese Mountain Dogs South Africa Dogs Never Lie About Love (Jeffrey Masson) - Original Message - From: THOMAS SLIDER [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Bernese Mountain Dog Mailing List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, August 03, 2003 9:06 PM Subject: Re: Prong Collars I use a prong collar on my 130# berner-boy, Ian if we are going places that he might lunge or pull my arm off! g Normally he is good on a round leather collar and will stay by my side. I feel it is better than choking him on a choke collar which can do damage to his throat area. He behaves better and it is a gentle pressure all around his neck area, if used properly. I once left the prong collar on him when I put him in his car crate and could not understand why he would not get out when we got home. He had gotten it caught at the far end of the crate and I had to crawl in with him to release it. Talk about a TIGHT squeeze for both of us!! But he forgave me.. :-)) Carol Slider in NC
Re: Prong Collars
forwarded in plain text for Vilma: [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: German Shepherd that had been trained on a prong collar. The owner had been told this was the way to go but I think he was very inexperienced and the dog had suffered quite a lot. A great deal of patience and love used to try and get him right again. Poor dog! But I would say this has to do w/ the trainer, not the training tool. One can also be quite abusive to a dog w/ your voice and/or handsthat doesn't mean that voice and hands are bad tools, just incorrectly used tools. The worst cases of down dogs I have seen have been those trained (jerked around) w/ a choke collar by someone who thought he/she knew what he/she was doing. Damage to the trachea is also a big concern w/ choke collars. Also, we can agree to disagree. We can politely discusss the merits and drawbacks of training methods. Ex: While I personally don't like or recommend choke collars or invisible fences/electronic collars for training, it doesn't mean there aren't some people/dogs who do fine w/ them. And sometimes my personal preferences (clicker training and a buckle collar, head halter or pinch collar - in that order) aren't always the right choice either. The DOG will tell you. Listen to him -- watch his ears, tail, body language. To be a really good dog trainer, you want to have lots of tools in your tool chest as one well known trainer told methen you have many options for each individual handler/dog combo. Vilma Briggs (Kistner) Mt. Gilead, OH U-UD Mocha Java Slurp, UDX, HIC, TT Ch. Brighteye Expresso Bean, UD, NDD, TT U-CDX Our Little Buddy, UD, NA, TT Thirdtym's A Charm, CD Hob Nob Clouds In My Coffee (puppy Perc) and foster Bernerboy: Brew/Bruin (Pat Long's dog 2B) Check any e-mail over the Web for free at MailBreeze (http://www.mailbreeze.com)
Re: BERNER-L digest 4527-prong collars/hip dysplasia
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Re: Prong Collars
I use a prong collar on my 130# berner-boy, Ian if we are going places that he might lunge or pull my arm off! g Normally he is good on a round leather collar and will stay by my side. I feel it is better than choking him on a choke collar which can do damage to his throat area. He behaves better and it is a gentle pressure all around his neck area, if used properly. I once left the prong collar on him when I put him in his car crate and could not understand why he would not get out when we got home. He had gotten it caught at the far end of the crate and I had to crawl in with him to release it. Talk about a TIGHT squeeze for both of us!! But he forgave me.. :-)) Carol Slider in NC
Prong collars
Several trainers have written wonderful accounts of the proper use and benefits of a prong collar. These collars do look like midevil torture devices I'm sure we all agree. But looks can be deceiving. In working with pet owners for many years, I discovered that a prong collar is gift in some cases and I would recommend them to some owners as a last resort. It is truly power steering and can save a dog's life. In that I mean there are people (not Berner owners!) who will give up dealing with an unruly dog by leaving it tied out in the north 40, giving it away, taking it to the pound. In most cases, a prong collar need only be used for a short time. A prong collar does not tighten up all the way. Just wearing the collar gets positive results. The constrictive feeling equally around the neck gets the dogs attention. They really don't hurt, I have tried one on. Personally, I don't use one on my obedience dogs because it gets tangled in their hair and is a pain to put on and take off. Most of the time I don't use any collar when practicing obedience. Years ago, I used a prong on my Labrador to get the two of us from the car to the start of the track w/o causing me bodily harm. I also had occasion to use a prong on my high energy, overly excitable Berner who jumped out of the car over my shoulder, breaking her chain collar, and hurting me in the process. There I was, frantically calling her name as she circled wildly in the parking lot at dog school harassing other dogs/owners. Talk about embarrassing. The next week we arrived at class with her wearing the prong collar and a leash. She got out of the car, took a lunge towards her doggy friends. I never even pulled it, just stood there. She amazingly became a well mannered dog who was happy to pay attention to me. She was much better behaved in class. I began to like her better and she began to like me better. She only wore the prong 6 more times. A prong, choke chain, halti, nylon slip, and others should only be used for training and under supervision. April Rifenburg
Re: Haltis and prong collars/Articles about; URL correction
WowI just now had a chance to go read the articles at flying dog press and I was blown away. Her experiences almost mirrored mine in regards to the prong versus halti [with Bacchus anyway]. Thank you both for sending in this info. I have bookmarked it for future reference. Thank you so much Cathi Massillon Ohio - Original Message - From: Pat Long Paul Dangel [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'Bernese Mountain Dog Mailing List' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2003 6:54 PM Subject: RE: Haltis and prong collars/Articles about; URL correction I found it here: http://www.flyingdogpress.com/articles.html Thanks Cheryl! Pat
Re: Haltis and prong collars/Articles about; URL correction
Just a comment that I wanted to make regarding this topic. I posed the question a couple of months ago, about the use of different collars when I was having problems with getting Stevie under control (he thinks he is Pegasus when it comes to birds!) and after sustaining a rotator cuff injury to my shoulder because of it, and because of some physical problems that now affect my balance it was necessary for me to find a quick but effective solution to our dilemma. I received many many emails both for and against the prong collar and also many both for and against a head halter. I tried both very diligently and as most of you know, I would never do anything to hurt Stevie, either physically or emotionally! Stevie never got used to the head halter and his spirit appeared injured whenever I tried it on him after the initial freaking out period!! It disheartened me to see him this way. We then continued with the prong or pinch collar. Stevie is an absolute perfect gentleman with this collar and I have received so many compliments as to how well behaved he is on leash (we have also had no formal classes). We never have to put any pressure per se on the collar, and he trots along with tail wagging and head held high, smiling. Of course, I am very grateful that I do not have to worry about him pulling me off my feet or reinjuring my shoulder. Our walks are so pleasant and enjoyable. No stress at all. I have just read the articles that Pat had posted from Flying Dog and I must say that they were so informative and got the point across very effectively. We must remember that what works for some does not work for all and since every situation and human and dog combination are unique we must be open minded and respectful of others and their decisions. I however do appreciate the discussions as I am sure most of us do, this is how we learn and expand our horizons. I have learned so much in the last 9 months since joining this list and am forever thankful and indebted. Stevie is as well!! Berner hugs Karen and Stevie NB, Canada
Re: harnesses, Haltis, prong collars
Forwarded in plain text for Vilma: In a message dated 7/29/2003 9:48:49 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Is there a proper way to put on a prong collar? Yes, it is very easy. Just take it apart in the middle and put it back together on the dog. Simply squeeze any two of the links to open it and seperate themyou can put together or take apart the collar at any point and rehook it around the dog' s neck. Do NOT slide it as it is over the dog's head like you do for a choke collar, it will be too loose to do any good. You should be able to slide a couple fingers under the collar when properly fitted, but not your whole hand. If it is too big or small, take a link or two out or add a link or two until it fits properly. You don't have to pop the dog on a properly fitted prong collar. You have power steering and you can be very gentle w/ the dog. Just put it on as above and go for a walk99.9% of the time the dog will simply come to his own conclusions if he acts up, you dont have to say a thing, tho I usually say a soft sweet Buzz, asy! and then you can simply smile and praise him for being such a good boy and walking so nicely by your side. Vilma Briggs (Kistner) Mt. Gilead, OH U-UD Mocha Java Slurp, UDX, HIC, TT Ch. Brighteye Expresso Bean, UD, NDD, TT U-CDX Our Little Buddy, UD, NA, TT Thirdtym's A Charm, CD Hob Nob Clouds In My Coffee (puppy Perc) and foster Bernerboys: Brew (Pat Long's dog 2B) and Buzz and foster PRT Daisy Check any e-mail over the Web for free at MailBreeze (http://www.mailbreeze.com)
Re: harnesses, Haltis, prong collars
forwarded in plain text for Vilma: In a message dated 7/29/2003 12:40:26 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: prong collars are forbiddenand even if they was not forbidden I would not use them. The feeling of the best for the dog is always the most important, more important than my own convenience. Margaret, Have you ever tried using a prong collar on a dog? Have you ever seen a dog learn to wear one? You'd be surprised! Fitted and used proplerly, the dogs really aren't bothered much by it, but they usually quickly stop trying to dislocate mom's shoulder! A member of our Berner club actually had that happen to her. When used properly, the prong collar/pinch collar doesn't hurt them in any way the dog indicates, so I let the dog tell ME what stresses him too much and what does not, I don't decide that for him. The overwhelming majority of dogs don't show any body language or vocalisation that indicates stress whatsoever. Wearing the prong collar does nothing to their attitude 99.9% of the time, most dogs adapt amazingly well and very quickly and do not find it to be aversive at all. Of course every tool is not for every dog, some dogs don't do well w/ head halters, some flip out at citronella bark collars, some do fine w/ choke collars -- all the opposite of what I recommend. You need to match the individual dog and his handler to the tool. That is part of the skill of being a dog trainer. And if you own just one dog, you ARE a dog trainer. :-) All dogs do not need a prong collar or head halter, many do fine on a flat buckle collar, my own adult dogs dont wear them, and if you are lucky enough to have well behaved dogs that's wonderful -- but there are a lot of dogs who would not get to go on walks at all if they were that poorly behaved and pulled that much. I think these dogs would much rather get to go places and do things than be left home! Vilma Briggs (Kistner) Mt. Gilead, OH U-UD Mocha Java Slurp, UDX, HIC, TT Ch. Brighteye Expresso Bean, UD, NDD, TT U-CDX Our Little Buddy, UD, NA, TT Thirdtym's A Charm, CD Hob Nob Clouds In My Coffee (puppy Perc) and foster Bernerboys: Brew (Pat Long's dog 2B) and Buzz and foster PRT: Daisy Check any e-mail over the Web for free at MailBreeze (http://www.mailbreeze.com)
re: Haltis and prong collars
Hi all, Just my personal experience-at around 8 months of age we needed some extra help with Bacchus. He was full of himself and I couldn't take the chance of him pulling me off my feet on a walk [I've had a total knee replacement, broke my hipetc, blah, blah]. We were taking obedience classes and first tried the halti. It looked like his spirit was broken when he wore the halti. He would stand with his head down, looking up at me with those big brown eyes.or else would be so fixated on removing it that he would try to rub it off on the helpers legs when we were doing the figure 8 in obedience. But it did prevent him from pulling. He just hated it. So, reluctantly, I tried the prong collar. I had never used one. He acted like it was no different from a buckle collar. Head up, tail wagging, happy. I did find you want the prong collar to fit snuglyand that [in our case] leash corrections were not necessary [in fact I believe they discourage any leash correction, instead let the dog pull once and learn that way]. He walked like a good boy with a happy face. Alsothis was only used for about 2 months. Bacchus got over his teenage years quickly and now at the age of 7 continues to be a gentle boy [of course he's also neutered nowLOL]. So keep that in mind.just because one might need a bit of temporary help.doesn't mean you have to use it forever. I've heard the same thing from people that have used haltis successfully. Again just my personal experience Cathi with Bacchus and Ari [mom never had to use ANYTHING on me!]
collars
I've long been looking for a nice, rounded, buckle collar. The flat one that Louis has at the moment is fine but ruins his hair. I've looked for a long time now but never come across one, here in The Netherlands. The other day I was in a pet shop and a very helpful and very, very tall and muscular young man explained that I should be using a harness and not a collar for a dog of Louis's size. Although Louis is not generally a puller he can be aggressive with some male dogs. If I see potential trouble I put the Halti on him. The man explained that he had a St Bernard and a Mastiff and that his wife could control them with a harness! I would have thought you would be fighting the full weight of the dog using a harness! I've never used a harness on Louis. Believe me this young man looked like he could halt a bus ... not sure what his wife looked like! I don't recall anyone on the List recommending using a harness for control. Was he right? Rhona Vantine __ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com
Re: collars
When I showed up with Chelsea at our first puppy class (3.5 mos old), she was wearing her harness. It's a harness she wears in the car so she can be buckled in to the seat belt, but you can also attach it to a leash for walks. The instructor said that when walking/training her, a buckle collar is best, because a harness basically allows the weight that the dog is pulling (you!) to be evenly distributed over the front part of its body frame, allowing the dog to pull harder. And I have to agree. I notice that Chelsea can pull like a horse with her harness on! So walks now are done with her wearing her buckle collar or gentle leader. In my opinion, stick with the buckle collar. Maybe the salesman at the pet store used the word harness to mean a gentle leader or halti?? Cheers! Alison Chelsea (i LIKE wearing my harness mum! why can't i wear it more often??) On Fri, 11 Jul 2003 00:49:23 -0700 (PDT), Rhona Vantine wrote: I've long been looking for a nice, rounded, buckle collar. The flat one that Louis has at the moment is fine but ruins his hair. I've looked for a long time now but never come across one, here in The Netherlands. The other day I was in a pet shop and a very helpful and very, very tall and muscular young man explained that I should be using a harness and not a collar for a dog of Louis's size. Although Louis is not generally a puller he can be aggressive with some male dogs. If I see potential trouble I put the Halti on him. The man explained that he had a St Bernard and a Mastiff and that his wife could control them with a harness! I would have thought you would be fighting the full weight of the dog using a harness! I've never used a harness on Louis. Believe me this young man looked like he could halt a bus ... not sure what his wife looked like! I don't recall anyone on the List recommending using a harness for control. Was he right? Rhona Vantine __ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com
Re: collars
In a message dated 07/11/2003 2:49:50 AM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Was he right? My experience over the years is that there is far LESS control with a harness than a collar as the dog can throw its entire weight into the chest strap. That's one of the reasons harnesses are used in drafting rather than just hitching the cart to the collar. I sincerely doubt, unless one of the special no pull harnesses are used, there would be greater control. I think you are doing fine using the Halti when you anticipate problem behavior. Anne Copeland (Flash CGC, TDIA, 9 yrs. old, Berner; Gypsy CGC, TDI, 2 yrs. old, Cavalier) Northern Illinois [EMAIL PROTECTED], Corr. Sec. BMDCA
Leather Decorative Collars, Take 2
Dear List; For all of you who emailed me privately, I'm sorry that I forgot to add the website. I think I was tired by then and copied it from my Leolist friend but didn't paste it into the email. So, here it is... to http://www.collarbone.net Jeanne Schoech, please disregard the last website I sent you. It was the wrong one. Maybe I better give up email for the weekend!!! Wendy Keene, Klarsson (it's TOO HOT outside) and Lilah (I just want to sleep on the AC vent). Hampton, VA
Leather Decorative Collars
Hello List! A friend with Leonbergers forwarded me this website for a decorative leather, hand-crafted collar with the Bern crest on it. If you view the web site, click on the Leonberger breed for a picture of the actual collar (of course it would have the Bern crest instead). Just thought I would throw this out for those of you that are looking for unique items for your Berner buddies. Wendy Keene, Klarsson (BMD) and Lilah (the right-colored Sheltie) Hampton, VA PS: I have no affiliation with this man or his company. Just thought I would pass it along to the List as it seems that there are lots of people looking for all things Berner!
Collars and Classes
Hi, I encourage all puppy owners to attend a behaviourist run Puppy Kindergarten and to study basic obedience in a motivational environment. I too dislike training where harsh methods are used, not everyone is born with the skill to communicate with their dog and they must be helped with guidance provided in classes. People need to learn that they must talk with their dog not just clip on a leash to whatever collar and expect the dog to know what is expected. Rose T.
Re: prong/pinch collars is forbidden to use in our country
Margareta Same applies in S Africa except that it is KUSA (our official Kennel Club) that bans prong, spike or electric collars for use at any affiliated club. However, they are not unknown in private training clubs! We have never used anything but positive training on our own dogs, be they Rotties or Bernese. Marion Brown Teversal Bernese Mountain Dogs South Africa Dogs Never Lie About Love (Jeffrey Masson)
RE: Collars for Berners
Hi, All collars have the potential to injure the dog and so do head halter type collars. The answer is in teaching your dog to focus on you and let the dog know what is expected of him. How many times I see people hauling their dog around with the dog gagging and the human straining on the other end. I dislike choke chains but will use martingale collars and that includes the prong collar where the situation necessitates. It is not the collar that causes the injury but the human on the end of the leash. Rose T.
Re: Collars for Berners
Hi, But there are always two - one in each end of the leash. I am a human being and I hope I sometimes is a little bit more educated than the dog when it comes to intellectual thinking. I am the one who can decide not to be a strength in one end causing my dog a damage. We are many, also many on the list, who very well know the kind and soft methods of training without any pinches and jerks will give you a so much happier and healthier dog. I am also one of them who is quite uninterested in obedience classes or training for my dog. My dog got a close human natural training in everyday life and I do not enjoy competitions in general and not competitions in obedience. I see no need for prong or pitch collars or no other cruelty to animals. I leave this topic and will in the future concentrate on the positive things discusssed on the list and how we as humans can help our Bernerfriends. Margareta Strand It is not the collar that causes the injury but the human on the end of the leash.
collars
Terry, I understand about the collars. My Splash girl pulls like a freight train. Even worse when she spots a squirrel. Not anymore though! Our trainer recommened a new type of harness for us. It is called a Sensation Harness made by a company out of California called Soft Concepts. We are not in any way affliated with this company, except that we are very pleased customers. The best part about it this harness is that it is does not involve the throat at all. The ring where you clip your leash is actually in the center of the dog's chest, So when the dog starts pulling, they stop because they are pulling against themselves. I like it better than the Gentle Leader, as the dogs aren't digging at their face to get the darned thing off. Hope that helps, it certainly did us! Wendi = Wendi Giordano [EMAIL PROTECTED] Striving to be worthy of my beautiful Berners... In gratitude to and loving memory of Miss Kitty (Swiss Stars Cat Balou) Dec. 1, 1994 - Feb. 14, 2003 Splash (Swiss Stars Over Niagara) Cutter (Swiss Stars Black Diamond) __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM). http://calendar.yahoo.com
prong/pinch collars is forbidden to use in our country
Hi, I got information on prong or pinch collars. It is forbidden to use these kind of collars in Sweden. We saw them sometimes many, many years ago and noone would even dream of using this kind of torture for their pets or members of the families as the dogs are. Very sorry to understand these collars are discussed for use on dogs among serious owners of Berners. Margareta Strand Stockholm Sweden
Re: Collars for Berners
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Collars for Berners
Has there been a definitive conclusion of what collars are best to use with Berners? I have switched from a prong collar to a buckle collar. Our berner girl of 9 months doesn't seem to mind pulling on the leash with either one. My wife swears by the prong collar and I refuse to put her on it. Any recommendations? Terry Bering
training collars
I have a 9 month old girl who is quite spirited and loves to play with other dogs. . We used a buckle collar when she was younger and switched to a prong collar after 7 months. I have found the prong collar to be of limited use. I thought perhaps we just had a berner that didn't respond like other dogs. Now I find she has the same tendencies with or without it. I find she pulls at the beginning of her walk regardless of what is around her neck. She can be bullheaded and resistant when she wants to play with another dog or even stay in the park and wait for another dog to play with. I have decided to go back to the buckle collar and continue all of her training activities with this collar. It is still a struggle, depending on the day, but I think the buckle collar is worth the effort. I find myself using more coaxing and positive reinforcement even though I am sure some dog owners think I am being nice to this nut-case on a leash. By the way, I have seen dogs play together with one or both wearing a prone collar and it can be a little scary. Terry Bering
Collars
Karen, I just wanted to second Vilma's post that prong or pinch collars, if used properly, are very useful, humane tools for most dogs. As I also thought they looked like a medieval torture device, I was shocked to see at my first Berner specialty that most of the dogs were wearing one!! My Maddie was just beginning the pulling problem, and I had tried no-pull harnesses, a Gentle Leader, and LOTS of positive training methods, to no avail. My stand like a tree whenever she pulled resulted in her just standing there, gazing at her surroundings, for 10 or 20 minutes -- she just didn't get the point I was trying to make that if you pull, we stop. Anyway, I tried a new obedience class instructor who HATES the traditional choke or slip collar but strongly recommended the prong/pinch collar. I tried it and was amazed at the results. All it took to remind Maddie to walk on a loose lead was a subtle, quick pop. This made the collar tighten slightly all around her neck and quickly got her attention. It does not dig into the dog's neck, and most important it works without pressure against her throat. She very quickly learned what I wanted, and I was able to discontinue regular use of the prong collar. It's simply a tool and does not need to be a permanent crutch if used properly. Maddie has since earned her Novice A Obedience title, and demonstrated EXCELLENT off-lead heeling skills in draft demonstrations and tests -- and both my Berners are wonderful, well-behaved certified therapy dogs. I learned the hard way that dogs will sometimes be dogs, and walking my two together in public can sometimes lead to blood, bruises, and scrapes on my body. So when I have 200 pounds of Berner enthusiasm and muscle on my flaccid, old arm, they are both wearing their prong collars and I have much better control should one of their best doggie friends suddenly appear down the street. They are, for the most part, well behaved and under control -- but they can also do very stupid things at times. Anyway, I think the prong collar, used properly, is an excellent and safe tool. Hugs to Stevie -- what an inspiration you both are! Vicky Whitney in Bozeman, Montana _ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
Re: Karen and Stevie-Collars.
Karen -- Take a look at the no-pull harness shown here: http://www.petsmart.com/dog/shopping/collars%5F%5Fleashes%5F%5F%5Fid%5Ftags/harnesses%5Fand%5Fmuzzles/products/product%5F11833.shtml. We used a very similar one on 2 of our dogs who pulled terribly - a 65 lb husky-x and a 95 lb intact BMD boy. Works well - does not inflict pain, but rather causes discomfort under the arms ONLY when the dog pulls. Worked great for us - after a few weeks we could put it away and had well behaved dogs on leash! Liz Steinweg The Crew Blue Moon's Baloo Berry Torte Balou (11/06/1995) Bobby Sox (husky-x 10/31/1993) Rio Sahara (the Rat Cats) and in loving memory of my 1st BMD - Toby (6/29/97 - 6/30/00 lost to MH) Colorado Springs CO http://www.ccrtiming.com/personal/personal.htm - Original Message - If I have him on leash and he sees a bird that he would like to get to know or anything else that strikes his fancy, he just about pulls my arm out of the socket. A friend of mine uses a pinch collar and I just wanted an opinion on them.
RE: Karen and Stevie-Collars.
this is the sporn harness. we have had great success with it. the company is great about replacement pieces as well. there is another similar one out, but it puts some pressure on the chest. this one is totally biomechanically sound. andrea -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Liz Steinweg Crew Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 12:12 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Berner List Subject: Re: Karen and Stevie-Collars. Karen -- Take a look at the no-pull harness shown here: http://www.petsmart.com/dog/shopping/collars%5F%5Fleashes%5F%5F%5Fid%5Ftags/ harnesses%5Fand%5Fmuzzles/products/product%5F11833.shtml. We used a very similar one on 2 of our dogs who pulled terribly - a 65 lb husky-x and a 95 lb intact BMD boy. Works well - does not inflict pain, but rather causes discomfort under the arms ONLY when the dog pulls. Worked great for us - after a few weeks we could put it away and had well behaved dogs on leash! Liz Steinweg The Crew Blue Moon's Baloo Berry Torte Balou (11/06/1995) Bobby Sox (husky-x 10/31/1993) Rio Sahara (the Rat Cats) and in loving memory of my 1st BMD - Toby (6/29/97 - 6/30/00 lost to MH) Colorado Springs CO http://www.ccrtiming.com/personal/personal.htm - Original Message - If I have him on leash and he sees a bird that he would like to get to know or anything else that strikes his fancy, he just about pulls my arm out of the socket. A friend of mine uses a pinch collar and I just wanted an opinion on them.
Re: Karen and Stevie-Collars.
Karen, I would highly recommend a Gentle Leader. We've used them on both our guys and they work really well. Our trainer uses these exclusively. I tried a pinch collar on Tugboat once because of an issue we were having with him fence fighting a couple of dogs on his walk, but I will NEVER do that again. That was months ago and I THINK he's forgiven us. You can check it out at www.gentleleader.com. It gives plenty of information on how it works, etc. It's more like a horse harness than a collar and there's no pain for the dog. Except the trauma of not getting to do exactly what they want when they want! Andie Reid Wilmington, NC Karen wrote: Dear Listers, Hi everyone!! First of all, just a quick update on Stevie. Stevie is doing absolutely WONDERFULLY. He is really a very normal and somewhat goofy boy. Bouncy and energetic. Stevie saw the vets yesterday and we do not have to go back again!! They have declared him completely recovered from his horrific accident (and believe me they are in awe just as much as I am) and also from his recent testicular tumour scare. All is well, Thank God and thank all of you!! Now I have a question for all my learned list friends. I have been having a problem myself with some health issues that involve my balance and physical strength. Stevie, now that he is well, is very exuberant to go out and explore absolutely everything. I have always only used a regular web collar on him but he pulls sometimes. He actually has pulled me off my feet and I am a fairly big girl! If I have him on leash and he sees a bird that he would like to get to know or anything else that strikes his fancy, he just about pulls my arm out of the socket. A friend of mine uses a pinch collar and I just wanted an opinion on them. I tried one on Stevie and it worked beautifully, but I don't know whether to use it or not. I value your opinions and suggestions. When I took Stevie out with it on this morning there was no pulling at all, and he did not seem to mind it at all. I just don't want to traumatize or hurt him in anyway. Thanks in advance for all and any help. Big Berner Hugs and Kisses Karen and Stevie NB, Canada --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.478 / Virus Database: 275 - Release Date: 06/05/2003
Ang: Re: Ang: Re: Karen and Stevie-Collars.
Hi, It will be a heat between the collar and the skin. Wounds like chafes in the armpits, close to the dogs chest. Margareta
Re: Karen and Stevie-Collars.
In a message dated 5/27/2003 12:52:08 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: It will be a heat between the collar and the skin. Wounds like chafes in the armpits, close to the dogs chest. Margareta, I have not seen (nor ever heard of) this happening w/ either the various no pull harnesses, head halters, nor the pinch collar, all of which are used extensively in my area. If it did then it was not fitted properly. The same thing could happen w/ a buckle collar left on a long time too tight. I have never seen anything like this happen and I have used pinch collars myself for several of my dogs and my students' dogs and have many friends who do also. That would never happen in a properly fitted pinch collar b/c it is loose against the fur (you can slide your hand part way under it) except for the moment the dog pulls, which they rarely do very often once they understand how to walk nicely on it. Vilma Briggs (Kistner) Mt. Gilead, OH U-UD Mocha Java Slurp, UDX, HIC, TT Ch. Brighteye Expresso Bean, UD, NDD, TT U-CDX Our Little Buddy, UD, NA, TT Thirdtym's A Charm, CD Hob Nob Clouds In My Coffee (puppy Perc) and foster Bernerboy: Brew/Bruin
Flea collars
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Flea Collars
I have had really good luck the past 3 years using an herbal flea / tick collar on my group of three. I get them from Medipatch. Go to: www.medipatch.com for more info. The only time I use Front Line is if we are going to the beach. I think the collars would probably work there also but I hate the thought of sand fleas. (I think putting all this stuff into our dogs is dreadful.) Nancy Bullard - Vistaplatz - 1972
breakaway collars
Just thought I'd let you all know, I just got my break away collars. They are very well made and came really quickly. I've realized in the past couple of days just how lucky we were with Sallie and Pecan's accident. It could very easily have gone the other way and we would be mourning the loss of my sweet little girl. I highly recommend these collars to all. One less thing to worry about! kendra, Jackson, and Sallie
RE: Collars
Hi, A friend used to breed field trial beagles and when these dogs are running the bunny in trial they wear ID collars. These look like the old style ID bracelets with an engraved plate and the flat link chain are fastened tightly around the beagles neck to avoid getting tangled in the brush. They are also painted with numbers on their flank for the judges and if some of the hot running beagles would overrun the track and get lost those would wear tracking collars. My local vet has a sign for embroidered flat collars whereby you have your surname and phone number on the collar and this can be worn without risk of tags getting caught. I've also rescued hunting dogs that have worn flat leather collars with an engraved brass plate, makes for easy return. There are lots of choices out there and as Anne says you choose what works for you. Take into account whether your dog lives with another, do they play and chew around each other's necks, are they escape artists, do you have good fencing and locked gates. Basic rule is never leave an unattended dog with a choke or martingale collar on and never crate a dog with these types of collars on. Flat or rolled buckled collars are best for daily wear providing they fit fairly snugly, loose fitting collars have the potential for getting caught. Rose T.
RE: Collars -- Tag requirements
In my region of the world, we are required to have lic tags on our dogs whenever they are outside (including in our yards). The authorities can come on to your property to check and the fine is something you would notice. In our house, we do a lot of collar on and collar off maneauvers. The buckle collar does tend to wear the hair. Any dog that is being shown in conformation in our house, tends see a collar less (might even take a few liberties in the yard, but don't tell the dog catcher). But, even if they tend to see the collar less, all the dogs, even the ones we shown in conformation, wear a buckle collar in obedience classes. Life is full of trade offs and this is one of them. The other reminder is NEVER leave a collar on a dog in a crate. Nancy Melone
Breakaway dog collars
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Re: Collars on Dogs
as the tags get caught in the vent while he sleeps and then when he wakes he'll have the vent grill hanging off his neck Been there, done that - got bonked on the head with the floor register. Cessi hooked herself into the register (wintertime though - hogging the heat?) and being relatively calm, didn't panic, just whacked me in the head with it so that I would wake up and get that rotten thing *off* her neck. grin That was when she had all of her tags on her collar - I've removed the excess, but I still keep a single ID tag on my guys 'cause you just never know... I've brought home several strays who could have been taken back home to Momma if they had their tags on. (They ended up finding their homes, but one had to spend the night here because we found him around 11:00pm, and it was too late to call anyone for help locating his people - I'd go crazy if that was me looking for one of my babies). Jen P.S. We have home collars, cottage collars and Collingwood collars - each with a local address or similar identifying home locator, and local phone #s. It wouldn't do me any good if someone found my dog (for example) in Collingwood while we were there for the weekend and they were trying to call me at home.
collars
- Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] What would be the best collar for her to be able to wear on a permanent basis ? Would a choke chain be ok to wear during day and then at walk time put on her normal collar ? Not a choke. Imagine if she got the ring hung up on something while messing about. Leather buckle collars are the way to go in my opinion, if you want to keep a collar on always. I'd get rolled leather, not flat, since that won't break the hair. -- Eileen Morgan March 30th Clinic Information: http://www.enter.net/~edlehman/USEAAR2.html The Mare's Nest http://www.enter.net/~edlehman --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.458 / Virus Database: 257 - Release Date: 2/24/2003
Re: Collars
You will hear many opinions on the collar on/collar off situation. I now always keep a flat, buckle collar on all my dogs with their tag ID's. In past years, twice I had dogs escape the fenced yard and neither time did the dog have on any ID although all had been tatooed (before microchips were available). Only through my own efforts at calling all vets, police stations, kennels, humane societies several times a day, repeatedly were these dogs recovered. I now keep tags on all the time. Slip collars, whether chain or nylon braid, are not the safest to keep on all the time. To preserve coat and be safe, a rolled leather collar or nylon will not destroy coat or choke the dog under ordinary circumstances. I must say, in my limited experience, the flat nylon buckle collar that Flash has worn for 5 years has not left any mark on his neck coat, but he has a rather long, harsh outer coat. Anne Copeland, Flash,TDI/CGC (Berner, 8 1/2 yrs.) Gypsy TDI/CGC(Rescue Cavalier,2 yrs.) BMDCSEW Tracking Test Chair/Sec. NE ILL [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ty's memorial page: http://www.geocities.com/workingyorkie/ty.html Gypsy's page:http://hometown.aol.com/annes4/Gypsy.html
Re: Collars
In a message dated 02/27/2003 11:24:36 AM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I guess if these are not available for dogs, The collars that are made with the plastic clip type fastener do function as a break away collar. We had it happen with my Cavalier when his leash got caught and the collar snapped open with the two prongs breaking off, releasing the dog. As with so many things in life, you choose your risks. On the one hand is the chance to lose the dog, on the other is the chance of injury. My guess is, there is a very small chance of either if you are a reasonably careful guardian, so each person must decide which direction is right for them. Anne Copeland, Flash,TDI/CGC (Berner, 8 1/2 yrs.) Gypsy TDI/CGC(Rescue Cavalier,2 yrs.) BMDCSEW Tracking Test Chair/Sec. NE ILL [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ty's memorial page: http://www.geocities.com/workingyorkie/ty.html Gypsy's page:http://hometown.aol.com/annes4/Gypsy.html
Jumping, collars, etc (was BERNER-L digest 4164)
In a message dated 12/6/2002 5:18:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: ? from New mommy?? My 41/2 month female is 35lbs What is the best way to stop her from jumping on people. I'm not touching this part, Eileen did too good a job. g I have conflicting advice on leash/collar types choke like vs the non-muzzle leader leash...I am sure there is much real-life advice. My pick is None of the above. The very best training is done OFF leash because it means the dog is truly learning/understanding your cue and giving you the behavior of his own volition. Do it whenever you can...around the house, in a safe yard or park, etc. Attach a longline to his collar that you can step on if you're in an area where running off could get him in trouble. Obviously, off leash isn't always practical for safety reasons...so I go to the next best thing, a flat buckle collar and a pocket full of yummy tidbits (always). The more you can build the relationship between your pup and yourself (YOU want to be THE most interesting and exciting thing in HIS world) and the more consistent you are in what you allow and don't, the more effective your training will be. That eliminates the need for specialized training devices like a choke collar (requires VERY skilled use) or head halter. To me, those are remedial measures to solve a problem that's already developed...better to avoid the problem from the get-go. One exception...the head halter may be necessary for someone with limited physical ability to hold fast against an errant berner. Positive training does NOT mean permissive so one should be ready and physically able to control the dog and not allow a full of himself teenager to run amok. then there is the burp/toot issues, but no loose stool and real good about no messes in house. Hmmm...puppies typically get the hiccoughs but I don't think I'd be comfortable with a gassy tummy (inmore ways than one ;-}. If a dog's producing excess gas it tells me something's off key somewhere in digestive tract (very scientific, I know ;-} and can most likely be addressed with a little fiddling. Are you in communication with his breeder? I think I'd discuss this with her, she might have found that some foods work better than others with her dogs. If you don't have an ongoing relationship with his breeder, I think I'd try phasing over to another food...one with a very different set of ingredients, and see if that makes a difference. Another root is to give probiotics but my leaning is to try to identify the problem first...rather than 'mask' the fact that a particular food doesn't sit well with my dog. PS I used to live with just a spoiled rotten husband and a spoiled roten daughter...now a spoiled rotten Berner, I love it Ummmat the risk of sounding the party pooper...you may not love it down the road. I have a spoiled rotten, Berner princess. At 10-3/4 yrs, she's a benevolent dictator...sometimes I let her have her way, sometimes she lets me have mine g. But it wasn't fun when she was 10 months old, 85 lbs, and out of controlI was in tears. Was she a 'bad' dog? No! What she was is a smart, over-indulged, strong-willed, princess. I was very lucky, although she was a take charge kind of girl, she wasn't terribly concerned about possessions and status stuff. My problem was making her do what I wanted her to do...like getting in the car or going for a walk or being civilized while I prepared her meal. THANK HEAVENS she never went in the direction of not letting me on the couch or growling if I came near her toy... like SO MANY spoiled berners do. This leads down a road that you DON'T want to go... So, don't let that cute ball of fluff and brains sucker you...build a working relationship with him, based on mutual respect...not indulgence, NOW, before you find yourself in a place that's not much fun. -Sherri Venditti (Long recovered from the bruised arms and wounded ego inflicted by my first berner... and STILL learning from her every day.)
