The BMW UUC Digest Volume 2 : Issue 556 : "text" Format Messages in this Issue: [Fwd: Re: English pronunciation.] Re: [Fwd: Re: English pronunciation.] Re: [Fwd: Re: English pronunciation.] Re: English Re: English Re: English Re: English Re: English Re: [UUC]pop/soda/Ccoke was English Re: English Re: English> pop Re: English> pop Re: Porsche 911 (was English) Re: Compression Tests Was: S50 3.2 compression Re: Compression Tests Was: S50 3.2 compression
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 14:26:31 -0500 From: Carey Probst <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> Subject: [Fwd: Re: English pronunciation.] Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Had to respond to the other challenge as a confused Merrican. Cholmondeley 'Chum-ley' - you'll get serious street cred for getting that one right !! a surname Featherstonehaugh 'Feather - ston - how' a surname and a town in the north east of England Menzies 'Men - zeez' a store chain Carey ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 15:04:22 -0500 From: "Gary Derian" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [Fwd: Re: English pronunciation.] Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I was sure that was when girls entered puberty. Gary Derian > > Menzies > 'Men - zeez' > a store chain > > > Carey > Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 01 Jan 2000 07:39:39 +0000 From: nick brearley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Cc: Carey Probst <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [Fwd: Re: English pronunciation.] Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> At 14:26 21/02/05 -0500, Carey Probst wrote: >Had to respond to the other challenge as a confused Merrican. > > >Cholmondeley >'Chum-ley' - you'll get serious street cred for getting that one right !! >a surname Yep, that's it. >Featherstonehaugh >'Feather - ston - how' >a surname and a town in the north east of England No, the correct version is Fanshaw. The town is Featherstone, pronounced as you would think, in Yorkshire. >Menzies >'Men - zeez' >a store chain Sorry, that one is Mingies, or Mingus according to the Menzies of Clan Menzies... Men-zeez is what we ignorant Sassenachs called the store chain of that name. Judging by the replies I've had you Merricans have spent far too much time reading P G Wodehouse, or Google really pulls the rug out from under the feet of anyone who tries to set tricky questions. Well done. Just been out to a talk by a retired Concorde flight engineer this evening. Some food for thought there, 500,000 (half a million) horsepower available for takeoff when the engines were running well in good weather conditions!! Nick Brearley ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 12:07:35 -0800 (PST) From: Richard Dorffer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: English Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> --- "Robinson, Lee" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Although, I by no means should start throwing stones and have > > stayed completely out of this discussion until specifically > > called out. Besides, it is generally understood that us > > Midwesterners speak properly and are usually the standard for > > national broadcasted spoken language due to the lack of > > accent and other idiosyncrasies... > > > > By the way, that would be Ohioans.... > > This from someone who lives in a state where someone actually said to me, > "Dang! You from A'lanta? You ain't even got one of them stupid soundin' > southern accents." My continued conversation allowed me to perceive that > central Ohio trailer trash was she & her boyfriend's native dialect. Do you really want to make generalizations about Ohioans from this one individual? Would you like me to start making some generalizations about people from Georgia? I don't think so. > Unfortunately, one of the words I picked up working up north (i.e. Ohio & > Pennsylvania) garners me the most ridicule at home. Using the word "pop" > instead of "coke" (I am from Atlanta after all) always ends up with me > trying to resolve never using the word again to refer to a bubbly, sugary > beverage. At least pop is a general and appropriate reference to a carbonated drink or fountain drink and shortened from "soda pop" unlike Coke which is a brand name (and under trademark). It is equivalent to using the term Xerox for a copy or Kleenex for a tissue. By the way, Coke is capitalized and should only be used in reference to Coca-Cola. Later, Rich ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:42:39 -0500 From: "Robinson, Lee" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Subject: Re: English Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Do you really want to make generalizations about Ohioans from > this one individual? Would you like me to start making some > generalizations about people from Georgia? I don't think so. Rich, Don't forget I worked in Columbus for over 18 months, so I have lots of individuals from whom I can make generalizations. :) It was usually these kind of people who started off with the generalizations about people from Georgia anyway. Easy tiger. My point was that it doesn't matter where you are from, you can't really poke fun at any dialect or accent as yours is probably funny to someone else too despite the fact that everybody thinks their dialect is the "correct" one. To say that one dialect is correct & the others are wrong is a little silly. After all, which one is correct? The one that came first? The one closest to the root language? The one from the area with the most money? > > At least pop is a general and appropriate reference to a > carbonated drink or fountain drink and shortened from "soda > pop" unlike Coke which is a brand name (and under trademark). > It is equivalent to using the term Xerox for a copy or > Kleenex for a tissue. By the way, Coke is capitalized and > should only be used in reference to Coca-Cola. Pop is an action verb, a synonym of explode. Soda is also something you won't hear commonly in the south, albeit much more descriptive than pop, especially since sodas actually fizz. Coca-Cola seems to have absolutely no problem with the fact that billions of people world-wide refer to various & sundry different colas as "coke." It can also refer to an illegal white substance or the by-product of consumed coal. It goes further to prove my pervious point. Go to Alabama & ask for a pop. Chances are you'll get mixed results at best. I can go anywhere in the world & ask for a "Coke" & get some form of international or local cola drink. I have to say I've never heard anyone refer to a copy as Xerox & only heard older folks I know refer to tissue as Kleenex. That being said, I'd know right away what someone asking about in either case resulting in successful communication. > > Later, > > Rich Lee ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 16:45:16 -0800 From: "Scott & Charlotte Miller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "UUC Digest" <[email protected]> Subject: Re: English Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I like to warsh my BMs whenever I can. (Obligatory BM content) Scott Miller Never won a spelling bee GGC BMW CCA >Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:28:20 -0600 >From: Scott Staewen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Cc: [email protected] >Subject: Re: English >Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >My 95 year old grandmother (from south Texas, btw) still warshes her >head and her teeth regularly. >rss > > >On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:24:03 -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> Rich, Brett, et al. >> >> My late grandmother warshed alot of clothes and dishes in her day, and >> would usually alert us when it was time to warsh our hands for dinner. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 15:28:19 -0800 (PST) From: Richard Dorffer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Subject: Re: English Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> --- "Robinson, Lee" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Do you really want to make generalizations about Ohioans from > > this one individual? Would you like me to start making some > > generalizations about people from Georgia? I don't think so. > > Rich, > > Don't forget I worked in Columbus for over 18 months, so I have lots of > individuals from whom I can make generalizations. :) Do you hear that Gary and Kathy? We speak a form of trailer trash dialect being from Ohio according to Lee... Well, let's not forget, I have lived here for 33 years, I believe that far trumps your 18 months working here at one plant with fairly localized exposure. I have spent a fair amount of time in Georgia, I don't believe I am going to characterize all of them as "trailer trash rednecks" based on "lots of individuals that I met" while in Georgia. ;-) > It was usually these kind of people who started off with the generalizations > about people from > Georgia anyway. Easy tiger. I wasn't talking about these people's generalizations, I was talking about yours as that is who I was responding to. > My point was that it doesn't matter where you > are from, you can't really poke fun at any dialect or accent as yours is > probably funny to someone else too despite the fact that everybody thinks > their dialect is the "correct" one. To say that one dialect is correct & > the others are wrong is a little silly. After all, which one is correct? > The one that came first? The one closest to the root language? The one > from the area with the most money? Alright, imitate a standard Midwestern accent (not some localized dialect)? My point about Midwestern spoken English being generally recognized as a nationally broadcast standard is still accurate as the point is, there are less distinguishing features to phonetic pronunciations (not that we are without any by any means, just likely less so than most other regions in the US). I am not talking about the Amish, crude "red neck" speech, Pittsburgh dialect or any other potential local dialect or accent you may find in the Midwest. There is no such thing as an area without any accent/dialect, every region has their quirks, the Midwest generally has some of the least. > > At least pop is a general and appropriate reference to a > > carbonated drink or fountain drink and shortened from "soda > > pop" unlike Coke which is a brand name (and under trademark). > > It is equivalent to using the term Xerox for a copy or > > Kleenex for a tissue. By the way, Coke is capitalized and > > should only be used in reference to Coca-Cola. > > Pop is an action verb, a synonym of explode. Soda is also something you > won't hear commonly in the south, albeit much more descriptive than pop, > especially since sodas actually fizz. Coca-Cola seems to have absolutely no > problem with the fact that billions of people world-wide refer to various & > sundry different colas as "coke." Pop can be a noun, an adjective, an adverb, a verb, you name it, it has widespread usage. But, in the context of carbonated beverages which is what we were talking about, "pop" is shortened from "soda pop" which is defined as "a beverage consisting of soda water, flavoring, and a sweet syrup" by MW. Coke is a trademarked word of Coca-Cola which is a brand not unlike my previous examples. Coca-Cola surely defends their trademarks as much as any other company. I am sure Coca-Cola quite prefers people to use the word "Coke" when they refer to carbonated beverages, it increases brand recognition. Here, you can participate in this survey: http://www.popvssoda.com/ Regards, Rich - prefers Pepsi to Coca-Cola ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 19:32:56 -0500 From: Rob Levinson * UUC Motorwerks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Subject: Re: English Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> For what it's worth, having spoken with Rich, I think he and I share a similar "lack of accent". Despite my ribbing for the sake of ribbing, the Midwestern/newscaster mode of speech is as close to a "universal English" simply for the sake that it is understood by all other English speakers. You may not be able to understand a deep-Southerner, a North Englander, or any number of other distinctly-accented forms of the language... but the Midwestern form is the O+, "universal donor" of the family, understood by all. "I hate fookin' Pikeys." ;-) - Rob On Feb 21, 2005, at 6:28 PM, Richard Dorffer wrote: > > Alright, imitate a standard Midwestern accent (not some localized > dialect)? > > My point about Midwestern spoken English being generally recognized as > a nationally broadcast > standard is still accurate as the point is, there are less > distinguishing features to phonetic > pronunciations (not that we are without any by any means, just likely > less so than most other > regions in the US). I am not talking about the Amish, crude "red > neck" speech, Pittsburgh dialect > or any other potential local dialect or accent you may find in the > Midwest. > > There is no such thing as an area without any accent/dialect, every > region has their quirks, the > Midwest generally has some of the least. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 03:45:26 +0000 From: "Gilbert Hoffman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [UUC]pop/soda/Ccoke was English Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> They call it 'coke' in the South because they like their soda sweet like their (iced) tea. Supposedly Coke is sweeter than Pepsi. I don't drink either so I wouldn't know. They assume you want a Coke cause only a yankee would be drinking Pepsi. If you ask for a pop in NY/NJ, you might get a knuckle sandwich. (Is that local English?) Although having relocated to a 'pop' area, most locals think you are talking about soda water when you just say soda. English is best for those name places said differently yet pronounced the same. Province in Canada: new-fin-land Town in NJ: new-found-land Gilbert ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 19:27:27 -0500 From: Rob Levinson * UUC Motorwerks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Subject: Re: English Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> "Successful" being more than somewhat dissimilar to "good" being the operative topic. What I don't get about the Southern "coke" thing is the extra step of questioning required: "Would you like a coke?" "Yes, please." "What kind?" Whereas north of the Manson-Nixon line, we simply ask for the Coke, Sprite, Ginger Ale, whisky shot, or whatever it is we actually want. - Rob On Feb 21, 2005, at 5:42 PM, Robinson, Lee wrote: > That being said, I'd know right away what > someone asking about in either case resulting in successful > communication. > Lee ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 12:36:33 -0800 From: JKerouac <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Robinson, Lee" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: [email protected] Subject: Re: English> pop Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Pop? first heard soda called that by people who grew up going out for lunch in high school to get 'grinders'. That origin kinda makes sense since its full of stuff cut from the meat grinder. More etymologically inexplicable is "Hoagie". What's a hoagie? Would you buy a low calorie, nutritious lunch sandwich from a "Hoagieway"? OBMWC: first learned about bonnets, spanners, and saloons from BMW service manuals. Barry Robinson, Lee wrote: >>Although, I by no means should start throwing stones and have >>stayed completely out of this discussion until specifically >>called out. Besides, it is generally understood that us >>Midwesterners speak properly and are usually the standard for >>national broadcasted spoken language due to the lack of >>accent and other idiosyncrasies... >>By the way, that would be Ohioans.... >>This from someone who lives in a state where someone actually said to me, >>"Dang! You from A'lanta? You ain't even got one of them stupid soundin' >>southern accents." My continued conversation allowed me to perceive that >>central Ohio trailer trash was she & her boyfriend's native dialect. >>Unfortunately, one of the words I picked up working up north (i.e. Ohio & >>Pennsylvania) garners me the most ridicule at home. Using the word "pop" >>instead of "coke" (I am from Atlanta after all) always ends up with me >>trying to resolve never using the word again to refer to a bubbly, sugary >>beverage. >>Later, >>Rich - says "hite" although I am sure I make my share of >>mistakes, my parents like to add the letter "R" to words like >>wash so it becomes "warsh". >> ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 12:47:21 -0800 From: Mark Gold <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Subject: Re: English> pop Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Didn't hear those terms until I got my 318ic and started working on it. As for the little bit of German that I understand, I picked that up while researching BMW's (I think I can translate most factory color names) and from the Yiddish I heard around my house growing up (that and Spanglish). On Feb 21, 2005, at 12:36 PM, JKerouac wrote: > OBMWC: first learned about bonnets, spanners, and saloons from BMW > service manuals. Sincerely, Mark Gold Sacramento Chapter BMWCCA 916-852-6533 (home) 916-743-7153 (cell) [EMAIL PROTECTED] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:39:10 -0500 From: "KMS- Brett Anderson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "UUC Digest" <[email protected]> Subject: Re: Porsche 911 (was English) Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > I have a Columbian co-worker & a Thai wife who simply say "BM," as it's > understood that there's no other car that one could be referring to that > way. > When I first got to the US, one auto nickname I had to drop was Merc. Merc, in Australia, is a Mercedes Benz. In the US, it's apparently a Ford product..... ;-) Brett Anderson KMS ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 19:55:36 -0600 From: "Matt Evans" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "'Gary Derian'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[email protected]> Subject: Re: Compression Tests Was: S50 3.2 compression Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Thanks gary. I'm feeling especially slow. Is 1.4 a dimensionless constant ? Something else I saw suggested that (P2/P1) = (V1/V2)^1.4 If that were the case, when I take say, 9.8^1.4 I get 24ish.. And then that would show that P2/P1 = 24 Multiplying 14.7 * 24 gives me an enormous number for P2.. So more to the point, given an engine's CR, can you reliably say what the ideal compression test results ought to be? If so, what's that formula ? (and why?) -----Original Message----- From: Gary Derian [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, February 21, 2005 9:51 AM To: Matt Evans; [email protected] Subject: Re: [UUC] Compression Tests Was: S50 3.2 compression That would be for isothermal compression. A compression test is adiabatic, pressure for that is (V1/V2)^1.4 for air.. Plus the intake valve closes some time after bottom dead center reducing the effective compression. Don't forget to work in absolute pressures. Gary Derian >I have a question about why compression numbers are what they are. > > It seems to me that a compression number should be maximally, CR * > Atmospheric. After all, you're putting some amount of air in there > (at atmospheric), then compressing it by a factor of CR. Yet the > compression numbers people expect are always higher than that. Why ? > > Matt > 88 M5 with 150-155psi across the board :/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 22:28:28 -0500 From: "Gary Derian" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]>, "Matt Evans" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: Compression Tests Was: S50 3.2 compression Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 1.4 is the ratio of the specific heat at constant volume to the specific heat at constant pressure of air. For an ideal gas, the number is 1.6. 14.7 x 24 = 353. Then subtract 15 to get gauge pressure. but the intake valve closes after bottom dead center which reduces the compression. If it closes 50 degrees after bottom, that leaves only about 80% of the compression stroke for compression. The 9.8 compression becomes 7.8, and the calculated pressure is 246 psi. Since the engine is cold, stuff leaks, and the compression isn't really purely adiabatic, the actual pressure is lower. Gary Derian > Thanks gary. > > I'm feeling especially slow. Is 1.4 a dimensionless constant ? Something > else I saw suggested that > > (P2/P1) = (V1/V2)^1.4 > > If that were the case, when I take say, 9.8^1.4 I get 24ish.. And then > that > would show that > > P2/P1 = 24 > > Multiplying 14.7 * 24 gives me an enormous number for P2.. > > So more to the point, given an engine's CR, can you reliably say what the > ideal compression test results ought to be? If so, what's that formula ? > (and why?) > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Gary Derian [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Monday, February 21, 2005 9:51 AM > To: Matt Evans; [email protected] > Subject: Re: [UUC] Compression Tests Was: S50 3.2 compression > > That would be for isothermal compression. A compression test is > adiabatic, > pressure for that is (V1/V2)^1.4 for air.. Plus the intake valve closes > some time after bottom dead center reducing the effective compression. > Don't forget to work in absolute pressures. > Gary Derian > >>I have a question about why compression numbers are what they are. >> >> It seems to me that a compression number should be maximally, CR * >> Atmospheric. After all, you're putting some amount of air in there >> (at atmospheric), then compressing it by a factor of CR. Yet the >> compression numbers people expect are always higher than that. Why ? >> >> Matt >> 88 M5 with 150-155psi across the board :/ > > ------------------------------ End of [bmwuucdigest] digest(15 messages) **********
