On Apr 3, 5:20 pm, Craig Weinberg <whatsons...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Apr 3, 5:27 am, 1Z <peterdjo...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > But the experiment didn't show there was more or less free will. It > > > > didn't even show > > > > there was any free will. It just showed that inducing a belief in free > > > > will changed > > > > performance. > > > > Performance in what though? Readiness to execute personal will. > > > Nothing in the experiment indicates the will was free in a > > philosophical > > sense, just the usual scientific sense of volition, ie conscious > > control > > or control by higher brain centres. > > Right. I don't even look at the philosophy of how free is free - any > experience of will is unexplainable in a deterministic universe.
So you keep saying, but "deterministic" doens't mean "qualia-less". > > > > > > > > >It might have also shown that belief in alien abductions changed > > > > performance. > > > > No, they did controls to eliminate that. There may be other beliefs > > > that change people's ability to take action as well, but this study > > > suggests that this specific idea that we should doubt the existence of > > > our own free will has a negative impact on the very thing that is > > > being considered. > > > > > Either one is perfectly consistent with determinism. > > > > No, determinism would not allow a mention of a deterministic function > > > of the brain to affect the performance of that function, because then > > > it wouldn't be deterministic - it would be open to suggestion by > > > others and by ourselves. > > > One deterministic process can affect another. Think of dropping a > > clock > > of a tall building. > > That's a straw man of the findings. What the experiment shows would be > like dropping a clock off of a tall building and seeing that it falls > faster than 32ft/sec/sec if you tell it that it's doomed to fall, > slower than 32ft/sec/sec if you tell it that it can control the speed > of its fall, and exactly 32ft/sec/sec if you tell it unrelated things. I wasn;t talking about the psychology experiment at all. I meant that the falling and the ticking are both deterministic processes, and the one is bound to impact the other: "One deterministic process can affect another." -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To post to this group, send email to firstname.lastname@example.org. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en.