On 16 Aug 2012, at 16:21, Roger wrote:
BRUNO: I meant that some fixed hardware computer can emulate a
virtual self-modifying version of itself, so that your point is not
valid.
ROGER: What point ? And emulate in what sense ? Ie could a computer
ever be a good wine taster ?
As I said, it seems they are. the french have succeeded in making a
wine testing machine which according to experts in the field is better
than the average qualified wine tester.
Does such machine get the human qualia of drinking wine. i doubt so,
for this you need to have a longer human history, and higher reflexive
abilities. But there is no reason why machine could'n get them in
principle (obvious for a computationalist which bet that he is himself
a machine relatively to its more probable neighborhood).
BRUNO: If not you introduce a notion of living matter leading to an
infinite regression.
ROGER: Infinite regression of what ? Consciousness ? The monad does
away with that problem,
except of course it's just philosophy, not hardware.
It might be math, also. Could you explain what a monad is without too
much jargon?
BRUNO: It might have a solution, but it begs the question of comp/
non-comp, and you are just saying
(without arguing) that machines cannot think, and that souls are
substantial actual infinities.
ROGER: I think I said and believe what you said I said, but I don't
understand your main point
just above, even vaguely. At any rate, emulation is not the real
thing.
If the brain is a universal emulator, as it surely is at least, then
when a computer emulates an emulation done by the brain, at the right
level, emulation is the real thing.
Bruno
Roger , [email protected]
8/16/2012
Leibniz would say, "If there's no God, we'd have to invent him so
everything could function."
----- Receiving the following content -----
From: Bruno Marchal
Receiver: everything-list
Time: 2012-08-15, 03:53:59
Subject: Re: Definitions of intelligence possibly useful to
computersinAIordescribing life
On 14 Aug 2012, at 17:47, Roger wrote:
Hi Bruno Marchal
You say, "a non living computer can supported a living self-
developing life form"
Do you mean support instead of supported ? Or what do you mean ?
I mean "support". Sorry.
I meant that some fixed hardware computer can emulate a virtual self-
modifying version of itself, so that your point is not valid.
If not you introduce a notion of living matter leading to an
infinite regression. It might have a solution, but it beg the
question of comp/non-comp, and you are just saying (without arguing)
that machines cannot think, and that souls are substantial actual
infinities.
Bruno
Roger , [email protected]
8/14/2012
----- Receiving the following content -----
From: Bruno Marchal
Receiver: everything-list
Time: 2012-08-12, 05:17:45
Subject: Re: Definitions of intelligence possibly useful to
computers inAIordescribing life
On 11 Aug 2012, at 13:07, Roger wrote:
Hi Russell Standish
When I "gave in" to the AI point of view that computers can posess
intelligence,
I had overlooked the world of experience, which is not
quantitative. Only
living things can experience the world.
You are right. But a non living computer can supported a living
self-developing life form, unless you postulate that infinitely
complex substances are at play in the mind.
Bruno
http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
Groups "Everything List" group.
To post to this group, send email to everything-
[email protected].
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]
.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en
.
http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
Groups "Everything List" group.
To post to this group, send email to [email protected].
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]
.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en
.
http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"Everything List" group.
To post to this group, send email to [email protected].
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
[email protected].
For more options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en.
