Dinesh ji, The posted plant could be as simple as Abutilon indicum. The mericarps are acute (not rounded at tip), about 18 (20 or less) and the plant doesn't seem to have viscid hairs - all pointing to A. indicum.
Vijay ------------------------------------------------------------------- Vijayasankar Raman, Ph.D. Research Scientist National Center for Natural Products Research University of Mississippi, MS, USA On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 10:18 AM, surajit koley < [email protected]> wrote: > Thank you again Dinesh Ji. > Regards > surajit > > > On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 9:31 PM, Dinesh Valke <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> Oh yes Surajit ji ... colours in descriptions help in general >> identification. Variation in colours is quite possible. Thanks for this >> clarity. >> Regards. >> Dinesh >> >> >> On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 9:14 PM, surajit koley < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Thank you very much Dinesh Ji, for everything and links. >>> I would like to add that description and picture in FloraKarnataka (or >>> anywhere else) should not be taken as exhaustive. Vijay Sir has flower >>> without "purple" base - >>> https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/indiantreepix/itKwnycckx8/sl-J3Mdmmv4J >>> Many thanks to Anurag Ji as well. >>> >>> Regards >>> surajit >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 11:28 AM, Dinesh Valke <[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Many many thanks Surajit ji for all your efforts. >>>> Yesterday night Anurag helped me with following links ... >>>> >>>> *Abutilon hirtum*: herbarium >>>> <http://florakarnataka.ces.iisc.ernet.in/hjcb2/img/herb/Abutilon%20hirtum/P1010874.JPG> >>>> | description >>>> <http://florakarnataka.ces.iisc.ernet.in/hjcb2/img/pdf/Abutilon%20hirtum/245.pdf.jpg> >>>> | picture >>>> <http://florakarnataka.ces.iisc.ernet.in/hjcb2/img/field/Abutilon%20hirtum/Picture%20076.jpg> >>>> *Abutilon pannosum*: herbarium >>>> <http://florakarnataka.ces.iisc.ernet.in/hjcb2/img/herb/Abutilon%20pannosum/P1010873.JPG> >>>> | description >>>> <http://florakarnataka.ces.iisc.ernet.in/hjcb2/img/pdf/Abutilon%20pannosum/246.pdf.jpg> >>>> >>>> >>>> With all that you discussed and pointed out, I am convinced that the >>>> posted plant is not *A. pannosum*; it *must* be *A. hirtum*. >>>> Many thanks to Anurag too - especially for the herbarium of *A. >>>> pannosum*. >>>> >>>> Regards. >>>> Dinesh >>>> >>>> On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 8:07 AM, surajit koley < >>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Good morning Dinesh Ji >>>>> >>>>> I asked myself the very question you have pointed out when I was >>>>> examining the KEW herb. My another query was can dried up mericarps have a >>>>> bit pointed tip? That is why I cannot rule out any possibility and >>>>> repeatedly said that maybe Roxburgh's plant is not the type species. >>>>> >>>>> Now please check an old thread which was identified and placed under >>>>> *Abutilon >>>>> hirtum* (Lam.) Sweet in our database - >>>>> https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/indiantreepix/TRSEpDxNHCA/6Q8xOMWuu88J, >>>>> not the picture of the original post but pic no. Abutilon indicum is >>>>> it I2 IMG_5261.jpg and series. >>>>> >>>>> Thank you >>>>> Regards >>>>> surajit >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 1:05 AM, Dinesh Valke <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Thanks Anurag for your upload of possible *A. pannosum. *(Perhaps >>>>>> not *pannosum* - mericarps do not appear rounded at top, and the >>>>>> calyx is relatively very short). >>>>>> >>>>>> Yes Surajit ji, had seen the KEW herbarium image. Many thanks for >>>>>> pointing to the link and for elaborating the features. >>>>>> >>>>>> My naive query: >>>>>> Would that herbarium contain a fruit that was fully matured and dried >>>>>> up naturally on the plant ? >>>>>> 1) the mericarps could assume different shape as they dry up - thus >>>>>> would seem higher than the calyx >>>>>> 2) the calyx when drying tend to re-curve; would appear of lesser >>>>>> dimension than that seen in a tender fruit - as can be seen in the first >>>>>> pic of the posted plant. >>>>>> >>>>>> So much said - the posted plant may be different; some species other >>>>>> than *indicum* AND *pannosum*. :-) >>>>>> >>>>>> Regards. >>>>>> Dinesh >>>>>> >>>>>> On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 11:38 PM, surajit koley < >>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Dinesh Ji, >>>>>>> You must have already viewed the only herbarium of *A. pannosum* in >>>>>>> KEW >>>>>>> <http://apps.kew.org/herbcat/getImage.do?imageBarcode=K000659530> >>>>>>> site. The fruit is not clear there. So, it is hard to tell. I agree >>>>>>> that *A. >>>>>>> indicum* has more prominent beaks. However, Roxburgh noted >>>>>>> "Capsules about twenty, nearly as high as the calyx, in a depressed >>>>>>> verticel, very downy, reniform, equally rounded at each end, this mark >>>>>>> distinguishes it immediately from *S. indica* and *asiatica*...." >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Surely, Roxburgh's plant is not the type species of *Abutilon >>>>>>> pannosum*, I think. >>>>>>> At the same time my record of *Abutilon indicum* is different, not >>>>>>> like yours one in this thread. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thank you >>>>>>> Regards >>>>>>> surajit >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 11:12 PM, Dinesh Valke < >>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks Surajit ji for all the efforts. >>>>>>>> I had posed the query because mericarps of the posted plant are not >>>>>>>> well-pointed as I remember to have seen for *A. indicum*, but my >>>>>>>> observation does not take care of possibility of variances in >>>>>>>> pointedness. >>>>>>>> Was disappointed to find almost no picture of *A. pannosum*'s >>>>>>>> fruit on internet - thus not sure whether the fruit is globose as >>>>>>>> described >>>>>>>> OR seemingly globose. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Regards. >>>>>>>> Dinesh >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 10:17 PM, surajit koley < >>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Thank you Dinesh Ji, the problem is FoP recognizes both *muticum*, >>>>>>>>> with >>>>>>>>> different author citation, and *pannosum*. Roxburgh's plant has >>>>>>>>> fruit both top and bottom rounded. It appears to me the top of your >>>>>>>>> mericarps are not exactly rounded. But at the same time I also >>>>>>>>> understand >>>>>>>>> that what Roxburgh recorded in writing may be a bit different with >>>>>>>>> the real >>>>>>>>> thing. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Moreover, Roxburgh's plant is not the only species which is >>>>>>>>> synonymous with *A. pannosum*. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> So, finally I never reject probability. I just don't know. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Regards >>>>>>>>> surajit >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 9:43 PM, Dinesh Valke < >>>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Yes, agreed Surajit ji with all your points. >>>>>>>>>> Regards. >>>>>>>>>> Dinesh >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 9:05 PM, surajit koley < >>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Dear Garg Sir, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> - I have seen only one *Abutilon* and that is *indicum* >>>>>>>>>>> - After going through lit. and efloras I think clear >>>>>>>>>>> pictures of fruits, stipules, etc are necessary to id species >>>>>>>>>>> level of this >>>>>>>>>>> genus which I miss in this thread >>>>>>>>>>> - Flora of India, vol3 (BSI) recognizes *pannosum* but >>>>>>>>>>> doesn't recognize *muticum*; >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/species/m---z/m/malvaceae/abutilon> >>>>>>>>>>> *;* or are they synonymous? >>>>>>>>>>> - Roxburgh's *Sida tomentosa* is synonymous with *Abutilon >>>>>>>>>>> muticum* G. Don of FBI, maybe synonymous with *S. pannosum >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> <http://plants.jstor.org/stable/10.5555/al.ap.specimen.k000659530>* >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I do not think the fruit description of Roxburgh's plant, in FI, >>>>>>>>>>> matches with the fruit picture in this thread. Neither the same FI >>>>>>>>>>> description matches with other posts identified in our database. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Thank you >>>>>>>>>>> Regards >>>>>>>>>>> surajit >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Feb 25, 2015 at 11:39 AM, J.M. Garg <[email protected]> >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Forwarding again for validation please. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> efi page on Abutilon pannosum >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/species/m---z/m/malvaceae/abutilon/abutilon-pannosum> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >>>>>>>>>>>> From: Dinesh Valke <[email protected]> >>>>>>>>>>>> Date: 20 February 2015 at 18:57 >>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [efloraofindia:216131] along KSH 34 between Malamba & >>>>>>>>>>>> Gundolli :: Abutilon pannosum FOR VALIDATION :: DVFEB47/80 >>>>>>>>>>>> To: efloraofindia <[email protected]> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> [image: along KSH34 Malamba & Gundolli] >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://www.google.com/url?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.flickr.com%2Fphotos%2Fdinesh_valke%2F15962692663&sa=D&sntz=1&usg=AFrqEzekde88pkb7cBA1u24KlyW8HEVjHQ>along >>>>>>>>>>>> Karnataka State Highway No. 34 ... between Malamba & Gundolli >>>>>>>>>>>> *Date*: 15 OCT 2011 ... *Altitude*: about 640 m asl >>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------ >>>>>>>>>>>> *Abutilon* ¿ *pannosum* ? ... (family: Malvaceae)Dear friends, >>>>>>>>>>>> Shrub, about 1 m height; flower about 30 mm across, fruit about >>>>>>>>>>>> 15 mm across. >>>>>>>>>>>> While it looks like the mericarps are not beaked, not sure >>>>>>>>>>>> whether they are round enough to look like the ones at Western >>>>>>>>>>>> Desert Flora >>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.google.com/url?q=http%3A%2F%2Fwesterndesertflora.geolab.cz%2Fherbarium%2FAbutilon_pannosum.php&sa=D&sntz=1&usg=AFrqEzegB3MlG4goXH1KytNL30j4SsU-MA> >>>>>>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------ >>>>>>>>>>>> [image: Abutilon ¿ pannosum ?] >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://www.google.com/url?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.flickr.com%2Fphotos%2Fdinesh_valke%2F6257258369&sa=D&sntz=1&usg=AFrqEzff8a48gkP9wnYhW3ArQe4fwYW4Ag> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> [image: Abutilon ¿ pannosum ?] >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://www.google.com/url?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.flickr.com%2Fphotos%2Fdinesh_valke%2F6257260471&sa=D&sntz=1&usg=AFrqEzfQFAPWqZZIl4HVxm53LZIJcMJXEg> >>>>>>>>>>>> Regards. >>>>>>>>>>>> Dinesh >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>>>>>>>>>> Google Groups "efloraofindia" group. >>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from >>>>>>>>>>>> it, send an email to [email protected] >>>>>>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to >>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]. >>>>>>>>>>>> Visit this group at >>>>>>>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/indiantreepix. >>>>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>> With regards, >>>>>>>>>>>> J.M.Garg >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> 'Creating awareness of Indian Flora & Fauna' >>>>>>>>>>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Jmgarg1> >>>>>>>>>>>> The whole world uses my Image Resource >>>>>>>>>>>> <http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:J.M.Garg> of more >>>>>>>>>>>> than a thousand species & eight thousand images of Birds, >>>>>>>>>>>> Butterflies, >>>>>>>>>>>> Plants etc. (arranged alphabetically & place-wise). You can also >>>>>>>>>>>> use them >>>>>>>>>>>> for free as per Creative Commons license attached with each image. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> For identification, learning, discussion & documentation of >>>>>>>>>>>> Indian Flora, please visit/ join our Efloraofindia Google >>>>>>>>>>>> e-group <https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/indiantreepix> >>>>>>>>>>>> (largest >>>>>>>>>>>> in the world- more than 2400 members & 2,00,000 messages on >>>>>>>>>>>> 9.9.14) or Efloraofindia >>>>>>>>>>>> website <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/> (with a >>>>>>>>>>>> species database of more than 10,000 species & 2,00,000 images). >>>>>>>>>>>> Winner >>>>>>>>>>>> of Wipro-NFS Sparrow Awards 2014 for efloraofindia >>>>>>>>>>>> <https://sites.google.com/site/efloraofindia/award-for-efloraofindia> >>>>>>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Also author of 'A Photoguide to the Birds of Kolkata & Common >>>>>>>>>>>> Birds of India'. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "efloraofindia" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/indiantreepix. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "efloraofindia" group. 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