Re: [M100] On-device file conversion?

[Mike Stein]

Doesn't look like it'd take much to convert the BASIC NC100 version,
especially if you're only using 5 or 6 control codes.

On Sat, May 11, 2024 at 6:29 PM Lee Osborne 
wrote:

> I'm a big fan of portable computers, and besides my beloved Model T, I
> have an Amstrad NC100, a mid-90s machine in a similar form factor but with
> a fairly sophisticated word processor on board. Like most machines from
> that era, the word processor saves in an obsolete proprietary format, but
> someone has written a clever BASIC program for it that converts files to
> Rich Text Format. They can then, of course, be opened up with Word on a
> modern PC, with formatting maintained.
>
> The program is here: https://www.ncus.org.uk/utils.htm#nc_to_rtf
>
> It got me wondering whether BASIC on the Model T could support something
> similar. Obviously TEXT doesn't directly support bold, underline etc, but
> it wouldn't be difficult to just use some symbols as on/off indicators for
> these. Would it then be possible to use a BASIC program like the one above
> to create a new file with the relevant RTF formatting codes in it? I'm sure
> you see what I'm getting at here.
>
> Maybe someone has already done something similar? Or there's a better word
> processing program out there than TEXT?
>
> It would be really helpful as I use my Model T for writing quite a lot. I
> have a Backpack drive so transfer across to a PC is very simple. Do let me
> know your thoughts on this!
>
> Lee
>

Re: [M100] retroprinter and the m100

[Mike Stein]

Yeah, definitely something amiss with bits 2 and 3. When I looked at a few
characters it happened that they all became 0 instead of 1 and it was just
dropping bits, but apparently it's also reading a 1 instead of 0 in some
cases.

The M100 printer port is not 100% Centronics-compatible and it's also
partially shared with the keyboard, so there might be a timing issue; I'm
guessing you don't have another computer with a parallel printer port that
you could try?

m

On Sun, Mar 17, 2024 at 4:17 PM Will Senn  wrote:

> I tried every config setting... twice or more :).
>
> It's super consistent in that bits 2, and 3, counting from zero, from the
> least significant bits, are having some kind of issue (they aren't always,
> zero, or one, but they are always the bits that are wrong and they are
> consistently wrong (of the 40 chars or so I tested):
>
> <0x7f> vs w
> 0111
> 01110111
> 1000 (b3 1->0)
>
> \ vs T
> 01011100
> 01010100
> 1000 (b3 1->0)
>
> 4 vs <
> 00110100
> 0000
> 1000 (b3 0->1)
>
> 5 vs =
> 00110101
> 0001
> 1000 (b3 0->1)
> 6 vs >
> 00110110
> 0010
> 1000 (b3 0->1)
>
> 7 vs ?
> 00110111
> 0011
> 1000 (b3 0->1)
>
> 8 vs <
> 00111000
> 0000
> 0100 (b3 0->1)
>
> 9 vs =
> 00111001 (b3 0->1)
> 0001
> 0100
>
> Weird, huh? Anybody seen anything like it? Can I troubleshoot it with a
> multimeter?
>
> Will
>
>
>
>
> On 3/17/24 2:13 PM, Will Senn wrote:
>
> Yep, it's consistent. It took me a while to make some progress on this. I
> tried redoing the Centronics side of the cable, and here's my source vs
> what the pi sees:
>
> 10 PRINT "Hello, world!"
> 20 GOTO 10
>
> 10 PRMN\ "Lmllo, orll!"
> 20 OO\O 10
>
> I'm not sure how to troubleshoot...
>
> I found this in the retroprinter handbook:
>
> Missing Characters or Repeated Characters:
> This is generally because the equipment sending the printout is using
> a specific timing mechanism and not necessarily adopting the correct
> Centronics signal methods for acknowledgement of data.
> We have added the following configuration options to help address
> this:
> /root/config/handshaking
> This allows you to specify how the handshaking is handled between
> the computer and the Retro-Printer. This can help overcome issues
> with lost characters or repeated characters when the equipment
> misses the busy / acknowledge signals.
> The parameter takes a value between 0 and 4.
> 0 = Busy On (for 5ms), Busy Off, Ack On (for signal time), Ack Off
> 1 = Ack On (for signal time), Busy On, Ack Off, Busy Off
> 2 = Busy On (for 5ms), Ack On (for signal time), Busy Off, Ack Off
> 3 = Ack On (for signal time), Ack Off, Busy On (for 5ms), Busy Off
> 4 = Busy On and Ack On (for signal time), Ack Off and Busy Off
> Default is 0
>
> Any idea how the M100 handshakes?
>
> Will
>
>
> On 3/17/24 7:18 AM, Mike Stein wrote:
>
> Is it consistent, i.e. do you always get the same garbled output for a
> given file?
>
> At a fast glance it looks like bits 2 and/or 3 are being dropped; have you
> checked the computer to Pi cable and connectors?
>
> m
>
> On Sun, Mar 17, 2024 at 2:14 AM Will Senn  wrote:
>
>> I am finally coming back around to this. I bought a retroprinter a year
>> and half ago or so and shelved it out of frustration. Now, I know a lot
>> more about this sorta stuff and so I pulled it out, updated the software to
>> latest and tried to get it working.
>>
>> The PI prints a test page fine, but it won't print anything I send it
>> from the M100. After hours of troubleshooting, it appears that whatever
>> codes the pi is sending aren't DMP-15, EPSON ESC/P or Plain Text codes...
>> When I do llist, I see the data coming across to the retroprinter and have
>> set up a file to capture, but I can't find anything that will make sense of
>> the data.
>>
>> Here's a sample:
>>
>> 10 PRMN\ "lmllo"
>> 1= RMS\ORM =0>NORM=0\O1>RMALR,M-,Q,,M-,C,,M,0-,C,,M,1->CL,M-=0>NM\\M
>> 20 M=0
>> 2= O=0>OOS]B<0
>> 30 OOS]B<=
>>
>> It looks like reasonably valid data and not complete gibberish, but who
>> am I to judge. Is it one of:
>>
>> Epson ESC/P 9 Pin - didn't work, when I tried it
>> Epson ESC/P 24/48 Pin
>> HP Printer (PCL3 or PCL5)
>> HP Plotter (HP-GL)
>> IBM ProPrinter
>> Plain Text - didn't work, when I tried it
>> Postscript
>> Printronix-P Series
>> Printronix-S Series
>> Seiko QT-2100P
>> Siemens PT-88
>> Apple Image Writer II
>> Seiko STP
>> Star Micronics SP700
>> Tandy DMP-105 - didn't work, when I tried it
>>
>> Help and thank you.
>>
>>
>
>

Re: [M100] retroprinter and the m100

[Mike Stein]

Is it consistent, i.e. do you always get the same garbled output for a
given file?

At a fast glance it looks like bits 2 and/or 3 are being dropped; have you
checked the computer to Pi cable and connectors?

m

On Sun, Mar 17, 2024 at 2:14 AM Will Senn  wrote:

> I am finally coming back around to this. I bought a retroprinter a year
> and half ago or so and shelved it out of frustration. Now, I know a lot
> more about this sorta stuff and so I pulled it out, updated the software to
> latest and tried to get it working.
>
> The PI prints a test page fine, but it won't print anything I send it from
> the M100. After hours of troubleshooting, it appears that whatever codes
> the pi is sending aren't DMP-15, EPSON ESC/P or Plain Text codes... When I
> do llist, I see the data coming across to the retroprinter and have set up
> a file to capture, but I can't find anything that will make sense of the
> data.
>
> Here's a sample:
>
> 10 PRMN\ "lmllo"
> 1= RMS\ORM =0>NORM=0\O1>RMALR,M-,Q,,M-,C,,M,0-,C,,M,1->CL,M-=0>NM\\M
> 20 M=0
> 2= O=0>OOS]B<0
> 30 OOS]B<=
>
> It looks like reasonably valid data and not complete gibberish, but who am
> I to judge. Is it one of:
>
> Epson ESC/P 9 Pin - didn't work, when I tried it
> Epson ESC/P 24/48 Pin
> HP Printer (PCL3 or PCL5)
> HP Plotter (HP-GL)
> IBM ProPrinter
> Plain Text - didn't work, when I tried it
> Postscript
> Printronix-P Series
> Printronix-S Series
> Seiko QT-2100P
> Siemens PT-88
> Apple Image Writer II
> Seiko STP
> Star Micronics SP700
> Tandy DMP-105 - didn't work, when I tried it
>
> Help and thank you.
>
>

Re: [M100] Gold Card v7.10 2x256Kb IC Card expansion for M100/T102 from 1988

[Mike Stein]

Cool; I'll have to check it out.

Thanks, and happy holidays!


On Fri, Dec 22, 2023 at 11:08 AM Steve Baker  wrote:

> The “Model T Dice Box” is a dice roll simulator for various role-playing
> game systems; it was a ton of fun to code.
>
> Here’s the tokenized basic file —
>
>
> http://www.club100.org/memfiles/index.php?action=view=DICE.BA=Steve%20Baker;
>
> … and the source code and REX backup of the same are in my uploads folder —
>
>
> http://www.club100.org/memfiles/index.php?=0==Steve%20Baker
>
> … and as if that wasn’t enough, I made a way-too-long video on how it
> works —
>
> https://youtu.be/mIptQC7AHac
>
> Cheers and thanks,
> Steve
>
>
> --
> Greetings from Steve Baker
> “Gravity brings me down...”
>
>
> On Dec 22, 2023, at 10:58 AM, Mike Stein  wrote:
>
> 
> Looking forward to it;
> dice box??
>
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 22, 2023 at 10:25 AM Steve Baker 
> wrote:
>
>> Hello again!
>>
>> Ah — an interesting experiment, for sure! Bummer that it didn’t work. :-(
>>
>> If you’re interested in the goldcard system itself, stay tuned… over the
>> holidays I will prepare a “mega sale” of sorts with many T102s and at least
>> one T200 and T600, along with a variety of gadgets (gold box, Rex/Rex#,
>> TPPD1, serial-WiFi adapters, spare chargers, cables, caps, batteries,
>> manuals, and the like).
>>
>> When the list of items is ready — probably early January — I will post
>> the it along with photos, with the intent of bundling as many of them
>> together as possible. I wouldd rather not sell each item separately, yet
>> I’m open to spot offers for something in particular. eBay would be a last
>> resort if there’s no interest here.
>>
>> My love for the Model T ecosystem emerged as a pleasant distraction and
>> way to focus on something positive while caring for my wife who battled a
>> rare, incurable form of cancer for over six years. After she passed I
>> haven’t touched any of these. I will keep a few T102s and some accessories
>> for down the road.
>>
>> But with so many of them in boxes, I’d rather offer them to this vibrant
>> community so they can be (repaired as needed and) enjoyed for years to
>> come. I loved writing that Model T Dice Box utility and will occasionally
>> still journal on my Tandy WP-2. But it’s time to release the bulk of them
>> into other caring hands.
>>
>> Happy holidays,
>> Steve
>>
>>
>> --
>> Greetings from Steve Baker (he/him/his)
>> “Gravity brings me down…”
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Dec 22, 2023, at 10:06 AM, Brian K. White 
>> wrote:
>>
>> ...and the reason I noticed was I was hoping maybe the goldcard worked
>> the same as the node rampac (not physically but the interface & api, and so
>> maybe the rom could work on minindp.
>> No and no :)
>>
>>
>> On 12/22/23 05:51, Steve Baker wrote:
>>
>> Seasons Greetings!
>> Good catch, thanks! I’ll update my directory with the file you posted.
>>  :-)
>> Again, thanks,
>> Steve
>> —
>> Greetings from Steve Baker
>> Gravity brings me down...
>>
>> On Dec 22, 2023, at 12:24 AM, Brian K. White 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Steve, I just noticed that the GoldCard 7.1 rom image is wrong in your
>> Club100 directory. It's a copy of the DISK+ 3.1 rom.
>>
>> However, the hex file is correct. I converted it to a binary and here is
>> a copy of that: http://tandy.wiki/File:GoldCard_7.1.bin
>>
>> --
>> bkw
>>
>>
>> On 1/11/21 19:40, Steve Baker wrote:
>> Greetings again Brian and everyone,
>>
>> I would never ask to break something.
>>
>> If it has screws or obvious snaps, and you're comfy then fine, otherwise
>> don't think one second about it.
>>
>> My sincere apologies! I didn’t for a moment think that you were asking me
>> to break anything; my post was simply me lamenting my emerging but nascent
>> skills! The case appears to be quite well stuck together, and I was hoping
>> that I might’ve been able to crack it open without needing to hot glue it
>> back together (ugh, my glue gun chops are awful!).
>> But… I did take a peek at the 256Kb IC cards and sure enough, there’s not
>> only a battery compartment that easily unscrewed, but also an on/off
>> switch! Pretty cool stuff, so I took some more photos and added two slides
>> into the PDF (pages 12 and 13, in particular). This also shows the other
>> 32Kb IC card I have (sure enough, it initialized and works!).
>> This should be a direct link to the

Re: [M100] Gold Card v7.10 2x256Kb IC Card expansion for M100/T102 from 1988

[Mike Stein]

Looking forward to it;
dice box??



On Fri, Dec 22, 2023 at 10:25 AM Steve Baker  wrote:

> Hello again!
>
> Ah — an interesting experiment, for sure! Bummer that it didn’t work. :-(
>
> If you’re interested in the goldcard system itself, stay tuned… over the
> holidays I will prepare a “mega sale” of sorts with many T102s and at least
> one T200 and T600, along with a variety of gadgets (gold box, Rex/Rex#,
> TPPD1, serial-WiFi adapters, spare chargers, cables, caps, batteries,
> manuals, and the like).
>
> When the list of items is ready — probably early January — I will post the
> it along with photos, with the intent of bundling as many of them together
> as possible. I wouldd rather not sell each item separately, yet I’m open to
> spot offers for something in particular. eBay would be a last resort if
> there’s no interest here.
>
> My love for the Model T ecosystem emerged as a pleasant distraction and
> way to focus on something positive while caring for my wife who battled a
> rare, incurable form of cancer for over six years. After she passed I
> haven’t touched any of these. I will keep a few T102s and some accessories
> for down the road.
>
> But with so many of them in boxes, I’d rather offer them to this vibrant
> community so they can be (repaired as needed and) enjoyed for years to
> come. I loved writing that Model T Dice Box utility and will occasionally
> still journal on my Tandy WP-2. But it’s time to release the bulk of them
> into other caring hands.
>
> Happy holidays,
> Steve
>
>
> --
> Greetings from Steve Baker (he/him/his)
> “Gravity brings me down…”
>
>
>
>
> On Dec 22, 2023, at 10:06 AM, Brian K. White  wrote:
>
> ...and the reason I noticed was I was hoping maybe the goldcard worked the
> same as the node rampac (not physically but the interface & api, and so
> maybe the rom could work on minindp.
> No and no :)
>
>
> On 12/22/23 05:51, Steve Baker wrote:
>
> Seasons Greetings!
> Good catch, thanks! I’ll update my directory with the file you posted.  :-)
> Again, thanks,
> Steve
> —
> Greetings from Steve Baker
> Gravity brings me down...
>
> On Dec 22, 2023, at 12:24 AM, Brian K. White  wrote:
>
> Steve, I just noticed that the GoldCard 7.1 rom image is wrong in your
> Club100 directory. It's a copy of the DISK+ 3.1 rom.
>
> However, the hex file is correct. I converted it to a binary and here is a
> copy of that: http://tandy.wiki/File:GoldCard_7.1.bin
>
> --
> bkw
>
>
> On 1/11/21 19:40, Steve Baker wrote:
> Greetings again Brian and everyone,
>
> I would never ask to break something.
>
> If it has screws or obvious snaps, and you're comfy then fine, otherwise
> don't think one second about it.
>
> My sincere apologies! I didn’t for a moment think that you were asking me
> to break anything; my post was simply me lamenting my emerging but nascent
> skills! The case appears to be quite well stuck together, and I was hoping
> that I might’ve been able to crack it open without needing to hot glue it
> back together (ugh, my glue gun chops are awful!).
> But… I did take a peek at the 256Kb IC cards and sure enough, there’s not
> only a battery compartment that easily unscrewed, but also an on/off
> switch! Pretty cool stuff, so I took some more photos and added two slides
> into the PDF (pages 12 and 13, in particular). This also shows the other
> 32Kb IC card I have (sure enough, it initialized and works!).
> This should be a direct link to the updated PDF with the additional
> photos, for convenience (if this doesn’t work, the link to the folder is in
> the thread, below):
> http://www.club100.org/memfiles/index.php?action=downloadfile=Gold
> <
> http://www.club100.org/memfiles/index.php?action=downloadfile=Gold>
> Card 7.10 Photos and 1988 Review.pdf=Steve Baker&
> Next for me with the Goldmine (clearly, I like giving things nicknames) is
> in the software; I'd like to figure out more about the ROM Eliminator
> feature chronicled in the article (slide 17). Might they have a precursor
> to REX? While mine is probably not the industrial interface ($100 option)
> perhaps the ability to save and restore Option ROMs is available?
> Onward we go,
> SB
> --
> Greetings from Steve Baker
> “Gravity brings me down…”
>
> On Jan 11, 2021, at 6:54 PM, Brian White  b.kenyo...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>
> I would never ask to break something.
>
> If it has screws or obvious snaps, and you're comfy then fine, otherwise
> don't think one second about it.
>
> Thanks for dumping the rom and the pics.
>
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2021, 5:07 PM Steve Baker  stevebake...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>
>From Brian K. White:
>
>Could you look a little more at the cards?
>Do they come apart to see the board inside?
>Is the battery permanent or a removable coin cell?
>
>Does the main unit with the sockets come apart to see that board?
>
>
>Good questions and thoughts @Brian thanks for your follow-up with
>this! In the next day or two I’ll poke around a little bit. I’m a
>bit squeamish 

Re: [M100] 19.2Kbps on the Tandy 102

[Mike Stein]

"But what I recollect and what happened are not always the same thing."

Ah yes... more and more, more and more every day...

On Tue, Dec 12, 2023 at 6:09 PM John R. Hogerhuis  wrote:
>
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 12, 2023 at 3:00 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>>
>> I've never had any problems at 19.2K using Windows so, as John
>> suggests. there may be Linux-specific issues.
>>
>> There are buffers in most if not all USB-RS232 adapters and also in
>> the program on the PC at the other end, and sometimes these need to be
>> tuned a bit. When I send a 25K file from TeraTerm to an M100, TeraTerm
>> finishes in 1/2 minute or so, but the M100 still receives data for
>> another minute.
>>
>> And don't forget that TEXT is usually effectively faster for
>> transferring files since it doesn't have to display or scroll.
>>
>> m
>>
>
> Well Brian is seeing xon/xoff working fine with Linux at high speed with his 
> setup.
>
> Maybe time to try the experiments again to figure out what is different.
>
> Also T200 not working with hardware flow control? It used to. Steve ported 
> HTERM to it. I do recall we had issues with the > 19200bps baud rates on the 
> T200.
>
> But what I recollect and what happened are not always the same thing.
>
> -- John.

Re: [M100] 19.2Kbps on the Tandy 102

[Mike Stein]

BTW, another tip: if you're sending a text file to the M100, send it
without Line Feeds (i.e. only CR) if possible; that will save time
since there's no scrolling, and that's how the M100 sends files
anyway.

On Tue, Dec 12, 2023 at 5:43 PM Brian Brindle  wrote:
>
> This has come up in discussion a few times so I wanted to show that 19.2Kbps 
> on the Tandy 100 is possible with only software flow control.
>
> Here is a video of me creating a 500 line 40 col file that is 20KB, 
> transferring it to the M102 and back again using the 19.2Kbps serial 
> connection. It gets slowed down due to the screen being so slow making it 
> absolutely of no value to be running at those speeds but does demonstrate 
> that flow control can be used on a Linux device in this situation.
>
> Hardware flow control would work best and is what I would recommend but I 
> wanted a device that would work on a stock M100/102 and on a M200 where the 
> flow control lines do not work properly.
>
> It's apparently really hard to film, type and remember what to say so I 
> apologize for that..
>
> https://youtu.be/BGxx__Zr1O4
>
> Brian
>

Re: [M100] 19.2Kbps on the Tandy 102

[Mike Stein]

I've never had any problems at 19.2K using Windows so, as John
suggests. there may be Linux-specific issues.

There are buffers in most if not all USB-RS232 adapters and also in
the program on the PC at the other end, and sometimes these need to be
tuned a bit. When I send a 25K file from TeraTerm to an M100, TeraTerm
finishes in 1/2 minute or so, but the M100 still receives data for
another minute.

And don't forget that TEXT is usually effectively faster for
transferring files since it doesn't have to display or scroll.

m

On Tue, Dec 12, 2023 at 5:43 PM Brian Brindle  wrote:
>
> This has come up in discussion a few times so I wanted to show that 19.2Kbps 
> on the Tandy 100 is possible with only software flow control.
>
> Here is a video of me creating a 500 line 40 col file that is 20KB, 
> transferring it to the M102 and back again using the 19.2Kbps serial 
> connection. It gets slowed down due to the screen being so slow making it 
> absolutely of no value to be running at those speeds but does demonstrate 
> that flow control can be used on a Linux device in this situation.
>
> Hardware flow control would work best and is what I would recommend but I 
> wanted a device that would work on a stock M100/102 and on a M200 where the 
> flow control lines do not work properly.
>
> It's apparently really hard to film, type and remember what to say so I 
> apologize for that..
>
> https://youtu.be/BGxx__Zr1O4
>
> Brian
>

Re: [M100] M100 ergonomics

[Mike Stein]

On a desk, with legs made from dried-out pens purposely about 1/2"
longer than the standard ones.

Lighting's important; just the right angle and brightness setting for
maximum contrast without reflections.

m

On Sun, Dec 10, 2023 at 7:48 PM runrin  wrote:
>
> Hey all!
>
> I was wondering if people would be willing to share how they typically
> use their Model Ts.
>
> I've found that it's pretty difficult for me to find a comfortable
> position to use my Model 100 for any length of time. I'm always bending
> forward to get a better view when I sit at a table or desk, and when
> it's on my lap the lack of palmrest causes the keyboard to slide too
> close to my body making it hard to type.
>
> Do you typically only use them on desks? Do you use yours on your lap?
> Do you use a lap desk? Any tips for how you comfortably use a Model T
> for longer stretches (30+ minutes) would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks!

Re: [M100] m100 maximum baud rate without flow control

[Mike Stein]

The hardware is capable of 76,800 baud and if the other end supports
it then John's Hterm can run at that speed.

Using XON/XOFF handshaking and minimal buffer size the native apps
BASIC, TEXT and TELCOM will run at 19,200bd.

Without handshaking the maximum speed depends on the software and what
it has to do between characters received;
BASIC is the slowest because it has to interpret incoming text.
TELCOM is next because it has to display each character and possibly
scroll the screen. Download is slower because it also has to store the
characters.
TEXT is the fastest because it only has to store the characters.

I did some tests years ago but don't remember the results; why not try
it yourself? Create a large (20K) text file, send it to and from the
M100 and compare it to the original.

600 bd is probably the fastest in all cases while TEXT may be happy with 1200.


On Thu, Nov 30, 2023 at 1:30 AM runrin  wrote:
>
> hey all,
>
> i was wondering if anyone has done any work determining the maximum baud
> rate the m100 supports without xon/xoff flow control? i assumed it was
> 9600 because thats what most of my machines from that era support
> (usually with a 8250 uart).
>
> i've been working on a homebrew computer for some time now, and even
> with a dead stable serial clock at 9600 hz i'm dropping characters on
> the m100. i thought it was a software issue, but it works perfectly with
> my heathkit terminal, so i'm thinking its an m100 problem.
>
> 300 baud worked fine, but even as slow as 2600 seemed to be an issue.
>
> thanks!

Re: [M100] MiniNDP 512 (was Re: FlexROM with REX#)

[Mike Stein]

Thanks! I read most of that but didn't find the diameter specs

On Tue, Nov 28, 2023 at 9:30 PM Brian White  wrote:
>
> https://gist.github.com/bkw777/52d85d89eeff8445cc667685d05ea94d
>
> includes some links to sources as well as specs
>
> 26 awg or 0.4mm
>
>
> bkw
>
> On Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 8:59 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>>
>> I probably missed it and can't easily find the previous discussion,
>> but what diameter wire do you suggest? I see the hole size 0.6mm/24
>> mil but not the wire gauge.
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 28, 2023 at 7:56 PM Brian K. White  wrote:
>> >
>> > You have lost me.
>> >
>> > If you want to dump or re-write the flexrom, you can just do it it it's
>> > programming adapter.
>> >
>> > I thought you wanted to dump the original rom?
>> >
>> > And if you want to avoid all the hardware actions while changing the
>> > main rom, that's exactly what REX Classic allows. It's purely software
>> > once you set that up, and even if you botch both primary and secondary
>> > images, you only need to open the option rom compartment instead of the
>> > whole machine to revert to the internal eeprom.
>> >
>> > If you have a soic-28 test clip, you *might* be able to program the
>> > eeprom without removing from the machine. Mostly it should be ok, the
>> > board allows the programmer to drive /WE for instance, it's definitely
>> > ok to program the chip directly with a test clip if the board is not
>> > installed in the machine. But but one thing I don't know is, if the
>> > board is installed in the machine, all the pins are connected to the
>> > bus. Mostly that should be ok but one thing I don't know is what happens
>> > when the programmer tries to provide power on the vcc pin? Does it power
>> > up the whole machine? Even with the memory power switch turned off,
>> > which normally kills everything, this would be injecting power to the
>> > rail from a point "inside the walls".
>> >
>> > If you're worried about the legs, and you're right that it would be a
>> > pain to repair a loose one after the frame was cut away, I now actually
>> > prefer gold plated plain brass wire.
>> > https://gist.github.com/bkw777/52d85d89eeff8445cc667685d05ea94d
>> >
>> > The advantages are,
>> > - just wire, no special shapes to cut off or anything, no single special
>> > supplier
>> > - a few feet makes hundreds of 6mm legs
>> > - the wire is round, so there is no problem with it rotating when
>> > loosened and resoldered
>> > - gold plated
>> > - repair/replacement of a broken leg is trivial
>> >
>> > The disadvantages are,
>> > - each leg has to be soldered individually, no one-piece connector or
>> > frame like with a normal pin header
>> > - no simple supplier to point to, it's such a generic thing that there
>> > is no part number or such, except in large quantities from bulk
>> > suppliers. The various suppliers (for small quantities) I've found have
>> > all been transient like Etsy or Ebay links that don't work a year later.
>> > And it's easy to end up with gold colored aluminum wire or brass wire
>> > that isn't gold plated (which starts tarnishing within a year), since no
>> > one selling the stuff is writing their descriptions for electronics use.
>> > I have also gotten wire from aliexpress that was thinner than claimed,
>> > which ends up being too thin and weak despite you buying the correct awg
>> > or mm number.
>> >
>> > But if you do get some, then you have a lifetime supply after that.
>> >
>> > The preloaded bom carts with the pcbs have the sil leadframes just
>> > because it's an actual part that can be ordered normally along with
>> > everything else, and is both a little cheaper and a little more
>> > convenient to solder than the MillMax or Keystone micro pins which could
>> > also be ordered as part of the bom.
>> >
>> > --
>> > bkw
>> >
>> > On 11/28/23 13:32, runrin wrote:
>> > > This is a good idea, but I've already got my new EEPROM in there and
>> > > every time I remove it and put it back in, I get worried I'll break off
>> > > one of the legs and have to resolder it.
>> > >
>> > > The leadframes used to make DIP pins on Brian's FlexROM adapter board
>> > > work well, but I really don't want to have to replace them when I
>

Re: [M100] MiniNDP 512 (was Re: FlexROM with REX#)

[Mike Stein]

I probably missed it and can't easily find the previous discussion,
but what diameter wire do you suggest? I see the hole size 0.6mm/24
mil but not the wire gauge.

Thanks!

On Tue, Nov 28, 2023 at 7:56 PM Brian K. White  wrote:
>
> You have lost me.
>
> If you want to dump or re-write the flexrom, you can just do it it it's
> programming adapter.
>
> I thought you wanted to dump the original rom?
>
> And if you want to avoid all the hardware actions while changing the
> main rom, that's exactly what REX Classic allows. It's purely software
> once you set that up, and even if you botch both primary and secondary
> images, you only need to open the option rom compartment instead of the
> whole machine to revert to the internal eeprom.
>
> If you have a soic-28 test clip, you *might* be able to program the
> eeprom without removing from the machine. Mostly it should be ok, the
> board allows the programmer to drive /WE for instance, it's definitely
> ok to program the chip directly with a test clip if the board is not
> installed in the machine. But but one thing I don't know is, if the
> board is installed in the machine, all the pins are connected to the
> bus. Mostly that should be ok but one thing I don't know is what happens
> when the programmer tries to provide power on the vcc pin? Does it power
> up the whole machine? Even with the memory power switch turned off,
> which normally kills everything, this would be injecting power to the
> rail from a point "inside the walls".
>
> If you're worried about the legs, and you're right that it would be a
> pain to repair a loose one after the frame was cut away, I now actually
> prefer gold plated plain brass wire.
> https://gist.github.com/bkw777/52d85d89eeff8445cc667685d05ea94d
>
> The advantages are,
> - just wire, no special shapes to cut off or anything, no single special
> supplier
> - a few feet makes hundreds of 6mm legs
> - the wire is round, so there is no problem with it rotating when
> loosened and resoldered
> - gold plated
> - repair/replacement of a broken leg is trivial
>
> The disadvantages are,
> - each leg has to be soldered individually, no one-piece connector or
> frame like with a normal pin header
> - no simple supplier to point to, it's such a generic thing that there
> is no part number or such, except in large quantities from bulk
> suppliers. The various suppliers (for small quantities) I've found have
> all been transient like Etsy or Ebay links that don't work a year later.
> And it's easy to end up with gold colored aluminum wire or brass wire
> that isn't gold plated (which starts tarnishing within a year), since no
> one selling the stuff is writing their descriptions for electronics use.
> I have also gotten wire from aliexpress that was thinner than claimed,
> which ends up being too thin and weak despite you buying the correct awg
> or mm number.
>
> But if you do get some, then you have a lifetime supply after that.
>
> The preloaded bom carts with the pcbs have the sil leadframes just
> because it's an actual part that can be ordered normally along with
> everything else, and is both a little cheaper and a little more
> convenient to solder than the MillMax or Keystone micro pins which could
> also be ordered as part of the bom.
>
> --
> bkw
>
> On 11/28/23 13:32, runrin wrote:
> > This is a good idea, but I've already got my new EEPROM in there and
> > every time I remove it and put it back in, I get worried I'll break off
> > one of the legs and have to resolder it.
> >
> > The leadframes used to make DIP pins on Brian's FlexROM adapter board
> > work well, but I really don't want to have to replace them when I
> > inevitably break one off.
> >
> > Would you use a BASIC script to do this Mike? Just a loop to PRINT each
> > byte to the COM port?
> >
> > On Tue, Nov 28, 2023 at 11:45:10AM -0500, Mike Stein wrote:
> >> Why not just dump it out of the M100 directly?
> >>
> >> On Tue, Nov 28, 2023 at 9:50 AM Brian K. White  
> >> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> On 11/27/23 11:48, runrin wrote:
> >>>> Do you know if it's possible to dump the original ROM using the
> >>>> programming adapter for the FlexROM 100?
> >>>
> >>> Maybe.
> >>>
> >>> There are two things to worry about and I'll just think out loud right 
> >>> here.
> >>>
> >>> 1
> >>> The programming adapter presents a pinout for a 28C256, not a 27C256 or
> >>> mask rom. Those are only a couple wires different, but then again, since
> >>> it's just for reading, and the read cycle is the same, you

Re: [M100] MiniNDP 512 (was Re: FlexROM with REX#)

[Mike Stein]

That's what I do, and then convert to hex or binary on the receiving
computer as needed. There are utilities available for dumping an
option ROM as well.


On Tue, Nov 28, 2023 at 1:49 PM runrin  wrote:
>
> This is a good idea, but I've already got my new EEPROM in there and
> every time I remove it and put it back in, I get worried I'll break off
> one of the legs and have to resolder it.
>
> The leadframes used to make DIP pins on Brian's FlexROM adapter board
> work well, but I really don't want to have to replace them when I
> inevitably break one off.
>
> Would you use a BASIC script to do this Mike? Just a loop to PRINT each
> byte to the COM port?
>
> On Tue, Nov 28, 2023 at 11:45:10AM -0500, Mike Stein wrote:
> > Why not just dump it out of the M100 directly?
> >
> > On Tue, Nov 28, 2023 at 9:50 AM Brian K. White  wrote:
> > >
> > > On 11/27/23 11:48, runrin wrote:
> > > > Do you know if it's possible to dump the original ROM using the
> > > > programming adapter for the FlexROM 100?
> > >
> > > Maybe.
> > >
> > > There are two things to worry about and I'll just think out loud right 
> > > here.
> > >
> > > 1
> > > The programming adapter presents a pinout for a 28C256, not a 27C256 or
> > > mask rom. Those are only a couple wires different, but then again, since
> > > it's just for reading, and the read cycle is the same, you could just
> > > tell the programmer that it's reading a 28C256 (force it, override chip
> > > id detection), and that won't hurt the rom.
> > >
> > > 2
> > > Pin 23. The programming adapter routes pin 27 from the programmer (/WE
> > > if a 28C256 were in the programmer) to pin 23 of the DIP socket, which
> > > is ALE on the LH535618 rom, but the flexrom board connects it to the /WE
> > > pin on the actual 28C256 on the board.
> > >
> > > I *think* what you want to do is take a DIP-28 socket and bend out pin
> > > 23, connect the bent-out pin 23 to pin 27, put the modified socket into
> > > the programming adapter and then the old rom into the modified socket.
> > > Then tell the programmer to read a 28C256 and ignore chip id. The socket
> > > is just to avoid bending the leg on the old chip.
> > >
> > > IE, feed /CE from the programmer to both /CE and ALE on the chip, and
> > > don't connect anything to /WE at the programmer.
> > >
> > > But, at that point it's almost simpler to just make the entire adapter
> > > manually with two dip sockets and wires. Especially since it's a
> > > one-off. In that case, use a 27C256 pinout and tell the programmer to
> > > read a 27C256 instead of 28C256.
> > >
> > > But if your chip has any of these part numbers, then it's already been
> > > dumped.
> > > https://bitchin100.com/wiki/index.php?title=Model_and_ROM_information
> > >
> > > --
> > > bkw
> > >

Re: [M100] MiniNDP 512 (was Re: FlexROM with REX#)

[Mike Stein]

Why not just dump it out of the M100 directly?

On Tue, Nov 28, 2023 at 9:50 AM Brian K. White  wrote:
>
> On 11/27/23 11:48, runrin wrote:
> > Do you know if it's possible to dump the original ROM using the
> > programming adapter for the FlexROM 100?
>
> Maybe.
>
> There are two things to worry about and I'll just think out loud right here.
>
> 1
> The programming adapter presents a pinout for a 28C256, not a 27C256 or
> mask rom. Those are only a couple wires different, but then again, since
> it's just for reading, and the read cycle is the same, you could just
> tell the programmer that it's reading a 28C256 (force it, override chip
> id detection), and that won't hurt the rom.
>
> 2
> Pin 23. The programming adapter routes pin 27 from the programmer (/WE
> if a 28C256 were in the programmer) to pin 23 of the DIP socket, which
> is ALE on the LH535618 rom, but the flexrom board connects it to the /WE
> pin on the actual 28C256 on the board.
>
> I *think* what you want to do is take a DIP-28 socket and bend out pin
> 23, connect the bent-out pin 23 to pin 27, put the modified socket into
> the programming adapter and then the old rom into the modified socket.
> Then tell the programmer to read a 28C256 and ignore chip id. The socket
> is just to avoid bending the leg on the old chip.
>
> IE, feed /CE from the programmer to both /CE and ALE on the chip, and
> don't connect anything to /WE at the programmer.
>
> But, at that point it's almost simpler to just make the entire adapter
> manually with two dip sockets and wires. Especially since it's a
> one-off. In that case, use a 27C256 pinout and tell the programmer to
> read a 27C256 instead of 28C256.
>
> But if your chip has any of these part numbers, then it's already been
> dumped.
> https://bitchin100.com/wiki/index.php?title=Model_and_ROM_information
>
> --
> bkw
>

Re: [M100] Alternate keymaps on the M100 (and a question about caps lock)

[Mike Stein]

Thanks for the tip! I'll have to check it out.

m

On Sat, Nov 25, 2023 at 9:28 PM Joshua O'Keefe 
wrote:

> On Nov 25, 2023, at 4:54 PM, Stephen Adolph  wrote:
>
>  I use the Telemark TASM32.  I think you can find it online, not sure.
>
>
> bergen is a modern open source reimplementation of Telemark TASM, intended
> as a drop-in replacement that runs on modern platforms.  I haven't tested
> it but it looks like a pretty nice project:
>
> [image: bergen.png]
>
> kyleedwardsny/bergen: Free and open-source replacement for the Telemark
> Assembler. 
> github.com 
> 
>

Re: [M100] Text Sweeper 2.7.3

[Mike Stein]

I think he was referring to 'Computers', not television sets, telephones,
refrigerators, etc.

On Sat, Nov 25, 2023 at 12:39 PM grima...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> I assumed Josh was referring to all “computers” not just personal
> computers.
>
> iPhones run iOS which based on Unix(BSD), and Android is based on Linux.
>
> Most Smart TVs and Streaming boxes are running Linux.
>
>
>
> On Sat, Nov 25, 2023 at 12:29 PM Walt Perko  wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>>
>>
>> The vast number of UNIX/Linux systems is actually servers, not desktop
>> computers.
>>
>>
>>
>> As for desktop computers, MS Windows is the top of the heap, no other
>> platform even comes close to those numbers.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ==
>> C U L8r,  °|°  Walt Perko  °|°"Kids ... teach them the good
>> stuff, and they still learn the bad stuff on their own."
>>
>> http://www.R2Pv1.com/   *RoboGuts™ Intelligent
>> content for 3D printing making S.T.E.A.M. education better, easier and more
>> affordable  *
>>
>>
>>
>> Experiments to learn how to use various Electronic Components, Structured
>> Computer Programming, Phonemes for Speech  in any language, and Art.
>>
>>
>>  "The World Needs a New Economic Model"
>>
>> ==
>>
>> [image: BillyBotAvatar-2centsStamp-c]
>>
>> Sent from the Cyber7
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* M100 *On Behalf Of *Joshua O'Keefe
>> *Sent:* Saturday, November 25, 2023 9:10 AM
>> *To:* m...@bitchin100.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [M100] Text Sweeper 2.7.3
>>
>>
>>
>> On Nov 25, 2023, at 6:24 AM, ho collo  wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Yes Ken — A majority of the world still uses windows. What would make you
>> think otherwise?
>>
>>
>>
>> The vast majority of the planet runs on Unix-like platforms.  Windows is
>> pretty much only popular on desktops, which are a tiny fraction of the
>> computers people own or use on a daily basis in the modern world.
>>
>>
>>
>> John was kind enough to create CloudT (see http://bitchin100.com/CloudT )
>> for the convenience of people who don't want to compile and install
>> VirtualT for their platform, or who wish to access an emulated system
>> quickly and easily.
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm happy to report that Text Sweeper 2.7.3 seems to run like a dream on
>> it!
>>
>

Re: [M100] Text Sweeper 2.7.3

[Mike Stein]

Has it ever been safe?
;-)

On Sat, Nov 25, 2023 at 11:13 AM John R. Hogerhuis  wrote:
>
> Lol take a breath, he was joking around :-)
>
> Windows is safe for a while
>
> -- John.
>
> On Sat, Nov 25, 2023, 6:25 AM ho collo  wrote:
>>
>> Yes Ken — A majority of the world still uses windows. What would make you 
>> think otherwise?
>>
>> Apple, Linux, and the others still have only a very small market share. At 
>> last check windows was holding on with a mere 68-70% of the market.
>>
>> > On Nov 25, 2023, at 07:56, Kenneth Pettit  wrote:
>> >
>> > Oh wow!  Do people actually still use Windows?  :-)
>> >
>> > I think I have a Windows 10 VM on my Mac somewhere (from a few years ago 
>> > when I was forced to create a Windows API library at work for a customer). 
>> >  I've never tried to run VirtualT on it.  I suspect it (the Windows VM) 
>> > would still boot, though it has been a couple of years since I tried it.
>> >
>> > Ken
>> >
>> >> On 11/24/23 12:42 PM, Philip Avery wrote:
>> >> Hi George
>> >>
>> >> Regarding VT issues on W10: Sometimes I've got VT in a pickle and have to 
>> >> delete the Roaming file to reset it.
>> >>
>> >> Delete: Windows (C:)/Users/(name)/AppData/Roaming virtualt
>> >>
>> >> Regards
>> >> Philip
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> On 25/11/2023 8:42 am, grima...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >>> Hi all,
>> >>>
>> >>> Happy Thanksgiving to all those who may be located in the US and 
>> >>> celebrated!
>> >>>
>> >>> I just wanted to share that since last year, I have done a bit more work 
>> >>> on Text Sweeper (Model 100 Minesweeper Clone), and have published a new 
>> >>> release to GitHub.
>> >>>
>> >>> https://github.com/Grimakis/TextSweeper/releases/tag/2.7.3
>> >>>
>> >>> I have added a few changes since I last posted to the list, but the 
>> >>> major ones are:
>> >>> 1. Using an ML subroutine to switch between the game screen and help 
>> >>> screen. (way faster than the prior version)
>> >>> 2. Requiring less memory to run(approx 1KB less), by using ALTLCD as my 
>> >>> stack space for the search algorithm, switching to LIFO, and changing 
>> >>> the XY coordinate data structure from 4 bytes to 2 bytes.
>> >>>
>> >>> As a reminder, the game is compatible with the M100, T102, T200, and the 
>> >>> DVI in both 40 and 80 col mode.
>> >>>
>> >>> -George
>> >>>
>> >>> P.S. Has anyone had issues with Virtual T on Windows 10? the Memory 
>> >>> Viewer window no longer appears for me. It's made a little harder to 
>> >>> debug whilst coding. If anyone has any ideas, let me know.
>> >>
>> >
>>

Re: [M100] Model T clock doubler

[Mike Stein]

Ah, thanks!

Shoulda thought to look there!

On Thu, Nov 23, 2023 at 1:59 AM Joshua O'Keefe 
wrote:

> On Nov 22, 2023, at 9:01 PM, MikeS  wrote:
>
> MVT100 Windows application???
>
>
> I think that's referring to this program:
> Club100 Member Upload Library
> 
> club100.org
> 
>
> 
> 
>
> To quote Steve: "This is a Windows program that is serial-fed terminal
> emulator specifically modified to match the M100 screen output. It enables
> an 80x24 terminal screen. Compiled on Windows 10 using Visual Studio, based
> on .NET 4.8. Program is very early and possibly quite buggy"
>
>

Re: [M100] Printing from RS232 port?

[Mike Stein]

Definitely possible; details depend on what program you're printing from.


On Wed, Nov 15, 2023 at 5:13 PM Lee Osborne 
wrote:

> Hey everyone...
>
> Is it possible to print from the serial port on a Model 100? If so, how is
> it done?
>
> I have a Brother EP44 typewriter with built in RS232 port, and a double
> ended 25 pin cable which I hope is suitable, but I'm scratching my head
> getting it to do anything.
>
> Pointers appreciated.
>
> Lee
>

Re: [M100] 10.4" LCD with the Model 100

[Mike Stein]

It's been a while since I've played with the DVI, but AFAIR not only did it
not do bit-mapped graphics but I'm not sure whether it was 100%
compatible with the entire M100 character set (or maybe I'm hiking about
the printer...)

The screen size issue is taken care of by the DOS extensions for the CVI or
the VT100.

Sounds like an interesting project to be sure.


On Thu, Nov 9, 2023 at 7:03 AM Scott McDonnell 
wrote:

> ===
> John R. Hogerhuisjhoger at pobox.com   ?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BM100%5D%2010.4%22%20LCD%20with%20the%20Model%20100=%3CCACutKUg_WATxG%3DfVPQE6mWcbSsp8eANThWJFhtw6KiM5NOvj8Q%
> 40mail.gmail.com%3E>  wrote:
> "The TRS-80 Model 100 has its system bus expansion port on the bottom. The
> >> Tandy 102, the successor to the TRS-80 Model 100 has its expansion port
> on
> the back of the unit. The connector looks like a parallel port, but is not
> a parallel port. The Model 100 and Tandy 102 have a parallel port but the
> connector looks and is compatible with the internal parallel port to
> motherboard cable used in PCs."
> ===
>
>
> Ahh! That makes perfect sense to what I was seeing now. Thank you.
>
> ==
> Mike Steinmhs.stein at gmail.com   ?Subject=Re%3A%20%5BM100%5D%2010.4%22%20LCD%20with%20the%20Model%20100=%3CCAHHfo1sURCQacqEdbuxuXe%3DFMXrCvjjxYhnqE%3D-AR5ZbdH%3D3OA%
> 40mail.gmail.com%3E>  wrote:
> "Sounds like an ambitious project ;-)
>
> You can send the display data out to a display via the com port and, if you
> need the port for something else, even the bar code port; there is also a
> terminal driver that is compatible with the M100's screen codes. Have a
> look here:
>
> https://bitchin100.com/wiki/index.php?title=VT100  "
> =
>
> So, there is no real "compatibility" issues to be concerned about as in
> there
> is no software really which relied on the specific hardware of the DVI?
>
> Using a COM port would leave my LCD driver pretty universal. My only
> concern with doing it that way is that it wouldn't support the bitmap
> graphics
> commands.
>
> It may be completely naive at this stage of research for me, but the most
> ideal
> would probably be to hijack the interrupt for the display output and
> override
> the kernel routine to move the video memory to another location that would
> be
> outside of the M100 through the expansion port. Then have my controller
> just
> scanning the video and attribute memories and painting the LCD. Pretty much
> just parallel to serial shift registers. It is probably something I could
> implement with a CPLD. But to do this, I will need to study the M100 kernel
> code.
>
> My naivete is probably going to get a rude awakening when thinking about
> how
> to deal with the screen size differences. Text is one thing as once you
> send
> the text, it can just live in the memory until pushed off the screen.
> Bitmap
> would mean being able to randomly address pixels in the memory. I will have
> to figure out how to handle that when the bitmap memory would be larger
> than
> the built in screen.
>
> In the end, I may just support text only. Or at least start there since it
> would be easier and provide some sort of early success to keep motivation.
>
>

Re: [M100] 10.4" LCD with the Model 100

[Mike Stein]

Sounds like an ambitious project ;-)

You can send the display data out to a display via the com port and, if you
need the port for something else, even the bar code port; there is also a
terminal driver that is compatible with the M100's screen codes. Have a
look here:

https://bitchin100.com/wiki/index.php?title=VT100



On Wed, Nov 8, 2023 at 9:31 PM Scott McDonnell 
wrote:

> I ended up with a small qty of 10.4" monochrome LCDs and was asking around
> for ideas what to do with them. In one of my other groups, it was suggested
> to get one working as a display for a model 100 and I thought that was a
> great idea. Probably the most compatible way to do this would be to emulate
> how the DVI worked, but I have never seen one in action. I have also gotten
> confused looking up youtube demonstrations. In some, the DVI plugs into the
> 40 pin expansion socket on the bottom. In another video, it was plugged
> into the parallel port, I think. The 40 pin expansion makes more sense to
> me.
>
> Looking through the service manual, it appears to use a 8255 PPI to
> interface with the computer to write into VRAM and ARAM which a CRT
> controller then uses to paint the screen on a monitor. Is that a simple
> description of how it works? It appears to require loading a driver program
> and is not something that is just available in the BIOS, right? Would it
> work with all screen output, even graphics, etc? If so, maybe compatibility
> is not really an issue with my own driver?
>
> So I am looking for links and info to help me on this quest. The service
> manual is great, but it is geared more toward repair than theory of
> operation. Is anyone aware of any reverse engineering information on this?
> Has anyone attempted to duplicate it before?
>
> These displays are controller-less, so of course first I need to design a
> controller for them. I was planning to just use a Raspberry Pi Pico to
> drive it.
>
> Here is a really good project with tons of information on driving my exact
> display for those curious which display it is. The display is nearly
> exactly the size of the Model 100, so making an enclosure that could flip
> down like a laptop would be possible.
>
> http://www.projekte.daleske.de/mcp/49_LCDM/LCDM.htm
>
>

Re: [M100] Anti-static foam types

[Mike Stein]

If I have a lot of an IC I leave them in the tubes, but they can be awkward
to ship. For most ICS and even some small parts I prefer the pink
anti-static foam, both the semi-rigid type and the flexible types; on a
flat 12x12 sheet for example they're much easier to store and also to ship
once cut to size.

e.g.:
https://canada.foambymail.com/product/anti-static-polyethylene-foam-1-7lb-pink.html

Grainger sells 1/8x12x12 sheets 2 for C$3.46
https://www.grainger.ca/en/product/FOAMSHEET-ANTISTATIC-1-8X12X12-PK2/p/CFM1001002

Newark sells black foam sheets, probably better stuff these days:
https://canada.newark.com/multicomp-pro/038-0100/conductive-chip-foam-127-x-228/dp/87P0221?gad_source=1=Cj0KCQjwqP2pBhDMARIsAJQ0CzqxdbWNoAt6mshLYqKD6rPkk8OnO4OstxqzOpwJbxvK6nxwVvSVNfwaAuq0EALw_wcB_kwcid=AL!8472!3x!!=_dc|pcrid||plid||kword||match||slid||product|87P0221|pgrid||ptaid||=KNC-GCA-Shopping-PMAX-CATCH-ALL-NEW-S39_price=true

Stay away from Styrofoam except for non-sensitive parts like DIP switches
etc.; it can actually _create_ static electricity, the last thing you want.

As to the old black stuff I've had mixed experiences; generally I've had no
issues with the flexible type, but pretty well all the rigid stuff I've
come across has crumbled and very often has corroded or even eaten away IC
pins, especially gold pins on white ceramic chips like the old AYx-
modem and custom ROM chips. But YMMV...

m

On Mon, Oct 30, 2023 at 7:16 PM Peter Noeth  wrote:

> I would NOT recommend the black carbonized foam for storage. We used to
> use that type where I worked as a Component Level computer tech for our
> "Component Inventory" many decades ago. It will turn the legs of I.C.s and
> transistors black after a few months if you stick them into the foam,
> requiring cleaning with a mild abrasive before soldering (risking static
> damage). It may be a solution for shipment only.
>
> The other foam looks like High Density Styrofoam, as used in the building
> trades for wall insulation. I have seen it both light blue and pink, used
> for the purposes you mention, and have never trusted it as styrofoam is
> inherently very staticy, even with anti-static additives. I have seen some
> people wrap that foam in aluminum foil first before poking any leaded
> components into it. This may be a shipment only solution.
>
> I have always used the plastic anti static tubes (rails) that the
> manufacturers sell their components in, or the anti-static poly and
> mylar bags that DigiKey and other distributors use. With "through hole"
> components not being as popular as they once were, and "surface mount"
> components now the "norm", your best solution would be the anti-static poly
> and mylar bags easily found with an Internet search.
>
> Regards,
>
> PeterN
>
> On Mon, Oct 30, 2023 at 2:42 PM  wrote:
>
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2023 14:25:24 -0700
>> From: Gary Weber 
>> To: M100 
>> Subject: [M100] Anti-static foam types
>> Message-ID:
>> <
>> caajazkoqdyapx1godpsvutedor+x1npum1isuhrv+udoman...@mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>
>> Question for anyone out there familiar --
>>
>> There's a few kinds of antistatic foams out there that I've come across
>> which have had DIP chips stuck into them for storage, and the ones I
>> currently have on hand is the black stuff which is very porous, and this
>> other very stiff stuff that almost has the feeling of styrofoam.  (Not
>> bendable.)
>>
>> Here's the two I have on hand:
>> [image: image.png]
>>
>> Is anyone else familiar with the light colored antistatic "hard" foam
>> that's in the right of this photo?  What's it called and where would you
>> obtain more of it?  It seems to protect a DIP chip's pins much better for
>> long term storage or shipping and I'd like to have some on hand.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> --
>> Gary Weber
>> g...@web8201.com
>> -- next part --
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>> http://lists.bitchin100.com/private.cgi/m100-bitchin100.com/attachments/20231030/b21a215a/attachment.htm
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>> >
>>
>>

Re: [M100] REXCPM

[Mike Stein]

It is indeed a challenge to organize so much varied info; overall it's
pretty well done but I think John could also put a few more entries in the
top level index.

Am I getting senile, or did you put a link to Ordering Info in the
REX/REXCPM main page? Don't recall seeing that; problem solved..

m

On Wed, May 17, 2023 at 4:22 PM Stephen Adolph  wrote:

> I'm not great at organizing stuff on the wiki.
>
> I'm also concious of creating dead pages since iirc you can't delete a
> page.  In other words I try to reuse pages.
>
> I'll take a look and see if I can reorganize or otherwise improve.
>
> I have also thought about a fancier website, but it feels like it would be
> a lot of extra work and cost.
>
>
>
> On Wednesday, May 17, 2023, John R. Hogerhuis  wrote:
>
>> OK. I was just curious where the confusion was... FWIW, Rex sales and
>> support has always been in the wiki. I guess you're looking for it on the
>> top level bitchin100 site, we could put a link there.
>>
>> As to REXCPM, I agree... the ordering link is under the REX# section of
>> the REX page. If you search for rex, then immediately click on Rexcpm you
>> will miss the ordering link.
>>
>> Probably bitchin100 should add a e-commerce store. We'll see.
>>
>> -- John.
>>
>> On Wed, May 17, 2023 at 12:42 PM MikeS  wrote:
>>
>>> Well, if you expect to find ordering info in the Wiki section...
>>>
>>> Even when you finally find the REXCPM section there's no mention of
>>> ordering info in the contents index either; you have to guess that it's
>>> under 'Links' in the Overview section as though it were on some external
>>> site...
>>>
>>> I see I'm not the only one, and the person I just told about it couldn't
>>> find it either (which is why I asked).
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>> m
>>>
>>>
>>> - Original Message -
>>> *From:* John R. Hogerhuis 
>>> *To:* m...@bitchin100.com
>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 17, 2023 11:58 AM
>>> *Subject:* Re: [M100] REXCPM
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, May 17, 2023, 7:39 AM MikeS  wrote:
>>>
 Having a lot of trouble finding stuff in Bitchin100 these days...
 Where's the order page for REXCPM?

 m

>>>
>>> I went to the wiki, typed rex into the media wiki search bar and it
>>> showed a link to the ordering page for rex#
>>>
>>> And since bitchin100 is now indexed by Google and bing you can just
>>> search them for bitchin100 ordering rex and it takes you to the order page.
>>>
>>> So seems findable?
>>>
>>> -- John
>>>

>>>
>>>

Re: [M100] Variable Concordance - MTVarConcor

[Mike Stein]

Sorry; not much info there ;-)

It worked fine on the test program; FYI, attached is the program it died on.

m

On Mon, May 1, 2023 at 7:33 PM Mike Stein  wrote:

> Here's what I get (Win7):
>
>
> On Mon, May 1, 2023 at 4:38 PM  wrote:
>
>> Hello all,
>>
>>
>>
>> I’ve written a variable concordance program for Windows that will take a
>> TRS-80 Model 100 BASIC program and will list the variables in alphabetical
>> order with the line numbers where they appear.The name of this program
>> is MTVarConcor.   The executable, source and a pdf file describing it can
>> be found at www.GitHub.com/LEJ-Projects/MTVarConcor.
>>
>>
>>
>> As an example, the 10 line program, drop (written by David Plass) is as
>> follows:
>>
>>
>>
>> 0
>> CLS:POKE-902,PEEK(63795):F=.25+RND(1)/4:W=-.25+RND(1)/2:X=0:Y=1:B%=5+25*RND(1)
>>
>>
>> 1 C=0:PRINT@280+B%,CHR$(27)"Vý"SPACE$(9-E)"ý":PRINT@200
>> ,"S:"S:PRINT"L:"5-L:PRINTUSING"W:#.#";W
>>
>> 2 C=C+F:PRINT@C," ýý":IFX<>0THENPRINT@OX+40*OY%,"
>> ":OX=X:OY%=Y:Y=Y+.3:X=X+W:GOTO6
>>
>> 4 IFINKEY$=" "THENX=C+2:F=F*2:OX=0:OY%=0
>>
>> 5 IFC>=37THENPRINT@37," ":C=0:GOTO2ELSE2
>>
>> 6 IFY<7.01THENPRINT@X+40*FIX(Y),"ý":GOTO4
>>
>> 7 
>> IFX>=B%+1ANDX<=B%+10-ETHENPRINT@97,"Hit!":CALL4811:S=S+10*(E+1):E=E-(E<8):GOTO0
>>
>>
>> 8 L=L+1:IFL<5THENPRINT@97,"MISS!":CALL4811:GOTO0ELSEPRINT@55,"Game
>> over":END
>>
>>
>>
>> The output from MTVarConcor when the above program is the input is:
>>
>>
>>
>> B% 0 1 7(2)
>>
>> C 1 2(3) 4 5(2)
>>
>> E 1 7(5)
>>
>> F 0 2 4(2)
>>
>> L 1 8(3)
>>
>> OX 2(2) 4
>>
>> OY% 2(2) 4
>>
>> S 1 7(2)
>>
>> W 0 1 2
>>
>> X 0 2(4) 4 6 7(2)
>>
>> Y 0 2(3) 6(2)
>>
>>
>>
>> I hope someone will find this program useful.
>>
>> Lloyd
>>
>>
>>
>>
<>

Re: [M100] Variable Concordance - MTVarConcor

[Mike Stein]

Here's what I get (Win7):


On Mon, May 1, 2023 at 4:38 PM  wrote:

> Hello all,
>
>
>
> I’ve written a variable concordance program for Windows that will take a
> TRS-80 Model 100 BASIC program and will list the variables in alphabetical
> order with the line numbers where they appear.The name of this program
> is MTVarConcor.   The executable, source and a pdf file describing it can
> be found at www.GitHub.com/LEJ-Projects/MTVarConcor.
>
>
>
> As an example, the 10 line program, drop (written by David Plass) is as
> follows:
>
>
>
> 0
> CLS:POKE-902,PEEK(63795):F=.25+RND(1)/4:W=-.25+RND(1)/2:X=0:Y=1:B%=5+25*RND(1)
>
>
> 1 C=0:PRINT@280+B%,CHR$(27)"Vý"SPACE$(9-E)"ý":PRINT@200
> ,"S:"S:PRINT"L:"5-L:PRINTUSING"W:#.#";W
>
> 2 C=C+F:PRINT@C," ýý":IFX<>0THENPRINT@OX+40*OY%,"
> ":OX=X:OY%=Y:Y=Y+.3:X=X+W:GOTO6
>
> 4 IFINKEY$=" "THENX=C+2:F=F*2:OX=0:OY%=0
>
> 5 IFC>=37THENPRINT@37," ":C=0:GOTO2ELSE2
>
> 6 IFY<7.01THENPRINT@X+40*FIX(Y),"ý":GOTO4
>
> 7 
> IFX>=B%+1ANDX<=B%+10-ETHENPRINT@97,"Hit!":CALL4811:S=S+10*(E+1):E=E-(E<8):GOTO0
>
>
> 8 L=L+1:IFL<5THENPRINT@97,"MISS!":CALL4811:GOTO0ELSEPRINT@55,"Game
> over":END
>
>
>
> The output from MTVarConcor when the above program is the input is:
>
>
>
> B% 0 1 7(2)
>
> C 1 2(3) 4 5(2)
>
> E 1 7(5)
>
> F 0 2 4(2)
>
> L 1 8(3)
>
> OX 2(2) 4
>
> OY% 2(2) 4
>
> S 1 7(2)
>
> W 0 1 2
>
> X 0 2(4) 4 6 7(2)
>
> Y 0 2(3) 6(2)
>
>
>
> I hope someone will find this program useful.
>
> Lloyd
>
>
>
>

Re: [M100] M100 repairs (LCD, keyboard)

[Mike Stein]

Yeah, if those switches are the type I think they are, they're not exactly
manufactured to the strictest tolerances...

But kudos for getting it all working.

Now to start playing...

m

On Sat, Apr 29, 2023 at 3:18 PM David Plass  wrote:

> Heh.
>
> Yep, all the function switches are working and all the regular keyswitches
> are working.
>
> However... the replacement function switches have more rotational "play"
> than the old ones so some of them look funny. I may use some kind of
> flexible tape on the "lower step" of the function keycaps to prevent them
> from tilting.
>
> On Sat, Apr 29, 2023 at 3:05 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>
>> It's no fun if it's too easy ;-)
>>
>> A shame about the pant & the extra effort; did you get all the switches
>> working/replaced?
>>
>> m
>>
>> On Sat, Apr 29, 2023 at 3:01 PM David Plass  wrote:
>>
>>> Latest update:
>>>
>>> I used lots of 99% IPA and got much (but not all) of the paint off the
>>> keyswitches and PCB. I gave up after a while and decided it's good enough.
>>>
>>> I found a replacement contrast potentiometer. Its leads are a little too
>>> short so it's too loose in the PCB and therefore intermittent, so I may use
>>> a regular pot sticking through the hole, which is TBD.
>>>
>>> I derusted and painted the metal bracket at the top of the keyboard and
>>> reassembled everything.
>>>
>>> Working off a wall wart, it was fine, but when I popped in some
>>> batteries, it didn't turn on.
>>>
>>> I tracked it down to the barrel jack "interlock" failing, so it always
>>> thinks there's a power plug inserted. I removed the old barrel jack and
>>> installed a new one that is *almost* the right size. I'm going to have to
>>> modify the case to get it to fit flush.
>>>
>>> Two steps forward, one step back, but it's still progress.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Apr 23, 2023 at 5:37 PM David Plass  wrote:
>>>
>>>> An update:
>>>>
>>>> Unfortunately there was a freak accident in the workshop... I'm
>>>> de-rusting some of the keyswitches and the on/off switch and figured after
>>>> removing the rust I'd paint over the rusty areas (it's not ideal, but the
>>>> best I could do).
>>>>
>>>> One of the switches was "clean" so I temporarily installed it on the
>>>> keyboard PCB. To paint, I was going to use a silver "paint-pen". While
>>>> shaking the pen (according to the directions), the pen exploded and
>>>> splattered paint on the keyboard and PCB. About 4 switches were inundated
>>>> with paint and another 2 or 3 got some paint splattered on them.
>>>>
>>>> I spent about a half an hour cleaning the paint as best I could using
>>>> 99 IPA, but there's still some paint on the PCB.
>>>>
>>>> A few hours later I checked some of the affected switches and I think
>>>> the paint has dried inside them, because they're open circuits now. I tried
>>>> De-Oxit, and they are revived, but I fear it's only temporary.
>>>>
>>>> My question for the forumbrain is: can the keyboard switches be
>>>> disassembled for 'deep cleaning'? I would desolder them first, obviously.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Apr 20, 2023 at 10:48 AM Gregory McGill <
>>>> arcadeshop...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> thanks!
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Apr 20, 2023 at 4:14 AM David Plass 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I was surprised too but it's a near exact match. I tried the key caps
>>>>>> and, while they're tight, they definitely fit.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 20, 2023, 6:25 AM Louis Ciotti 
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I would have never thought these would have been used back when the
>>>>>>> M100 was designed.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Apr 19, 2023, at 10:03 PM, David Plass 
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> The function keys are 12x12x7.3mm tactile switches with square tops
>>>>>>> and PCB/through-hole mounting pins.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> For example:
>>>>>>> https://www.amazon.com/TWTADE-Momentary-Tactile-Button-12x12x12mm/dp/B07CG7VTGD?th=1
>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>> https://www.amazon.com/ACEIRMC-12x12x7-3mm-Momentary-Tactile-Arduino/dp/B091HL5YBD/ref=sr_1_3
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>

Re: [M100] M100 repairs (LCD, keyboard)

[Mike Stein]

It's no fun if it's too easy ;-)

A shame about the pant & the extra effort; did you get all the switches
working/replaced?

m

On Sat, Apr 29, 2023 at 3:01 PM David Plass  wrote:

> Latest update:
>
> I used lots of 99% IPA and got much (but not all) of the paint off the
> keyswitches and PCB. I gave up after a while and decided it's good enough.
>
> I found a replacement contrast potentiometer. Its leads are a little too
> short so it's too loose in the PCB and therefore intermittent, so I may use
> a regular pot sticking through the hole, which is TBD.
>
> I derusted and painted the metal bracket at the top of the keyboard and
> reassembled everything.
>
> Working off a wall wart, it was fine, but when I popped in some batteries,
> it didn't turn on.
>
> I tracked it down to the barrel jack "interlock" failing, so it always
> thinks there's a power plug inserted. I removed the old barrel jack and
> installed a new one that is *almost* the right size. I'm going to have to
> modify the case to get it to fit flush.
>
> Two steps forward, one step back, but it's still progress.
>
>
> On Sun, Apr 23, 2023 at 5:37 PM David Plass  wrote:
>
>> An update:
>>
>> Unfortunately there was a freak accident in the workshop... I'm
>> de-rusting some of the keyswitches and the on/off switch and figured after
>> removing the rust I'd paint over the rusty areas (it's not ideal, but the
>> best I could do).
>>
>> One of the switches was "clean" so I temporarily installed it on the
>> keyboard PCB. To paint, I was going to use a silver "paint-pen". While
>> shaking the pen (according to the directions), the pen exploded and
>> splattered paint on the keyboard and PCB. About 4 switches were inundated
>> with paint and another 2 or 3 got some paint splattered on them.
>>
>> I spent about a half an hour cleaning the paint as best I could using 99
>> IPA, but there's still some paint on the PCB.
>>
>> A few hours later I checked some of the affected switches and I think the
>> paint has dried inside them, because they're open circuits now. I tried
>> De-Oxit, and they are revived, but I fear it's only temporary.
>>
>> My question for the forumbrain is: can the keyboard switches be
>> disassembled for 'deep cleaning'? I would desolder them first, obviously.
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 20, 2023 at 10:48 AM Gregory McGill 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> thanks!
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 20, 2023 at 4:14 AM David Plass  wrote:
>>>
 I was surprised too but it's a near exact match. I tried the key caps
 and, while they're tight, they definitely fit.

 On Thu, Apr 20, 2023, 6:25 AM Louis Ciotti  wrote:

> I would have never thought these would have been used back when the
> M100 was designed.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Apr 19, 2023, at 10:03 PM, David Plass  wrote:
>
> 
> The function keys are 12x12x7.3mm tactile switches with square tops
> and PCB/through-hole mounting pins.
>
> For example:
> https://www.amazon.com/TWTADE-Momentary-Tactile-Button-12x12x12mm/dp/B07CG7VTGD?th=1
> or
> https://www.amazon.com/ACEIRMC-12x12x7-3mm-Momentary-Tactile-Arduino/dp/B091HL5YBD/ref=sr_1_3
>
>

Re: [M100] Lack of info on DIY RAM upgrades

[Mike Stein]

Duh!

I saw the Tandy part number and thought it was an 'official' part, but of
course that's the model # of the 8K M100, not the Ram board.

Thanks!

m

On Tue, Apr 25, 2023 at 10:33 PM Stephen Adolph 
wrote:

> Not much to say really. I decided it would be a fun challenge to carefully
> measure out the M100 sockets and NEC sockets to see if I could have a
> single card that spans all 3 (or 4 in the case of NEC) ram slots with a
> single ram chip.
> It works, and it saves a bit of money if you need a bunch of 8k rams.  Bit
> of a pain to make though.  I have to pick apart pin headers to get the
> pins, and then hand place 40 pins in a jig, and then wiggle the board into
> place and solder.
>
> I have enough M100's that have only 8k, and several NEC with no bank 2
> RAM, I decided to finish the project off,  and flood my machines with ram.
> Since then I decided I would offer it if there was interest.
> Never was intended to be DIY.
> regards.
> Steve
>
> On Tue, Apr 25, 2023 at 9:45 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>
>> I didn't know there was a 24K RAM card for the M100; any details on that?
>>
>> m
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 25, 2023 at 9:17 PM Stephen Adolph 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> http://bitchin100.com/wiki/index.php?title=Ordering_Information
>>>
>>> Mark, those 2 items are things you can order from me.
>>>
>>> Steve
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, April 25, 2023, mark audacity romberg <
>>> mark.romb...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Say y’all, I don’t have a login on the Bitchin 100 Wiki to comment
>>>> there, but both the 8k and 24k DIY RAM board articles have no actual
>>>> actionable information—no schematics, no links, no PCB art, nothing but a
>>>> photo of the 8k, and a photo of the prototype installed for the 24k.
>>>>
>>>> Needless to say…these are not useful. Could we either get the folks who
>>>> created those projects to post the rest of the information/files, or remove
>>>> the articles, since they essentially are stories, not projects?
>>>>
>>>> —m.a
>>>
>>>

Re: [M100] Lack of info on DIY RAM upgrades

[Mike Stein]

I didn't know there was a 24K RAM card for the M100; any details on that?

m


On Tue, Apr 25, 2023 at 9:17 PM Stephen Adolph  wrote:

>
> http://bitchin100.com/wiki/index.php?title=Ordering_Information
>
> Mark, those 2 items are things you can order from me.
>
> Steve
>
>
> On Tuesday, April 25, 2023, mark audacity romberg 
> wrote:
>
>> Say y’all, I don’t have a login on the Bitchin 100 Wiki to comment there,
>> but both the 8k and 24k DIY RAM board articles have no actual actionable
>> information—no schematics, no links, no PCB art, nothing but a photo of the
>> 8k, and a photo of the prototype installed for the 24k.
>>
>> Needless to say…these are not useful. Could we either get the folks who
>> created those projects to post the rest of the information/files, or remove
>> the articles, since they essentially are stories, not projects?
>>
>> —m.a
>
>

Re: [M100] Recognize this cable?

[Mike Stein]

Thanks, Brian,

I thought of that but never bothered to check with my box of PCMCIA modems
because of the six-pin RJ12 plug; I will now though.

Thanks again,

m

On Thu, Apr 20, 2023 at 1:58 PM Brian Brindle  wrote:

> That's an old school PCMCIA MODEM telephone cable with A 41H8105
> connector. You'd cram that huge crazy end into the PCMCIA modem and the
> other into your wall jack.
>
> On Thu, Apr 20, 2023 at 12:00 PM MikeS  wrote:
>
>> Thought I'd ask here if anyone recognizes/wants this cable before it hits
>> the trash; kinda looks like it might be for a PDA of some kind.
>>
>> m
>>
>

Re: [M100] M100 Digest, Vol 148, Issue 5

[Mike Stein]

Be nice; yours could also use a little proofreading ;-)


On Sun, Apr 9, 2023 at 8:52 PM Stephen  wrote:

> Is you code as good as your grammar, because that reads like word salad.
>
> Stephen Walters
> Tel 07956-544202
>
>
> On Sunday, 9 April 2023 at 21:04:01 BST, m100-requ...@lists.bitchin100.com
>  wrote:
>
>
> Send M100 mailing list submissions to
> m100@lists.bitchin100.com
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://lists.bitchin100.com/listinfo.cgi/m100-bitchin100.com
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> m100-requ...@lists.bitchin100.com
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> m100-ow...@lists.bitchin100.com
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of M100 digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>   1. MTLineRef (lloydel...@comcast.net)
>
>
> --
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 9 Apr 2023 07:41:31 -0500
> From: 
> To: 
> Subject: [M100] MTLineRef
> Message-ID: <007001d96ae0$9df359d0$d9da0d70$@comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Good morning to all:
>
>
>
> I've written a Windows Console program in C to that will a TRS-80 Model 100
> BASIC program and will list the line number and first ten characters of
> each
> line that is referenced by another line.  It will also list the line
> numbers
> that reference it.
>
>
>
> The program can be found at www.GitHub.com/LEJ-Projects/MTLineRef
>  .
>
>
>
> I hope that someone finds this useful.
>
>
>
> Lloyd
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -- next part --
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <
> http://lists.bitchin100.com/private.cgi/m100-bitchin100.com/attachments/20230409/316d490b/attachment-0001.htm
> >
>
> --
>
> Subject: Digest Footer
>
> ___
> M100 mailing list
> M100@lists.bitchin100.com
> http://lists.bitchin100.com/listinfo.cgi/m100-bitchin100.com
>
>
> --
>
> End of M100 Digest, Vol 148, Issue 5
> 
>

Re: [M100] Removing DVI Disk Basic

[Mike Stein]

Got it; tnx


On Fri, Mar 3, 2023 at 6:34 AM Brian White  wrote:

> In my first post in this thread I linked DVI.CAT and the directory it
> sits in, the peripherals dir in m100sig, and pointed to a couple files
> described in DVI.CAT, then just noticed more files from the same place
> that apply to this question.
>
>
> bkw
>
> On Thu, Mar 2, 2023, 9:18 PM MikeS  wrote:
>
>> What and where is SWITCH.DSK?
>>
>> - Original Message -
>> From: "Brian K. White" 
>> To: 
>> Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2023 10:33 AM
>> Subject: Re: [M100] Removing DVI Disk Basic
>>
>>
>> > Ah, and SWITCH.DSK must be what I thought I remembered seeing before
>> > about switching between dvi and other.
>> >
>> >
>> > On 3/2/23 10:29, Brian K. White wrote:
>> >> See L-DVI.100
>> >>
>> >> On 3/2/23 10:18, grima...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >>> Just tried out BOOT.BA  and it works pretty well.
>> Only
>> >>> thing I don't love about it, is that you need to re-enter the
>> >>> Time/Date after removing Disk-BASIC.
>> >>>
>> >>> I think I'm going to modify it to store the current date/time in
>> >>> ALTLCD before clearing the ram, as I think that location ought to be
>> >>> protected.
>> >>>
>> >>> -George
>> >>>
>> >>> On Thu, Mar 2, 2023 at 9:48 AM Brian K. White > >>> > wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> I never noticed that, but I just tried it and you're right, the dvi
>> >>> needs the system disk on every power-on, not just for installation.
>> >>>
>> >>> -- bkw
>> >>>
>> >>> On 3/2/23 09:20, grima...@gmail.com 
>> >>> wrote:
>> >>> > I guess the need to pack the Disk BASIC away is pretty limited,
>> >>> since
>> >>> > when the DVI starts up, it loads software into it's RAM from the
>> >>> system
>> >>> > disk, the same disk which you can use to load Disk BASIC to the
>> >>> M100. So
>> >>> > even if you were to pack and reload Disk BASIC, the DVI will be
>> >>> useless
>> >>> > without the system disk. (unless there is a way to load the DVI
>> >>> software
>> >>> > into the DVI from the System Bus connector of the M100.)
>> >>> >
>> >>> > That would be great if possible, you could bootstrap a DVI
>> >>> without the
>> >>> > original disk.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > -George
>> >>> >
>> >>> > On Thu, Mar 2, 2023 at 9:11 AM Brian K. White
>> >>> mailto:b.kenyo...@gmail.com>
>> >>> > >>
>> >>> wrote:
>> >>> >
>> >>> > On 3/2/23 07:37, grima...@gmail.com
>> >>>  > >>> > wrote:
>> >>> > > Hi Brian,
>> >>> > >
>> >>> > > Just reading the descriptions in your link and they seem
>> >>> to be
>> >>> > exactly
>> >>> > > what I need.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > Looks like also D100.BA  > >>> > and DISABL.DVI
>> >>> >
>> >>> > I would have sworn I saw directions in the user manual, but I
>> >>> don't see
>> >>> > anything like that now.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > There may be yet other programs or texts elsewhere in the
>> >>> m100sig
>> >>> > besides these too.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > I thought I saw some that don't just unload the dvi software
>> >>> but pack
>> >>> > it away for restoring later, and did the same for other
>> >>> dosses like for
>> >>> > chipmunk or tpdd, and let you flip back & forth between them.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > Here's something cool, search the entire m100sig using the
>> >>> search
>> >>> > box on
>> >>> > github:
>> >>> >
>> >>> >
>> >>>
>> >>> https://github.com/LivingM100SIG/Living_M100SIG/search?q=Disk%2FVideo
>> >>> <
>> https://github.com/LivingM100SIG/Living_M100SIG/search?q=Disk%2FVideo> <
>> https://github.com/LivingM100SIG/Living_M100SIG/search?q=Disk%2FVideo <
>> https://github.com/LivingM100SIG/Living_M100SIG/search?q=Disk%2FVideo>>
>> >>> >
>> >>> > Whoa Nelly!
>> >>> >
>> >>> > --
>> >>> > bkw
>> >>> >
>> >>>
>> >>> -- bkw
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >
>> > --
>> > bkw
>>
>

Re: [M100] - Backpack

[Mike Stein]

Not sure what you mean? What's the bad habit?

The idea of using .BA for plaintext BASIC files and .DO for text documents
made perfect sense in the old days. Keep in mind that a stock M100 can not
transfer binary files such as tokenized BASIC or .CO, so normally all files
transferred would be plain ASCII and you would only have tokenized files on
the M100 itself.

The problem being discussed only arose once various means of transferring
binary files without discriminating between binary and plaintext came along.

m

On Wed, Mar 1, 2023 at 3:29 PM Peter Vollan  wrote:

> See, I take the unpopular opinion that that should not be done because it
> teaches bad habits.
>
> On Wed, 1 Mar 2023 at 06:20,  wrote:
>
>> I also tried loading a .DO named as .BA through BASIC, i.e. load
>> "com:98n1e" and that worked fine. Seems to me that if it were a man ROM
>> issue the same problem would happen this way. Also, the TS-DOS disassembly
>> shows that it changes it’s behavior based on filetype extension.
>>
>>
>>
>> Jeff Birt
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* M100  *On Behalf Of *Brian
>> White
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 1, 2023 6:51 AM
>> *To:* m...@bitchin100.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [M100] - Backpack
>>
>>
>>
>> I don't think it's ts-dos, it's the main rom. The main rom and all the
>> tpdd clients basically have to trust the file name. If it's declared as a
>> .ba, then the bytes are copied verbatim and then later interpreted
>> according to the rules of parsing a .ba. If the contents are not .ba,
>> kablooey.
>>
>> bkw
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 28, 2023, 8:11 PM  wrote:
>>
>> I did some more testing and discovered that John is absolutely correct.
>> Previously when I had tried to load a .BA which was really a .DO it made it
>> about 3-4 line in and then stopped. This led me to believe it was an issue
>> I have seen on other computer; when loading an ASCII file over serial the
>> computer will tokenize the line when the CR is encountered. Just like it
>> had been typed in on the keyboard. For these systems you have to add a 2
>> second or so delay after each line to allow for tokenization.
>>
>> TSDOS does its own thing, like John says, and really makes a mess of it.
>>
>>
>>
>> Jeff Birt
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* M100  *On Behalf Of *John R.
>> Hogerhuis
>> *Sent:* Saturday, February 25, 2023 7:40 PM
>> *To:* m...@bitchin100.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [M100] - Backpack
>>
>>
>>
>> A side note but the reason files misnamed as BA cause a problem is that
>> tsdos will load them into the BASIC program region verbatim and  treat the
>> ASCII bytes as parts of binary formatted line numbers and tokens among
>> other problems, ultimately causing a corrupted RAM file system.
>>
>>
>>
>> It was the convention on the old Club100 library  to name them this way
>> but it's now a bad practice.
>>
>>
>>
>> -- John.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023, 5:30 PM  wrote:
>>
>> Yes, someone already wrote such a program and shared it. If you just got
>> a Backpack Drive Plus it is already on the SD card. You can also download
>> it from: https://github.com/Jeff-Birt/Backpack/tree/main/User_Programs
>>
>>
>>
>>

Re: [M100] Interfacing Model 100 with the Real World

[Mike Stein]

There are lots of ways to interface to the M100 aside from the 'normal'
ports, for instance using the Bar Code port to measure frequency and/or
voltage, using the RS-232 control lines as digital I/O lines and of course
the easiest of all, the cassette motor relay.

But the actual details of the interface will depend entirely on your
sensors and what you want to do with them.

Years ago John W. designed and built a great little interface called the
"ADIOS', with several digital and analog I/O ports that it would
send/transmit over the RS-232 port; maybe someone would want to copy it
(with his permission of course).

m

On Tue, Feb 28, 2023 at 4:50 AM Daniel L  wrote:

> I dont but you may find it useful to watch Birt's latest video on youtube
> where he adds a rom to a multirom jobber on his 100 and that he will use it
> to collect weather data. Read the thread announcing the video about
> dial-a-rom. It's a fascinating new feature he highlighted and im interested
> in seeing the outcome.
>
> D
>
> On February 27, 2023 5:43:56 PM PST, Joseph Colson III <
> joecols...@outlook.com> wrote:
>>
>> I’m very interested in interfacing the Model 100 or Model 102 with
>> sensors, such as temp, wind and other that would be helpful.   Are there
>> any books that I can read that are somewhat specific to the Model T’s that
>> would help in the endeavor?
>>
>

Re: [M100] WEB8201.net now more "linkable"

[Mike Stein]

Sounds very useful; thanks for making the effort!

m

On Mon, Feb 27, 2023 at 8:27 PM Gary Weber  wrote:

> I've gone through the process of refactoring the way child pages on
> WEB8201 are rendered in an , and now child pages are sent as top
> level address-bar URLs instead of simply redirections within the frame
> itself.
>
> This has the effect of making the website's pages a *lot* more linkable
> from external sites.  You'll now be able to copy the address bar URL from
> pretty much any page you visit, and you'll be able to bookmark that page
> specifically or link it from your own website and resource without issues.
>
> This goes for really any page on the site, including the various sub-pages
> within the file download areas.
>
> Cheers,
> Gary Weber
>
> P.S.  Sorry this took so long.
>

Re: [M100] VIDEO - Dial-A-ROM for the Model T computers (and others)

[Mike Stein]

Jeff,

Is there a way to reserve a DaR or BP for whenever they become available
again?

Also if/when I order one of each will the shipping be combined?

TIA,

m

On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 8:32 AM  wrote:

> I’ll be doing a video on it eventually. It is quite a complex little
> beasty, need to take some time and really learn how to use it.
>
>
>
> Jeff Birt
>
>
>
> *From:* M100  *On Behalf Of *Daniel L
> *Sent:* Sunday, February 26, 2023 3:44 AM
> *To:* m100@lists.bitchin100.com
> *Subject:* Re: [M100] VIDEO - Dial-A-ROM for the Model T computers (and
> others)
>
>
>
> Good video Jeff. Anyone have a demo for that weather tracker? Looks DOPE
>
> On 2/25/23 07:31, bir...@soigeneris.com wrote:
>
> Morning all,
>
> I just made this video live this AM. The DARs for the Model T computers
> have sold out already but my friend is making more.
>
> In this video we take a look at the ‘Dial-A-ROM’ a spiffy new multi-ROM
> for vintage portable computers. It was designed by the same guy who did the
> Backpack drive. First, we’ll learn how to use the Dial-A-ROM with the ROM
> images that come preinstalled on it. Then we’ll see how to add our own ROM
> images if we so desire.
>
>
>
> *https://youtu.be/CejyLsI0HIw Jeff Birt (Hey
> Birt!)*
>
>
>

Re: [M100] VIDEO - Dial-A-ROM for the Model T computers (and others)

[Mike Stein]

Ah, got it; I was asking about switching it from the keyboard as the XR4
does, not a physical switch.

But if you're just talking about a small number of selections then tiny
diodes would probably work just as well and not require any power.

m

On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 9:52 AM Brian K. White  wrote:

> On 2/26/23 08:23, Stephen Adolph wrote:
> > Brian, If I understand your comment, I don't think you need an IC to do
> > rom selection. I think the DAR uses a rotary encoder.
>
> I understand that the dar uses a rotary encoder.
> The slide switch needs the extra glue.
>
> I was responding to Mike's question "how does the bank select work?"
> answer: gratuitous extra parts because I just wanted a slide switch.
>
>
> > When I first saw the DAR, I wondered about that. I'm pretty sure I found
> > the part at Digikey.  Very good!
> > Steve
> >
> > On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 3:51 AM Brian White  > <mailto:b.kenyo...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > Gratuitous use of another chip just for 2 OR gates to implement a
> > 4:2 encoder. It's all less efficient and less practical than the
> > dial-a-rom, in that the dar holds 16 roms and doesn't need another
> > ic, and the dar programming connection is even simpler and more
> robust.
> >
> > But it just amused me to have a direct selector without manually
> > binary encoding dip switches because why not? And I didn't want it
> > to require a tool to use either like a screwdriver. And of course I
> > always want an open source option, and I'm not up to the task of
> > coming up with an open source rex-alike but using a Lattice part and
> > the open source toolchain.
> >
> > It's unfortunate timing but I had already started this at least 3
> > years ago but just never finished it. A non-working version has been
> > sitting in that github since 2019. A few weeks ago I finally dusted
> > it off and corrected my bonehead pinout error, dialled-in the
> > programming connection so it works well (the holes are slightly
> > closer together than the pins, and the pattern and amount of offset
> > took some trial & error) and replaced dip switches with the slide
> > switch & or gates. I had no idea the dar was in the works. Not that
> > it would have stopped me, but I just mean to say this isn't a
> reaction.
> >
> > It's no competition anyway because only a very few people ever build
> > these diy-only things. I want them to exist so the option is there,
> > but almost no one actually employs it. So this is not touching
> > anyone's sales. Besides, *16* roms. And of course really it's even
> > sillier when rex exists which doesn't even need a programmer or
> > adapter to load it's, what, 30? slots? But for other platforms 4 is
> > plenty. There's only 2 roms total for the 600 for example. Still
> > leaves 2 free slots for hacking.
> >
> > I just added the browser-friendly render of the schematic to the
> > readme so you can see the bank-select.
> >
> > --
> > bkw
> >
> > On Sat, Feb 25, 2023, 8:18 PM Mike Stein  > <mailto:mhs.st...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > How do you select among the 4 images?
> >
> > On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 6:50 PM Brian K. White
> > mailto:b.kenyo...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > On 2/25/23 10:31, bir...@soigeneris.com
> > <mailto:bir...@soigeneris.com> wrote:
> >  > Morning all,
> >  >
> >  > I just made this video live this AM. The DARs for the
> > Model T computers
> >  > have sold out already but my friend is making more.
> >  >
> >  > In this video we take a look at the ‘Dial-A-ROM’ a spiffy
> > new multi-ROM
> >  > for vintage portable computers. It was designed by the
> > same guy who did
> >  > the Backpack drive. First, we’ll learn how to use the
> > Dial-A-ROM with
> >  > the ROM images that come preinstalled on it. Then we’ll
> > see how to add
> >  > our own ROM images if we so desire.
> >  >
> >  > *https://youtu.be/CejyLsI0HIw
> > <https://youtu.be/CejyLsI0HIw> <https://youtu.be/CejyLsI0HIw
> > <https://youtu.be/CejyLsI0HIw>>
> >  >
> >  > Jeff Birt (Hey Birt!)*
> >  >
> >
> > And for the diy-er, I finally vetted these last week:
> > https://github.com/bkw777/Teeprom/blob/master/4ROM.md
> > <https://github.com/bkw777/Teeprom/blob/master/4ROM.md>
> >
> > --
> > bkw
> >
>
> --
> bkw
>
>

Re: [M100] - Backpack

[Mike Stein]

You're right. They're produced in relatively small quantities and sell out
pretty quickly; guess we'll have to wait for Jeff to respond.

m

On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 11:57 AM ho collo  wrote:

> Thanks. I’ve tried both of those several times since I got my 100. Has
> been sold out since I’ve been looking.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 26, 2023, at 10:21, Mike Stein  wrote:
>
> 
> Sorry; I forgot that it's been upgraded; try this link:
> https://www.soigeneris.com/tandy-tpdd-2-backpack-drive-2
>
>
> On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 8:22 AM ho collo  wrote:
>
>> That page has always come back out of stock.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Feb 25, 2023, at 22:12, Mike Stein  wrote:
>>
>> 
>> https://www.soigeneris.com/vintage-computing?pagenumber=3
>>
>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 9:27 PM ho collo  wrote:
>>
>>> I have been searching for a source to actually purchase a backpack for a
>>> Model 100. Does anyone have a source where I can purchase a unit?
>>>
>>> Google has not been my friend.
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On Feb 25, 2023, at 20:21, Gary Weber  wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>> Hi George,
>>>
>>> Yes you can configure the way the date is represented by your backpack
>>> sending commands to it when it is in regular serial mode:
>>> It's on page 37 of the User Manual, and here's a summary:
>>>
>>> To switch between 24-hour and 12-hour time format:
>>> set time 24
>>> set time ampm
>>>
>>> To switch between date formats:
>>> set date mdy
>>> set date dmy
>>> set date ymd
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Gary
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 7:16 PM grima...@gmail.com 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Thank you!
>>>>
>>>> I typed it in from GitHub. what I found is my Backpack is setup to
>>>> reply with dd/mm/.
>>>>
>>>> However, Tandy BASIC appears to want the date in mm/dd/. The RTC.BA
>>>> program seems to assume the date will come back in the correct format.
>>>>
>>>> Does the Backpack have a way to configure the output format?
>>>>
>>>> In the meantime i altered the program and it works fine!
>>>>
>>>> Best,
>>>> George
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 8:30 PM  wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Yes, someone already wrote such a program and shared it. If you just
>>>>> got a Backpack Drive Plus it is already on the SD card. You can also
>>>>> download it from:
>>>>> https://github.com/Jeff-Birt/Backpack/tree/main/User_Programs
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> There is an MT version and NEC version. Note that while these have a
>>>>> .BA extension they are really text files, a.k.a. .DO files. It has been 
>>>>> the
>>>>> convention to give BASIC programs shared as text files the .BA extension
>>>>> but if you try to load such a file as is BASIC will try to parse it on the
>>>>> fly and it can’t do so fast enough. The file extension needs to be changed
>>>>> to .DO. Load it into RAM, go to BASIC and do: LOAD”FILE.DO”. After it 
>>>>> loads
>>>>> do: SAVE”FILE.BA” and it is now a tokenized BASIC file.
>>>>>
>>>>> I’ll get these renamed and include the tokenized version in the future
>>>>> to avoid such confusion.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Jeff Birt
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *From:* M100  *On Behalf Of *
>>>>> grima...@gmail.com
>>>>> *Sent:* Saturday, February 25, 2023 7:19 PM
>>>>> *To:* m...@bitchin100.com
>>>>> *Subject:* Re: [M100] - Backpack
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Random question - Does a BASIC program already exist to interface with
>>>>> the Backpack to set the clock?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I find myself having to Cold start the machine often, but this handy
>>>>> Backpack has a real time clock in it.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Would be great to run a quick program that interfaces with the
>>>>> Backpack over serial, issues the TIME, DATE and DAY commands, queries the
>>

Re: [M100] Possible BBS launch

[Mike Stein]

Most VoiP systems don't play very well with old tone-encoded protocols like
modems or FAX machines, but if you have a POTS line or can get it to work
with VoiP then most modems will let you dial out with either TT or pulse
and also answer incoming calls.

FWIW there are cell-phone to 'normal' phone adapters out there; e.g.::
https://www.cell2jack.com/
I've never tried any of mine and I'd be surprised if it worked any better
than 'normal' VoiP, but might be worth trying.

m

On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 8:40 AM grima...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> Hi Jesse,
>
> Do you happen to have any more details on your setup?
>
> I suppose in an ideal world, I’d like a setup that I can dial out from my
> rotary phone, and a second line that I could dial in to a modem.
>
> How difficult does that sound? I tried to use MagicJack previously but the
> compression codex they use doesn’t play well with data transfer.
>
> On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 8:11 AM Jesse Lafleur 
> wrote:
>
>> I can provide bell 103 compatible 100% online dial-in access to linux
>> servers/services using voip/asterisk/etc. I use my m100 to dial into my
>> local home pbx server, and ive even tried it over the web!
>>
>> On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 7:44 AM grima...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> What are the odds that any of these BBSes would allow dialing in from a
>>> real phone line?
>>>
>>> There is a Commodore 64 BBS out there called BorderlineBBS that has a
>>> hybrid Telnet/Dial-Up interface.
>>>
>>> I managed to use the acoustic couplers to dial in once from the Model T,
>>> but ever since switching to VOIP I wasn’t able to get it to work.
>>>
>>> I really always loved BBSing, so I would be in full support of using a
>>> Model T focused BBS.
>>>
>>> -George
>>>
>>> On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 7:30 AM Ben Strewens 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 On 2023-02-26 4:50 a.m., Daniel L wrote:

 I'm considering a specialized launch of a BBS catering to the modelT
 community. Any good boards out there already doing this that I can peruse?

 Daniel

 I'm currently working on one that will support multiple systems,
 including the model 100. I'm aiming for going all the way down to the Epson
 HX-20, but we'll see how that pans out. It won't be up and running for a
 while yet. We're supposed to get a new ISP here this year. The one who
 bought out the company I was with closed all my ports and had no clue how
 to re-open them, so my BBS got shut down. In the meantime, I figured I'd
 work on one that caters to the vintage computer community. I still have
 lots of work ahead of me.

>>>

Re: [M100] VIDEO - Dial-A-ROM for the Model T computers (and others)

[Mike Stein]

I don't quite follow the discussion either. I built some DaR equivalents
years ago for my AIM65s, using a tiny binary-encoded rotary switch like this
https://www.grayhill.com/documents/51BCD-Datasheet
mounted on the rear of the case, with a real knob; no other parts required.

Since those binary switches are normally a little expensive, I built
another one with a tiny diode board to encode a 'normal' rotary switch.

BTW, those surface mount switches as used in the DaR are available with
small knobs so you don't need a screwdriver, but I don't know whether that
would fit in the space.

Where is this 4 to 2 encoder IC that you mention required?

My question is how the XR4 selected one of four images; the extRAM just
uses the normal RAM/ROM switch at M5 but how does it (and maybe REX as
well) select one of several RAM areas? Is that what you (Brian) are talking
about?

m

On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 8:24 AM Stephen Adolph  wrote:

> Brian, If I understand your comment, I don't think you need an IC to do
> rom selection. I think the DAR uses a rotary encoder.
> When I first saw the DAR, I wondered about that. I'm pretty sure I found
> the part at Digikey.  Very good!
> Steve
>
> On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 3:51 AM Brian White  wrote:
>
>> Gratuitous use of another chip just for 2 OR gates to implement a 4:2
>> encoder. It's all less efficient and less practical than the dial-a-rom, in
>> that the dar holds 16 roms and doesn't need another ic, and the dar
>> programming connection is even simpler and more robust.
>>
>> But it just amused me to have a direct selector without manually binary
>> encoding dip switches because why not? And I didn't want it to require a
>> tool to use either like a screwdriver. And of course I always want an open
>> source option, and I'm not up to the task of coming up with an open source
>> rex-alike but using a Lattice part and the open source toolchain.
>>
>> It's unfortunate timing but I had already started this at least 3 years
>> ago but just never finished it. A non-working version has been sitting in
>> that github since 2019. A few weeks ago I finally dusted it off and
>> corrected my bonehead pinout error, dialled-in the programming connection
>> so it works well (the holes are slightly closer together than the pins, and
>> the pattern and amount of offset took some trial & error) and replaced dip
>> switches with the slide switch & or gates. I had no idea the dar was in the
>> works. Not that it would have stopped me, but I just mean to say this isn't
>> a reaction.
>>
>> It's no competition anyway because only a very few people ever build
>> these diy-only things. I want them to exist so the option is there, but
>> almost no one actually employs it. So this is not touching anyone's sales.
>> Besides, *16* roms. And of course really it's even sillier when rex exists
>> which doesn't even need a programmer or adapter to load it's, what, 30?
>> slots? But for other platforms 4 is plenty. There's only 2 roms total for
>> the 600 for example. Still leaves 2 free slots for hacking.
>>
>> I just added the browser-friendly render of the schematic to the readme
>> so you can see the bank-select.
>>
>> --
>> bkw
>>
>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023, 8:18 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>>
>>> How do you select among the 4 images?
>>>
>>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 6:50 PM Brian K. White 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2/25/23 10:31, bir...@soigeneris.com wrote:
>>>> > Morning all,
>>>> >
>>>> > I just made this video live this AM. The DARs for the Model T
>>>> computers
>>>> > have sold out already but my friend is making more.
>>>> >
>>>> > In this video we take a look at the ‘Dial-A-ROM’ a spiffy new
>>>> multi-ROM
>>>> > for vintage portable computers. It was designed by the same guy who
>>>> did
>>>> > the Backpack drive. First, we’ll learn how to use the Dial-A-ROM with
>>>> > the ROM images that come preinstalled on it. Then we’ll see how to
>>>> add
>>>> > our own ROM images if we so desire.
>>>> >
>>>> > *https://youtu.be/CejyLsI0HIw <https://youtu.be/CejyLsI0HIw>
>>>> >
>>>> > Jeff Birt (Hey Birt!)*
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> And for the diy-er, I finally vetted these last week:
>>>> https://github.com/bkw777/Teeprom/blob/master/4ROM.md
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> bkw
>>>>
>>>>

Re: [M100] - Backpack

[Mike Stein]

Sorry; I forgot that it's been upgraded; try this link:
https://www.soigeneris.com/tandy-tpdd-2-backpack-drive-2


On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 8:22 AM ho collo  wrote:

> That page has always come back out of stock.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 25, 2023, at 22:12, Mike Stein  wrote:
>
> 
> https://www.soigeneris.com/vintage-computing?pagenumber=3
>
> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 9:27 PM ho collo  wrote:
>
>> I have been searching for a source to actually purchase a backpack for a
>> Model 100. Does anyone have a source where I can purchase a unit?
>>
>> Google has not been my friend.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Feb 25, 2023, at 20:21, Gary Weber  wrote:
>>
>> 
>> Hi George,
>>
>> Yes you can configure the way the date is represented by your backpack
>> sending commands to it when it is in regular serial mode:
>> It's on page 37 of the User Manual, and here's a summary:
>>
>> To switch between 24-hour and 12-hour time format:
>> set time 24
>> set time ampm
>>
>> To switch between date formats:
>> set date mdy
>> set date dmy
>> set date ymd
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Gary
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 7:16 PM grima...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Thank you!
>>>
>>> I typed it in from GitHub. what I found is my Backpack is setup to reply
>>> with dd/mm/.
>>>
>>> However, Tandy BASIC appears to want the date in mm/dd/. The RTC.BA
>>> program seems to assume the date will come back in the correct format.
>>>
>>> Does the Backpack have a way to configure the output format?
>>>
>>> In the meantime i altered the program and it works fine!
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> George
>>>
>>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 8:30 PM  wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yes, someone already wrote such a program and shared it. If you just
>>>> got a Backpack Drive Plus it is already on the SD card. You can also
>>>> download it from:
>>>> https://github.com/Jeff-Birt/Backpack/tree/main/User_Programs
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> There is an MT version and NEC version. Note that while these have a
>>>> .BA extension they are really text files, a.k.a. .DO files. It has been the
>>>> convention to give BASIC programs shared as text files the .BA extension
>>>> but if you try to load such a file as is BASIC will try to parse it on the
>>>> fly and it can’t do so fast enough. The file extension needs to be changed
>>>> to .DO. Load it into RAM, go to BASIC and do: LOAD”FILE.DO”. After it loads
>>>> do: SAVE”FILE.BA” and it is now a tokenized BASIC file.
>>>>
>>>> I’ll get these renamed and include the tokenized version in the future
>>>> to avoid such confusion.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Jeff Birt
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *From:* M100  *On Behalf Of *
>>>> grima...@gmail.com
>>>> *Sent:* Saturday, February 25, 2023 7:19 PM
>>>> *To:* m...@bitchin100.com
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [M100] - Backpack
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Random question - Does a BASIC program already exist to interface with
>>>> the Backpack to set the clock?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I find myself having to Cold start the machine often, but this handy
>>>> Backpack has a real time clock in it.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Would be great to run a quick program that interfaces with the Backpack
>>>> over serial, issues the TIME, DATE and DAY commands, queries the current
>>>> system time and date, calculates the delta and then resets the system 
>>>> clock.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I started to write the program in BASIC, but I admit I don’t know much
>>>> about serial communication. I managed to open the COM buffer for output,
>>>> send the four CR to wake it. However, I then PRINT “TIME”+chr$(13) after
>>>> that, close the buffer, reopen it for input and then try to get the result.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> However I only end up with:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> C
>>>>
>>>> #
>>>>
>>>> T
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> As if the second PRINT never went through.
>>>>
>>

Re: [M100] - Backpack

[Mike Stein]

Yeah, the XR4 would certainly expand the options (pun intended) but I never
quite figured out how they selected among the images; I did work out
another solution and started building a 16MB RAM expansion but never
actually finished or tested any of it. Things like REX, the Backpack and
the Dial-a-ROM are a lot easier ;-)

The issue is that when TS-DOS is in (the single) ROM space it would get
clobbered by loading another ROM image there; I'll have to have another
look at it all, including the EME tools, to see how it might work. Am I
missing something?

BTW, I haven't used my REX in years; AFAIR it's the original version with
the System ROM replacement option and I guess there's not much support for
that these days?

m

On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 12:14 AM Stephen Adolph 
wrote:

> Mike, not sure I follow.
> You know you can have multiple ram spaces in option locations.  Like xr4.
> Could an xr4 do what you want?
>
> Xr4 was a tidy solution.  Needed a few wires to make it work.
>
> I guess I don't understand why tsdos is not compatible with option ram?
> Seems like it is, just like any other rom program?
>
>
>
> On Sunday, February 26, 2023, Mike Stein  wrote:
>
>> As you may remember, years ago I designed an adapter that let you put
>> both the system image and an option ROM image into a single chip that
>> replaced the System ROM, both the standard (new) or non-standard (old)
>> version; some folks on here may even still have one in their M100, probably
>> loaded with TS-DOS.
>>
>> In another M100 I replaced the option ROM with RAM and load/save/copy
>> etc. various ROM images using the EME extRAM tools, but of course I can't
>> have TS-DOS in the same memory area as the option ROMs.
>>
>> The Dial-a-ROM and REX are certainly excellent solutions, but I'd still
>> like to make the Option RAM concept compatible with TS-DOS, even if I have
>> to add or reuse a physical switch to select between RAM and ROM. Any other
>> ideas?
>>
>> m
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 11:26 PM John R. Hogerhuis 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023, 8:18 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yeah, I guess everybody has TS-DOS in ROM one way or another these
>>>> days; I've thought about putting it in the system ROM instead of the
>>>> Scheduler and Address Book, but removing them doesn't really free up much
>>>> space; maybe Teeny would fit...
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Scheduler and address book are a very simple "grep" type utility serving
>>> as a simple database. I feel they are too clever and minimalist a solution
>>> to remove :-) plus there are programs that let you use this search facility
>>> on any text file.
>>>
>>> -- John.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>

Re: [M100] - Backpack

[Mike Stein]

Hmm... She's incorporated Teeny, not TS-DOS but that's fine; removing modem
functionality also doesn't trouble me, but she also removed ADDRSS and
SCHEDL, as well as some print functions; those were probably the issues I
found with it when I first looked at it.

But a pretty impressive effort and worth a try for sure.

m

On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 12:06 AM Stephen Adolph 
wrote:

> Teeny integrated Main  rom has been done and shared.
>
> I think it was quite a good job and useful.
> http://sarahkmarr.com/retromodel100.html
>
>
>
>
> On Saturday, February 25, 2023, Mike Stein  wrote:
>
>> Point taken; I've never used them but I suppose others find them useful.
>> I don't think they'd free up much space anyway because ISTR that they use
>> TEXT for much of their functionality.
>>
>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 11:26 PM John R. Hogerhuis 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023, 8:18 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yeah, I guess everybody has TS-DOS in ROM one way or another these
>>>> days; I've thought about putting it in the system ROM instead of the
>>>> Scheduler and Address Book, but removing them doesn't really free up much
>>>> space; maybe Teeny would fit...
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Scheduler and address book are a very simple "grep" type utility serving
>>> as a simple database. I feel they are too clever and minimalist a solution
>>> to remove :-) plus there are programs that let you use this search facility
>>> on any text file.
>>>
>>> -- John.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>

Re: [M100] - Backpack

[Mike Stein]

Thank you!

Now that you mention it I'd seen that before, probably from a link that you
also supplied.

ISTR that I found a couple of minor issues with it, but it's time to read
that again and burn one.

Tnx again!


On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 12:06 AM Stephen Adolph 
wrote:

> Teeny integrated Main  rom has been done and shared.
>
> I think it was quite a good job and useful.
> http://sarahkmarr.com/retromodel100.html
>
>
>
>
> On Saturday, February 25, 2023, Mike Stein  wrote:
>
>> Point taken; I've never used them but I suppose others find them useful.
>> I don't think they'd free up much space anyway because ISTR that they use
>> TEXT for much of their functionality.
>>
>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 11:26 PM John R. Hogerhuis 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023, 8:18 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yeah, I guess everybody has TS-DOS in ROM one way or another these
>>>> days; I've thought about putting it in the system ROM instead of the
>>>> Scheduler and Address Book, but removing them doesn't really free up much
>>>> space; maybe Teeny would fit...
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Scheduler and address book are a very simple "grep" type utility serving
>>> as a simple database. I feel they are too clever and minimalist a solution
>>> to remove :-) plus there are programs that let you use this search facility
>>> on any text file.
>>>
>>> -- John.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>

Re: [M100] - Backpack

[Mike Stein]

As you may remember, years ago I designed an adapter that let you put both
the system image and an option ROM image into a single chip that replaced
the System ROM, both the standard (new) or non-standard (old) version; some
folks on here may even still have one in their M100, probably loaded with
TS-DOS.

In another M100 I replaced the option ROM with RAM and load/save/copy etc.
various ROM images using the EME extRAM tools, but of course I can't have
TS-DOS in the same memory area as the option ROMs.

The Dial-a-ROM and REX are certainly excellent solutions, but I'd still
like to make the Option RAM concept compatible with TS-DOS, even if I have
to add or reuse a physical switch to select between RAM and ROM. Any other
ideas?

m



On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 11:26 PM John R. Hogerhuis  wrote:

>
>
> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023, 8:18 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>
>> Yeah, I guess everybody has TS-DOS in ROM one way or another these days;
>> I've thought about putting it in the system ROM instead of the Scheduler
>> and Address Book, but removing them doesn't really free up much space;
>> maybe Teeny would fit...
>>
>>
> Scheduler and address book are a very simple "grep" type utility serving
> as a simple database. I feel they are too clever and minimalist a solution
> to remove :-) plus there are programs that let you use this search facility
> on any text file.
>
> -- John.
>
>>
>>

Re: [M100] - Backpack

[Mike Stein]

Point taken; I've never used them but I suppose others find them useful. I
don't think they'd free up much space anyway because ISTR that they use
TEXT for much of their functionality.

On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 11:26 PM John R. Hogerhuis  wrote:

>
>
> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023, 8:18 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>
>> Yeah, I guess everybody has TS-DOS in ROM one way or another these days;
>> I've thought about putting it in the system ROM instead of the Scheduler
>> and Address Book, but removing them doesn't really free up much space;
>> maybe Teeny would fit...
>>
>>
> Scheduler and address book are a very simple "grep" type utility serving
> as a simple database. I feel they are too clever and minimalist a solution
> to remove :-) plus there are programs that let you use this search facility
> on any text file.
>
> -- John.
>
>>
>>

Re: [M100] - Backpack

[Mike Stein]

Probably dates back to the days when files that you downloaded from
Compuserve or another user etc. had to all be plain text ASCII because
TELCOM can't handle binary files; I suppose everyone just knew that .DO
stood for documentation and .BA stood for plaintext BASIC programs that had
to be renamed before loading with BASIC or TEXT.

On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 8:41 PM John R. Hogerhuis  wrote:

> A side note but the reason files misnamed as BA cause a problem is that
> tsdos will load them into the BASIC program region verbatim and  treat the
> ASCII bytes as parts of binary formatted line numbers and tokens among
> other problems, ultimately causing a corrupted RAM file system.
>
> It was the convention on the old Club100 library  to name them this way
> but it's now a bad practice.
>
> -- John.
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023, 5:30 PM  wrote:
>
>> Yes, someone already wrote such a program and shared it. If you just got
>> a Backpack Drive Plus it is already on the SD card. You can also download
>> it from: https://github.com/Jeff-Birt/Backpack/tree/main/User_Programs
>>
>>
>>
>> There is an MT version and NEC version. Note that while these have a .BA
>> extension they are really text files, a.k.a. .DO files. It has been the
>> convention to give BASIC programs shared as text files the .BA extension
>> but if you try to load such a file as is BASIC will try to parse it on the
>> fly and it can’t do so fast enough. The file extension needs to be changed
>> to .DO. Load it into RAM, go to BASIC and do: LOAD”FILE.DO”. After it loads
>> do: SAVE”FILE.BA” and it is now a tokenized BASIC file.
>>
>> I’ll get these renamed and include the tokenized version in the future to
>> avoid such confusion.
>>
>>
>>
>> Jeff Birt
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* M100  *On Behalf Of *
>> grima...@gmail.com
>> *Sent:* Saturday, February 25, 2023 7:19 PM
>> *To:* m...@bitchin100.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [M100] - Backpack
>>
>>
>>
>> Random question - Does a BASIC program already exist to interface with
>> the Backpack to set the clock?
>>
>>
>>
>> I find myself having to Cold start the machine often, but this handy
>> Backpack has a real time clock in it.
>>
>>
>>
>> Would be great to run a quick program that interfaces with the Backpack
>> over serial, issues the TIME, DATE and DAY commands, queries the current
>> system time and date, calculates the delta and then resets the system clock.
>>
>>
>>
>> I started to write the program in BASIC, but I admit I don’t know much
>> about serial communication. I managed to open the COM buffer for output,
>> send the four CR to wake it. However, I then PRINT “TIME”+chr$(13) after
>> that, close the buffer, reopen it for input and then try to get the result.
>>
>>
>>
>> However I only end up with:
>>
>>
>>
>> C
>>
>> #
>>
>> T
>>
>>
>>
>> As if the second PRINT never went through.
>>
>>
>>
>> So rather than continue to rack my brain, I figured I’d ask if it already
>> exists.
>>
>>
>>
>> -George
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 17, 2023 at 4:44 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>>
>> It might not be that straightforward; the printer port is partially
>> shared with the keyboard.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 17, 2023 at 10:58 AM Alex ... 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Wire a R2R DAC to the printer port and have the M100 play music Covox
>> style. 
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 15, 2023, 14:21 Fisher  wrote:
>>
>> All it needs in its next version is an 8mm stereo jack, an mp3 player and
>> some jukebox software for the laptop!
>>
>> Too much to wish for? No matter, it’s already a great piece of kit. :-)
>>
>>
>>
>> Sean
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Feb 14, 2023, at 8:08 PM,  <
>> bir...@soigeneris.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> The Backpack was designed by a friend of mine who wishes to remain
>> private. He sent me one and I thought it was great and encouraged him to
>> make more offering my help. My only part of the design was the case.
>>
>>
>>
>> Jeff Birt
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* M100  *On Behalf Of *
>> grima...@gmail.com
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 14, 2023 1:15 PM
>> *To:* Model 100 Discussion 
>> *Subject:* [M100] - Backpack
>>
>>
>>
>> Just received my Backpack from Soigeneris. All I have to say, is that I
>> really like the design of it all. It’s relatively compact, it matches the
>> design of the M100, and it runs on a single AA cell.
>>
>>
>>
>> I immediately plugged it in, and got it to work. Pretty much zero
>> configuration needed. I’ve already got REX installed so I was able to load
>> up TS-DOS and be off to the races.
>>
>>
>>
>> Shout out to Soigeneris and to whomever designed and built this device!
>>
>>
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> George
>>
>>
>>
>>

Re: [M100] Windows "MVT100" terminal

[Mike Stein]

Great, thanks!

I think I have one of your terminals somewhere but I also have several of
Geoff's version from before you decided to make yours.

m

On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 9:22 PM Stephen Adolph  wrote:

>
>  Oh!  I see.  Yes the mvt100 fiemware is compatible with the original
> Geoff terminal hardware.
>
>
>
>>>>> On Saturday, February 25, 2023, Mike Stein 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> You may have misunderstood my poorly worded question: can I upgrade
>>>>> the firmware in Geoff's board with your VT100 version?
>>>>>
>>>>> m
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 7:08 PM Stephen Adolph 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> no, the Geoff board uses the Geoff firmware.
>>>>> Model 100 has some impossible-to-replicate escape codes that needs
>>>>> some firmware on the terminal end to deal with.
>>>>>
>>>>> So, it will sorta work but not entirely, without the firmware I think
>>>>> I have posted.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 6:57 PM Mike Stein 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> While on the topic, can I assume that your updated MVT100 firmware
>>>>> will work correctly in the original Geaoff Graham board?
>>>>>
>>>>> m
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 3:29 PM Stephen Adolph 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> http://club100.org/memfiles/index.php?direction===Steve%20Adolph/MVT100%20for%20PC;
>>>>>
>>>>> I decided to post my hacked MVT100 windows application, for feedback.
>>>>>
>>>>> It works with this driver:
>>>>> https://bitchin100.com/wiki/index.php?title=Integrated_VT100_driver
>>>>> or REX#/REXCPM R2.1 or newer.
>>>>>
>>>>> Why:
>>>>> Using a serial connection, this modified terminal application gives
>>>>> you an 80x24 display using your PC.
>>>>> Program is called VT52.exe, which is how it was named by the original
>>>>> author.
>>>>> Download and extract the executable from the link above, and configure
>>>>> the serial interface. Connect your M100/T102 with the VT100 driver
>>>>> installed, and connect to PC via serial cable.
>>>>>
>>>>> Status is "very beta". Feedback is appreciated.
>>>>>
>>>>> thx
>>>>> Steve
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>

Re: [M100] Burning a 27C256 EPROM

[Mike Stein]

Did you buy your programmer? Always useful to have, but if you're only
buying it to burn this ROM I'm sure there are folks on here that would burn
one and mail it to you, depending on where you live.

m


On Wed, Feb 15, 2023 at 4:47 PM Joseph Colson III 
wrote:

> While surfing the private files on the Club100 site the file below caught
> my eye as I have a booster pack and would like to update the System ROM.
> My question for the group is how much do the programmers cost?   What
> inexpensive programmer would you suggest?  Is it difficult to program?
> Any links to software or documentation would be helpful.
>
>
>
> As Always Thanks for your help,
>
>
>
> Joe
>
>
>
>
>
> (  BP1ROM_Fixed.bin  )
>
> This is the Booster Pak v1.23 "BP1" main system ROM image which includes
> the multi-page file display bug fix. With the original ROM, if you have
> more than two pages of files to display, you would only ever be able to see
> the second page of files when pressing shift-down. The third page of files
> or beyond was inaccessible due to a limitation in Traveling Software's TPDD
> client. Well, with this replacement BP1 system ROM image, the limitation is
> gone! The bug fix was originally made available in Ken Pettit's release of
> the TS-DOS 4.10 option ROM. This fix has been extended to all RAM versions
> of TS-DOS, as well as the SARDOS option ROM. And now, it is available for
> the "Disk" client that is in your Booster Pak's system ROM. Just burn this
> image to a standard 27C256 EPROM and replace your Booster Pak's "BP1" chip
> which would be all the way on the bottom-right side of your Booster Pak's
> sockets.
>

Re: [M100] - Backpack

[Mike Stein]

Yeah, I guess everybody has TS-DOS in ROM one way or another these days;
I've thought about putting it in the system ROM instead of the Scheduler
and Address Book, but removing them doesn't really free up much space;
maybe Teeny would fit...

On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 10:02 PM grima...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> Thanks Gary!
>
> Mike - I have TS-DOS in ROM thanks to REX. So after a cold start, I just
> need to activate TS-DOS, copy RTC from Backpack, and run it.
>
> Best,
> George
>
> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 9:21 PM Gary Weber  wrote:
>
>> Hi George,
>>
>> Yes you can configure the way the date is represented by your backpack
>> sending commands to it when it is in regular serial mode:
>> It's on page 37 of the User Manual, and here's a summary:
>>
>> To switch between 24-hour and 12-hour time format:
>> set time 24
>> set time ampm
>>
>> To switch between date formats:
>> set date mdy
>> set date dmy
>> set date ymd
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Gary
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 7:16 PM grima...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Thank you!
>>>
>>> I typed it in from GitHub. what I found is my Backpack is setup to reply
>>> with dd/mm/.
>>>
>>> However, Tandy BASIC appears to want the date in mm/dd/. The RTC.BA
>>> program seems to assume the date will come back in the correct format.
>>>
>>> Does the Backpack have a way to configure the output format?
>>>
>>> In the meantime i altered the program and it works fine!
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> George
>>>
>>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 8:30 PM  wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yes, someone already wrote such a program and shared it. If you just
>>>> got a Backpack Drive Plus it is already on the SD card. You can also
>>>> download it from:
>>>> https://github.com/Jeff-Birt/Backpack/tree/main/User_Programs
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> There is an MT version and NEC version. Note that while these have a
>>>> .BA extension they are really text files, a.k.a. .DO files. It has been the
>>>> convention to give BASIC programs shared as text files the .BA extension
>>>> but if you try to load such a file as is BASIC will try to parse it on the
>>>> fly and it can’t do so fast enough. The file extension needs to be changed
>>>> to .DO. Load it into RAM, go to BASIC and do: LOAD”FILE.DO”. After it loads
>>>> do: SAVE”FILE.BA” and it is now a tokenized BASIC file.
>>>>
>>>> I’ll get these renamed and include the tokenized version in the future
>>>> to avoid such confusion.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Jeff Birt
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *From:* M100  *On Behalf Of *
>>>> grima...@gmail.com
>>>> *Sent:* Saturday, February 25, 2023 7:19 PM
>>>> *To:* m...@bitchin100.com
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [M100] - Backpack
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Random question - Does a BASIC program already exist to interface with
>>>> the Backpack to set the clock?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I find myself having to Cold start the machine often, but this handy
>>>> Backpack has a real time clock in it.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Would be great to run a quick program that interfaces with the Backpack
>>>> over serial, issues the TIME, DATE and DAY commands, queries the current
>>>> system time and date, calculates the delta and then resets the system 
>>>> clock.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I started to write the program in BASIC, but I admit I don’t know much
>>>> about serial communication. I managed to open the COM buffer for output,
>>>> send the four CR to wake it. However, I then PRINT “TIME”+chr$(13) after
>>>> that, close the buffer, reopen it for input and then try to get the result.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> However I only end up with:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> C
>>>>
>>>> #
>>>>
>>>> T
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> As if the second PRINT never went through.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> So rather than continue to rack my brain, I figured I’d ask if it
>>>> already exists.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>

Re: [M100] - Backpack

[Mike Stein]

https://www.soigeneris.com/vintage-computing?pagenumber=3

On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 9:27 PM ho collo  wrote:

> I have been searching for a source to actually purchase a backpack for a
> Model 100. Does anyone have a source where I can purchase a unit?
>
> Google has not been my friend.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 25, 2023, at 20:21, Gary Weber  wrote:
>
> 
> Hi George,
>
> Yes you can configure the way the date is represented by your backpack
> sending commands to it when it is in regular serial mode:
> It's on page 37 of the User Manual, and here's a summary:
>
> To switch between 24-hour and 12-hour time format:
> set time 24
> set time ampm
>
> To switch between date formats:
> set date mdy
> set date dmy
> set date ymd
>
> Cheers,
> Gary
>
>
> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 7:16 PM grima...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> Thank you!
>>
>> I typed it in from GitHub. what I found is my Backpack is setup to reply
>> with dd/mm/.
>>
>> However, Tandy BASIC appears to want the date in mm/dd/. The RTC.BA
>> program seems to assume the date will come back in the correct format.
>>
>> Does the Backpack have a way to configure the output format?
>>
>> In the meantime i altered the program and it works fine!
>>
>> Best,
>> George
>>
>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 8:30 PM  wrote:
>>
>>> Yes, someone already wrote such a program and shared it. If you just got
>>> a Backpack Drive Plus it is already on the SD card. You can also download
>>> it from: https://github.com/Jeff-Birt/Backpack/tree/main/User_Programs
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> There is an MT version and NEC version. Note that while these have a .BA
>>> extension they are really text files, a.k.a. .DO files. It has been the
>>> convention to give BASIC programs shared as text files the .BA extension
>>> but if you try to load such a file as is BASIC will try to parse it on the
>>> fly and it can’t do so fast enough. The file extension needs to be changed
>>> to .DO. Load it into RAM, go to BASIC and do: LOAD”FILE.DO”. After it loads
>>> do: SAVE”FILE.BA” and it is now a tokenized BASIC file.
>>>
>>> I’ll get these renamed and include the tokenized version in the future
>>> to avoid such confusion.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Jeff Birt
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* M100  *On Behalf Of *
>>> grima...@gmail.com
>>> *Sent:* Saturday, February 25, 2023 7:19 PM
>>> *To:* m...@bitchin100.com
>>> *Subject:* Re: [M100] - Backpack
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Random question - Does a BASIC program already exist to interface with
>>> the Backpack to set the clock?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I find myself having to Cold start the machine often, but this handy
>>> Backpack has a real time clock in it.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Would be great to run a quick program that interfaces with the Backpack
>>> over serial, issues the TIME, DATE and DAY commands, queries the current
>>> system time and date, calculates the delta and then resets the system clock.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I started to write the program in BASIC, but I admit I don’t know much
>>> about serial communication. I managed to open the COM buffer for output,
>>> send the four CR to wake it. However, I then PRINT “TIME”+chr$(13) after
>>> that, close the buffer, reopen it for input and then try to get the result.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> However I only end up with:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> C
>>>
>>> #
>>>
>>> T
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> As if the second PRINT never went through.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> So rather than continue to rack my brain, I figured I’d ask if it
>>> already exists.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -George
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 17, 2023 at 4:44 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>>>
>>> It might not be that straightforward; the printer port is partially
>>> shared with the keyboard.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 17, 2023 at 10:58 AM Alex ... 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Wire a R2R DAC to the printer port and have the M100 play music Covox
>>> style. 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Feb 15, 2023, 14:21 Fisher  wrote:
>>>
>>> All it needs in its next version is an 8mm stereo jack, an 

Re: [M100] - Backpack

[Mike Stein]

If you just cold started, wouldn't that erase the program?

m

On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 8:20 PM grima...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> Random question - Does a BASIC program already exist to interface with the
> Backpack to set the clock?
>
> I find myself having to Cold start the machine often, but this handy
> Backpack has a real time clock in it.
>
> Would be great to run a quick program that interfaces with the Backpack
> over serial, issues the TIME, DATE and DAY commands, queries the current
> system time and date, calculates the delta and then resets the system clock.
>
> I started to write the program in BASIC, but I admit I don’t know much
> about serial communication. I managed to open the COM buffer for output,
> send the four CR to wake it. However, I then PRINT “TIME”+chr$(13) after
> that, close the buffer, reopen it for input and then try to get the result.
>
> However I only end up with:
>
> C
> #
> T
>
> As if the second PRINT never went through.
>
> So rather than continue to rack my brain, I figured I’d ask if it already
> exists.
>
> -George
>
> On Fri, Feb 17, 2023 at 4:44 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>
>> It might not be that straightforward; the printer port is partially
>> shared with the keyboard.
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 17, 2023 at 10:58 AM Alex ... 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Wire a R2R DAC to the printer port and have the M100 play music Covox
>>> style. 
>>>
>>> On Wed, Feb 15, 2023, 14:21 Fisher  wrote:
>>>
>>>> All it needs in its next version is an 8mm stereo jack, an mp3 player
>>>> and some jukebox software for the laptop!
>>>> Too much to wish for? No matter, it’s already a great piece of kit. :-)
>>>>
>>>> Sean
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Feb 14, 2023, at 8:08 PM,  <
>>>> bir...@soigeneris.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> The Backpack was designed by a friend of mine who wishes to remain
>>>> private. He sent me one and I thought it was great and encouraged him to
>>>> make more offering my help. My only part of the design was the case.
>>>>
>>>> Jeff Birt
>>>>
>>>> *From:* M100  *On Behalf Of *
>>>> grima...@gmail.com
>>>> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 14, 2023 1:15 PM
>>>> *To:* Model 100 Discussion 
>>>> *Subject:* [M100] - Backpack
>>>>
>>>> Just received my Backpack from Soigeneris. All I have to say, is that I
>>>> really like the design of it all. It’s relatively compact, it matches the
>>>> design of the M100, and it runs on a single AA cell.
>>>>
>>>> I immediately plugged it in, and got it to work. Pretty much zero
>>>> configuration needed. I’ve already got REX installed so I was able to load
>>>> up TS-DOS and be off to the races.
>>>>
>>>> Shout out to Soigeneris and to whomever designed and built this device!
>>>>
>>>> Best,
>>>> George
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>

Re: [M100] VIDEO - Dial-A-ROM for the Model T computers (and others)

[Mike Stein]

How do you select among the 4 images?

On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 6:50 PM Brian K. White  wrote:

> On 2/25/23 10:31, bir...@soigeneris.com wrote:
> > Morning all,
> >
> > I just made this video live this AM. The DARs for the Model T computers
> > have sold out already but my friend is making more.
> >
> > In this video we take a look at the ‘Dial-A-ROM’ a spiffy new multi-ROM
> > for vintage portable computers. It was designed by the same guy who did
> > the Backpack drive. First, we’ll learn how to use the Dial-A-ROM with
> > the ROM images that come preinstalled on it. Then we’ll see how to add
> > our own ROM images if we so desire.
> >
> > *https://youtu.be/CejyLsI0HIw 
> >
> > Jeff Birt (Hey Birt!)*
> >
>
> And for the diy-er, I finally vetted these last week:
> https://github.com/bkw777/Teeprom/blob/master/4ROM.md
>
> --
> bkw
>
>

Re: [M100] Windows "MVT100" terminal

[Mike Stein]

You may have misunderstood my poorly worded question: can I upgrade the
firmware in Geoff's board with your VT100 version?

m

On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 7:08 PM Stephen Adolph  wrote:

> no, the Geoff board uses the Geoff firmware.
> Model 100 has some impossible-to-replicate escape codes that needs some
> firmware on the terminal end to deal with.
>
> So, it will sorta work but not entirely, without the firmware I think I
> have posted.
>
>
> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 6:57 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>
>> While on the topic, can I assume that your updated MVT100 firmware will
>> work correctly in the original Geaoff Graham board?
>>
>> m
>>
>> On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 3:29 PM Stephen Adolph 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> http://club100.org/memfiles/index.php?direction===Steve%20Adolph/MVT100%20for%20PC;
>>>
>>> I decided to post my hacked MVT100 windows application, for feedback.
>>>
>>> It works with this driver:
>>> https://bitchin100.com/wiki/index.php?title=Integrated_VT100_driver
>>> or REX#/REXCPM R2.1 or newer.
>>>
>>> Why:
>>> Using a serial connection, this modified terminal application gives you
>>> an 80x24 display using your PC.
>>> Program is called VT52.exe, which is how it was named by the original
>>> author.
>>> Download and extract the executable from the link above, and configure
>>> the serial interface.  Connect your M100/T102 with the VT100 driver
>>> installed, and connect to PC via serial cable.
>>>
>>> Status is "very beta".  Feedback is appreciated.
>>>
>>> thx
>>> Steve
>>>
>>>

Re: [M100] Windows "MVT100" terminal

[Mike Stein]

While on the topic, can I assume that your updated MVT100 firmware will
work correctly in the original Geaoff Graham board?

m

On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 3:29 PM Stephen Adolph  wrote:

>
>
> http://club100.org/memfiles/index.php?direction===Steve%20Adolph/MVT100%20for%20PC;
>
> I decided to post my hacked MVT100 windows application, for feedback.
>
> It works with this driver:
> https://bitchin100.com/wiki/index.php?title=Integrated_VT100_driver
> or REX#/REXCPM R2.1 or newer.
>
> Why:
> Using a serial connection, this modified terminal application gives you an
> 80x24 display using your PC.
> Program is called VT52.exe, which is how it was named by the original
> author.
> Download and extract the executable from the link above, and configure the
> serial interface.  Connect your M100/T102 with the VT100 driver installed,
> and connect to PC via serial cable.
>
> Status is "very beta".  Feedback is appreciated.
>
> thx
> Steve
>
>

Re: [M100] C# terminal slooowwww

[Mike Stein]

MS-DOS Forever!!!

On Fri, Feb 24, 2023 at 2:34 PM Kenneth Pettit  wrote:

> Hey Steve,
>
> I think the operative words in your email contributing to slowness are
> "windows machine"  (tee hee hee).  But seriously ... Windows? Do people
> still use Windows in 2023?  (Sorry, just can't help myself).
>
> Ken
>
> On 2/24/23 11:15 AM, Stephen Adolph wrote:
> > Question for the crowd.
> >
> > I've got the mvt100 terminal in C# running well.  It is compiled in
> > Visual Studio.
> >
> > When I run in full screen mode, the cpu utikixlxation jumps to 50% and
> > the response of the terminal is visibly slow.
> >
> > I get that the screen updates take time, but really?  My windows
> > machine is less responsive than the little Pic based Geoff terminal.
> >
> > Is thisn indicative of bad code?
>
>

Re: [M100] M100 LCD repair video and alternative use for unused screen RAM

[Mike Stein]

Well, you don't need it on a T200 ;-)

The challenge was putting a 9x9 grid on an 8-line screen

BTW, he's also the guy who did most of the firmware for the CP/M port.



On Fri, Feb 24, 2023 at 2:41 AM B 9  wrote:

> On Sun, Feb 19, 2023 at 4:06 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>
>> You might also get inspired by Philip Avery's Sudoku program in his
>> Club100 upload folder.
>>
>
> Unfortunately, it doesn't work at all on my Tandy 200. (I tried both
> version 3.1 and 4.1).
>
> Maybe he'll publish the source...
>>
>
> That'd be nice. Is he still around? It looks like he has a few nifty
> utilities (like the HW scrolling demo) which are worth archiving somewhere,
> if he's willing to release the source.
>
> —b9
>

Re: [M100] T102 Nite Lite

[Mike Stein]

Nice!!

On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 5:38 PM Peter Noeth  wrote:

> I recently finished my T102 "Nite Lite" v2 and am attaching pictures,
> which I hope make it through to the list.
>
> I originally attached a "gooseneck" type book light I got from Barnes &
> Noble to an empty DB-25 connector and shell years ago by taking the "spring
> clamp / battery holder" off the light and placing the batteries inside the
> DB-25 shell. After responding to SteveA's recent query about a reading
> light solution, I decided to make a more refined solution that is powered
> by the computer itself.
>
> I decided to keep using the RS-232 port for connection as my gooseneck is
> somewhat too short to use the Barcode Port. The light would not reach to
> the midpoint of the display for an even illumination.
>
> I jumpered +5v from the power supply to unused pin 14 (secondary Tx, an
> output signal) on the RS-232 connector and take ground thru pin 7. The
> light draws ~25mA as opposed to its normal ~33mA from a +6v battery (2 2032
> coin cells in series). It lights up the display and keyboard nicely, but is
> not *really* bright.  I guess these book lights are not supposed to be
> real bright when used in a pitch dark room so as not to blind the reader.
>
> Haven't used it enough to know how much it would shorten the normal 20
> hour AA battery life, but since I usually use an external 6v lantern
> battery, it probably won't make much difference to my "use model" anyway.
>
> Regards,
>
> PeterN
>

Re: [M100] Printer port clamp

[Mike Stein]

I think he's looking for the other end, like eBay item  181408861399 for
example

m


On Sun, Feb 19, 2023 at 7:40 PM Kenneth Pettit  wrote:

> Yep, it is a 36-pin centronics connector:
>
>
> https://www.amazon.com/uxcell-Centronics-Connector-Printer-Adapter/dp/B00X7BP2B6
>
> Ken
>
> On 2/19/23 3:41 PM, Wayne Lorentz wrote:
> > I was in the book store yesterday and picked up one of those little
> battery-powered lights that clip onto a book.  Not the ones with the giant,
> scary clamps, but one with a smaller, dainty clip.
> >
> > I thought I might have it do double-duty illuminating an M100 screen
> from above, but there doesn't appear to be anything suitable on an M100 to
> clip it onto.  Then I thought, maybe I can plug something inert into the
> printer port, like a very short, unpopulated circuit board. (The serial
> port is occupied already.)
> >
> > Can anyone tell me what the connector for the printer port is called?  I
> assume that once identified, I can buy it online, since I'm a long way from
> the (last?) Radio Shack in Wisconsin Dells.
>
>

Re: [M100] M100 LCD repair video and alternative use for unused screen RAM

[Mike Stein]

You might also get inspired by Philip Avery's Sudoku program in his Club100
upload folder.

Maybe he'll publish the source...

m

On Sun, Feb 19, 2023 at 10:16 AM Joshua O'Keefe 
wrote:

> > On Feb 19, 2023, at 6:58 AM, B 9  wrote:
> >
> > TextSweeper could benefit from more rows, which ROM-View 80 doesn't do.
> Does anyone know if there is a ROM to do that?
>
> Ultrascreen100 can do this.  I found my copy in Gary Weber's member upload
> area.  At 10 lines the font is not beautiful for text, but for a game or a
> program without close reading on the part of the user it might work out
> pretty nicely.

Re: [M100] - Backpack

[Mike Stein]

It might not be that straightforward; the printer port is partially shared
with the keyboard.

On Fri, Feb 17, 2023 at 10:58 AM Alex ...  wrote:

> Wire a R2R DAC to the printer port and have the M100 play music Covox
> style. 
>
> On Wed, Feb 15, 2023, 14:21 Fisher  wrote:
>
>> All it needs in its next version is an 8mm stereo jack, an mp3 player and
>> some jukebox software for the laptop!
>> Too much to wish for? No matter, it’s already a great piece of kit. :-)
>>
>> Sean
>>
>>
>> On Feb 14, 2023, at 8:08 PM,  <
>> bir...@soigeneris.com> wrote:
>>
>> The Backpack was designed by a friend of mine who wishes to remain
>> private. He sent me one and I thought it was great and encouraged him to
>> make more offering my help. My only part of the design was the case.
>>
>> Jeff Birt
>>
>> *From:* M100  *On Behalf Of *
>> grima...@gmail.com
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 14, 2023 1:15 PM
>> *To:* Model 100 Discussion 
>> *Subject:* [M100] - Backpack
>>
>> Just received my Backpack from Soigeneris. All I have to say, is that I
>> really like the design of it all. It’s relatively compact, it matches the
>> design of the M100, and it runs on a single AA cell.
>>
>> I immediately plugged it in, and got it to work. Pretty much zero
>> configuration needed. I’ve already got REX installed so I was able to load
>> up TS-DOS and be off to the races.
>>
>> Shout out to Soigeneris and to whomever designed and built this device!
>>
>> Best,
>> George
>>
>>
>>

Re: [M100] Some M100 SIG files

[Mike Stein]

Good guess; as a matter of fact there are other files with an extension
made up of the contributor's initials and a digit.

On Fri, Feb 17, 2023 at 3:20 PM Brian K. White  wrote:

> On 2/17/23 13:51, Gary Weber wrote:
> > Hi Mike,
> >
> > I'm not sure what those extensions represent either,
>
> .pw1 is probably for Phil Wheeler
>
> and .des is probably description based on the contents
>
> IE, not intended to indicate file types
> There's a fair amount of that scattered through the m100sig
>
> --
> bkw
>
>

Re: [M100] Some M100 SIG files

[Mike Stein]

How did I not know about this...

Thanks, Brian!

On Fri, Feb 17, 2023 at 3:19 PM Brian K. White  wrote:

>
>
> https://github.com/LivingM100SIG/Living_M100SIG/blob/main/M100SIG/Lib-07-UTILITIES/LFUTL.INF
>
>
> https://github.com/LivingM100SIG/Living_M100SIG/blob/main/M100SIG/Lib-07-UTILITIES/LF.CMD
>
>
> https://github.com/LivingM100SIG/Living_M100SIG/blob/main/M100SIG/Lib-07-UTILITIES/LFUTL.PW1
>
>
> https://github.com/LivingM100SIG/Living_M100SIG/blob/main/M100SIG/Lib-07-UTILITIES/LFUTL.DES
>
>
> On 2/17/23 13:30, Mike Stein wrote:
> > Hi Gary,
> >
> > I'm trying to download a couple of files from the M100 SIG repository
> > but it looks like it won't allow downloading any files with a
> > non-standard extension and I don't quite understand the explanation and
> > instructions I get instead.
> >
> > Can you help?
> >
> > The files are in LIB07:
> > LFUTIL.PW1
> > LFUTIL.DES
> >
> > What are those extensions anyway?
> >
> > TIA,
> >
> > m
>
> --
> bkw
>
>

Re: [M100] Some M100 SIG files

[Mike Stein]

Thanks very much!!!

m

On Fri, Feb 17, 2023 at 1:51 PM Gary Weber  wrote:

> Hi Mike,
>
> I'm not sure what those extensions represent either, but I can say that I
> definitely missed adding them to the approved "MIME" types list on the
> website back-end, thus preventing download in this case.   Ugh!  Sorry
> about that.
>
> I'll go through the entire library with a script that will spit out all
> file extensions that I can use to compare against the MIME type
> configuration as it stands now so I can add the missing ones.
>
> Gary
>
> On Fri, Feb 17, 2023 at 11:30 AM Mike Stein  wrote:
>
>> Hi Gary,
>>
>> I'm trying to download a couple of files from the M100 SIG repository but
>> it looks like it won't allow downloading any files with a non-standard
>> extension and I don't quite understand the explanation and instructions I
>> get instead.
>>
>> Can you help?
>>
>> The files are in LIB07:
>> LFUTIL.PW1
>> LFUTIL.DES
>>
>> What are those extensions anyway?
>>
>> TIA,
>>
>> m
>>
>

[M100] Some M100 SIG files

[Mike Stein]

Hi Gary,

I'm trying to download a couple of files from the M100 SIG repository but
it looks like it won't allow downloading any files with a non-standard
extension and I don't quite understand the explanation and instructions I
get instead.

Can you help?

The files are in LIB07:
LFUTIL.PW1
LFUTIL.DES

What are those extensions anyway?

TIA,

m

Re: [M100] One Tiny Battery Pack (Cryptronics, RAM+ expansion)

[Mike Stein]

Yes, please.

TIA

On Fri, Feb 17, 2023 at 12:27 AM Brian K. White 
wrote:

> OK so Sean got his own, so, Mike & Gary?
>
> I'll throw in some jst connectors so if you want you can take a stab at
> making the pack disconnectable too for storage and for future
> replacement without any more soldering. I thought it might be good to be
> able to store the thing with the battery disconnected while the bus pins
> are buried in conductive antistatic foam. Plus just future owners won't
> have to keep resoldering the pcb for future batter changes.
>
> I don't know if it will really fit, and I didn't think of it until I
> already soldered mine. But I have a bunch of these connectors and I
> tried a dummy test fit just sticking the empty connector housings in a
> cavity next to the molex socket and then putting the ram board back, and
> it looks like it should actually fit with the wires in theory.
>
> Here is the empty connector housings (red thing), both male & female
> connected the way they would be. It's hard to see from stright above
> like this but the depth is low enough that the pcb does install and lay
> right over top of the connectors. It looks like there is just room for
> the wires to snake out & back.
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/gVjRYPRcKmriWn29A
>
>
> I was surprised that definitely the battery is needed for more than just
> holding the ram contents alive during standby. When I tried running with
> the unit installed with no battery connected (no dead battery pulling
> the rails down), even with the pcb fully cleaned in my ultrasonic and
> dried, it *barely* worked. It usually crashed the machine any time I
> tried to run the Bank# menu enries. The relay would click and the screen
> would die and that's it, have to cold reset to get a menu again.
>
> And since installing the new pack, it seems to work perfect with no
> relay clicks and no main menu crashes or even appearing to be trying
> hard or anything.
>
> --
> bkw
>
>
> On 2/16/23 23:45, Mike Stein wrote:
> > Yeah, I'm sure surprised by how many of us have come out of the woodwork
> ;-)
> >
> > m
> >
> > On Thu, Feb 16, 2023 at 11:01 PM Sean O’Brien  > <mailto:nolan...@fisher25.ca>> wrote:
> >
> > Thanks Gary! But no, I’ll soon have a surplus of them. So if you or
> > anyone else needs one…  just ask.  :D  (Seems like there are more of
> > these expansion banks still out there than I’d have thought. )
> >
> > Sean
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> >  > On Feb 16, 2023, at 11:27 PM, Gary Weber  > <mailto:g...@web8201.com>> wrote:
> >  >
> >  > But you need it, don't you Sean?
> >  > I just visited the eBay link and they're still selling them; I
> > have no problem ordering one there.
> >  >
> >
>
> --
> bkw
>
>

Re: [M100] One Tiny Battery Pack (Cryptronics, RAM+ expansion)

[Mike Stein]

Yeah, I'm sure surprised by how many of us have come out of the woodwork ;-)

m

On Thu, Feb 16, 2023 at 11:01 PM Sean O’Brien  wrote:

> Thanks Gary! But no, I’ll soon have a surplus of them. So if you or anyone
> else needs one…  just ask.  :D  (Seems like there are more of these
> expansion banks still out there than I’d have thought. )
>
> Sean
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Feb 16, 2023, at 11:27 PM, Gary Weber  wrote:
> >
> > But you need it, don't you Sean?
> > I just visited the eBay link and they're still selling them; I have no
> problem ordering one there.
> >
>

Re: [M100] One Tiny Battery Pack (Cryptronics, RAM+ expansion)

[Mike Stein]

If we're speaking, I could use one ...



On Wed, Feb 15, 2023 at 8:53 PM Brian K. White  wrote:

> On 2/10/23 10:13, Brian K. White wrote:
> > Oh you sure don't want to solder to the cells.
> > I did not mean to suggest buying individual cells, just to identify
> > them for reference for searching for packs made with them.
> >
> > Battery packs are often named after the cells.
> > The memory battery inside the 100 is called "3/V80H 2-pin" because
> > it's made of 3 V80H cells, etc.
> >
>
> The new batteries worked perfect.
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/68qSfxdPD9WwdhzHA
>
> The only thing is it is a tight fit between the rom socket and the edge
> of the cryptonics board, and I think that tightness pushing sideways on
> the edge of the board maybe caused some of the bus pins to not make good
> connection and made the machine crash and no boot after reset. Fiddling
> with the cell pack a little flipping it over different directions I
> found an orientation that felt slightly better and now it's running
> again. Or maybe that was just alcohol not fully dried yet trapped under
> chips. I think maybe the trick is lay the battery in position first and
> then the pcb.
>
> The tight fit is the same as the original pack anyway.
>
> The lead wires fish right in between the female bus sockets like the
> original wires. I fished them in end-wise, not mashed from the top, and
> they fit with no resistance, no mashing of the insulation at all.
>
> If you look at the pics here, before soldering, I flush-cut 4 of the
> pins that poke up right under the red & black wires, and then touched
> them with flux and fresh solder so they made smooth domes so they don't
> pierce the battery wires. I did that before installing the new battery.
>
> The old battery wire was stuck by super glue, so it took a little care
> to scrape up most of the insulation and super glue without scratching
> any traces on the pcb.
>
>
> If you want you can have one of the 2 extra packs I got.
>
> --
> bkw
>

Re: [M100] M100 Audio / music

[Mike Stein]

Convenience; how many people would have dug out a special cable (if they
had one) and speakers to listen to Ken's Xmas card...

m


On Fri, Dec 30, 2022 at 8:21 PM Gregory McGill 
wrote:

> I realize that, but since it sounds like a very small potato why not
> hook up speakers to the cass out like my model 3/4 does
>
> On Fri, Dec 30, 2022 at 4:04 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>
>> I think we're trying to use the internal beeper like the PC, PET etc. do
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 30, 2022 at 6:23 PM Gregory McGill 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Why don't you play it out the cassette port like the other trash80s do?
>>>
>>> On Thu, Dec 29, 2022, 7:57 PM Ken Pettit  wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 12/29/22 6:46 PM, MikeS wrote:
>>>> > There's quite a bit of 1-bit music out there for the PC, PET and
>>>> other systems that only had a speaker, some of it remarkably good; should
>>>> be possible to use similar techniques and even the same sound files on the
>>>> M100.
>>>>
>>>> I actually tried playing a 1-bit audio file (that I recorded) last
>>>> night
>>>> on the M100 using a small ML routine I wrote.  I could tell it was a
>>>> person talking, but couldn't make out any of the words.  I think the
>>>> piezoelectric device the M100 uses as a "speaker" just doesn't cut it.
>>>> At least I believe that is the problem.
>>>>
>>>> Ken
>>>>
>>>> > Re MIDI: there was a project years ago to use an M100 as a MIDI
>>>> sequencer; IIRC the baud rate was 'close enough'. I cobbled together an
>>>> interface for a proof-of-concept and it seemed to work OK; never went
>>>> beyond that though ;-(
>>>>
>>>> Yeah, I was kinda wondering / thinking 1.7% error might be close
>>>> enough,
>>>> but not having any MIDI devices, I have no way to test it.
>>>>
>>>> Ken
>>>>
>>>>

Re: [M100] M100 Audio / music

[Mike Stein]

Ah, I see what you mean; no, one-bit sound on one hand and 'normal' UART
MIDI on the other - no bit-banging.

On Fri, Dec 30, 2022 at 7:50 PM John R. Hogerhuis  wrote:

> Are you talking about sound or bit banging MIDI protocol?
>
> -- John.
>
> On Fri, Dec 30, 2022, 3:23 PM Gregory McGill 
> wrote:
>
>> Why don't you play it out the cassette port like the other trash80s do?
>>
>> On Thu, Dec 29, 2022, 7:57 PM Ken Pettit  wrote:
>>
>>> On 12/29/22 6:46 PM, MikeS wrote:
>>> > There's quite a bit of 1-bit music out there for the PC, PET and other
>>> systems that only had a speaker, some of it remarkably good; should be
>>> possible to use similar techniques and even the same sound files on the
>>> M100.
>>>
>>> I actually tried playing a 1-bit audio file (that I recorded) last night
>>> on the M100 using a small ML routine I wrote.  I could tell it was a
>>> person talking, but couldn't make out any of the words.  I think the
>>> piezoelectric device the M100 uses as a "speaker" just doesn't cut it.
>>> At least I believe that is the problem.
>>>
>>> Ken
>>>
>>> > Re MIDI: there was a project years ago to use an M100 as a MIDI
>>> sequencer; IIRC the baud rate was 'close enough'. I cobbled together an
>>> interface for a proof-of-concept and it seemed to work OK; never went
>>> beyond that though ;-(
>>>
>>> Yeah, I was kinda wondering / thinking 1.7% error might be close enough,
>>> but not having any MIDI devices, I have no way to test it.
>>>
>>> Ken
>>>
>>>

Re: [M100] M100 Audio / music

[Mike Stein]

I think we're trying to use the internal beeper like the PC, PET etc. do



On Fri, Dec 30, 2022 at 6:23 PM Gregory McGill 
wrote:

> Why don't you play it out the cassette port like the other trash80s do?
>
> On Thu, Dec 29, 2022, 7:57 PM Ken Pettit  wrote:
>
>> On 12/29/22 6:46 PM, MikeS wrote:
>> > There's quite a bit of 1-bit music out there for the PC, PET and other
>> systems that only had a speaker, some of it remarkably good; should be
>> possible to use similar techniques and even the same sound files on the
>> M100.
>>
>> I actually tried playing a 1-bit audio file (that I recorded) last night
>> on the M100 using a small ML routine I wrote.  I could tell it was a
>> person talking, but couldn't make out any of the words.  I think the
>> piezoelectric device the M100 uses as a "speaker" just doesn't cut it.
>> At least I believe that is the problem.
>>
>> Ken
>>
>> > Re MIDI: there was a project years ago to use an M100 as a MIDI
>> sequencer; IIRC the baud rate was 'close enough'. I cobbled together an
>> interface for a proof-of-concept and it seemed to work OK; never went
>> beyond that though ;-(
>>
>> Yeah, I was kinda wondering / thinking 1.7% error might be close enough,
>> but not having any MIDI devices, I have no way to test it.
>>
>> Ken
>>
>>

Re: [M100] TS-DOS Option ROM

[Mike Stein]

Well put ;-)

Interesting that clicking a button on a web site seems more effective than
exchanging an email with a seller. A friend of mine died a year ago and his
e-store site is still up as though nothing had happened; you could wait a
while for a reply ;-)

A sign of the times I guess, when personal contact is perceived as riskier
than a flashy web site...

I suppose folks are used to actual business sites selling stuff for
Commodores etc. instead of the more personal and friendly atmosphere in
this community, where even 'serious' sellers are active and accessible
participants. I'd think that just being on a site as community-based as
Bitchin100 would suggest that it's not likely a scam.

m

On Wed, Dec 21, 2022 at 3:28 PM Brian White  wrote:

> The main REX info page has a large link that says "ordering information"
>
> So far so good.
>
> Following that link presents you with text that says "orders are accepted
> via email".
>
> It's not a big "buy!" button but it's hardly unclear.
>
> At that point I think any sensible person is now on the lookout for an
> email address. Yes, it's annoying that there wasn't a mailto: link right
> there in that line.
>
> And a few lines further down is something that is perhaps slightly
> cryptic, but also cannot be explained any other way than by being an email
> address, and it is far from uncommon to obfuscate email addresses on
> publicly scrape-able web sites.
>
> All in all, the prior text explaining that you need to send an email, and
> the page as a whole, provides sufficient direction.
>
> There is no store or cart system, but there absolutely is ordering
> information as advertised.
>
> It's at *worst*, ever so slightly 90's. Oh the baffling horror.
>
> But there is no way it's actually any sort of minimum requirement or
> obligation for an individual operating at this hobby scale to operate a
> full shopping cart web site, or even an Etsy or ebay store, even if some
> others do. "Order by email" is perfectly reasonable, and obfuscating that
> email from scrapers is also reasonable, whether you happen to think it's
> necessary or not.
>
> You could always build your own classic REX
> http://tandy.wiki/REX but I promise it's not as convenient as decrypting
> that order page.
>
> --
> bkw
>
> On Wed, Dec 21, 2022, 11:01 AM Wayne Lorentz  wrote:
>
>> No, there isn't an ordering link on the Rex page.  Clicking on "Ordering
>> information" just brings you to a page that lists prices and methods of
>> payment.
>>
>> Perhaps it's my fault for not knowing that "twospruces / gmail" after
>> the sign-off was supposed to be an e-mail address, and that I'm supposed to
>> write a letter to someone at that e-mail address asking for information
>> about how I can order their product.  My Little Orphan Annie Secret Decoder
>> Ring is in the shop.  What I expected was a link to a PayPal, or other
>> service ordering and payment page.  He already has a PayPal account.
>> Making a proper, secure payment link only takes a few clicks.
>>
>> Gmail has the second-best spam protection on the planet (after
>> FastMail).  It's not perfect, but there's no reason to obfuscate a gmail
>> address online anymore.  That hasn't worked for years.  Spambots know all
>> the clever tricks already.
>>
>> While it's nice that everyone in this community is happy to vouch for
>> him, how is someone who is not part of this mailing list supposed to know
>> that he's not some fly-by-night scam artist?  Or perhaps dead, which
>> happens all too often in retro computing?  Decode and send an e-mail, then
>> wait six months for a reply that may never come?  Asking someone to send
>> $100 to another country requires establishing a basic level of trust.
>>
>>
>> On Dec 20, 2022, at 3:03 PM, m100-requ...@lists.bitchin100.com wrote:
>>
>> There's a ordering link on the Rex page
>>
>> https://bitchin100.com/wiki/index.php?title=REX
>>
>>
>> https://bitchin100.com/wiki/index.php?title=Ordering_Information
>>
>> Steve's email is on that page but he encoded it so he doesn't get spam.
>> Point is you can send him emails through that or he is also on this list.
>>
>>
>>
>>

Re: [M100] Wiring Question

[Mike Stein]

Very nice!


On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 7:54 PM Spencer  wrote:

> I'm pleased. I finished it about 15 mins ago.
>
> The USB can provide up to the voltage of the PS (17.8VDC), and that
> voltmeter uses the power from the PS terminals in the box, but the larger
> meter doesn't do it that. It was an $8.00 meter I had to build and its
> design requires an external battery source, so I just added a battery
> holder on the back. The smaller meter was $54.00 (and too high!!!) with no
> light and for that much money.
>
> It was a lot of fun, and you and Brian made it easier and educational, and
> I really appreciate you two taking the time to suggest and guide.
>
> I've attached two pics showing testing with both the banana plugs and USB
> port hooked to a handheld meter.
>
> Spencer
>
>
>
>
> On Sunday, December 11, 2022 at 03:47:03 PM EST, Mike Stein <
> mhs.st...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Excellent! Nothing more satisfying than a job well done.
>
> Just curious: if you have a fixed 5V for the USB port, why do you have to
> power the meter from a battery?
>
> m
>
> On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 11:52 AM Spencer  wrote:
>
> Works great!!  I'm tickled. I did it exactly the way you recommended. It
> looks great too!  I'll get the USB port today and install it.  I'll send a
> pic of the finished product. Words can't express enough gratitude for your
> help!
>
> Spencer
>
> On Saturday, December 10, 2022 at 06:11:33 AM EST, Brian K. White <
> b.kenyo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Ok the pins are probably like this:
> http://switches-connectors-custom.cwind.com/Asset/GRB293B01BR.pdf
> The top-right corner shows the wiring for oins 1,2,3, and further down
> on the right shows where 1, 2, & 3 are physically. And the pics from the
> ebay listing also show pin number 1,2,3 in order like that (They aren't
> always, I almost posted a link to an identical looking switch that had
> the center pin numbered 1, but still had the same physical arrangement.)
>
> And it looks like the light probably takes 120vac.
>
> Which means hook the incoming hot to pin 1 (silver not in the center)
> load to pin 2 (silver in the center)
> neutral to pin 3 (the brass one)
> neutral also to the other side of the load.
>
> When you open the switch, neither the load nor the light gets power.
> When you close the switch, both the load and the light gets power.
>
> Which I believe is more or less what you guessed in the first place when
> you said ground to the brass one. Except in this case there is no ground
> and not even any consistent neutral, and you don't want to treat
> anything as actually gnd or neutral.
>
> Without a polarized plug, you're just picking one of the two wires at
> random and calling it "hot" and calling the other "neutral", but in this
> case they are just labels to keep track of them, the "neutral" isn't
> really neutral. You can't tie either wire to gnd or to the chassis
> anywhere (if there is any chassis or metal case), and the chassis must
> be fully insulated. Both wires are treated as hot in that sense.
>
> Personally I just would not use a non-polarized plug. I'd get a new
> normal cord and the white wire is neutral and the black wire is hot.
>
> --
> bkw
>
> On 12/9/22 15:04, Spencer wrote:
> > Hello Brian.
> >
> > It's a SPST 3 position switch.  Link ==> 10x SPST Red Neon Light On/Off
> > Round Rocker Switch 6A/250V 10A/125V AC | eBay
> > <https://www.ebay.com/itm/274361807522>
>
> >
> > Been busy - darn gum surgery. Not fun ;-(
> >
> >
> > On Tuesday, December 6, 2022 at 07:16:09 PM EST, Brian K. White
> >  wrote:
> >
> >
> > If the plug is not polarized then there is no hot or neutral.
> >
> > One wire IS hot (swings from -120v to +120v relative to GND).
> > And one wire IS neutral (stays at 0v relative to GND).
> >
> > Relative to each other, it's the same 120vac either direction, or
> > rather, there is no such thing as a direction.
> >
> > But if the plug is not polarized then you have to treat both wires as
> > equally hot, since every time it's plugged in either side could be the
> > hot side that time, at random.
> >
> > Switches come in all kinds of arrangements, so the only way to know how
> > to wire this particular switch is to test it with a continuity tester
> > and observe what connections it makes in each position, or consult it's
> > datasheet. Sometimes there is a diagram of the connections drawn right
> > on the body, otherwise google it's model number or find the datasheet
> > from the website where you got it or perhaps it's pac

Re: [M100] Wiring Question

[Mike Stein]

Excellent! Nothing more satisfying than a job well done.

Just curious: if you have a fixed 5V for the USB port, why do you have to
power the meter from a battery?

m

On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 11:52 AM Spencer  wrote:

> Works great!!  I'm tickled. I did it exactly the way you recommended. It
> looks great too!  I'll get the USB port today and install it.  I'll send a
> pic of the finished product. Words can't express enough gratitude for your
> help!
>
> Spencer
>
> On Saturday, December 10, 2022 at 06:11:33 AM EST, Brian K. White <
> b.kenyo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Ok the pins are probably like this:
> http://switches-connectors-custom.cwind.com/Asset/GRB293B01BR.pdf
> The top-right corner shows the wiring for oins 1,2,3, and further down
> on the right shows where 1, 2, & 3 are physically. And the pics from the
> ebay listing also show pin number 1,2,3 in order like that (They aren't
> always, I almost posted a link to an identical looking switch that had
> the center pin numbered 1, but still had the same physical arrangement.)
>
> And it looks like the light probably takes 120vac.
>
> Which means hook the incoming hot to pin 1 (silver not in the center)
> load to pin 2 (silver in the center)
> neutral to pin 3 (the brass one)
> neutral also to the other side of the load.
>
> When you open the switch, neither the load nor the light gets power.
> When you close the switch, both the load and the light gets power.
>
> Which I believe is more or less what you guessed in the first place when
> you said ground to the brass one. Except in this case there is no ground
> and not even any consistent neutral, and you don't want to treat
> anything as actually gnd or neutral.
>
> Without a polarized plug, you're just picking one of the two wires at
> random and calling it "hot" and calling the other "neutral", but in this
> case they are just labels to keep track of them, the "neutral" isn't
> really neutral. You can't tie either wire to gnd or to the chassis
> anywhere (if there is any chassis or metal case), and the chassis must
> be fully insulated. Both wires are treated as hot in that sense.
>
> Personally I just would not use a non-polarized plug. I'd get a new
> normal cord and the white wire is neutral and the black wire is hot.
>
> --
> bkw
>
> On 12/9/22 15:04, Spencer wrote:
> > Hello Brian.
> >
> > It's a SPST 3 position switch.  Link ==> 10x SPST Red Neon Light On/Off
> > Round Rocker Switch 6A/250V 10A/125V AC | eBay
> > 
>
> >
> > Been busy - darn gum surgery. Not fun ;-(
> >
> >
> > On Tuesday, December 6, 2022 at 07:16:09 PM EST, Brian K. White
> >  wrote:
> >
> >
> > If the plug is not polarized then there is no hot or neutral.
> >
> > One wire IS hot (swings from -120v to +120v relative to GND).
> > And one wire IS neutral (stays at 0v relative to GND).
> >
> > Relative to each other, it's the same 120vac either direction, or
> > rather, there is no such thing as a direction.
> >
> > But if the plug is not polarized then you have to treat both wires as
> > equally hot, since every time it's plugged in either side could be the
> > hot side that time, at random.
> >
> > Switches come in all kinds of arrangements, so the only way to know how
> > to wire this particular switch is to test it with a continuity tester
> > and observe what connections it makes in each position, or consult it's
> > datasheet. Sometimes there is a diagram of the connections drawn right
> > on the body, otherwise google it's model number or find the datasheet
> > from the website where you got it or perhaps it's packaging.
> >
> > A rocker with 3 pins and 2 positions (you didn't say how many positions
> > btw so I'm assuming) is fairly likely to be a center-common SPDT on-on,
> > hopefully non-shorting (break-before-make). Meaning the center pin is
> > connected to either one side or the other at any given time. When you're
> > turning one pin off, you're also turning the other pin on at the same
> > time. In this case since yoiu only care about turning something on/off,
> > you would just use the common pin and either one of the others. You just
> > run your hot wire from the wall to the center pin and connect the load
> > to either of the other pins, either one, doesn't matter, but only one,
> > and leave the other pin unconnected. (might want to cover it with
> > heat-shrink)
> >
> > Except that is just one common configuration and might not be right for
> > your switch.
> >
> > Really the switch could be totally different. It might have 3 positions
> > and be on-off-on, or the common pin might not be the center pin, or it
> > could be a lighted switch where only 2 pins are for switching and the
> > 3rd pin is to power the light, and that light may also possibly not take
> > the same voltage as what's passing through the main pins.
> >
> > Even a lighted switch where at least one of the pins is definitely
> > special and different, still doesn't necessarily have a right way to
> 

Re: [M100] Wiring Question

[Mike Stein]

Well, it's rare that Brian and I completely agree on anything (almost as
rare as non-polarized line cords ;-) but he's summed it up perfectly.

Just to be sure, I'd double check with a meter that the switch contacts are
indeed the two silver pins (1 & 2); connecting the line across those would
not be a good idea.

Just curious: where'd you get that cord? Aside from items that have an
isolating transformer, non-polarized cords and double-insulation seem to be
becoming more and more common on small appliances that used to have
three-prong grounded cords.

That supply looks gorgeous by the way!

m

On Fri, Dec 9, 2022 at 8:32 PM Spencer  wrote:

> I've included a few pics. I thought i had it figured out, but maybe not. I
> actually haven't put on a new AC rocker yet - still waiting on them. Here's
> the link =>  10x SPST Red Neon Light On/Off Round Rocker Switch 6A/250V
> 10A/125V AC | eBay <https://www.ebay.com/itm/274361807522>
>
> This project has really turned out well, and I don't want to kill it
> wiring the rocker wrong!!  The pics do show both blades are the same so my
> eyes tell me, but they've been wrong before.
>
> Let me know what you think of the pics.
>
> Thanks
>
> Spencer
>
>
>
> On Friday, December 9, 2022 at 07:35:20 PM EST, Mike Stein <
> mhs.st...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Glad you got it sorted.
>
> BTW, not that it matters much in your application but I'd be surprised if
> that cord were not polarized. Most cords like that are, and yours looks
> like it has a ridge on one side that denotes the neutral (some cords use a
> white stripe). Are you sure that one blade of the plug isn't wider than the
> other so it can only plug in one way?
>
> It's not a matter of plus or minus but of safety; on a lamp for instance
> where you can touch the threaded part while changing a bulb you want to be
> sure that it's connected to ground and not the 115+ volt hot 'line' side
> and that the switch turns off the 115V and not the grounded 'neutral'.
>
> m
>
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 9, 2022 at 3:04 PM Spencer  wrote:
>
> Hello Brian.
>
> It's a SPST 3 position switch.  Link ==>  10x SPST Red Neon Light On/Off
> Round Rocker Switch 6A/250V 10A/125V AC | eBay
> <https://www.ebay.com/itm/274361807522>
>
>
>
>
> Been busy - darn gum surgery. Not fun ;-(
>
>
> On Tuesday, December 6, 2022 at 07:16:09 PM EST, Brian K. White <
> b.kenyo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> If the plug is not polarized then there is no hot or neutral.
>
> One wire IS hot (swings from -120v to +120v relative to GND).
> And one wire IS neutral (stays at 0v relative to GND).
>
> Relative to each other, it's the same 120vac either direction, or
> rather, there is no such thing as a direction.
>
> But if the plug is not polarized then you have to treat both wires as
> equally hot, since every time it's plugged in either side could be the
> hot side that time, at random.
>
> Switches come in all kinds of arrangements, so the only way to know how
> to wire this particular switch is to test it with a continuity tester
> and observe what connections it makes in each position, or consult it's
> datasheet. Sometimes there is a diagram of the connections drawn right
> on the body, otherwise google it's model number or find the datasheet
> from the website where you got it or perhaps it's packaging.
>
> A rocker with 3 pins and 2 positions (you didn't say how many positions
> btw so I'm assuming) is fairly likely to be a center-common SPDT on-on,
> hopefully non-shorting (break-before-make). Meaning the center pin is
> connected to either one side or the other at any given time. When you're
> turning one pin off, you're also turning the other pin on at the same
> time. In this case since yoiu only care about turning something on/off,
> you would just use the common pin and either one of the others. You just
> run your hot wire from the wall to the center pin and connect the load
> to either of the other pins, either one, doesn't matter, but only one,
> and leave the other pin unconnected. (might want to cover it with
> heat-shrink)
>
> Except that is just one common configuration and might not be right for
> your switch.
>
> Really the switch could be totally different. It might have 3 positions
> and be on-off-on, or the common pin might not be the center pin, or it
> could be a lighted switch where only 2 pins are for switching and the
> 3rd pin is to power the light, and that light may also possibly not take
> the same voltage as what's passing through the main pins.
>
> Even a lighted switch where at least one of the pins is definitely
> special and different, still doesn't necessarily have a right way to
> wire it, since it's st

Re: [M100] Wiring Question

[Mike Stein]

Glad you got it sorted.

BTW, not that it matters much in your application but I'd be surprised if
that cord were not polarized. Most cords like that are, and yours looks
like it has a ridge on one side that denotes the neutral (some cords use a
white stripe). Are you sure that one blade of the plug isn't wider than the
other so it can only plug in one way?

It's not a matter of plus or minus but of safety; on a lamp for instance
where you can touch the threaded part while changing a bulb you want to be
sure that it's connected to ground and not the 115+ volt hot 'line' side
and that the switch turns off the 115V and not the grounded 'neutral'.

m



On Fri, Dec 9, 2022 at 3:04 PM Spencer  wrote:

> Hello Brian.
>
> It's a SPST 3 position switch.  Link ==>  10x SPST Red Neon Light On/Off
> Round Rocker Switch 6A/250V 10A/125V AC | eBay
> 
>
> Been busy - darn gum surgery. Not fun ;-(
>
>
> On Tuesday, December 6, 2022 at 07:16:09 PM EST, Brian K. White <
> b.kenyo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> If the plug is not polarized then there is no hot or neutral.
>
> One wire IS hot (swings from -120v to +120v relative to GND).
> And one wire IS neutral (stays at 0v relative to GND).
>
> Relative to each other, it's the same 120vac either direction, or
> rather, there is no such thing as a direction.
>
> But if the plug is not polarized then you have to treat both wires as
> equally hot, since every time it's plugged in either side could be the
> hot side that time, at random.
>
> Switches come in all kinds of arrangements, so the only way to know how
> to wire this particular switch is to test it with a continuity tester
> and observe what connections it makes in each position, or consult it's
> datasheet. Sometimes there is a diagram of the connections drawn right
> on the body, otherwise google it's model number or find the datasheet
> from the website where you got it or perhaps it's packaging.
>
> A rocker with 3 pins and 2 positions (you didn't say how many positions
> btw so I'm assuming) is fairly likely to be a center-common SPDT on-on,
> hopefully non-shorting (break-before-make). Meaning the center pin is
> connected to either one side or the other at any given time. When you're
> turning one pin off, you're also turning the other pin on at the same
> time. In this case since yoiu only care about turning something on/off,
> you would just use the common pin and either one of the others. You just
> run your hot wire from the wall to the center pin and connect the load
> to either of the other pins, either one, doesn't matter, but only one,
> and leave the other pin unconnected. (might want to cover it with
> heat-shrink)
>
> Except that is just one common configuration and might not be right for
> your switch.
>
> Really the switch could be totally different. It might have 3 positions
> and be on-off-on, or the common pin might not be the center pin, or it
> could be a lighted switch where only 2 pins are for switching and the
> 3rd pin is to power the light, and that light may also possibly not take
> the same voltage as what's passing through the main pins.
>
> Even a lighted switch where at least one of the pins is definitely
> special and different, still doesn't necessarily have a right way to
> wire it, since it's still up to you to decide when you want the light to
> be on. Usually you want the light to reflect the power state, on when
> the device is turned on. Or maybe you want the light to be a pilot light
> that is on at all times so that you can find it in the dark, or so that
> it indicates when power is available to the device rather than
> indicating when the device is turned on.
>
> There is unlikely to be a particular pin for GND. It's possible if the
> switch has a metal body, or for example light switches in walls, or if
> it has a light it might have a specific gnd pin, but generally there is
> no such thing as a gnd pin on a switch, they are just contacts which you
> connect to whatever your application requires. The closest thing to a
> right or wrong is a general rule that for a mains power switch would be
> to switch the hot side rather than the neutral side, simply so that when
> it's in the off position, the least amount of things are hot.
>
> But since you have a non-polarized plug, both wires are equally likely
> to be hot at any given time, and so you just pick either one for the
> switch, and treat the entire inside of the box as hot, and make sure the
> whole box is well sealed and insulated, and users are well protected
> from the internals. Or better, get rid of the non-polarized plug and use
> a polarized one, and then you have an actual hot side to treat as the
> hot side.
>
> --
> bkw
>
> On 12/5/22 21:52, Spencer wrote:
> > Hello
> >
> > Got a wiring question.
> >
> > I built a simple 18VDC PS from JameCo and I put it in a project box.
> > I've added two pots for adjusting power, banana plugs for external
> > power, two mini 

Re: [M100] OT:Sony Clie

[Mike Stein]

No idea, since I don't have a charger (or any accessories except the stylus
;-)

No idea if it even works; just thought I'd list it here in case someone
wants it as is for their collection. Tried to open it in case I could
charge the battery externally but couldn't get past the tiny three-point
security screws.

Looks nice except for a little scuffing on the back; haven't got the heart
to throw it in the garbage, especially with that too cute scroll wheel ;-)

m

On Sun, Dec 4, 2022 at 3:10 PM Jerry Novak  wrote:

> Is its battery, screen and pressure pad any good?
>

Re: [M100] custom key mapping generator for Tandy 200

[Mike Stein]

And you too never disappoint ;-) Obviously you and I will never resolve
whatever your problem is with me (and John?)

The discussion in question was indeed a total waste of time (as a few
others in the past) and I think I'm entitled to choose how to spend my
time; life's getting shorter all the time...

I rarely contribute anything anyway, certainly nothing that smarter folks
won't also come up with, so as I said, I'll leave it up to them while I
spend more time elsewhere; you've certainly contributed an impressive
amount of knowledge and hardware to the community and I'll definitely
continue to follow this list for useful information and just the sense of
community.

m



On Thu, Nov 17, 2022 at 6:56 PM Brian K. White  wrote:

> On 11/17/22 16:23, MikeS wrote:
>
> > I think in future I'll refrain from wasting time
>
> Promise?
> I was ready to acknowledge and apologize because you're right, I didn't
> really get that at first and did replicate something already said. But
> then you went and remained the same MikeS as always. So by all means
> refrain away in the future.
>
> --
> bkw
>
>

Re: [M100] Tandy Portable Disk Drive 2

[Mike Stein]

If you don't mind spending a few bucks, maybe Jeff Birt can look at it for
you. On the other hand, there are a few better storage options available
these days ..

m

On Mon, Nov 14, 2022 at 10:47 PM Spencer  wrote:

> Sorry folks for all the chatter on this. This is my last email on this. If
> I find a fix I'll share. I haven't been using the T200s all that long, but
> learned alot. I also learned that the earlier models did in fact have
> jumpers and when you opened the little door you saw them. Later models you
> only see the shield when opening the door, and I found the service manual;
> it told me I was wrong about the default settings of the switches; I
> thought they were off, but the default is on, so I changed the switches to
> ON (apparently a previous owner changed them all to OFF), and it still
> didn't help.  So I'll keep reading the service manual for hopefully more
> insight, but I may determine it's some hardware issue with the drive that I
> may need parts to repair. Who knows what has been done to this drive over
> the 28 + years.
>
> Thanks again for your help.
> Spencer
>
> On Monday, November 14, 2022 at 06:09:49 PM EST, Spencer <
> spencer...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> Found nothing of value when I looked again. I found that on some earlier
> models (so it appears) it had a physical dip block, but on later models it
> had four jumpers on SW1 but were soldered (or etched in the board) at the
> factory and the bottom part of the four switches showed the contacts as
> open. It looks like they should be off, but please set me straight if my
> assumption is wrong. In any event still the "drive not ready" error still
> there ;-(. I'll see if I can find a service manual unless any of you have
> one you wouldn't mind sending me.
>
> Thanks for your help!
>
> On Monday, November 14, 2022 at 04:57:18 PM EST, Spencer <
> spencer...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> Ok I popped the hood and YES there is a dip block of four switches and all
> are off, and yes it's covered by the shield so opening that little door
> shows just the shiled. If anyone knows how they should be please let me
> know. Something I did find was the power supply has a white connector that
> plugs into a board with the fuse and it was some pulled out from one side
> but not all the way. Actually don't know if I pulled it out when I opened
> it or not. Btw the 1A fuse is good. Everything looks good. Don't see any
> popped/leaking caps or broken solder joints, but I'll try it again and
> share what I find.
>
> Thanks
>
> On Monday, November 14, 2022 at 03:26:44 PM EST, John R. Hogerhuis <
> jho...@pobox.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Nov 14, 2022 at 11:59 AM Greg Swallow  wrote:
>
> Oh my. Checked for cover and assumed DIP under it as the TPDD1 I once had.
> Opened the TPPD2 lid to expose bright shiney shield. No DIP switches. Never
> had to change anything so never opened it before now.
>
>
> And my recollection is that means short of somehow populating the DIP
> (which may or may not work) you're locked at 19200bps on the TPDD-2. The
> TPDD-1 is actually a rebadged Brother FB-100. The FB-100 has the dip
> switches, but defaults to 9600bps which the Brother Knitting machine
> devices are locked to. So although TPDD-1's can be used with Brother
> Knitting Machines, the TPDD-2 cannot.
>
> -- John.
>

Re: [M100] custom key mapping generator for Tandy 200

[Mike Stein]

That's what the lengthy discussion with Brian is about; if /OE and /PGM
disables data out then a 27C64 should work.

Unlikely, but possible; more likely that Georg's board is revised and only
uses 2 active-low chip selects.

On Mon, Nov 14, 2022 at 11:54 AM Stephen Adolph 
wrote:

> Very interesting Georg,
> Can you take some photos of thr PCB sometime if you happen to have your
> machine open?
> It is a bit of a pain to reassemble I know.
>
> How did you determine that a 27C64 worked in
> M13 socket?   Besides the obvious that it does work.
>
> Because the schematic does not seem to indicate that.  Maybe your board is
> very different.
>
> Thx
> Steve
>
> On Monday, November 14, 2022, Georg Käter <
> georg.kae...@gk-engineering-services.de> wrote:
>
>> Hello together,
>>
>>
>>
>> my Tandy 200 (European version, build in 1985) uses main PCB
>> #-PLX178AHIX. This board accepts
>>
>> standard UV-eraseable EPROM 27C256 (32kB) and 27C64 (8kB) 150ns type w/o
>> any modification.
>>
>> Maybe there are other revisions of PCB with different EPROM pinout I´m
>> not aware of.
>>
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Georg
>>
>> Georg Käter
>> Gangolfsweg 44
>> 
>> D-52076 Aachen
>> Tel.: +49  2408 7194987
>> Fax.: +49  2408 7196758
>> Mobil: +49  171 4839954
>> E-Mail   :
>> georg.kae...@gk-engineering-services.de
>>
>> == Ihre Nachricht ==
>>
>> *von*  : Brian K. White 
>> *gesendet* : Montag, 14. November 2022, 16:24
>> *an*   : m100@lists.bitchin100.com
>> *Betreff*  : [M100] custom key mapping generator for Tandy 200
>>
>> __ Originalnachricht ___
>>
>> On 11/14/22 10:11, Brian K. White wrote:
>>
>> On 11/14/22 09:12, Brian White wrote:
>>
>> The datasheet says to rest vpp at vcc. Most do, even if elsewhere they >>
>> also say that writing is disabled as long as vpp is below vpp and the >>
>> only low limit is pretty much the same as for any other pin, like 0.5 >> or
>> 0.7 below vcc.
>>
>> derp I mean the low limit is a little below GND or VSS not VCC.
>>
>> Although a Microchip 27C64 datasheet I happen to be looking at at the >
>> moment does actually say the vpp read voltage is min vcc-0.7, max vcc.
>>
>>
>> More derp, I obviously confused VPP with /WE there.
>> But pin 27, being /WE (/PGM), still needs to be held at VCC not GND,
>> although theoretically any writes should still fail without VPP, but still,
>> you just hold /WE at VCC for reads.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> __ Ende Originalnachricht __
>>
>>
>> *Vertraulichkeitsinformation: *Diese Nachricht ist vertraulich. Die
>> Informationen dieser Nachricht sind ausschließlich für die persönliche
>> und vertrauliche Verwendung durch den/die oben genannten Empfänger
>> bestimmt. Wenn Sie kein beabsichtigter
>> Empfänger sind, bitte lesen, kopieren und verwenden Sie die Nachricht
>> nicht. Machen Sie sie nicht anderen
>> zugänglich. Bitte informieren Sie uns umgehend über den Zustellfehler und
>> senden Sie die Originalnachricht
>> per E-Mail an uns zurück.
>>
>>
>> *Confidentiality Notice: *This message is confidential. The information
>> contained in this message is intended only for the personal
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>> intended recipient, please do not
>> read, copy, or use it and do not disclose it to others. Please inform us
>> immediately of the delivery error
>> and return the original message to us via e-mail.
>>
>

Re: [M100] custom key mapping generator for Tandy 200

[Mike Stein]

Oh, *that* Vpp... ;-)


On Mon, Nov 14, 2022 at 11:38 AM Brian K. White 
wrote:

> On 11/14/22 11:17, Mike Stein wrote:
> > "Vpp is below Vpp"? Not sure what you meant there?
>
> Yeah sorry, vpp the pin at a level below vpp the level
> it's only tech, no need to be unambiguous or anything :)
>
> --
> bkw
>
>

Re: [M100] custom key mapping generator for Tandy 200

[Mike Stein]

Oops; received this after sending mine.

Writes will definitely fail; I'm just curious whether outputs are enabled
with /OE low and /PGM also low.

On Mon, Nov 14, 2022 at 10:24 AM Brian K. White 
wrote:

> On 11/14/22 10:11, Brian K. White wrote:
> > On 11/14/22 09:12, Brian White wrote:
> >> The datasheet says to rest vpp at vcc. Most do, even if elsewhere they
> >> also say that writing is disabled as long as vpp is below vpp and the
> >> only low limit is pretty much the same as for any other pin, like 0.5
> >> or 0.7 below vcc.
> >
> > derp I mean the low limit is a little below GND or VSS not VCC.
> > Although a Microchip 27C64 datasheet I happen to be looking at at the
> > moment does actually say the vpp read voltage is min vcc-0.7, max vcc.
>
> More derp, I obviously confused VPP with /WE there.
> But pin 27, being /WE (/PGM), still needs to be held at VCC not GND,
> although theoretically any writes should still fail without VPP, but
> still, you just hold /WE at VCC for reads.
>
> --
> bkw
>
>

Re: [M100] custom key mapping generator for Tandy 200

[Mike Stein]

"Vpp is below Vpp"? Not sure what you meant there?

And "And chip pin 27 pulled to VCC"? ; Since you're talking about Vpp in
this post I think you're confusing /PGM (27) with Vpp.(1)?

We're not programming, so Vpp should indeed be at Vcc and normally /PGM
should indeed be pulled high.

To enable the data outputs to read, /CE and /OE should be low, and /PGM
high, which is what you want. /OE *high* and /PGM low turns the data lines
into inputs, i.e. disables output..

I'm just curious what happens when /OE is *low* and /PGM is also low, which
we want to disable the outputs. I expect /OE will enable the outputs
regardless of /PGM, but if by chance /PGM also turns the data line into
inputs then that'd be what you want (i.e. /PGM  = active-high CE)

Just wasting bandwidth with idle speculation... ;-)

m



On Mon, Nov 14, 2022 at 9:12 AM Brian White  wrote:

> The datasheet says to rest vpp at vcc. Most do, even if elsewhere they
> also say that writing is disabled as long as vpp is below vpp and the only
> low limit is pretty much the same as for any other pin, like 0.5 or 0.7
> below vcc.
>
> I never saw a reason why, but it's definitely a consistent suggestion in
> datasheets to hold vpp at vcc rather than gnd.
>
> Maybe holding it at gnd wastes a little power or stresses a gate somewhere
> through reverse leakage and vcc is closer to where that gate is when
> running. So, it may still be true that any voltage from gnd to vcc is legal
> and functional, yet one is still better than the other.
>
>
> bkw
>
> On Mon, Nov 14, 2022, 12:19 AM Mike Stein  wrote:
>
>> Too bad I don't have a 200; you're probably right but since it's not
>> clearly defined in the data sheet I'll have to dig out one of my other
>> systems using a 2764 and check it for myself ;-)
>>
>> But I have to ask: why pull pin 27 to Vcc? What happens if you pull it
>> low?
>>
>> On Sun, Nov 13, 2022 at 9:06 PM Brian K. White 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> 27C64 can't be used as-is.
>>> pin 27 is A15 and needs to needs to go to a non-existing 2nd OE or CE.
>>>
>>> You'd need an adapter board that combines pin 27 (A15) from the socket,
>>> with pin 22 /CE0 (/BANK#1) from the socket, to produce a single /CE to
>>> pin 22 of the chip.
>>>
>>> You could do that with a single 2-gate NAND part the same as in this
>>> model 200 RAM
>>> https://github.com/bkw777/TANDY_200_RAM#single-bank---sop
>>>
>>> https://raw.githubusercontent.com/bkw777/TANDY_200_RAM/main/TANDY_200_RAM.svg
>>>
>>> That is using one nand gate just to invert /CS1 to CS1,
>>> then ANDing those to make a single CS, and inverting that to make a
>>> single /CS output to the chip's /CE
>>>
>>> The point is getting the job done with only 2 gates of the same type so
>>> it's all from a single part.
>>> They even make little 8-leg parts with just the 2 needed gates.
>>>
>>> For 27C64 you'd need to do that with /CE0 from bus pin 22 and CE1 from
>>> bus pin 27, to produce a single /OE to chip pin 22. And chip pin 27
>>> pulled to VCC by anything from 100k to a plain trace. All other pins
>>> including /CS would go 1:1 socket to chip.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 11/13/22 19:38, Mike Stein wrote:
>>> > Duh; shoulda looked more carefully; it really IS A15 (not A13) and it
>>> > goes to /CE1 (or CE1); double duh! Thanks, Brian.
>>> >
>>> > So it looks like the only non-standard pin is pin 27, since 26 is not
>>> > used. Has anyone actually tried a JEDEC standard  27C64?
>>> >
>>> > Pin 27 is the Program pin which looks like it might effectively be an
>>> > active high OE (since there is no program voltage.
>>> >
>>> > m
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On Sun, Nov 13, 2022 at 5:27 PM Brian White >> > <mailto:b.kenyo...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > 8k.
>>> >
>>> > HN61364 = 8k
>>> > A15 is connected to a chip select to enable/disable the whole chip
>>> > (really just output enable not chip enable despite the /CEx
>>> labels),
>>> > and the actual address lines are only A0-A12
>>> >
>>> > It's mostly like 27C64 but with 3 OE lines, customer programmable
>>> to
>>> > be either active high or low as part of the mask programming.
>>> > Although the schematic labels them as /CE0 /CE1 /CE2, really they
>>> > are all OE not CE, and it appears that /CE1 should be shown as
>>>

Re: [M100] custom key mapping generator for Tandy 200

[Mike Stein]

Too bad I don't have a 200; you're probably right but since it's not
clearly defined in the data sheet I'll have to dig out one of my other
systems using a 2764 and check it for myself ;-)

But I have to ask: why pull pin 27 to Vcc? What happens if you pull it low?

On Sun, Nov 13, 2022 at 9:06 PM Brian K. White  wrote:

> 27C64 can't be used as-is.
> pin 27 is A15 and needs to needs to go to a non-existing 2nd OE or CE.
>
> You'd need an adapter board that combines pin 27 (A15) from the socket,
> with pin 22 /CE0 (/BANK#1) from the socket, to produce a single /CE to
> pin 22 of the chip.
>
> You could do that with a single 2-gate NAND part the same as in this
> model 200 RAM
> https://github.com/bkw777/TANDY_200_RAM#single-bank---sop
>
> https://raw.githubusercontent.com/bkw777/TANDY_200_RAM/main/TANDY_200_RAM.svg
>
> That is using one nand gate just to invert /CS1 to CS1,
> then ANDing those to make a single CS, and inverting that to make a
> single /CS output to the chip's /CE
>
> The point is getting the job done with only 2 gates of the same type so
> it's all from a single part.
> They even make little 8-leg parts with just the 2 needed gates.
>
> For 27C64 you'd need to do that with /CE0 from bus pin 22 and CE1 from
> bus pin 27, to produce a single /OE to chip pin 22. And chip pin 27
> pulled to VCC by anything from 100k to a plain trace. All other pins
> including /CS would go 1:1 socket to chip.
>
>
> On 11/13/22 19:38, Mike Stein wrote:
> > Duh; shoulda looked more carefully; it really IS A15 (not A13) and it
> > goes to /CE1 (or CE1); double duh! Thanks, Brian.
> >
> > So it looks like the only non-standard pin is pin 27, since 26 is not
> > used. Has anyone actually tried a JEDEC standard  27C64?
> >
> > Pin 27 is the Program pin which looks like it might effectively be an
> > active high OE (since there is no program voltage.
> >
> > m
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Nov 13, 2022 at 5:27 PM Brian White  > <mailto:b.kenyo...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > 8k.
> >
> > HN61364 = 8k
> > A15 is connected to a chip select to enable/disable the whole chip
> > (really just output enable not chip enable despite the /CEx labels),
> > and the actual address lines are only A0-A12
> >
> > It's mostly like 27C64 but with 3 OE lines, customer programmable to
> > be either active high or low as part of the mask programming.
> > Although the schematic labels them as /CE0 /CE1 /CE2, really they
> > are all OE not CE, and it appears that /CE1 should be shown as
> > active-high, so really: /OE0, OE1, /OE2 , and /CS is a normal actual
> > whole chip enable, active low.
> >
> > I was just now in the middle of drawing up an adapter for that chip
> > like FlexROM_102 but for that chip, to facilitate using the main rom
> > replacement feature of REX Classic in a 200 the way I have already
> > for 100 and 102.
> >
> > But it may be simpler to make a different kind of adapter that
> > replaces both chips with a single larger chip on a single adapter in
> > the main rom socket and simply remove the 8k chip. The /BANK1 line
> > goes to both chips the same, and A15 ends up activating one or the
> > other exclusively at any given moment.
> >
> > bkw
> >
> > On Sun, Nov 13, 2022, 4:48 PM Mike Stein  > <mailto:mhs.st...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > Looking at the schematic, are you sure it's 8K and not 16
> (27x128)?
> >
> > Looks standard except for pins 26 & 27
> >
> > On Sun, Nov 13, 2022 at 4:23 PM Stephen Adolph
> > mailto:twospru...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > Georg,
> > What type of ROM chips did you use, when you replaced your
> > ROMs with patched versions?
> > I've been pondering what the simplest way to do that is.
> > The 8K M13 socket is wired oddly, and doesnt seem compatible
> > with a 27C64.
> > thx
> > Steve
> >
> > On Sun, Nov 13, 2022 at 12:30 PM Georg Käter
> >  > <mailto:georg.kae...@gk-engineering-services.de>> wrote:
> >
> > Hello together,
> >
> > I own a M200 "German/EU Version" (Art.Nr. 26-3860H)
> > w/modem, for German market it was delivered with set of
> > keyboard
> >
> > caps and a data tape including driver for keyboard a

Re: [M100] custom key mapping generator for Tandy 200

[Mike Stein]

Duh; shoulda looked more carefully; it really IS A15 (not A13) and it goes
to /CE1 (or CE1); double duh! Thanks, Brian.

So it looks like the only non-standard pin is pin 27, since 26 is not used.
Has anyone actually tried a JEDEC standard  27C64?

Pin 27 is the Program pin which looks like it might effectively be an
active high OE (since there is no program voltage.

m



On Sun, Nov 13, 2022 at 5:27 PM Brian White  wrote:

> 8k.
>
> HN61364 = 8k
> A15 is connected to a chip select to enable/disable the whole chip (really
> just output enable not chip enable despite the /CEx labels), and the actual
> address lines are only A0-A12
>
> It's mostly like 27C64 but with 3 OE lines, customer programmable to be
> either active high or low as part of the mask programming. Although the
> schematic labels them as /CE0 /CE1 /CE2, really they are all OE not CE, and
> it appears that /CE1 should be shown as active-high, so really: /OE0, OE1,
> /OE2 , and /CS is a normal actual whole chip enable, active low.
>
> I was just now in the middle of drawing up an adapter for that chip like
> FlexROM_102 but for that chip, to facilitate using the main rom replacement
> feature of REX Classic in a 200 the way I have already for 100 and 102.
>
> But it may be simpler to make a different kind of adapter that replaces
> both chips with a single larger chip on a single adapter in the main rom
> socket and simply remove the 8k chip. The /BANK1 line goes to both chips
> the same, and A15 ends up activating one or the other exclusively at any
> given moment.
>
> bkw
>
> On Sun, Nov 13, 2022, 4:48 PM Mike Stein  wrote:
>
>> Looking at the schematic, are you sure it's 8K and not 16 (27x128)?
>>
>> Looks standard except for pins 26 & 27
>>
>> On Sun, Nov 13, 2022 at 4:23 PM Stephen Adolph 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Georg,
>>> What type of ROM chips did you use, when you replaced your ROMs with
>>> patched versions?
>>> I've been pondering what the simplest way to do that is.
>>> The 8K M13 socket is wired oddly, and doesnt seem compatible with a
>>> 27C64.
>>> thx
>>> Steve
>>>
>>> On Sun, Nov 13, 2022 at 12:30 PM Georg Käter <
>>> georg.kae...@gk-engineering-services.de> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hello together,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I own a M200 "German/EU Version" (Art.Nr. 26-3860H) w/modem, for German
>>>> market it was delivered with set of keyboard
>>>>
>>>> caps and a data tape including driver for keyboard and printer. I tried
>>>> this in VirtualT and it seems to work so far. To run REX
>>>>
>>>> on my M200 I replaced original ROM by ROM from VirtualT patched to
>>>> serve german keyboard mapping.
>>>>
>>>> For your reference I´ve added original ROM files and files from tape
>>>> for your reference.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Regards
>>>>
>>>> Georg
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Georg Käter
>>>> Gangolfsweg 44
>>>> D-52076 Aachen
>>>> Tel.: +49  2408 7194987
>>>> Fax.: +49  2408 7196758
>>>> Mobil: +49  171 4839954
>>>> E-Mail   :
>>>> georg.kae...@gk-engineering-services.de
>>>>
>>>> == Ihre Nachricht ==
>>>>
>>>> *von*  : Cedric Amand 
>>>> *gesendet* : Sonntag, 13. November 2022, 15:37
>>>> *an*   : m...@bitchin100.com
>>>> *Betreff*  : [M100] custom key mapping generator for Tandy 200
>>>>
>>>> __ Originalnachricht ___
>>>>
>>>> My point exactly Brian !
>>>> How did they come up with that idea ? It makes no sense. It really
>>>> prevents you from using the option rom socket.
>>>> The docs does not talk about removing it.
>>>>
>>>> And even if you could remove it ; the installation procedure of that
>>>> ROM is not easy at all, requires to type two "calls" with the freaking
>>>> keyboard inverted.
>>>> OK - us nerds 40 years later can do it easily, just type "CQLL", but
>>>> imagine explaining that to a random journalist in 1984 ?!
>>>> Especially as the french doc (which I happen to have) says to type
>>>> "CALL" not CQLL.
>>>>
>>>> I also wonder if other markets are affected by this plague,
>>>> If anyone 

Re: [M100] custom key mapping generator for Tandy 200

[Mike Stein]

Looking at the schematic, are you sure it's 8K and not 16 (27x128)?

Looks standard except for pins 26 & 27

On Sun, Nov 13, 2022 at 4:23 PM Stephen Adolph  wrote:

> Georg,
> What type of ROM chips did you use, when you replaced your ROMs with
> patched versions?
> I've been pondering what the simplest way to do that is.
> The 8K M13 socket is wired oddly, and doesnt seem compatible with a 27C64.
> thx
> Steve
>
> On Sun, Nov 13, 2022 at 12:30 PM Georg Käter <
> georg.kae...@gk-engineering-services.de> wrote:
>
>> Hello together,
>>
>>
>>
>> I own a M200 "German/EU Version" (Art.Nr. 26-3860H) w/modem, for German
>> market it was delivered with set of keyboard
>>
>> caps and a data tape including driver for keyboard and printer. I tried
>> this in VirtualT and it seems to work so far. To run REX
>>
>> on my M200 I replaced original ROM by ROM from VirtualT patched to serve
>> german keyboard mapping.
>>
>> For your reference I´ve added original ROM files and files from tape for
>> your reference.
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Georg
>>
>>
>> Georg Käter
>> Gangolfsweg 44
>> D-52076 Aachen
>> Tel.: +49  2408 7194987
>> Fax.: +49  2408 7196758
>> Mobil: +49  171 4839954
>> E-Mail   :
>> georg.kae...@gk-engineering-services.de
>>
>> == Ihre Nachricht ==
>>
>> *von*  : Cedric Amand 
>> *gesendet* : Sonntag, 13. November 2022, 15:37
>> *an*   : m...@bitchin100.com
>> *Betreff*  : [M100] custom key mapping generator for Tandy 200
>>
>> __ Originalnachricht ___
>>
>> My point exactly Brian !
>> How did they come up with that idea ? It makes no sense. It really
>> prevents you from using the option rom socket.
>> The docs does not talk about removing it.
>>
>> And even if you could remove it ; the installation procedure of that ROM
>> is not easy at all, requires to type two "calls" with the freaking keyboard
>> inverted.
>> OK - us nerds 40 years later can do it easily, just type "CQLL", but
>> imagine explaining that to a random journalist in 1984 ?!
>> Especially as the french doc (which I happen to have) says to type "CALL"
>> not CQLL.
>>
>> I also wonder if other markets are affected by this plague,
>> If anyone here lives in germany and owns a qwertz (or other keyboard
>> variant) of the M200 : do you have a "stock option ROM" as well ?
>>
>> I also wish to thank Stephen publicly for the time he invested into
>> helping me, as indeed, you can't use an option ROM (and even less a REX#)
>> in those non-qwerty  M200s, and I think this research might help some other
>> people at some stage (this hobby is booming right ? :) )
>>
>> We're (and I am) in the process of replacing the main rom + 8KB rom with
>> a 27C512 flashed with a custom "native Azerty" firmware
>> Which should free up to option socket, for a REX#
>>
>> I also plan to make other modifications to that custom ROM, but we'll see
>> if I get there.
>> I've also been experimenting in the past with custom firmware for the my
>> M102 for different reasons.
>> I'm a "modem" nerd and I have all the equipment (PABX, etc) to make voice
>> calls between my vintage laptops - so it's important for me to have my
>> modems work. This required a custom firmware to make my M102 work, with
>> modem, with a REX#. ( OK I think this kind of stuff is only relevant to me
>> this time :) :)
>>
>>
>> Le 2022-11-13 14:53, Brian White  a écrit :
>>
>> Nice.
>>
>> So the point would be to make the main rom natively azerty to match the
>> hardware, free up the option rom slot for normal use, without otherwise
>> changing the main rom so that it becomes incompatible with application
>> software? I guess you might even be able to make a dvorak version and move
>> the keycaps around?
>>
>> I'm just trying to imagine the sales pitch for that azerty 200 that needs
>> the option rom, thus preventing the use of any other option rom (or at
>> least making it pretty inconvenient by having to swap them on every reset I
>> guess?)
>>
>> "Here's your new model 200. It's only half as useful as others with no
>> modem and no option rom but you can still pay full price please."
>>
>> --
>> bkw
>>
>> On Sun, Nov 13, 2022, 8:28 AM Stephen Adolph 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> hi folks,
>>>
>>> Thought I would share this work.  It is a spreadsheet for computing the
>>> keyboard table in the T200 so you can make native custom keyboards for T200.
>>>
>>> Why?
>>> The AZERTY keyboard in Europe was accommodated using an option ROM that
>>> kinda hacked the keyboard.  Keystrokes get intercepted and corrected to be
>>> AZERTY even though the main ROM is set up for QWERTY.
>>>
>>> An alternative is to have the main rom directly support AZERTY.
>>> To do this, there are 6 keyboard mapping tables that start at 9763h.
>>> Each table are 44 bytes long.
>>>
>>> This spreadsheet lets you assign the ascii codes for each of the 44
>>> affected keys, for all 6 tables. (unshifted, shifted, GRAPH, shift GRAPH,

Re: [M100] RS-232 to bluetooth

[Mike Stein]

I've played with BT adapters and didn't really have any problems except for
the handshaking issues discussed in another thread.

As you note, there are basically two versions (aside from master/slave etc.
issues): True RS232 that have a DE9 connector and plug riight into the M100
with a 25<>9 pin adapter, and modules like the HC-05/06 that are 5V TTL
serial and either need a level shifter or directly connect to the 5V TTL
signals inside the M100 (there is at least one article on the Web somewhere
detailing that).

It's been long on my to-do list to replace the internal modem with internal
Bluetooth and USB modules, using the modem switches to select one or the
other and turn them on and off. Maybe you've inspired me ;-)

I had timeout problems with the original TS-DOS in ROM but I gather that
that's been fixed in later versions.

Have FUN!

m



On Tue, Nov 1, 2022 at 1:42 PM jonathan.y...@telia.com <
jonathan.y...@telia.com> wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I can connect my M100 to a Raspberry Pi, either through a USB-->RS232
> adapter, or even on the GPIO bus with a suitable level shifter.  I've
> always done with the 'larger' ones but I've been playing a Zero W, which
> doesn't have the GPIO soldered on and only 2 micro USB connectors, one of
> which is for power.  I've thought of trying to connect the M100 via
> bluetooth, but I thought I would ask if anyone has done this.  I can get a
> console via bluetooth from other bt devices (like my android tablet) and
> the zero 2 has bluetooth on-board, so this kind of connection wouldn't need
> anything hanging off the Pi zero.
>
>  I've seen RS-232 to bluetooth adapters, though the 'cheaper' ones don't
> really conform to the +12 -12 of real RS232. I've toyed with trying an
> hc-05 and a level shifter but maybe it's better to get somethiing that does
> it all, if this is even reasonable.
>
> Jonathan
>
>

Re: [M100] Notoriously S.L.O.W BASIC posted - help speeding it up appreciated

[Mike Stein]

That's odd; can't your terminal program just wait forever for the next
dump? If it times out, can't you override that?

It probably won't matter with a small file like this but I've found that at
19200 even TEXT has trouble keeping up when downloading. The M100 doesn't
have hardware handshaking and only has XON/XOFF, which is not always
reliable.

When uploading/saving from BASIC there doesn't seem to be much difference
between 9600 and 19200, since it has to detokenize as it goes. Try it and
see how it goes at 19200; TELCOM and text would probably be a little faster.

I've added an option to send the dump output to the com port; that seems to
work fine at 19200.

BTW, I don't think we'll do much better than 34 seconds/50 lines; as I
mentioned, LCD performance is pretty bad, especially scrolling.

For comparison, outputting to the com port halves the time to 17 seconds,
and of course you can scroll, save and print that on your PC as well.

m

On Sun, Oct 30, 2022 at 9:54 PM B 9  wrote:

> That sounds like a nice workflow. This ought to be in a FAQ of tips and
> hints for people new to the M100.
>
> I might just try it out. I'm pretty rigorous about using *SAVE
> "COM:98N1ENN"*, but I have to tell my Unix box to receive the file each
> time (cp /dev/ttyUSB0 foo.do). And every copy I save overwrites the
> previous one, unlike the natural history you'll have in your log file if
> you find you need to go back a few revisions.
>
> One question though: why do you send at 9600 bps? I thought all Model T's
> could do 19,200bps.
>
> —b9
>
> On Sat, Oct 29, 2022 at 10:26 AM MikeS  wrote:
>
>> Hi Will,
>>
>> Too many times I've made some changes and either accidentally deleted the
>> file or messed it up so badly that I want to revert to the previous
>> version, so I've learned the hard way that it's a good idea to save the
>> work before making major changes.
>>
>> One way is to SAVE it locally on the M100 as a .DO file ("Foo.do" or
>> "Foo",A) , changing the name as appropriate; note that BASIC will save a
>> file as .BA by default but will LOAD a .DO file without specifying the
>> '.DO' or ',A' if no .BA file with the same file exists. Of course if it's a
>> very large file you may not have room for both the .BA and .DO files in RAM
>> at the same time.
>>
>> What I do if I'm close enough to a PC to easily connect or stay connected
>> is to open a file (e.g. "backup.txt") on the PC for ASCII text download
>> with a terminal program and just leave it open.
>>
>> On the M100 I've programmed F7 to 'Key 7, "COM:88N1E"', so when I want to
>> save the file I'm working on I press F3 to save, F7 in response to 'Save "'
>> and Return. It's a good idea to embed a version no. in the program and
>> update it every time.
>>
>> This concatenates all the saved files in one file; if you actually need
>> to go back then you'd have to stop the transfer, edit the file on the PC
>> and send it back to the M100. Of course you can open a new file on the PC
>> every time if you don't mind typing on the PC every time.
>>
>> To Load a .DO file from the PC, open TEXT, enter the File name, LOAD (F2)
>> and enter 'COM:88N1E' in response to 'Load from:'; on the PC terminal
>> program select Upload ASCII or whatever it's called and the file name
>> (which does not have to be the same as on the M100). You may not see
>> anything happening but the terminal program should indicate somehow when
>> the transfer is finished. Type a CTL-Z on the PC and the file should appear
>> on the M100; switch to BASIC and Load it, and Bob's your mother's brother.
>>
>> This is mainly meant for folks who want to or have to just use the M100's
>> built-in functions, and to show how to avoid overruns when Loading BASIC
>> .DO programs as in a previous post here a few days ago.
>>
>> Teeny, TS-DOS etc. certainly are very useful and in fact necessary if
>> you're working with .BA tokenized files or Machine language code.
>>
>> Other than my phone I'm not an Apple kind of guy, so I can't give any
>> Mac-specific hints.
>>
>> One other hint: to simplify switching from RUN to EDIT mode I've
>> programmed 'F6,"Edit"+chr$(13)'
>>
>> Not too verbose, I hope...
>>
>> m
>>
>>
>>
>> - Original Message -
>> *From:* Will Senn 
>> *To:* m100@lists.bitchin100.com
>> *Sent:* Saturday, October 29, 2022 10:16 AM
>> *Subject:* Re: [M100] Notoriously S.L.O.W BASIC posted - help speeding
>> it up appreciated
>>
>> Hi Mike,
>>
>> I'm curious about the COM stuff. In a later note you said:
>>
>> It's actually sorta been fun programming on the 'real' M100; I left a
>> download running on the PC and every time I wanted to backup an interim
>> version just in case, I just pressed F3 and F7 (which I'd programmed with
>> the COM stats).
>>
>> and here, you say stuff about programming the function keys with
>> "COM:88N1E"...
>>
>> It would be nice to be able to transfer / save from BASIC and/or my
>> terminal on the Mac without the overhead of dl/TEENY.CO. I know enough
>> to be 

Re: [M100] Notoriously S.L.O.W BASIC posted - help speeding it up appreciated

[Mike Stein]

My head hurts ;-)

Oddly enough, explicitly typing variables (e.g. A%) actually slows things
down a bit.

And yes, the intermediate values can be >32767 as long as the result is a
legal integer.

m

On Sat, Oct 29, 2022 at 10:20 PM Eric LK  wrote:

> I wrote:
> >FWIW, I also tried "caching" the result of "PEEK(P+1)" but again,
> >it didn't change the result (in all 3 implementations, 1000
> >iterations took 14 seconds, so those modifications aren't really
> >interesting, except for the brain picking exercise ;o)).
>
> Well, I managed to (almost) half this time :o) : 8 seconds for 1000
> iterations!
>
> I'd like to say I found a very innovative solution, but it's so simple
> I wonder how we didn't think of it before... Just let the BASIC do the
> work for you :o)
>
> 10 DEFINTP-Q:DEFSTRH
> 20 H=CHR$(201)
> 30 P=VARPTR(H)+1:Q=VARPTR(P)
> 1000 POKE Q,PEEK(P):POKE Q+1,PEEK(P+1)
> 1010 PRINTP
>
> "John R. Hogerhuis"  wrote:
> > As to type sigils on variables... Don't know how much it changes ram use
> > or execution time. Some! Maybe look at the tokenized output difference
> > for the space difference.
>
> Thanks, I may give it a try. BTW, is there a good documentation of the
> tokenized format (and of the variables encoding) for the M100? I
> learned a lot about the ZX-Spectrum BASIC by reading the user guide
> which gives a lot of implementation details about this, but I don't
> remember the M100 user manual going so deep.
>
> > If it goes over 32767 on any permutation of peek'd values it will fail.
> > Probably worth generating every permutation and confirming it
> > works.
>
> I suspect the integer conversion is only made when the value is stored
> in the integer variable.
> For example, this totally works:
> A%=1E15/1E14:?A%
>
> The only thing to be careful with is using functions that can only
> work with integer arguments like \ or AND:
> ?1E15\1E14 => OV Error
> ?!E15AND1E14 => OV Error
>
> Eric
>

Re: [M100] Notoriously S.L.O.W BASIC posted - help speeding it up appreciated

[Mike Stein]

I don't see where it makes much difference In general in BASIC but in this
case there is a justification for MSB first ;-)
It goes from MSB to LSB because the same routine does 4 or 2 digits
depending on where you enter; line 5 gives the 4 digit address and it falls
through to line 7 which also gives the 2 digit bytes peeked and creates the
ASCII value for the text on the right hand side.

I suppose going the other way I'd always have to start at the beginning and
return after two digits* 'if'* doing peeks instead of addresses; more
complicated IMO.

m


On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 6:04 PM John R. Hogerhuis  wrote:

>
>
> On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 1:10 PM MikeS  wrote:
>
>> More good tips, thanks. Yes, I have to look at defining the various
>> types, especially the ones that can go above 32768.
>>
>> Concatenation with '+' is a habit from other languages I've worked with;
>> as a matter of fact in most cases the M100 lets you print without any
>> separators at all, e.g. print A$" to "B$ or a"plus"b
>>
>> Interesting discussion (at least for some of us ;-) )
>>
>>
>
> One overall thing in outputting numbers in any radix, is that it is
> *usually* most tractable in reverse of how you output since we generally
> write/read numbers with the most significant digit first. So for generating
> a number to output, It is most efficient to extract the least significant
> digit, shift or otherwise divide by the radix, prepend the extracted number
> onto a string/buffer, and when the value gets to zero, you're done, output
> the string.
>
> So for the number 1235 in decimal,
>
> 1235 MOD 10 = 5. Prepend ASC('0') + 5 on buffer. Divide remaining value by
> 10
> 123 MOD 10 = 3. Prepend  ASC('0') + 3 on buffer.  Divide remaining value
> by 10
> 12 MOD 10 = 2.  Prepend  ASC('0') + 2 on buffer.  Divide remaining value
> by 10
> 1 MOD 10 = 1. Prepend  ASC('0') + 1 on buffer. Divide remaining value by 10
> Remaining value is 0, so we're done. Buffer contains the number
>
> In your subroutine at 5 it is doing it MSB to LSB, I think. Overall your
> way may still be faster in BASIC even with the larger divisors.
>
> With hex it's a question though since MOD 16 can be done with AND 15 which
> is probably faster than a general integer 16 modulus. There's no bitshift
> operator so you still need a integer divide by 16%. Who knows how efficient
> an integer divide by 16 is in the interpreter versus 4096 (integer)
> divides.
>
> -- John.
>
>>

Re: [M100] is the m100 a trs-80? In walks like a, not is categorized as a

[Mike Stein]

Granted, it's convenient to have BASIC built into the system ROM but would
we love it any less if it were an option ROM as it is in a number of
similar machines?

You'd have more RAM available, and could easily switch to another
environment/language, e.g. MFORTH, especially if you have a REX or
equivalent.

Keep in mind that thousands of people used their M100 every day without
ever starting BASIC except perhaps to delete a file.

m

On Wed, Oct 19, 2022 at 5:51 PM David Szasz  wrote:

> Interesting discussion, but it's all a little like saying which came first
> "chicken or the egg."  Without BASIC the model 100 would have no charm at
> all.
>
> BTW: I see from the auction link for the Bill Gates Model 100 that it sold
> for around  $30K. That reminds me of many Ebay auction prices I've seen!
>
> On Thu, Oct 6, 2022 at 3:54 PM Brian K. White 
> wrote:
>
>> On 10/6/22 15:09, John R. Hogerhuis wrote:
>> > "HH/OS (Hand Held OS)"
>> >
>> > Probably better to keep it always abbreviated, at least for the 600 ;-)
>> >
>> > I guess the 600 is more hand-held than, say, a Compaq or Kaypro
>> luggable.
>> >
>> > -- John.
>>
>>
>> It is quite difficult to hold it in merely one hand. It's like over 9
>> lbs? You need at least an arm. Arm Held OS? Back Packable OS?
>>
>> I know what it's rightful name is, Donky Back OS
>>
>> --
>> bkw
>>
>>

Re: [M100] Talking over serial port

[Mike Stein]

Doesn't Steve's program handle the display part? Hooking the RS-232 receive
into the keyboard vector should also not be too difficult but as you say,
what's the point?

I don't recall whether the M100 has it (ISTR that it does) but some systems
have a built-in function, usually CTL-P that echoes everything on the
display to the printer (not just one screen like PRINT), which could in
turn be redirected to the com port and fed to a terminal program

m

On Thu, Oct 6, 2022 at 3:05 PM John R. Hogerhuis  wrote:

>
>
> On Thu, Oct 6, 2022 at 11:47 AM Brian K. White  wrote:
>
>> 2. Can I run M100 stuff from my remote?
>>
>>
>> What?
>>
>>
> I guess he means display what the M100 displays on the host and route
> characters sent from the host to the keyboard buffer of the M100.
>
> It could be done... it would require a program on the M100 side.
>
> Not sure of its utility though.
>
> Another idea would be using a host PC as a large display for the M100.
>
> So, say you have the M100 configured for 80x24, and a 80x24 xterminal or
> putty window on the PC displaying its output. Bytes and display codes
> routed out the serial port, with character set and control code mapping.
>
> Kind of like a simple DVI or VGA adapter.
>
> At a high baud rate, I'd guess it would be more performant than the native
> display.
>
> -- John.
>

Re: [M100] Modems and the modern world

[Mike Stein]

Not too terribly difficult; there are various hardware 'modems' (e.g.
Lantronix UDS-10) that can often be found used for around $30, or there are
a number of software apps that run on (through) another computer (e.g.
TCPSER).

Have fun researching!

m

On Thu, Oct 6, 2022 at 7:54 PM Will Senn  wrote:

> Awesome. Now, all I gotta do is figure out how to telnet from my m100...
>
> On 10/6/22 6:36 PM, Gregory McGill wrote:
>
> https://thekeep.net  i have modem and telnet
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 6, 2022 at 11:45 AM Tommy Phillips 
> wrote:
>
>> There are certainly BBSes running, but the majority are accessible via
>> telnet over the internet.
>>
>> bbsing.com
>> telnetbbsguide.com
>>
>>
>> On 10/6/2022 12:26 PM, Will Senn wrote:
>> > As you may have noticed, I'm putting my m100 through its paces and
>> > enjoying the process of treading down memory lane. Last night I
>> > finished coding up my banner program using the M100 font. Now I just
>> > need a printer (or retroprinter emulator) to try it out on... in the
>> > meantime, I'm catching up on remote communications. If I understand
>> > correctly, the m100 has a built in 300 baud modem. Am I understanding
>> > this correctly?
>> >
>> > If so, in this oh so modern era, how does one go about exercising it?
>> > I don't currently have a land line, so does it work with an iphone?
>> > (never saw that coming... can I connect 300 baud over iphone,
>> > hilarious, but there you have it). Are there BBSes still in operation?
>> >
>> > Later,
>> >
>> > Will
>>
>>
>> --
>> Tommy Phillips
>>
>> to...@tommyphillips.info
>> 303-981-4310
>>
>>
>

Re: [M100] is the m100 a trs-80? In walks like a, not is categorized as a

[Mike Stein]

There's no denying that BASIC is an important part of the Model T's overall
system but its operating system?
It is indeed closely tied to the Model T 'kernel' but is nevertheless just
another program in ROM.

No. the MENU is not the OS; it is the GUI interface to the OS, whatever
name you want to give that.

Except for 'KILL' most of what you mention is specific to BASIC; LOAD and
SAVE for example are part of every BASIC and specifically only load BASIC
program files;  if you're using your Model T for writing, communication,
scheduling etc. you will never need those functions. Try LOADing a text
file from BASIC.

Autostart only (re)starts a BASIC program AFAIK.

DATE$ and TIME$ are defined BASIC variables so that's where they are set
and used.

Granted, deleting and renaming files as well as loading machine language
files are done through BASIC, which is why I would consider it a
programming language and a limited file handler.

The point is that, unlike a Commodore system where you cannot do anything
without going through BASIC, you could just create a couple of small
machine language programs to KILL files, set the time and load .CO files,
and completely dispense with the BASIC interpreter.

Everything else needed to load, save, print and edit text files, download
and upload files from outside, maintain your schedule and address book etc.
and run any M/L programs that did not use any BASIC routines would all
still function as before.

A curiosity question: how do other languages, e.g. FORTH, get loaded and
run?

m


On Thu, Oct 6, 2022 at 3:12 PM Jerry Stratton  wrote:

> On Oct 6, 2022, at 11:57 AM, Mike Stein  wrote:
> > As I said elsewhere that point of view certainly applies to systems like
> Commodore where everything including loading other programs is done through
> BASIC, the system prompt is actually a BASIC command prompt
> >
> > IMO the Model T is uniquely different in fundamental ways; the 'system
> prompt' is the MENU and you can certainly load and run TELCOM, TEXT, etc.
> and most machine language programs without ever invoking BASIC at all.
>
> This would imply, though, that as soon as you write a file manager for a
> system and make it autostart, BASIC stops being the system’s OS. But even
> further, the MENU system, at least on the Model 100, has very limited
> system control. You can’t even delete a file through the MENU. If you want
> to set up an autostart program, that’s a BASIC function. Setting the DATE
> and TIME must be handled in BASIC. BASIC on the Model T arguably is even
> more of an operating system than BASIC on the Commodore. As far as I know,
> BASIC on the Commodore cannot shut the machine down (POWER OFF).
>
> Loading new programs from external storage (and saving old ones) is all
> handled through BASIC;  if you look in Tandy’s Quick Reference for the
> Model 100, it doesn’t say that typing “LOAD" is the equivalent of choosing
> F2 when in BASIC. It says that choosing F2 is the equivalent of typing
> “LOAD”. (Literally so.) The same for F1, F3, F4, F5, and F8.
>
> It’s certainly possible to argue that the MENU system on the Model T is a
> very rudimentary operating system akin to those on modern mobile devices;
> I’ve done so myself. But BASIC definitely remains “the” operating system.
> On the Model 100 especially, no one could operate their device without
> regularly going into BASIC to clear out files, correct the time, set the
> power timer, and so on.
>
> Jerry Stratton
> https://hoboes.com/coco/
> “We invented machinery to save and surpass our bodies’ labour; now we have
> invented computers to save and surpass the labour of our minds.”—Peter
> Laurie, The Joy of Computers
>
>

Re: [M100] is the m100 a trs-80? In walks like a, not is categorized as a

[Mike Stein]

As I said elsewhere that point of view certainly applies to systems like
Commodore where everything including loading other programs is done through
BASIC, the system prompt is actually a BASIC command prompt

IMO the Model T is uniquely different in fundamental ways; the 'system
prompt' is the MENU and you can certainly load and run TELCOM, TEXT, etc.
and most machine language programs without ever invoking BASIC at all.

m

On Thu, Oct 6, 2022 at 12:46 PM Jerry Stratton  wrote:

> On Sep 29, 2022, at 4:52 PM, Tommy Phillips 
> wrote:
> > A BASIC operating environment doesn't really meet the definition of
> "operating system".
>
> I just recently re-read John G. Kemeny’s “Man and the Computer”. He
> specifically describes BASIC as an attempt to create “a new language… that
> facilitated communication between man and machine.”
>
> While it was written for time-sharing computers rather than as the sole
> operating system, this philosophy made it a natural choice for a very
> simple operating system for these earlier computers. It was interactive and
> was “a direct communication between computer and human being” that
> translated well into a simple command-line operating system.
>
> Kemeny envisioned BASIC programming as “teaching the computer” and
> “imparting intelligence to computers”. The “collaboration” that Kemeny
> envisioned BASIC facilitating between man and machine is somewhat forgotten
> today, when even BASIC tends to involve multiple steps and is used as an
> application separate from the machine. But that philosophy baked into the
> language, made it, in my opinion, almost inevitable (when combined with
> BASIC’s very low memory and CPU overhead) that it would be used for the
> operating system as well.
>
> https://archive.org/details/mancomputer00keme/
> Jerry Stratton
> https://hoboes.com/coco/
> “We invented machinery to save and surpass our bodies’ labour; now we have
> invented computers to save and surpass the labour of our minds.”—Peter
> Laurie, The Joy of Computers
>
>

Re: [M100] is the m100 a trs-80? In walks like a, not is categorized as a

[Mike Stein]

It's definitely unique and different from most 'normal' operating systems.

A different point of view would call the ROM the operating system, with
MENU the GUI/browser that is not part of BASIC but optionally selects it,
just like other apps  like TELCOM, TEXT etc. and machine language programs
which also save and load files etc.; they don't need or involve BASIC at
all. From an OS point of view BASIC just supplies some standalone file
management and a programming language.

It's quite different from systems like Commodore etc. where BASIC does
indeed supply the main interface and control.

In some ways I actually find the Model T OS similar to Android etc.

m

On Thu, Oct 6, 2022 at 10:12 AM B 9  wrote:

> It is definitely an "Operating System", not just "BASIC".
>
>- It hides device drivers behind nice interfaces. For example, just by
>changing the filename prefix one can save a file to a RAM disk filesystem,
>the serial port, a cassette tape, or even the printer.
>- As a file grows in the RAM disk,  behind the scenes, the system is
>constantly moving other files around in memory to make room.
>- Memory is dynamically partitioned so that the RAM disk coexists with
>the RAM used as working memory by programs.
>- And of course it has all the nice utilities like the point-and-click
>file browser, serial terminal, and an editor which isn't half bad even by
>today's standards.
>
> I've been wondering what this Model T / Kyotronic / NEC operating system
> was called. I saw somebody referring to it as "BASIC-85", but I'm pretty
> sure that's wrong. Recently, Bill Gates' Model 100 was auctioned
> 
> and the details referred to the firmware system he and Jey Suzuki wrote as 
> *"Microsoft’s
> N82 BASIC 80 programming software"*. That's a term I've never heard
> before. Has anyone else?
>
> —b9
>
> On Thu, Sep 29, 2022 at 5:04 PM Brian K. White 
> wrote:
>
>> On 9/29/22 17:52, Tommy Phillips wrote:
>> > A BASIC operating environment doesn't really meet the definition of
>> > "operating system".
>>
>> It is literally, the operating system of that device. There is no
>> particular set of features that defines "operating system". The literal
>> and only definition of operating system is the system that operates the
>> device.
>>
>>
>> > But maybe I am being too pedantic. It wouldn't be the first time.
>> >
>> > On 9/29/2022 2:29 PM, Peter Vollan wrote:
>> >> Huh? The Model 100 says "Copyr. 1983 Microsoft" when you go into
>> >> basic. It is common knowledge that Bill wrote the OS himself.
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, 29 Sept 2022 at 09:08, Tommy Phillips
>> >>  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> ... and if I recall correctly, the Model 16 ran Xenix, thus being
>> >> the only TRS-80 to run an O/S from Microsoft.
>> >>
>> >> This, of course, was years before Linux.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On 9/29/2022 9:04 AM, Chris Trainor wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> But still mostly a brand… the basis for the 80 was the Z80 in
>> >>> their early stuff, but like the Model 16 had a 68k in it. 
>> >>> Plus even tho the II had a Z80 like the I, III & IV, I thought
>> >>> operationally it was substantially different and none of the
>> >>> I/III/IV stuff would work on it? (never used one, remember my
>> >>> grandfather having one at work, but that’s it) .Plus the 2 &
>> >>> 12 were very similar, but the 16, meant to be an ‘upgrade’ from
>> >>> the 12 was way different (being 68k based like Apple/Amiga
>> >>> products, but not as ‘hip’ as those  )
>> >>>
>> >>> --Chris
>> >>>
>> >>> *From:* M100 
>> >>>  *On Behalf Of *Justin
>> >>> Poirier
>> >>> *Sent:* Thursday, September 29, 2022 8:04 AM
>> >>> *To:* m100@lists.bitchin100.com
>> >>> *Subject:* Re: [M100] is the m100 a trs-80? In walks like a, not
>> >>> is categorized as a
>> >>>
>> >>> TRS-80 starts for "Tandy Radio Shack" and "Z80 microprocessor."
>> >>> The M100/T102/T200 have an Intel 80C51 microcontroller, not a
>> >>> Zilog Z80, like the Model I, II, III, IV had, and even worse the
>> >>> TRS-80 Color Computers have a Motorola 6809, so even in
>> >>> themselves, they were not consistent in sticking to their own
>> brand.
>> >>>
>> >>> --Justin
>> >>>
>> >>> On Wed, 2022-09-28 at 17:09 -0400, chri...@macross.com wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> TRS80 is a brand.  There are substantial differences between
>> >>> the different models for the most part.  Especially ones like
>> >>> the Model II.  The 1, 3 and 4 had some limited compatibility
>> >>> but stuff written for one wouldn't necessarily work in the
>> >>> other.  (Except that in theory you could boot a 4 into 3 mode
>> >>> to run 3 apps, but that wasn't really 'compatible' ).   So
>> >>>   

Re: [M100] Character bitmaps

[Mike Stein]

30481,  7711H - Start of LCD character generator shape table.  Five bytes
per char for
 the first 128 characters.  6 bytes per char for characters 128-255.

On Sun, Sep 25, 2022 at 1:55 PM Will Senn  wrote:

> All,
>
> This is my first post, but hopefully not my last.
>
> I originally had an M100 in 1984 that I hocked for $50 bucks at a local
> pawn shop for food money in my freshman year. I never went back (I didn't
> get the $50 plus interest for ages). Now, it's 38 years later and I'm
> finally getting it out of hock (so to speak). I remember writing a basic
> program that read the character bitmaps out of ROM (at least that's how I
> remember it) and used the bitmap as a basis for a banner in the same font.
> I think I'd like my first program on my new/old M100 to be a banner program
> and so I'm digging around looking for where, in ROM, the character bitmaps
> are stored. I've looked here, there, and everywhere to no avail. Is there a
> set of bitmaps stored in ROM, and if so where?
>
> If I remember correctly, each character was represented as a set of 8
> (maybe 7) 6 (maybe 5) bit binary numbers:
>
> 001000
> 010100
> 100010
> 100010
> 10
> 100010
> 100010
> 00
>
> or somesuch for A...
> resulting in something like:
>
>   1
>  1 1
> 1   1
> 1   1
> 1
> 1   1
> 1   1
>
> being displayed. The zeros on the bottom and right may be on the top or
> left, or not there at all, but there are spaces between and below
> characters, either in the bitmap or added by the display functions.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Will
>
>
>

Re: [M100] Questions about tokenizing BASIC in UNIX

[Mike Stein]

When Steve and I were playing with M100 to M100 communication over the
internet way back when, he spent a fair bit of time trying to overcome the
small buffer in the Model Ts but I don't think he could ever get it to work
100%. IIRC reducing the buffer size in the ethernet 'modem' down to one did
solve the problem but wasn't an option with all versions of the adapters.

m

On Fri, Sep 23, 2022 at 1:09 PM John R. Hogerhuis  wrote:

>
>
> On Fri, Sep 23, 2022 at 2:59 AM Brian White  wrote:
>
>>
>> I believe all the right chip does is help, and make more code more likely
>> to make it through
>>
>
> Chip/driver wise the two things I've observed:
>
> You can configure the FTDI driver buffering threshold on Windows all the
> way down to 1 byte, which I think is what we want. This is really about
> decreasing transmit latency on the Windows side in case of a sensitive
> receiver on the Model T side... that is, TS-DOS.
> The prolific drive has bugs under the Windows API, last I checked. There
> is a facility under Win32 and the .Net Framework for reading a block of
> data with a timeout. It works with the FTDI, it doesn't work with Prolific.
> I believe it is a driver issue. I can work around it in software, and have,
> but just generally spec it out of commercial projects because it is not
> correct.
>
> On Linux, I've never really noticed a difference between Prolific and
> FTDI. But my experience is the same as yours, that software flow
> control does not work with our laptop. Linux is too slow to react to a
> flow-off presumably since it is in-band in the data and gets buffered, and
> overwhelms the tiny 64-byte, interrupt driven receive buffer on the Model
> T. And as Mike mentions, USB, Wifi-Serial add create even more overhead and
> burstiness.
>
> I could imagine some low level hardware scheme (specific
> hardware+driver+configuration) overcoming the buffering of XON/XOFF
> specifically, in the wired case... but this is the first I've heard of it.
> And it really seems like it would have to be configured. Hardware isn't
> normally involved in software flow control.
>
> -- John.
>

Re: [M100] Questions about tokenizing BASIC in UNIX

[Mike Stein]

Terminal sessions aren't usually a problem unless you're sending a file to
the Model T; manual typing in either direction isn't likely to overrun a
buffer and whatever the T is connected to will probably be able to handle
the data stream.

Even receiving a file is usually not a problem if you're connected through
'real' RS232 ports unless the T has to scroll the screen; you may be able
to avoid that.

The main issue is when the T has to spend time processing the incoming data
somehow and it's in packets as it is when using a USB, BT or WiFi<>serial
converter; by the time the sending computer sees an XOFF there are probably
enough characters already on the way to overflow the buffer. Some drivers
have the option to set the packet length, which may solve the issue.

m

On Fri, Sep 23, 2022 at 11:47 AM Brian Brindle  wrote:

> One way under Linux I have gotten around the issues of software flow
> control is to use screen for my serial terminal sessions. It has software
> flow control support built in. A must if you want to use ssh or another app
> that doesn't play well with stty.
>
> Brian
>
>
> On Fri, Sep 23, 2022, 5:59 AM Brian White  wrote:
>
>> I don't believe this is enough to ensure clean data. I must have a dozen
>> real ftdi adapters from different manufacturers and I keep having to
>> increase the per-byte sleep in dlplus' bootstrapper and tsend.ps1 and
>> PDDuino as I discover new basic programs to feed in.
>>
>> Some programs will ingest fine at 5ms/byte, some will fail on some
>> particular part of one line, always the same spot, unless the sleep is
>> increased to 6ms.
>>
>> Then I discover some other code that fails at 6 but succeeds at 7.
>>
>> Some of the problem code I just found in the M100SIG, some were new
>> things like the REX setup utils, some I created the new problem by
>> refactoring existing tpdd client loaders to make them smaller. This made
>> them apparently more difficult to ingest, but they are still legal correct
>> BASIC, so any procedure needs to be able to handle the worst case or else
>> it's no good.
>>
>> For an example, one of the loaders I re-worked, used to work fine before,
>> and then the reworked version would always be missing a : in the middle of
>> one long line of code. Always the same byte missing. And it didn't cause
>> the transfer to fail immediately, it tokenized on the fly without apparent
>> error. But the program was broken and didn't work when you try to run it.
>>
>> This is all with real ftdi adapters and with xon/off enabled on both ends.
>>
>> It may work at 1200 or something where the low baud rate does the same
>> job as a sleep between bytes, but no way at 19200.
>>
>> I will put together a few test cases that expose the problem. And if this
>> method does somehow work then that would indeed be pretty interesting and
>> good to know.
>>
>> I believe all the right chip does is help, and make more code more likely
>> to make it through, but not actually guarantee it. It probably does make a
>> large improvement, and you can probably show numerous examples of data that
>> fails on one adapter and succeeds on an ftdi chip.
>>
>> --
>> bkw
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 22, 2022, 8:57 PM John R. Hogerhuis  wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Sep 22, 2022 at 5:32 PM B 9  wrote:
>>>

 Of particular note for troubleshooting is that, if some of the data
 gets transferred, but it is garbled or you get a ?DS ERROR, then the
 problem is that your PC's serial port does not support "ON CHIP SOFTWARE
 FLOW CONTROL".  One solution is to buy a serial card or USB cable with an
 FTDI chip in it. (Other companies make ICs that support on chip software
 flow control, I even have a cheap Prolific 2303 device that does, but FTDI
 is the only company I know of whose chips are supposed to always work. )


>>> I've never heard of this on-chip software flow control.All I knew was
>>> that software flow does not work under Linux. My experience is software
>>> flow control with a Model T *does* work on Windows.
>>>
>>> Is that something you have to enable? Seems awfully strange to have the
>>> chip interceding in-band. Automatic hardware flow control I have heard of.
>>>
>>> This failure on Linux is why I made HTERM to use hardware flow control
>>>
>>> If there's a consistent way to make it work on Linux, it would be good
>>> to know. Even just with FTDI chipset. Windows prolific drivers are trash. I
>>> don't know about Prolific on Linux.
>>>
>>> Is the stty command you put supposed to enable on-chip software flow
>>> control? Which part?
>>>
>>> *s**tty -F /dev/ttyUSB0 ixon ixoff  stop ^S start ^Q  -onlcr -icrnl
>>>  eof ^Z  19200*
>>>
>>> -- John.
>>>

Re: [M100] DVI

[Mike Stein]

Thanks for sharing; the price sounds reasonable, I don't think it'll take
much to fix that flickering

Mine has two normal 5 1/4 drives although they are in fact two-sided; I
added the second drive myself and when I couldn't find a drive to match the
original TEC drive I installed a pair of Panasonics.

I haven't dug it out for a while but it is indeed pretty clean and although
I haven't used it very much recently I've never had any problems with it.

The 3.5" drives were just a fun experiment to see if they would work
without any modifications; they did indeed, but of course without modifying
the DVI firmware you still only have 180 KB per drive, regardless of
single/double sided or 5 1/4 vs. 3.5"

Nevertheless, if you don't mind being incompatible with anyone else there
may be some slight advantage to using 3.5" diskettes; easier to come by,
easier to store, maybe more reliable dpending on whom you listen to, etc.

Hope you get that flicker sorted and have fun with it!

m


On Sat, Sep 17, 2022 at 8:16 PM Spencer  wrote:

> Hello Mike.
>
> I found it on ebay and paid $140 plus shipping/taxes.
>
> Does your have 2 5 1/4" or a mix of 5 1/4 and 3.5" drives?
>
> Your pics show the unit as really clean.  Did you have to do any repairs
> to it?
>
> Thanks
>
> On Saturday, September 17, 2022 at 02:28:28 PM EDT, Mike Stein <
> mhs.st...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> I did find some pictures from when I was playing with 3.5" drives:
>
> [image: image.jpeg]
> [image: image.jpeg]
> [image: image.jpeg]
>
> On Sat, Sep 17, 2022 at 11:12 AM Spencer  wrote:
>
> Hello Mike.
>
> I actually found an Tandy unit, but the video flickers in and out.  Is
> yours something you did or a Tandy unit? Would you mind sending a pic or
> two?
>
> Thanks!
>
>