Re: [ozmidwifery] fenugreek
I have had adverse reactions to fenugreek every time I have tried it and when I spoke to my homeopath about it she actually said she never recommends it herself because it seems rather innocuous but is actually quite a powerful diuretic and blood thinner and can cause exactly the problems I was having (dehydration no matter how much I drank, associated headaches, dizziness, and more). You might want to consider something like blessed thistle instead? There are so homeopathics which can boost supply wonderfully. On 14/02/2007, at 9:45 AM, gypsymidwife wrote: Dear All Just wondering if someone can help me with the therapeutic dose of fenugreek. I have heard it 's amazing to increase milk supply but as it says nothing of this on the bottle, I would like to know if others have had experience with its use. Thanks in advance. Catherine Pearson.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Serena Esther arrived
Woohoo!! What wonderful, wonderful news Phillipa. Congratulations to you and all the family and friends who supported you. On 04/02/2007, at 12:01 AM, Philippa Scott wrote: Hi all, I thought you would all like to know that Serena Esther Scott was born gently and beautifully into the water at home on 1/02/2007. She was a lovely 9pnd 7oz or 4280grams (my biggest by far). It was a perfect birth for us with no tears or bleeds or anything else to necessitate the need for assistance. As you can imagine I am on a high. Alana Brianna watched with awe and excitement and are talking about it lot. It was so wonderful to have them there. Trevor is finally convinced home water birth is the way to go, he was terrific. All my women folk where as amazing as I knew they would be I am so blessed to have friends such as these. The experience would not have been the same with out them. Cheers Philippa Scott Birth Buddies - Doula Assisting women and their families in the preparation towards childbirth and labour. President of Friends of the Birth Centre Townsville
Re: [ozmidwifery] co-sleeping
Maybe I am alone in this but having coslept with our first and used a cot for #2 I found the opposite to be true - I get so much better quality sleep without the baby in bed with me that it is definitely worthwhile getting up even three times a night to feed her and then put her back in the cot. She is wonderfully secure and content and I really feel we have brought out the best in her sleep tendencies rather than the worst as we did with #1. Sleeping well is a life skill and to be honest I don't feel that we did #1 any favourss. I am not suggesting that cosleeping be discrouraged, we would absolutely have done it again if the bassinets/cot plan hadn't worked. But I guess I just don't think that cosleeping is necessarily a miracle cure either. I think the best solution is assuring parents that cosleeping can be done safely, that they can't spoil a baby and that they should do what works for them whatever that is. On 22/01/2007, at 8:53 PM, James Fairbairn wrote: but the positives are - as everyone has mentioned - a less tired mum - not needing to completely wake up in the night when feeding and having a more secure and contented baby
Re: [ozmidwifery] Pregnancy and Crohns
When I was confirming what my health insurance would cover ($2k towards a planned homebirth and a private transfer if it became necessary) I explained that my pregnancy was somewhat high risk but the birth, if I was healthy at term, should not be. They asked what my OB thought about my home birth plans and left it at that (I believe I said She knows I am planning to birth at home if all is well or something like that). I don't get how they could possibly dictate what is safe beyond asking what your carer/s think? On 16/01/2007, at 9:28 PM, Lisa Barrett wrote: ~thanks for that. I did tell her that I don't believe her to be high risk, but her health insurance fund has stepped in and said that the only place she would be safe to birth is at a large tertiary hospital (lucky her). It is sad to see that a woman who should be excited and cherishing every moment of her pregnancy has been fed doubt and despair from ill informed professionals.~ That's interesting, how long have insurance companies been dictating terms of birth here? Lisa Barrett
Re: [ozmidwifery] Pregnancy testing
Some women just never spill bHCG, and just in general you can get a false negative but pretty much never a false positive. On 08/01/2007, at 2:59 PM, Andrea Quanchi wrote: Anne the pregnancy test reading levels of bHCG which are elevated only in the first trimester and peak at 60-90 days post conception. They then decrease after 10-11 weeks and plateau at 100-130 days at a lower level that is maintained until birth and is not detectable by 2 weeks post birth. What the sensitivity of the test is I am not exactly sure but the answer is probably both these things. The level was not high at this stage so by the time the baby had been dead for a week the level was low enough not to be detected by the test. Hope this helps Andrea Q On 08/01/2007, at 2:16 PM, Anne Smith wrote: I have a question for you wise women – will give you some background first. Young woman with a concealed or unacknowledged pregnancy at 26 weeks presented with acute abdominal pain to a remote area health clinic. No midwife was present and doctor had not practiced obstetrics for “years”. The woman did not appear pregnant at all. They did a pregnancy test and it was negative. They thought that renal colic may have been the cause. No one could palpate contractions but eventually the doctor did a VE and discovered “something there”. A very experienced nurse then “delivered” (and I use the word advisedly), the baby which was in a breech position. Traumatic for everyone especially the woman, who was then transferred by plane to the nearest hospital. I will be attending a debriefing session on Friday and would like to be able to at least explain the negative pregnancy test. Was this due to the demise of the baby (perhaps up to a week previously) or have the hormones altered so much that the test will not react - a. because of FDIU or b. advanced pregnancy or c. was there a technical problem with the test itself Your input would be much appreciated. Keep up the discussions on why women don’t choose or don’t know to choose more wisely when contemplating pregnancy because we do have a responsibility as midwives for disseminating this knowledge. Many thanks Anne (in the NT)
Re: [ozmidwifery] Haemorroids
Are they getting a brand of witch hazel with too much alcohol in it? It should be pure double distilled witch hazel which usually has the tiniest amount of alcohol. On 24/12/2006, at 6:49 PM, suzi and brett wrote: Some women have complained to me that the witch hazel tincture burns so much they cant bear it...have you heard of that prob? There is also that thick Witch hazel barrier cream. Also warm compress in labour is supportive. Suzi - Original Message - From: Philippa Scott To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 1:35 AM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Haemorroids My naturopath out me on something called Phytopro by Metagenics. I take 2 3 times a day and they are gone within 1-2 days. When I stop taking them they come back. I only have them during pg and shortly after so not long to go know but they have been great. Cheers Philippa Scott Birth Buddies - Doula Assisting women and their families in the preparation towards childbirth and labour. President of Friends of the Birth Centre Townsville From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Janet Fraser Sent: Thursday, 21 December 2006 12:59 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Haemorroids Tissue salts are really effective and available in most health food shops, topical witchazel is excellent too. J - Original Message - From: Michelle Windsor To: Ozmidwifery Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2006 12:26 PM Subject: [ozmidwifery] Haemorroids Hi everyone, Just needing some help for a friend who is 36/40 with very painful haemorroids. Is there anything that can be done apart from symptomatic relief and not becoming constipated? And in your experience how painful do women find them when they are pushing? Thanks in advance Michelle Send instant messages to your online friends http:// au.messenger.yahoo.com
Re: [ozmidwifery] Are breastfed kids smarter?
You know I have friends whose mother's recollections of what happened when they were babies vary rather wildly from what was recorded in their blue books when they tried to confirm stuff to see if there was a family pattern going on with the next generation. You would assume that mothers would recall accurately whether they breastfed at all, but I would not find it hard to believe that memories of when solids or formula were introduced might be hazy or inaccurate. I think of my first daughter as not starting solids until she was well over a year because that is when she consumed enough for her poo to change, I have no real memories of trying to feed her solids much before that, but I recently found photos that prove otherwise and this was less than 4 yrs ago! On 18/12/2006, at 8:55 PM, diane wrote: Cant trust a woman to know how she fed her baby Another problem with this study and many others is their reliance on mother's memories of how they fed their infants, often a long time after the fact. Cheers, Di - Original Message - From: Andrea Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Sunday, December 17, 2006 10:29 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] Are breastfed kids smarter? From today's Sunday Herald http://www.smh.com.au/news/parenting/breastfed-kids-smarter/ 2006/12/15/1165685867351.html Andrea -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. __ NOD32 1924 (20061215) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com
Re: [ozmidwifery] deep vein thrombosis in pregnancy and birth
The message I got as a consumer when taking clexane was that whether to stop at 36-38w and wait for labour or whether to be induced 24 hrs after stopping depends very much on the severity of the condition that requires the clexane in the first place. I stopped at 34w. But this really should be a case by case decision I would think. With more severe problems the concern is to get you into labour as soon as the anti coagulant is enough out of your system to be safer but before it is too far gone and you introduce other risks... On 06/12/2006, at 9:33 PM, Ken Ward wrote: NO -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Jenny Turnbull Sent: Wednesday, 6 December 2006 6:04 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] deep vein thrombosis in pregnancy and birth so is an induction really necessary? I think that is her main concern. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 5:32 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] deep vein thrombosis in pregnancy and birth In my experience woemn just stop taking the anticoagulants at around 36 weeks. - Original Message - From: Jenny Turnbull To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 4:36 PM Subject: [ozmidwifery] deep vein thrombosis in pregnancy and birth A lady has approached me with the following question. Her baby is due at the end of January. Hello, hoping I could get some opinions on the following matter. I had a deep vein thrombosis, in my calf at 12 weeks of pregnancy and have been taking Clexane since then. I am due late Jan 2007 My obsterician has flagged the idea of an induction (somewhere around 38 week mark) so that I can time stopping the medication with the birth. Her concern is I will bleed too much otherwise. I would like some help on the following: what would be some good questions to ask the specialist to help weigh up my options for birth eg to induce or not and other related matters eg relative risks Are you aware of mothers that have given birth whilst taking Clexane and what the outcomes have been. Thanks for your responses, I will forward them on Jenny No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.409 / Virus Database: 268.15.9/573 - Release Date: 12/5/2006
Re: [ozmidwifery] independent midwifery
It puzzles me too. Why choose an evidence based carer and then take them somewhere they can't provide you with it? Because if you know you have a higher than average change of NEEDING a hospital if might be nice to have someone who knows you, cares about you and will actually give you evidence based advice while you are there. Women in this situation need an ipm MORE not less if you ask me... Even my midwife confessed (after the magical homebirth) that she had expected me to end up in hospital with a medical extravaganza given my health issues. Without my midwife not only would there not have been the option of homebirth if I made it to term healthy, there probably would have been almost no chance of even a remotely natural birth in hospital, for a whole host of reasons I haven't time to explain right now. Planning a home birth should not be a requirement of hiring an IPM. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] independent midwifery
I am sorry, I should have added that there were no one-to-one options available to me at a hospital practical to my location and none of the women I know who have recently birthed at the hospital I was booked to have received any sort of personalised care. The care might possibly be evidenced based but certainly there is no rapport or getting to know women as individuals. If I wanted the care I described I needed and IMP in my current location. I also wanted the choice of a homebirth if I made it to term healthy enough, but that was a big if at the start of my pregnancy, which is why I was booked into a hospital too, and had a private OB to manage my medications, monitoring, and other specialist care. Our first daughter was born in a fabulous hospital in Adelaide and the care provide to us by the midwives could not be faulted. If that hospital were still an option for us we might have made some different choices, though it's highly unlikely I would have qualified for midwife care in the public hospital system given my high risk status. On 01/12/2006, at 11:45 AM, sharon wrote: I am an hospital based midwife and I believe that I do give evidence based care, the hospital that I work for is working on a homebirth standard presently and the group practice will soon be able to offer women homebirths provided the individual midwife is confortable to offer this service. The individual midwives in the DE are quick to develop rapport with their women and they also are good at getting to know the women and their needs. I dislike people on this list who consitantly run down hospital based midwives and the care that they provide can people please remember that IMP is not for everyone although it is a good way to develop and maintain your skills. cheers -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jo Bourne Sent: Friday, 1 December 2006 8:28 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] independent midwifery It puzzles me too. Why choose an evidence based carer and then take them somewhere they can't provide you with it? Because if you know you have a higher than average change of NEEDING a hospital if might be nice to have someone who knows you, cares about you and will actually give you evidence based advice while you are there. Women in this situation need an ipm MORE not less if you ask me... Even my midwife confessed (after the magical homebirth) that she had expected me to end up in hospital with a medical extravaganza given my health issues. Without my midwife not only would there not have been the option of homebirth if I made it to term healthy, there probably would have been almost no chance of even a remotely natural birth in hospital, for a whole host of reasons I haven't time to explain right now. Planning a home birth should not be a requirement of hiring an IPM. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.409 / Virus Database: 268.15.2/560 - Release Date: 30/11/2006 -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] homebirth costs
Speaking as a consumer who just paid sydney prices for a homebirth - the cost of living is higher here than most if not all other cities in Australia. It's one of those odd things that some careers are FAR better paid in Sydney than elsewhere, others are not. We, for example are far better off living in Sydney because my husband's pay is FAR better, my mother on the other hand (who recently moved here to be near us) was financially better off in Adelaide as her pay here the same (or less) but her costs are higher. I have no problem with someone who can set their own rate of pay doing so at a level that is proportional to their cost of living. My midwife came to me for all visits, she was with us for a magical birth at the end of a fairly awful pregnancy that could not possibly have ended so well without her care and the post natal care in our home was exceptional. She took care of things like having synto and vit k available should i need them, and everything else we might need. I believe she takes on a maximum of 24 clients a year, this year more like 10-12. Even with 24 clients, let alone 10-12, less costs I imagine it works out to an average wage at best. We should not have to pay for homebirth, but neither should midwives have to earn less than they are worth, so we can have the choice. On 18/11/2006, at 10:46 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Barb, I think it's wonderful that you had such an amazing birth and wish for all women to have such an experience. From my understanding, many Sydney midwives ask their clients to come to them not vice versa. So a lot of their care is not midwifery care at home, rather it is out of their home until the final weeks. I'm not sure about all midwives, but this seems more common place now in Sydney. And, you get paid $4000 to have a child these days. Midwifery care at home? It's a bargain. I find it very interesting that people see you get paid to have a baby. I was under the impression that the baby bonus was given to help mums to be able to afford to stay home longer from work, or upgrade their car if they need more space, or buy car seats, slings, good food for nourishment while breastfeeding etc. The only women I know that can afford to spend that whole $4000 on midwifery care are the women that didn't need that money in the first place. The women that choose to spend the whole amount even though they can't afford it, because they have no other choice in Sydney, have no benefits from the baby bonus for living expenses with a newborn. There is no bargain if you can't afford it. I understand the value of midwives and continuity of care and midwifery care at home, but why should women in Sydney and NSW be paying that much more?? Nobody has answered that question. I'm not questioning the value of midwifery care, more why Sydney midwifery care is so much more 'valuable' in the dollars and sense kind of way? Love Abby xo -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] homebirth costs
Actually my out of pocket costs for my OB were pretty much equal to my out of pocket costs for my midwife. Even with private health insurance and the medicare safetynet private OBs are far more expensive in Sydney than elsewhere too. The real question as far as Im concerned ( yes I have a 'vested interest' as a midwife, which I guess is slightly different to the vested interest I had when I was a consumer of homebirth midwifery services) is why are women being made to pay out of their own pockets at all just because they choose to birth at home? If women had to pay up-front for obstetric services, ie they were not provided 'free' by the public health system nor were rebatable by the majority of private health insurance companies, then this conversation might have some balance to it. I think some of the answers to the question of differences in charges of homebirth midwifery services is more about supply and demand, cost of living in different geographical areas, the fact as Mary has stated that midwifery service is traditionally undervalued not just within the profession but by other health professionals and consumers alike.and we are meant to be seen as 'caring' and how caring can you be when you actually charge what your service is worth, when you want to provide care to women whether they can afford it or not, regardless of their financial situation, when the midwife in the next suburb or state charges significantly differently because she has different financial needs or different ways of practice or . Please just take into account that every single independently practising midwife I know has worked for no or very little pay, sometimes by choice because we dont want to turn away a woman desperate for a homebirth, or because we've had a client who either didnt pay or didnt pay the agreed amount. Please also take into account that every single homebirth a midwife attends is a major financial risk in terms of the lack of PI insurance - we can be sued by anyone at any time with no recourse to any sort of support, and yes we all want to believe this doesnt happen but it does actually, enough that a significant number of midwives stopped practicing independantly after the PII was no longer available. Rather than asking why are women in NSW paying more, the question should be why are women in other states paying less? And why are they being made to pay at all, when homebirth is provided free in some very specific areas and obstetric care is 'free' everywhere? -- Jennifairy Gillett RM Midwife in Private Practice Women’s Health Teaching Associate ITShare volunteer – Santos Project Co-ordinator ITShare SA Inc - http://itshare.org.au/ ITShare SA provides computer systems to individuals groups, created from donated hardware and opensource software
Re: [ozmidwifery] BFing lactose intolerant babies.
http://kellymom.com is a great source of breastfeeding information. On 25/10/2006, at 8:32 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi everyone, I'm after some advice or information of BFing a baby who is lactose intolerant. Where can I find some information on this? Cheers, Sam. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Speaking of steps backwards...
Well there is nothing they can do about making you accept a medical procedure you don't want!! Her body, her baby, her choice to be constantly monitored or not. On 02/10/2006, at 5:04 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From a woman wanting a VBAC in my forums, who is also a dear friend and I hope to support her if she gives birth some time around the Australian Doula Conference: I was just told at my midwife appt this week that the hospital has changed policies in the past few months and now required constant fetal monitoring of all induction, VBAC and higher risk births. Now, I am all for making sure our babies are healthy and doing well during labour, BUT our hospital seems to have variations of women's positions during monitoring which is frustrating. One midwife told me I would have to stay in bed, another said that some women are able to be on the fit ball may not be able to roam heaps but are able to change positions and get more comfortable. I have in my birth plan a clear indication that I don't want to be monitored constantly, that I want to be able to have breaks shower etc etc... she said today the only option for that would be once my membranes were released attaching a monitor to the baby's skull. And I don't know how I feel about that either. ...this is Redlands Public, but apparently its gone through all of QLD Health public systems that higher risk pregnancy's need constant monitoring during labour. I told the midwife today that under no circumstances would I agree to constant monitoring. I asked her what they could do about it she said nothing really... Why is the answer always 'There's nothing we can do about it'? Makes my blood boil - if enough people care we CAN do something about it... -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Breastfeeding feedback
Actually this list is one of the only places I have heard this side of the coin, most often I hear women say I thought it was supposed to be natural and easy and just work... I wish someone had told me it might be hard and need some work, that we might BOTH need to learn how to do it. At 3:51 PM +1000 9/8/06, Gail McKenzie wrote: Hi All. The feedback I've gotten so far seems to mirror what I instinctively believe breastfeeding to be. Pamphlets that are distributed at the hospital advocate breastfeeding as a learned response from both mother and baby. Um...May I say.CRAP? -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Breastfeeding feedback
I am a consumer who spends a lot of time listening to other women. At 4:52 PM +1000 9/8/06, Gail McKenzie wrote: Jo, do you work in a hospital in a postnatal ward? I want to know what homebirth midwives know about this From: Jo Bourne [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Breastfeeding feedback Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 16:07:53 +1000 Actually this list is one of the only places I have heard this side of the coin, most often I hear women say I thought it was supposed to be natural and easy and just work... I wish someone had told me it might be hard and need some work, that we might BOTH need to learn how to do it. At 3:51 PM +1000 9/8/06, Gail McKenzie wrote: Hi All. The feedback I've gotten so far seems to mirror what I instinctively believe breastfeeding to be. Pamphlets that are distributed at the hospital advocate breastfeeding as a learned response from both mother and baby. Um...May I say.CRAP? -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Placenta Praevia IVF Article
Aaarrgh! Chapman should know better than to spout this rot: As a woman gets older she's more likely to have placenta praevia and obviously women who have IVF are older. The majority of women treated at my clinic are under 35 and I am fairly sure IVFA's stats are similar (Chapman's clinic, I think). IVFers have enough trouble with the general public thinking IVF is used by older women who forgot to have kids without Drs adding to this misconception. Most people doing IVF are either of average chid bearing age (for our times) or at least started trying at an average age and are now older because they have been trying so damn long. As for the increased placenta previa - I thought this was already well established? I know it was discussed in my support group some time ago. Most IVFers who manage to conceive are painfully aware that their risk of miscarriage and most other problems are higher than average. There is a reason we don't assume pregnancy will be straight forward, or necessarily result in a baby. At 10:10 PM +1000 31/7/06, Kelly @ BellyBelly wrote: FYI Risk of haemorrhage 'increases with IVF' Clara Pirani, Medical reporter May 26, 2006 WOMEN who have IVF treatment are six times more likely to suffer a potentially dangerous condition during pregnancy than those who conceive naturally. A study of 845,000 births in Norway revealed women who underwent IVF had higher rates of placenta praevia, a condition in which the placenta attaches itself to the lower uterus, blocking the cervix. Placenta praevia can cause the mother to haemorrhage before giving birth. Researchers from St Olavs University Hospital in Trondheim said the risk of developing placenta praevia increased from three births per 1000 among the general population, to 16 every 1000 with IVF. The study, published in the journal Human Reproduction, also found a threefold risk among mothers who had given birth twice, once conceiving naturally and once IVF, or ICSI, in which a sperm is injected directly into an egg. The incidence rose from seven in 1000 births for women who had two natural conceptions, to 20 in 1000 births for women who had one natural and one assisted conception. Regardless of whether it was the first or second pregnancy that was conceived through assisted reproduction technology, we found a nearly threefold risk of placenta praevia, said lead researcher Liv Bente Romundstad. This suggests that a substantial proportion of the extra risk may be attributable directly to factors relating to the reproduction technology. The researchers were not sure why IVF increased the risk of placenta praevia. However, they suggest it may be caused by anatomical factors that contributed to the women's original infertility, rather than to the IVF procedure itself. Alternatively, the embryo may be placed lower in the uterus during IVF to improve implantation rates. About 6000 babies a year are born through IVF in Australia. Michael Chapman, chairman of the IVF Director's Group, said other factors could account for the higher rate of placenta praevia among women who had IVF. As a woman gets older she's more likely to have placenta praevia and obviously women who have IVF are older. Women who've had any surgery on the uterus, like having fibroids removed, would also have a high chance of placenta praevia. Professor Chapman said doctors closely monitored women who develop the condition and those undergoing IVF should not be concerned by the study. In this day and age we have good ultrasound and we tend to diagnose it as early as 18 weeks, and therefore we'd be watching out for it, he said. Later on in pregnancy, if a woman presents with bleeding, it's extremely rare for it to be a catastrophic haemorrhage. Women with placenta praevia are monitored and they will almost always give birth by caesarean section. Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, http://www.bellybelly.com.au/BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-supporthttp://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-supportBellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Blood cells and placenta?!
My 2 week old baby was born asleep and took a little while to decide to breathe, cry and open her eyes. It was one of the joys of birthing at home that she was able to wake up and breathe in her own time rather than being rubbed etc to prove she could cry straight away. Her cord kept pulsing longer than the entire (natural) 3rd stage of her older sisters birth, presumably because of her slow gentle transition into wakefulness and breathing. At 8:34 PM +1000 25/7/06, Diane Gardner wrote: Imagine the poor baby who has suddenly had it's oxygen supply prematurely cut off and is forced to breathe to survive. I have seen some terrible instances of having to rub and jiggle babies to make then breathe or I have also seen babies that born peacefully, gently start to breathe, gradually getting stronger and the cord gradually slowing down and then after some time the cord stops pulsating and is then cut. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Induction due to pulmonary embolism?
I was on clexane this pregnancy (for a different condition) I interviewed two OBs and one wanted to follow exactly this protocol, the other recommended my case was mild enough to cease clexane at 34w and wait for natural labour. My understanding from speaking to other women who have to take Clexane or other blood thinners during pregnancy for current clots or history of severe clots is that they would definitely follow this sort of protocol though. At 9:58 AM +1000 15/7/06, Michelle Windsor wrote: Hi Kelly, In my (limited!) experience with this sort of thing, women are usually on Clexane which is an anticoagulant ie 'thins the blood'. If the woman went into labour naturally while still on Clexane, obviously her risk of haemorrage would be increased. But to stop the clexane days before she might go into labour could be risky too if she has a pulmonary embolis or DVT. So what seems to happen is that the clexane will be ceased for 24 hours and then the woman will be induced, and anticoagulants restarted after the birth. Hope this makes sense! Cheers Michelle Kelly @ BellyBelly [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One of the women on my forum had a crisis and was going to have a caesar, but with a bit of encouragement from the others on the site and with the Obs back-up she decided against it and was ecstatic, but then said WOW you girls totally rock when a girls in need! I actually have to be induced cause of the pulmonary embolism I got and have to be monitored in labour because Im on a blood thinning agent Could someone please explain? Sorry to be asking such basic questions all the time, I just want to learn! J Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, http://www.bellybelly.com.au/BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-supportBellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mail/tag/au/**http%3A%2F%2Fau.blogs.yahoo.com%2FlostninjaThe LOST Ninja blog: Exclusive clues, clips and gossip. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] 'Lactation failure caused by lack of glandular development in the breast'
I would be fascinated to see these pictures as it sounds a lot like what my breasts looked like before breastfeeding for the first time - which started EXTREMELY badly and took a very long time to get sorted out (8 weeks to turn a corner and know it would eventually get better, 3 months to start really settling down). Evidently I had enough glandular tissue for adequate supply but our issues were in large part to do with the physiological shape/structure of my breasts. At 8:44 AM +1000 14/7/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Kelly, I've only just read your post, and I really dont know much about this subject, but I can tell you there is definitely information out there about it, and it is a real condition. I'm a first year Bmid student, and last semester in a lecture with a lactation consultant from the RHW Randwick (if you wanted to contact someone who really knows about it), this issue was discussed in some detail. It was only a short lecture and I dont have notes for it, but what I can recall is this: information and understanding about how the breasts work and produce milk is still being understood, in fact our understanding of the anatomy of the breast has recently been challanged! Lactation consultants would have the best and most up to date knowledge of this stuff, as it's their area of expertise if you like. Anyway, it was discussed that breasts of a particular shape are possibly anatomically different to others, in that the tissue inside the breasts which actually produces the milk concentrates in the area around the nipple, and does not extend very far back into the breast. In normal breast development, regardless of the size of the breast, the tissue extends right up to the armpit. We were shown photo's of breasts which possibly have this type of tissue development, and the features of them were: tubular in shape (whether small or large in size) and with a clear sort of seperation across the sternum, if that makes sense. There is a marked space between each breast. In many of the pictures it was possible to see that most of the fullness of the breast was around the nipple area. This is not to alarm anyone who has breasts of this shape who may be reading this, or to offend anyone by my dispassionate desription of breasts! This is all I can remember really, and this infrormation was given to us as future midwives as something to look out for, but obviously we would refer to a lactation consultent if there was a problem. Maybe this is new information , and the midwives involved with this woman were unaware?? Anyway, I hope this helps, Regards, Astra Quoting Kelly @ BellyBelly [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Does anyone have any experiences to share with this? A woman has posted on my site about her experience and I was wondering what everyone thought on the topic. http://bellybelly.com.au/forums/showthread.php?p=352746 Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, http://www.bellybelly.com.au/ BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: Fw: [ozmidwifery] Blood pressure...
I did get it the first time... maybe some emails get through to some people but not everyone? At 12:29 PM +1000 6/7/06, Stephen Felicity wrote: Sending this to the list for the second time as it mysteriously disappeared. :o( - Original Message - From: Stephen Felicity [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Wednesday, July 05, 2006 1:17 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Blood pressure... A little bit of knowledge can be a dangerous thing. Heidi, I'm shocked by this statement. I can only assume I misunderstood your stance; could you expand on this statement? Being well-informed is not about being scared or doubtful of the Hospital (and a Doula doesn't put fear or doubt into their clients); it's a basic human right, particularly for a birthing woman and her baby. Knowledge is never dangerous (it's NOT being informed that carries the danger); and if knowledge leads a woman to feel fearful of a course of action that is proposed for her, that is a GOOD thing - it's her intuition telling her that she isn't ok with it happening, and pushing her to seek other options. Co-operation with a Hospital and her careprovider is not the ultimate goal for a birthing woman. It should be the other way around. Women are not infants and they have a right to any and all information, and to their emotions - even if they include fear. Fear is natural in birth and it's good support and good practice that gets us through it effectively; not avoiding the feeling altogether. Careproviders might not interfere with women and birth for fun (although I've seen and heard of Obs that indicate differently - and even, rarely, Midwives), but the rates of intervention compared to the rates indicated as actually necessary show that they're not often intervening based on evidence, either. It's not the information and knowledge that scares women. It's the practices and the outcomes. To address the fear we don't need to withhold information so the women can birth in Hospital without fuss; we need to truly support women, foster open negotiation and respect, and keep pushing to change the practices that aren't evidence-based or in the best interests of women and their babies. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] community mid program WA
There is the northern community midwives program in SA, who provide continuity of care and homebirth and the new continuity of care and homebirth program run out of Kogarah in NSW. If only there were more in each state At 3:07 PM +0800 25/6/06, Mary Murphy wrote: Up until march this year, the CMP has struggled along uncertain of its future, contracts being signed late and for only a year. The midwives have been on 3 monthly contracts for 3-4 years. Why is this so? The politics of birth, insurance, money, all sorts of reasons. Our managers have just signed a 3 yr contract with the Health Dept. The numbers are starting to move now there is some certainty and there is thought of increasing midwife numbers. Midwives also have permanent contracts. This program was the result of parents and midwives lobbying for about 10 years. No answers as to why it hasn¹t happened elsewhere. MM From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kristin Beckedahl Sent: Sunday, 25 June 2006 11:22 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] community mid program WA Can someone tell me why other states in Australia do not embrace the initiative of a Community Mid Programme, like the one in WA. I'm sure there is a reason or two for it not being a national program; and I presume its cuaght up with government? money? insurance? demand? Love to hear your thoughts... Kristin -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] List working properly???
I often get the feeling that not all posts make it through, I see replies to messages that I never received etc. At 11:38 PM +1000 23/6/06, Great Birth Men at Birth wrote: G'day, I'm aware that a few people have sent responses to my post of 20 June entitled Consumer demand for inductions and caesareans but they never appeared on the list (I got sent them personally when they didn't appear) Has the list been malfunctioning in the last few days? Cheers David David Vernon, Editor and Writer http://www.acmi.org.au/greatbirth.htmHaving a Great Birth in Australia, http://www.acmi.org.au/menatbirth.htmMen at Birth, http://web.mac.com/david.vernon/iWeb/With%20WomenWith Women - Shiftwork to Group Practice and http://web.mac.com/david.vernon/iWeb/The Hunt for Marasmus GPO Box 2314, Canberra ACT 2601, Australia Em: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Click here to email me My other websites: http://web.mac.com/david.vernon/iWeb/Kitty%20and%20%20MausKitty Maus | http://web.mac.com/david.vernon/iWeb/Beryl%27s%20%20HansardBeryl's Hansard | http://web.mac.com/david.vernon/iWeb/Busy%20Dad%27s%20Guide%20to%20CookingBusy Dad's Guide to Cooking | _ -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?
A friend of mine gave birth in a popular private Sydney hospital a few weeks ago, was induced (her choice, against OBs preference, amazingly he doesn't like to induce before 41w) - 2 doses of gel, ARM, synto. The only EFM was one trace at the start of the process. The midiwife caring for her asked her a number of times for a further trace, which she refused, usually by saying she wanted a shower now or to go to the toilet and that was that. She had discussed this plan with her OB in advance and knew she had his support, so she was fully prepared to send the midwife off to sort it out with him if the midwife had tried to bully her about it but it did not come to that. So there are hospitals around where it is possible. At 7:03 AM +1000 17/6/06, Kelly @ BellyBelly wrote: I would love to hear what other hospitals are doing with Syntocinon Inductions. Is it policy to use continuous CTG's throughout labour? From my perspective only, it seems to be all of them at the induced / augmented births I have been attending. I attend usually one but sometimes two births a month and it seems it's all part and parcel to be strapped down with Synto AND EFM in the bigger hospitals. Haven't been to a birth that's otherwise anyway. We work very hard to fob off any synt-happy midwives and doctors, especially where the membranes are ruptured even if it's only been an hour or two (yes I'm afraid there's pressure from midwives too, one was in a 'Know Your Midwife' program and thank goodness we were able to say no enough times as she did establish contractions on her own after the ARM). It's such a big effort sometimes that you can see how a woman without good support is going to be more likely to accept this as what's needed or feel overpowered, but you do it because you know you not only get synt you get continuous monitoring too. Say no and you get an entourage of doctors sometimes! Another challenge too is not only letting them have that choice, but choice without having an inappropriate comment made after she makes a choice alluding to the health of the baby, e.g. '... but if you keep labouring without the monitoring, I can't tell you / guarantee that everything will be okay for your baby down the track...' or mentioning the 's' word... (stillbirth). I don't know how many times one poor woman struggling to get the confidence to say no was spoken down too, not in a nasty way, but with lots of little dug in comments, she had to fight to say no to antibiotics, no to synto sooner after only an hour or two, EF monitoring, a drip for her baby in case he had strep b, which he didn't, the list goes on. Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bowman Family Sent: Thursday, 21 September 2006 4:35 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? Abby, I agree with you, the proceedure should not be compulsory and I will take this up with colleagues, women should be given the right to choose if they want this, and I suppose the best way to go is what Emily has suggested and explain to the mother and write it in their notes if they choose to not have EFM.. I find this whole policy/proceedure thing often very difficult to work with, but hospitals do have to work within the safety of policies and guidelines to protect not only the mother and baby, but the hospital and staff themselves. In a court of law they will have to show that they followed proceedure. and have risk management in place. I would love to hear what other hospitals are doing with Syntocinon Inductions. Is it policy to use continuous CTG's throughout labour? Our policy is still at the updating stage and has room for change (hopefully) Thank you also Emily for you advise. Linda -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?
It's true, there is a lot of pot luck involved for consumers, it is certainly what scares me about hospitals. But in this case I am pretty sure that the only policy was for an initial trace because the midwife was fairly clearly out of her comfort zone and didn't pull out the it's policy argument. At 12:19 PM +1000 17/6/06, Janet Fraser wrote: So there are hospitals around where it is possible. I think in most cases it's that there are individual staff, nothing to do with the institutions. Some women have great births in some hospitals and for others the same place is a bloodbath. It's the staff you fluke on the day that have the biggest impact on your experience. J -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] PPH levels soar
I know that homeopaths believe that the same thing you give to fix a symptom can cause that symptom in a well person, or given in the wrong dose for the individual. This is how they prove a homeopathic treatment. I don't know if I have explained that very well... Here is a link about homeopathic proving http://www.hpathy.com/research/shere-proving-homeopathy.asp Jo At 6:49 PM +1000 11/6/06, Sue Cookson wrote: Hi, This article appeared in last week's Sydney Morning Herald. I think it's amazing and it appears that some of the information is incorrect in that the article states that NSW Health implemented active thrid stage and early cord clamping in 2002. Surely syntometrine and syntocinon have been used for many more years than just the last four, in which case this study is a real eye-opener if you believe we are stopping women from bleeding by using drugs in third stage. What do you think? Sue Transfusions soar for women giving birth Julie Robotham Medical Editor June 3, 2006 RECORD numbers of NSW women need transfusions to treat massive blood loss after giving birth, in an epidemic that doctors say is threatening new mothers' health and fertility and sometimes their lives. The number of women diagnosed with post-partum hemorrhage has rocketed by nearly 30 per cent, and almost one in nine births was affected in 2002, compared to one in 12 in 1994, University of Sydney research has shown. Of those, the proportion whose condition was severe enough to warrant a blood transfusion increased sixfold, from 2 per cent to 12 per cent. It's extremely important, said Ken Clark, the president of the Royal Australian and New Zealand College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists. Bleeding was still a very real cause of the death of women but also a great deal of [ill health] that has a tremendous impact on women and their families. In the worst cases mothers had to undergo emergency hysterectomies to save their lives, but even less dramatic surgery to clamp blood vessels or anaemia could be debilitating. To have that on top of all the other stresses and strains of motherhood it's the last thing people need, Dr Clark said. The NSW findings are the first large-scale confirmation of the impression among individual doctors and hospitals across Australia that major bleeding is increasing. Carolyn Cameron, who led the statewide analysis, said neither the well-documented rise in caesarean section births nor the growing number of older mothers could explain the increase in hemorrhages. It was possible more borderline cases were being identified, but this alone was unlikely to account for the increase. We have to search for something else. It's a mystery, said Ms Cameron, a research officer at the Centre for Perinatal Health Services Research. The group would now look at how many previous pregnancies women had and the length of their labours to see whether these offered clues to the reasons for hemorrhage - diagnosed when more than 500 millilitres of blood is lost after a vaginal birth, or more than 750 millilitres after a caesarean. Blood loss - usually from the site where the placenta detaches - is currently the single largest cause of pregnancy-related death in Australia. Between 1997 and 1999 - the most recent period for which figures are available - eight women died as a consequence, including two who refused transfusions for religious reasons. Ms Cameron's research, published in the Australian and New Zealand Journal of Public Health, was based on the medical records of more than 52,000 women who had a birth-related hemorrhage in NSW between 1994 and 2002. It is not yet clear whether the pattern has continued since 2002, when NSW Health recommended the use of drugs to expel the placenta and early clamping of the umbilical cord to limit bleeding. David Ellwood, professor of obstetrics and gynaecology at the Australian National University Medical School in Canberra, said: All of the major hospitals around the country have been noticing an increase. Women who gave birth vaginally after a previous caesarean, or those carrying twins, might be at increased risk, he said. Rising birthweights might also contribute to the trend. Increasing transfusion numbers indicated that the severest bleeding was also rising, Professor Ellwood said - because doctors were reluctant to transfuse women with less serious hemorrhages. A group of maternity hospitals was researching women's recovery from birth hemorrhages to see whether they affected breastfeeding or triggered post-natal depression, he said. http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/transfusions-soar-for-women-giving-birth/2006/06/02/1148956546560.htmlhttp://www.smh.com.au/news/national/transfusions-soar-for-women-giving-birth/2006/06/02/1148956546560.html# -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Fw: E-News 8:11 - Postdates Pregnancies (May 24, 2006)
But it's not a very safe place for a consumer to be. Rocking the boat as a consumer (especially in labour) it's your body and your baby that you are risking will have a worse outcome for having alienated the only carers you may have available to you. It's anybody's guess for most women whether there is going to be a supportive midwife or Dr to help them if they speak up for what they want/need. When you demand what you want you may be heard by a wonderful midwife who immediately takes up your cause, or you may be dismissed as being too difficult or a c/s waiting to happen because you have too many expectations. Maybe we are scared sometimes to speak up in our workplace if we want to keep our job and dont want to rock the boat, but the women are free to say what they want and demand complete informed consent, and we can help them navigate that rocky terrain. And isn't it great when you get to work with a women who is making those demands, and get to advocate for them - its very safe territory because we are doing what our midwifery competancies demand. Love Suzi -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] Natural Birth
Does the WHO have recommendations on the percentage of women that are likely need help? At 10:53 AM +0930 19/5/06, Dean Jo wrote: What she is asking is how many women actually get to birth without interventions. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mary Murphy Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 8:47 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Natural Birth Surely if they are (natural, normal, unintervened) it means they don't' need medical assistance? What is the real question? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dean Jo Sent: Friday, 19 May 2006 7:10 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] Natural Birth Request from another list: Most specifically, I'm looking for what percentage of births actually need intervention/medical assistance. There's a tricky one! -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.5.6/337 - Release Date: 5/11/2006 -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.5.6/337 - Release Date: 5/11/2006 -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.5.6/337 - Release Date: 5/11/2006 -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] GDM
Is there are reference a study relating to this, or conference papers? At 4:12 PM +1000 9/5/06, Katy O'Neill wrote: Dear all, Sorry my finger can't help the double click. The US conference was referring to well controlled, non macrocosmic babies of GDM mothers. Sharon is right about getting things in perspective. Once armed with the facts that are out there and the Drs are using, it is up to the individual woman to make her choice. Katy - Original Message - From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]islips To: mailto:ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2006 3:47 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] GDM i had GDM with both my pregnancies. well controlled with diet and daily monitoring. laboured spont at 38 weeks with first and arm at 41 weeks with second.i had the first at birth centre and transfered to KEMH with second. even though i had private obstetrician back up both times there was never any pressure to be treated differently. i actually chose an elective induction at 41 weeks. i guess it just depends on the individual situation. babies 3.5 kg and 4.0kg. zoe - Original Message - From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]diane To: mailto:ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2006 12:22 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] GDM I believe that Liz meant the baby died in utero, while awaiting the onset of spontaneous labour' Di - Original Message - From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]sharon To: mailto:ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2006 1:56 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] GDM insulin dependant diabetics are given a insulin infusion at the hospital i work at their off spring are taken to the nursery and bsl's done on them if they are ok then they go back to the mother to direct room in. if not they are given dextrose via a ivt until they can stabalize and then go to their mothers. it seems like your case was mis managed medically. i hope this senario does not happen to anyother unsuspecting mother. regards - Original Message - From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]diane To: mailto:ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2006 12:57 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] GDM I believe that insulin dependent GDM is a different situation. Didnt the US pick up the macosomia?? How does this very low rate of unexplained deaths in utero compare with that of the general , non diabetic population? Cheers, Di - Original Message - From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Elizabeth and Mark Bryant To: mailto:ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2006 12:39 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] GDM Dear Readers, I saw this as a student, very well controlled GDM (but on insulin), the woman chose to wait for natural labour at T + 7 despite encouragement from some doctors for IOL. She had CTG's and USS all of which were perfect however lost her beautiful daughter the next day - only explanation given was macrosomia. Was a heartbreaking experience for all involved Liz -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Katy O'Neill Sent: Tuesday, 9 May 2006 12:05 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] GDM Dear Diane, This decision comes out of the conference held annually in the US on GDM. This last one concluded that diet controlled GDM should not go beyond term due to the risk ( very low, 1% ) of sudden unexplained deaths in utero beyond this time. Apparently you can have a baby with U/S and CTG all indicating foetal well-being and within a few hours have the baby die without any explanation. Katy. - Original Message - From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]diane To: mailto:ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Monday, May 08, 2006 12:38 PM Subject: [ozmidwifery] GDM Hi wise women, I think this may have been a thread not long ago, but can anyone point me to some research on the safety of going past the due date , for a woman with well controlled gestational diabetes? My step daughter, in Tamworth, has been informed that although she is at no higher risk than anyone else, they wont 'LET' her go past due date!! Lucky I wasnt there at the appointment Maybe later, he he he!! I love a good debate. Thanks, Diane __ NOD32 1.1523 (20060505) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.comhttp://www.eset.com __ NOD32 1.1525 (20060508) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.comhttp://www.eset.com -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] fertility problems
assistance to achieve another pregnancy - and certainly learning about her fertility and charting her cycles could help her. She could contact the Australian Council of Natural Family Planning 1800 114 010 for an accredited NFP teacher (sadly there are a lot of quacks in NFP!!) and she might also look at naturopaths etc. If however there is a mechanical problem or blockage with the tube, then she is really looking at needing more medical assistance - this may mean true full on IVF, but there are all sorts of other treatments that may be lumped under that banner and she really needs to know exactly what her problem is to know what her options are. Certainly a lap, DC, and HSG are invasive, but they are not particularly aggressive (in so far as what could be done!) and they are a good set of diagnostic tests. There are no 'althernate therapies' that will give her this kind of information. Once she knows 'where she stands' she can make a true choice about her options. I wish her the very best of luck. Beck. Rebecca Hart, Midwife Natural Family Planning Teacher -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] fertility problems
Given she has had previous ectopic pregnancy and surgery to remove it I would STRONGLY advise that she at least make sure her tubes are clear before continuing to try naturally. The xray she has been offered is called a HSG and is used to test tubal patency (whether they are clear). You can have this done by ultrasound instead of xray (called a HiCoSy) but it involves a similar level of invasiveness and discomfort and is slightly less reliable - if it doesn't work you then have to get it done by HSG anyway. That said my own HiCoSy went perfectly. She should be aware that if her tubes are blocked either of these tests might be quite painful as they will be trying to pump dye or sugar water through her blocked tubes and it won't work. Personally I would also get some basic blood work and a semen analysis done and then decide whether to try naturally, do more tests or start treatment. I also think when it comes to fertility treatment it is always worth getting two opinions, you would be amazed how radically differently two fertility specialists will interpret the same test results (she doesn't have to redo her tests, just take results of anything she has already had done to the second Dr). I am not sure where she lives or who she is seeing but I can highly recommend Dr.Graeme Hughes. Of the three Drs we saw (and we also saw the other Dr mentioned in this thread) he did by far the most thorough assessment of our case and was pro-active without being IVF happy. Though we did end up using IVF in the end, at a different clinic with a different Dr for complex reasons that were no reflection on how impressed we were with Dr.Hughes, we really missed him when we changed. I hope it works out for your friend! Jo At 12:36 AM +0300 8/5/06, Päivi Laukkanen wrote: Hi everyone, A friend of mine has moved to Sydney and is having problems getting pregnant. A year ago she had an operation, because she had an unexpected pregnancy and the fetus was outside the womb. (Don't know how to say this in english). Now a doctor in Sydney has suggested her to give bloodsamples for ovulation, and take x-ray, where they spray the womb with some special color, which then shows in the x-rays. The doctor also suggested some kind of operation to see the scar from the previous unsuccesfull pregnancy. They would also scrape the womb and take some samples to see if her body is doing what it's supposed to. If they find problems the doctor suggested ivf next. This all sounds like a lot of uncomfortable procedures. Just wanted to ask if you guys would have any input on this? Aren't there more gentle ways to go? This really is an area that I know nothing about. Päivi -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] fertility problems
All the natural fertility treatment and charting in the world won't help blocked tubes... With her history she does need to get her tubes checked before she decides what to do next or she may end up wasting a lot of time and money. There are plenty of problems for which IVF or western fertility treatment in general should NOT be the first answer, but blocked tubes is not one of them. At 5:02 PM +1000 8/5/06, Justine Caines wrote: I agree. Why even look at IVF in the first place. Sort of like going to an Ob for a normal pregnancy! The Jocelyn Clinic in Paddington (Sydney) is run by Franchesca Naish (has a book called Natural Fertility) She has had some great success (even with IVF didasters) I have recently referred a friend there who is happy with their approach etc. Worth a look into The Jocelyn Centre for Natural Fertility Management Holistic Medicine 46 Grosvenor St, Woollahra ph: (02) 9369 2047 JC -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
[ozmidwifery] OB recommendations for the RPA
I am hoping that anyone currently working at the RPA would email me off list with OB recommendations for the RPA. I need a second opinion as I am in disagreement with my current OB. I can email you my history and problem off list if you think you might be able to help. thanks Jo -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Breastfeeding Mothers Given Wrong Advice for 40 Years
You can download the new WHO charts online now... At 5:41 AM +0100 30/4/06, denise thomson wrote: In the UK there has been repeated talk of breastfeeding centile charts but no one has actually seen one. Instead the mothers are subjected to pre feed and after feed weighing in some hospitals, neither wonder people get stressed about breastfeeding! I wonder how long it will take these charts to come out over in Australia. Do you have the centile charts for Down syndrome babies- these have been recognised as being required in the uk? Denise Jo Bourne [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The thing that surprises me is that most of my friends have exclusively breastfed and produced babies with rolls on their rolls and crevices so deep you can't find the bottom of them... My own daughter was off the chart at 6 months (she was exclusively breastfed until somewhere around 16 months). They did generally seem to look different to chubby formula babies though, sort of softer looking fat. At 10:42 AM +0800 25/4/06, Susan Cudlipp wrote: This is interesting Kelly and about time these wretched charts were consigned to the bin. I did a lactation course a few years ago and the facilitator asked us to all bring in our own babies health records, some of which were very old! It was obvious that all of us who had breast fed produced babies with very different growth patterns to that specified on the chart. She explained about the growth being based on formula feeding, which was something most of us were unaware of. Regards, Sue The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing Edmund Burke - Original Message - From: Kelly @ BellyBelly To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Tuesday, April 25, 2006 7:13 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] Breastfeeding Mothers Given Wrong Advice for 40 Years Breastfeeding evolution in Britain - WHO changes guidelines... http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2087-2147863,00.html Mothers got wrong advice for 40 yearsSarah-Kate Templeton, Medical Correspondent BREAST-FEEDING mothers have been given potentially harmful advice on infant nutrition for the past 40 years, the World Health Organisation (WHO) has admitted. Charts used in Britain for decades to advise mothers on a baby's optimum size have been based on the growth rates of infants fed on formula milk. The organisation now says the advice given to millions of breast-feeding mothers was distorted because babies fed on formula milk put on weight far faster. These breast-feeding mothers were wrongly told that their babies were underweight and were advised, or felt pressured, to fatten them up by giving them formula milk or extra solids. Health experts believe the growth charts may have contributed to childhood obesity and associated problems such as diabetes and heart disease in later life. A government study has found that more than a quarter of children in English secondary schools are clinically obese, almost double the proportion a decade ago. This week, the WHO will publish new growth standards based on a study of more than 8,000 breast-fed babies from six countries around the world. They will say the optimum size is that of a breast-fed baby. The move will put pressure on British doctors to replace charts which, for the last four decades, have taken into account the growth patterns of bottle-fed babies. Professor Tim Cole, of the Institute of Child Health at University College London, said: We should change to a growth chart based on breast-fed babies. During their first year they do not put on as much weight as those fed on formula milk. Breast-fed babies are less likely to be fat later in life and to develop complications such as diabetes and heart disease. Six years ago, Cole developed an alternative chart based on breast-fed babies but it has never been endorsed by the British medical establishment. The Child Growth Foundation, a UK charity, campaigns for the adoption of Cole's chart. The foundation claims breast-fed babies are, on average, at 22lb at 12 months, about 1lb lighter than those fed solely on formula milk. It is thought that breast-fed babies grow more slowly in the first year because they control the rate at which they feed, rather than being tied to their parents' notion of meal times. Mercedes de Onis, who co-ordinates WHO child growth standards, said: Breast-fed babies appear to self-regulate their energy intake to lower levels. Breast-fed babies have different metabolic rates and different sleeping patterns. Formula-fed babies seem to have higher intakes of energy and, as a result, are heavier. The American Academy of Pediatrics has warned that being overweight as a baby is a key early risk factor for heart disease and diabetes. The babies who were the models for the new WHO standards were selected for good health. They were all breast-fed, their mothers did not smoke and they received good health care. The WHO says babies
RE: [ozmidwifery] Mastitis question
]Megan Larry To: mailto:ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auozmidwifery Sent: Tuesday, April 25, 2006 10:03 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] Mastitis question Can a mother pass on her infecton to her breastfeeding child when she has mastitis? Its just that I had what to me was obvious mastitis on Sat, quite a decent case of it, very sore breast, redness, fever, vomiting, quite ill. Still recovering on Monday when my breastfeeding 22 mth old developed a fever and vomiting. This morning he is quite recovered but no doubt will need a very quiet day still. So, is this a coincidence, or can the child become infected too? We were both rundown form a busy few weeks, so the rest was well needed, just wanted it without the misery. Thanks in advance Megan -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Breastfeeding Mothers Given Wrong Advice for 40 Years
Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-supportBellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.4.6/323 - Release Date: 24/04/2006 -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] Mastitis question
My episodes of mastitis got less frequent after the first 3 months but I probably averaged at least one mastitis every 6 months for the entire time I was feeding (2.5yrs). Though my later mastitis were generally breast injury induced rather than infection and easily treated with homeopathics. At 12:36 PM +1000 25/4/06, Nicole Carver wrote: Hi, Normally you should breastfeed from both breasts with mastitis. The only exception, and I may stand corrected, is strep infection. The breast is very red, not your typical mastitis. It is very painful and you feel quite ill. I have not seen mastitis at 22 months. It might be precipitated by something else, as usually the feeding would be fairly trouble free at that stage, I would imagine. When a woman has mastitis the milk needs to be kept moving. Babies are best for that! Expressing is really just the tip of the ice berg. A little blood does not hurt. If the baby vomits a little blood there is no harm done. Obviously if there is a lot it would be best to discontinue for 24 hours or so. The breast must be emptied though, or you run the risk of abscess formation. Sometimes the antibiotics taken by mum will upset the babies stomach. However, I suppose they are also protecting them to some extent. Regards, Nicole. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of sharon Sent: Tuesday, April 25, 2006 12:24 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Mastitis question where i work we encourage women to express on the side that they are infected and continue feeding on the other side until the infection clears, the infection should be treated by antibiotics and if severe admission to hospital for iv antibugs. if the breastmilk has blood in it we discourage any breastfeeding whatsoever and get the mother to express all feeds until the infection passes she then can resume b/feeding when she feels better but ensure that the breast is always empty after feeding. regards sharon - Original Message - From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Megan Larry To: mailto:ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auozmidwifery Sent: Tuesday, April 25, 2006 10:03 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] Mastitis question Can a mother pass on her infecton to her breastfeeding child when she has mastitis? Its just that I had what to me was obvious mastitis on Sat, quite a decent case of it, very sore breast, redness, fever, vomiting, quite ill. Still recovering on Monday when my breastfeeding 22 mth old developed a fever and vomiting. This morning he is quite recovered but no doubt will need a very quiet day still. So, is this a coincidence, or can the child become infected too? We were both rundown form a busy few weeks, so the rest was well needed, just wanted it without the misery. Thanks in advance Megan -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] massage in pregnancy
Oh my osteopath had table inserts to allow me to comfortably lie face down. I think at the end of my last pregnancy I almost looked forward more to lying comfortably than the actual treatments! At 7:04 PM +1000 17/4/06, Ganesha Rosat wrote: Hi J Before I became a midwife I worked as a massage therapist and frequently massaged pregnant women. I don¹t feel that any particular style is any better then another. Some considerations are taken into account when massaging pregnant women ie is there a history of miscarriages, blood pressure problems. Also some acupressure points are avoided due to there link with the uterus ie gallbladder 21 (in the traps). If concerned stick to gentle relaxation styles such as Swedish. Also the essential oils used during the massage need to be taken into consideration as some are contraindicated in pregnancy. As for the therapist it depends on the confidence and experience as to whether they a comfortable with massaging pregnant women. Massage therapists whom advertise pregnancy massage often have purchased specially designed table attachments that allow pregnant women to lie face down comfortably and provide rolls to help prevent postural hypotension. Hope that has been of some help Ganesha From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Janet Fraser Sent: Friday, 14 April 2006 2:26 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] massage in pregnancy Hi all, can anyone recommend a form of massage particularly beneficial in pregnancy? I've been in contact with a massage student who's been told that she must never on any account massage a woman in pregnancy as it can cause miscarriage. Personally I know that's a crock but I'd love to be able to give her better info, perhaps on traditional and well evidenced forms of massage in pregnancy. TIA, J For home birth information go to: Joyous Birth Australian home birth network and forums. http://www.joyousbirth.info/http://www.joyousbirth.info/ Or email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] massage in pregnancy
hmmm. A professional massage turned my baby from breech to cephalic (and she stayed that way), which was definitely beneficial! The masseuse I saw was a qualified Rolfer, which requires extensive previous training beforehand, but unfortunately I don't know what style/s that training was in her case. There are a number of people around offering pregnancy massage, maybe she could call one of them for advice as to where they got their training? cheers Jo At 2:26 PM +1000 14/4/06, Janet Fraser wrote: Hi all, can anyone recommend a form of massage particularly beneficial in pregnancy? I've been in contact with a massage student who's been told that she must never on any account massage a woman in pregnancy as it can cause miscarriage. Personally I know that's a crock but I'd love to be able to give her better info, perhaps on traditional and well evidenced forms of massage in pregnancy. TIA, J For home birth information go to: Joyous Birth Australian home birth network and forums. http://www.joyousbirth.info/http://www.joyousbirth.info/ Or email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] Re:Sad Story, any help please?
Do you really think that a massive PPH 2.5 weeks (WEEKS, not hours or days) after a ceaser that resulted in a nasty uterine infection is most likely to do with the breech presentation? If the babe was cephalic she still might have stuck at full dilation and had a c/s - would she have been less likely to have gotten an infection or have the PPH? At 6:21 PM +0800 2/4/06, Mary Murphy wrote: I guess this is why some advise c/s for breech, but it seems that this, ³She laboured to fully without any analgesia then pushed valiantly for 3.5 hrs² is the problem. I was led to believe that if progress of the breech halted, then it was the time to change options. Mm -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Misoprostol
From what I know of Misoprostol I can't imagine ever agreeing to take it. BUT in order to stay pregnant I am currently taking two kinds of drugs not recommended for pregnant women or women trying to get pregnant... When I was doing IVF almost all the drugs they gave me were clearly marked not to be taken during pregnancy or when you may become pregnant. As a consumer it does seem to me that sometimes you do have to make complex choices about medications and there are times when taking drugs that aren't recommended or approved for pregnancy can be the better choice. cheers Jo At 6:20 PM +1030 20/3/06, Lisa Barrett wrote: it seems a little unethical to use an unlicensed drug on women unless we tell them.(Unlicenced to use on gravid women that is) Is this the case in any of your units. do you let women know that a.the drug you are going to use is a. unlicensed for that use b. contraindicated in pregnancy and lactation (information freely available on the net) c. if it's going to be used for induction the isn't really agreement about dose etc. etc. I find it hard to believe that any woman would actually want the drug even if some god like dr thinks it has to be available. Lisa - Original Message - From: Joy Cocks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Ozmidwifery ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 2:58 PM Subject: [ozmidwifery] Misoprostol I work in a very small hospital, covering acute, aged care, emergency, as well as midwifery. One of our GP obstetricians has requested that we have Misoprostol in stock (which we already have for acute patients) as all the hospitals now use it for post-partum bleeding. I would be interested to know how common this is as it is another off label use. I'm also concerned that it will then be a small step to use if for cervical ripening/IOL. I notice in Hale that it is a category L3 (moderately safe) whereas Ergometrine is L4 (possibly hazardous) in breastfeeding mothers. I'm remembering the olden days when Ergometrine tablets were used fairly routinely for women with incomplete 3rd stage or were passing clots - I don't remember the exact dose - but it was used over several days in reducing doses (I even had it myself 30 yrs ago!). Interested to hear any comments or research that anyone has regarding Misoprostol and post-partum bleeding (I'm assuming he means haemorrhage, not normal bleeding). Thanks, Joy Joy Cocks RN (Div 1) RM CBE IBCLC BRIGHT Vic 3741 email:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] public-private birth centres
You can book into the public RPA birth centre as a private patient, but there aren't many OBs who work there (the birth centre that is, not the RPA). You can't book in as a private patient with a private midwife as they don't have admitting rights with the current insurance problems so if you have a private midwife going with you it would be as a public patient and one of the RPA's midwives would be present as well. At 9:50 AM +1100 8/3/06, jo wrote: 'I think if you went private you had to have a private OB?' Or independent midwife. jo -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Honey Acharya Sent: Wednesday, 8 March 2006 9:30 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] public-private birth centres Royal Women's in Randwick Birth Centre (Sydney) is public and private (or it was when I birthed there) perhaps contact them, I think if you went private you had to have a private OB? - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2006 6:55 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] public-private birth centres Hi everyone, we have been approached by a doc here in the south west of WA about establishing a public/private birth centre, I am not aware of one in Australia but I could be wrong, if so could someone let me know how it works and any suggestions or thoughts on how it should work would be greatly appreciated. Yours in midwifery, Pete Malavisi -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Watch the Today Show - Tuesday
She is on life matters (radio national) right now. At 1:06 PM +1100 28/2/06, Helen and Graham wrote: Yes Emily - follow this link it's on video. http://ninemsn.video.msn.com/v/en-au/v.htm?f=39g=d6868579-89b4-423d-82c8-7cc218a93eebp=aunews_autodayt=s29 She certainly did look nervous I thought. Also didn't seem to make sense what she was saying This is what I wrote in ...up on my soapbox! Could you please clarify Tizzie Hall's qualifications when you interview her next week on her new book Save Our Sleep. I have been hearing some mixed reactions to her teachings online and as a midwife and mother, I am usually pretty lukewarm about people SELLING quick fixes to baby sleep problems. Really I think we should be encouraging people to accept their babies the way they are. If you look at other cultures, they all sleep together and breastfeed when they want. Why do we continue to put children into their own rooms up the other end of the house and expect them to sleep and only feed them when we think they should need it! No wonder we have so many neurotic people with eating disorders, depression, etc. etc. in our society. Western culture is an abhorration in this situation. We have it all wrong. My 2 cents worth. Helen - Original Message - From: Emily [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2006 11:56 AM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Watch the Today Show - Tuesday hi all is there anywhere you can download it from because i missed it as i have no tv ! love emily --- Kelly @ BellyBelly [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think someone seemed a little (well maybe A LOT!) nervous - and rightly so And I know who wrote that email too, so it was great to see one being read out, from someone I know! :-) I also think that they decided to change the interview format given the circumstances. There is a lot of discussion about it on my forums about some contradictory points in her interview with her own beliefs. Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, http://www.bellybelly.com.au/ BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support BellyBelly Birth Support - Click Here _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Felicity Dowker Sent: Tuesday, 28 February 2006 9:19 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Watch the Today Show - Tuesday She's awful, isn't she. I wrote a rather long, rather strongly worded email after seeing her on there this morning. - Original Message - From: Kelly @ mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] BellyBelly To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 8:10 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] Watch the Today Show - Tuesday Dear all, Be sure to watch the channel 9 Today Show on Tuesday - Tizz.ie Hall is on Tuesday the 28th of February at 8:20 am. Perhaps about her new sleep book which is being released, this is what I am guessing. Be sure to watch. Oh and you might like to know that the Today Show's email is [EMAIL PROTECTED] ;) Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, http://www.bellybelly.com.au/ BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions For Conception, Pregnancy, Birth Parenthood http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support BellyBelly Birth Support __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: diabetes incipidus and breastfeeding
Just checking because of the typo in the subject line :-). DId you try looking a the Diabetes insipidus foundation website? They have a form you can fill out to ask a question about DI. http://www.diabetesinsipidus.org/ Also I couldn't access all of this article but it looks interesting: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrievedb=PubMedlist_uids=8489722dopt=Abstract cheers Jo At 7:52 PM +1100 21/2/06, Nicole Carver wrote: Hi Jo, No I typed in diabetes insipidus and combined the search with breast feeding. All I could get was that breast feeding is protective against juvenile diabetes. I think it is a fairly rare condition. Regards, Nicole. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Jo Bourne Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 6:32 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: diabetes incipidus and breastfeeding Could it be that not results came up because of a typo? I googled the condtion and it is apparently spelt with an S not C. Most search engines fail to warn you of typos the way that google does... At 6:09 PM +1100 21/2/06, Nicole Carver wrote: Hi Barb, I did do a quick search of the LRC site with no luck. However, I still think they are the best bet, as they will know 'who might know'! Kind regards, Nicole. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Barbara H Stokes Sent: Monday, February 20, 2006 8:26 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: diabetes incipidus and breastfeeding Dear Lactational Consultants, Can anyone help with lactation establishment for Gravida 2 Para 1 coming in for induction tomorrow. Has diabetes incipidus, did not lactate last time, takes demopressin nasal sprays? Thankyou, Barbara Stokes, Parkes -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] repair surgery and bf
Actually my understanding is that estrogen levels would be FAR higher at birth (and presumably soon after) than once breastfeeding is established. Certainly my own estrogen level was post menopausal during breastfeeding. That said surely post menopausal women have surgery too? At 2:57 PM +0100 21/2/06, Vedrana Valãiç wrote: How come episiotomies heal then? Are oestrogen levels then higher than later on? Vedrana -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jo Watson Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 12:43 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] repair surgery and bf I'd definitely go to a plastic surgeon... an ob does baby and mum stuff... this seems to me like something more cosmetic ( not saying it like she's only getting it done for looks!!) Jo On 21/02/2006, at 7:21 PM, Janet Fraser wrote: She's been told by several Obs that the lower oestrogen in her system mean her vagina won't heal. It sounds like a crock to me. I've seen bf blamed for most things wrong with babies and mothers but this was a new one to me. :( - Original Message - From: Maxine Wilson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 10:15 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] repair surgery and bf Maybe I am being daft but what effect do lactational hormones have on surgery? I would also suggest another opinion or 2 - perhaps to a plastic surgeon also. Maxine -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] cranio-osteopath
I can highly recommend Amber Laris in the CBD. At 8:45 AM +1030 18/2/06, Megan Larry wrote: Hi Sylvia, In Adelaide I know of, Andrea Wheatley in Nth Adelaide Ph 8361 8033, my kids I have all been treated by her and I highly recommend. Mile End Osteo clinic on Sth Rd, Abigail Abbott, ph 8354 4887. Also can recommend personally. Kensington Osteo, Barbara Mat Towers, Ph 8431 1166. They have 2 or 3 little ones themselves, but not sure about what their practice is. Also Helen in Mt Barker, 8391 3298, not sure of her practice either. They are all registered qualified Osteopaths. In the yellow pages others are listed, often Chiros will carry this title as well and say they do cranial work. Hope this helps Megan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sylvia Boutsalis Sent: Saturday, 18 February 2006 8:20 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] cranio-osteopath Hi all, Does anyone know of a cranio-osteopath in Adelaide for an infant. The baby was born with forceps and is showing signs of colic and is really unsettled. I thought I could give the mother another avenue to explore. Thanks in advance. Sylvia Boutsalis Adelaide -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: OP
://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Breach of List Ethics
Sally this is a public list with archives publicly available on the internet. Anyone googling for Epi-no may have stumbled across emails from this list and sent them on. Quite possibly it is somebody's job to google for discussions just like this one on a daily or weekly basis so the company can defend themselves if they want to. There is no privacy on the internet and it is a mistake to think that there is, especially in a public forum or mailing list. At 5:21 PM +1100 12/1/06, Sally-Anne Brown wrote: Dear all, RE: Dear Kelly, I have just been sent the email you sent from your client regarding EPI-NO. I have also seen the comment from a midwife who answered your query. I am very interested to read these posts. Sent by whom ??? It is clear that irrespective of comments made on this list that any person forwarding list emails without consent of the persons involved is (knowlingly or unknowingly) in breach of basic email ethics. In the extreme of course this may be referred to as a 'mole'. Can those persons who wish to send on emails please take the time to ask first ? and for the person/persons who have sent on these emails, perhaps you will consider acknowledging this to the list. Kind Regards Sally-Anne - Original Message - From: Andrea Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, January 12, 2006 4:17 PM Subject: [ozmidwifery] EPI-NO Hello, Just forwarding a message I received from Tecsana, that was intended for the list You have not provided sufficient information for a response to this woman's query however from what has been provided: a. The second time she has used EPI-NO b. She was pushing out the balloon. the woman was not following instructions in the correct use of EPI-NO. It would not be possible to push out the balloon with the amount of dilatation possible after the second use. The balloon is inflated to the level of personal comfort and the woman will experience a slight burning sensation at which point she would cease dilatation. This is controlled by the woman. Your client should not recommence training with EPI-NO unless instructed to by her obstetrician as her problem may be the result of an underlying condition. Perhaps you could request from the midwife who made that comment, clinical evidence to support it. We work in an evidence based medical environment, and all evidence of which we are aware supports the contrary view. A new EPI-NO Clinical Trial will commence in January through Sydney University to show the effect of EPI-NO on the Pelvic Floor following childbirth. Please make you client aware that EPI-NO is also a pelvic floor training device which can be used 4-6 weeks after delivery to strengthen the Pelvic Floor. I would be happy to answer any questions you may have. Sincerely Campbell Heather Tecsana Limited. - Andrea Robertson Birth International * ACE Graphics * Associates in Childbirth Education e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] web: www.birthinternational.com -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.14.17/227 - Release Date: 11/01/2006 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.14.17/227 - Release Date: 11/01/2006 -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Let baby decide birth date
A friend of mine is a vet and we had a very similar discussion not that long ago about dogs and the iniation of labour and a few other things. I remember laughing at her and saying so if vets know all this about dogs why don't Drs know it about humans, we can't be that different! At 4:37 PM +1030 27/12/05, Julie Garratt wrote: So, I was chatting with a family friend who breeds show horses. Talking about postdates, etc. He laughed at me. Apparently, any horse breeder worth his salt knows that 1) the foal initiates birth, 2) any breeder who induces labor is a fool, 3) foals that come from induced labors are inferior (have long term health difficulties, etc), 4) induced labors are hard on both foal and mare, and 5) some foals just take longer, and gestational dates are just a guess. If this is common knowledge amongst horse breeders, fercryingoutloud, why isn't it for human breeders -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Let baby decide birth date
The thing with dogs' c/s rate skyrocketing though is that is more often going to be the owners meddling with the natural process than the vets. The vets generally don't get involved until after things have gone wrong. Even then I believe my vet generally tries leaving the bitch alone in a dark room for a while to see if that will start things back up. This of course relates fairly directly to Brenda's comments below about consumer pressure for IOL (and elective c/s). At 9:41 PM +1100 27/12/05, jesse/jayne wrote: The rate of c-sect for dogs has also sky rocketed :) It's not only horses' birthing but ask any farmer/breeder of cows/sheep/horses or I guess any mammal for that fact about the shortcomings of an animal baby that is denied colostrum for any reason. Why do humans think they are any different? Humans are supposed to be the intelligent ones! Regards Jayne - Original Message - From: brendamanning [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2005 8:54 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Let baby decide birth date A huge number of women demand IOL from 37/40 onwards, like you Janet,(btw your views make perfect sense to me) I despair of how how to get the message across that the 'process' of birth will happen when all the participants are ready ie the baby, the mothers mind her body. Sometimes in clinic I see women exert enormous pressure on the OB to IOL when he's not fussed about it would happily await events. Perhaps the issue is that the animals won't sue the vet if something happens to their offspring because they were post-dates no one intervened ! Whereas the women or their partners/families/GPs will. Litigation has a lot to answer for, CYA (cover your arse) medicine alive well ! With kind regards Brenda Manning www.themidwife.com.au - Original Message - From: Jo Bourne [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2005 7:05 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Let baby decide birth date A friend of mine is a vet and we had a very similar discussion not that long ago about dogs and the iniation of labour and a few other things. I remember laughing at her and saying so if vets know all this about dogs why don't Drs know it about humans, we can't be that different! At 4:37 PM +1030 27/12/05, Julie Garratt wrote: So, I was chatting with a family friend who breeds show horses. Talking about postdates, etc. He laughed at me. Apparently, any horse breeder worth his salt knows that 1) the foal initiates birth, 2) any breeder who induces labor is a fool, 3) foals that come from induced labors are inferior (have long term health difficulties, etc), 4) induced labors are hard on both foal and mare, and 5) some foals just take longer, and gestational dates are just a guess. If this is common knowledge amongst horse breeders, fercryingoutloud, why isn't it for human breeders -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Private Health Midwifery
Kelly, You probably don't want to hear this having just changed, but you might want to continue looking around for someone that will give you more back than $480! Australian Unity offer a similar sort of cover for midwifery unless you are having a planned homebirth - in which case you can get an agreement from them in writing to cover somewhere between $2000-$2500. They don't care if you have an OB as backup but they will only make payments to one or the other so if you do transfer and use a private OB you won't get the homebirth cover (though I think you still qualify for the standard midwifery cover which as I said I think is similar to the NIB details below). If you transfer publicly they will still cover the planned homebirth. HBA's cover is apparently better still if you can find the right person to talk to. good luck! Jo At 11:37 AM +1100 23/12/05, Kelly @ BellyBelly wrote: Hey all, There has been lots of talk over the HBA covering midwifery of late, but after being so unhappy with Medibank Private I did some research last night and found out that NIB have actually been covering it for some time just not in full and they offer a much better package for much less cost than Medibank that I have switched over!!! This is what NIB offer for midwifery services: NIB 10 ante-natal visits - $13 back per visit 10 post-natal visits - $13 back per visit $220 back for the birth cost This is as per the safeguard cover (second to top cover) and if you have a private Ob as back-up, there are some changes to these amounts so you need to clarify (they wont cover as much for the private midwife), but not if you go public. 100% ambulance cover. For my family, this package cost only $148 a month whereas Medibank are charging $190 and I get much less back, no midwifery. Some might already know this, but for those that don¹t it might be a great one to recommend to women seeking midwifery services. I just thought it was so cool speaking to a private health fund that was readily and openly telling me about their private midwife services. I was half expecting them to have to ask someone else or have no idea. A very Merry Christmas to all on this list, you have provided me with so much food for thought and help in some situations where I needed more clarity. So thank-you to all and have a wonderful Christmas season. Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Director, http://www.bellybelly.com.au/www.bellybelly.com.au http://www.toys4tikes.com.au/www.toys4tikes.com.au Gentle Solutions For Conception, Pregnancy, Birth Baby Australian Little Tikes Specialists -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Whilst we are on the topic of early screening....
One of the things I keep thinking about with this and the other screening tests that have been discussed is that not all birth defects have a genetic origin. Couples that feel strongly that they would not continue a pregnancy can do all these tests, feel reassured, and get to their 20 week ultrasound, or the birth of their child only to find that something is anywhere from slightly to very wrong with their baby. Getting an all clear on downs or CF does not mean you won't find your baby has an extra finger, webbed fingers, club foot, cleft palate or a radically malformed heart. I think the education given to consumers about what tests there are, what is and is not covered, what results will mean, what you might want to do about the results etc, is woefully lacking and makes the shock of getting a bad result so much worse. I think the availability of testing is generally a good thing, but there should be far better education about the tests and the conditions they are for that allow people to make informed choices of their own about whether to test in the first place and what to do if they do test and get a bad result. At 8:22 AM +1100 7/12/05, Helen and Graham wrote: http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/babys-sex-test-offers-new-hope/2005/12/06/1133829597883.htmlhttp://www.smh.com.au/news/national/babys-sex-test-offers-new-hope/2005/12/06/1133829597883.html Baby's sex test offers new hope By Julie Robotham Medical Editor December 7, 2005 AUSTRALIAN doctors have identified the sex of 22 foetuses as early as five weeks into pregnancy from cells taken from their mother's cervix, in a proof of concept experiment they say could lead to improved tests for conditions such as Down syndrome and cystic fibrosis. Gab Kovacs, professor of obstetrics and gynaecology at Melbourne's Box Hill Hospital, said women would welcome the opportunity to know their foetus was healthy as early as possible during pregnancy. Where an abnormality was detected and the woman chose termination, this would involve fewer risks and medical complications if it could be done earlier. At present, the earliest test that can determine definitively if a foetus is affected by Down syndrome is chorionic villus sampling, in which placental cells are cultured around 11 weeks of pregnancy. But the test is invasive, and occasionally triggers miscarriage of healthy foetuses. Amniocentesis, conducted later in pregnancy, has similar drawbacks. Professor Kovacs's initial study, reported this week in the Australian and New Zealand Journal of Obstetrics and Gynaecology, was carried out in women who were having abortions. The scientists compared the sex of the foetus identified from foetal cells in the women's cervical mucus with the sex chromosomes they found in the placenta after the termination. The results matched in all cases. The next phase would be to conduct a larger study in women who were continuing their pregnancies, Professor Kovacs said. This would provide extra information about the reliability of the method, which uses polymerase chain reaction (CVS) technology to confirm the cells are not from the mother and the sex of the foetus. We have ethics committee approval to do that in an antenatal population, Professor Kovacs said. Detecting abnormalities would be no more difficult technically than determining sex, he said. The trial would also confirm the technique - which Professor Kovacs described as causing less discomfort than a Pap smear - was safe for the mothers and babies. But it would be at least five years before it could go into widespread use. Andrew McLennan, a consultant in foetal medicine at Royal North Shore Hospital, said previous attempts to isolate foetal cells had failed, and Professor Kovacs's technology was still at a very early stage. If the new technique proved effective, Dr McLennan predicted it would initially be used with more traditional tests. A woman whose cervical mucus test showed she was at increased likelihood of having a baby with an abnormality could be referred for amniocentesis or CVS, he said, while women with more reassuring early results might opt not to have further testing. Australian statistics show that more than 90 per cent of women whose foetus is diagnosed with Down syndrome choose to terminate the pregnancy. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] burping/winding
I never burped my daughter at all, I seem to recall trying a few times and finding it impossible and pointless. I have friends though were it works easily and clearly makes a huge difference to the baby's comfort. Interestingly enough these are not babes that need to woken up to burp and most likely would not sleep until they had been burped. Seems to me like one of those things where women should know to give it a go if they want to and then do what works for them and their baby. cheers Jo At 7:40 AM + 5/11/05, wump fish wrote: What do you wise women think about winding/burping babies. I am very aware that I am totally confusing women and providing them with information which conflicts with my colleagues. I would love to hear what information you give women about this subject. My standpoint at the moment (more than willing to change it) is that for most babies winding is unnecessary and if they fall asleep at the breast just leave them. Rather than sitting them up and jiggling them about = waking them up all over again etc. Other cultures do not wind/burp babies. Wind will find it's own way out. Please correct me - I would love to hear alternative theories. Rachel _ The new MSN Search Toolbar now includes Desktop search! http://toolbar.msn.co.uk/ -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Co-Sleeping
I think it really depends on personalities and sleep styles too though. We still cosleep with our 3.5 yr old and despite every mattress arrangement we have tried it guarantees me a bad night sleep. If Isabelle just wanted to be near by then what you are suggesting would rock, but she sleeps wedged into my armpit, with her fingers digging a hole in my belly button, and as I try to drift away from her she follows me across the bed until her (6'7) father and I have less than half the bed to share and she is taking up the rest. This happened even when we had mattresses side by side on the floor. It means I have to spend the whole night in one position, usually on my back with my head wedged between pillows (instead of on top of one) and with both arms over my head to make room for the small person wedged in to one side and the very large person trying not to fall off the bed on the other side, or trying not to be crushed into the wall or whatever. I wake up sore and cranky. She! arguably sleeps better. Apart from getting sore I also don't get that true restful sleep with Isabelle in the bed. We persist because she sleeps like me - lightly and irregularly. Her wakings are not habitual and I see no possibility of simply retraining her not to have a regular Xam waking because there is no pattern to break. I also believe that she lies awake for up to an hour, or more, during the night most nights and that she would be frightened/sad to do this alone in her own room. It's a blessing that she has learned she has to lie quietly and still and wait to go back to sleep next to us. My point being that sometimes the arrangement of beds/mattresses makes no real difference to a cosleeping arrangement. And even it if is the best option for a family it can still be pretty exhausting and unpleasant. cheers Jo At 6:44 AM +0800 28/10/05, Mary Murphy wrote: The most successful co-sleeping arrangements I have seen (as a homebirth midwife) are those households which have beds of the same height all across the room or ditto mattresses on the floor. The bedroom is the sleeping room and the other rooms are the nap, play, dressing rooms. Then everyone gets the sleep they need as there is plenty of room and no danger of falling off. MM I really wish co-sleeping worked for us, but it doesn't - I don't sleep well with my kids in the bed and often end up with muscle aches from weird positions. We tried for 4 months with my first, and sporadically since with both. Hence the mattress on the floor next to me. Which works well sometimes! -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] Older Children's Sleep
I have been seeing Amber Laris in the city since I was a child and she is amazing. When we were still in Adelaide she would check Isabelle for me every now and then when I went it (as a babe) and only once felt the need to do an adjustment (soon after a nasty head accident). Isabelle loves her. Also wonderful for pregnancy, turned my stubbornly posterior babe for me. cheers Jo At 11:30 AM +0930 27/10/05, Tania Smallwood wrote: Hi Kate, I'd recommend Simon Kent, chiro at Victoria Park chiropractic, ad I've heard that Andrea Wheatley at Nth Adelaide Osteopathic Clinic is a great osteopath for children... Tania xxx -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Lactation after ART
I am currently undergoing IVF for secondary infertility. I have PCO, not PCOS, but my hormones are without a doubt whacky. However, I breastfed my daughter for 2.5 years. The first 3 months, particularly the first 8 weeks were utter hell, but not because of low supply. One thing I never had, at least early on, was low supply - though I pretty much never felt let down, had a late/slow letdown and more of a slow but steady flow than the raging torrents of milk some of my friends struggled not to drown their babies in. Also, it's a big assumption that all these women with lactation problems did ART for their own reproductive issues, infertility is considered to be something like 30% female, 30% male, 30% both and 10% unexplained. Of the cases where the woman has the infertility problem they won't all be hormonal, there are lots of other reasons to do ART - she may have blocked tubes from previous surgery, carry an unfortunate gene combination that makes PGD necessary/preferable, we don't all have PCO/S or endo. Personally I would say if you are seeing a lot of women with lactation problems post ART then the most common feature is likely to be post traumatic stress from the ART, shock that they have a live baby at all if they were the one with the problem then also complete and utter loss of faith that any part of their reproductive system works at all. Neither infertility or ART end when you get pregnant and the pregnancy care that most women chose or are forced into through circumstance post ART is not likely to have helped them heal before the birth. Just my two cents. cheers Jo At 11:37 AM +0930 24/10/05, Jenny Cameron wrote: Hi all Does anyone have information on the effect on human lactation of assisted reproductive technology? I am noticing a lot of poor lactation among women who have had a baby by ART. A lot of women seem to be on Domperidone these days at the best of times?? Anyone else experiencing these phenomena? It does make sense that if the woman's hormonal milieau is such that reproduction needs hormonal assistance then lactation is likely to also??? Cheers Jenny Jennifer Cameron FRCNA FACM President NT branch ACMI PO Box 1465 Howard Springs NT 0835 08 8983 1926 0419 528 717 The following document was sent as an embedded object but not referenced by the email above: Attachment converted: pudding:Network Blitz Bkgrd 12.gif (GIFf/prvw) (000D0FE2) -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] another fyi...
to public health and support women to achieve biologically optimal childbirth. Where we can, we should be helping women to have children earlier. HAVE YOUR SAY *The choice is still clear, have a career or have children late. I would advise other women to leave it and take the gamble * Victoria Finney, Brighton Clare Brown, Chief Executive of Infertility Network UK, said Delaying having children until you are in your thirties is a choice many people make but they need to be aware of the added problems when trying to conceive, particularly over the age of 35 when a woman's natural fertility declines. When this is exacerbated by a further complication such as blocked tubes or low sperm count the chances of a successful pregnancy even using IVF are much less. Peter Bowen-Simpkins, of the Royal College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists, said: The biological clock is one thing we cannot reverse or change. The message that needs to go out is 'don't leave it too late'. Story from BBC NEWS: http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/health/4248244.stm Published: 2005/09/15 23:08:39 GMT -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.24/101 - Release Date: 13/09/2005 -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] another fyi...
late. I would advise other women to leave it and take the gamble * Victoria Finney, Brighton Clare Brown, Chief Executive of Infertility Network UK, said Delaying having children until you are in your thirties is a choice many people make but they need to be aware of the added problems when trying to conceive, particularly over the age of 35 when a woman's natural fertility declines. When this is exacerbated by a further complication such as blocked tubes or low sperm count the chances of a successful pregnancy even using IVF are much less. Peter Bowen-Simpkins, of the Royal College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists, said: The biological clock is one thing we cannot reverse or change. The message that needs to go out is 'don't leave it too late'. Story from BBC NEWS: http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/health/4248244.stm Published: 2005/09/15 23:08:39 GMT -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.24/101 - Release Date: 13/09/2005 -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. _ The new MSN Search Toolbar now includes Desktop search! http://toolbar.msn.co.uk/ -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] 3rd degree tears
I can't speak to quality of guestimating baby sizes but I can tell you there is a world of difference between ultrasound machines and technicians. I seem to be averaging about 2-3 pelvic ultrasounds a month at the moment, quite often it is that many per week, and I would have great faith in my favourite clinic's ability to measure just about anything and almost no faith in various other clinics ability to measure anything. Having become quite the connoisseur of ultrasounds for infertility reasons I could probably tell whether it was worth trusting a baby measurement or not - but how do you know if you haven't spent hours watching your own insides on a big screen at a wide variety of clinics? Last time I had a bad scan I walked out, called my favourite clinic booked in for later that day, got a new referral and trotted over to find that my suspicions were spot on and the previous scan was hideously wrong. I certainly would not have had the knowledge or confidence to do this without having had as many scans as I have had in the last year Having to explain to my specialist that I didn't trust his staff's scan and went and got another one which had very different results was not quite so easy (interestingly he had no problem believing my preferred clinic over his own team's scan, apparently my 2nd opinion result was much more inline with my blood test results than the first scan had been). I am not sure home much value there is in measuring a baby to decide what to do after a previous 4th degree tear, I probably wouldn't do it if it were me. But if she does decide to get an ultrasound to estimate size choose the clinic VERY carefully - it DOES matter. I can give recommendations in Sydney if that is any help. cheers Jo At 7:58 PM +1000 30/8/05, Julia Vaughan wrote: No experience of vaginal birth following 4th degree tear (thankfully!). But I personally had an ultrasound at 37 weeks last pregnancy (at a specialist women¹s ultrasound clinic) and the estimate of bub¹s weight was actually spot on (if you allow approx a 1oz a day foetal weight gain). At the time I was told that the estimate could be as much as + or 10% which is huge when you are talking about 4500+ grams of baby! HTH, Julia -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kim Stead Sent: Tuesday, 30 August 2005 9:19 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] 3rd degree tears Out of curiosity.. does anyone have any experiences of vaginal birth following previous 4th degree tear? I've just recently met a woman who wants to give vaginal birth a go - has new partner (says old one was huge!). She is smallish person - 60kg, last babe 10lbs (1st baby). What do you think. She will be birthing in hospital. I've asked her to get a copy of her obstetric records from previous hospital. Still in early pregnancy so can't gauge size yet. Is a later ultrasound a good idea for a gestimate on the weight? I know they can be so inaccurate. Kiwi Kim, http://www.incredimail.com/index.asp?id=54475 -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Men at births
The thing that struck me is that they were both talking about standing at the wrong end of the bed. When I told my husband about the article he first snorted and then when I pointed out this theme of wishing they had stood at the other end of the bed he felt that standing around as a witness to a dramatic medical event probably would have been traumatic for him as compared to actively participating in something that was entirely about the two of us and our baby and was not medical at all. Perhaps this was the advantage of his spending the entire labour either providing counter pressure on my back or holding me up - he never actually saw anything but he was very useful to me and wouldn't have missed it for the world. At 10:55 AM +1000 31/8/05, Andrea Robertson wrote: This is an interesting report in today's Sydney Morning Herald. I remember Michel Odent talking about research done in the US that explored the effect on a couple's sexual relationship when the man had been exposed to the birth process. Michel was advocating that women might want to retain some of their sexual mystery by excluding men from the birth room. I have been at births where I wondered how the father was taking the sight of a practitioner cutting an episiotomy. What does everyone think about this? http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2005/08/30/1125302566185.html Regards, Andrea - Andrea Robertson Birth International * ACE Graphics * Associates in Childbirth Education e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] web: www.birthinternational.com -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] another induction
is appalling. I've sent her Henci Goer on induction along with my outrage and suggestion that she complain about him officially. I'm so enraged by it. I'm just livid! What other branch of medicine would this happen in??? Sigh. Roll on the medicare stuff and proper care for women and babies. J - almost despairing but not quite... Joyous Birth Home Birth Forum - a world first! http://www.joyousbirth.info/forums/ Accessing Artemis Birth Trauma Recovery http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/accessingartemis -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] VBAC's and Midwifery led birth centres
My understanding as a consumer is that hospitals will allow fathers to catch as long as all is going well but not on the record by your MIPP. I have been told the exact same thing by every midwife or hospital I have spoken to, the story seems to be fairly consistent. I don't see why, if they would have been happy for Dad to catch, you can't have anyone you choose do the catching, what if you want your best friend or sister to catch? What if they happen to be a midwife does that preclude them? And for that matter what if Dad is a midwife by profession, does that preclude him from catching because he actually has professional experience? Makes me cranky, amongst other things. I understand that insurance being what it is that if you choose to be in a hospital then you choose to have someone on their staff give advice and make decisions about your care (or at least agreeing with what is going on), but if it reaches the point where someone has to catch and the hospital staff would have been happy for Dad to do it then surely anyone the mother asks should be able to catch at that point? Jo At 11:27 PM +1000 5/8/05, Andrea Quanchi wrote: Brenda, Do you work at Rosebud if so could you tell me do they have a policy for MIPP who come to the hospital with women in labour. Someone led me to believe that they do. In fact does anybody know of anywhere that does that could get me a copy. I have been summonsed by the CEO to please explain why I acted as an accoucher for a woman when I was not there as a hospital employee. They seem to have decided that only hospital employees are to be 'allowed' to catch babies when in this establishement and I need to be able to demonstrate that there can be an agreement that non hospital employed persons such as MIPP can and should be able to do this. I know it is happening in lots of places but is it all undetected and hidden by false ( or not quite the truth) documentation as is my experience. The trouble with this is that it will eventually come back to bite you in the bum. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Andrea Quanchi -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] HBA
Australian Unity also have excellent cover for homebirth but you have to get it in writing from them first. cheers Jo At 2:36 PM +1000 3/8/05, Janet Fraser wrote: Excellent news, Andrea. I await with interest, as does the rest of Joyous Birth! The defence forces gold standard cover pays for hb entirely, which is also useful to know : ) J -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] laparoscopy
I am currently doing IVF and have jumped through all the test hoops, well most of them anyway. I haven't had a lap because the only reason for me to have one would be to check for endo and if I do have endo it is not severe enough to prevent IVF from working, I am doing IVF anyway so there is no point. A lap is the ONLY way they can be sure about endometriosis so if they suspect she has endo then that is the test yes. Severe endo can often be seen on a high level ultrasound but not always and less severe endo probably would not be seen by ultrasound. There is a blood test for endo but my understanding is that it is so unreliable as to be not worth the time. They often also check tubal patency during a lap but this can by done without the lap by having a HSG (dye/xray) or HyCoSy (sugar solution/ultrasound) instead, both of these tests can be painful but they are quick and do not involve any more sedation or painkillers than a couple of panadol. Is her Gyno a fertility specialist practicing as part of an IVF clinic? If not then she should change Drs, general gynos are not known in the infertile community for giving the best fertility advice. If she is in Sydney I can recommend two excellent Drs. Whether she changes Drs or not she should take all of her test results to someone else for a second opinion, you would be amazed how differently two fertility specialists can interpret the same results. I don't know what other tests she has had but fertility workups usually start with a semen analysis, cycle day 21 blood tests to check progesterone levels and confirm ovulation, probably a bunch of other blood tests too to look for things like PCOS and a tubal patency test. Depending on what is wrong then possibly some cycle tracking with regular blood work and ultrasounds. If the problem is PCOS then she would most likely be put on metformin, which seems to be quite helpful and will most likely also help with the weight problem. If tubes are clear and SA is ok then the the medical approach for unexplained or ovulatory infertility is usually 2-4 months of chlomid. If Chlomid doesn't work in 4 months it won't work. Chlomid has a number of drawbacks but it is cheap and simple (taken orally monitoring not really required) and it does often work. Then maybe FSH ovulation induction with or without IUI, FSH ovulation induction works better than chlomid, has less side effects but i! s more expensive, involves injecting yourself daily and extensive monitoring. If neither of those work then she would be encouraged to move on to IVF. Fertility treatment often provides more answers as you go along, though sometimes you continue to be told there is no apparent reason for your infertility and you just have bad luck... that was probably way more than you were looking for but hopefully it will help a little. cheers Jo At 10:19 PM +1000 29/7/05, Madelaine Akras wrote: I have a patient that I am treating for infertility. Her gyno has recommended she have a laparoscopy to investigate possible causes. She is feeling uncomfortable with this procedure due to the risks. She has also been told that being overweight may also increase these. Can anyone advise or assist me please. Are there any other safe procedures avaiable to determine the same?? Madelaine Akras Naturopath -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: Fw: [ozmidwifery] Encouraging twins into a good presentation.
Gloria, I too wonder about the hysteria about cord prolapse etc and once they knew that the twins were so locked together that they weren't moving anywhere you have to wonder how serious the cord prolapse was going to get. However the ambos didn't know that nothing was pressing on the cervix and lying down for them really could have had tragic results. I think the transverse one was lower, blocking the path of the second cephalic twin and they were wrapped around each other preventing either from moving. Also the twin whose waters broke was fine at birth but the second twin was not ready to be born and had (to a NICU) minor breathing problems for a week or so. They both breastfed ok but the one that broke his waters did better, this was despite the hospitals very helpful advice that the were too young to feed. Finally (furthering Gloria's point about the hysteria around cord prolapse) when the babes arrived in NICU no one was expecting them. When they were told whose babies the the reply was But her babies died in utero en route. Nice. Gloria I absolutely agree it's a juggling act, I was planning a homebirth for my second and then turned out to be infertile. I now find myself as worried about moving too far from a level three hospital as I am about actually going to one. We have moved on to IVF now, so the risk of twins just dropped dramatically, which is a comfort. cheers Jo At 10:44 AM -0700 29/7/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The risk of cord prolapse is increased with a presenting part that is NOT cephalic, however, there is a great deal of adrenalin production obstetrics which I am dubious about. Nature does have another protection in the event of cord prolapse called Wharton's jelly in the cord. When we try to ligate the vessels after birth by tying cord tape or dental floss around it, we have to really put our whole body weight and strength into getting it tight enough to stop blood flow through those vessels EVEN WHEN THE PULSE HAS STOPPED in the cord for many minutes. So, although no one wants to have a cord prolapse, and, of course, smart, prompt action should be taken, I have come to suspect pronouncements by obstetricians about what would have happened if had not occurred. The greatest danger in cord prolapse, in my view, is during second stage with a primip having the cord pinched between the bony pelvis and the bony head. Another extreme danger might be the pack a day (Or more) smoking mom who has a skinny umbilical cord and already compromised baby. I think that a big part of midwifery is educating each other and pregnant women to look more objectively at the drama that surrounds complications in birth and ask ourselves is the mythology actually true. Thanks for posting that story, Jo, because it's definately not right to just quote wonderful stories where everything turned out perfectly by just sitting on hands. My question that I always come down to with modern obstetrics is How many are killed or injured by the fear who would have lived if they had gone out and squatted in the woods somewhere? It's a juggling act, for sure. There have been so many second twins that die or are injured in medical care and somehow those stories are buried. I think this is one of the reasons that more families in N. America are saying The hell with it, we'll take our chances with Mother Nature and accept responsibility for the consequences. Gloria Lemay Quoting Lindsay Yvette [EMAIL PROTECTED]: - Original Message - From: Lindsay Yvette [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Jo Bourne [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 12:42 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Encouraging twins into a good presentation. Thanks Jo, that's really good to know just in case that happened to me. I'll mention possible cord prolapse to the midwife Ob when I see them next. Gloria I've seen that website, seen the stills read the birth story though not bought the DVD. I've seen another DVD of a planned twins homebirth in Melbourne of boy/girl twins, where the second baby was breech, and it's truly inspiring. The babies were born into water both so alert, calm healthy looking. The website for that one is http://www.womenofspirit.asn.au/welcome.html My website for this pregnancy is http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/t/twingirlslb/ where I've been keeping a journal. Yvette - Original Message - From: Jo Bourne [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Lindsay Yvette [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 9:27 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Encouraging twins into a good presentation. Hi Yvette, I hate hate hate conveying less good outcomes on a list like ozmid (or at all for that matter) so I nearly didn't send this. A friend of mine who had two previous text book natural births was pregnant with identical twins in separate sacks for her third pregnancy, she fought very hard to organise at least the opportunity to birth
Re: [ozmidwifery] drs getting paid to vaccinate
actually they are still giving the live polio vaccine, I discussed this with my GP just a few weeks ago as polio, tetanus anddiphtheria are the only ones we are remotely considering giving our daughter (3.5 yrs) and she said it would be next year before the injectable (killed) polio would be available for free. She did say I could buy it now if I wanted to but we may not do it at all so we are in no rush... At 2:39 PM +1000 29/7/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I also choose to vaccinate my children and myself (working in the healthcare field) as I believe the benefit to the greater whole (community) outweighs any possible adverse reaction from the vaccination. I have made an informed choice and should the unthinkable happen I would in no way feel guilty for my choice. I suggest that each individual needs to know that they can accept the consequences of their own decisions either way. Regards Fiona Rumble I think it is important to remember that there have been many factors involved in dangerous diseases being irradicated, hygeine the main reason. There are many many people including health professionals that do not believe that vaccinations are the main reason that diseases have been wiped out, infact for a long time the only cases of polio in Australia were due to the live vaccine given ( yes, I know it is no longer given, just using an example). I don't think it is a true statement to say that vaccines are of benefit to the greater community, especially at the potential risk to a childs life. Love Abby - who was trying to stay out of this controversial topic..but.. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] broken collar bone subsequent birth
Well there is also the fact that surgery is presumably what surgeons do well, waiting around patiently for you to do it yourself perhaps not so much the average surgeon's main skill set. At 9:15 AM +0930 24/6/05, Dean Jo wrote: On a side note, I'm always intrigued that consumers will often trust a surgeon to cut their baby out but not trust that surgeon to catch their baby safely in a vaginal birth. Perhaps there's a logic in there I don't understand? AH! Because trusting them to catch your baby requires trusting your body to birth the baby. That self trust is not encouraged by many in the system, especially those who believe that birth is not safe anyway. jo -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.7.11/26 - Release Date: 6/22/2005 -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Childbirth Education classes
to be legislation to bring cbe OUT of the institutions to the community. In SA we are so proud of our state wide Perinatal guidelines, there is probable cause to push the need for education to be statewide also. We need the government to push safe and happy birthing by promoting education that impacts these things. And then the little piggies can fly -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Diane Gardner Sent: Friday, May 27, 2005 1:57 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] Childbirth Education classes Wow am I steamed! I've just had a woman ring me in an absolute mess. She attended the Prenatal classes run by St Vincents Private just recently and and is scared out of her wits. She said she had been so excited and looking forward to birthing her baby until she attended the classes. She said they fed in negative, pain, complications and drugs! What is going on here? We wonder why women go into labour in a hospital screaming and begging for drugs. Just what sort of programming are these classes installing into women and taking away their ability to trust their bodies for birth. How long do we have to put up with this and how much worse is it going to get before the hospital Boards GET it or is the money rewards for doing all this more important than birth. Sorry to vent here SO loudly but I'm getting so fed up with this same old story. Where does one have to start to have these classes brought back to the real world and some sensible and simple tools for birth! Sheesh Breathing and counting to 10...20.30 grrr ahhh!!! Diane -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.17 - Release Date: 5/25/2005 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.17 - Release Date: 5/25/2005 No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.17 - Release Date: 25/05/2005 -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Baby!
Congratulations! At 10:19 AM +0800 27/5/05, JoFromOz wrote: Hello one and all. Just a quick note to let you know that my darling little William Matthew Watson is here! He arrived at 0529 this morning born in water at home with membranes intact, and he's gorgeous! 3.4kg, 50cm length, 33cm head, attended by the honerable Mary Murphy :) That's all for now. Love Jo (RM) -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Pain relief resources
Oh I have to disagree, I have had a tooth abscess and it is WAY worse than natural birth. There is no mental work you can do to make sense of broken limbs or dying teeth - you are in pain because something is VERY wrong. This is nothing like labour (was for me). It is likely that I was in more pain during labour but it was a very different kind of pain and far more manageable there was mental work I could do to get through it and the whole thing had a point. I think pain from the body doing its job is far more manageable than pain from the body being damaged. At 9:04 AM +1000 26/5/05, Barry Sonja wrote: It was very funny to watch Oprah have her ears pierced!!! Along this track, my mother says that childbirth is like that tooth ache you get if you need root canal therapy! only much more bearable because you get breaks in between!! Sonja - Original Message - From: Andrea Quanchi [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 7:06 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Re: Pain relief resources Did anyone see Oprah getting her ears pierced on her show recently it was hysterical. Just reinforced my lack of desire to have mine done and I gave birth to three big babies without much trouble at all. Andrea Q On 25/05/2005, at 4:10 PM, Lieve Huybrechts wrote: I still have no ear piercings,will you come and hold my hand :-))) Lieve Lieve Huybrechts vroedvrouw 0477/740853 -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Namens G Lemay Verzonden: dinsdag 24 mei 2005 18:00 Aan: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Onderwerp: [ozmidwifery] Re: Pain relief resources I think one reason why women fear the pain of childbirth so much is that they know that no one is being straight with them about Just how bad is it? I think that being descriptive about what I felt (like a molten hot basket ball being pressed down into my crotch every 3 minutes with just enough time to barely get myself together before the next big press) AND also letting women know that I'm the world's biggest wimp when it comes to pain (didn't have my ears pierced till I was 34 y.o. and then had to lie in bed whimpering for 24 hrs after) and yet I've had 3 natural births, is empowering. I also find that if a woman is friends with other women who have done it she's more likely to go the distance. I tell the women they can have the pay now plan or the pay later plan with re to pain in birth. The pay now route gets it done in one day (natural birth), the pay later route means a low grade insidious pain that can last beyond six weeks (epidural headache, backache, stitches healing, or worse after c sec). The biggest benefit of the pay now route is that you have a child with all the brain cells Nature intended for him/her. That is a reward that you reap for your whole life for just one day of courage. Gloria Lemay, Vancouver, BC Canada -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.15 - Release Date: 22/05/2005 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.15 - Release Date: 22/05/2005 -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] testing again.
yes At 12:37 PM +1000 22/5/05, jesse/jayne wrote: does anyone receive my messges? thanks Jayne -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
[ozmidwifery] Re: breastfeeding
It was absolutely worth it!! One day when my daughter was about 9mths a woman
from my yoga class, who had only jut had her baby, stopped by with her husband
to pick up some nappies. The next time I saw her she told me how, as they
drove away her husband had said to her You make breastfeeding look easy but
she makes it look like it's nothing at all. I cried and still cry every time i
think of this conversation. Making it through to that point was absolutely
worth it.
Lieve's point is also very very true.
cheers
Jo
At 3:39 PM +1000 20/5/05, Denise Fisher wrote:
The trying times that Jo experienced breastfeeding will only have been 'worth
it' to we professionals if we can learn from it, and other women's
experiences. (Jo, I'm guessing you felt it was worth it for you and your child
regardless - taking nothing away from what you went through).
It's undeniable that artificial feeding is inferior nutrition for infants. So,
rather than fighting for a mother's right to not have to put up with pain,
cracks, mastitis, cellulitis, etc, etc, etc, let's direct all our energies
into finding causes and solutions for these problems. And to educating our
colleagues about what we have already learnt.
Oh well ... that's what makes sense to me. X;{
Denise
***
Denise Fisher
Health e-Learning
http://www.health-e-learning.com
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--
This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics.
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--
Jo Bourne
Virtual Artists Pty Ltd
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RE: [ozmidwifery] Breastfeeding
the assumption of breastfeeding as normal, and facilitating normal establishment of breastfeeding by knowledgeable midwives is the key. Self-confidence in an ability to birth naturally is just as important as self-confidence to feed their baby naturally. Introducing doubt needlessly to either process destroys self-confidence. Denise *** Denise Fisher Health e-Learning http://www.health-e-learning.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.8 - Release Date: 5/10/2005 -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.0 - Release Date: 4/29/2005 -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] FW: Breastfeeding
to Australia's population, no matter how much Mr Howard exhorts me to. If I had no breasts or my breasts were not functional I would not feel guilty that I'm not breastfeeding regardless of how many people told me it was best. My opinion is that some health professionals don't know how to support women to breastfeed adequately and in covering their own feelings of guilt about this they 'pretend' that it's the mother they are trying not to make feel guilty. To give you lots of different opinions on guilt and breastfeeding do a google search using those terms. Have fun Denise At 03:23 PM 18/05/2005 +0930, you wrote: Some food for thought, What about the women who simply cannot breastfeed and cannot produce enough milk The wet nurse is still in existence in many tribal cultures where formulary has no influence. Itís very easy to be passionate about something and sing itís praises when you have experienced success, but what about those women who donít succeed despite months of trying and perseverance. I, like all many midwives of course believe that breast is best and should be promoted as optimum nutrition for a baby but sometimes I believe that in trying to get this message across we need to be careful not to make other women lose their ëconfidence ands fall into the motherhood guilt trapí. Carina *** Denise Fisher, MMP, BN, IBCLC Health e-Learning http://www.health-e-learning.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Fwd: Message for Ozmid board
I have to respectfully disagree, all the the more they sleep the more they sleep advice to the contrary my daughter goes to sleep in record time the days she skips her nap and is up 2 hours past her bedtime if we let her nap too long or too late. It is sheer hell Every child is different, I don't think it helps anyone to say that all kids sleep better at night if they sleep better during the day because it just makes those of us with different sleepers feel worse. cheers Jo At 6:27 PM +1000 1/1/05, Fiona Craig Rumble wrote: ? Hi all just thought I'd throw in my 5 cents worth on the sleeping in the day subject. My first child refused to sleep during the day at all, unless I was wearing her in a sling (or we were at a NMAA meeting when she would make a liar of me and blissfully sleep in the capsule). When I became pregnant with no. 2 when 1st was 1 year I thought I was in trouble as I needed a nap! Luckily at 14 months she decided a daytime sleep would be OK! I am a firm believer that the better a child sleeps during the day, the better they sleep at night, and have never personally known an occasion when keeping a child from having a sleep during the day helped them to sleep at night. Child just gets over-tired and harder to get to sleep. The least stress is the best, so stay calm and enjoy your little ones. Soon they are all growed up and hard to get to go to bed and even harder to get out of bed! Cheers Fiona -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] insurnace companies
australian unity is the same, up to $2000 for a planned homebirth but if you decide to employ a private OB you can only get a refund for one of your care providers, not both. my understanding is they would still pay the midwife if you transfered to hospital but only if you either went public or paid the hospital/OB fees yourself. You must make an agreement with them in advance though, their policy document states a much lower amount for midwifery with a note to contact them regarding planned homebirth. We got a letter from them spelling out what they would cover before transferring to them, as we transferred soley for this reason they said they would only pay if we conceived AFTER changing to them. cheers Jo At 8:07 PM +1030 12/11/04, Kate /or Nick wrote: I know with defence health that it covers you for a midwife. But it doesn't if you then need an OB. ie one or the other. Kate - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 7:49 PM Subject: [ozmidwifery] insurnace companies Hi Jo, we are covered for Midwifery by Defence Health. Heard of others using Australian Unity. I know there are others but can't be sure off the top of my head, cheers Megan -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Dean Jo Sent: Friday, 12 November 2004 2:05 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [ozmidwifery] insurnace companies Has anyone got an up to date list of health insurance companies that offer midwifery or birth care? Cheers Jo This message was sent through MyMail http://www.mymail.com.au -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Doppler anyone....?
I don't imagine ever having the slightest interest in one of these for myself - I ended up refusing to have doppler checks at antenatal appointments once anyone with eyes could see my daughters constant kicking... HOWEVER for women who have struggled with infertility and in particular repeated loss I can understand absolutely their need to listen. I read blogs daily of a number of women in this situation and it is literally a question for them of how long they can force themselves to go between ultrasound checks and not be a weeping mess, for most this seems to be a week or two. I would never ever want that many ultrasounds for myself but I honestly think for some women the stress involved in not hearing a heartbeat very regularly is probably worse for the fetus than the repeated ultrasound exposure. Of course these are being marketed at all and sundry and they shouldn't be, but for some women they probably do have a place. cheers Jo At 3:09 AM + 8/10/04, Kirsten Wohlt wrote: Well picked up Abby! That would certainly have been me. I'm a neurotic mess when I'm pregnant at the best of times, without having that extra worry! That's what I love about this group. You see things in a way I never would have thought of. Education by email - love it. Thanks! Kirsten -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] measuring Hb during pregnancy
I can only speak about my own pregnancy but I had consistently normal hb but low serum ferritin levels. The care I was given was to keep an eye on my dietary iron intake and monitor my hb to make sure it stayed up then to recheck sometime before my next pregnancy to see if I was always that way. Both levels remained consistent from the time this was first noticed, no more action was taken (than eating iron rich foods) and i did end up getting the retest a year or more post natally and my ferritin was normal so the low levels were presumably pregnancy related. I think supplements may have been suggested as an option if I felt like it but not pushed as necessary unless the situation changed... cheers Jo At 8:13 PM +0800 22/9/04, Mary Murphy wrote: Andrea wrote:... there is a widespread belief that this test (hb) can effectively detect anaemia and iron deficiency. The latest measure seems to be Ferritin and according to http://www.ironpanel.com.auwww.ironpanel.com.au this measures the iron stores in the marrow. Ironpanel says that ferritin 15 means that a person usually has no sustainable iron left in the bone marrow My experience has been that pregnant women have reasonable Hbs (110) with ferritins of 5. They are usually well and energetic, but because of the low ferritin are being supplemented quite heavily. Comments please? -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] FW: URGENT - Publcily funded Home Birth needs your support!!
I have written a letter, I borrowed some of yours, I hope that is ok - I haven't posted it yet so I can change it if you prefer. cheers Jo At 15:40 +1000 6/8/04, Julie Clarke wrote: As I write, the Health Minister, Mr Morris Iemma, currently has before him a report considering publicly funded home birthing for healthy women in NSW. I appreciate how busy everyone is but I think it is an excellent and rare opportunity to express, in the form of letter writing, our need and support for such a service. Therefore, I am asking that all you happy homebirthers, midwives, partners, family and friends, please write the Minister a letter in support of this proposal. It doesn't matter how detailed or straightforward the letter is, the main aim is to inundate the Minister our enthusiasm for such a service. We need to let the politicians know that we are out there and we are not going away until our needs have been met!!! Thanks and all the best - Brigett English PS: I would be grateful if you could please forward my email to all interested parties. Minister's address: Mr Morris Iemma, Minister for Health, NSW Health Department, Level 30, Govenor Macquarie Tower, 1 Farrer Place, NSW 2000 (My letter) Dear Minister Iemma Publicly funded home birth for health women I understand that the NSW Health Department are currently assessing the viability of a home birth service for healthy women. I am writing to you to express my absolute support and enthusiasm for such a service. I gave birth at home in the UK and it was without doubt the most empowering experience of my life. One of the many positive aspects of a publicly funded home birth service is that it will promote the view that birth is essentially a healthy and normal process. I feel that this is something that will be of benefit to all women and their families. Thankfully, there are midwifes currently operating independently in NSW who believe in the birth process. I am so grateful that these health professionals are willing to provide such a valuable maternity service to women like me without insurance and with little support from the medical establishment. I am hopeful that this lack of support for women and their partners, who choose to birth outside the hospital system and the midwives that support them, is about to change! Yours sincerely Want to block unwanted pop-ups? Download the free http://g.msn.com/8HMBENUK/2728??PS=47575MSN Toolbar now! -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Orthodontist
I can absolutely recommend Helen McClean. My teeth were shocking and the school dentist said I would need braces years in advance. My first orthodontist used to have waiting times of up to a 2 hrs He was also rude and explained his treatement as 4 teeth out and then braces for 1.5 years. My mum got jack of the waiting and rudeness and changed to Helen just before I was due to start treatment. She was AMAZING. Explained everything, generally directly to me while mum listened in, rarely more than a 5 minute wait, radically different treatment plan too. She told us upfront that my teeth would, to some point, return to their orginal state and that her goal was to get all my molars meeting and everything straight, than anything else was a bonus. 10 years after ending treatment this is exactly how they were. I went to see a fancy international lecturing orthodontic surgeon in sydney as I was considering trying to fix the front again. He asked who had done my original treatment and what they did. He said I had the absolute best of modern treatment and then proceed to go on and on about how amazing Helen McLean was. I was frankly amazed that the high flying sydney (male) orthodontist knew of and was impressed by my Adelaide (female) orthodontist. does that say more about me or him? He said he didn't want to treat me (only option jaw surgery that would also be back how it was in 5 yrs) but to go back to Helen next I was in Adelaide and ask her. I went to see her and she a) remembered my case in detail and b) did the most thor! ough exam I have ever had c) said this is exactly what I hoped for d) explained all the reasons in detail for not doing various treatments had been sugestted to me and I left feeling great. cheers Jo At 23:00 +1000 26/5/04, Sheena Johnson wrote: Hi this is not mid related, but I am stuck, and was wondering if any of the midwives in Adelaide could recommend an orthodontist for my daughter? I am having trouble finding one that comes recommended, don't really know enough people over there. Could you email me off list? Actually, I do have a midwifery question. Since I am starting my grad year and am beginning to assist at births unsupervised, I was wondering how many people on the list routinely remove the cord from around the babies neck if it is there, and how many don't.Do you even check? What is the frequency of cutting before the shoulders are born? I feel that if there is no obvious obstruction of labour and there are signs of progress, ie restitution, the shoulders follow the head etc. then we should probably not bother about removing the cord, what do others think? Thanks, Sheena Johnson mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Beautiful Birth
I have seen this on a few websites I read daily, as well as here, and i thought it was beautiful, certainly made me cry. I keep wanting to go back and watch it again, but each time I am surprised a new by how still the mother seems to be. You can see how happy and healthy mum and baby are at birth, so I can only assume she was doing exactly the right thing for her - but I guess I expected a homebirth to have more moving around, standing up, etc. There is a big gap in there between 6 and 7:30ish, maybe she was off going for a walk, who knows, I guess I just can't imagine being able to spend what appears to be so much time reclining during active labour. Was anyone else struck by this? If nothing else my reaction tells me something about my own preconceptions and expectations :-). cheers Jo At 21:21 +1000 14/4/04, megan davidson wrote: This from the ukmidwifery list and is an absulutely beautiful birth!!! Megan - Original Message - From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Maxine Moss To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, April 13, 2004 5:44 PM Subject: [ukmidwifery] Check this out :-) Sorry if you've seen it before:- Takes a little while to load, but worth the wait http://danielfairbanks.com/jude/jude.htmhttp://danielfairbanks.com/jude/jude.htm Max x CHANGING YOUR UKMIDWIFERY SETTINGS: To change to the Daily Digest, go no-mail (ie read emails only on the website), to leave the list, and to remove graphics and adverts from messages, go to 'Edit My Membership' at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ukmidwiferyhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/ukmidwifery You can also UNSUBSCRIBE by sending a blank email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] and NOT to the usual group address. *** Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ukmidwifery/http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ukmidwifery/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/Yahoo! Terms of Service. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Beautiful Birth
I guess this is what I was trying to say, the photos (and the 3 hr timeframe) really did seem to show that she was doing just what she needed. But I was surprised, I couldn't really relate, and this probably tells me more about myself than anything else but I was curious if anyone else noticed is all. Also, there must be a element of photographs being easier (and maybe looking better) when everyone is staying still long enough to get a good shot cheers Jo At 9:41 +1000 16/4/04, Judy Chapman wrote: At the risk of being flamed, moving around is not the best for all. I have recently cared for a woman with definite ideas for an active birth (unfortunately I did not know her prior) and when she started contracting well she was very active. Bath, all fours, standing, walking all night. Declined VE. I thought she was doing really well but had to go at change of shift. I was gobsmacked to see her still walking when I came back the next night. She got to 7 cm and then stalled for a long time, by then ready for CS, anything. By 0145 she had what was for this small hospital a rare occurrence, an epidural, and was birthed in just over 2 hours. I suspect she had not been able to let her pelvic floor go and let the baby out. Suggestions? Cheers Judy --- jayne [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yes Jo, despite loving the 'story', the music, the look of wonderment on the childrens' faces etc, after noticing the mum on the bed in a couple of photos, I kept thinking, why isn't she up moving around?! But how well done was it?! It's truly one of the most beautiful things I've seen in a long time. Seems to be making a big impact on the web. Jayne - Original Message - From: Jo Bourne [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, April 16, 2004 8:43 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Beautiful Birth I have seen this on a few websites I read daily, as well as here, and i thought it was beautiful, certainly made me cry. I keep wanting to go back and watch it again, but each time I am surprised a new by how still the mother seems to be. You can see how happy and healthy mum and baby are at birth, so I can only assume she was doing exactly the right thing for her - but I guess I expected a homebirth to have more moving around, standing up, etc. There is a big gap in there between 6 and 7:30ish, maybe she was off going for a walk, who knows, I guess I just can't imagine being able to spend what appears to be so much time reclining during active labour. Was anyone else struck by this? If nothing else my reaction tells me something about my own preconceptions and expectations :-). cheers Jo At 21:21 +1000 14/4/04, megan davidson wrote: This from the ukmidwifery list and is an absulutely beautiful birth!!! Megan - Original Message - From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Maxine Moss To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, April 13, 2004 5:44 PM Subject: [ukmidwifery] Check this out :-) Sorry if you've seen it before:- Takes a little while to load, but worth the wait http://danielfairbanks.com/jude/jude.htmhttp://danielfairbanks.com/jude/j ude.htm Max x CHANGING YOUR UKMIDWIFERY SETTINGS: To change to the Daily Digest, go no-mail (ie read emails only on the website), to leave the list, and to remove graphics and adverts from messages, go to 'Edit My Membership' at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ukmidwiferyhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/ukm idwifery You can also UNSUBSCRIBE by sending a blank email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] and NOT to the usual group address. *** Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ukmidwifery/http://groups.yahoo.com/group/u kmidwifery/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]ukmidwi [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/Yahoo! Terms of Service. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. Find local movie times and trailers on Yahoo! Movies. http://au.movies.yahoo.com -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Co-sleeping and older children
to co-sleeping with our child it seemed only natural, despite the fact that I had no preconcieved ideas about how we would handle it. I did recognize that my situation with Mum would no doubt have been quite different if Dad had still been alive. He used to let us get in to the bed in the night, but we were still predominantly in the cot when he was around. We certainly find our child needs to co-sleep as part of his emotional security and it is predominantly a beautiful bond strengthening experience alround, but admit as per my recent postings on the subject, that it can be challenging to say the least and does, at times, interfere with our sex lives. We don't seem to be as energetic, imaginative or motivated as we were early in our relationship. I wonder if it is also an age/familiarity related thing...again that is another story. I too have really enjoyed the recent discussions on this subject and thanks those who have give us an insight into their lives when the sun goes down. Helen Cahill -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Fw: NRMA
In my cancelletion email earlier this month I explained I was leaving soley due to their in adequate homebirth cover as we were planning to have more children and needed better cover. That was before this... At 22:59 +1100 17/3/04, jo hunter wrote: Hi all, NRMA Health Funds are discontinuing rebates for homebirth and midwifery homecare. Below are the details and address to write letters too. thanks Jo Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2004 2:03 PM Subject: FW: NRMA Subject: NRMA Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 18:32:07 +1100 Hi Rob, Would you be able to pass this information through the email to our families please. NRMA Health Fund are discontinuing rebates for homebirths and midwifery home care as they believe this service is not used. We need to write to NRMA as either members or prospective members to complain. Not only should the rebate for homebirths remain but it should be increased to the equivalent rebate paid for women who choose to birth their babies in a private hospital with a private obstetrician, which, if they ended up with a caesarean (private hospitals have a 25 - 50% caesarean rate) would cost upwards of $10,000 to cover fees for: 1.. hospital stay ($4000 - $6000) - this cost may not cover labour ward fees 2.. Obstetrician ($3500 - $4500) 3.. Anaesthetist (for epidural in labour which is almost assured at a private hospital or a general if required for the caesarean) 4.. Routine Paediatrician check ($150 - $200) 5.. Physiotherapy 6.. Operating theatre costs 7.. Every drug is itemised and charged to your account, even panadol. Comparatively speaking, homebirthing is saving the government and the health funds an enormous cost. Letters should be addressed to: Jenece Coyles Customer Service Manager NRMA Health Fund Myra _ Protect your inbox from harmful viruses with new ninemsn Premium. Go to http://ninemsn.com.au/premium/landing.asp?banner=emailtagreferrer=hotmail -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] sleep issues
mothers identify what works best, i.e. having the baby in bed, but they will then say in the next breath but I don't want to get into that habit or I don't want to go down that path. What do you think would happen if you did make that choice? Unlikely the baby would still be there when he was 5 years old although if he was and you were all still sleeping, would that bother you? And if so, why? What would be your concerns? Before you can find a solution, you first need to identify your priorities and your concerns/fears. If having the baby in your bed works but it would cause you excessive distress then this may not be the option. As a mum of 4 who chose co sleeping with babies 2,3 and 4, a childbirth educator and a doula, I have to say that any fears about the baby being spoilt or never moving into their own room are unwarranted. My kids have all moved quite comfortably to their own beds at around 3-4 years of age. Exactly the same time that otehr friends who insisted on cots in seprate rooms had children who started to settle better at night. It doesn't really appear to makea lot of difference which method you try in terms of getting them to sleep through the night. Several points to remember: 1. Some babies just do sleep through night regardless of what their parents do or don't do - it is just luck of the draw 2. Some babies need more close connection with their parents for the first 3 years 3. It is more important to get sleep than to have good intentions - without sleep you have no ability to carry through the good intentions anyway! 4. Most babies tend to settle a lot more once they get beyond 3 years - regardless of what you did in the first 3 years Think about why him being in his own bed is so important to you. Is it because of preconcdeived ideas about what constitutes a good mother? Or what other's expectations of you are? Or having to explain to other people (perhaps not tewlling anyone else is a viable alternative here!) Good luck. Having had my first child who did not sleep through the night until he was four years old and after sharing countless sleepless nights with him, I can completely empathise. Nikki Macfarlane Director, Childbrith International http://www.childbirthinternational.comwww.childbirthinternational.com -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] The best news...!
As a consumer where is a letter best sent in support of this news? To Mary Chiarella? If so does any one have an address? thanks Jo At 3:37 +1100 1/3/04, Andrea Robertson wrote: From the Sydney Morning Herald today. --- Publicly funded home births for healthy women on agenda By Julie Robotham, Medical Editor March 1, 2004 http://www.smh.com.au/cgi-bin/common/popupPrintArticle.pl?path=/articles/2004/02/29/1077989435235.htmlPrint this article http://www.smh.com.au/cgi-bin/common/popupEmailArticle.pl?path=/articles/2004/02/29/1077989435235.htmlEmail to a friend Women would be able to give birth at home in the care of midwives employed by NSW Health under a radical proposal being considered by the department. The state's chief nursing officer, Mary Chiarella, confirmed that publicly funded home births for healthy women without medical complications were on the agenda. It would mark the first time NSW public maternity patients could have their babies outside hospital. At present, women who want to give birth at home have to employ a midwife privately, with no Medicare rebate - and most private midwives no longer carry insurance after last year's indemnity crisis. Only a handful of NSW women take this option. But Professor Chiarella said: There's no doubt there is a significant consumer drive for home birth. It's about understanding that birth can be a very healthy process. In New Zealand, home deliveries are routine - accounting for more than 10 per cent of births - while there are limited public home birth services in Western Australia and South Australia. In NSW, Professor Chiarella said, home birth midwives might be managed centrally by the department, or could be attached to hospitals or area health services. The possible arrangements would be outlined for public consultation later this year. Lesley Barclay, director of the Centre for Family Health and Midwifery at the University of Technology, Sydney, said a hospital was still the safest place to give birth when there was a known risk of a medical problem. But for healthy mothers, the risks of having their baby in hospital might outweigh the benefits. Professor Barclay said the move towards home births internationally was an acknowledgement not just of mothers' preferences, but of hospitals and health services that can no longer sustain the cost of high-intervention births when they're not necessary. There has been increasing pressure on birth services across NSW, especially in rural and regional areas where many specialist GPs and obstetricians have stopped delivering babies in response to rising insurance premiums and workloads. Professor Chiarella said working parties - including departmental managers and lawyers, doctors, midwives and consumer advocates - would examine how home births could be offered safely and equitably. This is the best news we have had for some time. Congratulations to everyone who has worked so hard on this! Regards Andrea - Andrea Robertson Birth International * ACE Graphics * Associates in Childbirth Education e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] web: www.birthinternational.com -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
[ozmidwifery] Re: Private Insurance companies covering independent midwives?
I just sent a letter to australian unity asking what cover they would give me for a home birth. They give about $640 for a private midwife in hospital birth situation (some for prenantal, some for post and a small fee for the birth). They give $2000 for a homebirth if you organise it with them in advance (and join before conceiving). SGIC/NRMA give $500 for midwifery similar to the hospital cover above. Many other funds have a similar small ammount of cover.1 At 9:52 +1100 24/2/04, Alphia Possamai-Inesedy wrote: Jen, I was not aware that this was the case - do you know which private insurance companies do this? I find it surprising considering that independent midwives are not covered by indemnity insurance. I am currently finishing a subsection of my thesis on the indemnity crisis and found your news interesting. If you could help me out with this I would grealty appreciate it. Take care Alphia At 03:47 AM 17/02/2004, you wrote: Some private insurance companies cover the fee of a midwife in private practice. One to one care with a midwife she's known throughout pregnancy birth is her best bet for successful breast feeding. Best of luck, Jen Melissah Scott @ Spilt Art [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have someone who is about 18 weeks pregnant and fairly recently moved to the blue mountians (Katoomba) She is unsure of where to birth at the moment and is concidering birthing at nepean private to make use of her private health insurance. She is hoping to stay in hospital for about 5 or so days, and at nepean private her husband can stay with her. She wants to stay in for a few days because she is nervous about being able to breastfeed and take care of her bub, as she feels she has not much idea of what she is doing. So I sugested to her that maybe a doula could be of great benifit to her by the way of childbirth info, birthing and post natal care/advice etc. She is quite interested in talking to some doulas in the area. So, I thought Id try to get together a list of Doulas in the area to pass on to her. If anyone is interested, could you please either reply or email me directly with all your details mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] I know your around Abby, but I cant find your contact details. Thanks! Melissah http://www.splitart.com/www.Splitarthttp://www.splitart.com/.com Try the new improved http://au.rd.yahoo.com/mail/tagline/*http://www.yahoo.com.auYahoo! Australia NZ Search Alphia Possamai-Inesedy Ba (Hons.) PhD. Candidate School of Applied and Human Sciences Bankstown Campus, University of Western Sydney UWS Locked Bag 1797 South Penrith Distribution Centre NSW 1797 Australia Phone: 02 97726628 Fax: 02 97726584 -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] Re: Private Insurance companies covering independent midwives?
speaking about insurance, I just called our previous insurer to see if they would match Australian Unity before changing over (they pay a maximum of $500). They wouldn't because Its a lesser level of care than you would receive in hospital to have a home birth. I couldn't help myself, I actually laughed at the poor woman who had to give me this jem of health insurance wisdom. At 7:59 +0800 24/2/04, Sally Westbury wrote: HBF in Western Australia refund $1400 for a homebirth or a private midwife in a public hospital. Sally Westbury -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jo Bourne Sent: Tuesday, 24 February 2004 7:31 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [ozmidwifery] Re: Private Insurance companies covering independent midwives? I just sent a letter to australian unity asking what cover they would give me for a home birth. They give about $640 for a private midwife in hospital birth situation (some for prenantal, some for post and a small fee for the birth). They give $2000 for a homebirth if you organise it with them in advance (and join before conceiving). SGIC/NRMA give $500 for midwifery similar to the hospital cover above. Many other funds have a similar small ammount of cover.1 At 9:52 +1100 24/2/04, Alphia Possamai-Inesedy wrote: Jen, I was not aware that this was the case - do you know which private insurance companies do this? I find it surprising considering that independent midwives are not covered by indemnity insurance. I am currently finishing a subsection of my thesis on the indemnity crisis and found your news interesting. If you could help me out with this I would grealty appreciate it. Take care Alphia At 03:47 AM 17/02/2004, you wrote: Some private insurance companies cover the fee of a midwife in private practice. One to one care with a midwife she's known throughout pregnancy birth is her best bet for successful breast feeding. Best of luck, Jen Melissah Scott @ Spilt Art [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have someone who is about 18 weeks pregnant and fairly recently moved to the blue mountians (Katoomba) She is unsure of where to birth at the moment and is concidering birthing at nepean private to make use of her private health insurance. She is hoping to stay in hospital for about 5 or so days, and at nepean private her husband can stay with her. She wants to stay in for a few days because she is nervous about being able to breastfeed and take care of her bub, as she feels she has not much idea of what she is doing. So I sugested to her that maybe a doula could be of great benifit to her by the way of childbirth info, birthing and post natal care/advice etc. She is quite interested in talking to some doulas in the area. So, I thought Id try to get together a list of Doulas in the area to pass on to her. If anyone is interested, could you please either reply or email me directly with all your details mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] I know your around Abby, but I cant find your contact details. Thanks! Melissah http://www.splitart.com/www.Splitarthttp://www.splitart.com/.com Try the new improved http://au.rd.yahoo.com/mail/tagline/*http://www.yahoo.com.auYahoo! Australia NZ Search Alphia Possamai-Inesedy Ba (Hons.) PhD. Candidate School of Applied and Human Sciences Bankstown Campus, University of Western Sydney UWS Locked Bag 1797 South Penrith Distribution Centre NSW 1797 Australia Phone: 02 97726628 Fax: 02 97726584 -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Fw: Hep C question
I seem to recall my GP (who is an IBCLC) told me that HIV and Tuberculosis are the only contra indicators to breastfeeding these days. We didn't get into any details of whether there were diseases where you could feed but needed to take extra precautions as I didn't need to know, she was just cranky about women being told to stop for stupid reasons (my mum was stopped when she had the flu while feeding me which is where the conversation started). cheers Jo At 21:48 +1000 15/2/04, M T Holroyd wrote: Trying again. Tina H. - Original Message - From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]M T Holroyd To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]ozmidwifery Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 9:11 PM Subject: Hep C question Hi everyone you might remember around August last year I sent out a request for my friend (J) with regards to her sister who had Hep C (among many other problems). Well I have yet another question. This woman is due to have her baby at the end of March was told at one of her last antenatal visits that she will be able to breastfeed her bub. She is very excited about this as it is something that she had wanted to do if safe for bub. BUT is it safe? I thought I remembered that you were not able to feed if you had Hep C. Has something new come up in recent times to say that it is safe even if she wasn't still using IV drugs (not sure if this has stopped). Thankyou for considering yet another one of my questions. Tina H. (Brisbane) -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Fw: Hep C question
The conversation I am thinking of was over 2 years ago so the info could well have changed. At 7:41 +0800 16/2/04, Kirsten Blacker wrote: Is TB a contra indication? I thought that if the mother was being treated it was ok. I had LONG discussion with many people about the TB meds last year when I had to take them, in the USA, as I was still feeding my youngest Kirsten - Original Message - From: Jo Bourne [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2004 8:37 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Fw: Hep C question I seem to recall my GP (who is an IBCLC) told me that HIV and Tuberculosis are the only contra indicators to breastfeeding these days. We didn't get into any details of whether there were diseases where you could feed but needed to take extra precautions as I didn't need to know, she was just cranky about women being told to stop for stupid reasons (my mum was stopped when she had the flu while feeding me which is where the conversation started). cheers Jo At 21:48 +1000 15/2/04, M T Holroyd wrote: Trying again. Tina H. - Original Message - From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]M T Holroyd To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]ozmidwifery Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 9:11 PM Subject: Hep C question Hi everyone you might remember around August last year I sent out a request for my friend (J) with regards to her sister who had Hep C (among many other problems). Well I have yet another question. This woman is due to have her baby at the end of March was told at one of her last antenatal visits that she will be able to breastfeed her bub. She is very excited about this as it is something that she had wanted to do if safe for bub. BUT is it safe? I thought I remembered that you were not able to feed if you had Hep C. Has something new come up in recent times to say that it is safe even if she wasn't still using IV drugs (not sure if this has stopped). Thankyou for considering yet another one of my questions. Tina H. (Brisbane) -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Fw:(WOW) birth and breastfeeding attitudes
OH that made my day, what a lovely story. At 18:23 +1100 9/12/03, jayne wrote: I was attending the church service of my uncle's funeral. My 4month old started to get fussy and I started to stand to leave the church with her when the minister boomed Don't you dare leave! You are welcome to feed your baby here! He had seen me at the front of the church earlier breastfeeding. - Original Message - From: megan davidson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2003 11:01 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Fw:(WOW) birth and breastfeeding attitudes I have also BF in church, where my father was a priest. No one commented. thats What god, being a wise woman, made them for. Megan - Original Message - From: Pinky McKay [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, December 08, 2003 4:31 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Fw:(WOW) birth and breastfeeding attitudes Hi Cas, God on you -that's what god made breasts for! Reminds me when I was at a nieces wedding and a tiny bub in front of us began to cry, parents were obviously not about to BF in church -James then 2 said in a very loud voice - Mummy, the baby wants a booby I later discovered we were sitting directly in front of the person who was taping teh service - my brotherinlaw, father of the bride was quite bemused - my kids were the first on my husbands side of the family to be breastfed. Pinky - Original Message - From: Wayne and Cas [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, December 08, 2003 3:47 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Fw:(WOW) birth and breastfeeding attitudes I breastfeed my bub in church :) Cas, Wayne, Liam and Daniel McCullough [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.casmccullough.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of JoFromOz Sent: Monday, 8 December 2003 11:29 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Fw:(WOW) birth and breastfeeding attitudes I feel very strongly about the breast feeding in public issue as well. I can't WAIT to do it myself! No wonder some people have so much trouble breastfeeding - it's not considered normal enough to do infront of people, so how do they know how to do it and how to fix the common problems with it? I could be on my high horse for hours about this, but I'll jump off before I start galloping away :) Breastfeeding is just so important, and anyone who tries to tell me not to do it will cop an earful! :) Jo -- Babies are Born... Pizzas are delivered. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
RE: [ozmidwifery] Response from Today Show
thinking before you air something based on the opinions of an obstetrician who's primary concern appears to be his star qualities as a performer instead of what should be his role. Promoting what is safe and best for women and babies. I would have second thoughts about watching your show again! Dierdre Bowman _ Get Hotmail on your mobile phone http://www.msn.co.uk/msnmobile -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] birth and breastfeeding attitudes
this really surprises me, I have just never had even a nasty look (though lots of smiles) - feeding my baby (and now my toddler) on buses, in bank queues, at funerals, weddings, at restaurants with my grandmother who bottlefed all of her 7 children... I forget that there are still people around with this attitude. My daughter still feeds A LOT at 22 months so we still feed in public all the time and I would have the same reaction you did - assuming they must be talking about something else. To be honest I have heard far more women who bottle feed complaining about getting dirty looks and feeling embarassed in public than breastfeeders, possibly they feel guilty and are expecting to get a negative response so they see one. I do think that the majority of Australians have a reasonable attitude today, or at least know to keep their negative opinion to themselves. cheers Jo At 23:05 +1100 7/12/03, Ron Nicole Christensen wrote: Not only am I exasperated by the constant shameful attitude about natural birthing in this country ...but it seems to not stop there!!! . I was strolling out of a local shopping plaza this morning, with my darling 4 month old baby suckling contentedly on the breast all snuggled up in his sling... when a middle-aged woman past me and commented quite loudly to her husband that's disgusting!!. Being in my own little world with my baby - my first thoughts were that she was in deep conversation with her husband... until I eventually looked up and she was giving me a filthy look!!! I am already disheartened by the ignorance of natural birth in this country ... but when the sight of a mother breastfeeding her young baby draws venom (especially from another woman) it really makes me sad. I hope that this woman does not have girls...goodness knows what advice she would be passing on! sorry - just had to share my bizarre experience of today... kind regards, Nicole -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Fwd: response from Pat and Nicky and fetal hearts
midwife rules our little one income family out of that league (our recent homebirth was a loving gift). I see it as a positive and exciting step forward in what is a very bleak and dismal maternity service that currently exists. I just hope that Pat and Nicky do not get so disheartened by the lack of support, that they would consider forgetting about setting up the proposed model. We should all be saying Go Pat and Nicky!!! (I know I am!!!). kindest regards, Nicole - Original Message - From: Andrea Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2003 3:03 PM Subject: [ozmidwifery] Fwd: response from Pat and Nicky Subject: response from Pat and Nicky Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2003 13:59:40 +1100 Dear Andrea Thank you for sending us the emails that have been circulating about the proposed homebirth model at St George.We find much of the content insulting and grossly ill informed. It is hard to imagine where the information has been collected from and we find it very sad that so much can be said about what is not yet formed in any way. There is a meeting in a few weeks time and these views will be well represented and discussed in a respectful and honourable manner. Please do not forward us any more emails. You may post this onto ozmidwifery Many thanks Pat Brodie Nicky Leap -- -- - Andrea Robertson Birth International * ACE Graphics * Associates in Childbirth Education e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] web: www.birthinternational.com -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] New models of midwifery care
criteria (and that currently includes VBAC for example) then she should be able to give birth at home should she wish. If the decision regarding birth place can be left until the labour itself, there is a good chance of a positive outcome all round. Instead of spreading rumours and doubts, let's get behind the proposed program and make sure it works well - for everyone's benefit. Regards Andrea - Andrea Robertson Birth International * ACE Graphics * Associates in Childbirth Education e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] web: www.birthinternational.com -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] New models of midwifery care
I re read my post and realise that I didn't stress enough how much I DO hope the service gets off the ground and succeeds - I may well be using it. I have had wonderful experiences with midwives in the public system (and OBs actually, and obstetric physicians even), I am sure there will be many wonderful people working on this project. My train of thought was following after the questions about how IPMs might be affected and hospital control of the program. As a consumer I would prefer to choose and hire my own midwife and I feel anxious about a homebirth system run by a hospital I got a bad impression of. Never the less I very much hope it comes to fruition because a choice that might involve some anxious moments is better than no choice :-). cheers Jo At 18:13 +0800 29/11/03, Lesley Kuliukas wrote: Hear, hear! - Original Message - From: Andrea Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2003 3:53 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] New models of midwifery care Hello Jo and Justine, Thanks for sharing your thoughts with us - can I suggest that you wait to see how this service will operate before you worry unnecessarily about obstetric care interfering with your planned home birth? The way this service will operate will be very similar to the Albany practice in the UK - which has wonderful outcomes: 43% home birth rate with an 85% hight risk caseload (social risk mainly - homeless, drug users, teenagers, non-English speaking, etc). The women at St George will have their own caaseloading midwife, which will be no different from an independent midwife. All independent midwives use guidelines for accepting women for a home birth and if they choose to contract in to any Government supported service (e.g. through Community Health) then they will be asked to work strictly to agreed guidelines in order to obtain their insurance cover. All guidelines will have some obstetric input because they will be dealing with criteria for transfer when there is a problem. If a midwife decides to work outside these guidelines then she is taking risks with the woman's health and also her own legal safety. The big advantage of the hospital based home birth service is that it will be free. Women who cannpt afford a private practitioner will not be excluded from having a home birth as happens now. THe people involved in setting up this service have vast experience of home birth in the UK and elsehwere and are dedicated to providing the best woman-centreds care they can. They wouldn't want anything else! We need this propject to go ahead, and quickly. At the moment we have no homebirth service that provides safety for the woman in terms of insurance and this is a worry for both women and their midwives. Let's all support this model rather than be trying to pick holes in it before the facts are known and it has even had a chance to be tried and tested! There are some very dedicated midwives out there who are trying to create the best birth options for women and they need out support. Regards, Andrea At 03:18 PM 29/11/2003, Jo Bourne wrote: speaking as a consumer I would definitely view a public hospital run homebirth service as a second choice to a private midwife that I chose for myself - partly because of the choosing the best personality for our family an partly because I would be very frightened of the hospital controlled service having far more rigid and beurocratic rules and regulations about when OB care was required during pregnancy or when transfer was required during labour. I would most likely spend the whole pregnancy worried about the day that my assigned midwife said well an OB has reviewed your notes and says you have to birth in hospital (for some reason that I don't agree with). I was very fearful (at least at the start) of my first pregnancy that I would be forced into labour ward for a reason I didn't agree with but was able to tell myself they can make me use the labour ward - they can't make me use the bed/drugs/whatever, its all the same floor of the building and same staff so I just w! on't let it bother me. I would find it much harder to think soothing thoughts about being denied a homebirth at the last minute... I realise that the risk of being denied a homebirth might be much less than I think but intellectual knowledge is somewhat separate from the intense *feeling* of anxiety about my midwife not being her own boss and able to use entirely her own judgement about appropriate care in my circumstances rather than a very rigid rule book. We don't know if we will be able to afford a private midwife in NSW if we get pregnant here. We very much want a homebirth and are very near RHW so I hope this service gets off the ground as we may need to use it - but I do feel anxious about it as I didn't get the best impression of the hospital/birth centre there when we did a tour. RHW seemed
RE: [ozmidwifery] New models of midwifery care
At 18:48 +0800 29/11/03, Sally Westbury wrote: Dear Andrea, (Jo and Justine) To begin I am really concerned as a midwife and as a homebirth mother at the tone of this letter and feel I want to respond to some comments that have been made. It is really important that these questions are asked in order to have thought through as many possibilities as we are able, to end with the best solution. I welcome and encourage all of us to think about this move to hospital based homebirth. With this in mind I would like to raise my own personal perspective and concerns. Why are we modelling a service based on a UK model when we have a model that works here in Western Australia?? (I would be greatly distressed if our services homebirth rate was 43% I do acknowledge that given their high risk setting this may be adequate but the women that will be using this service will be screened as low risk.)The Community Midwifery Program has a homebirth rate of 72%!! Why is no-one looking to our own home grown homebirth service? To hear that a hospital based caseload midwife is no different from an independent midwife is a surprise to me. There great differences about an independent midwife who employed by a women and a hospital based midwife who is employed by a hospital. The greatest difference is who we work for. Surely a safe midwifery practice has it own guidelines for consultation and transfer? The possibility that this service is being set up to be guided/supervied by obstetrics is of great concern? (We have seen how this fails in birth centres that have high transfer rate in a medical climate that seems to wish our great birth centres to fail) Why not midwifery guidelines? A midwife should have midwifery guidelines. These do not automatically agree with obstetric guideline but does not mean that she is taking risks with the women's health! For example some midwives support VBAC at home.. this does not agree with obstetric guidelines but does not put a woman's health at risk or risk the midwives legal safety!! ' The big advantage of the hospital based home birth service is that it will be free. Women who cannpt afford a private practitioner will not be excluded from having a home birth as happens now. THe people involved in setting up this service have vast experience of home birth in the UK and elsehwere and are dedicated to providing the best woman-centreds care they can. They wouldn't want anything else! We need this propject to go ahead, and quickly. At the moment we have no homebirth service that provides safety for the woman in terms of insurance and this is a worry for both women and their midwives. Let's all support this model rather than be trying to pick holes in it before the facts are known and it has even had a chance to be tried and tested! There are some very dedicated midwives out there who are trying to create the best birth options for women and they need out support I would like to point out that 'we' do have a free homebirth service that is community based, supported by state and federal funding and fully insured. We do have in now in Western Australia. Why are we not looking to our own. We have a model that has been tried and tested in Australia. Why are 'we' not looking to our own for information and support. The Community Midwifery Program has worked long and hard to maintain autonomous practice whilst working within agreed guidelines to provide free homebirth services. What political campaign is happening that we may end up with a hospital based homebirth service instigated by imported experts, supervised by obstrtic experts rather than the community based model established by local activist and midwives which is driven by midwifery models of best practice and women's needs. So there it is my personal perspective. I am supportive of government funding of homebirth but not at any cost. Sally Westbury Homebirth Mother/Activist since 1984 Homebirth Midwive since 1992 -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] New models of midwifery care
of (current) homebirthers in NSW will still want to employ an independent midwife, regardless of the cost, to be with them during labour and birth because many believe that they don't want it attached to a hospital system and certainly don't want their births overseen by Obstetricians. As well as those women who are seen as 'high risk' - VBAC, breech etc I assume they wouldn't be permitted to birth at home through a hospital run homebirth service. I believe there needs to be strong consumer input to any model that is set up - lets listen to the women and find out what it is that they want. Jo Hunter - Original Message - From: Dierdre Bowman [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, January 01, 2002 5:02 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] New models of midwifery care While I think that it is TERRIFIC that homebirth will finally be offered as a choice. I think that the way midwives are compensated for this work is important to look at. The system in NZ is somewhat dodgy where payment is concerned. I would like to see funds made directly available to parent so that they may choose and fund their own midwife, not one assigned to them or where couples only have the choice of recieving paid homebirth if they choose the few midwives set up through these schemes. This has the potential to damage the livelihood of midwives currently working independently of the system. Any thoughts Dierdre B. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Compulsory heelpricks for newborns plea - MJA
We passed on pretty much everything but this test and it was a complete non-event, my daughter fed through the test without even wincing, I can't really understand why you wouldn't do it. But the idea of making it compulsory scares me, I wonder what would be next - many people can't understand why I wouldn't vaccinate. At 12:06 +1000 20/10/03, Sally Williams wrote: Personally, I believe that parents should be encouraged to have this test on their babies. Surely a moment's discomfort is worth a lifetime of illness, or no life at all! Sally - Original Message - From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]margaret schmidt To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2003 1:35 AM Subject: [ozmidwifery] Compulsory heelpricks for newborns plea - MJA Hi everyone Found this snippet this morning. Going to be published in MJA this week. Will make for some interesting conversation at work. I hope I have pasted the link correctly. The word mandatory always sends shivers down my spine. http://news.ninemsn.com.au/Health/story_52510.asphttp://news.ninemsn.com.au/Health/story_52510.asp Have a great day Michelle -- Jo Bourne Virtual Artists Pty Ltd -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] Breech and women's rights
If she chooses to refuse a c/section it would be assault for the hospital staff to attempt to proceed. As you say there are issues about trying to attempt a breech with inexperienced and negative practitioners, I don't think I would do it personally, but only the woman can make that choice in the end. I have been asking this question of all the birth centres I have visited in Sydney recently and even those hospitals who now have policies of ceaser for all breech babies did say when asked that no vaginal breech at all is new(ish) policy and there are still midwives and OBs with breech experience if that is what you want. When I then pushed for details about their approach to vaginal breech I was also fairly happy with the answers (they said they preffered active labours, hands and knees delivery in most cases). On the other hand I recently spoke to a woman whose first two babies were vaginal breech births and who now pregnant with her 3rd was told she would be booked in early pregnancy for a ceaser at 38 weeks because she was clearly going to have another breech and ceaser was her only choice (even trying ECV not an option). She changed hospitals to one that would book her to the birth centre until the baby was actually breech at close to term, try an ECV and then look at a vaginal breech with an experienced OB on labour ward if it was what she wanted. hope that is of some use. cheers Jo At 7:00 PM +1000 9/10/03, Sue Cookson wrote: Hi all, Nearly a year since I was last on the list. Lots of lovely babies born and a uni degree on the way! I have a question tho' about women with breech babies in 2003. If a women presents at a hospital labouring with a breech baby, does she have the right to decline a c/section? I understand the risks involved re experienced/inexperienced practitioners, but bottom line, what would happen if she refuses the c/section? Looking forward to your responses, Sue -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
