Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 6:19 AM 'Cosmin Visan' < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > > *Sorry, if I want to read fairy-tales I read Harry Potter. AI is a rather > boring fairy-tale.* > You've written quite a few posts in the last few days but they

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

Yeah, ok, you seem to know everything. Probably you are God or something. I cannot take seriously people that know everything. On Friday, 26 April 2019 13:00:52 UTC+3, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 22 Apr 2019, at 22:57, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List < > everyth...@googlegroups.com > wrote:

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

> On 25 Apr 2019, at 08:18, Stathis Papaioannou wrote: > > > > On Thu, 25 Apr 2019 at 2:42 pm, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List > mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> > wrote: > But it happens all the time. How do you think you move your body if not by > top-down influence in levels

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

> On 24 Apr 2019, at 15:57, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List > wrote: > > "Matter" doesn't exist. "Matter" is an idea in consciousness. That’s better. Now, consciousness is not an idea in arithmetic, but it is a truth for all numbers having the right amount of self-reference ability. They

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

> On 24 Apr 2019, at 15:08, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List > wrote: > > This is not the reason why AI is not conscious. The reason is that AI doesn't > even exist, is just an idea in consciousness. Consciousness which of course > is not made out of at

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

> On 24 Apr 2019, at 09:54, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List > wrote: > > So ultimately they are not "artificial", but natural, grown through > biological processes, not assembled in a factory. Then they are natural and > are not made of atoms, but are made by invisible natural processes th

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

You're just making a mess of concepts gathered from everywhere. A is like B, $@#$@ is like 423423, Hampty-Dampty is like Harry Potter. Sorry, there can be no dialogue with you. On Friday, 26 April 2019 12:30:13 UTC+3, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > The “singularity” belongs to the past, it is just

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

> On 23 Apr 2019, at 03:24, Jason Resch wrote: > > Perhaps not, but this video of it is quite fascinating: > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEejivHRIbE > > Quite fascinating. Biology has always been my main source of inspiration for mechanism.

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

Sorry, if I want to read fairy-tales I read Harry Potter. AI is a rather boring fairy-tale. On Friday, 26 April 2019 12:30:13 UTC+3, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > If mechanism is true, a reasoning can show that even your laptop can be > said conscious, even maximally conscious,

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

> On 22 Apr 2019, at 23:34, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List > wrote: > > > > On Tuesday, 23 April 2019 00:20:49 UTC+3, Brent wrote: > > Actually it will work just like the car you replicated. So why won't the > replicated driver work just like the driver? > > No, it won't. Because you

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

> On 22 Apr 2019, at 22:57, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List > wrote: > > Nobody knows how an embryo develops. That is entirely solved by the second recursion theorem of Kleene. That has been found by many people independently. Descartes did search this all his life, and at his time, Drie

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

> On 22 Apr 2019, at 21:51, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > This is just Dualism which says there is (material) Matter and there is > (immaterial) Mind, and Mind operates with brains, not hearts. > > If you were a true consciousness-only ontologist, then you would say a brain > could be bio-print

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

> On 22 Apr 2019, at 21:13, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List > wrote: > > A brain is not a heart. There are special relations in the brain through > which consciousness can act upon the world. You cannot copy those relations, > since they are not material. The addition function is not

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

> On 22 Apr 2019, at 10:28, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List > wrote: > > Only if you never did some serious thinking you can consider AI can be > conscious. Is not at all the same thing like other similar statements across > history like "objects heavier

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

> On 22 Apr 2019, at 00:10, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List > wrote: > > Conscious AI = the fairy-tale of 21st century. If mechanism is true, a reasoning can show that even your laptop can be said conscious, even maximally conscious, before you add applications

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 7:29:08 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: > > > > On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 2:48 AM Philip Thrift > wrote: > >> >> >> On Monday, April 22, 2019 at 6:24:37 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: >>> >>> The above reminded me of this quote from Alan Turing: >>> >>> Personally I think that s

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 9:57 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > > On 23 Apr 2019, at 03:32, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:51 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List < > everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > >> >> >> On 4/22/2019 4:24 PM, Jason Resch wrote: >> >> >> >> On Tue, No

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 9:45 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > > On 23 Apr 2019, at 01:24, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> >> On 5 Nov 2018, at 02:56, Martin Abramson >> wrote: >> >> Consciousness is a program. >> >> >> Consciousness might be related

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 2:48 AM Philip Thrift wrote: > > > On Monday, April 22, 2019 at 6:24:37 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: >> >> >>> The above reminded me of this quote from Alan Turing: >> >> Personally I think that spirit is really eternally connected with matter >> but certainly not always by the

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Thu, Apr 25, 2019 at 1:49 PM 'Cosmin Visan' < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > >> it would be perfectly correct to say I scratched my nose because I >> wanted to, but it would be equally correct to say the nerves in my nose >> triggered the nerves in my hand to move. >> > > > > *Ex

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On 4/25/2019 9:30 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: Can you derive today a dark-matter theory from The Standard Model + General Relativity? No, so what ? I just said theories change to explain new datas or they propose test that gives rise to new results. If

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 3:55:50 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: > > > > On 4/25/2019 7:50 AM, cloud...@gmail.com wrote: > > > > On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 8:34:30 AM UTC-5, Quentin Anciaux wrote: >> >> >> >> Le??jeu. 25 avr. 2019 15:23, a ??crit??: >> >>> >>> >>> On Thursday, April 25, 2

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On 4/25/2019 7:50 AM, cloudver...@gmail.com wrote: On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 8:34:30 AM UTC-5, Quentin Anciaux wrote: Le??jeu. 25 avr. 2019 15:23, > a ??crit??: On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 1:18:44 AM UTC-5, stathisp wrote: On Thu, 25 Apr 2019 a

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 11:30:57 AM UTC-5, Quentin Anciaux wrote: > > > > Le jeu. 25 avr. 2019 à 17:44, > a écrit : > >> >> >> On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 10:21:04 AM UTC-5, Quentin Anciaux wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> Le jeu. 25 avr. 2019 à 16:50, a écrit : >>> On Thursday, A

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

You forgot the point before that where a perception triggered a memory and the signal. Brent On 4/25/2019 3:38 AM, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List wrote: You forgot the last point where consciousness initiate the signal. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Goog

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On 4/25/2019 12:00 AM, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List wrote: Also airplanes can fly better than birds. Does that mean that airplanes are alive ? No, but it means flying is a physical process, not an quale of birds. Nobody moves the goalpost of intelligence anywhere. Intelligence is what

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On 4/24/2019 11:33 PM, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List wrote: Exactly. Those experiments are not valid. The "brain" does not exist. But I exist. I think you are making a category confusion. You equate by default brain with consciousness, and because brain doesn't exist, you conclude that c

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

rs are irrational deterministic objects. > Bullshit. Fifty years ago people were saying the ability to play a good > game of Chess was a excellent sign of intelligence, but then 20 years ago a > computer beat the best human player and overnight Chess suddenly had > nothing to do wi

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

't. And very often I don't know what I'm going to do until I do it, just as a computer doesn't know what the answer to a calculation will be until it's finished making the calculation. *> To think that an AI has "brain" is to have no understanding whatsoever >

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

That's how existence is: miraculous. And we have evidence for it: just get out of the chair and move around the room and there's your evidence. On Thursday, 25 April 2019 15:27:17 UTC+3, stathisp wrote: > > > > On Thu, 25 Apr 2019 at 8:38 pm, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List < > everyth...@goog

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

Le jeu. 25 avr. 2019 à 17:44, a écrit : > > > On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 10:21:04 AM UTC-5, Quentin Anciaux wrote: >> >> >> >> Le jeu. 25 avr. 2019 à 16:50, a écrit : >> >>> >>> >>> On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 8:34:30 AM UTC-5, Quentin Anciaux wrote: Le jeu. 25 avr. 20

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 10:21:04 AM UTC-5, Quentin Anciaux wrote: > > > > Le jeu. 25 avr. 2019 à 16:50, > a écrit : > >> >> >> On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 8:34:30 AM UTC-5, Quentin Anciaux wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> Le jeu. 25 avr. 2019 à 15:23, a écrit : >>> On Thursday, Ap

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

Le jeu. 25 avr. 2019 à 16:50, a écrit : > > > On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 8:34:30 AM UTC-5, Quentin Anciaux wrote: >> >> >> >> Le jeu. 25 avr. 2019 à 15:23, a écrit : >> >>> >>> >>> On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 1:18:44 AM UTC-5, stathisp wrote: On Thu, 25 Apr 2019 at 2:4

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 8:34:30 AM UTC-5, Quentin Anciaux wrote: > > > > Le jeu. 25 avr. 2019 à 15:23, > a écrit : > >> >> >> On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 1:18:44 AM UTC-5, stathisp wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On Thu, 25 Apr 2019 at 2:42 pm, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List < >>> everyth...

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

Le jeu. 25 avr. 2019 à 15:23, a écrit : > > > On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 1:18:44 AM UTC-5, stathisp wrote: >> >> >> >> On Thu, 25 Apr 2019 at 2:42 pm, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List < >> everyth...@googlegroups.com> wrote: >> >>> But it happens all the time. How do you think you move your

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Thursday, April 25, 2019 at 1:18:44 AM UTC-5, stathisp wrote: > > > > On Thu, 25 Apr 2019 at 2:42 pm, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List < > everyth...@googlegroups.com > wrote: > >> But it happens all the time. How do you think you move your body if not >> by top-down influence in levels fro

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Thu, 25 Apr 2019 at 8:38 pm, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > You forgot the last point where consciousness initiate the signal. That would mean, at some point in this causal chain, something miraculous happening, like a bone moving without any m

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

You forgot the last point where consciousness initiate the signal. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.co

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Thu, 25 Apr 2019 at 16:38, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > You are randomly extrapolating. I think this is called "strawman logical > error". Things are not random. There are reasons for why consciousness only > exercises its powers in certain con

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

e a burp "free will" conveys > nothing, it's just a sound made with the mouth. > I don't know. I feel free. Don't you ? > > >>The "I" in AI stands for intelligence not consciousness, do you believe >>> a AI can be intelligent? And by

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

One interpretation might be that consciousness sends its influence from the future to the past. On Thursday, 25 April 2019 09:37:53 UTC+3, Quentin Anciaux wrote: > > So you are saying that we are fooled when doing experiments showing > movement is seen before in brain motor function before the s

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

You are randomly extrapolating. I think this is called "strawman logical error". Things are not random. There are reasons for why consciousness only exercises its powers in certain conditions. Evolution confined those powers to own body alone, though in some cases indeed you get connections betw

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

So you are saying that we are fooled when doing experiments showing movement is seen before in brain motor function before the subject being aware of it... and assert that is always the consciousness that initiates movement despite experiments showing the contrary.. so we can't test anything of you

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

Exactly. Those experiments are not valid. The "brain" does not exist. But I exist. I think you are making a category confusion. You equate by default brain with consciousness, and because brain doesn't exist, you conclude that consciousness doesn't exist. You are loosing yourself in abstract th

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Thu, 25 Apr 2019 at 2:42 pm, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > But it happens all the time. How do you think you move your body if not by > top-down influence in levels from consciousness ? > At the molecular level, if this were true, we would see

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

Are you aware of the Grey Walter experiments that imply your brain thinks of moving before your consciouness.?? Of course I know the brain and Grey Walter and his experiment don't existand neither do you. Brent On 4/24/2019 9:42 PM, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List wrote: But it happens

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

But it happens all the time. How do you think you move your body if not by top-down influence in levels from consciousness ? On Wednesday, 24 April 2019 20:06:07 UTC+3, stathisp wrote: > > > Why has no-one ever observed the components of the brain breaking physical > laws? It should happen all t

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

It's simple. You say: "Santa Claus has legs and arms like humans, therefore Santa Claus must exists." On Wednesday, 24 April 2019 18:50:03 UTC+3, Quentin Anciaux wrote: > > > Could you share your *serious* thinking on our santa claus belief to us > unserious people ? > > -- You received this m

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On 4/24/2019 4:44 AM, smitra wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNiiLfB8s0s A thoroughly dishonest presentation.?? Pross selective misrepresents quotes from people who are all arguing for the physical basis of life.?? He quotes Morowitz on the impossibility of randomly realizing an RNA,

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

than "free will", it's so bad it's not even wrong. To be wrong an idea must first convey a thought, an erroneous thought but a thought nevertheless, but like a burp "free will" conveys nothing, it's just a sound made with the mouth. >>The "I" in AI

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Wed, 24 Apr 2019 at 11:16 pm, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > I don't see why it would matter. If you obtain consciousness, that > consciousness will have free will, so will take over the whatever > subcomponents that you might use, so those subco

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

everyth...@googlegroups.com> wrote: >> >> > *This is not the reason why AI is not conscious.* >>> >> >> The "I" in AI stands for intelligence not consciousness, do you believe a >> AI can be intelligent? And by "intelligent" I mean w

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Wednesday, 24 April 2019 16:46:33 UTC+3, John Clark wrote: > > On Wed, Apr 24, 2019 at 9:08 AM 'Cosmin Visan' < > everyth...@googlegroups.com > wrote: > > > *This is not the reason why AI is not conscious.* >> > > The "I" in AI sta

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Wed, Apr 24, 2019 at 9:08 AM 'Cosmin Visan' < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > *This is not the reason why AI is not conscious.* > The "I" in AI stands for intelligence not consciousness, do you believe a AI can be intelligent? And by "intell

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

I don't see why it would matter. If you obtain consciousness, that consciousness will have free will, so will take over the whatever subcomponents that you might use, so those subcomponents will stop obeying the "physical laws" that we know from simple systems. On Wednesday, 24 April 2019 13:43

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

This is not the reason why AI is not conscious. The reason is that AI doesn't even exist, is just an idea in consciousness. Consciousness which of course is not made out of atoms. We are not made out of atoms. "Atoms" are just ideas in consciousness. On Wednesday, 24 April 2019

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

he only answer is the way atoms are arranged, and it doesn't make any difference if the atoms are of carbon or silicon if the process is the same. Saying an AI can't be conscious because its brain is dry and hard and not wet and squishy is as silly as saying another human can't be c

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Mon, 22 Apr 2019 at 6:28 pm, 'Cosmin Visan' < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > > *Only if you never did some serious thinking you can consider AI can be > conscious. * > What sort of serious thinking did you engage in that enabled you to conclude any

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNiiLfB8s0s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkGb12xBKlM On 24-04-2019 09:54, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List wrote: So ultimately they are not "artificial", but natural, grown through biological processes, not assembled in a factory. Then they are natural and

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Wednesday, April 24, 2019 at 4:09:37 AM UTC-5, Cosmin Visan wrote: > > I think that if we want to have any shot at understanding reality we need > to be serious in our thinking. "Assembled in factories" sounds like you > just take atom by atom and put them together, which clearly is not what

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Wed, 24 Apr 2019 at 7:14 pm, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > There might be some room for wiggling, but ultimately red must be red. > > On Wednesday, 24 April 2019 11:47:52 UTC+3, stathisp wrote: >> >> >> A piece of paper wouldn’t work as a comput

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

There might be some room for wiggling, but ultimately red must be red. On Wednesday, 24 April 2019 11:47:52 UTC+3, stathisp wrote: > > > A piece of paper wouldn’t work as a computer screen replacement. Replacing > an LCD screen for an LED screen would work; replacing a spinning hard drive > for

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

I think that if we want to have any shot at understanding reality we need to be serious in our thinking. "Assembled in factories" sounds like you just take atom by atom and put them together, which clearly is not what happens. People start with already living cells and just modify them a little

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Wed, 24 Apr 2019 at 4:46 pm, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > This is like saying: If you replace part of the computer screen with > drawings made on a piece of paper, what does this indicate ? Well... it > indicates that on the part replaced with

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

They ("synthetic neurons") are assembled in laboratories/factories. New neuron-like cells allow investigation into synthesis of vital cellular components https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/01/180122164702.htm - pt On Wednesday, April 24, 2019 at 2:54:01 AM UTC-5, Cosmin Visan wrot

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

So ultimately they are not "artificial", but natural, grown through biological processes, not assembled in a factory. Then they are natural and are not made of atoms, but are made by invisible natural processes that are also responsible for the workings of consciousness. I think this fact must

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

This is the whole point: The neuronal cells being replaced in the brain can't be made of anything. The replacements (synthetic neurons) have to be made of atoms/molecules such that they that replicate the actual chemical processing abilities of the cells they are replacing. - pt On Wednesd

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

This is like saying: If you replace part of the computer screen with drawings made on a piece of paper, what does this indicate ? Well... it indicates that on the part replaced with the piece of paper, nothing will happen anymore. On Wednesday, 24 April 2019 01:41:14 UTC+3, stathisp wrote: > >

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Mon, 22 Apr 2019 at 6:28 pm, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > Only if you never did some serious thinking you can consider AI can be > conscious. Is not at all the same thing like other similar statements > across hist

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

Time will tell. Uncovering the power of glial cellsBrain implants can rely on more than neurons to function https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/01/180108130158.htm - pt On Tuesday, April 23, 2019 at 12:12:35 PM UTC-5, Cosmin Visan wrote: > > Besides, "artificial neurons" that "fully mi

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

Besides, "artificial neurons" that "fully mimic" is just a shocking amazing ZOMG news title, not a serious statement. Nobody knows how a neuron works, and they already mimic that behavior ? trololol -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List"

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

You first said that injuries "are being repaired" and then you give me links with maybes and coulds. Maybe Santa Claus will help us all in the end. Amen! On Tuesday, 23 April 2019 11:44:35 UTC+3, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > > *Artificial Neurons Could Replace Some Real Ones In Your Brain* > A n

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 23 Apr 2019, at 07:13, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List > wrote: > > > > On 4/22/2019 6:32 PM, Jason Resch wrote: >> >> >> On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:51 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List >> mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> >> wrote: >> >> >> On 4/22/2019 4:24 PM, Jaso

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 23 Apr 2019, at 03:32, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:51 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List > mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com>> > wrote: > > > On 4/22/2019 4:24 PM, Jason Resch wrote: >> >> >> On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal >

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

> On 23 Apr 2019, at 01:24, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal > wrote: > >> On 5 Nov 2018, at 02:56, Martin Abramson > > wrote: >> >> Consciousness is a program. > > Consciousness might be rel

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

*Artificial Neurons Could Replace Some Real Ones In Your Brain* A new way to fix neurological disorders - https://www.popsci.com/these-artificial-neurons-work-organic-ones *Scientists Have Built Artificial Neurons That Fully Mimic Human Brain Cells* - https://www.sciencealert.com/scientists-b

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Monday, April 22, 2019 at 6:24:37 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: > > >> The above reminded me of this quote from Alan Turing: > > Personally I think that spirit is really eternally connected with matter > but certainly not always by the same kind of body. I did believe it > possible for a spirit at

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

Link please. On Tuesday, 23 April 2019 02:16:15 UTC+3, Philip Thrift wrote: > > > > But damaged brains are being repaired today by implanting new (perhaps > synthetic, polymer-based) neurons, and full consciousness is restored. > > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to th

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

I'm just using my reason. I'm not a shallow thinker. Have a look at this guy's blog to see countless arguments for why memories are not stored in the brain: https://headtruth.blogspot.com/2019/02/brains-store-memories-dogma-versus.html This is just one example, but you can explore more on his b

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

You apparently have the illusion that you know too much about embryology that you start to imagine answers where there are none. On Tuesday, 23 April 2019 01:00:57 UTC+3, Brent wrote: > > You apparently don't know much about embryology. But that's to be > expected since you think all knowledge

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

Yes, to protect the system of interacting consciousnesses. On Tuesday, 23 April 2019 00:57:57 UTC+3, Brent wrote: > > > Do you wear a helmet when riding your motorcycle? > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tue, Apr 23, 2019 at 12:13 AM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > > > On 4/22/2019 6:32 PM, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:51 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List < > everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > >> >> >> On 4/22/2

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On 4/22/2019 6:32 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:51 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List > wrote: On 4/22/2019 4:24 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal mailto:marc...@ulb.ac.be>> wrote:

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 7:51 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > > > On 4/22/2019 4:24 PM, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> >> On 5 Nov 2018, at 02:56, Martin Abramson >> wrote: >> >> Consciousness

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

Perhaps not, but this video of it is quite fascinating: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEejivHRIbE Jason On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 3:57 PM 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > Nobody knows how an embryo develops. > > On Monday, 22 April 2019 23:48:16 UTC

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On 4/22/2019 4:24 PM, Jason Resch wrote: On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal > wrote: On 5 Nov 2018, at 02:56, Martin Abramson mailto:martinabrams...@gmail.com>> wrote: Consciousness is a program. Consciousness might be related to a pr

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems (a symposium at the AAAI Stanford Spring Symposium 2019)

On Tue, Nov 6, 2018 at 3:16 AM Bruno Marchal wrote: > > On 5 Nov 2018, at 02:56, Martin Abramson > wrote: > > Consciousness is a program. > > > Consciousness might be related to a program, but is not a program, that > would identify a first person notion with a third person notion, like a > glas

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Monday, April 22, 2019 at 4:44:06 PM UTC-5, Cosmin Visan wrote: > > I think I am used to talk at a certain level and therefore I skip certain > details. "Brain" is just an idea in consciousness that stands for a system > of interactions between consciousnesses. If you damage "the brain", you

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 3:13 PM 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: *> A brain is not a heart.* > A brain is interesting but a heart is dull as dishwater, it's just a pump. > *> There are special relations in the brain through which consciousness > can

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

You apparently don't know much about embryology.  But that's to be expected since you think all knowledge comes from introspection. Brent On 4/22/2019 2:34 PM, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List wrote: They don't know what matters. They have no ideas how the embryo gets to its final form. On

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On 4/22/2019 2:34 PM, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List wrote: On Tuesday, 23 April 2019 00:20:49 UTC+3, Brent wrote: Actually it will work just like the car you replicated.  So why won't the replicated driver work just like the driver? No, it won't. Because you need the driver to

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

I think I am used to talk at a certain level and therefore I skip certain details. "Brain" is just an idea in consciousness that stands for a system of interactions between consciousnesses. If you damage "the brain", you damage that system of interacting consciousnesses, so you would disrupt ce

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

I think you don't understand what "X is just an idea in consciousness" means. You are adding an extra step to the meaning of this phrase, that shouldn't be there. That extra step that you add is that you first create the X, and then you put it in consciousness. The correct meaning of this phras

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

They don't know what matters. They have no ideas how the embryo gets to its final form. On Tuesday, 23 April 2019 00:23:27 UTC+3, Brent wrote: > > They know a helluva a lot of it. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubs

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On Tuesday, 23 April 2019 00:20:49 UTC+3, Brent wrote: > > > Actually it will work just like the car you replicated. So why won't the > replicated driver work just like the driver? > > No, it won't. Because you need the driver to set it in motion. > > That's not what you said. You said "The

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

How can you assert that access is eliminated when the brain doesn't exist? In order for that to make sense, you're presupposing a role for the brain in one's consciousness. On Mon, Apr 22, 2019 at 4:57 PM 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List < everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: > > Then why a

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

But the "what matters" part is the basis of dualism. If everything is consciousness, then the cells of the brain - and the brain itself - are ideas in consciousness. So the brain copy would be conscious according to consciousness monism! With dualism, you get what you said: Something is left b

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

They know a helluva a lot of it.  Will it make a difference when they know all of it and can do it in vitro (or a 3D printer)?  No, then you'll invoke a the Holy Spirit to supply consciousness, just like the Pope demands. Brent On 4/22/2019 1:57 PM, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List wrote:

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

On 4/22/2019 1:57 PM, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List wrote: On Monday, 22 April 2019 23:34:13 UTC+3, Brent wrote: What are they...exactly. I cannot tell you what are they exactly, but is like the relation between a car and the driver. Only because you replicate the car, it doesn

Re: Towards Conscious AI Systems

Is just an analogy to make you understand better the problems that will appear in case you want to "copy" the brain. The true reason is that the "brain" is just a very specific image that you see in your own consciousness of a much greater reality that you don't see. And you can only copy what

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