* Peter Donald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
|
| On Mon, 7 Jan 2002 03:08, Ceki Gülcü wrote:
| Some of the existing projects within Jakarta are server-side only, others
| are client-side as well as server-side, none are client-side only.
|
| except for JMeter ?
JMeter is useful for testing
On Sat, 12 Jan 2002 04:38, Gunnar Rønning wrote:
* Peter Donald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
| On Mon, 7 Jan 2002 03:08, Ceki Gülcü wrote:
| Some of the existing projects within Jakarta are server-side only,
| others are client-side as well as server-side, none are client-side
| only.
|
|
Jon Scott Stevens typed the following on 04:22 PM 1/6/2002 -0800
on 1/6/02 3:46 PM, Kief Morris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Although I haven't been participating, I've been following this discussion,
and would like to donate my 30,000 Turkish Lira (roughly $0.02 at today's
rates).
Yes, everyone
So, that's my $0.00 this time around (that's about 10,000 Turkish
Lira today).
I would give at least 2 Euros for this one!
=:o)
Couldn't say it better... or I would have done it before!
=:o)
Have fun,
Paulo Gaspar
-Original Message-
From: Kief Morris [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
On Sun, 6 Jan 2002 16:10, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
I was leafing through my copy of A Pattern Language by Alexander,
Ishikawa and Silverstein, which is really about architecture of human
habitat (buildings and environs), and ran across some interesting
assertions about society and groups.
Peter Donald wrote:
Effectively XML/Jakarta would become a single city with a mosaic of
subcultures. Already we have different sub-cultures which are effectively
defined by the committers - when a committer is a member of multiple projects
they tend to imbue the projects with their own
I agree except that I think the cities here are the subprojects, like
Velocity and Struts, and the projects, like Jakarta and XML, are just
arbitrary containers (lines on a map). Subprojects are like cities,
Projects are like states (or provinces), and ASF is the nation.
I don't think an
Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
I thought I would share, as my thinking about removing community containers
here in Jakarta, XML et al resonates well this.
Personally, I just think its mainly a matter of packaging. By
definination, we are all trying to share the same ASF culture, though
each
On 1/6/02 3:52 AM, Peter Donald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Sun, 6 Jan 2002 16:10, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
I was leafing through my copy of A Pattern Language by Alexander,
Ishikawa and Silverstein, which is really about architecture of human
habitat (buildings and environs), and ran
On 1/6/02 8:06 AM, Ted Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
I thought I would share, as my thinking about removing community containers
here in Jakarta, XML et al resonates well this.
Personally, I just think its mainly a matter of packaging. By
definination, we are
Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
On 1/6/02 8:06 AM, Ted Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
I thought I would share, as my thinking about removing community containers
here in Jakarta, XML et al resonates well this.
Personally, I just think its mainly a matter of
Ooops, should have been
I believe that the subcultures exist mainly at the subproject level. The
PROJECTS, like many states and provinces are, simply granfalloons.
http://www.kcoyle.net/granfalloons.html
-T.
Ted Husted wrote:
Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
On 1/6/02 8:06
On Mon, 7 Jan 2002 00:22, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
On 1/6/02 8:06 AM, Ted Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
I thought I would share, as my thinking about removing community
containers here in Jakarta, XML et al resonates well this.
Personally, I just think its
Ted Husted wrote:
(1) That we petition the ASF to change our charter and remove the word
server, so what we are simply charged with providing production
quality solutions on the Java platform.
[I'd link to our charter, but can't find the ASF minutes any more, and
don't know where else it
Ted Husted wrote:
So I'm thinking we might propose that our charter be amended to
RESOLVED, that the Jakarta Project Management Committee be and
hereby is responsible for the creation and maintenance of
-1 commercial-quality, open-source, server-side solutions for the Java
+1
Peter Donald wrote:
Alternatively, perhaps we might consider something like a public
apache-projects list, where all the PMCs would meet and discuss
issues
like this, and conduct the formal votes, and let the general lists
revert back to a chat room.
I can't see the PHP people being too
At 10:29 06.01.2002 -0500, you wrote:
Ted Husted wrote:
(1) That we petition the ASF to change our charter and remove the word
server, so what we are simply charged with providing production
quality solutions on the Java platform.
[I'd link to our charter, but can't find the ASF minutes any
Sam Ruby wrote:
I think Roy's reaction is highly predicatable, and should be anticipated.
From http://jakarta.apache.org/site/pmc/01-01-17-meeting-minutes.html :
Roy identified two potential showstoppers and (1) if there
was overlap with other PMCs (example: Cocoon), and (2) if the
On Mon, 7 Jan 2002 03:08, Ceki Gülcü wrote:
Some of the existing projects within Jakarta are server-side only, others
are client-side as well as server-side, none are client-side only.
except for JMeter ?
--
Cheers,
Pete
On 1/6/02 10:29 AM, Ted Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Ted Husted wrote:
(1) That we petition the ASF to change our charter and remove the word
server, so what we are simply charged with providing production
quality solutions on the Java platform.
[I'd link to our charter, but can't find
At 03:35 07.01.2002 +1100, you wrote:
On Mon, 7 Jan 2002 03:08, Ceki Gülcü wrote:
Some of the existing projects within Jakarta are server-side only, others
are client-side as well as server-side, none are client-side only.
except for JMeter ?
Well, JMeter is a client application to test
On 1/6/02 11:38 AM, Peter Donald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Mon, 7 Jan 2002 03:25, Ted Husted wrote:
Sam Ruby wrote:
I think Roy's reaction is highly predicatable, and should be anticipated.
From http://jakarta.apache.org/site/pmc/01-01-17-meeting-minutes.html :
Roy identified two
Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
I'll continue to swim upstream.
Take POI, Ant, BCEL, Oro, Regexp and make that the core of a new client-side
project...
Our e-mails crossed in the ether. My point: the above needs a champion.
And the proposal needs to be supported by the committers of the affected
On Mon, 7 Jan 2002 04:06, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
I'll continue to swim upstream.
Take POI, Ant, BCEL, Oro, Regexp and make that the core of a new
client-side project...
wouldn't all those projects be out of scope of a client-side project as none
of them are client-side?
--
Cheers,
On Mon, 7 Jan 2002 04:57, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
So the problematic part of the conversation is that we are hung up on the
literal semantics behind the words 'client' and 'server' and would be good
to explore that.
Or maybe we should just recognize that use of those terms is relatively
On Mon, 7 Jan 2002 04:06, Ceki Gülcü wrote:
So, the word server-side might require some further clarification, but
removing it completely is not just a cosmetic change. It means opening the
flood-gates.
The flood gates were opened long ago. Maintianing things like Ant Oro
Avalon/Framework
On 1/6/02 12:48 PM, Peter Donald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Mon, 7 Jan 2002 04:01, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
Maybe we could just start having sub-catgories within Jakarta. So
basically Jakarta is still the top level project but we have a software
map underneath it that categorizes project
Peter Donald wrote:
Again, you might think the above is flip, but you are talking about
modifying the charter here...
The charter was modified ages ago. Sure the words haven't changed but it has
been a long time since jakarta project was actually true to the words in its
charter ... see
Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
I would again try to get is to consider that we have a great chance to
use a
strong community to anchor a new project. Jakarta can't grow forever.
When do you decide to actually step up and try to make a change? I hope
it's *before* the outside perception of
On 1/6/02 1:26 PM, Sam Ruby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Peter Donald wrote:
Again, you might think the above is flip, but you are talking about
modifying the charter here...
The charter was modified ages ago. Sure the words haven't changed but it has
been a long time since jakarta project
Or maybe we should just recognize that use of those terms is relatively
arbitrary for many (most?) of the jakarta projects and throw it away
completely?
That is exactly what I think.
Paulo
-Original Message-
From: Peter Donald [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Sunday, January
-Original Message-
From: Geir Magnusson Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Sunday, January 06, 2002 7:14 PM
To: Jakarta General List
Subject: Re: Cultural homogeneity
On 1/6/02 1:08 PM, Geir Magnusson Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I would again try to get is to consider that we have
On 1/6/02 1:59 PM, Peter Donald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
With the the high threshold of entry I doubt jakarta will ever be in the same
category as sourceforge - I can't see that as anything but a strawman that is
brought up every now and again ;)
Here is the threshold of entry as stated by
I was leafing through my copy of A Pattern Language by Alexander, Ishikawa
and Silverstein, which is really about architecture of human habitat
(buildings and environs), and ran across some interesting assertions about
society and groups.
I haven't read the book end to end, as I just pick it up
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