Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread Sven Neumann
Hi, On Sun, 2007-07-08 at 19:15 -0400, guepe wrote: In fact, my patch... does exactly that : if defaults settings are already saved, jpeg is saved with the parasites one (erasing the hardcoded ones). If no settings have been saved, then hardcoded are used. There is another player in the

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread Sven Neumann
Moin, On Mon, 2007-07-09 at 00:03 +0200, Sven Neumann wrote: The JPEG plug-in should not use the last-used values when being run non-interactively from the Save action. It should use the, now user-configurable, default values. Of course if the jpeg-save-options parasite is set on the image

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread Tor Lillqvist
Sven Neumann writes: If someone wants to try to recover some of the JPEG save settings when loading the JPEG file, feel free. There are some scenarios in which blindly reusing the quality factor guesstimated from loading an image is not a good idea, even if the guesstimate is very accurate.

Re: [Gimp-developer] Script-Fu/tinyscheme: using scheme_call?

2007-07-09 Thread Glimmer Labs
Thanks for the reply, Kevin. While using the foreign function interface of TinyScheme might work, for what you are trying to do it is not the best approach. You should really look at implementing it as a TinyScheme extension. Take a look at the re and tsx extensions for TinyScheme to see how

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread Raphaël Quinet
On Mon, 9 Jul 2007 17:32:29 +0300, Tor Lillqvist [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sven Neumann writes: If someone wants to try to recover some of the JPEG save settings when loading the JPEG file, feel free. I did. Thanks for this very nice patch! It would be even better to do the same for the

Re: [Gimp-developer] Script-Fu/tinyscheme: using scheme_call?

2007-07-09 Thread Glimmer Labs
Thanks for the reply! Interesting attempt, but Script-Fu was never meant to be used for direct pixel manipulation. May I ask why you aren't using one of the GIMP bindings, like for example Python, that provides support for this level of pixel access? We're working for the Grinnell College

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread peter sikking
guys, what a thread. I say that the solution for all this lies in treating these lossy (my spell-checker proposes lousy) formats the same we are (gonna) handle indexed mode: import + export only. This would prevent the misunderstanding that there is a continuous lossless workflow for these type

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread Raphaël Quinet
On Mon, 9 Jul 2007 17:54:29 +0200, peter sikking [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: guys, what a thread. I say that the solution for all this lies in treating these lossy (my spell-checker proposes lousy) formats the same we are (gonna) handle indexed mode: import + export only. Eek! That would

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread Michael Schumacher
Von: Raphaël Quinet [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Mon, 9 Jul 2007 17:54:29 +0200, peter sikking [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: guys, what a thread. I say that the solution for all this lies in treating these lossy (my spell-checker proposes lousy) formats the same we are (gonna) handle indexed

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread Sven Neumann
Hi, On Mon, 2007-07-09 at 18:42 +0200, Raphaël Quinet wrote: Side note: as suggested by Sven in #gimp, I just had a look at ImageMagick to try and find out how they retreive or guess the quality settings from JPEG files. The code is about 100 lines long and can be found in

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread Guillermo Espertino
There is another player in the game and that's the last-used values stored with gimp_[gs]et_data(). And that's what has bitten Guillermo. He has saved an image as JPEG with low quality settings. No, I haven't. Since I know the problem I'm using always save as with quality=95 but it's still

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread Sven Neumann
Hi, On Mon, 2007-07-09 at 09:42 +0200, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ha, cross post . Cross post? Huh? Btw, is it intentional that you are mailing from two (or three) different accounts and never put your real name in the From field? I find the use of two accounts annoying and the lack of a real

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor

2007-07-09 Thread Scott
On Sun, Jul 08, 2007 at 09:59:18AM -0400, Robert L Krawitz wrote: Think of the quality setting as an indication of expectations rather than a specific outcome. It may not be possible to get the exact same outcome (and obviously -- at least to us -- there's no way to retroactively improve

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor

2007-07-09 Thread Sven Neumann
Hi, On Mon, 2007-07-09 at 11:36 -0600, Scott wrote: Just curious, what would be so wrong with saving the original file as a backup before doing a destructive save? Emacs only bites me when I'm *really* stupid There's nothing wrong with that. It's even on the list of things that the file

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread gg
On Mon, 09 Jul 2007 19:32:14 +0200, Sven Neumann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Btw, is it intentional that you are mailing from two (or three) different accounts No it's not intentional. I share this email client which has several accounts configured. Occassionally I hit reply and fail to notice

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread Guillermo Espertino
Scott wrote: I am so glad that Guillermo stuck by his guns and apparently *finally* got the developers to realise the illogic of this feature. Scott: Please keep in mind that I was trying to collaborate, not to fight. In these cases is very common to see differences of criteria and some rough

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread gg
On Mon, 09 Jul 2007 17:54:29 +0200, peter sikking [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: guys, what a thread. das stimmt! I say that the solution for all this lies in treating these lossy (my spell-checker proposes lousy) formats the same we are (gonna) handle indexed mode: import + export only. I

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor

2007-07-09 Thread Scott
On Mon, Jul 09, 2007 at 08:18:44PM +0200, Sven Neumann wrote: Hi, On Mon, 2007-07-09 at 11:36 -0600, Scott wrote: Just curious, what would be so wrong with saving the original file as a backup before doing a destructive save? Emacs only bites me when I'm *really* stupid There's

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor

2007-07-09 Thread Sven Neumann
Hi, On Mon, 2007-07-09 at 14:07 -0600, Scott wrote: If more users would be so persistent, as you call it, then there would probably not a single developer left who would feel that developing GIMP is fun. There would probably be noone who would be willing to spend his/her free time on it.

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread gg
On Mon, 09 Jul 2007 11:33:34 +0200, Tor Lillqvist [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There are some scenarios in which blindly reusing the quality factor guesstimated from loading an image is not a good idea, even if the guesstimate is very accurate. (Which happens when the loaded image's quantization

Re: [Gimp-developer] [Fwd: upgrading GNU packages to GPLv3]

2007-07-09 Thread Michael Schumacher
Sven Neumann wrote: I am forwarding this mail from the FSF to the developer list for your information and for discussion. The summary, resulting from a short discussion on the #gimp IRC channel: We won't change to GPLv3 for 2.4. After 2.4 has been released, this topic can be discussed.

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread Liam R E Quin
On Sun, 2007-07-08 at 12:19 +0200, Sven Neumann wrote: [...] Due to the way file plug-ins are implemented in GIMP, it is not trivial to do this. But you can easily work around it by assigning Ctrl-S to Save As. I'd advise making ^S to be Quit. Then you'll be prompted, realise your mistake,

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread peter sikking
Raphaël wrote: I say that the solution for all this lies in treating these lossy (my spell-checker proposes lousy) formats the same we are (gonna) handle indexed mode: import + export only. Eek! That would significantly break the flow for what must be the most common image format for

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor

2007-07-09 Thread saulgoode
Quoting Sven Neumann [EMAIL PROTECTED]: ... The happy user is silent. If we would do a change every time a user asks for a change, then GIMP would be a lot more inconsistent and probably also more buggy. For that reason it is important to

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread Graeme Gill
On Mon, 09 Jul 2007 11:33:34 +0200, Tor Lillqvist [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There are some scenarios in which blindly reusing the quality factor guesstimated from loading an image is not a good idea, even if the guesstimate is very accurate. (Which happens when the loaded image's quantization

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread Chris Mohler
At the risk of lengthening this thread... :) I agree with Peter - saving in a lossy format is a last-step operation in a good workflow. I respect the case of simple tweak and saving, but in the long run, all users should never being able to choose save and then lose data. I expect the Save

Re: [Gimp-developer] [Gimp-user] selections workflow???

2007-07-09 Thread David Gowers
On 7/10/07, Tom Davidson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Im going to go nuts - i do not understand the gimp work flow with selections. When I paste an element on to a layer, i can no access the area of the layer not covered by the element. In on specific example, I moved the contents of a layer

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread gg
On Tue, 10 Jul 2007 00:46:44 +0200, peter sikking [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Raphaël wrote: I say that the solution for all this lies in treating these lossy (my spell-checker proposes lousy) formats the same we are (gonna) handle indexed mode: import + export only. Eek! That would

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor

2007-07-09 Thread gg
On Tue, 10 Jul 2007 01:24:40 +0200, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If I have a Quality setting of 95 and I load an image that was saved with a Q=50, I should be very disappointed if the GIMP degraded to that level when I have specified that I expect less loss when saving. It would NOT degrade it

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread gg
On Tue, 10 Jul 2007 01:58:50 +0200, Graeme Gill [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 09 Jul 2007 11:33:34 +0200, Tor Lillqvist [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There are some scenarios in which blindly reusing the quality factor guesstimated from loading an image is not a good idea, even if the

Re: [Gimp-developer] jpeg quality factor.

2007-07-09 Thread gg
On Tue, 10 Jul 2007 02:08:45 +0200, Chris Mohler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I expect the Save command to retain *all* data: not just some. If you expect that when using jpeg you are wrong and need to see the first use warning that has been suggested. Assuming you do have some knowlege of

Re: [Gimp-developer] [Gimp-user] selections workflow???

2007-07-09 Thread David Gowers
On 7/10/07, Tom Davidson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: yes, sounds like Chris suggestions may do the trick. I will try it our 1st thing in the morn when I get back to work. It looks to me like you moved the layer itself rather than its contents, i used the move tool with not hot keys.