Re: [TruthTalk] sweat
'sweating blood' is a classic nuanced English figure of speech, Bro, sorta like 'making a silk purse from a sow's ear' the underlying elemental requirementsofProtestant orthodoxy arenot too complicated--ourhistory in Christ--all its documents, too--allow (any)one to discover, understand,and teach God's holy intentionsashisppl always practically relying on the validity of our common, also Spiritual experience/s depicted openlyin our common _expression_/s and languages laced though they may be with evidence of our ignorance myths and follies; e.g., we mostly former sinnersallrealize, as do many current sinners, too,that healthy ppl do notactually sweat blood per seyettherereally existsan overwhelming dynamic existential stressin willfully electing to follow a voluntary course of action which will lead particto 'the death of theCross'captured so amazingly in such descriptive Englishwording as sweat[ing] blood(!) there is neither overstatement nor understatementof physical factthere nor insubsequent exceptional expressionselucidatingour God'shumility in sacrificial death for us partic premised previously incertain prophetic poems policies and ppl altogetherworthy verbal historical inspirational vehicles ofthe rarest of discernable, truly human, yetgermanely Godlytraits ever expressed: JCs humility On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 22:59:14 -0600 "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [..do you get this stuff..? --when you do pls try to explain it to our resident cultic gurus Bible readers:)L, g] || In a message dated 12/17/2005 4:03:10 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: English nuancecaptures the foregoingNT concept in the compounded wording, blood shed, or, shed blood, which, as is obvious,isproperly associatedwith Golgotha, not Gethsemane Then you must not really believe everything the Bible says--he sweated great drops of blood in Gethsemane--recall the officers of the High Priest, who came to take him? When he identified himself as the one they wanted, they fell backwards. Ever wonder why? Probably because he was so bloodied--even his clothes probably had blood on them. His hair was probably matted with blood at that point. Also, what about his forty stripes? You think he she blood there and then? Probably lots of it. I am amazed he wasn't so dehydrated and weak from loss of blood, by the time he picked up his cross, that he was even alive.
Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: The tree
Response to Iz:Spoken like a true REPUBLICAN, sadly. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 00:00 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: The tree Lots of confusion, huh? Blainerb In a message dated 12/18/2005 10:51:21 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Confusion only comes from questioning God words. We only do that when we prefer the snake’s words. Confusion is the result of attempted compromise. Compromise is simply disobedience wearing grey. Iz PS The snake offers immediate gratification. The result is inevitable degradation. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2005 9:51 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: The tree One other thought: it seems to me that Eve is first confused by outside influences (the snake) and then - out of this confusion -- she commits the sin. I mean, she is created in the image of God and , yet, the temptation is "you will become like God." Can it be said that sin springs from this same confusion? If we all share in the same sin (Ro 5:12), do we not share in the same confusion? And, so what?? jd
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
The operative word is PROVISIONAL. - Original Message - From: Charles Perry Locke [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 12:13 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles Not really. But, is also depends on the nature of the error. Everyone has error in their theology, in my opinion. The question in my mind is how much error is too much error? How far can one get from the true meaning of the gospel message before they are outside of Christianity. While I cannot draw a hard line separatig those inside from those outside (since degree of error seems to be a contunuum), I can only identify groups that I believe are firmly inside or outside. There are basic beliefs that identify one as a Christian. Having the right Jesus and the right God is the starting point. Perry From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles Date: Sun, 18 Dec 2005 00:11:04 -0700 ..do Bible readers 'camp' around theological error in your neck of the woods? On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 00:00:30 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: CPL, Are [Bible] readers who believe that JC taught that encouraging the baptism of the HS for the already converted 'sums up the Law and Prophets' Christian/s? On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 22:01:39 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: || Matt 7:11 is a scripture that is used to encourage people to seek the Baptism in the Holy Spirit... jt || -- for reference: 7:12So in everything, do [the good] to others [t]hat you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
Judy:Give me the name of the church you attend. IFO would be please to personally call your pastor. I do not trust you as a conduit of his ideas. - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 09:59 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend to them while I press on to know the Lord and the power of His resurrection in my daily life. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:12:10 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Were I prone to worry Judy, YOU would not be among those about whom I would. Why? I perceive you to be a completely and utterly genuine believer, who esteems the Scriptures highly and who lives what she believes. Now, when it comes to the hurling of epithets at those servants of God about whom you possess no firsthand knowledge, I'd put you alongside DaveH and Blainer and their knowledge of the TRUE GOSPEL. (Believe it or not, this is a sort of compliment, Judy) From: Judy Taylor I wonder if the Bereans had done any reading of primary source material when they examined what Paul preached. Also the apostle John, I wonder if he had read source materialwhen he exhorted 1st Century Christians not to even wish a false teacher "godspeed" for if they did they would be a "partaker of his evil deeds" If I were prone to worry you would worry me Lance. You are more concerned about these men than you are about Jesus Himself and the ministry of the Spirit of Christ. IMO you need to do more primary reading fromthe source of all Truth - then you will more accurately be qualified to discern between good and evil. Your qualifications are not those of Christ. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 08:26:28 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: YOU JUDY are not entitled to call it anything, IMO. You've not done, insofar as I know, any reading of primary source material (2 vol Institutes, Commentaries). It's akin to hearing an atheist condemn the teachings of the Scriptures based upon the same sort of evidentiary inquiry that you've conducted with John Calvin. From: Judy Taylor Would Calvinistic heresay be acceptable Lance? Where did the doctrine called Calvinism come from if not from him? What should we call doctrine taken from his
[TruthTalk] CALVIN'S TEACHINGS SAY???? THE BIBLE'S TEACHINGS SAY??? JUDY TAYLOR
Well Judy, at least one has to commend you for both your consistency and your constancy!! - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 09:49 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Banning/Shunning not the same thing Oophs! I forgot - Calvin's teachings say that when God decrees something you are forced to acknowledge it whether you want to or not leavingno room for deception. So the ones who will nothear are just not part of the "select of the elect" and God did not decree it for them. There does that make you feel better? .. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:43:01 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Only for those with ears to hear what the Holy Spirit is saying - some are more interested in the teachings of "other spirits" On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:36:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: 'THESE GUYS' speak a TRUTH capable of being understood, WITH THE AID OF THE SPIRIT OF GOD, by anyone. From: Dean Moore From: Lance Muir ON STREET PREACHING:I've done it (yes, I actually have) I've seen it by practiced by others. Praise God for SOME of it! What I've gleaned from David Miller, you and, Kevin, IMO, does not fall into that 'SOME' category. The lot of you may have driven as many away from as to the Gospel. Limiting my remarks now to just you and Kevin, I'd have to say that your dialogue with the MC has been, to a large extent, infantile. cd: Then why have we seen converts in SLC and in many other places? And how many have you converted? I ask this so we will know it by the fruit presented?Kevin Has giving much truth on this site and supported the truth with written documentation-what more do you want? Ask yourself this, what if these guys are speaking a higher truth than you understand-what then would all you attacks on us mean for you? To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 08:46 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Banning/Shunning not the same thing - Original Message - From: Lance Muir To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/18/2005 6:48:16 AM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Banning/Shunning not the same thing Judy: David Miller, the list owner, opened participation on TT to such as these. The current moderator (CPL) is a rabid anti-Mormon. Others (Dean/Kevin) have chosen to engage the Mormon contingent in an inflammatory mannner in almost every post. I must say that I no longer believe that the MC (Mormon contingent) is still on TT to 'learn'. I believe there to be no danger of anyone converting to Mormonism through what the MC have said since I've been on TT. I have also come to believe that Dave and Blaine may not understand their own history/beliefs/practices as well as those on TT who are their critics. (I found this to be the case when I did my own research long ago.) Finally, I believe that they should not be granted 'center stage', as it were. IMO, they are NOT prepared to 'engage' on serious/substantive matters. (I thought so for a while but, not now.) cd: You are clinging to the principle that Mormons are here to learn they are not as Dave himself stated-they are here for no other reason then to stand against truth -to twist ,lie and cause divisions among the brethern-This is what their works show.Dave enjoyed this game for well over 5 years-and whether you want to acknowledge the fact or not better Christians have tried to reason with these guys and were merely mocked by the Mormonsby turned their truth(s) into a game. You are also wrong about Perry -Dave was giving many opportunities to correct his behavior by Perry-If he was a "Rabid anti-Mormon" why did Perry give him so many opportunity to repent? Do you not conceive that Satan would send his to this site as to hinder a Street Preacher site-which this is. I also think you are here for the same reasons as the Mormons-not to learn but to cause problems and
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
Ever the optimist, Lance once again asks Judy: Do you always and completely UNDERSTAND EMPLOY THEM (those Scriptures you cite) as God and the author means them? - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 15:25 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 16:52:31 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Oh well, guess the Promise does not mean as much to you. It is this constant bit ofjudging that renders your influence nil. Bit of judging? I am just reflecting back to Lance what he has already written to me, so how is it me that is judging - never him? They name streets after you JD. To speak as if you know anything at all about Lance and his attachment to the "promise" is not just misinformed -- it is a cheap ad hom . I don't profess to know the first thing about Lance JD. However, I do know something about the Promise of the Father and this is what the wonderful Lance negates in my life... so how is it you don't take up for me?? Lance is actually the one who is doing the judging. It is not "judging" to say that you do not understand scritpture - although such a statement involves a judgment. It is judging , however, when you put yourself in the place of God and make your determinations.jd By stating that I do not understand scripture Lance is putting himself in the place of God and so are you. From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] I do Lance, this is why I try to stick with scripture -in spite of your belief that all I have isregard for same. Oh well, guess the Promise does not mean as much to you. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 07:07:08 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: With apologies (sort of) in advance to David Miller and Linda Shields, I ask you once again, Judy: Do you believe that you are MORE DISCERNING THAN JOHN CALVIN? IMO, your regard for Scriptures appears to be second to nobody on TT. (regard NOT being the same thing as understanding). However, you do indeed appear to read/study and live it insofar as you are enabled. Scripture is a primary source for you. Amen! for that. Now, other than the blessed internet, how much of John Calvin's own writings,have you actually read. Do you possess anything whatsoever by him? If all that you know of him would be classed as 'hearsay' then do cease and desist from your unfounded allegations hereafter.Stick to that which you claim to understand, please?. From: Judy Taylor Sure they do, they camp around John Calvin don't they? Why do you think there are so many different doctrines all claiming to be the truth? On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 00:11:04 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: ..do Bible readers 'camp' around theological error in your neck of the woods? On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 00:00:30 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: CPL, Are [Bible] readers whobelieve that JC taught that encouraging the baptism of the HS for the already converted'sums up the Law and Prophets' Christian/s? On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 22:01:39 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: || Matt 7:11 is a scripture that is used to encourage people to seek the Baptism in the Holy Spirit... jt || -- for reference: 7:12So in everything, do [the good]to others [t]hat you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets. judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4) judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4) judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Cross
Yes I was going by the part I observed on the open list - but apparentlythere was more going onoffline which I was not aware of until yesterday.. but it sounds like they are working things out. judyt On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 22:55:20 EST [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: In a message dated 12/17/2005 2:18:03 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Blaine, DaveH kicked himself off. The Moderator told him that it was his last warning - that's all... because they kept ignoring him and went on with a thread he told them to take offline. Who told you he was kicked off?? judyt I got it that he was actually kicked off after discussion with DaveM and Perry, with conditions being set to get back on. DaveH sent me a private e-mail. judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
JD is correct on this one, Judy. Do you, Judy, believe that in HAVING THE MIND OF CHRIST you are thereby INFALLIBLE IN BOTH YOUR SELECTION, UNDERSTANDING AND INTERPRETATION OF SCRIPTURE. I believe it is possible for you to answer yes/no on this. - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 15:41 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 17:25:51 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes to Dean: Amen Judy ? Get a life. You are one insulting somebody JD. Judy writes as if she knows the reading habits of the Bereans or the Apostle John.Since John is so obviously writing to those who are not of Jewish traditional thought, I would say his reading of others is substantial. Oh? so nowthe unlearned disciples have all of a sudden become scholars according to JD. John and his brother James, sons of Zebedee, fishermen on the sea of Galilee are now Seminary grads and know all about cultural distinctions and all that. I guess Peter had learned all this before giving his address on the day of Pentecost also . Get a grip JD. Paul is admittedly well read. What I do know is this - you and Judy speak of that which you cannot know. Why not? We have the mind of Christ don't we?Or are you, like Lance going to negate every promise to us sincewe do not speak in accord withyour great learning? You attach your interpretation of [even] historical conisiderations to your sense of reality and then, insist it is truth. Ridiculous in many instances. jd It may appear ridiculous to you JD but then God takes pleasure in hiding things from those who think themselves wise and prudent andHe likesrevealing things to babes. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend to them while I press on to know the Lord and the power of His resurrection in my daily life. cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:12:10 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Were I prone to worry Judy, YOU would not be among those about whom I would. Why? I perceive you to be a completely and utterly genuine believer, who esteems the Scriptures highly and who lives what she believes. Now, when it comes to the hurling of epithets at those servants of God about whom you possess no firsthand knowledge, I'd put you alongside DaveH and Blainer and their knowledge of the TRUE GOSPEL. (Believe it or not, this is a sort of compliment, Judy) From: Judy Taylor I wonder if the Bereans had done any reading of primary source material when they examined what Paul preached. Also the apostle John, I wonder if he had read source materialwhen he exhorted 1st Century Christians not to even wish a false teacher "godspeed" for if they did they would be a "partaker of his evil deeds" If I were prone to worry you would worry me Lance. You are more concerned about these men than you are about Jesus Himself and the ministry of the Spirit of Christ. IMO you need to do more primary reading fromthe source of all Truth - then you will more accurately be qualified to discern between good and evil. Your qualifications are not those of Christ. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 08:26:28
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
Are you, Judy, concerned for your son/yourself in this church, under this pastor? - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 15:45 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles He does JD and if he left almost the whole church would go with him. It is definitely "he" who has it "going on" rather thanthe Lord. You would like him. You could laugh at all his jokes appreciate all the books he has read and cites in his sermons and join his pastorlyfollowing especially since you are pleased to accommodate Calvinism - you'd probably fit right in. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 17:27:22 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Your pastors name? Sounds as though he has it going on ! jd From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend to them while I press on to know the Lord and the power of His resurrection in my daily life. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:12:10 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Were I prone to worry Judy, YOU would not be among those about whom I would. Why? I perceive you to be a completely and utterly genuine believer, who esteems the Scriptures highly and who lives what she believes. Now, when it comes to the hurling of epithets at those servants of God about whom you possess no firsthand knowledge, I'd put you alongside DaveH and Blainer and their knowledge of the TRUE GOSPEL. (Believe it or not, this is a sort of compliment, Judy) From: Judy Taylor I wonder if the Bereans had done any reading of primary source material when they examined what Paul preached. Also the apostle John, I wonder if he had read source materialwhen he exhorted 1st Century Christians not to even wish a false teacher "godspeed" for if they did they would be a "partaker of his evil deeds" If I were prone to worry you would worry me Lance. You are more concerned about these men than you are about Jesus Himself and the ministry of the Spirit of Christ. IMO you need to do more primary reading fromthe source of all Truth - then you will more accurately be qualified to discern between good and evil. Your
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
Will you kindly interpret 'vain imaginations' for me/us? - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 17:33 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles Unlike some - I don't entertain vain imaginations JD - On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 21:49:25 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yes, he sounds like a wonderful pastor. And I bet that God has much more to do with his life that you could (obviously) imagine. Whose next on your list -- the BSF?? From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] He does JD and if he left almost the whole church would go with him. It is definitely "he" who has it "going on" rather thanthe Lord. You would like him. You could laugh at all his jokes appreciate all the books he has read and cites in his sermons and join his pastorlyfollowing especially since you are pleased to accommodate Calvinism - you'd probably fit right in. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 17:27:22 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Your pastors name? Sounds as though he has it going on ! jd From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend to them while I press on to know the Lord and the power of His resurrection in my daily life. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:12:10 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Were I prone to worry Judy, YOU would not be among those about whom I would. Why? I perceive you to be a completely and utterly genuine believer, who esteems the Scriptures highly and who lives what she believes. Now, when it comes to the hurling of epithets at those servants of God about whom you possess no firsthand knowledge, I'd put you alongside DaveH and Blainer and their knowledge of the TRUE GOSPEL. (Believe it or not, this is a sort of compliment, Judy) From: Judy Taylor I wonder if the Bereans had done any reading of
[TruthTalk] Judy employs the small case 'g' when speaking of the 'god' those named below (Pun) serve!!
IFF I've read you correctly on this then, you ought to be called on to apologize by the moderator (if he can drag himself away from the MC) "I don't believe He is the same god, JD") - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 17:39 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 21:45:28 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: absolute nonsense. We are told to oppose the false teacher, correct? This implies that we can make judgments as to whether one understands or not. You do it[judgeother's understandingin regard to thewritten word] all the time -- all the time. It is the theme of nearly every single post you have written since I have been on this forum. You have isolated yourself to such a degree that your personal theology is not the majority opinion of any group of disciples. Now, I know that you don't care -- but such is the reason for your weirdness when it comes to "biblcial teaching."It is not wihtin man to direct his own steps. Your "hermeneutic" is a testament to the truth of that thought. I have praised you several times in the past -- but you have not improved with the passing of time. Just the opposite. You come across like an abusive mother. Sometimes it gets tiring. It is truly upsetting to see you so negative and yet, so attached to the same God I and lance and Bill and Gary and Debbie and and and serve. I don't believe He is the same god JD because what you and the others write is very complicated and at times incomprehensible - It is alwaysmixture - which God hates. We will see who is left standing at the last day. In the meantime a little less aggression and a little more humility from youmight help. Oh well, guess the Promise does not mean as much to you. It is this constant bit ofjudging that renders your influence nil. Bit of judging? I am just reflecting back to Lance what he has already written to me, so how is it me that is judging - never him? They name streets after you JD. Where has Lance ever judged your faith in God and Christ, your commitment to scripture, your claim to salvation , or your practice of the faith? NOWHERE. You , on the other, make such sommits a way of life. To speak as if you know anything at all about Lance and his attachment to the "promise" is not just misinformed -- it is a cheap ad hom . I don't profess to know the first thing about Lance JD. However, I do know something about the Promise of the Father and this is what the wonderful Lance negates in my life... so how is it you don't take up for me??Lance is actually the one who is doing the judging. It is not "judging" to say that you do not understand scritpture - although such a statement involves a judgment. It is judging , however, when you put yourself in the place of God and make your determinations.jd By stating that I do not understand scripture Lance is putting himself in the place of God and so are you. absolute nonsense. We are told to oppose the false teacher, correct? This implies that we can make judgments as to whether one understands or not. You do it[judgeother's understandingin regard to thewritten word] all the time -- all the time. It is the theme of nearly every single post you have written since I have been on this forum. You have isolated yourself to such a degree that your personal theology is not the majority opinion of any group of disciples. Now, I know that you don't care -- but such is the reason for your weirdness when it comes to "biblcial teaching."It is not wihtin man to direct his own steps. Your "hermeneutic" is a testament to the truth of that thought. I have praised you several times in the past -- but you have not improved with the passing of time. Just the opposite. You come across like an abusive mother. Sometimes it gets tiring. It is truly upsetting to see you so negative and yet, so attached to the same God I and lance and Bill and Gary and Debbie and and and serve. judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Banning/Shunning not the same thing
- Original Message - From: To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org;TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/18/2005 9:55:13 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Banning/Shunning not the same thing Maybe you can try reading the posts and counting the number of people who are actually SP. It is not an SP site. cd: When searching for a Street Preacher site years ago-I searched for "Street Preaching" and the goggle took me here. The owner is a street preachers many that come one this site are street preachers Ruben , Kevin, David , Me ,and now Lance(?)many others come on occassions-We report and get updates thru this site. This is a test John: The sky is blue. -- Original message -- From: "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org;TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/18/2005 12:07:43 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Banning/Shunning not the same thing Dean, I have been here nearly two years. I do not consider this to be a SP site and it is not. The Elmsman lists (and there are many) is a SP assemply -- complete with fist fighting, and all levels of apostate filth of speech. jd cd: Really? Try looking at some of the pictures DavidM. has post on his events menue-I think you will see thing a little clearer. -- Original message -- From: "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Lance Muir To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/18/2005 6:48:16 AM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Banning/Shunning not the same thing Judy: David Miller, the list owner, opened participation on TT to such as these. The current moderator (CPL) is a rabid anti-Mormon. Others (Dean/Kevin) have chosen to engage the Mormon contingent in an inflammatory mannner in almost every post. I must say that I no longer believe that the MC (Mormon contingent) is still on TT to 'learn'. I believe there to be no danger of anyone converting to Mormonism through what the MC have said since I've been on TT. I have also come to believe that Dave and Blaine may not understand their own history/beliefs/practices as well as those on TT who are their critics. (I found this to be the case when I did my own research long ago.) Finally, I believe that they should not be granted 'center stage', as it were. IMO, they are NOT prepared to 'engage' on serious/substantive matters. (I thought so for a while but, not now.) cd: You are clinging to the principle that Mormons are here to learn they are not as Dave himself stated-they are here for no other reason then to stand against truth -to twist ,lie and cause divisions among the brethern-This is what their works show.Dave enjoyed this game for well over 5 years-and whether you want to acknowledge the fact or not better Christians have tried to reason with these guys and were merely mocked by the Mormonsby turned their truth(s) into a game. You are also wrong about Perry -Dave was giving many opportunities to correct his behavior by Perry-If he was a "Rabid anti-Mormon" why did Perry give him so many opportunity to repent? Do you not conceive that Satan would send his to this site as to hinder a Street Preacher site-which this is. I also think you are here for the same reasons as the Mormons-not to learn but to cause problems and add confusion-as your works suggest. Ask you self this why would a person come to a Street Preacher site and mock Street Preachersas you-and many o thers have done on this site? To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 06:27 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Banning/Shunning not the same thing Who has been banned? DaveH received a last warning,he apparently got offended and banned himself and now Blaine ahs taken up an offense for him and possibly you also Lance.. Why? On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 06:21:06 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Once banned, I assume that such may stay on TT for the purpose of reading. Is this so? L judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath
- Original Message - From: To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/18/2005 11:05:09 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath Just another little disagreement as to what conclusions can be reached in reading a particular passage in the Bible. Blainerb cd: The bible say to study to show thyself approved. Some passages must be studied-I see no problem here-you bias against the Bible is showing Blain-better cover it. In a message dated 12/17/2005 3:10:10 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Dean, the words of Romans 14 eliminates all holy days. To escape this conclusion, one must add some sort of contextual consideration.Such is perfectedly permissible ... the larger context of a passage is always an important consideration. But, your conclusions regarding the observance of the sabbath is based upon this contextual consideration and not upon the literal wording of the passage. You could be right BUT not necessarily. Agreed? So there is room for disagreement on this issue (?) jd cd:If Romans 14 eliminates all Holy Days why then did Christ and Paul keep those Holy Days? Why did the early Christians keep the Sat. Sabb. and honor the first day?On considering the Contextual meaning relating of the passage in Question one must insert the passage into the context of the entirechapter or the meaning of the passage will be lost-and once that is done insert the chapter into the entire Bible. The context of thechapter deals with eating herbs or meats on Holy days and to not judge ones brother if they eat herbs or eat other foods. No where in the context of this passage does it mention the Sabbath-it is speaking of the Feasts of Israel (ie called Holy Days). Is there not a Commentary available for you or Terry to research?If not E-Sword is a good starting place.Your argument would be better fought using Col 2:6. Romans 14:5 Is teaching us to be fully persuaded that there is not sin involved-breaking a commandment is sin therefore the Sabbath is obligatory.
[TruthTalk] DAVID MILLER WHERE ARE YOU ON THE SCRIPTURE THREAD??
IMO both Judy and David have the same understanding with respect to understanding/interpreting Scripture. 1. Exactly what is that 'understanding'? 2. After having it explicitly stated, I'd like to know who, on TT, subscribes to it. L - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: truthtalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 17:49 Subject: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles JD Lance's savior writes: Where has Lance ever judged your faith in God and Christ, your commitment to scripture, your claim to salvation , or your practice of the faith? NOWHERE. You , on the other, make such sommits a way of life. The following JD is a judgment; Lances judgment with which you no doubt will fully concur; just don't claim he never made it lest you be found a liar. IMO, your regard for Scriptures appears to be second to nobody on TT. (regard NOT being the same thing as understanding). However, you do indeed appear to read/study and live it insofar as you are enabled. Scripture is a primary source for you. Lance So, Lance says I have a regard for scripture and I read/study it so far as I am enabled . Whoop-de-do The Word of God says something entirely different - and I know where my faith lies.
Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath
- Original Message - From: To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/18/2005 11:12:43 PM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath Blainerb: VERY GOOD, jd!! Jesus said several times he was sentonly to the House of Israel, which is why he even went to the Samaritans, many of whom had Jewish bloodlines. That being concluded, what do you think when he said, "Other sheep I have which are not of this fold, and they too I must visit, and they too must Hear My Voice!" cd: Is John and the LDS in agreement now? In a message dated 12/17/2005 3:25:29 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Christ's physical ministry was to the Jew, only. He lived under the law and was the fulfillment of that law. In Him is the end of the law. As to Paul, it is Paul who writes against holy days. Why did he continue to keep them (and I believe he kept ALL of them) : he became all things to all men that by all means he might save some. He was a Jew to the Jews, and a Gentile to the Gentiles. jd
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
Is it not possible, though actually attending this church, that YOU DON'T KNOW THIS PASTOR EITHER, Judy? - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 18:51 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles Once more you run right over the top of me JD; you don't respect me as a person or as another believer in Christ with a different take on just about everything. I would rather you disagree rationally stating why you don't see it the same as me. Your response is offensive just as offensive as putting words in my mouth. You don't know the pastor, the situation, or even what he preaches - yet you are more opinionated than even me. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 23:41:36 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Oh of course you do. This very response proves it !! :-) jd From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unlike some - I don't entertain vain imaginations JD - On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 21:49:25 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yes, he sounds like a wonderful pastor. And I bet that God has much more to do with his life that you could (obviously) imagine. Whose next on your list -- the BSF?? From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] He does JD and if he left almost the whole church would go with him. It is definitely "he" who has it "going on" rather thanthe Lord. You would like him. You could laugh at all his jokes appreciate all the books he has read and cites in his sermons and join his pastorlyfollowing especially since you are pleased to accommodate Calvinism - you'd probably fit right in. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 17:27:22 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Your pastors name? Sounds as though he has it going on ! jd From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
Linda:Judy, as is frequently the case, misunderstood my post, unlike her infallible understanding of Scripture. I'd never think that either of you as subscribing to calvinism. INSOFAR AS I UNDERSTAND ALL TT PARTICIPANTS, NOT ONE SUBSCRIBES TO CALVINism! I'd becha on that. - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 12:32 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles Lance I cannot defend or denounce Calvin, as I am not that familiar with him. So far as I can tell, Im not in agreement with his doctrines, but am not interested enough to care. Sorry to disappoint you. iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy TaylorSent: Sunday, December 18, 2005 8:34 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgCc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles Are both Linda and DavidM IYO Calvinists Lance? Maybe it is not forthcoming because they are willing to allow someone to hold an opinion that is different from their own which is something your mentors could not abide and so it seems neither can you. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:26:02 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Where you reflect IGNORANCE and, choose to remain thus, I leave to your choosing. Where you choose to speak ill of God's servants, I await a warning from either David Miller or Linda Shields. Why, I wonder do I believe neither to be forthcoming? From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend to them while I press on to know the Lord and the power of His resurrection in my daily life. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:12:10 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Were I prone to worry Judy, YOU would not be among those about whom I would. Why? I perceive you to be a completely and utterly genuine believer, who esteems the Scriptures highly and who lives what she believes. Now, when it comes to the hurling of epithets at those servants of God about whom you possess no firsthand knowledge, I'd put you alongside DaveH and Blainer and their knowledge of the TRUE GOSPEL. (Believe it or not, this is a sort of compliment, Judy) From: Judy Taylor I wonder if the Bereans had done any reading of primary source material when they examined what Paul preached. Also the apostle John, I wonder if he had read source materialwhen he exhorted 1st Century Christians not to even wish a false teacher "godspeed" for if they did they would be a "partaker of his evil deeds" If I were prone to worry you would worry me Lance. You are more concerned about these men than you are about Jesus Himself and the ministry of the Spirit of Christ. IMO you need to do more primary reading fromthe source of all Truth - then you will more accurately be qualified to discern between good and evil. Your qualifications are not those of Christ. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 08:26:28 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: YOU JUDY are not entitled to call it anything, IMO. You've not done, insofar as I know, any reading of primary source material (2 vol Institutes, Commentaries). It's akin to hearing an atheist condemn the teachings of the Scriptures based upon the same sort of evidentiary inquiry that you've conducted with John Calvin. From: Judy Taylor Would Calvinistic heresay be acceptable Lance? Where did the
Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: what is new for me
Are you, ALWAYS? - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 19:05 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: what is new for me If you are walking in the Spirit, yes. iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Terry CliftonSent: Sunday, December 18, 2005 1:38 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: what is new for me If your principles reflect Him perfectly, would your speech and behavior also do the same?ShieldsFamily wrote: If we really know the Person, our principles will reflect Him perfectly. There is no dichotomy for those walking in the Spirit. iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2005 9:56 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: what is new for me And this: Wemeasure the options against principlesinstead of responding/submitting to a Person. -- Original message -- From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Debbie Sawczak To: Lance Muir Sent: December 17, 2005 19:43 Subject: what is new for me is not the understanding that this is our condition. What is new is the connection between that condition and "knowledge ofgood and evil"--that this is the meaning of the name of thetree in the Genesis story. D
Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath
In a message dated 12/17/2005 3:25:29 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Christ's physical ministry was to the Jew, only. He lived under the law and was the fulfillment of that law. In Him is the end of the law. In Him is no such thing. God's law has not gone anywhere. In fact according to the apostle John who writes under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit in the New Testament "SIN IS THE TRANSGRESSION OF THE LAW" So how can one transgress against something that is ended? Or are you saying that nobody sins anymore since you have proclaimed the end of the law? judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
[TruthTalk] Empty-headed regard for it (Scripture?) Accute disdane for (his) people (living dead)
Well said, Gary. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 00:15 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles no myth in this--that you supremely regard only your empty-headed regard for it is accurate; evidence shows that no one who really loves JC demonstrates the accute disdain for (his) ppl that ppl like you exhibit On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 07:14:48 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I try to stick with scripture -in spite of your belief that all I have isregard for same. ||
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
After sitting in the pew for a year and a half I know enough about him and as a matter of fact I like him but we won't be going anywhere other than more bricks and mortar and more ss rooms.. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:42:59 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Is it not possible, though actually attending this church, that YOU DON'T KNOW THIS PASTOR EITHER, Judy? From: Judy Taylor Once more you run right over the top of me JD; you don't respect me as a person or as another believer in Christ with a different take on just about everything. I would rather you disagree rationally stating why you don't see it the same as me. Your response is offensive just as offensive as putting words in my mouth. You don't know the pastor, the situation, or even what he preaches - yet you are more opinionated than even me. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 23:41:36 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Oh of course you do. This very response proves it !! :-) jd From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Unlike some - I don't entertain vain imaginations JD - On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 21:49:25 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yes, he sounds like a wonderful pastor. And I bet that God has much more to do with his life that you could (obviously) imagine. Whose next on your list -- the BSF?? From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] He does JD and if he left almost the whole church would go with him. It is definitely "he" who has it "going on" rather thanthe Lord. You would like him. You could laugh at all his jokes appreciate all the books he has read and cites in his sermons and join his pastorlyfollowing especially since you are pleased to accommodate Calvinism - you'd probably fit right in. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 17:27:22 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Your pastors name? Sounds as though he has it going on ! jd From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ
Re: [TruthTalk] sweat
Earth to Blainer:Please do a little homework on this one. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 00:11 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] sweat In a message dated 12/18/2005 10:00:08 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Blaine that is SO ridiculous. Where do you get this stuff?? iz Sorry my thinking does not jive with yours--Actually, this is not necessarily Mormon doctrine, just my own thinking out loud. But the blood of Gethsemane was a reality. And it WAS there that the sins of mankind were atoned for. The cross was where he died, in order that he might be resurrected and over come death, brought into the world by the fall of Adam-- As in Adam all men die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
[TruthTalk] DOCTRINAL DISPUTES SELDOM (DEFINE PLEASE) HAPPEN
Blainer: Just how well (seriously) do you know your own history? - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 00:06 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] SO THEN it is safe to assume that NO MORMON RESPONSE TO THE "... Most Bishops have so much to do that they have little time to answer petty questions to resolve doctrinal disputes. I would not take a problem of that nature to my Bishop. No one I know would. Doctrinal disputes seldom happen, since the BoM and the DC are very clear. I know this sounds weird, but it happens to be true. If I have a doctrinal misunderstanding, I just study it out in my own mind, and the answer usually presents itself via the Spirit of the Lord. Blainerb In a message dated 12/18/2005 9:36:36 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Blaine, if you and a fellow mormon disagreed on the meaning of a verse, you would go to your Bishop, he would tell you what it means, and regardless of the answer, you both would acceot that, am I right? If not, how would you resolve it?From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Reply-To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] SO THEN it is safe to assume that NO MORMON RESPONSE TO THE "...Date: Sun, 18 Dec 2005 23:24:46 ESTIn a message dated 12/17/2005 5:09:12 P.M. Mountain Standard Time,[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:Blainerb: To "be perfect," it seems one would first have to becomeperfect--which may take more time for some than others. I do OK in following theadmonitions of Jesus Christ, and I believe I do better each day--but I am afterall a son of Adam and Eve, from whom I inherited imperfections.cd:Christians are son of Christ -the lost are sons of AE and will have noinheritance.Where does it say that, Dean? We are all sons and daughters of Adam andEve, who inherit the conditions of the fall. Are you an exception?
Re: [TruthTalk] Some enjoy theological knots, others feed on God's Word as is!!
So ought you and JD Lance, how is it what you write always passes the smell test with you and what I write is always needing a reprimand ie: "By stating that I do not understand scripture you Lance are putting yourself in the place of God and so is JD in your Amen gallery" judyt On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:37:04 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: IFF I've read you correctly on this then, you ought to be called on to apologize by the moderator (if he can drag himself away from the MC) "I don't believe He is the same god, JD") I don't believe He is the same god JD because what you and the others write is very complicated and at times incomprehensible and it is alwaysmixture - which God hates. We will see who is left standing at the last day. In the meantime a little less aggression and a little more humility from youmight help. From: Judy Taylor On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 21:45:28 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: absolute nonsense. We are told to oppose the false teacher, correct? This implies that we can make judgments as to whether one understands or not. You do it[judgeother's understandingin regard to thewritten word] all the time -- all the time. It is the theme of nearly every single post you have written since I have been on this forum. You have isolated yourself to such a degree that your personal theology is not the majority opinion of any group of disciples. Now, I know that you don't care -- but such is the reason for your weirdness when it comes to "biblcial teaching."It is not wihtin man to direct his own steps. Your "hermeneutic" is a testament to the truth of that thought. I have praised you several times in the past -- but you have not improved with the passing of time. Just the opposite. You come across like an abusive mother. Sometimes it gets tiring. It is truly upsetting to see you so negative and yet, so attached to the same God I and lance and Bill and Gary and Debbie and and and serve. Oh well, guess the Promise does not mean as much to you. It is this constant bit ofjudging that renders your influence nil. Bit of judging? I am just reflecting back to Lance what he has already written to me, so how is it me that is judging - never him? They name streets after you JD. Where has Lance ever judged your faith in God and Christ, your commitment to scripture, your claim to salvation , or your practice of the faith? NOWHERE. You , on the other, make such sommits a way of life. To speak as if you know anything at all about Lance and his attachment to the "promise" is not just misinformed -- it is a cheap ad hom . I don't profess to know the first thing about Lance JD. However, I do know something about the Promise of the Father and this is what the wonderful Lance negates in my life... so how is it you don't take up for me??Lance is actually the one who is doing the judging. It is not "judging" to say that you do not understand scritpture - although such a statement involves a judgment. It is judging , however, when you put yourself in the place of God and make your determinations.jd By stating that I do not understand scripture Lance is putting himself in the place of God and so are you. absolute nonsense. We are told to oppose the false teacher, correct? This implies that we can make judgments as to whether one understands or not. You do it[judgeother's understandingin regard to thewritten word] all the time -- all the time. It is the theme of nearly every single post you have written since I have been on this forum. You have isolated yourself to such a degree that your personal theology is not the majority opinion of any group of disciples. Now, I know that you don't care -- but such is the reason for your weirdness when it comes to "biblcial teaching."It is not wihtin man to direct his own steps. Your "hermeneutic" is a testament to the truth of that thought. I have praised you several times in the past -- but you have not improved with the passing of time. Just the opposite. You come across like an abusive mother. Sometimes it gets tiring. It is truly upsetting to see you so negative and yet, so attached to the same God I and lance and Bill and Gary and Debbie and and and serve. judyt
Re: [TruthTalk] Some enjoy theological knots, others feed on God's Word as is!!
"Lance and JD are putting themselves in the place
of God in saying that I (Judy) do not understand Scripture."
Speaking only for myself Judy, I will live with
that which you believe concerning your
understanding/apprehension/interpretation/selection of citations etc.('Live
with' does NOT mean agreement)
ONCE YOU EXPLICITLY STATE WHAT YOU BELIEVE, I WOULD
LIKE TO HEAR FROM THOSE ON TT WHO SUBSCRIBE TO THIS POSITION.
From: Judy Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: December 19, 2005 07:08
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Some enjoy
theological knots, others feed on God's Word as is!!
So ought you and JD Lance, how is it what you write
always passes the smell test with you and what I write is always
needing a reprimand ie: "By stating that I do not understand scripture you Lance are
putting yourself in the place of
God and so is JD in your Amen gallery"
judyt
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:37:04 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
IFF I've read you correctly on this then, you ought to be called on to apologize by the moderator
(if he can drag himself away from the MC) "I don't believe He is the same
god, JD")
I don't believe He is the same god JD because what
you and the others write is very complicated and at times
incomprehensible and it is alwaysmixture -
which God hates. We will see who is left standing at the last
day. In
the meantime a little less aggression and a little
more humility from youmight help.
From: Judy Taylor
On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 21:45:28 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
absolute nonsense. We are told to
oppose the false teacher, correct? This implies that we can make
judgments as to whether one understands or not. You do
it[judgeother's understandingin regard to
thewritten word] all the time -- all the
time. It is the theme of nearly every single post you have written
since I have been on this forum. You have isolated yourself to
such a degree that your personal theology is not the majority opinion of
any group of disciples. Now, I know that you don't care
-- but such is the reason for your weirdness
when it comes to "biblcial teaching."It is not
wihtin man to direct his own steps. Your
"hermeneutic" is a testament to the truth of that thought. I
have praised you several times in the past -- but you have not
improved with the passing of time. Just the
opposite. You come across like an abusive mother.
Sometimes it gets tiring. It is truly upsetting to see you so
negative and yet, so attached to the same God I and lance and Bill and
Gary and Debbie and and and serve.
Oh well,
guess the Promise does not mean as much to you.
It is this constant bit ofjudging
that renders your influence nil.
Bit of judging? I am just reflecting back
to Lance what he has already written to me, so how is it me that is
judging - never him? They name
streets after you JD.
Where has Lance ever judged your faith in
God and Christ, your commitment to scripture, your claim
to salvation , or your practice of the faith?
NOWHERE. You , on the other, make such sommits a way of
life.
To speak as if you know anything at all
about Lance and his attachment to the "promise" is not just
misinformed -- it is a cheap ad hom
.
I don't profess to know the first thing
about Lance JD. However, I do know something about the Promise
of the Father and
this is what the wonderful Lance negates in my life... so how is it
you don't take up for me??Lance is actually the one who is doing the
judging.
It is not "judging" to say that you do not
understand scritpture - although such a statement involves a
judgment. It is judging , however, when you put
yourself in the place of God and make your
determinations.jd
By stating that I do not understand
scripture Lance is putting himself in the place of God and so are
you. absolute nonsense.
We are told to oppose the false teacher, correct? This implies
that we can make judgments as to whether one understands or
not. You do it[judgeother's
understandingin regard to thewritten word] all the
time -- all the time. It is the theme of
nearly every single post you have written since I have been on this
Re: [TruthTalk] Some enjoy theological knots, others feed on God's Word as is!!
I've been explicitly stating what I believe for the
past 2-3years on this list. Seems you've been paying
more attention to the MC Lance so you've missed
it. judyt
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 07:16:50 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
"Lance and JD are putting themselves in the place
of God in saying that I (Judy) do not understand Scripture."
Speaking only for myself Judy, I will live with
that which you believe concerning your
understanding/apprehension/interpretation/selection of citations etc.('Live
with' does NOT mean agreement)
ONCE YOU EXPLICITLY STATE WHAT YOU BELIEVE, I
WOULD LIKE TO HEAR FROM THOSE ON TT WHO SUBSCRIBE TO THIS
POSITION.
From: Judy Taylor
So ought you and JD Lance,
how is it what you write always passes the smell test with you and what I
write is always
needing a reprimand ie: "By stating that I do not understand scripture you Lance are
putting yourself in the place of
God and so is JD in your Amen gallery"
judyt
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:37:04 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
IFF I've read you correctly on this then,
you ought to be called on to apologize by the
moderator (if he can drag himself away from the MC) "I don't
believe He is the same god, JD")
I don't believe He is the same god JD because
what you and the others write is very complicated and at
times
incomprehensible and it is alwaysmixture -
which God hates. We will see who is left standing at the last
day. In
the meantime a little less aggression and a
little more humility from youmight help.
From: Judy
Taylor
On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 21:45:28 + [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
absolute nonsense. We are told to
oppose the false teacher, correct? This implies that we can make
judgments as to whether one understands or not. You do
it[judgeother's understandingin regard to
thewritten word] all the time -- all the
time. It is the theme of nearly every single post you have written
since I have been on this forum. You have isolated yourself
to such a degree that your personal theology is not the majority opinion
of any group of disciples. Now, I know that you don't
care -- but such is the reason for your
weirdness when it comes to "biblcial
teaching."It is not wihtin man to direct his
own steps. Your "hermeneutic" is a
testament to the truth of that thought. I have praised you
several times in the past -- but you have not improved with
the passing of time. Just the opposite. You come
across like an abusive mother. Sometimes it gets
tiring. It is truly upsetting to see you so negative and yet, so
attached to the same God I and lance and Bill and Gary and Debbie and
and and serve.
Oh
well, guess the Promise does not mean as much
to you.
It is this constant bit ofjudging
that renders your influence nil.
Bit of judging? I am just reflecting back
to Lance what he has already written to me, so how is it me that
is judging - never him? They name
streets after you JD.
Where has Lance ever judged your faith in
God and Christ, your commitment to scripture, your
claim to salvation , or your practice of the faith?
NOWHERE. You , on the other, make such sommits a way
of life.
To speak as if you know anything at all
about Lance and his attachment to the "promise" is not just
misinformed -- it is a cheap ad hom
.
I don't profess to know the first thing
about Lance JD. However, I do know something about the
Promise of the
Father and this is what the wonderful Lance negates in my life...
so how is it you don't take up for
me??Lance is
actually the one who is doing the judging.
It is not "judging" to say that you do
not understand scritpture - although such a statement
involves a judgment. It is judging , however,
when you put yourself in the place of God and make your
determinations.jd
By stating that I do not understand
scripture Lance is putting himself in the place of God and so are
you. absolute
nonsense. We are told to oppose the false teacher,
correct? This implies that we
Re: [TruthTalk] Who gives understanding Barth, TFT, or the Spirit of God?
Since you apparently do not eitherunderstand them or believe themLance, why would you want to put everyone into your theological box? If I did not understand them, naturally I would not employ them - but this one is a no brainer. Jesus says: "It is expedient for you that I go away for if I go not away the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart I will send him unto you" (John 16:7) "Howbeit when he the Spirit of truth is come he will guide you into all truth; for he shall not speak of himself but whatsoever he shall hear that shall he speak and he will show you things to come. He shall glorify me; for he shall receive of mine, and shall show it unto you" (John 16:13,14) On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:27:05 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Ever the optimist, Lance once again asks Judy: Do you always and completely UNDERSTAND EMPLOY THEM (those Scriptures you cite) as God and the author means them? From: Judy Taylor On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 16:52:31 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Oh well, guess the Promise does not mean as much to you. It is this constant bit ofjudging that renders your influence nil. Bit of judging? I am just reflecting back to Lance what he has already written to me, so how is it me that is judging - never him? They name streets after you JD. To speak as if you know anything at all about Lance and his attachment to the "promise" is not just misinformed -- it is a cheap ad hom . I don't profess to know the first thing about Lance JD. However, I do know something about the Promise of the Father and this is what the wonderful Lance negates in my life... so how is it you don't take up for me?? Lance is actually the one who is doing the judging. It is not "judging" to say that you do not understand scritpture - although such a statement involves a judgment. It is judging , however, when you put yourself in the place of God and make your determinations.jd By stating that I do not understand scripture Lance is putting himself in the place of God and so are you. From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] I do Lance, this is why I try to stick with scripture -in spite of your belief that all I have isregard for same. Oh well, guess the Promise does not mean as much to you. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 07:07:08 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: With apologies (sort of) in advance to David Miller and Linda Shields, I ask you once again, Judy: Do you believe that you are MORE DISCERNING THAN JOHN CALVIN? IMO, your regard for Scriptures appears to be second to nobody on TT. (regard NOT being the same thing as understanding). However, you do indeed appear to read/study and live it insofar as you are enabled. Scripture is a primary source for you. Amen! for that. Now, other than the blessed internet, how much of John Calvin's own writings,have you actually read. Do you possess anything whatsoever by him? If all that you know of him would be classed as 'hearsay' then do cease and desist from your unfounded allegations hereafter.Stick to that which you claim to understand, please?. From: Judy Taylor Sure they do, they camp around John Calvin don't they? Why do you think there are so many different doctrines all claiming to be the truth? On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 00:11:04 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: ..do Bible readers 'camp' around theological error in your neck of the woods? On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 00:00:30 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: CPL, Are [Bible] readers whobelieve that JC taught that encouraging the baptism of the HS for the already converted'sums up the Law and Prophets' Christian/s? On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 22:01:39 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: || Matt 7:11 is a scripture that is used to encourage people to seek the Baptism in the Holy Spirit... jt || -- for reference: 7:12So in everything, do [the good]to others
Re: [TruthTalk] CALVIN'S TEACHINGS SAY???? THE BIBLE'S TEACHINGS SAY??? JUDY TAYLOR
Lance you are so opinionated about everything - don't you have an opinion on this point? Calvinism has permeated just about every denomination and at one time controlled Scotland. Do you think your beloved TFT is completely free of it's taint? On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:19:29 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Well Judy, at least one has to commend you for both your consistency and your constancy!! From: Judy Taylor Oophs! I forgot - Calvin's teachings say that when God decrees something you are forced to acknowledge it whether you want to or not leavingno room for deception. So the ones who will nothear are just not part of the "select of the elect" and God did not decree it for them. There does that make you feel better? .. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:43:01 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Only for those with ears to hear what the Holy Spirit is saying - some are more interested in the teachings of "other spirits" On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:36:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: 'THESE GUYS' speak a TRUTH capable of being understood, WITH THE AID OF THE SPIRIT OF GOD, by anyone. From: Dean Moore From: Lance Muir ON STREET PREACHING:I've done it (yes, I actually have) I've seen it by practiced by others. Praise God for SOME of it! What I've gleaned from David Miller, you and, Kevin, IMO, does not fall into that 'SOME' category. The lot of you may have driven as many away from as to the Gospel. Limiting my remarks now to just you and Kevin, I'd have to say that your dialogue with the MC has been, to a large extent, infantile. cd: Then why have we seen converts in SLC and in many other places? And how many have you converted? I ask this so we will know it by the fruit presented?Kevin Has giving much truth on this site and supported the truth with written documentation-what more do you want? Ask yourself this, what if these guys are speaking a higher truth than you understand-what then would all you attacks on us mean for you? To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 08:46 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Banning/Shunning not the same thing - Original Message - From: Lance Muir To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/18/2005 6:48:16 AM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Banning/Shunning not the same thing Judy: David Miller, the list owner, opened participation on TT to such as these. The current moderator (CPL) is a rabid anti-Mormon. Others (Dean/Kevin) have chosen to engage the Mormon contingent in an inflammatory mannner in almost every post. I must say that I no longer believe that the MC (Mormon contingent) is still on TT to 'learn'. I believe there to be no danger of anyone converting to Mormonism through what the MC have said since I've been on TT. I have also come to believe that Dave and Blaine may not understand their own history/beliefs/practices as well as those on TT who are their critics. (I found this to be the case when I did my own research long ago.) Finally, I believe that they should not be granted 'center stage', as it were. IMO, they are NOT prepared to 'engage' on serious/substantive matters. (I thought so for a while but, not now.) cd: You are clinging to the principle that Mormons are here to learn they are not as Dave himself stated-they are here for no other reason then to stand against truth -to twist ,lie and cause divisions among the brethern-This is what their works show.Dave enjoyed this game for well over 5 years-and whether you want to acknowledge the fact or not better Christians have tried to reason with these guys and were merely mocked by the Mormonsby turned their truth(s) into a game. You are also wrong about Perry -Dave was giving many opportunities to correct his behavior by Perry-If he was a "Rabid anti-Mormon" why did
Re: [TruthTalk] Some enjoy theological knots, others feed on God's Word as is!!
I grant my 'thickness' readily, Judy. Please, just
for me, one more time?
- Original Message -
From:
Judy
Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: December 19, 2005 07:24
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Some enjoy
theological knots, others feed on God's Word as is!!
I've been explicitly stating what I believe for the
past 2-3years on this list. Seems you've been paying
more attention to the MC Lance so you've missed
it. judyt
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 07:16:50 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
"Lance and JD are putting themselves in the
place of God in saying that I (Judy) do not understand
Scripture."
Speaking only for myself Judy, I will live with
that which you believe concerning your
understanding/apprehension/interpretation/selection of citations etc.('Live
with' does NOT mean agreement)
ONCE YOU EXPLICITLY STATE WHAT YOU BELIEVE, I
WOULD LIKE TO HEAR FROM THOSE ON TT WHO SUBSCRIBE TO THIS
POSITION.
From: Judy Taylor
So ought you and JD
Lance, how is it what you write always passes the smell test with you and
what I write is always
needing a reprimand ie: "By stating that I do not understand scripture you Lance are
putting yourself in the place of
God and so is JD in your Amen gallery"
judyt
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:37:04 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
IFF I've read you correctly on this then,
you ought to be called on to apologize by the
moderator (if he can drag himself away from the MC) "I don't
believe He is the same god, JD")
I don't believe He is the same god JD because
what you and the others write is very complicated and at
times
incomprehensible and it is alwaysmixture
- which God hates. We will see who is left standing at the last
day. In
the meantime a little less aggression and a
little more humility from youmight help.
From: Judy
Taylor
On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 21:45:28 + [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
absolute nonsense. We are told to
oppose the false teacher, correct? This implies that we can make
judgments as to whether one understands or not. You do
it[judgeother's understandingin regard to
thewritten word] all the time -- all the
time. It is the theme of nearly every single post you have
written since I have been on this forum. You have isolated
yourself to such a degree that your personal theology is not the
majority opinion of any group of disciples. Now, I
know that you don't care -- but such is the
reason for your weirdness when it comes to "biblcial
teaching."It is not wihtin man to direct his
own steps. Your "hermeneutic" is a
testament to the truth of that thought. I have praised
you several times in the past -- but you have not improved
with the passing of time. Just the opposite.
You come across like an abusive mother. Sometimes it gets
tiring. It is truly upsetting to see you so negative and yet, so
attached to the same God I and lance and Bill and Gary and Debbie and
and and serve.
Oh
well, guess the Promise does not mean as
much to you.
It is this constant bit ofjudging
that renders your influence nil.
Bit of judging? I am just reflecting
back to Lance what he has already written to me, so how is it me
that is judging - never him?
They name streets after you JD.
Where has Lance ever judged your faith
in God and Christ, your commitment to scripture,
your claim to salvation , or your practice of the
faith? NOWHERE. You , on the other, make
such sommits a way of life.
To speak as if you know anything at all
about Lance and his attachment to the "promise" is not
just misinformed -- it is a cheap ad hom
.
I don't profess to know the first thing
about Lance JD. However, I do know something about the
Promise of the
Father and this is what the wonderful Lance negates in my
life... so how is it you don't take up for
me??Lance is
actually the one who is doing the judging.
Re: [TruthTalk] CALVIN'S TEACHINGS SAY???? THE BIBLE'S TEACHINGS SAY??? JUDY TAYLOR
Not only is my 'beloved TFT' not free of it's 'taint' Judy but, horror of horrors, he, along with his brother David, edited the New Testament Commentaries. However, I cannot but concur as to the ongoing negative impact of 'Calvinism' (NOT SYNONYMOUS WITH CALVIN'S TEACHING) It'd be a little like alluding to the negative impact of 'Judyism' were someone(s) to do with your teaching what some other(s) have done with his (Calvin's) - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 07:27 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] CALVIN'S TEACHINGS SAY THE BIBLE'S TEACHINGS SAY??? JUDY TAYLOR Lance you are so opinionated about everything - don't you have an opinion on this point? Calvinism has permeated just about every denomination and at one time controlled Scotland. Do you think your beloved TFT is completely free of it's taint? On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:19:29 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Well Judy, at least one has to commend you for both your consistency and your constancy!! From: Judy Taylor Oophs! I forgot - Calvin's teachings say that when God decrees something you are forced to acknowledge it whether you want to or not leavingno room for deception. So the ones who will nothear are just not part of the "select of the elect" and God did not decree it for them. There does that make you feel better? .. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:43:01 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Only for those with ears to hear what the Holy Spirit is saying - some are more interested in the teachings of "other spirits" On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:36:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: 'THESE GUYS' speak a TRUTH capable of being understood, WITH THE AID OF THE SPIRIT OF GOD, by anyone. From: Dean Moore From: Lance Muir ON STREET PREACHING:I've done it (yes, I actually have) I've seen it by practiced by others. Praise God for SOME of it! What I've gleaned from David Miller, you and, Kevin, IMO, does not fall into that 'SOME' category. The lot of you may have driven as many away from as to the Gospel. Limiting my remarks now to just you and Kevin, I'd have to say that your dialogue with the MC has been, to a large extent, infantile. cd: Then why have we seen converts in SLC and in many other places? And how many have you converted? I ask this so we will know it by the fruit presented?Kevin Has giving much truth on this site and supported the truth with written documentation-what more do you want? Ask yourself this, what if these guys are speaking a higher truth than you understand-what then would all you attacks on us mean for you? To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 08:46 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Banning/Shunning not the same thing - Original Message - From: Lance Muir To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: 12/18/2005 6:48:16 AM Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Banning/Shunning not the same thing Judy: David Miller, the list owner, opened participation on TT to such as these. The current moderator (CPL) is a rabid anti-Mormon. Others (Dean/Kevin) have chosen to engage the Mormon contingent in an inflammatory mannner in almost every post. I must say that I no longer believe that the MC (Mormon contingent) is still on TT to 'learn'. I believe there to be no danger of anyone converting to Mormonism through what the MC have said since I've been on TT. I have also come to believe that Dave and Blaine may not understand their own history/beliefs/practices as well as those on TT who are their critics. (I found this to be the case when I did my own research long ago.) Finally, I believe that they should not be granted 'center stage', as it were. IMO, they are NOT prepared to 'engage'
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
Foolish, empty, profitless imaginations, the kind that should be cast down. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:32:20 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Will you kindly interpret 'vain imaginations' for me/us? From: Judy Taylor Unlike some - I don't entertain vain imaginations JD - On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 21:49:25 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yes, he sounds like a wonderful pastor. And I bet that God has much more to do with his life that you could (obviously) imagine. Whose next on your list -- the BSF?? From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] He does JD and if he left almost the whole church would go with him. It is definitely "he" who has it "going on" rather thanthe Lord. You would like him. You could laugh at all his jokes appreciate all the books he has read and cites in his sermons and join his pastorlyfollowing especially since you are pleased to accommodate Calvinism - you'd probably fit right in. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 17:27:22 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Your pastors name? Sounds as though he has it going on ! jd From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend to them while I press on to know the Lord and the power of His resurrection in my daily life. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:12:10 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Were I prone to worry Judy, YOU would not be among those about whom I would. Why? I perceive you to be a completely and utterly genuine believer, who esteems the Scriptures highly and who lives what she believes. Now, when it comes to the hurling of epithets at those servants of God about whom you possess no firsthand knowledge, I'd put you alongside DaveH and Blainer and their knowledge of the TRUE GOSPEL. (Believe it or not, this is a sort of
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
No, I figure God is able to keep us and our son is doing his own homework which is more than many. The missionary girl (just spent 7yrs in Ukraine) that just moved into an Apt with our youngest girl was raised in what they call the Reformed faith and has never questioned it. Many pew sitters want to be spoon fed by someone who is charismatic, entertaining, and has a good personality and if God doesn't show up - Oh well!! They wouldn't know the difference. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:31:30 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Are you, Judy, concerned for your son/yourself in this church, under this pastor? From: Judy Taylor He does JD and if he left almost the whole church would go with him. It is definitely "he" who has it "going on" rather thanthe Lord. You would like him. You could laugh at all his jokes appreciate all the books he has read and cites in his sermons and join his pastorlyfollowing especially since you are pleased to accommodate Calvinism - you'd probably fit right in. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 17:27:22 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Your pastors name? Sounds as though he has it going on ! jd From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend to them while I press on to know the Lord and the power of His resurrection in my daily life. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:12:10 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Were I prone to worry Judy, YOU would not be among those about whom I would. Why? I perceive you to be a completely and utterly genuine believer, who esteems the Scriptures highly and who lives what she believes. Now, when it comes to the hurling of epithets at those servants of God about whom you possess no firsthand knowledge, I'd put you alongside DaveH and Blainer and their knowledge of the TRUE GOSPEL. (Believe it or not, this is a sort of compliment, Judy) From: Judy Taylor I wonder if the Bereans had done any reading of primary source material when they examined what Paul preached. Also the apostle John, I wonder if he had read source materialwhen he exhorted 1st Century
[TruthTalk] JUDY ASSERTS THAT I, LANCE, NEITHER UNDERSTAND NOR BELIEVE 'THEM' Who blasphemes?
'Them'? The Scriptures? I should actually appreciate staying with this important matter until it is abundantly clear. Clear to me, to you, and, to DAVID MILLER and to all others on TT, Judy. DAVID MILLER ACCUSED ME OF BLASPHEMY, as I recall, ON THIS VERY MATTER AND, VIS A VIS JUDY TAYLOR! - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 07:21 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Who gives understanding Barth, TFT, or the Spirit of God? Since you apparently do not eitherunderstand them or believe themLance, why would you want to put everyone into your theological box? If I did not understand them, naturally I would not employ them - but this one is a no brainer. Jesus says: "It is expedient for you that I go away for if I go not away the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart I will send him unto you" (John 16:7) "Howbeit when he the Spirit of truth is come he will guide you into all truth; for he shall not speak of himself but whatsoever he shall hear that shall he speak and he will show you things to come. He shall glorify me; for he shall receive of mine, and shall show it unto you" (John 16:13,14) On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:27:05 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Ever the optimist, Lance once again asks Judy: Do you always and completely UNDERSTAND EMPLOY THEM (those Scriptures you cite) as God and the author means them? From: Judy Taylor On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 16:52:31 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Oh well, guess the Promise does not mean as much to you. It is this constant bit ofjudging that renders your influence nil. Bit of judging? I am just reflecting back to Lance what he has already written to me, so how is it me that is judging - never him? They name streets after you JD. To speak as if you know anything at all about Lance and his attachment to the "promise" is not just misinformed -- it is a cheap ad hom . I don't profess to know the first thing about Lance JD. However, I do know something about the Promise of the Father and this is what the wonderful Lance negates in my life... so how is it you don't take up for me?? Lance is actually the one who is doing the judging. It is not "judging" to say that you do not understand scritpture - although such a statement involves a judgment. It is judging , however, when you put yourself in the place of God and make your determinations.jd By stating that I do not understand scripture Lance is putting himself in the place of God and so are you. From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] I do Lance, this is why I try to stick with scripture -in spite of your belief that all I have isregard for same. Oh well, guess the Promise does not mean as much to you. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 07:07:08 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: With apologies (sort of) in advance to David Miller and Linda Shields, I ask you once again, Judy: Do you believe that you are MORE DISCERNING THAN JOHN CALVIN? IMO, your regard for Scriptures appears to be second to nobody on TT. (regard NOT being the same thing as understanding). However, you do indeed appear to read/study and live it insofar as you are enabled. Scripture is a primary source for you. Amen! for that. Now, other than the blessed internet, how much of John Calvin's own writings,have you actually read. Do you possess anything whatsoever by him? If all that you know of him would be classed as 'hearsay' then do cease and desist from your unfounded allegations hereafter.Stick to that which you claim to understand, please?. From: Judy Taylor Sure they do, they camp around John Calvin don't they? Why do you think there are so many different doctrines all claiming to be the truth? On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 00:11:04 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: ..do Bible readers 'camp' around theological error in your neck of the woods? On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 00:00:30 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
No JD is not correct on this one Lance. James and John were not scholars, neither were the Bereans. John was arrested along with Peter and brought before the High Priest (educated) in Jerusalem because they were acting like Street Preachers . and "Now when they (the educated and learned ones) saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were unlearned and ignorant men, they marvelled; and they took knowledge of them, that they had been with Jesus" (Acts 4:13) This should put it to rest for a reasonable person. You and JD do not understand the ministry of the Holy Spirit Lance. The Scriptures are spiritually rather than mentally appraised and so your question about "infallibility"is irrelevant except for the Vatican and in their economy the Pope is the only one who speaks ex-cathedra. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:30:17 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: JD is correct on this one, Judy. Do you, Judy, believe that in HAVING THE MIND OF CHRIST you are thereby INFALLIBLE IN BOTH YOUR SELECTION, UNDERSTANDING AND INTERPRETATION OF SCRIPTURE. I believe it is possible for you to answer yes/no on this. From: Judy Taylor On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 17:25:51 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes to Dean: Amen Judy ? Get a life. You are one insulting somebody JD. Judy writes as if she knows the reading habits of the Bereans or the Apostle John.Since John is so obviously writing to those who are not of Jewish traditional thought, I would say his reading of others is substantial. Oh? so nowthe unlearned disciples have all of a sudden become scholars according to JD. John and his brother James, sons of Zebedee, fishermen on the sea of Galilee are now Seminary grads and know all about cultural distinctions and all that. I guess Peter had learned all this before giving his address on the day of Pentecost also . Get a grip JD. Paul is admittedly well read. What I do know is this - you and Judy speak of that which you cannot know. Why not? We have the mind of Christ don't we?Or are you, like Lance going to negate every promise to us sincewe do not speak in accord withyour great learning? You attach your interpretation of [even] historical conisiderations to your sense of reality and then, insist it is truth. Ridiculous in many instances. jd It may appear ridiculous to you JD but then God takes pleasure in hiding things from those who think themselves wise and prudent andHe likesrevealing things to babes. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend to them while I press on to know the Lord and the power of His resurrection in my daily life. cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:12:10 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Were I prone to worry Judy, YOU would not be among those about whom I would. Why? I perceive you to be a completely and utterly genuine believer, who esteems the Scriptures highly and who lives what she believes. Now, when it comes to the hurling of epithets at those servants of God about whom you possess no firsthand knowledge, I'd put you alongside DaveH and Blainer and their knowledge of the TRUE GOSPEL. (Believe it or not, this is a sort of compliment, Judy) From: Judy Taylor I wonder if the Bereans
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
How are you using 'charismatic'? IFF the Spirit of God is NOT present in this church Judy, flee immediately! IFF the Spirit of God IS present in this church Judy, then take care concerning those accusationslest you falsely accuse one of God's own. D**n Judy, but you're one c***y lady!! - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 08:10 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles No, I figure God is able to keep us and our son is doing his own homework which is more than many. The missionary girl (just spent 7yrs in Ukraine) that just moved into an Apt with our youngest girl was raised in what they call the Reformed faith and has never questioned it. Many pew sitters want to be spoon fed by someone who is charismatic, entertaining, and has a good personality and if God doesn't show up - Oh well!! They wouldn't know the difference. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:31:30 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Are you, Judy, concerned for your son/yourself in this church, under this pastor? From: Judy Taylor He does JD and if he left almost the whole church would go with him. It is definitely "he" who has it "going on" rather thanthe Lord. You would like him. You could laugh at all his jokes appreciate all the books he has read and cites in his sermons and join his pastorlyfollowing especially since you are pleased to accommodate Calvinism - you'd probably fit right in. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 17:27:22 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Your pastors name? Sounds as though he has it going on ! jd From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend to them while I press on to know the Lord and the power of His resurrection in my daily life. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:12:10 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Were I prone to worry Judy, YOU would not be among those about whom I would. Why? I perceive you to be a completely and utterly genuine believer, who esteems the
Re: [TruthTalk] JUDY ASSERTS THAT I, LANCE, NEITHER UNDERSTAND NOR BELIEVE 'THEM' Who blasphemes?
Yes Lance "them" - (that is unless you receive interpretation through some educated person that you respect). You do not believe that the scriptures I cite below are operative in my life no matter what I say which is in effect blaspheming the Holy Spirit if in fact, I am speaking the truth. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:22:25 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: 'Them'? The Scriptures? I should actually appreciate staying with this important matter until it is abundantly clear. Clear to me, to you, and, to DAVID MILLER and to all others on TT, Judy. DAVID MILLER ACCUSED ME OF BLASPHEMY, as I recall, ON THIS VERY MATTER AND, VIS A VIS JUDY TAYLOR! From: Judy Taylor Since you apparently do not eitherunderstand them or believe themLance, why would you want to put everyone into your theological box? If I did not understand them, naturally I would not employ them - but this one is a no brainer. Jesus says: "It is expedient for you that I go away for if I go not away the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart I will send him unto you" (John 16:7) "Howbeit when he the Spirit of truth is come he will guide you into all truth; for he shall not speak of himself but whatsoever he shall hear that shall he speak and he will show you things to come. He shall glorify me; for he shall receive of mine, and shall show it unto you" (John 16:13,14) On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:27:05 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Ever the optimist, Lance once again asks Judy: Do you always and completely UNDERSTAND EMPLOY THEM (those Scriptures you cite) as God and the author means them? From: Judy Taylor On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 16:52:31 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Oh well, guess the Promise does not mean as much to you. It is this constant bit ofjudging that renders your influence nil. Bit of judging? I am just reflecting back to Lance what he has already written to me, so how is it me that is judging - never him? They name streets after you JD. To speak as if you know anything at all about Lance and his attachment to the "promise" is not just misinformed -- it is a cheap ad hom . I don't profess to know the first thing about Lance JD. However, I do know something about the Promise of the Father and this is what the wonderful Lance negates in my life... so how is it you don't take up for me?? Lance is actually the one who is doing the judging. It is not "judging" to say that you do not understand scritpture - although such a statement involves a judgment. It is judging , however, when you put yourself in the place of God and make your determinations.jd By stating that I do not understand scripture Lance is putting himself in the place of God and so are you. From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] I do Lance, this is why I try to stick with scripture -in spite of your belief that all I have isregard for same. Oh well, guess the Promise does not mean as much to you. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 07:07:08 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: With apologies (sort of) in advance to David Miller and Linda Shields, I ask you once again, Judy: Do you believe that you are MORE DISCERNING THAN JOHN CALVIN? IMO, your regard for Scriptures appears to be second to nobody on TT. (regard NOT being the same thing as understanding). However, you do indeed appear to read/study and live it insofar as you are enabled. Scripture is a primary source for you. Amen! for that. Now, other than the blessed internet, how much of John Calvin's own writings,have you actually read. Do you possess anything whatsoever by him? If all that you know of him would be classed as 'hearsay' then do cease and desist from your unfounded allegations hereafter.Stick to that which you claim to understand, please?. From: Judy Taylor Sure they do, they camp around John Calvin don't they? Why do you think there are so many different doctrines all claiming to be
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
By charismatic I mean charming and he is "educated". I've not met any Reformed ppl who areinto spiritual giftings but we get a lot of ppl from Regent University who drive 45 minutes to come out here which tells me there is a dearth at VA Beach also. This fellow is OK for historical background and a philosophical overview and ppl like the "look" of success so they keep joining the church. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:27:13 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: How are you using 'charismatic'? IFF the Spirit of God is NOT present in this church Judy, flee immediately! IFF the Spirit of God IS present in this church Judy, then take care concerning those accusationslest you falsely accuse one of God's own. D**n Judy, but you're one c***y lady!! From: Judy Taylor No, I figure God is able to keep us and our son is doing his own homework which is more than many. The missionary girl (just spent 7yrs in Ukraine) that just moved into an Apt with our youngest girl was raised in what they call the Reformed faith and has never questioned it. Many pew sitters want to be spoon fed by someone who is charismatic, entertaining, and has a good personality and if God doesn't show up - Oh well!! They wouldn't know the difference. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:31:30 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Are you, Judy, concerned for your son/yourself in this church, under this pastor? From: Judy Taylor He does JD and if he left almost the whole church would go with him. It is definitely "he" who has it "going on" rather thanthe Lord. You would like him. You could laugh at all his jokes appreciate all the books he has read and cites in his sermons and join his pastorlyfollowing especially since you are pleased to accommodate Calvinism - you'd probably fit right in. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 17:27:22 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Your pastors name? Sounds as though he has it going on ! jd From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
They are not his ideas Lance, Do you sell a Westminster Catechism at your Bookstore? You will find them in there if you have time to look up all the scriptures and fine print. This should keep you busy for a while. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:21:31 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Judy:Give me the name of the church you attend. IFO would be please to personally call your pastor. I do not trust you as a conduit of his ideas. From: Judy Taylor Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend to them while I press on to know the Lord and the power of His resurrection in my daily life. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:12:10 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Were I prone to worry Judy, YOU would not be among those about whom I would. Why? I perceive you to be a completely and utterly genuine believer, who esteems the Scriptures highly and who lives what she believes. Now, when it comes to the hurling of epithets at those servants of God about whom you possess no firsthand knowledge, I'd put you alongside DaveH and Blainer and their knowledge of the TRUE GOSPEL. (Believe it or not, this is a sort of compliment, Judy) From: Judy Taylor I wonder if the Bereans had done any reading of primary source material when they examined what Paul preached. Also the apostle John, I wonder if he had read source materialwhen he exhorted 1st Century Christians not to even wish a false teacher "godspeed" for if they did they would be a "partaker of his evil deeds" If I were prone to worry you would worry me Lance. You are more concerned about these men than you are about Jesus Himself and the ministry of the Spirit of Christ. IMO you need to do more primary reading fromthe source of all Truth - then you will more accurately be qualified to discern between good and evil. Your qualifications are not those of Christ. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 08:26:28 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: YOU JUDY are not entitled to call it anything, IMO. You've not done, insofar as I know, any reading of primary source material (2 vol Institutes, Commentaries). It's akin to hearing an atheist condemn the teachings of the Scriptures based upon the same sort of evidentiary inquiry that you've conducted with John Calvin.
Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: The tree
How would one get Democrat or Republican out of what Izzy writes below? Apparently you wear "political eyeglasses" when reading her posts Lance. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:07:54 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Response to Iz:Spoken like a true REPUBLICAN, sadly. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Lots of confusion, huh? Blainerb In a message dated 12/18/2005 10:51:21 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Confusion only comes from questioning God words. We only do that when we prefer the snake’s words. Confusion is the result of attempted compromise. Compromise is simply disobedience wearing grey. Iz PS The snake offers immediate gratification. The result is inevitable degradation. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2005 9:51 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: The tree One other thought: it seems to me that Eve is first confused by outside influences (the snake) and then - out of this confusion -- she commits the sin. I mean, she is created in the image of God and , yet, the temptation is "you will become like God." Can it be said that sin springs from this same confusion? If we all share in the same sin (Ro 5:12), do we not share in the same confusion? And, so what?? jd judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
[TruthTalk] For Dean
I'll pray for your localchurch home pilgrimage also .. thanks for sharing. judyt PS: Where is Kevin?? judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
Funny but, that's kind of how I see 'your ideas'. Instead of the WC, you speak the ideas of J Finis Dake. He obviously kept YOU busy for quite a while. - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 08:38 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles They are not his ideas Lance, Do you sell a Westminster Catechism at your Bookstore? You will find them in there if you have time to look up all the scriptures and fine print. This should keep you busy for a while. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:21:31 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Judy:Give me the name of the church you attend. IFO would be please to personally call your pastor. I do not trust you as a conduit of his ideas. From: Judy Taylor Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend to them while I press on to know the Lord and the power of His resurrection in my daily life. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:12:10 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Were I prone to worry Judy, YOU would not be among those about whom I would. Why? I perceive you to be a completely and utterly genuine believer, who esteems the Scriptures highly and who lives what she believes. Now, when it comes to the hurling of epithets at those servants of God about whom you possess no firsthand knowledge, I'd put you alongside DaveH and Blainer and their knowledge of the TRUE GOSPEL. (Believe it or not, this is a sort of compliment, Judy) From: Judy Taylor I wonder if the Bereans had done any reading of primary source material when they examined what Paul preached. Also the apostle John, I wonder if he had read source materialwhen he exhorted 1st Century Christians not to even wish a false teacher "godspeed" for if they did they would be a "partaker of his evil deeds" If I were prone to worry you would worry me Lance. You are more concerned about these men than you are about Jesus Himself and the ministry of the Spirit of Christ. IMO you need to do more primary reading fromthe source of all Truth - then you will more accurately be qualified to discern
Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: The tree
Nope! - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 08:43 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: The tree How would one get Democrat or Republican out of what Izzy writes below? Apparently you wear "political eyeglasses" when reading her posts Lance. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:07:54 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Response to Iz:Spoken like a true REPUBLICAN, sadly. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Lots of confusion, huh? Blainerb In a message dated 12/18/2005 10:51:21 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Confusion only comes from questioning God words. We only do that when we prefer the snake’s words. Confusion is the result of attempted compromise. Compromise is simply disobedience wearing grey. Iz PS The snake offers immediate gratification. The result is inevitable degradation. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2005 9:51 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: The tree One other thought: it seems to me that Eve is first confused by outside influences (the snake) and then - out of this confusion -- she commits the sin. I mean, she is created in the image of God and , yet, the temptation is "you will become like God." Can it be said that sin springs from this same confusion? If we all share in the same sin (Ro 5:12), do we not share in the same confusion? And, so what?? jd judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
Isn't RU a 'charismatic' U? Maybe those who drive 45 min see what you cannot! - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 08:34 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles By charismatic I mean charming and he is "educated". I've not met any Reformed ppl who areinto spiritual giftings but we get a lot of ppl from Regent University who drive 45 minutes to come out here which tells me there is a dearth at VA Beach also. This fellow is OK for historical background and a philosophical overview and ppl like the "look" of success so they keep joining the church. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:27:13 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: How are you using 'charismatic'? IFF the Spirit of God is NOT present in this church Judy, flee immediately! IFF the Spirit of God IS present in this church Judy, then take care concerning those accusationslest you falsely accuse one of God's own. D**n Judy, but you're one c***y lady!! From: Judy Taylor No, I figure God is able to keep us and our son is doing his own homework which is more than many. The missionary girl (just spent 7yrs in Ukraine) that just moved into an Apt with our youngest girl was raised in what they call the Reformed faith and has never questioned it. Many pew sitters want to be spoon fed by someone who is charismatic, entertaining, and has a good personality and if God doesn't show up - Oh well!! They wouldn't know the difference. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:31:30 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Are you, Judy, concerned for your son/yourself in this church, under this pastor? From: Judy Taylor He does JD and if he left almost the whole church would go with him. It is definitely "he" who has it "going on" rather thanthe Lord. You would like him. You could laugh at all his jokes appreciate all the books he has read and cites in his sermons and join his pastorlyfollowing especially since you are pleased to accommodate Calvinism - you'd probably fit right in. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 17:27:22 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Your pastors name? Sounds as though he has it going on ! jd From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific
Re: [TruthTalk] JUDY ASSERTS THAT I, LANCE, NEITHER UNDERSTAND NOR BELIEVE 'THEM' Who blasphemes?
NO! I very much believe that the Scriptures are
operative in your life. I just believe your interpretations of them to be 'hit
and miss', just like everyone else ('ceptin some are better at it than
you)
- Original Message -
From:
Judy
Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: December 19, 2005 08:27
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] JUDY ASSERTS
THAT I, LANCE, NEITHER UNDERSTAND NOR BELIEVE 'THEM' Who blasphemes?
Yes Lance "them" - (that is unless you receive
interpretation through some educated person that you
respect). You do not believe that the
scriptures I cite below are operative in my life no matter what I say
which
is in effect blaspheming the Holy Spirit if in fact,
I am speaking the truth.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:22:25 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
'Them'? The Scriptures?
I should actually appreciate staying with this
important matter until it is abundantly clear. Clear to me, to you, and, to
DAVID MILLER and to all others on TT, Judy.
DAVID MILLER ACCUSED ME OF BLASPHEMY, as I
recall, ON THIS VERY MATTER AND, VIS A VIS JUDY TAYLOR!
From: Judy Taylor
Since you apparently do not
eitherunderstand them or believe themLance, why would you want
to put
everyone into your theological box?
If I did not understand them, naturally I would
not employ them - but this one is a no
brainer. Jesus says:
"It is expedient for you that I go away for if I
go not away the Comforter will not come unto
you; but if I
depart I will send him unto you" (John
16:7)
"Howbeit when he the Spirit of truth is come he
will guide you into all truth; for he shall not speak of
himself but whatsoever he shall hear that shall
he speak and he will show you things to come. He shall
glorify me; for he shall receive of mine, and
shall show it unto you" (John 16:13,14)
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:27:05 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Ever the optimist, Lance once again asks
Judy: Do you always and completely UNDERSTAND EMPLOY THEM
(those Scriptures you cite) as God and the
author means them?
From: Judy Taylor
On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 16:52:31 + [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Oh well,
guess the Promise does not mean as much to
you.
It is this constant bit ofjudging
that renders your influence nil.
Bit of judging? I am just reflecting back
to Lance what he has already written to me, so how is it me that
is
judging - never him? They name
streets after you JD.
To speak as if you know anything at all
about Lance and his attachment to the "promise" is not just
misinformed -- it is a cheap ad hom
.
I don't profess to know the first thing
about Lance JD. However, I do know something about the Promise
of
the Father and this is
what the wonderful Lance negates in my life... so how is it you
don't take up for me??
Lance is actually the one who is doing the
judging.
It is not "judging" to say that you do not
understand scritpture - although such a statement involves a
judgment. It is judging , however, when you put
yourself in the place of God and make your
determinations.jd
By stating that I do not understand
scripture Lance is putting himself in the place of God and so are
you.
From:
Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I do Lance, this is why I try to stick
with scripture -in spite of your belief that all I have
isregard for same. Oh well,
guess the Promise does not mean as much
to you.
On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 07:07:08 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
With apologies (sort of) in advance
to David Miller and Linda Shields, I ask you once again, Judy:
Do you believe that you are MORE DISCERNING THAN JOHN
CALVIN? IMO, your regard for Scriptures appears to be
second to nobody on TT. (regard NOT being the same thing as
understanding). However, you do indeed appear to read/study and
live it insofar as you are
Re: [TruthTalk] For Dean
Interpretation of PS:Where is Kevin?? Help, Kevin! - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: truthtalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 08:47 Subject: [TruthTalk] For Dean I'll pray for your localchurch home pilgrimage also .. thanks for sharing. judyt PS: Where is Kevin?? judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
Apparently you wear "J Finis Dake" eyeglasses when reading my posts Lance Makes sense. Do you sell his Bible also and check what I write with his notes? If so you are in even worse shape than what I had thought because I don't teach him and seldom refer to his lists these days. Whereas this Pastor teaches Reformed Theology from the Westminster Catechism to more than 700 families and has creedal type readings from same. Please get a life - Lance On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:50:50 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Funny but, that's kind of how I see 'your ideas'. Instead of the WC, you speak the ideas of J Finis Dake. He obviously kept YOU busy for quite a while. From: Judy Taylor They are not his ideas Lance, Do you sell a Westminster Catechism at your Bookstore? You will find them in there if you have time to look up all the scriptures and fine print. This should keep you busy for a while. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:21:31 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Judy:Give me the name of the church you attend. IFO would be please to personally call your pastor. I do not trust you as a conduit of his ideas. From: Judy Taylor Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend to them while I press on to know the Lord and the power of His resurrection in my daily life. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:12:10 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Were I prone to worry Judy, YOU would not be among those about whom I would. Why? I perceive you to be a completely and utterly genuine believer, who esteems the Scriptures highly and who lives what she believes. Now, when it comes to the hurling of epithets at those servants of God about whom you possess no firsthand knowledge, I'd put you alongside DaveH and Blainer and their knowledge of the TRUE GOSPEL. (Believe it or not, this is a sort of compliment, Judy) From: Judy Taylor I wonder if the Bereans had done any reading of primary source material when they examined what Paul preached. Also the apostle John, I wonder if he had read source materialwhen he exhorted 1st Century
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
You keep wanting to card file everyone and everything Lance. Pat Robertson is charismatic - yes but that is not to say that everyone at Regent University believes this way - it is equal opportunity.His Hotel has been sold to a secular company. A lot of things happen because of the ebb and flow of the almighty dollar. My daughter's roomate worked at Regent for a while - calling a list of the big donors to see if they would give more $$ and she was shocked that they asked on the form she filled out if she spoke in tongues which is anathema in Reformed circles. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:52:06 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Isn't RU a 'charismatic' U? Maybe those who drive 45 min see what you cannot! - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 08:34 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles By charismatic I mean charming and he is "educated". I've not met any Reformed ppl who areinto spiritual giftings but we get a lot of ppl from Regent University who drive 45 minutes to come out here which tells me there is a dearth at VA Beach also. This fellow is OK for historical background and a philosophical overview and ppl like the "look" of success so they keep joining the church. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:27:13 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: How are you using 'charismatic'? IFF the Spirit of God is NOT present in this church Judy, flee immediately! IFF the Spirit of God IS present in this church Judy, then take care concerning those accusationslest you falsely accuse one of God's own. D**n Judy, but you're one c***y lady!! From: Judy Taylor No, I figure God is able to keep us and our son is doing his own homework which is more than many. The missionary girl (just spent 7yrs in Ukraine) that just moved into an Apt with our youngest girl was raised in what they call the Reformed faith and has never questioned it. Many pew sitters want to be spoon fed by someone who is charismatic, entertaining, and has a good personality and if God doesn't show up - Oh well!! They wouldn't know the difference. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:31:30 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Are you, Judy, concerned for your son/yourself in this church, under this pastor? From: Judy Taylor He does JD and if he left almost the whole church would go with him. It is definitely "he" who has it "going on" rather thanthe Lord. You would like him. You could laugh at all his jokes appreciate all the books he has read and cites in his sermons and join his pastorlyfollowing especially since you are pleased to accommodate Calvinism - you'd probably fit right in. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 17:27:22 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Your pastors name? Sounds as though he has it going on ! jd From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying
Re: [TruthTalk] JUDY ASSERTS THAT I, LANCE, NEITHER UNDERSTAND NOR BELIEVE 'THEM' Who blasphemes?
You couldn't make this kind of a judgment call unless
you considered yourself to have apprehended
ALL TRUTH which would put you in the position to judge
in your own estimation.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:53:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
NO! I very much believe that the Scriptures are
operative in your life. I just believe your interpretations
of them to be 'hit and miss', just like everyone
else ('ceptin some are better at it than you)
From: Judy Taylor
Yes Lance "them" - (that is unless you receive
interpretation through some educated person that you
respect). You do not believe that the
scriptures I cite below are operative in my life no matter what I say
which
is in effect blaspheming the Holy Spirit if in
fact, I am speaking the truth.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:22:25 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
'Them'? The Scriptures?
I should actually appreciate staying with
this important matter until it is abundantly clear. Clear to me, to you,
and, to DAVID MILLER and to all others on TT, Judy.
DAVID MILLER ACCUSED ME OF BLASPHEMY, as I
recall, ON THIS VERY MATTER AND, VIS A VIS JUDY TAYLOR!
From: Judy
Taylor
Since you apparently do not
eitherunderstand them or believe themLance, why would you
want to put
everyone into your theological box?
If I did not understand them, naturally I would
not employ them - but this one is a no
brainer. Jesus says:
"It is expedient for you that I go away for if
I go not away the Comforter will not come
unto you; but if I
depart I will send him unto you" (John
16:7)
"Howbeit when he the Spirit of truth is come he
will guide you into all truth; for he shall not speak of
himself but whatsoever he shall hear that shall
he speak and he will show you things to come. He shall
glorify me; for he shall receive of mine, and
shall show it unto you" (John 16:13,14)
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:27:05 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Ever the optimist, Lance once again asks
Judy: Do you always and completely UNDERSTAND EMPLOY THEM
(those Scriptures you cite) as God and
the author means them?
From: Judy Taylor
On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 16:52:31 + [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Oh well,
guess the Promise does not mean as much
to you.
It is this constant bit ofjudging
that renders your influence nil.
Bit of judging? I am just reflecting back
to Lance what he has already written to me, so how is it me that
is
judging - never him? They name
streets after you JD.
To speak as if you know anything at all
about Lance and his attachment to the "promise" is not just
misinformed -- it is a cheap ad hom
.
I don't profess to know the first thing
about Lance JD. However, I do know something about the
Promise of
the Father and this
is what the wonderful Lance negates in my life... so how is it you
don't take up for me??
Lance is actually the one who is doing
the judging.
It is not "judging" to say that you do
not understand scritpture - although such a statement
involves a judgment. It is judging , however,
when you put yourself in the place of God and make your
determinations.jd
By stating that I do not understand
scripture Lance is putting himself in the place of God and so are
you.
From:
Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I do Lance, this is why I try to stick
with scripture -in spite of your belief that all I have
isregard for same. Oh well,
guess the Promise does not mean as much
to you.
On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 07:07:08 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
With apologies (sort of) in
advance to David Miller and Linda Shields, I ask you once
again, Judy: Do you believe that you are MORE DISCERNING THAN
JOHN
Re: [TruthTalk] For Dean
Not hardly but I have to say he is an encouragement because healong with the other brothers you eschew are seeking the narrow path that leads to life On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:55:00 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Interpretation of PS:Where is Kevin?? Help, Kevin! - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: truthtalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 08:47 Subject: [TruthTalk] For Dean I'll pray for your localchurch home pilgrimage also .. thanks for sharing. judyt PS: Where is Kevin?? judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] For Dean
A the good old dualistic narrow path! - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 09:08 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] For Dean Not hardly but I have to say he is an encouragement because healong with the other brothers you eschew are seeking the narrow path that leads to life On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:55:00 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Interpretation of PS:Where is Kevin?? Help, Kevin! - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: truthtalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 08:47 Subject: [TruthTalk] For Dean I'll pray for your localchurch home pilgrimage also .. thanks for sharing. judyt PS: Where is Kevin?? judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] JUDY ASSERTS THAT I, LANCE, NEITHER UNDERSTAND NOR BELIEVE 'THEM' Who blasphemes?
Your response here indicates ignorance
Lance
When the Holy Spirit gives understanding there is no
interpretation involved
One either understands or they don't .. just like a
foreign language
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:53:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
NO! I very much believe that
the Scriptures are operative in your life. I just believe your interpretations
of them to be 'hit and miss',
just like everyone else ('ceptin some are better at it than
you)
From: Judy Taylor
Yes Lance "them" - (that is unless you receive
interpretation through some educated person that you
respect). You do not believe that the
scriptures I cite below are operative in my life no matter what I say
which
is in effect blaspheming the Holy Spirit if in
fact, I am speaking the truth.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:22:25 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
'Them'? The Scriptures?
I should actually appreciate staying with
this important matter until it is abundantly clear. Clear to me, to you,
and, to DAVID MILLER and to all others on TT, Judy.
DAVID MILLER ACCUSED ME OF BLASPHEMY, as I
recall, ON THIS VERY MATTER AND, VIS A VIS JUDY TAYLOR!
From: Judy
Taylor
Since you apparently do not
eitherunderstand them or believe themLance, why would you
want to put
everyone into your theological box?
If I did not understand them, naturally I would
not employ them - but this one is a no
brainer. Jesus says:
"It is expedient for you that I go away for if
I go not away the Comforter will not come
unto you; but if I
depart I will send him unto you" (John
16:7)
"Howbeit when he the Spirit of truth is come he
will guide you into all truth; for he shall not speak of
himself but whatsoever he shall hear that shall
he speak and he will show you things to come. He shall
glorify me; for he shall receive of mine, and
shall show it unto you" (John 16:13,14)
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:27:05 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Ever the optimist, Lance once again asks
Judy: Do you always and completely UNDERSTAND EMPLOY THEM
(those Scriptures you cite) as God and
the author means them?
From: Judy Taylor
On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 16:52:31 + [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Oh well,
guess the Promise does not mean as much
to you.
It is this constant bit ofjudging
that renders your influence nil.
Bit of judging? I am just reflecting back
to Lance what he has already written to me, so how is it me that
is
judging - never him? They name
streets after you JD.
To speak as if you know anything at all
about Lance and his attachment to the "promise" is not just
misinformed -- it is a cheap ad hom
.
I don't profess to know the first thing
about Lance JD. However, I do know something about the
Promise of
the Father and this
is what the wonderful Lance negates in my life... so how is it you
don't take up for me??
Lance is actually the one who is doing
the judging.
It is not "judging" to say that you do
not understand scritpture - although such a statement
involves a judgment. It is judging , however,
when you put yourself in the place of God and make your
determinations.jd
By stating that I do not understand
scripture Lance is putting himself in the place of God and so are
you.
From:
Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I do Lance, this is why I try to stick
with scripture -in spite of your belief that all I have
isregard for same. Oh well,
guess the Promise does not mean as much
to you.
On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 07:07:08 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
With apologies (sort of) in
advance to David Miller and Linda Shields, I ask you once
again, Judy: Do you believe that you are MORE DISCERNING THAN
[TruthTalk] Seldom is not never, Judy re:J. Finis Dake
PS: I do have a life. PPS: I don't carry the WC. I'm not that big on it. Apparently those who wish to hear from it can attend your church (you do CHOOSE to go there do you not?) - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 08:57 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles Apparently you wear "J Finis Dake" eyeglasses when reading my posts Lance Makes sense. Do you sell his Bible also and check what I write with his notes? If so you are in even worse shape than what I had thought because I don't teach him and seldom refer to his lists these days. Whereas this Pastor teaches Reformed Theology from the Westminster Catechism to more than 700 families and has creedal type readings from same. Please get a life - Lance On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:50:50 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Funny but, that's kind of how I see 'your ideas'. Instead of the WC, you speak the ideas of J Finis Dake. He obviously kept YOU busy for quite a while. From: Judy Taylor They are not his ideas Lance, Do you sell a Westminster Catechism at your Bookstore? You will find them in there if you have time to look up all the scriptures and fine print. This should keep you busy for a while. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:21:31 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Judy:Give me the name of the church you attend. IFO would be please to personally call your pastor. I do not trust you as a conduit of his ideas. From: Judy Taylor Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend to them while I press on to know the Lord and the power of His resurrection in my daily life. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:12:10 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Were I prone to worry Judy, YOU would not be among those about whom I would. Why? I perceive you to be a completely and utterly genuine believer, who esteems the Scriptures highly and who lives what she believes. Now, when it comes to the
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
NOT, I repeat NOT, amongst some of the 'reformed believers' who regularly shop in this store. Like I've said concerning you on occasion, y'all otta get out more. - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 09:02 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles You keep wanting to card file everyone and everything Lance. Pat Robertson is charismatic - yes but that is not to say that everyone at Regent University believes this way - it is equal opportunity.His Hotel has been sold to a secular company. A lot of things happen because of the ebb and flow of the almighty dollar. My daughter's roomate worked at Regent for a while - calling a list of the big donors to see if they would give more $$ and she was shocked that they asked on the form she filled out if she spoke in tongues which is anathema in Reformed circles. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:52:06 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Isn't RU a 'charismatic' U? Maybe those who drive 45 min see what you cannot! - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 08:34 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles By charismatic I mean charming and he is "educated". I've not met any Reformed ppl who areinto spiritual giftings but we get a lot of ppl from Regent University who drive 45 minutes to come out here which tells me there is a dearth at VA Beach also. This fellow is OK for historical background and a philosophical overview and ppl like the "look" of success so they keep joining the church. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:27:13 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: How are you using 'charismatic'? IFF the Spirit of God is NOT present in this church Judy, flee immediately! IFF the Spirit of God IS present in this church Judy, then take care concerning those accusationslest you falsely accuse one of God's own. D**n Judy, but you're one c***y lady!! From: Judy Taylor No, I figure God is able to keep us and our son is doing his own homework which is more than many. The missionary girl (just spent 7yrs in Ukraine) that just moved into an Apt with our youngest girl was raised in what they call the Reformed faith and has never questioned it. Many pew sitters want to be spoon fed by someone who is charismatic, entertaining, and has a good personality and if God doesn't show up - Oh well!! They wouldn't know the difference. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:31:30 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Are you, Judy, concerned for your son/yourself in this church, under this pastor? From: Judy Taylor He does JD and if he left almost the whole church would go with him. It is definitely "he" who has it "going on" rather thanthe Lord. You would like him. You could laugh at all his jokes appreciate all the books he has read and cites in his sermons and join his pastorlyfollowing especially since you are pleased to accommodate Calvinism - you'd probably fit right in. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 17:27:22 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Your pastors name? Sounds as though he has it going on ! jd From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the
[TruthTalk] And Gary, and John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
Shall we accuse them ALL of blasphemy? C'mon let's
do it! Surely it's not a serious charge is it, Judy?
From:
Judy
Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: December 19, 2005 09:06
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] JUDY ASSERTS
THAT I, LANCE, NEITHER UNDERSTAND NOR BELIEVE 'THEM' Who blasphemes?
You couldn't make this kind of a judgment call unless
you considered yourself to have apprehended
ALL TRUTH which would put you in the position to
judge in your own estimation.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:53:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
NO! I very much believe that the Scriptures are
operative in your life. I just believe your interpretations
of them to be 'hit and miss', just like
everyone else ('ceptin some are better at it than you)
From: Judy Taylor
Yes Lance "them" - (that is unless you receive
interpretation through some educated person that you
respect). You do not believe that the
scriptures I cite below are operative in my life no matter what I say
which
is in effect blaspheming the Holy Spirit if in
fact, I am speaking the truth.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:22:25 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
'Them'? The Scriptures?
I should actually appreciate staying with
this important matter until it is abundantly clear. Clear to me, to you,
and, to DAVID MILLER and to all others on TT, Judy.
DAVID MILLER ACCUSED ME OF BLASPHEMY, as I
recall, ON THIS VERY MATTER AND, VIS A VIS JUDY TAYLOR!
From: Judy
Taylor
Since you apparently do not
eitherunderstand them or believe themLance, why would you
want to put
everyone into your theological box?
If I did not understand them, naturally I
would not employ them - but this one is a
no brainer. Jesus says:
"It is expedient for you that I go away for
if I go not away the Comforter will not
come unto you; but if I
depart I will send him unto you" (John
16:7)
"Howbeit when he the Spirit of truth is come
he will guide you into all truth; for he shall not speak
of
himself but whatsoever he shall hear that
shall he speak and he will show you things to come. He shall
glorify me; for he shall receive of mine, and
shall show it unto you" (John 16:13,14)
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:27:05 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Ever the optimist, Lance once again
asks Judy: Do you always and completely UNDERSTAND EMPLOY THEM
(those Scriptures you cite) as God and
the author means them?
From: Judy Taylor
On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 16:52:31 + [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Oh well,
guess the Promise does not mean as much
to you.
It is this constant bit ofjudging
that renders your influence nil.
Bit of judging? I am just reflecting
back to Lance what he has already written to me, so how is it me
that is
judging - never him? They name
streets after you JD.
To speak as if you know anything at all
about Lance and his attachment to the "promise" is not
just misinformed -- it is a cheap ad hom
.
I don't profess to know the first thing
about Lance JD. However, I do know something about the
Promise of
the Father and this
is what the wonderful Lance negates in my life... so how is it
you don't take up for me??
Lance is actually the one who is doing
the judging.
It is not "judging" to say that you do
not understand scritpture - although such a statement
involves a judgment. It is judging , however,
when you put yourself in the place of God and make your
determinations.jd
By stating that I do not understand
scripture Lance is putting himself in the place of God and so
are you.
From:
Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [TruthTalk] Seldom is not never, Judy re:J. Finis Dake
Yes, I understand, you exhibit a very active intellectual life - lots of opinions. Then why so judgmental as to whether or not I know what I am hearing? I'm sure there are plenty of Reformed ppl in Canada Yes, I attend because it is where my family chooses to go On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:09:29 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: PS: I do have a life. PPS: I don't carry the WC. I'm not that big on it. Apparently those who wish to hear from it can attend your church (you do CHOOSE to go there do you not?) From: Judy Taylor Apparently you wear "J Finis Dake" eyeglasses when reading my posts Lance Makes sense. Do you sell his Bible also and check what I write with his notes? If so you are in even worse shape than what I had thought because I don't teach him and seldom refer to his lists these days. Whereas this Pastor teaches Reformed Theology from the Westminster Catechism to more than 700 families and has creedal type readings from same. Please get a life - Lance On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:50:50 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Funny but, that's kind of how I see 'your ideas'. Instead of the WC, you speak the ideas of J Finis Dake. He obviously kept YOU busy for quite a while. From: Judy Taylor They are not his ideas Lance, Do you sell a Westminster Catechism at your Bookstore? You will find them in there if you have time to look up all the scriptures and fine print. This should keep you busy for a while. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:21:31 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Judy:Give me the name of the church you attend. IFO would be please to personally call your pastor. I do not trust you as a conduit of his ideas. From: Judy Taylor Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching usthat the sin of "unbelief" had been taken care of at the cross. So I guess that makes the whole of Romans 11 null and void and no branches have to be concerned about beingcut off and burned. The elect have it made in the shade but noone seems to be able to know for sure who they are. It's confusion at best and an antiChrist spirit at worst. Don't know whether or not I can stay the course. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:47:58 -0500 "Dean Moore" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cd: Amen Judy for their fruits are enough-Studying their teaching apart from their works is the reason those -who support Calvin-on this site are confused. We see their work so we have no need for their teachings.We don't have to study the Satanic Bible to know our enemy for truth sheds a bright light onhim already. The Bible teaches to look at their fruits and their works is what God Judges every man by-so we can also use God tool to know them. From: Judy Taylor I have yet to hurl anepithet anywhere Lance. My objectionto Calvinism is for some very specific reasons with or without "firsthand knowledge or intricate and specific detail" about Calvin the man.His teachings are enough. I will leave the man to God. I have no desire to be an expert on John Calvin the man or any other anti-Christ (meaning in place of) figure for that matter and this would include Athanasius, Augustine, Aquinas, et al. along to the present Papacy both rc and protestant. I am happy to leave you to tend to them while I press on to know the Lord and the power of His resurrection in my daily life. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 09:12:10 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL
Re: [TruthTalk] JUDY ASSERTS THAT I, LANCE, NEITHER UNDERSTAND NOR BELIEVE 'THEM' Who blasphemes?
Would your approach to Scripture be just like those
who 'heard in their own language' in Acts 2.? Seriously Judy, if this is the
case then I'm gonna shut my mouth and, listen to nobody but you..oh and David
'cause I think he also believes sumpin like this.
- Original Message -
From:
Judy
Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: December 19, 2005 09:13
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] JUDY ASSERTS
THAT I, LANCE, NEITHER UNDERSTAND NOR BELIEVE 'THEM' Who blasphemes?
Your response here indicates ignorance
Lance
When the Holy Spirit gives understanding there is no
interpretation involved
One either understands or they don't .. just like a
foreign language
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:53:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
NO! I very much believe
that the Scriptures are operative in your life. I just believe your
interpretations
of them to be 'hit and
miss', just like everyone else ('ceptin some are better at it than
you)
From: Judy Taylor
Yes Lance "them" - (that is unless you receive
interpretation through some educated person that you
respect). You do not believe that the
scriptures I cite below are operative in my life no matter what I say
which
is in effect blaspheming the Holy Spirit if in
fact, I am speaking the truth.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:22:25 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
'Them'? The Scriptures?
I should actually appreciate staying with
this important matter until it is abundantly clear. Clear to me, to you,
and, to DAVID MILLER and to all others on TT, Judy.
DAVID MILLER ACCUSED ME OF BLASPHEMY, as I
recall, ON THIS VERY MATTER AND, VIS A VIS JUDY TAYLOR!
From: Judy
Taylor
Since you apparently do not
eitherunderstand them or believe themLance, why would you
want to put
everyone into your theological box?
If I did not understand them, naturally I
would not employ them - but this one is a
no brainer. Jesus says:
"It is expedient for you that I go away for
if I go not away the Comforter will not
come unto you; but if I
depart I will send him unto you" (John
16:7)
"Howbeit when he the Spirit of truth is come
he will guide you into all truth; for he shall not speak
of
himself but whatsoever he shall hear that
shall he speak and he will show you things to come. He shall
glorify me; for he shall receive of mine, and
shall show it unto you" (John 16:13,14)
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:27:05 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Ever the optimist, Lance once again
asks Judy: Do you always and completely UNDERSTAND EMPLOY THEM
(those Scriptures you cite) as God and
the author means them?
From: Judy Taylor
On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 16:52:31 + [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Oh well,
guess the Promise does not mean as much
to you.
It is this constant bit ofjudging
that renders your influence nil.
Bit of judging? I am just reflecting
back to Lance what he has already written to me, so how is it me
that is
judging - never him? They name
streets after you JD.
To speak as if you know anything at all
about Lance and his attachment to the "promise" is not
just misinformed -- it is a cheap ad hom
.
I don't profess to know the first thing
about Lance JD. However, I do know something about the
Promise of
the Father and this
is what the wonderful Lance negates in my life... so how is it
you don't take up for me??
Lance is actually the one who is doing
the judging.
It is not "judging" to say that you do
not understand scritpture - although such a statement
involves a judgment. It is judging , however,
when you put yourself in the place of God and make your
determinations.jd
By stating that I do not understand
Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
You just love the groupfest thing don't you
Lance?.
You talk yourself into a corner and then want everyone
who has ever disagreed with anything
I have ever said on this list to join you. How
very sad!!! I say the Spirit of God gives
me
understanding as per John 16:3,14 and you say He does
not because it differs from what you
think. One of us is blaspheming the Holy
Spirit. But let's leave the others out of it.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:14:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Shall we accuse them ALL of blasphemy? C'mon let's do it!
Surely it's not a serious charge is it, Judy?
From: Judy Taylor
You couldn't make
this kind of a judgment call unless you considered yourself to have
apprehended
ALL TRUTH which would put you in the position to
judge in your own estimation.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:53:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
NO! I very much believe that the Scriptures are
operative in your life. I just believe your interpretations
of them to be 'hit and miss', just like everyone else
('ceptin some are better at it than you)
From: Judy
Taylor
Yes Lance "them" - (that is unless you receive
interpretation through some educated person that you
respect). You do not believe that the
scriptures I cite below are operative in my life no matter what I say
which is in effect blaspheming the Holy
Spirit if in fact, I am speaking the truth.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:22:25 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
'Them'? The Scriptures?
I should actually appreciate staying with this
important matter until it is abundantly clear. Clear to me, to you,
and, to DAVID MILLER and to all others on TT, Judy.
DAVID MILLER ACCUSED ME OF BLASPHEMY, as I recall,
ON THIS VERY MATTER AND, VIS A VIS JUDY TAYLOR!
From: Judy
Taylor
Since you apparently do not
eitherunderstand them or believe themLance, why would
you want to put
everyone into your theological box?
If I did not understand them, naturally I
would not employ them - but this one is a
no brainer. Jesus says:
"It is expedient for you that I go away for
if I go not away the Comforter will not
come unto you; but if I
depart I will send him unto you" (John
16:7)
"Howbeit when he the Spirit of truth is
come he will guide you into all truth; for he shall not speak
of
himself but whatsoever he shall hear that
shall he speak and he will show you things to come. He shall
glorify me; for he shall receive of mine,
and shall show it unto you" (John 16:13,14)
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:27:05 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Ever the optimist, Lance once again asks Judy:
Do you always and completely UNDERSTAND EMPLOY THEM
(those Scriptures you cite) as God and the
author means them?
From: Judy Taylor
On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 16:52:31 + [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Oh well,
guess the Promise does not mean as
much to you.
It is this constant bit
ofjudging that renders your influence nil.
Bit of judging? I am just reflecting
back to Lance what he has already written to me, so how is it
me that is
judging - never him? They name
streets after you JD.
To speak as if you know anything at
all about Lance and his attachment to the "promise" is
not just misinformed -- it is a cheap ad hom
.
I don't profess to know the first
thing about Lance JD. However, I do know something about
the Promise of
the Father and
this is what the wonderful Lance negates in my life... so how
is it you don't take up for me??
Lance is actually the one who is
doing the judging.
It is not "judging" to say that you
do not
Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles
There is some weird charismania out there also that borders on the occult which is why a lot of the 'once Spirit led' groups in this area are not as they once were... SoI will neither accept or reject your claim. I personally believe there is a real but most of what we have been subject to is the false. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:18:02 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: NOT, I repeat NOT, amongst some of the 'reformed believers' who regularly shop in this store. Like I've said concerning you on occasion, y'all otta get out more. From: Judy Taylor You keep wanting to card file everyone and everything Lance. Pat Robertson is charismatic - yes but that is not to say that everyone at Regent University believes this way - it is equal opportunity. His Hotel has been sold to a secular company. A lot of things happen because of the ebb and flow of the almighty dollar. My daughter's roomate worked at Regent for a while - calling a list of the big donors to see if they would give more $$ and she was shocked that they asked on the form she filled out if she spoke in tongues which is anathema in Reformed circles. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:52:06 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Isn't RU a 'charismatic' U? Maybe those who drive 45 min see what you cannot! From: Judy Taylor By charismatic I mean charming and he is "educated". I've not met any Reformed ppl who areinto spiritual giftings but we get a lot of ppl from Regent University who drive 45 minutes to come out here which tells me there is a dearth at VA Beach also. This fellow is OK for historical background and a philosophical overview and ppl like the "look" of success so they keep joining the church. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:27:13 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: How are you using 'charismatic'? IFF the Spirit of God is NOT present in this church Judy, flee immediately! IFF the Spirit of God IS present in this church Judy, then take care concerning those accusationslest you falsely accuse one of God's own. D**n Judy, but you're one c***y lady!! From: Judy Taylor No, I figure God is able to keep us and our son is doing his own homework which is more than many. The missionary girl (just spent 7yrs in Ukraine) that just moved into an Apt with our youngest girl was raised in what they call the Reformed faith and has never questioned it. Many pew sitters want to be spoon fed by someone who is charismatic, entertaining, and has a good personality and if God doesn't show up - Oh well!! They wouldn't know the difference. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:31:30 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Are you, Judy, concerned for your son/yourself in this church, under this pastor? From: Judy Taylor He does JD and if he left almost the whole church would go with him. It is definitely "he" who has it "going on" rather thanthe Lord. You would like him. You could laugh at all his jokes appreciate all the books he has read and cites in his sermons and join his pastorlyfollowing especially since you are pleased to accommodate Calvinism - you'd probably fit right in. On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 17:27:22 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Your pastors name? Sounds as though he has it going on ! jd From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Dean: Thanks for your response and please pray for me. I am in a Reformed Church right now ONLY to encourage our son and DIL who want to raise our grandson in Church but the more I learn about it the worse it becomes. Our Pastor is smart, charismatic, and has been to three different Bible schools and in four different denoms. He has a Phd andTHIS is what he has chosen? It boggles the mind. Last week he was teaching
Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
I've been just as clear as you've been on this.
Including others is not a 'groupfest thingy', Judy. Have you truly failed to
take note of anyone's recent disagreement with you over your scriptural
interpretation? I've most certainly NOT failed to note them!
Here is a very serious suggestion! Let's have David
and Perry prounce on this issue. Let's say that if anything warrants being
thrown off the list, it'd be blasphemy. Agreed? Given their and your
understanding we could, it'd appear, think this list out considerably.
Thereafter, only those of you who saw things your way on this issue would
remain.
So, let's go ahead with this, shall
we?
- Original Message -
From:
Judy
Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: December 19, 2005 09:25
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and
John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
You just love the groupfest thing don't you
Lance?.
You talk yourself into a corner and then want
everyone who has ever disagreed with anything
I have ever said on this list to join you. How
very sad!!! I say the Spirit of God gives
me
understanding as per John 16:3,14 and you say He does
not because it differs from what you
think. One of us is blaspheming the Holy
Spirit. But let's leave the others out of it.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:14:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Shall we accuse them ALL of blasphemy? C'mon let's do it!
Surely it's not a serious charge is it, Judy?
From: Judy Taylor
You couldn't make
this kind of a judgment call unless you considered yourself to have
apprehended
ALL TRUTH which would put you in the position to
judge in your own estimation.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:53:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
NO! I very much believe that the Scriptures are
operative in your life. I just believe your interpretations
of them to be 'hit and miss', just like everyone else
('ceptin some are better at it than you)
From: Judy
Taylor
Yes Lance "them" - (that is unless you
receive interpretation through some educated person that
you
respect). You do not believe that the
scriptures I cite below are operative in my life no matter what I say
which is in effect blaspheming the Holy
Spirit if in fact, I am speaking the truth.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:22:25 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
'Them'? The Scriptures?
I should actually appreciate staying with this
important matter until it is abundantly clear. Clear to me, to you,
and, to DAVID MILLER and to all others on TT, Judy.
DAVID MILLER ACCUSED ME OF BLASPHEMY, as I recall,
ON THIS VERY MATTER AND, VIS A VIS JUDY TAYLOR!
From: Judy Taylor
Since you apparently do not
eitherunderstand them or believe themLance, why would
you want to put
everyone into your theological box?
If I did not understand them, naturally I
would not employ them - but this one is
a no brainer. Jesus says:
"It is expedient for you that I go away
for if I go not away the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I
depart I will send him unto you" (John
16:7)
"Howbeit when he the Spirit of truth is
come he will guide you into all truth; for he shall not speak
of
himself but whatsoever he shall hear that
shall he speak and he will show you things to come. He shall
glorify me; for he shall receive of mine,
and shall show it unto you" (John 16:13,14)
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:27:05 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Ever the optimist, Lance once again asks Judy:
Do you always and completely UNDERSTAND EMPLOY THEM
(those Scriptures you cite) as God and the
author means them?
From: Judy Taylor
On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 16:52:31 + [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Oh well,
guess the Promise does not mean as
much to you.
It is this constant bit
[TruthTalk] Blasphemy?
I've sent the post to David and to Perry, Judy. I await their responses. Lance
Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:38:35 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
I've been just as clear as you've been on this. Including
others is not a 'groupfest thingy', Judy. Have you truly failed to take note
of anyone's recent disagreement with you over your scriptural interpretation?
I've most certainly NOT failed to note them!
Who are the "others"? Gary John and Bill?
Your theological trio?
Here is a very serious suggestion! Let's have David and
Perry prounce on this issue.
Let's say that if anything warrants being thrown off the
list, it'd be blasphemy. Agreed? Given their and your understanding we could,
it'd appear, think this list out considerably. Thereafter,
only those of you who saw things your way on this issue would remain.
So,
let's go ahead with this, shall we?
No, something like this would automatically eliminate
the MC and DavidM has reasons for wanting them
here; alsoJesus Himself said to let the wheat
and tares grow together. The angels will do the separating
soon enough and in that day the judgment will be
perfect.
From: Judy Taylor
You just love the groupfest thing don't you
Lance?.
You talk yourself into a corner and then want
everyone who has ever disagreed with anything
I have ever said on this list to join you.
How very sad!!! I say the Spirit of God
gives me
understanding as per John 16:3,14 and you say He
does not because it differs from what you
think. One of us is blaspheming the Holy
Spirit. But let's leave the others out of it.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:14:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Shall we accuse them ALL of blasphemy? C'mon let's do
it! Surely it's not a serious charge is it, Judy?
From: Judy Taylor
You couldn't
make this kind of a judgment call unless you considered yourself to have
apprehended
ALL TRUTH which would put you in the position
to judge in your own estimation.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:53:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
NO! I very much believe that the Scriptures are
operative in your life. I just believe your
interpretations
of them to be 'hit and miss', just like everyone
else ('ceptin some are better at it than you)
From: Judy
Taylor
Yes Lance "them" - (that is unless you
receive interpretation through some educated person that
you
respect). You do not believe that the
scriptures I cite below are operative in my life no matter what I
say which is in effect blaspheming the
Holy Spirit if in fact, I am speaking the truth.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:22:25 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
'Them'? The Scriptures?
I should actually appreciate staying with this
important matter until it is abundantly clear. Clear to me, to
you, and, to DAVID MILLER and to all others on TT,
Judy.
DAVID MILLER ACCUSED ME OF BLASPHEMY, as I
recall, ON THIS VERY MATTER AND, VIS A VIS JUDY
TAYLOR!
From: Judy Taylor
Since you apparently do not
eitherunderstand them or believe themLance, why
would you want to put
everyone into your theological
box?
If I did not understand them, naturally
I would not employ them - but this one is a no brainer. Jesus says:
"It is expedient for you that I go away
for if I go not away the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I
depart I will send him unto you" (John
16:7)
"Howbeit when he the Spirit of truth is
come he will guide you into all truth; for he shall not speak
of
himself but whatsoever he shall hear
that shall he speak and he will show you things to come. He
shall
glorify me; for he shall receive of
mine, and shall show it unto you" (John 16:13,14)
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 06:27:05 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Ever the optimist, Lance once again asks
Judy: Do you always and completely UNDERSTAND EMPLOY
THEM
(those Scriptures you cite) as God and the
Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
You and David have accused ME of blasphemy. By
extension you've similarly accused the 'trio' as you call them.Kicked off
or not, I should like for this to go ahead. 'Blaspheming' is serious business,
Judy.
- Original Message -
From:
Judy
Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: December 19, 2005 09:51
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and
John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:38:35 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
I've been just as clear as you've been on this. Including
others is not a 'groupfest thingy', Judy. Have you truly failed to take note
of anyone's recent disagreement with you over your scriptural
interpretation? I've most certainly NOT failed to note them!
Who are the "others"? Gary John and
Bill? Your theological trio?
Here is a very serious suggestion! Let's have David and
Perry prounce on this issue.
Let's say that if anything warrants being thrown off the
list, it'd be blasphemy. Agreed? Given their and your understanding we
could,
it'd appear, think this list out considerably. Thereafter,
only those of you who saw things your way on this issue would remain.
So,
let's go ahead with this, shall we?
No, something like this would automatically
eliminate the MC and DavidM has reasons for wanting them
here; alsoJesus Himself said to let the wheat
and tares grow together. The angels will do the
separating
soon enough and in that day the judgment will be
perfect.
From: Judy Taylor
You just love the groupfest thing don't you
Lance?.
You talk yourself into a corner and then want
everyone who has ever disagreed with anything
I have ever said on this list to join you.
How very sad!!! I say the Spirit of God
gives me
understanding as per John 16:3,14 and you say He
does not because it differs from what you
think. One of us is blaspheming the Holy
Spirit. But let's leave the others out of it.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:14:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Shall we accuse them ALL of blasphemy? C'mon let's do
it! Surely it's not a serious charge is it, Judy?
From: Judy Taylor
You couldn't
make this kind of a judgment call unless you considered yourself to
have apprehended
ALL TRUTH which would put you in the position
to judge in your own estimation.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:53:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
NO! I very much believe that the Scriptures are
operative in your life. I just believe your
interpretations
of them to be 'hit and miss', just like everyone
else ('ceptin some are better at it than you)
From: Judy Taylor
Yes Lance "them" - (that is unless you
receive interpretation through some educated person that
you
respect). You do not believe that
the scriptures I cite below are operative in my life no matter
what I say which is in effect
blaspheming the Holy Spirit if in fact, I am speaking the
truth.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:22:25 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
'Them'? The Scriptures?
I should actually appreciate staying with this
important matter until it is abundantly clear. Clear to me, to
you, and, to DAVID MILLER and to all others on TT,
Judy.
DAVID MILLER ACCUSED ME OF BLASPHEMY, as I
recall, ON THIS VERY MATTER AND, VIS A VIS JUDY
TAYLOR!
From: Judy Taylor
Since you apparently do not
eitherunderstand them or believe themLance, why
would you want to put
everyone into your theological
box?
If I did not understand them,
naturally I would not employ them - but this one is a no brainer. Jesus says:
"It is expedient for you that I go
away for if I go not away the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I
depart I will send him unto you"
(John 16:7)
"Howbeit when he the Spirit of truth
is come he will guide
[TruthTalk] Question for Lance
Your response to the narrow path and the strait gate is as follows - why? Where does the dualism come from? A the good old dualistic narrow path! judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
I know - and for this reason you
should stop doing it Lance.
I don't know about this "by extension" thing; let the
others fight their own battles ...
Gary's writings are incomprehensible so I wouldn't know
what he is saying most of the time
JD's are also so much mixture it has become
impossibleto weed through
And Bill is so into himself and his own theology that
if one does not agree he takes his ball
and goes home... or becomes
totally incommunicado.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 10:00:47 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
You and David have accused ME of blasphemy. By
extension you've similarly accused the 'trio' as you call them.Kicked
off or not, I should like for this to go ahead. 'Blaspheming' is serious
business, Judy.
From: Judy Taylor
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:38:35 -0500 "Lance
Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
I've been just as clear as you've been on this.
Including others is not a 'groupfest thingy', Judy. Have you truly failed
to take note of anyone's recent disagreement with you over your scriptural
interpretation? I've most certainly NOT failed to note them!
Who are the "others"? Gary John and
Bill? Your theological trio?
Here is a very serious suggestion! Let's have David and
Perry prounce on this issue.
Let's say that if anything warrants being thrown off the
list, it'd be blasphemy. Agreed? Given their and your understanding we
could,
it'd appear, think this list out considerably.
Thereafter, only those of you who saw things your way on this issue would
remain. So,
let's go ahead with this, shall we?
No, something like this would automatically
eliminate the MC and DavidM has reasons for wanting them
here; alsoJesus Himself said to let the
wheat and tares grow together. The angels will do the
separating
soon enough and in that day the judgment will be
perfect.
From: Judy
Taylor
You just love the groupfest thing don't you
Lance?.
You talk yourself into a corner and then want
everyone who has ever disagreed with anything
I have ever said on this list to join
you. How very sad!!! I say the
Spirit of God gives me
understanding as per John 16:3,14 and you say
He does not because it differs from what you
think. One of us is blaspheming the Holy
Spirit. But let's leave the others out of it.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:14:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Shall we accuse them ALL of blasphemy? C'mon let's
do it! Surely it's not a serious charge is it, Judy?
From: Judy Taylor
You
couldn't make this kind of a judgment call unless you considered
yourself to have apprehended
ALL TRUTH which would put you in the
position to judge in your own estimation.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:53:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
NO! I very much believe that the Scriptures are
operative in your life. I just believe your
interpretations
of them to be 'hit and miss', just like everyone
else ('ceptin some are better at it than you)
From: Judy Taylor
Yes Lance "them" - (that is unless you
receive interpretation through some educated person that
you
respect). You do not believe that
the scriptures I cite below are operative in my life no matter
what I say which is in effect
blaspheming the Holy Spirit if in fact, I am speaking the
truth.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:22:25 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
'Them'? The Scriptures?
I should actually appreciate staying with
this important matter until it is abundantly clear. Clear to
me, to you, and, to DAVID MILLER and to all others on TT,
Judy.
DAVID MILLER ACCUSED ME OF BLASPHEMY, as I
recall, ON THIS VERY MATTER AND, VIS A VIS JUDY
TAYLOR!
From: Judy Taylor
Since you apparently do not
eitherunderstand them or believe themLance, why
would you want to put
everyone into your theological
box?
RE: [TruthTalk] sweat
Although this is a very rare phenomenon, bloody sweat (hematidrosis or hemihidrosis) may occur in highly emotional states or in persons with bleeding disorders. (18,20) As a result of hemorrhage into the sweat glands, the skin becomes fragile and tender. (2,11) Luke's description supports the diagnosis of hematidrosis rather than eccrine chromidrosis (brown or yellow-green sweat) or stigmatization (blood oozing from the palms or elsewhere). (18-21) Although some authors have suggested that hematidrosis produced hypovolemia, we agree with Bucklin5 that Jesus actual blood loss probably was minimal. http://www.holytrinity.ok.goarch.org/Interesting%20Stuff/Special%20Communication%20Plus%20Picture.html A Physician Looks at the Crucifixion of Jesus Christ izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2005 11:11 PM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] sweat In a message dated 12/18/2005 10:00:08 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Blaine that is SO ridiculous. Where do you get this stuff?? iz Sorry my thinking does not jive with yours--Actually, this is not necessarily Mormon doctrine, just my own thinking out loud. But the blood of Gethsemane was a reality. And it WAS there that the sins of mankind were atoned for. The cross was where he died, in order that he might be resurrected and over come death, brought into the world by the fall of Adam-- As in Adam all men die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
Re: [TruthTalk] Question for Lance
Where does the dualism come from, you ask? Ask Judy where it comes from. I notice it, Gary identifies it, so do John and Bill. OOOPS! You wanna make this just about me, doncha? When I speak well of you Judy, I truly mean it! It's you who keeps on addressing the rest of us minions from your infallible perch. - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: truthtalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 10:02 Subject: [TruthTalk] Question for Lance Your response to the narrow path and the strait gate is as follows - why? Where does the dualism come from? A the good old dualistic narrow path! judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath
cd: Is John and the LDS in agreement now? You might actually try reading some of my posts rather than sitting there trying to come up with something cute to say. Refer to my 8 point post comparing Mormonism to Christianity and you will have your answer.
Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
I await the prouncement(s).
- Original Message -
From:
Judy
Taylor
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: December 19, 2005 10:08
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and
John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
I know - and for this reason you
should stop doing it Lance.
I don't know about this "by extension" thing; let the
others fight their own battles ...
Gary's writings are incomprehensible so I wouldn't
know what he is saying most of the time
JD's are also so much mixture it has become
impossibleto weed through
And Bill is so into himself and his own theology that
if one does not agree he takes his ball
and goes home... or
becomes totally incommunicado.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 10:00:47 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
You and David have accused ME of blasphemy. By
extension you've similarly accused the 'trio' as you call them.Kicked
off or not, I should like for this to go ahead. 'Blaspheming' is serious
business, Judy.
From: Judy Taylor
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:38:35 -0500 "Lance
Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
I've been just as clear as you've been on this.
Including others is not a 'groupfest thingy', Judy. Have you truly
failed to take note of anyone's recent disagreement with you over your
scriptural interpretation? I've most certainly NOT failed to note
them!
Who are the "others"? Gary John and
Bill? Your theological trio?
Here is a very serious suggestion! Let's have David
and Perry prounce on this issue.
Let's say that if anything warrants being thrown off
the list, it'd be blasphemy. Agreed? Given their and your understanding
we could,
it'd appear, think this list out considerably.
Thereafter, only those of you who saw things your way on this issue
would remain. So,
let's go ahead with this, shall we?
No, something like this would automatically
eliminate the MC and DavidM has reasons for wanting them
here; alsoJesus Himself said to let the
wheat and tares grow together. The angels will do the
separating
soon enough and in that day the judgment will
be perfect.
From: Judy
Taylor
You just love the groupfest thing don't you
Lance?.
You talk yourself into a corner and then want
everyone who has ever disagreed with anything
I have ever said on this list to join
you. How very sad!!! I say the
Spirit of God gives me
understanding as per John 16:3,14 and you say
He does not because it differs from what you
think. One of us is blaspheming the
Holy Spirit. But let's leave the others out of it.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:14:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
Shall we accuse them ALL of blasphemy? C'mon let's
do it! Surely it's not a serious charge is it, Judy?
From: Judy Taylor
You
couldn't make this kind of a judgment call unless you considered
yourself to have apprehended
ALL TRUTH which would put you in the
position to judge in your own estimation.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:53:52 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
NO! I very much believe that the Scriptures
are operative in your life. I just believe your
interpretations
of them to be 'hit and miss', just like
everyone else ('ceptin some are better at it than
you)
From: Judy Taylor
Yes Lance "them" - (that is unless
you receive interpretation through some educated person that
you
respect). You do not believe
that the scriptures I cite below are operative in my life no
matter what I say which is in
effect blaspheming the Holy Spirit if in fact, I am speaking
the truth.
On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 08:22:25 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
'Them'? The Scriptures?
I should actually appreciate staying with
this important matter until it is abundantly clear. Clear to
me, to you, and, to DAVID MILLER and to all others on TT,
RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: what is new for me
No, not always. Its a good thing I have a Savior to help me get back on track when I slip off, and to forgive me for the moments when I take my eyes off of Him. iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 5:51 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: what is new for me Are you, ALWAYS? - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 19:05 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: what is new for me If you are walking in the Spirit, yes. iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Terry Clifton Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2005 1:38 PM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: what is new for me If your principles reflect Him perfectly, would your speech and behavior also do the same? ShieldsFamily wrote: If we really know the Person, our principles will reflect Him perfectly. There is no dichotomy for those walking in the Spirit. iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2005 9:56 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: what is new for me And this: Wemeasure the options against principlesinstead of responding/submitting to a Person. -- Original message -- From: Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Debbie Sawczak To: Lance Muir Sent: December 17, 2005 19:43 Subject: what is new for me is not the understanding that this is our condition. What is new is the connection between that condition and knowledge ofgood and evil--that this is the meaning of the name of thetree in the Genesis story. D
RE: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath
Oooh, Judy, good point! iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy Taylor Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 5:52 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath In a message dated 12/17/2005 3:25:29 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Christ's physical ministry was to the Jew, only. He lived under the law and was the fulfillment of that law. In Him is the end of the law. In Him is no such thing. God's law has not gone anywhere. In fact according to the apostle John who writes under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit in the New Testament SIN IS THE TRANSGRESSION OF THE LAW So how can one transgress against something that is ended? Or are you saying that nobody sins anymore since you have proclaimed the end of the law? judyt He that says I know Him and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: what is new for me
I believe you. - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 10:20 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: what is new for me No, not always. Its a good thing I have a Savior to help me get back on track when I slip off, and to forgive me for the moments when I take my eyes off of Him. iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance MuirSent: Monday, December 19, 2005 5:51 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: what is new for me Are you, ALWAYS? - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 18, 2005 19:05 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: what is new for me If you are walking in the Spirit, yes. iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Terry CliftonSent: Sunday, December 18, 2005 1:38 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: what is new for me If your principles reflect Him perfectly, would your speech and behavior also do the same?ShieldsFamily wrote: If we really know the Person, our principles will reflect Him perfectly. There is no dichotomy for those walking in the Spirit. iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2005 9:56 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: what is new for me And this: Wemeasure the options against principlesinstead of responding/submitting to a Person. -- Original message -- From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Debbie Sawczak To: Lance Muir Sent: December 17, 2005 19:43 Subject: what is new for me is not the understanding that this is our condition. What is new is the connection between that condition and "knowledge ofgood and evil"--that this is the meaning of the name of thetree in the Genesis story. D
RE: [TruthTalk] Empty-headed regard for it (Scripture?) Accute disdane for (his) people (living dead)
How do Gary and Lance presume to know whether or not Judy has distain for his people? You, again, sin with your words. iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 5:55 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: [TruthTalk] Empty-headed regard for it (Scripture?) Accute disdane for (his) people (living dead) Well said, Gary. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 00:15 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of unregenerate gentiles no myth in this--that you supremely regard only your empty-headed regard for it is accurate; evidence shows that no one who really loves JC demonstrates the accute disdain for (his) ppl that ppl like you exhibit On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 07:14:48 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I try to stick with scripture -in spite of your belief that all I have isregard for same. ||
Re: [TruthTalk] Question for Lance
You didn't answer my question I am not asking Gary, John, or Bill You say it below - I want to know what you mean. judyt On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 10:17:16 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Where does the dualism come from, you ask? Ask Judy where it comes from. I notice it, Gary identifies it, so do John and Bill. OOOPS! You wanna make this just about me, doncha? When I speak well of you Judy, I truly mean it! It's you who keeps on addressing the rest of us minions from your infallible perch. From: Judy Taylor Your response to the narrow path and the strait gate is as follows - why? Where does the dualism come from? A the good old dualistic narrow path! judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4) judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Question for Lance
You are a tripartate who has a disdain for things of the earth which by extension indicates that you do not apprehend the significance of the Incarnation and the humanity of Jesus. - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 10:27 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Question for Lance You didn't answer my question I am not asking Gary, John, or Bill You say it below - I want to know what you mean. judyt On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 10:17:16 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Where does the dualism come from, you ask? Ask Judy where it comes from. I notice it, Gary identifies it, so do John and Bill. OOOPS! You wanna make this just about me, doncha? When I speak well of you Judy, I truly mean it! It's you who keeps on addressing the rest of us minions from your infallible perch. From: Judy Taylor Your response to the narrow path and the strait gate is as follows - why? Where does the dualism come from? A the good old dualistic narrow path! judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4) judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Empty-headed regard for it (Scripture?) Accute disdane for (his) people (living dead)
Small point but, 'disdain' not 'distain'. How, you ask? Think of your attitude toward the Democrat party (made up of real Democrats) then, read Judy's posts on both the living and the dead. The 'disdain' is similar to your 'Democrat disdain'. THAT IS HOW! - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 10:23 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Empty-headed regard for it (Scripture?) Accute disdane for (his) people (living dead) How do Gary and Lance presume to know whether or not Judy has distain for his people? You, again, sin with your words. iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance MuirSent: Monday, December 19, 2005 5:55 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: [TruthTalk] Empty-headed regard for it (Scripture?) Accute disdane for (his) people (living dead) Well said, Gary. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 00:15 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles no myth in this--that you supremely regard only your empty-headed regard for it is accurate; evidence shows that no one who really loves JC demonstrates the accute disdain for (his) ppl that ppl like you exhibit On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 07:14:48 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I try to stick with scripture -in spite of your belief that all I have isregard for same. ||
Re: [TruthTalk] Question for Lance
I don't have disdain for things of the earth at all so there is no extension I believe we are "fearfully and wonderfully made" and thank God for every earthly blessing daily So it's just another straw man - huh!! Who constructed this one? On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 10:34:28 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: You are a tripartate who has a disdain for things of the earth which by extension indicates that you do not apprehend the significance of the Incarnation and the humanity of Jesus. From: Judy Taylor You didn't answer my question I am not asking Gary, John, or Bill You say it below - I want to know what you mean. judyt On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 10:17:16 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Where does the dualism come from, you ask? Ask Judy where it comes from. I notice it, Gary identifies it, so do John and Bill. OOOPS! You wanna make this just about me, doncha? When I speak well of you Judy, I truly mean it! It's you who keeps on addressing the rest of us minions from your infallible perch. From: Judy Taylor Your response to the narrow path and the strait gate is as follows - why? Where does the dualism come from? A the good old dualistic narrow path! judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4) judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4) judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Question for Lance
Me! - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 10:37 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Question for Lance I don't have disdain for things of the earth at all so there is no extension I believe we are "fearfully and wonderfully made" and thank God for every earthly blessing daily So it's just another straw man - huh!! Who constructed this one? On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 10:34:28 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: You are a tripartate who has a disdain for things of the earth which by extension indicates that you do not apprehend the significance of the Incarnation and the humanity of Jesus. From: Judy Taylor You didn't answer my question I am not asking Gary, John, or Bill You say it below - I want to know what you mean. judyt On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 10:17:16 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Where does the dualism come from, you ask? Ask Judy where it comes from. I notice it, Gary identifies it, so do John and Bill. OOOPS! You wanna make this just about me, doncha? When I speak well of you Judy, I truly mean it! It's you who keeps on addressing the rest of us minions from your infallible perch. From: Judy Taylor Your response to the narrow path and the strait gate is as follows - why? Where does the dualism come from? A the good old dualistic narrow path! judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4) judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4) judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
[TruthTalk] Significance of the Incarnation
You write: You are a tripartate who has a disdain for things of the earth which by extension indicates that you do not apprehend the significance of the Incarnation and the humanity of Jesus. Do you actually believe your salvation comes through Jesus' humanity Lance? What does that mean - and in the light of it - Pleasetell me what this means: "and so it is written. The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual. The first man is of the earth earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven. As is the earthy such are they also that are earthy; and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly. And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly. Now this I say brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, neither doth corruption inherit incorruption" (2 Cor 15:45-50)
Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath
Keeping the law has never saved anyone, girls. The law has value in that it shows us (to some extent) what sin is. We no longer offer a sacrifice because Jesus was our sacrifice. If that part of the law has been fulfilled, then all the law has been fulfilled. The shed blood of Jesus was far more valuable than the blood of any sacrifice you can think of or all the sacrifices ever offered stacked on an alter together. The law is history, and history only has value as a teacher. Look at the verse you post in every missive, Judy. He that says, "I know Him", and doesn't keep HIS commandments is a liar. The two laws given by Jesus are HIS commands. The old law allowed you to hate your enemy. The new law requires you to love him. Now you know. What are you going to do about it? If the love is there, let it show, 'cause right now, Judy, I Truly wish I could see it in you and I cannot, no matter how hard I try. I know it hurts you to read this, but it needed to be said. I hope you will examine yourself before you reply, then, when you are done, feel free to examine me. I am sure I have faults that I cannot see either. Terry ShieldsFamily wrote: Oooh, Judy, good point! iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Judy Taylor Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 5:52 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath In a message dated 12/17/2005 3:25:29 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Christ's physical ministry was to the Jew, only. He lived under the law and was the fulfillment of that law. In Him is the end of the law. In Him is no such thing. God's law has not gone anywhere. In fact according to the apostle John who writes under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit in the New Testament "SIN IS THE TRANSGRESSION OF THE LAW" So how can one transgress against something that is ended? Or are you saying that nobody sins anymore since you have proclaimed the end of the law? judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath
Terry wrote: The old law allowed you to hate your enemy. When you say, old law, are you talking about the Torah of Moses? Where does it allow anyone to hate anybody? I don't see how this is possible because Jesus said that those who love God and love their neighbor fulfill the requirements of the Torah of Moses. Do you mean that the Torah was more permissible than the New Covenant, for example, allowing for divorce whereas Jesus did not? Is that what you are talking about? Please consider the following passage from Torah: Leviticus 19:17 (17) Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him. Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath
David: You may have addressed the 'letter' of Terry's post but, might you have missed it's spirit? No, I don't believe this needs any clarification. - Original Message - From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 11:20 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath Terry wrote: The old law allowed you to hate your enemy. When you say, old law, are you talking about the Torah of Moses? Where does it allow anyone to hate anybody? I don't see how this is possible because Jesus said that those who love God and love their neighbor fulfill the requirements of the Torah of Moses. Do you mean that the Torah was more permissible than the New Covenant, for example, allowing for divorce whereas Jesus did not? Is that what you are talking about? Please consider the following passage from Torah: Leviticus 19:17 (17) Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him. Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath
I was not talking about divorce or brothers or neighbors.. I was talking about enemies. David Miller wrote: Terry wrote: The old law allowed you to hate your enemy. When you say, "old law," are you talking about the Torah of Moses? Where does it allow anyone to hate anybody? I don't see how this is possible because Jesus said that those who love God and love their neighbor fulfill the requirements of the Torah of Moses. Do you mean that the Torah was more permissible than the New Covenant, for example, allowing for divorce whereas Jesus did not? Is that what you are talking about? Please consider the following passage from Torah: Leviticus 19:17 (17) Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him. Peace be with you. David Miller. -- "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath
I'm talking about God's moral law Terri and Jesus did not negate any of that. The ceremonial law was for the Levitical priesthood which has passed away. He is now our Prophet, Priest, and King. Jesus Commandments are the Spirit of the Law which as you say is based on Love, but then so is God's moral law. Most of the 10 Commandments are basically the Golden Rule. Terry, please tell me. If you could see the love in me - what would it look like? Can you describe it please? judyt On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:53:35 -0600 Terry Clifton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Keeping the law has never saved anyone, girls. The law has value in that it shows us (to some extent) what sin is. We no longer offer a sacrifice because Jesus was our sacrifice. If that part of the law has been fulfilled, then all the law has been fulfilled. The shed blood of Jesus was far more valuable than the blood of any sacrifice you can think of or all the sacrifices ever offered stacked on an alter together. The law is history, and history only has value as a teacher. Look at the verse you post in every missive, Judy. He that says, "I know Him", and doesn't keep HIS commandments is a liar. The two laws given by Jesus are HIS commands. The old law allowed you to hate your enemy. The new law requires you to love him. Now you know. What are you going to do about it? If the love is there, let it show, 'cause right now, Judy, I Truly wish I could see it in you and I cannot, no matter how hard I try. I know it hurts you to read this, but it needed to be said. I hope you will examine yourself before you reply, then, when you are done, feel free to examine me. I am sure I have faults that I cannot see either.TerryShieldsFamily wrote: Oooh, Judy, good point! iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Judy TaylorSent: Monday, December 19, 2005 5:52 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgCc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath In a message dated 12/17/2005 3:25:29 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Christ's physical ministry was to the Jew, only. He lived under the law and was the fulfillment of that law. In Him is the end of the law. In Him is no such thing. God's law has not gone anywhere. In fact according to the apostle John who writes under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit in the New Testament "SIN IS THE TRANSGRESSION OF THE LAW" So how can one transgress against something that is ended? Or are you saying that nobody sins anymore since you have proclaimed the end of the law? judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4) judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath
Terry wrote: I was not talking about divorce or brothers or neighbors.. I was talking about enemies. Again, when you say, old law, are you talking about the law of Moses? What old law allows a person to hate their enemies? I hope you are not talking about the Torah. Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath
Lance wrote: You may have addressed the 'letter' of Terry's post but, might you have missed it's spirit? I did not miss it's spirit. I agree with that and see no reason to respond to it. It stands fine on its own. We all need to be provoked to love one another more fervently. The idea, however, that the law has been done away does not agree with all of Scripture. The idea that the law allows one to hate their enemies seems problematic to me. Maybe he means that the law is not strong enough in condemning the hatred of enemies? I'm just asking for clarification. Do you know anywhere that the law allows one to hate their enemies? I think the law preaches love just as Jesus did. Both the commands to love God and love your neighbor are found in the Torah. These are the two greatest commandments of Torah, and all of Torah hinges upon these two commandments according to Jesus. All the so-called ceremonial laws also hinge on these two commandments. Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Re: [TruthTalk] Empty-headed regard for it (Scripture?) Accute disdane for (his) people (living dead)
Lance how about answering my question before getting off on giving Izzy a typing lesson. jt PS - Who is the one who wrote "disdane" in the subject line? On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 10:30:59 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Small point but, 'disdain' not 'distain'. How, you ask? Think of your attitude toward the Democrat party (made up of real Democrats) then, read Judy's posts on both the living and the dead. The 'disdain' is similar to your 'Democrat disdain'. THAT IS HOW! - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 10:23 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Empty-headed regard for it (Scripture?) Accute disdane for (his) people (living dead) How do Gary and Lance presume to know whether or not Judy has distain for his people? You, again, sin with your words. iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance MuirSent: Monday, December 19, 2005 5:55 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: [TruthTalk] Empty-headed regard for it (Scripture?) Accute disdane for (his) people (living dead) Well said, Gary. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 00:15 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Condition of heart of "unregenerate" gentiles no myth in this--that you supremely regard only your empty-headed regard for it is accurate; evidence shows that no one who really loves JC demonstrates the accute disdain for (his) ppl that ppl like you exhibit On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 07:14:48 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I try to stick with scripture -in spite of your belief that all I have isregard for same. || judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
[TruthTalk] And Gary, and John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
Lance wrote: Here is a very serious suggestion! Let's have David and Perry prounce on this issue. Let's say that if anything warrants being thrown off the list, it'd be blasphemy. Agreed? No, Lance, I don't agree. This list is not a Christian list. Atheists and pagans are allowed. Surely they will say blasphemous things. We want to deal with blasphemy by using the Word of God to expose it as such. That is all. There is really only one thing that gets a person kicked off the list, and that is not cooperating with the moderator. When someone posts contrary to his instruction and he feels he needs to remove that person in order to keep order on the list, then that is his prerogative to do so. Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
Here we go once again, David. Since we are totally public why don't you outline, utilizing texts and interpretation just how you support this 'non-accusation' that not you but, God is judging me for? - Original Message - From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 12:11 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David Lance wrote: You and David have accused ME of blasphemy. Technically, I have not accused you of such. I have simply asked you to stop the blasphemy. I judge what you have said to be blasphemy. God judges you and I do not accuse you of anything. Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
"techniccally" is the word of a legalist justifying what he has actually done while pretending to be fully consistent. One simply cannot tell another to "stop the blasphemy" without, at the same time and in the same breath, accusing him OF blasphemy. jd -- Original message -- From: "David Miller" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Lance wrote: You and David have accused ME of blasphemy. Technically, I have not accused you of such. I have simply asked you to stop the blasphemy. I judge what you have said to be blasphemy. God judges you and I do not accuse you of anything. Peace be with you. David Miller. -- "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscri bed.
Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath
Romans 14 puts to an end this argument. -- Original message -- From: "Marlin halverson" [EMAIL PROTECTED] "Over one hundred years ago the Catholic Mirror ran a series of articles discussing the right of the Protestant churches to worship on Sunday. The articles stressed that unless one was willing to accept the authority of the Catholic Church to designate the day of worship, the Christian should observe Saturday. Those articles are presented here in their entirety." http://www.cbcg.org/rome's_challenge.htm Photo copyright 1914 by Underwood Underwood ---BeginMessage--- attachment: image001.jpg ---End Message---
Re: [TruthTalk] JUDY ASSERTS THAT I, LANCE, NEITHER UNDERSTAND NOR BELIEVE 'THEM' Who blasphemes?
So Judy, we only needed the apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors and teacher until the Bible was approved by the Chruch? Is that what you are saying? And Lance's claim, below, that we all might just sitat your your feet when we have a question of scripture or disagree with your view. Obviously, in a disagreement, your view (and DM's) are the correct and inspired view and ours is not. And when you and David disagree, who is right on that one. And don't hide behind the "we argree on the important issues" as if there was something unimportant in "God's word." Just answer the question. jd -- Original message -- From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Would your approach to Scripture be just like those who 'heard in their own language' in Acts 2.? Seriously Judy, if this is the case then I'm gonna shut my mouth and, listen to nobody but you..oh and David 'cause I think he also believes sumpin like this. - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 09:13 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] JUDY ASSERTS THAT I, LANCE, NEITHER UNDERSTAND NOR BELIEVE 'THEM' Who blasphemes? Your response here indicates ignorance Lance When the Holy Spirit gives understanding there is no interpretation involved One either understands or they don't .. just like a foreign language
Re: [TruthTalk] Who blasphemes?
No that is not what I am saying JD ATST there is just one "Bread from Heaven" and His are the feet you are to sit at. Only one mediator between God and man. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 18:20:43 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: So Judy, we only needed the apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors and teacher until the Bible was approved by the Chruch? Is that what you are saying? And Lance's claim, below, that we all might just sitat your your feet when we have a question of scripture or disagree with your view. Obviously, in a disagreement, your view (and DM's) are the correct and inspired view and ours is not. And when you and David disagree, who is right on that one. And don't hide behind the "we argree on the important issues" as if there was something unimportant in "God's word." Just answer the question. jd From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Would your approach to Scripture be just like those who 'heard in their own language' in Acts 2.? Seriously Judy, if this is the case then I'm gonna shut my mouth and, listen to nobody but you..oh and David 'cause I think he also believes sumpin like this. From: Judy Taylor Your response here indicates ignorance Lance When the Holy Spirit gives understanding there is no interpretation involved One either understands or they don't .. just like a foreign language judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath
I am sorry Judy. It pains me to say it, but I do not see any love in you. I see an intense desire to be right and I see at least a tendency to condemn those who do not see it as you do. I hope that love is there. I hope I am just blind to it and do not see it because of my inability. I thought you should know that if it is there, I cannot see it, because others may have the same problem. Thanks for clearing up your perceptions of the remaining law. Terry Judy Taylor wrote: I'm talking about God's moral law Terri and Jesus did not negate any of that. The ceremonial law was for the Levitical priesthood which has passed away. He is now our Prophet, Priest, and King. Jesus Commandments are the Spirit of the Law which as you say is based on Love, but then so is God's moral law. Most of the 10 Commandments are basically the Golden Rule. Terry, please tell me. If you could see the love in me - what would it look like? Can you describe it please? judyt On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:53:35 -0600 Terry Clifton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Keeping the law has never saved anyone, girls. The law has value in that it shows us (to some extent) what sin is. We no longer offer a sacrifice because Jesus was our sacrifice. If that part of the law has been fulfilled, then all the law has been fulfilled. The shed blood of Jesus was far more valuable than the blood of any sacrifice you can think of or all the sacrifices ever offered stacked on an alter together. The law is history, and history only has value as a teacher. Look at the verse you post in every missive, Judy. He that says, "I know Him", and doesn't keep HIS commandments is a liar. The two laws given by Jesus are HIS commands. The old law allowed you to hate your enemy. The new law requires you to love him. Now you know. What are you going to do about it? If the love is there, let it show, 'cause right now, Judy, I Truly wish I could see it in you and I cannot, no matter how hard I try. I know it hurts you to read this, but it needed to be said. I hope you will examine yourself before you reply, then, when you are done, feel free to examine me. I am sure I have faults that I cannot see either. Terry ShieldsFamily wrote: Oooh, Judy, good point! iz From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Judy Taylor Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 5:52 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath In a message dated 12/17/2005 3:25:29 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Christ's physical ministry was to the Jew, only. He lived under the law and was the fulfillment of that law. In Him is the end of the law. In Him is no such thing. God's law has not gone anywhere. In fact according to the apostle John who writes under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit in the New Testament "SIN IS THE TRANSGRESSION OF THE LAW" So how can one transgress against something that is ended? Or are you saying that nobody sins anymore since you have proclaimed the end of the law? judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4) judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
Re: [TruthTalk] Saturday Sabbath
That is exactly what I am talking about, David. Jesus said "You have heard it said that you should love your neighbor and hate your enemy, but I tell you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you." Jesus is saying to change. Stop doing it the way you have been taught. I have a better way. Why did the Jews teach this? Look at Leviticus 19:18. It forbids hard feelings or bad brhavior toward your neighbor, but there is nothing there about the enemy. If you doubt that, look at Samson. He killed a thousand enemies with the jawbone of an ass. After he had killed nine hundred and ninety- nine, don't you think the thousanth one asked for mercy? Don't you think Samson could have taken him prisoner instead of taking his life. Look at King Saul. God was with him until he showed mercy to an enemy king. I know that somewhere in proverbs we are told to feed our ememy, but the reason given is not love. David Miller wrote: Terry wrote: I was not talking about divorce or brothers or neighbors.. I was talking about enemies. Again, when you say, "old law," are you talking about the law of Moses? What "old law" allows a person to hate their enemies? I hope you are not talking about the Torah. Peace be with you. David Miller. -- "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
Lance wrote: ... why don't you outline, utilizing texts and interpretation just how you support this 'non-accusation' that not you but, God is judging me for? Your last comment indicates you have misunderstood me. What I meant is that you are under God himself. You are not somebody who is under my authority; therefore, I do not judge you. God does. In other words, you answer to God, not to me. As for outlining how you have blasphemed, I have already done so. Jesus promises Judy the Holy Spirit, to be her teacher and comforter, to lead her and guide her into all truth. You rebuked her, telling her that she had no such guarantee in Scripture. Later in private correspondence, you told me that what you meant was that she had failed to apprehend truth in a particular area. I don't have a problem with you saying that. Apparently what you wrote was communicating a blasphemy that you did not intend. Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
John wrote: techniccally is the word of a legalist justifying what he has actually done while pretending to be fully consistent. One simply cannot tell another to stop the blasphemy without, at the same time and in the same breath, accusing him OF blasphemy. There is a distinction between holding to an opinion about someone being in error and accusing someone of an error. Part of this distinction has to do with the attitude of our heart. It is important to understand this distinction if we are to correct others in love. Many times my children fall into error. If I took the approach of accusing them of error, it could crush their spirit. Instead, I can hold to the opinion that they are in error and seek to correct the problem in love. There is indeed a difference between working to stop blasphemy and accusing someone of blasphemy. Even when Jesus warned about blasphemy against the Holy Ghost, he did not accuse anyone in particular. He held to an opinion that those who confused the good work of the Holy Spirit with the work of Satan were in great danger of unforgiveable blasphemy. You might also consider the woman taken in adultery. Jesus held to the opinion that she had sinned, yet he told the woman that he did not condemn (accuse) her. In other words, Jesus held to the opinion that she was wrong to commit adultery without accusing the woman of adultery. I hope you understand this distinction. It is an important one and not merely the rhetoric of a legalistic sophist. Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Re: [TruthTalk] Who blasphemes?
If "illumination" or "spritual discernment" means that you cannot be wrong AND you reject virtually everything I have written on this forum over the past two years or so, how do you avoid the implication that your interpretation is "inspired" and mine is not? Do you believe that your understanding (interpretation) simply cannot be wrong as you read any number of the scripture? jd -- Original message -- From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] No that is not what I am saying JD ATST there is just one "Bread from Heaven" and His are the feet you are to sit at. Only one mediator between God and man. On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 18:20:43 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: So Judy, we only needed the apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors and teacher until the Bible was approved by the Chruch? Is that what you are saying? And Lance's claim, below, that we all might just sitat your your feet when we have a question of scripture or disagree with your view. Obviously, in a disagreement, your view (and DM's) are the correct and inspired view and ours is not. And when you and David disagree, who is right on that one. And don't hide behind the "we argree on the important issues" as if there was something unimportant in "God's word." Just answer the question. jd From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Would your approach to Scripture be just like those who 'heard in their own language' in Acts 2.? Seriously Judy, if this is the case then I'm gonna shut my mouth and, listen to nobody but you..oh and David 'cause I think he also believes sumpin like this. From: Judy Taylor Your response here indicates ignorance Lance When the Holy Spirit gives understanding there is no interpretation involved One either understands or they don't .. just like a foreign language judyt He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments is a liar (1 John 2:4)
[TruthTalk] Do believers really disagree on anything?
JD wrote: Obviously, in a disagreement, your view (and DM's) are the correct and inspired view and ours is not. And when you and David disagree, who is right on that one. I think disagreements between Spirit-filled believers are more tenuous than most will acknowledge. Misunderstanding between the parties involved are much more common than true disagreements. Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David
HUZZAH!! David has loosed me from condemnation! Actually David, it may well be Judy who misunderstood. IMO both of you misapprehend Jn 16 1 Cor 2 but, another conversation for another prophet. . - Original Message - From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 14:42 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] And Gary, and John, and Bill and, on occasion(s), Linda and David Lance wrote: ... why don't you outline, utilizing texts and interpretation just how you support this 'non-accusation' that not you but, God is judging me for? Your last comment indicates you have misunderstood me. What I meant is that you are under God himself. You are not somebody who is under my authority; therefore, I do not judge you. God does. In other words, you answer to God, not to me. As for outlining how you have blasphemed, I have already done so. Jesus promises Judy the Holy Spirit, to be her teacher and comforter, to lead her and guide her into all truth. You rebuked her, telling her that she had no such guarantee in Scripture. Later in private correspondence, you told me that what you meant was that she had failed to apprehend truth in a particular area. I don't have a problem with you saying that. Apparently what you wrote was communicating a blasphemy that you did not intend. Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Re: [TruthTalk] Do believers really disagree on anything?
Horsefeathers! 'Slip sliding away' (prophet Paul Simon) - Original Message - From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: December 19, 2005 14:57 Subject: [TruthTalk] Do believers really disagree on anything? JD wrote: Obviously, in a disagreement, your view (and DM's) are the correct and inspired view and ours is not. And when you and David disagree, who is right on that one. I think disagreements between Spirit-filled believers are more tenuous than most will acknowledge. Misunderstanding between the parties involved are much more common than true disagreements. Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
