Give me a break. I just joined WISPA in the past 60 days with intentions
of HELPING THE INDUSTRY. In the 60 days I have been on this list I have
seen all kinds of BS- Political grandstanding, rudeness and generally
unprofessional behavior. The most recent discussions about operating
illegally have
Where are you finding those boards for $22 a piece?
-Tony
cw wrote:
We use WAR boards but if it's resi wireless LAN needed, these work fine
http://www.pcbay.net/wgnewirowisu.html. They have Atheros chipset and
are $22 delivered. Throw them away when they die. All the consumer grade
stuff
Hi Matt,
I ran this past my support team. They don't agree with this:
AS prepending is fairly effective method. Assuming you have more then just
a /24 network, you also can use selective advertising of more specific
prefixes through a preferred provider to influence inbound traffic.
In this
Marty,
What you have experienced is not the norm on the WISPA list IMO.
'Scuffles' occasionally do take place, but this list is well run and
moderated. You will find a wealth of information sharing and support on
this list.
This my change for you 2 cents... :)
- Cliff
-Original
Agreed..
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 12:19 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] TV white spaces
Well, either way, if it's an ap that talks to more than one client,
Hi,
I currently have over 2,000 Linksys routers installed... probably closer
to 3,000. They have the same failure rate as every other brand we tried
(Belkin, Netgear, Dlink). The big advantage for us is Linksys' RMA
procedure is all online, and you can do 20 or 200 at a time. We save
them up
Jeff Broadwick wrote:
AS prepending is fairly effective method. Assuming you have more then just
a /24 network, you also can use selective advertising of more specific
prefixes through a preferred provider to influence inbound traffic.
AS prepending is not as effective as it used to be. I
Does anyone else have an issue with the tiny little SMA connector that
Trango and some others use for antenna connections?
I have seen several failures where the mating connector on the antenna feed
line self destructs due to leverage caused by the cable. Nothing kills an
installation budget quite
AMEN to you, Marlon!
The people (and there are some big names right on this list who are doing
it) who are building their own stuff out of OEM boards are not operating
under Part 15 properly and risk fines. The FCC can inspect ANY radio
station, licensed or not, so all it takes is for them to
Hi,
I serve hundreds of users off this MT router... I can't turn on DHCP for
a single location for a free hotspot. :(
Travis
Eric Muehleisen wrote:
What if you have the the MT do the DHCP to the end user instead of the
Linksys? Turn off NAT or do DHCP passthrough or something like that?
Ralph,
When you are talking a 12 or 18 pigtail, using LMR-195 vs. LMR-400 or
even LMR-600 there is going to be less than .5db difference. Why would
you need such a large cable for just a small jumper cable?
Travis
Microserv
Ralph wrote:
Does anyone else have an issue with the tiny little
I have kept pretty silent watching all the grandstanding. But Marty
brings up an excellent point. The licensed operators are using the
flaunting of the laws as good reason to not give you any more UL
spectrum. I have seen and heard this first hand. You guys can throw all
the darts you want but I'm
Hi Travis- I understand (and agree with) your point-
But
Sometimes the installation calls for a longer one. I have seen 4-10 ft ones
for various reasons.
Sometimes the specification for the job calls for that size cable because
the owner has it in his head that there may be .025 dB less of loss.
Hi,
I can tell you that Trango is going to an N connector on their new
series of radios (6-12 months out). However, they are not going to
change anything with the existing radios.
Travis
Microserv
Ralph wrote:
Hi Travis- I understand (and agree with) your point-
But
Sometimes the
If that's true, I'm glad to see that they have decided to use a more
appropriate connector type.
Ralph
_
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Travis Johnson
Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 10:29 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Little
Yeah, I hate trying to seal connectors that have such a large step up in
cable size. It's hard to get the tape to set up right.
I have had a LOT better luck with those little connectors by only buying 18
jumpers. I also have moved to using rg 58u instead of lmr 240 or something
like that.
All,
I ran across this article and found it quite amusing.
As quoted from the article;
Newtowne Court public housing, chosen for its proximity to public
buildings and its high percentage of school-age children, is already
equipped with 20 to 30 antennae for WiFi, said Hart. Hart said the
Marty,
That was not a dig :-) No offense intended. I agree 100% with what you
said and most of what Patrick generally has to say. (That aint no dig
either Patrick) hehehe
I was just picking on my brother Leary!!
As far as UL operators - it is no different for us than it is in any other
I get a kick out of these discussions. First, if the people that think
we're all illegal operators think that the 5 or 10 very vocal ones on a
couple of emails lists represent they whole industry they are being less
than honest with anyone. MOST operators are good and honest. Not all of
What do you want to bet they put it in a spot that's almost impossible to
weather seal?
What are the odds that they'll post a picture or 3 of a prototype here on
this list and ask for OUR feedback before they release the product.
Far too vendors fail to take advantage of our skills
Someone a bit back shared some code with a list, and I can't for the life of
me find where
I put it, developed some on top of it, and came up with something web based
that was
pretty cool.
hehe. I've got like 7 machines here that I could've picked, and it was a
tiny file... doh!
If had
It's simple Marlon- WISPA can affect this crowd- If WISPA demands all
members be 100% legal operators or NO MEMBERSHIP allowed that would send a
powerful message to the FCC and the WISP community.
From the code of ethics-
ARTICLE II
We will conduct ourselves in such a manner as to bring credit
Marlon,
Correct me if I am wrong, wasn't it you that was looking for an amp for
a 15 mile link of an omni the other day?
Fact is it's none of our business here at wispa what our members use for
equipment. None what so ever.
WISPA is not an enforcement group. We are a trade association.
That is what I was looking for. We all serve the same interest and that is
customer satisfaction. I did learn a great deal from you all providing me
your feedback. Our scenario has been been using bulk ordered refurbs. We
used to be all Linksys until we started seeing a high failure rate.
I could be way off base here. I dont run a hotspot with MT at this time
but I have played with it. You might want to try
http://forums.mikrotik.com/ for help.
If i remember correctly when you create a hotspot server it creates a
DHCP server for this virtual interface and thus it is a
Mac:
Aren't you one of those who wants to see dedicated WISP Spectrum
become available, like 3650 or television broadcast whitespace?
Do you think there's an incentive by the regulators to grant such
spectrum exclusively to WISPs, when, as professionals you know
about such behavior, and
Why? Because our industry is getting hammered at the FCC by the licensed
operators. They are telling the world that UL operators are running wild and
giving them (us) more UL spectrum will result in the exact same issues in
the new spectrum.
The FCC does not intend to hire hundreds of inspectors
Marty,
I believe that this list of 'open to the public,' and therefore users
are not subject to the code of ethics that a member agrees to when they
join.
The paid members have access to a private discussion group with added
benefits over and above the public list. The private list is also where
Gang,
I've heard various numbers, but I'd like to put a finer point on it.
How many WISPA members are there?
How many independent WISPs are there?
Thanks,
Dave Brenton
General Manager
Rural Tennessee Wireless Broadband
Bringing FAST Internet to the rest of us (sm)
Dover TN
(931) 232-0914
Steve,
What you are suggesting here is very similar to what the ham radio
community does now. I would add a step in your process, that first the
offending WISP be contacted via official WISPA correspondence explaining
what it is we are doing and the planned course of action through the FCC
Found on Slashdot:
http://blogs.zdnet.com/security/?p=19
ZDNet has a story about the public launch of Immunity's Silica, a portable
hacking device that can search for and join 802.11 (Wi-Fi) access points,
scan other connections for open ports, and automatically launch code
execution exploits
That is almost perfectly correct, but you have to set up the DHCP server in
MT for the Hotspot gateway/clients. Also choose which interface you would
want the HotSpot to run from. MAC authentication is easy and very effective!
You can shape the traffic as well within the Hotspot.
Its just great
Add a step before this- just contact the offender first, air your
concern, try to work it out locally. Less trouble/intervention/attention
for all parties involved. I still believe most people are decent. No
need to call the dogs unless you are forced to.
Chris
-Original Message-
From:
Justin,
Scary stuff...
Thanks for the post.
jack
Justin Wilson wrote:
Found on Slashdot:
http://blogs.zdnet.com/security/?p=19
ZDNet has a story about the public launch of Immunity's Silica, a portable
hacking device that can search for and join 802.11 (Wi-Fi) access points,
scan other
That sounds like an excellent idea Brian!
I don't think that WISPA has the money or the time to chase down illegal
operators. I also don't think it is something that WISPA ought to get in to,
but I don't think it would be a bad idea for WISPA to get behind its members
and send out a letter
Follow the link I pasted http://www.pcbay.net/wgnewirowisu.html.
Anthony R. Mattke wrote:
Where are you finding those boards for $22 a piece?
-Tony
cw wrote:
We use WAR boards but if it's resi wireless LAN needed, these work
fine http://www.pcbay.net/wgnewirowisu.html. They have Atheros
Mac,
There are many things the amateur radio community does that an
organization
like WISPA could use as an organization for examples on how to accomplish
tasks. Frequency coordination and this voluntary policing of the airwaves
are two situations that come to mind. Emergency
Mac Dearman wrote:
That sounds like an excellent idea Brian!
I don't think that WISPA has the money or the time to chase down illegal
operators. I also don't think it is something that WISPA ought to get in to,
but I don't think it would be a bad idea for WISPA to get behind its members
and
We use WAR boards but if it's resi wireless LAN needed, these work fine
http://www.pcbay.net/wgnewirowisu.html. They have Atheros chipset and are
$22 delivered. Throw them away when they die. All the consumer grade stuff
Those look like Netgear routers. We run PPPoE and have always had
trouble
What I would like to know is what is the cheapest router that is
supported by OpenWRT?
http://wiki.openwrt.org/TableOfHardware
Matt
Hey guys, I hope some of you can enlighten me on what is the best line of
router out there for home and small business. We have used linksys and netgear
and
I have seen many excellent ideas posed lately about ways in which WISPA
can do this or WISPA can do that for the industry. I am sure WISPA will
become the place where all of these things become a reality in the
future. For now we have a more immediate need. People need to stop
telling us what
Brian:
Amateur Radio processes was one of the mental models I used in my
proposal. You were right on in noting the similarities.
Thanks,
Steve (N8GNJ)
On Feb 8, 2007, at Feb 8 09:55 AM, Brian Webster wrote:
Steve,
What you are suggesting here is very similar to what the ham
Amen to that, it's called 'Vendor Protectionism'. I remember when the
companies doing low voltage pre-wiring in buildings lobbied to make only
certified contractors be able to do Cat5/6 work in housing and an Apprentice
Program was required. They knew full well that if another company wanted
Hello Everyone
We have been a waverider shop for a couple of years but have recently installed
a microtik 900 mhz AP and was wondering what is available for INDOOR CPE
equipment.We would sure appreciate any input as to what is available.Outdoors
we are using rootenna enclosures with
Those _are_ Netgear routers. The thread was looking for consumer grade
routers. All sub hundred dollar wireless routers are going to lose their way
periodically and require power cycling. This particular router has Atheros
chipset and it's priced for throw away so you don't have to waste more
I'll give you the time tested answer to that question.
It depends.
:)
I've got 3 AP's up now, starting to have SOME luck, mostly LOS, a couple
NLOS here but no leaf experience yet as the trees are naked...
On one NLOS shot in town, around corner 3/4 mile away, I can transfer
18mbps through
How many of you operate in farm country? You got any problem with
illegal produce flooding your market? I bet your community might have
something to say about that.
Are you asking if those of us who have the ethics to make the required
investments to operate legally in this country (and in every
What channel size for 18 mbps?
Scriv
Rick Smith wrote:
I'll give you the time tested answer to that question.
It depends.
:)
I've got 3 AP's up now, starting to have SOME luck, mostly LOS, a couple
NLOS here but no leaf experience yet as the trees are naked...
On one NLOS shot in town,
that was at 10mhz channels.
when I went to 20mhz, I was able to squeeze 22 mbps on a 36 meg connect
rate, but
that's too much freq usage...
Seems to work ok - just need to start separating thse things.
Might be interesting to find an enclosure that had two compartments - one on
each side
and
Inline
Patrick Leary wrote:
How many of you operate in farm country? You got any problem with
illegal produce flooding your market? I bet your community might have
something to say about that.
I am rural. What is illegal produce? If I grew it in my backyard, is
it illegal?
Are you
Fellow WISPAs
I've been reading these threads here with some great interest,
and as the new kid on the block (Well at 53, maybe
the new geezer might be more correct ... )
maybe I've not yet earned the right to sound off,
but what the heck.
I am deeply concerned that a few (but likely
I actually talked to the guys that are involved with this.
Several things now, is that they want to know if it is feasible, that is the
60 grand. Second, they want someone to do it, but mostly it is going to be
some big company, and they don't think that they can get a local company to
do it.
If not mistaken, the proposed freq for wimax is in the 3gig range, with 2db
more output than 2.4. So would wimax not have even more penetration issues?
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Dawn DiPietro
Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 9:41
I would like to introduce all of you to Ross Cornett of Hofnet
Communications, Inc.. They are WISPA's newest Principle Member. I have
known Ross for a number of years and I am glad to see him make the step
up to membership in WISPA. Here is some information about Hofnet
Communications, Inc.:
Patrick,
I agree and appreciate you frustration on this issue! I too remember
when I had to compete in the computer business when we only offered FCC
certified computer systems, but the 'shade-tree' computer builder was
peddling his goods for less money. It wasn't fair to those following the
Dennis,
The reason given in the article for this was so the vendor could incur
the cost of building the network. For coverage of the whole county to
become a reality they need a company with the resources to do this.
Regards,
Dawn DiPietro
Dennis Burgess - 2K Wireless wrote:
I actually
Shannon,
Who elsefor example offers a lifetime warranty?
Ron Wallace
-Original Message-
From: KyWiFi LLC [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, February 7, 2007 11:33 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Routers
Yes, I'm serious. Lots of companies offer a lifetime
HIP HIP HOORAY!
Welcome to WISPA Michael and crew.
I look for great things to take place due to OUR industry organization.
of the WISPs, by the WISPS, for the WISP
Mac Dearman
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of John Scrivner
Sent:
What should I say next time I'm before people like Julie Knapp, who
heads OET. Here is a potential script:
Me - Good morning sir, congratulations on earning the Chief position.
Julie - Thank you Patrick. What's on your mind?
Me - Julie, we could really use more spectrum for UL.
Julie - Well,
Dennis,
Thanks for taking the time to talk to the local government officials.
I can understand them paying 60 grand to see if it's feasible. I'm sorry
that they don't believe that a local WISP could do it. In an ideal
world, there would be a local WISP who is open-minded enough and
WiMAX will create better link budgets, power for power and band for
band, because the technology employed is more sophisticated -- both more
efficient on Mhz by Mhz basis and more directive (e.g. fast-switching
and adaptive beam-forming plus MIMO).
Patrick Leary
AVP WISP Markets
Alvarion, Inc.
o:
On Thu, 2007-02-08 at 12:50 -0600, Matt wrote:
What I would like to know is what is the cheapest router that is
supported by OpenWRT?
I'd almost guarantee it's the Buffalo WHR-G54S. I've only one so far.
It's been at grandma's house doing a 300' link in client mode. It's
been installed almost
Jack Unger wrote:
To answer your second question, yes - if Dennis paid me to appear at his
City Council meeting to lobby for his company I would be happy to do
that. The only requirement would be that I talk with Dennis first to be
sure that I was knowledgeable enough about his company to
Who's already used a Part 15 certification lab?
What was good or bad about your experience?
How much did the certification cost?
Would you use that lab again?
Do you want to find a certification lab?
Here's the link that I got right off of WISPA's homepage:
What I would like to know is what is the cheapest router that is
supported by OpenWRT?
I'd almost guarantee it's the Buffalo WHR-G54S. I've only one so far.
It's been at grandma's house doing a 300' link in client mode. It's
been installed almost a year now, without a hiccup (not even a
We have for years, though I am not personally involved in those
processes. Our 3-digit grantee code is LKT and all equipment
authorizations for all brands) are easily and comprehensively searchable
even if you do not know the grantee code via
All,
If you are speaking of downtown St. Louis. They already chose ATT. But
on the other hand if you are speaking of St. Louis County then that is
an awful lot to take on considering they want the vendor to eat the cost
of the hardware.
Regards,
Dawn DiPietro
George Rogato wrote:
Jack
All,
Also I forgot to mention they want to cover the whole county. But if you
read the article you already knew that and I apologize.
Regards,
Dawn DiPietro
Dawn DiPietro wrote:
All,
If you are speaking of downtown St. Louis. They already chose ATT.
But on the other hand if you are
/
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Fair warning, a post like this reflects a large ego by its very nature,
but it comes from a committed champion of WISPs none-the-lessFor
God's sake, please don't post any thanks for your efforts type
replies. I'm not fishing for them or public appreciation in general,
though I do appreciate
Patrick,
What lab does Alvarion currently use?
Do you have any specific labs that you would recommend to WISPs who may
want to get their own equipment combinations certified?
Thanks,
jack
Patrick Leary wrote:
We have for years, though I am not personally involved in those
Does anyone have any experience with either of these products and can
provide some range and speed readings NLOS and LOS? Thanks.
Sincerely,
Joshua
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Archives:
A few years ago I ran up a network design that would cover over 80% of my
whole country. Redundant feeds, high speed backhauls etc.
It would have cost around $1million. AND that would have purchased the
first 500 cpe units. It doesn't have to cost as much as people somehow seem
to keep
There is a critical difference Patrick.
WE (us, the wisps) are SPECIFICALLY asking that the whitespaces rules
include smart radio technology. It won't be easy for anyone to run illegal
networks.
laters,
marlon
- Original Message -
From: Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA
So can we get some real world data on how well it is working? Is the
terrain flat? Wooded? What kind of coverage area are you seeing? Power
levels up and down? Speeds up and down per client? Maximum CPE per
sector currently? Bandwidth used per sector? Is this 802.16 d or e?
FDD or TDD? Can
I remember clear back in 2001 or so. I was fortunate enough to have
breakfast with Michael Marcus. Patrick, i think you were there for this.
I remember him telling the story about FCC certified computers. Back in the
day, it was only legal to sell a computer as a complete certified system.
As soon as I can this info, I will answer these questions Scriv. So far we
we only see 1.5M for coverage with the current rev of software.
-Dee
Alaska Wireless Systems
1(907)240-2183 Cell
1(907)349-2226 Fax
1(907)349-4308 Office
www.akwireless.net
- Original Message -
From: John
I don't know, but I'll check and report back Jack. I know we have used
several. The standards and rules are tight for them, so I think our
decision may be based on locality. Stay tuned please.
Patrick Leary
AVP WISP Markets
Alvarion, Inc.
o: 650.314.2628
c: 760.580.0080
Vonage: 650.641.1243
Yes, but that's with the self-install indoor CPE, right? Nothing
outdoors except the wilderness :)
Patrick Leary
AVP WISP Markets
Alvarion, Inc.
o: 650.314.2628
c: 760.580.0080
Vonage: 650.641.1243
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Marlon,
Thank you for your very interesting post. I would have to say that I
agree with most of the sentiments that you've expressed. There is
however ONE point that perhaps you would clarify. You said that you have
operators in your area running illegal networks... and the WHOLE market
is
- Original Message -
From: Jack Unger [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 9:58 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] My Hypothetical Conversation with Julius Knapp,
ChiefofOET
Marlon,
Thank you for your very interesting post. I would
Marlon,
I was just trying to determine if the problems you're experiencing were
due to:
a) Equipment Certification Issues - Use of equipment that had dirty
transmitters.
b) Overpower Issues - Running too much power.
c) Uncoordinated Frequency Issues - Legal power and clean transmitters
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