Re: [WISPA] online doc sharing
And who is the NDA with? On 5/16/07, Sam Tetherow [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What part of the CALEA stuff requires an NDA? Sam Tetherow Sandhills Wireless Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 wrote: Law enforcement stuff. Google hasn't signed the needed NDA so we can't host the docs there. Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: Clint Ricker [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Cc: Principal WISPA Member List [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 2:41 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] online doc sharing Just out of curiousity, what privacy requirements are you trying to meet that aren't met by Google Docs? Thanks, Clint Ricker Kentnis Technologies On 5/16/07, Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, The calea committee needs a way to share word docs online. We need to be able to edit them etc. online so that our edits don't overlap or get left off. We'd been using google docs but due to some new privacy requirements we're unable to do that now. We have to have the same functionality on one of our servers. Anyone know how to get one of the machines set up this way? The doc needs to be stored on a secure password protected site. thanks! Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Waltonville Ethernet Run
LOL, glad to know the big guy is human too! :-) -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David E. Smith Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 1:36 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Waltonville Ethernet Run John Scrivner wrote: We need to have Ron run a new Ethernet run at Waltonville. Is there a big enough opening in the outdoor case there to terminate the Cat 5 before we send it up with Ron? Can Ron terminate Cat 5? We need to know these things before we send him up the tower obviously. This needs to be the first thing done tomorrow. Um, wrong 'wireless' list, boss. :D David Smith MVN.net -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email
Frank - Muto had a very valid reason to whin as you say it. Muto pays WISPA a good amount of $$ to be a Vendor Member of WISPA. Dee has contributed nothing other then for his own personal gain. For Dee to make an appology and then change his signature to reflect another free plug was a bit out of line I think. Either way, paying members are what are going to get things done for our organization. If a vendor is going to support us financially, then we need to stand behind them and support them in anyway possible as an organization. And if that means slapping the hands of vendors that don't pay, when they get out of line, then so be it. I don't feel Rick, George, Muto was immature or out of line in bringing this to as someone said the rubber meets the road. JohnnyO - Original Message - From: Frank Crawford [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 2:35 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email Muto whins, Rick responds, George puffs up and threatens Dee, Dee apoligies, Muto dis's the apology. Very mature guy's. - Original Message - From: Frank Muto [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 6:10 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email That was not the point and now you changed your signature to promote your products, nice. The point is that you are promoting your services, nothing wrong about it really, but pay for it. If you do not see any value in paying for the privilege to participate as a vendor sponsor of WISPA, then stop acting like one. Talking about products, pro-cons, best use, warranties etc., is all well and good. But to directly solicit business on this WISPA list-srv with a competitive product, is not an acceptable practice in my opinion. Apology not accepted. Frank Muto President FSM Marketing Group, Inc Postini Partner Reseller www.SecureEmailPlus.com ISPCON Spring 2007 May 23-25 in Orlando, FL. LaunchPad Pavilion J - Original Message - From: W.D.McKinney [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 9:37 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email Hi Frank, I was not saying anything for or against you, Postini or Barracuda. If you you took offense at my statements, my apologies. Cheers, -Dee Alaska Wireless Systems 1(907)240-2183 Cell 1(907)349-2226 Fax 1(907)349-4308 Office www.akwireless.net Barracuda Networks Diamond Reseller Imagestream Router WAN Cards Force10 Networks Reseller - Original Message - From: Frank Muto [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wed, 16 May 2007 16:55:33 -0800 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email As a PAYING supporting vendor of WISPA and co-sponsor for ISPCON, I take offense to this direct marketing of a competitive service. Last I looked on the WISPA website, neither Barracuda or Alaska Wireless Systems had a logo displayed, unless you are a paid associate vendor. Frank Muto President FSM Marketing Group, Inc Postini Partner Reseller www.SecureEmailPlus.com ISPCON Spring 2007 May 23-25 in Orlando, FL. LaunchPad Pavilion J - Original Message - From: W.D.McKinney [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Folks, As a Diamond Reseller for Barracuda Networks, we take the pain out of dealing with issues the best we can for our customers. The issue of selling a used Barracuda is like a lot of hardware vendors. It varies on which entity you are dealing with as to the answer you will get. We move customers off Postini regularly due to issues they have them, so it depends what side of the coin you are looking at. (Only the experienced walk with a limp) We also take the pain of ownership out for folks and filter e-mail for WISP's as they frequently need a lower cost solution. Cheers, -Dee Alaska Wireless Systems 1(907)240-2183 Cell 1(907)349-2226 Fax 1(907)349-4308 Office www.akwireless.net -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives:
Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email
I think Dee's input was greatly relevant to the thread. It wasn't a random post. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Frank Muto [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 7:55 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email As a PAYING supporting vendor of WISPA and co-sponsor for ISPCON, I take offense to this direct marketing of a competitive service. Last I looked on the WISPA website, neither Barracuda or Alaska Wireless Systems had a logo displayed, unless you are a paid associate vendor. Frank Muto President FSM Marketing Group, Inc Postini Partner Reseller www.SecureEmailPlus.com ISPCON Spring 2007 May 23-25 in Orlando, FL. LaunchPad Pavilion J - Original Message - From: W.D.McKinney [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Folks, As a Diamond Reseller for Barracuda Networks, we take the pain out of dealing with issues the best we can for our customers. The issue of selling a used Barracuda is like a lot of hardware vendors. It varies on which entity you are dealing with as to the answer you will get. We move customers off Postini regularly due to issues they have them, so it depends what side of the coin you are looking at. (Only the experienced walk with a limp) We also take the pain of ownership out for folks and filter e-mail for WISP's as they frequently need a lower cost solution. Cheers, -Dee Alaska Wireless Systems 1(907)240-2183 Cell 1(907)349-2226 Fax 1(907)349-4308 Office www.akwireless.net -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Waltonville Ethernet Run
I think some kind of moderation action is needed here! Any suggestions? :) Rick Harnish President OnlyInternet Broadband Wireless, Inc. 260-827-2482 Founding Member of WISPA -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Broadwick Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 7:34 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: RE: [WISPA] Waltonville Ethernet Run LOL, glad to know the big guy is human too! :-) -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David E. Smith Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 1:36 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Waltonville Ethernet Run John Scrivner wrote: We need to have Ron run a new Ethernet run at Waltonville. Is there a big enough opening in the outdoor case there to terminate the Cat 5 before we send it up with Ron? Can Ron terminate Cat 5? We need to know these things before we send him up the tower obviously. This needs to be the first thing done tomorrow. Um, wrong 'wireless' list, boss. :D David Smith MVN.net -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Waltonville Ethernet Run
I agree Harnish, but severity will all depend if Ron can actually make an ethernet cable that will fit through the pass through in the box at the base of the tower! Mac -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rick Harnish Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 7:38 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: RE: [WISPA] Waltonville Ethernet Run I think some kind of moderation action is needed here! Any suggestions? :) Rick Harnish President OnlyInternet Broadband Wireless, Inc. 260-827-2482 Founding Member of WISPA -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Broadwick Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 7:34 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: RE: [WISPA] Waltonville Ethernet Run LOL, glad to know the big guy is human too! :-) -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David E. Smith Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 1:36 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Waltonville Ethernet Run John Scrivner wrote: We need to have Ron run a new Ethernet run at Waltonville. Is there a big enough opening in the outdoor case there to terminate the Cat 5 before we send it up with Ron? Can Ron terminate Cat 5? We need to know these things before we send him up the tower obviously. This needs to be the first thing done tomorrow. Um, wrong 'wireless' list, boss. :D David Smith MVN.net -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Waltonville Ethernet Run
Sorry guys. Long day. Bad case of sleep-typing I am afraid. :-) Scriv Rick Harnish wrote: I think some kind of moderation action is needed here! Any suggestions? :) Rick Harnish President OnlyInternet Broadband Wireless, Inc. 260-827-2482 Founding Member of WISPA -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Broadwick Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 7:34 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: RE: [WISPA] Waltonville Ethernet Run LOL, glad to know the big guy is human too! :-) -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David E. Smith Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 1:36 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Waltonville Ethernet Run John Scrivner wrote: We need to have Ron run a new Ethernet run at Waltonville. Is there a big enough opening in the outdoor case there to terminate the Cat 5 before we send it up with Ron? Can Ron terminate Cat 5? We need to know these things before we send him up the tower obviously. This needs to be the first thing done tomorrow. Um, wrong 'wireless' list, boss. :D David Smith MVN.net -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
Mike does have a point here, I am a subscriber of the list, and I have pondered this as well, I have seen direct promotion and links in plenty of signatures, I don't think the link to their site is bad, you can determine the site of most posters by their address, some you can't because they use a gmail address like mine to keep my own desktop free of the amount of mail that passes through this list daily, plus I like the by-thread organization it presents. I don't feel that ANY promotion of products or services in a signature of this particular list should be allowed unless you pay for it. I do however think that a link to the mailers website would not offend the paying vendors, just not direct marketing of their products in their signature or in their posts. This would allow a list subscriber to contact another subscriber of the list without having to mail them back to their *maybe* list only address. Just my 2 cents. I'm not a paying vendor either, I just think that that makes sense. Zack On 5/17/07, Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Wow, tough crowd. Do I have to remove my company's name and link from my sig? - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Frank Muto [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 9:10 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email That was not the point and now you changed your signature to promote your products, nice. The point is that you are promoting your services, nothing wrong about it really, but pay for it. If you do not see any value in paying for the privilege to participate as a vendor sponsor of WISPA, then stop acting like one. Talking about products, pro-cons, best use, warranties etc., is all well and good. But to directly solicit business on this WISPA list-srv with a competitive product, is not an acceptable practice in my opinion. Apology not accepted. Frank Muto President FSM Marketing Group, Inc Postini Partner Reseller www.SecureEmailPlus.com ISPCON Spring 2007 May 23-25 in Orlando, FL. LaunchPad Pavilion J - Original Message - From: W.D.McKinney [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 9:37 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email Hi Frank, I was not saying anything for or against you, Postini or Barracuda. If you you took offense at my statements, my apologies. Cheers, -Dee Alaska Wireless Systems 1(907)240-2183 Cell 1(907)349-2226 Fax 1(907)349-4308 Office www.akwireless.net Barracuda Networks Diamond Reseller Imagestream Router WAN Cards Force10 Networks Reseller - Original Message - From: Frank Muto [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wed, 16 May 2007 16:55:33 -0800 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email As a PAYING supporting vendor of WISPA and co-sponsor for ISPCON, I take offense to this direct marketing of a competitive service. Last I looked on the WISPA website, neither Barracuda or Alaska Wireless Systems had a logo displayed, unless you are a paid associate vendor. Frank Muto President FSM Marketing Group, Inc Postini Partner Reseller www.SecureEmailPlus.com ISPCON Spring 2007 May 23-25 in Orlando, FL. LaunchPad Pavilion J - Original Message - From: W.D.McKinney [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Folks, As a Diamond Reseller for Barracuda Networks, we take the pain out of dealing with issues the best we can for our customers. The issue of selling a used Barracuda is like a lot of hardware vendors. It varies on which entity you are dealing with as to the answer you will get. We move customers off Postini regularly due to issues they have them, so it depends what side of the coin you are looking at. (Only the experienced walk with a limp) We also take the pain of ownership out for folks and filter e-mail for WISP's as they frequently need a lower cost solution. Cheers, -Dee Alaska Wireless Systems 1(907)240-2183 Cell 1(907)349-2226 Fax 1(907)349-4308 Office www.akwireless.net -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
Re: [WISPA] Malware monitor Device
I have seen a demo of this product and think it might work the way you are talking.. http://www.trusteli.com/business/isp.php Zack On 5/15/07, Gino Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there any device on the market that would monitor that would sit between my network and my internet feed and do this: 1-monitor customer traffic 2-identify problematic traffic(malware,storms, ect) 3- Redirect those customers to a Cleanup portal Or can it be developed with the current open source tools? (nagios,Ntop,snort)? Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Board Applications Available for Review
I won't be there, to many damn installs to little time and to think there was when I thought I would be thankful for this. :-) Oh well no party for me. But we are working on a solution. You have a Good Day now, Carl A Jeptha http://www.airnet.ca Office Phone: 905 349-2084 Office Hours: 9:00am - 5:00pm skype cajeptha Rick Harnish wrote: Peter, The WISPA Board Election is scheduled for June 15, 2007. Unfortunately, I will not be attending ISPCON this year as my daughter is graduating that Friday night. I will however be attending the Digital Cities Convention in Chicago Tuesday and Wednesday. I hate to miss ISPCON, but it just won't fit in my family schedule this time. I believe John Scrivner, Matt Larsen, Tom DeReggi and Mac Dearman will be there, I'm not sure about any others. Rick Harnish President OnlyInternet Broadband Wireless, Inc. 260-827-2482 Founding Member of WISPA -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Peter R. Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2007 11:17 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Board Applications Available for Review 11 great candidates. Just a quick thank you to the Board members for bringing WISPA along this far. Lots of forward thinking from the candidates. When's the vote? How many candidates will be at ISPCON? Rick Harnish wrote: The election for the WISPA Board is coming up in a few weeks. We have 11 applicants for 7 Board positions. These applications can be reviewed at http://nominations.wispa.org http://nominations.wispa.org/ . Election instructions will be made as the election approaches. Respectfully, Rick Harnish President OnlyInternet Broadband Wireless, Inc. 260-827-2482 Founding Member of WISPA -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email
You are right Johnny, I was not trying to be harsh, but I right to the point. As a member of the WISPA Board of Directors, you all should know that if you are a paying WISPA member I'm going to cover your back and give you as much benefit as possible. Membership has privilege. If you are a paying member of WISPA, then I'm going to back you all the way. Frank pays a 1,000.00 per year membership. He also has funded FCC trips at 500.00 per pop for those going to CALEA meetings. Aside from that he has given WISPA very expensive booth space at ISPCON, bought refreshments for the WISPA gathering and offered to buy any wisps 250.00 WISPA membership that bought his product. Nobody else has gone this far and he ain't a wisp or selling wireless anything. He just believes in our organization and sells a product that many can use to offload overhead. Dee is also a good guy, but he's not exactly paying dues of any kind. He could buy an inexpensive membership to help support this organization, but has not. But he is here and on the other lists to let you all know he is a distributor if a couple of products. I don't really have a problem with that but dues paying members come first. I say if it comes down to making a paying member happy or letting the paying member get his toes stepped on by a non paying member, I have to side with the paying member. After all that is the least WISPA can do to give back to those that support us. George JohnnyO wrote: Frank - Muto had a very valid reason to whin as you say it. Muto pays WISPA a good amount of $$ to be a Vendor Member of WISPA. Dee has contributed nothing other then for his own personal gain. For Dee to make an appology and then change his signature to reflect another free plug was a bit out of line I think. Either way, paying members are what are going to get things done for our organization. If a vendor is going to support us financially, then we need to stand behind them and support them in anyway possible as an organization. And if that means slapping the hands of vendors that don't pay, when they get out of line, then so be it. I don't feel Rick, George, Muto was immature or out of line in bringing this to as someone said the rubber meets the road. JohnnyO - Original Message - From: Frank Crawford [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 2:35 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email Muto whins, Rick responds, George puffs up and threatens Dee, Dee apoligies, Muto dis's the apology. Very mature guy's. - Original Message - From: Frank Muto [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 6:10 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email That was not the point and now you changed your signature to promote your products, nice. The point is that you are promoting your services, nothing wrong about it really, but pay for it. If you do not see any value in paying for the privilege to participate as a vendor sponsor of WISPA, then stop acting like one. Talking about products, pro-cons, best use, warranties etc., is all well and good. But to directly solicit business on this WISPA list-srv with a competitive product, is not an acceptable practice in my opinion. Apology not accepted. Frank Muto President FSM Marketing Group, Inc Postini Partner Reseller www.SecureEmailPlus.com ISPCON Spring 2007 May 23-25 in Orlando, FL. LaunchPad Pavilion J - Original Message - From: W.D.McKinney [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 9:37 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email Hi Frank, I was not saying anything for or against you, Postini or Barracuda. If you you took offense at my statements, my apologies. Cheers, -Dee Alaska Wireless Systems 1(907)240-2183 Cell 1(907)349-2226 Fax 1(907)349-4308 Office www.akwireless.net Barracuda Networks Diamond Reseller Imagestream Router WAN Cards Force10 Networks Reseller - Original Message - From: Frank Muto [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wed, 16 May 2007 16:55:33 -0800 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email As a PAYING supporting vendor of WISPA and co-sponsor for ISPCON, I take offense to this direct marketing of a competitive service. Last I looked on the WISPA website, neither Barracuda or Alaska Wireless Systems had a logo displayed, unless you are a paid associate vendor. Frank Muto President FSM Marketing Group, Inc Postini Partner Reseller www.SecureEmailPlus.com ISPCON Spring 2007 May 23-25 in Orlando, FL. LaunchPad Pavilion J - Original Message - From: W.D.McKinney [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Folks, As a Diamond Reseller for Barracuda Networks, we take the pain out of dealing with issues the best we can for our customers.
Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
Zack Kneisley wrote: I don't feel that ANY promotion of products or services in a signature of this particular list should be allowed unless you pay for it. That gets into the incredibly fuzzy question of what counts as promotion, though. Let's take the email thread, as an example. If I'm the owner of SuperDeluxeEmail and post you should use my company because it's the best, that's probably self-promotion. What if I say you should use my company because I'm a WISPA member? Is that promotion, or an advertisement of the sort WISPA has been known to offer to paying vendor members? What if I don't disclose that I own SuperDeluxeEmail? What if I'm using a sock puppet to tell people how awesome SuperDeluxeEmail is? What if, instead of being the owner of the company, I'm just a minority investor? Or merely a very satisfied customer? What if I think it's a lousy company and I want you to use their service so you'll think it's lousy and join me in publicly bad-mouthing them? There's a lot of subtle levels here. Honestly, IMO a lot of the value of this list comes from the fact that a lot of different vendors are directly, or indirectly, represented here. A little self-promotion is probably inevitable, and probably healthy. (If you can't promote yourself and your business at least a little bit, you won't be in business for very long.) Giving WISPA money doesn't (or at least shouldn't) mean that everyone walks on eggshells around your booth in the ongoing trade show that is this mailing list, and doesn't mean that we'll overlook any problems or shortcomings in your product. Conversely, if you make a good product, we won't ignore it out-of-hand because you haven't yet tithed. (We'll probably encourage you to do so, but...) If we're going to start treating some folks differently based solely upon whether they're paying members of WISPA, this list loses a lot of its value. David Smith Employed by [[ That information is not available at your security clearance, citizen. ]] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email
Our mail server is problem free. Keith at Talon built it for us. For spam and virus' we use Postini. I'm also looking at BOSS. http://intrameta.com/ Very close to the WNoc system I was involved in years ago. I've been talking to them for quite a while, I'm pretty impressed. Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: Doug Ratcliffe [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 3:12 PM Subject: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email Currently we do in-house email. We always have one problem or another with our old IMail server ,plus dealing with a spam server and antivirus... We have about 15 domains we currently host, about 150 users. Is it cost effective to outsource something this small? Also on a similar note, does anyone know of a free Exchange host out there that will download pop3 mail and Direct Push to my mobile phone? Thanks -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email
Ross, you need to come up here and use my AR-15 to do the shooting Much more fun to blow 30 small holes though the POS in a few seconds than a few big ones in a couple of minutes! big grin Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: Ross Cornett [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 3:31 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email I appreciate it, but the financial side of it has my attention. .It is truly a depreciable asset as long As I own it. I would lose that if I sold it. So, i will still shoot it... and place it in a trophy case and thenpost the video for you all to see. I will call it barracuda hunting... lol - Original Message - From: David E. Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 3:26 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email Butch Evans wrote: On Wed, 16 May 2007, Ross Cornett wrote: NOpe... worth more to me to shoot it... Not wanting to start a bidding war, but where do you draw that line? I may have a use for it, too (assuming the price is not too much). Okay, sixty dollars, but that's my final offer. :) My point really was that, since the Barracuda is just PC hardware, it's not a total loss (and probably not worth shooting). Even if you don't want to filter email with it, it still has some value. (From what I know of how they're built, I'd guess a recent Barracuda 400, which retails for about $4000, is probably worth $1000 or so from the hardware included. Paradoxically, the older ones are probably worth a bit more, as they had a hardware RAID controller instead of using Linux software RAID.) If you really were gonna shoot it (and that wasn't just a gesture of frustration), seriously, between Butch Evans and I, we'll find a good home for it (that has nothing to do with email). David Smith MVN.net -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Is ATT now a SPAMMER???
I received a SPAM e-mail for a company that offers mass e-mailing http://pws.prserv.net/describe/RFQsales.html I traced the domain back to ATT Global Services., abuse is back to ATT also. So is ATT Global Service the SPAMMER? Anyone know anything about this company? Just what we need . 1 million SPAMs for $299 and 50 million SPAMS for $3000. Thanks, Tim Kerns CV-Access, Inc. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
On Thu, 17 May 2007, Zack Kneisley wrote: I don't feel that ANY promotion of products or services in a signature of this particular list should be allowed unless you pay Not sure I'd go that far. I think email sigs are acceptable, regardless of the content or poster. I can tell you that I have a single signature file that I use and if it were not allowed on this (or some other) list, the I would just go to the trouble to not post on that list. There is value to the list members in the input of various people, regardless of their status with WISPA. However, I think the problem (in the case of what started this) was a little different. Personally, I think anything should be allowed in an email sig. I think answering questions is (and should be) allowed, even if the answer promotes a product you sell. I am a vendor member of WISPA and I sell consulting services as well as technical training for the Mikrotik RouterOS. I have been on this list since it's creation. I have been a vendor member for only a month or two. I have posted MANY answers to questions on this list, some of which were borderline advertisements. I have, also, paid for actual advertisements. If you look back through the archives, you'll see that my posts (most of them) have not been self promoting, however, I have gained MUCH value from having participated in this, and many other, lists. I think the problem that started this thread (and the original one) should have been handled offlist. I DO think, however, that blatant advertising, which WAS happening, should be kept to a minimum. I'm just glad I'm not the one who has to decide what is and is not appropriate. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ My calendar: http://tinyurl.com/y24ad6 Training Partners: http://tinyurl.com/smfkf Mikrotik Certified Consultant http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
I think the big problem here is that Dee almost never posts unless he's got something to sell folks. Naturally, people have to be able to talk about what they know. And when a person is selling a product he'd better know that better than anyone else eh? grin WISPA needs funds to accomplish anything though. And the vendor members pay 4x what the wisp members do for membership. With that comes some marketing rights and protections. Back in the day I spent quite a bit of time talking to Chris Night (anyone else remember Sparky of the isp-lists???) about how to run a good list. The most important thing is to make sure that people are on it and are there because of a perceived value to themselves. This means that folks need information, from whoever is giving it. It also needs financial support. When you start billing for ad content, those paying for it expect, and deserve, that those not paying for content won't be allowed to post ads. Especially not blatant ones. At the risk of offending folks (and none intended) I'll use Patrick and Dee as examples. Both are good guys, care about the industry, are deeply committed to what they do etc. Patrick is a paid member, Dee's not. Patrick answers general questions about issues whether he's got something to sell or not. Dee often tells people to contact him for a solution but doesn't help on list. See the difference? If you have solutions to problems, you have to offer them up, even if it doesn't benefit you directly. In this way you become a vital part of the success of the list. Personally I think one also has much more credibility. I don't usually read posts from anyone that's always hocking a product vs. giving away what he knows so that the rest of us can benefit from it. And no, I don't fall for the trick that friends use to get each other's names or products out there all of the time. I hope that Dee does join as a vendor member. I think that would be great. I also hope that Frank (and the other vendor members) can let this water run off his back. I also think that WISPA really should do a better job of policing our lists. We now have enough vendor members that we're seeing some overlap and we have more responsibilities to them. laters, Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: David E. Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 7:41 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list Zack Kneisley wrote: I don't feel that ANY promotion of products or services in a signature of this particular list should be allowed unless you pay for it. That gets into the incredibly fuzzy question of what counts as promotion, though. Let's take the email thread, as an example. If I'm the owner of SuperDeluxeEmail and post you should use my company because it's the best, that's probably self-promotion. What if I say you should use my company because I'm a WISPA member? Is that promotion, or an advertisement of the sort WISPA has been known to offer to paying vendor members? What if I don't disclose that I own SuperDeluxeEmail? What if I'm using a sock puppet to tell people how awesome SuperDeluxeEmail is? What if, instead of being the owner of the company, I'm just a minority investor? Or merely a very satisfied customer? What if I think it's a lousy company and I want you to use their service so you'll think it's lousy and join me in publicly bad-mouthing them? There's a lot of subtle levels here. Honestly, IMO a lot of the value of this list comes from the fact that a lot of different vendors are directly, or indirectly, represented here. A little self-promotion is probably inevitable, and probably healthy. (If you can't promote yourself and your business at least a little bit, you won't be in business for very long.) Giving WISPA money doesn't (or at least shouldn't) mean that everyone walks on eggshells around your booth in the ongoing trade show that is this mailing list, and doesn't mean that we'll overlook any problems or shortcomings in your product. Conversely, if you make a good product, we won't ignore it out-of-hand because you haven't yet tithed. (We'll probably encourage you to do so, but...) If we're going to start treating some folks differently based solely upon whether they're paying members of WISPA, this list loses a lot of its value. David Smith Employed by [[ That information is not available at your security clearance, citizen. ]] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
Re: [WISPA] Is ATT now a SPAMMER???
This wouldn't be the first time that ATT has been caught involved in SPAM. Anyone else remember the Blue Contracts? Big companies are all about the money first. Doing what's right second. Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: Tim Kerns [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 8:46 AM Subject: [WISPA] Is ATT now a SPAMMER??? I received a SPAM e-mail for a company that offers mass e-mailing http://pws.prserv.net/describe/RFQsales.html I traced the domain back to ATT Global Services., abuse is back to ATT also. So is ATT Global Service the SPAMMER? Anyone know anything about this company? Just what we need . 1 million SPAMs for $299 and 50 million SPAMS for $3000. Thanks, Tim Kerns CV-Access, Inc. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Waltonville Ethernet Run
LOL I'll get right on that John! hehehehehe Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: John Scrivner [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 10:15 PM Subject: [WISPA] Waltonville Ethernet Run We need to have Ron run a new Ethernet run at Waltonville. Is there a big enough opening in the outdoor case there to terminate the Cat 5 before we send it up with Ron? Can Ron terminate Cat 5? We need to know these things before we send him up the tower obviously. This needs to be the first thing done tomorrow. Scriv -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
I think that the standard e-mail signature should be allowed for any member. It is the blaent advertising that should not be allowed. Dennis On 5/17/07, Zack Kneisley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. That's what I was trying to get through as well, either enforcement of the rules or non-enforcement. Just make it equal across the board for those who do or do not pay certain dues. Zack On 5/17/07, Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I also think that WISPA really should do a better job of policing our lists. We now have enough vendor members that we're seeing some overlap and we have more responsibilities to them. laters, Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: David E. Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 7:41 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list Zack Kneisley wrote: I don't feel that ANY promotion of products or services in a signature of this particular list should be allowed unless you pay for it. That gets into the incredibly fuzzy question of what counts as promotion, though. Let's take the email thread, as an example. If I'm the owner of SuperDeluxeEmail and post you should use my company because it's the best, that's probably self-promotion. What if I say you should use my company because I'm a WISPA member? Is that promotion, or an advertisement of the sort WISPA has been known to offer to paying vendor members? What if I don't disclose that I own SuperDeluxeEmail? What if I'm using a sock puppet to tell people how awesome SuperDeluxeEmail is? What if, instead of being the owner of the company, I'm just a minority investor? Or merely a very satisfied customer? What if I think it's a lousy company and I want you to use their service so you'll think it's lousy and join me in publicly bad-mouthing them? There's a lot of subtle levels here. Honestly, IMO a lot of the value of this list comes from the fact that a lot of different vendors are directly, or indirectly, represented here. A little self-promotion is probably inevitable, and probably healthy. (If you can't promote yourself and your business at least a little bit, you won't be in business for very long.) Giving WISPA money doesn't (or at least shouldn't) mean that everyone walks on eggshells around your booth in the ongoing trade show that is this mailing list, and doesn't mean that we'll overlook any problems or shortcomings in your product. Conversely, if you make a good product, we won't ignore it out-of-hand because you haven't yet tithed. (We'll probably encourage you to do so, but...) If we're going to start treating some folks differently based solely upon whether they're paying members of WISPA, this list loses a lot of its value. David Smith Employed by [[ That information is not available at your security clearance, citizen. ]] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
Point well taken, I think I was trying to make the point that if Dee looked as if he was blatantly advertising the product by putting that service in their signature, then that *should* apply to everyone, don't you agree? I don't have a problem one way or another, I just want the rules to apply to everyone equally. I don't mind being able to advertise in my signature either. Zack Giga-Data, LLC The company that sells everything, consultant of all services, cheaper than anyone. Phone: (740)432-3130 (see what I mean) :-) On 5/17/07, Butch Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, 17 May 2007, Zack Kneisley wrote: I don't feel that ANY promotion of products or services in a signature of this particular list should be allowed unless you pay Not sure I'd go that far. I think email sigs are acceptable, regardless of the content or poster. I can tell you that I have a single signature file that I use and if it were not allowed on this (or some other) list, the I would just go to the trouble to not post on that list. There is value to the list members in the input of various people, regardless of their status with WISPA. However, I think the problem (in the case of what started this) was a little different. Personally, I think anything should be allowed in an email sig. I think answering questions is (and should be) allowed, even if the answer promotes a product you sell. I am a vendor member of WISPA and I sell consulting services as well as technical training for the Mikrotik RouterOS. I have been on this list since it's creation. I have been a vendor member for only a month or two. I have posted MANY answers to questions on this list, some of which were borderline advertisements. I have, also, paid for actual advertisements. If you look back through the archives, you'll see that my posts (most of them) have not been self promoting, however, I have gained MUCH value from having participated in this, and many other, lists. I think the problem that started this thread (and the original one) should have been handled offlist. I DO think, however, that blatant advertising, which WAS happening, should be kept to a minimum. I'm just glad I'm not the one who has to decide what is and is not appropriate. -- Butch Evans Network Engineering and Security Consulting 573-276-2879 http://www.butchevans.com/ My calendar: http://tinyurl.com/y24ad6 Training Partners: http://tinyurl.com/smfkf Mikrotik Certified Consultant http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] CALEA solutions.
Hi All, The CALEA committee is currently working on a number of possible CALEA solutions for you guys. These won't be a WISPA standard but should do the trick for you if you do get called upon before we can get a standard written. As I get these from the folks we're working with (all solutions will be either from or looked over by the CALEA committee members, no endorsements etc. blah blah blah though) on the committee I'll get them added to the WISPA CALEA page so you can easily find them again. Here's the first one I've gotten back from a committee member. Yeah, I know this only talks about one companies solution, I'll add more as I get them. Also, in light of the recent self promotion thread please direct all issues to me directly. It's MY decision to publicize the solutions that our committee members prefer. ImageStream recently released new software for its routers that can be used to perform CALEA intercepts with or without a TTP. The current ImageStream Linux distribution supports direct LEA delivery with fan-out to multiple collectors using the ATIS LAES intercept delivery protocol, which provides a safe harbor for intercept compliance. This solution also includes a collector module, which can be run on a standard Linux server to support local capture-to-disk. In the coming weeks, ImageStream plans to release a new product called Intercept Manager, which will provision intercepts remotely to comply with the CALEA confidentiality requirements that affect most midsize and large carriers. Intercept Manager will also be available with a hard drive to support capture-to-disk for those who prefer not build their own Linux systems. ImageStream routers support WAN and LAN interfaces from T1 through OC12, and ethernet over copper and fiber. Prices for the entry-level Envoy router start at $499. WISPs who already use ImageStream routers can simply upgrade to the latest ImageStream Linux distribution, which includes the tools required to perform CALEA intercepts. As an alternative to buying new production routers, WISPs may use ImageStream taps to passively tap LAN or WAN links for CALEA intercepts with legacy equipment. An ImageStream router is connected to the tap and acts as an out-of-band probe for intercept filtering and delivery. A tap and probe solution like this for a single 10/100 ethernet segment lists for under $1,300 including a year of technical support and warranty. ImageStream is also offering an intensive 1-day training seminar on its CALEA solutions, to be held concurrently with ICNA certification in Orlando, Florida on June 18th, 2007. If you have any questions about CALEA compliance solutions, please contact ImageStream at (800) 813-5123 x106 or e-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jeff Broadwick Sales Manager, ImageStream 800-813-5123 x106 (US/Can) +1 574-935-8484 x106 (Int'l) +1 574-935-8488 (Fax) Hope this helps some folks out. Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
Zack Kneisley wrote:
I don't have a problem one way or another, I just want the rules to
apply to
everyone equally. I don't mind being able to advertise in my signature
either.
I think that's the issue, though - where is the line between normal
harmless customary stuff and blatant self-promotion?
Also, that whole thing about I've used a lot of products for X and
really truly believe Y is the best X there is, and I do coincidentally
sell or service Y but that's beside the point, aka the Butch Evans
Clause. :)
David Smith
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Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
WISPA has responsibilities to the Vendor members? Yikes. Isn't WISPA responsible to the Members and Industry first? I've resisted joining as a Vendor because I disagree with the commercial nature of it all. It is not the money, but rather the principle. When WISPA was being formed, I contributed about $2,000 in direct cash and Server Licenses to induce others to pay up, yet I have never been a member, let alone a FOUNDING MEMBER as some can claim. I got real discouraged to be throwing my weight behind the whole things and the VERY FIRST act of WISPA was to allow Charles to act as if it were his private list for marketing. Why did they do that? Because Charles gave them some freebies and support. WISPA has to decide if it is an Organization that is for Vendors to market to members or is it an Organization for the Industry to represent the needs of the Industry to Government, and other regulatory bodies. This period before elections is a good time have those discussions and see where all the proposed board members sit on the various issues. I for one would support a strict no self promotion policy in ANY email. Keep it to PAID ads (if you need them at all) and limit the number of those that can be distributed. A Vendor should be happy to support the Industry and should not expect a return or special privilege. Lest people jump on me for self promotion, I'll point out that I always try and point people to our Support Forums. This list should NOT become a free support arm for ANY Vendor too lazy or incompetent to set up their own support lines. This list should be for issues that affect the Industry. Your troubles with routing or bridging or particular brand of equipment, although important to you at the time, have very little to do with the Industry in general. There are other lists for that and also Vendors should have their own solutions to help you. So, this is what my day looks like. Now I'll get back to work. We're building 4 more towers this year and I get to run the Bobcat today. It'll be fun after all. Lonnie On 5/17/07, Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think the big problem here is that Dee almost never posts unless he's got something to sell folks. Naturally, people have to be able to talk about what they know. And when a person is selling a product he'd better know that better than anyone else eh? grin WISPA needs funds to accomplish anything though. And the vendor members pay 4x what the wisp members do for membership. With that comes some marketing rights and protections. Back in the day I spent quite a bit of time talking to Chris Night (anyone else remember Sparky of the isp-lists???) about how to run a good list. The most important thing is to make sure that people are on it and are there because of a perceived value to themselves. This means that folks need information, from whoever is giving it. It also needs financial support. When you start billing for ad content, those paying for it expect, and deserve, that those not paying for content won't be allowed to post ads. Especially not blatant ones. At the risk of offending folks (and none intended) I'll use Patrick and Dee as examples. Both are good guys, care about the industry, are deeply committed to what they do etc. Patrick is a paid member, Dee's not. Patrick answers general questions about issues whether he's got something to sell or not. Dee often tells people to contact him for a solution but doesn't help on list. See the difference? If you have solutions to problems, you have to offer them up, even if it doesn't benefit you directly. In this way you become a vital part of the success of the list. Personally I think one also has much more credibility. I don't usually read posts from anyone that's always hocking a product vs. giving away what he knows so that the rest of us can benefit from it. And no, I don't fall for the trick that friends use to get each other's names or products out there all of the time. I hope that Dee does join as a vendor member. I think that would be great. I also hope that Frank (and the other vendor members) can let this water run off his back. I also think that WISPA really should do a better job of policing our lists. We now have enough vendor members that we're seeing some overlap and we have more responsibilities to them. laters, Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam - Original Message - From: David E. Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 7:41 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list Zack Kneisley wrote: I don't feel that ANY promotion of products or services in a signature of this particular list should be allowed unless you pay for it.
[WISPA] GMAIL
Just wondering, I saw a post where someone said that the GMAIL service has the ability to show messages by the topic (subject), anyone wish to enlightn me! -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE
Has anyone used this before? I normally use MT units everywhere, but I figured that I could save my customers money when they want to repeat to other buildings of theirs. Instead of setting up a 5 GHz AP with N-Streme and 5 GHz N-Streme clients, I'm looking at moving to 802.11g for everything. Someone suggested to me the High Gain 8186HP CPE and it looks like a good deal. What sort of mounting options does it have (can't tell from the pictures)? Normally I put up a UM and U-bolt it on, but my customer would like a flat-mount solution. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
I'm just glad I'm not the one who has to decide what is and is not appropriate. That would be me! You don't want my job? Come on Butch, where is your sense of spirit? Rick Harnish President OnlyInternet Broadband Wireless, Inc. 260-827-2482 Founding Member of WISPA -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Outsourced vs in-house email
John Scrivner wrote: Very good points George. Frank has definitely worked hard to show his support of WISPA and deserves our gratitude for sure. Frank, we all thank you for everything you have done and continue to do for WISPA. You are a friend to our organization and we appreciate you very much. Just so you guys all know. I see that Dee has sent in his application for Vendor Membership to WISPA. He is not paid up yet but it appears he is taking steps to put his money where his mouth is. Alls well that ends well.:-) Scriv I never once doubted Dee's integrity. He has been around us for many years and contributed to the betterment of our industry. I'm glad he is taking this approach and helping support WISPA. There is nothing worse than those who take and never give. George -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
Zack, It is totallly impractical to create and have to (somehow) manage different email files for different lists, responses to clients, etc. One email file is the only practical way to go. jack Zack Kneisley wrote: On 5/17/07, David E. Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Zack Kneisley wrote: I don't feel that ANY promotion of products or services in a signature of this particular list should be allowed unless you pay for it. That gets into the incredibly fuzzy question of what counts as promotion, though. As I put it, I think there should be a limit of what should be included in a signature due to the fact that it could and is inevitably advertising your company. Let's take the email thread, as an example. If I'm the owner of SuperDeluxeEmail and post you should use my company because it's the best, that's probably self-promotion. I agree What if I say you should use my company because I'm a WISPA member? Is that promotion, or an advertisement of the sort WISPA has been known to offer to paying vendor members? Wispa vendor based advertising is, or should be limited to the specific advertisement only based posts that that vendor has paid for. What if I don't disclose that I own SuperDeluxeEmail? Good question, this is a fuzzy type of situation, and the person is being dishonest in posting their views because it is biased. they should disclose this info. Most companies do when they report on a financial partner. Ever watch the evening news when they report on a parent company? They purposely disclose this information. What if I'm using a sock puppet to tell people how awesome SuperDeluxeEmail is? Dishonest and shoud be treated so. What if, instead of being the owner of the company, I'm just a minority investor? Or merely a very satisfied customer? Disclose it then. What if I think it's a lousy company and I want you to use their service so you'll think it's lousy and join me in publicly bad-mouthing them? Not quite sure what you mean. There's a lot of subtle levels here. Honestly, IMO a lot of the value of this list comes from the fact that a lot of different vendors are directly, or indirectly, represented here. A little self-promotion is probably inevitable, and probably healthy. (If you can't promote yourself and your business at least a little bit, you won't be in business for very long.) Rules http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless 5) No selling or self promotion allowed. Giving WISPA money doesn't (or at least shouldn't) mean that everyone walks on eggshells around your booth in the ongoing trade show that is this mailing list, and doesn't mean that we'll overlook any problems or shortcomings in your product. Conversely, if you make a good product, we won't ignore it out-of-hand because you haven't yet tithed. (We'll probably encourage you to do so, but...) Not talking about a booth, talking about direct advertisement in a community post. If we're going to start treating some folks differently based solely upon whether they're paying members of WISPA, this list loses a lot of its value. No, just no self promotion that you can buy this product through me in a general post. this doesn't mean you can't say this product is good because it does this and this It is all a little fuzzy, but I think signatures should be limited to a single link to their site, if not, the majority of the list is breaking the rules. If you don't agree, then maybe the rules need to be changed, or enforced differently. David Smith Employed by [[ That information is not available at your security clearance, citizen. ]] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Jack Unger ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. FCC License # PG-12-25133 Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993 Author of the WISP Handbook - Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs True Vendor-Neutral Wireless Consulting-Training-Troubleshooting FCC Part 15 Certification for Manufacturers and Service Providers Phone (VoIP Over Broadband Wireless) 818-227-4220 www.ask-wi.com -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
See inline comments Behalf Of Lonnie Nunweiler WISPA has responsibilities to the Vendor members? Yikes. Isn't WISPA responsible to the Members and Industry first? [Mac says:] We do have responsibilities to the paid vendors since their membership is a major form of financial support that enables/empowers us as an organization to accomplish the tasks we have before us. If we had no vendor members we wouldn't have very much capital to work with. Vendor members are a very important to us. I think that by treating our vendor members well we are putting our general membership and the industry first. The By-Laws are in place for a reason and that is to guide this organization, protect this organization and ultimately put the wireless operator in the driver's seat. I've resisted joining as a Vendor because I disagree with the commercial nature of it all. It is not the money, but rather the principle. When WISPA was being formed, I contributed about $2,000 in direct cash and Server Licenses to induce others to pay up, yet I have never been a member, let alone a FOUNDING MEMBER as some can claim. [Mac says:] Lonnie - I remember how enthused you were when we first started organizing WISPA. I don't understand what you mean by the commercial nature of it all. The only commercial part of WISPA is a paid vendor membership and I guess the collection of dues from wireless operators. How else would we ever collect enough revenue to do anything? I understand Love is free, but I understand you will love in the dark without money. I got real discouraged to be throwing my weight behind the whole things and the VERY FIRST act of WISPA was to allow Charles to act as if it were his private list for marketing. Why did they do that? Because Charles gave them some freebies and support. [Mac says:] NO - that's not even close to right and I think you know that. I am sorry if you got your feelings hurt, but if memory serves me - we all had a hand and input for the first WINOG. I don't know about anyone else, but I was thinking that this might be something for WISPA. A trade show put on by WISPA in the future. It didn't take any of us very long to realize that it was not an event that WISPA could do at the time seeing as how we didn't even have members yet - - although we did use it to get together and where the first dues (ever) were collected. I - like you and several others donated money way before there was even a due structure in place and way before WINOG 1. I didn't expect anything out of it and the only thing I wanted was to see WISPA get a start and once again - - what can you do without money? NO MONEY - NO LAWYER - - NO LAWYER - - NO BY-LAWS - - NO BY LAWS - - NO ORGANIZATION (non profit legal and all!) I THINK YOU OUGHT TO BE A VENDOR MEMBER and I think you need to be recognized as a vendor who stepped up to the plate in the EARLY days of forming up this organization with no expectation of special privileges - - just a good heart and concern for the industry! WISPA has to decide if it is an Organization that is for Vendors to market to members or is it an Organization for the Industry to represent the needs of the Industry to Government, and other Regulatory bodies. [Mac says:] That is not an issue! We aren't a money making company and I know you know this.. Will you support WISPA 100% in all of its financial dealings? I don't think you or anyone else on this list has pockets that deep. Do you think that we have no need of staff, a paid lobbyist, electricity, a building of our own in DC, Should we never have a paid President whose whole job is to lead this organization thus may stand a chance in leading the WHOLE INDUSTRY??? Trying to run WISPA (much less accomplish something) without money would be like you trying to run your business with no money! No Money - No business! This period before elections is a good time have those discussions and see where all the proposed board members sit on the various issues. [Mac says:] I agree 100% - - you see where I am standing eh? Lol I for one would support a strict no self promotion policy in ANY email. Keep it to PAID ads (if you need them at all) and limit the number of those that can be distributed. A Vendor should be happy to support the Industry and should not expect a return or special privilege. [Mac says:] I guess this will be one of those things decided by the current board. I have no trouble with email signatures as long as there are no direct advertisements attached to them. I think mine is OK, but then some of you may not due to the fact it has my VoIP companies web site attached. See below sig: Mac Dearman Maximum Access, LLC. Rayville, La. www.inetsouth.com www.radioresponse.org (Katrina relief) www.mac-tel.us (VoIP sales) 318.728.8600 318.728.9600 (I ain't through - read on) Lest people jump on me for self promotion, I'll point out that I always try and point people to
Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
Jack, Actually, that is exactly what I do, you will notice the gmail address? I have a total of seven gmail addresses that I use. Some reply with a signature, some don't. I also use Outlook that has 4 pop accounts that it checks. Two accounts it checks send the same signature one that doesn't and another that sends an entirely different signature. This is why my signature, or lack thereof, is not present when I reply to this list. I don't self promote, because the rules say I shouldn't. This method is actually the most efficient, most organized, and the easiest way to sort, search, respond and recall messages that I have ever had in place in the past 18 years of using the internet. Gopher was alot simpler back then hu? lol I don't really have a preference of a sig or no sig or the use of more than One email file. I just would like clarification of what can or cannot be done accordance with this lists rules. Zack On 5/17/07, Jack Unger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Zack, It is totallly impractical to create and have to (somehow) manage different email files for different lists, responses to clients, etc. One email file is the only practical way to go. jack Zack Kneisley wrote: On 5/17/07, David E. Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Zack Kneisley wrote: I don't feel that ANY promotion of products or services in a signature of this particular list should be allowed unless you pay for it. That gets into the incredibly fuzzy question of what counts as promotion, though. As I put it, I think there should be a limit of what should be included in a signature due to the fact that it could and is inevitably advertising your company. Let's take the email thread, as an example. If I'm the owner of SuperDeluxeEmail and post you should use my company because it's the best, that's probably self-promotion. I agree What if I say you should use my company because I'm a WISPA member? Is that promotion, or an advertisement of the sort WISPA has been known to offer to paying vendor members? Wispa vendor based advertising is, or should be limited to the specific advertisement only based posts that that vendor has paid for. What if I don't disclose that I own SuperDeluxeEmail? Good question, this is a fuzzy type of situation, and the person is being dishonest in posting their views because it is biased. they should disclose this info. Most companies do when they report on a financial partner. Ever watch the evening news when they report on a parent company? They purposely disclose this information. What if I'm using a sock puppet to tell people how awesome SuperDeluxeEmail is? Dishonest and shoud be treated so. What if, instead of being the owner of the company, I'm just a minority investor? Or merely a very satisfied customer? Disclose it then. What if I think it's a lousy company and I want you to use their service so you'll think it's lousy and join me in publicly bad-mouthing them? Not quite sure what you mean. There's a lot of subtle levels here. Honestly, IMO a lot of the value of this list comes from the fact that a lot of different vendors are directly, or indirectly, represented here. A little self-promotion is probably inevitable, and probably healthy. (If you can't promote yourself and your business at least a little bit, you won't be in business for very long.) Rules http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless 5) No selling or self promotion allowed. Giving WISPA money doesn't (or at least shouldn't) mean that everyone walks on eggshells around your booth in the ongoing trade show that is this mailing list, and doesn't mean that we'll overlook any problems or shortcomings in your product. Conversely, if you make a good product, we won't ignore it out-of-hand because you haven't yet tithed. (We'll probably encourage you to do so, but...) Not talking about a booth, talking about direct advertisement in a community post. If we're going to start treating some folks differently based solely upon whether they're paying members of WISPA, this list loses a lot of its value. No, just no self promotion that you can buy this product through me in a general post. this doesn't mean you can't say this product is good because it does this and this It is all a little fuzzy, but I think signatures should be limited to a single link to their site, if not, the majority of the list is breaking the rules. If you don't agree, then maybe the rules need to be changed, or enforced differently. David Smith Employed by [[ That information is not available at your security clearance, citizen. ]] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Jack Unger ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. FCC License # PG-12-25133 Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993 Author of the WISP
Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
Zack, I salute you for your integrity and your ability to manage 11 email accounts. I, on the other hand, in my waking hours between 6 AM and 2 AM barely have the ability to keep up with email on a single Thunderbird email account. For me, practicality wins the day and I'll continue to try and manage and use one main email account that appends one sig file. I do agree that clarification of the rules is important long as we don't get into so much hairsplitting that life becomes totally impractical (well, not any more impractical than it already is anyway) :) Best Regards, jack Zack Kneisley wrote: Jack, Actually, that is exactly what I do, you will notice the gmail address? I have a total of seven gmail addresses that I use. Some reply with a signature, some don't. I also use Outlook that has 4 pop accounts that it checks. Two accounts it checks send the same signature one that doesn't and another that sends an entirely different signature. This is why my signature, or lack thereof, is not present when I reply to this list. I don't self promote, because the rules say I shouldn't. This method is actually the most efficient, most organized, and the easiest way to sort, search, respond and recall messages that I have ever had in place in the past 18 years of using the internet. Gopher was alot simpler back then hu? lol I don't really have a preference of a sig or no sig or the use of more than One email file. I just would like clarification of what can or cannot be done accordance with this lists rules. Zack On 5/17/07, Jack Unger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Zack, It is totallly impractical to create and have to (somehow) manage different email files for different lists, responses to clients, etc. One email file is the only practical way to go. jack Zack Kneisley wrote: On 5/17/07, David E. Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Zack Kneisley wrote: I don't feel that ANY promotion of products or services in a signature of this particular list should be allowed unless you pay for it. That gets into the incredibly fuzzy question of what counts as promotion, though. As I put it, I think there should be a limit of what should be included in a signature due to the fact that it could and is inevitably advertising your company. Let's take the email thread, as an example. If I'm the owner of SuperDeluxeEmail and post you should use my company because it's the best, that's probably self-promotion. I agree What if I say you should use my company because I'm a WISPA member? Is that promotion, or an advertisement of the sort WISPA has been known to offer to paying vendor members? Wispa vendor based advertising is, or should be limited to the specific advertisement only based posts that that vendor has paid for. What if I don't disclose that I own SuperDeluxeEmail? Good question, this is a fuzzy type of situation, and the person is being dishonest in posting their views because it is biased. they should disclose this info. Most companies do when they report on a financial partner. Ever watch the evening news when they report on a parent company? They purposely disclose this information. What if I'm using a sock puppet to tell people how awesome SuperDeluxeEmail is? Dishonest and shoud be treated so. What if, instead of being the owner of the company, I'm just a minority investor? Or merely a very satisfied customer? Disclose it then. What if I think it's a lousy company and I want you to use their service so you'll think it's lousy and join me in publicly bad-mouthing them? Not quite sure what you mean. There's a lot of subtle levels here. Honestly, IMO a lot of the value of this list comes from the fact that a lot of different vendors are directly, or indirectly, represented here. A little self-promotion is probably inevitable, and probably healthy. (If you can't promote yourself and your business at least a little bit, you won't be in business for very long.) Rules http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless 5) No selling or self promotion allowed. Giving WISPA money doesn't (or at least shouldn't) mean that everyone walks on eggshells around your booth in the ongoing trade show that is this mailing list, and doesn't mean that we'll overlook any problems or shortcomings in your product. Conversely, if you make a good product, we won't ignore it out-of-hand because you haven't yet tithed. (We'll probably encourage you to do so, but...) Not talking about a booth, talking about direct advertisement in a community post. If we're going to start treating some folks differently based solely upon whether they're paying members of WISPA, this list loses a lot of its value. No, just no self promotion that you can buy this product through me in a general post. this doesn't mean you can't say this product is good because it does this and this It is all a little fuzzy, but I think
[WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
(In response to Lonnie and Mac) 1) It takes money for an organization to do things. Sometimes vendors put up that money so that their customer base thrives. (Some times they do not). 2) It's always hard to get dues-paying members, especially when the most value is the listserv. (Again, it ought to cost something to be here. If they want free, go to ISP-Wireless). 3) Be careful how you represent your relationship to vendors. This is how one org received the reputation for being an RBOC tool. You need a pro-member reputation. 4) That said, how many people on this list post more than once a week and are NOT members? How many lurk - read every message - but aren't members? 5) Most here don't understand the energy, effort, time and money it takes to run an association. If you give a hoot at all, you spend 2 to 5 hours daily on issues, messages, board and committee stuff. Then travel to DC. Travel to some shows to get the WISPA name under the lights. PR costs money, but to date are we doing any? Rent, utilities and salary even for a part-time administrator would be $30K per year (if outsourced to a certified association management company). 6) The problem becomes when there are parties here who do not 100% agree with the direction of the org. (And we have seen that problem recently). Unfortunately, the answer for those that do not whole-heartedly agree is to pack their stuff and leave. (Now that is real adult). This association is by and for the members -- to do everything to help you thrive and survive. You as WISP's have responsibilities too - to comment, join, volunteer, steer, and row the boat. If you don't want to do any (some) of that, why get mad at the people and the direction? What did you do to steer? [Note} And PLEASE don't give me the I'm-too-freaking-busy or I'm-too-poor to help. That is an excuse. If you use excuses, then you might as well close shop now. Just fess up: I'm too selfish or It is easier to be a back seat driver. (As a back seat driver, you don't pay for gas, can point out all the short comings, and claim you weren't steering.) 7) If you are going to be in the Wireless Broadband Industry next year, join WISPA now. The more members, the more voice. Plus you get to vote for the new board. 7b) If you aren't going to join, and continue to be a free-loader, then don't complain that you don't like the direction. No potshots from the bleachers, okay? If you don't like something, volunteer to work on it. Be a part of the Solution, not a piece of the problem. Whew! Now, go sign up a customer, so you can join WISPA, since one client will pay for your membership dues. Peter Radizeski RAD-INFO, Inc. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Johnny O
Call me. 516 551 1131 Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
I think that WISPA does a great job policing its list. It ain't easy -- and there are many shades of gray. I for one think that you should have to pay 'something' to be involved on the lists. Either actually $ or advice points. (Many other forums use this method). Or have a fine for crossing the line. For instance, if Dee did cross the line, he is fined or bounced. To get back on, he has to join as a member. I try not to use a sig file here. But then Patrick and a few others pointed out that without one, no branding - and people don't associate other stuff to the P.I.T.A. on the lists :) Regards, Peter Radizeski @ RAD-INFO, Inc. http://4isps.com Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 wrote: I hope that Dee does join as a vendor member. I think that would be great. I also hope that Frank (and the other vendor members) can let this water run off his back. I also think that WISPA really should do a better job of policing our lists. We now have enough vendor members that we're seeing some overlap and we have more responsibilities to them. laters, Marlon -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE
I have a stack of High-Gain CPEs that don't work. Just a FYI. We also waited a bit over a MONTH to get the first order. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 12:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE Has anyone used this before? I normally use MT units everywhere, but I figured that I could save my customers money when they want to repeat to other buildings of theirs. Instead of setting up a 5 GHz AP with N-Streme and 5 GHz N-Streme clients, I'm looking at moving to 802.11g for everything. Someone suggested to me the High Gain 8186HP CPE and it looks like a good deal. What sort of mounting options does it have (can't tell from the pictures)? Normally I put up a UM and U-bolt it on, but my customer would like a flat-mount solution. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] GMAIL
I was thinking it would look like newsgroups or something,g that has a little plus that drills down the replies etc. I have it working the way you have it. Still trying to get it to capture EVERYTHING from WISPA. .etc. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zack Kneisley Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 1:26 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] GMAIL It does. It's very nice for lists.. actually the best I have ever used. The 2853MB of space doesn't hurt either. I'm not sure how to get it to work that way, but it does it for me Zack On 5/17/07, Dennis Burgess [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Just wondering, I saw a post where someone said that the GMAIL service has the ability to show messages by the topic (subject), anyone wish to enlightn me! -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] GMAIL
Any way to tell it to MOVE them into the lable, not just sit in the inbox? On 5/17/07, Dennis Burgess - 2K Wireless [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was thinking it would look like newsgroups or something,g that has a little plus that drills down the replies etc. I have it working the way you have it. Still trying to get it to capture EVERYTHING from WISPA. .etc. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zack Kneisley Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 1:26 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] GMAIL It does. It's very nice for lists.. actually the best I have ever used. The 2853MB of space doesn't hurt either. I'm not sure how to get it to work that way, but it does it for me Zack On 5/17/07, Dennis Burgess [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Just wondering, I saw a post where someone said that the GMAIL service has the ability to show messages by the topic (subject), anyone wish to enlightn me! -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
I would agree! Hear hear! :) I do get good ads from them too! On 5/17/07, Peter R. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think that WISPA does a great job policing its list. It ain't easy -- and there are many shades of gray. I for one think that you should have to pay 'something' to be involved on the lists. Either actually $ or advice points. (Many other forums use this method). Or have a fine for crossing the line. For instance, if Dee did cross the line, he is fined or bounced. To get back on, he has to join as a member. I try not to use a sig file here. But then Patrick and a few others pointed out that without one, no branding - and people don't associate other stuff to the P.I.T.A. on the lists :) Regards, Peter Radizeski @ RAD-INFO, Inc. http://4isps.com Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 wrote: I hope that Dee does join as a vendor member. I think that would be great. I also hope that Frank (and the other vendor members) can let this water run off his back. I also think that WISPA really should do a better job of policing our lists. We now have enough vendor members that we're seeing some overlap and we have more responsibilities to them. laters, Marlon -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
Zack Kneisley wrote: Jack, Actually, that is exactly what I do, you will notice the gmail address? I have a total of seven gmail addresses that I use. Some reply with a signature, some don't. I also use Outlook that has 4 pop accounts that it checks. Two accounts it checks send the same signature one that doesn't and another that sends an entirely different signature. This is why my signature, or lack thereof, is not present when I reply to this list. I don't self promote, because the rules say I shouldn't. This method is actually the most efficient, most organized, and the easiest way to sort, search, respond and recall messages that I have ever had in place in the past 18 years of using the internet. Gopher was alot simpler back then hu? lol I don't really have a preference of a sig or no sig or the use of more than One email file. I just would like clarification of what can or cannot be done accordance with this lists rules. Zack That is alot of email accounts. I limit myself to two accounts that I actively check. My work account and my personal account. If I have a list I am involved in, I filter by the list-id header. If I am signing up for something I use the the email address tagging (rfc 2822) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Those two features plus some filter rules works really nice to keep my inbox clean. There are a few sites that, do not like the + sign, those are generally spammy site and I dump them to a throwaway account. btw, gmail does support the +tag. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE
What cheap CPE would you recommend, then? 802.11g, outdoor, integrated Going 150' through a couple trees to the house from the shop. At the house is a MT RB112 that is a 5 GHz CPE and planning on being an 802.11g AP with an 8 dbi omni. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Dennis Burgess - 2K Wireless [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 1:32 PM Subject: RE: [WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE I have a stack of High-Gain CPEs that don't work. Just a FYI. We also waited a bit over a MONTH to get the first order. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 12:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE Has anyone used this before? I normally use MT units everywhere, but I figured that I could save my customers money when they want to repeat to other buildings of theirs. Instead of setting up a 5 GHz AP with N-Streme and 5 GHz N-Streme clients, I'm looking at moving to 802.11g for everything. Someone suggested to me the High Gain 8186HP CPE and it looks like a good deal. What sort of mounting options does it have (can't tell from the pictures)? Normally I put up a UM and U-bolt it on, but my customer would like a flat-mount solution. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE
They are a standard universal mount. My biggest gripe is the fact that you have to order them Vertical vs Horizontal due to the ethernet passthrough. I have had issues with them disconnecting from the tower but they do have a watchdog feature which will reboot them when they do. Sam Tetherow Sandhills Wireless Mike Hammett wrote: Has anyone used this before? I normally use MT units everywhere, but I figured that I could save my customers money when they want to repeat to other buildings of theirs. Instead of setting up a 5 GHz AP with N-Streme and 5 GHz N-Streme clients, I'm looking at moving to 802.11g for everything. Someone suggested to me the High Gain 8186HP CPE and it looks like a good deal. What sort of mounting options does it have (can't tell from the pictures)? Normally I put up a UM and U-bolt it on, but my customer would like a flat-mount solution. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE
Did you call to RMA them? I do know that they had a batch that had bad boards in them. I guess the board manufacturer changed something on the board, but didn't notify them of the change. Sam Tetherow Sandhills Wireless Dennis Burgess - 2K Wireless wrote: I have a stack of High-Gain CPEs that don't work. Just a FYI. We also waited a bit over a MONTH to get the first order. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 12:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE Has anyone used this before? I normally use MT units everywhere, but I figured that I could save my customers money when they want to repeat to other buildings of theirs. Instead of setting up a 5 GHz AP with N-Streme and 5 GHz N-Streme clients, I'm looking at moving to 802.11g for everything. Someone suggested to me the High Gain 8186HP CPE and it looks like a good deal. What sort of mounting options does it have (can't tell from the pictures)? Normally I put up a UM and U-bolt it on, but my customer would like a flat-mount solution. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE
Another MT would be great, we constantly use TenX Radios from Jeffco SOHO, 250mw at 19db, for around 240 or so. Every feature needed is in it, DHCP, NAT, BW Shaping, throttling, borrowed BW, B/G too. Thats what we use as they work, and also helps that Jeffco is about 5 min from my house! lol We just had bad luck with High Gains, maybe they will work for you, they mostly worked out of the box.Put them up for a month or so, and caput. Dennis On 5/17/07, Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What cheap CPE would you recommend, then? 802.11g, outdoor, integrated Going 150' through a couple trees to the house from the shop. At the house is a MT RB112 that is a 5 GHz CPE and planning on being an 802.11g AP with an 8 dbi omni. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Dennis Burgess - 2K Wireless [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 1:32 PM Subject: RE: [WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE I have a stack of High-Gain CPEs that don't work. Just a FYI. We also waited a bit over a MONTH to get the first order. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 12:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE Has anyone used this before? I normally use MT units everywhere, but I figured that I could save my customers money when they want to repeat to other buildings of theirs. Instead of setting up a 5 GHz AP with N-Streme and 5 GHz N-Streme clients, I'm looking at moving to 802.11g for everything. Someone suggested to me the High Gain 8186HP CPE and it looks like a good deal. What sort of mounting options does it have (can't tell from the pictures)? Normally I put up a UM and U-bolt it on, but my customer would like a flat-mount solution. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] GMAIL
Set the filter to Archive them as well as labelling them. Mark Dennis Burgess wrote: Any way to tell it to MOVE them into the lable, not just sit in the inbox? On 5/17/07, Dennis Burgess - 2K Wireless [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was thinking it would look like newsgroups or something,g that has a little plus that drills down the replies etc. I have it working the way you have it. Still trying to get it to capture EVERYTHING from WISPA. .etc. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zack Kneisley Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 1:26 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] GMAIL It does. It's very nice for lists.. actually the best I have ever used. The 2853MB of space doesn't hurt either. I'm not sure how to get it to work that way, but it does it for me Zack On 5/17/07, Dennis Burgess [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Just wondering, I saw a post where someone said that the GMAIL service has the ability to show messages by the topic (subject), anyone wish to enlightn me! -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
I'm going out on a limb and will voice some things that have been suppressed. I get your point that you think I am a freeloader and do not contribute. My problem for not joining is not a money one, but rather one of principle. I did get involved early on and saw that there was still an old guard of the good old boys. They played favorites early on and still do. Is it proper to support that? It would be very BAD for the Industry if one were to push and fight the GOB's, but, and this in not an excuse, I do not have to time for such fights. There are other more important things to do, so I lurk, and occasionally chime in when I feel something has been really missed or has gone overboard. It is better for me not to get into fights and the Organization does need that either. Do I support WISPA? Partly. When things like CALEA come up and people are sent to talk with the FBI and FCC, what is their game plan? What are they trying to do for the membership? All I saw was a few people were star struck that they actually talked the HEAD of the FBI for CALEA. BIG DEAL. Those people put their pants on one leg at a time like we all do. Did you tell these guys what would be best for the Industry? Did you even know what was good for the Industry? Or did you take your hat in your hand and come back and use all sort of tactics to get people to sign that they would be ready for CALEA compliance, when in fact nobody even knew what that would require? I feel that WISPA should have taken a much harder line on that and other issues. Any members who spoke against what the FBI and FCC told the WISPA group were quickly put down and isolated. It was disgusting to watch. It certainly was not a functioning democracy. It was pretty heavy handed. In short, I have not seen the organization really go to bat for the membership. I can only imagine the crap that would hit the fan if the FBI and FCC were to give the Telcos the same sort of treatment with regards to time and unknown requirements that they gave to the WISPA people. Sure you don't have the funds, but do you compromise everything until you get the funds? Or do you stand up for what is right and people either support you or not? My suspicion is you'll get the support if you represent what people want. People vote with their feet and pocketbooks. I've seen a lot of good people leave. I've seen a lot of good people forced out because the GOB's could not stand them. And I've seen a lot of good people (mostly everybody on this list) not support WISPA financially. Does that tell you anything? No you don't need more Vendors, you need a reality check so you can get more members. This whole idea that you need more Vendors because they pay the most is, well, so commercial sounding. I'm sure that business principles have to be used to run and account for things, but to raise money? No, that should not be a business. Lonnie On 5/17/07, Peter R. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (In response to Lonnie and Mac) 1) It takes money for an organization to do things. Sometimes vendors put up that money so that their customer base thrives. (Some times they do not). 2) It's always hard to get dues-paying members, especially when the most value is the listserv. (Again, it ought to cost something to be here. If they want free, go to ISP-Wireless). 3) Be careful how you represent your relationship to vendors. This is how one org received the reputation for being an RBOC tool. You need a pro-member reputation. 4) That said, how many people on this list post more than once a week and are NOT members? How many lurk - read every message - but aren't members? 5) Most here don't understand the energy, effort, time and money it takes to run an association. If you give a hoot at all, you spend 2 to 5 hours daily on issues, messages, board and committee stuff. Then travel to DC. Travel to some shows to get the WISPA name under the lights. PR costs money, but to date are we doing any? Rent, utilities and salary even for a part-time administrator would be $30K per year (if outsourced to a certified association management company). 6) The problem becomes when there are parties here who do not 100% agree with the direction of the org. (And we have seen that problem recently). Unfortunately, the answer for those that do not whole-heartedly agree is to pack their stuff and leave. (Now that is real adult). This association is by and for the members -- to do everything to help you thrive and survive. You as WISP's have responsibilities too - to comment, join, volunteer, steer, and row the boat. If you don't want to do any (some) of that, why get mad at the people and the direction? What did you do to steer? [Note} And PLEASE don't give me the I'm-too-freaking-busy or I'm-too-poor to help. That is an excuse. If you use excuses, then you might as well close shop now. Just fess up: I'm too selfish or It is easier to be a back seat driver. (As a back seat driver, you don't pay for
Re: [WISPA] GMAIL
no, just clicking on the actual label text on the left, but I don't use the label option much. I love the archive button though. Gets alot of clutter out of the way. Zack On 5/17/07, Dennis Burgess [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Any way to tell it to MOVE them into the lable, not just sit in the inbox? On 5/17/07, Dennis Burgess - 2K Wireless [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was thinking it would look like newsgroups or something,g that has a little plus that drills down the replies etc. I have it working the way you have it. Still trying to get it to capture EVERYTHING from WISPA. .etc. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zack Kneisley Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 1:26 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] GMAIL It does. It's very nice for lists.. actually the best I have ever used. The 2853MB of space doesn't hurt either. I'm not sure how to get it to work that way, but it does it for me Zack On 5/17/07, Dennis Burgess [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Just wondering, I saw a post where someone said that the GMAIL service has the ability to show messages by the topic (subject), anyone wish to enlightn me! -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE
Yep, I understand. When I needed radios, and I had to wait a month to get them, and when I called and they said thye would be here within a day or two and they did not come, etc. I don't mind paying for the radios as right now I am buy one, and its done. On 5/17/07, Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: These are $126 after SH. :-p I'm at about $195 + SH for MT units. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Dennis Burgess [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 1:51 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE Another MT would be great, we constantly use TenX Radios from Jeffco SOHO, 250mw at 19db, for around 240 or so. Every feature needed is in it, DHCP, NAT, BW Shaping, throttling, borrowed BW, B/G too. Thats what we use as they work, and also helps that Jeffco is about 5 min from my house! lol We just had bad luck with High Gains, maybe they will work for you, they mostly worked out of the box.Put them up for a month or so, and caput. Dennis On 5/17/07, Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What cheap CPE would you recommend, then? 802.11g, outdoor, integrated Going 150' through a couple trees to the house from the shop. At the house is a MT RB112 that is a 5 GHz CPE and planning on being an 802.11g AP with an 8 dbi omni. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Dennis Burgess - 2K Wireless [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 1:32 PM Subject: RE: [WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE I have a stack of High-Gain CPEs that don't work. Just a FYI. We also waited a bit over a MONTH to get the first order. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 12:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] High Gain 8186HP CPE Has anyone used this before? I normally use MT units everywhere, but I figured that I could save my customers money when they want to repeat to other buildings of theirs. Instead of setting up a 5 GHz AP with N-Streme and 5 GHz N-Streme clients, I'm looking at moving to 802.11g for everything. Someone suggested to me the High Gain 8186HP CPE and it looks like a good deal. What sort of mounting options does it have (can't tell from the pictures)? Normally I put up a UM and U-bolt it on, but my customer would like a flat-mount solution. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] GMAIL
The archive was nice. I like the lables, keeps everythign string. Wish they had a little plus or something to see the thread without going into it. On 5/17/07, Zack Kneisley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: no, just clicking on the actual label text on the left, but I don't use the label option much. I love the archive button though. Gets alot of clutter out of the way. Zack On 5/17/07, Dennis Burgess [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Any way to tell it to MOVE them into the lable, not just sit in the inbox? On 5/17/07, Dennis Burgess - 2K Wireless [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was thinking it would look like newsgroups or something,g that has a little plus that drills down the replies etc. I have it working the way you have it. Still trying to get it to capture EVERYTHING from WISPA. .etc. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zack Kneisley Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 1:26 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] GMAIL It does. It's very nice for lists.. actually the best I have ever used. The 2853MB of space doesn't hurt either. I'm not sure how to get it to work that way, but it does it for me Zack On 5/17/07, Dennis Burgess [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Just wondering, I saw a post where someone said that the GMAIL service has the ability to show messages by the topic (subject), anyone wish to enlightn me! -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: Your troubles with routing or bridging or particular brand of equipment, although important to you at the time, have very little to do with the Industry in general. That is your opinion. Mine is that using this list for any tech support, financial help, legal, regulatory , etc. is wide open and makes for interesting reading most of the time. That is why I am a member of the public list. I sign up for other lists in WISPA for various specific issues which are dedicated to building the industry like the [EMAIL PROTECTED] list, the [EMAIL PROTECTED] list and the [EMAIL PROTECTED] list. Membership has its privileges whether you want to believe it or not. I still do not understand why you think it is rational to ask for WISPA to do this or that but feel no need to support us as a member now after we worked this hard to build the association. I think most of our members see great value in what we do. I know I do. Scriv -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
Lonnie, I've been quiet through this whole thing, but I have to speak up here. CALEA is a reality here, and I believe that something like it will soon be a reality in Canada. Shouting at the Capitol building from outside the fence may feel good, but it gets nothing accomplished. The FACT is that if you want to be a service provider you need to have a plan for CALEA compliance. It's everyone's right to say that it doesn't apply to them, but that doesn't make them correct...and if they say it loud and often enough, others may get the wrong idea as well. We are involved heavily on the CALEA committee. Has everything gone exactly the way we would like? No, but that's the nature of any committee (and Wispa is really a large committee), and we are ok with that. Overall, we've been pleased to be part of forming Wispa's direction for CALEA compliance. I believe that we are further along in our efforts, and that Wispa is further along in the overall effort, because we joined in the process. I don't think you are a freeloader. Everything I see and hear says that you are a great guy and a fine businessman. You have been contributing to lists for years and anyone who has been around knows that. I hope that you join in, you'd be a terrific addition to the team. Jeff -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lonnie Nunweiler Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 2:55 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list I'm going out on a limb and will voice some things that have been suppressed. I get your point that you think I am a freeloader and do not contribute. My problem for not joining is not a money one, but rather one of principle. I did get involved early on and saw that there was still an old guard of the good old boys. They played favorites early on and still do. Is it proper to support that? It would be very BAD for the Industry if one were to push and fight the GOB's, but, and this in not an excuse, I do not have to time for such fights. There are other more important things to do, so I lurk, and occasionally chime in when I feel something has been really missed or has gone overboard. It is better for me not to get into fights and the Organization does need that either. Do I support WISPA? Partly. When things like CALEA come up and people are sent to talk with the FBI and FCC, what is their game plan? What are they trying to do for the membership? All I saw was a few people were star struck that they actually talked the HEAD of the FBI for CALEA. BIG DEAL. Those people put their pants on one leg at a time like we all do. Did you tell these guys what would be best for the Industry? Did you even know what was good for the Industry? Or did you take your hat in your hand and come back and use all sort of tactics to get people to sign that they would be ready for CALEA compliance, when in fact nobody even knew what that would require? I feel that WISPA should have taken a much harder line on that and other issues. Any members who spoke against what the FBI and FCC told the WISPA group were quickly put down and isolated. It was disgusting to watch. It certainly was not a functioning democracy. It was pretty heavy handed. In short, I have not seen the organization really go to bat for the membership. I can only imagine the crap that would hit the fan if the FBI and FCC were to give the Telcos the same sort of treatment with regards to time and unknown requirements that they gave to the WISPA people. Sure you don't have the funds, but do you compromise everything until you get the funds? Or do you stand up for what is right and people either support you or not? My suspicion is you'll get the support if you represent what people want. People vote with their feet and pocketbooks. I've seen a lot of good people leave. I've seen a lot of good people forced out because the GOB's could not stand them. And I've seen a lot of good people (mostly everybody on this list) not support WISPA financially. Does that tell you anything? No you don't need more Vendors, you need a reality check so you can get more members. This whole idea that you need more Vendors because they pay the most is, well, so commercial sounding. I'm sure that business principles have to be used to run and account for things, but to raise money? No, that should not be a business. Lonnie On 5/17/07, Peter R. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (In response to Lonnie and Mac) 1) It takes money for an organization to do things. Sometimes vendors put up that money so that their customer base thrives. (Some times they do not). 2) It's always hard to get dues-paying members, especially when the most value is the listserv. (Again, it ought to cost something to be here. If they want free, go to ISP-Wireless). 3) Be careful how you represent your relationship to vendors. This is how one org
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
I am not saying that CALEA is not real and I actually agree that is required, BUT, did the group have to agree with the rushed timing and especially agree to meet a standard that was not even defined? They could have argued for some prior consultation to make sure the requirements were not a hardship for their membership. They owed that duty to the members. Instead they mostly tried to beat up anybody who spoke against any aspect of it, and as you just tried, to say the speaker uppers were acting like hippies from the 60's and merely wasting time. I believe in Government and Anarchy would be horrible, so at some point Government must be prepared to listen to people, especially an organization that purports to represent a large group of people. That is WISPA and that was what the group was organized for. Heck, to come back from that meeting and simply parrot everything that had been told to the committee was a waste of time and money to even go to the meeting. To achieve what they achieved could have been done with a conference call, or simply done nothing. The Telcos would never have sent a group and accepted an outcome like that. I'll drop back to lurk mode now. The level of hurt feelings is growing, as evidenced by my private in basket. Lonnie On 5/17/07, Jeff Broadwick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Lonnie, I've been quiet through this whole thing, but I have to speak up here. CALEA is a reality here, and I believe that something like it will soon be a reality in Canada. Shouting at the Capitol building from outside the fence may feel good, but it gets nothing accomplished. The FACT is that if you want to be a service provider you need to have a plan for CALEA compliance. It's everyone's right to say that it doesn't apply to them, but that doesn't make them correct...and if they say it loud and often enough, others may get the wrong idea as well. We are involved heavily on the CALEA committee. Has everything gone exactly the way we would like? No, but that's the nature of any committee (and Wispa is really a large committee), and we are ok with that. Overall, we've been pleased to be part of forming Wispa's direction for CALEA compliance. I believe that we are further along in our efforts, and that Wispa is further along in the overall effort, because we joined in the process. I don't think you are a freeloader. Everything I see and hear says that you are a great guy and a fine businessman. You have been contributing to lists for years and anyone who has been around knows that. I hope that you join in, you'd be a terrific addition to the team. Jeff -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lonnie Nunweiler Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 2:55 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list I'm going out on a limb and will voice some things that have been suppressed. I get your point that you think I am a freeloader and do not contribute. My problem for not joining is not a money one, but rather one of principle. I did get involved early on and saw that there was still an old guard of the good old boys. They played favorites early on and still do. Is it proper to support that? It would be very BAD for the Industry if one were to push and fight the GOB's, but, and this in not an excuse, I do not have to time for such fights. There are other more important things to do, so I lurk, and occasionally chime in when I feel something has been really missed or has gone overboard. It is better for me not to get into fights and the Organization does need that either. Do I support WISPA? Partly. When things like CALEA come up and people are sent to talk with the FBI and FCC, what is their game plan? What are they trying to do for the membership? All I saw was a few people were star struck that they actually talked the HEAD of the FBI for CALEA. BIG DEAL. Those people put their pants on one leg at a time like we all do. Did you tell these guys what would be best for the Industry? Did you even know what was good for the Industry? Or did you take your hat in your hand and come back and use all sort of tactics to get people to sign that they would be ready for CALEA compliance, when in fact nobody even knew what that would require? I feel that WISPA should have taken a much harder line on that and other issues. Any members who spoke against what the FBI and FCC told the WISPA group were quickly put down and isolated. It was disgusting to watch. It certainly was not a functioning democracy. It was pretty heavy handed. In short, I have not seen the organization really go to bat for the membership. I can only imagine the crap that would hit the fan if the FBI and FCC were to give the Telcos the same sort of treatment with regards to time and unknown requirements that they gave to the WISPA people. Sure you don't have the funds, but do you compromise everything
[WISPA] Ethernet over 328ft
The Ethernet spec is for a maximum cable run of 328ft. What is the the spec limits it to this distance, timing, cable resistance? I need to do an outdoor run of 350-400ft, not real keen on fiber as I then need to power a converter and I have doubts of a converter that will with stand the cold being available. It is a critical cable run. I don't need the full 100mb. Any feed back, ideas, or experience would be great. Erik -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Ethernet over 328ft
the spec 328 is for 100meg, you can go considerably farther with 10meg, plus I have 440 foot right next to AC power, without issues at 100meg. Quality cable helps, shielded etc. On 5/17/07, Erik Jansson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The Ethernet spec is for a maximum cable run of 328ft. What is the the spec limits it to this distance, timing, cable resistance? I need to do an outdoor run of 350-400ft, not real keen on fiber as I then need to power a converter and I have doubts of a converter that will with stand the cold being available. It is a critical cable run. I don't need the full 100mb. Any feed back, ideas, or experience would be great. Erik -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: My suspicion is you'll get the support if you represent what people want. People vote with their feet and pocketbooks. I've seen a lot of good people leave. I've seen a lot of good people forced out because the GOB's could not stand them. And I've seen a lot of good people (mostly everybody on this list) not support WISPA financially. You know Lonnie, I consider you a friend of mine, but I just can't say that I have seen that many people leave. I have seen more people decide to join. Join means actually paying a membership fee not just participate on list. As for the good old boys. I'm not so sure I see much of what you perceive you are seeing. Either there is a whole other board list that left me out or it's just not the situation. I don't consider myself to be a good old boy. I think the other board members who actually contribute behind the scenes do a wonderful job. The hardest working guy on the board, and by far he IS the #1 hardest working guy on the board is Marlon and he is leaving the board voluntarily because of lack of time. How many ways can you split Marlon up? I think Marlon thinks the board is one way too many. And he has decided to open a position for someone else to take a shot at doing something. My respect for Marlon has grown 10 fold. Even if I disagree with some of his opinions, I believe he is just trying his hardest best. I would venture to guess that if we all put down our swords and shields and forgot about those things in the past that have prejudiced us against each other, we would be far more better off and this organization would be an even better asset to the wisp industry. I personally harbor no ill feelings against anyone. I may have my opinions, but in no way shape or form do I have anything but goodwill towards everyone. Sure there are some of us here who are short, crude or rude or rush to judgment, but we are after all just human and none of us are perfect. We make mistakes. I prefer to look past the faults that anyone has and look for the good in everyone. Lonnie, WISPA can still use your support. You asked certain things a couple months ago as a prerequisite to again supporting WISPA with a vendor membership and we have done these things mostly and want to remind you that we are an organization of various opinions / ideas who are just trying to do things that will make being a wisp that much better. There is no good old boys club. Sincerely George -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
Inline... Matt Liotta wrote: Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: I am not saying that CALEA is not real and I actually agree that is required, BUT, did the group have to agree with the rushed timing and especially agree to meet a standard that was not even defined? Specifically, CALEA does not require use of a standard to be compliant, which is why none is defined. If you want safe harbor then yes, you are going to need to use a blessed standard, but again that is not required. My understanding is that WISPA was attempting to define their own standard, get it blessed, and then allow the membership to use it as opposed to the very complicated and expensive ATSI standard that exists now. They could have argued for some prior consultation to make sure the requirements were not a hardship for their membership. They owed that duty to the members. Instead they mostly tried to beat up anybody who spoke against any aspect of it, and as you just tried, to say the speaker uppers were acting like hippies from the 60's and merely wasting time. I believe in Government and Anarchy would be horrible, so at some point Government must be prepared to listen to people, especially an organization that purports to represent a large group of people. That is WISPA and that was what the group was organized for. If the membership of WISPA wanted to lobby against CALEA then we had an opportunity almost two years ago. Simply put, by the time CALEA got on enough people's radar to matter there was no longer time to lobby against it. Therefore, the only practical thing to do was to figure out how to comply. I don't want to drag this topic up again, BUT ;) Two years ago, did this apply to ISPs or just VOIP providers? I don't remember anyone on the lists talking about CALEA being for anything other than VOICE in various forms, but maybe my memory is selective, wouldn't be the first and probably won't be the last time. Personally, I don't think WISPA as an organization should work on a CALEA standard. Every member WISP had to become CALEA compliant without WISPA because of the deadline, so WISPA working on a standard now is simply too late. The spectrum issues we were discussing and working on with the FCC before CALEA came up seem much more important now that the CALEA deadline has passed. I strongly disagree with this. I am currently not operating under safe harbor, but that doesn't mean that I don't want to do so in the future. I strongly believe that there should be an open CALEA standard that anyone can meet without having to pay someone a royalty for it. Sam Tetherow Sandhills Wireless -Matt -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
Agreed. Lonnie On 5/17/07, Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: I am not saying that CALEA is not real and I actually agree that is required, BUT, did the group have to agree with the rushed timing and especially agree to meet a standard that was not even defined? Specifically, CALEA does not require use of a standard to be compliant, which is why none is defined. If you want safe harbor then yes, you are going to need to use a blessed standard, but again that is not required. My understanding is that WISPA was attempting to define their own standard, get it blessed, and then allow the membership to use it as opposed to the very complicated and expensive ATSI standard that exists now. They could have argued for some prior consultation to make sure the requirements were not a hardship for their membership. They owed that duty to the members. Instead they mostly tried to beat up anybody who spoke against any aspect of it, and as you just tried, to say the speaker uppers were acting like hippies from the 60's and merely wasting time. I believe in Government and Anarchy would be horrible, so at some point Government must be prepared to listen to people, especially an organization that purports to represent a large group of people. That is WISPA and that was what the group was organized for. If the membership of WISPA wanted to lobby against CALEA then we had an opportunity almost two years ago. Simply put, by the time CALEA got on enough people's radar to matter there was no longer time to lobby against it. Therefore, the only practical thing to do was to figure out how to comply. Personally, I don't think WISPA as an organization should work on a CALEA standard. Every member WISP had to become CALEA compliant without WISPA because of the deadline, so WISPA working on a standard now is simply too late. The spectrum issues we were discussing and working on with the FCC before CALEA came up seem much more important now that the CALEA deadline has passed. -Matt -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Lonnie Nunweiler Valemount Networks Corporation http://www.star-os.com/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
You are comparing apples to grapes. The telcos have an embedded base and have billions of dollars to force their issues. FYI, the original order was in August 2005. So people actually had over 1 year to get ready. (timeline here: http://www.lasarletter.net/drupal/node/9) Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: The Telcos would never have sent a group and accepted an outcome like that. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: I'm going out on a limb and will voice some things that have been suppressed. I get your point that you think I am a freeloader and do not contribute. My problem for not joining is not a money one, but rather one of principle. I did get involved early on and saw that there was still an old guard of the good old boys. They played favorites early on and still do. Is it proper to support that? It would be very BAD for the Industry if one were to push and fight the GOB's, but, and this in not an excuse, I do not have to time for such fights. Do I support WISPA? Partly. When things like CALEA come up and people are sent to talk with the FBI and FCC, what is their game plan? What are they trying to do for the membership? I feel that WISPA should have taken a much harder line on that and other issues. Any members who spoke against what the FBI and FCC told the WISPA group were quickly put down and isolated. It was disgusting to watch. It certainly was not a functioning democracy. It was pretty heavy handed. I am guessing the way Mark K was verbally beat up on the list by many may have led to some of what Lonnie refers to as the Good Old Boys heavy handed words. I guess I am the Prez of that GOB he refers to so here is an excerpt from an April 22nd post in what I believe was my last post toward Mark in regard to his stance on CALEA: (Quote from April 22nd post FCC Admits Mistakes In Measuring Broadband) I think one of WISPA's jobs is to allow some open access for industry debate and discussion about issues. I openly support having Mark and others to air their ideas, even when, and especially when, those ideas conflict with WISPA policy and/or views of leadership. This public list is here to be that forum. To serve the industry we must hear from the industry. WISPA is here to serve our members but it is more important for us to serve the entire industry. That means we have to hear from them and consider what is best for the industry as our first priority. (End Quote) Lonnie, am I part of that GOB or was my support of Mark (who was speaking against the WISPA CALEA effort with great vigor) something you missed previously? If you did not like my words back to Mark from time to time then you should at least acknowledge that I publicly approved of his right to speak out against the CALEA efforts and how WISPA was handling them, despite my own personal feelings on the subject. Nobody in WISPA leadership acted to stop any effort to protest CALEA. In fact there was open support of the efforts of a Senator who was working on a relief plan for small operators. Jack Unger was heading that up. Who was helping small operators for relief of CALEA regulations? I argue it was WISPA as much as anyone else. If you know of others who did more then please send me a URL. Maybe I will send them a donation. Nobody wants CALEA shoved up their backside but somebody has to do the heavy lifting. Somebody has to cover the collective asses of the WISPs who might get a lawful intercept order. That somebody happens to be the WISPA CALEA Committee which is made up of a number of people who are working hard to help. That is their only agenda in regard to the committee work being done. I am sure some will profit from doing the work. Is there anything wrong with that? I say NO. More power to them. Lonnie, I have no problem with you kicking me or WISPA when it is founded. I have my doubts you have a claim here. My advice to you is to lead, follow or get out of the way. Scriv -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
Thanks for the link Peter, that answers my earlier comment to Matt concerning having 2 years to voice opinion. Sam Tetherow Sandhills Wireless Peter R. wrote: You are comparing apples to grapes. The telcos have an embedded base and have billions of dollars to force their issues. FYI, the original order was in August 2005. So people actually had over 1 year to get ready. (timeline here: http://www.lasarletter.net/drupal/node/9) Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: The Telcos would never have sent a group and accepted an outcome like that. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
Well, that should bring JohnnyO out of the woodwork! :-) -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lonnie Nunweiler Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 4:40 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list You have shown your good nature many, many times George. Thanks for the hard work and peace making. Are you sure you're not Canadian? Lonnie On 5/17/07, George Rogato [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: My suspicion is you'll get the support if you represent what people want. People vote with their feet and pocketbooks. I've seen a lot of good people leave. I've seen a lot of good people forced out because the GOB's could not stand them. And I've seen a lot of good people (mostly everybody on this list) not support WISPA financially. You know Lonnie, I consider you a friend of mine, but I just can't say that I have seen that many people leave. I have seen more people decide to join. Join means actually paying a membership fee not just participate on list. As for the good old boys. I'm not so sure I see much of what you perceive you are seeing. Either there is a whole other board list that left me out or it's just not the situation. I don't consider myself to be a good old boy. I think the other board members who actually contribute behind the scenes do a wonderful job. The hardest working guy on the board, and by far he IS the #1 hardest working guy on the board is Marlon and he is leaving the board voluntarily because of lack of time. How many ways can you split Marlon up? I think Marlon thinks the board is one way too many. And he has decided to open a position for someone else to take a shot at doing something. My respect for Marlon has grown 10 fold. Even if I disagree with some of his opinions, I believe he is just trying his hardest best. I would venture to guess that if we all put down our swords and shields and forgot about those things in the past that have prejudiced us against each other, we would be far more better off and this organization would be an even better asset to the wisp industry. I personally harbor no ill feelings against anyone. I may have my opinions, but in no way shape or form do I have anything but goodwill towards everyone. Sure there are some of us here who are short, crude or rude or rush to judgment, but we are after all just human and none of us are perfect. We make mistakes. I prefer to look past the faults that anyone has and look for the good in everyone. Lonnie, WISPA can still use your support. You asked certain things a couple months ago as a prerequisite to again supporting WISPA with a vendor membership and we have done these things mostly and want to remind you that we are an organization of various opinions / ideas who are just trying to do things that will make being a wisp that much better. There is no good old boys club. Sincerely George -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Lonnie Nunweiler Valemount Networks Corporation http://www.star-os.com/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Ethernet over 328ft
One thing to remember is that the spec also specifies that two patch cords may be used. A 90Meter Horizontal run, with 3M patch cord from the wall jack to the work area, and a 6M patch cord in the wiring closet. The extra two male plug/female jacks create an insertion loss of about 82ft, assuming top quality connections. This does not include the 110 IDC connectors for the patch panels, those also add significant insertion loss. So, there your close to 400ft, and, to a stretch, it's within the spec. The other is how long it takes the signal to get from one side of the wire to the other. And how many bit times it takes to detect a collision, which needs to happen within 512-bit times. So, just based on the math, you could get away with 672 feet. I've run FastEthernet farther than 100M many times. But, I also had to put in a switch at mid-point on 300ft cable run this week, too. It was an AM-tower though, I don't think it was the distance getting us, but the interference. So, if your on an interference free tower, use good cable, good ends, and good installation techniques and you'll be fine with 400ft. Thanks, -Russ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Erik Jansson Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 4:01 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: [WISPA] Ethernet over 328ft The Ethernet spec is for a maximum cable run of 328ft. What is the the spec limits it to this distance, timing, cable resistance? I need to do an outdoor run of 350-400ft, not real keen on fiber as I then need to power a converter and I have doubts of a converter that will with stand the cold being available. It is a critical cable run. I don't need the full 100mb. Any feed back, ideas, or experience would be great. Erik -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
Sam Tetherow wrote: I don't want to drag this topic up again, BUT ;) Two years ago, did this apply to ISPs or just VOIP providers? I don't remember anyone on the lists talking about CALEA being for anything other than VOICE in various forms, but maybe my memory is selective, wouldn't be the first and probably won't be the last time. That was my point... no one was talking about it until it was too late. No blame meant; just pointing out that we collectively missed our opportunity. I strongly disagree with this. I am currently not operating under safe harbor, but that doesn't mean that I don't want to do so in the future. I strongly believe that there should be an open CALEA standard that anyone can meet without having to pay someone a royalty for it. I understand your position and respect it. I just disagree that WISPA is the organization to produce such a standard. Seems like Merit's effort is meant to achieve the same thing and is being more broadly backed. -Matt -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
Sam Tetherow wrote: Thanks for the link Peter, that answers my earlier comment to Matt concerning having 2 years to voice opinion. I didn't mean we had 2 years. What I meant was that it was in 2005 (almost 2 years ago) that the CALEA requirement was issued. -Matt -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? (CALEA timeline)
Sam Tetherow wrote: I don't want to drag this topic up again, BUT ;) Two years ago, did this apply to ISPs or just VOIP providers? I don't remember anyone on the lists talking about CALEA being for anything other than VOICE in various forms, but maybe my memory is selective, wouldn't be the first and probably won't be the last time. On March 10, 2004, DOJ filed a petition asking the Commission to declare that broadband Internet access services and VoIP services are covered by CALEA. It was a part of the original order: Adopted: August 5, 2005 Released: September 23, 2005 In May 2006, the second order was released answering specific questions. - Peter -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Ethernet over 328ft
the AM towers, the little farite ring or whatever it is, is worth its wait in gold. We are about 300 feet from a AM tower, the power 1000 watts, was enough for us to burn our fingers on the cat5 end without ether end plugged in! And I do mean, you start to smell burning skin, not good! Dennis On 5/17/07, Russ Kreigh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One thing to remember is that the spec also specifies that two patch cords may be used. A 90Meter Horizontal run, with 3M patch cord from the wall jack to the work area, and a 6M patch cord in the wiring closet. The extra two male plug/female jacks create an insertion loss of about 82ft, assuming top quality connections. This does not include the 110 IDC connectors for the patch panels, those also add significant insertion loss. So, there your close to 400ft, and, to a stretch, it's within the spec. The other is how long it takes the signal to get from one side of the wire to the other. And how many bit times it takes to detect a collision, which needs to happen within 512-bit times. So, just based on the math, you could get away with 672 feet. I've run FastEthernet farther than 100M many times. But, I also had to put in a switch at mid-point on 300ft cable run this week, too. It was an AM-tower though, I don't think it was the distance getting us, but the interference. So, if your on an interference free tower, use good cable, good ends, and good installation techniques and you'll be fine with 400ft. Thanks, -Russ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Erik Jansson Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 4:01 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: [WISPA] Ethernet over 328ft The Ethernet spec is for a maximum cable run of 328ft. What is the the spec limits it to this distance, timing, cable resistance? I need to do an outdoor run of 350-400ft, not real keen on fiber as I then need to power a converter and I have doubts of a converter that will with stand the cold being available. It is a critical cable run. I don't need the full 100mb. Any feed back, ideas, or experience would be great. Erik -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
People were allowed a LOT of leeway in taking shots at Mark. It got very personal, very quickly and I have no idea if people were reprimanded or not. He was definitely excluded by attacks from a select few who did not want any differing views. Why does everything have to hit the fight or flight situation? What is wrong with discussion? I do accept that the time for action was 2 years ago, so I propose to just bow out of this whole discussion and I'll get back to work. Lonnie On 5/17/07, John Scrivner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: I'm going out on a limb and will voice some things that have been suppressed. I get your point that you think I am a freeloader and do not contribute. My problem for not joining is not a money one, but rather one of principle. I did get involved early on and saw that there was still an old guard of the good old boys. They played favorites early on and still do. Is it proper to support that? It would be very BAD for the Industry if one were to push and fight the GOB's, but, and this in not an excuse, I do not have to time for such fights. Do I support WISPA? Partly. When things like CALEA come up and people are sent to talk with the FBI and FCC, what is their game plan? What are they trying to do for the membership? I feel that WISPA should have taken a much harder line on that and other issues. Any members who spoke against what the FBI and FCC told the WISPA group were quickly put down and isolated. It was disgusting to watch. It certainly was not a functioning democracy. It was pretty heavy handed. I am guessing the way Mark K was verbally beat up on the list by many may have led to some of what Lonnie refers to as the Good Old Boys heavy handed words. I guess I am the Prez of that GOB he refers to so here is an excerpt from an April 22nd post in what I believe was my last post toward Mark in regard to his stance on CALEA: (Quote from April 22nd post FCC Admits Mistakes In Measuring Broadband) I think one of WISPA's jobs is to allow some open access for industry debate and discussion about issues. I openly support having Mark and others to air their ideas, even when, and especially when, those ideas conflict with WISPA policy and/or views of leadership. This public list is here to be that forum. To serve the industry we must hear from the industry. WISPA is here to serve our members but it is more important for us to serve the entire industry. That means we have to hear from them and consider what is best for the industry as our first priority. (End Quote) Lonnie, am I part of that GOB or was my support of Mark (who was speaking against the WISPA CALEA effort with great vigor) something you missed previously? If you did not like my words back to Mark from time to time then you should at least acknowledge that I publicly approved of his right to speak out against the CALEA efforts and how WISPA was handling them, despite my own personal feelings on the subject. Nobody in WISPA leadership acted to stop any effort to protest CALEA. In fact there was open support of the efforts of a Senator who was working on a relief plan for small operators. Jack Unger was heading that up. Who was helping small operators for relief of CALEA regulations? I argue it was WISPA as much as anyone else. If you know of others who did more then please send me a URL. Maybe I will send them a donation. Nobody wants CALEA shoved up their backside but somebody has to do the heavy lifting. Somebody has to cover the collective asses of the WISPs who might get a lawful intercept order. That somebody happens to be the WISPA CALEA Committee which is made up of a number of people who are working hard to help. That is their only agenda in regard to the committee work being done. I am sure some will profit from doing the work. Is there anything wrong with that? I say NO. More power to them. Lonnie, I have no problem with you kicking me or WISPA when it is founded. I have my doubts you have a claim here. My advice to you is to lead, follow or get out of the way. Scriv -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Lonnie Nunweiler Valemount Networks Corporation http://www.star-os.com/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Ethernet over 328ft
We've had good luck with ferrite beads elsewhere. Not on this tower. We had a tone/probe cable tester that when you would plug the probe into the ethernet cable going up the tower, you could hear the radio station, on the cable tester speaker. Explain that one to me. -Russ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dennis Burgess Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 4:50 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ethernet over 328ft the AM towers, the little farite ring or whatever it is, is worth its wait in gold. We are about 300 feet from a AM tower, the power 1000 watts, was enough for us to burn our fingers on the cat5 end without ether end plugged in! And I do mean, you start to smell burning skin, not good! Dennis On 5/17/07, Russ Kreigh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One thing to remember is that the spec also specifies that two patch cords may be used. A 90Meter Horizontal run, with 3M patch cord from the wall jack to the work area, and a 6M patch cord in the wiring closet. The extra two male plug/female jacks create an insertion loss of about 82ft, assuming top quality connections. This does not include the 110 IDC connectors for the patch panels, those also add significant insertion loss. So, there your close to 400ft, and, to a stretch, it's within the spec. The other is how long it takes the signal to get from one side of the wire to the other. And how many bit times it takes to detect a collision, which needs to happen within 512-bit times. So, just based on the math, you could get away with 672 feet. I've run FastEthernet farther than 100M many times. But, I also had to put in a switch at mid-point on 300ft cable run this week, too. It was an AM-tower though, I don't think it was the distance getting us, but the interference. So, if your on an interference free tower, use good cable, good ends, and good installation techniques and you'll be fine with 400ft. Thanks, -Russ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Erik Jansson Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 4:01 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: [WISPA] Ethernet over 328ft The Ethernet spec is for a maximum cable run of 328ft. What is the the spec limits it to this distance, timing, cable resistance? I need to do an outdoor run of 350-400ft, not real keen on fiber as I then need to power a converter and I have doubts of a converter that will with stand the cold being available. It is a critical cable run. I don't need the full 100mb. Any feed back, ideas, or experience would be great. Erik -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
Thanks Lonnie My only goal for WISPA is to unite us all, divided we fail. Even if I'm off base, I'm just one opinion. George Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: You have shown your good nature many, many times George. Thanks for the hard work and peace making. Are you sure you're not Canadian? Lonnie On 5/17/07, George Rogato [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: My suspicion is you'll get the support if you represent what people want. People vote with their feet and pocketbooks. I've seen a lot of good people leave. I've seen a lot of good people forced out because the GOB's could not stand them. And I've seen a lot of good people (mostly everybody on this list) not support WISPA financially. You know Lonnie, I consider you a friend of mine, but I just can't say that I have seen that many people leave. I have seen more people decide to join. Join means actually paying a membership fee not just participate on list. As for the good old boys. I'm not so sure I see much of what you perceive you are seeing. Either there is a whole other board list that left me out or it's just not the situation. I don't consider myself to be a good old boy. I think the other board members who actually contribute behind the scenes do a wonderful job. The hardest working guy on the board, and by far he IS the #1 hardest working guy on the board is Marlon and he is leaving the board voluntarily because of lack of time. How many ways can you split Marlon up? I think Marlon thinks the board is one way too many. And he has decided to open a position for someone else to take a shot at doing something. My respect for Marlon has grown 10 fold. Even if I disagree with some of his opinions, I believe he is just trying his hardest best. I would venture to guess that if we all put down our swords and shields and forgot about those things in the past that have prejudiced us against each other, we would be far more better off and this organization would be an even better asset to the wisp industry. I personally harbor no ill feelings against anyone. I may have my opinions, but in no way shape or form do I have anything but goodwill towards everyone. Sure there are some of us here who are short, crude or rude or rush to judgment, but we are after all just human and none of us are perfect. We make mistakes. I prefer to look past the faults that anyone has and look for the good in everyone. Lonnie, WISPA can still use your support. You asked certain things a couple months ago as a prerequisite to again supporting WISPA with a vendor membership and we have done these things mostly and want to remind you that we are an organization of various opinions / ideas who are just trying to do things that will make being a wisp that much better. There is no good old boys club. Sincerely George -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Ethernet over 328ft
Stick your tounge on it, see what happens. On 5/17/07, Russ Kreigh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We've had good luck with ferrite beads elsewhere. Not on this tower. We had a tone/probe cable tester that when you would plug the probe into the ethernet cable going up the tower, you could hear the radio station, on the cable tester speaker. Explain that one to me. -Russ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dennis Burgess Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 4:50 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ethernet over 328ft the AM towers, the little farite ring or whatever it is, is worth its wait in gold. We are about 300 feet from a AM tower, the power 1000 watts, was enough for us to burn our fingers on the cat5 end without ether end plugged in! And I do mean, you start to smell burning skin, not good! Dennis On 5/17/07, Russ Kreigh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One thing to remember is that the spec also specifies that two patch cords may be used. A 90Meter Horizontal run, with 3M patch cord from the wall jack to the work area, and a 6M patch cord in the wiring closet. The extra two male plug/female jacks create an insertion loss of about 82ft, assuming top quality connections. This does not include the 110 IDC connectors for the patch panels, those also add significant insertion loss. So, there your close to 400ft, and, to a stretch, it's within the spec. The other is how long it takes the signal to get from one side of the wire to the other. And how many bit times it takes to detect a collision, which needs to happen within 512-bit times. So, just based on the math, you could get away with 672 feet. I've run FastEthernet farther than 100M many times. But, I also had to put in a switch at mid-point on 300ft cable run this week, too. It was an AM-tower though, I don't think it was the distance getting us, but the interference. So, if your on an interference free tower, use good cable, good ends, and good installation techniques and you'll be fine with 400ft. Thanks, -Russ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Erik Jansson Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 4:01 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: [WISPA] Ethernet over 328ft The Ethernet spec is for a maximum cable run of 328ft. What is the the spec limits it to this distance, timing, cable resistance? I need to do an outdoor run of 350-400ft, not real keen on fiber as I then need to power a converter and I have doubts of a converter that will with stand the cold being available. It is a critical cable run. I don't need the full 100mb. Any feed back, ideas, or experience would be great. Erik -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Ethernet over 328ft
Thanks for the feed back, It is a 340ft tower (no broadcasting!) with about a 15 ft run to the shack, so all tolled I should com in at 375-385 or so with just the arrestors at top and bottom then in to the poe and router. We always use a gell filled copper shielded cable and AMP jacks for tower work like this. The freznel zone is a bit tighter then I like so a few extra feet over the 300ft mark would make be feel much better about the link working as planed you just never can tell how tall those trees on the hill are when they're is 15 miles of bush to the nearest road! Erik Dennis Burgess wrote: Stick your tounge on it, see what happens. On 5/17/07, Russ Kreigh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We've had good luck with ferrite beads elsewhere. Not on this tower. We had a tone/probe cable tester that when you would plug the probe into the ethernet cable going up the tower, you could hear the radio station, on the cable tester speaker. Explain that one to me. -Russ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dennis Burgess Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 4:50 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ethernet over 328ft the AM towers, the little farite ring or whatever it is, is worth its wait in gold. We are about 300 feet from a AM tower, the power 1000 watts, was enough for us to burn our fingers on the cat5 end without ether end plugged in! And I do mean, you start to smell burning skin, not good! Dennis On 5/17/07, Russ Kreigh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One thing to remember is that the spec also specifies that two patch cords may be used. A 90Meter Horizontal run, with 3M patch cord from the wall jack to the work area, and a 6M patch cord in the wiring closet. The extra two male plug/female jacks create an insertion loss of about 82ft, assuming top quality connections. This does not include the 110 IDC connectors for the patch panels, those also add significant insertion loss. So, there your close to 400ft, and, to a stretch, it's within the spec. The other is how long it takes the signal to get from one side of the wire to the other. And how many bit times it takes to detect a collision, which needs to happen within 512-bit times. So, just based on the math, you could get away with 672 feet. I've run FastEthernet farther than 100M many times. But, I also had to put in a switch at mid-point on 300ft cable run this week, too. It was an AM-tower though, I don't think it was the distance getting us, but the interference. So, if your on an interference free tower, use good cable, good ends, and good installation techniques and you'll be fine with 400ft. Thanks, -Russ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Erik Jansson Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 4:01 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: [WISPA] Ethernet over 328ft The Ethernet spec is for a maximum cable run of 328ft. What is the the spec limits it to this distance, timing, cable resistance? I need to do an outdoor run of 350-400ft, not real keen on fiber as I then need to power a converter and I have doubts of a converter that will with stand the cold being available. It is a critical cable run. I don't need the full 100mb. Any feed back, ideas, or experience would be great. Erik -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Dennis Burgess, MCP, CCNA, A+, N+, Mikrotik Certified Consultant www.mikrotikconsulting.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
- Original Message - From: Lonnie Nunweiler [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list I am not saying that CALEA is not real and I actually agree that is required, BUT, did the group have to agree with the rushed timing and especially agree to meet a standard that was not even defined? Within the law, it's up to us to define the standard. We met with the customer that can give us safe harbor status if they like our solution. We also took the time and money needed to make sure that we could get the RIGHT answers to as many questions as we could. They could have argued for some prior consultation to make sure the requirements were not a hardship for their membership. And how would anyone out here know what we did in that regard? For the reccord, *I* talked to the FBI about CALEA and it's impact on our industry segment. *THEY* knew that there would be problems with the independant operators but didn't know who to talk to and hadn't yet taken the time to find out. We're building a standard so that compliance won't create a hardship for our industry. They owed that duty to the members. We fullfilled that duty as you call it. We did tell them that CALEA, as things stand, is a disaster for our industry. They know and understand. That's one of the reasons that they are working so closely with us to build a more affordable/lower impact solution for those that need it. Instead they mostly tried to beat up anybody who spoke against any aspect of it, and as you just tried, to say the speaker uppers were acting like hippies from the 60's and merely wasting time. Sigh. Beating up? I don't think so. Sure, we called a spade a spade when people said that we were wasting our time in the wrong direction. The time to protest is past, we have to comply now. People fought the battle and lost. It's law and it's not gonna go away. So now what. What can we DO??? (other than jumping up and down pitching a fit???) I believe in Government and Anarchy would be horrible, so at some point Government must be prepared to listen to people, especially an organization that purports to represent a large group of people. That is WISPA and that was what the group was organized for. No, we were organized to make our industry better. Part of that means that we're here to make our operators better. Part of that means that they have the knowledge and skills needed to comply with the laws as they exist. There is NO way to change this law in time to deal with the compliance issue. Some are content to sit on the sidelines and toss gas on the fires. Others are more interested in building fireproof houses. When we're working from a platform built on rocks instead of sand, we can be much more powerful. No sense in wasting time fighting on the sand when solid ground is just a few steps away. Granted, the solid ground in the case of CALEA is rocky and scary, it's also a bit of a hike to get to it. But once there the ground is indeed solid. And, once we're done with our work, there will be a nice easy to walk bridge to the solid ground. You'll still have to walk there but it'll be a much easier trip. Heck, to come back from that meeting and simply parrot everything that had been told to the committee was a waste of time and money to even go to the meeting. To achieve what they achieved could have been done with a conference call, or simply done nothing. I can't believe anyone just said this out loud! Wowsers. We WENT there to learn answers to the questions that people have. Bringing those answers back was one of the goals of the trip! sheesh Guess we should have just kept our heads in the sand and pretended that we didn't know our asses were on fire. I'm floored by that paragraph. The Telcos would never have sent a group and accepted an outcome like that. Um, that's completely wrong. They've also been working closely with the FBI on CALEA compliance. As an industry and in some cases individually. I'll drop back to lurk mode now. The level of hurt feelings is growing, as evidenced by my private in basket. Hurt feelings? No. Not me anyway. I'm certainly flabergasted though. The idea that someone that's not willing to actively help, not involved in any of the processes would ever talk in the certain terms of one that's been there and done that isn't what I'd expect from you. You make it sound as though you (and others arguing this same line) have been privy to all of the backgound information that those of us riding in the front of the bus can see. We're up here busy steering the bus around the corners, making sure that we don't go over the cliff. And there are those looking out the back of the bus telling us we're idiots for not taking the road that we happen to know is a dead end. Don't
Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
- Original Message - From: Lonnie Nunweiler [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 9:36 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list WISPA has responsibilities to the Vendor members? Yikes. Isn't WISPA responsible to the Members and Industry first? I've resisted joining as a Vendor because I disagree with the commercial nature of it all. It is not the money, but rather the principle. When WISPA was being formed, I contributed about $2,000 in direct cash and Server Licenses to induce others to pay up, yet I have never been a member, let alone a FOUNDING MEMBER as some can claim. I got real discouraged to be throwing my weight behind the whole things and the VERY FIRST act of WISPA was to allow Charles to act as if it were his private list for marketing. Why did they do that? Because Charles gave them some freebies and support. Boy this is getting old. Lonnie, there was a FORMAL agreement in place between WISPA and Charles. He paid, out of profit, for the right to use the lists like he did. He was also the first one and we used the experience to fine tune what we do now. Again, you speak of things which you could/would have known about if you'd bothered to participate in an official capacity, or at least ask. WISPA has to decide if it is an Organization that is for Vendors to market to members or is it an Organization for the Industry to represent the needs of the Industry to Government, and other regulatory bodies. It's all of those Lonnie. Vendors are as much a part of the industry as are the WISP. Regulators are a part of what makes us who we are too. So are the customers. If you'll kindly go back over the bylaws you'll see that wisps HAVE to be a bulk of our board's make-up. We, as a board, protect our PAID vendors because that's the deal we made with them. They were given certain rights when they put their money where their mouths are. It's an incentive for other vendors to pony up. This period before elections is a good time have those discussions and see where all the proposed board members sit on the various issues. Very true. I for one would support a strict no self promotion policy in ANY email. Not practical. People have to be able to answer questions about what they know the most about. You have to be able to help people with Star OS questions and this is a good place to do it. The line gets drawn when someone asks about a Mikrotik problem and you tell the list to use your StarOS solution instead. And, those that help with general questions will often be given a longer leash than those that only speak up when it's in their own self interest. Again, it's about the health of the list as much as anything else. Keep it to PAID ads (if you need them at all) and limit the number of those that can be distributed. A Vendor should be happy to support the Industry and should not expect a return or special privilege. Yeah. That would be nice. Not reality though. Many of our current vendor members are certainly very philanthropic (sp???) though. Many have NEVER posted an ad. They all get 1 per quarter. Lest people jump on me for self promotion, I'll point out that I always try and point people to our Support Forums. This list should NOT become a free support arm for ANY Vendor too lazy or incompetent to set up their own support lines. Again, we don't mind the support here. It helps those of us not using the product make choices to or not to use it in the future. It also helps drive list membership and that helps drive association membership and ad sales. We also offer, at no charge to the vendors, specific vendor email lists that they can use as they see fit. This list should be for issues that affect the Industry. Technical issues affect us all. It's also very helpful to know what problems people are having and what they are doing about them. Keeping the customers happy is the MOST important part of our businesses. Your troubles with routing or bridging or particular brand of equipment, although important to you at the time, have very little to do with the Industry in general. I totally disagree with that. It's all important. There are other lists for that and also Vendors should have their own solutions to help you. Who needs yet another list? So, this is what my day looks like. Now I'll get back to work. We're building 4 more towers this year and I get to run the Bobcat today. It'll be fun after all. I LOVE Bobcats! Those things are a blast to play with. Someday I'm gonna find an excuse to buy one. Then I'm gonna paint it yellow and put TONKA stickers all over it :-) Stay safe, marlon Lonnie On 5/17/07, Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think the big problem here is that Dee almost never posts unless he's got something to sell folks. Naturally, people have to be able to talk
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
Okay. So we have two parties here. Those that are loud and boisterous. And the lurkers and people who think WISPA has veered the wrong way. Well, elections are June 15. Your candidates are here: http://nominations.wispa.org/ Writing about what they see as the future. Read it - and ask them questions. Pick the board that will drive this bus where you want it to go. Election rules are here: http://www.wispa.org/?page_id=5 You may have to actually pay to vote, but at $25 per month, that's easy. Regards, Peter Radizeski RAD-INFO, Inc. (813) 963-5884 -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list
- Original Message - From: David E. Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 1:30 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Promotion of services on-list Clint Ricker wrote: Just making it known that blatant self-promotion by non-Vendor members is bad taste means that self-promotion is done at one's own risk--sure, I may let people know I offer a service, but I also may alienate all of my potential customers. And blatant self-promotion by vendor members is better, just because they gave WISPA some money? Yes. That's part of the deal they got when they signed up. Does it mean that they can post an ad every time they want? Not at all. But they can certainly let folks know when they have a solution that fits a question that was asked. AND they DO get to post ads according to the vendor member schedule. Right now that means once per quarter. (I'm not saying this is necessarily your opinion, either express or implied, it was just a really good place to interject the above.) I don't think it's fair or appropriate for any individual or any business entity to get preferential treatment just because they've made a (probably tax-deductible) donation. Donations to WISPA are NOT tax deducatble. WISPA is a 501c6 corp. That's a non profit LOBBYING corp. Dues are not deductable, but we're also able to do much more at the congressional level without getting in trouble for it. For the present sort of issue, really the only thing that should get anyone any special treatment is technical merit - if you make the best widget in the industry, a lot of people will say yup that's a mighty fine widget. Fortunately, I think most of the list agrees with this, at least in principle. The question is just what constitutes unnecessary self-promotion, and there's no single answer to that - it pretty much has to be decided on a case-by-case basis. (If I'm wrong, and there really is a significant paid vendor members = better than sentiment on the list, well, that's another story entirely.) David Smith Bureau 42 Enterprises Multigalactic -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] SB and Tranzeo compatibility
Anyone else running into problems with the newer CPQ radios and their existing SB access points? I'm seeing either total non functioning systems or intermittent problems. The symptom is that the CPQ can't see the AP's ssid. Rebooting the AP sometimes helps, temporarily. This did NOT happen with the CPE-200 units. And did NOT happen with older CPQ radios (that I'd noticed anyway). I run all radios in bridge mode, changing the preamble doesn't help. Any ideas? Am I alone with this problem? Swapping to the new Teletronics TT2400 aps (nice working units so far!!!) cures the problem. Swapping out 20 towers worth of APs isn't something I'm excited about doing though. HHEEEP Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] SB and Tranzeo compatibility
Recently, I've had problems with CPQ's connecting to Atheros based Mesh AP's. They work for a bit then stop communicating. If I reset them to factory defaults and then reconfigure them, they sometimes start working again. Currently, I just move the units that stop talking to my Atheros based AP's to locations with Prisiam or Hermes based AP's. This is, of course, not a long term fix as I am slowly removing the Hermes and Prisiam based AP's from my network Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 wrote: Anyone else running into problems with the newer CPQ radios and their existing SB access points? I'm seeing either total non functioning systems or intermittent problems. The symptom is that the CPQ can't see the AP's ssid. Rebooting the AP sometimes helps, temporarily. This did NOT happen with the CPE-200 units. And did NOT happen with older CPQ radios (that I'd noticed anyway). I run all radios in bridge mode, changing the preamble doesn't help. Any ideas? Am I alone with this problem? Swapping to the new Teletronics TT2400 aps (nice working units so far!!!) cures the problem. Swapping out 20 towers worth of APs isn't something I'm excited about doing though. HHEEEP Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] What is WISPA? MORE THAN YOU!
All right - here it is - I am done and this is all I will say! Lonnie - how are you with all your resources helping the CALEA effort? Come to think about it - how are you helping with getting your StarOS and hardware FCC certified for the USA WISP? You are good to point a finger here today, but you aren't any help in even supporting those that have supported you for years! There are many B I G wireless operators that praise you and you're OS and I have yet to hear how you are going to assist getting these businesses legal and yet you want to pound WISPA board for Mark K's multi thousand comments on list that was absolutely driving the majority insane? I didn't ever say he didn't have a point - - but to make that point 77 times a day is a bit much - wouldn't you say? I have to admit I complained to the board, but they were quick to point out that he has a right to his opinion much to my chagrin. Lets get down the nitty gritty - what are you doing to assist us in our problem of CALEA? You won't even pony up the $1000.00 (just like Mark K.'s membership dues) to be a member of WISPA, but you will bitch and moan and groan about what the board members (who did pay)have to say as well the paid members opinions. You haven't even bothered to assist the GOB's or the not so GOB's who run your OS, (built their entire network off StarOS) get legal. I think (personally) if your gear ain't FCC certified - you ought not to be allowed to sale it in the USA. I will take it a step further than that - - - - no I won't as it includes a horse, dragging, nakedness and a town full of people to witness!! I guess I will self impose a banishment now - how many days Harnish? Mac Dearman Maximum Access, LLC. Rayville, La. www.inetsouth.com www.radioresponse.org (Katrina relief) www.mac-tel.us (VoIP sales) 318.728.8600 318.728.9600 318.303.4182 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 4:47 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list - Original Message - From: Lonnie Nunweiler [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list I am not saying that CALEA is not real and I actually agree that is required, BUT, did the group have to agree with the rushed timing and especially agree to meet a standard that was not even defined? Within the law, it's up to us to define the standard. We met with the customer that can give us safe harbor status if they like our solution. We also took the time and money needed to make sure that we could get the RIGHT answers to as many questions as we could. They could have argued for some prior consultation to make sure the requirements were not a hardship for their membership. And how would anyone out here know what we did in that regard? For the reccord, *I* talked to the FBI about CALEA and it's impact on our industry segment. *THEY* knew that there would be problems with the independant operators but didn't know who to talk to and hadn't yet taken the time to find out. We're building a standard so that compliance won't create a hardship for our industry. They owed that duty to the members. We fullfilled that duty as you call it. We did tell them that CALEA, as things stand, is a disaster for our industry. They know and understand. That's one of the reasons that they are working so closely with us to build a more affordable/lower impact solution for those that need it. Instead they mostly tried to beat up anybody who spoke against any aspect of it, and as you just tried, to say the speaker uppers were acting like hippies from the 60's and merely wasting time. Sigh. Beating up? I don't think so. Sure, we called a spade a spade when people said that we were wasting our time in the wrong direction. The time to protest is past, we have to comply now. People fought the battle and lost. It's law and it's not gonna go away. So now what. What can we DO??? (other than jumping up and down pitching a fit???) I believe in Government and Anarchy would be horrible, so at some point Government must be prepared to listen to people, especially an organization that purports to represent a large group of people. That is WISPA and that was what the group was organized for. No, we were organized to make our industry better. Part of that means that we're here to make our operators better. Part of that means that they have the knowledge and skills needed to comply with the laws as they exist. There is NO way to change this law in time to deal with the compliance issue. Some are content to sit on the sidelines and toss gas on the fires. Others are more interested in building fireproof houses. When
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? MORE THAN YOU!
I guess I'll unsubscribe as well. Good bye. Lonnie On 5/17/07, Mac Dearman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: All right - here it is - I am done and this is all I will say! Lonnie - how are you with all your resources helping the CALEA effort? Come to think about it - how are you helping with getting your StarOS and hardware FCC certified for the USA WISP? You are good to point a finger here today, but you aren't any help in even supporting those that have supported you for years! There are many B I G wireless operators that praise you and you're OS and I have yet to hear how you are going to assist getting these businesses legal and yet you want to pound WISPA board for Mark K's multi thousand comments on list that was absolutely driving the majority insane? I didn't ever say he didn't have a point - - but to make that point 77 times a day is a bit much - wouldn't you say? I have to admit I complained to the board, but they were quick to point out that he has a right to his opinion much to my chagrin. Lets get down the nitty gritty - what are you doing to assist us in our problem of CALEA? You won't even pony up the $1000.00 (just like Mark K.'s membership dues) to be a member of WISPA, but you will bitch and moan and groan about what the board members (who did pay)have to say as well the paid members opinions. You haven't even bothered to assist the GOB's or the not so GOB's who run your OS, (built their entire network off StarOS) get legal. I think (personally) if your gear ain't FCC certified - you ought not to be allowed to sale it in the USA. I will take it a step further than that - - - - no I won't as it includes a horse, dragging, nakedness and a town full of people to witness!! I guess I will self impose a banishment now - how many days Harnish? Mac Dearman Maximum Access, LLC. Rayville, La. www.inetsouth.com www.radioresponse.org (Katrina relief) www.mac-tel.us (VoIP sales) 318.728.8600 318.728.9600 318.303.4182 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 4:47 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list - Original Message - From: Lonnie Nunweiler [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list I am not saying that CALEA is not real and I actually agree that is required, BUT, did the group have to agree with the rushed timing and especially agree to meet a standard that was not even defined? Within the law, it's up to us to define the standard. We met with the customer that can give us safe harbor status if they like our solution. We also took the time and money needed to make sure that we could get the RIGHT answers to as many questions as we could. They could have argued for some prior consultation to make sure the requirements were not a hardship for their membership. And how would anyone out here know what we did in that regard? For the reccord, *I* talked to the FBI about CALEA and it's impact on our industry segment. *THEY* knew that there would be problems with the independant operators but didn't know who to talk to and hadn't yet taken the time to find out. We're building a standard so that compliance won't create a hardship for our industry. They owed that duty to the members. We fullfilled that duty as you call it. We did tell them that CALEA, as things stand, is a disaster for our industry. They know and understand. That's one of the reasons that they are working so closely with us to build a more affordable/lower impact solution for those that need it. Instead they mostly tried to beat up anybody who spoke against any aspect of it, and as you just tried, to say the speaker uppers were acting like hippies from the 60's and merely wasting time. Sigh. Beating up? I don't think so. Sure, we called a spade a spade when people said that we were wasting our time in the wrong direction. The time to protest is past, we have to comply now. People fought the battle and lost. It's law and it's not gonna go away. So now what. What can we DO??? (other than jumping up and down pitching a fit???) I believe in Government and Anarchy would be horrible, so at some point Government must be prepared to listen to people, especially an organization that purports to represent a large group of people. That is WISPA and that was what the group was organized for. No, we were organized to make our industry better. Part of that means that we're here to make our operators better. Part of that means that they have the knowledge and skills needed to comply with the laws as they exist. There is NO way to change this law in time to deal with the compliance issue. Some are content to sit on the sidelines and
[WISPA] Going to Dayton this weekend?
Who from here will be in Dayton Ohio this weekend? (http://www.hamvention.org) I would be interested in meeting face to face! We are in Flea Market spots 3154 and 3155 and are running a free hotspot with that in the ESSID. Ralph -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? MORE THAN YOU!
Good Riddens ! *Singing* Oh Say Can you see... By the stars early light was so ... JohnnyO - Original Message - From: Lonnie Nunweiler [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 7:36 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? MORE THAN YOU! I guess I'll unsubscribe as well. Good bye. Lonnie On 5/17/07, Mac Dearman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: All right - here it is - I am done and this is all I will say! Lonnie - how are you with all your resources helping the CALEA effort? Come to think about it - how are you helping with getting your StarOS and hardware FCC certified for the USA WISP? You are good to point a finger here today, but you aren't any help in even supporting those that have supported you for years! There are many B I G wireless operators that praise you and you're OS and I have yet to hear how you are going to assist getting these businesses legal and yet you want to pound WISPA board for Mark K's multi thousand comments on list that was absolutely driving the majority insane? I didn't ever say he didn't have a point - - but to make that point 77 times a day is a bit much - wouldn't you say? I have to admit I complained to the board, but they were quick to point out that he has a right to his opinion much to my chagrin. Lets get down the nitty gritty - what are you doing to assist us in our problem of CALEA? You won't even pony up the $1000.00 (just like Mark K.'s membership dues) to be a member of WISPA, but you will bitch and moan and groan about what the board members (who did pay)have to say as well the paid members opinions. You haven't even bothered to assist the GOB's or the not so GOB's who run your OS, (built their entire network off StarOS) get legal. I think (personally) if your gear ain't FCC certified - you ought not to be allowed to sale it in the USA. I will take it a step further than that - - - - no I won't as it includes a horse, dragging, nakedness and a town full of people to witness!! I guess I will self impose a banishment now - how many days Harnish? Mac Dearman Maximum Access, LLC. Rayville, La. www.inetsouth.com www.radioresponse.org (Katrina relief) www.mac-tel.us (VoIP sales) 318.728.8600 318.728.9600 318.303.4182 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 4:47 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list - Original Message - From: Lonnie Nunweiler [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list I am not saying that CALEA is not real and I actually agree that is required, BUT, did the group have to agree with the rushed timing and especially agree to meet a standard that was not even defined? Within the law, it's up to us to define the standard. We met with the customer that can give us safe harbor status if they like our solution. We also took the time and money needed to make sure that we could get the RIGHT answers to as many questions as we could. They could have argued for some prior consultation to make sure the requirements were not a hardship for their membership. And how would anyone out here know what we did in that regard? For the reccord, *I* talked to the FBI about CALEA and it's impact on our industry segment. *THEY* knew that there would be problems with the independant operators but didn't know who to talk to and hadn't yet taken the time to find out. We're building a standard so that compliance won't create a hardship for our industry. They owed that duty to the members. We fullfilled that duty as you call it. We did tell them that CALEA, as things stand, is a disaster for our industry. They know and understand. That's one of the reasons that they are working so closely with us to build a more affordable/lower impact solution for those that need it. Instead they mostly tried to beat up anybody who spoke against any aspect of it, and as you just tried, to say the speaker uppers were acting like hippies from the 60's and merely wasting time. Sigh. Beating up? I don't think so. Sure, we called a spade a spade when people said that we were wasting our time in the wrong direction. The time to protest is past, we have to comply now. People fought the battle and lost. It's law and it's not gonna go away. So now what. What can we DO??? (other than jumping up and down pitching a fit???) I believe in Government and Anarchy would be horrible, so at some point Government must be prepared to listen to people, especially an organization that purports to represent a large group of people. That is WISPA and that was what the group was organized for.
RE: [WISPA] What is WISPA? MORE THAN YOU!
Is that the best you can come up with Lonnie? Hit and run? I think you owe everyone that has ever bought a StarOS license an explanation as well as an explanation for the hard time you have hammered WISPA leadership with in dealing with CALEA. I have yet to figure that angle out, but I feel assured something will raise its head in the near future. That's not a very professional attitude even if I were out of line. Inquiring minds wonder where they stand in getting FCC legal with their StarOS, WAR boards and Wrap combo's. No News, I guess, is bad news in this case. GL, Mac Dearman Maximum Access, LLC. Rayville, La. www.inetsouth.com www.radioresponse.org (Katrina relief) www.mac-tel.us (VoIP sales) 318.728.8600 318.728.9600 318.303.4182 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lonnie Nunweiler Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 7:36 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? MORE THAN YOU! I guess I'll unsubscribe as well. Good bye. Lonnie On 5/17/07, Mac Dearman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: All right - here it is - I am done and this is all I will say! Lonnie - how are you with all your resources helping the CALEA effort? Come to think about it - how are you helping with getting your StarOS and hardware FCC certified for the USA WISP? You are good to point a finger here today, but you aren't any help in even supporting those that have supported you for years! There are many B I G wireless operators that praise you and you're OS and I have yet to hear how you are going to assist getting these businesses legal and yet you want to pound WISPA board for Mark K's multi thousand comments on list that was absolutely driving the majority insane? I didn't ever say he didn't have a point - - but to make that point 77 times a day is a bit much - wouldn't you say? I have to admit I complained to the board, but they were quick to point out that he has a right to his opinion much to my chagrin. Lets get down the nitty gritty - what are you doing to assist us in our problem of CALEA? You won't even pony up the $1000.00 (just like Mark K.'s membership dues) to be a member of WISPA, but you will bitch and moan and groan about what the board members (who did pay)have to say as well the paid members opinions. You haven't even bothered to assist the GOB's or the not so GOB's who run your OS, (built their entire network off StarOS) get legal. I think (personally) if your gear ain't FCC certified - you ought not to be allowed to sale it in the USA. I will take it a step further than that - - - - no I won't as it includes a horse, dragging, nakedness and a town full of people to witness!! I guess I will self impose a banishment now - how many days Harnish? Mac Dearman Maximum Access, LLC. Rayville, La. www.inetsouth.com www.radioresponse.org (Katrina relief) www.mac-tel.us (VoIP sales) 318.728.8600 318.728.9600 318.303.4182 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 4:47 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list - Original Message - From: Lonnie Nunweiler [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list I am not saying that CALEA is not real and I actually agree that is required, BUT, did the group have to agree with the rushed timing and especially agree to meet a standard that was not even defined? Within the law, it's up to us to define the standard. We met with the customer that can give us safe harbor status if they like our solution. We also took the time and money needed to make sure that we could get the RIGHT answers to as many questions as we could. They could have argued for some prior consultation to make sure the requirements were not a hardship for their membership. And how would anyone out here know what we did in that regard? For the reccord, *I* talked to the FBI about CALEA and it's impact on our industry segment. *THEY* knew that there would be problems with the independant operators but didn't know who to talk to and hadn't yet taken the time to find out. We're building a standard so that compliance won't create a hardship for our industry. They owed that duty to the members. We fullfilled that duty as you call it. We did tell them that CALEA, as things stand, is a disaster for our industry. They know and understand. That's one of the reasons that they are working so closely with us to build a more affordable/lower impact solution for those that need it.
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? MORE THAN YOU!
JohnnyO wrote: Good Riddens ! *Singing* Oh Say Can you see... By the stars early light was so ... JohnnyO Don't hate me because I am American. :) ahem, dawn's early light ... ;) -m- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
Lonnie Nunweiler wrote: You have shown your good nature many, many times George. Thanks for the hard work and peace making. He is a good man. Are you sure you're not Canadian? Peace making is not something peculiar to Canadians. In fact that is what American's do best. We make peace. Whether the bad guys want it or not. ;) Once it was Pax Romana, but no longer. Now it is Pax Americana. Lonnie Lonnie, you are one of the great Linux developers. Is it really necessary to let politics and opinion determine the direction you will take your business? Hey, nobody says you have to help us become compliant but I can assure you that if you do not make your product meet a standard, you will loose business on this side of that border. Why let that happen? We have to do what we have to do, just like Canada had to do what it did when it pulled it's people from Iraq. I don't think anyone needs to blame anyone here... Nobody needs to believe all sorts of foolishness about what American WISPs have to do or what hoops we have to jump through, either. Why not jump through the hoops and get it over with. If you have a good product and it is profitable, it will be a better product and more profitable to get the certifications taken care of, won't it? -m- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] SB and Tranzeo compatibility
I want my cpe 200's back!!! marlon - Original Message - From: Blair Davis [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 5:20 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] SB and Tranzeo compatibility Recently, I've had problems with CPQ's connecting to Atheros based Mesh AP's. They work for a bit then stop communicating. If I reset them to factory defaults and then reconfigure them, they sometimes start working again. Currently, I just move the units that stop talking to my Atheros based AP's to locations with Prisiam or Hermes based AP's. This is, of course, not a long term fix as I am slowly removing the Hermes and Prisiam based AP's from my network Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 wrote: Anyone else running into problems with the newer CPQ radios and their existing SB access points? I'm seeing either total non functioning systems or intermittent problems. The symptom is that the CPQ can't see the AP's ssid. Rebooting the AP sometimes helps, temporarily. This did NOT happen with the CPE-200 units. And did NOT happen with older CPQ radios (that I'd noticed anyway). I run all radios in bridge mode, changing the preamble doesn't help. Any ideas? Am I alone with this problem? Swapping to the new Teletronics TT2400 aps (nice working units so far!!!) cures the problem. Swapping out 20 towers worth of APs isn't something I'm excited about doing though. HHEEEP Marlon (509) 982-2181 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services 42846865 (icq)WISP Operator since 1999! [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.odessaoffice.com/wireless www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
I will say this though - if you aren't a member, how do you have a say in what the Org does? Because the org is speaking on the behalf of all WISPS not just WISPA members. If the org is speaking on the behalf of all WISPS then all WISPS should be able to have some input on what is being taken to the table, member or not. I offered to help with whatever I could when WISPA started, but I was never taken up on my offer of time. We my wife and I have been in business for over four years now and have just now gotten to the point that I could quit my Day job and focus on our business. So yes the money is a big deal to some companies out there. I am not a WISPA member and I don't consider myself a freeloader here. If I give input to one person a month on a problem they are having I have pulled my weight. As I have mentioned before, everytime I get ready to open up the wallet to join crap like this comes up and makes me wonder if it is a good investment. Talk of free listserver members being freeloaders and not supporting the org is sure as hell not a good way to drive up membership. Thanks, Chadd Thompson -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] What is WISPA? was Promotion of services on-list
Chadd Thompson wrote: I will say this though - if you aren't a member, how do you have a say in what the Org does? Because the org is speaking on the behalf of all WISPS not just WISPA members. If the org is speaking on the behalf of all WISPS then all WISPS should be able to have some input on what is being taken to the table, member or not. It astounds me that you would make the statement above but not understand why it is your obligation to pay the $25 a month it costs to pay your part. If you cannot pay $25 a month for the things we are doing then you are not seeing the bigger picture. You cannot afford not to pay your dues. I have saved several times more than I pay in dues with what I get from WISPA. If you don't then you have simply not looked at what we are offering.. I offered to help with whatever I could when WISPA started, but I was never taken up on my offer of time. We have committees. Our membership helps with dues and time. Why can't you offer a little of both? We my wife and I have been in business for over four years now and have just now gotten to the point that I could quit my Day job and focus on our business. So yes the money is a big deal to some companies out there. So $25 per month is a deal breaker? Maybe you need a stronger association to work to find ways of making you more money. Then again if you cannot see the value then why would you join? I am not a WISPA member and I don't consider myself a freeloader here. If I give input to one person a month on a problem they are having I have pulled my weight. Sorry. That is not enough. We need dues to do the work of what needs to be done in WISPA. We all help each other on the lists. That goes both ways You never get help from people on the lists? That does not help lobby for change in regulatory or legislative efforts. I work for free as basically an executive director for this organization, Marlon works for free basically as a lobbyist. Rick Harnish runs 60 list servers for free. Matt Larsen runs the WISPA website. Do you think we do this so we can get an attaboy? We do this to help guys like you. We won't be here doing it for free forever. Who does the heavy lifting if we all decided to do it your way? Who pays the bills then? As I have mentioned before, everytime I get ready to open up the wallet to join crap like this comes up and makes me wonder if it is a good investment. Talk of free listserver members being freeloaders and not supporting the org is sure as hell not a good way to drive up membership. What is the feel good way for us to convince you that the $3000 worth of free legal help we gave out for CALEA is worth the $250 a year? That is just one thing WISPA has done for WISPs lately. We constantly work to help. If you cannot see it then you just are not paying enough attention to what we do for you guys here. Scriv -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
