Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-14 Thread Matt Liotta

Tom DeReggi wrote:

You dont use Sun Boxes!  You use Linux based P4-3Ghz Rackmount PCs, 
they cost us about $700, and never had one give us a bit of trouble in 
5 years. Could probably do it in a set top box type unit for under $350.


While I haven't seen their software, the traditional reason to use a Sun 
box over something x86 is that an application is IO-bound as opposed to 
CPU bound. In this case, HTTP proxying sounds a lot like an IO-bound 
application hence the Sun box.


-Matt

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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-14 Thread Matt Liotta

Tom DeReggi wrote:

Well thats the question. Does it have to be that way. I don't see the 
need to have all the traffic flow through it. I see it sitting in 
parallel, and just certain type of traffic gets redirected to the 
cache appliance server that adds the marketing data.


You aren't familiar with their business and neither am I. However, they 
are probably pretty familiar with their business and have designed their 
architecture with that in mind. Unless you are planning an entry into 
their business you probably want to take their word for it.


-Matt

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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-14 Thread Tom DeReggi

Matt,

Yes, that may likely be the case.  I do not challenge the idea to use SUN 
boxes for high volume players.

However, for low volume players, its just not needed.
Our x86 based systems have been tested beyond 100mbps, with many virtual 
managed firewall rules inline, with no sweat.
It also helps when you use onboard 1GB NICs, that typically perform better 
than a NIC in a PCI slot, depending on MB design.


Maybe my original post was a bit rude. But again, my intent was not to 
challenge Adzilla's business model where it applies, it was to challenge 
their business model for WISPs.  I think Adzilla has also done the same, 
which is why they just represented a lower dollar appliance is likely on its 
way in the future for lower volume commits.


Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2006 7:43 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams



Tom DeReggi wrote:

You dont use Sun Boxes!  You use Linux based P4-3Ghz Rackmount PCs, they 
cost us about $700, and never had one give us a bit of trouble in 5 
years. Could probably do it in a set top box type unit for under $350.


While I haven't seen their software, the traditional reason to use a Sun 
box over something x86 is that an application is IO-bound as opposed to 
CPU bound. In this case, HTTP proxying sounds a lot like an IO-bound 
application hence the Sun box.


-Matt

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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-14 Thread Peter R.

Tom,

Is it just me or are many of your posts written in outrage or disbelief?

You have the right to discuss how the model should work for WISPs, but I 
think that you need to understand that the model needs to work 2 ways - 
for the vendor and the WISP - whether VOIP or advertising.


The problem is that a vendor designs the system from their view and then 
changes it later to attract more partners. In the process, the original 
plan is so manipulated that the plan fails and no one wins. (Bandwidth 
resellers and VOIP providers to name but a few).


In the case of Adzilla, the cost of the boxes is one fixed cost but the 
cost of selling local advertising is a very real additional cost. And if 
you have ever tried to hire salespeople you know that it is challenging. 
Media advertising is just as demanding.
And as you add partners, a company has to scale. Scale takes money and 
time and people. Many start-ups want to maximize the business plan (and 
VC capital infusions) by capturing white elephants.


I understand your frustration. Little guys need help and it seems that 
many vendors don't treat them as partners. There are a few reasons for 
this, but chief among them is that it takes huge time to sell to many 
smaller players. Pareto Principle.


Regards,

Peter

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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-14 Thread Tom DeReggi

Peter,

No need to respond to most of your post, as your points were fair and made 
sense to me. However a couple comments.


if you have ever tried to hire sales people you know that it is 
challenging


I have, and failed miserably. I recognize its not easy. However, my weakness 
shouldn't effect others from succeeding at it, that are better trained in 
those skill sets.  Someone in the sales business needs to be good at it.



Is it just me or are many of your posts written in outrage or disbelief?


Depends how you are directing that comment. On average I feel my on-list 
comments are fair, objective, and realistic.
However, recently, I realize that I may have been a little easy to offend, 
and a little quick to respond in outrage.
Recently, I've been under tremendous pressure, and have had little patience 
because of it, and possibly taken my daily frustrations out on those around 
me.

For that, I appologize, and ask for understanding.

However, if I stop for a second and analyze myself, and where the outrage 
comes from... Its not that I'm an unreasonable person nor that the people 
I'm conversing with are unreasonable.  I think it comes from the constant 
reminder of several point of views that every one seems to think that 
everyone should get paid except for me. That nobody should have to foot the 
bill upfront, except me.  That they shouldn't have to take risk in their 
business venture, but I should to be a part of it. That their part of the 
partnership has more value than mine.  And that by being a small provider I 
am in some way inadequate or less desirable to do business with than the 
next guy.  And that as a Small guy I am a liabilty, not an asset.   It 
doesn't matter what side of the fense I sit. If I'm the customer, the 
provider doesn't want to take the risk, If I'm the provider, the customer 
doesn't want to take the risk. Its always me that bends to make it all work. 
I'm tired of bending, because I have recognized my worth, and no longer 
should have to. If I have primarilly download data, they want to sell me 
transit. If I primarilly have upload data they want to turn me into a peer 
and charge me to send them traffic. Either way they want to get paid.  I 
just get tired of hearing the message.  I need to establish business 
ventures that guarantee that I get paid. Nobody has directly said these 
things to me, but its inferred by their daily actions. And when I say I, I 
don't only mean me, I mean small WISP. There is so much potential in the 
small WISP market, if it was only recognized. The same arguement applies to 
bankers and financers to. They are looking for the sure thing. Well business 
isn't a sure thing.  Think about it for a second. Even our own government 
shares this view. If there is any organization in the country that should be 
investing and partnering in Wireless companies, its the federal governement, 
or local governements for economic development. Even they are getting on the 
bandwagon crying No Tax Dollars Used, make the WISPs come up with the cash 
to provide the FREE network to consumers.  What do you do when your own 
governement says Come Earthlink, Come AOL, Come Verizon, you are our only 
hope, we need your money?  Its not jeolousy, envy, or hatred of the big 
guys, Its jsut the small guy get overlooked to easilly. I'm just tired of 
hearing it.  Small business is an intricate part of American economy, and we 
have an aweful lot to offer the world in value. Small Business is NOT a bad 
word.  Small businesses should be helping small businesses succeed. I simply 
believe that it is my job to stand up for what we WISPs have to offer. And 
prove our value. I've taken the first step by investing everything I own in 
being a small WISP, because I see the value.  I think the rest of the world 
should also recognize the value. I don't want to appologize for WISPs 
because most are still small. I want to demand that they are recognized for 
full value.  You bring the arguement up, its hard to hire sales people, 
well I have the same problem, I have to find a way to do it to succeed. 
Does that mean I turn away $50 residential subs when I'm searching for the 
big $800 a month subs? I think WISPS need to start setting the presidence of 
their value.  They need to start demanding what should be comming to them, 
opportunity to participate. There are two types of players in this 
business. There are the big guys that control the market and bully everyone 
else around. And then there is everyone else that is fighting to survive and 
keep in the game.  Unfortuntately, I'm not one of the big players, so I 
stick up for the little guy. I think the samll guy deserves to play ball 
jsut like the next guy.  Part of the problem I have is I fall trap to 
stereotypes, and I tend to look at everyone as the big guy or the little 
guy, and that is really not the case. Sometimes the vendors pitching to the 
WISPs, are also little guys, and have little guy needs also. I 

RE: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams -- Amen

2006-03-14 Thread Brian Webster
Amen Brother Tom! We'll get you to stand up with brother Matt Larsen at
the next tent revival. You had me in stitches on the floor about being the
one to be every other persons risk taker, been there done that. Keep your
course, it does get better. Just take a couple of nights and knock off
early, by 11 PM or so and your head will start to clear and feel better.
Great Rant.



Thank You,
Brian Webster

-Original Message-
From: Tom DeReggi [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2006 8:16 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


Peter,

No need to respond to most of your post, as your points were fair and made
sense to me. However a couple comments.

 if you have ever tried to hire sales people you know that it is
 challenging

I have, and failed miserably. I recognize its not easy. However, my weakness
shouldn't effect others from succeeding at it, that are better trained in
those skill sets.  Someone in the sales business needs to be good at it.

 Is it just me or are many of your posts written in outrage or disbelief?

Depends how you are directing that comment. On average I feel my on-list
comments are fair, objective, and realistic.
However, recently, I realize that I may have been a little easy to offend,
and a little quick to respond in outrage.
Recently, I've been under tremendous pressure, and have had little patience
because of it, and possibly taken my daily frustrations out on those around
me.
For that, I appologize, and ask for understanding.

However, if I stop for a second and analyze myself, and where the outrage
comes from... Its not that I'm an unreasonable person nor that the people
I'm conversing with are unreasonable.  I think it comes from the constant
reminder of several point of views that every one seems to think that
everyone should get paid except for me. That nobody should have to foot the
bill upfront, except me.  That they shouldn't have to take risk in their
business venture, but I should to be a part of it. That their part of the
partnership has more value than mine.  And that by being a small provider I
am in some way inadequate or less desirable to do business with than the
next guy.  And that as a Small guy I am a liabilty, not an asset.   It
doesn't matter what side of the fense I sit. If I'm the customer, the
provider doesn't want to take the risk, If I'm the provider, the customer
doesn't want to take the risk. Its always me that bends to make it all work.
I'm tired of bending, because I have recognized my worth, and no longer
should have to. If I have primarilly download data, they want to sell me
transit. If I primarilly have upload data they want to turn me into a peer
and charge me to send them traffic. Either way they want to get paid.  I
just get tired of hearing the message.  I need to establish business
ventures that guarantee that I get paid. Nobody has directly said these
things to me, but its inferred by their daily actions. And when I say I, I
don't only mean me, I mean small WISP. There is so much potential in the
small WISP market, if it was only recognized. The same arguement applies to
bankers and financers to. They are looking for the sure thing. Well business
isn't a sure thing.  Think about it for a second. Even our own government
shares this view. If there is any organization in the country that should be
investing and partnering in Wireless companies, its the federal governement,
or local governements for economic development. Even they are getting on the
bandwagon crying No Tax Dollars Used, make the WISPs come up with the cash
to provide the FREE network to consumers.  What do you do when your own
governement says Come Earthlink, Come AOL, Come Verizon, you are our only
hope, we need your money?  Its not jeolousy, envy, or hatred of the big
guys, Its jsut the small guy get overlooked to easilly. I'm just tired of
hearing it.  Small business is an intricate part of American economy, and we
have an aweful lot to offer the world in value. Small Business is NOT a bad
word.  Small businesses should be helping small businesses succeed. I simply
believe that it is my job to stand up for what we WISPs have to offer. And
prove our value. I've taken the first step by investing everything I own in
being a small WISP, because I see the value.  I think the rest of the world
should also recognize the value. I don't want to appologize for WISPs
because most are still small. I want to demand that they are recognized for
full value.  You bring the arguement up, its hard to hire sales people,
well I have the same problem, I have to find a way to do it to succeed.
Does that mean I turn away $50 residential subs when I'm searching for the
big $800 a month subs? I think WISPS need to start setting the presidence of
their value.  They need to start demanding what should be comming to them,
opportunity to participate. There are two types of players in this
business. There are the big guys

Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-13 Thread Tom DeReggi
For the life of me, it amazes me how companies come up with requirements 
like   10,000.
Any one with half a sense, would realise that WISPs dont have 10,000 subs 
yet, but all combined represent a unique segment of the market, The Under 
Served, that no other ISP can touch.  Its not like you can turn the station 
like TV or Radio.


7000 wireless providers times 500 users each = 3,500,000 unique eye balls to 
market to with Broadband.

Adzilla is insane not having a 500 sub startout package.
Where you miss in vlume of users you substitute with frequency of adds.
Where you had had hardware appliance you subsitute software executable.


Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: Brian Rohrbacher [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2006 9:47 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


Oh, yippee.  1 WISP can do it.  10,000 subs what?  Guess we can quit 
talking about this.


Eric DaVersa wrote:


Currently its 10K subs since it is a rev share/subsidy model - dial-up,
DSL, wireless.  A high volume of business class subs can make this
number flexible.  There will be lower tier appliance platforms coming
down the pipeline.
Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jory Privett
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 4:10 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams

What are the subs  that I have to have to get a system like this???

Jory Privett
WCCS

- Original Message - 
From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 5:34 PM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


The simple answer to that is don't use that option.  The ad
optimization is transparent and its basically free money.  I usually
have to say it 3 times before ISPs start to understand the concept, so
in the interest of saving time...

It's free money, it's free money, and - you guessed it - it's still free
money.

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 2:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-
- Original Message - 
From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 8:57 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams




For a Network Operator, you have some incredible new tools as part of
the package.  You have a GUI interface where you can insert messaging
DIRECT TO THE DESKTOP.  This means, Dear Customer, your payment is 7
days past due, your account will be shut off if you do not pay within


x


hours.



I think if I tried that with my customers, I would be losing, not
gaining,
customers.   The notion of inserting something into thier data is... too
intrusive for me to consider.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-




--
Brian Rohrbacher
Reliable Internet, LLC
www.reliableinter.net
Cell 269-838-8338

Caught up in the Air 1 Thess. 4:17

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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-13 Thread Peter R.
Easy to say but then you don't have to supply the Sun boxes that the 
Zillacasters run on.

Also, selling local advertising takes time and man-power.
How do you get enough click-throughs and other metrix on 500 subs?
Even pay the advertising salesperson?

Regards,

Peter

Tom DeReggi wrote:

For the life of me, it amazes me how companies come up with 
requirements like   10,000.
Any one with half a sense, would realise that WISPs dont have 10,000 
subs yet, but all combined represent a unique segment of the market, 
The Under Served, that no other ISP can touch.  Its not like you can 
turn the station like TV or Radio.


7000 wireless providers times 500 users each = 3,500,000 unique eye 
balls to market to with Broadband.

Adzilla is insane not having a 500 sub startout package.
Where you miss in vlume of users you substitute with frequency of adds.
Where you had had hardware appliance you subsitute software executable.


Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband



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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-13 Thread Tom DeReggi



The requirement is actually pretty simple. All of the traffic has to be
aggregated to an appliance, so there has to be an appliance at each 
network's headend.


Well thats the question. Does it have to be that way. I don't see the need 
to have all the traffic flow through it. I see it sitting in parallel, and 
just certain type of traffic gets redirected to the cache appliance server 
that adds the marketing data.


Tom DeReggi


Therefore, the company is going to want the most band
for their buck by putting the appliance at large network headends as 
opposed to small.


One the flip side, businesses shouldn't be counted as single subs. 
Clearly, a business with 150 employees should be worth more than a single 
subscriber.


-Matt

Tom DeReggi wrote:

For the life of me, it amazes me how companies come up with requirements 
like   10,000.
Any one with half a sense, would realise that WISPs dont have 10,000 subs 
yet, but all combined represent a unique segment of the market, The 
Under Served, that no other ISP can touch.  Its not like you can turn 
the station like TV or Radio.


7000 wireless providers times 500 users each = 3,500,000 unique eye balls 
to market to with Broadband.

Adzilla is insane not having a 500 sub startout package.
Where you miss in vlume of users you substitute with frequency of adds.
Where you had had hardware appliance you subsitute software executable.


Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - From: Brian Rohrbacher 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2006 9:47 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


Oh, yippee.  1 WISP can do it.  10,000 subs what?  Guess we can quit 
talking about this.


Eric DaVersa wrote:


Currently its 10K subs since it is a rev share/subsidy model - dial-up,
DSL, wireless.  A high volume of business class subs can make this
number flexible.  There will be lower tier appliance platforms coming
down the pipeline.
Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jory Privett
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 4:10 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams

What are the subs  that I have to have to get a system like this???

Jory Privett
WCCS

- Original Message - From: Eric DaVersa 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 5:34 PM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


The simple answer to that is don't use that option.  The ad
optimization is transparent and its basically free money.  I usually
have to say it 3 times before ISPs start to understand the concept, so
in the interest of saving time...

It's free money, it's free money, and - you guessed it - it's still 
free

money.

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 2:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!



-
- Original Message - From: Eric DaVersa 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 8:57 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams




For a Network Operator, you have some incredible new tools as part of
the package.  You have a GUI interface where you can insert messaging
DIRECT TO THE DESKTOP.  This means, Dear Customer, your payment is 7
days past due, your account will be shut off if you do not pay within


x


hours.



I think if I tried that with my customers, I would be losing, not
gaining,
customers.   The notion of inserting something into thier data is... 
too

intrusive for me to consider.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!



-




--
Brian Rohrbacher
Reliable Internet, LLC
www.reliableinter.net
Cell 269-838-8338

Caught up in the Air 1 Thess. 4:17

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RE: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-09 Thread Eric DaVersa
Agreed, but there is a free lunch...for the web publishers and ad
servers you allow to sell over your pipes.  

Take the old example of the Internet as a highway.  You've built a
highway (your wireless network) and people (your customers) pay to drive
on it.  Along the way there are billboard advertisements (web ads.)  

You collect nothing from the billboards that people view.  In essence,
the advertisers get a free lunch from your highway.

Adzilla basically gives you the opportunity to place your own billboards
in front of those existing billboards so that you, as the highway
operator, can receive a revenue share.

Mark, I don't mean to pick on you here and I apologize if my replies
come off as arrogant or inappropriate in any way.  I appreciate your
questioning and devil's advocate approach.  These lists are certainly
good for digging through the facts.

Peter R. sent an email for those interested in participating in a
webinar.  Also, an Adzilla exec will be at WISPNOG.

Respectfully,

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2006 1:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


There is no free lunch.

this is the most concise, most accurate, and wisest words ever spoken,
on
the subject of economics.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-
- Original Message - 
From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 3:34 PM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


 The simple answer to that is don't use that option.  The ad
 optimization is transparent and its basically free money.  I usually
 have to say it 3 times before ISPs start to understand the concept, so
 in the interest of saving time...

 It's free money, it's free money, and - you guessed it - it's still
free
 money.

 Eric DaVersa
 Vice-President, Business Development
 NetLogix
 OFFICE: 858.764.1998
 CELL: 858.245.6702
 FAX: 858.764.1982
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]


 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
 Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
 Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 2:47 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


 North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
 personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
 sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
 Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


 
 -
 - Original Message - 
 From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 8:57 AM
 Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


 
  For a Network Operator, you have some incredible new tools as part
of
  the package.  You have a GUI interface where you can insert
messaging
  DIRECT TO THE DESKTOP.  This means, Dear Customer, your payment is
7
  days past due, your account will be shut off if you do not pay
within
 x
  hours.

 I think if I tried that with my customers, I would be losing, not
 gaining,
 customers.   The notion of inserting something into thier data is...
too
 intrusive for me to consider.



 North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
 personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
 sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
 Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


 
 -

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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-09 Thread Blair Davis




If I publish a web page, who are you to modify it before displaying it
to a user?

I'd start getting annoyed if my web page displayed differently
depending on whose network it flows thru

I also feel that this is a bad idea in general because I think it could
end up weakening the 'safe harbor' provisions that protect us from
liability over data content. We are not censors. Beyond the
monitoring needed to assure network integrity, we do not monitor or
censor our users in any way and we do not plan to.

IMO, we should not modify the data flowing to the user in any way
without the express, informed consent of the user. If a user wants you
to censor, modify or block pages, fine if you wish to offer that
service. For liability reasons, we choose not to.

Eric DaVersa wrote:

  Agreed, but there is a free lunch...for the web publishers and ad
servers you allow to sell over your pipes.  

Take the old example of the Internet as a highway.  You've built a
highway (your wireless network) and people (your customers) pay to drive
on it.  Along the way there are billboard advertisements (web ads.)  

You collect nothing from the billboards that people view.  In essence,
the advertisers get a free lunch from your highway.

Adzilla basically gives you the opportunity to place your own billboards
in front of those existing billboards so that you, as the highway
operator, can receive a revenue share.

Mark, I don't mean to pick on you here and I apologize if my replies
come off as arrogant or inappropriate in any way.  I appreciate your
questioning and "devil's advocate" approach.  These lists are certainly
good for digging through the facts.

Peter R. sent an email for those interested in participating in a
webinar.  Also, an Adzilla exec will be at WISPNOG.

Respectfully,

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2006 1:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


"There is no free lunch."

this is the most concise, most accurate, and wisest words ever spoken,
on
the subject of economics.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-
- Original Message - 
From: "Eric DaVersa" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: "'WISPA General List'" wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 3:34 PM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


  
  
The simple answer to that is "don't use that option."  The ad
optimization is transparent and its basically free money.  I usually
have to say it 3 times before ISPs start to understand the concept, so
in the interest of saving time...

It's free money, it's free money, and - you guessed it - it's still

  
  free
  
  
money.

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

  
  On
  
  
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 2:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


  
  
  
  

-
- Original Message - 
From: "Eric DaVersa" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: "'WISPA General List'" wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 8:57 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams




  For a Network Operator, you have some incredible new tools as part
  

  
  of
  
  

  the package.  You have a GUI interface where you can insert
  

  
  messaging
  
  

  DIRECT TO THE DESKTOP.  This means, "Dear Customer, your payment is
  

  
  7
  
  

  days past due, your account will be shut off if you do not pay
  

  
  within
  
  
x


  hours."
  

I think if I tried that with my customers, I would be losing, not
gaining,
customers.   The notion of inserting something into thier data is...

  
  too
  
  
intrusive for me to consider.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


  
  
  
  

-

-- 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wi

Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-09 Thread Jory Privett



I think you are not understanding the way the 
system works. Please correct me if I am wrong here. This does 
not modify every web page, only those pages that have the Adzilla tags in 
them. The device just uses the tag to display the adds that are 
setup for your area. IS this correct?
If it modified every page that a user went to you 
would have a lot of unhappy customers very quickly.

Jory Privett
WCCS



  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Blair Davis 

  To: WISPA General List 
  Sent: Thursday, March 09, 2006 1:19 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  
  Revenue Streams
  If I publish a web page, who are you to modify it before 
  displaying it to a user?I'd start getting annoyed if my web page 
  displayed differently depending on whose network it flows thruI 
  also feel that this is a bad idea in general because I think it could end up 
  weakening the 'safe harbor' provisions that protect us from liability over 
  data content. We are not censors. Beyond the monitoring needed to 
  assure network integrity, we do not monitor or censor our users in any way and 
  we do not plan to.IMO, we should not modify the data flowing to the 
  user in any way without the express, informed consent of the user. If a 
  user wants you to censor, modify or block pages, fine if you 
  wish to offer that service. For liability reasons, we choose not 
  to.Eric DaVersa wrote:
  Agreed, but there is a free lunch...for the web publishers and ad
servers you allow to sell over your pipes.  

Take the old example of the Internet as a highway.  You've built a
highway (your wireless network) and people (your customers) pay to drive
on it.  Along the way there are billboard advertisements (web ads.)  

You collect nothing from the billboards that people view.  In essence,
the advertisers get a free lunch from your highway.

Adzilla basically gives you the opportunity to place your own billboards
in front of those existing billboards so that you, as the highway
operator, can receive a revenue share.

Mark, I don't mean to pick on you here and I apologize if my replies
come off as arrogant or inappropriate in any way.  I appreciate your
questioning and "devil's advocate" approach.  These lists are certainly
good for digging through the facts.

Peter R. sent an email for those interested in participating in a
webinar.  Also, an Adzilla exec will be at WISPNOG.

Respectfully,

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2006 1:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


"There is no free lunch."

this is the most concise, most accurate, and wisest words ever spoken,
on
the subject of economics.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-
- Original Message - 
From: "Eric DaVersa" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: "'WISPA General List'" wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 3:34 PM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


  
The simple answer to that is "don't use that option."  The ad
optimization is transparent and its basically free money.  I usually
have to say it 3 times before ISPs start to understand the concept, so
in the interest of saving time...

It's free money, it's free money, and - you guessed it - it's still
free
  
money.

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
On
  
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 2:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


  

-
- Original Message - 
From: "Eric DaVersa" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: "'WISPA General List'" wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 8:57 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams



  For a Network Operator, you have some incredible new tools as part
  of
  

  the package.  You have a GUI interface where you can insert
  messaging
  

  DIRECT TO THE DESKTOP.  This means, "Dear Customer, your payment is
  7
  

  days past due, your account will be shut off if you do not pay
  within
  
x

  hours."

RE: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-09 Thread chris cooper













While we are on the topic of ad based revenue streams- How about Tobacco advertising? Ive never seen any push type tobacco ads on the web. Im wondering if this medium is regulated the same as television and radio? (before anybody gets upset- Im a former smoker. Tobacco is evil, believe me I know) Just wondering.Chris Cooper
Intelliwave




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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-09 Thread Frank Muto



Blair, I feel your concern is a valid 
one.

This is a basic twist of the walled network e.g., 
AOL uses. As within AOL's network portal and browser they would have their paid 
advertisers' shown. As a dialup provider (97-2002), we did the same thing using 
our own portal and custom browser of which the user would use. Our free-based 
users would be locked into the portal but our paid users would not be.If 
they went outside our portal using their browser of choice, we did not control 
their end destination. Our TOS spelled out these terms. 

Steering a customer away from a company's website 
like Amazon.com and redirecting theHTTP request through an affiliate 
channel, is not good practice in my opinion. I'm not saying this is the case in 
point, but there are companies like Zango, 180 Solutions and others that do this 
and cost many affiliates commissions when the software, (e.g., P2P) or bundled 
softwareis installed on the customers machine using various methods, such 
as an Active-X pop-up asking the user to install certain software.

For an example, we fight click fraud everyday that 
use these methods. When a user does a search on say Google and clicks on an 
affiliate link, the user is redirected to another affiliate who would get the 
sale if the customer purchased the advertised item or paid for the lead 
generation. 




Frank MutoPresident/CEOFSM Marketing Group, 
Inc





  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Blair Davis 

  If I publish a web page, who are 
  you to modify it before displaying it to a user?I'd start getting 
  annoyed if my web page displayed differently depending on whose network it 
  flows thruI also feel that this is a bad idea in general because I 
  think it could end up weakening the 'safe harbor' provisions that protect us 
  from liability over data content. We are not censors. Beyond the 
  monitoring needed to assure network integrity, we do not monitor or censor our 
  users in any way and we do not plan to.IMO, we should not modify the 
  data flowing to the user in any way without the express, informed consent of 
  the user. If a user wants you to censor, modify or block pages, 
  fine if you wish to offer that service. For liability reasons, 
  we choose not to.Eric DaVersa wrote:
  Agreed, but there is a free lunch...for the web publishers and ad
servers you allow to sell over your pipes.  

Take the old example of the Internet as a highway.  You've built a
highway (your wireless network) and people (your customers) pay to drive
on it.  Along the way there are billboard advertisements (web ads.)  

You collect nothing from the billboards that people view.  In essence,
the advertisers get a free lunch from your highway.

Adzilla basically gives you the opportunity to place your own billboards
in front of those existing billboards so that you, as the highway
operator, can receive a revenue share.

Mark, I don't mean to pick on you here and I apologize if my replies
come off as arrogant or inappropriate in any way.  I appreciate your
questioning and "devil's advocate" approach.  These lists are certainly
good for digging through the facts.

Peter R. sent an email for those interested in participating in a
webinar.  Also, an Adzilla exec will be at WISPNOG.

Respectfully,

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2006 1:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


"There is no free lunch."

this is the most concise, most accurate, and wisest words ever spoken,
on
the subject of economics.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-
- Original Message - 
From: "Eric DaVersa" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: "'WISPA General List'" wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 3:34 PM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


  
The simple answer to that is "don't use that option."  The ad
optimization is transparent and its basically free money.  I usually
have to say it 3 times before ISPs start to understand the concept, so
in the interest of saving time...

It's free money, it's free money, and - you guessed it - it's still
free
  
money.

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
On
  
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 2:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


No

Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-09 Thread John Scrivner
 share.

Mark, I don't mean to pick on you here and I apologize if my replies
come off as arrogant or inappropriate in any way.  I appreciate your
questioning and devil's advocate approach.  These lists are certainly
good for digging through the facts.

Peter R. sent an email for those interested in participating in a
webinar.  Also, an Adzilla exec will be at WISPNOG.

Respectfully,

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2006 1:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


There is no free lunch.

this is the most concise, most accurate, and wisest words ever spoken,
on
the subject of economics.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-
- Original Message - 
From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 3:34 PM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


 


The simple answer to that is don't use that option.  The ad
optimization is transparent and its basically free money.  I usually
have to say it 3 times before ISPs start to understand the concept, so
in the interest of saving time...

It's free money, it's free money, and - you guessed it - it's still
   


free
 


money.

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
   


On
 


Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 2:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!

   



 



-
- Original Message - 
From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 8:57 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


   


For a Network Operator, you have some incredible new tools as part
 


of
 


the package.  You have a GUI interface where you can insert
 


messaging
 


DIRECT TO THE DESKTOP.  This means, Dear Customer, your payment is
 


7
 


days past due, your account will be shut off if you do not pay
 


within
 


x
   


hours.
 


I think if I tried that with my customers, I would be losing, not
gaining,
customers.   The notion of inserting something into thier data is...
   


too
 


intrusive for me to consider.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!

   



 



-

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--
Blair Davis

AOL IM Screen Name --  Theory240

West Michigan Wireless ISP
269-686-8648

A division of:
Camp Communication Services, INC
 


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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-09 Thread John Scrivner
Wrong. Adzilla works with the advertising agencies who serve these ads. 
Nothing is done without the full blessing of the content and advertising 
providers of the content. The only time a replacement happens is when 
the ad agency who serves the ads for that particular page allows for 
insertions to happen. This does not circumvent or force any advertiser 
to lose placement. This is how it has been explained to me.

Scriv


Frank Muto wrote:

Who determines the relevancy of the add? So what I am seeing here, 
is if I have an ad campaign with one of the web publishers mention 
below with the same product or service, the Adzilla ad would take it's 
place over our ad?

Frank Muto
President/CEO
FSM Marketing Group, Inc

- Original Message -
*From:* Eric DaVersa mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
*To:* 'WISPA General List' mailto:wireless@wispa.org
*Sent:* Thursday, March 09, 2006 3:16 PM
*Subject:* RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams

Jory is correct. No part of web content is altered as that is
copyright infringement and illegal.

The way the system works is within the existing ecosystem of the
web publishing and ad serving world. Many web publishers
(websites) establish relationships with ad servers such as 24/7
Media, Double Click, etc. because they lack the infrastructure to
sell advertising nationally. They set up automated communications
links between each other to serve ads on the websites. There’s a
financial agreement and structure based on common ad industry specs.

So in the existing world here’s how it works. Your customer clicks
on a website. A request for the content is sent to the appropriate
location where that website’s content is hosted. Within that
website are banner ads that cycle through. A request is sent (all
this in real time) from the website to their ad server partners so
that an ad can get served up. Your customer sees the ad as part of
the overall web page even though the publisher. The website makes
money off the ad and you get nothing as the ISP.

In the Adzilla world it works very much the same way, except that
on the way out of network core the http traffic request is tagged
based upon contextual relativity. In real time the Adzilla
appliance determines if the ad can be replaced if Adzilla has a
relationship with the ad server or web publisher. In essence, the
calculation asks, C/an Adzilla serve up a higher paying ad to the
ad server company?/ If so a more relevant ad is served into the
website because Adzilla has a relationship with the ad serving
company.

What Adzilla has developed is a very unique method to allow ISPs
to participate in a revenue share of ads running across their
networks. The percentage of pages surfed that can be “optimized”
is typically between 5~10% so we’re talking very minimal. But it
adds up quickly and their reach is growing.

To be quite honest, it took me a few explanations and a PowerPoint
before the light clicked on since the ad world was foreign to me.
Hope this helped explain.

Eric DaVersa

Vice-President, Business Development

**NetLogix**

OFFICE: 858.764.1998

CELL: 858.245.6702

FAX: 858.764.1982

[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

-Original Message-
*From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of *Jory Privett
*Sent:* Thursday, March 09, 2006 12:05 PM
*To:* [EMAIL PROTECTED]; WISPA General List
*Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams

I think you are not understanding the way the system works. Please
correct me if I am wrong here. This does not modify every web
page, only those pages that have the Adzilla tags in them. The
device just uses the tag to display the adds that are setup for
your area. IS this correct?

If it modified every page that a user went to you would have a lot
of unhappy customers very quickly.

Jory Privett

WCCS

- Original Message -

*From:* Blair Davis mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

*To:* WISPA General List mailto:wireless@wispa.org

*Sent:* Thursday, March 09, 2006 1:19 PM

*Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams

If I publish a web page, who are you to modify it before
displaying it to a user?

I'd start getting annoyed if my web page displayed differently
depending on whose network it flows thru

I also feel that this is a bad idea in general because I think
it could end up weakening the 'safe harbor' provisions that
protect us from liability over data content. We are not
censors. Beyond the monitoring needed to assure network
integrity, we do not monitor or censor our users in any way
and we do not plan to.

IMO, we should not modify the data flowing to the user in any
way without

Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-09 Thread Matt Larsen - Lists

Jory,

I think you hit the nail on the head there.  Does anyone know if there 
is a program for ISPs 1 subs? 


Inquiring minds want to know.  :^)

Matt Larsen
[EMAIL PROTECTED]



Jory Privett wrote:

As all of this is a  great thing that I would like to be part of,  I 
do not think it will ever happen.  If I remember correctly from an 
earlier post you have to have 10,000+ subs before they will let you 
participate.  This counts me out as well as the large majority of the 
people on this list, unless Adzilla lowers this number or allows 
groups (such as WISPA) to be counted together.
 
Jory Privett

WCCS
 



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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-09 Thread Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181



OK, I understand the concept.

It looks to me though, that most of the time we'll 
not have the right to change page content. Even though it's being 
delivered over our medium.

So I couldn't replace Ford car ads that no one here 
cares about and insert the local Napa ads that they do care about.

I can't see this as a viable thing if I can't find 
a way to sell local advertising that would show up whenever someone went to MSN 
or Yahoo or Google or whatever.

Marlon(509) 
982-2181 
Equipment sales(408) 907-6910 
(Vonage) 
Consulting services42846865 
(icq) 
And I run my own wisp!64.146.146.12 (net meeting)www.odessaoffice.com/wirelesswww.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Frank 
  Muto 
  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; WISPA General 
  List 
  Sent: Thursday, March 09, 2006 1:05 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  
  Revenue Streams
  
  Blair, I feel your concern is a valid 
  one.
  
  This is a basic twist of the walled network e.g., 
  AOL uses. As within AOL's network portal and browser they would have their 
  paid advertisers' shown. As a dialup provider (97-2002), we did the same thing 
  using our own portal and custom browser of which the user would use. Our 
  free-based users would be locked into the portal but our paid users would not 
  be.If they went outside our portal using their browser of choice, we did 
  not control their end destination. Our TOS spelled out these terms. 
  
  
  Steering a customer away from a company's website 
  like Amazon.com and redirecting theHTTP request through an affiliate 
  channel, is not good practice in my opinion. I'm not saying this is the case 
  in point, but there are companies like Zango, 180 Solutions and others that do 
  this and cost many affiliates commissions when the software, (e.g., P2P) or 
  bundled softwareis installed on the customers machine using various 
  methods, such as an Active-X pop-up asking the user to install certain 
  software.
  
  For an example, we fight click fraud everyday 
  that use these methods. When a user does a search on say Google and clicks on 
  an affiliate link, the user is redirected to another affiliate who would get 
  the sale if the customer purchased the advertised item or paid for the lead 
  generation. 
  
  
  
  
  Frank MutoPresident/CEOFSM Marketing 
  Group, Inc
  
  
  
  
  
- Original Message - 
From: 
Blair Davis 

If I publish a web page, who 
are you to modify it before displaying it to a user?I'd start 
getting annoyed if my web page displayed differently depending on whose 
network it flows thruI also feel that this is a bad idea in 
general because I think it could end up weakening the 'safe harbor' 
provisions that protect us from liability over data content. We are 
not censors. Beyond the monitoring needed to assure network integrity, 
we do not monitor or censor our users in any way and we do not plan 
to.IMO, we should not modify the data flowing to the user in any way 
without the express, informed consent of the user. If a user wants you 
to censor, modify or block pages, fine if you wish to offer 
that service. For liability reasons, we choose not to.Eric 
DaVersa wrote:
Agreed, but there is a free lunch...for the web publishers and ad
servers you allow to sell over your pipes.  

Take the old example of the Internet as a highway.  You've built a
highway (your wireless network) and people (your customers) pay to drive
on it.  Along the way there are billboard advertisements (web ads.)  

You collect nothing from the billboards that people view.  In essence,
the advertisers get a free lunch from your highway.

Adzilla basically gives you the opportunity to place your own billboards
in front of those existing billboards so that you, as the highway
operator, can receive a revenue share.

Mark, I don't mean to pick on you here and I apologize if my replies
come off as arrogant or inappropriate in any way.  I appreciate your
questioning and "devil's advocate" approach.  These lists are certainly
good for digging through the facts.

Peter R. sent an email for those interested in participating in a
webinar.  Also, an Adzilla exec will be at WISPNOG.

Respectfully,

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2006 1:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


"There is no free lunch."

this is the most concise, most accurate, and wisest words ever spoken,
on
the subject of economics.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fas

RE: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-09 Thread Jonathan Schmidt



What 
about something that works like this, instead?
(I 
think you have to push the demo button to see it)

http://www.publicwifiproject.org/anysitehpt2.htm
. . . j o n a t h a 
n

  -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 
  982-2181Sent: Thursday, March 09, 2006 6:28 PMTo: WISPA 
  General ListSubject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue 
  Streams
  OK, I understand the concept.
  
  It looks to me though, that most of the time 
  we'll not have the right to change page content. Even though it's being 
  delivered over our medium.
  
  So I couldn't replace Ford car ads that no one 
  here cares about and insert the local Napa ads that they do care 
  about.
  
  I can't see this as a viable thing if I can't 
  find a way to sell local advertising that would show up whenever someone went 
  to MSN or Yahoo or Google or whatever.
  
  Marlon(509) 
  982-2181 
  Equipment sales(408) 907-6910 
  (Vonage) 
  Consulting services42846865 
  (icq) 
  And I run my own wisp!64.146.146.12 (net meeting)www.odessaoffice.com/wirelesswww.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam
  
  
  
- Original Message - 
From: 
Frank 
Muto 
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; WISPA General 
List 
Sent: Thursday, March 09, 2006 1:05 
PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  
Revenue Streams

Blair, I feel your concern is a valid 
one.

This is a basic twist of the walled network 
e.g., AOL uses. As within AOL's network portal and browser they would have 
their paid advertisers' shown. As a dialup provider (97-2002), we did the 
same thing using our own portal and custom browser of which the user would 
use. Our free-based users would be locked into the portal but our paid users 
would not be.If they went outside our portal using their browser of 
choice, we did not control their end destination. Our TOS spelled out these 
terms. 

Steering a customer away from a company's 
website like Amazon.com and redirecting theHTTP request through an 
affiliate channel, is not good practice in my opinion. I'm not saying this 
is the case in point, but there are companies like Zango, 180 Solutions and 
others that do this and cost many affiliates commissions when the software, 
(e.g., P2P) or bundled softwareis installed on the customers machine 
using various methods, such as an Active-X pop-up asking the user to install 
certain software.

For an example, we fight click fraud everyday 
that use these methods. When a user does a search on say Google and clicks 
on an affiliate link, the user is redirected to another affiliate who would 
get the sale if the customer purchased the advertised item or paid for the 
lead generation. 




Frank MutoPresident/CEOFSM Marketing 
Group, Inc





  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Blair Davis 
  
  If I publish a web page, who 
  are you to modify it before displaying it to a user?I'd start 
  getting annoyed if my web page displayed differently depending on whose 
  network it flows thruI also feel that this is a bad idea in 
  general because I think it could end up weakening the 'safe harbor' 
  provisions that protect us from liability over data content. We are 
  not censors. Beyond the monitoring needed to assure network 
  integrity, we do not monitor or censor our users in any way and we do not 
  plan to.IMO, we should not modify the data flowing to the user in 
  any way without the express, informed consent of the user. If a user 
  wants you to censor, modify or block pages, fine if you 
  wish to offer that service. For liability reasons, we choose not 
  to.Eric DaVersa wrote:
  Agreed, but there is a free lunch...for the web publishers and ad
servers you allow to sell over your pipes.  

Take the old example of the Internet as a highway.  You've built a
highway (your wireless network) and people (your customers) pay to drive
on it.  Along the way there are billboard advertisements (web ads.)  

You collect nothing from the billboards that people view.  In essence,
the advertisers get a free lunch from your highway.

Adzilla basically gives you the opportunity to place your own billboards
in front of those existing billboards so that you, as the highway
operator, can receive a revenue share.

Mark, I don't mean to pick on you here and I apologize if my replies
come off as arrogant or inappropriate in any way.  I appreciate your
questioning and "devil's advocate" approach.  These lists are certainly
good for digging through the facts.

Peter R. sent an email for those interested in participating in a
webinar.  Also, an Adzilla exec will be at WISPNOG.

Respectfully,

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.24

Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-09 Thread John Scrivner
Some of the ads that flow through now are able to be inserted over with 
local ads you can sell (legally and with permission from all involved). 
This, again, mirrors the cable television ad insertion strategy. Those 
ads can be replaced by ads you can sell in your market and all the 
players involved will be compensated and will bless the act of inserting 
over some other random ads. The reason is simple. Focused and targeted 
ads sell for more than just random broad spectrum ads. The better we get 
at being involved in the ad sales and insertion process, the more 
valuable this medium for advertising will become. Localizing ads for the 
Internet is a really big deal. I was in cable television before ad 
insertion and watched it move into the cable business. At first ads 
would sell for peanuts, just like banners do now. Over time it added a 
massive amount of revenue to the cable operator bottom line and 
continues to grow to this day. ISP ad insertion will be the same model, 
growing, maturing and increasing in dollars into your business.

Scriv


Eric DaVersa wrote:


You do not have to sell a thing. It’s a real time automated transaction.

If you did want to sell or send communications messaging, you have a 
GUI tool for insertion.


Eric DaVersa

Vice-President, Business Development

**NetLogix**

OFFICE: 858.764.1998

CELL: 858.245.6702

FAX: 858.764.1982

[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

-Original Message-
*From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
*On Behalf Of *Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181

*Sent:* Thursday, March 09, 2006 4:28 PM
*To:* WISPA General List
*Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams

OK, I understand the concept.

It looks to me though, that most of the time we'll not have the right 
to change page content. Even though it's being delivered over our medium.


So I couldn't replace Ford car ads that no one here cares about and 
insert the local Napa ads that they do care about.


I can't see this as a viable thing if I can't find a way to sell local 
advertising that would show up whenever someone went to MSN or Yahoo 
or Google or whatever.


Marlon
(509) 982-2181 Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage) Consulting services
42846865 (icq) And I run my own wisp!
64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless http://www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam http://www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam


- Original Message -

*From:* Frank Muto mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

*To:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ; WISPA General
List mailto:wireless@wispa.org

*Sent:* Thursday, March 09, 2006 1:05 PM

*Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams

Blair, I feel your concern is a valid one.

This is a basic twist of the walled network e.g., AOL uses. As
within AOL's network portal and browser they would have their paid
advertisers' shown. As a dialup provider (97-2002), we did the
same thing using our own portal and custom browser of which the
user would use. Our free-based users would be locked into the
portal but our paid users would not be. If they went outside our
portal using their browser of choice, we did not control their end
destination. Our TOS spelled out these terms.

Steering a customer away from a company's website like Amazon.com
and redirecting the HTTP request through an affiliate channel, is
not good practice in my opinion. I'm not saying this is the case
in point, but there are companies like Zango, 180 Solutions and
others that do this and cost many affiliates commissions when the
software, (e.g., P2P) or bundled software is installed on the
customers machine using various methods, such as an Active-X
pop-up asking the user to install certain software.

For an example, we fight click fraud everyday that use these
methods. When a user does a search on say Google and clicks on an
affiliate link, the user is redirected to another affiliate who
would get the sale if the customer purchased the advertised item
or paid for the lead generation.

Frank Muto
President/CEO
FSM Marketing Group, Inc

- Original Message -

*From:* Blair Davis mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

If I publish a web page, who are you to modify it before
displaying it to a user?

I'd start getting annoyed if my web page displayed differently
depending on whose network it flows thru

I also feel that this is a bad idea in general because I think
it could end up weakening the 'safe harbor' provisions that
protect us from liability over data content. We are not
censors. Beyond the monitoring needed to assure network
integrity, we do not monitor or censor our users in any way
and we do not plan to.

IMO, we should not modify the data flowing to the user in any
way without the express, informed

Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-09 Thread Brian Rohrbacher

Less than 100 you mean?

Matt Larsen - Lists wrote:


Jory,

I think you hit the nail on the head there.  Does anyone know if there 
is a program for ISPs 1 subs?

Inquiring minds want to know.  :^)

Matt Larsen
[EMAIL PROTECTED]



Jory Privett wrote:

As all of this is a  great thing that I would like to be part of,  I 
do not think it will ever happen.  If I remember correctly from an 
earlier post you have to have 10,000+ subs before they will let you 
participate.  This counts me out as well as the large majority of the 
people on this list, unless Adzilla lowers this number or allows 
groups (such as WISPA) to be counted together.
 
Jory Privett

WCCS
 






--
Brian Rohrbacher
Reliable Internet, LLC
www.reliableinter.net
Cell 269-838-8338

Caught up in the Air 1 Thess. 4:17

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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-08 Thread Frank Muto
Personally, having a 10k tier is leaving money on the table. Having been a 
former dialup ISP (97-2002), we used ad based portal(s) revenue to subsidize 
our free-based users as well as our paid subscriber base. You can earn 
revenues from local based advertisers' by taking some time in doing so. 
There are numerous programs to choose from that any ISP can get direct 
revenues from without sharing. But if you do not have the resources to do it 
on your own, then this solution would be a good opportunity to look into.




Frank Muto
President/CEO
FSM Marketing Group, Inc







- Original Message - 
From: chris cooper [EMAIL PROTECTED]




How does the 10K include value of eyeballs viewing at hot spots?  Those
are not captive customers but I would think they represent a tremendous
value to advertisers, especially at high volume locations.  Can content
also be tailored to specific demographics, say housewives, retirees or
highschool students?

Chris
Intelliwave

-Original Message-



Currently its 10K subs since it is a rev share/subsidy model - dial-up,
DSL, wireless.  A high volume of business class subs can make this
number flexible.  There will be lower tier appliance platforms coming
down the pipeline.

Eric DaVersa


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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-08 Thread Brian Rohrbacher
Oh, yippee.  1 WISP can do it.  10,000 subs what?  Guess we can quit 
talking about this.


Eric DaVersa wrote:


Currently its 10K subs since it is a rev share/subsidy model - dial-up,
DSL, wireless.  A high volume of business class subs can make this
number flexible.  There will be lower tier appliance platforms coming
down the pipeline.  


Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jory Privett
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 4:10 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams

What are the subs  that I have to have to get a system like this???

Jory Privett
WCCS

- Original Message - 
From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 5:34 PM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


The simple answer to that is don't use that option.  The ad
optimization is transparent and its basically free money.  I usually
have to say it 3 times before ISPs start to understand the concept, so
in the interest of saving time...

It's free money, it's free money, and - you guessed it - it's still free
money.

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 2:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-
- Original Message - 
From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 8:57 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


 


For a Network Operator, you have some incredible new tools as part of
the package.  You have a GUI interface where you can insert messaging
DIRECT TO THE DESKTOP.  This means, Dear Customer, your payment is 7
days past due, your account will be shut off if you do not pay within
   


x
 


hours.
   



I think if I tried that with my customers, I would be losing, not
gaining,
customers.   The notion of inserting something into thier data is... too
intrusive for me to consider.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-

 



--
Brian Rohrbacher
Reliable Internet, LLC
www.reliableinter.net
Cell 269-838-8338

Caught up in the Air 1 Thess. 4:17

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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-08 Thread Peter R.
How about to make it easy for all of you, I set up a con call with 
Martin Stewart from Adzilla for a QA early next week?


There are minimums because the Zillacaster hardware isn't exactly cheap.
Plus local advertising has to be sold (and salespeople paid to close 
contracts on that).


If interested in the call, please email me for bridge info.

Regards,

Peter
RAD-INFO, Inc.
813.963.5884
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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-08 Thread Mark Koskenmaki

There is no free lunch.

this is the most concise, most accurate, and wisest words ever spoken, on
the subject of economics.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!

-
- Original Message - 
From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 3:34 PM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


 The simple answer to that is don't use that option.  The ad
 optimization is transparent and its basically free money.  I usually
 have to say it 3 times before ISPs start to understand the concept, so
 in the interest of saving time...

 It's free money, it's free money, and - you guessed it - it's still free
 money.

 Eric DaVersa
 Vice-President, Business Development
 NetLogix
 OFFICE: 858.764.1998
 CELL: 858.245.6702
 FAX: 858.764.1982
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]


 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
 Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
 Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 2:47 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


 North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
 personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
 sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
 Fast Internet, NO WIRES!
 
 
 -
 - Original Message - 
 From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 8:57 AM
 Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


 
  For a Network Operator, you have some incredible new tools as part of
  the package.  You have a GUI interface where you can insert messaging
  DIRECT TO THE DESKTOP.  This means, Dear Customer, your payment is 7
  days past due, your account will be shut off if you do not pay within
 x
  hours.

 I think if I tried that with my customers, I would be losing, not
 gaining,
 customers.   The notion of inserting something into thier data is... too
 intrusive for me to consider.



 North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
 personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
 sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
 Fast Internet, NO WIRES!
 
 
 -

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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-07 Thread Peter R.
I worked with Martin at Adzilla on a Conference Call to introduce him to 
some prospective ISPs.

(http://www.rad-info.net/partners/adzilla.htm)
Adzilla is a possible revenue stream for ISPs through ad replacement. 
(Instead of them seeing the ILEC ad, they can see you ad). It is 
definitely worth a listen to.


For larger ISPs (25k subs or higher), there is another revenue 
generation stream: Bare Fruit. 
(http://www.rad-info.net/partners/barefruit.htm)
When your users get a HTTP error (like 404 or 500) from a search, the 
Bare Fruit server will offer up a page of links along with the message 
that the page you click on was unavailable, perhaps these links would 
be suitable.
The links come from a search of the clicked link and each click through 
pays the ISP. (This can amount to huge revenue).


These are some of the ways for an ISP to gain revenue from its existing 
network of eyeballs. (In both cases, no upfront costs for the ISP either).


Regards,

Peter
RAD-INFO, Inc.
813.963.5884


Charles Wu wrote:


Here's an interesting concept (so interesting, in fact, that we made a
session about it at our next show)

All wireless network operators today carry Internet advertising over their
networks.  All that network traffic equates to more than $14 billion dollars
per year and is growing at double-digit rates every year.  Yet, even though
the network operator is responsible for connecting the eyeball to the ad,
they are left conspicuously on the sidelines when the advertising revenue
checks are being handed out.

John Wigboldus from Adzilla New Media will discuss how the wireless network
operator needs to think and act like a cable television company to start
earning revenue from advertisements that are being shown to their viewers.

More details at: http://www.winog.com

Now sure exactly what they're about -- but IMO, it's an interesting thought
(and I'm gonna try to make that session =)

Btw, for those of you that can't make it -- don't fret, we DO post
powerpoints after the show available for public download (but of course it's
NEVER as good as actually being there =)

-Charles


---
WiNOG Austin, TX
March 13-15, 2006
http://www.winog.com 

 


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RE: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-07 Thread Eric DaVersa
Charles - glad to hear that John is speaking at WiNOG! Your attendees
should find his presentation VERY interested.

We partnered with Adzilla recently.  With our growth in the Citywide
Wi-Fi market and all the FREE offerings out there, I did a lot of
research on advertising models to help Network Operators make money.  In
the end, Adzilla really was far ahead of the curve.  

Imagine this concept...the more my network is used, the more money I
make. Hmmm...INCONCEIVABLE!!!

The thing that Network Operators can't seem to grasp is, What do you
mean I stick this appliance at my POP and you start sending me checks?

The answer is YES.  But since Network Operators are so foreign to the
concept of advertising it generally requires a long explanation and a
PowerPoint (it's OK - I needed that too.) grin

The advertising can be tweaked to the point that the ads are virtually
unnoticeable to your clients.  Adzilla has developed a proprietary way
to deliver more relevant, localized ads in partnership with ad servers
and web publishers.

For a Network Operator, you have some incredible new tools as part of
the package.  You have a GUI interface where you can insert messaging
DIRECT TO THE DESKTOP.  This means, Dear Customer, your payment is 7
days past due, your account will be shut off if you do not pay within x
hours. 

It can also be used for marketing direct to the desktop!  Imagine that -
a message for your VOIP service to raise ARPUs, or other new service
enhancements.

It's really quite revolutionary.  I'll be glad to explain more to anyone
who's interested.

Respectfully,

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Peter R.
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 5:52 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams

I worked with Martin at Adzilla on a Conference Call to introduce him to

some prospective ISPs.
(http://www.rad-info.net/partners/adzilla.htm)
Adzilla is a possible revenue stream for ISPs through ad replacement. 
(Instead of them seeing the ILEC ad, they can see you ad). It is 
definitely worth a listen to.

For larger ISPs (25k subs or higher), there is another revenue 
generation stream: Bare Fruit. 
(http://www.rad-info.net/partners/barefruit.htm)
When your users get a HTTP error (like 404 or 500) from a search, the 
Bare Fruit server will offer up a page of links along with the message 
that the page you click on was unavailable, perhaps these links would 
be suitable.
The links come from a search of the clicked link and each click through 
pays the ISP. (This can amount to huge revenue).

These are some of the ways for an ISP to gain revenue from its existing 
network of eyeballs. (In both cases, no upfront costs for the ISP
either).

Regards,

Peter
RAD-INFO, Inc.
813.963.5884


Charles Wu wrote:

Here's an interesting concept (so interesting, in fact, that we made a
session about it at our next show)

All wireless network operators today carry Internet advertising over
their
networks.  All that network traffic equates to more than $14 billion
dollars
per year and is growing at double-digit rates every year.  Yet, even
though
the network operator is responsible for connecting the eyeball to the
ad,
they are left conspicuously on the sidelines when the advertising
revenue
checks are being handed out.

John Wigboldus from Adzilla New Media will discuss how the wireless
network
operator needs to think and act like a cable television company to
start
earning revenue from advertisements that are being shown to their
viewers.

More details at: http://www.winog.com

Now sure exactly what they're about -- but IMO, it's an interesting
thought
(and I'm gonna try to make that session =)

Btw, for those of you that can't make it -- don't fret, we DO post
powerpoints after the show available for public download (but of course
it's
NEVER as good as actually being there =)

-Charles


---
WiNOG Austin, TX
March 13-15, 2006
http://www.winog.com 

  

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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-07 Thread Mark Koskenmaki

North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!

-
- Original Message - 
From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 8:57 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams



 For a Network Operator, you have some incredible new tools as part of
 the package.  You have a GUI interface where you can insert messaging
 DIRECT TO THE DESKTOP.  This means, Dear Customer, your payment is 7
 days past due, your account will be shut off if you do not pay within x
 hours.

I think if I tried that with my customers, I would be losing, not gaining,
customers.   The notion of inserting something into thier data is... too
intrusive for me to consider.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!

-

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RE: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-07 Thread Eric DaVersa
The simple answer to that is don't use that option.  The ad
optimization is transparent and its basically free money.  I usually
have to say it 3 times before ISPs start to understand the concept, so
in the interest of saving time...

It's free money, it's free money, and - you guessed it - it's still free
money.

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 2:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-
- Original Message - 
From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 8:57 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams



 For a Network Operator, you have some incredible new tools as part of
 the package.  You have a GUI interface where you can insert messaging
 DIRECT TO THE DESKTOP.  This means, Dear Customer, your payment is 7
 days past due, your account will be shut off if you do not pay within
x
 hours.

I think if I tried that with my customers, I would be losing, not
gaining,
customers.   The notion of inserting something into thier data is... too
intrusive for me to consider.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-

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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-07 Thread Brian Rohrbacher

Sign me up.  When and where???

Eric DaVersa wrote:


The simple answer to that is don't use that option.  The ad
optimization is transparent and its basically free money.  I usually
have to say it 3 times before ISPs start to understand the concept, so
in the interest of saving time...

It's free money, it's free money, and - you guessed it - it's still free
money.

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 2:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-
- Original Message - 
From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 8:57 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


 


For a Network Operator, you have some incredible new tools as part of
the package.  You have a GUI interface where you can insert messaging
DIRECT TO THE DESKTOP.  This means, Dear Customer, your payment is 7
days past due, your account will be shut off if you do not pay within
   


x
 


hours.
   



I think if I tried that with my customers, I would be losing, not
gaining,
customers.   The notion of inserting something into thier data is... too
intrusive for me to consider.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-

 



--
Brian Rohrbacher
Reliable Internet, LLC
www.reliableinter.net
Cell 269-838-8338

Caught up in the Air 1 Thess. 4:17

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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-07 Thread Ron Wallace
Yea, Brian!-Original Message-From: Brian Rohrbacher [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Tuesday, March 7, 2006 06:50 PMTo: 'WISPA General List'Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue StreamsSign me up. When and where???Eric DaVersa wrote:The simple answer to that is "don't use that option." The adoptimization is transparent and its basically free money. I usuallyhave to say it 3 times before ISPs start to understand the concept, soin the interest of saving time...It's free money, it's free money, and - you guessed it - it's still freemoney.Eric DaVersaVice-President, Business DevelopmentNetLogixOFFICE: 858.764.1998CELL: 858.245.6702FAX: 858.764.1982[EMAIL PROTECTED]  -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] OnBehalf Of Mark KoskenmakiSent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 2:47 PMTo: WISPA General ListSubject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue StreamsNorth East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061personal correspondence to: mark at neofast dot netsales inquiries to: purchasing at neofast dot netFast Internet, NO WIRES!-- Original Message - From: "Eric DaVersa" [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: "'WISPA General List'" wireless@wispa.orgSent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 8:57 AMSubject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams For a Network Operator, you have some incredible new tools as part ofthe package. You have a GUI interface where you can insert messagingDIRECT TO THE DESKTOP. This means, "Dear Customer, your payment is 7days past due, your account will be shut off if you do not pay within x hours." I think if I tried that with my customers, I would be losing, notgaining,customers. The notion of inserting something into thier data is... toointrusive for me to consider.North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061personal correspondence to: mark at neofast dot netsales inquiries to: purchasing at neofast dot netFast Internet, NO WIRES!- -- Brian RohrbacherReliable Internet, LLCwww.reliableinter.netCell 269-838-8338"Caught up in the Air" 1 Thess. 4:17-- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.orgSubscribe/Unsubscribe:http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wirelessArchives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
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Re: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-07 Thread Jory Privett
What are the subs  that I have to have to get a system like this???

Jory Privett
WCCS

- Original Message - 
From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 5:34 PM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


The simple answer to that is don't use that option.  The ad
optimization is transparent and its basically free money.  I usually
have to say it 3 times before ISPs start to understand the concept, so
in the interest of saving time...

It's free money, it's free money, and - you guessed it - it's still free
money.

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 2:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-
- Original Message - 
From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 8:57 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams



 For a Network Operator, you have some incredible new tools as part of
 the package.  You have a GUI interface where you can insert messaging
 DIRECT TO THE DESKTOP.  This means, Dear Customer, your payment is 7
 days past due, your account will be shut off if you do not pay within
x
 hours.

I think if I tried that with my customers, I would be losing, not
gaining,
customers.   The notion of inserting something into thier data is... too
intrusive for me to consider.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-

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RE: [WISPA] Adzilla Revenue Streams

2006-03-07 Thread Charles Wu

What are the subs  that I have to have to get a system like this???

Jory Privett
WCCS

Hi Jory,

Are you coming to WiNOG? The people from Adzilla will be there, so you can
meet them first-hand and talk with them directly

-Charles

---
WiNOG Austin, TX
March 13-15, 2006
http://www.winog.com 



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jory Privett
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 6:10 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams



- Original Message - 
From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 5:34 PM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


The simple answer to that is don't use that option.  The ad optimization
is transparent and its basically free money.  I usually have to say it 3
times before ISPs start to understand the concept, so in the interest of
saving time...

It's free money, it's free money, and - you guessed it - it's still free
money.

Eric DaVersa
Vice-President, Business Development
NetLogix
OFFICE: 858.764.1998
CELL: 858.245.6702
FAX: 858.764.1982
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mark Koskenmaki
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 2:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams


North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-
- Original Message - 
From: Eric DaVersa [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 8:57 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Adzilla  Revenue Streams



 For a Network Operator, you have some incredible new tools as part of 
 the package.  You have a GUI interface where you can insert messaging 
 DIRECT TO THE DESKTOP.  This means, Dear Customer, your payment is 7 
 days past due, your account will be shut off if you do not pay within
x
 hours.

I think if I tried that with my customers, I would be losing, not gaining,
customers.   The notion of inserting something into thier data is... too
intrusive for me to consider.



North East Oregon Fastnet, LLC 509-593-4061
personal correspondence to:  mark at neofast dot net
sales inquiries to:  purchasing at neofast dot net
Fast Internet, NO WIRES!


-

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