My own personal frustration comes from people not willing to accept that
anything good can possibly come from religion. I don't feel that I need to
defend or answer for everything religion has done.
I apologize for bringing the subject here. What my real frustration was was due
to the fact that this was a forum which, as I said, had a portion designated
for religious discussions and it was dominated by anti-religious sentiment.
I truly believe that many of the issues that are facing our world - the death
of the environment, unrestricted greed - are caused by rampant materialism, in
both the sense of money and in the sense of denying the spiritual. I think we
need more, not less spiritual input in our world, and anything remotely
spiritual seems to be struck down.
--- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, Kristy McClain <healthypl...@...> wrote:
> Gentlemen, :)
> Wait~~ don't get me into this discussion, as it is now "I" who has lost the
> thread.Â I was merely trying to point out to DP that debating on-line with
> people who attack him or hurt his feelings seems pointless to me, and making
> a different choice to disengage and move on might be more productive.Â I see
> now that it was a waste of my time as he has broughtÂ the issue to this
> forum.Â I will take my own advice andÂ move on.Â I have no problem
> accepting both atheistsÂ and those who practice faith-based religions.Â I
> don't think atheists are ignorant of faith.Â That was not my point. My point
> was-- and is-- perhaps people of faith are guided byÂ something other than
> "facts", whereas atheists can, and often do debate religion from an
> analyticalÂ or logic perspective.Â You can't prove or dis-prove faith, so
> why try?Â I'm of the boringÂ "Can't we all just along" school"Â Silly me..
> --- On Mon, 10/4/10, mike brown <uerusub...@...> wrote:
> From: mike brown <uerusub...@...>
> Subject: Re: [Zen] Re: Don't pray in my school and I won't think in your
> To: Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Monday, October 4, 2010, 10:18 AM
> Just because you're paranoid it doesn't mean they're not out to get you, huh.
> Let me spell it out for you one more time. To paraphrase Kristy -Â Â she said
> that atheistsÂ are ignorantÂ of faith and so don't understand the religious
> perspective. I pointed out that 1) lots of atheists were once upon a time
> believers who have now 'seen the light' and so do have such experience but
> rejected it. 2) I may beÂ ignorant ofÂ the beliefs of other groupsÂ but still
> can deduce that they are harmful. NOT that religious folks are the same as
> neo-nazis but the harm that can be DONE is the same. Clear?
> MikeÂ Â
> From: DP <wookielife...@...>
> To: Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tue, 5 October, 2010 1:03:36
> Subject: [Zen] Re: Don't pray in my school and I won't think in your church.
> My god, that is disingenuous...
> Kristy specifically said that the people who are arguing probably don't have
> an experience of faith and that this means I can't explain it to them.
> You essentially said "I don't have to be a Neo-Nazi to understand that it's
> It doesn't take a paranoid person to see a comparison being made.
> You are using your own personal definition of religion to attack. This is not
> my experience of religion, and it never will be.
> --- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, mike brown <uerusuboyo@> wrote:
> > DP,
> > Â
> > I wrote: "Moreover, I am ignorant of what it is to be a neo-nazis, but have
> > no
> > trouble rejecting their beliefs as not just harmful, but wrong."
> > You wrote: "You were essentially implying that religious belief was no
> > different
> > from being a "neo-nazi." I'm sorry, but I do find that offensive."
> > Â
> > That wasn't my intention in the above sentence. I could just as easily have
> > said
> > I am ignorant of being a racist/Republican/terrorist/bigot/child-molester
> > etc to
> > make the point. If you see the connection with those and religion, well...
> > Â
> > MikeÂ Â
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