Glad you are back. I am back too after absence for a short while.
Your advice of being awake all the time may work for Dave. Or may not work. He
needs to try a hundred things until he finds something good.
A while ago, if you remember, you advised helping others. It is a good idea,
but he did not follow.
I suggested taking medicine. Again, he did not follow.
Years ago, depression was thought to be a psychological disease. But now
doctors have found it results at least partly from chemical inbalances in the
body. So medicine works. I don't know about Dave's problems. Why not go to a
doctor and listen to his advice.
--- On Sun, 2/1/11, Kristy McClain <healthypl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
From: Kristy McClain <healthypl...@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Zen] Re: Mindfulness pt 2
Date: Sunday, 2 January, 2011, 6:56 AM
*bows* to Dave,
I haven't been following this thread due to the holidays, but thought I'd
share this. Another perspective..
>From Small Boat, Great Mountain by Amaro Bhikkhu
>And so for about the first two or three weeks of the winter
>retreat in 1987, Ajahn Sumedho kept telling people not to meditate:
>Just be awake.
>He would say to us over and over again, Stop it, stop meditating!
>He stressed this repeatedly and gave two or three
>Dharma talks a day on not meditating. He would tell people to
>open their eyes and stop trying to concentrate. Sometimes there
>would be the plaintive cry, But what are we supposed to do?
>For which the person would receive a response in thunderbolts
>saying, do!? Don’t do anything. You already are it. Don’t do
>anything. The methodology was identical to the undistracted
>nonmeditation employed in Dzogchen practice.
>He was trying to point out that dimension of doingness, busyness,
>that becoming quality that so easily takes over the meditation.
>It can permeate the whole effort of spiritual practice. The
>becoming tendency takes over and gets legitimized by being called
>meditation or me becoming enlightened. Meanwhile, we miss
>the fact that we are losing the main point and that what we are
>doing has turned into a self-based program. We get caught in the
>illusion, trying to make the self become something other. As a
>result, we lose track of the real essence of the practice. Making
>the effort to see how this happens made this a very fruitful
>retreat. After about two or three weeks we were beginning to get
>a sense of what it means to stay present: Don’t do something
>now to become enlightened in the future. Just be awake now.
Be well in the New Year..
--- On Sat, 1/1/11, Dave P <wookielife...@yahoo.ca> wrote:
From: Dave P <wookielife...@yahoo.ca>
Subject: [Zen] Re: Mindfulness pt 2
Date: Saturday, January 1, 2011, 10:39 AM
Here's another dillemma i've had. the idea that everything is under control,
and the difference between that and choice. There is the phrase "pain is
inevitable, suffering is optional." I think that there is truth in that, but I
still feel that choosing to feel one may nmeans that you have to ACT. That your
actions have consequences that you cannot control, a notion that paralyzes me.
Can mindfulness help with that? If so, how?
--- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 <chan.j...@...>
> Happy New Year Ed,
> Propose another word in place of "mindfulness" is a very challenging
> task. Let me explain.
> In the practice and dealing with everyday life, we say "Be aware but not
> attached to", "focus but not focusing", "observe but not observing", are
> some of the terms we use while we translate from our Chinese text to
> English. In other words, "sync to the universal wisdom at every moment,
> and not be attached to the meaning of the phenomena." is the phrase we
> need to represent with a single word.
> The most common general terms as a verb in the practice, we use are "be
> aware", "sense", "feel", etc. i.e. "sense our breathing", "feel the
> chakra". They are usually terms applying also to emotions, feelings as
> well as our general overall well being, physical and spiritual. We can
> not separate our "true feeling" from our body or mind.
> We are very careful not to consistently use the same word. Especially
> the practice to "notice" the conditions of our body, mind and spirit,
> could require different verb for a similar function. Chan teaching
> requires flexibility.
> The purpose of Chan wordings are nothing but to wake up the
> practitioner, and not to set a path or a rule to follow. After 5,000
> words, Diamond Sutra said only one thing, "Whatever you think it is, it
> is not. It just is."
> Perhaps a lot of times, I am guilty in becoming lazy and just say,
> "Shut up, Sit down and Stop thinking."
> Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can
> On 1/1/2011 7:37 AM, ED wrote:
> > JM,
> > What is your proposed definition of 'mindfulness'?
> > --ED
> > --- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, Jue Miao Jing Ming - è¦ºå¦™ç²¾æ˜Ž
> > <chan.jmjm@> wrote:
> > >
> > Thank you JDB. Indeed we also teach "emptiness of mind".
> > Somehow the western Zen is stuck on the label of "mind" and would not
> > let go.Â There is even a seminar about the small mind and big mind.
> > Though all journeys lead to the same place.
> > "Mind" is too close to "thinking". It can be easily misunderstood and
> > misinterpreted.
> > We teach "empty your mind", "enhance your heart". And we continue to
> > say "because heart is where we could unify our body, mind and spirit."
> > Somehow, unify our body to the same physical structure as the universe
> > is not emphasized in western Zen.Â Most of the reading that I have
> > encountered with focuses mainly on the mind and its awareness, not on
> > the body and little on the spirit.Â Though we constantly talked about
> > body, mind and spirit, but in essence, they are one and inseparable.Â
> > Just like the universe.
> > In our school, awareness does not reside in the mind. Awareness is a
> > function of our spirit, which reside in our heart.Â "Heart" is not
> > the organic heart, but our "total well being", our "center" or
> > "ONE".Â Awareness enhancement helps us to be awakened to the Absolute
> > Awareness of the universe.
> > This brings this post to another question. What does Zen say about our
> > spirit? Our spiritual levels, our spiritual being, spiritual karma,
> > the sixth, seventh and eighth consciousness?
> > After several years with this forum, I have read little about these.Â
> > In other words, to be enlightened, we need to surpass karmic hindrance
> > of body, mind and spirit. We need to work on all three.
> > Otherwise, we are just imagining and hoping.
> > On this New Year Day, I hope this post is not too objectionable to ALL.
> > Happy New Year and thank you for your patience and understanding for
> > all the years.
> > JMJM
> > Head Teacher
> > Order Of Chan
> > Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can
> > http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com
> > http://www.heartchan.org
> > On 12/31/2010 10:12 PM, Rev. Joriki Dat Baker wrote:
> >> Â
> >> Or the emptiness of mind.
> >> I wonder if something similar could be said about mindfulness.
> >> "Mindful" in the Western sense seems to be directing your attention
> >> in one direction, However, maybe a better translation is "mind
> >> fullness," as in you experience everything with the fullness of your
> >> mind. Or am I way off here?