Re: [Biofuel] Okay, This time I really am going to take down the list, , , , but first, please read
I guess I'm sorta left, in more ways than one,depending who is talking about me. I admit I don't devote a lot of time to the email list Hover I'll will follow the group/list to wherever it migrates too, if it migrates at all. All good things come to on end that is particularity true of thing that are of low or now cost to the ultimate consumer, I can't complain. I don't know to what degree they would be valuable will the archives be saved somehow?. In the event they could be compiled into file that's usable I would me more than happy to put such fa file in my peer to peer folder where the file would be support by BitTorrent distribution. Regards Doug ___ Sustainablelorgbiofuel mailing list Sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org http://lists.eruditium.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel
[Biofuel] Jan. 2009 ARES report
Registered members, 2, no change. No nets No traffic. I spoke with the two Rooks County Health Center employees, that where recently licensed. Somewhere along the line they got the impression that Public Safety personnel could use amateur radio frequencies to talk with amateur radio licensees. I think I actually seen the wind leave their sails, when I advised them, only if the PS personnel had amateur radio licenses also. Now I have to see if I can play this to encourage more people to become licensed. 73 Doug, N0LKK ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Who Owns Nature?
Hi Keith, Giving it all an extra moment of thought, I realize the following; While mankind is able to exploit the planet's resources, nature owns mankind. Owns us absolutely, there is no negotiation. I probably knew that all along, but it slips my mind, time to time. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Keith Addison wrote: Hi Doug Judging by the writings of Thomas Paine I ran across recently, all of mankind owns our planet(nature?) in common. Agrarian Justice http://xroads.virginia.edu/~Hyper2/CDFinal/Paine/agrarian.html Thankyou! The more history I discover, the more I wonder how the USA got from then to now. And thanks for sending the link to the etc group report. Ralf Nader or some one else with similar experience with corporate world, should pull an Al Gore, taking this information to the people. Doug, N0LKK All of mankind owns the planet though... Only mankind? Doesn't nature own itself? Ecuador's new constitution includes an article that grants nature the right to exist, persist, maintain and regenerate its vital cycles, structure, functions and its processes in evolution and will grant legal standing to any person to defend those rights in court. http://www.metafilter.com/75251/Ecuador-has-a-new-constitution Ecuador has a new constitution September 29, 2008 Voters in Ecuador appear to have approved a new constitution yesterday, guaranteeing rights to clean water, universal healthcare, pensions, and free state-run education through the university level. It also may allow President Rafael Correa to remain in power until 2017. Particularly of note is a world first bill of rights for nature which grants inalienable rights to nature. http://www.ecoearth.info/shared/reader/welcome.aspx?linkid=107108 http://dotearth.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/09/29/ecuador-constitution-grants-nature-rights/ The specific provisions state: (source) Chapter: Rights for Nature Art. 1. Nature or Pachamama, where life is reproduced and exists, has the right to exist, persist, maintain and regenerate its vital cycles, structure, functions and its processes in evolution. Every person, people, community or nationality, will be able to demand the recognitions of rights for nature before the public organisms. The application and interpretation of these rights will follow the related principles established in the Constitution. Art. 2. Nature has the right to an integral restoration. This integral restoration is independent of the obligation on natural and juridical persons or the State to indemnify the people and the collectives that depend on the natural systems. In the cases of severe or permanent environmental impact, including the ones caused by the exploitation on non renewable natural resources, the State will establish the most efficient mechanisms for the restoration, and will adopt the adequate measures to eliminate or mitigate the harmful environmental consequences. Art. 3. The State will motivate natural and juridical persons as well as collectives to protect nature; it will promote respect towards all the elements that form an ecosystem. Art. 4. The State will apply precaution and restriction measures in all the activities that can lead to the extinction of species, the destruction of the ecosystems or the permanent alteration of the natural cycles. The introduction of organisms and organic and inorganic material that can alter in a definitive way the national genetic patrimony is prohibited. Art. 5. The persons, people, communities and nationalities will have the right to benefit from the environment and form natural wealth that will allow wellbeing. The environmental services are cannot be appropriated; its production, provision, use and exploitation, will be regulated by the State. I think that's great! Best Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.9.6/1797 - Release Date: 11/18/2008 11:23 AM ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Who Owns Nature?
Judging by the writings of Thomas Paine I ran across recently, all of mankind owns our planet(nature?) in common. Agrarian Justice http://xroads.virginia.edu/~Hyper2/CDFinal/Paine/agrarian.html The more history I discover, the more I wonder how the USA got from then to now. And thanks for sending the link to the etc group report. Ralf Nader or some one else with similar experience with corporate world, should pull an Al Gore, taking this information to the people. Doug, N0LKK ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Bush-Led 'Disaster Capitalism' Exploits Worldwide Misery to Make a Buck
While I understand that my country never intends to truly liberate Iraq and her citizens, but I wonder Naomi Klein understands how naive going on about the reported 25/75 split will be read by royalty owners in the United State. 25% is twice as much as royalty owners in the United States typically receive.In the event a conservative talk show host hasn't yet used that detail to discredit, the more reasonable points Klein offers one soon will Doug, N0LKK Keith Addison wrote: Bush-Led 'Disaster Capitalism' Exploits Worldwide Misery to Make a Buck By Naomi Klein, The Nation ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Consumers Prefer Locally Grown Food, Study Finds
Keith Addison wrote: http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2008/06/local_food.html Consumers Prefer Locally Grown Food, Study Finds Shoppers say they're willing to pay a premium Has anyone asked the questions Can you afford to pay a premium? How much of a premium? Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Company is buying WVO
I doubt that higher petroleum prices would mean, an appreciable increase in amount waste oil is recycled, but higher prices may increase the demand for what of what waste oil is collected. I would love to have a transport tanker full of it to sell at the crude oil reclaiming plant a mile South of me. :) Other than burning it in their diesel engined motor vehicles some silly people may would like to recycle it to heat buildings. What is and isn't practice depends on the cost of the refined products from petroleum to be stating the obvious. Anyway the tanker full is a daydream, but in some places those using recycled oil for heating purposes could be competition for the diesel driver. Doug Original Message From: Keith Addison Anyway, why would the price/value of waste lube oil be soaring? Do high oil prices really mean more waste oil is being recycled? More silly people burning it as fuel in their diesels? Just because the price of everything else is soaring? And nobody's even blaming biofuels? :-) Best Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Sweet sorghum, clean miracle crop for feed and fuel
My understanding is that the Sorghum cane used to produce molasses is different that grain sorghum. Milo, but, some call it Maize as well. knew a man used to farm irrigated land in Southwest Kansas. He spoke of growing Corn and then he spoke of growing Maize. Took me forever to figure out when he said Maize, he was talking about Milo. The cane used to make molasses at the annual antique engine tractor event here is decidedly different than than grain sorghum grown in the field adjoining my property. We are told the sorghum grown to make the molasses at the event is a variety grown specifically to make molasses. At least one Kansas Ethanol plant was designed around using grain sorghum. Grain Sorghum being a dryland crop in much of Kansas, unlike Corn. Doug Randy wrote: Sorghum is a cane crop that also produces a grain called Milo. The grain is also able to be processed in much the same way as corn or oats/barley would. The most visible product from Sorghum is molasses style syrup that is sold in grocery stores. It is the ingredient that makes gingerbread cookies as dark as they are. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] New Legislation Calls for Government Ownership of DNA
You would think here in the US someone as innocent as an infant would be protected by the 4th amendment. I wonder what the fate of a child who's DNA profile shows them to predisposed to becoming a politician would be? Doug ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Pantone-Reactor
Fritz Friesinger wrote: www.econologie.com and get more Info from there Website! Everything is in french maybe Frantz coul help a little with this Fritz Or you could install the Google tool bar for your browser or use babelfish http://babelfish.altavista.digital.com/babelfish/tr Babelfish may be something Frantz may invesigate to see if it could aid in his project. Doug ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] We Need To Solve The Oil Crisis--Now
Kirk McLoren wrote: I am in favor of new laws - only if you recind an old one. There are so many laws now the only way you know you are breaking one is if they pinch you. Kirk I can't recall a time when I first learned of a law is when I was pinched. I'm still relatively young, perhaps there is time for me to experience this yet. :) What guarantee is there that any old law rescinded would be on that should be rescinded? An idea that could bite us in the butt if it had any chance of being implemented. Doug ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] We Need To Solve The Oil Crisis--Now
Chip Mefford wrote: There were a *lot* of problems with this. I'm not going to go into it all, in fact, I'm barely going to scratch the surface. But essentially, the nationwide 55mph speed limit was about as popular as prohibition, and caused many of the same problems. That was interesting. No, not that the 55 speed limit was as popular as prohibition. The idea that the 55 speed limit created problems anywhere near those caused by prohibition. Please go into it, I may have missed something during those years, unless you where exercising your right to hyperbole. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] 7 myths of energy independence
Darryl McMahon wrote: Francene, have you done the test with DC-rated equipment? Most low-cost EMF testing equipment is designed for use with AC power. I believe the Prius does use AC. Doug ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] plug in kit for hybrid
I did understand that the unit has batteries of it's own, for some reason I got the impression the unit also recharged the vehicle's original batteries as well. shrug Doug robert and benita wrote: I've read that Toyota isn't standing by their hybrid systems after the warranty period is up. People who've bought early Priuses (Priii?) are complaining that they can't get service for their hybrid drives anymore. My Camry has a 7 year warranty on the battery and drive system, but once that's up, I can do whatever I want with the thing. The plug in system Kirk linked us to replaces the NiMH battery pack with Lithium polymer batteries. I don't think the manufacturers will cover that at all, and I also wonder about insurance . . . ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] plug in kit for hybrid
Kirk McLoren wrote: Kit converts hybrid to plug in electric http://www.hymotion.com/ What do the hybrid manufacturers have to say about the use of outboard battery chargers? Will the use affect the manufacturers warranty of the vehicle's batteries? d. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Coal on the Ropes
The Holcomb power plant in SW Kansas is a topic of particular interest to me, because it now will affect what I pay for power from the grid. I'm certain 10 cent electrical power is going to be a thing of the past. Considering it's reported that $200 million is still owed on the plant constructed 30 some years ago. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] WVO squeeze
I would really doubt a label on the barrel would deter dumpster divers. The only down sides I could imagine are; that by claiming ownership, you would be making yourself liable. For example if the oil would happen to leak into the environment for any reason, you may be held responsible for the costs of cleanup. A cost that could get very high if the WVO ever got onto water. As it is now the restaurants' liability insurance should cover it, but I'm sure a smile will come across the insurance adjustor's face the moment they see a property of label of someone other than their insured party. Rural or not the label may make responsible for any regulations your state may have regarding WVO storage, collection,disposal. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Thomas Kelly wrote: Hello, Is there any down side to placing a small barrel (15 or 30 gal/ ~ 55 or 115L) at restaurants for them to put their WVO in? I ask because I am finding increased hijacking of my WVO. This despite owners assuring me that they tell anyone who asks for the WVO: No. We already have someone picking it up (me). The restaurants I collect from have a nice, friendly, but informal relationship. They put plastic containers (cubies) out for me. I pick them up once a week. I noticed a plastic WVO barrel beside an veg oil dumpster that I used to pump oil from when I ran short. The chef said they put it in the barrel for a local guy. The WVO in the barrel seems to be left untouched. It doesn't have a label. I thought a label like Property of T Kelly might discourage hijackers . or does it just alert the powers that be to come bust my chops? I live in rural New York (USA). Comments appreciated, Tom ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fwd: Rumsfeld flees France fearingarrest
Well all they would have to do is stay within the United States. I really can't recall either of them being globe trotters prior to their election. I'm not so sure the action of the French officials has any thing to do with the status of their balls. They where safely in their home country and if they didn't feel the popular opinion of their countrymen was behind them they wouldn't have made the attempt. The new era of Mutual Assured Destruction will be tempering the actions of other counties for some time yet. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ??? Wouldn't it be nice if Bush and Cheney get chased around like this when they get out of office. War criminals on the run from the law, for the rest of their days. ??? Maybe they may even be made examples of if the international community had any balls, as we Americans, seem to have lost ours. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fwd: Rumsfeld flees France fearingarrest....................................
I don't believe eternity is long enough to discuss tit for tat. Perhaps if weren't for some American businessmen empowering Hitler, history may have been different. Of course we ignore the US's effective genocide. Forgetting about those German Nazi collaborators that the US shielded and brought into the USA? Of course both Osama and Saddam where allies of the US. As for the story I find it odd that credit is given for an author or the agency that released it. Along with the date was nearly a week ago. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Mark Cookson wrote: This from a nation who collaborated with Germany during the 2nd world war, rounded up their own French resistance fighters for execution, and then had the brass neck to charge the Jews the railway fare whilst they were shipped to the death camps in cattle trucks. And not only allowed the people responsible to remain in France but remain in government office for the rest of their lives. Not forgetting building the underground control bunkers in Iraq and selling them an airforce If charity begins at home where does justice live these days? Mark ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Open letter from Islam to Christianity
swalms wrote: Perhaps they should state they deplore the attacks of 911. or do they? Respectfully that's no more than looking for an excuse to reject something. Anyway what's the word on European and US Christian leaders deploring the policies of their respective countries that result in many deaths? Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The great Iraqi swindle
Mike Weaver wrote: *And we keep getting richer but we can't get our picture On the cover of the Rolling Stone -Dr Hook Curses. Thanks to you that tune will be stuck in my head for hours. Doug ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Re-inventing the 3 wheel
No matter the Japanese auto manufacturers spin it, the car is going to be basically a machine for getting around. And always will play a role in pollution and, in accidents. Transforming it into a friendly companion ain't gonna change those facts. Perhaps they are mesmerized by the Sony robots, nice doggy :) ... Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] FFA decolorization
Whew! For a moment there I though the Future Farmers of America http://ffa.org/ lost their trademark colors. :) Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] From the Bin Laden tape
I see nothing that hasn't been stated before by others. Much of this was history prior to Bin Laden and the Afghan Mujahideen accepting U. S. aid in their Jihad against the Soviets occupying Afghanistan. He is no discerning in, who he allies with no more than, the the U. S. has been. Neither care about the means, as long as the results are favorable to them. Even after reading the transcript, unless I missed something, the only solution he offers is our accepting the Islam and the Quran. He knew full well lost practically all who stayed with his letter to that point. I don't know if he is aware that, myself and others are certain, he and other Islam extremists, along with their Quran are as morally ambiguous as, the self-described moral majority and their Bible are. Bin Laden is one more ass who only seeks peace on his unconditional terms of surrender, understanding it will be rejected. Interesting the accuser, learned lessons in deception well, from those he accuses of deception. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Keith Addison wrote: Full transcript: http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/i/msnbc/sections/news/070907_bin_laden_transcript.pdf This version edited and condensed by Michael Dickinson http://www.counterpunch.org/dickinson09112007.html ... After examining the transcribed text of Osama's address, I found much of what he said made sense to me. After condensing and editing, this following version of the speech might make sense to you too - ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The DC Establishment vs American Public Opinion
John Mullan wrote: It's not a war, it's an occupation. That sound like a bumper sticker Can't pull out the troops. If they were withdrawn, the security of the oil won't be assured. 10-15-20-25-30 years down the road I suspect that will remain the situation. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Israeli nuclear reactor
A new twist on MAD? The risk of your home being effected by your use of nuclear weapons on close in targets, deters your use of them? Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Kirk McLoren wrote: The estimates I heard wasnt 200. It was 600 bombs. As for tritium I think it has a lot of uses. What possible use could Israel have for H bombs? I suppose that has little bearing on their ambitions though. Collective insanity. Kirk ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] [Fwd: Re: FW: Live from congress]
Original Message did you notice the Onion logo in the lower right? Not until you mentioned it. Cleverly hidden in the C of C-SPAN. Doug ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor
John Ferree wrote: For a veggie farm. . . . http://www.flyingbeet.com/electricg/ john Such a conversion could be suitable for the VI Case sitting here in the yard. But it isn't typical of the tractors used around here. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Smashing Capitalism
But isn't sustained mass wealth leg a pipe dream? What do we need to to prevent that weak loose leg from, poking us in the butt, as the stool crashes to the floor? Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: to Biofuel List from Lewis L Smith I am old enough to remember with affection the pre-WW II Sears catalogue. M Weaver is right. Mr. Ford and Mr. Sears had it very clear in their heads that mass prosperity, mass production and mass distribution constitute a three-legged stool. You can have a healthy economy or an upright stool without all three legs. Cordially. ### ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Smashing Capitalism
IMO it's because that large percentage has been lead to believe that personal empires that will be inherited by their children, is a birthright, that large majority will not accept modest. I'm not so sure where that leaves the minority? [shrug] Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: to Biofuel List from Lewis L Smith My professional judgment is this Sustained mass wealth is probably unsustainable for environmental reasons, but a modest level of dignity and prosperity for a large percentage of the people is not, provided the population of the World can be stabilized. Cordially. ### ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor
Perhaps I'm reading the article too critically. Diesel tractors do not need the PTO to operate cultivation and seeding implements, that I'm aware of, so it would stand to reason an electric tractor wouldn't either. Desi el or electric a PTO will required to operate some crop harvesting implements. Yes in the past their operation was powered by the wheels of horse pulled ancestors. I would have to think their wouldn't be enough time in a 24 hour day for a modern versions of the to do the amount of work powered equipment in a much shorter, but still plenty long,work day. The AC and they hydraulics will need power, perhaps the hydraulics will provide enough heat for the cab during the winter. Certaintly they will be quieter, but hear the chirping birds quit, may be a stretch I'm sure electric tractors will have to be a part of the solution, so it will be interesting to see how they take shape and if over the road electric tractors will be developed alongside them. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor
Larry Ruebush wrote: PTO IS USED during planting and cultivating. Often used to run the planter or sprayer. Larry Ruebush west central IL I stand corrected. I'll pay a bit more attention when my my neighbors drill in the wheat this fall. Doug, N0LKK ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel in V6 diesel engine
Jason Mier wrote: thats because the old american diesels were poorly designed (being modified gassers) and burned out after a few sickly weak years. Robert's post pointed out the myth about the GM Diesels being modified Oldsmobile Gasoline engines. Oddly, wikipedia articles both perpetuate and dispel the myth. Most likely I hadn't seen a vehicle equipped with a GM V6 diesel is because this is an agriculture and oil field area. Full sized family sedans where expected to be able to work as hard as a pickup if need be and would have V8 power. Many around here do miss the availability pickups and full sized sedans with the GM 5.7 diesel. Just too far away from the big cities to buy imported models. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Dick Cheney is right
Respectfully this is old news. Americans ignored it when it was trotted out before the run up to the Iraq invasion. Even with the fact his words have proven true, I doubt that many more Americans are going to care today. I don't believe it would change things if there where. This Administration is suicidally stubborn and this Congress is too timid to figuratively grab the administration by the lapels and throw it against a wall and proceed to pound some sense into it. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Weapons of mass destruction finally found
In this Catholic area, 2-3-4 kids seems to be typical, but 6 or more isn't unheard of. I would have a difficult time labeling any of those women anything less then empowered. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Zeke Yewdall wrote: On 8/16/07, Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: the evidence shows that as people's economic situation improves, as soon as they're not too poverty-stricken to feed their children, their breeding rate slows right down. The surefire way to do that is to empower the women, and especially to educate the women. Statistically, this probably is true. But in my experience, portions of the US are not doing very well at this. The Mormon church in Utah (about 60 of my relatives) still seems to be averaging 4 or more children per family, even in good economic situations. True, this is way less than alot of the developing world, but still way higher than most of the developed world. I'm not as familiar with the evangelical movement in the US, but I get them impression that empowering women is not a high priority of theirs either. Z ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel in V6 diesel engine
Zeke Yewdall wrote: I vaguely remember a 6 cylinder 4.3 liter version of the early 80's GM 5.7 liter diesel but alot of people don't consider those suitable for running diesel in, let alone biodiesel. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oldsmobile_Diesel_V6_engine supports your recollection. I never knew anyone who owned a vehicle so equipped. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] $1-billion worth of water pouring out of leaking lines - Niagara Falls Review - 2007.07.12
Approaching comparing apple to oranges here, so I have to agree with Kirk. The loss associated with the transportation of electrical power are known expected loss, loss that little can be done to prevent. The loss of water in the transportation of the water in this example is due to the deterioration of the transporting equipment. Again expected, but tolerated until the cost of loss nears the cost of repairs or replacement, just SOP. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Kirk McLoren wrote: yes, but they represent reasonable engineering. The water mains are deferred maintenance. A different kind of engineering I suppose. */Paul S Cantrell [EMAIL PROTECTED]/* wrote: Funny thing, that's not funny is, about 50% of the energy contained in coal makes it to the power outlet. The rest is lost to heat loss, line losses and transformer losses. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel in V6 diesel engine
Zeke Yewdall wrote: Ummm. I don't know anyone who makes a V-6 diesel engine. What's it in, how old is it, and who manufactured it. Some of the Detroit 2 cycle diesels where, are? available in a V6 configuration. I remember that my dad's first oil well servicing rig was power by a V6 71 DD. Wikipedia reveals that the V configuration was introduced in 1957. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Speaking of bottled water
I just brought in a case of the Ozarka brand of water that I purchase yesterday. Emblazoned on the shrink wrap was the announcement that now 30% less plastic is used to make the bottles. -- Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Pepsi Forced to Admit It's....
Fritz Friesinger wrote: Hey Jeromie, whats wrong with kids running in the streets? I'm guessing the potential to becoming road kill? Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Crosspost: Home-Front Ecology
Yes it's a matter of scale, that's probably why I referenced it, instead of ignoring it. You mentioned urban not village, Mention of urban horses. Now there's an idea worth looking at. The current calender year is 2007 not 1907, much less 1808. I have too believe you would have a hard time finding even a rural community that is far removed from dodging animal emissions, willing to start doing so again on a voluntary basis. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Dawie Coetzee wrote: As with everything else, it's a matter of scale. I was seeing a handful of village drayhorses, not London, 1880! -D ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Crosspost: Home-Front Ecology
Considering it's our grandparents generation that was a part of the group that put us on the consumptive path we have been on, I'm not so sure what they would have to teach us. Perhaps after surviving the hardships of the Depression and WWII, they thought it was their and America's due to do so. Today I have to think an insufficient number of Americans believe we are facing a crisis of such seriousness an extraordinary effort on their part ist required. About urban horses, don't forget that that motor vehicles where thought to be the cities savior when it came to animal emissions. As far as I know no technology has been developed to reduce animal emissions Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Dawie Coetzee wrote: Mention of urban horses. Now there's an idea worth looking at. -D [Fwd: [sfbike] from the indispensable mike davis : home-front ecology] what the USA can do when it tries ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Old wisdom unites to solve global dilemmas
While I don't mean to disrespect the effort, this more a think tank than a council. Council or think tank, I didn't read about any commitment from anyone in a position to be a part of creating public policy , to use the counsel of the council in creating public policy. Perhaps it's value will be in creating a stronger grass roots movement. Time will tell, as they say. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: water and electricity as fuel!
Peak Coal, Peak Oil, any guesses how long to Peak Water? A recent editorial by our small town weekly publisher, along with my Congressman's email newsletter reinforces, few in leadership positions are ready suggest that we conserve resources. I guess some of those who call themselves conservatives have no interest in being conservative when it come to consuming shared natural resources. Doug ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Magic Compost Enhancer
Mike Weaver wrote: Foxfire. Used to be my bible - are they still around? -Weaver At this point we all have seen where Keith directed us to where can find the foxfire volumes as pdf files and pointed us to http://www.librum.us/pdfs/index.htm where there may be other interesting material, tnx Keith. As for the volumes being the bible, I don't know enough to be sure about that. Volume five's appearance at the book store coincided with my begging interest in Blacksmithing. The concept was compelling enough that I would have bought the other volumes if they would have appeared on the shelf, they didn't so I have only volume five 5 in paperback. For me the foxfire series are more history than anything else, they do make a decent reference in regards to some technical details. I wished all areas of the country picked up on the concept and created their own foxfire like projects. In regards to foxfire itself visit www.foxfire.org Doug, N0LKK ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Magic Compost Enhancer
robert and benita rabello wrote: Indeed! And they need technology to separate urine? Grief! A plastic jugg next to the toilet will do. This saves water, and my maize plants are SO much happier . . . robert luis rabello In the event Law enforcement ever sees your urine collection, you may be a terrorist suspect or suspect of operating a meth lab. Urine can be processed to extract potassium nitrate. Volume 5 of the Foxfire book series details how it was done in the old days for use in manufacturing black powder. apearently the urine from met users is processed to recover ephedrine Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] biofuel specific?
Another member mention filters/message rules, that's how manage the volume of email I elected to receive. I use the filters to direct new email from each list into it's own folder. That way the email in my inbox are the ones that may really need my attention. When I turn my attention to the specialized folders, I may elect to delete all the new posts there based on the subject lines or read those of interest. After you get used to using the filters you will discover how to refine the further. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Kurt Schasker wrote: Biofuelers: I have been lurking on this list for awhile, but never actually participated. I am wondering if there is some way I could filter the posts to read only those that directly related to biofuel issues? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Headlines
Obviously humor for targeted audience and posting to his list may have been off target. Beyond that I'm unsure if, Iran still closed off is any more or any less callous than, Massachusetts executes last remaining conservative. Oh well, it's nothing I would forward on, no matter how many times I receive it. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Keith Addison wrote: Bob, sorry but I have to ask, would you still think it's just a break from the gloom and doom if it said this? New Zealand still closed off; physicists estimate it will take at least 10 more years before radioactivity decreases to safe levels. Or the UK, Ireland, the Cape of Good Hope, or wherever it is that you call home? That's not humour, IMHO, not even black humour, it's sheer mindless callousness on quite a breathtaking scale. Anyway, what doom and gloom are you referring to, particularly? Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Plastic bag revolt spreads across Britain
Butcher paper is still in use in a few stores around here, as well. The end of plastic bags would put an end to the paper or plastic question and, that would put an end to my baffling carry outs. I answer the question with plastic, support the local economy. Seldom do they make the connection of the plastic bags, to the local petroleum production. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Thomas Kelly wrote: My local market still cuts meat while you wait or while you shop. You can also call in an order so it will be cut, wrapped and ready when you arrive. It is wrapped in a thick paper, perhaps wax coated. They tear it off a big roll, wrap the cut of meat, and use the price sticker to keep the paper from unwrapping. The same paper is used to wrap cold cuts (sliced ham, turkey, roast beef) and cheese. Just picked some up. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Plastic bag revolt spreads across Britain
:) on reading the bag recycling method. my thought process ran; I just washed them, why would I want them to fall on *my* floor? Besides that the inside of the bag is what ends up needing the cleaning. On recycling glass milk bottles, how much higher would the energy input be? Hot water to sterilize them for re-use. Heavier trucking loads, both ways. I'm not old enough to remember dry bulk goods, I don't recall my parent's generation mentioning it. I always they where prepackaged in paper like flour and some sugar still is today, before plastic arrived. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Keith Addison wrote: You haven't seen our kitchen floor. You must be a city slicker. Storage bags are okay, and useful (ziplock), it's the shopping bags that cause the problems. Don't plastic bags come from oil wells? When I was a kid the stores had the dry-goods stuff (beans, grains and so on) in wooden bins and barrels, they scooped it out onto scales on the counter and then tipped it into a paper bag for you. Greens and fruit were also in paper bags, or wooden boxes or hessian sacks. Milk was in returnable bottles, bread was wrapped in tissue in a brown paper bag, can't remember how the meat got packed but the butcher cut it for you while you waited (greaseproof paper?), same at the fishmonger. I guess we'll have all that again, if the local food movement has its way. Just in case you thought I was being nostalgic, not at all, looking to the future. :-) Best Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] U.S. government fights to keep meatpackers from testing all slaughtered cattle for mad cow
Ah Keith and the group, Respectfully you don't understand that the testing for BSE is unscientific. Kansas Representative Jerry Moran has told us so. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] U.S. government fights to keep meatpackers from testing all slaughtered cattle for mad cow
Mike Weaver wrote: So why doesn't Creekstone just test in Canada or Mexico or anywhere the USDA doesn't have jurisdiction? Fedex. Long ways to truck cattle to extract a sample. Why would anyone in those countries risk it? Now the USA is now bring people who have never previously step foot in the USA, to imprison them for violating US law. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Governments using filters to censor Internet, survey finds
MK DuPree wrote: Anyone know how JTF List members can know if JTF is ever filtered? Would each member stop receiving posts to the List? Would we each receive only certain posts? Thanks in advance for any ideas, comment. Mike DuPree As I read the article what was labeled, filtering would more accurately be called, blocking access to to web content. As in the U. S. military recent action of blocking service personnel's access to myspace, youtube along with other web pages. This access is blocked when using military computers, LANs, but not from other internet access options like home and public computers. Doug, N0LKK ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] crosspost [Alternative_Medicine_Forum] EMF-Omega-News 28. April 2007
Kirk McLoren wrote: cell phones should be reserved for emergencies only. Kirk That may or may not be wise advise, I don't know and, doubt anyone knows for certain. I am fairly certain if everyone followed that advise there would be no cell phone network and if there where, service would be prohibitively expensive to own one for emergencies. Yes prepay phones and air time are cheap to purchase to have on for emergency use. But those who purchase service contracts actually subsidize they prepay users. A $15 refurb phone, $15 activation fee and 15* cents a minute ain't gonna pay the bills. :) Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. * all prices are what it costs for Altell's pay-per-minute, the best prepay option in my area. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Federally Funded Boffins Want To Scrap The Internet
And here I have been suspecting a network, not accessible to the general public, has been in operation all this time. Did everyone save their software from the telephone BBS days? Where currently the focus is on the internet, I wonder how many, if any, subversive groups are currently using a BBS for their cause? In general I wonder how many general interest groups, subversive or not are prepared to move to a BBS, if circumstances, suggest such a move may be needed. Of course operating one now is going to be cheaper than back when,it will still cost. Participant will be required to put in a few dollars a month, but that can only weed out the less serious. The fact of the matter is their are still plenty of people in the U.S. who still don't own a computer, much less use the internet. Even if they have an aversion to big brother, they aren't likely put any effort into keeping any networks payed for by public dollars open to the public. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Keith Addison wrote: Lots of hotlinks in the Web version. - K -- http://snipurl.com/1hemw April 21, 2007 Federally Funded Boffins Want To Scrap The Internet Seeking further funding from Congress for clean slate projects by Steve Watson Global Research, April 18, 2007 Infowars.net Researchers funded by the federal government want to shut down the internet and start over, citing the fact that at the moment there are loopholes in the system whereby users cannot be tracked and traced all the time. Time magazine has reported that several foundations and universities including Rutgers, Stanford, Princeton, Carnegie Mellon and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology are pursuing individual projects, along with the Defense Department, in order to wipe out the current internet and replace it with a new network which will satisfy big business and government: One challenge in any reconstruction, though, will be balancing the interests of various constituencies. The first time around, researchers were able to toil away in their labs quietly. Industry is playing a bigger role this time, and law enforcement is bound to make its needs for wiretapping known. There's no evidence they are meddling yet, but once any research looks promising, a number of people (will) want to be in the drawing room, said Jonathan Zittrain, a law professor affiliated with Oxford and Harvard universities. They'll be wearing coats and ties and spilling out of the venue. The projects echo moves we have previously reported on to clamp down on internet neutrality and even to designate a new form of the internet known as Internet 2. This would be a faster, more streamlined elite equivalent of the internet available to users who were willing to pay more for a much improved service. providers may only allow streaming audio and video on your websites if you were eligible for Internet 2. Of course, Internet 2 would be greatly regulated and only appropriate content would be accepted by an FCC or government bureau. Everything else would be relegated to the slow lane internet, the junkyard as it were. Our techie rulers are all too keen to make us believe that the internet as we know it is already dead. Google is just one of the major companies preparing for internet 2 by setting up hundreds of server farms through which eventually all our personal data - emails, documents, photographs, music, movies - will pass and reside. However, experts state that the clean slate projects currently being undertaken go even further beyond projects like Internet2 and National LambdaRail, both of which focus primarily on next-generation needs for speed. In tandem with broad data retention legislation currently being introduced worldwide, such clean slate projects may represent a considerable threat to the freedom of the internet as we know it. EU directives and US proposals for data retention may mean that any normal website or blog would have to fall into line with such new rules and suddenly total web regulation would become a reality. In recent months, a chorus of propaganda intended to demonize the Internet and further lead it down a path of strict control has spewed forth from numerous establishment organs: * In a display of bi-partisanship, there have recently been calls for all out mandatory ISP snooping on all US citizens by both Democrats and Republicans alike. * Republican Senator John McCain recently tabled a proposal to introduce legislation that would fine blogs up to $300,000 for offensive statements, photos and videos posted by visitors on comment boards. It is well known that McCain has a distaste for his blogosphere critics, causing a definite conflict of interest where any proposal to restrict blogs on his part is concerned. * During an appearance with his wife Barbara on Fox News last November, George
Re: [Biofuel] man pays $520 electric bill in pennies
I suspect Ameren CIPS will be instituting a policy, where they will not accept cash payments in cash, below a certain denomination. I recall a case where it was revealed while US coins are legal tender, for amounts less than a dollar, but I can't find a reference to it. In regards to nationalization. I suspect that those who now are reaping the profits, will be the ones reaping the profit, after any nationalization. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Kirk McLoren wrote: necessities of life shouldnt be available to exploitation by piggish folks- like the electricity corporations and natural gas. Nationalize oil! Kirk ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Al Gore's 'Inconvenient Truth' Power Use
OK, one more hypocrite in a nation full of them. When I read someone harping about an electric gate, I have to think how much more of the article contains other silly concerns. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fund new technology to curb climate change: oilexecutive - CBC.ca - 2007.02.20
My guess is, a want to be President, wouldn't select an ineligible running mate. In the event he where to do so and was elected and died, the VP would have to step aside for the Speaker of the House At this time there are two persons in the presidential line of succession who appear to be ineligible to serve as President of the USA. The Constitution doesn't address any presidential line of succession, it exists by an act of Congress. Surely it will be the Supreme Court who really decides. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Jason Katie wrote: yknow, if someone not born in ameri-co. were to be VP, and the prez died or quit, how would they handle that? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Fake Drug, Fake Illness People believe it!
Havidol cute, but I doubt most people see have it all, until after they learn it's a hoax. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fund new technology to curb climate change: oil executive - CBC.ca - 2007.02.20
Fellas, Review that again. Nobody alive today meets that 14 year residency requirement. You would have to be as old as the adoption of the Constitution PLUS 14 years. Bottom line is, if weren't born here you can't be, top dog. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. robert and benita rabello wrote: Randall wrote: Robert, Unless I am just missing something basic...if you are over 35 years old, a natural born citizen of the US, and have lived in the US for 14 years, you are qualified. I don't read anywhere that it says that you have to be a resident for the last 14 years prior to running for election. Plus, don't forget...there are other national offices. :-) --Randall US Constitution, Article II, Section 1 No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty-five years, and been fourteen years a resident within the United States. Ok, I looked at my copy of the Constitution and you're right. I'd read the 14 years' residency requirement to mean 14 years immediately prior to running for office. Vote for me!!! Although, I don't really WANT the job . . . robert luis rabello The Edge of Justice The Long Journey New Adventure for Your Mind http://www.newadventure.ca Ranger Supercharger Project Page http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Is the Deadly Crash of Our Civilization Inevitable?
Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Fred Oliff wrote: screw the meek, they have had over 2000 years to do something and have not, doth quote the Onion OK-who did the Onion Quote? Or should that be The Onion saith... Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The Anti-Empire Report
Aztec, Inca, Maya, I believe two of those flourished, and met their demise sometime before, the European discovery of the new world. I just don't remember by world history as well as I should. I was in High School, when I figured out those indigenous to the American Continents, where no less civilized, and no more barbaric than the Europeans who discovered them. However that was not the conditioning expected of me. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Jason Katie wrote: i thought the South American empires were wiped out by the europeans before they had the chance to kill themselves off? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The Anti-Empire Report
I'm sure that's what the bible thumpers want us to believe, but I'm not sure that is the case. Ever notice how those who seek to use the bible to say America is doomed always use words from the bible that don't require them to change. Always the other persons fault. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Joe Street wrote: And witness how our entertainment media is obsessed with violent and scandalous subject matter, our sports become increasingly violent and individual members of our society tend toward increasing levels of egocentricity and self indulgence. Didn' similar things happen in the times leading up to the collapse of previous empires? Joe ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Don't worry England will look after you
Far out the Queen doesn't fancy Kansas. I can still have my beer cold, then. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Inner Space
Not that I'm saying I would fully comprehend any explanation, but it would been nice to be informed what it was that I was viewing. Was this a depiction of something that was actually observed, or an artist's rendering of what is believed to be taking place? While it was visually stunning, but I'm left with nothing. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Kirk McLoren wrote: Inner Space Darwin based his theory of evolution on the assumption that cells were simple blobs of protoplasm. As this short video demonstrates, they are anything but and, as such, a good argument of why evolution is impossible as a viable theory (though not as a matter of very blind faith, perhaps). http://aimediaserver.com/studiodaily/videoplayer/?src=harvard/harvard.swfwidth=640height=520 http://aimediaserver.com/studiodaily/videoplayer/?src=harvard/harvard.swfwidth=640height=520 The walker was one of my favourites. Kirk Don't get soaked. Take a quick peak at the forecast http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/?fr=oni_on_mail#news with theYahoo! Search weather shortcut. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/?fr=oni_on_mail#news ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.10/651 - Release Date: 1/24/2007 6:48 PM ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Mark Your Calendar!
Well I guess that is the American way, Mike. Sucker punch anyone who isn't doing your bidding. ;) Friday nights are Kansas legislator night on Smoky Hills Public TV. Never occurred to me to call in and ask them about the real ID Act. Really hard to guess how the legislators in my part of state would vote. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. MK DuPree wrote: My response to this forward is...do you have fellow citizens who do same, who won't get involved when they really need to? REJECT REAL ID...Mike DuPree ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Reference to Real ID Act in State of the Union
I read this from Greg Palast earlier. Too bad he calls into question, valid points about big brother, by mis-characterizing The Strategic Petroleum Reserve. No matter what side of the issue Palast is not the only commentator, to give cause to question their remarks, with obvious spin. I suppose no matter what stripes the politicians and media wears they think the remainder of the population is ignorant. :( Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. MK DuPree wrote: I wish Palast would have referenced outright H.R.1268, Title II (the Real ID Act) in this article, but he makes the point of concern to all US citizens anyway. By the way, New Hampshire has rejected this Act (http://www.newswithviews.com/Devvy/kidd177.htm). *What are you doing to get your State Reps to do same?* *To get Federal Reps to rescind?* Also, pay attention to Palast's reference to Choice Point. This is the outsourcing of the implementation of Real ID to private industry and the total exposure of our private information without benefit of the Privacy Act (see www.unrealid.com http://www.unrealid.com). I'm tellin ya...*GET INVOLVED* or you WILL hate yourself the morning of May 11, 2008. Mike DuPree ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] 6 stroke motor
The referenced article mentions steam multiple times, Jason. Google reveals there is another flavor of a 6 stroke engine http://www.sixstroke.com/ , that doesn't seem to be linked with Crower's. I just just can't wrap my imagination around either of them. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Jason Katie wrote: i think weve seen his 6 cycle work before, but i dont remember anything about steam, maybe a new experiment in the series? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Reference to Real ID Act in State of the Union
My response was about Greg Palast's editorial, *not* any error on your part, Mike. As I said Palast makes valid points about big brother, but I wouldn't forward that editorial on to anyone, that I would want to convince of an impending problem. Why? His misrepresentation of the purpose of the Strategic Petroleum Reserve, may give others reason to question the remainder of the editorial. I went on to state my opinion, that not only Palast is guilty of misrepresentation. That many on both sides of an issue rely in part of ignorance of their targeted readers. the USA inc. is a simple way to express my take on the state of affairs in our county. Going further IMO the patriot act may be evidence the terrorists have already won. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. MK DuPree wrote: Doug...not sure what is your point. Could you please restate in other words? Not sure if it's your use of commas or what but I'm not understanding your point. Also, I made a mistake in my remark...New Hampshire has NOT rejected Real ID. I've written to the source of my remark and pointed this out. As I've stated elsewhere, shame on me for not exercising my own due diligence, a lesson learned, which I hope will be helpful to others also. Mike DuPree ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] 6 stroke motor
Yea I guess peak usable or peak easily attainable would be more accurate, but awkward. Doug S.; Yes water vapor will condense and fall to the planet's surface SOMEWHERE, however replenishing to it's original source may be a bit of chance. Particularly if the source was an underground aquafier . When I worked in the oil patch I aften introduced chemicals into prehistoric oceans deep underground. As I did so I often wondered if I was permanately polluting a potential source of water that may be needed no matter the cost. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Zeke Yewdall wrote: It's not so much peak water, as peak usueable water. If we want freshwater, the oceans are out (or at least expensive to turn into fresh water). That's the problem -- if areas become more arid and glaciers melt, even more of the earth's water will be locked up as saltwater. Z On 1/26/07, *doug swanson* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK, I hear the term peak water and know the idea behind it, but I can't wrap my mind around the idea that water will become scarcer as the globe warms, unless it escapes our atmosphere into space. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.10/651 - Release Date: 1/24/2007 6:48 PM ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] 6 stroke motor
Interesting. Hopefully someone will create an animation of it's operation. On drawback I see is that many places have reached peak water,to borrow a phrase. Yes stationery application could easily condense the exhaust. So could vehicles, but it may a trick where the trend needs to be lighter/smaller vehicles. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] I.D. Cards and Rifers
The problem I have with films such is this is that the information flows by so fast, and without being provided a transcript one can't really study the issue, perhaps that's by design? I have long understood it's mostly about the wealth* and who is able to accumulate it, but that's been the case ever since humans banded into tribes hasn't? I do believe they are vastly overstating the capabilities of RFID. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. *IMO wealth is the better term to use, as there are many things other than money supply that can be use to extort the populace. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Bio-Gas...i.e. Methane...Marsh Gas...etc.
I can't direct you to any emails or even to a news item I recall. The program outlined how on operation in Kansas recovered methane off it's lagoons, along with using methane from a nearby landfill. I want to recall it was on the Sunflowers journeys produced by KTWU http://ktwu.washburn.edu/journeys/ , but I can't seem to find it. I have also read of hog and dairy operations using biomethane production to power their operations, selling excess electrical power to the power company grid. My guess is even after any methane recovery, the waste may end up as fertilizer, but I really don't know Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. John P Gochoco wrote: Can someone show me a string of emails...or something showing any discussion regarding the production and use of Methane in the US? I pass by huge poultry's and cow and pig farms almost everyday and not one of them ever even thought of the potentials. They all seem to be sold on the idea of just using manure for fertilizer. Maybe I'm wrong...somebody help me!!! ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] IS WVO BIO-DEGRADABLE?
Even clean petroleum is biodegradable, I suppose. When spilled on the ground, the volume will overwhelm any existing plants. As time passes it become difficult to see the visual evidence of a spill. Spills that have brine associated with the petroleum are another matter. Evidence of the spill remains for years. Where such spills are on, crop land the evidence eventually disappear, but i still takes a long time. Not that I recommend WVO be spread on the ground. Why not salvage it? Could you gently wash it with water in a drum, and draw the water off, after it separates? Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. When all else fails- Amateur Radio http://www.arrl.org/FandES/field/pscm/sec1-ch1.html ARES [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I suppose you could compost it. Just spreading it on the ground will probably take a while for it to break down. -dave On Tuesday, October 24, 2006 10:51 AM, ROY Washbish wrote: Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2006 08:51:01 -0700 (PDT) From: ROY Washbish To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: [Biofuel] IS WVO BIO-DEGRADABLE? Hi All I had a WVO spill in my basement and am wondering if it is bio-degradable. Can I dump this WVO on the land and expect it to go away? Thanks for your help. Roy __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Industry Girds For Sprawling E.U. Regulatory Scheme
While many here is the USA cry excess government regulation, without considering that a good portion of the regulation is authored by those being regulated. I suspect the same is true in Europe, and the remainder of the World. Spin... Spin... Spin... Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. A. Lawrence wrote: Some interesting takes - esp. the last comment about trusting the EU... would we rather trust a chemical mfr.?? Although this seems somewhat cumbersome, so are diseases and eaths caused by safe chemicals... safe according to the mfrs... DDT was the best thing ever for pests not so good for everything else though... anyway, I'm sure you get the idea... Won't be long and I'll become a Raging Grandpa grouch about all this crap... g ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: FDA is set to approve milk, meat from cloned animals
As far as I know cloning hasn't reached the point, where the clone appears at a ready to slaughter size. I would suppose a clone grown from birth to slaughter size on grass, would qualify as grass feed beef. A mass of muscle tissue grown in a petri dish may not. Personally I have fewer objections to cloning food, than I do for genetic engineering. I'm not so sure if I would halt the tinkering, but do feel it should be slowed to the point where irreversible consequences are minimized as much as passable. I do remain unconvinced this technology is now need to prevent the starvation of my fellow citizens in the world. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. W D. Mindock wrote: I don't eat beef or pork. I wonder if chickens are going to be cloned too. It won't be long before we will have beef grown on the cellular level. Could they call it grass fed beef? It seems that technology is taking us further and further from nature. I think most of us would want to slow or even halt this tinkering with our food. Peace, D. Mindock ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fwd: Happy Halloween...
Could be scary, but I'm not sure it's any scarier that any of the other possibilities that may emerge. Doug ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Check out http://www.bisonpress.com/homestead.html
Like most things one has to pick out what may be applicable, and useful to/in their situation. Again everything is relative. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fw: Bush Owes Us an Apology
In the event that the nut doesn't fall from the tree. Just don't hold your breath waiting for any kind of apology from GWB. I recall GHWB stating he(GHWB) would never apologize for anything America has done, EVEN if it was WRONG. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. When all else fails- Amateur Radio http://www.arrl.org/FandES/field/pscm/sec1-ch1.html ARES robert and benita rabello wrote: Yesterday, the US Senate approved detainee legislation that essentially hands dictatorial power over to the president. Once this bill is reconciled with the House version and is signed by Mr. Bush, he will have the right to detain anyone he deems a threat--irrespective of their citizenship--without trial, without evidence, for as long as it pleases him. I thought, for a gleaming moment, that Senator McCain would show some spine and garner support to defeat this ill-conceived legislation, but he and other senators who should know better simply caved in. Welcome to the fascist Republic of the United States . . . Mr. Bush doesn't need to apologize if he's king. robert luis rabello ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fwd: CANADIAN POLICE OFFICIAL APOLOGIZES FOR MISTAKES
Those who caused the losses, pain will not be the ones to paying restitution. I propose the name every elected politician and political appointees who vote for, or otherwise support torture, be put in a hat. Whenever an innocent is torture, a name will be drawn from that, and that person will be subjected, to whatever the innocent was subjected to. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. When all else fails- Amateur Radio http://www.arrl.org/FandES/field/pscm/sec1-ch1.html ARES Kirk McLoren wrote: How about restitution of lost wages and payment for pain and sudffering? Talk is cheap. Kirk ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] A textbook definition of cowardice
Keith Olbermann seems to be the only media person in the USA willing to take on the Republican cabal, as it currently exists in the USA, and make is point, with a calm demeanor. Too bad his calm statements based on fact aren't widely seen or read. Not that I think that would make a big difference, as so many of my fellow citizens have taken the 3 monkey posture of, see no evil hear no evil, say no evil. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. D. Mindock wrote: I saw the interview where Fox News tried to sandbag Clinton, but he threw it all back in the interviewer's face. Now it seems that interview has been pulled from online access. Wonder why? Peace, D. Mindock ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Clinton fights back in Fox News interview.
Jason Katie wrote: i rather enjoyed seeing him tear wallace to shreds. Jason As did I, I was thinking, it's about time when I seen it. However that machine Keith Olbermann Spoke of, was quick to respond with the spin. Was Clinton Pissed? Clearly. Was Clinton assertive? Yes. Was Clinton crazed? No. D. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] hidden price gouging
Personally I think this is one of those slow news day items trotted out on occasion, this is not the first time this is news.As I'm concerned I see nothing to be concerned about as, in the long run it averages out. The retailer, will not be making a lot of extra profit, so the consumers will not be gouged. Just more instance of, spinning one small single fact, instead of looking at the bigger picture. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Jeff Lyles wrote: When you get gas from underground pumps, I am inclined to believe that the gas is around the 50 to 60 degree range because the ground, at the dept the tanks are at, tend to say at that temperature. The stable ground temp is one reason why some people use the ground in there geothermal units to heat and cool their homes. Jeff ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] RFID Controversy
I'm not ready to subscribe to the RFID paranoia just yet, mostly because of the content D. Mindock provided. I have to feel their extreme capabilities are being over stated In regards to beef, it will be the Rancher who will be absorbing the cost of RFID implantation. As I understand it the tracking begins with the birthplace of the animal. Rancher or Feed lot will absorb all the costs, because the prices they get are set by the commodity markets Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. When all else fails- Amateur Radio http://www.arrl.org/FandES/field/pscm/sec1-ch1.html ARES Kirk McLoren wrote: Just how far this can be depends on the type of the reader, but in the extreme case some readers have a maximum power output of 4 W http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watt, enabling signals to be received from tens of kilometres away.^[/citation needed/ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citing_sources] ^-- ^This is misleading. This reader is basically a repeater and if instead was connected to the telco the data could be received anywhere within telephone range - ie planet wide. It makes the tag look far more effective than it is. As for printed cicuits passivation (protection from environment) is still an issue and the designers biggest headache, power, is as unsolved as ever. The largest new use I am aware of is tracking carcasses. Japan has insisted on it because of mad cow fears. The chip has to withstand planting in the animal and so far reports from feedlot operators are that it is often unreliable and adds at least $10 to each animal for the tag. It is unlikely they will be recovered and returned from Japan as well. Then there is the cost of the readers and the book keeping. Feedlot operators have to pass the cost along of course. ^Kirk ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] OT glider was Sharing Biodiesel
I'd fear in my hands a glider would become a vehicle powered totally by gravity. But then I'm not an aviator Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Joe Street wrote: Hey Matthew; Have you ever tried gliding? Once I tried unpowered flight I had no more interest in the noisy stinky brute force method of cruising the skies. The silence in a sailplane (just the sound of the slipstream) is beautiful. It is actually a solar powered vehicle when you think of it. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] was...Our cash is becoming trackable
I'm sure there will be counter measures developed and, sold to those who are not DIY bent. Anyway those who do invest in making use of RFID are going to be sorely pissed when, when they discover, the rfid didn't tell them how easily rfid terrorists will be able to disrupt it all Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. AltEnergyNetwork wrote: Also, just think of the possabilities for merchants. With an RFID reader, they will be able to tell how much cash you have in your wallet tallex ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Redneck biodiesel video
Not only you can't please all the people all the time, it's damn difficult to please few, once. ;) Yes it's an infomercial minus the disclaimer, but most who watch such programs know that already. Yes it could have been done better, but they probably done what they could in only ~11.5 minutes. Power braking never really unpressed me, but tire fryer, I like it -- Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] What is happening?
Heh! Hakan, are you one of those individuals that can't handle silence? :) In the event you are don't worry I have never seen it last long Doug Hakan Falk wrote: I never, I never saw so little activities on the list before. Missing it. Hakan ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Sinkholes and oil production
Allow me to comment(underscoring what Bob said) the reason water and CO2 is pumped into producing formations is to extract MORE oil from from the formation, not replace it, enhanced recovery they call it. Jeff, I suspect the Texan was telling you a tall tale and later joked with his buddies what he told to nosy person. I don't mean any disrespect, but hell, they don't pass an opportunity's to pull one on their buddies, the rest of the world doesn't stand a chance ;) There have been sinkholes attributed to oil production. Generally the cause is wash out of an area closer to the surface than the collapse of an oil formation several thousand feet down. Anyway removing CO2 from the atmosphere and pumping into a producing formation will not sequester it. As Bob mention porosity is a key feature of producing formations. Sooner or later the CO2 will migrate to a well bore and re-enter the atmosphere when the oil it associated with it is processed. As Terry mentions locking the Co2 in played out capped formations can't be totally safe. Natural Gas stored in old salt mines, years old practice, near Hutchison, KS did find a way out and cause some fires. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] DIY links
I ran across makezine.com last week, interesting. Are you aware of www.hackaday.com? Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Kirk McLoren wrote: http://www.makezine.com/blog/archive/diy_projects/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] OT -a most amazing fountain
Just one more damned if you do and damned if you don't situation I think. There is so much time in a day. the media has to make choices in What what to present. The individual has to make a choice in what sources to use. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. Kirk McLoren wrote: http://www.comagz.com/webmagazine/story/the_most_amazing_fountain_in_latin_america when I see things like this I wonder what else I might find in South America. I think our media promotes a picture of poverty and omits such beautiful things. Kirk ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Class Warfare: The Minimum Wage Goes Down
John- one problem is if even you own property outright you haven't eliminated your debt. The tax man will still demand payment. As will the insurance man if the use of said property brings mandatory liability insurance coverage. That's not to say you wouldn't be better off owning property outright. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. When all else fails- Amateur Radio http://www.arrl.org/FandES/field/pscm/sec1-ch1.html ARES John Mullan wrote: snipped Economic crash and the re-issue of currency has happened before and has to happen again. To survive, eliminate your debt and try desperately to own all your property out-right. Just my two-cents worth. Cheers, John ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Class Warfare: The Minimum Wage Goes Down
I just can't recall when, but the following was from an episode of the Religion and Ethics program aired on PBS during a past Congressional debate on the minimum wage. I recall the term used was just wage. Problem is that here in the USA such criteria is labeled communist, instead of Christian. -- Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. BUSINESS EXECUTIVES FOR ECONOMIC JUSTICE Criteria For Determining Whether A Wage Is Just 1.You cannot assume a wage is just because someone is willing to accept it. 2.The lowest full-time paid person at a company ought to be properly compensated to allow the person a standard of living consistent with human dignity. 3.Your primary obligation is managing the company as a going concern for the benefit of all the stakeholders (investors, employees, customers, and community), recognizing that these are not mutually exclusive. 4.The right of all employees of the company to earn a living wage is at least as important as the right of owners/investors to earn a reasonable rate of return on their investment in the company. 5.If the above four criteria are met: Owners/investors, since they risk their capital, are justified in earning a higher level of compensation than generally prevails among their employees. Managers are also justified in earning a higher level of compensation, because of their assumed responsibility, level of talent, and experience. For more information, write to: Business Executives For Economic Justice 711 W. Monroe St. Chicago, IL 60661 -- Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Al Gore interview
Actually it has to say more about the majority Americans than it does Al Gore. As a group that as so much, they have been hoodwinked into believing that they are being cheated, out of their due. Irony is that those doing the hoodwink, are the very ones doing the cheating. The myth of the liberal press was exposed in 2000, when they gave GWB a pass, while reinforcing right wing rhetoric. John Kerry was as timid in 2004. I don't understand why he never asked GWB if he(GWB) was a waffler or a lier. shrug Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA Michael Redler wrote: I'd like to know what happened since his last campaign. Did he have a vision quest or something? Maybe he broke loose from a political sleeper hold. Do you remember how his opponents on the right nicknamed him the wooden Indian? It's a name that's wrong on many levels but, the point I'm making here is that he didn't seem to fight back. It's like he was sedated or something. What about the whole inventing the Internet thing? He was viciously attacked and I felt embarrassed just to watch it. Although I've never been a big fan of Al, I'd really like to see another player on the field - the left side of the field. -Redler P.S. Agh! I used a sports metaphores! */Mark Manchester [EMAIL PROTECTED]/* wrote: Glad you saw it. Yes, Gore sounds like such a cool guy! I guess it's just more on the Buy the Administration shenanegans. Block this great guy, get the richer one into office. Jesse On Jun 20, 2006, at 11:24 PM, JJJN wrote: Mark, I was in a Hotel last night in Bismarck North Dakota, I got to see the whole interview. I must say I am ready to see the movie. I wish more people could have seen Al in this light about 6 years ago. Jim mark manchester wrote: Ha-HAH! Same post, new title. This is a fantastic interview, guys, to which there has been no response at all~! Read! Or else let's talk about our lawns. (Lawns are important too, don't get all biofuelly on me..) Al Gore interview, last month, about his global warming platform and movie. I missed it, maybe you did too. Jesse http://www.macleans.ca/culture/films/article.jsp? content=20060522_127258_127 258 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] No New Refineries
No; building refineries will not reduce the price of crude. Products refined from crude are traded as commodities. Along with the supply and demand of crude, the supply and demand of refined products also affects the price the consumer pays for those products. The question can become if the industry is making money in the current situation, will it build new refineries given relaxed regulation, if new refineries that may increase supply, resulting in lower prices for the refined product. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA chem.dd wrote: Building new refiniries will not reduce the price of crude. It is based on global demand. The Chinese and Indians are rapidly moving from bicycles to automobiles. This is why the price of crude is $70+ for a barrel. And this is why bio based feedstocks for fuel are going to become economically viable, irrespective of environmental concerns/benefits. If crude were at $25/barrel we would not be having this conversation. David - Original Message - From: Doug Younker [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2006 5:33 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] No New Refineries This is one of those times I smell a rat, but can't find/prove it. In regards to environmental requirements, in the industry previously claimed the costs where too high and the consumer wouldn't pay the price. Here we are now: No refineries where not built and the consumer is paying unprecedented prices that result in higher profits for the industry. Chances are the industry will be allowed to build new refineries that don't meet the stricter environmental require, pocketing the savings. The cynic in me has to feel that in no way, even with relaxed environmental regulations, will the industry build capacity to significantly increase supply. Oh well... Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA Keith Addison wrote: http://www.tompaine.com/articles/2006/06/06/no_new_refineries.php No New Refineries Frank O'Donnell ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] No New Refineries
This is one of those times I smell a rat, but can't find/prove it. In regards to environmental requirements, in the industry previously claimed the costs where too high and the consumer wouldn't pay the price. Here we are now: No refineries where not built and the consumer is paying unprecedented prices that result in higher profits for the industry. Chances are the industry will be allowed to build new refineries that don't meet the stricter environmental require, pocketing the savings. The cynic in me has to feel that in no way, even with relaxed environmental regulations, will the industry build capacity to significantly increase supply. Oh well... Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA Keith Addison wrote: http://www.tompaine.com/articles/2006/06/06/no_new_refineries.php No New Refineries Frank O'Donnell ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] seasonal burning
Allen, I never felt Kirk's reply nit-picking, I was just a bit confused. Anyway ET rarely enters my though process, unless someone brings it up. I would be surprised if ET does exist, nor will I be disappointed if I go to my grave not knowing the answer. I have no speculation if ET is peaceful or not. -- Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA E. C. wrote: Doug; your meaning was crystal clear to me, i am an English major (more precisely, was, since i never followed the career path i trained for in college). In point of fact, your response said what i tried to, but more succinctly to the point. Kudos. :-)~ Kirk; I looked back in my archived file to see if your nit-pick was justified, didn't find it so, IMHO -- but hey, to err is human, i've been called on gaffes i've made before. Since you brought it up (the ET comment) -- a couple i know has acquainted me with the fact that there's a fair number of folks who fervently believe that, indeed, the human species IS descended from cross-breeding between early hominids and ET visitors from space (there being no clearly-defined missing link in the fossil record). True or not, we humans are a relatively new experiment in Earth's evolution -- and may not have a very long chapter in that history if we don't learn to overcome our aggressive, egocentric management style. Regards, ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] seasonal burning
Kirk, The reason I bothered to post was to detail why I believe seasonal burning, while it may have apparent benefits, is not natural, as practiced by man. I would think the last sentence of mine; Personally I think man has interfered enough, long enough, we can't fully understand the role of fire in Earth's evolution. would have indicated my opinion man can affect the environment, thus perhaps evolution? Oh well English composition has never been my strong suit Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA Kirk McLoren wrote: Interesting that you dont see man as part of earth's evolution. Are we ETs? Kirk ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] seasonal burning
Keith Addison suggested that this discussion topic is an annual as the burning of topic, I just can't recall that, or if my following comments may have been said by others. Like Keith and others, I have observed that fire can be beneficial for the prairie, but those same observations also show that fires do not occur annually on a natural basis in all areas. I have also read that the indigenous Plains population started fires to aid in hunting Bison. I would think that that practice was in tune with the herds seasonal(annual) migration, could there be a chance that the fire use practice of the Plains people, was more about harvesting animals than is was about land stewardship? The reality is that where I live on the High Plains, that even during a drought naturally started fire is a rare event. Years perhaps decades pass before fire naturally starts the same area. I have to conclude the practice of seasonal burning both by the Indians and descendants of Europeans is more about getting things done on man's schedule not nature's. Personally I think man has interfered enough, long enough, we can't fully understand the role of fire in Earth's evolution. -- Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Water: a commodity or a fundamental human right?
I read some one commentated on the order of; that there is enough water, nut not in the right places. I'm not so sure if there's enough water or not, I do agree location is key, along with who controls that location. What is right and what are rights is ambiguous. In the end it's the opinion of the most powerful majority that decides what's right, I don't see that changing anytime soon. :( Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA Jason Katie wrote: isnt the basis of life (food,water,oxygen) considered a right? i mean there is a right to survive, isnt there? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
