The BMW UUC Digest Volume 2 : Issue 372 : "text" Format Messages in this Issue: Upper control arms bushings bad, yes or no? Pad recomendations Re: Upper control arms bushings bad, yes or no? Pad recomendations long shot - Anyone have a contact at Team Davidoff Racing? Re: People Who Know Nothing About BMWs Idiot salesmen (was Re: People Who Know Nothing About BMWs) Re: People Who Know Nothing About BMWs Re: People Who Know Nothing About BMWs Re: 5th Gear TV show on SpeedTV 1990 BMW 535i 97k miles - $5200 Re: euro delivery info, gift ideas Alignment <long> Re: Alignment <long> shock/strut upgrade, E46 325iT How to check ball/control arm joints on an E36? Re: OT: euro delivery info, gift ideas
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 11:28:03 -0500 From: "Andrew Harkonen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "UUCDigest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Upper control arms bushings bad, yes or no? Pad recomendations Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hello, Here is the story, '89 535i 5 spd. Has the 55 Mph shimmy. I rotated tires front to back a while ago, shimmy remained. I tried abrupt braking at about 15-20 Mph to see if there was a clunk from the front end. I cannot detect anything very loud, but there does seem to be a very slight clunking noise. Jacked the car up and used my 2' long channel locks on the bushing. I got it to deflect about 1/8 of an inch by compressing the body of the arm that hold the bushing and one of the tabs/bracket ends that the upper end fits into. I could also twist the control arm a slight amount by hand, just by grabbing it and twisting. I do not have much experience checking bushings with large channel locks so I am hoping someone can confirm or deny that my bushings are the cause of the shimmy. I hate the shimmy and want it gone. Please help. Does any one have any good sources for the new arm and bushing? Should I pop for the 750i bushings? can you get the new arm with the 750i bushing already installed? note: car has lowering springs and Bilsteins. Also, I intend to put in new brake pads on while I am in there, Mintex reds now on M5 calipers with cross drilled rotors. (previous owner put these on) I am not too happy with the Mintex Reds. They grab well initially, but then they stop doing much. As I apply more brake pressure, they do not seem to respond with more braking force. I would like something for 95% street use 5% DE use, that has good bite and progressive grab (I hope that make sense). Any brake pad recommendations are welcome from folks who have E34 experience. Thanks in advance for any help. Andrew Harkonen '89 535i 5 spd STL BMWCCA ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 12:58:56 -0400 From: "Rob Levinson * UUC Motorwerks" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: Upper control arms bushings bad, yes or no? Pad recomendations Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Mythbuster time: E34 M5 bushings are stronger than 750iL bushings. Use those. The problem is the ball joints themselves may be bad - you won't know until you replace the bushings. If the problem remains, you've got to do it all over. Ideally, you'd start with new arms with M5 bushings, or even the 850CSi aluminum arms with the OE spherical bearings, direct fit in the E34. A bit more expensive at around $250-ish each. - Rob ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrew Harkonen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "UUCDigest" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2004 12:28 PM Subject: [UUC] Upper control arms bushings bad, yes or no? Pad recomendations > Hello, > > Here is the story, '89 535i 5 spd. Has the 55 Mph shimmy. I rotated tires > front to back a while ago, shimmy remained. I tried abrupt braking at about > 15-20 Mph to see if there was a clunk from the front end. I cannot detect > anything very loud, but there does seem to be a very slight clunking noise. > Jacked the car up and used my 2' long channel locks on the bushing. I got > it to deflect about 1/8 of an inch by compressing the body of the arm that > hold the bushing and one of the tabs/bracket ends that the upper end fits > into. I could also twist the control arm a slight amount by hand, just by > grabbing it and twisting. I do not have much experience checking bushings > with large channel locks so I am hoping someone can confirm or deny that my > bushings are the cause of the shimmy. I hate the shimmy and want it gone. > Please help. Does any one have any good sources for the new arm and > bushing? Should I pop for the 750i bushings? can you get the new arm with > the 750i bushing already installed? note: car has lowering springs and > Bilsteins. > > Also, I intend to put in new brake pads on while I am in there, Mintex reds > now on M5 calipers with cross drilled rotors. (previous owner put these on) > I am not too happy with the Mintex Reds. They grab well initially, but then > they stop doing much. As I apply more brake pressure, they do not seem to > respond with more braking force. I would like something for 95% street use > 5% DE use, that has good bite and progressive grab (I hope that make sense). > Any brake pad recommendations are welcome from folks who have E34 > experience. Thanks in advance for any help. > > Andrew Harkonen > '89 535i 5 spd > STL BMWCCA > > Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > __________________________________________________________________________ > In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. > > UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate > Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! > 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 10:07:24 -0700 From: "scott" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: long shot - Anyone have a contact at Team Davidoff Racing? Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hi Guys, I'm working on the project team for an upcoming Xbox game that features the 1997 McLaren F1 GTR BMW Team Davidoff and we're looking for a contact in the Team Davidoff camp. I know this is a long shot, but there are several of you out there who are deep in BMWCCA, club racing and just plain racing enthusiast, so I figured I'd broadcast a call for help. I you know anyone, or have any leads on Team Davidoff Racing, please let me know ASAP. Your help is greatly appreciated. - Scott Catlin ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Sep 2004 12:25:39 -0400 From: ben keyes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: People Who Know Nothing About BMWs Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> nope. I'd put his editor (who should catch honest mistakes like that) in the category. Ben 180 degree V4 in the Subaru :-P [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Speaking of the ol' V6 mistake, it was done verbally on this past Saturday by > none other than John Davis on MotorWeek while doing a short piece on the long > term test of the X3. They had the obligatory hood-up shot and he referred to > it as a V6. > > I wouldn't put John in the 'People Who Nothing About BMW's' category however. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 16:34:43 -0400 From: "Rob Levinson * UUC Motorwerks" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Idiot salesmen (was Re: People Who Know Nothing About BMWs) Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Reminds me of the time I went with a friend to look at a Suzuki Sidekick for him. Nice enough vehicle for what it was, yet the greenhouse tumblehome made the B-pillar uncomfortably close for me... I was literally putting pressure on it with my shoulder. I mention that to the salesperson and he says "Oh, then try the (blah blah) version, it's wider." Forgot what the special edition name was, this was before the Grand Vitara and XL-7. Whatever it was called, I hop into it and feel nothing different - still leaning against the B-pillar. I hop right back out and look at it. It _is_ wider... they have tacked on fender flares. The chassis and body panels are the same, it just has some cosmetic enhancement at the fenders. The salesman looks at me with a triumphant smile on his face, "Fit better?" After too many minutes of trying to explain to this lottery-ticket-buying mouth-breather that 20mm of tacked-on exterior plastic does not magically increase interior occupant room, I simply walked away. Then there's the time a late '80s Honda salesmen sold a 4-cylinder Accord to an older couple who really wanted a V6 Camry by saying he would "order the two extra cylinders and install them when they come off backorder." Damn those backorders, every time the customer called in, the cylinders were still unavailable. - Rob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 22:16:57 -0500 From: "M Kittock" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: People Who Know Nothing About BMWs Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I got a chuckle out of the local newspaper when the E36 325i came out. I don't pay much attention to the auto section of the paper but curious to see what the mass media says about bimmers. I was living in CA at the time, and the San Jose Mercury News auto writer got invited to a media gig, and wrote how he like the BMW V6.... Mark '96 328i -- would that be a 360 degree V6?? :) > [Original Message] > From: Scott & Charlotte Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: UUC Digest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Date: 9/20/2004 8:12:57 AM > Subject: [UUC] People Who Know Nothing About BMWs > > We've all seen the ads before - a BMW with a "V6" engine. We've all > made the comment about how these folks (usually used car dealers with > questionable reputations) obviously never even opened the hood, > wouldn't know an inline 6 if it bit them in the butt, and know nothing > about BMWs. > > So here's another one. > > "BMW 2001 Z3 3.0i V6, lthr, alloys, 8K mi, Must See!, #L48573 > Concord BMW..." > > Yes that's right, this is a local authorized BMW dealer. Draw your > own conclusions. > > Scott Miller > GGC BMW CCA > > > > Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > __________________________________________________________________________ > In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. > > UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate > Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! > 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 23:40:20 -0400 From: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: People Who Know Nothing About BMWs Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 300 degrees, actually. - Rob From: "M Kittock" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Mark > '96 328i -- would that be a 360 degree V6?? :) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Sep 2004 13:39:23 -0400 From: ben keyes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: 5th Gear TV show on SpeedTV Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Dennis Wynne wrote: > Looks like some of the same folks from "Top Gear" - who had that great > flog-the-E39-M5 video review. yes, several of the people were previously on Top Gear & then were sacked - Tiff, VBH & Quentin are the ones I'm sure of. Tom Ford (curly haired guy) is a writer for "Car" (better magazine than Top Gear but not as good as it used to be). dunno where they got the other sorta funny guy. > They seem to be airing a "new" show each week, but ones I Tivo'd last week > seem to be a year or more old. I set the TiVo to record them all as I'm not sure they don't sometimes throw in an extra un-aired episode on some of the latenight/early morning broadcasts. Ben ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 11:30:26 -0700 (PDT) From: wy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: 1990 BMW 535i 97k miles - $5200 Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Found an ad for 1990 535i forsale. Pls contact me for more info. I'm just passing on the link. http://losangeles.craigslist.org/car/43151270.html _______________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today! http://vote.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 18:31:49 +0000 From: "Evan A" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: euro delivery info, gift ideas Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> If he doesn't already have it, how about the European CD (DVD?) for the nav system? Is that standard on the new 7? That would've been great on my Euro deliivery (if I had ordered the nav system). Evan --- original message --- hey there, my father in law is going to do euro delivery on his new 745 and i'd love to get him some "guru" info on a eur delivery trip. he'll be there about 2 weeks -- any insider info on good drives, must see places, or ?? is appreciated. he's no a cca member (yet) so i am trying to help him out. also, i would like to get him some sort of gift for the trip (string back gloves come to mind....i know, corny...), so if anyone has any tips on somethign they would have really like to have had when they did their euro delivery (cool guidebooks, flare gun, whatever...) , i would appreciate it. TIA. -paul _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 13:07:10 -0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Alignment <long> Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> If you are in the Bay Area, use your car for any kind of high performance driving and need an alignment, you owe it to yourself to call John Siau at Convertion Techniques in Oakland. For those of you who have been following my wheel bearing/trailing arm saga, here's the latest installment. I now have adjustable trailing arm bushings (from Bimmerworld), and it has been a couple of years since my last front end alignment. For reference, my car (1990 325i) rides on M3 springs, which lower the car just under an inch in front, and about a half inch in the back. I called CT Monday afternoon to make an appointment. John said he was leaving Tuesday morning for Shanghai, but if I could rush on down, he'd do it Monday night. So I did. CT has the fancy schmancy Hunter optical computerized laser-guided alignment equipment, which is impressive, if you've never seen it in action. He brought up the alignment specs for my E30 325i. The screen showed lots of red (out of spec) and not much green (in spec). I reminded John that, the last time I had been in, he said rear toe was out of spec, and that I should get adjustable bushings. Well, now I have them. I also said that I'd like to go back to zero front toe. I've run zero front toe on several cars as a compromise between toe-out for autocross and toe-in for normal driving/tire life. Last time I had zero toe on this particular car, it wore out the front tires prematurely, so John had dialed in some toe-in. But my last tires wore fine, and I wanted to experiment with zero toe again. John said, "I don't recommend it". But first he attacked the rear. Camber started out at neg 1.3 deg left, neg 1.8 deg right. Toe was -0.06 deg left (that's toe out, oops!) and +0.12 deg right. The camber is not excessive and I can live with it. But the toe out had to be corrected. John's hope was to get the settings he wanted by adjusting only the inner trailing arm bushings. It is really difficult to get a wrench on the nuts on the outer bushings. When I installed the arms, I had to drop the subframe a couple of inches to get to the outer nuts. (John said something about grinding down a 19mm wrench to fit in there.) Fortunately, he was able to get the left toe adjusted from the inner bushing, and did not have to touch the outers. I ended up with +0.11 deg toe in left and right, and left camber is now neg 1.4 deg. Factory spec calls for a minimum of +0.2 deg toe in at the back. I asked John why he was leaving them out of range. He explained that acceleration forces cause the bushings to deflect towards zero toe. The urethane bushings don't deflect as much, so less static toe is required. Time for the front. So John, I really want to go back to zero toe. "I don't recommend it", he repeated. OK, why? Because the rubber control arm bushings allow moderate deflection under acceleration, so you end up with toe out while driving. OK John, what DO you recommend? He proceeded to dial in +0.04 deg of toe on each side. It had started at +.15 left and +.20 right. Camber (with offset factory strut bearings) is neg 1.9 deg on the right, but only neg 0.9 deg left. John thinks I may have a tweaked control arm. It has passed driving school inspections, but maybe I should have the arms changed anyway. Caster is 9.1 deg left, 8.4 deg right. I also have the M3 offset lower control arm bushings, but these settings are still within factory spec for a 325i. Oh well. On the way home I drove out I-580 from Oakland to Dublin. The pavement has some pretty pronounced rain grooves. When my car had Dunlop SP8000s, it tracked straight as an arrow. With the first set of Bridgestone S-03s, it would wander a bit on the rain grooves. I had attributed this to the tires. Now, with new S-03s and the alignment done, there was NO wander! With less toe in up front, this is not what I expected. So maybe the dartiness was really caused by the left rear toe out? Not sure. Anyway, test number two comes at the GGC autocross this Sunday. Disclaimer: I have no affiliation with Conversion Techniques or Bimmerworld, other than being a happy customer. Scott Miller GGC BMW CCA ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 23:19:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Andy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Alignment <long> Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Howdy, On Tue, 21 Sep 2004 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > I also said that I'd like to go back to zero front toe. I've run zero > front toe on several cars as a compromise between toe-out for autocross and > toe-in for normal driving/tire life. Last time I had zero toe on this > particular car, it wore out the front tires prematurely, so John had dialed > in some toe-in. But my last tires wore fine, and I wanted to experiment > with zero toe again. John said, "I don't recommend it". Wait. What? Why would toe in in the front cause less tire wear than zero toe? I'm being serious in that question... Currently I run ~-3 deg camber and 1/4" toe out in front for autox and knock camber back to ~-2 deg (bringing toe back to 0") for the street. If its better to have toe in for street tire wear, that'll also let me reduce camber for the street more, which should also be a good tire life thing. So... Is toe in on the street better for tire wear? Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 18:42:38 -0700 From: Tom Kosmalski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: shock/strut upgrade, E46 325iT Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Nope, no sport package. Wanted the shocks, tires, and wheels. The seats, unfortunately, seemed a little higher and tighter. When combined with the MANDATED sunroof in the wagon, my headroom was marginal. I'm leaning towards the bilsteins, but maybe an alignment check would be worthwhile first? Tom ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 23:23:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Andy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: How to check ball/control arm joints on an E36? Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Howdy, On our '93 325is, we get a little steering wheel shake at times on the freeway. Its on the level of what an out of balance tire has caused me with other cars in the past. So I rebalanced the wheels. No change. So we started looking at other things. We can see some very slight movement in the ball joint when we shake the tire side to side, along with a good bit of movement if we pry between the ball joint and the wheel. It was around then that we figured there's probably a real method to check the outer ball joint and inner control arm ball joint/bearing. Bentley didn't have a method though, and neither did the Mitchell repair software my buddy has at the shop. Each had replacement procedures, but nothing on the diagnostic end. So. How do you know when the ball joint and/or control arm (with the associated inner joint) need to be replaced? Thanks! Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 20:24:27 -0700 From: John Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: OT: euro delivery info, gift ideas Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > The Deutsches-Museum in Munich is fascinating. Allow a full day > there for anyone minimally tech-minded. > <http://www.deutsches-museum.de/e_index.htm> It's a truly amazing place, do not miss it. > I stayed nearby at the Hotel Admiral. Four-star luxury hotel, good > location, great breakfast. We've done Euro Delivery twice now, the first one (1998) got a website: http://www.milleredp.com/~jem/nordschleife Never gotten around to finishing the second one (2000) yet. First time we stayed at the Hotel Kriemhild, small place with a wonderful location in Nymphenburg. A short walk from the Schloss, an even shorter walk from the Hirschgarten - which is very important when one has two Masse of bier and a currywurst in one's stomach. Second time was on somewhat short notice and the Kriemhild was booked, we ended up staying...I can't remember the name, it was closer in to downtown, also a nice place but more 'anonymous' and not as scenic or walkable a locale. I haven't checked for broken links on the '98 travelogue lately, but I note that Betten Rid has a webstore now. I think I need to order a couple new pillows... John. ------------------------------ End of [bmwuucdigest] digest(15 messages) **********
