On 9/25/2012 8:43 AM, Roger Clough wrote:
Hi Stephen P. King

No. Think of how decisions are made. There has
to be an external thinker who is not
part of the problem who makes the decision.

In a chess game, the rooks and pawns do not
choose their own moves. The players,
who are external, do.

Yes, but I am asking that you think about how the objects and the "external thinker" are connected with each other.



Roger Clough, rclo...@verizon.net
9/25/2012
"Forever is a long time, especially near the end." -Woody Allen


----- Receiving the following content -----
From: Stephen P. King
Receiver: everything-list
Time: 2012-09-24, 10:56:41
Subject: Re: Zombieopolis Thought Experiment


On 9/24/2012 10:13 AM, Roger Clough wrote:
A computer being not conscious ? All computer operations
(to my mind,probably not yours) are actual (in spacetime).
But consciousness is an inherent (mental, not in spacetime)
activity.

Cs = subject + object

A computer has no inherent realms, no conscious self or observer.

Instead, a computer is all object (completely in the objective realm),
no subject.
Hi Roger,

      I disagree. You are merely stipulating that there is no "self"
possible and thus conclude the obvious implication. If we permit
consideration of an internal modeling system then the possibility of a
conscious self becomes just a matter of discovering whether or not the
technical means of implementing an internal modeling and updating
process are actual. There strong reasons to consider that a physical
object and its evolution in time are, effectively, the best possible
simulation of that physical system, thus a physical system is, FAPP, its
own best possible model. If there is a feedback between the physical
states of the system and its simulation that has come causal efficacy
then I would propose that we must consider that physical system to be,
in fact, conscious.

--
Onward!

Stephen

http://webpages.charter.net/stephenk1/Outlaw/Outlaw.html


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Onward!

Stephen

http://webpages.charter.net/stephenk1/Outlaw/Outlaw.html


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