Hi Richard,
On 06 Jan 2014, at 18:31, Richard Ruquist wrote:
Bruno,
Are you saying that 3p determinacy and locality are sufficient to
satisfy Bell's theorem?
You need physical realism. Something like Einstein principle of
reality (if without perturbing a system, I can predict with certainty
an outcome, then there is an element of reality to it).
The MW, that is pure QM without collapse, satisfies those three
conditions. The non-locality is an illusion coming from our
abstraction from the existence of the superposed states in which we
are in.
The same with comp, except that the wave itself becomes a similar
"illusion" capable of being explained by arithmetic only.
Bruno
Richard
On Mon, Jan 6, 2014 at 12:23 PM, Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be>
wrote:
On 06 Jan 2014, at 16:40, John Clark wrote:
On Sun, Jan 5, 2014 at 1:28 PM, Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be>
wrote:
>>> Bell's theorem holds only under a certain set of assumptions,
>> True. As I've said many times Bell made exactly 3 assumptions:
1) High School algebra and trigonometry works.
2) Things are local.
3) Things are realistic.
If those 3 assumptions are valid then Bell's inequality can
NEVER be violated.
> Yes, that is correct. You showed this correctly indeed.
>> But from experiment we know that Bell's inequality IS violated.
> In our branch. Not in the multiverse.
We do not know for a fact that the multiverse even exists, and even
if it does those other universes are about as non-local as you can
get.
The point is logical and does not depend on the existence of a
multiverse. The point is that Bell's inequality violation is seen in
one branch, and that it entails physical non locality only if that
branch is unique.
All universes or branches of the multiverse are local. You can even
define them by step of events close for interactions.
The only branch we know to exist for sure is our local universe,
and in our local universe Bell's inequality is violated.
Yes, and a multiverse restores 3p determinacy and locality. That's
the point.
And even if those other universes are real Bell's inequality is
violated there too, provided of course that High School algebra and
trigonometry still works.
Yes, and so, for those inhabitants who believe in determinacy and
locality, they are forced to assume the presence of the other
branches, like ours.
> MW restores 3p determinacy, and it restores 3p locality
I should have asked this long ago but who exactly is this third
person?
Just read the original papers.
- In comp, anyone locally not duplicated, and observing a
duplication of someone else, can play the needed role asked for
defining a 3p view.
- In Everett QM, the 3p is an external view of the solution of the
SWE, and the 1-views are the record of the observers obeying to that
wave.
In both case, the 1p are given by the memory records of duplicated
or superposed states, and the 3p is the view from those who observe
the "whole" system.
Can you give me his phone number or at least his Email address?
So funny ...
Bruno
John K Clark
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